Sword and Scale - Episode 213

Episode Date: June 13, 2022

Thanksgiving of 2012 started off very poorly for the Redwine Family. When one member of their clan, 13-year-old Dylan Redwine vanished on November 18th, an expensive and lengthy search of the Colorado Mountains ensued. What they found over the course of a decade exhausted investigatory resources and frustrated the community. By the time an arrest was made, everyone already knew who had taken Dylan. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Sort and scale contains adult themes and violence and is not intended for all audiences Listener discretion is advised My husband picked up something he said hey honey. What do you think this is? I took it from his hands and Immediately I knew it was a useful and immediately I knew it was a useful. Hello and welcome. This is season nine, episode 213 of Sword and Scale. I show that reveals that the worst monsters are real. Soared and scaled plus is just $5 right now but it's going to go up to 10 for the base

level pricing this year. If you sign up now before that happens you get it grandfathered in forever. So do not miss out. This is your last chance potentially to get all all of the good content all of the premium stuff Hours and hours of it that you can't find anywhere else Right on your phone or computer for half the price you would normally get it So do it now or Live to regret it.

Growing up in a broken home is not an uncommon human experience for a lot of us. As of 2020, 25% of children in the United States were living in a single parent household. That's triple what it was in 1960. These days it seems we need to remind parents that they need to be parents. Driving down any highway across the country, you may see a billboard for a PSA about fatherhood. Its government funded, and there are several variations of it, but one advertisement features a girl giggling with her hands over her mouth. Captioned, this moment brought to you by Dad.

Take time to be a dad today. Fatherhood.gov. Hashtag. Dad jokes rule. These PSAs are cute, but also kind of depressing. Do we really need to propagandize parenthood now? Turning it into an advertising campaign? Do we have to guilt people into being parents?

Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Why do we have to incentivize parenthood? As if some deadbeat dad who hasn't seen his kids in four years will suddenly have an epiphany and decide to start paying his child support. This government parenthood website touts a section for dads, including things like activities for dads and kids. Dad jokes and something called, quote, dadication. Feel free to cringe right now. This section features stories of fathers who overcame life struggles and remembered, I guess, that they have kids.

My biggest fear in the middle of my addiction was that I would never be able to get over it and that my kids wouldn't have a father. I overdosed on heroin and I lived. I found the fatherhood program and it was one of the best decisions I've ever made in my life. My desire to change had finally outweighed my desire to stay the same. A very profound insight, I guess you would say. The point is a lot of kids grow up with only one of their parents. The other ones are real piece of trash. And the red wine brothers were no different. When my mom originally told me that she was pregnant, I was kind of bummed.

Well, I mean, I was super excited, you know, I was going to have a sibling, but I really wanted a little sister. You know, I just always wanted a little sister. And so when my mom told me, you know, we're having a little sister. I just always wanted a little sister. And so when my mom told me, we're having a little brother, I got a little frustrated. But I was excited to be an older brother. This is Corey Redwine. We lived in Denver until I was about 12.

The day Dylan was born, and the first time I held him, there's a picture of me that I have, but I remember the feeling, you know, and I was just so excited. It was really hard to maintain my composure because I really wanted to like squeeze in and, you know, he was kind of freaky looking too. So, you know, I was unsure about it, but I was just so excited to kind of start the growth process of just, you know, figuring out who he's all about and what he's all about and just kind of start getting to know him.

When little Dylan Red wine came along, Cory was already seven years old, a pretty substantial age gap, but that didn't stop them from becoming best friends. Cory swiftly took his little brother under his wing, vowing never to leave Dylan to deal with the ugly parts of life on his own. There's seven years difference between me and Dylan, but we always remained a really close relationship, even with the age gap. I always just like being an older brother. And so I really enjoyed teaching him things and just watching him grow and learn as a child. So we always had a really close relationship.

These towheaded Colorado boys started out as part of a family of four. Dylan and Corey lived with their mother Elaine and their father Mark. The waters in the Red Wine Household were often calm, and the four frequently went on fun family excursions. You know, just kind of normal things like sports events. You know, I love sports as to Dylan,

and that was something that we as a family always did. Well, one of the goals that I've had, and this goes back to with Cory as well, but one of the things that I've had, and this goes back to with Cori as well, but one of the things that I wanted to do in our lifetime was be able to go to every baseball stadium in the country and every NASCAR track in the country. So for example, last year we went to Chicago, Ridley Field, and then we went to Detroit to an NASCAR race, and then we went to Cleveland to watch the Rockets

play the Indians, where we actually met Todd Helmsfather while we were watching the game. And I will tell you that he spent 45 minutes in an hour talking to Dylan. You know, the memories kind of when, you know, it was just us four. I mean, we were happy or some of of my the ones I hold onto the most. The red ones often took exciting trips like the ones mark recounts, but when they were back at home, Dylan and Cory continued their adventures, riding dirt bikes, exploring the woods, playing sports, and you know, all the other fun out to outdoor activities that kids these days tend to avoid. Playing catch was definitely one of the best memories that, you know, I just always did

with Dylan. That was one thing he and him would do for hours and hours each day or so. Dylan looked up to Cory. He in many ways was a model big brother, taking Dylan on adventures and guiding him in experiences, those without older siblings tend to miss out on. You know there'd be times we'd go ride ATVs there's this one time. We were at an ATVs and he thought it'd be a good idea to try and pass me, you know, not really knowing how to do it. So he comes around and he tries to pass me and he gets

a little off the road and he just went straight down into these trees You know, you just see the panic on his face He took his helmet off and his eyes or you know as big as oranges and he's you know kind of tear you hide But you know as soon as he got off and realized he was okay, you know, he started laughing about it and you know We are we just we did a lot of crazy things together. But he was always, he just wanted to learn from you. And being the older brother that I was, there's a lot of things that I tried to teach in that I would go through and I try to help him out, but

