Subpar - Charley Hoffman Interview: How he became known as the Seagull, playing high stakes cash games with Phil Mickelson

Episode Date: July 21, 2020

On this week's episode of GOLF's Subpar, 4-time PGA Tour winner Charley Hoffman joins former PGA Tour pro Colt Knost and his close friend and on course rival Drew Stoltz for an exclusive interview. The man known as the Seagull explains the origins of his nickname, how playing high stakes cash games with Phil Mickelson helped prepare him for big moments on Tour, and which city is the most fun to miss a cut in.

Hello world. Welcome to this week's episode of Golf Subpar, Colt Nost and Drew Stoltz. Sleys, what a week it was. We have a new world number one, and he might just be a friend of the program. Yes, friend of the program. Actually, our debut guest here on Golf Subpar. And man, I don't know about you. I loved watching this event this week. I feel like all of a sudden here we are in the middle of July and a U.S. Open broke out. Like this thing looked different than everything we've seen so far this year. We've, you know, the six weeks back, first five weeks, soft greens, no wind, easy. conditions guys shooting 20 under and jack put a stop to that real quick it shows you what a firm fast golf course will will do it even exposes the best players in the world i mean we have all these 19 to 25 unders winning golf tournaments they get a firm firm golf course very firm greens some rough and single digits wins yeah do you think this does anything to the conversation about tone back the ball

tone back the equipment because you got guys like number one for instance tony fienow brice these guys were hitting drives over 400 yards i saw guys hitting it way down there crazy distance missing the green on number one, simply because if they weren't in the fairway and the greens were firm. Like this seems like a blueprint for here's how you make golf hard. I mean, it's, it's no secret. We've known for years when it's firm and fast, it plays a lot harder. There's no doubt about that. When you actually have to hit fairways, golf's a lot harder for these guys. And I just wish more tournaments would take note. Like, I get it. You can't always control mother nature. You can't get everything firm all the time, but you can damn sure grow your rough up. Yeah, that's an easy

thing to do. You don't have to have 20 mile hour wins. You grow some rough up, firm up, some greens. golf gets a lot harder. What do you think as like a spectator on the other side of this? Because I know you played some really hard conditions when you were playing. Is it fun for you to like, I personally love it. I don't want this every single week, but I love seeing guys go out there and even par is a great score. There's so few places on the PJ tour where that's the case. I love seeing a round of golf. Like John Romchrot, 68 on Saturday. He's like, that might be the best one of the best rounds of golf I've ever played in my life. I love that. And we had John Cook on our serious XM show earlier today talking about Muirfield Village, which no one knows it better than he does,

being an Ohio State Buckeye. And he's like, to get it close at Muirfield Village, it's like Augusta. You don't go at the pins. You go at sections and slopes and work it in there. So you actually have to think your way around. If you have 140 yards, you just don't hit 140 yards shot. You might try to think, okay, let's land it at 130, 15 feet right of the sole. It'll catch the slope and feet down.

You actually have to think a lot more than just, you know, throwing a dart out there. Yeah, I love that. I mean, John Rom played unbelievable. I mean, technically one by three. I think he won by five. If you're talking to me, I think the ruling at the end was complete horse shit. and we're opening up a can of worms if we're going to use 10x zoom and slow motion to determine when and when there is not a penalty. But like it just goes to show like you do that to a golf

court. I think the best player obviously won this week. He won by a landslide, but I would love to see more golf courses try to emulate what Muirfield Village did this week. It's not rocket science. Rough, firm greens. Everyone can do it. If you get wind, that's a bonus. But like there was no 20 under that was going to happen this week on Jack's watch. Nope. So congrats to John Rom on becoming number one in the world, our first ever guest. Feels good to be on top, Colt. It does, it does. But also good to see Tiger Woods back in action.

Little rusty around the greens. Yeah, what did you think about Tyg? Swing looked okay. Back looked a little tweaked on Friday, but I thought the swing and everything, he was moving pretty well. I mean, I think the thing that doesn't get talked about enough is, I know he's in great shape,

but Mearfield Village is a very tough walk, and not walking a golf course for five months. It's tough on the body. And, you know, it was good to see him back. He made the cut, finished 40th. I'm really excited to see if he plays before the PGA. I think he will at the WGC. at Memphis and knock a little more rust off and he'll be ready to go come PJ Championship.

I think he's got to play because like everyone talks about his driver. That's the big issue. Will he drive it straight? I think Tita Green, he was still one of like, I think in the top 10 strokes game with his iron play this week, right? Seventh. All that's fine. I think the biggest, the weirdest thing that I saw from Target this week, he looked unlike I've ever seen before on the greens. I saw him hit a few puts like 10 feet and in where he's the best putter in the history of golf from 10 feet and in. I saw him hit a few this week that had no chance. And I think that's just strictly, A, those greens are arguably the hardest on the PJ Tour to put. They're so fast and so slow, but B, he hadn't played any golf either in that time.

I think he needs to play again. If he has any realistic possibility of showing up to the PJ Championship, thinking he's going to have his best stuff. I agree. I think he's going to be just fine. He'll knock some rust off. But now it's time to get into a little funny money. Let's do it.

And I played this week's tournament on the PJ Tour is the 3M up in the Twin Cities, Minneapolis. And I was there last year. Had the weekend off, believe it or not. It's right. Short week. So once again, I want everybody's story

does not involve golf, but this is great. You'll love this because you're a hustler, you're a gambler. Let's go. We'll appreciate this. So, miss the cut.

Stay the weekend in Minneapolis. Minnesota Twins, baseball team. They're in town. I'm aware. Hosting my former home city, the Texas Rangers. Okay.

I got some good friends. My boy Jim Fernholtz up in Minnesota. Great dude. Fernie. Legend. Gets us tickets right above the Texas Rangers dugout. First row.

Tom Love Lady. was there. Former PJ tour player missed the cut. Likes to get amongst it a little bit. He ain't afraid. So we're having some cocktails talking trash. He's like, yeah, we're going to the Twins game tomorrow. Tom was going as well. I was like, I bet you 500 I catch a ball tomorrow. He's like, what? And I was like, 500 I catch a ball. He's like, no way. I'm like, all right, done. Bet. Bet. So one of my good buddies, Elvis Andrews, which plays shortstop for the Texas Rangers.

I go, hey dude, I'm actually in Minnesota. I'm coming. I'm sitting right above your dugout tomorrow. I need you to throw me a ball. He's like, are you serious? And I was like, yes. Yeah, don't question me. So it was great. We showed up late. We were like third inning. Go to our seats right above the dugout. Elvis is running off the field.

He sees me. Hey, you're fucking late. But here, threw me a ball. Got it. Tom, pay me. Did Tom give any bitch? Like, no, that's not a live ball. He's like, that's bullshit.

He's like, hey, I said catch. I didn't say foul ball. I said catch. I bet I will catch a ball. Technically, got it. Got out smart. That's how you hustle. Got out of Starry.

That's a lot of fun. It was a lot of fun. So hopefully next time we do funny money, I'll actually might involve golf. Yeah, maybe one where we get on the course. Yeah. I'm very limited. But these are more between, but I love that.

Sorry, Tom, love lady. All right. Use your brain a little bit. In other news, we have started to gain a lot more social media followers. And I know some of them have submitted some questions. And producer Mark, fire a couple, maybe one or a couple off at us. Yeah, we'll start off with one this week because it's for both you guys. Scott Faber on Twitter wants to know.

After witnessing some of the meltdowns this weekend, what's your best, meltdown story on the course. Oh, mine is so easy. Does it have to be us personally or one that we witnessed? I think just best all around. Okay. Is this like an attitude explosion or like playing bad? This is like what Rom or Deschambeau sort of had happened to them where they just sort of melted down, middle of the course.

Well, I don't think I've ever had one where I've just like freaked out, but like I had a disaster at Quail Hollow, Wells Fargo Championship. I was in third place with nine holes to play on Friday and I believe I finished I bogeed 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, and doubled 18 to miss the cut by a shot. And I'm pretty sure that's a meltdown. That would classify as a meltdown, I think. Slightly.

