Suggestible - The White Lotus

Episode Date: August 12, 2021

Suggestible things to watch, read and listen to. Hosted by James Clement @mrsundaymovies and Claire Tonti @clairetonti.Check out Claire’s new podcast Tonts!Sign up to Claire’s weekly bonus newsletters here – tontsnewsletterThis week’s Suggestibles:The White LotusReal Stories: Toxic Body CultureCodenamesLove is Blind: The ReunionBlown Away (Glass Blowing Show)A Mighty Girl WebsiteInvisible Woman BookJames & Maid Marian on The Weekly Planet RedditSend your recommendations to [e-mail], we’d love to hear them.You can also follow the show on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook @suggestiblepod and join our ‘Planet Broadcasting Great Mates OFFICIAL’ Facebook Group. So many things. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Bing bong, bing ba bing, ba bing bong. It's good to be back, Claire. It's, we're back. I'm wearing purple pants today. Nobody cares, Claire. It's we're back. I'm wearing purple pants today. Nobody cares, Claire. I just thought I'd say it for Collings to edit out my purp sounds.

Oh. Poor Collings. He's long suffering. Poor ponderous Collings. Poor ponderous Collings. The poor person. Very good. Very quick.

It's so slow-witted. It's late. We've had a long day. Oh, is it? I don't know. What time is it? Who knows? Hello, I'm Claire. James is here also. Also, I realized I haven't plugged the headphones in. Oh, wasn't that interesting? I plugged them into my laptop. I was trying to figure out why I couldn't hear us. I saw you do it and I just went, I was thinking to myself, yeah, that seems right. Like I didn't even notice. We are slowly going mad. We are back in. And both running at what, 20%?

About that, yeah. That's 40% in total. And is that how percentages work? I'm not sure. I don't know. But we are back in lockdown at the moment, so we've been doing a lot of homeschool and this and that. But we're here to suggest things.

We're here to be like, hey, we've taken the time to watch or read something and now you have to listen to us talk about it. And also listen to us talk about it. And also listen to your. The video just finished publishing. I was going to fix that. You can hear it publishing in the background. For those who haven't been to this show before, welcome.

Welcome to the destination. James is a YouTuber. He runs the channel MrSundayMovies and likes to yell a lot into the void. No, not really. I'm just here by myself. So this is fun. Anyway. Sorry, I thought I muted it.

When I finish publishing a video, like often like it automatically opens and I never wanted to do that. So I don't know why I haven't changed that setting. Anyway. It's been doing that for 10 years. Yes. What are you recommending? Do you know, okay, just on a side note, I will sometimes, I remember this very clearly before we had kids and we lived in a tiny flat.

I would often wake up in the middle of the night to hear that happen. Yeah. Because you'd left the laptop running to publish. Yep. And then because we lived in like two rooms, that was ostensibly one room with a dividing wall. It's got to do it. It's got to do it.

It's got to do it. Anyway, my turn first, your turn first. I'd love you to do it. Let's see what you got. All right, dude. Yeah, I got nothing. You didn't bring anything this week? That was my gag.

Oh. I was doing a gag. I was doing a bit. Oh. I would have been. That's a massive power play. I would have loved that if you were really like, no, I just didn't do anything. Didn't do my work.

No, that's not who I am. Deep down in my core, I'm a big old nerd I would have respected that as a teacher But kids are like, I didn't do it And I'm like, why not? And they're just like, I just didn't I'd be like, yeah fair I often do that, I just didn't do it

Anyway I know Oh yeah, don't do that if you're a student That teacher will fucking hate that That is They will That is exclusive to me Yeah, that is exclusive to James

Who is no longer a teacher for that very reason Because you don't care if kids don't do that very much. I wouldn't react like that. I wouldn't be like, that's great because you can't. No, but deep down in your heart that's what you were thinking. You were like, I respect that, mate. Good on you. Okay, so I want to talk about a show that we've both been watching

called The White Lotus. Oh, yes. Do you have that on your list? I don't actually. I was hoping you'd bring it up and then I wouldn't have to write anything down about it. What have you got? All right, yes. Do you have that on your list? I don't actually. I was hoping you'd bring it up and then I wouldn't have to write anything down about it. What have you got? All right, excellent. So The White Lotus is an American satire comedy drama television miniseries created, directed

and written by Mike White. Mike White. And it's on HBO. Yes. So you can get it there and it's on Binge, which is like Foxtel, I think, in Australia. Yeah, a version of it. I don't really know. But that's where you can find it currently.

Or various VPNs you can access it for. Or various VPNs, correct, exactly. So it was greenlit in October 2020 and filmed in Hawaii in late 2020. So they somehow managed to do this during the pandemic time. Well, because the entire thing is shot and set within a hotel. So it would make sense that you would be able to do that if you just locked everybody down in there. That's so true.

And it's probably actually a really smart location to do it in for that very reason. And spoiler alert, we happened to go to that hotel. Just to clarify, this isn't a spoiler for the show at all. This is a personal anecdote. It is. Why did I say spoiler alert? I don't know.

My brain's like misfiring. Anyway, I just thought maybe I wanted to say personal anecdote alert. Sure, alert. Ding, ding. Ding, ding. Ring-a-ding-ding. Yeah, we've been there. We went to a friend's wedding because it's set at the Four Seasons.

It's not set at the Four Seasons. The dovetail is called The White Lotus but it's filmed at the Four Seasons. Correct. And when we started it, we were like, we've been here? Yeah, it looks so familiar. It turns out, yeah, we have. Yeah. Just for one night.

