Table Manners with Jessie and Lennie Ware - S4 Ep 5: Cheryl

Episode Date: November 7, 2018

She’s back. And wanting seconds of mum’s Key Lime Pie. We talk to the peoples’ princess, Cheryl, about Stottie cake, her perfect roast potatoes, the only man in her life, tattoos and her first bit of music in 4 years. It’s a big one!Produced by Alice Williams Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello and welcome to Table Manners. It is a madhouse. Yep. But you look very glamorous. Because I've made an effort, darling. Whilst I have just post-dyed hair for my grey hairs that's gone a bit too dark because we left it on too long because I was shopping. And I'm going to look an absolute shocker in the photo. Please, can you try and do something? Tonight is a big one.

Very big. Everyone knows of her. Yeah yeah and everyone thinks they know her yeah i think she's just called cheryl now cheryl because on spotify she's just cheryl i know it's like a down our shell our cheryl no that's not what she calls herself our cheryl she's cheryl all right well she's cheryl yeah she's so well known that you'd know her by her first name. That's like Cher. Yeah, it is. She's our version of Cher. She's our version of Cher. I mean, how do you introduce her?

She's an author. She's one of the original kind of reality TV pop stars. Yes. Was in the phenomenal Girls Aloud. Fabulous. Has fallen in love a few times. Has had too much attention in the press. And I'm sure it was

right and is probably one of the most beautiful people i've ever seen in my life is she i think this is where it started i managed to drunkenly at the brits after party stumble over to her because i think she had commented on an instagram this is like this is this is good stalking i did anyway i was very drunk because I had not won Jesse will you stop talking about being very drunk well I'm not drunk anyway I was drunk it was the Brits like that's where you're allowed to right hadn't won it was the first award so had lots of time to drink went to the after party quite miserable at the after party just because I think the hangover was setting in and I couldn't find the food quick enough and saw Cheryl with Liam and I kind of pushed him aside and went to Cheryl and

was like I love you I love you and she said I love you too well I remember drunkenly she said that do you think she did I don't know I think she was just trying to get me away because Nicola Roberts knows your song Nicola Roberts best mate yeah and Nicola Roberts actually I think has been very important to this new record that cheryl's putting out has she yeah i mean not only is she a best friend but i think she's a big co-writer on this record oh fantastic so and i love nicola anyway it's not about me tonight no it's about the one i'm going to fight fight fight fight fight for your love or promises do you think she'd sing just one chorus I mean it's actually we've got to fight okay how does promises go promises which which you're gonna make me make me love you

yeah which birthday party did we play it at? Alex's 21st. I think so. What have you made for Cheryl? Well, I've made a, basically I practiced it out on my best mates at a hen do that I was at the weekend. And I made a chili brisket. Wow. That kind of pulls apart. And we had it with tortillas and kind of guac. And we also had it with chicken wings.

But I thought maybe that was going to be too much. So I have done it with jacket potato because I feel like they don't get enough of a look in. And they're my favorite thing in the world. So we're having jacket potatoes and brisket, like chili brisket, with the most delicious coleslaw that I've kind of added avocado to, to kind of provide that limey guacamole creaminess. And then we've got cheddar cheese to sprinkle on top it's a cozy meal it's yeah what have you done for pud yeah I thought you were doing the whole thing what

happened that I had to rescue the situation I'm not as talented as you and I can't do a pudding I was very happy to go to M&S and get a pud from there no we're not doing that Jessie standards I did key lime pie have you ever made it no do we know what it tastes like yeah because i put my finger in the mixture and it tastes all right and it's a tribute to nora effron who probably has the best key lime pie recipe ever in her book heartburn and then i just want to give a shout out to chapel down vineyard so i was on um this hen do in kent and i organized a wine and cheese tasting before three of us knew we were pregnant but lots of other hens weren't pregnant and so we had wine tasting in kent at the weekend

with chapel down and it's english wine english wine and apparently they're really enjoying the fact that there is global warming because it's made that extra celsius or that extra degree it's working really well for english wines so i just want to say thank you so much to gavin who was the most amazing wine tasting um sommelier actually they kindly sent a box down so if cheryl fancies drinking we've got a nice red to go with the brisket. Do you think she drinks? And some dessert wine. Does she drink? I don't know. Neither do I. I hope she does because I think

I've just got tap water otherwise. But I think that's quite good ecologically. Tap water? Yeah instead of bottles. Instead of bottles darling. I'm trying to slim down on my single use plastic. Are you going to start making your own toothpaste, Mum? No.

Cheryl, coming up. Cheryl. Yes. You are in Dalston. I am. Having dinner with us. I am. Thank you very much for having us.

This is so exciting. I mean, this is a massive deal for us. And me. Because we're big fans. Yeah. But face versa. The mean, this is a massive deal for us. And me. Because we're big fans. Yeah. But face versa. The old girl is so sweet. It's true.

She's so sweet. I had no idea you looked so much alike, though. Do I? She's so lucky. It's like... Mannerisms. You're bringing your A game tonight. Okay, here we go.

Right, all right, fine. Was the journey all right? It was fine. Like, it was long. Don't get us wrong. It was an hour, 55... Right, all right, fine. Was the journey all right? It was fine. Like, it was long. Don't get us wrong. It was an hour, 55, well, two hours, basically. Mate, I feel so guilty. Only because of the time.

But I just... Like, rushing on. It gave me time to watch. I just watched the behind-the-scenes of my video. Oh, nice. Oh, great. And did a couple of emails that I'd been putting off. Oh, fine.

Yeah. So new... Shall I turn it off? No. No, because you may need some. New video for a new song. Yeah. When's it coming?

