Table Manners with Jessie and Lennie Ware - S14 Ep 8: Nikesh Patel

Episode Date: November 16, 2022

This week we welcome Nikesh Patel to Table Manners. We all fell in love with him as Tom Kapoor in Starstruck, and now we can watch him play a cop in the new crime thriller ‘The Devil’s Hour��, starring opposite Peter Capaldi. Nikesh came over, before a kids birthday party, for a spot of Lennie’s ultimate….vegan cuisine. Whilst eating a stew, we talked about his mum’s fabulous Gujarati food and her famous yellow Dahl, falling in love, bleaching his hair at school, Eminem and everything else in between. And now we all need to go to Kensal Green for Malaysian food. It was a pretty gorgeous Sunday afternoon. Thanks for coming down to hang out Nikesh. Go watch The Devil’s Hour now x Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello and welcome to Table Manners. I'm Jessie Ware and I am here at Mum's house. It's a Sunday afternoon. Yeah. And I would have done a roast, but I've got a vegetarian. No, it's not a vegetarian, it's a vegan. It's a vegan. You could have done a roast.

Another level vegetarian. Well, you know what? After having Shanaa Twain and her mushroom gravy she talked about, we could have done a roast. However... Actually, I've got a thing in the freezer that's a roast thing, like a chicken baton thing. Anyway.

Well, I've used the marrow that Buffy gave me. I'm very thrilled with this huge marrow you had. Yeah. That you were given by Buffy down the road. Yeah. That was homegrown. Wow. Yeah. That's why I wanted to use it.

Now, producer Alice is quite anti-marrow because when her mum was on a macrobiotic diet, there was a lot of marrow going on. It tastes of nothing. It's a bit like tofu. So what is the point of marrow? Is it very nutritious? I don't think it's anything, to be honest.

It's just bulky. It's not as good as a courgette, I have to say. It's full of water. Great. Well's just bulky. It's not as good as a courgette, I have to say. It's full of water. Great. Well, we're having a watery marrow bean stew. No, can I tell you that I put it in, it's with fennel, marrow, slow-cooked fennel, marrow and tomato stew with butter beans. Yeah. I think it looks nice, actually.

It does look nice. And it smells nice. And it's got loads of red onions. Yeah. And capers and wine and red wine vinegar. I think it's a good recipe, actually. But I am a little starstruck. Oh, come on.

Tell us who we've got. We've got Nikesh Patel. Who we all fell in love with as Tom Kapoor in Starstruck, Rose Matafayo's amazing comedy that was on BBC. Watched both series. I was obsessed. I didn't let my husband... I'd watch it and go, I'm just going up to bed to read and I'd be watching it.

And just, it was so fun. It's just a really wonderful thing. If you haven't watched Starstruck, you should go and watch it. You've got two seasons to watch. Vegan, starstruck, handsome handsome actor nikesh patel coming up on table manners can i just say i have been stalking you on instagram since i watched starstruck and i am completely starstruck. Oh.

Yeah. We are both huge fans. It's such a great show. I'll try not to let you down then. You won't let me down. No, of course you won't. It was, it was. Or should I just call you Tom?

No, that's weird. Yeah. Is it coming back? It is coming back. Yeah. Weirdly, I was at a comedy gig at the Soho Theatre last night. Watching or taking part? Watching.

Okay. And the duo called Two Hearts, they're from New Zealand. And of course, like, Rose was there. Yeah. Alice and Nick, who wrote the show, were there. Because they all know each other. And in fact, they all stay at each other's houses all the time. But yeah, we're filming their writing at the moment.

And we start again in the new year and so so this thriller this amazon thriller when's that coming out so um yeah a bit of a change of pace that is yeah that's a very different character policeman i do i play a detective yeah it was i mean that was one of the big appeals i mean it's a brilliant it's called the devil's hour um it's out on Prime Video and it's got an awesome cast. It's Peter Capaldi, Jessica Raine, Alex Ferns, who plays my sort of like partner in crime in terms of like we're a little cop duo, aka Trevor for EastEnders from back in the day. It's this like really naughty, intricate,

kind of mystery thriller. Quite different from Starstruck. Did you kind of feel like you needed that? I don't know if I was actively looking, but I think the fact that when it came up and I got into it, it was, yeah, it's just a real luxury being able to go between the two

because I love doing Starstruck. It's so clever and funny and fun. And my job is basically to bounce off Rose Matifeo, which is like. That's hard though, isn't it? Because you're slightly, I was saying just before to Jesse, you are slightly an anti. Tom, not you. I would say that Tom is slightly anti-hero because although he's handsome and a film star.

