Strictly Anonymous Confessions - 826 - Sunny is Into Hotwifing, Swinging, Orgies and More

Episode Date: May 13, 2024

Sunny and her husband are into hotwifing, swinging, orgies and more and she called in to talk all about it. Tune in to hear all the details including how they met and how they started off very sexual ...from the get go, how wound they at their first ent bdsm club and exactly what went down there, the threesome she had with a mom friend of hers and exactly what went down, how and when her husband came out as bi to her and how she felt about it, how her husband brought up that he wanted to see her to f*** another guy and how she felt at first , the first time they hooked up with a guy and exactly what went down, their 2nd experience with a guy and how and why it ended poorly, their first mmf hook up and what went down, the perfect bi bull they met up with and what went down with him and why he was their fave, how and when her husband brought up swinging and how and why she wasn’t into it at first, the first couple they hooked up with and was went down with them, the gold star gay guy they hooked up and what went down with him, the first lifestyle party they went to and what went down there including the 12 person orgy they had, hjow she was able to see her guy with another woman and be totally into it as opposed to jealous of it, how being in lifestyle has changed their relationship for the better plus a whole lot more. **To see a pics of SUNNY plus see anonymous pics of my other female guests + hear anonymous confessions + get all the episodes early and AD FREE, join my Patreon! It's only $7 a month and you can cancel at any time. You can sign up here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/StrictlyAnonymousPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and when you join, I'll throw in a complimentary link to my private Discord! MY BOOK IS NOW OUT FOR PRE-ORDER!!!! Strictly Anonymous Confessions: Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers. A bunch of short, super sexy, TRUE stories. GET YOUR COPY NOW: https://amzn.to/4i7hBCd Want to be on the show? Email me at strictlyanonymouspodcast@gmail.com or go to http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com and click on "Be on the Show" Have something quick you want to confesss while remaining anonymous? Call the CONFESSIONS hotline at 347-420-3579. You can call 24/7. All voices are changed. Sponsors: https://bluechew.com Get your first month FREE! https://butterwellness.com/ Try the Butter Wellness perineum massager and use code STRICTLY for 20% off your entire order Follow me! Instagram https://www.instagram.com/strictanonymous/ Twitter https://twitter.com/strictanonymous?lang=en Website http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com/ Everything else https://linktr.ee/Strictlyanonymouspodcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Starting point is 00:00:00 What's called strictly anonymous because I change everybody's voices. I change everybody's names. You call me from a phony number. I don't really care who the fuck you really are. I just want to hear your true story. So if you have an interesting, unique, hot story that you want to talk about while we're meeting anonymous or not anonymous if you don't want to be anonymous. Send me an email, strictly anonymous podcast at gmail.com or go to my website, strictly
Starting point is 00:00:19 anonymous podcast.com and click on beyond the show. If you have a naughty confession that you want to leave on my confessions hotline, you can call that number 247. The number's 347, 4203579. 347, 4203579. Do me a favor when you call that number and you leave a confession? Make sure you're holding the phone up to your ear. That gets the best sound.
Starting point is 00:00:44 You have four minutes to leave a message. If you need longer, just call back. I'll edit together. I change the voices on the confessions. Some of those confessions make it on to a confessions episode. All the rest of them are posted on my Patreon. My Patreon is still just $5 a month. I think I'm raising it in June.
Starting point is 00:01:01 I keep saying I'm raising it. I'm like, and I keep forgetting to do it. But for $5 a month, which is nothing, you get so much. Like you get all my episodes early in ad-free. You get numerous Q&As that I've done over the years, tons of them where I ask, answer personal questions. You get all the hot R-rated picks of all of my female guests and some of my male guests also send me in picks over there. Plus you get all of the anonymous confessions that ever came in.
Starting point is 00:01:27 They're all posted there. And you also get access to my Discord, which is a place where people get to post whatever they want. You could get super naughty over there. It is a private discord that you get access to when you join my Patreon. But I have over 2,300 people on my Patreon. So it's a great community. And like I said, it's only $5 a month.
Starting point is 00:01:46 Patreon.com slash strictly anonymous podcast. Now listen, everything I just told you about is in the description. Today I have on Sunny. Sunny's story is great. You're going to fucking love it because it's. It's like real life. It's like a real life story.
Starting point is 00:02:00 It's not all perfect. There were some bumps in the road. And her and her guy have like kind of been there, done a lot. She talks about how they met. They were very sexual from the get-go. They wound up their first experience going to a BDSM club. She talks about that. Then they got into hotwifing and they fucked a bunch of guys.
Starting point is 00:02:17 And her guy brought up that he was by. And then he hooked up with guys. And she also talks about her experience with women. And then they decided to start hooking up with couples. and then they started going to swinger parties and they got really into fucking orgies, okay? And she talks all about all of that. And she also, like I said,
Starting point is 00:02:35 talks about the little bumps in the roads, the times during these scenarios where both her and her husband got upset because of different things. And those stories, I think, are always super interesting because that's real life, like I said. You're going to hear the good and the bad
Starting point is 00:02:50 and the hot stories from Sunny. So I'm going to get right to it and be right back on with Sunny. Hi, Sunny. Welcome to the Strictly Donovan. podcast. How are you today? I'm well. Thanks for having me. Thanks for calling in Sunny. You are married to a guy. I'm assuming you guys were vanilla at some point because you did say that you became a hot wife couple and then you turned into swingers and you're here to talk about the good,
Starting point is 00:03:16 the bad and the ugly, which to me is like real life, which I love. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. So listen, Sunny, how long have you been married for? So my husband and I got. married in January of 2020, but we've been together for six and a half years. So we got married on our five year anniversary. We've been together for six years. Okay, great. So you've been together for six years. So when and why and how do things change? So we started out very sexual. So from the jump, we were actually, neither of us were looking for anything serious when we met. We met on at Facebook. And it wasn't like we were looking for dating or anything like that, but we just kind of started reporting in the comments. And we started DMing and we met up. And we were just
Starting point is 00:04:05 fucking at first. There was nothing, but wasn't serious. And then we just fell in love. We weren't looking for it. We just kind of found it. So we, but we started off very sexual. And that was one of the things that kind of made us attracted to each other was our sexuality and our overt sexuality, I guess. But we, like, played with toys and stuff like that. And then around the six months mark, we had started talking about kink. And I would call him Daddy and he would call me his little princess. And we kind of had that little, like, dominant, submissive role play going on, but not, like, really hardcore or anything like that.