It's coming on the 9th of November. Oh, it's soon. Soon, yeah. Can you tell us what it's called? It's called Love Made Me Do It. Wow. Now, I have to say, Cheryl and I have met a couple of times. First time was when I was drunk.

At the Brits. And I loved it so much. It was my best. Are you embarrassed? It was amazing. She'll be drunk. I loved it. No, she saw me on the ITV2.

Apparently I was a mess. She was like this, wobbly. No, but it's fun. It's a native celebration, isn't it? That's what. It was definitely commiseration for me. Always up for best female, never wins. I was just, yeah, always the bridesmaid, alas.

Never now, darling. But I was. You're my best British female. You're very sweet. Yeah, thank you. Thank you, doll. But I was so rude to Liam. Why?

I told him he had bad mic technique, I'd heard, from my son. That's a terrible thing to do. But no, sometimes, but our leg, it depends, right? Our leg's straight talking. Well, I mean, I think that was rude. Was it? To see. I think I was wrong.

I shoved him out of the way and just was like to you, I love you. Yeah, but that's also good. No, I said, oh, hi. What did you say to him? I was like, hi, we have the same sound man. He says you've got really bad mic technique. I mean, who do I think I am? And then your mum asked why I'm not drinking tonight.

It's for these kind of reasons. I don't know what would drop into me brain and therefore come out of my mouth. Who's got the baby tonight? Me, mum. Is she with you all the time? No, I make her travel across the country a lot. Does she still live in Newcastle? Yeah, she lives in Newcastle.

Good thing. And you complain about clapping to Dalston, Mum. She's clapping down here like, yeah, yeah. So is she, Mum. I don't know how she does that. I know, I bet she moans, doesn't she? I do feel bad. Would you ever live with her?

I would like her to live with me. I'd like Mum to live with me. But she wouldn't, she will not. She doesn't love London. She's a proper Geordie. Do you miss Newcastle? I miss, I mean, honestly, I've been here now 16 years, and I was 19 when I moved here.

So young. So I've almost lived as long here as I did there, but I miss elements. I miss the people, the friendly, the warmth. The warmth, yeah. I miss, like, I honestly miss the rain. I mean, we do get a lot of it here, but it's a different, there's a smell in the warm. I miss, like, I honestly miss the rain. I mean, we do get a lot of it, yeah, but it's a different, there's a smell in the air. Right.

Yeah, and I miss, like, Stottie. We have a certain bread. Oh, that's what I should have brought. Stottie? I should have got me mum to bring some. I didn't even think. What's Stottie? That's fine, you're forgiven.

But tell everyone what Stottie is. It's a Geordie bread, basically. It's a bread made in the North East. And it's like a cake bread. I would say it's a bit like chip butter bread, but a bit denser. Is it sweet? No, it's savoury. Yeah.

What would you have it with, like toasted? Toasted or anything, ham and peas pudding. You don't have peas pudding either, do you? Oh my God, is this like a Geordie thing? Yeah, it's delicious. What is it? Pea. It's basically...

Peas. What is peas? Yellow split peas. Okay. Made into a paste. It's like fava. What, they're having grease. What do you have it with?

It's delicious. You have it at whatever... Is it savoury? Yeah. Do you have it like a side? No, you can have... No, mainly like you would have a ham... It's delicious. You have it at whatever... Is it savoury? Yeah. Do you have it like a side? No, you can have... No, mainly like you would have a ham and peas pudding sandwich in a study. Or you can have it like hot.

It's baked round. Yeah. And you would half it. Yeah. And then fill it with... Oh, it's delicious. Could I have a glass of wine? What are you going to have?

Can I have Cheryl's one? I don't mind, darling. No, do you? She might not... Don't force it. No, I'm good. No, you know... I can drink it. I feel like I might have it. What have you going to have? I don't mind darling No don't force it I feel like I might have it What have you got there? I've got white but maybe not cold

Do you like white? I like red My favourite red is like a Shiraz Me too Like a deep heavy knock your head off This is why me and you are meant to be friends I'm going to come and be a babysitter oh babe

can I just say Cheryl walks in looking like a real life princess my daughter who is pretty well

she's suspicious of new people discerning discerning which I respect that in her ran up to Cheryl melted

at Cheryl oh that lovely smile. She's cute. She is quite cute. I know. We don't know where she got the curls from. It's really weird. She looks like a kind of old-fashioned...

But I've got curly hair. Oh, has he? Yeah. Has he? Yeah. I'll show you. Have you got curly hair? I think when I was...

No, I've got, like, a texture. It's not curls. My sister's got... Like, it looks like a perm, but it's natural. Oh, then that's... It's in the family. sister's got, like, it looks like a perm, but it's natural. Oh, then that's it. It's in the family. I don't talk about, I mean, I talk about my daughter, but I don't name her just because I don't know. That's fair enough.

But, like, was there a pressure to tell everybody the name and, like, announce it? I didn't. No, I never have. I never did. So did you get stumped, kind of? The birth certificate? No, don't tell me somebody sold it to no it's public record oh is it i guess they're more interested in your kid's

name than mine so they go and sniff it out but they've never you've never had them photographed have you no i i actually like sent out say, like, please respect his privacy and stuff. Yeah, I did too. Because it's not up to me. It's not fair. It's not his choice, is it? It's not his choice. And it's not up to me to make that decision, I don't feel. And I want him to, like, have a childhood like everybody else. Like, I did.

And did you both agree on that? Yes, 100%. I mean, also, it's like, there's so much pressure now. There's so much pressure anyway on kids, especially like when you get to your teens and you're making mistakes or they're a bit fat that week, they're a bit spotty. You don't need the world pointing that out. No.