Just maybe par one hole coming in. Just give me one. Just give me one non-square. That's a good feeling. Nope, couldn't do it. That's how I used to start doing the math. I was like, dude, I can bogey four the last five and still play the weekend.

Perfect. I finished and Anthony Kim played really well that day. That's when he was still playing. Shocker. He was in top 10. We get in the locker room. And I was like, nice playing, dude. He's like, you two.

I go, no. He goes, what? You're in third. When I looked at the leaderboard, he was, yeah, I'm packing my shit. Yeah, I'm out of here. I'm out of here. I'm out of 703 now, but. See ya.

Scroll down a few pages. You'll see the kid down there. So that's definitely mine. I played, uh, this is like this. I just will never forget this in the history of my life. I watched a guy four putt, the final hole of first stage of Q school when a three putt would have got him. I'll spare you all the details. There was previous meltdown on the holes leading up.

This was at Lantana in Dallas, which you're aware of. He was, dude, he was fine. He was cruising in, no sweat. Last hole, we pretty much know where the number is, but you don't really know exactly. I was like, bogey for this kid gets it done, right? The other two of us, we were already in. We're just kind of watching this kid. He lays up on the short par four.

You can drive it up by the green if you want, number nine, that Lantana. And hits it on the green, spins it back off the tiers. He's got 50 feet. And I was like, dude, just blow it to the back of the green. You got two uphill puts. It's over. you're good what's he do leaves it short now he's got this downhill greaser and i was like oh dude don't i don't even want to watch it like i'm just like don't do it don't i don't want to watch a four whack

hits it like six feet by and now i'm like okay now he's got to make the third misses it doesn't say a word misses it doesn't say a word taps in and we're both me and another dude looking at you're like i'm pretty sure that just missed and he ain't going to second stage gets done we have a shuttle into the cart doesn't say a word no one's saying a word it's silent drive in there he takes his golf club he's holding his putter the entire time sets his golf club down proceeds to beat the shit out of his go I mean there is zero clubs that survived this meltdown right in front of the scoring tent and no one says a word because everyone's just like sad for him at the time not a single club and he walked

off and left his golf bag there with his putter which was beat to all hell too I don't know if like whoever's catty or whatever picked it up like dude it was like silence like a like a dead body yeah that's a that's a tough one the key school stories are nightmare for but dude it was like boge bogey four put to miss by one all right well keep those questions coming you can reach this at golf subpar on both Instagram and Twitter. I love this segment. We need more of those. I love talking about meltdowns. But speaking of things I don't love, that's our next guest. Perfect segue. The Seagull. Charlie Hoffman joined us and what a beauty he is. God, we have a good time with this man right here. He is a peach.

It is shocking that he is like the head of the pack right now. He is the guy that's speaking on behalf of the players because when you listen to this man, he's got two different sides. He's got the Seagull side. He's got Charlie Hoffman on the business side. And you get a little bit of both in this interview right here. You really do. I mean, he very much cares about the. PGA tour. Oh yeah. And he was one of the guys that was like texting all the players. He's like, please vote for me. I'll do a good job at this. I want to, I want to be the chairman of the pack and all this. But he's a guy, me and him have a ton of history together. Obviously, we love to trash talk each other. Love to play practice rounds together. But he's a beauty.

I was interested in see how this interview goes because it's hard for me and him to be real serious. Yeah, when we first, I think even before like we started recording, I was like, Jesus, like two like flirting school girls right here, like two third grade girls just going at each other. I was like, this is going to be interesting. So we had a good time with but he does take his pack roll seriously, but there's also another side of him that he can get amongst it quick. All right, well, let's get right to it.

Here's the seagull, Charlie Hoffman. Cicca! Cicca! Cicoh! It is now time to welcome on our next guest of golf subpar, the one, the only, Seagull of the PGA tour. Mr. Charlie Hoffman,

thanks for joining us. How's it going, guys? Thanks for having me, Cole. That's the nicest intro we've ever done for anyone on this show. I mean, at least I have sound effects for you, But we got to get right into it because I don't know if a lot of people know about the whole Seagull name, but can we talk about where it originated and what exactly it means? And do you like it?

Well, originated for John Mallinger and Bill Lundy to be completely honest with you. Those guys lived in Vegas. We did a lot of practicing together. Malley lived there for about a year until he decided it was the best interest to go back to California and pay taxes again. But you know what? It's just something we were talking a lot of trash. and somehow I think Malley called Lundy a seagull, and then next thing you know, he called me a seagull, and then Colt found out that Malley called me a seagull, and it stuck, believe it or not, Colt's mouth was running again, and I embraced it. I mean, I like to talk a little bit of crap, and-

You can say other words on this show, just so you know. Yeah, good nature. I am always free. But, no, it was something that you and Malley and Lundy, I'd say, and then other guys, started picking up on it and I embraced it I don't have a problem with it it's it's something I enjoy doing do you think it's a fair nickname do you because like you supposedly just fly around and shit on people that's the where it came from but you feel like that's a fair assessment of what you do yeah I would say I fly around and talk shit about people I

don't know if I shit on people I mean I think that's a little a little aggressive but I maybe maybe throw it talk shit and but I but the thing is what's great about me I think is I'll talk shit in front of your face not behind your back. So yeah, that's fair. That's all you can ask. I love that about you. And it's no secret that Charlie and I go at it pretty well. It's hard to tell. We really love each other. Ever since I missed one of his proams. Yeah, Colton, I mean, he's a small little target base round so I can hit him a lot. There he go. Ding ding, ding. Let's start this. Let's just keep this going. How does it be the ugliest human on the BGA door? Go. Oh, there we go. I'll keep score. I'll keep score.

It's one to one right now. It's 7-7. That stash is really flattering, by the way. But let's get into it. You mentioned Bill Lundy earlier. You played at UNLV with the likes of Mr. Lundy, Chad Campbell, Chris Riley, Adam Scott. First off, how the hell did all you all end up in Las Vegas?

And what a loaded team that is? You know, all credit to Dwayne Knight in recruiting. I mean, we had the best facilities in the world and probably still do. I mean, we played at Shadow Creek. Colt's been there a few times. I don't know if he remembers being there, but he's been there a few times. And it's just a great practice facility. It's a great spot to learn the game of golf.

We had the desert inn when I was there. You had, geez, it goes in Las Vegas country club. The list goes on and on. It was a great spot. I remember going out the clubs in the, and most college places are like, or you can go out here Monday, you go out here Tuesday, another golf course, Wednesday, Thursday. But Vegas, we would travel to each golf course and play qualifying.

and next thing you know, go practice that course. They would go, why weren't you out here last week? Why aren't you using our facilities? We need to do something different. They embraced our college golf program. And the facilities in the desert were awesome, obviously. You got two TPCs out there now. And it's just a golf mecca.

It's a great place for a kid to get better at golf. And to be honest, before you're 21, you can't get in too much trouble in Vegas. You think Vegas, you need money. and you got to be 21. Two things I didn't have in college. So it was a pretty good place to go to school and prepare for the PJ tour and get a degree. Yeah, that was going to be my next question because it can be hard enough to stay focused on golf at any school across the U.S. But when you're in Vegas and you got that in your backyard, how hard is that?

It sounds like you did a pretty good job, but did you stay away from that or was that hard? You have to stay away. There's my dog. Kids are home. Watch out. You know, it's, it was a place that, I mean, you could get into trouble, but like I said, they're, this, it was state of the art, uh, um, ID, people looking at IDs before there were things you ran your ID through. Uh, you had to have money. I didn't have any money, uh,

unless I wouldn't caddy that Shadow Creek. I mean, we would caddy on a irregular basis out there, but not enough to get in any trouble, maybe enough to go to a local place once you turn 21, a local bar or But you know what? It was a great spot. And for me growing up in San Diego was close enough to home if I needed to go home and see an instructor get out of the heat. I could do the four and a half hour drive and get back home. Yeah, well, that's, I want to go ahead. It's a perfect follow up to this because that's funny that you say that because we actually, I spoke to a good friend of yours, Mr. Ricky Barnes, and he actually told me a story that kind of contradicts a little bit about what you're saying. But apparently he was there roughly around the year 2000 for a recruiting trip. He's one of the highly recruited guys in the United States of America.

