Subpar - Hank Haney Interview: Writing ’The Big Miss’ after coaching Tiger Woods, How he started working with Mark O’Meara

Episode Date: February 8, 2022

On this week's episode of GOLF's Subpar, legendary golf instructor Hank Haney joins former PGA Tour pro Colt Knost and jicky jack legend Drew Stoltz for an exclusive, in-studio, interview. The host of The Hank Haney Podcast talks the sequence of events that led to him meeting Mark O'Meara, the controversy around his decision to write 'The Big Miss' after coaching Tiger Woods, and how Charles Barkley ended up introducing him to his wife.

Hello world. Welcome back to golf subpar with Colt Nost and Drew Stoltz. Slees, a TCU horn frog is the latest winner on the PGA tour. Tom Hogi gets done at the AT&T Pebble Beach Pro Am. How about it? Been a long time since JJ Henry hoisted some crystal, you know what I mean? About time to get a frog in there. If it couldn't be me, which is not. Glad it's Tom Hogi. What a guy. I mean, 202 starts, I believe, since he got on the PGA tour. He's knocked on the door a few times. Most recently, I mean, down in Lakeitha, had a chance. chance, finish runner up to Hudson Swofford, and he didn't do anything to lose it. Hudson just kind of

took it with the Eagle on 16, Bertie on 17, but he's been knocking on the door, and damn, what a way to get it done. Not only at Pebble Beach, pretty good spot to do it, but you're looking up after his double on five, he's got Jordan Speed, Patrick Cantley. Those are two guys that give up the lead too often when they get it. Yeah, he's been playing great. He's been on a roll. I mean, I just love the way he goes about it. I mean, listen, he's a gambler on and off the golf course, which I respect tremendously. But, you know, when you think about the way he plays golf. Pebble Beach is a perfect fit. I mean, really small, tiny greens. You got to, the fairways aren't that hard to hit. You got to be really precise with your irons. And that's

what he does. And he switched to a new putter recently. And the putt on 17, my God, I mean, that was just massive pretty much. I've never seen a tournament flip-flop so fast. I was covering Jordan Spee's group for CBS. He's got a two-shot lead through 16. All of a sudden, bam, Jordan makes dokees up, makes bogey on 17. Hoagie almost damn near holds it on 16. How about that shot? Flips it. Then he birdies 17. I'm like, this thing just went from, It looked like a Jordan Speath was going to cruise. Most likely. To now Tom Hogan's cruising.

Just let, I mean, not layups or it didn't feel like a, I know it didn't feel like a layup to Tom, but walking into 18, you get to a hybrid off that T. He had hit an eight iron up over the tree for a second. He had, by the way, he hit seven iron. And we had him on the radio this morning. He's like, that was a seven iron. And he's like, it's a little more than I would ideally like to have in there, but hit a hell of a shot. And then the two putts, he's like, you know, I looked back. I had the four foot comeback or whatever.

And I know Bow's two back. And I look back and I see Boe in the middle of the fairway. And I'm like, you know, immediately, of course, it's your first time trying to get a win. And he's like, I know Bow's going to make Eagle. So he's like, I have to make. So he felt like that was the one to win the golf tournament. But you're right, dude. It flipped.

I mean, the shot on 16, probably the shot of his life, that nine iron that damn near found it. And then he, you know, see something you don't see too often from Jordan Speath with a little hiccup, short miss on 17 with an iron that I'm sure he loved when it came off the face. Yeah, he flushed it. First off, I'm glad he just had the opportunity to make bogey on 17 because what we saw on Saturday on number eight, I was there. it was so freaking scary dude i went over there and walked where his ball was on the edge of the cliff i took a stance and i said there is no way in hell i'd hit this ball joe griner max almost catty text me said no chance to let max zero zero michael greller begged him not to hit that golf ball at the end of the day jordan thought he could do it he pulled it off but whew dude it was my palms

were sweaty sitting there watching it i mean i was about 50 yards up in front of him on the left looking back and i'm like what happens if this foot slips like i know what happens and it ain't good i saw the ball from the overhead view. I was like, no chance even has a stance. I don't think he's just going to pull it back and it an iron, you know, and then he gets up there and he takes a stand. I'm like, oh, my God, I think he's going to hit this thing. Like, it's getting a lot of attention on Twitter and social media and all that stuff.

Like, come on, it's a golf shot. I'm like, you're dead. Like, I don't freak out so much about golf shots, but I was like, that one, especially on a Saturday, not even the final round for a guy that if he wants to win, of course, for his legacy. But it doesn't change his life if he wins. I could almost see it, A, if it was a Sunday. And it's like, okay, it's closing time.

or B, if it's a guy, let's say it's Tom Hogi there on a Sunday. And it's like, dude, a wind changes your life at that point. And maybe I can just slap it down there and I don't got to, you know, take a drop and do all that. But for Jordan Sweet, you know, on Saturdays, dude, I was floored by that. As one of the few guys, I think that actually got to go over there and stand and see exactly what it was like, man, I just, I couldn't believe it. I was really, I didn't even know what to say. Like, I was just trying to somehow not make light of a situation that could be very, very serious. But at the same time, not be like, holy shit, this guy might just die right here.

which is what honestly if the front foot looks what's going to happen yeah which is what everyone was thinking it's like they need to fence that thing off going forward because now everybody's going to walk over like oh this is where jordan hit it from like sergeo at medina from behind the tree where everyone that showed up there started hitting the shot that they had to put like a plaque and rope it off so because the grass was just dying over there people are going to walk over and be like oh this is where it went down could be some problems you get a few too many trannies up in you you know what i mean that's a good point yep but congratulations to tom hoagie that was very well learned he's been playing great it was awesome to see Before we get going, I got to tell you a little bit about our friend Gary Woodland, who I'm not very happy with right now. Just with him Saturday. What did he do?

Well, I was very nice. I was gone at Pebble Beach last week, and I gave him my car for the week. Because rental cars, you know, they're pretty expensive nowadays. And he had to rent too because he got the whole family coming in. So I flew to Pebble. He goes, hey, I'll drop your car off its signature because I'm flying back in. I was like, perfect. He sends me a picture with it on empty on gas tank.

The gas tank was empty. and then he said, I hope, have you ever played the game? Find the poopie diaper because he's got three kids. I was like, I'm going to kill you. He's like, yep, there's a poopie diaper in your car somewhere. Go ahead and get ready to look for it. He was obviously kidding. It showed up full tank of gas and it was washed.

But my Bluetooth connected to the phone. Here we go. And as I'm driving, I see this little pop up and it says, Little Dick. As the name of my Bluetooth dick. And I guess, obviously, he thought I probably wouldn't notice for a little while. I immediately call him and he just answers just die and laugh. I didn't even know if you knew about that yet. So I was out at TPC on Saturday, fulfilling some Thunderbird duties.

Oh, wow. We're in the parking lot, right? Your car pulls in. I'm like, oh, shit. And I'm like, oh, it's scary, right? So I'm like, immediately like, stop. I'm like, hey, sir, can I see a credential or whatever? Hey, what's up?

We start talking. And he's like, he's like, look at this, look at this. He points me into the screen. He's like, look, I changed his name to little dick on here. And he was laughing like he was in eighth grade. I was just dying. He was going out to practice. He was like, don't tell him, don't tell him.

I wanted to be a surprise when he gets back. God, he is such an idiot. Then we ended up playing golf. The next day, had a great crew out there with some of the fellas that he was still laughing about. He was like, dude,

I changed it to a little dick. He's so proud of himself. And by the way, I haven't been home long enough to try to fix it. I have no clue I don't even start. LD, that might be the new name.