He's a nice guy. He's a nice guy and he's kind of awkward. He doesn't really know he's that handsome and gorgeous. Yeah, but I think that was... Or maybe you do know you're handsome and gorgeous. No, I think like, I think going into it and reading it, because

there's the set up of him being a movie star is kind of where the comedy comes from. Yeah. But actually the writers are really clever at not going for the kind of obvious way to play that. And Jessie, Rose's character, like, she doesn't give a shit that he's a movie star if anything that it's a real turn yeah it's kind of got in the way yeah exactly yeah um so it's really nice and also like i've not i think thankfully encountered that kind of fame where it messes with your life i've seen friends brush up against it and kind of but

it's just fun and when it's a when it's a comedy to kind of play with it and the reason i think starstruck works so well is well a rose is kind of i don't even think she's triple threat she sort of does everything she's so good um but the scenes um that they've written the kind of rom bit of those of those scenes scenes, they're really playful. We really get a chance to spark off each other. And that includes Tom and Jessie argue. They take strips off each other. Which I think then you kind of earn the gooeyness.

It's a fine balance. So back to, well, we haven't even started on food yet. You're a vegan. I am, yeah. How long have you been a vegan for? About four years. Oh, crap. How?

So I don't know if you've listened. I don't know. You don't need to apologise. Well, he does really. I did. You know, when I was listening to it, I was like, I think I'm going to have to apologise to Lenny. No, you do not need to.

But mum gets the fear. I'm quite frightened. Oh, is that what it is? It's not, this is annoying. I'm just not confident. I think it's also, this is annoying for mum. It's much easier to do something you're confident with. That's, for me, that's the problem.

And I've got very best friends Jill and Johnny that they might listen to this and they're both vegetarian and I don't have them over for dinner because I never know what to cook Jill and Johnny now you know yeah

they know that Jill says I'll come and make my bring my own food oh my god because I don't it's not that I don't want to cook vegetarian food I'm just not confident

like i'm not confident about today and jessie's made me less confident i'll add a bit of something well you know a little zhuzh yeah but so do you find that lots of people find it difficult to cook for you or do you think uh some or lots of your friends vegan and vegetarian no no it's a real mix and i think like yeah you get a mix of reactions. It's interesting though. A lot of the time people are just annoyed. Like, oh, you know. I'm trying to hide that.

It'll come out as we get through the wine. But no, it's interesting that you said it's fear. I'd never thought of that. I'm frightened. Because I know what to do with meat. Chicken soup. You know what? She with meat. Sure. Chicken soup. You know what? She sounded like a bully for many series.

And now we know. It's just because you're a scared carnivore. There you go. It's what's masking. I'm a scared carnivore. So you weren't brought up vegan? No. So my mum did the cooking at home.

She's a very good cook. Oh, you're of the Indian heritage. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Gujarati specifically. So we had a lot of Gujarati food at home, which is not to say my mum wouldn't try other stuff, but it was like, you know, cooking for the family. She did this, both my parents worked,

but my mum worked part-time, but she was kind of this Swiss army knife of a woman. She'd wake up early, make... That's a good expression. Well, she'd like wake up early and she'd make the evening's curry um in the morning um so you know dad would go off to work mum mum would cook and then you know get showered and she'd go she'd go to work in the afternoon so it meant when we got back from

school or my dad got back from home if mum was a bit later food was already there did she cook meat yeah she did cook meat so we never eat um because we were brought up Hindu my parents are Hindu we never ate beef at home but my dad does like his meat so so what did you have chicken and lamb and chicken yeah um but that was one of the things that I think made it easier when I went vegan was actually if you it's sort of like having a cheat code if you know that you've got access to like Asian food and Asian recipes because there is a lot of flavor and they can be quite simple once you're a bit more confident with kind of you know bit having yeah having a spice

cupboard or yeah but why vegan why go the whole hog so what documentary did you watch you know what I I didn't the deal I made with myself was if I did it then I wouldn't have to bleak myself out by watching all of these documentaries because like I know a lot of friends that had um and I was definitely interested it was for ethical reasons and I did it I was thinking about at the end of must have been what 2017 and I thought I'll do Veganuary um and pretty much went like pretty hard into it I didn't like think oh I'll cut back on this um and for a month I think because I had time I made time to make sure that I cooked for myself and also by 2018 like the the options that were available when you're like especially in London I think I noticed particularly when you didn't have to feel sheepish trying to get vegan food at the pub um where before like I can food at the pub yeah everywhere does it yeah exactly