Dylan always liked to learn himself. Things were somewhat normal in the Red Wine household until Dylan turned seven and Corey breached the teenage years. The boy's mother Elaine was working outside of the home while her husband Mark stayed and took care of the kids. From Mark's point of view, that's where he and Elaine's relationship began to crumble. You know, Dylan's relationship with Mark was always way different than mine. Dylan was kind of the baby, and you know, they were kind of way more of, you know, buds

than me and Mark were, per se. We were inseparable. I mean, anywhere I was, he was right there beside me. You know, he would come to me before I would go to his mom. You know, I think in many ways that was part of the problems that developed in our relationship was because while she was out earning a career, it was very difficult for her to lose sight of the fact that she wasn't there bonding or dealing the way I was. And I think that that was a huge problem for her. He was a stayed home dad and it was just smothering us and the relationship between him and my mom and you know me and him and Dylan and him and you know when he's at home constantly. You know we were all ready for him to find something to get him out. Soon, Mark began a job as a truck driver, and he and Elaine began their divorce proceedings.

They lived together for nearly a year despite their separation and plans for imminent divorce, which made things even more difficult for the boys. Yeah, it was, it was an nasty divorce. You know, oftentimes me and Dylan were kind of the centerpieces of it. So there were moments, you know, where me and him were way more involved than we ever wanted to be. You know, we kind of were like, this is your relationship, handling it between yourselves. There was just kind of this thing in our household. You know, me and my mom and Dylan always had a blast together. And any time we were around each other,

you know, it was a good time. And we loved our mom, so we always favored her in any circumstance, whether it was an issue I had at school or I'm not feeling good. I just want to hang out. You know, we always were, you know, with my mom. Always wanted to spend time with her. There was never a doubt who the primary parent was to me in Dylan. So the relationships kind of evolved though as you know years went on. When the initial divorce happened, Mark was way more adamant about

Our initial divorce happened. Mark was way more adamant about having custody of us so that he could get, you know, like when they first split up, he was way more into having me and Dylan so that when, you know, the custody hearings would happen, he would get custody and, you know, my mom would end up having to pay child support. So he was always super, you know, he would come and take me and my brother, you know, when they were going through custody hearings and stuff like that and always wanted to be a really big part. By the time the divorce was in full swing

and custody hearings took place, Mark Redwine had purchased a small remote cabin about an hour drive into the mountains northeast of Durango, Colorado. He'd reside more than five hours from where Elaine and the boys now lived back in Colorado Springs. And then after the custody hearings, you know, and he got awarded 50% custody,

and you know, then it was like he was gone. So we never saw him. He was out on the road a lot. We loved our mom with everything we had, and it didn't matter what she had, you know, And then it was like he was gone. So we never saw him. He was out on the road a lot. We loved our mom with everything we had, and it didn't matter what she had, whether she was broke or whatever the case would be. We just wanted to be with her because she knew she would take care of us. So that's where we always wanted to spend our time. And with Mark, not necessarily with me but with Dylan you know he tried to

buy his love i feel like you know he would never see him maybe you know once or twice a year and in that one visit that he would see i mean Dylan would come home with just tons and tons of just meaningless crap you know Dylan enjoyed getting the new stuff but when it was time to be where he wanted to be, he was on the first plane to get home to be with Mama. Right around Thanksgiving of 2012, 13-year-old Dylan still being under the age of 18 was required to attend court-ordered visitation with his father, Mark. Dylan now lived with his mother full time, and that's how he liked it. Yeah, he spent all of his time with my mom. I mean periodically, there'd be some road trips

or maybe a one night visit, something like that. But my mom had custody of Dylan, you know. He loved being in the city. He loved just the atmosphere of what was going on around here and love being able to go to the Rockies games in the summer. We went to Waterworld, which is, I mean, he enjoyed it. There was no indication whatsoever that he didn't like being here. He loved his friends. He made so many friends here. He loved going to Skate City with his friend Joe and all of his friends in our old neighborhood and car springs. No, and he woke up every morning, bright and early for school

because he was excited for school. Dylan adored his mom and brother, and it was clear to everyone around him that he loved living in Colorado Springs. He didn't care so much about his dad. In fact, he was not looking forward to this court-ordered visitation. I just don't think Dylan knew Mark, and I just don't think Mark knew Dylan very well. I think that Dylan had grown a lot, you know, in the last couple of years, and I don't think Mark spent,

I know Mark didn't spend a lot of time with him, and I just don't think he knew Dylan, especially as he was growing into his teenage years. I think I underestimated spent, I know Mark didn't spend a lot of time with him and I just don't think he knew Dylan, especially as he was growing into his teenage years. I think I underestimated Dylan. I think he, you know, just didn't know him very well. Dad's house wasn't full of fun activities and to top it off, it was in the middle of nowhere, far from Dylan's friends. It was just a cabin in the mountains filled with plenty of things for a single middle-aged trucker. But there was nothing there for a 13 year old boy.

In the summertime, you know, I mean, it's a hike up there, but there's just a lot of people up there because there's a lot of campgrounds and stuff like that. So, I mean, there's not really a whole lot up there. There's a few gas, like two gas stations in a restaurant, but then there's just a lake and outdoor stuff. So, you know, get a lot of tourism and stuff like that, but, you know, there's nothing really around,

especially if you're a kid and don't have like, vehicle access or anything like that. I mean, there's nothing really around. I mean, it's probably a good four or five hour walk to the nearest gas station from Mark's house. So, you know, not a whole lot around, not really a whole lot of houses. In the wintertime, there's nothing. I mean, maybe two or three people up there. Naturally, Dylan resisted this trip. He huffed and puffed about longing to stay near his mother and her, thanksgiving cooking. Dylan dreaded the boring days ahead.

