Table Manners with Jessie and Lennie Ware - John Gregory Smith

Episode Date: December 10, 2025

We have chef & Instagram sensation John Gregory-Smith on the podcast this week! John brought round the most delicious monkfish curry and beef coconut rice from his brand new traybake cookbook, and mum made a gorgeous pear and chocolate tart for pud. We laughed non-stop with John - he told us about training to cook with Gordon Ramsey, his absolute love of Christmas, how to make the perfect festive gravy, eating his way round the Middle East, the ultimate kitchen gadgets, when Delia Smith introduced him to pesto, and why East 17 play a very important part in his family’s Christmas traditions! Thank you for the most delicious lunch John, that recipe is absolutely going straight on the regular meal list! John’s brand new cook book ‘The Greatest Traybake Cookbook ever’ is released on the 29th January, and available to pre-order now! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello and welcome to Table Manners. I'm Jessie Ware and I'm sitting opposite Mum who has managed to find something that's very kind of on the theme with Wicked being out, you've got green and pink and then you've added the Lenny Flair with a little dash of leopard. And your shoes. And your shoes. Oh my God, the leopard print shoes. Where did you get them from? Clarks.

Oh, Fabi. Are they comfortable? So comfortable. Oh, I'm thrilled for you. Also, should we talk about the fact that we were at Euston Station on Friday afternoon and our train to North Wales had been cancelled? Yeah. And Lenny was in the most... I was in me, vintage leopard.

Yeah. And so when you were complaining about the trains being cancelled, we also had fans coming up to you. They were coming up to say... Revealing their leopard print in honour of you. Yeah. Yeah. Total leopard. Total leopard. Ah.

How are you? Well, I've got a sty. Oh, working too hard. Yeah. But besides that, I'm fine. Why do you think you've got stye? I think I'm run down, Jessie. Oh, snap.

A lot of work going on. So we have been a bit lucky today. Well, you have? Well, yeah, actually, I have. I've done my bit. Yeah, thank you. Okay, I have been very lucky. And we have a chef coming over.

We have the king of the tray bake, John Gregory Smith coming over. And he's offered up, actually, let's be honest, we asked him to. The greatest tray bake cookbook ever. So he's making something at Lenny's request. Yep. So what is he making today? Well, he's doing a monkfish carol and curry, I think.

Lovely. I'm desperate to see how you make it because I've not good at making curries. I'm not a confident curry maker. Well, I think... He's good with spice. Well, we'll be chatting to him about this, but I think he's kind of prepped the sauce. Oh. Yeah, he's not going to make it here, Mom.

Oh, I thought he might show me how to do it. That's not a show and tell. Okay. But he's going to do the fish here. Great. So we're very excited to have him. Great. And then you've made pudding.

Yes. What have you made? I've made a chocolate pear, hazelnut and cardam and tart. Oh, nice. Whose recipe is that? From The Guardian, Helen Goh, G-O-H. It looks quite nice. Amazing.

Yeah. John Gregory Smith. coming up on Tableman's. John Gregory Smith, thank you for being here. Oh my God, thank you for having me. I'm very, very excited to be here. I think, as I just explained to you, I'm in like three different universes

of mixing a record and doing album artwork, and then you've just bought beautiful, gorgeous energy and gifts. So first we're going to pop the champagne. Yeah, let's do it. Thank you. It's a nice way to break the ice, isn't it? Have a little glass of fizz. And also tell us what else you brought.

Oh, okay. So I bought some tray bake recipes from my book, Delish. Yeah. I bought a cheese advent calendar. Who told you about this? Is it from a food PR? No, I just saw it and thought that it should be in all of our lives. And the dreams do come true.

So that's why I bought it. It's delicious. A little tiny little cube of cheese. Well, I haven't opened it yet. So I'm hoping that's what it is. Should we? Is it bad luck that we should open it? open it. Why not? Because you're not supposed to. Because I want to know, yeah, nothing to happen.

Oh, the Christmas won't come. Okay. Well, it. You won't come. Okay. But I think maybe we should just see what December the first is. I think we should. I think we'll do that. Are you worried? No. No. Okay. Have you been a good girl, ma'am. Good things. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. This should be to your new cookbook. The greatest trade bank cookbook ever. Does what it says on the tin. So everything in there is a tray bake.

Yes. So basically, I've sort of morphed my cooking style. That is really delicious. So nice and it was on offer as well. Well, well, that's, I love that for you. Love a bargain. No, absolutely. My cooking style has changed so much because I sort of cut my cloth really as a food writer

because I didn't want to become a chef. Why didn't you want to become a chef? So it's quite a weird but cool story. My sister, who I just adore, so cool. I'm very close to my family, very close. She was out on the Razz in a bar in like the early noughties and she met a little known chef called Gordon Ramsey and I don't know what happened but she basically said give my brother a job and he went yeah all right

here's a fax number right this is how long ago it was give him this fax number and I was like Rosie it won't be a real number like this is just fake so I faxed it and off it went what do you write to Gordon Ramsey? I wrote sort of hi you met my sister in a bar which sounds weird and she said you'd give me a job i mean the whole thing sounds really bizarre right a fax comes back going yeah that's fine he warned us about this call the call this number and we'll set you up with a stash it was royal hospital road wow i went for two weeks and worked in the kitchen at royal hospital road and my main job was he there he was there a little bit but it was um i can't remember when it was you know when you

reach a certain age, just everything kind of morphs into one. He, something horrific could happen to one of his chefs and he was very like on another planet, so he wasn't really there much. And he did breeze in and out. And I was either like picking crab. So you have to put, you have a huge box of crab. Yeah. And you put a small spoon here and you go like this to pick out shells. Or you get the smallest brush known to man and brush, um, mushrooms, like the dirt off the mushrooms. And I'm very, very, very impatient, have like no attention span and talk too much. So it, it was just a strange place for me to be. So for you, it was like being an asylum retreat. It was very weird. It was like