Just for one night. Because it was very expensive. But we stayed there for one night and it was so awesome. It was amazing. Genuinely. I mean, it's also like weird because it's like people running around hand and foot like looking at you and whatever. Yeah, it's like crazy next level Four Seasons-esque.

I've never been to a hotel like that ever. And the wedding was amazing. I loved it. That was just so gorgeous and great and it was right on the clifftops. Anyway, we digress. Yeah. The actual TV show itself is set in the hotel and it surrounds a few central characters,

one of which is Armand who's played by Murray Bartlett. Which is a very Australian name. Yes, he's very by Murray Bartlett. Which is a very Australian name. Yes, he's very. Murray Bartlett. Is he actually Australian? He is Australian, yeah. Yeah, I knew he looked so familiar. He plays the manager of the White Lotus Resort,

who is a recovering drug addict and who in the first episode acknowledges he's been sober for five years. Yeah, he looks so familiar. He's got a grey moustache. He does. Also, one of my faves, Connie Britton with the luxurious red hair. I love her in so many things including Friday Night Lights. She plays Nicole Mosbacher who is a CFO of a search engine

and sort of the central kind of story is really around her family. Yes. So her and her husband Mark and then their daughter and son and then their son's friend. Looks different without a moustache. Yeah, he really does, doesn't he? And the other really awesome person who's in this is Jennifer Coolidge who plays Tanya McCord, a troubled woman whose mother recently died. And, God, that woman's comic timing is so spectacularly great.

She is just excellent and awful but excellent. There's also a married couple who are on their honeymoon and Alexandra Daddario plays Rachel who's a journalist and has married this guy called Shane who's sort of, he's come from very wealthy money, right? Yeah. And very wealthy money. He's got a lot of, his family's got like.

Oh, my God, he's in Sex and the City. Do you remember this guy from Sex and the City? Yes, that's why he looks so familiar. I'm like, where have I seen this guy before? Yes, he's the shoe guy from Sex and the City. So young. Oh, I remember that now. He's really – I think he's like – he's obsessed with Carrie's shoes.

Is it a weird shoe? And he goes clubbing or something with her. He gets her into all the fancy things. Yeah. And Stanford Blatch has a crush on him. Anyhoo, back to The White Lotus. Yeah, so Shane plays this just like horribly obnoxious, or Jake Lacey, sorry, plays Shane Patton, a real estate agent,

who is just horribly obnoxious and clearly one of those kind of trust fund guys that's had everything given to him on a silver spoon. But is still upset. But is still upset by everything, yeah, and it kind of trust fund guys that's had everything given to him on a silver spoon. But is still upset. But is still upset by everything, yeah, and it kind of starts off with him being really irritated by them getting the wrong room and there's kind of a feud that happens between Armand, the manager of the White Lotus, and him. Yeah.

And then obviously Connie Britton's family. So it's really dark in some ways. It's very upsetting. It's set on like an island resort. And it's beautiful. And the music is very, it just paces through the whole thing and gives you this sense. It's very tropical and Hawaiian, obviously. These beautiful Hawaiian vocals, but also very kind of jungle-esque and upsetting. Yeah. And it's a lot about like class divide and extreme wealth and poverty and all these kind of other things going on because it focuses on like from like the head of the hotel and the richest people to like,

you know, who clean stuff. The local people, yeah, as well. On the hotel, yeah. And just what's happened to the local people's economy because of big resorts like that. And they have to come in and do local dances and that. Oh, yeah, exactly. It really, so it deals with all of the things that, you know,

the internet loves to talk about. Sure. White privilege. Yep. Male privilege. Yep. Gender bias. Drug addiction.

Drug addiction. You know, the millennial, like the divide between the old and the young, different generations. Connie Britton's character is this kind of quote unquote powerful woman who's a CFO and, you know, is all for women's rights and equality and supporting other women except her daughter actually doesn't, has this whole other view of the way that her mum operates in the world which is also a really interesting dynamic.

Like her daughter is very cynical about what her mum does and thinks that she's a really unhappy, deeply unhappy person. There's that dynamic that plays out. It's also like the daughter is benefiting from all of these things as well at the same time. Totally. And then her husband, Mark, clearly says he's not worried. Steve's on.

Yes, and he's really great too. He's great. He finds out very early on in the first episode that his dad was actually gay who died and so his dad passed away and so he finds that out because he has a cancer scare and then that kind of plays out and he starts to unravel sort of thinking about that and changes the way he speaks to his son. What do you think of it?

I mean it's very depressing. Like it's not, it's just, it's very. Why do you find it depressing? Because it's all just like terrible people with problems that like don't matter. Like slowly converging to a like it's hinted at, not hinted at, it's said very early on that there's like a terrible thing is kind of going to happen and you just but you don't know where it's coming from.

Yeah. And we're still I think we're five in and we're still not there. And it still hasn't happened. So we don't really know. We're like, oh, this guy's going to, oh, no, it's not that. Oh, this person's going to, no, that's not going to happen. Yeah, because you find out very, like literally in the first scene that there's someone that dies basically.

And so then. We're like, is it a murder? Is it an accident? Is it a suicide? Yeah. Like who is it in particular? You know what I mean? Yeah, exactly.

And you know what else? It really, the reason I find it so uncomfortable is that it makes you really examine your own privilege. Totally. And how, because we always have found that, and this is going to make us sound like assholes, I think, but just, I've always found it really hard to relax at a resort like that because I know how lucky we are to be there but also all the work that everyone has had to go to for it to be there.

