Talkin' Baseball (MLB Podcast) - 244 | Kim Ng, Alex Cora, Theo Epstein, Awards, & Signings!

Episode Date: November 17, 2020

Jomboy & Jake are back from vacation so they're running through the biggest headlines from the past week with Trevor Plouffe! Kim Ng was hired to be the GM of the Marlins (6:40), Alex Cora is back with the Red Sox (16:45), Tony LaRussa had a DUI (26:45), the Awards have all been given out (30:55),we're starting to get some free agent signings (47:40), and Theo Esptein has stepped down as Cubs GM! (54:00) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello and welcome to talking baseball. We're back from vacation. There's been some new hires. There's been some awards. There's been some stuff we got to discuss. Oh, shit. Sounded bad. Hello and welcome to talking baseball.

My name's Jimmy. Sitting next to me is Jake. Trevor's coming to us from California. And Bug Bug Bug A Dude is the producer behind the dish. What happened? David, did you drop something into your lap? Yeah, just dropped my phone right on to my private parts. Nice.

Welcome back. Congrats. Huge. Vacation is over and we're back in front of the mic and we have a lot to discuss. But of course, first we have to thank those who allow us to do this. And that, this time, Jake, starts with Indigo Mantoya. And I lost my spot. immediately.

Mark Badea, Moyance, Alex L, Nico Esperaza, Jeff Grau. Gray, maybe. Tyan, Alexander, Tim Dower,

and Kevin Brummet. My eyes are failing me or my contacts are bad because I have like blurry vision right now. Huge. It's not good. Did Treve leave?

10 day I.L. No, that's just your vision, man. Damn. Losing it. Yeah. How are you doing, Jake? I'm good. I'm good, James. Went on a little vacay, Grand Canyon, Sedona. It's all I talk about now.

The vortex there, nature. Looking to get a place out there. Once I get an actual place anywhere else first. But good, man. Played some golf with some old guys. That was fun. Saw Cole Tucker at the 311 drive-thru. concert, friend of the pod, friend of everyone.

He was kind of the king of the concert, and that's obvious. He was there with king or flex, whatever. His hair looked great. How to look in person? Hair's incredible. Took a lot to not touch it due to COVID and the drugs. And then I saw Tim Melville in Arizona, also a friend of the pod. Just a hilarious human.

He just flew back from winning the championship in Taiwan. and the whole story is hilarious. He was, so he signs over there, like he got the opportunity. He has to quarantine for 14 days. And he was, like, locked in his hotel room and, like, pretty crazy. So, like, straight off the plane. He got, like, kidnapped that security straight to the plane. And then he joins his team.

They were in last place, and they do, like, these two-part seasons. And then in the second part of the season, they won the championship. So I was like, are you, like, a hero over there? He's like, I don't know, a couple people like me. He's like, I stand out for sure. But yeah, we had a good time. Me, him, and Jess walked around Scottsdale for a little bit. So it was pretty nice.

So good to be back. Baseball returns to being hot in the streets, Trev. Scott's Dale. Yeah. Dale Scott. Dale Scott. Holy smokes. Nice connection right there.

You should move there. Trev, how is your vacay? Too hot for him there. You know, like, I had a great time. We did a little camping trip type thing up in like Santa Barbara area. But I got to be honest with you. Like the whole time I was just like, dude, I wish we were recording and doing talking baseball. And there's a lot of things we got to talk about.

I got a lot of thoughts on my mind today. I don't know if we're going to be able to get to them all. No, you, G.H. He's got a lot of thoughts on his mind. Did you? Trevor Ploose stuff. He's got a lot of good things. takes.

Right. Thank you, Ron. Yes. Did you and Cole talk about me? Very little. Very little. I mean, it was, honestly, it was kind of like an odd scene. It was a drive up 3-11 concert.

So I walked up, and I mean, Cole stood out pretty good. You know, 6'3 with, you know, a bowl of lettuce trickling down his back. And then, yeah, I mean, Kinger is like a normal. size dude so that was kind of that but also we're all wearing masks and we were chilling and cole's like oh yeah he's it this is the other guy from john boy and they're like oh are you john and i was like no i'm boy and that was pretty good joke and then um yeah we were just chilling and then the concert started and when 311 starts ripping i mean you're fucking whoa emmer is the color of your energy lead singer still fucks whoa which one isn't there like

There's a rapper. There's a rap guy. The lead guy, like Mark McGrath type five. He's like, he's definitely the lead singer of 3-11. Like, he's in his 40s. He's still pretty ripped up. He's definitely slamming after the show. The rap guy is losing me in a couple of songs.

He's got some antics on stage. I've seen them live. Yeah, he's having fun. He's like very sweaty by the end of the show. Cole Tucker's favorite band. He's been to like 25, 311 shows. That makes a lot. lot of sense.

A lot of sense. That was a good time. Okay. Oh, yeah, this dude, he meets. Oh, here we go. It's cool that you guys have matching sweaters on. Thanks. Yeah, brought to you by baseball lifestyle, Trev.

Not yet. Just was. Interesting that I don't have one. Yeah. Where's Bill at? Bill needs to step it up. Talk to Bill. He's here today.

Bill's here. Do you guys want to see what I'm wearing? We got a full office today. What is it? Oh, rad dad. Rad dad. B-Rad is rad. That's me.

We got a lot of baseball news to talk about. Just so much. I've got so many thoughts, too. You have thoughts. BPD's got a bullet point list. We're going to start front office. Then we're going to go on the field. Then we're going to go free agent stuff.

Baseball. Hell yeah. That's all it is. the biggest news of the day of the week of the month of the year of the decade. In a way. Maybe. Kim Ang hired as the Marlins GM. She first interviewed for a GM job in 2005.

So she's been qualified for over 15 years to get the interview, never got the job. Went to the front office. I don't know how much she's still been applying for GM jobs, but she gets the job long overdue. I mean, you know, I wasn't incredibly familiar with her resume as assistant GMs and all that, but I knew her name always came up and like probably the first GM. The first GM works in baseball. The first female GM works in baseball ready.

