Strictly Anonymous Confessions - 705 - Kim Lee and her Husband had a Long Term Foursome w/their Neighbors and it Went Very Wrong

Episode Date: October 16, 2023

Kim lee and her Husband got into the lifestyle and had a long term foursome with their neighbors that didn’t end well and she called in to talk all about it. When and why did they get into the lifestyle? When did they start having foursomes? And what went wrong during the long term foursomes with their neighbors? Tune in to hear all the details including how and why they started going to lifestyle clubs early on in their marriage and why they didn’t participate at first, how their dirty talk and open communication led to them being totally down with full swapping, the first foursome they had with a couple they met at church and exactly what went down, their reclaiming sex and how and why it’s the best part of them being with other people, the first full swap with their neighbors and why they didn’t go that far at first, how it progressed to them having full swaps regularly, why they decided to play with the other spouses separately from each other and how she felt about that, how and why they remained monogamous to that couple the whole time they were hooking up with them, how the wife of the other couple started to cross the line with her husband ad how and why at first she totally trusted her, why they eventually stopped hooking up with them and how the other couple reacted, how she found out her husband had hooked up with the neighbors wife behind her back, what went down between them, how she found out about it and how she reacted, how they worked through it and eventually got back in the lifestyle, the rules they have now that makes it work for them plus a whole lot more. The Swinger in the Mirror: A Memoir of the Lifestyle https://a.co/d/3oPOA0k **To see anonymous pics of Kim Lee plus anonymous pics of my other female guests + hear anonymous confessions + get all the episodes early and AD FREE, join my Patreon! It's only $7 a month and you can cancel at any time. You can sign up here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/StrictlyAnonymousPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and when you join, I'll throw in a complimentary link to my private Discord! MY BOOK IS NOW OUT FOR PRE-ORDER!!!! Strictly Anonymous Confessions: Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers. A bunch of short, super sexy, TRUE stories. GET YOUR COPY NOW: https://amzn.to/4i7hBCd To Join SDC and get a FREE Trial! click here: https://www.sdc.com/?ref=37712 or go to SDC.com and use my code 37712 Want to be on the show? Email me at [e-mail] or go to http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com and click on "Be on the Show" Have something quick you want to confesss while remaining anonymous? Call the CONFESSIONS hotline at 347-420-3579. You can call 24/7. All voices are changed. Sponsors: https://bluechew.com Get your first month FREE! https://butterwellness.com/ Try the Butter Wellness perineum massager and use code STRICTLY for 20% off your entire order Follow me! Instagram https://www.instagram.com/strictanonymous/ Twitter https://twitter.com/strictanonymous?lang=en Website http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com/ Everything else https://linktr.ee/Strictlyanonymouspodcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to the Strictly Anonymous Podcast. Strictly Anonymous Podcast. Conversations with online strangers. We place ads online. The Craigslist is definitely like the gift that keeps on giving. Real people respond. You go to Santerport or Thailand. You can't not do it.

The temptation is just too much. It's real problems. Do your friend know that you're banging her or no? No, he has no idea. And anything goes. The motto of the show, let your freak flag fly. Probably the only good advice I'll ever give you is to rehire. your wips and change. Here is your host, Kathy.

Hey, welcome to the Strictly Anonymous podcast with Kathy. If you want to follow the strictly anonymous podcast on Instagram or Twitter, follow the show at Strict Anonymous. If you want to be on the show, it's called Strictly Anonymous because I change everybody's voices on my show to make everybody anonymous. You could change your name. You could call me from a phony email, phony number. I don't care to, I don't even need to know who you are. I just want to hear your true story if you want to be on the show. go to my website, strictly anonymouspodcast.com and click on Beyond the Show. Now, if you have just a little confession that you want to leave, you could do that on my private

confessions line, you could call that 24-7, the number 347-4-2-0-3579. That's 347-4-2-3579. You could call that, like I said, I think, 24-7. You have four minutes to leave a message. make sure you're in a quiet place and you speak clearly. All of those anonymous confessions are aired on my Patreon. Now, my Patreon is a really great place because for just $5 a month, and you're going to get all the anonymous confessions.

There's hundreds of them. You're also going to get all the anonymous picks of all of my guests. Basically, every single girl except maybe one in the past three years have sent me in anonymous picks of them. They are rated, but they're sexy picks. You're going to get a pick of my caller today. Oh, you also get early and ad-free episodes, but the best part of my Patreon nowadays is you get free access to my private Discord. Now, you only can get in my Discord if you're a member of my Patreon.

And that's where people get X-rated. There's over 1,500 people, I think, now on my Discord. I know my caller today. Joey Panama is going to be on there. You could see him in all his glory over there on my Discord. It's $5 a month on my Patreon. You could cancel it at any time. It's Patreon.com.

slash strictly anonymous podcast patreon.com slash strictly anonymous podcast. Now, if you're driving or you're listening and you didn't take down any of that information I just said, don't worry about it. It's all in the description. Now, today I have on Kim Lee. You're going to laugh at this episode sometimes.

Kim Lee has a book. She wrote a book about her story, The Swinger in the Mirror, all about her experience in the lifestyle. But it was funny because there were certain times where she wasn't telling the story correctly and you know me. to my show. I was like, what the fuck, Kim? You're going to be happy I interrupt her sometimes to get

the full story and move her along. She's got a very interesting story. Kim Lee was married for a really long time, about seven years into it. They started dipping their toes in the water, going to swingers club, sniffing around. Eventually they wind up having a foursome with a couple. And then they get involved in this whole forsome swapping thing with neighbors. Now, let me just tell you, look out your window for all you people that live in the suburbs and look down the street. And I'm going to tell you, a lot of you people are living on a block where couples are fucking each other. Because that shit does go down, okay? It's not like it does it.