And he showed up and like you mentioned, Coach Knight runs a tight. Yeah, in his own mind, exactly. Coach Knight runs a tight ship. So you guys had a 7 a.m. putting practice the next morning. Ricky shows up. He's going around meeting all the guys. You guys are doing putting putting prudding drills. He comes over to talk to you. You're knocking a couple putts in the hole. You go down to reach it in to get the ball of the hole and some and some casino chips fall out of your pocket. So it sounds like you might add a little

more money than you talk about. Well, that night I did because I won. No, you know what? That was Ricky Barnes recruiting trip. I was obviously as at age by then I was 21. I was my senior year. And you know what? Recalling what happened. or vaguely recalling what happened is we took Ricky on his recruiting trip and was very mellow and did everything by the book and then once we dropped him off we went out and had fun unfortunately we had practice at 637 in the morning and i might have been a tad late which is not good for duen night jane night is uh that's like one of the few things you can't do is be late and uh you know what I got in a little bit of trouble for that.

The story is true. I showed up, man, it's like Ricky's already there. Guys were putting, and I had gone to sleep, and I just threw the clothes on. I had the night prior. I didn't know I'd cashed out for any chips, and obviously didn't cash out for chips or forgot the ones that were in my pocket.

And I went over and hit that three-footer, and it was dewy in the morning, and the putter slipped right out, chips went tumbling. I went sort of forward, stumbling, and I caught myself and I still, to the day, I don't know if Dwayne saw it all happen. I know plenty of the players do, but I'm not sure if Dwayne actually saw it happen, but I, to say the least, got to ask you on that next Monday morning at workouts.

And I was lucky enough to go to the next event and we won the next event. And we had to any, you would have to run laps if you were late. And I had probably the Thomas Mac Center was the basketball center there, where the running rebels, actually, I guess they're not the rebels anymore from all I know, but the running something, and we'd have to run up and down every stair in there if you were late. So I was due to two of those for how late I was, go around up and down every stair twice. But if you won the tournament that week or the team won the tournament that week, not individual, everything was wiped out. Thank God.

Oh my God. We were really, really, really good. And, uh, We won the tournament that week, and I didn't have to run the Thomas Mac twice. I did, believe me, there were other times I did have to run those Thomas Macs, and there were times where guys didn't do very well going around those things, and, I mean, Pukin and I mean, all different other stories. You lucky, lucky bastard. Knight would have had your ass, too, if he saw those chips, by the way. Yeah, but there's no question.

You mentioned how good your team was, obviously, and I mentioned it earlier. Chad Campbell, Chris Riley, Bill Lundy, Adam Scott. Who was the star of that team? And you, obviously, you yourself? Definitely not me. I was probably the four-man-up best. During those years, Bill Lundy was probably the rock on our team to be completely honest. He was the steadiest best player through those years.

You had, Jeremy Anderson was really good in his college years. I mean, he got his tour card right out of college. He was a great amateur golfer. and turned professional and had a limited success, but was a great, great player. We just had a really solid deep team, and I wouldn't say there was any real superstars on that team during the time, but we had just had a great, great solid crew of people that enjoyed to compete and pushed each other. Well, I know you lived with Bill Lundy later on in college, and I heard y'all had some

epic domino battles. Can you share any evenings of dominoes where maybe some Snoop Dogg was involved. Oh, Snoop was there. We played dominoes on a regular basis. It's actually something I miss. We, I mean, we used to maybe have a few 40s and play some Snoop Dog and roll the dominoes. And you know what? It was a blast. I mean, we had epic battles. We had sand for all the numbers that you get. Sweet Christine, that's 15. I mean, I don't know if you guys have ever played dominoes, But I promise you, I could walk down somewhere in a different area and maybe get a decent game going on and have it really, really enjoy it. I love it. That is awesome.

Little 40s and dominoes. Yeah. Just college. You know, that's what we do. Yeah. You turn pro after. Yeah. Well, hold up real quick.

When Adam Scott, he was there really briefly at UNLV, when he showed up, A, what was he like? What did you think of him? And B, when he showed up were you like, this kid definitely ain't going to last long in college? You know, Adam Scott was a scrawny, skinny kid out of Australia. You know what? You looked at his golf swing and it looked a lot like Tiger Woods. You expect a lot from him, but he definitely didn't college by any means. There's lots of good stories about Adam Scott.

I could tell, but I'm not going to tell him all. But I used to drop him off at the Greyhound bus. And he used to go down, like, he had a girlfriend in L.A. That was from Australia and a little Asian girl. and she lived in LA they went to the same boarding school or in high school from Australia I used to drop we go to putting that putting

practice on Saturday morning and I'd drop him off for the bus stop literally the Greyhound bus in downtown Vegas and he'd take the Greyhound bus down to L.A. to see his girlfriend and then come back and meet back to your workouts that Monday morning and I mean there's lots of stories now he's flying his own private general I was going to say yeah he's always got his own play

he's upgraded slightly no Greyhound bus happened but you know what I I thought Adam Scott was really good for one reason. It wasn't because of his golf shots he had, but he always had, I call it the it factor, the competitive factor that he always wanted to kick your buddy, even if he wasn't playing good. He could grind it out.

He could just, those last, like, well, three holes when the competition was on the line, he always stepped up. He had a lot of, I mean, a lot of guys on PJ Tour have it, but it's just, you can't describe it. It's it. He has it. And he's able to get the ball in the home when it counts.

And that's what I knew. It was special about him at college. It wasn't his ball striking. It wasn't his putting. It was the it. It was better than anybody else. You got a good eye, Charles. Very good eye.

Do not compliment him? No. Charles and I are aligned, dude. That mustache. Jesus. We can discuss that at a later date. But you do have four PGA Tour wins. Yes, I know.

That's four more than I do. Shut up. Don't say it. I'll beat you to this. Get out in front of it. I already know what you're going. Very good. Eight mile your last one being the 2016 Valero, Texas Open.

Of those four wins, which is your favorite? You've obviously won some big ones. You know, I mean, they all obviously have a special place. I mean, I think the first one was the biggest personally because you get out, it was my first event in my second year on tour. And obviously keeping your car on the PJ tour is no small feat your rookie year. Aval will do that was huge. And then the win, Riali gave my second year,

sort of validated what I did that rookie year and obviously validated me as a professional golfer. So that first win, I mean, meant a lot. You had a little bit of security. By winning, you're going to, Cole, you wouldn't know this, always have a place to practice. The TBCs always have a place to play on the-in. I'm America's guest, sir. I'm America's guest. At least you know.

But no, that one validated. And then obviously the biggest one was a playoff win that I had, I would say, in Boston. But all of them obviously weren't easy or none of them were easy. But I think that first one sort of meant the most just validating me as professional golf for me, you know, stay on the PGA tour for forever for the most part. Well, I'll be honest. I was rooting very hard for John Rollins in Palm Springs and Patrick Reed in San Antonio. You were like 14 at the time.

I mean, you probably, I mean, you weren't even watching golf. I still hated you. I was like, God, this guy's ugly. How's he going to win it? How's he going to be a face of a tournament? Come on. I like this Reed guy. He seems pretty likable. He seems awesome. He seems like a likable fellow. Charlie, let me get like when you first turned pro, you came out, you spent five years before you got your PJ tour of car, but you were great in college. You had, you know, you had a, you're an All-American Institute of A Team Championship. When you turned pro, did you expect to get to the tour right away with like that the expectation? Or did you think like, hey, maybe a couple years on the nationwide is best for me? You know what? I always thought it was good enough. I mean, I made I made the cut as an amateur a couple of times.

times in San Diego I put the Buick Invitational back then now the farmers invitation or farmers open and I made the cut when I was an amateur and is that's sort of what drove me to want to be professional golf was be able to make the cut as an amnitor and then I didn't have I mean you you can call it successful college grade I didn't win any individual titles I mean we had a solid team nothing stuck out but I was able to get through Q school my first year out of school, which was, I think, me, myself and Rue Giamada, who played a bunch of years on tour. The only two guys from college you get through Q school that year and get, we'll go to the

finals, I'd say. I didn't get my tour card. So I got my web card. Back then it was the buy.com card. And I was really excited, obviously. And then I missed my first 16 cuts. 16. That's just a couple bad bounces, dude. That's a couple bad breaks.