That was a headline that was raining a lot. And she gets the job as the Marlins GM. It's fantastic for the Marlins. She has a resume that if any male had it would have been hired. in the last 15 years and then maybe fired and then hired again and give it another shot and been through the GM washing machine cycle. Because she's a female. She didn't get that chance until now.

So that's fantastic. I do want to yell at sexist people, but I'm going to hold it back. Jake, Trev. I go to Trev first. Trev. Is this a name that you knew in baseball? You didn't play for the Dodgers, Yankees, and who else was she with? White Sox?

I think she started with. Yeah, she was in MLB front offices for a while. Yeah. You know, I know her from the Dodgers. Like that's when I think I first kind of heard the name. And again, like, you know, I don't think anybody's really versed with a bunch of front office people. Like, yes, you hear the GM's name. Sometimes you'll hear the maybe baseball ops.

I don't know. It's beginning to become more familiar. But, you know, even five years ago, you couldn't barely name all. the GMs in the league. So definitely heard of Kim, but you know, like you said, Jim, she never always a bride's mid, never a bride. And now Derek Jeter who, you know, look, man, Jeter's been doing some incredible things over there with the Marlins. He gets them into the playoffs this year. And then he, he's like, he sees an incredible opportunity in front of him. Someone like you said, who is very, has the resume of that's better than any GM that's

hired she's worked for the good organizations i think that's super important if you see like teams when they go out and get gms or front office people now they want them from you know the raise the dodgers the yankees like those are the organizations that these guys are coming from or most people are coming from so jeet sees the opportunity scoops up you know maybe one of his best moves that he's made and now uh you know it's been the story and i think it's cool that it is the story and You know, when I think about what it means to, you know, women across the U.S., like, you just saw, like, the amount of support out there, social media, whether it was Twitter, whether it was, you know, even on the news. Like, that made, that was a national headline when she got hired. So it was a cool thing to see.

And I think a lot of people now have read her resume. and it's like obviously, like she deserved a chance. Yeah, and I, uh, Jimmy won't attack the, the woke haters, but I will a little bit. If you're a 14-year-old white boy in the comments, you don't get it. Um, and it's, you should try to because it's a really cool thing that's happening for, for females, for Asian Americans, the first Asian American GM, that's really cool too. And it's, uh, the comparison I used in a, you know, Jam and BPD have heard me say this three times now, but that image of when Kamala Harris next to the other 47 vice presidents or whatever it's been

and they're 5. Well, I think people die and shit. I don't know how it works, Triv. But they, they definitely die and people definitely shit. But there's, it's like 47 or 48, and they're all white males. And when you see that, like, again, think about. when you're young and believing in what you want to do and believing you can do that.

And it's great. It's great. It's great. She finally got the opportunity. You know, we're talking about the timing of it. I think her first interview was the Dodgers in 2005. Ned Colletti got the gig fired. And then she interviewed around,

and then all the young Ivy League guys got sexy. Oh, put that on the soundboard. But she gets her chance. And she's going to get a legit chance. I mean, the Marlins are doing good things. Mattingly just wins manager of the year. They've got a lot of young talent on there. They got one of the best minor league systems,

and that's every interview. You know, they do all the good stuff and congrats. And oh, did you see Michelle Obama's tweet? And then they end with like, hey, so what's up? Like, what are you going to do? And she's like, well, we're going to build. Like, we're just going to build. So they've got a young base there.

They're going to add to that. And should be excited for it, whoever you are. Let me tell you what sucks about it, though. We just praised it for however long. Let me tell you what sucks about this higher. Here we go. You guys ready for this? Yes, love this, Trevor Plouf.

She's got to be with Jeets. I mean, she's got to clean up all the mess that that guy's made. So it's like, you know, she could have went to an organization with someone that knew what he was doing, or that they knew what they were doing, and now she's got to go clean it up. Kind of feel bad for Kim in that regards, but I think she's up for the task. The old pick, anytime there's a. old pick and new pick, it's kind of cool. But the old pick of Jets and Kim Ang and then the new one of them on the field, that's pretty

cool. Marlon's just hired a ring too, right? How many rings she got? She won like three with the Yanks. Three with the Yanks. Oops. Sorry. And, uh...

I thought she had more than that, but... Maybe not. She probably got something from, does the MLB get a ring for every World Series? She worked with MLB front office. Oh, that works. Um... She goes from working with Manfred to Jets. Ooh.

Joe Torre was her immediate boss at MLB. Oh, even worse. So she's just Yankees all over. Just, hey, Joe Tori. Hey, hey. Hey. Hey. You don't talk about Joe like that.

That taught me it's okay to cry. Trev, I have something. We talked about it on talking Yanks for three minutes. Yeah. And these kids in three minutes, 20 seconds. Thank you. Sorry. These three kids in the comments and then all their stupid upvotes like,

Virtue say going much. Yeah. It's like, if you can. here people talk about the first female and breaking the barrier and the gate open for all future females and you don't understand that it's better

now that when you hire GM you can interview 100% of the population than 50. If you're so insecure about this conversation look yourself in the mirror and punch yourself in the face because you're a sexist, sad, pathetic piece of shit. So what's the mirror

got to do with it? They got to see themselves. You can see yourself. Yes. Okay. Watch yourself get rocked. And also grow up because you probably are 14 years old or you have the brain of a 14 year old. Could they do like a pond or something, something with a reflection? That's too.

They wouldn't even get that. That's too deep and insightful to see your reflection upon Peter Pan style. Treb, I have your book here. I have your book here. Oh, thank you. And I want to read you something from the book. Okay. As we always, as we do on the traditional Tuesday episode, we'll be reading.

from Thomas Paine's common sense. What year was this written? 1776. You know, and they needed, what Thomas Paine needed to do is he needed to reach all the idiots. What George Washington did is he went town to town from colonial America. Trevor's Daily battle.

And he had the leaders of the army read this book to all the dumb people that couldn't read and write, and it was dumb down. And listen to what it opens with, Trev, a long habit of not thinking, thinking a thing wrong gives it a superficial appearance of being right. Hmm. So just because there's never been a female GM doesn't mean it's right.

Dumbies. I'm over it. I love it. And she's from Indianapolis, which I really respect people from Indiana. Kyle Gibson are guys from there. I disagree there. I'm so out on Indiana. Jim's a big ghost of elitist.