But I'll try to figure it out. But you might notice this hat because this week is the greenest show on turf, the WM Phoenix Open, which you'll be at. I'll be out there covering for Golf Channel and CBS this week. I'm going to be wearing this thing around

the all around TPC Scott scale. I'm going to actually have some to throw out into the crowd on 16 on Saturday. So be on the look for that. These are special. It's a hot look, bro. Hot look, LD. I love you in that thing. But I did just,

I played the Monday Pro Am out there and the course is looking incredible. The ball is bouncing. Greens are perfect, by the way. And the weather looks incredible. I cannot wait for this week to get going. Pushing 80 all week. Fans are going to be out. I got the,

we just had our first ever concert at the Coliseum on 16 in between. dude old dominion Thomas wreck it was a it was a scene it looked I saw videos unbelievable christened the place nicely fully lubed up 16 it's ready to go for some action that was a that's awesome that's gonna happen going forward now it was such a success next year's Super Bowl some names being floated around already it might be shown up for that but that's awesome it's like this thing starts now you know a week in advance and people are I mean I think it's I think we stopped keeping attendance records back in 2018 because it's just too hard and it gets too big but like this will probably be the most ever through the

Gates. Great. Can't wait. Oh, it's going to be... I bet everyone will say some really nice things to me as I'm rolling through the fairway down the airways. Oh, you're going to be perfect. I'd wear rain gear on 16. If you're set up there, there can be some, you know, well-lubricated fans. But if you're tossing out green, green BJ's hats, you know what I mean? From the L.D., you'll be fine. They're going to love you. So leaves, we got a banger of an episode this week. This one, I'm very, very excited about to see what everybody thinks. One of the legendary golf instructors in the game, you know,

became very famous when he started working with Tiger Woods. He's worked with Marco mirror in the past wrote a book that was very controversial some people liked it some people hated it but hank haney sits down with us for an hour and it is fantastic one of the few people in the world who's been able to be inside the inner circle of tiger woods and share that space and i would say arguably the only guy who's willing to talk about it and he comes out and he opens up we of course get into almost all almost exclusively tiger stuff that's what everyone wants to know and like we've heard a lot of stories. We've been around a lot of golfers. I was just captivated by what he was saying because I hadn't heard it face-to-face firsthand. And it is some interesting stuff. This is a really

genuinely very, very interesting interview. Yeah, I don't want to spoil any of it. Let's get to it. Here's Hank Haney on Golf Subpar. All right. The man with us here today, one of the most renowned swing instructors in the game, worked with elite talents, all of them. Tiger, Mark Omera, Barkley, Ray Romano. You name it. The man has his fingerprints all over. him Hank Haney in the building how are we doing Hank I'm doing good I'm glad to be with you guys this is like an honor to be with you guys oh man honor for us honor for us first off I mean you've traded in the golf hat for pickleball now I know you're diehard pickleball I love pickleball I I mean golf and pickleball two greatest games in the world for sure I mean I'm a pickleball

nut I feel like my best golf is behind me 67 years old I feel like my best pickleball is not behind me okay so that's my logic on pickleball ball and I keep trying to get better. I like getting better at stuff. So I like studying, you know, learning and it's fun. Do you get more frustrated when pickleball doesn't go right or when golf used to not go right? That's a good question. That's a really good question. Probably both. I'm not real pleased with myself when I hit a bad pickleball shot. And I'm, you know, I'm decent pickleball player, but I'm not, you know, great pickball player. It's like, you know, I win some tournaments. And then I've, And I think, you know, what did I just win?

I won like the second flight of the club championship. I mean, what the hell is that? I mean, it's like, you know, I'm not a pro. And I, you know, so it's weird playing in tournaments when you win, but you win in like the second flight. So you didn't really win anything. You got to win second flight before you win the championship, though. That's true.

I got to, like, as Pickle gets more and more popular, so many golfers are getting into it. Like, we got a bunch of buddies myself, including, I prefer to play Pickle now over golf if I got it. And I get way more pisses. off after losing in pickleball to my friends, then I would if I lost them on the golf course. Like five years ago, it would have been flipped.

Yeah. That's how you know. I know you're up at Gosser. Matt Cootcher's turned into a big pickleball player, I think. He's good. It seems like pretty much everything does. Hand-eye. He's got some serious pickleball game.

Really good. I mean, he's like a 5-0 player for sure. I mean, he's a good player. Yeah, same with his. He's like way better to me. We played in the finals of the, like, club championship. It was a partner deal. He's tough.

Any other tour guys? You've seen their game on the courts? I heard Daniel Summerhays is really good. Yeah, he's really good. Phil Mickelson's good player, really good. Phil is modeling as Tom Brady. No, he's good. Pickleball line the other day.

He's good. You know, I mean, you know, Ricky Barnes is a good player. Barnes, really good player. I think he's like one of the better players I've seen him. He's got just, you know, he's a great athlete, but he's just got good instincts for the game. I mean, you know, it's interesting because pickleball is, like golf in certain ways.

I mean, one way is, is that, you know, you have to have power. I don't have a lot of that. But, you know, you also turn around and you hit a powerful shot and then you immediately hit a touch shot. And that's where the similarity I think is in golf, you know, you can hit that long shot, but then now of a sudden you've got to hit a pitch or a, you know, a chip or a put, and you've got to have great touch. And it's like instantaneous.

I mean, the hard one, then you go immediately to a soft one. And a lot of guys can't do that. That's one of the things that's cool about the game, I think. That's awesome. I never really thought about that. And if you only got one of the two, it's a problem against the guy that's got both. Yeah, the guys that bang it all the time, they're not, you know, you're going to beat them. The guy that's just got a soft game only, you know, he can't go either.

So it's like golf in that way right now. I like it. Well, let's get to know you a little bit better here. Let's go back to the beginning. What got you into the game of golf? Oh, man. My dad played golf. I mean, I played golf.

I played golf. didn't start to I was like 12 years old. I played every sport. You know, honestly, I was the best player in every team I was ever on and my team's always sucked. And I, and I, and then as soon as I got into golf and then, okay, this is all me. And, you know, if I don't do good, it's all me. I don't have to worry about anybody else. And I think that was the thing that I really loved about the game. And I, and I love the challenge of it. I mean, it's so incredibly hard that, you know, you hit that one good shot and, you know, the same way it grabs everybody, I think. You hit that good shot and you think why can't I do it again. So I just gravitated towards golf and I was a hockey

player and a golfer and I was probably better at hockey but I was a little small. And then I got a golf scholarship to University of Tulsa and then I said, well, you know, I'm going to be a golfer. And then I just love coaching. So I majored in education there and I started coaching like during school. One of my classes was to coach golf at the rec centers in Tulsa. And then as soon as I got done, I just started coaching golf. So no interest in trying to play professionally. Yeah, I mean, I was a decent player. I mean, I played, you know, I was an all-conference golf or whatever that means. But Ron Strick was my roommate. And I think I beat like Ron like maybe like, I think I beat him one time in college. It was like a qualifying round. And I shot like 62.

And he shot 63. And he was so pissed he wouldn't talk to me for like two days. We were roommates, okay? And that was like the only time I ever beat him. And I'm like, you know, there's, people think they can play. And you guys know this. I mean, and, you know, when you can't play. I mean, it's a big difference.

You know. And you've always been, I've known you for quite a long time. You've always been one of the very honest ones about it, whether someone's got it or someone doesn't. I respect that. Yeah. Because, I mean, there's a lot of people out there that are probably wasting their time. Yeah.

I mean, it's just, you know, if you, and you see somebody that can really play. And Ron had a good career. I mean, won a couple times on the PJ tour, one on the Champions Tour, one on the Nike tour. But, I mean, it's not like he was the best player in the world. But, I mean, his level was just so different than the level that I was playing at. And I, you know, I didn't want to try to play. And then all of a sudden, you know, you're 28 years old and you've never had a real job in your life. So at 20, at 23, I was the director of instruction for the Pioneers Golf School,

is the biggest golf resort in the world. And, you know, I thought, you know, this is pretty good. Yeah, that's pretty good at age 23. And it was while you were down there, I believe, you got your first, if you want to call it, like big break. Your first, like every teacher, you kind of need a pro, I think, to get you started, to give you a credibility. That's where you got yours, huh?

Yeah, yeah, Mark O'Meara. I mean, if I didn't meet Mark O'Meara, nobody'd know who Hank Haney was, I wouldn't be sitting here with you guys. I wouldn't have had all the great opportunities I've had in the game of golf. I mean, you can think you're good. You can, you know, be confident in all those things, but you've got to be able to prove it. And you have to have a great student.