And it happens more in the swingers clubs. I mean, in the suburbs, I think, than in the city. But seriously, they were like best friends with these neighbors. They wound up eventually doing swaps with them. She talks about it. She talks about what went down. But their swaps were very much controlled by. the neighbor's wife. She was the bossy one in the foursome and she eventually caused some problems and that's

where the story gets interesting because eventually her husband wound up fucking that wife behind her back. Okay. But before that you see where it was going wrong. There were some red flags like this woman which is like whenever they played and they did swapping with the other couple, that neighbor couple. It was always solo. Each couple went in solo places. She talks about how that went down, why that went down, how long they did it, and then how it started to change. Because that woman eventually went in after her man, after they ended things.

She wound up finding out that her husband was with her behind her back. He copped to it. They were able to get past it, which I give them credit for, and she talks about that too at the end. And now they're back in the lifestyle. So she has a full, super interesting story. A couple that were in the lifestyle,

something about the lifestyle kind of fuck things up for them. They hit a really rough patch because of it. But after working through it, they are now into swapping still and they still play with other couples. And they learn from their experience. Now they have different kinds of rules and regulations. So anyway, her story's super interesting. She wrote a whole book about it,

The Swinger in the mirror. I'll put a link to it in the description. She talks about it at the end. But you're going to love her whole story. So I'm going to get right to it and be right back on with Kim Lee. Welcome to the Strickley-Nama's podcast. How are you?

Great. Thanks for having me. No, thanks for coming on. I kind of enjoy, you know, Swingers gone wrong story or three something wrong stories. I just like to show all different, what would you say, outcomes to certain lifestyles. I'm not here to say, oh, this works every fucking time. And I'm not here saying, oh, it never works, right?

I like to show all different kinds of stories. So people could, because I think people could learn from both. They could learn from a story that went right and was successful. And they could learn from a story that went wrong and wasn't successful. Basically, you were in the lifestyle. I don't know if you're still in it, but I'm going to get your whole story. You were in the lifestyle with your husband. You had a foursome and then wound up finding out later or at some point,

I can't wait to find out the real story, that your guy, your husband, husband was secretly seeing one of the women that was involved in that for some, right? It always blows my mind that people cheat on people who allow them to fuck other people to begin with. It never ceases to amaze me that here it is. He has got a girl who lets him fuck other people right in front of him, right? You were having foursons with him and he still had to go behind your back. Like, why?

It's just dumb. But it happens, right? Absolutely. I think that's a misnomer about being in the lifestyle that people think that. that cheating is not going to occur. It happens actually more than you realize. I think even though you're in the lifestyle, you feel like you have permission to have sex with other people,

play around, that you can still not communicate with your partner and do things that possibly could derail your relationship. So I think it's important that the partners are stable in their relationship. they're communicating their needs to avoid having this extramarital situation, even in the lifestyle. Yeah, because cheating sometimes isn't just about sex, right? I think marriage is like a pie. There's different pieces of it.

You have to tend to all pieces. You can't let anyone go out the window. So maybe you had a great sex life with your husband. What do you think happened in your relationship that made him go and cheat with that woman? Was it just like some sort of instant connection or was there issues going into that for some? Yeah, I think it wasn't really on our side. Now that I've had time, it's been over 14 years since it's happened. So I've had time to reflect about what happened and what went wrong.

And I think there was some prior communication issues between myself and my husband where he felt he couldn't communicate everything truthfully to me. But I think the bigger problem was on the other end, the other woman, where she had issues. I think it got complicated. She became my best friend. And because she had issues that I wasn't aware of and she was more into the whole foursome than I realized, that's where all the complications and everything went up, went out the window. It was amazing at first.

And then it just because she, I guess in a nutshell, she fell in love with my husband. And so there was that emotional connection. Yeah, well, let's go all the way back. And then we'll get back to this story. And at that point, when we get the whole backstory, I think it'll make more sense, right? But let's get back to like how you even opened up your marriage and decided to become a swinger. Tell me that story. Oh, and we want to say that you have a book.

okay and we're going to put links to it and at the end we'll talk about it but and so this is all chronicled even you know even more so in your book which is called the swinger in the mirror what's the tagline ago uh yeah the swinger in the mirror um my secret life because honestly there was a lot of secrets that was going on in my life and that i didn't realize yeah so let's go all the way back kim how long into your marriage and how did the whole opening up of it come to be. We had been married probably around, I would say around seven years. We started not really going right into the lifestyle. It was more of just Boyer, watching, looking. We were testing the waters, basically. We went to a few clubs, LS clubs, but we never really participated. And it was something

that we never, we talked about, but we didn't really actually do. I think we was just nervous about actually stepping into what that would mean or what that would look like. But I think what happened was probably around 10 years into our marriage. It was, I don't know if this is normal or not, but we had neighbors. That's how it all started. And it was not something we actually created or wanted to pursue. It was just, it was a friendship. It was neighbors. We had similar situations, young children going to the same schools. So we connected on that level where we felt very comfortable. We were seeing each other every weekend, every Fridays, and just having a drink.

And I think it started from there building that friendship, not realizing or not thinking or anticipating that something more was going to happen. And then it happened. But wait, before that, when you guys were actually going to LS clubs, like you said, back in that in your day, right? because you're saying this happened a while ago. Most couples didn't take that leap and go. Who was the one that brought up, hey, let's go to a swingers club and watch people have sex?

I mean, how did that even start? It's funny. I think we both, throughout our marriage, that we were both very open to sex talks and just they're going there and just wondering, well, how do you feel about this or about this scenario about hooking up with someone else? And it just happened really organically. So it was nothing where he was forcing something or I force. It just came together very naturally.

So we just moved along that wave, I guess, towards more and sort of and seeing, okay, well, what about doing this or doing that? So it was very natural for us in terms of the process. So it was like dirty talk between you guys and fantasy first. And then eventually you guys went to clubs. And you went to a bunch of clubs and saw people, did you ever have sex when you there in front of people or did you just strictly watch? No.

We didn't go to a bunch of clubs. We only went to one or two clubs from what I remember. And we just watched. It was very interesting. It was just very new. And we didn't, I don't think we, neither of us wanted to pull the trigger on it. We just wanted to see how we felt and go from there. And so now you're like hanging out with this couple friend next door and you're getting,

you know, close with them. Was it like alcohol? or something like, how does it go from just neighbor friends to like you're all naked, hook enough? It seems to be the common denominator with a lot of stories I hear. And that was probably definitely one situation for us. We saw them every weekend, became a very routine situation where we would go to their house.