yeah um whereas before it would be like a bit of salad if you're lucky and then you'd be like no this has got mayo on it and then you know um so I did it for ethical reasons and then I got to the end of January and I thought you know what I can keep this going and I I have um that's not to say that you you know there's there are still places where I think set catering on jobs has been quite interesting that that's some sometimes you do jobs usually ones that have a bit of American money where they're really on the ball. But sometimes, you know, the word will get out that, you know, one of the actors is vegan

and then you'll get, right, here's your snack for the evening. And it's like a jacket potato with no butter or cheese in it. And you're like, this is grim. If we were coming around to yours and you wanted to kind of cook something that felt actually kind of quite easy to do, but you wanted to yours and you wanted to kind of cook something that felt actually

kind of quite easy to do but you wanted to look like you made a bit of an effort what would be your kind of go-to vegan meal to

impress your mates with but doesn't require shit loads of effort because I need the recipe you need the recipe like we've done

a call out on on podcast this season too late for you yeah too late but because mum is we're getting late for you yeah it's too late but but because mum is we're getting so many more vegetarians and vegans on it and mum is just gets this fear and i don't mind it so much what would you what would you go for as a dish for so mirasoda stuff in the in the yeah the new vegan is she called the new vegan in there yeah yeah

she's kind of amazing but i wonder if wonder if that goes some way to making her, you know, think, right, I still want it to be like flavourful. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not that, you know, strictly vegan chefs aren't thinking that. But I guess, I guess, yeah, I relate to that a bit because I used to eat meat and now I don't. Yeah, I'd probably go with, she did, I think it's east in one of her cookbooks she's got um a recipe for like sweet potato bibimbap which is like a korean yum so it's that it's like that

i think she does it with you can do it with um tender stem broccoli or asparagus um bit of rice and then this amazing have you guys ever cooked with Korean gochujang paste? Yes. Yeah. Amazing flavour. It's the thing that, well, you don't eat kimchi, mum, but it's the stuff that you do. Yeah, I would say it's not as, you don't have to be, your palate for like sour kimchi doesn't

have to be, it's not quite that. It's just a heat. Yeah. It's quite sweet. But I don't really's quite sweet i don't really like heat i don't really like hot sauce right things like that so okay well this is going well no no no but look this maybe we can win you over and then pudding um this is actually so i'm it's one of the things i was most looking forward to today because puddings are still like in four years I think it's one of the areas where you do

feel the the options I feel the lack of options because people people are like oh do you miss me or do you miss you know the smell of this or the taste of this like I don't in a like in starters and mains because there's so many options for stuff but But yeah, puddings, yeah, I think it's still somewhere that, because I'm not particularly a baker myself, whenever I'm given something, I think, oh, I've never thought to try that. So mum, it may taste like shit and he'll still be happy. Yeah, I will.

And it won't taste like shit. I made something without eggs or any dairy. So you grew up, what's a memorable dish from your... Where did you start though? Where were you born? So I was born here. So my parents, not a dissimilar sort of story

to Mirasoda's actually, who was a Ugandan Indian. But my, both my parents were born in East Africa. So my dad was born in Kenya. My mum was born in Tanzania. And I think my grandparents grandparents there was a big move post uh independence and you know kind of opening up where we could go you know where we could go next to

look for work East Africa became viable but yeah they sort of moved from there my parents grew up there and then um both ended up going back to India for schooling and then uh eventually both sets of grandparents settled in the UK and that's where they met were they introduced they were yeah so they were introduced but not arranged so my mum could have my mum could have been like nah I'm not feeling it um but thankfully she did where did they where did they grow up in so uh dad studied was it london well not to start with i mean so i've got lots of family in leicester as well as london that dad did his studies in bolton um mom mom was at aston university in birmingham and then eventually they settled in London.

What do they do? They're both pharmacists. Are they? Yeah, their one bit of careers advice to me was... Don't be a pharmacist. Don't be a pharmacist. Really? Why?

I think for them it was... All those drugs. I know, I know, on tap, yeah. I think for them it was, don't get me wrong, they've provided for their kids and I have a comfortable life the footsteps of of our parents which I think was I didn't fully appreciate when I was growing up but quietly that was that was really progressive of them and that I think that's true of my parents like every time I think you know first it was oh I want to go study English literature at uni and that's not really a degree that has a kind of

high-paying job at the end of it um and then after that it was oh I want to go to drama school each time okay they didn't yeah they were you know what they I think because because I was I was good academically and hard working and and they saw that when I put my head down I you know I did well that bought me a certain amount of grace when they were like, okay, we don't get what you might do with this. And we don't understand what the acting world is like. And thank fuck, because if they did, they probably would have said, don't do it.