Yeah. Mark Cuban went to the University of Indiana. Cute. Kyle Gibson. Now Kim, I'm all about Indiana. Nah, the fuck is that. By the time she was in elementary school, she was in New York. Brooklyn. Queens, Queens, Queens, Queens.

Do I hate Kim now? I mean, they just took like the Yankees AAA coach and hired him. Like, it's a very Yankees thing going on over there. Congrats, Kim. She worked under Tori. She worked under Cashman. Now she's working under Jeter. Don Mattingly is the manager.

They bring in the AAA manager. Ablo Lopez. Gary Denbo, the development coach. Like, the Marlins are the Yankees. Pablo Lopez to the Yanks. So now I have to hate Kim. Yeah. And I think that'd be good for you.

You need to lean into that 1% that hates this. Well, look, I give Jeet's hate because he has a disproportionate amount of love. Right. Now, I don't know if the love for Kim is disproportionate. Maybe it's warranted. But if it starts to be unwarranted, I'll be the first one. on her case. Perfect.

I will be the first one on her case. That's my job is to restore balance. Okay. Huge. Speaking of people, you want to be the first one their case? Alex Korr returns as Red Sox manager. They also,

the J.T. Watkins, the replay dude that got fired. They hired him back as well. The bad guy. They did this on election night. They just announced it. Which, Trev, I'm going to steal, play the Ron Darling thing.

I like reading Trevor Plu's stuff. He's got a lot of good takes. Phenomenal tweet by Trev when you said, if you have to announce your managerial hire as a, what's the term like dump, like a news dump, a Friday election day news dump, if you can't announce it with pride,

maybe it's a weird hire or bad hire. I thought that was a really good thing. And I understand the Red Sox hiring them back. The league didn't punish them enough. And they are allowed to do this. So as an organization, their fans want it. They liked him. Blah, blah, blah.

But you have to announce it with pride and not a Friday night news dump if you're the Red Sox. Otherwise, it's just very weird. On that specific Friday. Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly. I could, I mean, look, how long we got because I can do Alex Quora hate for a long time. 30 seconds then. Okay.

I'll do it quickly. I'm not a big fan of the move. However long you need. As you guys know. Yeah. I love Sam Fold I was talking to Sam throughout the whole process He really wanted the job

He's turned down other managerial interviews This was one he wanted He's from that part of the country Obviously he didn't get it Which I think is a huge mistake by the Red Sox And I think it's a huge mistake by Heim And from all that I've heard It was he was pretty much pressured in

This is the thing though about Alex And people do like him in Red Sox Nation But that's because he brought him a world series his championship. The Red Sox. He had a very good vibe for the city and the swagger. And like, I don't hate managers a lot.

He got under my skin and Boston loves that. He was like, they're tough guy. It's really easy to do that when you have the best team in the big leagues. He's taking over a team now that sucks. So what are they going to do? When they're third in the AL East, maybe fourth in the ALE East, maybe fourth in the a lease come July and Alex Corr is sitting there like well look I'm a manager I can't play what are they going to do is he going to be the savior still that doesn't make any sense to me

so honestly maybe Heim has a little bit of tricks up his sleeve I think he did want Sam fold and I think he's like you know what let's have Alex in here you guys want him so bad you're pressuring me to take him let's have Alex in here we're going to lose for a few years get him out bring out my boy Sam and I really think think that could happen. Because look, they like Alex because he won. They are not going to win anytime soon unless something drastic happens. Well, Trevor. I just don't understand. I can keep going on about the cheating. I think we've touched on that enough. It just seems to me like it's a weird thing. The reason they love Alex Cora is because he brought him a World Series championship in

2018. They're not going to be good. So are they going to love them when they're bad? Doesn't seem like that's something the city of Boston does. They don't love people when they're bad at sports. Well, it's just the bottom line. They can look at this year and they can pivot from this year so easily. Renke was basically a zombie. John was on that early.

They get Cora back and it's swagger, Trevin. You know what's better than swagger? How about Chris Sale and Erod coming back? How about if they make some moves in free agency? That Boston team can come back pretty easily. They were using last year to get under the salary cap. And compete with the Yankees and the Rays and the Blue Jays? No, they can't.

Let's see what they do in Free Agency. I mean, you were against the Baby Birds last year. I think if the Red Sox make a couple strategic moves, they can be right back in wild car contention very easily. And then, you know, Cor will be all hot in the streets again. So I don't know. I get it kind of what Jimmy said. I mean, that city and that team really loved Corr.

And that's kind of a manager's job nowadays. I mean, a lot of the decisions. are predetermined. So if they like that guy and they rally behind that guy, yeah, go get him. And the only thing that gets me mad is the semantics of it. If you're suspended, you should be suspended like a player is. I mean, you know, he was fired and essentially he was suspended for a year and then he's rehired and they do it on draft night like we're talking about.

Like, how come he couldn't just actually be suspended for a year and have Rankie the Betchko step up? Like, I don't know. There's almost, there's less tarnished to. it. I don't know the way to phrase it in my head. It's semantical either way. Well, it just looks so stupid that the Red Sox fired him. Yeah. I don't, okay, he's going to serve his suspension. Renicki is going to be the manager while he's serving his suspension. It would have got a lot of backlash. But it just proves the

point that the firing of Cora and Hinch was a handshake deal with Robbie Manfred before any of it happened. Rob said, I will suspend them through the World Series. They said we will fire them afterwards. Handshake agreement, blah, blah, Red Sox obviously were just appeasing Manfred because they knew he was going to be back next year. So why did they fire him? It's, it doesn't matter.

It's just like, it's just more proof in my pudding. Oh, my God. That was a back end handshake deal. We're not actually investigating this guys. This is what we're going to do. We don't want to waste their time. you agree to fire them as soon as we do it. And whatever, that's been known.

