Stuff You Should Know - SYSK's Guatemalan Adventure, Part One

Episode Date: May 18, 2010

Josh and Chuck share the story of their recent eye-opening trip to Guatemala, which was sponsored by a nonprofit organization called Cooperative for Education, in this very special episode of Stuff You Should Know. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Hola, bienvenidos al podcast. And what the heck was that? That was not you, my friend. No, it wasn't. Clearly, that was the booming voice of our buddy that we met down there who had such an impressive voice for radio. We said, we've got to get this guy

to record our podcast intro if we can use it. Yeah, he works at one of the schools we went to. And he was emceeing an event. And we're like, holy cow. Yeah, boy was he. He's the Guatemalan Mel Torme. The velvet fog. Yeah, and this is a very special pair of podcasts, right, Chuck?

Absolutely, our Guatemalan adventures. Yes, our Guatemalan, not there. In hours. Yeah, so Chuck and I and Jerry went down to Guatemala as many of the listeners know. Team SYSK, nice Chuck. And our eyes were open quite a bit. You could say that.

Yeah, we were originally going to go down. We should probably tell the backstory. Do you want to take it? Chuck loves emailing people back, especially when they say, do you want to come to Guatemala with us? We'll pay for it. That's pretty much how it went down. We got an email from a fan named Ann Dempsey, our buddy now.

Yes, she is a buddy. And she emailed us, I don't know, last year, last fall, and said, hey, I worked for this nonprofit called Cooperative for Education. And we do work in Guatemala supplying school books and computer centers for rural indigenous poor people in Guatemala. And check out our video and our website.

And we'd love it if you guys came down. We'll sponsor you to come down on this trip and see what you think about it. No strings attached, of course. We just think you would enjoy it and have a great experience. Right. It's pretty much how it happened. And we're like, what's the catch, Ann?

What's your game here? And she really was like, no, really, we just want you to see. I mean, if you guys want to mention us on the podcast or something, that'd be awesome because they are a donor-driven organization. Sure, like all nonprofits. Exactly. Because nonprofit can't turn a profit.

And so we went down there initially with the idea of, OK, we can't just completely throw to this organization. Let's do one on, can education alleviate poverty? Can it actually happen? Because that's what CoA does. Right. Well, originally, she just asked for us to come down, and then we were like, wait a minute, why don't we bring Jerry?

And then we can record down there and do our first on-the-road live recording type of deal. That was your idea. I think I was snacking while you were thinking about that. You were way down with it, though. Yeah. So Chuck, we never go anywhere unprepared, or I should say we never do anything.

I don't put on my pants without doing a little research first to find out if, overnight while I was sleeping, somebody figured out a better way to do it. Sure, yeah. And that is true. So we did some research on Guatemala. And I actually have a little story for you. The night before we left, I secretly

wrote a note to my dear Yumi telling her that I love her in case anything happens to me. I really wanted to make sure she knew that. I went down thinking that there's a 40% chance I was going to lose my life in Guatemala. Yeah, here's a little tip. If you guys are going to travel in some country that's not, like France or Italy, don't go to the State Department website.

Isn't that where you found it? Yeah. To read the travel warnings and all. Because you go to some of these countries that are a little off the beaten path. And they do. They make it sound like you will be lucky if you come back alive. Yeah, and that's exactly what I thought.

There was about 18 paragraphs. You were scared. That detail, kidnappings, ransoms, beheadings, straight up murder. It sounds like the country is just overrun with criminals. And disease. Yes. All manner of disease.

We got shots out the yin-yang. What did we get? Hep A, we got lockjaw, tetanus. Yeah, I got a, I wasn't dip-ted. It was tet something like that. I don't know what they shot me full of. I just hold my arm out when somebody presents me with a syringe.

Jerry got sick, actually, from the shots ahead of time. And a little bit of foreshadowing. Yes. Little Chucky got sick on the way back. Yeah, I think I ingested some ice from a rum drink or two on the last night. There's some precautions you have to take. Oh, and to finish my story, Yumi found the secret note

within hours of us leaving. So that worked out well. Yeah, it's great. All right, Chuck, we also did some background on the country. And one of the first things you find out about Guatemala when you look into it is that it had a pretty serious civil war. Yeah, for about 30 years. 36, my friend.

Yeah, that's what I said about. Right. Actually, that's about 40 years. Yeah. But sure, internal conflict formally ended in 1996. That's a long time to be under a civil war. Yeah, and actually, Guatemala is kind of this very put upon Latin American state.

It was run by a dictator up to the 40s when there was a, I don't know if it was a bloodless revolution, but I think it was one of the softer revolutions. And there were some liberals run in the show for about 10 years. And Guatemalans still refer to it as 10 years of spring, right, Chuck? Right. They refer to everything in regards to spring.

It's the land of eternal spring. 10 years of spring. The spring is like their spring spring. Yeah, so they had this great, this era, this time of peace. And part of that was involved taking land from the United Fruit Company, which owned a bunch of land it wasn't using and redistributing it to farmers, right? And United Fruit Company didn't like this.

Went to the CIA and said, hey, you know, you got some lefties in your backyard. Right. You should probably support a coup. CIA backed a coup. End of the 10 years of spring in the beginning of this civil war. Right.

Yeah. Which they did not refer to as 10 years of summer that followed the spring. No. No, it was pretty bad. And we'll get into a couple of stories. We got a couple of stories while we were down there. Yeah.