They would come to our house. We'd have drinks. And one night, there was one too many drinks. And it was a late night. And then it was the ladies that really just started where we were just in the bathroom just connecting and we ended up kissing. And when we were kissing, we were realizing that this is, this is very novel, very new. And somehow we just stopped. And then we left the bathroom and went joined back with our husbands. And then they were just talking about something. And then we just,

I remember my friend started initiating the whole thing. And I think that's how it all unraveled. Okay, so how much did it unravel that first time? It was just very soft. I mean, it was just kissing, and I went to her partner. Her partner, my husband was with her. So it was just very, a lot of kissing and touching, but nothing more than that. So it was very, the very beginning. But you kissed her and then you went and kissed her husband,

and you let her kiss your husband. That's what went down. That's it? That's right. Okay. And it stopped there? No one got like cornyer to push it further. No, it just, it's pretty much stopped there.

I think we were all because it was just, it came out from left wing and we just didn't know how far we wanted to go. We didn't even know that they were even in the lifestyle or they were even remotely thinking about it. So I think that's why we just stopped at that moment. It was getting late as well. So it was a good reason to stop. and then the next day she and I were on a call and just wondering are you okay

are you okay is this going to affect our friendship so I think that's probably the reason why we stopped because we it blurred the whole line between friendship and then going further than this because this is something that neither of us expected but when you get home or they leave I don't remember whose house you were at

where you said to your husband what the fuck just happened or did you guys just pass out because you were drunk I mean, because I think that's kind of a big deal. If all of a sudden you allow your husband to make out with the woman who lives next door and you're now making out with her husband, were you guys like freaked out or were you horny for it? What was that conversation like after? That's a really good question because honestly, it was really late. They had to go, we had to go.

We had to get some sleep because we knew we had some stuff we had to do with the kids early in the morning. So we, I think we pretty much, my husband and I, we connected and we saved the talk for the morning. And I, just before I had to, we had our event, I had that discussion with him, like, how do you feel? Are you okay? What happened last night? And he was surprisingly fine. It was very comfortable with them, maybe because we had been friends already. So there was a comfort level of familiarity.

And so for him, he felt fine. I was more concerned about my relationship with my best friend. I think it's one thing if you go to a club and you're just meeting random people, strangers, there's no connection. It's just purely physical. Here's a different scenario where you're going into it, where there's a physical aspect, but then there's the friendship. And that gets where it gets very blurred and,

Potentially complicated. So wait, so you're telling me you make out these people. That's the first time you saw your guy like kissing another girl and he saw you with someone else. Like was that weird for you guys? No, honestly, we actually had another foursome before that that had sort of gone awry as well. Thank God I'm on the fucking calls with people. So a lot of times you see in comments, oh, Kathy interrupts people.

Thank fucking God I interrupt people because like you jumped from, oh, we just went to swingers club once and we just looked. you're going to this whole lame for some where you just kissed each other and nothing happens, but yet you had a hardcore for some before that. You skipped over. Okay, get to that story first because it really changes what happened at that time. I'm thinking the reason I'm asking all these dumb questions, like how did you feel when you saw your guys? Because I'm thinking this is the first time you guys have hooked up with other people in front of each other,

but it wasn't. You had an actual for some before. So let's go there and then we'll go back to the neighbors. Okay. So that first foursome that we've ever had, it was actually a couple that we met at church. Oh my God. You're skipping the fucking foursome with a couple at the church. Oh my God. Thank God. Maybe it's a for you in slip or not a slip. Yeah. We met them at church. And it was not something. Like I said, we were never looking into the level. I didn't. We didn't even know. what the lifestyle was all about to tell you the truth. So we're going into it where it was, again, just meeting a nice couple, had young children, we had the same kind of interests, and the same

scenario happened where we met them more, more, hung out at each other's houses and just did like very platonic things. And then one day we decided to go to a restaurant and it just became a little bit more touchy-feely. And that's where it evolved from that. So that sort of started the whole foursome with that couple. Well, where did it go from there? We had gone down south with our, the children, both families went down. And that's when we had our first connection, where we actually fully swapped. And it was very difficult because of our family situation that we didn't have the time to have as many encounters. So it was very few and far between that we actually had.

So I think it was more of a beginning for both us where we didn't want to jump into it too quickly. It was very... We got a full swap. You went from fondling each other in a bar to going on a vacation and full swapping while your kids were sleeping. Yes. That's not too slow.

Okay. So tell me about that full swap. I mean, going into it after you realize that these, this couple from the church that you're friends with are hot and horning for you guys even though you act as if you knew nothing about the lifestyle you got you had an inkling for it you had the stench on you because you had been to clubs you obviously had a part of you that was open to it so now this couple hits on you you take the offer you both know you're interested in each other you're going on a trip do you and your husband talk to each other about like oh i would be totally cool

seeing you fuck her and he's like i'd be totally cool seeing you fuck him I mean, because some people don't want to see their partner with anybody else. I mean, did you talk about that before you full swapped with them? Yeah, we definitely talked about it. We talked about it. I mean, we've always, like I said, we've always communicated during our sex talk and about what we wanted to see. So we talked to each other about how this is going to all look like if we have that first

time together. And he was very okay with it and as I was okay with it. So as you said, you know, we were both. Were you both horny for it? Were you like, wow, I'm really down to see you fuck someone else? And was he like, I really have a thing to want to see you fuck another guy? Absolutely. I mean, I think that's part of, absolutely.

That's part of what made our relationship more exciting because we were both very honest about what we wanted to see in our sex life together and with other partners. So that was where it was the beginning of actually translating it between. the fantasy, the talk and put it into actual action and this was the first time. So now you know all this talk about seeing each other fuck other people in front of each other.