Did you understand what it was like? No, not really. Did you have any mates that were acting? So I sort of, I got the bug when I was at university. Where did you study say so i went to warwick um yeah which has a you know they've got a good drama scene there and you can just kind of get stuck in because before uni i i dabbled a bit because it was something fun that i'd seen my friends do like you know i was a shark in west side story oh yeah it was me and like any other

any other brown kid in my year going like is this is this accent okay that we're putting on it's like yeah the teacher says it's fine so um but we got by by you yeah thankfully would not would not be doing that now but um when it's when I was at uni and I I auditioned for a play and then I got cast and then suddenly I just I it's all I wanted to do. What was the play? Othello was the first thing I did. Oh, wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You weren't Othello? Well, I auditioned for Iago and then I got cast as Othello. Wow. And I was just, and you know, it's a play that I dearly loved studying and then did it. And, you know, I remember my mum came up to see it and my uh my old English teacher Mr Blanche came up to see it and like yeah um and I still remember when I spoke like mum had to mum came see the show and then had to shoot off and I called her up afterwards and you know you talk about your parents keeping you grounded I was like so like mum what do you think

and she's what kind of pause for a bit she went yeah i noticed you spit a lot um when you're on stage and i was like yeah that's called diction mom that's fine but like did you like the performance like yeah yeah i thought i thought you i thought you were very moving i was like okay good but you know a memorable dish from your childhood that your mom would be making when you like whether that's at the weekend or that you know evening curry on every yeah but what which curry was so there's a there's a few like it's like my mum's doll is really it's a yellow doll it's really uh simple but it's just like really kind of cozy um and i've made it like i've shared because the way my mum cooks

is all very intuitive you know it's kind of stuff she learned from her mum and then it's a bit of this and a bit of this which um i i can cook but i i need i need the instruction yeah exactly but i did you know more and more i've just asked to be like right put it in a whatsapp so i can um but yeah her dal is like five different types of dal to start with in terms so there's like a um there's a yellow there's the kind of five different beans basically oh really so which ones you've got masoor um urad dal there's a few i'll look them up um but yeah that's just kind of you you know, it's pretty straightforward actually. It's just onions, ginger, garlic, and then spices.

But, um, that, and then occasionally she'll, she'll experiment and she'll do stuff like, she makes this amazing curry with mini aubergines, which she, the baby ones. Yeah. Which she splits lengthways and fills them with like a sort of peanut stuffing so stuff like that um oh my god yeah so what would she cook would she bake the baby aubergines so then she can scoop out the flesh uh i think so or i think it's all done in the pan but it's just i think i think so oh no no, maybe she does. She does bake them because she gets a bit of char on them.

So on the, on the, on the hob, um, just turning them. Oh, okay. Yeah. On a naked flame. Yeah. And then. Have you ever tried to make this one? I haven't.

No. You really should be. I know. That seems like a great one. Like a go-to. Yeah. And what's it called? Do you know what it's called?

I don't know. Like, cause she, I I guess because she's not she doesn't really think about like food would always be really important at home but even when we had friends over it was less about the I guess the rules of dinner parties where you'd have like courses and I quite like you know being able to you know when you go over to friends for dinner and they'll you get to talk about oh you know what is this that you've made and they'll tell you a bit about it but mum was kind of just like, no nonsense.

And it's on the table. Yeah. And it's on the table. And then people would usually just end up. Did your friends love coming back for dinner? They did. Yeah. Um,

but, um, it was quite, it's quite fun when, when mum started, particularly when I brought friends around, she's like, she'd,

and she still thinks like, Oh, I don't want to make Indian food because they're not gonna you know they're gonna want something like that they like it's like no no that's what they want when my friends come over they want Indian food so I think I think the dal would be one and then like an aubergine aubergine because your parents grew up in Kenya and Tanzania is there any African like influences on their cooking yeah maybe I wonder whether the peanuts yeah I mean there definitely are like um we used to go there's a place that we went to up the road um um which is now sadly shut I suspect the bailiffs got in there cafe 182 it's

called they did mogul which is uh cassava chips um yeah and it's just that like like kind of like you do regular chips but with you know a bit of um chili and lemon that kind of stuff i think there's like there's definitely an influence from like the east african diaspora where the flavors it'd be good it'd be good to really just sit down and go like what comes from what comes from where but i think yeah particularly with gujarati food which tends to not have as much dairy in it and like a lot of gujaratis are veggie as well so when even though initially when i said to mum i was gonna i was turning vegan she's like oh so no meat actually it was quite easy for her so what's her base in