And I was lucky. I mean, if you have one Mark O'Meara in your career, and I've had more than one, but if you had one Mark O'Meer in your career, you're a lucky coach for sure. And I met Mark. He was 124th on the money list on the PGA tour. And, you know, two years later,

he was second on the money list. So, you know, all of a sudden, people thought, you know, Hank Caney must know something. And I felt like I knew a lot about the back swing. You know, I probably didn't know too much about the down swing. I didn't give any refunds, but you just do the best you can. You keep trying to get better. But Mark was for sure.

How did that? Yeah, was that like? How did it start? Like, how did you get in touch with him? He was on the driving range. And a good friend of mine, Ken Crow, was on the one of our teachers. and Mark said, hey, would you watch me hit some balls? And there was like two terms to go in the year.

And Ken said, well, let me get somebody else. And he went and got me and Ken drugged me out there. And I didn't even want to go. Because I honestly, I thought this is one of his club pro buddies that just missed the cut. And he wants me to watch him. And, you know, it's been a long way. I didn't really want to do it. So, anyway, he drags me out there.

It was Mark O'Meara. And I stood back there. And Mark said, would you watch me hit someone? And I stood there for like, you know, seem like a long time. And he said, are you going to say anything? and I said, I'm thinking about what you need to do. I said, why don't we go inside? We'll have a little, you know, Coke or something,

and I'll talk about what I think your plan should be. And he said, I don't have any time for that. He said, if you just start telling me something, he says, if I don't start making, if I don't make these last two cuts, I'm not going to be on the PGA tour. But anyway, we went in and we sat down, then we started working that weekend.

And, you know, then he just gradually got better. He kept his card, and, you know, and two years later, he was knocking on the door all the time. And the thing is, though, back then there wasn't a lot of that. See, I was really the first, a lot of people don't realize, I was like one of the first people to do that.

Because back in the day, when I started coached and all the top teachers were teaching golf schools, they weren't teaching pros. And in fact, Mark is the one who told Nick Feldo, he says, you've got to get a coach. And Nick, and Nick Feldo went and got up with David Ledbetter,

but it started with Mark and I. And just, you know, Mark, he's, you know, you guys know him. He's just a great guy, and he's got a big mouth, too. You know, he likes to talk. So, you know, he was just singing my praises all the time. Because a lot of guys are helping they won't say a word. And Mark wasn't like that.

So he really, you know, he is the whole reason that I've had so many great things happen to me in golf. It's all because of him. I want to, since we're on the topic of Mark O'Meer, I want to talk a little bit about that 98 season because he obviously wins two majors, which one of the best seasons you can possibly have in the game of golf. Was that, did you see that type of golf? coming or was that something just kind of like oh boy he got hot and just wrote it out that

whole year well the one thing is like to win to win you have to be able you've got to be able to make the last putt i mean that's the thing and i always say like to win a major you probably got to make putts on two of the last three holes and mark could always do that like mark a lot of people don't know this but the the top finishing rates in the history of the pj tour and i'm talking about on the lead or tied for lead on Sunday, it's like Jack Nicholas, Tiger Woods, Ben Hogan, and Mark O'Meara. So Mark won 18 times on tour,

enough to make it to the Hall of Fame. But, you know, he didn't win like, you know, Tiger or Jack or anything, but he was a great finisher. So if he could get there, he would usually get the job done. So that's a great trait to have. So, but I didn't know, you know, if he would make.

I always told Mark, I said, you're a great player. He said, Hank, I'm not a great player. He said, you know, Jack Nicholas is a great player. Tiger Woods is a great player. I'm a good player. I said, you're a great place. No, I'm not a great player. Anyway, when he got inducted to the Hall of Fame, I said, they don't have any good players in the Hall of Fame. Yeah, yeah. He sounds like a golf player. But being that, like, if you take just from a talent perspective, those other names you just mentioned in terms of clothes, those are like the elite, most talented guys, God, some of his God given. You can't teach what a lot of those guys have. And to do that with Mark, make him a two-time

major champion, or help him become a two-time major champion. that's got as a teacher that's got to be a pretty big feather in the cap I would think even maybe more so than having one of those elite guys and to help him continuing a hundred percent because you you look at where he went from a hundred twenty fourth on the money list to the Hall of Fame you know I mean that you know I mean I had a great time helping Tiger you know his win percentage was incredible when I helped to me one forty five percent of the time but it was it's you know he was great before I ever was there you know did he get better statistically yes You know, win percentage, yes, but not like Mark O'Meara. You know, I mean, that's the difference. We take somebody from that level and you, you know, get to the ultimate. To me, the ultimate, I mean, Hall of Fame. It doesn't get any better than that. So it's, you know, it's fortunate to be an instructor and have that opportunity.

It's hard to win that many times without like some sort of crazy kind of elite talent. Like, I'm longer than everybody. I'm the world's best putter or something, you know what I mean? Right. And he wasn't like, you know, he was just steady. He just steady, steady, steady, steady. But his formula for winning was, you know, tight. You know, no three putts, no penalty shots, got a hole a couple bombs,

probably have to chip in somewhere in 72 holes or hole a shot, and, you know, get the ball up and in. I mean, it's just a tight formula. Not like Tiger, you know, Tiger could win a lot of different ways. I mean, Mark had to win with one specific formula, and you can't win that much with that formula, but he won his fair share for sure. Yeah, it's just the margin of error is way smaller. Right, for sure.

But it was a different game then, too. Yes, it was. No doubt about it. It would be interesting to see what kind of career he would have if he played now. Yeah. Well, he'd still do good because he can make that last put. Yeah. You know, you've got to be able to make that last pot, and he can do it, and he can hit the shot when he has to.

and he always could. And that's something that, you know, he didn't really learn from me. He just had it. So you've got to be able to do that. You know, and, you know, I know the game's different. It's changed. I mean, there's still certain golf courses. I mean, Colin Moriqa is not super long, and he's, you know, doing pretty darn good.

Now, you know, there's courses where you wouldn't pick him as a favorite, but there's a lot of courses where he can do just fine. No doubt about it. Well, through your relationship with Mark, I believe, is how you got to know Tiger, obviously very well. What was your relationship with Tiger before you started working with him? Well, I coached the Keeney kids who, you know, from Dallas, and they were friends with Tiger. So I'd met Tiger, you know, quite a few times even before Mark knew Tiger.

And then, you know, obviously I was around Tiger a lot with Mark because whenever we had practiced at Outworth where they both lived, you know, Tiger would always be there. So we would play with them and practice with them. And, you know, I always had a good relationship with Tiger. And, you know, when Tiger was looking for a coach, it's a short list you're picking from, you know, and if you're Tiger Woods, and I was one of the people on that list. So, you know, it worked out pretty good for me. I mean, when he called me, you know, and I pinch myself and he said, would you, you know, help me? And, you know, you can't believe you're getting that call, you know, I mean, no matter how good you are, your resume or whatever, you're still.

it's an incredible opportunity to work with arguably the greatest player ever. And then he asked me, you know, what do you think about my game? And I said, probably the biggest understatement of all the time. I said, I think it's pretty good. It's all right. You're on the right track, kid. He says, what do you think I need to do to be better? And I said, you know, it's hard for me to tell what your plan is.

I said, you know, you got obviously great knowledge and, you know, a great player and everything. But I think you need to have a better plan from, you know, A to Z to take you, you know, to where you could possibly be. And then I really just thought, you know, I get in there and I'll just, you know, just get out of his way. Don't screw him up and everything will be fine. And then, you know, I got in there and it was a little more difficult, obviously, than you thought because, you know, certain things that people like think about his game

or say about his game, you know, they're not really accurate. Yeah. And I would say from all the guys he's worked with, I mean, there's only a handful of coaches he's worked with, but his swing changed the most working with you visually wise. Like to the average guy at home, I would say you could look and be like, okay, that swing looks different than what it did before or after. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, he played better too. A lot of people don't realize that. But, you know, like I always say, I tell people, you know,

everyone's entitled to their own opinion, but no one's entitled to their own facts. So when you look at the statistics, that's what the statistics say, is ball striking, you know, and everything but is fairways hit, which, people used to pick on me. I said, that's not an important statistic. I said, the important statistic is, you know, all he has to do is just be able to find his ball. You know, as long as you don't take penalty strokes and you hit it as far as he did, that's fine. And now when they have the strokes gains statistics off the T, you look back and during the years I coach him, he was top 10 and strokes gained off the T. But everybody would pick on, he's not hitting very many fairways.