Now it's on the table and it's going to go down and you have sex with this couple and how was it? It was, I think because it was new for everybody. It was good but it wasn't great. There was a lot of like nervousness in doing it. And we were all in the same room. So everyone could see what each other were doing. So I think

it wasn't great. I think that first time was definitely more nerves, more apprehension compared to the next time that we had sex together. Now besides you like banging her husband and vice versa, did you hook up with the woman as well? So that was something you wanted to do? Yeah, I didn't realize that I enjoyed being with another woman. It was something that was very new and very foreign to me because I always thought I was just a straight woman. I've never, I mean, I appreciate a woman's body, but I've never been with another woman. So I think when I and the other woman connected, it was my first time actually feeling that there's more to this than I realized, that I actually enjoyed it more. And I think over time, my whole concept of being a woman, a bisexual woman, evolved over time.

And I think that was the first experience that led the way. Right. So how many times did you hook up with them? And we got better on the second time. And then it was like fucking great. I mean, because, listen, being in the same room as part of the turn on, I would think. I mean, I know that you said it made you nervous at first. But, I mean, eventually I would assume that looking over and seeing your guy and him looking over and seeing you, what I've heard from people, I've never done anything like that myself. But what I've heard is that's the turn on to see your partner pleasing someone else to see them being pleased, etc. Absolutely. I think that's for us, for my husband and I mean, we, that's what actually makes our sex life so much better is because we're able to be in the same

room on the same bed, ideally, where we're all connected and seeing, watching, and experiencing. And so for us, it was very erotic. It was very like, I think if anything, the sex part was the best, just being with him and watching with someone, as opposed to me just having sex with this, my new partner. That was fine, but it was the actual seeing my husband with someone else. I think that was really the turn on for me. And like I said, I think we might have had three or four more encounters. it wasn't a whole lot that we experienced with them. And then it just petered out.

I think it ran its course. Now, did you got, like, how was the reclaiming sex afterwards? That was always the best part. And I don't know if other people can say, but for us, we, that's the part what really drives our relationship, the sex, the attraction between my husband and I is being able to watch. And then after our moment with the foursome, that we can reconnect with each other, that I can reclaim him. I feel like I need to bring him back to me.

And I think that was the best part of the whole experience, really. Right. So that was the only time you played with other people until this neighborhood kiss thing went down? That's right. Okay. So now you have that one night. It's pretty PG. There's just light kissing.

You guys have, though, experience full swaps and stuff. So there's no need for all my questioning about the fucking conversation because now I know you had done stuff before. So you know you guys are open to fucking these people because you've done it in the past. So how did it progress with that couple? Yeah. And I think the reason why we didn't go into it really deeply is because we didn't know how they were feeling, whether they were even down for the whole. Oh, of course. I don't think it's weird that you didn't do anything that night.

I just thought it was weird that you never told me at a foursome before. That's what it was weird. So, and I was asking dumb questions that didn't need to be asked. You know what I'm saying? So I'm just bringing it back to where we left off. Yeah. So now that we know that night it was a little bit PG,

no one knows. I think, of course, these are your really good friends. I think, of course, there has to be a slow pace. I totally understand that. So how does it progress and go, further because eventually it does to the point where that girl winds up

hooking up with your husband behind your back but like what happens before that yeah I think after that first night after I had a conversation an honest conversation with her friend to friend where she told me that it it felt you know it felt good it felt comfortable that they were interested in pursuing more of this having a foursome And once I felt that she truly was okay, that there was a green light on both of their parts, then we, that's when we actually continued to pursue it. And like I said, we were very good friends. We saw each other every week.

So every week we would hang with each other, have drinks, and then things just slowly continued out in that direction where we were just building on that whole sexual connection and then finding the right tongue. I think we were both parties who were feeling a little nervous, anxious about making the first move. So I think it took a bit of time, but then slowly it went in that direction. Well, how did it go in that direction? You got to explain. Like, I wanted to take me there. Tell the story.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think we were at their place one time, the next time. And again, there's the drinks are flowing. and I sat next to her partner and he was very comfortable touching and sitting very close to me. And of course she sat next to my husband and it was very, it was very everyone was getting a little bit more relaxed, comfortable. And then we were kissing each other. And then I remember her not feeling comfortable about being in the same room.

which is what my husband and I wanted to have happened because we wanted the visual. That's the part that really excited us. But she was very uncomfortable with that scenario and she didn't feel that excited her. If anything, made her feel more awkward with her husband being there. So she took my husband down to the basement and they went to us separately. And I think that was the first time that we came to realize that this is something. something that she's more comfortable with. Her partner was, I'll do whatever you want me to do situation. So he followed her lead. So and the problem was that we were following her lead as well.

So they were, the two of them went to a separate room. I was with her husband. And so everything was great. I mean, the sex part was fine. I think what was not fine was the fact that my husband, and I were connecting the way that we were hoping to connect with the whole visual, the voyeur and the intimacy that we wanted to have. And unfortunately, it continued, it's like we started on that path and it continued down that path. So that night ends and you just fuck her husband in one room and she fucks your husband in another room and eventually you guys meet up in the living room? Yeah, when we come back to, so after everyone was done, we came back to the the living room and then we were just chatting and then we called it a night kind of thing.

So there was no conversation. There was no like, let's talk about this. But she did make a point of saying I would rather take him alone. And you were okay with that? In my mind, I wasn't okay with it. But because she was my friend and this is what she was asking, I went with it. And my husband went with it as well. And then did he say she was good? and was her husband good? Did you enjoy the experiences solo? It was really good with on my end. Like with her husband, everything was very comfortable. Everything was great. I think my husband wasn't as comfortable. And I don't know is because of going in the separate rooms that first time. But he just felt it wasn't as comfortable that first time for him.

Okay, but you continue to do it, right? And every time you do, it turns into this experience where you guys go in separate rooms and fuck each other's partners. Yes. It never came back, even though we would suggest, oh, well, what about we, you know, if we went to a hotel or another place. What do we, you know, stay in this room? Nope. It was just kiboshed and just like they would go to their separate rooms and continue like that. Now, did you ever fool around with her or was it only like full swaps with the member?

of the opposite sex? Well, there was one time that we had actually gone to a woman's retreat. And it was like an empowerment, woman's empowerment seminar retreat. And that's when I really connected with her one night, having a few glasses of wine during our downtime. And we actually connected. And we actually played with each other without our husband. So it was just the two of us.