because usually it would be ghee right so yeah just coconut oil yeah yeah coconut oil or just regular like rapeseed or vegetable oil yeah um and then you know a lot of the dairy subs work quite well now this is the thing that we have struggled with because the dairy subs are like i i mean maybe you've found some really amazing one i've talked about this before but i think nettle don't do them have you heard of nettle they do jarred cheese and it's like macadamia nut like blue cheese cheese and it's amazing but have you found any really good dairy subs are you not that fussed about finding them yeah i'm not massively fussed to be honest i have found like uh a good like a good oat fresh like instead of a

creme fraiche yeah we have we've used that but was it oatly it was yeah I've used the oatly one but like that's quite good as a substitute for like having regular yoghurt because I sometimes find like soy yoghurt can be a bit sweet and you just want something a bit plain but yeah

I tend not to mind too much with with substituting dairy when i'm when i'm cooking okay before we eat the stop it no it's gonna be great no but i'm now worried because right let me explain what i've made i've made because i a friend gave me a marrow yeah i couldn't work out what don't get excited about a marrow no don't get excited about a marrow but the thing was that i didn't want to cook indian food because i thought that i will never be up to scratch with i think that's one of the kind of go-to's that you would yeah i didn't feel like we could do that so then we thought about risotto yeah i said without parmesan cheese how are we going to make it really tasty yeah so the marrow was looking at me and i found this slow-cooked fennel and marrow stew with butter beans and jesse's now made something

i've made like a kind of pistachio walnut pesto to go on the top and then we've done this garlicky it may work garlicky kind of toast thing with um that's delicious well and also like you don't mind yeah no, no, not at all. Not something I've... I rarely eat marrow, so... No, no one eats marrow for a reason. We've discovered it's a bit like tofu. It has no flavour whatsoever. You've got to zazz it up.

Last supper. Start a main dessert and drink of choice um so this is kind of like a like a i don't know how thought through this would be as a complete meal but in terms of like if i could choose a starter it'd be this so my starter would be because because I, yeah, I was like, what of my mum's cooking would I put in my last supper? And I think I'd go for starter and it would be her samosa chart, which is just like, it's so, it's such a fun starter because it's a mini meal. It's got so many different components. starter because it's a mini meal it's got so many different components um and actually i i i whatsapped her today and was like mum what goes in your samosa chart because there's a very specific thing when we when she serves it up at home like we have to make sure that we put we set it up in the right order so you start with like these mini veg samosas. Yeah. Which, you know, she usually, you can, she usually fries them.

And then there's like a yogurt sauce, which is like, like, so she uses like a coconut yogurt or a vegan yogurt, thinned a bit and you add salt. And then there's tamarind sauce, there's dates, coriander, there's like a chickpea a kind of chule uh curry that goes with it and it's all just a lot of dipping yeah well so you kind of you layer it up right um and then you sprinkle coriander and sev i don't know how to describe sir but

they're like um they're like they almost look a bit like angel hair spaghetti but like really small fragments and you sprinkle it on yeah um so it's a really it looks really fun um and it's got loads of flavor in it so i think i'd go with my i'd go with a samosa chart and then main, um, just cause I'm obsessed with it. It's there's, um, uh, I did a job. I did well, Indian summer shot in Malaysia. We'd, we'd eat our way through Penang basically. And the cuisine there you've got, cause you've got South Indian cuisine, um, Malay food,

um, Chinese food. And then that's, there's actually, you know, because there's a big expat community out there. There's a lot of other cuisine. It's a real foodie spot. So great place to be living for six months of the year on this job. But since turning vegan, probably a lot of the stuff I would have enjoyed there is now off limits. Because it would eat like particularly you know stuff with fish sauce or that kind of thing yeah but there is a place that i found

um that's local to me which does a vegan rendang oh yeah um so which is usually lamb well it's usually lamb or i think beef yeah um and yeah so this is quite a this is quite a spicy last supper i realized but you know um if it's the last one that's fine so yeah i'd go there's a place near me called jolly which does a vegan rendang um and what is is jolly that's quite nice on it you don't have to have it if you don't want the yeah yeah so what would you drizzle it oh yeah whatever you like whack it on um yeah so jolly is that near where you live yes yeah yeah and what kind of cuisine is that uh malaysian all right yeah and selena who runs it has a she's got a stall in uh london bridge um what in borough market or yeah yeah yes in borough market um and yeah she's got a she's got a spot near me,

which I'm really nervous that eventually she's going to... She's doing so well out of Borough Market that she's going to go... This spot isn't quite right for me. I'm going to move on. So I'm going there a lot. Can I tell you, there's fennel in here and chilli. Fennel seeds. I can't taste them. I can feel a little heat.