Yeah. And I know it also creates jobs in the economy and all those things but also I feel like it's kind of ruining the environment and the natural landscape and it makes it really sad. Yeah, stripping away people's culture. Yeah, exactly. Funnelling money out of their communities to wherever. Exactly. And that whole idea of of their communities to wherever. Exactly.

And that whole idea of and then it starts to address colonialism. There's some very big themes perched on the island of Hawaii. But it's not even things that like it's mentioned but it's more like a low-hum kind of background to all these other dramas that are like less important but also going on. Personal and dramas. Yeah, which is interesting. It's very clever.

I think that's, yeah, because it seems like a lot of the times the main people in it are not aware of these things that are happening, which I think, but as a viewer, you know, you see it and also the music tells you often. It does. Yeah, totally. Yeah, but you're absolutely right. By showing these characters that are so unlikable, you really get a sense of even though they're unaware

of their own privilege, you get a sense of what's wrong with the world basically. Yeah, essentially. The other interesting dynamic I think I've enjoyed watching is the dynamic between Shane, so the real estate agent from a wealthy family, and his wife. And the reason I find that really interesting so that his wife is called Rachel and she was a journalist and not necessarily a very good journalist

but she had built her own career. Yeah, she's like, it seems like she worked for like BuzzFeed and stuff like that. Yeah, exactly. But she didn't come from money and she's worked really hard. She's incredibly beautiful looking and she increasingly becomes aware. Alexandra Daddario. Correct.

Did you say that? Yes, you did, yep. She increasingly becomes aware that she doesn't actually like this person she's married. Yeah. You know, because he's horribly obnoxious. And that's a really interesting dynamic because she has to make this decision about wanting to keep working and he just doesn't

understand why she would even want to. Why would you want to work? You've got enough money now for forever. What's the point? And they examine that, that she's got a prenup and that actually that's where women get into hot water because they give up their career, they give up everything when they get married and then end up with no superannuation. And if the marriage breaks down, they end up with nothing and no career and no ability to be independent. And there's these kind of interesting conversations they're having over what is ostensibly just like breakfast on their honeymoon, but it's actually about him encouraging her to completely do that.

Yeah. And then when his mother comes and she's basically saying, you're a trophy wife, not in that she doesn't say that directly. Oh, she pretty much does. Yeah, there's like an implication that she's a trophy wife and that really her role is to just make her son happy. She's like, why did you marry me? And she's like, you're very attractive and you seem like you make him happy.

Yeah. She didn't have like a good answer. No, which kind of she's intimating that she's just sort of like easy in that she looks beautiful and she's not too clever and she's not, you know, she's going to just keep him happy and that's why they're married. Anyway, I just felt like there's just so much in it that's really interesting. So anyway, but also it's awful. Oh, yeah.

We probably watched because I think we watched the first four like in a row or maybe not in a row but over a couple of nights. And, you know, they're an hour apiece and it just puts you in a very bad head space. It does. However, I also there's something beautiful about looking at the beach in Hawaii and all of that and just being escapist. I remember that wedding. Yeah.

I remember that one night we spent there. Which was so gorgeous. Probably dropped it insane about a buddy. Yeah, but it was and we could just like lie on the deck chairs on the beach. We didn't get none of these fancy rooms though that are. No, we didn't get no fancy. For us it was super fancy. You know when we walked in with everything,

like we arrived and they gave us hot towels and like gave me like a lotus flower or something. I remember. Or frangipani. And I thought we were late because the wedding was happening. I'm like, here's the flower thing. And I'm like, I don't want that. Like I wasn't trying to remove it.

I'm like, I have no purpose for this. I just want to go to my room and have a shower. Yeah. And I was bloody loving myself because they give you like a welcome drink. And I was like, a welcome drink? Yeah. I'm like, I don't want a drink. I want a shower. It was uncharacteristically stressing as you always was like a welcome drink. Yeah, I'm like I don't want a drink. I want a shower.

It was uncharacteristically stressing as you always are. Anyway. Yeah. Yeah. But no, they were all very nice. They were and it was great. And then we had cocktails in the bar. I remember those days.

And tip the staff, you know what I mean? Correct. Which is something that wasn't something I struggled with in America but was just like, oh, I have to do this thing and I'm like. How much do you do it? It's like 10% I guess or whatever depending on the meal but then one time I got a sandwich and I'm like, do I tip for the guy who sells the sandwich?

And they're like, no. And I'm like, but why do I not tip this guy but I buy a beer? I know, it's so confusing. I don't know. Anyway, it doesn't matter. I don't have to deal with it. Anyway, the White Lotus, I'd recommend it. We can wait for clean water solutions.

Or we can engineer access to clean water. We can acknowledge Indigenous cultures. Or we can learn from Indigenous voices. We can demand more from the earth. Or we can demand more from ourselves. At York University, we work together to create positive change for a better tomorrow. Join us at yorku.ca slash write the future. I watched a YouTube documentary on the channel Real Stories hosted by Reggie Yates. It's a British documentary YouTube thing. It's called Britain's Toxic Body Culture, Dying for a Six Pack, right?

And it sounds like that. You know that Britain's a lot of like trash and like, look, your body's got a hole in it and whatever. You know what I mean? Or these ones where it's like snog, marry, avoid. No, it's like horrible body stories. Oh, that's right. What's that?