Yeah, but he's hitting it forever. You know, so it changed for sure. We tried, you know, just tried to eliminate his his bad shot and you know always based my coaching around hitting the nine shots with tiger straight ball low medium and high right to left low medium and high ball starting right curving back to the target but not pass the target and then left to right low medium and high and that was the whole thing that drove us all the time and you know he'd call me and say i got my draws going i can't hit my fades i got my fades going i can't hit my draws you know i got the ball up I can't get it down, you know, and that was just always the way it went, just trying to keep everything in balance. When Tiger calls you, and you get that phone call, A, you're probably the most excited you're ever been in your life ever.

I think I would assume most teachers in the world dream of working with the best player in the world. But you also got to know when you hang that phone up like, okay, that's the most, he's under the microscope more than any athlete, I would say, in the world. And now all of his results are going to be a direct reflection on me as a teacher. That's got to be a ton of, I mean, the most pressure you can have. Yeah, I mean, you know, you just, you concentrate. on just doing your job, doing the best you can. You know, I didn't really feel that when I was coaching with him, although, you know, I remember when one stretch, he won seven tournaments in a row.

I thought, you know, they'll be off my ass for at least a couple weeks. That buys me in one loss. And, you know, but you don't kind of think about it because you're just trying to get better. Like, that's the way I think. I always just try to get better. And Tiger is all like that. He was always like, what do we need to do next? He'd win a term and he'd call me the next morning.

What's the plan now? What do we need to do to get better? That's just how it was. So it's always pushed on. There's no celebrating anything. It majors a little more, but the normal term, they didn't mean much to them. We just push on.

Let's just keep trying to get better. And you don't feel it so much when you're in it, but you feel it like when you're out of it. So like it's like the analogy is like the, you know, if a frog jumps in a pot of boiling water, it'll immediately jump out. But if you, if the frog, in the pot and you turn the heat on it'll stay in there until it dies and that's what it feels like

like when you're done you know you're done you're like whoa that was that was tough that was a ride yeah it's a ride so did you start to feel it more the longer i mean you're with them for six years was like starting off you didn't fin then maybe four or five six i mean i was there through all the you know the scandal and everything so it's it's a lot but you know and the injuries you know the knee you know so there's a lot some ups and downs but i i enjoyed every minute of it. I mean, it's a great challenge. It's, you know, I always say, you know, he's like, was my greatest student. He's my, you know, most talented student, my best student, my toughest student, my most

frustrating student, you know, it's like everything all in one. And you never knew what, you know, the day was going to bring, you know, the first time I went to, this is a great story, the first time I went to work with him, I showed up down there in Orlando. You know, he'd called me up, like you said. And then, you know, see, can you come down in Orlando? I show up down there and he's waiting for me at the end of the driveway. And before, I mean, he's got his clubs on a card. He's ready to go. I drive up and, you know, and the first thing he does is he tells me three things I teach

that he doesn't agree with. That's how he started off in relationship. I'm like, you're the one that just called me to, like, help you. And I thought, wow, you know, I thought this is going to be an incredible ride. Do you remember the three things? You know, you know, not really because, I mean, you know, I thought, now's not the time to have a knockdown drag out, because honestly, I was thinking to myself, you really don't know what you're talking about anyway, so we'll just let this go.

And we're going to build a relationship first. And then those three things, he came around on all of them. It wasn't, it wasn't an issue, issue. But, you know, it's just that's like setting the boundaries. It's like, you know, he doesn't, you don't just walk out. Okay, this is what we're going to work on today. It doesn't quite work like that when you're with Tiger Woods. Take us through because, I mean, we've all heard the stories of, you know, how hard he works.

And what is a typical day like in an off week? You go down to Iowa worth. What's the day like? What time we're waking up? What are we doing? Sun up to sundown. Well, I mean, he doesn't sleep much. He's really gets, you know, he didn't sleep, but maybe four or five hours a night.

So he's up early. Goes to the gym. And, you know, he would be in the gym by 6.6.30 in the morning. And then, you know, I, I, be rolling out about, you know, eight or eight-thirty when he'd be coming back. Then we'd have breakfast. And we'd be on the practice tea by, you know, 8, 45 or 9. Usually it's short game first, like pitch shots, you know, generally what he would start off with. And then go to the full swing, hit full swing on the drive range. And then he would want to go play

nine holes. We'd go play nine holes, go eat lunch, back to the drive range, hit more balls, go play nine more holes, go work on the putting. You know, after that, it's more short game. I remember the first time I worked with him. We went back to the house like at 6 o'clock at night, you know, and I go back and I went up, take a shower. I come downstairs, he's in the gym. Wow.

And I said, what are we doing? He goes, he says, when I'm done with my shoulder exercise, we'll go eat dinner. And that was pretty much like it was, pretty much every day. Every day. Yeah. Yeah. And you have... So it was a lot.

But, you know, I mean, a lot of... Mark O'Meara worked... I tell you what, Mark O'Meara probably worked as hard or harder than Tiger. But if you count in all the gym time, too, which I think a lot of times was overdone with Tiger, you know, like, a lot of times, like, you know, we're at the Masters and I'm like, you know, do we really need to go to the gym for, like, three hours? Couldn't we, like, go for like an hour and a half and maybe practice our putting a little bit? Yeah.

That was like an obsession, though, right? It's like you had to have that to operate. 100%. 100%. Well, you just had to have it. Yeah. I mean, he just, I feel like he always constantly has to be doing something. He doesn't, he doesn't, getting better.

Sitting still is going backwards type deal. Yeah, that's exactly right. Because there is, well, there is no such thing as staying the same. You're either getting better, you're getting worse. Because if you're staying the same, somebody's catching you. You know, and they never caught him. And you as a coach, I would assume when you're coaching Tiger, you got to be on call at all times.

If he finishes the golf tournament, you're in Dallas. He's like, hey, I hated the way my iron's wear this week. I need some work. You got to be ready to go at any time. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. At any time.

Was that common? Like after tournament, if he's been, I mean, I need you in Orlando tomorrow. Well, I mean, I was at most tournaments, but,

you know, he would tell me kind of when we're going to practice. Like I always, I kind of knew with the schedule because if he's playing, you know, the major, we're going to practice the whole week

before the major. So I know that. The only thing I don't know is, is what day were going to the major, but we're leaving from Orlando anyway, so it doesn't really matter. So we're practicing the whole week before a major. You know,

at the end of the year, when the season ends, he says, okay, well, we're going to be off before the, you know, until the first of the year. And, you know, Christmas, he's calling me and, hey, can you get down here tomorrow? I knew we never made it one time until the first year. You know, he's just ready to go. And then, you know, the week off, he kind of knew, if he took two weeks off, the first week would be doing, you know, taking a little time off, but doing his corporate obligations if he had any. And then the second week would, we'd be practicing.

So any two week off was always the second week was full-time practice, like the schedule I just described. Would you ever do anything other than golf? Was there any downtime at all? Pretty, you know, just at lunchtime when we'd... Yeah, we had lunch. No, they had a basketball court in the... Yeah. And then I'd kick his butt at free-throat shooting, you know, I'd piss them all.

What's his hoops came like? Pretty good. But I'm better... We'd play a horse, and he'd take me out there like four feet, five feet past the three. you know, three point line where I couldn't throw it that far. And as soon as he missed, I just go to the free throw line and I just stand there all day until he missed one. Crappy bet. Craptly bet. Just wear him down. Just wear him down. Take, I'm just curious, inside your lessons, you're working on full swing or things like that, right? Yeah.

Was he more like, how did you communicate with him? Was he more like technical? He responded better to like positions, seeing it on video and things like that. It was more like watching the ball ball flight and then going around that. I used a, I probably used a video in six years. maybe like three times. Wow. So we never really did that. Not that I didn't do it. It's just that, you know, I didn't.