A little heat's coming through. Yeah, the flavour's lovely. Is it? It's nice, Mum. Yeah, it's really nice. You've done great. Vegan rendang. It is very spicy.

I will say this. What do you have it with? With rice? Yeah, coconut rice and then Jollibee Roti Canai which is like it's a Malaysian variation on roti. Sorry, I'm a very slow eater as well.

No, also you're answering questions, so do not worry. I'm also really fast. Oh, yeah. Yeah, greedy. And this is all from Jolly. This is all from Jolly. So that's going to be your main that's my main

what drink are you having I think because I've named a Samosa Chut and a Rendang I've got to have something that's good with spice

I'm going to go with beer which one and maybe like I was trying to remember I had a really nice I'm not very fussy with beer

I've got to say but like I can't remember who it is that does a really nice like mango flavoured... Oh, you like the fruit flavoured ones? Well, that is an exception,

just because some of the fruit ones can feel a bit kind of, you know, studio bar, but this one... What did we have at Warwick? They used to have beer, they'd give you snake bite with Vimto in it. Oh, what? You're kidding me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought you'd have it with the black... And they'd call it purple, with vimto in it oh what you're kidding me yeah yeah yeah I thought you'd have it

with the black and they'd call it purple and you'd just go can I get a pint of purple what yeah what is snake bite it's cider

cider and beer cider beer and vimto is it with beer too no it's cider and blackcurrant cordial or something oh okay so yeah

this was so you used to do vimto I love vimto it's my go-to if i've got a cold yeah it's very nice of it yesterday yeah i bet you can't drink it now after having hangovers after doing it so pudding this is the thing that you struggle with being a vegan are you going to go for something that you could have had before you were vegan i don't know so i think the thing that i'm struggling with especially coming onto here where you know people go like oh you've got to try this that they serve here i don't know if

there's like a go-to dessert that i would have that often like chocolate tart like a really like rich chocolate tart which i think you know i've again it sort of escapes me where i've had it but that that still tastes really kind of creamy and delicious without having dairy in it. Something like that. Oh, these look amazing. Maybe these are my last supper dessert. Oh, don't worry about it.

He'll be happy. That's great. So a chocolate tart from somewhere that you don't know where it's from, but somewhere you've had a good one. Yeah, or maybe baklava is vegan. I think it probably is. I think, yeah. It's got honey in it.

Okay, yeah, okay. It's your version of it. Bad vegan, but yeah, my dessert would be baklava. I love baklava. Yeah. So who is the gorgeous woman that you live with as your partner? My girlfriend, Nicola, yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Oh my God, mum knows everything. Yeah, she's very, very pretty. She's she's very very pretty is she an actress so she is but but she pivoted to she's a broadcaster and a an economist now so she trained as an actress um how did you meet we met in we met in lockdown we met on a dating app yeah would you say which one uh yeah i feel quite cringe saying we we met in lockdown we met on a dating app yeah would you say which one yeah I feel quite cringe saying we met on Raya oh okay

yeah now I understand why you feel cringe yeah it's quite cringe you were the select few that were allowed an account do you know how Raya I heard you're the elite

chosen it's like Soho House yeah it sounds really wanky do you think I could get on it worked yeah definitely you could actually

I don't know if anybody would be your age on there I don't know that'd be quite. You could actually. Yeah. I don't know if anybody would be your age on there. I don't know. That'd be quite interesting actually. It's a bit rude. I don't know. I wish your new podcast, Mum, on like Raya.

Mum and Raya. But good, it worked. It worked. But also like when we established that we'd like, when we matched and we were into each other on Raya, I slid into her DMs on Instagram because I felt less. Oh yeah.

And then we went on a date. I've been reliably informed that I didn't smash it on our first date. And the person who reliably informed me was Nicola herself, which was Jacob. Well, just like, I wasn't very good at dating. Um,

but you're gorgeous. No, well, thank you. That's very kind. But also like, I do think in Indian summers, everyone loved you, but that, but i think that's no substitute for like having the experience of like

being on dates knowing what works so where was your first date we went so we went to uh we went to mildred's for dinner okay um but because you'd apologize for being a vegan and yeah but then she was she was veggie so it's like it like, we got off to a good start. Do you think that this is what brought you together? Mildred's. I love Mildred's. No, your vegetarianism brought you together. Would you have gone out with a non-veggie? Oh, mum.