Is it called horrible body? It's something like that. But anyway, it's like horrible body stories. Oh, that's right. What's that? Is it called horrible body? It's something like that. But anyway, it's not that. It's essentially it talks about like the extreme pressure on males now on staying in shape, about staying in shape as opposed to what it used to be. And it's all about like dieting and workouts and surgery and like body dysmorphia and steroids and testosterone replacement and all these

other things that men are now doing to kind of fit into a this type of mold which is expecting of them you know what i mean there's and it's this billion dollar industry that's kind of propped up you know in the last few years because there is a lot more online stuff you know with trainers or like you joe rogan's who's on all sorts of fucking HGH, which is human growth hormone, and a bunch of other stuff going on and how there is this kind of like the acceptable male body has kind of shifted in the way that it's all kind of always been for females. Do you know what I mean?

Yeah, the tables have turned. But it's leading to like bulimia and guys like dehydrating themselves to like look good all the time, do you know what I mean, and taking like Psalms, which is another like steroid of sorts. I'm not sure if there's specifics. I'm sure people will know, but I don't need to know that. But, look, it was just really fascinating and it follows a few people in particular of how like, oh, they look at themselves in the mirror.

I do this all the time and you're like, yeah, yeah, I feel like I could have like a better line here, do you know what I mean, or my triceps could be bigger or my jaw could be squarer or whatever. Like there's one guy when he works out, he's not happy with his abdomen so he literally wraps himself in like glad wrap or cling foil, whatever people call it, and then works out in that to like reduce the – which also like that's not even how it works because you can't reduce like fat from a particular – you can't target a particular part

of your body. You have to lose weight in general. But that in itself can be dangerous also because having a six-pack as well a lot of the time is unhealthy. You're literally starving because you've starved yourself to get, you know, to that point. And dehydrated. And dehydrated as well. Like that happens when you see like guys in movies or whatever, almost always if there's

a shirtless scene and they've, you know, gotten really big and ripped or whatever, it's, you know, chemically enhanced or perhaps surgically enhanced. And on top of like extreme diets and people cooking all the food for them, it's literally their job just to get in shape for this one shirtless scene and whatever, you know what I mean? And people think that that's like attainable all year round. And it even looks like a lot of influencers online who are like, do this one trick and you can do whatever, but they're all like on gear.

Like they're all these, you know, Instagram influencers or whatever. They're just on gear, you know, which is fine if you want to do that. It's whatever. But like you can technically do it if you want to do that, it's whatever. But like you can technically do it safely but a lot of times it's not. You know, you meet a guy at the gym and they're like, do you want to try this or whatever? And, you know, it's dangerous. And it's also it messes up your hormone balance and, you know,

your libido might like completely decrease. Fatility, you know what I mean, all of these different things and you can have long-term like effects on your body, like your body's wellbeing. And your mental wellbeing. And your mental wellbeing, yeah. So it was interesting. Like it was really interesting to kind of look at something like that

and to see the way that it's even changed in the last five years. Well, it's been slowly happening for longer than that. But, yeah, getting in shape is like the way that people think a person should look is not feasible a lot of the time or healthy. You know what I was thinking while you were talking about that? What is so interesting to me and obviously eating disorders and body dysmorphia, which is when you see your body differently from how it actually is and all those things. And I still think disproportionately affects women because of the fact

we live in a patriarchal society which means that men are still mostly in charge of most things. And so for a lot of the time that can mean that women are supposed to be seen through that male gaze of a particular body. However, it was interesting as you were talking because I realised I've let so much of that go. And I'm not saying that I don't still worry about my body. And maybe if I was single or something it would be different.

Sure, yeah. But I like to think maybe not as much as I think because it has taken me so long and so many years to get to a point where I can value my body for what it can do rather than what it looks like. Absolutely, yeah. Because you're very fit as well. Like you can run for.

Oh, look, I don't know. Yes, I am. I'm very fit. And you're excellent. You have great capacity. Not compared to a lot of people. But like particularly. No, I think if you looked at like generally you'd

be fitter than oh look I think I've got a lot it's not a competition it's not anyway but that no but it's not that's not even what I'm trying to say what am I trying to get at I think that women have had to cope with this bullshit of body image and looking at unattainable bodies and examining our bodies in minute detail and hating every part of our body for such a long time that I think we are now coming to a point of body positivity where the media and the culture that we're consuming as women is so much more affirming. And I don't know if you've noticed, but when you walk past like a bras and things ad in the, in the shopping center, there'll be women with roles and there'll be women with bodies that are

recovering from C-sections or women who are a size 16, which is the actual average size of a woman in Australia. We're just coming out of all of that. And because of the so many years, we've had to develop all of these coping mechanisms to cope with the onslaught of ridiculous bodies of women that we see on media, in magazines, in TV shows. Like we've seen that stuff. We've been absorbing it in the cartoons we watched as kids since we were babies. That's true. And so women, I think, have had to do all this inner work and reading and talking and

reflecting and looking for so long to prevent ourselves from going down some really dangerous roads and it doesn't work for everybody and depending on where you are at, I mean, eating disorders and all of those things are so huge. But I do think there's so much help out there for women as well with that kind of stuff because of just the amount of toxic shit we've had to cope with for so long. And I'm not saying we've solved it, but it just strikes me that to me I think all of that stuff for men may be less down the road.

Does that make sense? So there's less infrastructure around all of that body shaming stuff for men. I think a lot of the differences as well for men, it's often for gym guys, like the really intense guys, it's guys judging other guys and complimenting other guys. Not that, you know, women. No, but I don't think women get like, I don't know, I can't speak for all women, but I know that watching a scene

where a guy has his shirt off and he's got like a six pack and he's ginormous, Yeah. I'm not into that. I'm just not into that. Like, yeah, I just think because I know, I think maybe because I know how much work had to go into it, it doesn't look, to me it's not attractive. Yeah. In the same way, yeah.