I want them to have as much normality. You have people virtually stalking you, Cheryl. It used to be worse than it is now. Is it a bit better? It's a bit better now, yeah. I mean, I've completely removed myself from eyesight. It's good for us, though. I've thoroughly enjoyed being away.

So what does that mean? So when you go out, you just put a big hat on and no one can see you? No, I just do. Do you not go out? I just put a cap and I do low-key stuff. And I'm in Surrey, so I'm not in town. And people are more respectful were respectful there yeah I mean yeah yeah you drive most places probably I drive most places and but like I've taken him to bonds

to feed the ducks and nobody you just keep it low-key you haven't got a big security behind you checking everyone where some people can sense that it's weird they just don't look because they're not looking for it so i just yeah i think you get the publicity that you want don't you i just keep it low-key and keep it moving and that's been refreshing and even like because it got to the point where i mean you were in the daily mail i couldn't every minute they were following every move every outfit every kind of comment on your figure it was just like it was it's like being hunted but it's like people think but they it's like people think they kind of i get i don't know whether

this is coming from you were kind of the beginning of the reality tv yeah and everyone felt like you were there yeah and we adore you yeah and we adore you the nation does adore you that and so that was part of it wasn't it it? It was this... I don't know, but in my brain, I'm just still Cheryl from Newcastle. Yeah. I'm not, like, I understand. My life's completely changed,

and it has been a different life from moving there, but in my soul, I'm still here. So it's still, to this day, 16 years later, it still baffles me, the interest. But the worst thing about it, everything being so public, anything that happens, everyone knows about. Or they think they know, which is even worse. They think, yeah.

They get false information. And then they get speculative. And our problem being with private and not commenting on stuff is you give them the pen to write whatever they want. Oh, yeah, that's true. And then I'm not somebody that's like, actually, the odd time I'll be like, no, do you know what? That's not right. I'm not having that.

Correct this, say that. But mostly I just let it fly. And the only frustrating thing with that is sometimes even your family members can still be like, I saw in some trashy magazine that such and such said so and so. And I'm like, I have no idea. I don't read that stuff, but that's not true. That's the only way I hear about it. I don't go and buy magazines.

I don't say them all. I don't really know unless I say something on Twitter. So I want to hear about the new dance and who else is on the panel. Oh, yeah, the dance show. So, it's called The Greatest Dancer. Mm-hmm. Basically, there's three captains, dance captains, who is me. Do you know Matthew Morrison is from Glee?

Oh, yes! I love him. He's such a nice guy. Oh, yes! Do you watch Strictly? Yeah, of course. O.T.? O.T.? I. O.T.

I love O.T. Is she lovely? Amazing. Just great fun? So much fun. Always smiling, always laughing. I mean, emotional as well, to be fair. Is she Brazilian?

No, she's South African. Okay. Yeah, she can move her bottom. Oh, she's incredible. Were you trained as a dancer? So when I was little You did ballet, didn't you? I did ballet

And then when I was nine I went to the Royal Ballet Did you? I didn't even know that Did you know that? That's why she's so graceful, Mum Do you feel like you got that from being a prima ballerina? I didn't know I was, but I'll take it.

Do you think I'm graceful? I don't ever think you're... Yeah, you are. You've got a stillness. There's a stillness that I've always seen on X Factor. It's like when you answer and you'll say something very kind of... And it will be full of praise or emotion, but there'll be something so still about you. Really? Yeah.

It's very graceful. I think maybe because inside everything's going so what's the predominant dance i bet it's hip-hop the most yeah people danced yeah there was a good variety to be honest i would say the most was ballroom really i think strictly's's had a massive impact on people. Ballroom, a lot of hip-hop, and a lot of contemporary. A lot of contemporary. Am I right in thinking you, Kimberley and Nicola are tight? Really tight.

Really tight. To the point where Nicola's co-written this record with you? Yeah, the whole thing. Is that the first time you've written together she's written for me in the past so basically when she started songwriting she would always just send me stuff she'd done or things she'd said she thought suit me or things she's just proud of and i'd be like yeah that's awesome i'll take that out of that send that to someone so weird And then she started doing it

not long after I had to bear this time around. And I was like, I love this. I love that. You know what? Let's just do it. I'd spoken to David Joseph.

Who we love. Who we love. Yeah. Who is so kind to me. Yeah, I'm mad. And so good to me. And he was like, you've got to let me know

which tape or record you want to make. I was like, see you in a few months it was honestly like we had the best time did you yeah we did we had

and it was so natural and organic and real because we've got a 16 year long friendship like she knows me inside out she can speak for me

sometimes our melodies are always like first take wonders like it's just it's just an She can speak for me sometimes. And melodies are always like first take wonders. Like it's just, it's just an organic relationship. I remember when she sung in pop stars, River Deep, Mountain High. And I remember thinking, oh my God.

It was River Deep. It wasn't Ain't No Mountain. It was definitely River Deep. It was a woman, she sounded like Tina Turner. And I was like, shit, she can sing. But you're lucky that you found two really good mates. And I know that. Because it must have been so weird to be thrown together.