It could be, honestly, I tried not to do it because he would start, he would see something I didn't want him to see, and he would start working on that instead of staying focused on what we're supposed to be doing. So I didn't use video a lot. I mean, you didn't have really the launch monitors then. I mean, it's not like, you know,

it's not like they've taught, I mean, they haven't taught me anything, to be honest with you. I mean, I can't see if. if it's 3.6, I might think it might, I can see it's too much in the out. I don't know, you know, it's few degrees too much into out, whether it's 3.0 or 3.4, I don't know. But, you know, it's the same information that you're using today. You still, you know, you're just eyeballing it back then.

But, but yeah, he liked technical for sure. You know, he's, and he always has something to think about. You know, there's people that say, you know, you just, you know, I call it Danny B the Ball, you know, from Caddyshack, you know, just beat the ball. I'm like, who's the role model for Danny Be the Ball? You know, Nicholas thought about his swing every time he ever hit a ball. Tom Watson thought about his swing every time he hit a ball. Tiger Woods never hit a shot when he wasn't thinking about his swing.

Mark O'Meara never hit a shot without thinking about it. Except for one little stretch. Mark went in there like, everybody says, you're thinking too much. And Mark Woods out there and he's like, so he'd go to the sports psychologist. And he's, now he's just going to, visualize. And finally after about a month, he says, Hank, he said, I've been visualizing these perfect shots every single time for a month, and I haven't hit a one of them. He said, I got to go back to thinking about my swing.

This strategy is shit. So Tiger always thought about his swing all the time. Yeah, he feels like, and I think Phil Mixson actually said this one, he's like, he's the only, there's two types of golfers, there's artists and there's technicians. He's the best of each to ever live. And I think that's. That's good. That's good analogy. Yeah. Yeah. That's probably good way to put it.

Well, we do have to talk a little bit because y'all, you had six years, six majors. Yeah. It was incredible. Yeah. And then after y'all split up, you did write a book. Yeah. Called the big miss. First of all, I want to know where the title came from. Big miss. Got to avoid the big miss. Okay. Because it can be taken a few different ways. That's why it's a good title.

Yeah, it's a very good title. A double entendre there. Yeah. How long, before the book came out, how were you thinking about doing this for a while? At what point did you decide, you know what I'm going to do this? No, I mean, I just, when I, you know, was done, you know, coach and Tiger, I just, you know, I wanted to write about my experiences, you know. I mean, I figured, you know, I might catch a little heat, but, you know, I mean, it's, I'm not the first coach that ever wrote a book. I mean, you know, Phil Jackson wrote more than one book. Joe Torre wrote a book.

I mean, a lot of coaches write books, you know, and I'm like, like, when people said, you shouldn't have written a book, I'm like, am I the only coach that shouldn't have written a book or should all coaches not have written a book? There's just me that shouldn't have written a book. So I didn't really understand that. I mean, and I looked at it as like, you know what? They're my experiences too. Not just his experiences. They were my experiences. And the book was really about the greatness that is Tiger Woods.

Because my number one comment I ever got on the book. And it's a number one sports book of all time. And people would say to me, and they were all Tiger Woods fans. They're like, I'm a bigger fan now than I was before. because it was really about the greatness that is Tiger Woods. And, you know, it wasn't anything more than that, but it was just great experiences. I wanted to share them.

And, you know, I loved writing that book. And I love the comments I got from it, too. That's awesome. Yeah, it's only, like, one of the few guys in the world that can give you an actual inside look on what that's like. Yeah, people speculate all the time about him, but, you know, they're guessing. You know, I mean, I was there. I spent 150 days a year with them for, you know, six years.

And, you know, he was incredible. Yeah, there's not many people that can... It's just unbelievable. I mean, it's just the experience was unbelievable to stand next to that every day. I mean, I would like stand on that drive range. I think there's no way these guys can beat him. Yeah. I mean, I just like there's no possible way.

And, you know, he wasn't... Honestly, he wasn't nearly as good on the golf course. I mean, nobody is. but I've told this to, you know, a few people, I said, you know, I've taught over 200 touring pros. The worst player at taking it from the driving range to the golf course that I've ever coached is Tiger Woods. Wow. That's nuts. Go ahead and save that one because that's going to get, yeah, that's a lot.

I'm going to tell you what, the game he had on the, he won 45% of his time. He teed it up. when I helped him. On the driving range, you couldn't, he would thought, there's no way this guy could ever lose. But you're always going to have regression. I'm just saying, like, he hardly ever missed a shot, ever. Like, he would go on the golf course, you know,

and he'd miss a couple. But I'm, you don't understand. Like, he'd go through a warm-up, you know, all the time and never miss a shot. Like, ever. So, okay, that's actually great. That's cool. That leads me to a question because, I mean, I say this all the time when we're doing TV stuff.

Like, you walk up and down the range. Now, not to that level, but very few tour players really struggle on the range. I mean, that's why they're at that level. But Tiger, as you said, rarely miss it a shot. But yet, he struggled off the first T about as bad as anybody. Exactly. Why? Pressure.

Tiger, I mean, but like you said, there's no one in the world that should be able to beat him the way he is. And then he goes to the first T and he's nervous and pressure. And I would see it all the time. I'm like, where in the world did that come from? from. I mean, but you know, it usually in the opening rounds, okay, because in the opening rounds you can lose the tournament, but you can't win it. So there's more pressure on Tiger and it's just a phenomenon about him. Like he never hit a bad shot. Like people would talk about his driving or whatever. Okay, tell me the drives he's ever hit that cost him a tournament. Never. There

is none. He never hit one. Okay. But yet the first he shawl, Like most guys, they can hit the first T shot. They can't hit the last T shot. Yeah, that's... He can, he never missed when he had to. Well, you hear so many people say, like, the first whole at Torrey, like, he's always struggled. The first whole at Augustine National, he struggled.

I was like, if you put that at number 12, he probably stripes it right down the middle every time. And the thing is, at the beginning of the round, he had wiggle room. Like, he could struggle and still overcome it. At the end, he couldn't do that. So he didn't. I mean, did he make three double bogey? he's at Torrey and won the golf tournament and they were just like and and on the driving range

those and those warmups were flawless yeah and and he got on that first team but you know i mean that just shows he's human i mean you know he he was nervous you know i mean i could tell when he was nervous everybody is but he has never he never looked nervous at the end of the round it's just crazy yeah that's when people feel is at the beginning and at the end when things matter and then here's the guy who's better than any athlete period in the war and dealing with the end when most people just melt and collapse and the first tee was the one that was the only game issues you guys ever like talk about that like dude just first tee it down a little and maybe just slap it out there well i mean yeah but i mean i just kind of just tried to you know

things like that you don't really want to bring your awareness to it you just kind of try to ignore it but in my mind i'm thinking what and i know i don't know how to fix that because i've never seen him do it before exactly exactly people you know and people say oh he's hitting so bad i'm like you haven't stood there and watched some practice because i mean the guy never missed is a shot. I mean, he's just amazing. And, you know, I mean, that's the thing. You know, because when I say that, it's like, when I say, you know, of all the players that I've ever coached, he's the worst had taken from the, you know, the practice tee to the court. I mean, that's a compliment. I mean, that's like the highest compliment because he was just so good,

but it's like you guys noticed that everybody knows. That first T shot, yeah, he struggled with it. You know, and there were, there were times when I thought, man, I just hope we can get this one in play. Steve Williams would say the same thing. He'd go, man, if we can just, and we get off to par on the first hole, you know, we'll be okay. And I'm like, this is, he's Tiger Woods. I mean, what are you talking about? He's Tiger Woods. But it's like, you know, the pressure at the beginning, especially in a major, because that's

where you can shoot yourself out of it. Yeah. Yeah. In your six years with Tiger, was there one event that stands out to you were like, that's the best Tiger I've ever seen? This is when all aspects of the game, everything we'd work on was firing on all cylinders. That's the best version of Tiger. Oh, wow.

That's a, that's a, you guys got great questions. That's why you're good at this, you guys. Or is it all of them? Well, no, I mean, it's a lot of them. But the American Express over in England, he was pretty flawless. You know, it wasn't like the biggest tournament. I was a big tournament, but I think it was a world golf championship. But it's not, it wasn't, you know, it wasn't a major.