Starting point is 00:04:43 So we found out about a place in our city. It was a dungeon. And apparently they had parties. And so we're like, let me. Let's try it out. We went to one of their parties, and it wasn't quite what we expected. It was a little, it was fun, but it was a little, like, strange, a little more, a little darker than we had anticipated.
Starting point is 00:05:07 They did some rope play stuff. They had toys. They had Scybians. They had, like, stanking benches. They had outdoor fucking areas. It wasn't, like, a swingers party. It was, like, more focused on kink. Which is a totally different world.
Starting point is 00:05:22 It really is. Totally. Yes. Totally different world. Whenever I talk to people like online or meet people, I'm like, we're vanilla asswingers. Totally. We don't. We don't. You know. Exactly. Like, we do kinky shit, but we're not like into kink. There's a big difference. Yeah, totally. What did you guys do, though, at that party? Did you do anything like fuck in front of other people or do you just observe? So we did. Yeah. It was for my birthday. And we were there. And they had this, like, medical table with stirrups on it.
Starting point is 00:05:59 And so I'm an exhibitionist thrown through. And that's something that I have, like, slowly found out about myself through this whole process. But I am fully an exhibitionist. And so I was just kind of like, let's put on a show. And so I laid down on the table and put my feet in the stirrups. And he just started, like, going down on me, fingering me, all that. And this woman walked up and she was like, hey, I really want to. eat your wife's pussy.
Starting point is 00:06:25 And so I was like, oh my God, oh my God. And I had, at that point, I had never, that's not true. I had done something with a woman before. I had, like, gotten caught up in a threesome that was very unexpected and very awkward for me. And I can tell you that story if you'd like to hear it. But that was like between the time that I had left my ex and then met my current husband. Yeah, we finish this story, right, so we don't get off talk.
Starting point is 00:06:53 And I would love to hear that story if you could tell it. Okay. So, yeah, she came up and she was like, I want to eat your wife's pussy for a birthday. And so it's like, oh, my God, I've never had that before. Like, I'm scared, but I was very into it. I had fantasized about women since I was, like, in middle school. Right. I would literally master me before school every day in the shower with the shower head.
Starting point is 00:07:15 And think about one particular girl that I had a crush on that was like totally off limits for me. It was like my best friend's cousin. But yeah. So I knew that I was like interested. said my sister and I like found my dad's playboys when we were really young and we would look at them and look at the girls and so it's just something that was like intriguing I was always turned on by like porn that involved women a girl and girl so yeah I was like down so we went over to play area and we actually just ended up I actually I just got like ferociously fingered by the two of them which was like not that great It was just kind of like, okay, well, that was not what I had expected. And like, even when my husband tried to touch her, she was like, oh, no. Like, we're not doing that.
Starting point is 00:08:04 And so it was just kind of like awkward. And then they invited us back to their place. And they were like, we have party favors kind of alluding to the fact that they had speed, which I was like, no, it's not going to be that kind of night. No, thank you. Wait, so wait, tell me real quick, that threesome that you wound up being in the middle of. I was that time the girl didn't go down on you either. So she did actually.
Starting point is 00:08:28 Now that I think about it, she had. Okay. I didn't know until I looked down. So the way that it was presented to me, this, this woman was a friend via my child, my son. So my son was in the same class as her daughter. And we kind of became friends through that. just casually. And we were hanging out at the party one night.
Starting point is 00:08:58 And she actually happened to be dating a guy that I used to sleep with. And I was like, holy fucking shit, small world, crazy. I can't believe you guys know each other. And she's, yeah, you should come hang out with us. And so I went and hung out with them. And I didn't really think anything of it. I didn't think like anything like this was going to happen. Of course not.
Starting point is 00:09:18 We were just watching a movie. And I was like, okay I'm gonna go outside and smoke a cigarette and she like came with me and she's like so I have a proposition for you and I was like oh god what is it she's like I want you to fuck my boyfriend and I was like what oh my god and yeah and I was like oh I don't know she's like yeah I just like to watch I'm just I'm not going to do anything I just I just want to watch and so this was like totally foreign to me totally new and I was like I don't know so I ended up going where she like kind of fed me whiskey and was like oh think about it just stick around hang out think about it and so she kind of like tried to get me drunk I wasn't drunk but I was like okay I've had sex with this guy before it was enjoyable so I'll do it again and she's just going to watch so I did it and like first at first she's sitting in the chair and she's like touching herself and she's watching us and then I'm like closing my eyes and he goes down on me and then
Starting point is 00:10:22 all of a sudden I kind of like look back down and it's her. And I was like, oh, fuck, I did not expect that. This is happening. I guess whatever. I'm just going to go with it. And that was that was it. I like squirted it all over the red. In fact, we ended up breaking that bed.
Starting point is 00:10:44 One of the bed posts broke. Oh, my God. That's hilarious. I know. It was fucking wild. I actually, it's funny because I haven't thought. about this in so long that details of that story are just coming back to mine that are like, oh my God.
Starting point is 00:11:00 But it was like totally unplanned unexpected. Like I did not. And it was not my ideal scenario. It wasn't like if I could create a scenario that would not have been it at all. And she wasn't like forceful or like weird. She was very accommodating. And in fact, she had like kind of posed herself as a. professional dominatrix. She had said that to me in the past. She was like, yeah, that's what I do.
Starting point is 00:11:26 People pay me to dominate them. She didn't do that to me, but she was very, like, really good at guiding me through the next step because I was like, I've never kissed a woman before. And she was like, okay, well, it's just a lot softer than kissing a man. And this is what it feels like, and I'm going to kiss you. And so it was kind of, like, she was good at that. There were things that did really turned me on about her. And that was like, it ended up being a really like fun experience, but it was like, it took a minute to process it afterwards. I was like, what the fuck happened?
Starting point is 00:12:00 Yeah, that's hilarious. Okay. So now, so you go, let's go back to the BDSM. So you, that's what you did that night, right? You hooked up with that, the guy and that girl, you realize you're very into being watched. Like, was that really super hot for you? That was super hot for me. There was this guy there that was.