I mean, Lou Now's going on the podcast and he's suing because he says this is what happened. It was an agreement. There was no investigation. You've been listening to me for a year. There was no investigation. There was zero investigation. It was my video, the athletics article, and I should say that in the reverse order. And then, and then MLB.

be opening up their complaint file for the last three years and all the ones they swept under the under the cushion like they're like okay investigation over they were cheating and then they they went so quick to just how can we fix this immediately okay players get immunity so we so we don't do anything else i'll suspend them through the world series you guys fire them hush hush hush that's and it's just more proof because why would the red so hot right now i'm getting angry like just like thinking about all that's transpired since 2017. And you know, with Cora, we can get to Hinch later. I got a lot of shit to say about Hinch, too.

And Larusa and all that stuff. It's been a horrible, horrible offseason for managerial hires, in my opinion. But Cora, 2000, whatever, how long he was there in Houston. Ends in 2017. Clearly is a huge scandal there that he was essentially, you know, one of the top dogs in that scandal. He was one of the masterminds, if you will. Okay, you know what?

You messed up. You did something wrong. But then you become the manager of the Red Sox, and all of a sudden they also get in trouble in 2018, you know, with a different type of cheating. So they get reprimanded for that. So this is two strikes against this guy now. This isn't just one.

And now he comes back when he is being interviewed about being the manager again of the Red Sox after getting fired and suspended for a year. Now he's the manager again. And he's like, you know what? This is something I have to live with. It's part of my past. And it's never going to happen again. How do we know, dude?

It's happened twice already. It didn't happen once. I'm all about second chances. You got a second chance. You blew it. It's third chance for him. Why? Why does Alex Cora get three chances?

And Scott, well, you got a ring. Both those guys you mentioned you're just mad at. Well, hell, even LaRusa, too. They got a ring. They didn't get a ring. They didn't get a ring, dude. They do, Treve. I mean, you know, and, you know,

I'm not going to ask you to sit here and rip on your old managers, but the managers involved. And they got rings, and that's why they got rehired. And I think the biggest- They got rings. The Astro's got a ring because they fucking cheated, dude. Yeah.

What? Who implemented that? Yeah. And the, I mean, the biggest loser, Scott just mentioned him in the chat. It has to be Beltron.

Beltron's got to be like, what the hell, man? Beltron's like counting his money. He's like, I'm out of here. I don't want any part of this mess. I couldn't even believe he took a job to begin with. Well,

and that just shows how much of a baseball sicko he is, because Beltran's what, made probably a buck 50 mill playing baseball, and he still wants to go through a 162 game grind with the New York Mets? I mean, that guy's a sick puppy. I mean, just watch that one Instagram video. Yeah.

So good. I don't know, man. It fires me up to talk about both Cora and Hinge. I don't believe, like I look at these guys, I don't think they bring so much surplus. I don't even know where I'm looking for. They don't bring anything

that somebody else wouldn't bring. 222 million for Beltran. That's a lot of money. In his bank account. And people are saying, oh, the players liked them, Devers liked them, Bogarts likes them.

That's all the people who do they like. It's all about keeping the stars happy trust. That's why they kept Gardner around for you. You think Devers and Bogart's only like one person? There's other people they like, guys. We could find other people. It's fine. Hey, the city of Boston loves them.

I mean, if you're going to put out a loser, make the fan base happy. I don't care. I mean, it's more an MLB than Red Sox. MLB allowed the Red Sox to do this. Nobody got punished for the asterisk. Yeah. And speaking of managers that people kind of don't like right now,

Tony LaRusa. Yeah. Comes out that he got DUI. So it's a very interesting. Because like technically he got a DUI the day before he got hired and the White Sox knew about it. But he got pulled over like a month, month or two months earlier. He was suspected of driving drunk. And they didn't fucking hit him with the DUI until the day before the hiring.

So the White Sox didn't know he got charged with the DUI. They knew that he got pulled over in a suspected DUI check. And for all they knew, it was nothing because nothing came from it. I've never heard of a four-month delayed DUI charge. I don't know. But he already had one prior also. This is so. Yeah, but a while ago, whatever.

That's just weird. It just seems like, if anything, I'm calling bullshit on the DUI press chargers who are like, wait, he's about to get hired. Let's slam him with that DUI we've been sitting on for four months. That's fishy. Also, the White Sox, hey, them being like, we knew about it. I actually, like, I love the. Rhinzorf-ness of it.

Like, don't care. Yeah. That's the guy I's managing my team. Yeah. Do you think I care? You think? I was in the car with him. I gave him the wine.

Yeah, no kidding. If you think this guy has waited 30 years to hire Tony Larusa and the ultimate old white men trying to run the world situation, you think, if you think a little gentleman's dully is going to knock him out. Easy on the white guys, man.

No, I'm being tough, man. I'm, at least I'm short. I like white guys. Do you see my ring? I'm a Hall of Famer baseball person. I'm legit. I'm a Hall of Famer, brother. A little Hulk Hogan at the end.

So, yeah, I'm cool now, which is huge. All right, so maybe I'm on the wrong side of this whole story. I understand it's DUIs are terrible. Don't drink and drive. This higher is. terrible, but I like them sticking to their guns on it. Like, well, I mean, this is the guy I want, blah, blah. If I'm getting pulled over, I'll drop anything I need to drop.

I hate shaming people for trying to get out of tickets. You just, you try to get out of tickets, guys. If you're a Hall of Fame baseball person, you fucking let them know. You like baseball. I'm a baseball Hall of Fame person. If you get pulled over, be respectful, courteous, and say anything you think, you think he's going to be a Bruce Springsteen fan. Tell him you like Bruce Springston.

You know, if you see that he's got like a decal on his, on his shirt that says, you know, his daughter just did something in chorus. Be like, oh, my daughter's in chorus too. Get out of tickets. Not DUIs. I'm not. I'm off that one. Yeah. I have been thrown in the back of a cop car before.

I never once did I say, hey, I'm a baseball player. Well, you should have. DUI and speeding tickets different. You guys are right there because he's going to drive away. But he wasn't even let him drive away. Yeah. The whole thing's shitty. Yeah.

From the original hire. It's the opposite of the Red Sox situation. I mean, the same because I think it's a bad hire, but I don't think anybody on the White Sox team is like, oh, sweet, we got Tony LaRusa. Maybe. Like, in fact, I'm pretty sure they're like, what? Who is our manager right now?