So have you ever lived with somebody who's trying to do that or done it yourself? That's what I mean. It's miserable. And then they just fart and smell like eggs all the time. Do you know about me in particular? No, no, I just mean and I'm not saying like looking after your body. I'm not saying that isn't attractive but I think there's so many

other layers of it. I think like fitness is great. It's really good. Yeah, that's what I mean, what your body can do. When I think about like the people who when I feel like I'm, you know, looking well or whatever, it's often like men who will compliment me. They're like, oh, you're looking fit or whatever. Like I don't get women being like, you look great.

You look like you're really working out at the gym or whatever. It just literally never happens. I noticed that when Broden came over actually. Yeah, Broden did say that to me from Auntie Dada, yeah. Broden said that to me and I can tell you were both like, we're guys that work out. We're guys that work out. I respect that because that's the thing.

And actually for women. Because it's fucking hard, man. It is and women do that. Even to look like this, it's like. It's hard. are complimenting. Because it's fucking hard, man. It is. And women do that. Even to look like this, it's like it's difficult. You look great. But it is really hard. And I think that's the thing. Women do compliment other women.

We often dress for other women. Yeah, sure, yeah. I don't know if guys often, and this is such a generalization, but often notice what we're wearing comparatively to how in detail my friends will notice what I'm wearing. I would say that is on the whole true. Yeah, and, yeah, I think women compliment other women. It would be weird if women came up to you just going,

oh, looking good, James. That would be very weird. Like they might notice but they won't say. Well, you know what, if you're out there and you notice, you see me, just tell me what you think. Even if it's bad, just be like, nah, no good actually. You put a lot of effort in. You look like shit.

I just think that there is a difference between and I think it's like with all things, right? There isn't anything wrong with looking after your body and becoming fit and strong and it's important to put the right foods in there and all that stuff. But when it becomes an obsession and that's all you can think about and you just constantly scrutinise yourself in the mirror, it becomes dangerous.

And I think I've had to let, because I've had two kids as well, my body is just not going to be the same as it was. And it's done. It's been through a lot. I can't take on that ridiculous, minute detail of scrutiny that I used to when I was in my twenties. And I remember I was talking to my sister about this, looking back at photos of myself where I knew I was huge. I thought in my head, oh no, you're so unappealing and you look terrible in this outfit and you need to lose 10 kilos and all this stuff. And I look

back at that photo and I think, bloody hell, you were a bit of all right. You look lovely. photo and I think, bloody hell, you were a bit of all right there. You look lovely. What were you even worried about? And I think that now about myself, it's not. Imagine how bad you're going to look in another 20 years. I know, exactly. No, but I just think we walk around with these sort of cloudy ideas of what we look like and it's only when we look back in hindsight and we go, actually, you were beautiful and

what are we so obsessed over? Do you ever look back and go, oh, look, yeah, there are plenty of photos of me, particularly what in the early 2000s where I had like a really short haircut and it just, some people look great with short hair. I looked ridiculous. I had a fringe that started from the middle of my head. Yeah. You look like you had half a coconut. Yeah. And then I had a Beatles hair cover. I have a lot of terrible haircuts. I don't even know what I'm trying to say here. Just that I think with all of this stuff, everything in moderation, and if you're finding that you're becoming so obsessed with that, it's so dangerous. It's so easy to fall into that. And I think like with any addiction, food addiction, sex addiction,

you know, alcohol, drugs, it's another form of numbing and addiction to get obsessed with your body in that way. One thing, if you do do it properly and you're eating well and exercising, it's actually good. You feel good and you also, you know, you look good. You might not look like Chris Hemsworth or whatever who's definitely on the gear. But, you know what I know, you look good. You might not look like Chris Hemsworth or whatever, who's definitely on the gear. But, you know what I mean, that's good. You know, you're strong and you can run and whatever, you know what I mean?

And you live longer for your kids. Yeah, you live longer. All of that stuff. No, and I think that's great. I think that's a really good thing. Anyway. You know, so I've got this T-shirt. It's a fitness T-shirt.

It's got Arnold Schwarzenegger on it. I noticed. And now Sam to me goes, who's that guy? And I'm like, oh, he's like an old movie star. He's been in a bunch of stuff. He's a bit older now. And he goes, oh. And he goes, what did he do?

And I'm like, oh, he was like a muscle man kind of thing. And he goes, you've got bigger muscles than him. And I'm like, I absolutely do. I appreciate the compliment. You don't know what you're talking about. Thank you. That is really funny. He's quite obsessed with muscles at the moment and my muscles too.

I'm like, look at my muscles. But, you know, I don't want him to just think manhood is about things. No, we're trying to probably pushing him too much, but we're trying to like he's doing fitness stuff at the moment. You know, he's doing basketball and we're talking about practicing and all these kinds of things and he's working on some stuff. He's getting active. Anyway, all right, Let's move along.

I've got another recommendation. Let's do it. Do we have time, Claire? Ooh, it's already 28 minutes. Maybe not. Maybe I'll save it. Okay. Is it a long one or a short one?

No, it's a short one. I'll sneak it in. Okay. I'll sneak it in. This one is a board game called Codenames. Codenames. Oh, yes. Yes.

