Tabs Out Cassette Podcast - Bonus Episode: Aaron Dilloway | 1.24.21

Episode Date: January 25, 2021

We tried to interview Aaron Dilloway of Hanson Records but he mainly just walked around his house and showed us tapes. It was an honor and a pleasure. ...

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Tabs out. Bonus episode. Too spooky. Way too spooky. I'm ready. Tabs out. Cassette Podcast. Bonus episode. I am Mike. I'm Jamie. I was going to say herewith because you always fuck that up, Jamie,
Starting point is 00:00:38 but you got it. How are you doing, Jamie? I'm well. I'm doing well. That's good. First bonus episode of 2021. And I figured, why not start it off? Why not invite a nice guest over? You know, why not have company? So we have...
Starting point is 00:00:58 I'm sorry, I'm looking all over my soundboard for the clapping. Aaron, my name is Aaron. I know, I know what it is. But I was trying to give you a proper, like of these aaron dilloway whoo thank you yeah i i'm sorry go ahead oh i just said i'm honored you should well yeah not not a problem um i don't know if you remember this but like because this is a long time coming this whole this this interview this meeting yeah okay when tabs out first started like eight years ago we had agreed we were going to do an interview and you stood me up and like just sitting at the computer and never showed up for it and like oh no really yeah man oh and Oh, and then we never spoke of it.
Starting point is 00:01:45 I never brought it up to you. You never brought it up. I figured, ah, whatever. Oh, shit. I'm so sorry. Yeah, maybe it's for the best, you know. Like, it gave me time to, it gave the podcast the time to come into its own.
Starting point is 00:01:58 So now we can do it now, eight years in the making, right? Holy shit. I know. Oh, man, I'm really sorry. So let's fucking start this thing off man i got it all primed so um aaron dilloway do you like um you like uh like tape tapes you like tapes yeah sure yeah i like tapes eight years man that's all i came up with i know you like taste man i that's why we're having you on here i also want
Starting point is 00:02:25 to know tell me what's going on with with you with uh like quarantine what's been going on well i was planning on releasing a bunch of new tapes and i did like four at the beginning of of uh the lockdown and then my duplicator the one I've used for like 10 years, 13 years, finally bit the dust. No. After everything that's been dubbed on it, it's done for, huh? So all my Hanson tapes, they're all done from the same duplicator. Is that right?
Starting point is 00:02:59 Totally. Oh, yeah, because we got to know, us tape freaks, we got to know if there's a new duplicator being made. I got to make a note. Jamie's going to be on Discogs. He's got to know, us tape freaks, we got to know if there's a new duplicator being made. I got to make a note. Jamie's going to be on Discogs. Except for the last few, which were done just on my cassette deck here, but then I
Starting point is 00:03:15 think I did the last, I don't know, probably like 40 or 50 orders I was getting for tapes. I just did high speed on my cassette deck over here. But then those started fucking up and I think
Starting point is 00:03:32 I blew the... The belts. It's always the belts. It's not the belt. It's the heads. Oh, it's the heads? Yeah, there's something... It's just fucked up. What it's the heads? Yeah, there's something. It's like, it's just fucked up. What the hell is it?
Starting point is 00:03:46 Like rotating fucking. You want to open it up? You want to open it up to have Jamie take a look at it? Maybe I'll send it to you. Yeah. Yeah. I'll do my best. Anybody ever clown you with like an oomba?
Starting point is 00:04:02 Not in a while. I used to get it a lot. When were big i did yeah so tell me uh it's to aaron dillaway i've been seeing you playing what do you got like chickens now playing your music for you yeah what's that all about yeah got a couple what are you a farmer now i've always been a farmer i grew up on a farm did you you really? Oh, that. Okay. So tell me. That's, oh my God.
Starting point is 00:04:28 Listen to this. But I'm not a farmer at all. No. No way. You grew up on a farm. And what is this tape here? Tractor cuts. That, well, on the cover, that's Malachi from Children of the Corn. Oh, that's Courtney Gaines, isn't it?
Starting point is 00:04:40 Yeah. Yeah. And what else? He was in Fast Time. What's the one I picture him in a painter's cap? Yeah, yeah. And what else? He was in Fast Time. No. What's the one I picture him in a painter's cap, like with a skateboard? I think my picture's in Fast Time. But yeah, that's all sounds of my grandfather's tractor.
Starting point is 00:05:01 So this is a farm tape here, then. Yeah, yeah. You are a farm boy have you always been making music with these chickens then no not really maybe i we used to have a little snare drum out there that i would just for that was like their little uh treat bowl pretty much so i throw it on there and they snap at the snares have you been recording have you been recording these guys not too much no but then it was like a early in the pandemic it was kind of um you know uh it was didn't want to it was a lot of going out in the backyard and
Starting point is 00:05:41 just staring at chickens to just chill out you know to just try to calm your nerves you mean yeah totally yeah they're like little lava lamps do you usually let them in the house um no no but was that those two um they're really good ones and uh i was bringing them in the house to record for a little bit and then uh john abby asked me to do a track for that amplify thing and so i was working on that and then got asked by ben to do the the uh quarantine concert thing so yeah, no, I don't want to. I don't want to. I don't want them to be my new main instrument or anything. Gotcha.
Starting point is 00:06:34 I was going to ask, are they the instrument, or is it like a collab? It's a collab, for sure. Is the chicken the instrument, or is the chicken the instrument or is the chicken the artist this is the kind of shit I think about man this is keeping me up all night
Starting point is 00:06:50 I probably should have given them higher billing yeah Thank you. I'm going to go ahead and get back to the car. Thank you. I'm going to go ahead and get back to the car. and like where did you go from there because i let's trace your steps here and jamie you get his wikipedia open in case we need to add anything. Yeah, I will. Okay. Born in Ann Arbor. Lived in South Lyon, Michigan until I was eight.
