Table Manners with Jessie and Lennie Ware - S9 Ep 28: Twiggy

Episode Date: August 12, 2020

On Table Manners this week, we welcome the iconic Twiggy. Mum was particularly excited about this one; they both grew up in the swinging 60's & mum admits to having dressed up as Twiggy in her school days. Twiggy spills the tea on her days of touring the world; winning 2 golden globes, turning down Steve McQueen for a dance and the time Sonny & Cher threw her a party in Los Angeles. Twiggy gushes over her mums savoury mince pie & her love of an artichoke. Check out Twiggy's brilliant new podcast ‘Tea With Twiggy’ now. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello and welcome to Table Manners. I'm Jessie Ware and I'm here with mum and we have the first supermodel ever to be on Table Manners. Jessie, she's been my icon since I was a teenager. Even though I had dark hair, it was much larger than her. I absolutely wanted to be twiggy, every girl did. We all wanted to have the Vidal Sassoon haircut, asymmetrical. I used to draw freckles on my nose with an eyebrow pencil and eyelashes underneath your eye. That was her thing. So you paint them on with eyeliner. That sounds very time consuming. It was. I mean, you looked almost like a doll. She's lasted throughout the years. I mean, she's still right up there and if you say the name

Twiggy everyone knows who she is yeah it's quite remarkable isn't it because she not only has been you know the first supermodel she was really quite short for a supermodel she was five foot six and she was incredibly successful a girl from Neasden London, and she went on to win, I think, two Golden Globes for her performance in The One and Only. And she also did Broadway. Did she? Was she in The Boyfriend? Yeah, which she talks about as being one of her kind of proudest moments, I think. Well, she was discovered by, I think his name was Justin deVille-Nerve, who was like her muse.

And he discovered her. It was her manager. Well, he became her manager, but he discovered her, I think, walking down Oxford Street. You know what his real name was? What? Nigel. Crikey.

So we have Twiggy coming up, who also has a podcast that she started called Tea with Twiggy. I wish we were having her over. I'd love to have seen her in the flesh. I wish we were having her over. I'd love to have seen her in the flesh. I know we could have had a nice tea couldn't we? Hello. Hello. So Twiggy where are you? So I'm just drinking tea. I'm at the moment in London where we mainly live. We have we have a getaway as well in Sussex so but the moment we're in London. Oh nice and you're having tea quite on brand Twiggy. Yes. Tell us about tell us about the old podcast. Well funny enough

the idea came from my daughter of course because you know she's your sort of age and um last summer we'd been out to lunch with mutual friends of mine but Carly has known since she was a little girl um we had a lunch a girly lunch and we we were just chatting about you know events that had happened in the 60s and 70s and laughing like you do when you all get together. And I hadn't seen one of the girls for about 30 odd years. So we had this wonderful lunch and just started laughing from beginning to end. And at the end, Carly said to me, mum, that was brilliant, you should do a podcast.

And I said, I probably said, well, I don't really know what that is. You know, it was like, you know, I don't live in that world. Anyway, we talked about it and I said, well, yeah, it's a good idea, but I, you know, I wouldn't really know what that is you know it was like you know I don't I don't live in that world anyway we talked about it and I said well yeah it's a good idea but I you know I wouldn't know where to start and how you do it and we kind of you know life took over and I got I was doing other things I was busy and I didn't really think about it and then my agent said to me near Christmas you know have you ever thought about doing a podcast so I told him that story and he said um I think it'd be a really good idea because you know I can talk for England as you'll probably find that's the best kind of

guess you can shut me up if you want anyway he put me together with my producer um actually just before lockdown so actually the timing was brilliant because lockdown happened and I thought well at least I'm doing something it does keep you busy and it keeps your lockdown happened and I thought, well, at least I'm doing something. It does keep you busy and it keeps your mind active. And I've become a very good cleaner as well. Yeah, really? But I don't really enjoy it. I quite like it, you know, I get me rubber gloves on and I hit those bathrooms.