It's so fun. We played it when we went away with some families that are our friends and are awesome. And I think I'm really into like looking at board games at the moment, particularly in the whole pandemic time. It's true. So this one is really fun and it's kind of a word puzzle game and you have to divide into like two teams, red and blue,

and each team has a leader. And it's about kind of sort of hard to explain. You get a series of words. On a board. On a board. And so there will be like a person who's red and a person who's blue and the rest of the team doesn't know which words are the red words and the blue team doesn't know which words are the blue words.

Yep. And you kind of have to give one word as a clue and get your team to figure out which words you're talking about. So you could say like if it's bird, you could say flying and then they'll go, oh, he must be talking about bird. But if there's another word on there that is plane and it's like, well, I can't say flying because they'll think plane. Yeah, and there's like words in there that if your team guesses incorrectly,

the other team wins, all that kind of stuff. And also you can say one word to guess three different words. For example, if the word was bird, you might have flying, branch, nest, or something. Oh, whatever. Yeah, sure. Yeah. So there's like and you can get really meta with it.

Yeah. It's really interesting how people's brains work and I've really, really enjoyed it. It's a great game. It's really like difficult as well, especially if you get like a bad. A bad hand? Yeah. It's really hard.

I know. And you don't want to let the team down. Yeah, it's quite. But it's a really fun one to do with a big group or a small group. Yeah, you probably need about probably at least four to do it. Yeah, and you can also play it on Zoom. We've been doing some Zoom sessions with that, which has also been really fun too.

All right. Good stuff. I could probably squeeze in a quick one if you want as well. Yes, squeeze it in. I finished up and to much popular demand. People want to know about this, squeeze it in. I finished up and to much popular demand, people want to know about this I'm sure, the Love is Blind reunion special, which is the only reality show that I've watched in the past two years.

I think other than Love on the Spectrum, which is like a legitimately good one. Oh, that's so good. So for those people who don't know, it was a 10 episode or 11 episode, I think it was 10 episode Netflix series where they split up the men and the women and they went into a house and they'd go into pods and they'd talk to each other through a wall. They couldn't see each other.

That's why it was called Love in Blind. Listen, you can't see Jason's expression. We've already talked about it in the show. We have. They had to decide whether they would get married without seeing each other and the ones who decided then they would come out of the pods and then they'd kind of go and they'd go all the way up to when they'd get married and they'd all get dressed up and they'd stand on the altar with all their families and then they'd decide on the spot

whether or not they were going to marry the other person or break their heart. It was fucking hilarious. Anyway, no, it wasn't. Some of it was tragic. Some of it was funny. Some of them it's just like, why are you doing this? This is a terrible idea.

You started watching it and you were like, why am I watching this? And you watched the whole thing. I watched the whole thing. Anyway, so I didn't realise there was a reunion special. So this one you're catching up with a couple, some you love, some you don't love, some you know, some are together and you're just like, what is this? Why are you guys still together?

It's been two years. You clearly hate each other. What the fuck is going on? Some of them who like are now single, you kind of see how they're going and some are like doing better than others and still, you know, still kind of out there and putting themselves out there and whatever. And there's one couple in particular that's just like, what is this? And this guy's an absolute buffoon.

And the woman that he's dating is also like she's a real like firecracker as well and they clearly they just don't mesh. They've got this real like love-hate kind of situation. He's kind of a dope and she's really fiery. And one of the first things he says was, yes, I've been really looking after myself now. Now I take care of my hygiene. And I'm like, what the fuck is happening?

He's like 32 years old. And then he's going through his skincare regime or whatever. And he brings a different woman to the reunion party as opposed to the woman that he was dating and and then so there's this big blowout and the woman he brought is like why would you bring me to this what is wrong with you because i thought we were friends or whatever and she's like what no what why do you think i'm here and it was really funny and i'm like i want to see this guy again every day for the rest of my life. It's hilarious.

He just looks like an anvil just kind of walking around like, what doesn't she like me? Because you're stupid. You do stupid things. You're a stupid person. That's so mean. Yeah. Does it bother you that they, like, choose people and play on their mental health in order to create good television?

Yeah, but you know what? There's a couple of couples, like one in particular, who is like these guys legitimately seem like they like each other, which is nice, you know what I mean? And every other person who's in the game show is just, like, staring at them just like this fucking thing. Like they like each other and then look happy? Yeah.

Oh, no. But they look, like, legitimately happy. Like it's really quite nice. So there's one out look, like, legitimately happy. Like, it's really, it's quite nice. So there's one out of, like, 40, however many were in it. Wow. All right. But you recommended it? No, don't watch it.

Do you know what I realized? This is unsurprisingly what I love about reality TV because I don't watch a lot of it at all. I don't really get it. When I do like it, it's because it's hopeful and inspiring. Yeah, well, there's a little bit of that in it. Speedcubes, I watched that. I was actually talking about that today. Yeah, you were.

That's cool. Apparently there's one on glassblowing that's really amazing. Oh, really? Oh, glassblowing is amazing. Yeah. We saw glassblowing in Venice somewhere. We did and they like blew horses and all kinds of stuff. Those Italians.

They were cut out for you. Yeah, they were. Yeah, you know, Italians, Stallions. Big breath, you know what I mean? Anyway, apparently there's like, I think it might be on Netflix. I've been meaning to watch it. It's a glass-blowing reality TV show. And apparently, who was I talking to?

Oh, I'm on a podcast with Maria Angelico. She was telling me she got really into it because she was like, finally they get recognition. They've been working on their glassblowing for like 20 years. Yeah. We saw this dude, like I still remember it. He fashioned like a glass horse like in front of us. Yeah.