He was pretty darn good there for sure. I don't think he hardly missed a shot the whole tournament. And then, you know, it, he didn't win at Oakmont at the Open. but I think he came second to Cabrera, and he hit 17 greens on Saturdays round. On that golf course, that's not the greatest golf course for him. That was pretty special. But the best tournament ever was Hoy Lake, for sure.

And he played that tournament, but he played that tournament with pretty much irons only. He kind of decided that in the practice round, and it just worked out perfect for him because he couldn't get a driver past the bunkers, A three wood would go into the bunkers. His iron would be just short of the bunkers. And he's the only one that could do that

because he's the only one that had that low stinger shot. Anybody else, if they tried to hit iron off the tee, they couldn't hit it low enough to run it out there. So they'd be too far back. And they either had to hit driver or three wood. If you're going to hit three, would you might as well hit driver. So that gave him an advantage on that golf course. And he played so well there.

It was crazy. I mean, hold a four iron and one round. I mean, it's just nuts. He only hit three drivers. clinical iron yeah yeah was it three i mean that would go down probably in history is like there's a one the one par five i think on the back nine that that uh whatever it's like you know there's two fairways to hit it down it's the only one he pulled the driver out on good time to pull it out yeah i think we could talk about tiger all day but we got to switch to another man let's go you know

we go from tiger who rarely miss hit it yeah to a guy that rarely hits it yeah in charles barclay one of our favorites who you know mutual friend of ours yeah first off we're not bashing charles barclay because there's no one better on the planet. Right. Than Sir Charles. But your experience with him on the Haney Project. We got to talk about that. It was a bad.

He's one of my favorite people in the whole world. I mean, he's, first off, he's one of the, you know, funniest guys. He's just, he's a great guy. And he's one of the most charitable people. He's the absolute role model for how every sports personality or celebrity should act and treat people. Because you know it, because you guys have been around him. And he, you know, he'll take pictures with everybody.

says hello to everybody. I mean, he'll buy drinks for everybody. I mean, he's just, he's the absolute best. And he's the one that introduced my wife, Suzanne, to me. So it was when we were filming the Haney project, and Suzanne was actually working for a friend. She was like a part-time limo driver. And she wanted to drive us that night. And Charles decided he wanted to drive himself. And it was a night that he shouldn't have driven himself. But anyway, so Suzanne ended up driving my agent, Jeremy and I and then like you know nine months later we got married and Charles never lets me forget it you know because he's like the the whole reason I met Suzanne so yeah he's he's my favorite I mean and and you know other guys I had on my show show were great I had Michael Phelps and

Ray Romano and you know I mean I just Adam Levine I mean had you know great great celebrities you know Rush Limbaugh was on I mean it was incredible but people always say I you know I loved your show that you know when you had Charles Bark I've been like I should have just quit after Charles because he's like, you know, Charles is, he's so good for golf. And it's so great that he's, you know, playing better now and he can, you know, enjoying the game because I'll tell you what, he loves golf and golf loves him. And he's just, he's the best. I mean, I love the guy. I believe I asked him recently about working with you.

And he said it all started at Tiger's wedding. Yeah, I believe, correct. You said something about working with him. And Tiger said, be careful what you asked for. Hank's a worker. Yeah. And the next day he said, hey. damn near killed me he goes I wasn't going to quit but he damn near killed me

yeah yeah yeah I know he did he didn't he wouldn't let that on when it was happening though I lined those balls up for him I used to line them up in a row we'd line up the guys on my staff would go out there they lined up a thousand balls in a row on like short T's and he walked out the door and looked at those balls and and he he worked hard though and he's you know obviously he's one the greatest basketball players of all time so he's used to used to working but he uh he was fun and he always you know he's he's great. He's so good on TV. You know, I know he's great on your guy's podcast when you had him on.

I mean, he's just, you know, he doesn't have to, it's just, it just rolls off his tongue. You know, like Ray Romano is a comedian. He's a good friend of mine. Ray would come up with some great lines when I had him on my show, but you could tell he'd kind of, he'd thought about the line. Like, Charles, it's just, it's just flowing. No one is better on TV, in my opinion, the Charlie. And there's no one, like, Charles knows what he's getting into going. He's like, I stink at golf. This is going to be embarrassing. I'm just willing to just put himself out there in front of the whole country to be

made fun of and he handled the whole thing laughing about it. He had the greatest line ever to start the show. We did a little interview at a restaurant in Philadelphia. And he said to me, he said, Hank, he said, the golf channel says, I've got the worst swing in the world. He said, but they couldn't have seen everybody in the world. There is. I said, yeah, it might not need to. There's probably somebody worse than you, but nobody's ever seen him, Charles. Oh, that's good. The other guys, you got like Ray Romano, Rush Limba, all those guys, how did it work? Were you evolved in that like hey I'd like to work if there's some guys out there in the pool here's one I'd like to work with or they just come to you and say hey I mean we just shot for the moon and um you know when we

we tried for presidents and worked our way down from there and and we did did pretty good with uh you know I mean Rush Limbaugh had like you know 50 million listeners a week and you know Michael Phelps the greatest Olympian of all time and I mean it you know Charles is the best and Ray Romano I mean it was pretty incredible the list of guests we got. Out of the guys you worked with on that show, who improved the most? Adam Levine, but he had the farthest to go because he was just like, he was like a beginner. And my wife was like, you know, you got to help Adam. And I'm like, I didn't even know who he was, you know.

Got to help Adam. Get a picture. You got to help Adam Levine. And then when I had him on my show, you know, all these people, oh, I love your show. My wife even watched it. That's because Adam Levine's on. I can see, Suzanne. You should watch help Adam Levine, Bradley Cooper, Brad Pitt.

A lot of women got interested in the game of golf during that season than ever before. But he improved a lot and he loves the game now. So it's great when celebrities play the game. He's up at Gaza now. Yeah, yeah. He's into it. They all had to feel easy after Chuck. I mean, they had to be like, oh my God, this guy, I say something and it kind of happens.

The hardest one, Ray was tough because Ray, I got some great stories here about Ray, but he, you know, they told me he's like a 10 handicap, okay. And I'm like, okay. And his goal is to break 80. That's all right. Well, I mean, a 10 handicap shoots 82. You know, I mean, I don't even have to coach him. I can just tell him what club to hit, what shot to hit, you know, aim it over here a little more.

I mean, I can get him to break 80. The first time we go out and play, he shoots 117. I'm a 10. I said to his guy, he's got a guy following run. I said, I said, he's not a 10. He goes, he said, oh yeah, yeah. I said, he just shot 117. He said, well, he said, come to think of it.

I can't remember the last time he broke 90. I said, a 10 handicaps supposed to average 82. So I'm thinking to myself, I'm going to help him. I can just see the writing on the wall. I'm going to catch so much crap over this show. I'm going to get him like seven shots better for a net of 10 shots worse. Yeah, yeah. You know, and because his handicapped wasn't.

that but anyway he you know the last day of the show he shot 80 wow the last day of the show and then there was like four times when he had a chance to break 80 since that time okay and and he never did it and he called me up every time he literally on the phone said Hank I'm on the 18th hole I got a no hitter going. If I make, if I make par on 18, I break 80, or he'd text me. I said, Ray, just don't, just play the hole. Just one shot at a time, just played out. Don't text me and call me what you're doing.

Every time you'd do it, every single time. And, you know, I'd get the text back. Hit it in the bunker, couldn't get out. And he'd shoot, you know, 81, 80, 82. I mean, every time it would just blow up in the last hole. And then last year, he sends me a message. And he's filming the whole thing. And he's got, he said, I just want you to know,

I got a put on the 18th hole to break 80. And it's like a 15-foot putt. I'm thinking, first of all, he's got the yips, okay? There's no chance to make this punt. And he, and I'm waiting, you know, anyway, he sends me another message. And he's, you know, he's like this. And then all of a sudden he looks up, and he goes,

I did it. And he's got the biggest, he made the putt. Probably the highlight of his life. Oh, one of the highlights of mine, too, as a coach. It was like so cool. That's awesome. Like, he has tried forever to break 80, and he finally did it. The breaking 80 is a big milestone for someone that's never done.

And that ain't, like, they didn't grow up playing golf. For sure. For sure. You still keep up with any of those guys? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I keep up all of them, actually. So, you know, I mean, it's like, you know, my lifelong projects. Yeah. It doesn't stop.