A couple of bad massacres that happened. Yeah, there were, I think, 100,000 killed. Right. And 100,000 disappeared is what they called them, which meant killed that they didn't find your body. Sure. And a later Truth Commission report concluded that 93% of the atrocities

committed in that civil war were done by government soldiers. Right. And actually, oftentimes, they disguise them to make it look like the guerrillas had done it, to drum up. Resentment. Antipathy. Sure.

Toward them, yeah. It was a bad 36 years for Guatemala. Yeah. And, like you said, it ended in 1996. So they're still kind of coming out of this, right? Oh, yeah, very much. So I think more than half of Guatemalans are direct descendants of the Mayan people.

And some of them, like you said, speak in the Mayan tongue still. Chichacal. Some of them don't speak Spanish. Right. Many of them. Right. I mean, if you run into a Guatemalan who speaks Spanish,

likely they're bilingual because they speak their indigenous Mayan tongue and Spanish as well. Right. They are one of the most populous Central American countries. Yeah. Most of their population is rural. And 56% live below the poverty line. And that's Guatemala's poverty line.

Yeah, that's a very important thing to point out. Not America's poverty line. It's very different. And they are mainly agricultural, labor, industry, services, industry is only about 15%. Yeah, their economy, the top three segments of their economy are agriculture, remittances, and tourism. Yeah, and remittances is people that

leave the country to go make a decent wage and then send money back home. Yeah, and that's the number two segment of their economy. Crazy. And with tourism as well, it's number three, but it's not entirely enormous. I think it makes up a pretty decent portion, but it's not that big of a moneymaker,

again, because of things like the State Department website and the fact that the Civil War only ended 14 years ago. Yeah, and I tell you, except for Antigua, which we'll get into, that was the end of our trip, we didn't see any tourists where we went. No, we went definitely off the beaten path of Coed, right? Yeah, way in country. We weren't hanging out on the beach or anything like that.

And Chuck, the educational scene ain't exactly happening down there. Yeah, which is why we went and why Coed is there. Clearly. Right, and you mentioned Anne. So here's a clip of Anne explaining a couple of a stat that we found a little staggering. We know that in rural indigenous villages in Guatemala,

three out of four students who start first grade will drop out of school before they complete sixth grade. So of the four of us standing here, only one of us would actually complete sixth grade. That would be Josh. That would be Josh, exactly. But that's good to know, Josh, that you would have been the one to stay in school.

It's possible. I think you were the clear winner. I appreciate that. Anne seemed to get a kick out of it. Yeah, and most students who live in Guatemala, she also told us during that interview, don't learn to read until maybe third grade. And the teachers don't really feel

that's a problem because they think that kids can't learn to read until that age. So they don't teach them. They're finding, thanks to groups like Coed, that, oh, wait, well, kids can actually start to learn to read in the first grade. If they have books. Right.

Which is a big deal. Yeah. So that's why they're there. The whole thing that all this hinges on. Yeah, but that's one of their big programs. We'll break that down a little bit later, right? Yeah. So that's why Coed's there.

That's why we got invited to see the stuff firsthand. And so we begin our trip. So Josh, we meet the three of us. Early. Early at Hartsfield, Jackson, here in Atlanta. It was so early. A bonus for us is there's a direct flight to Guatemala from Atlanta and just a scant.

What was it, like, three hours maybe? Three hours. Three hours and like 300 bucks for airfare round trip. Yeah, it was a pretty good deal. Yeah. So we get on the plane. Jerry and I, we sit together. Josh, Alex, not to sit with us because I love the quote you

gave me when I was like, what's up with that? You said you'd like to leave it to the gods. I'd like to leave it to fate to determine whether I'm going to die in an airplane crash or not. So Josh is behind us. And a funny nickname came out of this. Josh, I turn around at one point because we all know from previous podcasts that you don't love to fly.

No. It's not your favorite thing in the world. No, it's not. So you actually put the black blanket that they give you, Jerry, so cracking up right now, the black blanket that they give you over your entire body and head. Yeah. And it's like, Jerry, check it out.

And we started calling you what? The black ghost of the skies. The black ghost of the skies. Yeah, I went to sleep. I needed to sleep because I don't like to fly. It was so funny. And I had taken a painkiller. Right, so that did you right, right?

I didn't wake up until we landed, I think. That was pretty awesome. And I remember when we did land, I actually woke up right before we landed. And as we were coming in to the runway, right as we were touching down, I noticed there was like a line of airplanes that had apparently been stripped for parts on another runway.

And I just thought, you've got to be kidding me. Because I thought I was going to die, remember. Sure. You probably thought that when we took off from the same airport. What, that I was going to die? Well, not from the heading. No, but just reminded when you say, hey, we need a tire. Go get one off that plane.

It was hilarious. So we get there, the first 10 minutes in the airport is literally like a Three Stooges episode. We're just kind of like walking in circles. We know we have to go through and show our passport. We know we need to exchange some money. Cameo. Cameo, we need to go to Cameo.

We eventually get outside. And this is when, this is when co-ed shines. They really, I can't stress enough, because we're going to try and get some of you people out there to go on one of these trips, one of these tours. They're so cool. They really take care of you. So there's no need to be worried about going

to a foreign, scary land. Like the second we got out to the airport, they had the signs and the bus waiting for us. We met our cohorts and got on the bus and went to Guatemala City. Yeah, and Chuck, I think all three of us, I was still groggy. And we decided that we needed to kind of create some intro in the field that we could use.