Yeah. And it could have been a disaster. Yeah. And also, it's quite unusual for the public to choose who goes in. Like, it's usually an exec. Or, you know, now an expat. It would be Simon deciding. And at the time when we did it, it was a fresh approach it was a new thing so yeah the

I loved the first song Sound of the Underground genius it was such a good song when you got that I still play that now I still like that now it's it's it's like up there like with sugar babes um I do like Push the Button but Sound of the Underground Oh man I've got so much to speak to you about Okay fine we're going to go and go on to that for a bit Promises It's my favourite

I love that one as well Is it Promises or Promise Me? The Promise The Promise The Promise Mum you bought the album for that I have an album called Promise This Oh right

Okay sorry I think we were talking about the problem the promise yes because that video was very good yeah I want to ask you about the single because we're lucky to be interviewing you but this is the first music in how many years four years are you scared I'm not I'm excited is it because it's that good no I think it's more because I mean obviously like I'm excited. Is it because it's that good? No I think it's more because I mean obviously like I'm comfortable and confident in the music but I'm just happy to be doing it again. I'm not nervous about it, I don't feel pressure I just feel excited. Will you be doing a lot of dancing? Yes. Like so

that's that's yeah great. we talk about the single yeah the title is love made me do it now you wrote it with nicola yeah and we met we met up before we did this um when i drunkenly accosted you but we also met and you told me some of the lyrics yeah and they were brilliant and i felt like they answered a lot of critics you know that we've talked about and you told me some of the lyrics. Yeah. And they were brilliant. And I felt like they answered a lot of critics, you know, that we've talked about, with people kind of assuming things. Yeah. Would you be able to just say some of the lyrics? I think that there's a lot.

Do you want us to say some of the lyrics? I want you to say the first verse. Okay. I've fallen hard like a million times On number seven of my nine lives The ink on my skin is all the places I've fallen hard like a million times on number seven of my nine lives. The ink on my skin is all the places I've been. Wow. It's good, isn't it?

Fantastic. Speaking of ink. Oh, I've got to ask you. Did your mum mind you having those tattoos? I mean, I'm not sure she was thrilled. I would kill her. I would. I was having a moment where I had been really sick,

and I was having like a... Was this when you had malaria? I should live life... Yeah. Yeah. That must have been... I don't even know... And then you just feel like life's short,

and you just feel like, do you want to experience everything? Sod it, I'm doing it. Yeah. Did it hurt? Yeah. Yeah. Shit.

Do you have to take painkillers? Afterwards, probably to sleep. Are you going to carry on having any more? No, I'm done. Not like David. He's getting them all up his neck now. No, I'm done. Would you allow Bear to have them?

You can't not if you've got them. Kind of can't not. Yeah, I guess. Does Liam have them as well? Liam has them, yeah. Liam's mother's not particularly you've got them. Kind of can't not. Yeah, I guess. Does Liam have them as well? Liam has them, yeah. Liam's mother's not particularly thrilled about his either. Did your mum go mad? No, I mean, I'm a 35-year-old woman.

I know you are. And I was like 30. I know you are. I'd still go mad. But living life in the fast lane, because speaking to you, you know, I'm talking to you as a 35-year-old woman. Yeah. A mum of oneyear-old woman. Yeah. A mum of one living in Surrey.

Yeah. Doesn't feel too fast like that. I mean... No. Yeah. Yeah. Did you have to slow down? I did.

Definitely. I needed it for me sanity. I didn't even... Honestly, I didn't know how much I needed it until I did it. What kind of drive you to kind of was it just I just had enough I just had enough of the cycle no I wasn't inspired mmm I was I was jaded mm-hmm you know like nothing I was it felt like a negative space I was living in mmm and then you you to the point, you're like, what is the point?

I could be doing something I hate doing and feel the same way. Yeah. Why am I, like, putting myself through this? Do you think it got too much doing all the X Factor stuff too? Probably. I'm sorry, that's Argos closing their doors, sorry. Just because you were on everyone's telly. Yeah.

Every Saturday. The thing for me... Everyone loves you, though. Everyone does love you. Yeah, everyone feels you're theirs. Do you think so? Yeah, I do. I think it's because of Girls Aloud

and the whole pop idol thing at the very beginning. I think people feel they own you a little bit. I think I've kind of grown up, haven't I, in the public eye. Because to be a teenager and then go through all of your 20s and then into your 30s in the public eye, it's a big chunk of your important stages of your life. And also, like, your relationships have been so public. Yeah.

Which must be so hard. But they haven't. No, of course. From me. Totally, totally. So, again course. But everyone... From me. Totally. Totally. So, again, it's what I spoke about earlier with the people thinking they know. Or like reading false information and assuming stuff.

But I just... Could you imagine how unbothered... I couldn't be bothered to have that fight daily. Could you imagine? All the nonsense. Just noise to me. Just like noise now you know i mean but everyone's going to be keen if you have a drink with someone or see someone what's going to happen next yeah and there's nothing i can do about that so i can't stress myself out

about it sorry chelsea footballer she's had they all live down there I've been there oh god you've had a Chelsea footballer of course who doesn't play for Chelsea anymore no but in Surrey that's where they always live I think you'll be steering clear I think avoid that one come and live up in Dalston

new area you're welcome we can have Turkish takeaways shop in Argos for potties she likes the quiet life i do like the quiet i like a balance honestly there's not particularly one way or the other that's right or wrong i just like peace and harmony in my life so i like a bit of this a bit of that but i'd like to be able to step away there's no way i could you sound like you're not going to put up with bullshit

I'm certainly not Lenny I've had my days of that no more bullshit for me zero for me I've always thought you wouldn't take bullshit I think in certain aspects there's different aspects

of my life which take on different parts of my character. And definitely within business, I know what I want, what I like, what I don't want. Even if it's right or wrong, it's how I feel. Yeah. I think in my romantic area, I'm not as evolved. Cheryl, you've got to get evolved in that area. No, I'm not.