I did not know that. If Colton had done some research here, you would have known that. I do my research very well normally, but I did not know. I knew you made four cuts, though. Yeah, I didn't know it was 16 consecutive. That's a tough one to swallow it. I missed my first 16 cuts. And this is a funny story that not very many people know is Zach Johnson and I travel a little bit together that year.

Actually, a lot. And Zach missed it, I think, his first 12 to 14 cuts. So we're really good together. I mean, we were awesome. But, you know, we, Zach and I, we discussed it on a regular. I played with them last week. We discussed on a regular basis. We learned more that year about ourselves, about professional golf, about failing, about what we

needed to do to succeed. I think it really made us the guys we are. Zach Johnson minds, in my mind is obviously a Hall of Fame golfer right now if he quit the game of golf. I have definitely not. but we've both been on tour for, I've been on tour for 15 years, she's probably been close to 18 to 20 years.

And to think about coming right out of college, I mean, we had a place to play, but missing 16 cuts in a row in like 12 to 14, I think Zach was. And to be able to get through that and play on the PGA tour of that long. And I mean, my best life lessons were that first year playing the buy.com tour and missing those cuts.

You're ready for question fire. You took those lessons in way different directions because he's the nicest guy in the world and then there's you. Okay, so you definitely didn't learn the same things from this. Yeah, that's a strange hotel group, I feel like with you and Zach Johnson. No kidding. That's a unique tandem there. You know what? Opposites attract, I guess.

No, Zach and I are still good friends of the day, obviously. I'm going to have to ask him, clarify. He'll definitely not answer your call. Oh, he loves me. I was the MVP at his charity event last year. No, Zach, Zach is a great person, a great golfer. And we, we, it's definitely what is sort of an odd couple. But we drove cross country together and stayed in a ton of extended stays together and

had a lot of weekends off together. How's the team energy in the group there when you're combined like Ofer 30 cuts consecutively between the two of you? Not a lot of positive vibes I would think going around the hotel room. No. it was literally we would like sit back and go what do we need to do to get better we go out and practice on the Saturday or Sunday and then we jump and pack in our car and we'd actually did a ton of Monday qualifiers back then we would uh

because our status obviously kept getting worse and worse and worse as we kept missing cuts and this is actually a great story about Zach you might kill me at the hills you hear's your story but we're coming on the end of that stretch we're at Salt Lake City in a plan and neither one of us are in the event. We just drove from Midland, Texas, where we missed the cut and backtrack a little bit. We're going to stop in Vegas where I live for a day

or two and then maybe practice and then go to Salt Lake City for the Monday qualifier. Well, I didn't tell Zach I was moving out of my apartment that week. I see you got some free mover. So Zach Johnson, myself and another guy, Randy Lean, I get, I'm like, oh, yeah, stay here. And then I go, oh, I've got to move all my shit out. And I actually think I moved all the storage unit. And then I move into a bill Lundy and into the house he was renting.

Anyways, it didn't take that long. I didn't have really anything at the time anyways. But that took like half a day when we went out and had a couple drinks in Vegas that night. And we drove to Salt Lake City that next morning. We both had to do that Monday qualifier that Monday afternoon, because we signed up late, and we're like the last group out, so we're playing together now. And Zach's all pissed off.

He hits it in like the 16th hole. He hits in the water, and he's like, balls up. He stands in the water, and he has his paraclassic shoes on at the time, and he steps in the water, and he sinks. He's like, oh, shit. He tries to pull his foot out. His shoe gets stuck in the mud, like, suction cups out. That foot comes out, no shoe.

He's all mad. Now he has one shoe. He takes that shoe off and throws it in the lake. So he has no shoes on. And no sooner that he gets to the green with no shoes on, he's covering him mud. He gets a call from a tour that he's in the tour. And he's in the event. That's awesome.

By the way, you were a seagull back then for having him help you move your shit out of your apartment. Yeah, unbelievable. Come to Vegas, guys. We'll get to practice in. Maybe we'll move all my shit out of my house too. there. I don't know. You're the absolute worst. And that's the master's champion right there. The guy throwing his shoes in the leg. That's incredible. Did you know he was going to be as good as he was at the time? I mean, he's obviously had a big career. He was always a quality ball striker. He's obviously

all around great player now. He's putting was a little bit suspect back then. He didn't have the Seymour putter yet. That Seymour putter sort of changed his career in my mind. Once he got that in the same, he started becoming a great putter. And he's obviously still playing. and great golf to this day. Rooming with you for a year probably toughened him up enough to do anything in life. If you can survive a year on the road with Hoff. Usually it goes two different direction. You're going to be a world-class player.

You're going to quit the game. One of the two. And host a podcast. Yeah. Then you get your own podcast. And then you interview people. You get a podcast or you're a major. Wonder what happened to me?

Cool. Yeah. Great. But I know one of the things you're very passionate about is the player advisory council. I mean, you've been on the board for many years. I believe you're chairman now, correct? Chairman, which... Mr. Chairman.

I know you're... Kevin Chappell wanted me to ask you, are you more proud of what you've done on the board or what you've done on the golf course? Well, I'm more proud of giving Kevin Chappell's job back this next year by saving them money. God, by the way, yeah, we need to talk about that off air. That's incredible. Yeah, he should be sending you gifts.

I promise you, if that was Colt... under those circumstances, it would have gone another direction. New rule, you're out. You know, I think I obviously like to voice my opinion, and a lot of people think the tour doesn't want to hear that a lot, but actually they enjoy hearing other people's opinion, and I think that's why I'm fitting good in those closed door rooms and the board calls and board conferences is because I'm not free to speak my mind,

I'm free to speak my mind to tell them what I think they need to improve. I've been wrong more than one time, but I've also been right a few times. But I really enjoy being in the know more than anything, what's going on. And you know what? It's a weird time now. Obviously, my first term was three years prior to this, and it was very smooth. The two, we're doing great, and Tiger Woods came back, and we're signing new TV contracts, and obviously COVID hits this year.

And the board meetings are a little bit different now than they were, the previous three years. And there was a lot of learning through all this. And I think we came out pretty good in the end. I mean, we're the first sport sort of playing live and being pretty safe about being healthy. And it was a lot of calls and a lot of talking a lot of doctors and infectious disease doctors and World Health Organization and CDC. I mean, Jane Bonahan is, I mean, he's a very special person. I mean, he put everything aside. He stopped getting his pay. He stopped getting his pay. He's still not getting paid to be fully honest. A lot of people don't know that. And he's working harder than ever to keep us out there and make sure the players are making

money and playing for full purse. I mean, you talk about baseball, only playing for a certain amount of money. I mean, obviously we missed tournaments and opportunity to make money. But we came back with no fans, those organizations, not able to sell corporate tents and so on and so forth. And we're still, as a player's plan for full purse, which is pretty special. A lot of people don't know how much work went into that and make that happen. Yeah, that is really awesome. But say Charlie Hoffman was commissioner of the PGA tour. What's the first thing you would change?

I'm already gone, so you can't say get me out of there. Wow, that's a good question. I don't know if I'd change too much at this point. I'm sure I could sit back and think about much. but Tim Finchum did an amazing job. Dean Beeman did an amazing job before Tim, and Jay is probably doing a little better than both of them. I mean, he's bulldog.

He puts good people around them, and he's very personal. I think he knows every player in Caddy by first name may know all their wives, and not that you need to do that to be a commissioner, but I know that makes a difference in a lot of people's eyes. And he knows all the sponsors. He's not scared to call a sponsor

when during the hard times. He's not scared to make. make a big, big step and move. And I can tell you right now, I wouldn't want anybody else to be our commissioner right now. I definitely, he's let us through this. And I don't know if anybody else would have been able to do that job that he's doing now. But I wouldn't change too much at this point in time. I think we make pretty good money.