very, was it was like very, was it was testing. It was just, it was both fascinating and boring all at once, if that makes sense. Because he shout at you. No, he was, he was so nice. And actually, I met him a few years later and at a restaurant launch of his in New York, and he just beeline to my table. He, I probably met him twice about five. minute and he was like you might need some help picking mushrooms and I was like how the hell do you remember that? It's quite presidential. It was so cool. Do you feel like he'd been informed by somebody that you were there? I don't think so because I was literally like that's quite amazing what he did say to me because I was like how the hell do you remember that? He said I never forget

face but I've got no idea your name and I was like that's you know good skills but it was it was a very strange experience because I was like I'd always wanted to get into food my whole life and I didn't know that such a thing as culinary school even existed and then I had this opportunity and it was like I probably didn't even understand at the time how amazing that opportunity was and then I was a bit deflating so I don't really know what to do with it we did go back actually as um it was quite hard to get a booking there and we went as a family after I had worked there and I sort of said oh look can we have you know my family quite a big family there'll be like eight of us and I don't know what you've ever been but it's quite a small room and it's little tables and there's one

of table in the middle and they gave us this table and we all turned up and it was you know back in the day hammered we'd been at some like we'd been for pre-drinks with my mum dad and we've got quite family that family sounds quite fine they're really really good fun and we were sort of very rowdy and we got in there and we sort of had they were so sweet with me and they were like we're going to do the set menu it's going to be amazing and it was just one it was we had one of the best night ever I think for the rest of the clientele there they were like less enthused by us Because we, you know, we drank, we only drank the house wine, but we sort of drank all of it.

At one point, this gorgeous French man who was like one of the matriads came out and was explaining what we were eating. My sister was like, I just thought, I'm saying, why are you serving chocolate moose? I don't get it. He was like, it's a pork tureen. And we were just, and then eventually they, I, at one point, my mum was making friends for someone in the Luz at one point. I was in the kitchen, like wielding a knife trying to, like,

oh, help you all prep. And then they just came up to table. and went, you'll be thrilled to know. We've ordered you a car. You can go anywhere you like. So that was, you know, that was that. But it was a funny experience, but it made me kind of then figure out what, what on earth do I want to do in food? Like, it was, not have a restaurant. Not definitely not have a restaurant. Did you ever get a reservation there again? No. We did, we did drunk book one when we were there though. And we cancelled it pretty quickly. I'm obsessed with your family. I suspect they were thrilled when we canceled it as well.

But it made me, it was weird because it was like before. internet was really a thing it was before social media so I was like I just don't know what to do so I actually set up a food brand so I it was back in the day when you like yahooed something or asked Jeeves do you remember that yeah yeah like so long ago it's so retro and I was like how do you set up a food brand like one thing came up because there was no information on the internet there's no AI then there was nothing and um so I launched a food brand into sainsbury's and it was all about for me, I didn't like classic cooking because it was like French, Italian and English and I like to eat it, but I don't want to cook it. So I was like, how do you kind of do more exciting

cuisines? And that sort of started a very long food journey of doing lots of very random jobs within that industry to sort of where I am now, which is like, it's sat in your kitchen a million miles away from that. What would you call yourself, like your job now? It's so weird my job. So how would I do? So it's really weird. So I kind of define it by it depends who I'm talking to. Okay. So if like I was at my parents house for dinner on Tuesday with a lot of their mates, my mum is 79, my dad's 80 and their friends are really cool. I just say I'm a chef. Okay. And I said, don't work in a restaurant by I'm a chef. And then they kind of get you work within food. Okay. If I say content creator, they'll just go. Got it. But I think that is my job.

Okay. I think it is. I mean, I do it every day. So, and I get paid for it. That makes it a job, doesn't it? Yeah, I think by definition. But you create your own recipes. Yes, that is true. And very good recipes you were probably about to say. Fabulous recipes. And your content is so good because it's from what I, from following you on Instagram,

like you make very delicious things that are enticing but also really doable. Yes. So I think when I consume food content myself, I either want to watch like very weird and wonderful. did you know you can watch village life on YouTube so you can watch like so people in villages all around the world will sort of film their daily lives and a lot of everyone's a bit confused

but a lot of it is like cooking based so I for example I love travelling and there's certain places that I can't get to like Iran being one of them so I got really fascinated by watching Iranian village people cooking and oh so you watch looking like I love it I love sort of like weird niche obscure stuff

but I'm not going to make that in the week. So for me, like, when I make content, I want to do stuff that is like, on a Wednesday night, you can throw it together for the family, for a load of mates, and just be like, do you know what, this is wicked and delicious, and I've made it. And that, to me, is a great recipe. Is there anyone that you modelled yourself on? Or do you feel like it's just been quite...

I mean, who did I love when I was younger? I think, because I've been sort of doing so many different things for so long, you know, you sort of roll with the punches and morph with it. Like, when I got into food, I loved Jamie Oliver when he came out with floppy hair down the spiral staircase. So everything was simple. Well, he taught us you could chuck it in. Yeah.

Unlike Delia, who weighed a glug was wild, wasn't it? But then actually, Delia was fascinating. So I remember watching a Delia show with my mum, where she's stand like that. And we went to M&S in Richmond to buy this paste that she told us all to buy that was apparently huge in Italy called Pesto. And we were just like, this is wild And we took this tub home And we literally like, step, like what do you do?

And I was like, she stirs it into pasta And you know, back there, even my mum was like We've got like, I don't know what pasta we've got And it was just nuts, but I used to love her And then, do you remember Ken Hon when he had a moustache? Yes, loved that. But didn't you adore Nigella? She was just like, she purrs like a kitten and I love her.