That area has just stopped, Lenny. That's not happening anymore. No, you've got to. It's the No I'm not That area has just stopped Lenny That's not happening anymore No you've got It's the end I can promise you it'll happen again Oh don't say it's the end Oh it's the end No you're too beautiful and gorgeous

I'm fabulous I've got the man in my life now Aww I do I'm good God help his girlfriends Girlfriends? Not gonna have them Oh man I'm good god help his girlfriends girlfriends not gonna happen oh man oh poor little bear I'd really like you to come and meet my mum they'll be like yeah it's Cheryl like yeah

love it no you'll be like worse than Robert De Niro and meet the fuckers um oh man but i i do think it's really i think it's really empowering you writing lyrics like this coming out answering your critics it's like nobody can say anything i just feel it's a bit tongue-in-cheek like i don't care enough to answer them i just want i'm just like it's a bit no no no no i guess do you know what i mean what's how does the course go oh my god i'm such a sucker i fall in love with every oh wow good for you do you fall in love with every fucker i just like i love people i think that i i'm a dreamer. And I believe things that are not really happening. You're an optimist. Yeah, I'm very much an optimist.

And a romantic. And a very romantic. It's been in the press that this record is about Liam. Yeah, because that's the easiest thing for them to write. But actually, all the music and all the songs that I've got ready were done way before

we split so hon does that mean that it is about him some of them are about him then no okay i none of them are about anybody okay um but that's just really the easiest thing that you could write isn't it like it's such an easy headline even if you you don't tell me. Yeah. If there is one about somebody. Is there one about somebody? No, there's not. I don't believe you. Don't you? No.

Why? Because like... Because when I'm in a room, honestly, I'm not sat there with two, three other writers, like, this moment when I'm like thinking about so-and-so. I don't write like that we all chat we all like yeah have talk about our different experience we might talk about one subject yeah and all the different experiences we have or we share within that subject and then it comes out that way but

I wasn't like sitting writing a love poem to anyone or about anybody I just think you're really brave actually because i think people speculate about your life and people's got their own ideas they feel they own you a little bit and i think you know you've had quite a public breakup he's also adored because of one direction and you're brave enough to come out and there's you know he's flaunted all over the magazines as well with every new girl that even a girl walks past him they say it's his new girlfriend i think it's really brave to come out and make a record that is your own self and you don't care about anyone else and it's fine

that's the key yeah i couldn't give a fuck yeah good for you i really believe that it's the truth none of it really what it gets stupidity really at the end of the day none of it matters so the Good for you. I really believe that. It's the truth. None of it really, it's stupidity really at the end of the day. None of it matters. So the focus at the moment is music and bear. Bear and music. Fair enough. Good answer.

I think, look, I'm a mum that does music and tries to juggle it all. Yeah juggling i think i'm gonna have to you work it out and you know what it takes a bit it takes a it's taking a lot of me it takes a village yeah a lot of adjusting like i didn't leave his side and i refused to get help until he was 16 months it's only been recently i've allowed why did you refuse just i just wanted that it didn't feel natural for me mm-hmm and I know a lot of people don't even have that choice think they have to go back to it yeah so I felt like I had such a luxury in time being able to have a year with me son and then after the year I was like there's no way I could give

that somebody I don't know take him oh I just couldn't fathom it. And then coax and coax and coax and coax, and then I finally gave in. But everything overnight, or for longer than one, like, longer than nine till six, I'm like, Mom, I have this thing coming up next week. I need you here for two nights.

She's always there, to be fair to her. Or his parents come down as well. They're very good as well. Well, that's good. Yeah. Do you cook? Yeah. What's your dish? If we were coming round for dinner? Sunday roast. What meat? What meat? Would it be chicken? if people if we were coming around for dinner sunday roast what meat what meat would you be would it be chicken some type okay so i prefer the gravy from beef me i understand that small flavor definitely but i like the the meat of chicken okay so do you do beef gravy with chicken i do normally do yorkshires with chicken gravy I mean I normally do beef and chicken And do you do Yorkshires? I don't

and Bessie Not very good I had Bessie once Oh yeah I can't Bessie But my mum does them fresh No judgement

No It takes four minutes It makes it easier And I don't normally because I'm cooking two meats normally I don't have the oven space

Oh you're doing beef meat and beef chicken Yes because I want to make the gravy from the stock of the beef. Oh, wow. Are you a feeder? I am. Okay, what are the sides? I'm not a foodie.

I'm a feeder, though. I love that. I love, like, doing it and watching people eat it. So roasts are your big thing? Yes. I would have a roast every night. Me too. I love it.

What would the sides be? So what, like, what like? What veg? Yeah, veg. So I would have normally chicken, broccoli, carrots, roast potatoes. How do you do yours? Aunt Bessie's. Are you good at them?

In goose fat. Tell me the truth. I do them in goose fat. Oh right, not Aunt Bessie's. No, so I boil them for eight minutes. Yeah. Ten minutes. Shake them in the. Yeah, so get fluffy. To get, ten minutes. Shake them in the...

Yeah, to get fluffy. To get fluffy. And then put them in the hot fat. And then I actually put... Nigella Lawson says you put semolina on them. Oh, to get the crisp. To get the crisp. Or you can put plain flour.

And then a salt and pepper. And that ensures the fat a bit more. Honestly, they're the bomb. I've got them down to a T. Condiments. Would you have like cranberry, a red currant sauce? A Christmas team. Condiments, when I was growing up, we used to have mint sauce always on the table for

Sunday dinner. Even if it wasn't lamb? Even if it wasn't lamb. I mean, I understand that. Mint sauce, not mint jelly? Mint sauce. I see. I like jelly.

I like the sauce, but I think it's just because of what i grew yeah yeah so was your mom a good cook um she cooks she cooks a lot of food yeah like she's still feeding the 5000 we would say when i was little and what's your favorite thing that she cooked a beef stew it is delicious and it's like homely and if warming and she's but she still thinks she's cooking for like five seven people you know she'll cook a big dinner and it's just made me brother so what do you do do you freeze it no a lot of it gets wasted oh what a shame i always have buried it yeah now he does oh he's love it he absolutely loves it and she gives him i don't know god knows what when I'm not there.