Starting point is 00:10:19 Then moved to Brighton, Michigan when my parents bought my grandma's house. And then moved to Ann Arbor when I was like 18, 19 that around when hansen started when you started the label yeah yeah okay so does it does it predate does it predate the oomba people yeah totally okay okay geez back up man i don't know that was it was it was frustrating time period when that record came out oh yeah that was like 98 because my sister was really into that yeah awk andrew um became buddies with those guys and told them about the label and was trying to get some sort of fucked up collab going but is it was awk at ann arbor guy yeah yeah yeah was there already like a noise scene going that you, when you got there, like who was, who was the bulb scene? Yeah. Um, I mean,
Starting point is 00:11:13 it was more noise rock, I guess, or noisy rock, but I mean, they were the guys who, you know, turned us on to incapacitance and educate on i mean really everything we uh when we were in bright in high school we would go to ann arbor to go to shows and we went to a basement gig that the laughing hyenas were playing and uh uh this band was opening called couch and jim magus comes walking by with a keytar you know he's wearing a suit he's got his nerdy glasses on holding the keytar and we're just like what the fuck is up with this guy and uh then they just you know to me it was just total straight noise it was
Starting point is 00:11:58 it was total freak out and uh, it kind of blew my mind. Then I found that I had a week or two later, I went to school kids in Ann Arbor and they had the record there. But like at that same time, like at that show was like Twig and Nate were at that show, but we didn't know each other. We were all, you know, in high school coming together.
Starting point is 00:12:24 It was this house called The Lab that that show was at. And I think Twig lived there at the time. And then, let's see, just kept going to the record shop in Ann Arbor. And Jim Magus was working at School Kids. Him and Jeff Walker from Graitar work both worked at school kids and would turn us on to noise stuff you know jim jim eventually moved over to borders and at the ann arbor borders used to be able to go in there and get like gross tapes you know i i got i got my copy of borders book and music like the chain store? Yeah, yeah. It was the original Borders in Ann Arbor.
Starting point is 00:13:07 It was the very first one. Oh, look at that. It's kind of like the original Dunkin' Donuts in Boston. Yeah. So the original Borders in Massachusetts had noise tapes? In Michigan, Ann Arbor. I'm sorry, what did I say? You said Massachusetts.
Starting point is 00:13:21 I'm sorry, that's because I was talking about Dunkin' Donuts. But the original Borders michigan had sold noise tapes because of maggots yeah yeah it was like i remember um i mean you used to be able to get that stuff at tower too well maybe not gross tapes but you could get like you'd go to tower you'd get all the like alchemy imports you know gero cds for like 33 or something but um no magus was working at borders and they would have i got my copy of the three temples there that that uh do you have that you just turn around and look at for your copy of the three temples no you said three temples and it sounds so scary i got scared
Starting point is 00:14:05 oh it's a it's a gross uh three three cassette tape on gross that's like uh it's like alb uh asana oh god i can't remember i don't have it anymore unfortunately um like once we saw couch um and got the record i would go back and and jeff from uh gravatar would be like well you need to check this out and hand me the first carolina record you know and then that got me trying to uh do shit at home. And I was really into Pussy Galore too. So I started doing like kind of junk metal, you know, banging on my guitar with drumsticks and stuff like that. And I made a tape under the name Galen
Starting point is 00:15:01 that had kind of like some pause button tape loop stuff um some uh like samples from the shining and shit like that junk guitar um and i sent a demo tape to bulb records and he rejected it but he sent he sent me a test pressing though he sent you a test pressing, though. He sent you a test pressing of what? Of this prehensile monkey-tailed skink record that was coming out. For a split second, I thought you were saying he rejected it, but he still got a test pressing. That's what I thought, too. That's what I thought, too. Jesus Christ.
Starting point is 00:15:39 At that point, you committed to so much. Just go through it. Just make it, man. Yeah, just make another copy. No, but it was a one-of-a-kind tape you know it was like i didn't think to make myself a copy oh you gave me and i kinda i recorded like you know these pause button loops right onto the onto the master tape and then sent it to him and he still has it uh mark morgan was hanging out with him sometime last year and sent me a uh video over the phone of them listening to it and i was nice man
Starting point is 00:16:12 put it out i don't want that to no that that that one's rough well you wouldn't want like it was it's a little too like ween you know what do you like it's it's just too fucking goofy man i would like to hear it you don't cartoon cartoon voices and shit yeah you don't think you'd like to release now like a kind of an artifact that that led you hold on because let me show you here's where you are. Let me show you where we've gotten to. Yeah, yeah. That kind of sounds like... Just kind of went back to the dead roosters.
Starting point is 00:17:01 That's what the dead roosters sounds like. What are you saying right here, by the way? Yeah. Right here. What are you saying right here by the way what yeah right here what are you saying right there i don't know man i don't remember i was freaking out i have no idea © BF-WATCH TV 2021 I don't know. © BF-WATCH TV 2021 Thank you. We're still in Michigan now. I know at some point you're in Nepal, right? End of 2004. Because I definitely want to get to that point, because Jamie, I know you wanted to talk about
Starting point is 00:20:00 the sounds of the Indian snake charmer tape. Oh, yeah. Well, that's Indiaia but you you did do some recordings in nepal recorded in nepal oh these were in nepal the snake charmers uh they were from india they were traveling through i got it right here yeah this is um this is one of my favorite tapes just so you know i really enjoy it thanks oh yeah i love that one so that i was just walking i would pretty much every day i would walk around tamel which is like the center of katmandu and um just look for sounds just walking around with my i had a mini disc recorder at the time and this really nice stereo mic. And I eventually met these Snake Charmer dudes
Starting point is 00:20:48 and was like, can I record you? And they're like, yeah, give us some money. And so I recorded them and then they said, come back tomorrow. And so I come back the next day and they had their full family they had uh their grandfather and uh one of their sons with them oh very cool and so i recorded uh all four of them and then we did that for about a month i would go and record them every few days and sometimes i'd pay them with cash sometimes I'd buy them uh cokes sometimes I'd uh buy them cigarettes I traded uh t-shirts uh button-down shirts to them for recording I tried to uh I had a
Starting point is 00:21:40 um I would go back and then I'd master these tracks every night and then I tried to make them CDRs to sell because I was like you guys can sell these and they're like no, no, just give us some money Oh they weren't interested at all in selling, did they say why they weren't interested No, I don't think they wanted to carry him around they were trapping with like like 19 snakes or something okay so like were they trying like you said you're doing this for months was it like was it like building up was it becoming more and more like the like of a of an event every time you would like record it or oh no no it was just that's what they did
Starting point is 00:22:26 you know they would it was always a bit of a show whenever they record or whenever they performed we would go down the side alley and i would put i set them up so that uh like like here's here's a horn player and here's a horn player okay so you have the stereo and then then this is a percussionist and this is a percussionist just so you know just so you know aaron the podcast is an audio media i know i know i'm just showing you guys okay then then the the stereo mics right there so they're like swaying you know at the at the uh cobra and so that's why the it has that kind of weird stereo tremolo oh okay throughout it because which which i think you pick up more on the lp because the um the cassette tape has i think one track that's from a video so that's just got the kind of open air okay
Starting point is 00:23:27 recording but yeah i have a bunch of video footage of them too you told me something once i might be misremembering this but like that this tape like howard stern played this tape or something oh yeah okay that's right i was fully i was fully prepared for you to be like what are you talking you didn't you tell me that right now i did no didn't you tell me that and send me the little snippet of it no you sure uh yeah okay some i i always unless this is kind of like i've never seen the movie looper but unless this is a looper situation, this might be what loopers about and you do tape loops. So this is all coming together.