He knew he would be trapped in the mountains with literal cabin fever and a dad who did more drinking than cooking. What a blast. He was a heavy drinker, so when he wasn't working or anything like that, typically when he came up to the house, he was always out his house because he was pretty much always intoxicated. Dylan had no intention and no, you know, well, he didn't want to be around Mark at all.

Not only just on the daily life, but even for Thanksgiving. So when Dylan found out, you know, he had to go spend the Thanksgiving with Mark, you know, later Dylan,, Dylan rebelled against it and didn't want to talk to him, didn't want to have any relationship with Mark and Mark didn't really care either.

I think he reached out to Dylan like one time in between the court hearing and the trip down there. So there was a lot of animosity between Dylan having to go down there and not only just from Dylan But for me and my mom as well, you know, we were super irritated that You know, he's had more than enough opportunities to spend Thanksgiving with us and they'll previous like three Thanksgiving's You know, he was never around but this one just had to be you know, it was so important and Dylan was, you know, he was upset about it.

As Thanksgiving loomed, it was finally time for Dylan to fly to Durango to see his dad. His mom put him on a plane on November 18, 2012 and their normal travel routine ensued. Dylan was just a kid and he would be traveling alone. After all, it was a quick routine flight and Mark was to meet Dylan at the airport and immediately pick him up and take him to the cabin. As he always does, he texted me and let me know that his dad had picked him up. And that was the last time I heard from him. But you know, it was an uncharacteristic of Dylan not to text me back right away, especially if he was with his friend, which is what I kind of assumed, you know, had happened because I know he was really excited to see his friends. So I really didn't think much of it that afternoon.

I got a text from his dad asking me if I knew where Dylan was. What did you think when you got that text? Well I was dumbfounded. I mean, you know, I was dumbfounded. I mean, you know, Dylan was visiting his father, and I told him it was very disconcerning that he had texted me and asked me where Dylan was considering I'm, you know, five, six hours away.

Once Dylan got off that plane, he was Mark's responsibility. And like the great dad that he is, Mark lost track of Dylan not 24 hours after his arrival. Everyone had a bad feeling about this trip. On November 18, 2012, the weekend before Thanksgiving, 13-year-old Dylan Redwine boarded a flight from Colorado Springs to Durango, Colorado, to see his father in a court-ordered visitation. Dylan resisted the visit, but eventually complied. When he arrived at Durango Sunday evening, he sent his mother a text to let her know that

his dad had picked him up from the day. He sent his mother a text to let her know that his dad had picked him up from the airport. It was the last text Elaine would ever get from her son. I never had any reason to believe that Dylan would just disappear in the Mark's watch. I mean, I never had any reason to believe that. So, you know, while Dylan was, you know, he was excited because we were having a big Thanksgiving thing here and so he wanted to be here, but he was also excited about going to Bayfield to spend some time with his friends. And I never had any reason to believe that, you know, Dylan would just disappear under Mark's watch. Well, his flight was late arriving. There was some delay leaving Denver.

And so he didn't actually land, probably. I want to say about six, six o'clock, six, twenty, something like that. I don't remember exactly what time it was, but immediately leaving the airport, I don't remember exactly what time it was, but immediately leaving the airport, we went to Walmart. Why'd you go to Walmart? Well, I had just recently come in from doing a job in Silver City in New Mexico, so I

didn't have a whole lot of things for us to eat and deal with. And so he's adamant about having his snacks around and things for him to snack on when he's around. So there was a need for us to go grab enough things from Walmart to be able to sustain ourselves for a day or two while we were figuring out. You know, I didn't even buy anything for Thanksgiving because I didn't have any concrete plan as to what we were gonna do, whether we're gonna do it here or whether we're gonna do it somewhere else. Dylan and his dad went to McDonald's to grab a late dinner and started their

drive up to Mark's house. The two arrived at the house around half past 8 p.m. on Sunday night. They watched a movie and Mark went up to bed at around 10 30 leaving Dylan to sleep on the couch until the next morning. I get up to go run my errands because I had a payroll issue that needed to be dealt with first thing money more because that's when payroll goes in and so it was important for me to get down there as early as possible. Well I wanted to leave at 6.30 so I'd be there at 7.30 when they open the doors. You know I spent 45 minutes on hour trying to get down to wake up and you know helping him

saying you know, telling him going down because he would talk to me about going to see his friend Ryan That morning, but he wouldn't have a no part of it, which is not uncommon for him I mean you can't get him to bed and you can't get him up When did you know something was wrong? Well when I got home he wouldn't hear it didn't think much of it at the time Because it's not unlike him to go wander and off, and he'll walk down to the river across the street, or, you know, he might go up into the campground where he can be next to the river up there.

I didn't think a whole lot of it. And it was probably 2.30 by the time I realized that Dylan still is not home and so I'm thinking, well, if he ain't going to return my text messages and I ain't hearing my phone rang because he ain't calling me, I need to go find that boy. That afternoon, Elaine received a text from Mark asking her if she knew where Dylan was. Elaine, of course, was, I rate. She gathered her family, jumped in the the car and sped to Durango. So we've pulled into Durango, I want to say, on the 19th, that probably 11.30, 12 o'clock at night.

And then that's kind of just where we started our plan for where we need to search and what we need to do. The day Dylan arrived at his dad's house, he had begun texting one of his friends in the area, making plans to hang out with him. How was your flight? Weird, my head went numb from all the vibrations. I'm in Pagosa. Coming? Can't come.

Sorry. I'll hang tomorrow. Okay. Why? Did your dad say no? Yeah. Can I come over early like 6'30 early tomorrow? Yeah, you better let me in.