In like a minute. I was like, what the hell? It was amazing. It was so amazing. And that kind of stuff was what I love. That's why you still have MasterChef for the same reason or like Australian Idol was when I liked or even I really loved Dancing with the Stars for the same reason because Dancing

with the Stars, they work bloody eight hours a day and they get really good. What I don't like that is about like that pirouette was shit. I'm like, you're fucking shit. You know how hard that is? I mean, I don't know how hard it is, but it seems really hard. I always love it when the footballers are like, oh, mate, you stood on the right foot this time.

And they're like stomping around. And they've got their shoes on the wrong feet. Just like. And they put their arm out in this really funny, awkward way. Anyway, I love that show because you can see a trajectory of people really improving and getting better. That's what I love. I don't can see a trajectory of people really improving and getting better. That's what I love. I don't like the taking down of stuff.

It's interesting seeing people who aren't dancers who take to it naturally. I'm trying to think of an example of that. Not even naturally, they work really hard. Celia Pakola. Correct, exactly. Hers was really interesting. Yeah, she won and she was bloody amazing.

That whole thing. And because they did it during the beginning of the pandemic, so back last year. Yeah, so it started with audiences and then they eventually lost their audiences. But she worked so hard. It was so good. Yeah.

That's what I love when you see someone that, and someone else who, Kate Sobrano. Oh, yeah, yeah. Was really amazing too. You met her? Yeah, I did meet her. Yeah. Yeah, at Parliament House. She's a Scientologist. You met her? Yeah, I did meet her. Yeah. Yeah, at Parliament House.

She's a Scientologist. Is she? Yeah. No, I follow her on Instagram. She seems really great. Her daughter seems really cool. I hope that's true. Oh, is that true?

You can be too thick. She is a Scientologist. Do you remember? She paints guitars and they're amazing. Anyway. She plays guitar. She's doing her own. She does both.

Oh, good. Do you remember when we went to Venice at that particular spot? Yes. 2008. Yes. And there was this amazing Venetian glass jewellery store. And I snuck in there. I snuck in and I bought you a bracelet, Venetian glass.

And then I hid it in my backpack and we carried it all around Europe and then back to London. I lived there. And just before you went home, I gave it to you. And you were like, oh, my God, this is amazing. And then you lost it. I mean, you left it at a bar. Anyway, I'm just asking, do you remember that?

I still think of it. I knew exactly what you were going to say as soon as you bought the Venetian glass, I got this like stabbing anxiety because I still remember it and I loved it so much. It was good. It was a beautiful round face. The guy helped me like distract you while I like picked it out or whatever. Yeah.

James. And it was probably 80 euro, which was a lot then and now. That's a lot of money. Oh, my God. I just am the worst with stuff like that. I just lose things so easily. I don't know why you took it off. I don't.

Or did you? It must have fallen off. I think the class broke easily. I don't know why you took it off. I don't. Or did you? It must have fallen off. I think the class broke. Maybe you sold me a piece of crap. No. I loved it so much. I'm really horrible at being. Wasn't meant to be.

Wasn't meant to be. I loved it so much. I love you. Well. I kept you. That's true. You had to leave something at a bar. Anyways, we should wrap it up.

All right. You can actually, you can review the show. It helps us out massively if you could or give us a review in-app. Five stars is our preference, but that's obviously up to you. This is from JDD7219 who says, Legends, you will have listened to them so often that you'll eventually find yourself furious that you cannot just text one of them to say thanks for the suggestion or to furiously disagree with them.

I love them both dearly. Thank you, JDD7219. Aw, thanks, mate. That's so lovely. And you can also email us with some suggestions just like the wonderful Eric from Nottingham has. Oh, my God. Nottingham.

Eric of Nottingham. Eric, I know it sounds like you're dressed in a little Robin Hood outfit. That's it. Only thing I know about Nottingham. It's true. I know Eric. I love that Disney cartoon with the fox dresses. Don't even start with that shit, please. outfit that's the only thing i know about nottingham it's true i know that disney cartoon with the fox dresses don't even start with that shit please i don't know if you know about this

i know about i know you know i know because people keep tweeting at me about the fox dresses it's because mason is in love with the fox from um she's very beautiful she has lovely i wouldn't know i don't i honestly can't see it. It makes no sense. Well, apparently you're into her and if she was real, I would be in trouble. Can I just quickly show you something? This is something that came up in the Reddit. There's a clip from Hey Hey It's Saturday.

Yep, that's up there. Mason and I also talk a lot about Hey Hey It's Saturday. I don't know if you know that. I've seen that one where it's the guy like looking back or something at Maid Marian. Is it this one? I haven't know if you know that. I've seen that one where it's the guy like looking back or something at Maid Marian. Is it this one? I haven't seen that one. So for those who don't know, it's me and Maid Marian.

This is drawn in MS Paint and we're not in the same location but we're looking up at the stars crying and Maid Marian is saying, can we pretend that airplanes in the night sky are like shooting stars? And then I'm saying I can really use a wish right now, which is that Rihanna song. It's so weird and niche. I just think that's really funny. And also more of a reflection of the way that Mason feels

about Maid Marian. Is that real? What? Does he really have a crush on Maid Marian? Yeah, that's true. Oh, yeah, fair enough. I have a bit of a crush on the? Yeah, that's true. Oh, yeah. Fair enough. I have a bit of a crush on the fox. Perfect.

You guys should talk about it all the time. He's foxy. And they're also, I'm dreading it because they're remaking it, but with like, you know the way they did like Zootopia? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I'm just like, I don't want this fucking movie to come out. The amount of people are going to send me shit. It's just like.