Starting point is 00:24:11 Makes sense. Yeah. This is all starting to come together. No, I didn't remember what the reason was, but they were talking, they mentioned snake charmers and then whoever's a sound guy immediately like whipped up a sample of what are those called drops yeah yeah you know
Starting point is 00:24:29 played it for like 15 seconds Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. and are you still running you still at the shop got the shop yeah it's not we're closed until the shit clears up okay what's what kind of restrictions selling on discogs you know we could be open if we wanted but i just don't fucking trust people enough yeah i guess it's probably assuming it's like a independent record store it's cramped as hell probably like yeah yeah and it's on it's on a second floor you know it's like three tiny little rooms up there. Yeah, you don't want to mess with that. I don't need people up there. I don't want to be around anyone. No, I'm with you.
Starting point is 00:29:51 I really am. Right now, at least. Yeah. You got a one or two with COVID. I mean, it's not just about going into the store, but you're constantly chomping on these contact mics. Yeah, yeah yeah you're gonna have to start watching this for 20 seconds yeah are you gonna continue to breathe in it people
Starting point is 00:30:11 you can you should start billing yourself as america's most dangerous noise artist because you're just willing to put these things in your mouth i think um i think there's a few others that could probably beat me out of that title. I'm not going to smash glass on my face. That's for sure. He's from Australia. Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Starting point is 00:30:34 Okay. America's. Yeah. Oh, man. It was pretty incredible. The first time he played, he played our house in Ann Arbor, our basement. And we had no idea what he was going to do. Matt St. Germain booked it, and he was just like, you just need to go out and get a sheet of glass.
Starting point is 00:30:53 He needs a sheet of glass. I'm like, what the fuck? This is Justice Yeldman we're talking about. Justice Yeldman, yeah. Okay, I'll stop right there because I have a quick question. If you book him, you have to provide the glass? Well, either provide it yeah or going we we actually took him to uh to a um home depot and he he bought the glass okay okay
Starting point is 00:31:14 i was just like yeah imagine hospitality rider yeah it would make sense to have on your rider but no it was it was pretty nuts because we were all just like kind of it was like eight people in a basement just kind of like not knowing what the hell was gonna happen oh you had no idea at all that no we had no idea what he did i imagine it's it's it's even more awkward when it's so few people oh yeah because it's easier to share an experience like that with an entire group it was super intense yeah and i don't think he did so much of the like it didn't sound like a space trumpet you know he didn't have his technique so down it was like it was really crude and and pretty fucking scary yeah what would you say is like the most bizarre noise set you've ever seen um oh oh totally um um john duncan brian lewis saunders
Starting point is 00:32:15 collab okay yeah i've seen brian lewis saunders live it made me feel very uncomfortable yeah three people passed out during that set i almost passed out like old ladies were their old ladies there who got the papers no it wasn't old ladies no it was it was just you know healthy looking adults what happened um shit this is like a whole episode it was it was nuts i mean it was it was um you want me to you want me to give the lowdown no i want to have a podcast and nothing's on it well basically basically um brian had made all these videotapes of himself being tortured in his garage oh maybe i don't hear it by uh different techniques you know you open the can of worms up man i gotta change my mind different torture techniques and he had a
Starting point is 00:33:14 four four screen four screens of him being tortured with the sound of all four of them going at once um then john came out and was doing these like intense uh deep tones then they brought brian out on this platform and he had a a metal he was like laying down in his underwear who's bringing who's bringing these people out? There were four people. John Duncan and I think a couple of the promoters or curators of the fest. They bring him out on this bed that he's kind of strapped into, this metal bed. But he's sitting up with his legs straight out. But it's got this metal helmet around his... It just looks like a big pipe that his head is stuck in, pretty much.
Starting point is 00:34:12 It's really, really shitty looking. And in a good way. Very, very freaky. And then he started reciting all these Guantantanamo like torture techniques and stuff like reading the actual like enhanced interrogation rules and regulations and shit and then like john duncan starts like tasing him he touched in the middle of it yeah and it's just way too scary it was intense it was intense there's some video of it on YouTube. And a good interview with Brian from after it.
Starting point is 00:34:50 I mean, I think all you need is a good Behringer mixer, a couple of distortion pedals. You don't have to get all, Jesus Christ. Come on. Don't go crazy about it. It's hard. I had to play after that. You played after that?