And we started drinking gaios, which is the national beer of Guatemala. And actually, you can get gaios here. Gaios is rooster, right? Yeah. It means rooster. I think so. So they call it famosa here, but it's the exact same beer.

Right. Well, co-ed hit the ground running, though. Remember when we first got there? Oh, yeah. Holly, awesome Holly, met us at the hotel, and was like, here's a subway sandwich. We've got to go to our first school. Do you guys want to go?

It's your option. And we were like, we want to record an intro here. So you guys go ahead and we'll meet up later. Right. So that was time well spent, because we were thinking about what to record while we were drinking gaios. And eventually, we got to the point

where everything we recorded was just kind of useless. I wish we could include some of that, because it's really funny. Jerry was so frustrated with us, because we just, we weren't doing a good job. Yeah. But it wasn't just that. It was also, we didn't really have a conception yet

of what co-ed did. And that was about to change, actually. Because remember, we were still going down on the premise that we were going to record a podcast. Can education alleviate poverty? Right. And this was about, I think it was in Guatemala City that night, where the turning point began.

And our eyes started to open more and more like, holy cow. Yeah, dinner. At dinner. Yes. So they took us, they got back. I was setting us up for a clip. We don't have a clip for that video. No, we don't have a clip.

That sounded very much like an NPR setup. Thank you. So yeah, we met up. They came back to the hotel. We had a couple of beers at that point. And failed miserably with our intro. And they all said, hey, let's walk down the street here to this restaurant.

And we can talk a little bit. And I thought, are we going to be kidnapped at any point during this walk? Right, yeah. But we weren't. No, we weren't. And we ended up hanging out with Joe. Can I mention real quick our kidnapping plan

that Jerry and I hatched? Yeah, you can. Because we came up with a plan. If the three of us were kidnapped, then we were to tell them that Josh was a prince or a very rich man in the United States. And that we worked for him. We were mere servants.

And I figured that probably would have gotten us off. Yeah, it would have gotten you two off. Thank you for that. You guys are like, so long, Joe. Prince Josh? Yes. So we hung out with Joe. Yeah, Joe Barninger is one of the founders

along with his brother, Jeff. Yeah, and Joe and Jeff used to go down to Guatemala for spring break, right? Yeah, they were going down there having a good time, meeting the ladies. But they come from this fairly uncommon family where they had tons of values instilled in them. So they're going down, hanging out.

A sickening, actually. And it was. I felt like a piece of trash. Yeah, Jeff was telling us all about his parents. I was like, wow, you sound like really great people. Yes, so much so that I guess they kind of led to Joe and Jeff being inspired to actually go back to Guatemala and live there to help this country.

And they've done it in a very clever way. Do you like all this teasing that we're doing? Right, right, people are like, what do they do? Exactly, yeah. I told you it hinges on books. It does. So we had this awesome dinner. Joe and Holly give us this really, really great rundown

to where we finally feel like, all right, we got a really good idea of what's going on here. And we're not ready to share that with you yet. We're not ready to share that. We go to sleep. We go to beddy-bye. I watched a little Spanish language Seinfeld. I watched, I think, Law and Order in English was on down there.

And I was like, oh, thank god. So we awake in the Radisson at Guatemala City. And they have a couple of buses arranged for us. It's like Mercedes, the small Sprinter buses. I know, they were nice. Yeah, not the huge chicken buses. Although we saw plenty of those, those are rad. Those are brightly colored.

And a little aside, do you know why chicken buses are painted brightly, vividly, and differently? I do, but you should say so. It's because a significant amount of the Guatemalan population who use those buses can't read where it's going. So they just know, oh, this red bus with the Tasmanian devil on it is going to Atitlan. And that's where I need to go.

And I'm going there. Pretty cool. Nice little fact, Joe. So we actually, that's where we went. We went to Santiago, Atitlan, which is where Lake Atitlan is. Beautiful. And actually, you should check out the coolest stuff

on the planet cast on Lake Atitlan. Yeah, yeah, they got a show on it. It's a great footage that Jerry took while we were down there. So we arrived there. And it's like, I think it was a few hours by bus. We got to see some of the countryside, tobacco farms. Coffee. Coffee.

Bananas. Bananas. Yes. Agriculture. Poor town. Yeah. So we arrived there at the lake. And this is a volcanic lake formed a long, long time ago

from a volcano. And I think three volcanoes are surrounded, right? Yeah, those are dormant. But on the way up, we saw a couple of volcanoes that are active. Had smoke coming out of them. Yeah, the first time for me ever. Yeah, me too.

And yeah, Atitlan, I think, was formed about 80,000 years ago. I learned from the coolest stuff cast. And it was actually ridiculously polluted for many, many years, which is kind of screwy, because it's a major tourist destination for Guatemala. So they actually bioremediated it. Yeah, and they said it's all good now. Yeah, we saw people swimming in.

Chuck and I didn't get it. I don't know if I would fish from it. We thought maybe after a couple more years of bioremediation I'd get in it. But it was a gorgeous stuff. Man, unbelievable. And people canoe standing up. Yeah.

It's the craziest thing I've ever seen. Very good balance. Yeah. So we're at this idyllic scene. We go to this little place that's run by this hippie expat, American expat, which is my dream to do this one day. Yeah, I know.

Chuck was very, very jealous. I guess Central American country. Yeah, you're jealous of that guy. It was awesome. He had it going on. And actually, the resort that we stayed at was around in the 60s, I think. And it was taken over by the army.