Yeah, they were the Haney project. for a few weeks, but now they're my lifelong projects. But they're all great guys, so it's, you know, it's fun. I got one more before we get to the E-9. Do you have any interest in coaching tour players anymore? No, not really, but I mean, but it's

not that I don't like teaching touring pros or coaching touring pros, but where do you go from Tiger Woods? That's a great point. Nowhere but down. Yeah, nowhere but down. He's teaching any AMs right now? You're doing any teaching at all? I'm teaching now. I started teaching again, So I built a studio at my, actually at my house, and I've got an outdoor area that Celebrity Greens did for me.

So I got a whole short game area, an indoor studio, and I started coaching it, and I'm having, you know, fun doing it. So, I mean, I love coach, and I haven't done it a long time. But I've started up again, it kind of needed something to do. But I think my touring pro days are done. You know, I mean, it's not that I didn't enjoy it, but, yeah. I might have to come check this lab out. Yeah, you like it. Check this out.

All right, let's get this. a project exactly makes lee's not suck anymore that's tough to do all right we got the e9 nine nine fun questions about hankaney we asked us to everyone all right trade lives with anyone for a day dead or alive you can be anyone who's it going to be oh my gosh ben hogan all right just flush it all day i just yeah i just like i'd just like to just like to just feel what he's doing see what he's doing yeah i think that would be it yeah that would be a nice one i'd sign up for that as well. It's been a while since I felt that middle.

Get some of our producers' clubs. You'll never miss the middle. Yeah, our producers got some bazookas, like you've never seen before for a new set of irons. It's basically like the wedge is a hybrid and all the way through the set. I might need to be in the market for some of those. But are we talking about pickle? You got the pickle hat on. Chances we see Hank Haney Golf Instructor turn into Hank Haney Pickleball instructor. That's a possibility.

Yeah. I don't know how much money you can make coaching pickle. ball. Get the right guy. My rate's a little higher in golf, but I, I, I, I, I, I, I, you know what, if you can coach any, one thing, you can coach anything, all, all you have to do is just learn the, uh, fundamentals, learn, you know, the, the techniques. And once you get that, then you can apply the same principles that you use in coaching. So, I mean, I feel like, you know, I got the coaching thing down and I'm learning the pickleball. I know you study it too. Yeah, I do. I study like I study golf. So I mean, I'm, I like to say I'm a pro-level pickleball understanding. I'm just not a pro-level execution. I love it. All right, we can stay

on the coaching thing here for a second. My next one. I know your son, Henry's a big hockey player, but let's just say for a second, he really wanted to be a golfer and he wanted to take his game to the next level. You could send him to any instructor in the world other than yourself. Who would you send him to? That's a, that's another good, good, good question. Oh, man, alive. I would have to send them to one of the instructors that's work with me over the years, you know, so probably Steve Johnson. That's what I thought you'd say. Yeah, yeah. It's a good question to ask teachers who they trust after themselves. And you guys are good at this. Oh, wait for this doozy. Hold on. It'll get worse.

What's more meaningful or more flattering in your career? All right, coaching the number one player, winning multiple major championships, winning all the awards you want, or being played by Jason Sadekis on an episode of Saturday Night Live. Did you see the skit? No. Oh, you're not even aware of it? Because when you were doing with Barclay, Barclay was the host and Sadacus came in as you. That's pretty cool.

If you go on SNL, that they're imitating, you know what I mean? You've done some. And he went on to play a little character named Ted Lassow. So you might have an argument that that was lifted from you. That's definitely pretty cool. I mean, I didn't know that. I got to check that one out. Oh, yeah.

He's in there like early. Jason Sadekis got the Nike hat on. Charles comes in and basically just make fun of his swing the whole time. Chuck going along with it. And you're like, he's terrible. I don't know what to do. A lot happens to you when you're

standing on that driving range of Piner's with Mark O'Meara. It's weird where this life can take you. Yeah. It's crazy. All right. Next one. Most talented player you ever worked with

that never made it on tour. Oh, boy. Um, you know, the best ball striker ever, that I coached, one of the best pro or anything, was Tripkini. I mean, he could really hit it. But it was like one day one of our friends came in the pro shop,

and he said, Tripp's playing great. He's going to win the U.S. amateur, or he's going to win the mid-amateur or the Western, whatever it was he was playing. He says, he's really playing great. And Steve Johnson looked at the guy, said, what, are they not going to have putting in those tournaments? So I, you know, I didn't think he could ever make it on tour because he just, you know, he didn't have the whole game. But ball striking wise, he could hit it. There's no doubt about that.

But there's a lot more to the game than that. It's had a hell of an amateur run. Yeah, I mean, he's got to playing some cool things and some cool experiences playing amateur golf. Yeah, no doubt about that. All right, next one from me. Being around Tiger Woods, as long as you were, you were around some pretty influential people, I got to assume. Yeah. during that time. Give me one, like, pinch me moment where not Tiger, like, someone that's with

Tiger, like, oh, my God, I can't believe I'm sharing space with this person. Oh, man. I mean, you know, all of them, to be honest with you. I mean, you know, Jordan, you know, Shaq. I mean, dinner one night with Kobe and Tiger. And I thought to myself, wow, there's two of these guys like this. Really? Was it just you, Tiger and Kobe? I mean, like, I'm like, these guys are both the Same. Whoa. In like what way? Just their demeanor? Yeah. Yeah. Wanted to beat everyone's head in and not settling for anything less. Yeah. That's awesome. That's a cool. I mean, you Tiger, Kobe. Did you even talk that dinner? Yeah, I just sat there, you know, pretty much just sat there. But yeah, for sure. That was, you know, that was definitely, I mean, that one stands out, you know,

it really does. That's incredible. Those two get lumped together a lot in comparisons, like just clutch wise. For sure. All right, this one's really simple. Obviously, Tiger's been through a lot. we see him playing with Charlie at the PNC, possibly making a comeback again. Will Tiger Woods ever win again on the PGA tour? I say yes. Awesome. I say he will win again.

All he has to do is be able to walk 72 holes. Now, I don't know if that'll happen, but if he can walk 72 holes, he can find somewhere to win. There's no doubt in my mind he'll find somewhere to win. And he loves the mountain. He loves to climb the mountain. And this would be, you know, the back was, the leg, went on a broken leg was a big mountain.

Coming back to win the Masters on the back was a big mountain, you know, this would be the biggest mountain. And he's Tiger Woods. And he's a hell of a lot closer to that than I thought would have guessed a couple months ago before I saw him down there in Florida with Charlie. He's just a question. He can walk for, so many two holes. I haven't seen him walk yet. That's really the only question. But he's swinging it nice.

All right. Last one for me. Most impressive thing you ever saw Tiger Woods do with a golf club that nobody. else got to witness. Oh man we we that's that's one I I easily think about so we're on the second hole at our worth you guys I don't know if you guys ever played there with the hardest golf course I ever seen in my life and you know it's course ratings like 77.5 or something and he's on the back T on number two and it's like 240 yard part three or crazy shoot crazy shit ridiculous ridiculously hard shot and we're and and

and he's playing two ball worst ball. Okay? And he hits the first one in there like this. And he hits the second one in there like this. 245 into the win through it. And that shoot, I don't know if you've played there. The shoot looks like it's six yards wide.

Yeah, I've just seen the picture people send it to me and tell me. Yeah. Hardest golf course they've ever seen. As far back as you go, he shoots two under par, two ball, worst ball.

Wow. That's a fun game. It takes forever and it's hard. So you were playing him, what you just plays straight up normal, and you're playing against his worst ball. He's got it, too, and he takes the worst each time. Wow, that's impressive.

Opposite scramble. That's really good. Yeah, that's good. After hits the first one, you're probably like, all right. Yeah. I played, like, you know, as good as I can play from the back tees and shot like 37, and I lost by three shots, and he played two-ball worst ball. To his worst ball. Wow.

Yeah, that's doing it. All right. Last one. We talked about your book earlier, the big miss. Let's just say you're going to write a book about Charles Barkley's golf game. what would the title be? Oh my gosh. Not the best.