So after that moment, that was the last time we, she and I. actually connected. So even when we were together as a whole. You fooled around all the way. You did everything with each other. But you never did that again. It was only that time when you were alone. That's right. And even when we were together as a foursome, I wouldn't really be

like even kissing or anything like that. It was just very, we kept it very separate. She was with my husband. I was with her husband. Do you think her husband knew that she was with you on that retreat? And did you tell your husband about the fact that you was with her. But they never wanted, but they were never wanting

you guys to do it in front of them. Like I would think two guys, their wives hooked up someplace else, they'd be like, okay, well, let us get in on the action this time. You know what I mean? They never requested a show.

I'm sure they would have welcomed it, but they never pushed it. They never said anything. I think she really was the leader in this where whatever she wanted to do, that's what we all, all three of us followed her

lead. So she never wanted to hook up with you solo in front of them or anything. That girl on girl action wasn't top of mind for her ever again. So that never came up. She just wanted to fuck your husband in another room. Watch out for that girl. Pretty much. Yeah. Exactly. Pretty much. Red flag. Okay. So she keeps taking. I mean, how many forcums do you have before you start to realize maybe something's up? I don't know. I mean, during this time, a quick question though before you answer that, during this time that you're with this couple, do you wind up with anyone else or you're still, this is just the only other couple you play with? That's a very good question.

Nope. She, they were the only couple because we had actually mentioned to her like, oh, let's go to a club or let's do this. And she's, no, I'm not interested. That's not something I want to do. It's just the four of us. So even if we, you know, remotely mentioned about going to a club with them, or or without them going down south to the Ellis Club. She would always remind that it's just the four of us.

She didn't want to introduce anyone else into our world. And you guys weren't open. And she made that very cool. And you guys weren't open to looking for anyone else because you were just satisfied with them, maybe, right? I mean, that's what I'm saying? Yeah, to tell you the truth, we really would have been very open to exploring and seeing other couples. but because she was very adamant and very clear about how uncomfortable it made her having other people that we wanted to respect her. They were friends.

They were very good friends. So we wanted to be respectful of what she wanted instead of looking at what we, my husband and I, what we needed as a couple. Yeah, that's interesting. I mean, listen, I'm like the type person that didn't listen to anybody my whole life. I got thrown out of three high school. So it always blows my mind that people like listen to people. But I think most people do. And I get it.

You know, you guys were being nice and consider it. And she took over that role. Like she was the one that set the fucking rules and you guys listened to her. And that's just the way that it went. And you didn't feel like you had to say. Even though you did, you just didn't think you did. I mean, that's just the way a lot of people are. Okay.

So now, you know, how long does this go on for? We were in the relationship for almost two years. Wow. And during the, yeah, I know, it went on way too long. And during those two years, certainly I had lots of conversations with my husband about how this was not going the way that we wanted it to go. Why not? But what wasn't going the way you wanted it? Because she was always calling the shots every time we would suggest about maybe moving it a little bit further, like having the same room or the same bed, or going to, I was.

we went to Vegas together. She wanted to spend more time with him. And instead of all of us sort of like together in the same bed, same room. And we tried. We would suggest and say that, well, this is not working for us. Like, it's not. And she would always pull the car. Oh, well, it doesn't make me feel comfortable.

And at the time, I didn't realize how much she was manipulating the situation. And that we really were just. Yeah. Well, no, listen, I'm going to tell you this because you're not a victim, really. I don't know that she was manipulating. What she was doing, which you should have been doing, is she was thinking about her fucking self, okay? That's all she thought about. She thought about her own feeling. She was doing what made her feel more comfortable. And none of you other three people felt like you could do that. I don't know why, because you can and you should have, but you didn't. I don't know that she was a master manipulator concocting up this plan knowing I think, you know, I would feel cheap doing that. I don't want to be in front of everybody. Like all those things I could see someone may be feeling. But she was just the only one that spoke up and was forceful about it. And because you guys all thought, like you just didn't have a strong enough voice,

which you should have. I mean, people should have their own fucking voice. But you didn't. So I don't know that she was manipulating you. She was just a little bit more selfish and a little bit louder. And you guys were too selfless. I mean, you need a little bit of her. And, you know, because.

No, absolutely. You're saying is very true, but I think when you sort of see more of the story that there was more layers to it. Well, eventually, like I said, I think it starts out that way. It doesn't mean that when, listen, this woman eventually steals your fucking husband, right, and falls for him. So eventually it does become a manipulative thing, right? But I don't think in these beginning phases where all this. Oh, no, absolutely. Yeah, you're right.

That's not a master plan. You know, she's not being manipulated there. Yeah. Yeah. I totally agree with. you. I don't think she knew. We obviously were unaware. I don't think she went with that intention. I think it evolved from just experience and just wanting whatever she was missing in her life that she wasn't getting. She didn't realize that time. And it just continued in that direction. And it grew

stronger and stronger for her. And she was meeting her own need. Yeah. Well, she was doing that from the beginning. Like I said. I mean, that was from the beginning. She was only thinking of herself. And then eventually when she crossed the line with your husband, she was continuing. to. I mean, that's where that kind of personality could be a problem, right? But let's just so, let's get to that point where it does kind of shift where things are changing. Like, how did she make the move on your husband? Like, were they texting on the side? Were they starting to talk when they were in the room solo? I mean, how did it shift? It shifted. I remember when she was trying to buy a new vehicle and she was not, she didn't know how to deal with the salesman and all that. So,

And my husband was really into it. So she asked for his help with me to the dealership. And of course, I was not interested in going as well. And so I, as a friend, I'm like, absolutely asked my husband. He can help you. Oh, no. And I think that's where it began. And I remember my husband just, he had always hated texting and messaging.