Playing a sport, obviously comparable to baseball and so on and so forth. No guaranteed money. I think maybe something in that line. I think what makes our sports special is not having any guaranteed money. I think it makes a little bit different, makes a little more relatable to some people in the world. And I don't think I would change much. Well, keep your commissioner hat on right now because I want to float a few of the things that are going around in the world of golf right now and get your take on it. So right now the RNA is making some noise that they are possibly considering making some rollbacks in terms of like either the golf ball or the equipment or the combination of the two in terms to like battle the distances that guys are hitting it right now, namely probably Bryce.

It's for the catalyst for all this stuff. But do you agree or disagree with the potential like rollback of the ball equipment or both? I'm not for bifurcation. I think playing under one rule makes our sport really special. There's a time in my life. I thought the tour could have come out and played by their own rules. I think we sort of missed that boat, be completely honest. Not saying we can't do it.

But I think Bryson is the perfect example to say why we don't need to roll back anything. The guy was average to long hitter. prior and he went and worked his ass off and found a way to hit it further. I mean, that is the perfect example of getting better. Why would you want to roll it back? And to be completely honest, if he do roll it back, he's still going to have an advantage. He still worked his ass off to swing it harder, faster, and straighter. I mean, you can do all that and he's hitting it straighter.

Athletes are playing the game of golf now. Nothing against Nicholas's era, which, whatever. The best athletes in the world were not playing golf. I've never talked to anybody back in the time about that, but you'd be naive to say they were. The best athletes in the world are starting to play golf now. Young kids are working out at young ages. They're more efficient, the teaching way better.

I mean, a list goes on and on and on. That's what it's going further. Now, the ProV1, the solid core golf ball, changed more than any, changed the game of golf more than anything than the driver or a hybrid or anything that golf ball did. But you know what? That's what we have. The PGA Tour only plays 40-something Vince a year on 40-something different golf courses. Not every golf course needs to be 7,000 yards or 7,500 yards. Are there a few of them that we need? Need to be that long? Yeah, probably. But it doesn't have to be. I promise you, you go get Riviera, which is a

very long golf course, but not by tour standards outrageously long. You firm those greens up and grow a little bit of rough. Even parr wins that golf tournament. It has to do with conditioning. It has to do with a little bit of rough and a little bit of firmness of the greens. If you can get the greens firm, we just struggle no matter how long it is. So you don't need a long golf course to make a great champion or make a great event. But last time I checked, I don't think anybody had a problem with guys in the farm making birdies.

I don't think anybody called in and goes, oh, these guys are making too many birdies. It's horrible to watch these guys make birdies coming down the stretch and making eagles to pass each other. It's great. That's great TV. I actually could argue even far as horrible TV. Who likes watching people make bogeys? I mean, maybe once a year at the U.S. Open,

but that's actually not great television. Actually, Colt has called in. I've called in and said guys. I've called in and complaining about everyone's too long. It is absolutely ridiculous. This gym thing is bullshit. You shouldn't be allowed to go in there. Drop it at 250 in the middle of the fairway and let's figure it out from there.

Let's play from 220 on every hole and see you wins, guys. Everyone get a hybrid and let's figure it out. All right, well, we got to get into this because our listeners, they like to have a good time. And obviously, as we've gone over, as you're sipping on your mule, your guy is not scared to have a good time. None of us like missing cuts, but if you're going to miss a cut, what's the best city on the PGA tour to miss a cut in? For weekend festivities. Back when I was younger in its chance. changed a lot because of security. I think Hilton Head might have been the best town of Missa Cut in.

Yeah. I mean, it's a secretive little spot, obviously, if you could have gone Vegas or Dallas or something like that. But I think Hilton Head might have been the best spot. They had a cool little vibe down the other quarter deck, had some, you could get on a boat party or something like that, and have a lot of fun if you happen to Missa Cut and Hillhead. And you could walk everywhere, which was very important. Yes, that is very, very true. And I've also done my research, and I've heard that you don't take any pain. Research on missing catch.

You did that research? No, I've researched you. Okay, actually, I've just witnessed it in person, but you do not take any pain medication to help your hangovers because you feel like you deserve them. Explain this theory to me. I don't get it. That's sociopath stuff. You know what? I deserve it.

I put myself through that pain. God. It's not great pain. I can promise you that at all. Very few times in my life I've taken the ad bill. I've taken them for back pains and stuff on the golf course. But you know what? I don't do it after hangover because you hit the nail right in the head.

I think I deserve that hangover after. So you're telling me, you're telling me after the Travis Matthew event in Cabo in the airport, you didn't take any pain medication. I didn't, but I was a bit deletive. that day. Oh my God, that's incredible. That's a top 10, I can promise you. Yes.

That's a top 10. All right, that's a bit psychotic, I feel like. What doesn't kill you make you stronger, I guess, you know? I can't believe it. But we're doing some fun stuff like this. All right, speaking of hangovers, Charlie Hoffman's out playing with his boys on the golf course. What do you drink and what game do you play?

You know, I very rarely, rarely drink on the golf course. It's like a Travis Matthew event I used to drink at when I was, when I was representing Travis Matthew. If I go in Mexico, outside the country lines like Mexico with a group of guys I'll drink. But if I'm at home, I don't drink on the golf course. I'm not, as I tell people, I'd be drinking 24-7 if I started drinking on the golf course playing with my friends. I don't think it's like going in the office. Guys, most people don't drink in the office.

So I'm a social guy. After the round, I'll have it. I'll have a beverage. Hmm. But I'm not a drink around the golf course, which might be, people might not believe it, but that is the truth. Yeah, you respect. Yeah, I get it.

Sometimes in Mexico, you jump in the ocean, have some cocktails, whatever, you know, no big deal. Yeah, maybe it's stripped down and jump in the ocean. Let me tell you who my favorite Hoffman is, by the way, because I was texting your father earlier today, and he just got back to me. I said, Big Earn, shooting a podcast with your wonderful son in a bit. Could you share a funny story about him or something people might not know about him? His comment, he is a dick to play golf with. He is a dick to play golf with.

Just one sentence. That's all I got from him. From your old man. How about that? I love it. He thinks you're a seagull too. His own seed. Well, you learn from the biggest seagull of them all.

That's all I got to say about that. That is very, very fair. I love it. Oh, my God. When you're home in San Diego, I know you play a lot of golf with Phil. What's your relationship, Phil Mickelson? What's your relationship like with him? And how often do y'all tee it up together when you're back home?

Yeah, I would say a relationship strictly business. I've never gone to his house for dinner. Don't hang out much or at all, really off the golf course. But we really enjoy going at it on the golf course. if our schedule is a matchup. We'll definitely play. And we talked about this offseason a little bit during the COVID time when we played it. We're lucky enough now to have a decent amount of players in California.

It was a long time where no one in professional golf lived in California for the most part because of taxes. But we've got Xander Schoffley, which is I consider a top 10, obviously top 10 player in the world on a regular basis, probably at some time in this career, maybe the number one play on the world. You got filming best play all time. You got Brennan Steel just up to the road about 45 minutes an hour up in Newport Beach area. You got a few other guys that enjoy playing golf. But it's great to get a group together to push each other. Like there's not a lot going on. We would go out and play and Phil and I text a little bit afterwards.

It's like that's what you need to get ready for a tour event is. I mean, you can go play a money game with a guy that's a 13-handy guy. to watch good golf shots and get your blood flowing and making a three-footer count coming down the stretch. That's what makes you succeed in professional golf. And we're lucky enough in San Diego to have that. Phil and I, obviously, try to kick each other their brains in. There's definitely a large weight you're usually going on why that had.

But that's good because you don't want to lose. I mean, if we were only playing for a few dollars, obviously you got some pride and ego going on. but you don't want to fork over that envelope, envelope of cash at the end of the day. Envelope. I love the envelope. That's different units than we play. That must be different units.