Starting point is 00:35:05 Yes. How'd your set go it was amazing it was super fun yeah nice there was a buffer in between us thankfully there was one set in between us oh everybody needed to kind of decompress a little bit yeah after experiencing torture like if anyone had any shit they had to deal with there was a drunk skinhead screaming fuck off at him the entire time too the entire time the entire time huh yeah that sounds about right it was it was it was a heavy gig but not the not the scariest or darkest what happened to the drunk skinhead um he got right up to the front and we were all kind of watching him and I mean at first I was a little worried because Brian's kind of in a vulnerable position you know but then again John's on stage with a taser so I think they could have
Starting point is 00:36:01 handled themselves but he about the time he got right up to the front of the stage, the set was over. And then I think he got kicked out. But that was, yeah, that was a crazy set. No, it sounds tight. But the scariest show I ever saw. What is a scarier show?
Starting point is 00:36:20 Anal Cunt. Oh yeah? What was your Anal Cunt experience? What year? 95? Okay. Yeah, maybe 96. Was it scary because of who was there? It was the last show at this club called Zoot's that was like the punk indie noise coffeehouse venue in Detroit, like anyone from crawl unit to the makeup would play there.
Starting point is 00:36:51 And this was their last show at that venue. And it was 7,000 dying rats and anal cunt. And we got there. Seth was throwing a cinder block in the air. Like this dude got hit in the head throwing a cinder block in the air. Like this dude got hit in the head with a cinder block. He's out on the porch crying and bleeding. His girlfriend's, you know,
Starting point is 00:37:13 freaking out. And there's like these asshole meat heads, like what the fuck do you expect? You come to an anal cunt gig, you know? And, uh, people are just throwing shit.
Starting point is 00:37:23 You know, they're like, let's trash the place last night at zoots let's trash the place then the owner of zoots who's um who was uh it's not kevin monroe that played bass in the hyenas and mule but his his brother i guess he gets up on the on the bar holds a gun up in the air it It's like, you want to trash something, go trash that white van outside. And then someone was like, don't trash the white van at 7000 Dying Rats Band. Oh, Jesus Christ. And then my girlfriend at the time was like, get me the fuck out of here.
Starting point is 00:38:03 And I was like, yeah well I mean actually that makes me think about actually a very bizarre noise show was um in Flint Michigan it was like I think it was Wolf Eyes PBK and Cocky SP and Cocky SP drove like 13 hours straight to the gig like got there came in played the gig you know they're like four minutes set got back in the car and drove home okay that night was just like the fuck you know they came they drove 13 hours to play for like 14, 15 people in Flint, Michigan, and immediately just got in the car and drove home. That was pretty fucking weird. No, that's just what their style was at the time.
Starting point is 00:38:57 It was amazing. It's very odd that you would choose that style, where you get to drive 26 hours. Yeah, that's just i think i have nightmares that are similar to that um so you were saying earlier you you did put out some tapes on hansen this year i totally i have totally missed out on anything you released this year what what came out i should send them to you yeah if i if I get something that can dub again, I will. I put out my At Wave Farm cassette. I put out a collab with myself and Sea Lavender.
Starting point is 00:39:35 I put out Christian Mirande tape and a Navarri Butcher's cassette. Thank you. Thank you. so Thank you. I wanted to ask about Hanson tapes. Okay. Do you still have the original template that you use for all the J cards? Yes. Can I see it? Yes. I want to look at it. Go get it.
Starting point is 00:43:09 I want to see it. He's got to get out of his safe. Well, I've got, I've got, no, that's, so I guess I have multiple templates. A lot of them are like a copy of a copy, but I can let you in on a, God, I don't know if I should let you in on this. Do it.
Starting point is 00:43:23 Let me in. I won't tell anyone. Hold on you in on this secret. Do it. Let me in. I won't tell anyone. Hold on a sec. No one listens to this. Jamie, what kind of secret do you think we're about to get? You think he's just not going to come back? I'm just thinking about Brian Lewis Saunders right now. I don't know much about him.
Starting point is 00:43:42 I'm Facebook friends with him, and he just seems like a totally normal guy i don't know about that i know not i know nothing about him now all right sorry that took so long yeah it took a really long time i grabbed a couple things a couple other things that um what do you got i can send you like uh some pictures that you can tweet along with the episode or something. Please do. I love tweeting. But, um, God,
Starting point is 00:44:08 I don't know if I want to give this away. Come on, man. It's eight years. It took to do this goddamn interview. Show me something good. What is this? This just looks like a tape to me.
Starting point is 00:44:18 The Rolling Stones. Oh, you made a Hanson edition of a Rolling Stones boot leg. No, this is where it came from. Oh, wait. Oh, this is the original? This was a bootleg. It's a five cassette tape set that I got of Rolling Stones.
Starting point is 00:44:40 This was like an old 80s or 70s or 80s bootleg. And look at that. The spine. Tape template. I have chills right now. I have, Aaron, I have chills. Aaron, I have chills right now. We're looking at history.
Starting point is 00:44:55 This should be in a museum. Look at this. Take it out. Do you have to put on gloves to take it out? Is it a white unlabeled tape? Oh, it's a... This is 90s, I guess. Just your standard blank.
Starting point is 00:45:13 Yeah, but it's on nice paper. Gray cardstock. It's got the... You know, a little info there. But but yeah that's where i got it i totally ripped it off from that i'm kind of tearing up i'm kind of tearing up seeing it it's beautiful it's beautiful that was awesome i brought some other things this is is a... Before Hanson, I had a label called Sasquatch. Okay. Anybody ever clown you like that, I forget.