She is famous all over the world. All my friends in Greece sit and watch Nigella's Christmas special. But she's just, Because she's just so gorgeous. She's sort of aspirational, but at the same time, she doesn't feel otherworldly. You know, she'll sort of do something utterly fabulous, but whilst with a bit of cream on the side of her face or something and just be wicked. And also, she always has a fabulous kitchen.

Fabulous. Yes. I'm really into fairy lights and that woman is into fairy lights. Oh, she loves fairy lights. So how, what does your kitchen look like? Have you got an island? So I'm in a rental and I don't know how much I can actually say about this because Because I've completely changed my kitchen because I felt I'll just jizz it up within the confines of what I can do.

So, yeah, I've given it a nice jush up. But it's a very nice kitchen. It's like bright and breezy. We put in lovely, because of filming like light cabinets, light marble. Is that where you do all you're filming? Yeah. Let's take it back to your family. Okay.

Your very fun loving family. They are fun. Tell us who was around the dinner table and what was a very kind of. of memorable dish from your childhood? So where I grew up in Richmond, I had our family and then my two aunties with, so all my cousins, we all grew up within a few minutes walk of each other and we're still really, really close now, which is so nice. So there's not, no, six grandparents, my mum, dad are two, nine cousins of which I'm one. And there's like 21 grandchildren. So there's a lot of us. And we've always just hung out together. So like when we were little, you know, if it was a

birthday on like a Tuesday night or whatever everyone would come for like a glass of wine and a colin the caterpillar we were always sort of all together and it's always been about food sunday roasts were massive curry curry night was a big thing christ i mean christmas dinner i think is one of my favorite events of the year with my family i just i literally love it who's cooking this year darling so i do majority of it yeah have you got a double oven so my mom so we cook at my mum and dad, they've got double oven, but much to my father's disdain, he hates this, I cook the turkey the day before and I, because it's for 32 people. Wow. Yeah, it's a lot. And the main thing when you cook 302 people is carving takes hours. And if I'm wearing a lovely

smart shirt or some fun cardi, I don't want it covered in turkey juice. And that's like 40 minutes of cutting it. So I cut it and then set it in like a very thin turkey juice. so it stays very moist yeah there's what you said it not me it's very moist and then you just bang it in the oven reheat it for 20 minutes and we always have late dinner so we we have dinner like at nine at nine o'clock at nine he've always done so do you know why we started doing it oh my god it started when we were young because we had you went out for a big walk no we went out for really big Christmas Eve we really like to celebrate Jesus and it went until very late at night Oh, so you went to church?

No, to the pub. Okay. Oh, yes, we were at church. Midnight mass, yeah, yeah. They were just in the pub. And then, um, and then, everyone was hung over. Everyone was deeply hung over and just like vile. And then you had a big brunch.

And my mum used to get really cross because she'd be like, I've put so much effort in today and you're just all moping around with like rugs on, awful. And then when everyone started having kids, they were like, actually, if we can do dinner, we can put the babies to bed and they won't bother us. Okay. So that's what, and we've just always done that. What about the, what about the 21 grandchildren? So now they're all there and they're all grown up and they're all like, they,

so it used to be we'd have like the adult table and the kids table. Yeah. And, you know, it literally was sweet. But nine is quite late though, even for posh people. That's so European of you. Oh, it's very European, darling. No, European. See, the night before.

Okay, it's very Greek of you. Well, I mean, it's funny because we're a very like just where, I mean, my surname is about as British as you can get, you know what I mean? It's too standard words. But, no, we're more like a Mediterranean family when we're all together. Everyone's just very loud, very yelly and loves the food. Right, a clock is quite late.

You'd love it later. Will you have pudding later as well? So we'd normally do. It's a bit like a buffet situation, if I mean, because there's so many people. You sort of lay everything out. Everyone gets a plate. We've all sort of done the table.

You know where you're sitting. You know where you stand. You know what's going on. And then pudding, again. So I will clear everything up. And then I'll put out cheese pudding. And then an alternative because I don't like Christmas pudding, all mince pies, which is slightly weird.

Do you just not like currents? I find cooked fruit, bizarre. Oh my God, you haven't made cooked fruits that? I have. Oh my God, fuck, you have. No. It'll be delicious. I bet you'll win me over.

No, it's a tort, though. It's fine. You can take the pear out. Is it a ginormous mince pie? No, it's a pear. It'll be delicious. Best thing ever. You can take...

Oh, don't know worried. I'll love it. I'll literally love it. Well, you can just take the pear out. Yeah, you can. It's a pear and chocolate. No, it's a teard chocolate and hazelnut tort. So chocolate is one of my favorite things ever.

Oh, well, you're really crying like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love everything. No, I love chocolate. So, yeah. So there'll be something else and then lots and lots of cheese, like a lot of cheese, I think. I'm interested. Your partner is.

He's Croatian. Croatian. So how, does he enter into this or is he very much like you're all nuts? He's gone back to Croatia, I think. Well, no. He wanted his dinner at. It's an early dinner. He loves it.

He's sort of funny. He's from a Mediterranean family, but their family's very little. And he just loves the big, loud vibes. What are you doing about Christmas presents this year? So I, okay, so I love Christmas, but I'm a massive screwed with presents. I just don't really bother because there's so many people. Yeah, you can't do it. And what am I going to buy, like, 30 kids, like their parents won't get them anyway.

I can give them hugs, that's fun. I'll get something for my mum and dad because they're a men. amazing and they're worth spoiling, but everyone, there's just too many. Yeah, I hear you. And I give the gift of Christmas dinner, which I think, you know what, done, I'm out. Do you do your stuffing separately then? We would probably just buy stuffing. Interesting.