Starting point is 00:12:17 like stripped down to his boxers and he was one of the few people watching us it was a small party i would i would say there weren't more than 20 people there there there were really not that many people there and he was watching us and he like asked if we mind if he like takes his dick out and strokes it while he watches and we're like yeah of course please do yeah and my husband always looks back at it now and he's like i wish we would have asked him to play with us like he was so hot but he wasn't out to me as by it So yeah, that's basically it for that story. We finished up with them. They invited us back to their place.
Starting point is 00:12:50 So like we have a bunch of toys and mess. And I was like, no, thank you. And yeah, so we left and had great sex about it for like a week. And then kind of like, but just kind of, that was it. Like we just had our own sex life exploring things and kinks and fetishes and like what we are into and stuff like that. So we bought more toys. We have a pretty nice collection now. And we got like floggers.
Starting point is 00:13:20 I got a writing crop. I got all kinds of stuff like that. And he had told me that he likes to fantasize about scenarios. And he had this dildo. He has this like beautiful dildo, seven inches. And it's like the ideal penis. And it's like nice and soft. and it he showed me what he did he's like yeah actually like when we're 60 because he loves
Starting point is 00:13:49 6090 like that's like his favorite position so when we do that he's like I actually suck on the dodo while I'm eating your pussy and I'm like oh interesting so there would be times where he would take it out of me and I didn't know what he was doing I didn't know if he was like adding a lube or whatever but he would put it in his mouth a little bit and then put it back inside of me And so it was like, I have no idea what's going on down there. I'm fucking blind. Like, it's all I can see is his dick and balls in my face. So, so yeah, he would like, he like slowly started kind of coming out to me about this.
Starting point is 00:14:25 But then my husband and I are like, have different ideas of when he originally came out to me and spy. He said that it was before the dungeon party. I do not remember it being before the dungeon party. but at some point between the dungeon party and our one year anniversary, he did kind of start alluding to that. He was telling me about the dildo and he likes to fantasize about it. And he kind of played it off like, I've always fantasized about it, but I've never done anything. And he didn't, he kind of like made it relatable to my situation, which was that, besides
Starting point is 00:15:01 the three-sum I had with that woman, that I've never had an experience with another woman that was, like, in my controller. That was, like, ideal for me. Yeah. So yeah, he played it off me well. And at some point between the dungeon party and our one year anniversary, so that's a six month period, he had proposed to me that he wanted to see me with another man. And so he was like, I just want to see you be a fucking slut. I want to slut you out to a guy and watch you get fucked and watch you get pleasure. And I think it'd be really fun to watch. And I was like, what? Am I being fucking set up right now? Like, I, I honestly thought that he was fucking with me. Yeah, I think unless you know that that's like a real kink and that's, you know, before my show, I had not one guy friend that cop to anything like that to me. I had no idea.
Starting point is 00:15:54 I really did. I mean, like compersion is a very real thing. Yeah. I think God for the internet because I would not know anything about a lot of the stuff that I've learned over the last six years. Yeah. So when he brought it up to you, you were like, is this a trap? lot of women don't know what to make of it because it's like it goes against everything we would think a guy would feel totally and it's it's societal norms have really fucked us up as a sure
Starting point is 00:16:21 whole because we think of monogamy as the only way and we think that any even even looking at another person I had problems with porn in the beginning and it's still a point of contention where it's like it gets brought up in arguments like you used to fuck with me about porn. Yes, yes, I did. I don't know. Yeah, you're just like you could help it. Rooted insecurities. I was obese for a lot of my life. And, oh, that's interesting. Yeah, I lost 100 pounds, like right around the time that we met, I was like halfway. Yeah. Into my weight loss journey, if you want to call it that. But yeah, so he told me that he was wanting to see me with another man. And so I was like, after the initial shock of it, and I'm like, okay, am I being
Starting point is 00:17:07 set up. If I say what's the wrong answer here? Is there a right answer? Yeah. Also, does this mean that if you let me fuck another guy, that I have to let you fuck another woman. That's a typical. It was just like a lot of being as jealous and insecure as I was or jealous because of the insecurity. I was like so, but this does not mean that you can fuck other women. Like you understand. And he was like, absolutely, I don't want to fuck other women. Don't worry about it. It's fine. And so he like went on, I think it was Reddit and posted an ad looking for a guy. And we ended up finding a BBC who was really fucking cool. Like I remember meeting up with him for the first date or whatever for the intro.
Starting point is 00:17:54 And we like went into the bar and he was there. He was really cute. He was fit. He had a beard. He was like he was just chill. And he wasn't aggressive or anything like that. he was just like it's whatever whatever's whatever everything is everything man like just totally cool dude yeah he and so we just kind of talked about like how it's going to work he still come back to
Starting point is 00:18:16 my place we'll hang out we'll have sex and then y'all will leave and so we're like cool I'm so my husband's there but he's he's assisting like it was essentially it was a threesome he wasn't like it wasn't like he was just sitting in a chair watching, which I kind of thought was how it was going to be. So the first time it was just, it was pretty cut and drive pretty straightforward. And I even mentioned to him as we were walking up the stairs, I was like, it feels like when I used to go on dates on Tinder, like when I would just go hook up with people on Tinder, but you're like escorting me. It's so fucking weird. Right. Like this is such a bizarre feeling.
Starting point is 00:19:02 And it's our one year. year anniversary. We're literally like, this is our one year anniversary. It's interesting. You guys are always doing things. It was like your birthday when you went to the BDSM club on your anniversary. You're fucking another guy. It's hilarious. It's always a special occasion. Yeah, I like it. I like it. But wait, so let me ask you this. Did you guys have any rules going in? Did you have the no kissing rule or anything or was it sort of anything goes? We didn't have a no kissing rule. at that point. Okay.
Starting point is 00:19:34 So it wasn't, the only rule was like condoms and no anal. And that was, I don't really remember us like going over any rules other than that. The guy didn't try to kiss me a single time. So that didn't really come up. Happen anyway. Okay. And then, so what went down? Like everything did you like, and how was it great?
Starting point is 00:19:59 What was that experience? It was fucking awesome. It was so much fun. Um, he was a little big for me, to be honest. So there were times, because my husband's like, I don't know, we'll see him again because he's, he looked like he was hurting you. Yeah. I was like, yeah, I liked it. But it, yeah, it was big.