I will, I'm gonna be at my grandma's. The plans were made, and Dylan's friend instructed him to call when he arrived. The next morning, Dylan didn't show. The last activity on his device was at 9.37pm on Sunday night. Where are you? Come to Nando's. Dylan's friend continued texting him throughout that Monday and through the evening. Dude, your dad's looking for you. Are you alright, dude? Dude, you need to call somebody,

anybody, ASAP. We're all worried about you. Your mom called and she's worried, bro. Seriously, when you get this message, call someone. Dylan likely made his attempt to stay with a friend so soon after arriving at his dad's house, in an effort to cut down on the amount of time he would have to spend in a boring cabin. And the amount of time he would have to spend in a boring cabin and the amount of time he would have to spend with his dad. We were always happier when he was at there. In a large part of that is because when he was there, he just controlled everything to a whole nother level. One of the things that he used to do is like during dinner time, if we wouldn't finish art, we'd eat our

dinner and then we'd throw it away in the trash can. But what he would do if you threw your dinner away before he'd see it and he didn't feel like you ate enough, he'd make you eat it out of the trash can. So I'll never forget this one time Dylan, you know, has some bacon or something like that and he throws it away, you know, just wasn't, you know, feeling all that well about it and he threw it away and goes and tells, you know, Mark that I'm done eating, comes back and you know, he sees the food in the trash can and he pulls it out and there's slime all over it, you know, just making him eat it and I'll never forget like the tears and like just the he's like

making himself throw up because of how just you know he had it in his mindset he didn't want to eat it and you know I'll never forget just watching him eat this bacon out of the trash can and from that day forward every time Dylan would go and do that I would grab his bacon and go or whatever it was whatever he didn't finish, I would take it and go run it down to my trash can, down in my room, so that it didn't have to happen again. Because that was one of the things that that happened to me a few times too.

It was just one of those things that we thought was normal. And we were like, at the time, we were like, well, we gotta figure out ways to eat our food better. And I don't know, you would tell ourselves it was our fault. This is only one single example from a robust collection that puts marks bad parenting on full display. That's why we were so close, this experience and that stuff together. Um, you know, just kind of always questioning just, you know, certain things together.

And, you know, is this right? You know, we don't know. We're just being shown this. This is every day for us. But, you know, in your heart and your mind, you question just, you know, a lot of things like that. So, you know, me and Dylan always were a unified team when it came to just handling the adversity you know in our house together Now that Cory had grown to be an adult

Dylan was on his own with his dad These forced visitations would have to be navigated without the help of Dylan's primary protector The person who had endured all of these traumas with him When he found out that his little brother was missing, Corey jumped into action, yearning to directly confront his dad about his gross negligence. So I drove up to his house. So I didn't do it that night that we got into town. But the next day, Mark was kind of just at his house and kind of so I drove up there and was trying to see what was going on. I wanted to speak with him and my mom didn't go with me on that, but I just wanted to

go up and talk with him and just kind of see, you know, what was going on. In a normal family, whether parents are divorced or not, you'd think everyone would come together to find a missing family member no matter what it takes. They'd put their differences aside and do what needs to be done. This was not the response Corey received from his father when he went up to the cabin to survey the situation. I don't know. He was just so calm and collected that I just got super pissed off.

So right from the start, probably the first time I'd seen him since Dylan went missing, I could just instantly tell that, you know, just the way his body language was and everything like that. So it took a lot of strength for me to not overreact on him, especially, you know, when there's law enforcement and everything like that. So I just went up there for the one time to ask some questions. And then from that point forward, I knew I kind of had to refrain myself from our visitations just because there's a lot that wanted to do.

So. Dylan Redwine disappeared last Monday from his father's home in Valicito. He was visiting his father for Thanksgiving on a core ordered visit. Dylan lives with his mom and brother in Colorado Springs. He disappeared one day after arriving at his dad's. The search to find Dylan is growing daily, which includes volunteers and many of Dylan's friends from Bayfield where he grew up, only 20 miles from where he went missing. His friends told the Durango newspaper, they believe he was hitchhiking to see them and was abducted.

There's also a Facebook page and a mother's plea. She writes on Facebook, I don't know if you can see this and I know you're not a big reader, so I will keep this short. We are all in Durango looking for you. I am here and I will never give up looking for you. You are my ray of sunshine and the best kid a mother could ever have. A week had come and gone with no sign of Dylan. It appeared that wherever he went, he took everything with him. All of his belongings. I have investigators given you any clues on what direction they're going in. Not really. I mean, it's an open investigation and that's what they tell me all the time.

Does it make you mad as a mom that they're not telling you everything? Well, I mean, there's other things that make me mad as a mom like the fact that Mark lost still and that makes me very mad and the fact that he won't speak to us, and the fact that he won't answer our questions, and the fact that every time I try to contact him, he's accusing me of harassing him. That makes me more angry. You know, the cops wouldn't be in this position if it weren't for Mark just losing Dylan. I mean, Cori and I have tried to keep in touch with him. We ask him to help us in the search.

And he's just very difficult and being very evasive. And that makes it extremely frustrating. Search and rescue teams had scoured every corner of the forest surrounding Mark's property. By this point, the FBI became involved as well. There was no sign of Dylan. To reach a larger audience, Dylan's remaining family members all agreed to go on the Dr. Phil show.

Mark made an appearance alongside both Cory and Elaine. You know, we did some, like, good morning, America and stuff like that, but our mindset was, you know, this is a good platform just to get Dylan's face out there. We weren't really concerned with anything that had to do with Mark. You know, there was no really plan if we had in place with Mark or anything on the Dr. Phil show. It was kind of more, you just stick us in a room and I guess that's what came out,

but you know, we didn't even really want Mark to go on. The Dr. Phil show just, because there's just nothing you really gain, I mean, we gained a lot from it, but at the time, we didn't think we would really gain anything just because he's got no concern. The show didn't go as I'm sure Mark Redwine hoped it would have. Dr. Phil forced him to go back through his story.