If vegetarian wasn't ticked on the thing. No, I think I would have. Well, I mean, it's hypothetical because I don't have to test it. But I think I would have well I mean it's hypothetical because I don't have to test it but I think I would have but then also I would have been like if you're only going to eat meat

all the time I'm not sure that's really good so Mildred's Mildred's was a really good spot Mildred's was a really good spot is it good for a date?

I've never sat in I've always got takeaway well so was it the one in Soho? it was the one in King's Cross near King's Cross yeah yeah

but basically there were a few reasons why she thought like I'm not really sure this guy's like Was it the one in Soho? It was the one in King's Cross. No, King's Cross. Yeah, yeah. But basically, there were a few reasons why she thought, like, I'm not really sure this guy's, like, that into it. I got there first, and I was... I brought a book with me, because I like to read on the tube. That's where I get most of my reading done. So I was sat reading while I was waiting. But I didn't really think... That's quite attractive.

Well, it was, but this is the thing. This is the thing. It wasn't... Did you choose a special book? No. So she'd think, what were you reading? No, no, no.

This is the problem. This is the problem. So I was reading a book that I was really engrossed in, which is a memoir by Rick Samada called I Never Said I Loved You. Oh, God. Christ.

That's not very good. So it looked... Does it look like a self-help book. It looked like, well, I don't know what it looked like. It looked like some sort of weird move or like I was some sort of erudite fuck boy just sat there kind of reading this book saying I never said, I don't know what it looked like, but she kind of turned up and went, okay.

I really enjoyed dinner and we got to chat and I thought she was really funny. Do you remember what you chat and like she's really funny and what she chose did you share we didn't share no we ordered our own we showed started wasn't really concentrating on the food no he was trying to work out whether he fancied her and whether she fancied him no but i think there was a lot of like you know what it was and it's mad to think about it now because you know i love her and she's amazing and and like but um was it so it was in lockdown so you had well we were sort of in between lockdowns we went on a few awkward thing where you did you not know whether you were allowed to hug or there was a bit of that and

then i remember i had work the next day and so like in my head i was like this went this went really well and i'd love i'd love to see this person again. But I was also like, time to call it a night because I've got work tomorrow. Yeah. And then. Did you forget to text her? No, no, I texted her, but she kind of went away from it going like, I'm, I don't know if he was, basically, I don't know what I was giving off, but it wasn't. It sounds like she didn't know that you fancied her or not.

Yeah, maybe. Mum, this is nice. Well, it's got no eggs and no butter. It's got coconut oil. It's really, I hate the word, moist. Because it's... Yeah, you're not a fan of... No, I'm not.

It is a weird word to keep to you. It's a terrible word, but yeah. Mum, this is lovely. Is it? Yeah, that's really nice. Is it? You'll be taking it home. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

There you go. Can you taste the rose? I can. It's really nice. I really like it, Mum. You've done really... You've smashed it, Lenny. You've smashed it.

Yeah, you have. I think you've broken through. I thought it was delicious. Do you like karaoke? Because I quite like it. So I'm a recent convert, so we talked about being in Penang. That's where I did karaoke for the first time.

I think I was terrified because like it just culturally, it was just not something that I did. I'd always thought karaoke, the only version of it was like, you're in a, you're in a crowded pub and you like get on stage or something. Yeah. Which I couldn't imagine. You thought it was like my best friend's wedding. Yeah, exactly.

Cameron Diaz does it. Exactly. But yeah, when we were in yeah when we were in when we were in Penang and I was like oh you can do it in a booth and it's just your mates um so you found your voice I found my voice I mean the first I knew I was away when I did I did the real Slim Shady um which is like you know living out my sort of naff teen fantasy of like spit spitting bars did you ever bleach your hair yeah I did but but not not because of Eminem okay um I listened to a lot of like punk rock as a kid and I thought it'd be good just once to have like the the highlight tips offspring did

they yeah all of that um but um my mum I told my mum that I was gonna do it and she was like well don't pay money to do it at a salon I was just like I'll do it for you wasn't she a cool mum she was a cool mum but what she did was she basically she gave me like a landing

strip all the way down to the roots so it wasn't highlights and then she left it in I remember she had to go to the shops and she was like wash i remember she had to go to the shops and she's like wash it out after this amount of time um and then so the timer went off i didn't do the thing where you're supposed to test it on a bit of your hair first to see what the color is um so i ended up with like a bright orange oh yeah mohawk because you have dark hair because i've got dark hair so apparently you're meant to do it twice I think if you want to go blonde um what happened well I just ended up like over the I had that summer I had this stupid bright