Starting point is 00:45:50 What? Oh, shit. All right, I'm never going to say it again. All right, what was the thing before Hanson? What is this? Sasquatch. Oh, Sasquatch. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:46:03 This is an unreleased compilation tape on Sasquatch that I started Corned it's called is that another Children of the Corn I can't remember what I think it was some joke that me and Jim Magus had come up with who's on this comp
Starting point is 00:46:18 it's got Galen Marlon Magus Duotron i think flying lutenbockers maybe jamie is it it was more it was like the no way b era you know make sure that's on this guy and i already started yeah this is not the first uh sql1 is okay it's on discogs what's sql1 uh that was the first galen tape which was my high school band okay this is very which was the first noise stuff i did under the name galen but then that turned into like a weirdo rock band ah um so you said that i did before we get too far away from it that it was a five tape rolling stones thing yeah it was a five tape did all the spines look the same
Starting point is 00:47:11 like that on all five tapes yeah it was all yeah they're all kind of scattered around now but this there's one or two that i have i came across recently i love it i love it i feel like this is an exclusive it is it is i feel like this is a goddamn exclusive i've only shown this to people who've come over to my house oh jesus christ you tell me i'm the first person to remotely see this ever yep yeah jamie how do you feel right now yeah are you just completely shook i'm a little shook I'm fucking shook I'm fucking shook I'm just completely fucking shook
Starting point is 00:47:48 the man himself the contact mic chomper himself now what is this I see Hanson 04 yeah this is um the sinus this was uh me and my friend Dustin Dorsey.
Starting point is 00:48:05 Do you have any way to just put these on and have it play through your audio of your laptop or whatever you're using? Yeah, I can scoot over. It'd be so embarrassing if you didn't have a tape deck. I don't have one that records right now. I can play. If anyone's listening, by the way, send this man a new tape deck to dub. Please.
Starting point is 00:48:32 After everything he's done for us. Yeah. Oh, shit. It's been so long. The label came off. Jamie, make sure you're getting that. There's a cool, exciting thing under here. So check this out.
Starting point is 00:48:48 Is it a recycled tape or something? It's world-class tapes, C10. World-class tapes was in Ann Arbor, Michigan. This is where we would get all of our tapes duplicated. The only thing I ever got duplicated was the Miss High Heel cassette. But this is where we would buy our blanks from. So you had a place right in town that made their own blanks and did all the duplication and everything? Yeah.
Starting point is 00:49:15 That's very convenient. I like that. The lady receptionist there always wore velvet. That was kind of her thing. Very classy. Yeah. Enscon always wore velvet. That was kind of her thing. Very classy. Ensconced in velvet. I can see it now. This is this.
Starting point is 00:49:38 What is that? This is Hanson 04. It's coming through great. It's organ and drums did you say what it was it's just organ and drums oh it's just organ and drums yeah okay which i don't know what it sounds like by the time it gets to you but that's perfect it sounds beautiful it sounds beautiful what else you got over there? What tape could you pull off the wall that I'd see and I would just go, whoa.
Starting point is 00:50:10 This is a cool one. Actually, here's my little... I have a little shrine here. I want to see the shrine. Yeah, give us a... Oh, this is very, very nice. What is that? A nice dark wood
Starting point is 00:50:25 is there is there glass in a or those open cases yeah yeah there's glass okay i thought it's a bit of a reflection open her up what do you got in there this is really cool this is this the third edition of robert terman's flux still shrink wrapped with the contains no digital effects sticker on it very cool which if you've heard this recording i don't know how you would ever think there were digital effects on it it's really lo-fi um but uh yeah that's one of my prized possessions. And let's see. I also have the first edition of it. There's only maybe, I think he only made about 10 copies of this.
Starting point is 00:51:18 Very nice. Nice. Oh, look at that. Cut out so it fits in there just perfect hand-typed labels i love those like real boxes those like however besides there there's like six inch reel-to-reel boxes or whatever they are seven seven inch reel-to-reel boxes excuse me yeah um don't ever correct me again though um well this is these are some of my favorite cassettes and what got me really into like kind of some of the label? And they used to be a distributor back in the day, Anomalous Records? I don't. pretty pretty incredible pretty important early um noise experimental music label and distro
Starting point is 00:52:29 well actually i'll just i'll just plug in then right here just so i don't sound like an idiot yeah i do yep yeah i know yeah yeah they were a pretty big deal yeah they were yeah they were. And when in the in the late 90s, when tapes were disappearing from catalogs. And so my, my record shop would do these wholesale orders with, with anomalous to get, you know, noise stuff. And I would just go through and sort the catalog by cassette and i would buy any tapes that they still had in stock so i would get these like old um john hudak tapes from the late 80s um and then i ended up getting these these uh all these slow scan cassettes which they come in these boxes. Yeah, are those like metal? It's silver.
Starting point is 00:53:30 Silver paper. Okay. It's almost like a VHS type box. Kinda. It's smaller. Jesus. So yeah, they have booklets here. Oh shit, this is put together very nicely yeah they're they're beautiful um and old uh look at that which one's this you're showing me are these are these all
Starting point is 00:53:59 compilations no not all of them that that one I was showing you was a Gordon Mooma, Gordon Mooma, early electric. I mean, it's, you know, late 60s, early 70s noise stuff. This is all, this isn't all Swedish stuff, is it? This is all kind of like some poetry stuff. Where's the one? But yeah, this one is crazy because it has the labels upside down, which was pretty intense. This is Tom Rashan and, uh, uh,
Starting point is 00:54:40 ant farm and Jad fair. Yeah, actually they, they mislabeled the a-side twice in this one. This one's just in a regular cassette, though. Yeah, so this is like live electroacoustic retrospective 68 to 84. David Rosenboom. So, yeah, those are some of my favorite.
Starting point is 00:55:05 There's ones in white as well. They all have these nice booklets. Most of them it looks like are 200 copies. And I think actually Chris Freeman, Jan Van Torn who runs this label, found a few of the extra boxes, unused boxes, a couple of years ago and made up a few extra copies of some of the tapes. So Chris Freeman at Fustron, I know, has a few of these. Oh, really? He's got maybe like two or three titles in stock. I'd love to look into that.
Starting point is 00:55:43 Those are fucking nice. Yeah. And it's all awesome stuff, man. Like early sound poetry stuff. Bernard Heidsieck. Yeah. What else I got in here? Some early original Daniel Johnston tapes.