That's not, if it was a lot of work, he didn't want to do it. This is all for fun. It shouldn't be a lot of work. and it was becoming more cumbersome in terms of the expectations on him to respond back. So I think before when I used to, it was like the ladies were texting and then the boys were out of it. And then it bled over where she started texting him. And then therefore I felt, okay, I guess I should be texting her husband to serve to keep it all fair or even. And I think with her going out to the car dealerships,

I think that's where it really began, where she started to rev it up, where she had opportunities to connect with him more, having conversations. It would start off very innocent. What are you doing? But then it became more, are you missing me? So it was extending beyond the boundaries of what was acceptable in a foursome. Well, listen, it's hard to keep those boundaries clear when the people live next door to you. They're great friends of yours. you see them every week and you're fucking them in separate rooms.

How do you say, okay, we'll do all of that and you'll live next door and we're all great friends, but you know, you can't go to the car dealership with my husband. Like I totally understand why you were like fucking go. You trusted her. I mean, you had been trusting each other in very intimate ways by allowing each other to be with each other, right? I mean, that takes a lot of trust to even go there to begin with. Yeah. Did you know that they were like was hurt?

and her husband having issues? Because I wonder why is she starting to look at your husband as a thing? And how does it turn out that he winds up sleeping with her behind your back? And how do you find out? I mean, that's a very good question. She never really said anything to suggest it. Like we all have our all relationships go through certain points. But it seemed pretty stable.

It seemed fine. So I never had an idea that she was missing. anything. Maybe my blinders were on. Maybe I didn't pick up on all the cues, but she was staying at home with the kids. Her husband was working outside of the home. And so maybe she felt something was missing. I don't know. And then she started feeling, well, there's a connection where, you know, in the lifestyle, I mean, we make a very strong distinction between the physical and the emotional. We compartmentalize everything. Or I'd like to think that's what I'm I do, that's what my husband does.

But I think for her, the intimacy, the sex, it was all wound together and it became, it bled over. And she was starting to look for someone that would give her what she was lacking in her current circumstance. But let me ask you this. Does your husband wind up falling for her too? No. And the problem is because that's why it gets complicated because she was my best friend. I kept reiterating how, oh my God, she's amazing.

I'm so happy that we live like we're neighbors and we're becoming really close. And he was constantly reminded of how close we were. And I think when he, there were many times he wanted to, you know, jump off and say, I'm done with it. But I think because of the complication of the friendship. Yeah, but I've got to cut you off, okay, because I need to get to the point where you find out. I mean, you did write in your email to me that he had an affair with her. So there's some sort of deception that goes on.

I was assuming a fair to me always feels like, oh, there's more than just sex involved, right? She winds up falling for your husband. But at some point, your husband is lying to you too. Let's get to that point. And then how do you find out? Yep. Well, basically, what happened, we broke off. He actually said, I've had enough of this whole thing.

between her and her neediness and wanting to always connect and texting and all. And he goes, I've had enough. And I, at that point, I conceded with him. I said, I think you're right. I think we need to stop this for some. And that's what we did. And when he broke it off, and he decided to actually speak with her alone to tell her, she didn't take it well. And then they were basically, we didn't talk to the, the four of us, we didn't talk over that summer. And then in the fall, I think I reconnected with her, sent her a message. Just, I don't know, I think I felt sad about the whole friendship. Yeah. And so basically, I found out that she had messaged, sent him a message just by looking at my email, I think, because we, my husband and I,

we worked together. I just happened to, was looking for an email and I saw that message from her. So she was reaching out to him. And basically what happened was that I confronted him. I said, I don't understand why she would actually message you, like out of the blue when she and I are just reconnecting as friends. Right, because you assume that your husband and you hadn't spoken to them all summer. I mean, you were supposedly on a break. Exactly, exactly. If I had no friendship with him, and I didn't speak to her husband, there was no need for her to talk to my husband. Of course.

And so what did your husband say? Basically, he broke down and he fessed up and said that. that he had, I said, there seemed to be a connection, something like, why is she reaching out to you? It doesn't make any sense. And he broke out and he committed to the affair. What had happened when I was away in Thailand for a couple weeks, that that's when they had their affair. Well, what did he say? It was just a one-time affair, a one-time hookup without you knowing?

Yeah, during the two weeks that I was away, they had sex three times. But was it before that, too? I mean, was this a whole long affair? No. Was it that time that he saw her while you were away? No, it was, he had sex with her during those two weeks. And then before when they would go for the car situation, car finding situation, they would meet up for coffee.

And he said to me, and I believe him, they never had sex. It was only the three times during the two weeks that I was away. But other times he had gone off and had coffee with her. and had talks and they weren't at the dealership. So on emotional level, it was happening before. And for him, he was explaining it then, which was really hard for me to believe at first. He explained it as we, he was told by her, if you tell your wife, my best friend, our friendship is over and my marriage is over.

So it was hanging over his head that he didn't want to create more of a situation. And I think he was blinded by that whole boundaries, friendship, secrets. He got over his head, basically. Well, he fucked her while you were gone. I mean, I don't understand. I mean, he fell into it and wound up having sex with her. He had sex with her before. Was he super apologetic?

Because he had cheated on you, kind of. I mean, even though he had... Oh, no, absolutely. He was, like I said, he was very remorseful. He felt incredibly bad that he kept it for me. Yeah, it's more so that, right? I mean, if he would have maybe called you up, I mean, because this was someone he had sex with before,

but it was like, I'm sure what's... I think, listen, any kind of cheating is always horrifying, but a big part of it is that deception, right, or not being told. I mean, he kept it like a secret. Like, you just weren't in the know. Oh, absolutely. that's probably what broke me because of that.