orange mohawk which I quite enjoyed but then we went on holiday um and yeah where do we go like I went with friends to like the silly isles or something it was like didn't everyone go to Newquay we didn't go to new key but i just remember like walking around the silly aisles and and i don't think they knew what to do with like this brown kid with brown with like bright orange neon hair yeah um and then i had to like cut it or you know we got back to school and and i was like right i've got cut i've got to cut my hair off that's the only way to get around this. So I had a buzz cut. But then, because mum had gone to the roots

at the start of summer, even when I had a buzz cut, it looked like I had sand in my hair. You have to dye it. Because I was still there. So I went through all the palaver of having a buzz cut and then still had to dye it. So it wasn't my finest moment.

Nikesh, do you have good table manners? I think I've got good table manners. Yeah. What can't you stand that other people do? I would very much include myself in this because it's not something

I'm immune to but phones. Phones at the table. Yeah, I'm that person. But I think we all are, aren't we? But it's just that thing of like... Not me.

But Jessie is the best. Yours is the one that's the only person that has her phone on the table that has pinged. This is the worst. Yours is the one that's the only person that has her phone on the table. That has pinged. This is the workplace. This isn't like... You are a piss taker.

But Jessie is terrible. Have you seen my phone? No, you've been... Her baby can make things open with his fingers. That's like every child now. He's a year old. Oh, as in the touchscreen. Touchscreen.

Can he? Yeah. And he slides old. Oh, as in the touchscreen. Can he? Yeah. And he slides it. Oh, yeah, though. He's not on Tinder yet, but he's sliding from left to right. Nikesh, thank you. Thank you for being on Table Manners this Sunday. I wanted to ask one thing.

Yeah. You're often cast as the love interest. You're not in this new thing the devil's but is that a bit annoying when you're do you feel objectified no i think do you not mind anyway i i think like looking at it you look at the script you look at what you get to do with it and actually so i've done starstruck but like a few years ago i did there was an american sort of reimagining of four weddings and a funeral so i've done a i've done a couple of these um and i think if if if the script's smart then it doesn't matter because i

can't remember who i was reading might have been might have been um Rose who said this, rom-coms are kind of underrated for, because there's a certain, a good rom-com, there's an effortlessness to it, there's an ease to it, that you kind of just go, this is really comforting. Sunday afternoon rom-com,

that's what you need. But I think there is, you know, within that. But Indian Summers wasn't a rom-com. No, exactly. You know, so yeah,

you're right. I've played stuff where I've been the love interest, but it always feels like there's been... Something meatier underneath. Yeah. Okay, don't use meaty, Mum. Come on, something vegan-ish. Something stronger. Jackfruit-ish.

Jackfruit-ish underneath. You haven't got to release your language. Thank you for being here. Thank you for being so... Thanks so much for having me. Gem-respirited when it comes to mum's attempt at vegan cooking. No, listen, it was a triumph. Oh, Nikesh, what a lovely, like, gentleman.

Lovely, just lovely. Really interesting. Maybe we're going to take a trip to Jolly, Mum, for that vegan rendang. You turned off by that point, weren't you? Darling, I couldn't. I know that it was probably okay, the food. But I think it needed the goat's cheese. I just don't enjoy it.

Do you think he did enjoy it? He ate it all. He ate all of it, Mum. Yeah. I think you do he did enjoy it? He ate it all. He ate all of it, Mum. Yeah. I think you do have to spice it up. Do you understand why I did the little pesto thing? No. Oh.

But I couldn't taste anything because I've got such a cold, so I don't know whether it tasted good or not. Well, I really liked it. You know when you're not confident about things. Do you want me to take it home now? Yeah, I've put it in a thing for you. You don't want to eat that? No that you don't want to see it again no never

well done Devil's Hour is out fabulous cast and you can catch it on Amazon Prime and he doesn't play a love interest he plays a detective I think as an actor you must always want to play detective once in your career right

yeah but he is of a type where he always plays the... Like, in Indian Summers, he played the handsome love interest. Isn't that a good leading man role? That's quite nice, no? Yeah, but I think he's quite intellectual, wasn't he? I mean, he read all very interesting books. Lovely, lovely, and you did feed him food. I think if I'd been on Raya, I could have met him. Mum, there's still time to meet your Nikesh.

Yeah. Of your dreams. Do you think? Of your age, of your ilk. Do you think? Let's try. Yeah. Thank you for listening, and we'll be with you next week

for another round of Table Manners, season 14. you