And they had to evacuate. The guy's mom had owned it originally. Right. And to call it a resort is kind of overstating things. It was really awesome. But there were little huts, like stone cabanas, kind of peppered, like 10 or 12 of them peppered on the property. Yeah, and it was called Pasada de Santiago.

Yeah, and it was awesome. And this was that we should point out. This is the first time on the trip and only time, and probably only time in our history, that we will all stay in the same place. Yes. We had to share another room. Jerry, luckily, had could close the door and had her own room.

But you and I were there, like New Hampshire, Vermont, on those little twin beds. Right, and apparently Chuck confirmed something that I've been told before, that I snore really, really, really loud. Oh, wow. Yeah. It's kind of a problem, actually.

It sounded like a sow being murdered with a spoon. Weird. It was bad. You're not the first person who said that. Really? Yeah. The room was awesome, though. Little fireplace, it was very cool.

So we get there, we set up, and had an awesome lunch. All the food was great the whole trip. It's going to get old saying we had an awesome meal, because it was so delicious. Well, I noticed that in the rundown, you noted every single one of them. So those things really stuck with you, didn't they? I'm all about the food.

Awesome meal. Mention this. So one of the first things we did was we went out. They took us out for a little tour of the main square in town. We saw a church from 1730 or something. A church where the lead priest, the head priest, was murdered. He was an American priest down there, and he was murdered in the Civil War.

That was kind of a big deal. Yeah, very big deal. And remember, they had the carpet made of flowers going from the doorway to the altar, which had to be at least 50, 60 yards. And we should say it wasn't just flat. We're going to put pictures of all this on the website, by the way, so you can check it all out.

It wasn't just flowers. It was an intricate design made of flower petals the entire way. It was astounding, actually. And we found that it's considered a very gracious way to welcome people by putting down evergreen straws. And then you got flowers over there, like higher up. But if you put down evergreen, then your guests' feet never touched the ground.

Yeah, and every school we went to, they did that for us. And it was, I don't know, I've never had anyone do that before. No, but I started doing it around my house. Oh, you do that for me? I felt very unworthy. If I did that day, I should be like, pick all that stuff up off the floor. What are you doing?

What kind of a mess is this? So we take a tour around the main town there, and then they set us up with a visit to the home of a girl that had been one of the co-ed students, and still is, I think, at the Taxacoy family. Yeah. And they invited us into their home. We've got a clip for this one, buddy.

Today, we went, we did kind of a tour of the town here, which is very poor, to say the least. Very eye-opening for guys like us. And we met a family, actually, whose daughter has benefited from the co-ed program. Yeah, Maria. Maria, and they invited us into their home. Yeah, it's a very small home.

You walk in, half of it, maybe, is roofed. Yeah. We all assembled in this one room, and we found out that it was the room they sleep in. So I mean, it was obviously a really big deal for them. They straightened everything up for these gringo guests to come gawk and take pictures and ask questions about them. But you could tell that they're very, very grateful.

So welcoming, too. Yeah, and the dad, too. I mean, to put all of his kids through school, and he's doing it at his own detriment, because he actually could use these kids to be productive money makers for the house. But instead, they're off at school, not making any money. And yet, this guy was dedicated.

And he didn't look like it to look at him. He just looked like some normal Guatemalan guy. But there was something in him that said, you know what? I'm going to stop this with this generation. I'm going to send all of my kids to school, and he has. Yeah, he wants, and that's kind of the whole thing, he wants his kids to exceed their own expectations, even. What do they say the kids want to exceed themselves?

Yeah, exceed themselves. I'm not sure what that is in Spanish. Right, I bet it sounds a lot better than that. But the only way to do that, we're learning, is to be educated. Because if you don't have an education in Guatemala, and really anywhere, your options are extremely limited. And here, more so than most places, probably.

So that was a real eye-opener. Yeah, it really was. And I can't get over the dead. He was about three feet tall, all smiles. Such a kind face. I don't think he's, did they speak Spanish, or did they speak? No, they were speaking Spanish, because we had the translation

going. OK, I thought it was being translated into Chichical. Oh, was it? I could just be making that up. But yeah, this guy lives in abject poverty. They actually rented the house that we visited them in. They rented a couple of rooms. The whole thing wasn't even there.

And instead of having his kids go work to support the family, like every other Guatemalan family, he's making sure all three of his kids go through school. It's just really, once it sinks in, the guy is, what the guy is doing is really amazing. Yeah, that was very touching. Yeah, it was very gracious. Actually, I went, pook, I like you.

Yeah, and he hugged you back. It was very nice. So after that, we go back to the main town. They have set up some, we should set this up. They have what they have in Guatemala are these little tiny little Toyota pickup trucks, the little ones. And they have these little A-frames,

wide open A-frames built in the beds of the truck so they can carry around like 12 people back there standing up. That's third taxis. And you just kind of hold on standing up to this little A-frame. That's third taxis. So they set us up for these trucks, Koa did, so we could go out a little bit on the outskirts of town

and see a couple of cool things. And it was, that's like, I felt like it was a real adventure. Yeah, it was. I mean, like we had the wind blowing our faces and that we were, you know, hip to hip. Yes, hip to hip. It was the sexiest cab, well, one of the sexiest cab rides I've ever been on.

That sounds good. And we went to, the first place we went to was to see this, and I'm gonna let you set this up because this obviously meant a lot to you, but we went to see someone or something called Mushiman. And we had a choice, we could have either gone shopping or gone to see Mushiman, right? Mushiman.