They're nice. They're nice units when you win. Not nice units when you lose. Who's up lifetime? Oh, life. Phil. Phil's up lifetime. Phil,

Phil's got me a decent amount of times for a decent amount. But I would say as of late, I've beat them more often than nine. but that that hasn't been hard the way he's been playing but there it is there it is the seagull just dropping dropping load i will tell you who absolutely's been smoking me which isn't as xander there was a time that we were playing a month back or so i mean he'd shoot nine or ten under every time we went out and played we were going to play and he's like let's go play again we don't play for nearly as much as phil but speaking of rival it's it's ego between me and zander because i used to get him

when he was younger and before he became the world-class player he is. And he's gotten me back tenfold now. I mean, the guy is a machine. He shoots nine, ten under every time he plays at home. I mean, it's insane how good he is. And we said the first two-ditch one day, and I'm like, I'm not playing you. I'll play a team game. I'll get my partner or whatever, but I'm not playing you.

It's the first time I've ever said that to anyone. Wow. He clipped your wings. He clipped the Siegel's wings. I shoot four or five under. I'm like, I feel pretty good about myself. I'm not shooting nine or 10 under today. I'm just not going to have it.

Oh my goodness. That is shocking news. That is shocking news. Charlie Hoffman turns down a game from fellow PJ Tour Pro. Is he the most underrated guy on tour? Because, like, Cole and I do a radio show. And like, he is never the name that's mentioned in all these big events. Like, he's never a name that's on the front of everybody's lips.

Like, this is the guy to look out for this week. But he's so good. Exactly. Is he the most slept on guy? I don't want to say slept on, but most underrated. Yeah, I guess he doesn't really have that personality of the, the JT, the Ricky Fowler, so on and so forth. But his golf game speaks for himself.

There's no question. And I think he sort of likes not being the name because it gives him a little chip on his shoulder to be completely honest. I think it's that chip that sort of drives him a little bit. I think he'll be a name someday. But I know he plays that chip that people don't give him the respect that he deserves.

And he, I mean, if it's a big event, his name is up there every single time. time it's it's actually unreal i mean i don't know the numbers but if you you throw his last x amount of majors i mean i between rick the young jordan ricky young guys i almost guarantee you his combined scores lower than theirs yeah what what would you say the best part is anders schoffley's game is mental yeah you because you took him under that little seagull wing they have that it factor like you're talking about i i i try he was he was beyond it uh i remember the first one of the first times playing we were playing Torrey Pines together before his rookie year and

obviously playing Torrey Pines in San Diego and he was hitting like crap but he was grinding this ass off out there and hitting chip shots and wanted it and I think we ended up pushing that day but he that he had it like he didn't he didn't like some people hit what am I hit it right this is whatever I don't know what's going on he just you hit it when found it and hit the left when founded, made pars and birdies from no matter where he hit it, never had an excuse, never, never made anything up. He just went, played golf. And he, his mental side is, is as strong as anybody on tour. We always joke, he goes, I just, I just want to be as mentally strong as Webb Simpson. He thinks Webb Simpson's the most positive mentally strong guy out there, which he is,

by the way. But, uh, you know, he's, he's mentally strong and guess what? A close second behind And that is how he puts, chips, his ball, and does everything else. I mean, there's not a weakness in his game. He drives it. I mean, unbelievably, it's an iron. I mean, it goes on and on. That's why you don't get a top 10 player in the world having a weakness. He is nails.

Do you feel like you're taking a pay cut with Phil moving to Florida here upcoming, and you're not going to get as many of those envelopes as you're accustomed to getting? I'll believe Phil in Florida when I see Phil in Florida. But, I mean, I know eventually be there, but he'll still have a house down the boat for me. So I'm sure I'll see him plenty. Yeah. For sure. If Charlie Hoffman could win one regular PGA tour event,

not a major, not a player, anything like that, what would it be? I mean, the monetary one would be the tour championship. I mean... Okay, well, I meant just like regular, not playoff, none of that.

I knew you're going to say that, by the way. The FedEx Cup. I should have thrown that in there when I said. The FedEx Cup championship. You're so greedy with money. I knew you're going to say that. You know what? I mean, obviously the local town event would be

it would be San Diego or Vegas would be close second behind there. I mean, I spent 20 years of Vegas going to college out there. So the hometown of events are always the ones you want to do well in. And that would be it. Perfect. That's fair. You don't have to stay out of those casinos. Keep those chips from falling out of your shirt during putting practice, bro.

You got to tighten up a little bit to win in Vegas. You got to be mentally strong. Vegas and chips falling out. What happened to Colt my pro M year? You're supposed to play my foundation event. What happened, Cole? First off, I played like 47 of your pro. events so let's not go there and first off this shows about you not me I'm asking the question

yeah we'll do the question asking around here but I will say you started a little early for me in Vegas okay you started a little noon shotgun and I kind of rolled over maybe 1245 noon shotgun I didn't get a response till two no it was 1245 for the record dude noon and Vegas is 6 am and every other city in the US there's a six hour different time again this isn't about me this is about you shut up charlie all right is it time to get to emergency yeah let's hit this little e9 right here. All right. We do this with every every guest. Nine fun questions. Get to know more about the Seagull, Charlie Hoffman.

All right, number one. Movie made about the life of Charlie Hoffman. You can pick any actor, dead or alive. Who plays you? Jeff Daniels. That's who I have written down. Jeff Daniels. I also have Philip Seymour Hoffman. That's who I had. Really? Yeah. That's who you had? Yeah. And it's the same last name too, which is weird. But dude,

he was a stud. Wow. Interesting. A lot of alignment. What do you think about that? What do you think about Philip Seymour Hoffman if you can't get Jeff Daniels. Yeah, maybe Dustin Hoffman. Dustin Hoffman would never have a mustache like that, bro. God, I love it. All right, number two. All right, question two, know your big L.A. Chargers guy.

So question, will it be easier to get a ticket to an L.A. Chargers game now that Philip Rivers and his wife and 27 kids won't be in attendance? It was never hard to get a ticket for an L.A. Charger game. I can promise you that. and now it's going to be a little bit easier. But they're the only team prepared to play not in front of fans. So I think they're going to have a great season. Yeah, the Rivers family took up an entire section.

So that one's going to be in the now. Are you still as big a fan as you were when they were in San Diego or no? Not at all. You were die hard. Yes, I was die hard. I would say when they went to L.A. I was a follower. I was a fan in San Diego.

In L.A. I was a follower, or they're still in L.A. as a follower. And I tell people, I have more ties to Vegas. I'm going to be more of a Raider fan. than I am a Charger fan at this point. Just because I have so many times of it, I mean, obviously the hockey team, that's my team,

saw it develop from start. You know what? I'm more, the, it's about the town and the city more than it's actually the team and where they're located in who's playing for them. I have no ties to L.A. whatsoever.

I don't like anything about L.A. So I'm probably more of a Raider fan. Okay, perfect. Wow, charges to Raiders. Well, back in the day, when the Chargers were in San Diego, used to carry a Sharpie around, just in case. Well, I try to fertilize your hair at one time at the game.

This is so good. Well, just so you know, you used to carry a Sharpie around, just in case, you know, someone might notice you. So the question is, have you signed more autographs at Chargers games or dump more beers on people's heads at Chargers? Definitely autographs. Definitely autographs. I'll never forget the time you dumped a beer on my head

because I fake high-fived you at a Chargers game. And then the guy behind me wanted to punch you. And I said, come on down, sir. I have no idea you are, but this would be fantastic. Please do it. The greatest part about this is you think you remember what happened because I didn't. I remember what happened, actually. I have no idea how, but I actually do.