Starting point is 00:20:19 We, yeah, we did the whole nine. We started out with four play like fucked his dick, which he absolutely loved. And then he fucked me doggy style. I got a spit rose. So it was like my, my night of first for sure. I like put both of their dick from my mouth at the same time. And this guy is a professional photographer, by the way. So he like took some beautiful shot.
Starting point is 00:20:41 Oh, wow. But yeah, it was a night at first. There was a point where I was like sucking black guy's dick while my husband was fucking used to dodo. There's, there was the spit roast. There's my husband is acting as kind of an assist in this situation. Like he is, he isn't participating with the guy, but he is like participating. with me and also here's some lube here's i'm gonna play with your clit while he fucks your pussy or
Starting point is 00:21:09 you know that kind of stuff and we had a great time it was really fun the guy ended up fucking coming in my eyeball though that was one thing that sucked so bad it fucking burns i was like never again am i going to look at it as he's about to come yeah so yeah that was it we came out of that with this kind of like excitement like holy fucking shit like we did that it was awesome It was crazy. I can't believe it. And he was so nice. So it was all in all. It was a really great experience.
Starting point is 00:21:38 We hung out. And you got pictures. I fucked a shitload of noise and soaked his carpet. So yeah, after that story, we like went home and we're all giddy and fucking in the car, you know, like, oh, my God. That was so crazy. That was so fun. Like my pussy's sore. Oh, my God, I can't wait to fuck you.
Starting point is 00:21:53 Like just all this stuff. Like, we were so stoked. And we, we, we, it didn't. enhanced our sex life a lot. We started getting a little more adventurous. And he started, after that, he started kind of coming out a little more and more about his byness through that whole thing. And he was like, well, I have actually sucked a dick before. Oh. And I was like, oh. Let's hear about this. And it's crazy because he was so fucking nervous. Of course. And one of the things that, like, the fines are there. Yeah. When I go back and look at it from my.
Starting point is 00:22:31 perspective now, hindsight's 2020, but I was always into gay porn a little. Like, I would, every once in a while, if it wasn't lesbians, I would look at men on men or bisexual porn. And I'm not super into porn anyway, but when I did, those were like the things that I watched. Interesting. They were like Fimdom or lesbian or guy on guy. I especially love to see men being sensual with each other. But whenever my husband would bring up porn, I would be like, well, let's watch this.
Starting point is 00:23:05 And I would pick out like a guy on guy's scenario. And he would get fucking pissed, like mad. Oh, that's the tell. Whoa. Yeah, for real. I did not think about it back then. Yeah. I thought that he, I think he, well, I thought he thought I was trying to like sabotage his porn enjoyment.
Starting point is 00:23:28 In fact, that was something that we had talked about later on where he was like, the whole reason I was. get mad at you for wanting to watch that shit is because I thought you were fucking with me. And I didn't want you. I didn't want to get aroused by it and have that expose me. And I was like, dude. So yeah, we started talking more about it. And then a few months later, we started, we posted another ad. And this time, I believe we were on FetLife.
Starting point is 00:23:56 And we found this guy who was, he was hot, he had a big dick. seemed nice enough. And we had arranged for a play date. And at the last minute, he, like, canceled. He was like, oh, I got called into work. And I was like, oh, that sucks. Like, I just shaved my pussy and everything or whatever. I don't know. I said some shit to, like, guilt trip him a little bit. And he's like, let me see what I can do. And so he ended up getting out of work. I don't know if it had just been an excuse or what. I don't, you know, whatever. But that was. That was. And was one of the instances that was like the first time that we really had problems. So it was only our second experience. But this guy did a fucking number on me. And this was the turning point when
Starting point is 00:24:44 we kind of called off kink altogether. So we made arrangements to go to his apartment. And we got liquor on the way there. So that was the first mistake. We started drinking when we got there. And we both got pretty, pretty sloshed, like pretty good and fucked up. And my husband and I, so we all started fooling around. We went to his bedroom. And this guy was a Dom for sure. He actually labeled himself as a primal predator, I think, or primal. What do they call themselves?
Starting point is 00:25:20 I don't, I'm so far separated from the kink community at this point. I'm just like, I don't even fucking remember. But it was like something like that primal something. And he, he fucked the shit out of me. Like we, 69. There was a point where he like, I was 69 with my husband and he was fucking me from the back. And he like took his dick out of my pussy and put it into my husband's mouth. And I didn't know that was happening.
Starting point is 00:25:50 But when my husband told me, but, you know, I thought it was hot. But at some point, he was like, fucking the shit had me for an hour straight. and he had he had whipped me with like canes and paddles and he like left my ass all bruised up and red and and I liked it kind of I kind of like impact play but not like to the point where it's it's leaving like crazy imprints and like marks and bruise and injuries I look at that as injuries and when I see that shit I'm just kind of like some people will get beaten so badly that they bleed. Yeah. I'm just like, dude, what the fuck? That is serious. And that's where he got me. But we did all of that stuff and I sucked his dick in the kitchen. Then we went to his room and we
Starting point is 00:26:37 were fucking all three of us together. And like I said, he had he had flipped it into my husband's mouth a couple times with and I didn't know. I couldn't see. But then he fucked me so I don't know how to what to call this. But he ended up putting me into a subspace, which is I, I learned. of all these terms after the fact because I went through a really low point, dark period after this all happened, that I had to do a bunch of research and find out what the fuck was going on. But some space is supposed to be amazing. It was. Yeah, no, no.
Starting point is 00:27:09 It was. Yeah. So it was like an out-of-body experience. Yeah. And I remember my husband, like, went to go pee and he came back and I was just kind of like, holy fuck, like looking up at the ceiling, like just couldn't even comprehend what was happening. And I remember the guy saying, oh, no, she's gone, dude. She's not even here right now. Because he was like, my husband's, baby, are you okay? And he's, oh, she's, she's totally out of it.
Starting point is 00:27:36 She's gone. She's, she's not even here right now. And I was like, oh, my God, trying to snap back to reality and just come back to my senses. And so we kind of like took a break after that, a little breather. And my husband and I, like, cuddled on the bed for a minute while homeboy was like in the kitchen doing whatever. And my husband ended up falling asleep. And I was like, I didn't know what to do at that point. I tried to wake him up. He wouldn't wake up.