And I actually quite like it. I put my music on. But it took me two days a day for upstairs and a day for downstairs I thought what am I doing this is exhausting what are you listening to when you're cleaning Twiggy oh gosh everything and anything I mean I'm you know I go back to old stuff as well so Joni Mitchell's kind of my my queen so I kind of got back into her albums and you know and the Beatles and Coldplay and there's a young lady called Amy Wad who I'm sure you know oh yeah I love Amy she did the music for Keeping Faith didn't she

yeah which that's how I got to know her because I sadly didn't know her and I started watching Keeping Faith which became my obsession last year on telly I just thought it was the best. Fabulous. Eve Miles was unbelievable. Twiggy you were such an icon I mean I think we're the same age but when I was a teenager you were a teenager and I wanted to be you so much I mean I could never have achieved that because my stature is not like yours but I used to paint on freckles on my nose eyelashes underneath my eyes did you used to paint the eyelashes on as well yeah because before I was discovered in 1966 at the age of 16 you know I was a school girl and like all teenage girls at the week I wasn't allowed makeup in sky went to grammar school so it was quite strict and we wore uniforms and makeup was not allowed so the weekends

me and my friends would sit like most teenage girls and play with makeup. And that's how that makeup evolved. So that was your look? That was my look. I was a mod, so I had long hair, probably about this length, but it was brown. But my eyes at the weekend, I'd paint because my mum and dad would let me go out on a Saturday night. That was the only time I was allowed to go out. And we used to go to a mod club in Harrow. And I had to be home by 10 o'clock. They were quite strict, quite rightly. No, I was only 14 and 15. And then when the whole thing happened to me, that's how I painted my

eyes. That was what I looked like. I mean, you know, if you look at those early pictures, I was a funny little thing. And I would never have gone to a model agency because in my head and it was true models came from posh families or middle class families yeah it was in those days it was all posh families who'd gone what was the name of the um the academy Lucy Clayton's Lucy Clayton everyone went to Lucy Clayton if you didn't go to secretarial college, if you weren't too sharp, you went to Lucy Clayton. That's right. Which was almost like a finishing school, wasn't it? But, you know, people like me didn't go there. Also, you know, models, if I'd have gone to an agency, if I'd have been brave enough, which I wasn't, I was five foot six and most you had to be at least five foot eight. which I wasn't, I was five foot six and most, you had to be at least five foot eight.

The minimum measurements were, I don't know, 34, 23. I don't know what they were, but I was, you know, I was this skinny little kid with funny little legs. So that was my look. And then when somebody kind of saw me and sent me to have my haircut that was the pivotal moment when that haircut was done and the photograph was taken it just for some reason and my nickname Twiggy which my boyfriend's brother used to call me to annoy me thank you for calling me Twiggy because you know once it was written in the paper it just went went stupid. You know, within six months, I was in Paris. It served you well, though. Oh, it certainly has. Phil's such an iconic name.

And everyone knows you across the generations. Twiggy, I wanted to ask, did you like the haircut when they did it? Well, it was funny because when I went in to have it shampooed and set, and Leonard saw me and he came over and he said, let me do my new haircut on you and I'd been growing my hair it was but it was probably about this long and I you know and I was very into my hair and for a moment I kind of went oh I don't know whether I want my haircut but I was so shy and I was in this very posh salon in Mayfair so I was a bit too shy to say I don't want it

done and I kind of nodded and I was I went back the next day and I was in there for seven hours where he cut it. And then I went up and had it coloured and then recut. And it was it was mad. And then at the end, Barry Lattergan took the photograph that has become quite well known now. And he put it Leonard put it up in the salon and a journalist saw it. That's how it all happened. And she came in and said, oh, I love the new haircut, Leonard put it up in the salon and a journalist saw it. That's how it all happened. And she came in and said, oh, I love the new haircut, Leonard. Who's the girl?