Starting point is 00:56:00 Oh, nice. Is this all still right out of your shrine in your room here? Yeah. Yeah. Where are you keeping just right out of your like your shrine in your uh room here yeah yeah where are you keeping just like all of your tapes they're in the attic the attic ah yeah they got put away huh yeah yeah i used to have a really nice spot for them and in my old place but uh yeah not here i got this oh these are cool um you used to i think you can get them on cdr now but you used to be able to get um any folkways record um you could get custom made-demand copies of them on cassette, and they came in nice vinyl boxes.
Starting point is 00:56:53 Oh, like they would dub them individually as they were ordered? Yeah, and then it comes with, like, you get a photocopy of the liner notes. Oh, what? Have you ever heard this one, Sounds of the Junkyard? No. Nah. It's just, it's a noise record.
Starting point is 00:57:08 That's incredible. From like late 60s. Just field recordings of a junkyard. So this was, I got this back in 94, looks like. They would have these. Is this something that you ordered or something that you found somewhere i ordered oh very cool yeah because i i was like hunting down the lp and couldn't find it for like less than 100 bucks you know so i ordered the tape it was like 10 bucks or something that's crazy that they would like just dub those on demand like that they still do it but they're serious
Starting point is 00:57:45 they do cdrs you can't get tapes anymore but you can get cdrs from them of everything they've but most of it's digitized anyways now yeah so you can get mp3s immediately speech after the removal of the larynx yeah this one's super fucked up. I wonder who was in charge of making the dubs. How rare it would have been if they would have come in. And somebody's like, somebody else wants sounds of the junkyard.
Starting point is 00:58:16 Now I gotta sit here and dub them sounds of the junkyard. Some young intern, probably. Yeah, those are some fun ones i got around here oh man i need to talk about this guy let's hear it you got really excited about this one so i'm i'm full mask well it's kind of the only i don't know place i can really talk about this see if i can find should we dim the light this see if I can find it. Should we dim the lights? This is a safe space. Yeah, man.
Starting point is 00:58:47 Should we dim the lights, get comfortable? Yeah, yeah. I might take my shoes off. Oh, when I went on tour with Ron, he had this little display case for his... You're talking about Ron from RRR? Ron from RRR.
Starting point is 00:59:04 He had this little display case and uh he let me have it so this is where i keep my uh ah your recycled my recycled oh it's upside down but uh you got mike's tape in there no don't embarrass me i do have i do have the old um um what demo i sent you that you never responded to? Yeah, the one in the crazy big box with the army guy behind the glass.
Starting point is 00:59:34 Oh, yeah, the big China. Big China in Little Trouble. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's up there. That was on display in my old house. I'm honored. Yeah, that's's cool didn't make it to the new house though no i didn't make it no no it's just in a box just fucking chucked it just chucked it to the attic oh my god where did i put these i okay so there's this guy that i went to high
Starting point is 00:59:59 school with that was he was really intense like kind of metal kid um and he had a george lynch guitar do you remember that guy damn it no no i can't find i can't find it um well never mind what was it we'll have to do a we should do a special on this guy. Cause he would, he, he started getting into noise. Cause I played him, um, uh, to live and shave in LA and Merzbow. And he kind of could relate to the like heaviness of it, you know? And he liked the wildness. He was really into like gg allen too and so he started making all these tapes under the name chrissy feces okay and he would make tapes for me and give me tapes and i think they're all like one-of-a-kind tapes that uh i think i was probably the only one that got copies of these and um i hear from him every couple of years he'll send me a um email message or a uh uh he got my phone number and we talked a couple months ago but um i've probably got 15 to 20 tapes from this guy and it's complete. It's, I mean, it's very along the lines of to live and shave, like,
Starting point is 01:01:29 like kind of crazy mixing, um, samples of like rock, like instruments and stuff. It's, it's really over the top and unhinged. Is he just making copies for you? Yes. Is this a true, are you, are you, as far as I know, are you being a trickster and this is just no see that's no if if he had a different name that's the reason i haven't released this because i don't want people to think that i have a fucking you know so you alter ego project called fucking chrissy feces but you understand that people would be suspicious
Starting point is 01:02:05 yeah that's why i don't release all these noise tricksters like to do stuff with these fake projects and then we don't know who to trust and then you're telling you're understandable yeah i get a tape and somebody tells me it's like some 1970s russian thing and it's just some dude in like nebraska it's like come on yeah temporal marauder so like oh so you have you're telling me you have like 50 tapes by this dude that he just made for me for you but you don't know where they are right now yeah i have a whole stack of them but they were because i was i was talking who was i talking with i think i was talking to christian miranda earlier in the pandemic and telling him about him and i had him
Starting point is 01:02:45 out and now of course i don't know oh they might be i think a light bulb just went off over your head yeah i think so um let's see yes you were very mobile small... Oh, I'm on my laptop. You must have excellent Wi-Fi. You're getting it all over the house. Yeah. So, yeah, this is... What is this? Blown out. This is...
Starting point is 01:03:17 I don't know. This one's not under Chrissy. Oh, yeah, this one's not under Chrissy Feces. This one's under Chrissy Oh yeah this one's not under Chrissy Feces This one's under Chrissy Angelson Chrissy Angelson Is sick in an album Tape for the new millennium Marcus Feces Rock and roll
Starting point is 01:03:37 Put that on This is good Greatest hits this is good greatest hits um yeah a lot of them are taped over these concrete corner tapes that i would give them at the record shop i worked at in high school oh nice see this is just making me think you're lying more now they're getting dubbed over tapes that you were the source of. Yeah, yeah. Well, I was. I mean, he played in Isis and Werewolves a couple times.
Starting point is 01:04:15 There's a recording of us at CBN where he's playing guitar with us. That's kind of a church. it's like really blown out like cock rock okay all right i can't uh i don't know if it was coming through oh Oh, no? You couldn't hear it? It's hard to tell sometimes if that's how it's supposed to sound like or if it's just bad. That's what it was supposed to sound like. Okay, then it was awesome. I like that shit a lot, man. That was tight.