Very nor effort of you. A bit of shortcuts, you know, stuffing, the little sausage rolls with the bacon, just pre-buy. Do you do, like, Jamie Oliver, and do like a get-ahead gravy? I do do a get-head gravy, yeah. Is yours very different to Jamie? It's your sick or thin, I've been watching. Instagram is very thick. My dad would disapprove of the thin gravy.

Yeah. There's a northern man somewhere in my father. He likes a very thick, rich gravy. And he's so sweet. We're about the same size, you know, quite little. And he'll get his plate and load it up with all his stuff. And then he'll put his gravy on. And he has to do sort of an almost like sort of, you know,

finishing school etiquette to keep it absolutely balanced perfectly straight. There's so much gravy on. You know, one little wobble, a little tidal wave gravy. but we do it ahead and my mum taught me to you brown the flour this is your content this week on Instagram

you brown the flower for like 20 minutes yeah so you have to because otherwise it will just burn and it will taste of like death but if you just do it like very gently and you don't have to be over it like a risotto the whole time you just every now and then give it a quick shake and it gives you a sort of

smoking is the wrong way like a nuttiness but then it gives you the colour so you get that beautiful dark colour Do you remember browning? Yeah. Like in the bottle, yeah. Jesse's too young. Oh, damn, damn it.

44. You're kidding. I'm only three years younger than you. How the hell do you not remember browning? I don't know. Because I didn't use gravy brony. You obviously had a great gravy maker. No, you used to put a few bistos.

I always put marm-I did you? Only in lamb gravy. Okay. But I would use granules or... But do you put in your Christmas gravy? Yes. I like red currant. jelly in my gravy and some wine. Wild. It's a bit, that's a bit sweet meat free. Kind of. Yeah. Oh,

you don't like sweet with meat. No, weird. Do you not have cranberry sauce with your turkey? Personally, I don't know. So would you not have mango chutney with what you've made us today? No. Okay. Tumbleweed. Do you want to tell everyone what you've made for us today? Okay, so I've made two delicious recipes from the cookbook. One is a... Two? Yeah, well, I'll tell you why. So one is a monkfish curry. Yum. It's just so nice. You just, you just, you just, Make a sauce, heat the sauce in the oven, bang in the fish. Darn, it's so delicious. Bang in the fish.

Wow. And then the second recipe, because I felt like you need something delicious to go with it. Rice, but I've made coconut beef rice. And it's so young. Yeah. It's really, really nice. So what is it? Like beef stock?

So, no, you fry the mince, but you fry it in the oven with onion. Flied the mints in the oven. If you were to choose any cuisine. Ever. Ever. Yeah. So we're coming to your last supper. Okay.

If you were to teach you, which one do you love? love and it shall go to and you couldn't not have it. Can I lump a sort of territory? I would say Middle Eastern. I just love everything about Middle Eastern food. You've done lots of cookbooks Yeah. I think because I find it all that area, that region is so different from us. The food is old and it's got lovely stories and lovely flavours. And they use really evocative things like rose petals and pomegranate molasses and pomegranate all these lovely fresh mint and stuff. and when I was sort of learning about food that's why I never wanted to train to be a chef

because I was like why would I want to learn how to make like some French sauce when you could be eating that that is the best for me and I feel very very strongly about hummus I love how do you make your hummus I actually was going to make some and then didn't have the right chickpeas

so I just used really good organic chickpeas from a can or bowl bean whatever you want and you have to have very very good tahini tahini and there's a really good brand called Al Nical and it's the best. I've got three tahit in here. In the like brown jar, green lid, but there's actually two of them.

There's two different brands. Both of them are really good. And it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's not Belazoo or I've got. That's really good. It's good. The Belazoo one's lovely. But they should be pourable and try and avoid anything in a jar. Do you put garlic in your hummus?

So you want chickpeas, lemon juice, chickpea water. No, it doesn't do anything. I thought it did. I think that's a lie. No, because if you think about it, if you've got, like, a blender that's not strong enough to blend a chickpea, how the hell is it going to blend an ice cube? It'll just stay in there until it doesn't.

So you're basically just adding water? It is complete limer. I don't know why you ever thought of an ice cube. I got obsessed with that and was like, oh my God, this is the future. My hummus is going to be smoother than anything. It doesn't make any difference. Just get a really good blender. And if your blender's not amazing, just drain your chickpeas, boil them.

Bold beans you don't need, because they're so soft. Boil them until they're squidgy, but keep that chickpea water from the tin. Oh, I never boil a chickpea. Right, should we put the food on? I say we, I'm doing nothing, I'm watching you, and you're sexy Tupperware. Okay, let's get that Tupperware. It's very good, yeah. You can take your drink over if you want, babe.

I feel like I'm kind of at the pre-drinks of Christmas dinner with John. So you've got prawns going in there that you've different. So these, like, a really nice, massive, more like, you know, American-style pawns. Some monkfish. Monkfish, gorgeous. I love monkfish. Do you use upper scale, John? A scale?

Upper scale. It's a fish delivery service. No. So this is from a little, so where I live, I live between Chiswick and Acton, right? There's a fish shop in Chiswick. It's called the Avenue. Yeah, I know the avenue. Come any time we're opposite the plumbed-up bakery.

And there's a little fish shop in Chiswick and you go and you buy one prawn for £700 because it's Chiswick or you can go to Acton and buy, you know, lovely monkfish for just like normal prices and they... And funnily enough, they serve all the restaurants around there. Oh, interesting. So you've just put that in and then how long will the monkfish need and the prawn? I'd say like three or four minutes.

So this is a really easy kind of... Tray bait. Trey bait. So this would usually be... In the oven. So if you were tray baking this, you basically bang... Oh God, I can't quite remember. Okay, so you start with your onion.