He left his house early in the morning on Monday, November 19th, and when he returned around 11.30, that same morning, Dylan was gone. Mark took a nap. That's right, he had to admit on national television that he took a nap until 1.30 in the afternoon. It was only after this snooze that Mark began texting and calling Dylan's friends, and finally texted Elaine to let her know that her son was missing. The two-part Dr. Phil special not only raised awareness about the family's missing child, but put a spotlight directly onto his father, Mark.

Several times, Dr. Phil's team requested that Mark take a polygraph test to clear his name. He was wishy-washy about it, throughout the course of the show, finally proclaiming quote, maybe now isn't the time to be taking the polygraph test. Everyone who watched that episode of Dr. Phil suddenly had the realization that Dylan's father not only had the time and opportunity to make his son disappear, but he was fully capable of it. Something was off, and the public was catching on. Cory Redwine, on the other hand, knew a lot more about his father than Dr. Phil's production team.

I kind of knew he was a sick guy, you know? I mean, through my whole childhood, I always kind of found little sick things to his, you know, magazines, or just a lot of things like that. When Mark first bought that house, it was a completely different layout than it was in 2012 when all this happened. So there was this room that he had, and it was still in his room, but it was kind of more of just his extra clothes and stuff. And I saw this Ryobey tool bag up top

and I just grabbed it down and wanted to open it up and see what was in there. But when I opened it up, the whole bag is just filled with women's panties and there's like brass knuckles in there, like some guns. And you know, I'm just like, what an odd combination. And you know, what makes you tick? Like what are you involved in? What's going on? That's, you know, and I didn't, I had the questions, but I didn't really want to know the answers, because as far as I'm concerned, you know, I just was, I just was having a hard time trying to figure out who he really was. Corey was only 14 when he discovered these items hidden in the closet. And over the years, he would come upon

other small items and clues that further solidified in his mind that his father was not the person he once thought he knew. I would find a lot of paraphernalia, throughout the years, like tinfoil things, just weird little things like that that I never really wanted to think about too much. You know, the more I thought about it, the more scared me.

So I just tried to kind of not think about it. But you know, he was just a weird guy. He did things sometimes that were so bizarre and so extreme. Like when him and my mom were getting divorced, one of the things he would do is he would go in, you know, and this is when he bought his house. So he would do is he would go in, you know, and this is when he bought his house. So, you know, he's living in his house, she's living in her.

But he would sneak into her house and grab like one of each of her shoes, because he felt he was entitled to it, you know, from getting divorced, he's entitled to 50% of everything. And then, you know, he would take like her black dresses, you know, because if she can't wear her, or if he can't see her and then no one can. And just do things like that, you know, just weird behaviors that, you know, I just, like I said, for so many years I thought they were normal, but as I really got, you know,

into turning into an adult myself, you know, I'm like, all right. There's just a lot of odd things about you that can't really explain. I just, you know, is always super uncomfortable with them. Unfortunately, Corey wasn't the one to discover the worst of what his father had hidden away. And it was far more disturbing than women's underwear, brass knuckles, firearms, or drug paraphernalia.

In November of 2012, Mark Redwine alerted his ex-wife that their 13-year-old son, Dylan, had gone missing during a court-ordered visitation. Elaine gathered her family and beeline to Durango to begin the search. Dylan's older brother, Corey, felt a lump of dread growing in his gut as they drove. He knew something no one else knew. He knew his dad might have a motive. A legitimate reason he may have wanted to get rid of Dylan. It was 2011 and we were on a road trip with Mark, you know, and I was on the phone with my wife

and it was, I wanna say like 11 o'clock at night, you know, so it was pretty late and, you know, I come in after talking on the phone with her and Dylan's like, you know, come check these out. And he was kind of just like chucklein, you know, under his breath, and he's like, look at these, you know, and showed them to me and then I'm like, oh my God, so we grabbed the laptop

and go inside the bathroom. And, you know, I break out my old school phone, flip phone, and take some pictures with it. What young Dylan had just discovered on his father's laptop was not something any human could ever be prepared to see. I'm sure many of you remember your first reaction to seeing two girls one cup. First reaction, I mean, I hope it was your only reaction.

But this was much, much worse. The photos Dylan found on the laptop were of his father, picture Frank Gallagher and his younger days. And several of the photos marked Dond Women's bras and underwear and even a wig. It's not common, but there have definitely been others out there who've discovered that their father's secretly liked to cross-dress. But this wasn't the worst part. The photos, which clearly had been taken by Mark inside his home, showed him or the diaper in his mouth. The diaper had what appeared to be human feces in it, and it looked

like he had wiped the thing all over his face. I remember telling Dylan that, and I'm like, we got to be careful with these, and I don't want you to have any link to them, you know, especially because at that point my relationship with Mark I could pick and choose when I saw him but Dylan, you know didn't have that access So I never wanted a contentious, you know Subject in between them to and the more I knew if Dylan had those pictures that you know It would put him in a bad position So I tried to keep him from him as best as I could. As they flipped through the photos, closer images showed that yes, Mark was indeed eating

shit. Presumably, his own. One close-up photo showed just the tip of Mark's shitty nose, with his tongue sticking out a few inches from a pile of human feces in the diaper. The brown sludge covered his lips, mustache, and cheeks. The final confirmation that this was indeed Mark's own feces was a photo showing Mark wearing the poopy diaper. Can you imagine discovering that your dad gets off on eating his own shit? Seriously, think about that.