It wasn't the sex. Like you said, he's had sex with her. The physical was already there. It was the unknown, him keeping it from me that when I was, when we were, we had broken up with him over the summer, I had told him how I missed her as a friend. And he had ample opportunity at any point to let me know what was really going down. So I was not saying, oh, well, I think I'm going to try. to reconnect with her as friends. If I had only known what she was doing or capable,

you would have never reconnected. There's no way I would have poked out. No, absolutely. I'm not, I'm not that foolish. So wait, so he confesses to you. And then what happens? I mean, what was the outcome of that affair that he had? I mean, it was incredibly difficult. And I think that's why I wrote the book was to really just get through the heart, the broken heart that I had. this whole situation. I never thought he would ever. We had such a close relationship. We talked about everything and I never thought that I would be on that side experiencing this. So we, it was rough. We left the lifestyle. We went through therapy and had to really go through a lot to try to see if we wanted to fix this, stay in it or just go our separate ways. It was pretty devastating.

But you were able to get past it? We were able to get past it because we both were able to continue to want to communicate. Like I wanted to understand what happened, what went wrong with him and I, why he couldn't tell me right from the get-go, why we didn't stand up to her as a couple. Why didn't we protect ourselves as a couple? I needed to understand all this. I needed to process this because there were so many different. layers and it was so complicated and I didn't understand how it could go so wrong.

Yeah, but it was right. No. And listen, I give you credit for getting past it. I don't necessarily think just because someone cheats that you have to, you need to throw away a whole marriage that was otherwise great for one in discretion. I don't necessarily always believe in it. Each story is totally different, right? I don't know if you have kids or how much you have invested.

You said you work together. I mean, to throw everything out because he fucked that girl. three times. He fucked her before. He didn't fall in love with her, right? It wasn't like that. That kind of entanglement could have been worse, right? She might have been in love with him, but your guy knew she was a fucking whackadoodle. I mean, he wasn't falling for her, like romantically, right? He just took an option. You weren't around for two weeks. He fucked her, got laid. And eventually you were able to get past that. I give you credit for that for saving your marriage. I know that it's not easy, though, because I think like you said,

it's the, I think the hardest part of that, it's not that he had sex. that is a part of it though, but it's more so the betrayal and somebody that you felt like you shared everything with and now all of a sudden they didn't share that with you. It's terrible. I think you hit it right. Yeah, I think you hit it on the nail. I mean, it's the betrayal. It was the secret. It was not knowing. And I felt like he, I thought we had a stronger relationship that he would have been able to tell me everything. And I think that's one thing that couples don't realize that there's a lot of times you don't communicate what you're really feeling. And for whatever reason, whether it's a hard conversation or you're making assumptions about your partner.

And things do go awry. I mean, especially if you're in a longer term relationship or marriage, that things will go awry and things happen. But it comes down to, do you want to save your marriage? And I'm not advocating this for everyone. I think everybody's story's different. Everyone has a different situation and they need to do whatever feels is right for them individually and as a couple. And for me and for my husband, I felt like it was worth giving it more time, more communication, more effort to get through it, whether it was through couples counseling, us continuing to see if we had a future together. And it was a lot of hard work. And it was like I was, it was not easy. It was definitely not easy at all. But listen, you have to give him credit because when you

found that email, like the email didn't have naked picks of her or there was no graphic details in there stating that she fucked your husband while you were gone. So he could have completely lied to you and never told you and you probably would have never found out. So he obviously is probably not a serial cheater because he felt bad enough the minute you asked him to drop it and come clean and get it out because a lot of guys could have just lied he could have just been like it's nothing she's crazy she's just emailing me like a psycho i don't know why she's emailing me he didn't have to tell you he fucked her three times yeah no absolutely you're right and he didn't have to say anything he could have just been very you could have just continued to bury it and

just forget and say move on we're not even in this relationship this for some anymore but he felt guilty yeah he felt guilty and i think that that's a good thing right because it means like I always warn I get a lot of cheaters on my show and I always love getting the story. Even the cheater side of the story is always different right and you can't put all cheaters in one category but whenever I have a cheater on my show that feels guilty about it I'm like you can't do things that you feel guilty about my I don't create your moral compass everyone has their own right so if some guy's cheating he doesn't fucking care that's how he rolls but the guy that's doing it that feels guilty.

It means it's not going with who he is. And those are the people I'm always like, watch out because you're the type of cheater that gets caught. Because the part of you that is doing something that isn't right for who you really are is going to subconsciously sabotage you because you're not going to be able to live with it. So obviously the fact that he felt bad about it is a good thing because plenty of people cheat without any fucking thought about it. They don't feel guilty. They would lie a million times.

You know what I mean? So no, absolutely. Yeah, I think you make a really good point about that. I think it, it, it, it saved our marriage, really, because when you have that guilt, I think you have some level of accountability that you need to own up to. And that's where you can begin to start piecing back the pieces if you want. And I think that's why he was willing and why I was, more importantly, why I was willing to, give a second chance because I knew he showed the guilt, the remorse that he knew what he had done wasn't right. And it wasn't something that he wanted to continue on that path. And I think that's what saved our marriage really along with the communicating and just to nauseam, like just talking and talking. So I felt safe and I understood. And so it was a big part of that. Million dollar question is this. Would you guys ever have a foursome again or do anything like that again or have you? Oh, yeah. I mean, since that has happened, that was over 14 years ago. I mean, we've been back in the lifestyle after taking a break. And one thing we have decided not to do is to have a monogamous for some ever again. It just, I mean, there's a negative connotation with it for us.

And we don't want to have, I mean, the whole reason why we like it is the whole lifestyle is the variety, the just having no sort of set boundaries to do what we want to do and not feel like you're obligated just to one couple. So no, we have not been with another foursome monogamously. But you still are in the lifestyle. It's not like that turned you off to it. You didn't look at that thing that happened and think that it happened because you had an open relationship. Obviously it happened because that girl wasn't so stable. You know, she was boundaryless.

So, and you spent too much time and you learn from that. And now you go back into the lifestyle. You guys play with other couples. Are you still rolling, doing like full swaps and stuff like that? Yep. I mean, after taking some time off, just recollect ourselves and bring ourselves back to a healthy place as a couple. I mean, we went back into the lifestyle. And it was where now we had defined rules.

what would be good for us as a couple, the two of us, not taking anyone else's consideration. It was just about us and going into the lifestyle with a new sort of viewpoint. I think that's what we were able to do and enjoy better, knowing that we can be with other couples and experience and do exactly what we started to do in the first place, why we were drawn into the lifestyle in the first place. So, yeah, we're back into it, full swap. and we're at a better place because we're communicating more telling each other what we want, what we don't like. But also communicating with the other couples.