Why? You fired Rick Renneria, who was up for manager of the year. Okay. Like you want to bring someone different in, better, younger, whatever it is? Oh, no, it's Tony LaRusa? Yeah, it's a bad hire. It's a bad hire. It's a bad hire.

It's been three, three bad hires. Now it cures everything, people. Winning and baseball lifestyle. It's funny. Yeah, okay, we'll go to bed the ad, but it is funny that Larissa's like, wait, what? That was in February. Is it legal? Who cares?

Charging me for you. You guys let me drive away. Like you can't let them dry. And then hit them. It's all weird. Yeah. It's all weird. Baseball lifestyle guys.

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They were awesome. We've been trying to find a way to work with them for a while now. You can find them at BL 101. They got best-selling items like the Buzz the Tower hat, which is like a hat with baseball laces on it. Kind of cool. Ghost Windbreaker, the ones Jake and I are wearing right now. You can wear on and off the field.

They got a lot of jewelry you can wear on off the field. You can always rep the game while wearing clean high-quality designs. Check out baseball lifestyle at BL101.com this holiday season and give the gift of baseball. Baseball. Baseball. It's more than a game. Bang. It's a lifestyle.

Dang. I got a lot of cool stuff, so head over to baseball lifestyle 101. BL.101. Dot com. H. Guys, I'm also a host of this show, so baseball lifestyle, if you want to send a little package out my way. It's here waiting for you. Yeah, it's here.

At the office. So next time you're coming around. I'll come out. I'll come out. I'm waiting. Couch pulls out. The strong possibility of that happens. I would love to.

Well, we actually need to. Can you make a note that I need to tell Tray. that we need to see each other before a certain date. I didn't mean to tell you that. Wow. So we're going to see each other, Trev. I'll give you my thing. Moving on to all the awards.

Awards. Awards. Bowers and Beaver, Cy Young winners. No surprises there, right? No. If anyone has any takes, you shout them out because I have zero. I think the only deep, deep take was that the Central's hitting did low-key, suck this year. And both these guys were in the Central. So I think there was an argument there,

but... Counter argument is, well, they suck because they're better pitches. Both these guys dropped Dick until Bieber saw the Yankees. Both these guys dropped major Dick. They deserved it. Abrayu and Freeman, again, those were the favorites that we thought, right? Yeah. Trev, I want to give you a little love. Do you mind? Please. Trev, you said it on one of the episodes this year. I think it was regular season. I think it was

when the White Sox were rolling. And you casually kind of said, that Jose Ibrahim is a guy that's always one of the best players on the field. And it's kind of funny because if you think best players in baseball, you don't normally jump to Jose Abrae. You think of the trouts and, you know, the harpers, the Sotos, the guys that can go nuts and really light it up. And Abraeu doesn't have a ton of those years. He's just got a bunch of really good years,

kind of the traditional, like, 30 homers, 100 ribbies. Like, he's just a mashing first baseman. He puts it together in this giant season. and I really liked what you said because if you think about it, anytime there's a baseball game, Jose Ibrahim is one of the best players on the field, and in this shortened season, he throws it together.

And you played some ball against him, Treff. Sorry, I was looking something up. Yes, Jose Abraeu is, he's a masher, dude, and he's always been able to hit, and he puts up good at bads. And when I think of Mike Trout, it's exactly kind of what I think about. Like, I don't, the reason Mike Trout is who he is,

is he just like never has a bad month. You know, like he's always very consistent. Like he's going to have six homers a month, six seven homers a month. He's going to hit 315 to whatever. He just like continue. He just piles up the stats, piles up the stats. And he's just like, before you know it,

you're like, this guy has got 35 and 110 with 30 steals. It's like, holy crap. Like that's an amazing season. and that's the way I look at Mike Trout. And Jose Bray is similar to Mike in that regard. Like he just hits, man. He hits and he hits and he hits. And then this year, he figured something out with his defense

and was really good at first base too. So he put it all together this year. And just watching all of his interviews and all the things he said after he won, like about perseverance and talking about his mom. Like it was really cool to see. He's one of the good guys in baseball. And this year, not only did he get better defensively,

but he got this whole, like, swag thing going, man, like with, like, the beard, the chain. I think some of the, his teammates must have influenced him because that wasn't always what he was about, but he put it all together this year. It's really cool to see. He's been a guy, like I said, he's been, he's just been one of those outs.

Like, he's up to bat. You know he's not just going to just going to give away in a bat. He's one of those guys. you want up there with the game on the line. And you can't say that about everybody. He doesn't get rattled at the plate. So I'm happy for him. Freddie. Also, getting some good love.

He wins. Yes. Mansplane pod. Check them out. Mansplane baseball elsewhere. I do have something to say. I'm looking for this tweet now. And, you know, we said, oh yeah, Bauer ran away with it.

There's a guy follow on Twitter that said that Bauer, that DeGrom was much more dominant than Bauer. And I'm going to find it. You guys can, you know, keep doing your thing until I find it. Trev, while you're looking for that, I do have, I have to taste you a little more. Oh, gross. There's something you have in common with Jose Abraeu. That's going to make you feel pretty good.

Both rad dads. Great facial hair. You both led the league and granted in double plays. He happened to do it in an MVP year, so. Wow. I'm not saying you could have won MVP, but. You had one of the odds. Right there, right there.

Damn. Yeah. Yeah. We like we're slow guys with the ball hard. Okay, that's what happens sometimes. Very similar. Same minus the latter. Kyle Lewis and Kevin, yep.

Go ahead, go ahead. Kyle Lewis and Devin Williams both win rookie of the year. Devin Williams is a reliever, both black guys. So that's cool. First time since 1980-something, I think, or 70-something? I think it was Doc Good. It's the first time it's ever been both leagues. Yeah, it's Doc Gooden.