Perfect. Try it. Try it. Not the best. That would be a good title. That would be good. I love it. Books yet to be written.

I'll tell you what. Hank Caney, this has been awesome, man. Thank you so much for joining us. It's my pleasure. You guys are great. I love you guys. Thanks.

Thank you. Hank. All right. Well, that was Hank Cainney joining us on Golf Subpar. Sleez. Wow. First off, I think the quote that most people will take away from that is,

Of all the tour players I've worked with, no one was worse at taking it from the range to the course than Tiger was. And that's a compliment. I mean, I think people will read that and be like, oh my God, this guy's a dick. I can't believe he'd say that. He's the best player ever. But that's just how good he was on the range when there was no pressure at all.

I think that just, yeah. I mean, that may be the biggest compliment you can give him. It's like as good as he was in tournaments. He was winning an unbelievable clip with Hank. It didn't even come close to what we saw on the range when no one's around. That's why getting into the question, like, what's the most impressive thing, you know, you've seen from Tiger that nobody else.

and things like that. And also, I thought it was interesting hearing him talk about it because, like, from my vantage, all right, you got Tiger Woods. He's already been with Butch Harmon. We know what he's done. People will look at that golf swing and say that's the best golf swing of all time, look at his record with it and things like that. When you take Tiger on as a pupil, given where he was in his career, I think there's

arguably nothing but downside. What can you do, like the way he was winning major championships and how many he was winning by? Like, what can you do as a teacher? People are like, oh, he's better now. It's almost all downside. If he doesn't win at that same clip or he's, starts losing for a while and doesn't win for a stretch of time.

People are going to look at you first and say, you ruined it. Well, you're going to get criticized. Of course. Tigers is just great when he plays well. If he wins everything, it's like, yeah, you're just doing, you know, you're doing what you're supposed to do. You've got the most talented player ever. But once again, I feel like when you talk to all these very well-known swing instructors,

they all kind of go back to their start. And it's kind of like, look, I got kind of lucky. You know, Mark O'Mara stumbles upon the range there at Pinehurst. Once somebody wants to have him, take a look at him, and here's Hankaney, goes out there helps Mark O'Mara. And next thing you know, he's guiding him to helping him win two major championships. And then that leads to working with Tiger Woods. He didn't even want to go out there and help him. Yeah. He didn't even want to go out. And it turns out, I mean, that kind of launched him. That's the hardest thing with all these teachers. You could have a wealth

of knowledge. You'll be the best teacher on the planet. If nobody knows about you and nobody's willing to trust you and kind of put your name behind it, you got to have that first guy. And Mark, I mean, that launched a hell of a career. And realistically, that's probably where the tiger, you know, relationship started. Well, I hope y'all enjoyed that one because I know we did. It was a lot of fun out there. But Slay's it's time to get to a little gambling. Our people over at Fandle, the best sports book in all the land. Not our best week at Pebble Beach. It started off looking kind of promising. You had Seamus Power. I thought Seamus was going to shock the world. I was getting some tweets. I was like, don't jinx it, but this is looking weird. He had a five shot lead at one point.

Yeah, through 36 holes. Yeah. I had Jason Day, who was four back going into Sunday. I'm like, all right, let's go. Let's make a move here at the end of the day. Didn't get it done, but we're going to bounce back. Should I had Hogie. Because that's, yep. How do you not take TCU every week? Starting now. But it's also Super Bowl week. We got Super Bowl, we got the WM Phoenix Open. We got so much stuff to go on. It's going to be incredible. FanDill Sportsbook is an official sports betting partner of Super Bowl 56. In addition to the deal for the Super Bowl you will hear about shortly, we also have a special giveaway for any listener who signs up for Fandul using promo code subpar. Just create an account and be entered to win

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That's right, you'll get your winnings in cold, hard cash because we know cash is always better than free bets. All right, Salis, I think we're on opposite sides of the Super Bowl. We are, which is good. One of us will win. Someone's going to win. We're going to be right on the show. Absolutely.

Absolutely. That's the way it should be. But I just think the Cincinnati Bengals, team of destiny, I like getting the points. Even though it is technically a home game for the L.A. Rams, I think Cincinnati's going to show up. I think the crowd will be there. I just love Joe Burrow. He's incredible. Their offense, if they can protect him, give him some time. Keep Aaron Donald off his back. We're going to be okay. Go Bengals. Yeah. Betting against Joe Cool. Toth right now. I mean, has anyone ever skyrocketed up the coolest guy in sports leaderboard faster than that?

Joe Burrow. So I hate betting against them, but I just feel like for that reason, you just said, home game for L.A., more or less. Also, the front four, and if you're going to point to one weakness on Sinci, it's probably that O'Line. I mean, dude, Joe Burrow gets his ass kicked every single game, and he still somehow pulls it out every single time. But I just think with all the money they've spent, all the signings they had, Odell, Vaughn,

all those guys. I just feel like time is now for L.A. And staff have been waiting for forever. And it's just the year the dogs Georgia seems to be winning everything. So I'm going to just probably go with my gut, stick with it. with the Rammies. All right. Well, what a Sunday it's going to be.

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All right, well, it's time to make our picks for the WM Phoenix Open. The Thunderbird. I'm going to give the Thunderbird the lead this week. I'll take the honor. Okay, and I'm going, I got a theme here on my two bets and go one near the top of the charts, and I'm going to go one a little bit further down, but both are champions and both play of this place very well. First off, I'm going to go Hadeki Matsuyama, 16 to 1.

So he's a two-time champ, 2016, and 2017. Seems to be a top 20 machine around here. He hits it high. He hits it. Farah does all the things that tend to suit, you know, suit PPC Scottsdale. And getting him at 16 to 1, I think that's a pretty good odd. He's been about a successful around here as pretty much anybody. Do you want me to go to my second one?

No, I'm going to fire off your big dog. I'm going off a big dog. He's a little bit down the list. But since I did just play the golf course and I get a feeling of who's going to play really well around this place, I think this place is going to be very, very firm this week. I mean, the weather's obviously not going to be an issue. They can get it as firm as they want, which I think they will. and not many hit it higher than this guy,

he's ready to break through. Scotty Sheffler, 27 to 1. Love him this week. Only a matter of time. Frog did it. Longhorn can do it too, you know? He does hit it to the moon. Hadecki, too, which kind of seems to play in every single year out here.

That's a big advantage hitting it high, hit it far off the T, which is a little bit surprising as to why I'm going to go with my next guy and the success that he's, but he's had crazy success around here. Webb Simpson, going off at 34 to 1. I mean, get it while it's hot on Webb Simpson, 34 to 1, 20-20 champ, right? just one here recently.

Lost in the playoff to Hadeki in 2017. He's damn near a two-time winner, too. He doesn't strike as a type of guy that would embrace kind of the whole culture of the Phoenix Open. Like, it's wild, it's raucous. He's a little more mellow, a little more chill.

But dude, he gets it done. He puts the eyes out of it out here. These greens are perfect. I just think Web Simpson, I mean, 34 to 1, that's a hell of a run for a guy that's one of the better players around this joint. Yeah, he just hasn't been himself

last six to 10 months. It's been a little bit of a struggle. Coming back to a happy place, though. Yes, he is. All right, my guy, I'm going pretty far down the board here. Love it. He's also a past champion.

I think his game's starting to turn a little bit. I talked to his swing instructor, Mark Blackburn. Things are getting better. The only thing that could hold him back is karma for putting Little Dick as my Bluetooth and my phone. But Gary Woodland's going off at 90 to 1. 90 to 1. I'll say this.

Went out, played golf on Saturday. We had a great crew. Some big names. I'm going to drop some names here. J.T. Ricky, Gary Woodland, Max Homa, amongst a couple other buddies out at Whisper Rock. cold, windy, nasty was playing tough. Gary Wooden with the best round of the day, and he was in the group behind, but it was clean, apparently.

So something to be said for that. He's in good form. He's playing some pranks, a little LD on the old console. So the kids, he's in a happy spot, too. All right. Well, if y'all are out at the WM Phoenix Open, getting amongst it, make sure you come say hi to us. We'll be out there all week, having an incredible time, and we'll talk to you next week on Golf Subpar.