And he said, oh, it's a schoolgirl called Twiggy. And she said, I want to meet her. So did you have that thing where afterwards, you know, when you go to the hairdresser and you go, I love it. And then you go home and you cry. Were you like, fuck's sake, I've got this bloody hairdo or were you like no I actually loved it it I mean he was it looked gorgeous he was an amazing hair cutter I have to say but it was very short if you look at those early pictures I mean I had the long bit

at the front but the back was like a boy well it was like and then I had a little tail at the back which I loved you say that you're shy you were shy. Oh I was so shy. And I guess maybe being a being a school girl you know you were being so kind of bold with your makeup choices you know you had a look and then they gave you even more of the this the hair and you know but you you had like this creativity with how you painted your face and you seem so gregarious and confident do you think that's from being in the industry for so long or I don't know was it just your age do you think that made you shy or I was thrown from one very ordinary world a happy world I mean I lived at home with mum and dad I went to

school I loved school funny I wasn't one of those kids who didn't like I loved it and I was planning hopefully to go to art school I wanted to be a designer dress designer because I was obsessed with clothes my mum always made clothes and sewed my sisters did I've got two older sisters so I learned at quite a young age and then I became a mod about 13 and a half 14 and we had to make our clothes because there weren't shops where you could buy teenage clothes until Bieber your mama remember Bieber yeah Which was like going into seventh heaven to go into Bieber. It was Bieber and bus stop. Yeah. But before those, Bieber was the leader, really. There was nothing. Department stores sold clothes for your mum and children's clothes. There weren't teenage clothes. So Barbara Houlinicky, who was the lady behind Bieber,

who's one of my dearest friends, who I love to madness and is so talented. She was the one who started the high street for teenage clothes, really. She was as iconic. Bieber was as iconic. I mean, I used to come from Manchester, where I grew up, to London just to go to Bieber. Oh, yeah, absolutely. And they had only the small shop on Kent Church Street. Yeah, that's right. Until they took over Derry and Toms.

That's right. Well, the earlier one was Abingdon Road. That was tiny. And I had that Saturday job at the hairdressers where my sister worked. And me and the other junior, in our lunchtime, we'd jump on the tube, go two stops to Kent High Street, run down Abingdon Road and spend our tips in Bieber because you could buy a dress for £2.50 there was nothing like it it was just amazing don't you think we were lucky growing up

being teenagers in the 60s yeah absolutely my daughter always says it to me oh mum you were so lucky it was so creative and it was a real change a cultural revolution absolutely it was just amazing when you would get photographed did you feel comfortable in front of the camera or did you feel like I am here I have arrived this is what I've wanted always or was it quite uncomfortable the first photo which is the very famous photo you know where I'm looking at camera in that fair hour sweater that was my first photograph and I was very lucky because the man who took it happened to be one of the great beauty photographers of that era he was a young South African called Barry Latigan

and his lighting I mean as you know when you do video lighting oh you love a bit of light good lighting as kids in photography if you get the lighting right and the photographer right you know you're three quarters of the way there so I was very lucky that my first experience was number one with a very sweet, gentlemanly man. And number two, that he was a brilliant photographer. So, and I was very shy. And if you look at that picture, I'm just staring. All he said is looking to camera. And, you know, he told me what to do. I't do much and then over the next two or three months I worked with him quite a lot because he booked me because once that picture was released I had we had magazines and things ringing my mum in Neasden to book me because I didn't have

an agent I did you know you know I was a school girl I had to get permission from my mum and dad to leave school because I was being booked to go to Paris and then six months later to New York. And, you know, it all went bonkers in that first year. Which agency did you go with? I didn't. I was never with an agent. Oh, really? No, because my dad, my dad was from Bolton in Lancashire. He was gorgeous. I loved him so much. He was very sensible, very down to earth. And I had to ask permission to leave school. And rightly or wrongly, he said to me, you know, you may regret this, but this is a huge chance you're being given. And if I say no, you might end up, you know, hating me for it. But he said, you've got to realise that this could all blow away in three months, which it could have done.