I want you to really form a picture of your mind of dear old dad. Semented there, solidified, and sweet dreams tonight. What is the appropriate reaction after discovering something like this? I have no idea. You know, it's kind of weird how humans work, but you know, it's so disgusting. You can't stop looking at it, you know, and his... He was so grossed out by it. It was so overwhelming to him, you know, but when you look at the pictures,

you have to really wonder how, if they're real, like, you know, I mean, there's, there's not really a way you can look at them and maintain any kind of a straight face, you know. They're just so repulsing on every level. And I was shocked at the level of that he went to, but I always kind of knew he had a side, you know, not to that extreme, but a weird side to him like that. When I first saw him, I was just wondering what drugs are you on? Like what the hell is going on? Like there's no way you did that with a clear mindset. Corey couldn't emotionally handle what he had just seen. He put the mental images

in a little box in his brain, shut it, and pushed it into a corner, a very dark corner. His main concern was making sure that Mark never found out about their little discovery. As he personally distanced himself from his father even further. Corey kept a close eye on Mark's relationship with Dylan. We found the pictures probably a little over a year before Dylan flew down there. Dylan hadn't seen Mark a lot in that time. So we went on that road trip and then I want to say like six, seven months later him and Dylan went on another road trip. So on that road trip, Dylan

was asking me for the pictures. You know, I didn't go on that road trip. So that's when Dylan was kind of texting me, asking for the pictures, calling me, I think he called me like nine times texted me. I was in a movie at the time. Corey realized Dylan must have needed something urgently. So then I called him and was like, you know, I'm not sending you these pictures. And I didn't really even remember that I did this, but that night I also sent those pictures to Mark, you know, kind of telling him what Dylan wanted to tell him. I, you know, wasn't sure what my plan was. I knew I was just really pissed off at Mark. Wasn't sure what my plan was I knew I was just really pissed off at Mark

but That was 2012 and the summertime of 2012 when they went on that trip and The pictures were brought up on that trip and then in between that trip and the time Dylan went missing You know, we had the custody hearing that Dylan was gonna go spend Thanksgiving down for that trip and You know, there was a lot of, you know, just contention and hostility that developed between Dylan asking me for the pictures and the time that he flew down to Mark's house. Corey had a theory.

Their mother mentioned earlier that she felt Mark underestimated Dylan, that he really didn't know him now that he'd entered his teenage years. Maybe everyone had underestimated Dylan. I'm sure that Dylan probably had a huge plan in place to bring and address the pictures during that trip to maybe try to stop with the holiday visitations and stuff like that. I definitely know they were something that Dylan was super just devastated by. And anytime he felt any kind of anger or resentment towards Mark, those are what Dylan wanted to. Because most of the time his resentment would stem from, you know, Mark talking badly

about my mom and I or my stepdad. You know, so Dylan would always be like, don't you say anything about them when I got this picture of you or, you know, that's kind of what his mindset was. But I know there's a lot of things, you know, that were just weighing on Dylan, you know, when he got off that plane and I think the pictures were just kind of one of his his go-to's is to just kind of, you know, place a mirror up to who Mark really is. The records they did let us see how to do with some family violence in the past. Do you think Mark is violent? I think Mark, yeah, has those tendencies. Do you anyway suspect that they got in some kind of argument or something like that?

I hope to believe with all my heart that Mark would never hurt his own son. But you say you hope to believe. I just have to believe that I didn't pick so wrong that he would hurt his own son. Christmas 2012 came and went without Dylan Redwine. Then New Year's and his 14th birthday in February. By summer of 2013, people were beginning to lose hope that any trace of the boy would ever be recovered. If you've watched Missing 411, you know how common people go missing on similar terrain. The search for Missing Colorado team Dylan Redwine has come to an end, and it's not the

end anyone was hoping for. Today Sheriff's officials confirmed that items found during a five-day search in the mountains include the bones of Dylan Redwine. He was 13 years old when he went missing back in November near Durango. This discovery was made during a five-day search of a stretch of road called Middle Mountain, just a few miles up the hill from Mark Redwine's home. The mountain is north of the Valacito Resito reservoir, and the areas that search teams scoured ranged in elevation from 8 to 11,000 feet.

On June 22, 2013 amidst the gulches, deep canyons, and thick forest, searchers recovered a Nike Jordan shoe, a youth size seven. They also recovered a scrap of fabric from a pair of underwear and other scraps of clothing. First of all, they recovered several small bones that were later identified as Dylan Redwine's remains. We found his clavicle and his shoe and a few things like that in

I want to say August of 2013 So that's when we found just a few those and then I want to say in 2015 is when the hikers found the skull in November of 2015, nearly three years after Dylan originally went missing, a couple hiking north of the Valacito reservoir stumbled upon something odd looking.

I mean, my husband, we were hiking down a slope. We decided to go out to the eight launch underneath the tree. And we saw some beautiful trees coming up. We decided to go out to the eight launch underneath the tree. And we saw some beautiful trees coming up, so they decided to go walk down an area. And went a little ways in, little streams everywhere, was very beautiful. And then my husband picked up something and he said, hey honey, what do you think this is? And I saw it and I could see it in his hands. I was right behind him, if he stepped behind him.

I didn't know exactly until I got up on the right, you know. I took it from his hands immediately. I knew it was a human hole. He disagreed with me. He says, no, it's not. I said, yeah, baby, it is. And he said, well, what do you want to do now? I said, well, we've got to go turn him in. We've got to go. The partial skull, these hikers found, later showed evidence of foul play.

The forensic anthropologist tasked with this case noted two marks on the skull likely caused by a knife or some other sharp instrument. And it was used on him around the time of death, either right before or right after. The skull also showed a nearly two-inch long fracture above the left eye socket, which according to the anthropologist, appeared to have been caused by blunt force trauma. So where the Dylan's remains were found, anthropologist appeared to have been caused by blunt force trauma.