Yeah. Onion goes in the oven for like 10 minutes, get a bit of colour on it. I think it's just onion. Then you add the sauce, which you just whisk in a jug. Pull that in, a couple of minutes heat up. Add the fish, a couple of minutes cooked through. So it's slightly layered. Yeah.

But if you did it all at once, it just wouldn't work. It would be a bit gross. So what are you doing now? You're going to make, like, is it called a tut-t-t-tut-t-tuk-a-tuk-a-tuk-a. So you know like dal, tuk-a-d-a-tuk-a. Yeah, so the tudka, turka is, so you make your dahl and then you heat oil flavour it and you pour that over at the end. That is a tucker. So because it's a tray bake, you can't do the spices in the oil so you do at the end.

Oh wow, what's going on? So just the curry leaves, they get a bit crackly. Are those curry leaves? Yeah. Fantastic. Get that in. Do you like, how spicy do you like food and life? I don't mind spice, mum's a bit of a less.

Yeah, and a bit of a worse. This looks delicious. There you go, bit of that, bit of that. So that's mincemeat and rice and any spices. So there's coconut milk, stock, soy sauce, fish sauce and oyster sauce. So, John, this looks absolutely exquisite. Take us through each dish on the table.

This is a South Indian-inspired curry based on a dish called Mean Moli, which literally just means fish in sauce you'd find in Kerala. And it's just a very simple monkfish, prawn curry with kairi leaves, mustard seeds, coconut, ginger garlic. delicious. This is a literally an oven-baked beef, coconut rice. You sort of slap the rice, beef and onions with like lots of soy, ginger

garlic, all in the oven with coconut milk and cook it. And there's a trick where you cook it on high for like 20 minutes so the rice will absorb all the liquid and then oven off and just leave it. It's in the cookbook. Yeah, and then you get this fluffy yummy rice. So is it cooked

with any water and stop? So there's stock in there Okay, fine. And then that's just what I had in the fridge salad. I love that. I mean, it looks perfect. Thank you. Pleasure. Right.

Curry. This may have to be our New Year's resolution that basically everyone cooks for us because this is heaven. It makes life way easier for you to. Has your partner got some of this back at home? No. Okay. No, fair enough. Absolutely not.

He did. He's very funny. He's like a cat. He can smell fish. So he came last time and went, oh, you can fish for me. It's like, sorry, love. No, there's no fish for you. Mom, I'm going to do it.

Oh, he's going to do it. Should I do you then? Yeah, go on. That sounds weird. You can do me, yeah. Okay. Whatever. Yeah, we're in.

Yeah, we're in. Okay, thank you. I'm going in. Mm. Mmm. Oh, God. So nice. And I would never think to do, like, minced beef with monkfish.

It's a slightly weird combo. It works. I thought just coconut rice with coconut So nice Have you been to like Malaysia and stuff? Yeah And they'll serve that coconut rice With all the coconut curries

And in your head you think Oh is that going to be too much But no it's not more is more Delicious This is amazing Honestly it's so wonderful And you promise me this is actually easy And you could serve this up for a dinner party

You could make I can look you in the eye And tell you no word of a lie you to Monday night you could make this after work like that, either of them. They're that, honestly, they're so easy. Darling, I think you should have a restaurant.

Oh, I'd be awful. No, you wouldn't. I'd spend the whole time gallivanting around the front sort of trying to talk to people. Like, inherently, I love people. You could be like Russell Norman from Brucho, wasn't it, Russell Norman?

Polpo. Polko. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was, Russell was like the best front man. He was very tall, I remember, wasn't he? He was fab and, like, would come over and it was the anniversary of Prince's death or his birthday and he's just like cranked up purple rain and like oh he was amazing

i feel like you'd give that energy this is so delicious i can't get over the rice it's so nice rice isn't it i think i'd just be too over familiar with people and actually in a restaurant experience especially if like imagine if you were like trying to sort of seduce someone on a date and then i just come over like oh my god tell me everything about you it just wouldn't work at all also it's bloody full on running restaurant it is really full on Do you want to shout out any local restaurants that you love in your area? So my favourite is a little dumpling place called Mr. Dumpling, just off Shepherd's Bush Roundabout.

And it looks like it should be in Chinatown. So they've got sort of ducks and people in the window. And it's the best northern Chinese dumplings that I've ever had in the UK. Really? They're so good. So you get like pork and chive or prawn pork and egg. And they are so juicy and delicious. and the pastry gives you that lovely bite

and then they do this sort of garlicky dipping sauce that is, I mean, you literally stink the next day but it's just so worth it. It's so yummy. And it's really nice going to eat there, but they deliver and they've got this handy delivery system where when they send you the dumplings, you get a neat box and each dumpling comes in its own handy slot.

So that it doesn't slosh around on the bike. So good. Oh, man. That sounds amazing. Just it just. Come. House next door. Up for sale, come.

Okay, so, last supper. Mm-hmm. Starter, Maine, dessert, drink of choice. Okay. So, I think starter would be those dumplings because I've always loved a dumpling. My brother used to live in Hong Kong. And one of the highlights was I used to go over there and I spent, I used to do the Thursday night, get their Friday, go out Friday night, eat dumplings all day Saturday and they leave on Sunday. It was so fun.

Because he lived there, you just pop over. You went for a weekend. Pop over to Hong Kong? Yeah, you used to literally go all the time for the weekend. But this was like years ago when flights are now are so expensive. Back then, they were sort of, you know, to a penny, just grab a flight, off you went. And we're quite greedy, so we, you know, my brother's, funnily enough, much taller than me. But we, dumplings I've always loved.