You know, nobody knew. Nobody knew that it was going to roller coaster into what it did, least of all me. So, I mean, I was very lucky that I had their backing. And over those years, you know, when suddenly you're in Paris and you're working for American vote, I was 16 and a half and I was working with Richard Avedon, who was the, I think, greatest fashion photographer of that era. And I was nervous, but, you know, if people are nice to me, I get on with everyone. If people aren't very nice, I can be very un-nice back. So growing up in Neasden, who was at the dinner table with you and what were you eating?

Right. My mum, God bless her, who was lovely, but she had issues. Well, I think today we diagnose her as bipolar. She was fine for many, many months of the year, and then she'd have a depression. And they didn't really know how to treat it in those days. I mean, she ended up in the mid-50s having shock treatment, which was pretty shocking, actually. Yeah, terrible.

Tough on you. Well, but my dad, you see, was amazing because he was always there. And mum, most of you see, was amazing because he was always there. And mum most of the time was fine. So I was very close to mum and it was a very normal household. My sister Viv is seven years older than me. So we were quite close, but it's quite a big age gap. And then my elder sister was 15 years older than me. So she became like a second mum. And when mum had what we used to call her wobblies

and she'd have to go into hospital or whatever, Shirley was there. And so I'm very, very close to my sisters. So for me, it was a very happy childhood. It must have been really hard on my dad now as an adult, looking back what he had to deal with. And food-wise, I think like most women in that era she was she wasn't very good cook I mean actually her pies were amazing her apple and blackberry pie her

she was a really good pastry cook which is weird because I love to cook but I don't bake and I don't do pastry and things but you know things like vegetables but I think it was the era she used to boil any veg for like 25 minutes yeah and there was there was no variety was there there was just carrots or cabbage or cauliflower but I do believe very strongly that and with this whole new thing on obesity in this country, we didn't have fast food then. I bet you didn't have it as a little girl, did you? No, fish and chips was the only thing. That was the only fast food, but at least it was,

and we'd only have that once in a blue moon. But my mum would buy fresh food, you know, whether it be, you know, we'd have chicken, not that often, and you'd only have salad in the summer. Yeah. And your salad would be a leaf of lettuce a few chopped up bits of cucumber a tomato salad cream egg yeah a boiled egg and a piece of ham that was salad yeah and she used to make a wonderful savory mince pie that was my favorite when I used to come back from modeling trips you know it was ground beef chop up carrots and onions no garlic because I never tasted garlic till I

started traveling and then she'd make a pie you know a narrow pie with a pie crust oh it was so good have it with mashed potatoes and get and the other thing she used to make oh it's making I'm gonna have to make this and it's quite complicated she used to do boiled ham you'd get a thing of uncooked ham like a hock and you'd boil it in water to get the salt out and then piece pudding and she used to put the split peas in a muslin cloth and you'd put that in the ham water then boil it for about three hours and we used to have that with carrots and boiled potatoes that was amazing I think that's a really old dish I think that goes back to kind of Victorian days absolutely delicious so when you were traveling I mean you say you were kind of introduced to all

these different cuisines I can only imagine I mean I'm sure you've got so many memorable meals and things that you can't even tell us about that happened at those dinners parties and whatnot but is there one particularly memorable city where you felt like you discovered something that you adored during that time of modeling and traveling and then also have you got a nice meaty story for us with you know somebody somebody around the dinner table? I think the big revelation for me, because spaghetti in our house when I grew up was in a tin. So when the whole thing happened to me and I started eating out in proper restaurants, there's a wonderful restaurant in London. And it was a big, big place to go in those days called San Lorenzo in Knightsbridge.

Yes. Do you remember San Lorenzo? Yes. Is it still on Beaufort Street? Beach and Place. Beach and Place, that's it. Didn't we go there for a birthday once, Mum? We did, we went for a birthday and I think Princess Diana used to go there.

Always, yeah. Princess Diana used to go there. Always, yeah. Well, her, Mara, who was the wife of Lorenzo, she became a big confidante of Diana and they were huge, huge friends. And sadly, Mara's no longer with us. But Lorenzo, I think he's 91 or 92 now. And we became really close friends over the years.