Starting point is 01:04:57 That was fucking tight. Yeah, no, he is a character. What is this more of his tapes okay I can't tell if he that guy well yeah I could have
Starting point is 01:05:13 pulled some other stuff out I'm curious about something do you have any like crazy masks there oh yeah what's with you must have been like a pig in shit when when we started with all these masks because you love those things so goddamn much right you must have heard to wear your mask and just thought here we go yeah yeah it's fucking field day what's with what's with all the what's
Starting point is 01:05:38 with all the masks on these covers i like masks they're scary so i always have so i grew up you know reading fangoria magazine and um that cd with the me and kevin drum with the beast within that poster is that this one i had nightmares for years of that image because i got a fangoria magazine and that was the pullout poster of it. And, um, I didn't see that. I didn't see that for years and years. And then I, when I was doing the CD edition of that, I decided to look it up and, uh, and found a copy on eBay and bought it. Um, but no, I always liked masks. Um, well, I was afraid of masks for years. One of my older brother's friends, um, I remember I was in the back seat of the car. I was probably like three or four, four or five. And, um, my brother's friend put on this rubber mask and scared the hell out of me. He turned around from the front seat, and I wouldn't even touch rubber masks when I first saw one.
Starting point is 01:06:51 I was, like, freaked out by them. My friend across the street had a couple. And then I kind of embraced them after a couple years. Like Batman. Yeah. That's what Batman did with the bats. So this is, like, the exact same thing. The Batman. That's what Batman did with the bats. So this is like the exact same year as the Batman and Noise.
Starting point is 01:07:09 But all the masks are in my studio. Whenever you pull out a tape, like even to this day, if you're like going through this... Let me just grab one right here. I got a few in front of me. Say you're going through the shelf and you grab like...
Starting point is 01:07:23 You grab this Aaron D dillaway after the showers and you just look at it real quick and there's the guy on the cover do you real quick even sometimes go like oh like you still get scared to this day no no no what about like i'm pretty used to it what about that's anybody ever clowned with that kind of shit like i don't know there's something going on with our connection here i think yeah might have uh i don't know something that's fine i haven't been recording any of it anyway oh here's some more uh early uh early non-hanson tape i think it might have an hanson might have ended up with a hanson uh catalog number
Starting point is 01:08:20 what do you what is this that, that's another scary one. See, I see that. Two track. That's a collage of me, twig, Nate and Carly. It was from a,
Starting point is 01:08:37 um, nautical almanac, uh, wolf eyes. Um, uh, uh, uh, zine like photo zine. made for a tour this was i worked at this record uh i guess it was a cd and and tape shop called discs and tapes very descriptive and yeah so i would whenever i
Starting point is 01:09:00 would dub i would make and dub tapes while I was on the job. And so I would use the shop stamp. And so there's a couple tapes on that would normally have been Hanson tapes, but they're on discs and tapes. See the crossed out Hanson logo. Okay. I love that. That's an early solo tape.
Starting point is 01:09:21 I love that this is going to be an episode of a podcast where you just show us tape. No one can see anything. I kind of really, really like that. It's perfect. In fact, the next one, show it to us and don't even say it. We'll just read anything we need to say. Wow.
Starting point is 01:09:41 Wow. Yeah. And the back. Mm. Okay. Very nice. Thank you. Damn.
Starting point is 01:09:53 Damn. Damn. Eric. Damn. That's the second time this episode. I got the chills. I think he muted himself. Oh man. Here we man. Here we go.
Starting point is 01:10:06 Here we go. Let's pull out this box. He's got a whole box. Well, yeah. I got these Let's go through every fucking one. Let's go through every fucking one. Yeah, I got these drawers here. And this has
Starting point is 01:10:21 all my chondritic three inches are in this drawer. See that, everybody? But in here, in here are all my Charlie Drayhem tapes. They're all in that envelope? There's a lot of them in this envelope. There's two of them in that envelope? There's a lot of them in this envelope. There's two of them in that envelope. All my Brian Rourke cassettes.
Starting point is 01:10:50 Are you guys into Brian Rourke? You know this guy? I don't think I'm familiar with that. He's a noise guitar player from Canada. Yeah, this guy, man. Guitar. This one's called... Oh, wait.
Starting point is 01:11:08 There's two of them. All of his tapes come in like old envelopes that's crazy like a window envelope like a number 10 window yeah yeah this is um and it's like super hot like hyper cut up noise guitar um but like mess like fucked up tape uh manipulated guitar and stuff he's incredible um yeah like this track uh brian wrote guitar in a plastic bag there's one of the tapes called piece of Shit Guitar Divers, which was a really great UK noise tape label in the mid-90s. Did a lot of good stuff. Yeah. Brian Rurik is still around, still putting out tapes and cassettes. Here's the Smegma tape on Gross.
Starting point is 01:12:09 They did these really nice packages. Everybody on the podcast can see this. It's got a little OB. Jamie, don't describe it too much. Some of this is just for us. There's a bunch of other old stuff some early merzbow tapes brindle stern and gerbil stock did mersbo block you on twitter like you did mike i don't think so i don't think he cares one way or the other he blocked my ass ass. Really? They block my ass. Do I ask them too much stuff?
Starting point is 01:12:46 I don't know. I don't know. I made one too many memes. Hands to early Jeff Jarman tapes. Really good organic noise stuff. Neil Bolio. A lot of these due process radio tapes the meal bolio's old radio show okay how do you say wait say this name again bolio emil bolio is that how you say i never knew how to say it either emil bolio bolio early chocolate oh no this one's on spite actually but it's uh
Starting point is 01:13:27 it's an early dylan yucas tape on spite which is really great is that how you say that name yucas i'm learning a lot oh yeah i didn't even know what he was talking about until until you said that dylan niukas niukas s core you know s cord really good that's probably my favorite japanese noise stuff s core s core do you have any uh any like carolina cassettes from the early days no i think the only cassette they ever did was the first album. Okay. They did mostly seven inches and stuff like that. LPs. Yeah. Yeah. I like them.