So I think that would be my starter with all, I love all the sort of soy and chili and all the bits. And it gets all a bit sloshy and messy, and I love all of that. Maine. What would my main be? Are we going to go Middle East here? Am I allowed a snack before the name? Yeah, I love that. So my snack would be

if you were, if you happened to find yourself, you may find yourself, in Armenia town, in Beirut. There is a restaurant called Macduce and it's like a tiny little hole in the wall kebab shop. They have the best chicken shwama ever and they do like this amazing, it's not the shave shwama,

it's like a chopped shwama. A tray bait swammer. Exactly. They wish, Lenny. And they basically have crispy, deep fried chips that they toss all together in the meat juices of the Schwama. Oh my God. And then put like garlic sauce. It's called Tuum, the sauce. It's so nice. It looks like a cloud in a giant. It's so nice. And then wrap it in this beautiful bread with salad. And it's just amazing. And actually, I remember taking my parents there years ago. And my mum was like awfully like, was that another weekend just popped to her. No, we were there for quite a while, actually.

Were you doing work there? Were you living there? So I was there for three months to write a book, which is like the greatest job ever. You know, I'm quite stubborn. And I decided when I got there that I was like, I don't need a translator. I don't need to pay. Because Lebanon's not on any tariff that we have. So I don't need to pay for my phone. I'm just going to use old fashioned maps.

And I'm going to, that's made done. So the fucking map I had was from like 1950. and had nothing on it. So I got completely lost. At one point, my actual car got wedged in a road in Tripoli and I had to get all these people outside a cafe to help me push it

because I'd gone down, you know, down like a little wrong lane. I love... That was one of the funnest things I've ever done. It was totally bonkers, but I was there with my mum, took into a kebab shop, my mum was awfully sniffy about it,

but then once we saw it, she was eating it, she was like, this is so good. So that would be my little snack. My main would be, I think Christmas dinner. I think it would be the full, am I allowed the full shabang with everyone? So I can get, I can ship them all in. So if I, it's this my death row dinner.

Am I dying the next day? Well, no. Not dying. What do you think? You're going to a desert island for six months at least. Jesus, and no talking. Maybe 60 years. 60 years.

I don't know. Well, like, do you want to die or do you want to go? Fucked. Sheets are we hanging to the floor. Okay. Let's go with that rather than death. So they're not going to seem of quite long time. I would want our Christmas dinner.

With all your family. All the family. And there's a very funny point with our Christmas dinner. Once all the, I think I said, once I lay out all the desserts and the cheese, my mum, you'll hear the chords of, Dung, when the thunder calls you. Do you know, mountain high? She loves eating.

E-17. It's so weird. I need to go to your parents. And my mum will literally be like, everyone up. And we have to all start dancing. All the grandkids are like slightly confused. To E-17. To E-17, Thunder when the Thunder calls you.

Yeah. And she loves a bit of that. Time to spread your wings. But wasn't it a Christmas hit? And they were all dressed. She went for like the B-side. So she loves that song. And then it all just descends into like a disco,

which is great fun. So that would be my main. Oh my name. Oh my God. Oh, this is amazing. You've got to come. Jesse, maybe we should have disco this year. Well, we could fit in 9 o'clock because we're at about three,

so we'll maybe see you there for the E-17 moment. Yeah, love it. Maybe I'll start getting my daughter to do a traditional song. A traditional boy band, 90s song. Get us and learn something on the piano. Yes, stain. No, that's exactly the same song, isn't it? Want you back for good, surely.

Want you back for good? That would be good. That would be really good. Then they've got that drawn out, whatever I said. Maybe you should add that I've got the worst pitch ever. Maybe you should add that to your mum's playlist. That is on her playlist.

Oh, it's... Can she play the piano? No, she just catawalls and has the best time ever. Oh my gosh, she sounds fantastic. She's great, fantastic. This high and so cool. What's her name? Sal. Sally.

She's very cool. I love my mom. So we've got Christmas dinner with your amazing family. With all the trimmings. Yeah. How many different stuffings do you have? Always have a really basic pork stuffing. Okay.

Which is essentially just a giant sausage, isn't it? Yeah. Delicious. And you cut it into cubes. And then someone will bring nice balls. What, like the Paxo? Yeah. Like a sage and onion stuffing.

Yeah. I just don't see the point when you could be having extra pork on your plate. Okay. Do you know what I mean? I like a... We do two really nice ones. Can they be too fine for it? And do you kind of apricot and walnut or...

And do you handmaid them? But he wouldn't eat it because it's cooked for it. So that I would try. That's one thing that is super easy to make. So that. That I would be all over. I think because we cook for so many people, we'll pick our battles. So you want really good turkey, really good gravy, really good roast potatoes.

And then... Red cabbage? Peas are peas, aren't they? No. We're quite basic with veg. I'll do like a quick tray of roasted things. And then that, and then it's just all the gubbins, you know? Do you like bread sauce?

Love it. Do you? I find it the weirdest thing ever. It's so strange. Her brother will have it on a sandwich. Really? Bread sauce on. on a sandwich, which is weird, bread on bread.

I find that's the strangest thing to read. You do this thing when you finish cooking something on Instagram and you go like this and you go, just do it. Like an orgasm face. Yeah, you do that face. Just do the face. Go on. You do it every time.

Let's get into character. Go, you've got to watch him. He goes like this. Okay. He always does it. And I love it. I think what I'm more. normally do if i'm not aware of that i do a slightly weird jig when i'm really happy or like a sort of

or like or i'll sort of involuntarily clap this is so delicious are you a sweet person so i'm obsessed for chocolate and i'm not just saying that suck up i love chocolate yeah it could be anything from like literally like a dairy milk or if i'm feeling really fancy i love like a bar of green and blacks with salt the salt is oh yeah yeah right we have dessert It looks beautiful. You said you were going to be a big boy and try the pair. But would you add in, I think, to your chocolate dessert? So what would be the dream dessert?