This guy wants to punch you in the face. You should probably sign something with that Sharpie that you carry around in case somebody asks you. Do you have a Sharpie on you right now? I do not have a Sharpie on me. Okay. We're not able to get him to sign the wall since this is on Zoom. disappointing all right next question who is your favorite player on tour to give the seagull treatment to who do you like to go in and just sprinkle with a little bit of dump

and then walk away I you know what I I don't discriminate I do it to everybody that that's why that's why I'm the single I literally don't discriminate I mean obviously the chattled between the group that we play with I mean I obviously get friends with Chappell Kisner and a few other guys but you know what I I don't just I like talking a little shit to everybody so uh i i do it to everyone that's fair it's equal treatment all right next question what's the maddest you've ever been at a fan on tour oh this is there's been a few of them there's a couple of them but that i was at liberty national one time it might have been it was definitely wasn't a playoff been back then anyways liberty national and i'm playing

pretty good. I want to say it's, we'll say it's Friday. And if you've ever played Liberty National, the ninth hole is out in the middle of nowhere. And I'm turning, and I'm maybe tied to the lead or close to the lead, and I hit shore the grain, chunk of chip, it comes back, it sort of rolls back to my feet and hit

it up there at about six feet and miss. Make double. And after I make double, or missed the put for bogey, this guy, one guy out there, I mean, probably one guy out there, go, choke! I'm like, first of all, it's freaking Friday. So I go up underneath the rope.

I go over underneath the ropes and get in his fat and go, what the fuck do you say? Yep, there it is. I didn't say anything. And somehow my brother-in-law, which never watched me play golf, was out. Not my brother. Yeah, brother-in-law, it comes out and gets in front of me. I mean, I was a little hot. Of course, my caddy at the time, Miguel was nowhere to be seen.

He was already on the other tee, like running away. didn't want to get any confrontation back back me up but uh i've been i've been hot a few times with a few fans i've calmed down a ton uh but uh i was pretty there's there's other stories i can go on about being hot of fans but that was that was probably wonderful the old joke on friday and for the record i thought you were going to say hartford and hartford harford harford was the easy one but the other one was a lot of people didn't see that one harford a lot of people know the heart for one by the way to be fair i got heckled the worst i've ever been heckled in my life at Hartford twice. So those people up there, they're ruthless. We're still trying

to identify this, this cult heckler, perennial cult heckler up in Hartford. If anyone knows, please wants to have him on the show. I want to have him on the show. I got to meet this guy. He hates Colt for some reason. And I hate me. I love this man. He just came out of the blue and heckled Colt to death every year. And I need to know who this is. All right. Next question. All right. Next question. Which PJ Tour player would benefit most in getting a hair transplant with the hair that you cut off a few years ago. You know, there's been some good transformations already. I mean,

I think Strillman's made a huge transformation through the years. Zach's still trying to get some better hair. To give up. Bill Haasne needs some hair.

But who's a blonde? I mean, you've got to have some blonde hair to get that's losing it. I mean, I didn't go with the easy one. I need it. I mean, let's be honest here. I need that hair back. Oh, I love it.

You should have saved it, dude. They could throw that. I could staple that right into the front of your head right now. Dude, the skull wouldn't look that good. I mean, you want to see the fun. Wow. Wow. Wow.

Allenger told me to ask you about the five head. It might be six now. Oh, my goodness. You could land a 747 on that bitch. I love it. It still has less room than Colts. That's all I know. That's true.

If I had hair, it wouldn't be fair. Charlie, just remember that. Okay. All right. Next question. What's the worst injury you've ever suffered on the golf course? I don't, I mean, my back's gone out on the golf course before. I've never suffered like an extremely bad injury. But I mean, getting older, I've been over a few times and like just locks up, seized or whatever. But being a play honest, right now, right now I'm playing with a torn or slight tear at my right arm tendon. And so that's decent pain for the last X amount of months.

So trying to fight through that. And as I say, getting old is not for Pussy's Colt. That's true. That is a fact. That's why I quit. One of the many reasons. But I once again thought you were going to go with a different answer. And I assumed it was going to be the time you tried to wrestle that wave in Cabo after making Bertie on 16.

But, you know, it's your opinion. It's your show. A little $800 birdie. Decide to go jump, take a little dip in the ocean. Yeah. Mother Nature don't lose. Mother Nature is undefeated. Father time and Mother Nature, they don't lose.

If anybody's been in common try to jump in those waves, there's some severe undertow in those. There's a reason you're not supposed to jump in the ocean there at El Dorado. Yeah. All right, last question. At least you didn't have clothes on. All right, last question. No, last question from me.

That's it. Is this the last one? Yeah. All right, last one. Is it true that Adam Scott left UNLV after only one semester because he couldn't handle being the second best looking guy on the team? Well, obviously. There's a lot of rumors about that going around.

He's like, I can't be on the team with this Charlie guy. We all know Bill Lundy was the best looking guy out there. The fact. My favorite thing about Bill Lundy is every time he wins something, it gets canceled the next year. He won the Kodak Challenge, gone. He won Turning Stone, gone. I'm like, Bill, you got to quit.

because every time you win something, it's gone the next year. Colt, keep your chin up. Things will turn around soon. First off, it's chins. If you're going to say it right, it's right. Keep your chins up. You stole that from John Malagher. Get your story straight.

Yeah, cite your source. Thank God you're good at golf. Oh, my God. That's good. But Charlie, it's been an absolute blast. Thanks so much for joining us on golf subpar. You're okay. Never call me again.

Commissioner Siegel. Thank you, my man. That was the Siegel. Thanks, buddy. Appreciate it. All right. That was the Seagull, Charlie Hoffman. He's the guy I love to hate or hate to love.

I'm not sure which way it works. No, you guys have a very, very complicated relationship. I can tell there's a lot of love between the two of you, but also there's probably no one you'd rather give the needle to more than Mr. Charles. We didn't even get into one of my favorite stories with him when I was leading Hilton Head going into Sunday in 2012. And we were over at the same house every night, eating dinner, playing gin, and I was just on a roll that week. I was playing great golf. I was playing great gin.

Everything lined up. And this is no kidding. We're playing heads up. He throws me a card. I yelled Jen. He takes his cards, throws them at my face and goes, fuck you. I hope you shoot 80 tomorrow. And he meant it.

That's a friend. Yep. That is a true friend. We also didn't get into, which I meant to ask him about, was we just had Kevin Stadler on and we talked about his historic Project X style victory party at the Phoenix Open when he won. Charlie Hoffman was a big part of that. And I had some funny memories from him.

That was the first time I'd ever met Charlie at the time. and he was in the running for most valuable player of that night. I'm sure he remembers none of it. Yeah, he's not scared to get amongst it. And now one of my favorite things I've learned is after a night of drinking, he does not take any pain medication because he feels like he deserves the hangover. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. I actually respect that.

He's like, no, dude, I did this to myself. I'm going to wear this. I'm going to wear this for the entire day, probably multiple days at this age. And also the only thing more surprising than him and Zach Johnson missing a combined, like 30 straight cuts to start their career on the now-quired. Horn Ferry tour was that those two room together. That is the odd couple of all odd couples. Like I would never have put those two in the same hotel room traveling around the

nationwide at the time or the web.com or whatever it was. It's crazy. Would have never put those two together. And by the way, since we're about to get into our gambling picks, what kind of odds could you have got that those two would turn out to have the careers that they had on the PJs? You're like, hey, you want these two nitwits? O for 30 on the web.com tour right now? Yeah, you can get one of them to win a couple majors and you can get the other one to

have a bunch of wins on. Charlie made $28 million on tour and earnings. You want that bet? That was going off a big plus money. Crazy, crazy stuff. A lot of fun with the Seagull, Charlie Hopping. We appreciate him joining us. But now it is time to get to the gambling segment.

And I need an update on this. It's getting very interesting. I think I chipped away a little bit, producer Mark. Yeah, there were some chipping away. You guys canceled out there on your picks of Xander Shafley for Sleys. And then you came in with Billy Horshaw. Both tied for 13th. Those checks canceled out.

But, Colt, you had all four of your. players make the cut this week, which helped. And the only other one that Drew had was Mark Leishman at a T-40. So it's down to a lead of $500,056. Dollars, dollars. Use your numbers. Read your numbers. I'm producer, Mark.

He's a producer, not a mathematician. By the way, there was a time with like five holes left on Friday. You and I were playing golf that day. And I was like, I'm going to get four. I'm going to have go O for four on my picks this week. I really thought you are Leishman. Zander Leishman. and both made it on the number.