And they can't remake that because it's just a classic. They do it all. You know what? It's not like amazing as a movie either. Like it's okay. Yes, it is. I love it. It's all right.

No, no, no. I totally disagree. It is such a good movie. It's in that weird Disney era where they didn't really know what they were doing. No, it's so good. There's a lot of ones that aren't so great, but that one, it's a classic. The songs are so great. The vibe of it is so good.

There's so many great jokes in there. The little rabbits are so cute with the little turtles. The little coins. The little coins and, like, the funny, like, lion prince guy. And I just, the snake, it's just great. The definitive version of Robin Hood is Robin Hood, Prince of Thieves with Kevin Costner. All right, okay.

Poor Eric from Nottingham. We have hijacked his email. What was his question? We haven't started reading his email yet. What have we got? Poor Eric from Nottingham. Hi, Claire and her husband, man. That's me.

I was listening to your soon-to-be more successful podcast, Todds, and in the episode with Jess Perkins you spoke about about gender-swapping characters in children's books. It's true. I wanted to let you know about A Mighty Girl, amightygirl.com. So there's a website there. Okay. It's a website that chronicles books, TV, movies with female protagonists. Ah, okay.

The description in the book section reads, A Mighty Girl's book section features over 4,000 girl-empowering books starring stellar Mighty mighty girl characters. So it seems like a great starting point for parents looking for female role models for their children, whatever gender they are. Very good. Also, a book recommendation of my own, Invisible Woman, Exposing Gender Bias in a World Designed for Men by Caroline Criado Perez. It's a book that analyzes and breaks down the gender gap in data collection and design of all areas of design, healthcare and culture,

and I found it fascinating and infuriating on my end. When you start examining this stuff, it's insane. Like hair, air conditioners, that's why women are constantly cold because it's the design of men. They have different, yeah. Correct. Anyway, as a bloke, I'm not aware in my everyday life of the little ways the world is designed

to benefit me and make things harder for women. And as an architectural designer myself, it's extremely important that I'm aware of how and when I'm excluding 50% of the planet in my work. Eric, you are a legend. Eric knows what he's doing. He does. Highly, highly recommend for any designers, particularly men, in my opinion. Sorry for the long email.

Thanks for the great content. Eric. Very good. I know. I totally think that is fantastic, Eric. Thank you so much because absolutely right that there's so much in design that has been designed with like a standard six foot man in mind. Even cities, when you start to look at it, are designed around sort of for men. What about pockets? Well, exactly, James. Like my sister and I were talking about this the other day. Men's clothing in general is cheaper and really well made.

It's warmer. There's like a thousand different hidden pockets everywhere. It's really functional and the fabrics are always better. And with women's clothing, you wash them twice, they like fall to pieces and there's usually way less function and way less pockets. And if you look at the difference in even kids' clothing between boys and girls, the clothing for boys is a better quality.

I think also a lot of times the girls' clothes is like they're like lighter and brighter colours so they show up dirt easier as well. Yeah, but it's also the fabrics too are often less quality because they've got like frou-frou bits and things. And there's nothing wrong with having them. We've got a bunch of clothes for our daughter that's like white and I'm like why the fuck would I put her in this? Yeah.

Like that's ridiculous. Yeah, I know. And look, and I'm not saying you shouldn't have beautiful clothes. I'm saying you should put every kid in a potato sack. Anyway, I just think that whole idea of looking at why the world is designed for men and how we can better design buildings and infrastructure that takes everyone into account. Exactly.

Including people with disabilities as well. That's a massive thing with accessibility. You know what, I've also like you notice pushing a pram how many places are not accessible. Yeah. You know what I mean? You totally do. There's a ramp. You're what, I've also, like you notice pushing a pram how many places are not accessible. Yeah. You know what I mean? You totally do. It's like there's a ramp, you're like, oh, thank God.

And a lot of, in Australia, like they have to have ramps. It's like mandated. Yeah, but I just even notice there's so many small shops where we can't wheel the pram around and there's massive stairs and it just always makes me think about people in wheelchairs who are trying to access. You would just have to avoid shops. Yeah, you just couldn't, yeah.

And I just, yeah, I mean obviously I can't empathise in that way. Like I couldn't, I have no idea what it would feel like. But in a small way I can see just how ridiculously unaccessible so many things are in our world and way of being. Anyhoo. I like to think this podcast is unaccessible. Do you know what I mean? You turn it on and you're like, what is this?

What is happening here? It is a strange place. Why is a guy who's not on the show in love with Maid Marian? It's a great question. You're going to have to message him at Wikipedia Brown on Twitter. And now everyone's going to think I'm a terrible wife because I lost that beautiful bracelet. Who cares?

How many terrible things have I done? I gave our son expired cough syrup this very evening. Yeah, you did. So it's fine. I think he's okay. We should go check. And not just like a little bit expired, like a lot. Like years.

And I tried really hard not to be mad, but I was really mad. But also it's like cough syrup. Who gives a shit? If it was like rat poison. No, don't say that on a podcast. Do check all the expiry dates of all the things. We rang. You looked at the Poison's website. you looked at the Poison's website.

I looked at the Poison's website and they said, what have you done? What have you done? They did. James, it said on the website. It knew. It did. Okay, we've really run over.

Thank you so much to Colleen for editing this episode. We've been to Jess for a podcast. Bye. Bye. This podcast is part of the Planet Broadcasting Network. Visit planetbroadcasting.com for more podcasts from our great mates. Hi, this is Katnett Unfiltered. If you know us, then you know that we do almost everything together,

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