Yeah, we all went to see Mushiman. Well, Mushiman, we went to see him actually because it turns out he's my patron saint. Yes. He is called the man in black at the crossroads or the black man at the crossroads, Papa Legba in Western African culture, but basically he's this guy, he's the god of vice.

Yes. And actually, this is hilarious because I went and I didn't know this at the time, but they keep him locked up. And every, definitely every year, but I think like every couple of months, they have a kind of a ceremony in his honor. And it moves from, it's every year,

and it moves from house to house. And you never really know where Mushiman is. And they keep him locked up because his sexuality is too much. Really? He's like the Antonio Banderas of like gods. Wow. So what service he offers to his flock, me included,

is that you can come bring him sacrifices and he'll help alleviate your vices. Yep. So we bought some, or Josh paid like 20 cents for a half pint of the local swill. They called it rum. No, it was like sugar cane moonshine. Yeah, but they, the local guys called it rum, I don't know.

That was no rum. It was not rum. It was called, I looked it up, it's called Guaro. It's actually Costa Rican. Oh, okay. But there's the sugar cane rum, or sugar cane moonshine down there is serious stuff. And actually, so I buy it and I'm like,

well Chuck, we should probably try this. Jerry declined. Chuck and I both tried it. Chuck shuttered, I didn't, which I think made it all the more reason I should dry out a little bit. Because I didn't shutter from this. Oh, you got some cereal I can pour this over?

Right, so I offer a cigarette to Moshamone as a sacrifice and the guy takes it from me and puts it in Moshamone's mouth and lights it. And I'm like, yes, I just knocked a cigar out of his mouth. Now my cigarette's in there, right? This is gonna be good for me. And then I go and get the liquor and then go in there. And you have to be very quiet.

This is quite sincere. And I was very sincere too. I was mocking in any way to reform. Like I was really hoping Moshamone would help me. But it's this dark, strangely lit barn, tiny barn. You could fit maybe a donkey and a half in it. And there's this acrid incense burning. I think it was frankincense.

And this crowded with sweaty people and a couple of guys are running the show and people are on their knees and like just praying before Moshamone. And he's just carved a probably three and a half, four feet tall figure. So he was life-size. Pretty much for Guatemalans.

And so they put the cigarette in his mouth. And then when I brought the whiskey or the moonshine, they actually put a funnel in his mouth, held a little bandana underneath his carved lip, and poured it into his mouth. And they didn't pour it all. And another reason why I know that I needed Moshamone's help was because I waited around to see if they gave me

the rest of the bottle back. Yeah, and they didn't. And they did not. Well, that's part of the little nod in a wink you get is they take it very seriously. They also collect a lot of liquor. Right in the process. Yeah, I imagine if you're running the Moshamone ceremony,

you get pretty lit. Yes, probably so. So that was a pretty big experience. Yeah, we're gonna have pictures of that up too. Yeah, yeah. And we left there and that was pretty cool. Yeah, very cool. Because I was doing that because I want to be a dad

and I need to get in better health, you know? Sure. So it was cool. I felt good. And then we go straight to one of the most depressing places I've ever been in my entire life. Yes, Josh, the mudslides from Hurricane Stan in 2005, devastating to this small town.

Well, yeah, I filled like 400 of the 500 people who lived there. 1500 people. Holy cow. Died. Wait, and just the village? Well, no, that's all over. That's in all of Guatemala from the Hurricanes.

I think this village is the worst hit though, because it was like 500 people, that there are 400 people that died, and then 1500 people in the whole country died from it. Right, they recovered only 77 corpses, and 300 people are still missing and presumed dead. Basically, where we were standing was, what they say, like 15 feet higher than it used to be,

and up below us was a mass grave of bodies. A village, and a lot of people were sleeping. It was pretty early in the morning, and you could actually look up the mountain and see still the trees hadn't fully grown back. It was like a swath cut where the mud came. It came right down right over the village and just covered it, and it was pretty sobering,

because one of the kids that we were talking to, well, we weren't, but our group was, was an orphan whose family was beneath his feet somewhere. And then to the right, there was an old school, police station and hospital, and they're gutted and abandoned, but you could still see the high mud mark on them. And this kid, I mean, he was all by himself.

He lost all his brothers and sisters and his parents, and he was now taking care of these other kids, and he looked to be about like 17. I remember they said, like, no, he's like 13, and he lost his parents when he was like eight, and he's been taking care of these kids ever since. Unbelievable. It really was.

He's very sad. Yes, and actually, so was the next place we visited too. Yes, Josh, the next site we went to was the site of a massacre that happened during the Civil War, in 1990, the Guatemalan army opened fire on an unarmed crowd of between 2,000 protestors that had finally kind of had enough. Yeah, the army had a garrison in Atitlan, right?

Yeah. And like just about every other town over a population of 10,000, and they used to just basically abuse the population. And one night, these soldiers got drunk, beat up some guys at a bar, started breaking into people's houses, and just basically being jerks.