But I was taken there so suddenly to actually taste proper spaghetti with amazing sauces and artichokes I mean I'd never heard of an artichoke or seen an artichoke it was like going into this wonderful world of wonderful food and what you could have and the dessert trolley I love a dessert trolley I wish they hadn't got rid of those. She, you know, she, they used to make theirs, the baglioni. Did you ever have that? Yes. Which is, is like a, a whipped up egg mousse with, um, macella. Oh, unbelievable. So that was the

big revelation for me. The worst story I can think of, and they they had they had to take me out of the restaurant screaming my first trip to Japan I would have been 17 you know we didn't have Japanese restaurants in England in those days we had Chinese restaurants but not Japanese so when we got to Tokyo which was an amazing trip and it was so funny because when I got off the plane there were all these little Japanese girls who'd done their hair like me and painted their faces like me it was sweet they had a twiggy look-alike competition so sweet but um they took us to what was supposed to be a really posh Japanese restaurant this whole fish was put on the table and they explained you had to kind of you sliced your bit of fresh whatever fish bit off and i saw it move it was still alive and i got absolutely hysterical and started screaming and they had to take me out the restaurant and they were mortified because i was like this

their special guest and they wanted to please you oh twiggy what would be your desert island meal with a starter a main a pudding and a drink of choice to start i would probably what do i love probably an artichoke actually because i was so amazed by them and i do a really good one where you get you have to slice the top of the leaves off you know the spiky bit and then you kind of open the leaves and then you make a mixture of wholemeal breadcrumbs extra virgin olive oil dribble not to make it so you can mush it around garlic and parmesan cheese mix that up you know it's not runny and then you stuff that down the artichoke leaves it's a bit messy and then you steam it in a steamer oh my goodness that sounds

great oh it's so good so I'd have that and then I'd have actually I've just learned to make um chicken piccata you know that's with a lemon caper sauce oh nice oh god it's amazing it's amazing is that just with a chicken breast yeah you just get you flatten it out you flatten it out i'd cut mine into kind of pieces because it cooks quicker you cook the chicken in a little bit of olive oil put that aside and then in that oil which has got bits of where the chicken's gone brown, you kind of scrape that down, add lemon juice, a splash of white wine, I do, garlic, capers, and you mix that down. What you do with the chicken, you dust it in flour first, so you get a bit of thickness in the sauce.

And then right at the last minute, you put the chicken back in. This is awful, it's making my mouth water. You sound like you eat well twiggy like i feel like i want to come over for dinner oh we do all right listen i really believe you are what you eat 100 i think i am what i drink to be honest well i like my glass of that's what i'd have a glass of rose because rose is my chosen tipple oh it's so lovely isn't it especially in the summer it's the best what was it like moving from being the first supermodel to then going into acting being up for a golden globe or two I got two and then yeah you won them right I did and then you did Broadway

I did and I mean did you feel like you was that was that always a bit of a dream to be an actress I didn't plan to do anything that I did you know that that's what and in a way I think that's that helped me because I didn't have this I've met people over the years who've, it's good to be ambitious. I'm not saying that, but I think people sometimes get eaten with ambition. And if it doesn't work out, they become very discontent, unhappy because it hasn't worked for whatever reason. But because what happened to me just happened, it was like a wonderful surprise all the time, a wonderful present given to me and I and I work very hard I'm not saying that I don't think you can be given those chances and not work at it and and and

make it work for you and and prove you've got a talent but when I the big change in my life was meeting an amazing director called Ken Russell who was a huge film director he was the biggest director in England at that time and he'd done films like Women in Love. If you've never seen it, see it. It's brilliant. And The Devils, which is a bit mad, but he became a great friend and I loved him to bits. And he gave me this huge chance. He cast me as the lead in a major motion picture thing of The Boyfriend, which was a Sandy Wilson musical. And I'd been to see it on stage, a stage version. And we were having dinner with Ken and his wife the next night.