So where the Dylan's remains were found, if you were to drive a car on the road and go that route, it's about like a 14 mile drive or something like that. But once you get up there, if you just, you know, were to fly over there, you know, like as a crow flies, my guess would be somewhere in between three miles from Mark's house. So, I mean, there's a pretty steep river and stuff like that. You know, and it's really hard to access, but if you walk out to where Dylan was found,

if you walk out about another hundred feet, you can see Mark's house from where Dylan's remains were found. Once the skull got introduced, then that's kind of when the legal team came in. And that's when we kind of started talking with lawyers, more than investigators and stuff like that. So at that point, that's kind of when it started transitioning into their attack

into arresting Mark. Drop cigarette. You guys can, you always explain to me what's going on? Yes sir. Is your name Mark? He's the same. Mark is the same. Mark, do you have any weapons on you sir?

No sir, I do not. It was now July of 2017 and police used a GPS tracker on Mark's tractor trailer to hunt him down, eventually locating him in Washington State. Okay, before we get going here, I do gotta let you know I am equipped with the body warrant camera, reports both audio and video. Okay, have you been read your Miranda rights yet? Okay, let me make sure I get those read to you so that I'm trying to answer all the questions you have, but because you're in handcuffs and the cousin in the back of a police car, I do want you to know what your rights are too.

Okay, you have the right to remain silent anything you say can be is against you in the court of law. You have the right it's time to talk to a lawyer and have him present with you while you're being questioned. You cannot afford to hire a lawyer or one will be appointed to represent you before you question if you wish and you can decide at any time to exercise these rights and not answer the questions or make any statements. You understand each of those rights and I just read to you. Okay. Yeah, having those rights in mind, the reason why you're in handcuffs right now is because we received a call from an agency in Colorado.

You know, is it Washington County or is it? What's the platy of money, maybe? Okay. What had happened is they had the information that you were potentially up here and they said they had a warrant for murder second for you. I'm sorry. I have no idea what that's about. Okay. No idea what this could possibly be about.

Is that right Mark? A grand jury had just indicted him on second degree murder and child abuse charges, and after years and years of investigation, they had a lot on Mark by the time 2017 rolled around. Many who have watched this case unfold over the past decade have questioned why it took so long to seriously consider Mark as a suspect, let alone make an arrest. This is especially frustrating, now knowing that cadaver dogs notified investigators that a body had once been in contact with Mark's truck in his home and on his clothing.

This discovery was made way back in 2012. Anytime you have a murdered 13 year old boy that is presumed to be murdered by his father, it's going to be a long daunting task to prove what happened. And I'm not sure that we'll ever really know what happened. I'm happy that something is finally progressing within Dylan's case. And we just appreciate all the work that's been done by the new folks in La Plata County that have been appointed that have actually made a lot of this come to fruition. I don't think if there weren't changes in La Plata County, we would be here today.

My frustration is not necessarily at law enforcement. I don't think if there weren't changes in Laplata County, we would be here today. My frustration is not necessarily at law enforcement. My frustration is that the person who took Dylan's life, that's where the frustration is. If it weren't for his actions, we wouldn't be here. There would be no frustration. I wouldn't have to worry about who the new DA is in Laplata or who the new sheriff is. So I put this squirrely on his shoulders. He's the one that caused this and he's the one who really should be held responsible for this. I don't consider this anybody else's

fault regardless of how long it's taken them to make a case. I appreciate the fact that they've done what they've done. And yes, it's taken a while, but I'd rather them have all the information that they need so that we can get a conviction. Though the full truth may never come out, Corey has a theory about how this tragic and horrendous crime took place. So I think he killed him on the 18th and drove up there after he killed him. I don't think he indulged in a big adventure. I think he just went up, pulled off to the side of the road, carried him maybe 10 steps away from the truck and left them there.

And through the coming months, we would just periodically go up there, see what he could find and remove it. There was so little of Dylan found, and in such odd locations that it seemed unlikely to professionals that an animal had taken his corpse and strewn it across the mountain. The more likely reality was that Mark Redwine took several trips up to the mountain over the course of months and years following Dylan's murder and slowly began to dispose of the evidence. In my mindset, I think he had more than enough time

before he left the house that morning and after he finished it up to clean up and just take care of all the details, make sure it's backpack and things like that were disposed of and then I think on the way down just in all the trash cans and dumpsters on the way down to work, maybe just dropped off a few of his personal belongings.

It's clear as soon as you see it that it's not animals moving it. You know, it's not like they're moving shoes, you know, just to... Everything was just so like, you know, spread apart in just a bizarre fashion. You know, it's not like he laid there and then animals did what they did. It was, you know, he's moving his shoes and recollecting a lot of his belongings up there. Because most of what we found was you could barely see it, you know, with how thick the trees and everything like that were.

I mean, it was really hard to see anything on the ground. So, you know, he spent a lot of time up there recollecting it all. But where we found like his clavicle was, was like six miles away from where we found his skull. You know, that's a pretty good indication. All that is certain is that Mark did pick Dylan up from the airport. It was verified by security camera footage, as was their trip to Walmart. Luminol confirmed Dylan's presence at Mark's house. It showed the investigators bloodstaining on the couch, the corner of the coffee table, and the floor.

There wasn't very much blood, but the forensic scientist who examined the scene concluded that many blood force injuries don't result in significant blood loss. Dylan's cause of death was never determined due to the scarce remains, but one thing was clear. He had blunt force injuries to his skull. The last activity on Dylan's phone was at almost 9.30 pm, which means Mark likely murdered his son before he went to sleep for the night. I'm sure he slept peacefully. After his arrest in 2017, Mark Redwine pleaded not guilty to his charges. His trial date was pushed off until finally the proceedings began in 2020. Dylan's friends and family had been waiting eight long and arduous years at this

point, and were eager to hear a verdict in what should have been an open and shut case. On November 9, 2020, a judge declared a mistrial in Mark's case due to the threat of, you guessed it, coronavirus. Mark's public defenders had to quarantine after they began experiencing symptoms. I don't quite get why the next court date wasn't just postponed. Regardless, a Miss Trial was the judge's decision.