Starting point is 00:28:06 He was passed out. He was drunk. And so I just kind of like ended up hanging out with the guy and let my husband kind of sleep it off because he was eventually going to have to get us home. And I didn't want to spend the night at this fucking dude's house. Like he's a total stranger. And so I was. let him sleep for a while. It probably was like an hour or two. But in that time, like, we had just
Starting point is 00:28:32 started out when the guy and I were hanging out in the living room, we had started out by just hanging out. Like, we were just talking. And I was like, I'm just going to wait for my husband to wake up, like, whatever. And he was like, well, I'm going to fuck you right here on his couch. And I was like, oh, I don't know. Like, I don't want to do anything I'm not supposed to do. I don't know if that's allowed or whatever. He ended up talking me into it. And he did fuck me on the couch. And the the whole time I was like scared that my husband was going to wake up and I was going to get in trouble and I didn't know how he was going to react because it's not something we had talked about. Yeah. You know, we hadn't talked about like, oh, well, if one of us isn't in the room, everything has to stop or if one of us is asleep or it's just and in hindsight, in hindsight, maybe it should have been common sense to me.
Starting point is 00:29:12 Maybe I should have, I should have thought about what I would want in that situation and I didn't. I was drunk to and I was, I was overcome with whatever fucking oxytocin or that was like making me just. I don't know. I can't blame it on anything other than myself. It's my fault. I did tell him afterwards. So the whole time that he and I were hanging out. So we like fucked on the couch for a little while and we like took a break. We went fucked on the balcony. But at one point he was like trying to talk me into thinking that my husband was gay. Like he was just talking straight shit about my husband. Oh my dad. What a doucheback. He was only my boyfriend at the time. And we had only been together for a year and a half. And there were a lot of things I didn't know at that point about my husband. But I was like, dude, he's not fucking gay. No, he's not. He's like, if I went and woke him up right now, I could bend him on this couch and fuck him. I was like, what the fuck are you talking? I don't even know where this is coming from. Why are you saying this stuff? We don't know you. He was like, fully trying to convince me that he was gay. And I was like, no, he's not. Just leave me alone. Okay. I was like, okay, we're done. And so I ended up going and waking my husband up after a couple hours. I think it was like probably two hours. And don't get me wrong. Like we had some good sex. There was actually one point we're wrong. on the patio and he had me bent over the railing and a couple came downstairs out of their apartment and they were like, holy shit, they saw us. Yeah. And we like stopped and they're like, no, keep going. And I was like, oh my God. That's right up your alley. That's right up my fucking alley.
Starting point is 00:30:41 But yeah. Otherwise, I woke my husband up and I was like, okay, like we got to go. We got to get the fuck out of here. Yeah. And he was like, holy fucking shit. Like I have, I've been asleep. Oh my God. What happened? And I was like, we'll talk in the car. Let's just go. And. And, So we said bye, gathered our things, and we left, and he started asking questions. And I told him everything. I told him what happened. I told him what he said. I told him everything.
Starting point is 00:31:08 But the next few days, and he wasn't, he wasn't mad. He was a little disappointed. And he was like, I know we didn't talk about it beforehand. But I wish in that situation you would have thought about how you would feel if I did something like that. I wish in that situation that you would have looked out for me more. And I was like, I told. totally understand. I get it. I fucked up in that situation. But the following few days were
Starting point is 00:31:32 even fucking worse. There's a little something called sub-drop. And so when I said sub-space earlier, subspace is wonderful. Sub-drop is one of the fucking worst experiences I've ever had in my life. Like, it's like after doing ecstasy. Yeah. It's like depleting your entire serotonin, like reservoir. Wow, I've never heard that. Yeah, it took a lot for me to research it and find out what was going on because I'm just like, I feel terrible. Yeah, interesting.
Starting point is 00:32:08 And not only that, but this guy is like still trying to reach out to me on the low. And I ended up having to tell my husband, I mean, it really fucked up our relationship and I honestly didn't know if we were going to make it through it. So we had a lot to work through there. And I think that my husband, I am actually. actually really grateful for the fact that he listens to your show because he can learn a lot about this stuff. He didn't believe me about Suddrop for a while. He didn't, he just thought it, he thought I was in love with the guy. I'm like, I'm fucking, you know. I was like, I don't, I have no love
Starting point is 00:32:37 for that guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No. But anyways, so that, that, that was that. We made it through. We learned a lot. Then I said something about the no kissing rule earlier on how we didn't have one at the time when we first started. We actually ended up fucking this guy. And my husband felt left out of the whole situation. He was like, I didn't, I didn't like, we, we fucked him. We actually sucked his dick together. That was the first dick that we sucked together. That's right.
Starting point is 00:33:03 And that was amazing. I was super excited about it. And I told him, he thought he was going to be less of a man. If he did these things and then me, I was like, no, dude, I love it. Yeah. So that was the first cock that we shared between our mouths. That was fun. And, but when we were leaving, the guy gave me a little peck on the lips.
Starting point is 00:33:23 And once we were gone, my husband was like, I fucking hated that. I don't want you to kiss him guys. Yeah. And I was like, okay, yeah, I totally get it. It's just, I know it sounds stupid, but it's too intimate, and I don't want you kissing other men. And so I was like, okay, like totally understood. But he also said that he had felt left out of that situation for the most part, which is what I meant when I said I was not as attentive as I should have been in those situations, which I've learned.
Starting point is 00:33:48 I've learned to be better about. But let's see. So next, there was. the oh god we found this guy so there was another guy we would almost do these like situations threesomes for about four years just with other guys right yeah with one other guy we did it like clockwork every six months it was really weird like he would just he would like I don't want to do it all the time but every six months would roll around he would be like I'm craving cock and so we ended up meeting this guy who ended up being like our
Starting point is 00:34:23 dream third. Like he was by, he was uncircumcised, which I fucking love. We both love an uncircumcised intact cock. And he was totally open-minded. So we like went and hung out with him for the first time. We met up with him. And we both sucked his dick. They both ate me out at the same time. Like they made me come several times. I made him come his fucking ass off. He got his ass eaten by my husband. And I should say my husband is mostly just orally by like he only likes to suck dick. And he's kind of selective about it. Yeah. He doesn't do like any butt stuff or whatever typically.
Starting point is 00:35:01 But he did eat his ass, which was fucking hot. Ugh. But anyway. So he kind of became our go-to for those situations. So from then on, we were just kind of like, if we're going to call anyone, we might as well just call him. Because I don't think it's going to get any better than that. And so we went. through all of this.