My favourite, because I wouldn't make them, is a chocolate fondon. Oh, I could have done that. Would you really? Like a melt in the middle. Yeah. Do you never make them? I just think it's really fussy. That's what I want to eat in a restaurant.

I can't be bothered. Why don't you find a way to make it not fussy? Do you want some? Could have been in the greatest trade bag. Deliverance. Yeah, fair enough. Just do you want? Little sliver, please.

Yeah, that's perfect. No, I'm not... D desserts, I kind of like chocolate brownies, something easy, but if I'm out, a chocolate fondon, I just, I think, I find it so thrilling when you cut into them and they just go, blob.

Do you make that many sweet things? You don't really on your... It's more savoury your channel. Yeah, I love savoury. But sweet is like, yeah, chocolate brownies, I pride myself on making it very good brownie. See, I'm just like,

I find the whole fuss around chocolate brownies. But if I made them for you You would do that face that I just did. What the? That's a slightly odd face, yeah. I just, I don't really get the fuss. So I think unlike a cake, a brownie has to be sort of almost beyond moist

into a world of like ooze almost. Yeah, gooey. Ooz is too much, isn't it? This is really good. Really gooey. I'm going to just go for it. Well done. Can you taste carbon, cardammon?

No. Weirdly, I just feel wide. Have I been so strange about them for so long? It tastes quite nice. I just went full on, ate the pair. Well done. Mmm, delicious. And it's almost like...

Now, try it with the chocolate. It's almost a bit fragrant, isn't it? A pear. Yes. It's quite delicate, isn't it? Yes, it is. They're also quite al dente, so it's not mushy. I really like that.

Delicious. This is lovely. Whose recipe is? I'd pay for that in a restaurant. Yum. It's Guardian Feast. Is it? Oh, yes.

Who's the... Helen Go. Helen Go. Yeah, she's amazing. What is on your Christmas list? What do you want? From Santa. World Peace, obviously.

Well, okay, so I think I mentioned earlier. I don't buy presents for people. So therefore, I don't think you can expect much back. Do you know what I mean? And does that happen? So I will still get a lovely stocking from Father Christmas. And there's always a sort of satsuit more or some deodorant going. And that could be it, but I'm happy with that, you know.

And it's funny because I'm not, I love a present. Who doesn't? But I just, yeah, it just doesn't bother me. I think, you know, again, it sounds so cheesy. We're all together and we're having a nice time and everyone's on good form. That's enough for me. What would be your gift if you were going to give one culinary, like, equipment, piece of gear, like food gear, cooking gear, what would you gift somebody? And I have all the money in the land.

Okay. Let's go for all the money in the land and then let's go for stocking filler. Okay. So if I had all the money in the land and I was buying, say, for you. you two, I'd give you the KitchenAid Artisan Blender because it's like a kitchen grade, like a restaurant kitchen grade blender so you can do soups, smoothies, everything, but you can put your chickpeas in and that's where you don't need ice. They will come out smoother than smooth, delicious.

We just need the most amount of money in the world to get. It's expensive, I think about 600 quid. Wow. It's really expensive piece of kit. Yeah. But when you sort of see it, it's like almost like heroic lending. But does it need to be on your table top, your work surface? You can't hide it away.

You could put it away, but it's heavy. Yeah, that's the problem. But it's amazing. Okay, so that's the big, big. Would you have a ninja cremeer? What's a ninja cream maker that's a thousand pounds? I would. Even on Black Friday.

If I was getting it, I would. Because do you know what I thought when I saw them? Imagine if you made frozen margaritas in them. That would be a, imagine having a really fun party, perhaps some of your disco music on. And a frozen margarita stand, that would be so funny. You could, like, trick the top of your glass out like that. Are you a good party kind of poster?

I love partying. Do you? The only things I've ever liked are music and cooking. That's it. Oh, fab. From a very young age when my parents used to take me out anyway. You know, like, do you remember that when you were younger? You'd go with mum to, like, a dinner party and you would just be put in a room,

and they'd be having, like, an amazing time. Did you used to do that? No. My parents would have. You had dinner parties all the time, though. And I would always want to come down. And you sit on the stairs when they were at home and stare and every now and then run down.

If we were at someone else's house, all I'd ever do is get all the sauce pans out and play with sauce pans or music. That was it. They're my two favourite things in the whole world. God, that sounds annoying, John. I think it really was. I think it really was.

Oh my God, John. I wouldn't have invited your parents over again. Fucking child. You love music and you love cooking. What do you listen to when you're cooking? So I've just started listening to a guy called Somba. Are you listening to him? he's cute. No, that's not my style at all.

He's very good. I could be his dad. No way. He's very good. Amazing. And he's all like wiggly like Mick Jagger. He's wicked. He's really good. He had Sophie Alaspects to come on stage on the other day. Oh my God. Amazing. Where? Why wasn't I there? Coco, I think he did. Yeah. He's really cool. He's a star. What's your kind of music? So I love any, he's 17. He's 17. We're like Natch. Any kind of like 90s grand music, I just love it all still. Same. You know. It's because it was so nostalgic, and then I love old rave music, Lenny. Oh, 90s, rave music was so good.

Like, what? Like, people like Carl Cox, amazing. He's an amazing DJ, he still works now. Or the kind of more like cheesy stuff, like... So you don't listen to write, said Fred? Did we ever listen to write his name? What's his name? I'm too sexy? No, the...

Fred again. Very different to write. Fred again, I love him. And I've still not seen him live and I really want to see him. Why would you want to see him live putting records on? Because it's more like the vibe. And I think he doesn't just put records on. I think he does play it like what he's doing it.