Closing arguments for Mark's second trial wouldn't end until July of 2021, nearing the 10th anniversary of Dylan's disappearance. On July 16th, the jury finally reached a verdict. Mr. Redwood, would you please stand up? Jury verdict count number one, murder in the second degree. Weed of jury, find the defendant Mark Redwine guilty of count number one. Be quiet please. Murder in the second degree, signed by Mr. Parker. Jerry Verde count number two, child abuse.

Weed of jury, find the defendant Mark Redwineline yield you account to child abuse signed by Colin Parker. Further, we did your e-finder with respect to the birdie question as to this count as follows. Did the child abuse result in death? The answer is yes. Over the years, you know, when this first happened, I was so angry at him. I was such a, you know, an angry kid, you know, for killing my brother. And over the years, you know, especially as I've become a dad myself, but, you know, I'm so disappointed as a father, you know, his ability to cover this up and continuously, like, only care about himself, you know, through

this whole process, even up to his appeal in the courtroom, just everything is just all about Mark and his selfishness and, you know, and just ready to let that part of my life go. So I, you know, with his sentence, I'm ready for him to go or he belongs. And, you know, I can get back to remember and Dylan and, you know, enjoy my family and not really have to think about, you know, him and his situation. Mr. Redone, would you stand up please? First of all, you killed your son, a 13-year-old boy.

At 13, he's still a little boy. As a father, it's your obligation to protect your son, to keep him from harm. And instead of that, you inflicted enough injury on him to kill him in your living room. After the passion of whatever caused you to act the way you did subsided, you didn't think about Dylan. You thought about yourself, you sanitized the crime scene, you hid Dylan's body, and you went so far as to remove his head from the rest of his body. There's only one reason to do that, and that's to try and avoid if any remains you're fighting or ever found that dealing with every beef identified. You left his body to be scavenged by wild animals. Your actions not only removed and deprived, dealing the opportunity, the opportunity, growing to a man, be what he could have been. He's not able to get married, fall in love,

have kids, and potentially have grandkids. The evidence against you is overwhelming. However, in your statement to the probation department or the precinct report, you wrote the following, and this is a quote from what you wrote, innocent of all charges, miscarriage of justice, miscarriage of justice, fake conviction, sham trial. So there is no misunderstanding. I am exercising all my rights to appeal the courts' rulings and challenge the bias, jury's decision to convict with no evidence any crime was committed. I take this circumstance very seriously,

and want to make clear that I too have lost a child, I love more than mine itself. I will fight for two justice, not for myself, but for Dylan. I have always shown remorse for the things that I am guilty of. Stand at the against faith, justice and court. After ten years, Mark still refuses to take responsibility. He shows no remorse, and has made his intentions clear. He will use up more tax dollars to try to get out of prison because, clearly, this shudder is innocent. I have trouble remembering a convicted criminal defendant that has shown such a

letter-like remorse for his promote behavior. Community needs to be protected from you. You need to be removed from society for a long period of time. I'm going to send you to 48 years on both counts. With five years of parole, they are to be served concurrently. You'll receive 1,540 days of credit for time served. Deputy Robinson, you can take the defendant back to jail. It's always a sad situation when a sibling has to fill the role of a parent for the sake of other siblings. Mark Redwine couldn't even do the bare minimum, which would have meant abandoning his children and never speaking to them again.

He couldn't even get that right. That would have been more of a logical decision, more of a humane decision than what that deadbeat piece of shit Mark Redwine chose. And the Redwine family would have been better off for it. Mark's narcissism clouded all decision-making, even when it came down to the life of his own child. Maybe if he had just read a few more of those fatherhood.gov billboards, he would have made for a better parent. But then again, maybe not, because none of those billboards actually specify you shouldn't murder your kids. That does it for this episode of Sword and Scale. We hope you've enjoyed it. Thank you so much for joining us. We do appreciate you.

Consider signing up for plus and all that. Also remember we have a call in line. Plus 1-954-889-6854. A lot of y'all got a lot to say, apparently. So why not say it to our voicemail line where I can actually hear it and some other people might too? Like this calling. Hey, I just want to call in and tell you I love the show. It's great. I'm reading so many comments from people who are pretty upset about you calling 911 dispatchers, qualified, deriving, operators. So one of the nicest people could take the criticism and

self-reflect and wonder why so many people are growing number field is so about 9-1-1-1 dispatchers. I get that you guys are out there taking calls on usually the worst day of people's lives. But that doesn't give you the right to the nasty rude of dismisses to somebody because you're all the longer having a bad day. Don't go to work on that day.

If you can't handle people who are in an emotionally intense situation, scared out of their mind because tone policing these people when they are having the worst day of their life doesn't do any good and like getting them any help faster you're actually traumatizing them more. If you can't handle going to work and being compassionate and patient times, and don't show up that day. Maybe be honest with yourself and find a new profession. But getting mad at somebody because they pointed it out, maybe many times, we're setting in a way that you didn't like, kind of ironic,

a little ironic. Anyway, I do enjoy the butt hurt after most of your episodes. I go and read the comments and see how personal everybody's taking things. Now, everybody needs to calm the hell down and, you know, instead of finding all these things to take so damn personal, I don't know, I want you to find something productive to do. And, you know, grow is a person. If you are growing is a person, these things wouldn't bother you so much and so easily. Anyway, everybody have a wonderful day, stay safe, thanks for what you do, I enjoy the show, I appreciate your candor and your perspective.

Thanks.