Starting point is 00:35:22 And we ended up having a conversation about four years into the hot wife thing. And he was like, I think that we should start trying couples. And I think it would be good to bring a feminine energy into all this. And so I flipped the fuck out. I was like, what? I kind of, I just felt like I was in danger immediately. No, but he was the one that said it, not you. Exactly.
Starting point is 00:35:48 Right. Yeah. Like, I think we should try couples. I think it would be fun. for you to get to play with women and experiment with women more. And I think it would be fun for me to have somebody else to have sex with and it not just be a guy. I think that it would be. And I was like so shut off to it. I was so fucking averse too.
Starting point is 00:36:03 I was like, can't do this. I can't see you with another woman. Interesting. Okay. And it kind of ended up, we were on vacation at the time with our family. And it ended up being horrible.
Starting point is 00:36:17 We were at such an impasse. And I honestly didn't know if we were going to make it through that one either. Just because just to him bringing it up to you. Like that's what you. Just him bring it up. Yeah, of course. I break the fuck out. And I was so terrified.
Starting point is 00:36:29 I thought that he was going to try to leave me. I thought, I don't know. I just. Listen, most women would feel that way. Okay, you're not like a, you're not like the weird one in this situation.
Starting point is 00:36:39 It's a normal human being emotion to be jealous and not want the person you love to be fucking somebody else. Look, your guy didn't even want you to have a peck of your mouth by a guy. He had the same experience. So it's normal. Yeah. Yeah. And I was like, you were built for this.
Starting point is 00:36:55 This was your idea. Like you were the one who wanted to see me with another one. I was like, I was not wired for this. I'm different. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. But I love that on some part of this story. I know you get past it because you do it, which is going to be so interesting.
Starting point is 00:37:08 How does the girl who's so horrified by it work through it? Okay. So that was like July of what last year or something. And I start kind of trying to. trying to think about it. And one of the ways, it's funny, one of the ways that I would try to get over jealousy issues would be fantasizing about him with other women while we were having sex. But I never said it out loud. I wasn't like, I'm, this is what's getting me off right now. Yeah, interesting.
Starting point is 00:37:34 And trying to turn my jealousy into compersion. Yeah. That's how I did it. I started therapy because my mom had died at some point in all this. And so I just kind of like, I obviously talk to her about all of our lifestyle stuff. I talk to her once every two weeks and I'm able to get all this stuff out. Journaling has helped, like all of these things. It's just I like to analyze my feelings. I'm a very, I like to look inward and kind of analyze what's going on. How can I do things differently?
Starting point is 00:38:04 I don't want to be one of those people who blames everybody else for the way that I feel. Yeah. So I am trying to do the work and be better and be more flexible and meet and meet his needs because he's meeting mine and even though he was the one who asked for it, I enjoyed it, whatever. So I finally came around and in October of last year we hooked up with our first couple, which was super fun. I didn't get to, at first it was kind of hard to see him with another woman, but I remember one of the things that he would say a lot when he was kind of trying to like, not, I don't
Starting point is 00:38:39 want to say talk me into it, but you know, get me comfortable with it. Was that you're going to be having fun with the husband while I'm having fun with woman, you're not going to know what the fuck is going on over here. Like, you're not going to be, you're not going to care what the fuck's going on every year as long as you're getting yours. I was like, yeah, actually, that's kind of true. Like, I didn't think that would be possible, but it totally was. Like, that was the case.
Starting point is 00:39:02 I was like, I'm getting fucked over here real nice. So you can, you do your thing, babe. But with this couple, was the woman by, were you going to get to be with her too? I did get to be with her. Okay. And I kind of like made sure that everybody knew. that I was new at this. And I was like, so I'm not comfortable going down on a woman just yet.
Starting point is 00:39:22 I don't know what I'm going to be comfortable with. So it's kind of like I kind of sold myself as a pillow princess and she was totally fine with that. I know some people hate pillow princesses, but and I'm not that way anymore at all. Yeah, but the first time, listen, I think what trumps everything is honesty. I love that you just put that out there because you were nervous. You're like, you're not going to pretend that you're going down on her and ruling the scene. Holy. Yeah, pillow princess is the way to.
Starting point is 00:39:46 go. I love it. You refraved it perfectly. And I don't want to give somebody expectations for, you know, like, yeah, I'm bisexual. Yeah, totally. Why the fuck aren't you eating my pussy? Yeah. Not bisexual. Yeah, okay. But yeah, so we did that. And then that was around the time that we decided to get married. We were like, fuck this. We're going to be in the lifestyle. We're not going anywhere. We're going to get married. I just wanted to add that layer of security. It felt like a layer of security for me to be like, we, I'm committed to you. You're committed to me. Like, we are in this together. And so we ended up deciding to elope and go to Vegas. But just before we did that, we decided to have one ass rendezvous with a guy. And my husband found this dude who was looking
Starting point is 00:40:29 for a wanted to fuck. He was a gold star gay. And he wanted to fuck. And he wanted to fuck his first pussy. And he, we ended up making arrangements to meet with him. We got a hotel room and everything. and he wanted me to call him slurs while he fucked me and talked shit to him, like talk straight, mad shit to him. So that was really interesting and fun. And he ended up, and it was cool because he's gay. Obviously, my husband can fuck with him. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:41:00 So he ended up sucking his dick and he came all over my husband's chest. That's the first time that my husband ever got nutted on. It was so fucking hot. Oh, my God. It was so hot. It's imprinted in my brain forever. But he was gay, so he was not very good at sex. So then we ended up playing our dream third afterwards.
Starting point is 00:41:20 And we're like, hey, what you have to? Oh, my God, that same night? That same night? That same night. Yeah. And then, of course, my husband's like, you fucking slight. You just fuck two guys in the same night. And I, like, turned them on so much.
Starting point is 00:41:32 That was like two weeks before we got married. So, yeah, that was that was that. And then we kind of like went down this whole road of, trying to figure out where we fit into the lifestyle and like finding out all the rules and stuff. So we went to our very first lifestyle party in the summer. And we were so nervous. It was like a DTF party like down to fuck, which I don't really understand the difference between a regular fucking party and a DTF party.