And I was going on and on about this amazing show I'd seen. And Ken had a few glasses of champagne and said, oh, I've always wanted to do a musical. You can play Polly Brown and I'll direct it. And I just thought he was drunk. The next morning he called me and said, what do you think I said well I've never done that before he said well it doesn't matter he said I go off to singing lessons and which I did for a year I went to singing lessons and dancing lessons because I'd never danced in my life I could sing in tune I'd been in the choir at school and I loved that kind of period you know it's all 1920s so I I knew that style because one of my idols was a lady called Ruth Etting and most singers in that era had very

high soprano voices and Ruth Etting had this beautiful husky kind of and she had hits like Mean to Me which I'm sure you know that song and I'll Never Be the Same and Shine on Harvest Moon. I mean, she was huge. She was absolutely huge, major star. So that helped me in The Boyfriend. And also I had Ken as a mentor and, you know, he guided me through and all my actor colleagues were amazing to me because I was nervous. But the most frightening thing was doing Broadway.

God. Which was 10 years later. Why so? Because I'd done a pantomime, that's all. And that was pretty scary. Where was that? In the West End. I was Cinderella.

Of course you were. And it was fun, actually. But it was quite light. And it was just for a few weeks. But one of my co-stars in The Boyfriend, a guy called Tommy Tune, who is one of the great tap dancers in the world. And he became a very big theatre director on Broadway and has won so many Tony Awards for directing. in the mid 1980s he wanted to perform again and we'd become great friends and he rang me and said we tried to get a film going that we couldn't 10 years earlier and he rang me he said I think I've got our project together and I said oh when do we start filming he said no it's not a film it's on

Broadway and I said you must be mad I can't do that and he said there's no such word as can't pack your bags and get out to New York and it's a really good lesson actually because he's right there is no such word as can't and then I worked really really hard and we opened in May 1983 and luckily the critics loved us and we ran for two years on Broadway and it was all Gershwin music so it was gorgeous oh amazing but I wanted to know did you feel like the success that you had was a blessing and a curse did it feel like it detached you from where you grew up your friends that you hung out with to be fair that world ended my school friends I kept in touch with a few but but you know I you've got to remember when it happened to me I

was literally flying around the world and you know I was being given parties where you know Clint Eastwood was there and and Barbara Streisand and you know it was mad did you meet Barbara I did tell me tell me Sally and Cher threw me a party on their lawn in Los Angeles. What did you eat? What did you eat? Can't remember. I can't. It was a daytime party.

The funny thing about that, your mum again will know who this is. There was one of the biggest film stars of that era was Steve McQueen. Oh, yeah. He was. Even Jessie knows that. Yeah, I'm sure you do. He was gorgeous. But, you know, I was just 17 when this all happened and we were at the party and I was with my boyfriend anyway.

Anyway, Steve McQueen turned up on his motorbike on the lawn and we somehow got introduced and he asked me to dance and I said no. You're mad. Swiggy, biggest regret of your life? Probably not. In hindsight, not really. You've had such a fabulous time.

So I don't regret what happened to me because look at the life I've had. I mean, obviously I've had really sad moments. You know, my first husband died. You know, he was an alcoholic and it killed him in the end. And that was, there was a few very tough years through that. But, you know, that's alcoholic and it killed him in the end and that was there was a few very tough years through that but you know that's part of a life you learn from that I also through that relationship got one of the lovers of my life which is my daughter who I love and adore to madness Carly yeah my Carly yeah Twiggy I don't want you to think I'm nosy but through the mirror

behind you yeah is that a reflection of an enormous bookshelf yeah that's that is a mirror and that's crikey you're a big reader we both are actually yeah I never not have a book on the go is that does that make sense so what what's on the go at the moment I've just started a new um Santa Montefiore oh yeah I love her that that's Kate Middleton's no it's not no not. No. Whose sister is she? Tara Palmer Tompkinson. Oh, yeah, it's Tara. That was awful.

But she's a wonderful writer. So I read... I like that sort of book or I like a good thriller. Me too. That's... My husband always says that's why I married him.