And finally. That's the right way to put it. Right, so this guy who was injured in the bar fight, I guess, went and told the mayor or something, and everybody got woken up, and went to the army. Garrison demanded that they stop abusing the population. And so the, I guess, one of the guys who was heading

the garrison said, well, what do you have to say? And somebody shot into the air, and somebody else just started firing into the crowd. Yeah, they ended up killing 14 people, an age range from 10 to 53, 21 others were wounded. And we visited there, and they literally have a, sort of like a little open plaza in the woods, and they have a little memorial at each spot

where each person was killed. Yeah, they have the original steps that were there. Yeah. And yeah, it's pretty, again, sobering. Yeah, very somber place. I think once a month or something. Yeah, and they still do have mass there. But the good news is, out of all that,

two weeks later, as a result of the pressure and outcry over this, the army vacated the garrison there, at least, and Atitlan became one of the few communities that didn't have a military base. Right, yeah, this one, for some reason, just stirred up the anger and resentment of everybody in Guatemala, even the people who were running the military

turned down the military for this one. Right, so at this point, we are like in Guatemala. I mean, we are really feeling like we got a handle on what's going on here after this day. Do you remember when we were walking around Atitlan, and I was like, look, you know, like 10, 20 years ago, there were guerrillas sitting here with AK-47s shooting it out with militias,

like where we're walking right now, you could feel it still had left some sort of impression on the area. It was very creepy. Yeah. And those little tight alleyways, and I was just trying to, like, wrap my head around, coming around a corner and seeing a guerrilla with a gun,

and, you know, kids everywhere, it was just awful. But at the same time, it was a really, really nice town, too. Oh, yeah. You know, like, it was this kind of dual experience. Well, yeah, because Lake Atitlan is a place where gringo tourists go, because it's so gorgeous, so it's a little weird. So we get back to the place, our little hippie cabana,

and have a little happy hour by the lake. Yes, we did. Which was one of the other great things about these tours is they believe in unwinding at the end of the day and fellowshiping with each other and having a cold one, cold gaio. So it was this gorgeous setting. We have a great dinner, once again.

And we were able to get co-founder Jeff Burninger in the cabin afterward for a little... We lured him in there with a beer. Yeah, we lured him in there with a fire and beer, and said, come in here and speak to us. And we got to talk to him a little bit more about co-ed, and we have a clip here of his thoughts on his initial inspiration to start this nonprofit.

When did the first seed of, I see a need here, and part of me wants to do something about it? When did that first hit you? That started when I was looking for a volunteer opportunity. I think a lot of us, you know, we come down, we see a beautiful country, we backpack, we try to learn a language, and we see the poverty. So what can I do to help?

Right. Well, what I found out was that with my level of Spanish, there was very little I could do to help. So except maybe teach English. And I found a school that was willing to allow me to come in and teach English. It was a volunteer opportunity, and it was something I thought I could do well.

Of course, I learned later that I was not really cut out for teaching. But what I learned in the classroom was that the kids didn't have books. And the way this started was, since I didn't know how to teach, I thought, well, the simplest way to teach would be just to get the book and follow it.

You know, starting chapter one, you go to chapter two, chapter three. Right. But since there was no books, I'm like, well, I've got to find books. So I'll ask the math teacher and the science teacher where they get their books, because obviously they did my English books.

It's a Spanish-speaking country. Well, I found out the math and science teachers didn't have books either. Like, well, this is not how you teach. So Josh, here's how the textbook program works. And I know you know this, but pretend that I'm telling you for the first time. Okay.

Everybody in podcast land hears how it works. What they do is, it's a really cool program because it is self-sustaining. They realize at some point early on that dropping things off and leaving, they call it the drop and go, that's not the way to go. I'm sure that people need supplies and things like that,

but in the end, they feel like just to have something dropped and leaving isn't really doing them a lot of good. Well, it's not sustainable. And that's the point of the textbook program is that it is sustainable, starting out with the first bit of seed money. Exactly.

So what happens is, they are able to buy books really cheap in bulk, textbooks, deliver them to these students. And these students actually, these very, very poor, poor students actually pay money to rent these textbooks for the year. Right. And we should probably say right here,

it's like two bucks a year. Yeah. Per student. Per student. Per book. Per book. Right. So what happens is, these kids, they rent the books.

That money goes into what they call revolving fund, an escrow account. Right. And in five years, the money, the collective money has grown to the point where they can now replace the original set of textbooks. Right. Or if they, when co-ed takes these books to these schools, there's a program,

a part of it is taking care of your textbook, right? Yeah, absolutely. So these kids are taking care of their textbooks. We'll hear why in a second. But so if their books, if say the math books are in really good shape still, they can use that money instead of replacing those. They can get another subject with that money.

Right. Sure. Or they will replace those books and then the use textbooks become part of their use textbook program and can go to some of the scholarship kids who can't even afford the two bucks. Right. So it's a self-sustaining program.

Once these kids rent into the program, they've got textbooks for life basically, or for their entire run of education. And here's Jeff's talking about why he's found the program works. Many people have told us that it would never work. They won't return the books. And that's actually a key piece of the reason why

that the fee program works. Because we've seen it, the school principals tell us that this is the case, that when someone has to pay, even if it's a small fee, that they respect what they receive a lot more. If someone hands you something in the street, a piece of paper, a small publication for free,

the likelihood of you keeping it or valuing it versus tossing it in the garbage can is much higher. And it's much higher that you will not read it because you've not put anything into it. But if you have to pay a small fee for it, it's much more likely that you're gonna read it or keep it. And Chuck, two bucks a year per book,

say three books, six bucks a year, it's paltry, but... Times how many kids sometimes though? Right, but you wanna make sure that you're not thinking it as an American life. Is it really paltry? So, Jeff said that Coed did a study to find out how expensive it was to these families. Yeah, whether or not they could actually afford it,

they'd struggle with that for a long time. That's the question we've been asking ourselves for the last 12 years. And we started by simply asking the school officials. And they said the principal and the teachers and everything. And they clearly believe that yes, they can. But we're concerned about that because some people in the development community believe