Starting point is 00:42:08 They seem the same to me now that I've been to more and more. but the we were so nervous we like pulled up to the front driveway and we're like should we go home or should we even do this this is terrifying we didn't know what kind of people were going to be in there we thought they were all going to be like hot super fit gym bods you just don't know what to expect so we ended up getting the balls to go in and we met the hosts and we like took a tour and it was really cool and nice and they had a bunch of playrooms at a pool and a cabana and like we just started mingling and we ended up having an orgy with a bunch of people. And so, so it was a lot of fun. I was starting to get more like comfortable with seeing him with other women. And that's when the no
Starting point is 00:42:56 kissing rule went out the window. We were just kind of like, well, if he's included now, we can, we can both kiss other people. But we also ended up doing a 12 person orgy at at a sex swingers club here in town for his birthday, which we're actually planning to do again this weekend. So you guys like the orgies? We do. We really like orgies. I do.
Starting point is 00:43:23 I am a huge fan, the more the merrier. I'm like, let's get this train rolling. And I just like a room full of bodies, especially when I can just like hop around and fuck with this person and then fuck with that person and then go over there to that person. And like it's guys and girls. And it's just dicks and pussies and boobs everywhere and ass.
Starting point is 00:43:46 It's awesome. But in those orgies, because your guys over there, fucking girls, doing whatever he's doing too. Like you're totally cool with that. At some point, because you said you did turn your jealousy into compersion.
Starting point is 00:43:59 Does it turn you on now to see your guy with a female? It does. It does. Yeah. Okay, cool. It does. Yeah. I remember seeing the first couple that we,
Starting point is 00:44:09 were with one-on-one was I remember her doing something with her husband where she like came up behind him while he was fucking me and she pushed his ass into me and like she so that he could thrust harder and so I was like oh my god that's like a a beautiful assist so I started trying to get more involved with him when he was with other women rather than it just being him over there and me over here. I like a group scenario, which is one cool, really cool thing about having a bi-husband
Starting point is 00:44:42 is that it's more of like a team effort rather than a swap. I hate the word swap. Yeah, I love that. It feels gross. I like a merger. So, yeah, well, I'll go and assist him and it actually really turns me on now to think about.
Starting point is 00:44:58 And also to like team up on other women or just other people, like either going down on a guy together or pleasing a woman together, like all of that stuff it actually really turns me on now i i i can't say that i'm like a full compersionist and it takes work and sometimes i have low moments where i feel bad about myself and i start to get a little insecure but i remind myself like this man is committed to me he has never given me any reason to think that he was ever interested in any other person romantically
Starting point is 00:45:29 it's all physical it's all sexual like it we don't even know these people so not on a level where it's like intimate. Yeah, of course. And let me just tell you, the most professional swingers, open, non-monogamous people have those days. I'm always like one day the wind can just blow a certain way and you're going to feel insecure or jealous.
Starting point is 00:45:51 That's real life. And that happens to everybody. And so that's like normal. I hear that in most people's stories. And the people that don't bring that up, I think they just forget about that one day that it happened. When I think what's most important is that you could put that on the table and be like, hey, babe, I feel, I don't know.
Starting point is 00:46:06 Why, but I felt insecure? Or you take it to your therapist. You just like talk. It's really nice having people to relate to on that kind of stuff. We ended up joining a bunch of Facebook groups. Yeah, there's a lot of them out there, Facebook groups. Yeah, who knew? There's one in particular that is just for women.
Starting point is 00:46:26 Oh, interesting. In the lifestyle. And they all bounce ideas off people or bounce their feelings. But it's kind of like an open diary. Can I get this advice from you? or have you ever felt this way? Or it's, and it's such a wonderful space to be able to kind of just be vulnerable and open up and get other people. Because when you don't feel alone, like it doesn't feel as hard.
Starting point is 00:46:49 It doesn't feel like you can't talk to anybody about it and you can't, like, you're the only one suffering through this. And you're pissing your partner off by feeling this way, but you don't really know how to handle it. So you can get feedback from other people who are, have been in similar situations. or have had similar feelings or struggle with the same issues. So it's really nice to be able to know that you're not the only person that's struggling with stuff like that. And there's so many different people with so many different dynamics, too, after going to like parties and meet and greets and also seeing people talk about it on social media.
Starting point is 00:47:24 Like, it's not great, totally like out of the ordinary for someone to get a little upset at something that they see their partner doing or they're just not used to it. But the way that we started out, that was one of my fears from the get-go. Does this mean I'm going to have to see you with another woman at some point? And I remember kind of referring back to that and being like, you said, you said you wouldn't do this. Yeah. And it's just, it's, I hate to use the word fair, but it really is. It's only fair if it's something that he wants for me to consider it.
Starting point is 00:47:57 So I did. And I'm so fucking glad that I did because we've made so many great friends in the lifestyle. And we have, especially like our buy friends, our buy experiences with the by couples that we've found. Because you can't really be an openly by man at Swingers party. I know. I know. It's weird. It's really stupid and I fucking hate the double standard.
Starting point is 00:48:18 But yeah, you can't really be an openly bi guy at a party. You might scare other couples from wanting to mess with you because for some reason, men think, straight men think that just because somebody is by and will suck dick means they have to suck their dick. Yeah, but you know how many guys in there are doing it all on the DL? And it's just that it's just still a stigma attached to it and they can't be open about it even in that world. So you have your buy couples. Let me ask you one last question and you're going to have to send me picks and stuff for my Patreon. I give you access to my Discord. But how do you feel all of this has changed your relationship?
Starting point is 00:48:58 Oh, my God. So it has made us more able to communicate. openly with each other, it has made our sex lives insane. It is, especially after a party or something like that, we're just like fucking rabid for each other for like at least a week or two. And we're more than usual. We're typically pretty fucking sexual. But after experiences like that, it's, whoo, hot. But it's, yeah, I think on a deeper level, it has made it to where we are able to connect more openly with each other and be like, have conversations about things that most couples don't talk about. A lot of couples have kind of passive relationships where they're just,
Starting point is 00:49:47 they're just there for each other. And after a certain amount of years or a certain amount of time, things kind of become just routine. And it's, it's so different for us now because we've been like this since we were like a year in. But the swinging thing, we do it way more often now that like I said with guys it was like once every six months. But now we we typically go to a party like once a month. And another thing is that we've found friends. We didn't have community before this. We didn't, I go to yoga and I have like people I see there, but I don't get their phone numbers and talk to them every once in a while or hang out with them or anything like that. We didn't go to church or anything like that. Like we just didn't really have community and now we do. But, you know,
Starting point is 00:50:31 Yeah, it's, I think for the most part, to in summation, it's really improved our sex lives with each other. It's really improved our appreciation towards one another. And it has really improved our communication. Yeah, I hear that all the time because you have to over communicate in situations like this and that there lies the reason why a lot of times people that are in this lifestyle, what people don't understand is they're like, they feel closer and they have more intimacy between each other because they are talking more than the Vanilla couple that's on autopilot Groundhog Day, same shit every day. And they're not really talking because they don't have to.