I think it's first time since Doc Gooden. Anyway, I don't remember. Well, uh, judges that at some point. Yeah, but it's both. Right, right, right. Yeah. For a sport that desperately needs to grow into other fan bases and other cultures, and especially it's, it's the percentage of black players has dwindled since the,

since the 80s, really. I mean, we did a lot of research on this at one point because we were going to do something. I don't know if it's still in the works. Dwindled. It was like up to. 15% down to like three. That's good. Young guys coming in being down at Devin Williams changeups

is crazy. And then Kevin Cash and Don Maddenly win manager for the year. No one got like robbed, right? Is anyone out there arguing? Like legit? Not for a guy on their own. Trevor is, I'm sure. I have my tweet up. Okay. And like I don't know. I honestly,

there's probably some stats here that I won't understand. But this guy's name is Alex Chamberlain. He's a stat guy. guy. So he says, I think what's interesting, in addition to extremely valid criticism, folks like that-da-da-da have articulated is, Bauer wasn't even that good? Like, we spend all this time making advanced metrics only to fall over ourselves when a guy has a 173 and 11 starts.

He had a 2.15 batting average balls in play, a 90.9 strand wrist. a 36% strike rate despite a paltry 12.8% swinging strike rate. DeGrom was objectively so much more dominant absent the role of random variance. So I kind of, I love, I love like, you know, we do. We're very analytically driven in baseball now. Definitely every team is going that way. And here, basically what he's saying is, look, small sample size, yes, he had a 173 and 11 starts. Usually we throw that out the window.

You're supposed to have 30 starts in the year. And he said, you know, look, the strand rate was high. The batting average of balls in play was low. And so he's basically saying he thinks, well, that kind of got a little lucky with his numbers. Babib when you're doing. Syung is a results-based award, a ward, not projecting what should have happened.

Babib holds no bearing. I think pitchers would disagree. Alex. I think pitchers would disagree because they like to look at that. If you're going to compare who to sign next year, or who projects better for the future, give me all you're expected. It's a result-based award.

What matters in baseball? Innings pitched and runs aloud and helping your team win. So get anything that's not a result of helping your team when you're on the mound out of my face. And the way that guy opened that argument with, like, using the word objectively, when it's clearly a debate and saying he was way worth. Just that, I mean, I don't know who you're talking about, so I feel bad shit talking about. But what an annoying.

And I mean, Nate in the chat said it best. I mean, who had the better Kiper? Yeah. I think that's what we need to be measuring. So, no. Don't get so mad at me. I'm reading a tweet. Well, I'm mad at the tweet.

I dig it because we do, you know, we try. The Kiper's pretty close. People are trying to take out the variance. And they're just saying, like, especially pitchers. You ask them, what stat do they like? They like FIP. They like fielding independent pitching. Okay, when you have these things, like the batting average balls in place should be, you know,

around whatever it is. 280 league aviders on that. So it was clearly lower. So that means he got lucky or helped from his defense. He had the 90.9 strand rate, which I don't really know if that's him, if there's some sort of luck involved in that. And it's 11 starts.

So I just, I agree. Like there's some things out there. Like, yes, when I watch Bauer pitch this year, he was fucking dominant, bro. He made Jose Ubreu, the ALMVP, swing at a pitch that went 40 feet. Like he was doing something, which we're going to talk about,

next talk in baseball. But I think it's okay to look at these things. We're going that way in baseball. It's okay to have the conversation. I mean, I kind of, I lean with Timbo there. I mean, at a certain point, the results have to matter. So, yeah. 159 to 100, Kuiper, Bauerwins.

Damn. You know, I guess, you know, with Alex Chamberlain stuff, yeah, I'd rather have de Grom next year. Huge. Same. And that's not, but that's not what Cy Young is. But it's a result. I don't know DeGrom's... Bauer outpitching is here.

You can't tell ERA, by the way. Everyone hates ERA until all of a sudden we use it for the best pitcher in the league award? ERA and batting average, the two that kind of get lumped together nowadays, they need to be appreciated for what they are. There is a value for being a contact hitter, but it's different when we know OPS. You know, a 300 hitter with a 670 OPS isn't as valuable as a 250 hitter with a 950 hitter with a 950 OPS and we come to learn these things, but there's still value in not allowing earn runs.

If there's a little bit of luck, if there's a little bit of luck, good, that's baseball. Trevor, you know it. I'm sure you've, you know, should your broken hat, broken bat singles be taken out of your records books? Because you didn't mean to do that. What if his strand rate is a lot of like strikeouts? That's a very good skill to have. Yeah, I'm going to do some, I'm do some Jimmyilletics here right now.

some Jimmy lyrics. Okay, because I'm not saying Bauer shouldn't, I'm not saying Bauer shouldn't have won. Like I said, whenever I saw him, Bauer started one less, Bauer started one less game and had five more innings than DeGrom. That's pretty good.

You know, Bauer, where am I? Who's on the left here? Bauer's on the left. Bauer had 10 out of 11 starts, he completed the sixth inning. DeGrom is 8 out of 12. So like on a day to day basis, who gave you a longer, better game? That could be anything that's manager's decision right there, dude.

Like, I'm sure. You know what? He also had like, he also had some double headers in here where he only could go seven innings. So it could even been more. I agree with you there. Look, I'm not saying Bauer shouldn't have one. I'm just saying like it's funny to read some people in the way they interpret stats. That guy's a Bauer.

I mean, the way he wrote that tweet, he does not like Trevor Bauer. And he, to use the words he uses is obnoxious. I didn't read you the tweet the first one because that's going to, that's for the next episode. So. Congrats to Kyle Lewis and Devin Williams. Yes, I love Kyle Lewis, loved watching it. I didn't really watch Devin Williams a lot. Bauer, I saw his stuff on pitching ninja, but Kyle Lewis.

Bauer allowed one, Bauer allowed one earn run or less eight times. DeGrom allowed one earned run or less six times. So you got real analytics. you got results and you got Jimmy Liddix and they all say Bauer was better because he was. I don't know Ben, Ben Philippi in the chat. Top 5 X FIPP 2020. Don't give me X.

Nola Darvish Casillo, then Bauer. Don't give me X when we're doing a results based. Let's vote for the Silver Slugger based on Babbib. How about that? Well. It's not what they're talking about. I mean, that's totally different. It's expected.

It's expected. Fielding independent pitching. Yes. But it's really shows how dominant a picture is. X, X, X, X, FIP. Not FIP. Okay. FIP's fine.