Kind of backdoored their way into that thing. And of course, Zander goes out and just finishes top 20, like a damn champion. He was my top guaranteed top 10 last week. Thought he missed the cut. And then he missed. Especially after Charlie Hoffman's talking about he shoots 10 under every day. I was never more confident than the Xander shop plate. I was like, well, well, he's going to win.

All right. Well, another exciting week on the PJ tour. We are heading to the Twin Cities, the 3M championship. It's your honor. Yeah, I do have the honor. Not the strongest field of the year, I would have to say. Yes, it's the top heavy. First step down.

All right, with the number one pick in this week's draft, I'm going with a guy who was in the final group, go ahead into the weekend at the Memorial Tournament, finished tied for 23rd at the 3M last year, had an awful weekend at the Memorial, but he's got a new caddy on the bag, new face to look at, long-hitting Tony Fienow. Yeah, who is now unleashing the fury on some of his drives,

falling a little bit of the Descham Bowl mold. And this is a big hitter's ballpark. Yes. That's one of many reasons I was off on the weekend. Are you shocked by the caddy change? Because this is just news to me, like right now, basically. I really am. I got a text from Gary Woodland's caddy out there asking me for a few phone numbers.

And I wasn't sure why. And he's like, Fee now decided to make a caddy change. And I'm like, oh, interesting. Because I know they're very good friends, him and his caddy, Greg. They've had a long run together. But listen, man, when you're as talented as Tony Fee now and you haven't crossed that finish line in a very long time, and the only one you have is Puerto Rico, sometimes you've got to make a change. I mean, you can't put yourself on the bench.

Can't blame yourself. At any time, I switch Gaddi's every week. But yeah, I was surprised to see him do that. But I liked that pick. And I was hoping, there was a time where I was hoping he, since neither of us picked him, I was like, I hope he not wins this thing. It would have been a great one. But his time's coming, hopefully.

All right, I'm going to go with my number one pick in this week's draft. This could be the dumbest pick in the history or this could be the best pick. But I'm picking a guy that's coming off back-to-back 80 burgers. And if anyone knows about back-to-back 80s, it's sleighs. And typically, that's not a sign of great form. But DJ, Dustin Johnson, going off at 10 to 1, the betting favorite, despite the fact that he didn't break 80 last week. I don't know if this is stupid or smart, but it is a bomber's golf course. And if anyone in the world of golf has a short-term memory, it's Dustin Johnson.

I think he's going to be just fine. Crazy shit. So I'm throwing out last week and just saying, hey, this is probably the best player in the field. I will take him and roll the dice with DJ. There's only like four or five guys in top 25 to 1 or better this week. And Brooks is one who is a wide open field. Nobody knows. And I think Paul Casey was the other one, who, by the way, last week was 80 to one to give you some reference on the strength of field. Well, and he took the weekend off. So that kind of made sense. He's fresh, though. All right, who's slees got with pick number two?

This is my favorite pick of my draft this week. I'm going with a guy who's had an incredible form lately. Mr. Harris English is the last two events. He's 17th, 13th at the RBC and the Memorial. This year, this year, this year. He's played great. In his last six, he's got one miscut at Colonial. the first week back after the break. And his worst finish other than that is 17th. He's playing good golf. I think he's under the radar. And he's my favorite pick of the lot. He's a very good golfer. He is not terrible at golf.

I'm a big Harris English fan. All right. Pick number two for me, guy who had it going last week, ended up finishing 38th, struggled on Sunday like a lot of guys, but finished tied for seventh here last year. Having a very sneaky good year,

not getting enough credit. Man can strike his golf ball. Lucas Glover going off at 35 to 1. Hits it. I had a little bet on him last week as well, too. Tita Green, tough to find better than him. Yep. All right. Pick number three. This is where we get into the dark horses, and this is where pretty much the whole field is. Yeah. Is outside of 50 to 1. This guy, another guy that's having a great year. He's 38th in the FedEx Cup and never gets talked about.

He's very quiet. One of my favorite people, I call him the princess. For many reasons, we'll get into that another time. But he tied for fifth here last year at the 3M. He's 66 to 1. Carlos Ortiz. Yes. The princesses. spoken Carlos Ortiz. I love him. Yeah, he's he's the he's a beauty and he's right. He doesn't get enough credit. Like you said, the whole field is basically back here 50 or plus. So like you, there's a lot of room to run here. All right, I like that pick. I'm going to go with a guy,

never been picked before on this show. This is kind of fun this week because we're not picking the same dudes. I'm done picking sung Jay for a while. I'm going with a new guy here. Guy we recently had on radio, awesome guy, huge talent, recently got special temporary membership on the PJ tour based on his third place finish at the Travelers. Vanderbilt. grad and upcoming stud, I believe, Will Gordon. Played five events this year on the PJ Tour. He's top 21 in three of the five obviously has the game. And then talking with some of the guys who are more familiar with this golf game,

they're like nobody hits it further. That looks like they don't hit it far than Will Gordon. It's like kind of effortless. You get out there. He hits it. Like, oh, good drive. And you get up there and he's 30 yards in front of everyone else. Well, for the record, as usual, you got your stats wrong.

What's that? He has been picked on this program. I picked him in Detroit the week after he finished third and he missed the cut. Oh, okay. You did get on him early. Get your facts straight. You didn't know when to pick him up. But I have a big fan.

Ever since we had him on the Sirius XM show, Gravy and the Sleece, he was awesome. And there's like a weight off his short. He needed to play his way on a tour. Now he's essentially done. I think it's already done, but it's pretty much done. And now he can just kind of go out on free will. All right. My last pick going off at 80 to 1.

His game, his results haven't been there. But his game, as he says, is very, very close. I love his. He's one of my favorite golf swings on the PJ tour. One of my favorite people to interview, Mr. Max Homa, going off at 80 to 1. I think he's doing. for a good week. Yeah, I absolutely. And in talking with him, he's like, I'm close, I'm just not getting the scores. Love Max Homa. We'd never say a bad thing about him. I'm going to go

on the other side of that, friend of the program, Max Homa. Guy, I don't know really shit about at all other than that he played good last week. So the game of golf. Henrik Norlander. Oh. I got to have somebody on my team with some recent form other than Harris English. I'm going to go Henrik Norlander. He's got two top 15s in his last four starts. Seems like the best form of all I could find in all the 50 plus to one guys. And the odds this week, six last week at Muirfield played well on a really hard golf course so this is more just a stab in the dark and you could have gone one of

30 ways down here and I'm going to just pick one guy that happened to play good last week. Well let me give you a quick story on Hendrik Norlander. You're going to love this and make your pick even better. Okay. Now so believe it or not Hendrick Norlander lives in Augusta, Georgia when Josh Gregory went to SMU who was the head coach,

Hendrick Norlander stepped in to be interim head coach at Augusta State. Whatever it's called now. I don't think it's called that anymore. But anyways, they didn't, he was done for the season. They didn't, they needed a golf coach. So he, he's their coach for a couple weeks. They come to Dallas, Texas to play a tournament, college tournament, Royal Oaks Country Club. He's the coach. They're in the van. Well, that week they were doing, it's normally five count four for that week. That week it was six count five. So the team knew, obviously there's six guys there. And one of the kids goes, uh, coach norlander,

what's the format this week? Since we have six guys. He goes, I don't know. But for y'all's like, I hope it's a fucking scramble. So that's my coach. That's my guy. That's my coach right there. That is your guy. All right. I'm more solidified than ever. I may pick him every week going forward based on that. He's the best. Coach of the year. So I call, I've called him coach ever since then. That is perfect. All right. To recap, I got Tony Fee now, Lucas Glover, Carlos Ortiz, Max Homa. I'm going with my hot hand DJ coming off 80 burgers. I'm going Harris English middle tier, Will Gordon, Henrik Norlander, my favorite coach in NCAA history at my four spot. All right. That'll do it for us this week. Everyone, good luck with all your

picks. Next week, another great guess. Our first caddy on the the show. Long time caddy for Ricky Fowler. Joe Scoverin will be joining us here on golf subpar. Everyone have a great week. We'll talk to you next week.