Starting point is 00:51:09 If I could count up the amount of minutes or hours, it would become days and weeks that we have just talked about lifestyle stuff. It comes up a lot and it's something you do have to over communicate. When we started setting boundaries and making rules and all of that stuff, we were like, holy shit, we didn't even know that this was something we had to talk about. it is. It's just, and we have to make sure we cover all of our bases because, yes, like, the main goal is to have fun and to be safe. But there are so many other things that you don't know that you need to prepare for or that you need to, you know, like be aware. Yeah, that could come up.
Starting point is 00:51:49 And so it has faced us with a lot of challenges emotionally and just, yeah, mostly emotionally. But I think working through those challenges always make you feel closer to somebody if you can work through them because that's real life anyway. Every relationship goes through tough times. And if you can make it through to the other side, you do feel closer because you've been through something together. And the stuff that you have guys have pushed past is pretty amazing because you push past like a real big insecurity that was like plaguing you your whole life when you've been able to work through that through what you and your husband has been doing. so I think that that's amazing. Do me a favor. What do we call you?
Starting point is 00:52:30 Oh, Sunny. Do me a favor, Sunny. Send me in some picks. Like for my Patreon. If you listen to my show, I always get like hot picks for Patreon, for my Patreon. Anonymous picks.
Starting point is 00:52:41 And then I will give you and your husband free access to my Discord and you guys could go in there and do whatever you want in there. You could do rated X stuff there, anything. And if you don't want to go in there, send it to me and I'll post it for you
Starting point is 00:52:53 because I've been having a hard time getting people to go and do their thing. And then it's so annoyed. So I'm just like, just send it to me. I'll do it. You know what I mean? There is a guest. Discord kind of like pisses me off and confuses me sometimes.
Starting point is 00:53:02 Yeah. So if you want, you could send, if you send me anything extra, I'll post it up there and say this is anyway. Should I leave my face out of it? Yeah. I think so. I keep people anonymous. It's up to you.
Starting point is 00:53:12 Some people don't aren't anonymous. It's your thing on Discord on Patreon. I'm going to change your voice here. So you're anonymous on my show. So I typically cut out people's faces for my Patreon only because I think you just never know. I don't know. I just, I just do. So thank you so much for calling in and telling me your guy's story. I loved it. It was, it's super interesting. Thank you for having me. Yeah, it's going to help a lot of people, I think, to learn from other people's story for sure. Hell yeah. That's great. I'm excited.
Starting point is 00:53:38 Awesome. Thanks, honey. Send me the pictures. Bye. Thanks, Kathy. Bye. Okay. I just want to tell you before you go that my book, it's called strictly anonymous confession, secret sex lives of total strangers is now available not only in paperback and ebook, but you can pre-order the audiobook. It's still not going to be out until August 25th, but you can pre-order it. The book is basically 17 different stories taken from my show. I kind of picked one story from each category that I talk about on my show. Like there's a hot wife story.
Starting point is 00:54:12 There's a cuck queen story. There's a cuck story. There's a gang-bang girl story. Like I said, 17 stories. And they're all told in the third person. and they're all true. I took the interview and rewrote it in the third person. And I wouldn't really call it like a total erotica book.
Starting point is 00:54:31 Think like Penthouse letters. It's more direct. It's not so over the top like erotica. I don't really like that kind of vibe, right? But these are true stories. 17 of them. They're really short chapters, easy read. You could read, you know, one or two and then skip around.
Starting point is 00:54:48 You could read the whole book. It's available in eback format. back format. And finally, the audio book is available coming out August 25th, but you could pre-order it now. And if you buy my book in any format or pre-order it, I will throw in a complimentary link to my Discord. My Discord does not disappoint. Okay. There's no way you get into my Discord any other way than getting the link from me. Okay. I give it to people who buy my book. There's tons of people in there. Everybody shares content with each other. And that's what you get to do there. You could your own pictures and videos. There's tons of channels. We have lots of contests where you can win a lot of
Starting point is 00:55:27 money. It's a super fun place to be. It's a total strictly anonymous community and you will love it. I will be giving anyone who buys my book access to my Discord. It's private, like I said. All you got to do is email me a screenshot of your purchase, whether you did the audio book, the ebook, or the paperback. Send it to me at strictly anonymous podcast at gmail.com. That's strictly Anonymous Podcast at gmail.com and I will send you the link to Discord. So anyway, thanks so much for tuning in. This is the Strictly Anonymous podcast. Hey everyone, thanks for tuning in to this week's episode. If you want to be on the Strictly Anonymous podcast because you have an interesting, naughty story to tell while we're meeting Anonymous, you could be on the show. Send me an email
Starting point is 00:56:26 Strictly Anonymous Podcasts at jemal.com or go to my website, strictly anonymouspodcast.com and click on Be on the Show. If you have a naughty confession, call my confessions hotline 347, 4203579. That's 347, 4203579. You could call that number 247. If you want to follow the show, follow me at Strict Anonymous on either Instagram or Twitter. That's at Strict Anonymous. And if you want to sign up for my Patreon, you're not only support.
Starting point is 00:56:56 my show, but you're going to get all of these episodes early and ad free. You're going to get anonymous picks of all of my guests. Most of the girls send me in anonymous hot picks of themselves, and some of the guys are sending me in anonymous picks as well. You also get access to my private discord where people are getting super naughty. If you sign up for my discord, you could post whatever you want and talk to my other listeners. To sign up for my Patreon, just go to patreon.com slash strictly anonymous podcast. That's patreon.com slash strictly anonymous podcast. The links and everything else I spoke about are all in the description. Thanks so much for listening.

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