Is she tiny like you? She's 4 foot 11. Mum, you've seen her. Yeah, I have, but she's, I mean, you know, she always looks so young. She's teeny tiny. She's very young looking. She's young spirited. I think that keeps you young looking.

How old was she when she had you? Well, she was 17 when she started having children. Oh, are you one of four? Five. Where did you come in the five? Four. The angel number, obviously. Is that the angel number?

Yeah, apparently spiritually that's... Is it? Does that still mean that you could potentially be within the middle child syndrome? No. Who gets the middle child syndrome in that? Someone gets the middle child syndrome. But it's not you. It's not me.

You're lying. I'm going to check on my back teeth. What are we having, syndrome. But it's not you. It's not me. You're lying. I'm going to check on my bake tools this once. What are we having, by the way? I have no idea what we're eating. Jessie, tell her what you've made. Okay, so. I tried this out with my hens at the weekend. And it was really nice.

And I actually think it's better tonight. But I love, like, slow-cooked meat. Me too. And it kind of falls away. Me too. So that's what we're having, having like pulled chili brisket beef. And then we're having it. I feel like.

I never understood what brisket. Wait, what? Can you break that down? It's a part of the cow that we use a lot in Jewish world. But also. To make salt beef. It's really good for salt beef. And it's just really good if you slow cook it and it kind of, it away like almost like pulled pork yeah so sorry i'm sorry mom it's got a bit

of spice in it i put ancho chilies in it and the anchos are all right uh yeah i've got some sour cream anyway so we're doing that and then i feel like the jacket potato is the unsung potato. I do like a jacket potato. Me too. I do. I've done nothing fancy apart from my friend Laura taught me to always score them, put loads of sea salt on and put olive oil so they get a bit crispy. So we're having jacket potatoes, brisket, sour cream, cheddar cheese, and then this very crunchy, delicious radish, cabbage um kind of coleslaw but then i put avocado in there to just kind of cream it up with a really nice like limey dijon well actually i didn't have dijon so i put whole grain hi oh hi bubs this is my husband sam hi sam

oh shut up we know that you came back so you can meet cheryl come on now i feel like i've already met you can meet Cheryl. Come on now. No I didn't. He's actually cancelled acquired. I feel like I've already met you because I've seen you on Instagram. No and also he was with me when I was drunk. He probably pulled me away from you. Yes pretty much. How's it going?

Good. How's your honey? Hi darling. Wow. Is this from? Yeah, Cheryl. Wow, amazing. Do you have a nickname?

Do people call you Chez? Chez. Che call you Chez? Chez. Chez. Chez. That's a bit fancier. All me nieces and nephews call us Auntie Chez. Auntie Chez.

Auntie Chez. And all me friends call us Chez or Chezza. Chezza. Depends what they want from us. Actually, we should eat a bit. I don't really want something from you. Can I get some food? Yeah. I love how comfortable Cheryl is,

that we haven't even eaten yet, and she's got her trousers undone. Good for her. Not all of them, just me top two buttons. Top two buttons. No, honestly, because, I'm sorry, but they're, like, restricting. Oh, babe, take it or not.

Why did you wear those tight jeans? She made an effort, Mum. When you stand up, they're like, okay, is this what you do at the dinner table? No, not usually, so I do apologise. But I went out for dinner last night and I went, I ate so much. Where did you eat? Have you been to Coya? No.

Coya. Coya. Coya. No, you don't have to make it Jewish, Mum. Coya. Coya. Coya. It's Peruvian.

Peruvian. Okay. Peruvian. It isian. Okay. Peruvian. It is the best restaurant in London. What do you eat? Ceviche. So there's a tuna ceviche that I love. There's a sweet corn salad that I love.

A cake. I know this all sounds quite boring. No, no, no. No? No, but honestly, everything you order. Come on, you're about to sex it up. I know you are. Come on.

There's a Wagyu beef. Oh, yeah. They? No, but honestly, everything you order... Come on, you're about to sex it up. I know you are. Come on. There's a Wagyu beef... Oh, yeah. They do that very... Yeah, yeah. Is it like a slider, a Wagyu beef slider? No, but it's just chunks. No, I've seen it. They slice it up.

They do it like that, and it's just so melty now. Melty, honest to God. Then, the best part of my evening was they said, oh, by the way, we've changed the dessert menu, and I was never keen on the dessert menu anyway. I like okay let's have a look Cheerios okay that you dip in chocolate orange sauce oh my god and it worked it's the best I was already full and I ate it creme brulee with pineapple and popcorn caramelized popcorn on top yeah I'd like that where is this place it's facing the Ritz Hotel oh wow is it

really good oh well seriously and then a chocolate fondue cake there was four of us so we all got a dessert and we just shared are you a sharer? yeah I'm a sharer, you can have it don't ever share with Jessie, if we become a best friend she eats it before you even get it down on the table she doesn't mind, that's why it's going to work out well

because she knows you can have it you can have it I just want a taste yeah well Jessie pretends she wants a taste and then eats the whole lot yeah I do do that to my mother though

I'm quite sneaky with it you can't have tapas with Jessie as soon as it's on the plate everyone's eating slowly and she it's down we are going to eat.

Could I have a bit of cheese, darling? And there's some, a little garnish. Do you like coriander? I do now. Oh, shit. No, I do. I actually do. No, some people don't.

I do. I like it. I like it on me. No, some people actually. No, I know. Hate it. Me brother hates it. Okay, and there's butter.