Is he thrilling? Is he a thriller? He's pretty nice. Is he acting still? No, he kind of... He's pretty nice. Is he acting still? No, he kind of, he's slowly got, you know, he still gets off of things, but he's been writing for a while. Jessie, have you seen Twiggy's husband? No, I haven't.

He's gorgeous. Well, yeah, of course. He was a very good actor. He just, you know, he did it. You know, he's in his mid-70s now, so he just said, I felt, he said he always promised himself that if he got to the point where he wasn't loving it and passionate about doing it he would he would kind of ease off yeah if social media had been a thing in the 60s yeah you are so full of

personality and you're brilliant do you think that there was a certain mystique around you that was quite fun to play into um or do you think would you think you would have got on quite well with social media you're on it now no i mean jesse she was on the front of every magazine you couldn't miss twiggy i know she was everywhere i know but there was that certain like there must have been that certain mystique and that cut off. Yeah. People didn't know what you were doing. You could be more private.

Yeah. And it's actually the part of social media that I, to say, don't approve of. But I think there's a danger in parts of social media where people give and tell you everything, from what they're eating to what they're wearing. I mean, I think people have to be very, very careful about how much of themselves they give. Otherwise, you don't have a life.

You know, I made a decision many, many years ago that my life with my husband, my family, was the number one important thing. And certainly when I had Carly, she became the most important person in the world. And if it worked for her, with her, then I could do it. If it didn't, I didn't do it. And when I met Lee, luckily we met in 1985, having gone to, I'd gone through, you know, being a widow and he'd broken up with his lady a few years before so we were both single which was

very lucky and we both made a decision that if we were going to make it work together if he got a really good job I'd go with him and I'd turn down things because we didn't want that separation for months you know if it was a few weeks that's some one thing but if it was going to be months which sometimes jobs were we'd do it together so when he was playing broadway i went out to new york with him and i i went out as his wife and i had a great time it was brilliant and i did some i mean i did while i was out there that time i actually met a lovely producer and we did we did an album of show tunes and things. So I did little bits, but I wanted to be with Lee. And then when I got something, you know, a gig that taught me,

Lee would come with me. So that's why we've been together for 35 years. Oh, wonderful. Yeah, muzzled off. That's amazing. No, we were very lucky to meet. Very lucky. Speaking of show tunes, karaoke,

what would be your show tune that you would sing i've never done karaoke and i'm probably never gonna do it what would be mine all right so then you can choose any song and we'll never hear it that's true um it would probably be an old song or maybe a beatle song i could do yesterday i know all the words there you go oh no i know i know what it would be now because I sing it to Joanie somewhere over the rainbow, which she loves. When she's going to sleep, I sing it to her. Is your granddaughter called Joanie? Yeah, after Joanie Mitchell.

How old is she? Five. Oh, great. And she's the new love of my life. Oh, I know that one. Twiggy, before we leave you, I'd like to ask you, do you think you've got good table manners? Oh, yeah, I think so. I think, again, growing up in that era, you know, we just learnt table.

We sat at the table. We called it tea every night. It wasn't called dinner. We always had to sit at the table and, you know, use a knife and fork and finish as much as we could on our plate and then put our knife and fork together yeah I think I have and hopefully I've taught our children the same um Twiggy um thank you so much for chatting oh it's been such a delight for me best of luck thank you for having me thank you I can't wait to hopefully meet you in real life sometime oh what a lovely woman lovely woman the warmest. I'd never seen an interview with Twiggy.

Oh, Jessie, she's dead normal. She's so normal. She's just really gorgeous, yeah. She's like all my mates' mums and like, she's just really nice. I loved her. Thank you, Twiggy. And if you want to hear more stories from the 60s, the swinging 60s, you can listen to her podcast

called tea with twiggy god if steve mcqueen had come up on his motorbike and asked me to dance christ i'd have got on the back of the motorbike and said take me away steve wouldn't you oh man thank you so much for listening to table manners we'll see you very soon lots of love take care Take care.