Same thing. That just shows you, that just takes the luck out. It's not always luck. Well, it could be defensive help. Awards are not based on expected numbers. It will be because we're moving that way. It's my biggest gripe with the analytics community. They disregard results because they can only think about expected results when results still matter.

The game is still. based on results. If I make seven errors, but win, I don't know where that was going. There's something there. Yeah, well, there's not like,

hey, well, they actually played works. I love it. I'm just relaying information. I thought it was interesting. Devin Williams, I think he was the first site

or rookie of the year to not have a save or a start. So there's some, that's cool. There's some future of baseball stuff. And we mentioned Kyle Lewis, uh, young stud up in Seattle.

That guy needs more pub. We all got lost in the Luis Robert show, and then he ended up blowing him out of the water. That feels like if that rookie of the year vote happened 15 years ago, it probably goes to Robert because he was Chicago and he was the name. And that's where analytics and good stuff and people paying attention worked out because Kyle Lewis deserved it. Yes.

Bang. Bang. All right, before we transition to some of the offseason moves and happenings, I got to tell you about a little show called Sequence with Trevor Plouffe. Wow. You can find full episodes on any podcast app or the Sequence YouTube channel, and you can find clips on the John Boy Media and John Boat, YouTube and Facebook. Trevor, our very own Trevor Plouf, sits down with a guest or it's solo.

He's had Chris Archer. He's had Gialito recap his no-hitter, Justin Moreno, Sergio Romo, Phil Hughes, Dallas Braden, tons of guests. Trev, what's the schedule moving forward? Do we have it? Do we know it right now? I think that's something that we got to talk about.

I got guys lined up. Check out the back catalog. Subscribe to the YouTube, like, subscribe to the podcast app, see what you do. I really like the Justin Turner bounce pass throws. Yeah, that was cool. Thank you. Yeah, you know, we kind of went all over the place with sequence this year,

trying to find out what we want to do with it. So I think we'll have some internal discussions And basically it's like I need some help from the chat What do you want to see all that stuff? Because that's what really matters I can do what I want to do and I will do that But also I'd like to take some notes from the people who watch the show Yeah

So go check it out and then send Trevor notes Thanks for that. I didn't know that was coming Chad Pinder Drew Smiley signed with Braves One year $11 million dollars They could have had Brad Hand for one year in 10 million very like everyone was kind of shocked by this

and Robbie Ray Roby Ray signed with the Jays for one year eight million Is that right? Yep which it bodes well for the free agent market yeah but then Stroman opting in boats bad for it depends on what tier you are

the smiley ones bizarre bizarre four starts last year Jim after post thing as over six ERA in 2019. I mean, good job by Drew Smiley and his agent. Who's his agent? I don't know.

Well. Another one we'll get to in our next show. Yeah. And the other, so a couple things here with Drew Smiley and Bradhand, if we're going to start the comparison there. Drew Smiley can start and he did a little bit this year. And I think the Braves will either use him in a swing role or have him in their starting rotation so he can add a little versatility that Brad Hand does not.

Brad Hand has a lot better and a healthier career. Smiley's been hurt and he's back, but all of his numbers ticked up incredible this year. I don't know if we want to call it the Aaron Loop effect or if we'll talk about it on future episodes of talking baseball, wink-wink. But a lot of his numbers lined up with some of the best pitchers in the league. And it's all those numbers we didn't get excited about. minute ago, you know, some of the X-Fibs and blah, blah, blah, and the strikeouts and everything, Drew Smiley was kind of gross this year. So the Braves are taking a chance and, hey, we saw them do

this last year. We saw the Braves make moves early in free agency and we questioned some of them. I know Travis Darno. We were kind of like, I don't know. You didn't want to wait out the market on Travis D? No, you just went out and got your guy. And hey, I kind of like it. I think Anthropopapus. How do you say his name? Alex Anthopoulos. I think he's making it kind of his signature move. Like, he's going to go out and free agency as do his thing. And I don't think he's going to do the song and dance. He's going to pay his guys what he thinks they are worth. I just would have expected more of a Michael Waka-esque deal that they gave the Mets.

Like, hey, we're going to give you $4 million up front. But you can get to eight with all these benchmarks of game started and innings pitched and performance bonus. Sure. But what if they ended up getting into a Drew Smiley bidding war and then it turns into two years, two years 20 or whatever it is. They saw their guy. This is the guy they wanted. They went out and they got them confidently.

The number seems a little scary, but also the brands don't give a damn. It's a one-year contract. If Drew Smiley's, perfect. If not, he's gone. They're going to bring in Charlie Moore in and then they're going to compare Pine Tom. Oh, this might hurt your Charlie Morin theory. helps. Okay. This is the one-year deal thing, I think, is the key here.

You know, the 11 million is more than I would have projected a guy like Drew Smiley to get. But I think like you're saying, Jim, one year, nobody cares about a one-year deal. I think we're going to see a lot of those this year. Talking to a few guys, pitchers that are free agents, you know, kind of like asking them if they've fielded calls yet. You know, I think a lot of them are expecting one-years are going to be. They're two, threes, you know, we'll see. But definitely, I mean, Drew Smiley turned four starts into $11 million, which is, you know, good for him, good for his agent.

Yeah. And on the other end of that, Robbie Ray, another lefty starting pitcher. He gets one year eight, which, hey, again, with all of our fear coming into this free agency and team screaming COVID and blah, blah, blah, blah. Robbie Ray was nothing short of horrible last year. A guy who has a couple good years in the book, but of late, he has not been good. Last year, in his 12 games, he had a 6-62 ERA.

And I think his FIP might have been even worse than that. Don't say FIP right now. Oh, great. FIP projected stats. I love them when you need them. I'll fit when I want to figure. what we think Robbie's going to do next year and how he bodes for the future. That's what it is.

I FIPP so. He was the ex-fitt. FIPP was not projecting. Front office decisions not to give a ward. He had a 6-5-fip, if you're into that, and he had a 1-8-9 whip, baby. Let him on, Robbie Ray. So he goes, he gets traded to the Blue Jays. He's a little better there.