that if there's any cost to education or the benefit that someone's receiving, that it becomes a barrier of entry into education. That you're keeping kids out of school because you're raising the cost of them going to school. But we've actually found that not to be the case with textbooks. We've gone so far as to interview the students

through a third-party organization through one of the universities in Guatemala City. Interviewed the students receiving the textbooks after they graduated from the program. And asking them on a simple scale, one to five, are the books very affordable, kind of affordable, mediocre, expensive on that scale? And basically, the results came back

saying the books were either cheap or affordable. So, that's good news. They put a lot of work into researching this and they did find that they were validated and that the parents can't afford it and that they believe in paying for it. And that's what really blew me away about this whole thing is that something earned is much more important

than something given to you. Right. And that's why the program's been so successful, Chuck. So, what we found, this is when our eyes were really starting to open to. Jerry's too. She was walking around and there's like a little crusty drool on the side of her mouth.

Like she's like, what is going on here? Well, what we found was this group that we're with goes down to Guatemala. They rustle up American money. Buy, they identify schools that say, yes, we want to be part of your textbook program because it's contractual. Oh yeah.

And they buy these books, take them down to donate them. And the kids rent these books. All this money's put in an escrow account for the school and then after X number of years, they can replace the books or add new books. And it's self-sustaining because those new books are rented and rented and rented and rented. So this bit of seed money that buys these 200 books

at first ends up spreading throughout the community. Right. And you know what? I just want to go ahead and say now, five dollars is what it costs to buy textbooks for one kid for a full school year. And you will have your opportunity to give just five dollars later on.

Little teaser. You are going to take over after Jerry Lewis retires. For the telethon? Yeah. I should. So we had a great talk with Jeff. It was awesome. Filled us in and we really felt like we knew what we were

in for at the end of day two. Our first really big day out. And we had a couple more guys and tumbled into slumber. And it was time to go to sleep. And it was time to go to sleep. So the next morning, dude, we wake up and we have a boat ride in store for us across the lake, which we were pretty excited about.

Cause you know, just being on a boat on an awesome lake is exciting for me. Yeah. Like a teat line, which we described. And actually no one has any idea how deep it actually is. Oh really? Yeah. I don't say it's like as deep as it is at its widest point,

but that's like lore. It sounds like lore. Right. So we take off and the lake is actually much bigger than what we were seeing from our little cabania there. So it was like a 30 minute boat ride to a village called, I know we're going to butcher this one. You're going to butcher this one.

I'm not even trying. Panna, Panna Hachel. Nice. That's it. That's where we're going to go. And you pointed out that it looked like the little village in the movie Popeye. And if you look on the internet under this,

if you Google that, P-A-N-A-J-A-C-H-E-L, I think you might agree. Yes. It was very cool looking. Yeah, it was. And we disembarked. We disembarked. That wasn't actually where we were going.

That was just where we landed. No, I get the impression they just kind of wanted to show off. Yeah, yeah, sure. Because we went across the lake by boat and then got off and then got on buses. Yeah. So I think they were just like, hey. The wow factor.

Yeah. Well, it worked. And it did work for sure. And we took pictures on the boat. Those will be up on the website as well. We load up on the buses again. And we set out for the Peachabaj Cooperative School. Yeah, because we were talking about how they come down

with textbooks to donate to a school that agreed to enter into this program. And we got, this is our first donation we got to see. Because they make a big to-do out of it. Oh, yeah. It's like, that's the main point of these tours that you go on is you go to the different schools. And they, you know, you're welcome with open arms.

You're welcome with dance and song. And we danced with some of the little girls there. They would come and grab our hands and dance. It was a lot of fun. But you really feel special. And they really roll out the, in this case, evergreen carpet, I guess, for you. And at this school, we were able to learn about the Corp

program, the culture of reading program. Right. And Chuck, first let me say this was the poorest of the poor as far as the schools and the areas we saw. Big time. There wasn't a discernable town because this was like the highest highlands that we entered into. Yeah.

And it was like road, mountain. Step farming on the mountain, which is really cool looking. Exactly. There wasn't really a town. It was all along this road. It was wide rather than condensed in any way. Right. But the people were very, very gracious and very,

very happy to see us. Yeah. So when we say poor school, let's set up a mental image. Think cinderblock rooms. Kind of this ranted smell in the air. It dust everywhere. Dust everywhere. Desks that look like they were donated from some of the

atomic experiments in New Mexico in the 40s. Was it the 40s? Yeah. And it's just beyond poor, what you would think of as poor. It is. But again, the people came from all over the community for this donation. And the kids, actually, we were with the young kids in the

early hours. And we were also there for when classes transferred, because it's young kids in the same school, young kids in the morning, older kids in the afternoon. And it's because, number one, they only have one school. But number two, because the older kids get up and work in the fields in the morning and then go to school. And when we say in the morning, they get up at like 4 a.m. to

make the tortillas and then to work in the fields. So they can attend school. Yeah. Unbelievable. The kids, we got to give out pins and pencils, which Jerry also brought some stickers and things. But she brought seven stickers. I remember there were like 100 kids tugging and pulling

her. I set off the deluge. I grabbed one of the kids and pointed. And then pointed to what Jerry was holding. And she just went over. And all of a sudden, they all just flocked at Jerry. It was hilarious. She took to it, though.