And if you have to sing karaoke, do you do karaoke at the Gregory Smith party? I think it's more karaoke would be really upselling it. It's more just people yelling. Okay. So what's the song that everyone wants to sing? Champagne soup and over. Oh, wow. Yeah.

Did you go and see Oasis? Oh my God, it was one of the greatest ones. Oh, wasn't it? I literally, I've always loved them. And I never had a, actually, Blur Oasis, I was like both. It was so amazingly nostalgic to see them all together. And I was with my brother and my sister and my sister's husband. And I've never seen that many overweight bald men crying.

I know. It was so weird, wasn't it? It was beautiful. Did you wear a bucket hat? No. Never back in the day either. Did you nearly buy one there? No.

I nearly did. And then I was like, I'm never going to wear this again. No, stay in your lane, G. Yes. No way. No. I, like, was yelling every word to every song and just, like, doing this weird hopping

because I was so happy. Wasn't, did you watch Richard Ashcroft as well? He was so good. He was really good. And they're also, they're from like a bygone era those guys, aren't they? It's like the swagger and that, like, imagine, can you imagine you going on stage and like,

telling your audience, like, fuck off. You just wouldn't. I don't know. Whereas they do it. And we all kind of go like, yay. I know, I know. Let's buy your merch. I know.

He was so good. Before we let you go, John, can you give us a nostalgic taste that can transport you back somewhere? What would it be? It would be a chicken ticca masala takeaway. And it would be at my aunt's house because we used to get them around there. And she had this, like, gorgeous old dining room. And we'd get a takeaway curry. And do you remember when you used to get takeaway curry, they'd give you like little sad bag of salad?

Oh, they still do. Do they? Yeah. Okay, so you get a bag of salad. No one really wants it, no one touches it, and you get your chicken ticcassad and rice, lots of beer. Love that.

That would be, I think there's something so nostalgic about chicken ticam masala. When was the last time you had a chicken teak masala? So I would more make one now. I'm that kind of guy. But yeah, quite often. I quite like a chicken ticca masala or a butter chicken. Do you have lots of dinner parties?

I try to, yeah. I love entertainment. A thousand percent. A thousand percent. But I don't cook at a dinner party. I'll cook and then it's done. I won't cook when anyone's there because I get extreme foamo.

I can't bear the thought of anyone chatting if I'm not right in there. Oh my God. Okay, so can you give me a tip? I'm having local neighbourhood Christmas drinks and the last mum is pissed off because she's not invited because she's not in the right postcode.

Can we have one night away from each other? We'll chat after. So when I did it two years ago, all I was doing was getting bloody canapes from MNS out of the bloody oven, nightmare. Boring. I was sweating. Yeah. I was hot. Yeah. The whole room was hot. Yeah. The oven had been, what would you suggest? Did you get hot hair? You know, when it goes a wrinkly and sweaty. And then you try and down a dirty martini and it was just like,

it was slightly unpleasant. I'm sure everyone had a nice time. So have cold things. But do people want cold? What would you do? So how many people, roughly? Well, I'm hoping not that many because I hope they're all gone back to wherever they're going to. Like more than 10? Yes. Okay. More than 20? Probably about 20. I would dare. I would dare. definitely do everything pre-done. So like an array of delicious dips, Labna, Babagnouche, hummus, and some thrilling things to dip in. Yeah. And then something warm that you don't need to do anything to. What could that be? Mini sausages. I love them. Cocktail sausages. Everyone loves them. Yeah. And then just loads of crisps. Got 72 ordered. Done. Yeah. Slamming in the oven. Job

done. Honey and mustard. A bit of honey and mustard. And then just do little ramekins of ketchup and mayonnaise. And then And you don't, what more do you need? Just ply everyone with booze. Would you do a big cheeseboard? I love a cheeseboard. I think that's so nice. And if you're really fancy, you could put like olives and cured meats on.

Dates. Yeah, like a grazing tape. Yes. Delicious. I think they look fabulous. Now, how do you feel on paper plates? I think it's fine. Me too.

Because then you don't need to do any washing up, been it all. And then the next morning you wake up and you're like, oh my God, my house is fine, rather than my house is trashed. And I'm never doing it again. You've been a great help. Thanks. Thank you for coming over. I think maybe we need to do this again where you just come and cook for us

and we talk about, you know, how you're getting on with stewed fruit. My pear journey. Yeah, your pair journey. When is the cookbook out? So the cookbook is out on the 29th of January available in all good bookstores. And we can vouch that it's delicious. That sauce for that, harrowing. Winner.

It's divine. John Gregory Smith, what a guest. Gorgeous, man. Loved him, cackled with him. He was kind of filthy and fab and brilliant and generous and had the best stories, and the food was delicious. Delicious, great fun. I mean, I'm rather stressed.

Got a lot going on at the moment. It's helped so much that he cooked today and he was so fab and just lifted spirits. Just such good fun. Yeah, I loved him. But his family parties are great. Just that we can get an invite.

The idea of his mum, Sal, going on to the piano, not being able to play and then go, When the Thunder calls you, it's just bonkers and fantastic. And maybe I'm going to have to adopt that Christmas tradition. That was a brilliant episode.

I loved having him on. Your tort was delish. You changed his life, eating pears. Now maybe he'll enter into eating a cooked apple. So the guy never will eat a tart to tap. He's missing out. It's very narrow-minded for a chef. Very narrow-minded, yeah.

Thank you, John, for coming on the podcast for being such a fabulous host. I guess he kind of did host me and my own. He was good fun. Also, shout out to Joe, who's sorted my larder out today. Anne is just the best. Joe can do it. Joe bloody can do it off. And we'll see you next week for another episode of Tablemanors.