I mean, he had a 479 ERA, a 532 FIP. But I think there was some connections there. I forget if it was the bullpen coach or something like that. and hey, the fact they wanted to bring him back, we said that the Blue Jays were going to be looking for pitching. Good for Robbie Ray. I mean, he was probably sitting there, you know, had to be kicking himself a little bit.

This guy had been in every trade rumor for three years. If he had continued on his 2017, 18, 19 pace, he was going to get a big old payday. He falls off. He hits free agency. So we'll get the one year. And, hey, Robbie Ray, figure it out for a year. And you could still get that big MLB payday.

if they ever play baseball after 20. I have a little birdie telling me something. Here we go. A little tidbit. Don't play the song. We don't need the song. That's a hard disagree, but okay. It's too long.

We need a shorter song. I heard, speaking of the Jays. Yes. And I did make this one of my free agent predictions after I heard this little tidbit. I heard the Js are going to be going very, very hard after George Springer. So it'll be interesting to see how that unfold.

I think he's going to have a lot of suitors. And the White Sox are going to go after him. But I have heard the Blue Jays are aggressively courting. Did you know right now the Blue Jays are the Vegas favorites to go get Lindor? Really? Yeah. I just tweeted a take on our next topic. Take.

Take alert. You ready for it? Maybe. Can you drop the passing noise? The chat wanted it. Awesome. Theo stepped down as Red Sox, or Cubs GM, right? And Red Sox, Gian.

Planned. I just got a scoop. It's planned. Planned. Theo doesn't stay somewhere for more than 10 years. Came to the Red Sox in 01, left in 11. Came to the Cubs in 11, left in 21. He also only ends droughts.

That's his thing. He's the MLB drought. Just comes with his big, all hose. Mike Chernoff. They trade Lindor. They get some prospects. Charnoff, you're out. Theo.

Biggest drought in baseball. Indians. Come on. Save the day. Central. Interesting. We're back in Central United States. You want to live in Cleveland, though?

Oh, he won't live there. Zoom. Everything's remote. You don't live in the Bronx. That's why you don't have a nice sweater. Wow. I like that. I like that.

He's like kind of like how Leonardo DeCate Caprio, like once the girls get 25 years old, out. Theo, once he stays in an organization for 10 years, out. Theo and Leo. Wow, look at that. There's got to be something there. Numbers. Yeah, the Cubs, man, they're going to be an interesting team to watch the next two years or so.

How the hell are they going to? No, they're not. No, they're not. They're going to be a horrible. Their transactions, Treve. Eat a bug about it. They're transactions. I'm out.

I'm out on it. Where's Chris Brian? Where's Javier? Contreras. Yeah. It's not going to be two years. They're going to get rid of all those guys this year. Well, that's going to be exciting, Trevor.

Yeah, it's going to be exciting to watch. Sorry. Or depressing, depending on how you look about. Or one team. Los Cubs. What's funny to me, you know, if you really think about it, like, the Cubs were a horrible franchise for so long. And now I kind of have them on a pedestal.

as like one of the better franchises in baseball. Isn't that funny? But they only won one championship. And they had all these guys, never did it again. And now they're going to get rid of them. So I think they're back to being just like the worst. Oh, yeah. And guess what, Wrigley?

Uh-oh. 10 years of Theo. Rigley's awesome. I don't care. I don't care if you don't have enough room to get your morning stretches and workout in. No one cares about the player's lives, Trev. It's brutal. Fan experience is fantastic.

I have never been there as a fan But I only have been there once as a player too So I'm not going to talk to you about Rigby I enjoy nostalgia And I think there's a place for a Rigby field in baseball But the Cubs back to being just a horrible organization Theo get out of there Yeah

He is He stepped out He's going to the Indians after they trade Lindor He might call the Indians owner What's his name? Yeah Can you strike that for? from the record BPD.

I just bleep out what I said. That was really bad. I don't, because I don't know who he is. It wasn't an insult. I was just a... Paul Dolan. What is his name?

Paul Dolan. So he might call Paul Dolan and be like, don't. Oh, he owns them too. He owns the recaps. He might call him up. He might call up Dolan and he might say, don't let turn off trade Lindor.

Oh, sign him because I'm coming. Yeah. I'll get you the better deal. I'm coming. Their owner doesn't care. Who are you? Yeah. I own a baseball team.

Does it make money? No, fuck. Interesting. That's everything we got. Interesting. A lot of takes. So, so many hot takes.

If I was negative in this episode, I apologize. I usually want to be positive, Trev. Amherj is quit on you. Sometimes I got to spit some truth at people. What are you negative about? I was pretty,

I was pretty anti-sexism. Yeah. Came out hard. Cora, I was negative. Hinch, Larusa, Bauer. Oh, that wasn't negative. I was,

reading somebody else's tweets about Bauer, I think he should have won the Sautil Young. Oh, now you're like President Trump. It's just a retreat. That's just a retreat. Guys. I didn't retweet. I read the tweet. Yes. Trevor, one word answer. One word answer. Is Tori Hunter a Hall of Famer? I don't have a one word answer. You have to look at the stats.

Okay. In my mind, yes. In my mind, yes. But I don't know. He's an intriguing argument. A lot of gold gloves. Got some homers. We getting him on sequence? The rest of his stats. Played a long time.

He's a compiler. Let me look at his stats right now. Let me look at the stats. Francesa only fans. Mike Franceso would take. He'll be coming on sequence. Ad. Nice.

Mike Franceso would take Hall of Fame questions on Mike and the Mad Dog a lot. 50.7 career war. 793 OPS as a center fielder with how many gold gloves? Nine? Two silver sluggers, five all-star teams, 353-Hum rounds, he's a Hall of Famer. Okay. I'll taste other dudes.

He's a Hall of Famer. Yeah. But compiler. I like compilers. 2,400 hits? I mean, you've got to be very good to be able to compile. Exactly. Stop penalizing compilers, Cheater.

All right. He was a blast to play with, man. Fuck. That's the show. Thank you guys very much for hanging out with us for a bit. We'll be back on Thursday. We got an interview. We got a topic that Trev is hot on.

Very exciting. So hot. Hot Treve. Hot in the streets. Hot. Enjoyed the rest of your Tuesday or Wednesday or whenever you're listening to this. Goodbye. Farewell.

Avede sane.