Thank you. And then there's the crunchy thingy. There's some cheddar. Delicious. Would you like some sour cream? Yeah, why not? Okay. If it's got a kick to it. I love spicy, by the way. Do you? Oh my god. It's not too spicy because I had to like,

I like burn your mouth off spicy. How do you know? Jess, you have put hot sauce on everything. Me too. Tabasco on everything. No! You're one of those people! Cheryl! So no before you'd even taste it if it was on the table. No I may have one or two mouthfuls. But then you'll need it but that's because you have it all the time. You... I'm addicted. There is a flavour in there I can't put my finger on. Not cumin.

There's cumin in there. There is cumin. There is cumin. There's paprika. It's delicious. Cinnamon. I can taste the cinnamon actually. I put smoked garlic in there.

Just because. I'm going to pipe my deep cumin pie, darling. Okay. Mum's really making a... I mean she's piping. I've never done it in my life. I mean imagine mum if you can pipe that's going to really... If I can pipe it's going to be very cool.

Don't you just have to put stuff in the thing and then squeeze? That's what my boobs look like after breastfeeding. Just is there a plate I can put this on? How's your piping going mum? Come and have a look. Oh, I should do it. How's your piping going, Mum? Come and have a look. There she is. She's getting me sick. Do you watch people? Paul Hollywood.

Does she watch, what do you think, Cheryl? No! My God! What, are you going to put a C in the middle? Can I have a look? Yeah, look. I've never done it before. It's all over the bloody place. It's pretty good mum. She's done a C for Cheryl.

That deserves a round of applause. Oh my god. That is brilliant. Mum you're hysterical. Jessie you've got to ask her about table manners. And last supper. I mean, honestly, Cheryl, I could ask... I want you to stay the night, to be honest. Oh, yeah, would you like some key lime wine? I would love some. Just a tiny bit, I'm sure, Jessie. Maybe she doesn't want a tiny bit. No, but it might not be any good.

Mum, can you just do it? Because I'm going to get judged if I do it wrong. So can you just do it? Who's going to judge you? My mother. Have you not met her? Have you not been with her for the last two hours? Would you like a bit of extra cream on the side?

Yes please. I love you. See we're just making, this is all perfect for our friendship together. Oh my god that's really good mum. What does it taste like? Does it? That is the bomb. Is it?

Yes. Mum that's really good. Well I don't know, I've never made it before. Like me, me, my taste buds are tingling. There's like a party in my mouth. Yes. What she's doing. Cheryl has the most serious look on her face.

But this is... What? She's savouring it. Literally, she's looking at me. What would... I feel like maybe I know the answer to the main... Mean? Yeah, the rule. For... I know the answer to the main... Mean? Yeah, the roast.

For... You know the answer. You know the question that's coming up. What? Me last meal? Last meal. The roast and then this cute end price. What would be the starter? Would you even have a starter? If it was the last meal, I would, yeah. What would I have, though? though ceviche yeah from koya they owe you a bloody free meal i think bad i think they do by now anyways the amount of times

i've been in there has the industry changed massively hugely but like did you used to go to really amazing restaurants was it like the money was so different 16 years ago because it's all budgets budgets budget these days budgets budgets budgets there was it yeah was it more glamorous though yeah i think it was i think the best thing for me was i could go out without anybody having a camera phone there was no camera phones oh yeah so you could enjoy the night freedom and yeah freedom and fame does that make sense so you could do your music videos and your performances and then go to a club and people would say yeah but and we're saying an autograph like and yeah that was what was the best bit for me. Yeah. I could eat a dinner and peace.

People would be looking at you, but nobody could take a photo. Do you feel like people, like, were people taking photos last night? No. Oh, when we left, there was a paparazzi. Oh, Jesus. And I... So somebody calls them? Are they...

Or they just know famous people go to that restaurant? Because Rob always drives me. So I think when they see Rob's car and they're in town. They know your driver now. Oh man. Oh I feel a bit bad Rob hasn't eaten anything. Maybe we'll give him some key lime pie to take so he gets gets you to sorry. His wife does my makeup but she's a good cook. His wife does your makeup? You're fiercely loyal aren't you? You have your set you have your people around you. I do. Do wife does your makeup? Mm-hmm. You're fiercely loyal aren't you? You have your set, you have your people around you. I do. Do you do your own like that? Yes, I did it in the car. And I love your hair. Yeah your hair is great.

I had my hair blowed. I don't feel like myself if I don't have my hair blowed. I think I should do that darling. So you get blow-dries? Mm-hmm. I'm obsessed obsessed Is that all your hair I paid for it Technically I think you see that's what I need to do Maybe I need some extension No you don't darling You've got the thickest hair Yours looks very real

Yeah yours looks fabulous Let's just see how goth we are Because literally liz left it on for about an hour so that was delicious do you want some more it's good it's okay i mean look it hides so many gray hairs dear oh your father was gray when he was 30 yeah no it's very it's like a serious so many gray hairs is it because when you apparently when you have children and you stress out yeah that's what

the grey hairs are doesn't help the darker you are the whiter you go oh I'd be completely white now but I'll go to my box with black hair

I'm telling you yeah no way I'm going grey I'm telling you and a blow dry and a blow dry yeah what's your

go to kind of comfort food? Like, if you're feeling a bit shit. I like a Chinese takeaway. Michelle Keegan does too. And I like Michelle Keegan. So we should get together.

Have you met Geneva? I do. I did a thing on Coronation Street when she was in it. Did you? And I just, I love her. I've always thought she's a good actress. She's so lovely. But she puts mayo on her chow mein, and I'm sorry.

No. No. She was embarrassed about that, too. You get, I think, like, you just get habits from when you're grown up sometimes, don't you? Have you got a weird habit? Tabasco. Put tabasco on everything, yeah. I love tabasco.