I feel like that was a big problem with all of you guys, right? That girl was bossing you guys around. Yeah, that girl was bossing you guys around and you didn't speak up. So now you're really communicating not only with each other but with other couples and really putting your needs first like she did for herself, talking, you know, going for what makes you guys feel comfortable and making sure you guys are okay with the situation. I mean, you were never okay with her solo playing, but you allowed it. Like, you wouldn't do that now. Yeah. No, absolutely. I think you're right. I think that's the biggest

change is being able to communicate to the other couples exactly what works for us and what doesn't work for us. And if they, if it doesn't align with them, then we bid them farewell and say, you know what, it was very nice meeting you, but we're moving on to the next couple. That's going to be more in line with what we want to do. So yeah, absolutely. It's about communicating that. Yeah, yeah, totally. So give a shout out to your book.

Tell people where they could find it. I'll put a link in my description too. Okay, perfect. So my book is called The Swinger in the Mirror. The Swinger in the Mirror, My Secret Life. And you can find it on my website, The Swinger in the Mirror.com. Sold in all the usual places, Amazon, Barnes & Noble, so forth.

All right, cool. So I'll put a thing there now. I have a Patreon. I don't know if you know this, but I have a Patreon where people send in sexy picks, no faces. Everyone remains anonymous unless you're like a famous person that wants to be out. It's fine. But if you want, you could send me a pick.

Do you want to send in a faceless pick for my Patreon? Oh, absolutely. I could definitely do that. Okay, cool. Send me a couple picks for my Patreon. So people who want to put a body, they want to your face because you're going to remain anonymous. Okay, Kim Lee. That's your pen name.

That's the name on the book. They could see that over my Patreon. I will put a link to your book. Thank you so much for calling in. I love your story. It's super interesting with so many different layers. Well, thank you so much for having me. I really appreciated having this opportunity to chat with you.

And you had some really amazing, intriguing questions that made me think more about it. Awesome. That's what I do. I like to peel back millions of layers and find out everything. I'm just like naturally. You certainly did that. Yeah, I'm naturally curious. I never have one question written down and just my brain always wants to know more.

more. So thanks for going with it and thanks for calling in Kim Lee. Oh, thank you so much. Okay. So send me that picture sooner than later. And then also what I could do is give you access to my Discord where you could go on and say, hey, I'm Kim and this and you can promote your book. My Discord is attached to my Patreon. Everyone else pays for that. But because you called into my show, I'll get you free access to my Discord. It's very X-rated in there. I mean, it's like a community of X-rated shit. I was like, people were always sending me their X-rated stuff. I'm like, I don't know what to do with this. I don't deal with that. But I created this community on Discord. It's behind a paywall. People go in there. If you want to promote your book and go in there,

you can. I'll give you the free link. If you don't want to, you don't have to, but I will send that to you as well. There's 1,500 people in there. So it can be a good way to advertise your book as well. You can put links to your book. That sounds great. Thanks so much, Kim. All right. Thank you for your time. Bye. Okay. Bye. Okay. Okay. Okay. I just want to tell you before go that my book, it's called Strictly Anonymous Confession, Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers, is now available not only in paperback and e-book, but you can pre-order

the audiobook. It's still not going to be out until August 25th, but you can pre-order it. The book is basically 17 different stories taken from my show. I kind of picked one story from each category

that I talk about on my show. Like there's a hot wife story. There's a cuck queen story. There's a cuck story. There's a gang-bang girl story. Like I said, 17 stories. and they're all told in the third person, and they're all true. I took the interview and rewrote it in the third person,

and I wouldn't really call it like a total erotica book. Think like Penthouse letters. It's more direct. It's not so over the top like erotica. I don't really like that kind of vibe, right? But these are true stories, 17 of them. They're really short chapters, easy read. You could read one or two and then skip around.

You could read the whole book. It's available in eback format, paperback format, and finally, the audiobook is available coming out August 25th, but you could pre-order it now. And if you buy my book in any format or pre-order it, I will throw in a complimentary link to my Discord. My Discord does not disappoint, okay? There's no way you get into my Discord any other way than getting the link from me, okay? I give it to people who buy my book. There's tons of people in there. everybody shares content with each other and that's what you get to do there you can post your own

pictures and videos there's tons of channels we have lots of contests where you can win a lot of money it's a super fun place to be it's a total strictly anonymous community and you will love it i will be giving anyone who buys my book access to my discord it's private like i said all you got to do is email me a screenshot of your purchase whether you did the audiobook the ebook or the paperback send it to me at Strictly Anonymous Podcast at gmail.com. That's Strictly Anonymous Podcasts at Gmail.com. And I will send you the link to Discord. So anyway, thanks so much for tuning in.

This is the Strictly Anonymous podcast. Hey, everyone. Thanks so much for tuning in to this week's episode. If you want to follow the show, follow me at Strict Anonymous on Instagram or Twitter. at Strict Anonymous. If you are on YouTube, make sure to subscribe. I love YouTube as a platform for my show because people comment there.

And I try to reply back to every single person who post a comment. So even if you're not listening on YouTube and you want to talk about the show, go to my YouTube channel, subscribe and share my videos. It's strictly anonymous podcast. If you want to sign up for my Patreon on my Patreon, you are not only supporting my show, but you will get these episodes early, ad free. you get to see anonymous picks of my guests. Most of the girls send in anonymous picks

and some of the guys send an anonymous picks. So if you want to see anonymous picks of my guests, as well as support my show and get these episodes early and ad-free, sign up for my Patreon. Patreon.com slash strictly anonymous podcast. That's patreon.com slash strictly anonymous podcast. The link is also in the description below.

Thanks so much for listening.