She was trying to instill some order. She was like, all right, all right. Everyone, calm down. Let's get this done. Which is funny, too, because a lot of these kids are a monolingual and just spoke in their Mayan dialect. So Jerry's sitting there speaking broken Spanish to them. And even if they spoke in Spanish, they wouldn't know

what she was saying. But they definitely had no clue what she was saying. And yet they still formed a line. Yeah, they did. The universal language lineup. So on a personal note, to see these kids clamoring over these pens and pencils like it was an Xbox made me want to slap American kids a little bit, to be honest.

So the kids are playing with these things? That's what they're playing with these days. Or the PS3, I don't know, the iPhone. But they were treating these pens and pencils like they were precious. And to them they are. Yeah. So they had a little ceremony like they did at all the

schools, a little traditional symbolic dancing and performing of, what kind of ceremony did they do here? It was the corn dance that they performed. Oh, that's right, the corn dance. Yeah, it was about how the corn was given to them by the gods, right? Yeah. And it's pretty cool.

And actually, by the last school we went to, Chuck Jerry and I could have performed the corn dance. We saw it at every single one. I think I could probably roughly perform it now. I'm not going to, but I could. You should. And then we got to meet a lady named Carolyn Johnson. She's from Portland, Maine.

Yeah, she's pretty cool. Lifelong educator, principal, school principal that went on a co-ed tour and went back and said, I'm going to quit my job. I'm going to go to Guatemala. Because they're not snotting those little brats that don't appreciate things down there. Well, the experience of Guatemala really led you to

disdain American kids in it. No, that's not true. But Carolyn obviously didn't say anything like that. She's like one of the sweetest ladies I've ever met in my life. She's very kind and soft-spoken, but with it and sharp. She actually went down on a tour like we were on and joined up and actually ended up creating an entirely new

program that co-ed institutes. Right. And we asked her what inspired her to leave her life behind and go to Guatemala. And here's what she had to say. I think the thing that really spoke to me. We went to an elementary school just to deliver some pencils and books and miscellaneous kinds of things.

And the principal found out that I was also a principal in the US and came up to me and said, can you help? My teachers don't know how to teach reading. We appreciate all this stuff, but we don't know what to do. So I started talking to Joe and Jeff. And they said, oh, we looked into getting into educational kinds of things. But they said we're not educators and we need

somebody to help us. So I started volunteering with them. And at one point decided working down here and working with these kids would be a lot more fun than continuing to be a school administrator in the United States. So here I am. So how awesome was she?

She was very cool. Very cool lady, doing great work. And how cool did the little birds in the background sound? Yeah, you could actually kind of hear how beautiful a day it was, thanks to the birds. That wasn't sound designed by Jerry. No, although it could have been. It could have been.

So she works with the culture of reading program. And why don't we get her to tell us about what core is instead of us doing it? So what does Corp stand for? And what are the basic fundamentals of the program? Corp is culture of reading program. That culture of reading was something really important to us.

We came to the schools and we saw that if you gave a second grader a third grader a short piece of text, they could read the words off the page. But they essentially had no comprehension. They, the words didn't have meaning. And without books in their homes, without books in their schools, reading is not something they do for enjoyment.

And it's not something they see as valuable. They don't see picking up a newspaper as something that will help them, that will assist them, or going to look for information in text. So developing that culture of reading. So we want the kids not only to be able to read and develop those critical thinking skills, we want them to want to read.

We want them to see that reading is something you do for pleasure. And it's something that you do that will enrich your life. So Chuck, what Carolyn and the Cooperative for Education figured out was that teachers were teaching kids to read, basically just writing their assignments on the board, and then kids had to scribble them down real quick before they were erased, and there was no

comprehension whatsoever. So the court program that Carolyn created is part teaching kids to read, but it's also part teaching teachers how to teach kids to read. So instead of just standing there reading very quickly from a book, it involves reading in a very big voice, like you read to kids, and showing them the pictures so that they're comprehending.

There's not just a string of letters, there's comprehension to the words. Sure. I mean, I wasn't any impression it's more for the teachers, because they had never seen books either. Well, no, it's part for the kids too, because remember the books get translated into a picture book, and then a play, and then I think another big book.

So technically, this one book that they start off with, by the end of the week, they have three books, and they've made a play out of it. So they have this book down flat in a week. Pretty awesome. So that's the end of part one of SYSK's Guatemalan adventure. The exciting conclusion is coming up on Thursday, and

stick around after these words to hear how you can buy student textbooks for life with just a $5 text donation. This episode of Stuff You Should Know is brought to you by Go To Meeting, the affordable way to meet with clients and colleagues. For your free 30-day trial, visit gotomeeting.com slash stuff. OK, folks, if you like what you've heard so far about the

Cooper for Education, and you want to support them, you can do so with just a $5 text donation. And here's how it works. Just text the word Stuff, S-T-U-F-F, to 20222, and you will donate $5 to help put a textbook into the hands of a Guatemalan child. You will receive a text back asking you to confirm the donation, and just reply with the word Yes to complete the

donation. And you will see a one-time $5 charge on your wireless bill, or deducted from your prepaid balance. Message and data rates may apply, and if you stop and change your mind before confirming the donation, which you shouldn't do, you can reply the word S-T-O-P, stop, to 20222. Or if you need help, reply with the word Help, H-E-L-P.

Donations are collected by the Mobile Giving Foundation. For more info, you can call 866-810-1203, or go to H-M-G-F dot org slash T. So tune in Thursday for the conclusion, the exciting conclusion, of S-Y-S-K's Guatemalan adventure. Adios. For more on this and thousands of other topics, visit HowStuffWorks.com.

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