Starting point is 01:14:09 I have an old rubber. I have a rubber cement cassette in a shoe, packaged in a shoe, but that's in my closet with all my other shoes. Do you really keep it with your other shoes? Yeah, of course. No, you don't. It was shrink-wrapped. It's a shrink-wrapped shoe.
Starting point is 01:14:29 Can I see the shoe? I'm going to go up to the attic now. We're going to the attic? Exclusive. But. This is going to be so exciting. But this was um oh here's this is a big box of hansen master tapes well look at this another bit of history here my attic of tapes but everything's really
Starting point is 01:15:01 jamie jamie you documenting all this with screenshots? Oh, so when you said they were in the attic, you didn't mean in crates. Crates. They're on the wall in the attic. Yeah, it's those wooden boxes. This isn't like a haunted attic with just bins full of tapes that you can't get into.
Starting point is 01:15:26 You have like a, this is fully on display. This is gorgeous. Oh no, no, there's tons of, there's shit everywhere. What's that?
Starting point is 01:15:34 Boredoms. Oh, really boredoms, Bortronics. Yeah. I just started kind of, here's a cool one. It's like an early 90s.
Starting point is 01:15:47 Meat Puppets on one side. Gary O' Gary Giggie Gay on the other. Dub tape. I did know how to pronounce that, Mike. You know how to say that? No, I don't. No.
Starting point is 01:16:02 Where's this shoe? Dude, that's in a box. Oh, man. I think, Jamie, I'm going to have to be the one that breaks it to you. I think he's lying about the shoe. This, I think, I don't know what happened to the actual cassette. I just have the... But I think this was one of the first tapes,
Starting point is 01:16:21 either this or Swan's Filth, wherever, saw tape listed as an instrument. Is that a fact? Which I remember thinking was really strange. Well, hold on. Let's not just fly past this moment. We're talking to Aaron Dilloway here, a master manipulator of the cassette tape.
Starting point is 01:16:41 This is the first time you had ever seen tape used as an instrument. Yeah. I guess it's not this one, because it doesn't say that he plays tapes on this at all. Or maybe it wasn't. Oh, well. Whoops. Whoops. Or maybe it was another defining moment. I know there was a
Starting point is 01:16:59 different fall tape, but it was the fall or swan's filth that i first saw that something like that what else do we got up here got all the let's see all the fag tapes all the american tapes what's the uh what's the humidity like up there are you are you ruining your tapes putting them in the ad totally totally yeah um this was my old box that used to house all the hanston tapes what are you up to now and do you have every one um no there's early ones i don't or that I only have the master for, like, my really early ones, like the Beast People.
Starting point is 01:17:53 This I only have, like, the one that the cover says the master. But it's got one of the tapes I kind of kind of like had ripped off the industrial records. I don't think I've ever seen, I don't think I've ever seen a Hanson tape. That just wasn't a white tape. And, uh, I kind of ripped off the,
Starting point is 01:18:15 the robbing and gristles. Yeah. All of the early tapes were C tens. Um, cause the shop I worked at would always get these promos and we got these promos by this band called Skold. It was a cassette single. They sent like 400 of them to my shop for some reason.
Starting point is 01:18:34 Why? You don't know why? We have no idea why. Who's Skold? We gave away a few. They were like an industrial rock band. They were like an industrial rock band. They were really shitty. So I would use those as the masters. Here's the Velocity Hopkins.
Starting point is 01:18:56 This is another one. I only have the master. That's my parents' address. The farmhouse. Oh, that's the farm. Is the farmhouse still in the family? No, they sold it like three years ago. Some of the land, my aunts and uncles still own, though.
Starting point is 01:19:16 Here's dead roosters tape. We'll just leave. Maybe you can add even a little more extra silence. That one. Look at that. MC Brink mandibles. Don't say anything, Jamie. What else? WolfEye Xander WK Split Tape.
Starting point is 01:19:52 Oh, wow. This is on Meatball Records. That's on my Discogs One list. Can I have that? No. Actually, I think I do have one without a cover that's just this all right just make me a cover and i'll take that one yeah if i if i if i uh remember oh these are all
Starting point is 01:20:16 numbered too out of a thousand yeah they really make a thousand of those no well they were like 30 or something well why does it say a thousand it said 62 out of a thousand yeah because we were funny that's not a glominac it's not that funny aaron tell me about uh pearl drills because that's a weird tape yeah that was, I was doing some digitizing of old reel-to-reels for a friend of my wife's. And that was like some weird stuff I found on a tape. I think it's like people testing out a tape recorder and they're getting feedback and stuff. And then it's, it's just kind of me fucking with it. And then that kind of became a thing with me, like messing with records, like the tape on wagon,
Starting point is 01:21:17 I think is, is records and maybe a lot of digital effects too. Like in computer effects yeah so um yeah sometimes people ask me like what's the weirdest thing you own and like the pearl drills that black pearl drills tape is up there with like one of the weirder sounding tapes i have yeah what do you mean that we're messing with uh like a tape deck well what were they doing it's like i found this tape and it's people like on it like like hello hello is it on what does this do you know and then push like the echo button or the sound on sound it's like feedback comes on and a lot of i haven't listened to that a long time but a lot of drastic changes on it too from what i. I haven't listened to it in a few years.
Starting point is 01:22:06 That's probably just a bad dub. Is it? Okay. That's excellent to find. Don't ruin it for them now, man. One of the best, though, the master tape I got for the Tusco Terror Hanson tape was like I remember that was like the fidelity changing you know in that
Starting point is 01:22:31 it sounds like a really poorly dubbed tape already and then you know I used my duplicator to make it worse but no I actually recorded some Pearl Drills stuff at the beginning of the pandemic
Starting point is 01:22:47 that I was going to release as Pearl Drills. Really? Did either of you ever get the network zines that I did? No. From the sounds of it, I don't think I've ever heard or seen a tape before in my entire life. With all these tapes on the wall. Yeah, I don't know shit. Thanks, guys. All right, Ben, I'll talk to you thanks again Thank you. so Thank you. © BF-WATCH TV 2021 Thank you.

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