Do you have one of those in your purse? Like, will you have it in your bag? I have had one in the past, yeah. I got hot sauce in on everything, yeah. I love Tabasco. Do you have one of those in your purse? Like, we'll have it in your bag. I have had one in the purse, yeah. I got hot sauce in my bag, swag. What do you least like about other people's table manners? Like, what's your worst table manner in somebody else? I don't judge anybody. That's the sweetest thing.

I don't. I don't believe you. Don't you? I do kind of believe you, but I want something more than that. No, but I wouldn't, like... Or if something irritated is a dinner with one of my family, I'd just say, stop fucking doing that. Yeah. Do you think you have good table manners? As I do.

I think there's an etiquette, isn't there? Like an unwritten certain amount. So will you be training your son and saying, like, don't put your elbows on the table. Don't put your hands on your lap. Not really. I mean, I think that they go through. Use your left and right foot properly, yeah. Yeah, and they get taught all of that stuff at school

and when you're at other people's homes and to be respectful in restaurants and whatever. But at home, I'm not going to judge him. If he wants to eat his dinner on the sofa while he's watching his Pink Panther or whatever, I'm not gonna judge him if he wants to eat his dinner on the sofa while he's watching his Pink Panther or whatever I'm gonna let him be are you best mate best and then I walk through the door and the excitement from his head to his toes yeah manomy dreams oh who do you like listening to, music-wise? Beyonce. Is she your ultimate?

She's your best. She's the best in the world. I think she's incredible. But not even just as a performer, as a woman. She's a good role model. I think she's just an incredible person. So, okay, so who were you listening to for this record when you were

making this record no I didn't I wasn't listening to anybody I was listening to music yeah

what I liked what I connected with and then just going from there they go to three four tracks be like oh I like

the second one and what like backing tracks yeah you know like or just a drum pattern and we'd be like oh like the second one oh what like backing tracks yeah you know like or just a drum pattern and we'd be like let's add this let's add it was just fun do you think like nicola's almost been like your a and r on this or do you think you're kind of your own a and r i mean only a and r yeah and there'll be music there'll be songs she's like wow i love this i think you should do this and i'll be like like, no, but we'd have conversations, for sure.

And I'd listen to her. But ultimately, I'd have to go out and perform it. So in the end, it was like between three songs. And I just couldn't... I was like, there's me three songs. When you say between three songs, what, for the... Oh, for the first single. Okay, for the first single.

Yeah. A&R-wise, there was no songs to not be put on the record. Literally every song we wrote, I've got. How many songs are on the record? Well, to be honest, the way the music industry works now, I haven't been around since Streamin's been around. That makes you sound so old doesn't it and that's mental but it's only been for four years since it's took off literally as I left

it come so I don't know really yet the way things are going to be received so I've got a body of work I've got got the songs, but I haven't said, yeah, I'm going to release the album. I'm just going to go song by song. Listen, I could chat forever, but I think you need to go home. I know, it's too hard. It's bloody back. I know. Poor thing. I'm okay.

You'd come out with this again. I'll just digest me laying back. Just a cup of tea. It was so good. I might have a cup of tea. What would you like? What kind of tea? I'm Northern, so I have strong but milky and one sugar, and I could drink tea all day.

Really? Proper tea drinker. Cheryl, thank you so much. I'm going to get you a cup of tea ready now. Thanks, sweetie. I love her even more and I didn't think it was possible to love her even more first of all she's pretty as paint I mean I don't think I've ever seen

as pretty a person in my life mum you need to talk about something other than her beautiful features she's also so easy yeah so sweet so engaging so charming funny funny bright as a button takes the piss out of herself yeah and just really such a lovely normal person she's surprisingly normal i mean she's got really good values yeah and good aspirations good values i just i think that this is a really exciting time for her with her music i didn't get to listen to it oh yeah was it brilliant it's a hit mum oh a banger

a banger um but no it it honestly was such a pleasure. And the most beautiful bunch of flowers. I've never seen such gorgeous flowers. And that wine looked very impressive. Yep. I've got that. It was called Wrath. Wrath. Grapes of Wrath.

Must have been. Oh, yeah. I got it. Wroth. Wroth. Grapes of Wroth. Well, potato, potato. Yeah.

Okay. My food, I feel like, was quite good. I think it was delicious. It didn't look impressive. Oh, no, no, no. Yeah. Okay. My food, I feel like, was quite good. I think it was delicious. It didn't look impressive. Oh, no, no, no, it did. It looked exactly how it should have looked. But that coleslaw was really nice, right? Yeah.

It was wonderful. I mean, it definitely had raw egg in it. And actually, the baked potato was very good with it. Mum, I'm very good at baked potatoes. Better than when you did it from Dermot. Did I do baked potatoes from Dermot? No, I didn't. It was not very good at baked potatoes better than when you did it from dermot did i do baked potatoes yeah no it was not very good okay well you've got your game tonight mum that key lime pie was special i don't know how it she she looked seductive when she actually it wasn't even such she looked kind of murderous but she looked at me and she kind of no but like the concentration it was like

beyond greg wallace enjoying a pudding cheryl really cheryl liked my key lime pie pudding bay yeah i'm pudding bay now you are you've taken the title and i don't even like puddings really did you see the piping yeah the piping was good was good. The C for Cheryl was really keen. I was going to do a circle and then I thought, no, we'll do C for Cheryl. I think she appreciated it. Yeah. They took a picture of it too.

Yeah. Probably be their album cover. If you are enjoying this podcast, please subscribe or give us a star, but only five stars will be accepted. Actually, four stars I'll accept, but only if you write a nice review under it. Jessie, we're five star. I'll accept.

Thank you very much for listening to Table Manners, and I'm Jessie. And I'm Henry, Jessie's mum. Because she didn't know the music you've listened to on Table Manners is by Peter Duffy and Pete Fraser and Table Manners is edited by the wonderful Alice Williams