Talkin' Baseball (MLB Podcast) - 279 | Detroit Tigers | Profile & Projection

Episode Date: February 20, 2021

You guys ranked the Detroit Tigers the #28 team in baseball. Jomboy, Jake, & Plouffe preview their 2021 season! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Alert, alert. This episode was recorded before the Tigers signed Scope and Mazara. This is an addendum. We didn't talk about either of those players. Don't think it changes what we would have said. Enjoy the episode. Hello and welcome to talking baseball. It's team profile and projection number three.

We are doing the Detroit Tigers. Jake, the Motor City, Kitties. Lost 114 games in 2019, the last full season they have played. Last year, they went 23 and 35, which is on pace for 62 and 100. They're coming to the very end or the beginning of the rebuild.

However you want to, like, say it. People are on their way, made some debuts last year. everyone that voted in the poll said that this is the 28th best team in Major League Baseball. We thank you for taking the poll. A quick reminder, if you're a diehard Tigers fan, you know more than us about your team. So anything we say that you're like, you're wrong, that's dumb. Tweeted us.

Tweeted us, correct us. We'd love to be corrected to make sure we're saying things correctly. Jake, can you tell me what the Tigers did this offseason? Jim, I'm just going to get this out. out of their, I'm in on these tigers. Who they did lose, though, they lost Austin Romine, the veteran catcher. He goes over to the Cubbies. Ivan, no fun.

He's on Philadelphia now. Jonathan Scope, C.J. Cron. Jordan Zimmerman ends his reign of terror for the Tigers. Who came into town, Wilson Ramos. He'll replace at the catcher position. Robbie Grossman, Trev's guy partially gets his bag in Jose Urania. Enemy of Ronald Ocuna Jr., he comes over and he joins

this young core that's forming in their lineup, T-Pain. Yeah, we can talk about the lineup a little bit. Grossman is my boy, not partially. That's my boy, Robbie. Robbie G. The Grossman. Anyways, that catcher,

Wilson's going to be the catcher. Okay? We got another guy named Grayson Griner. I think they'll probably be splitting time. It is a good name. Wilson, I don't think, can play 162 games. we all know that. I say Wilson pencil him in for 80 to 100 games.

They'll be switching off back and forth. First base, we got Heimer Candelario. And I probably said that wrong. Do I get that right? It's Heimer. Heimer. Yeah. Candelario.

Second base, another former Twins prospect, Nico Goodrum, who's really found his footing in Detroit. Happy to see that. At shortstop, we got Willie Castro. third base, Isaac Peredis. Peridis. Which one? Yeah, Peret. Falt work.

Bang. I like that one. We don't know the teams as good as you know the teams. Please correct me. Anyways, left field, Robbie Grossman, like we talked about. Centerfield, Jacoby Jones, rightfield, Kristen Stewart, and a DH, that big bad man, Mr. Triple Crown, Miguel Cabrera. Jim, what about their rotation?

Matthew Boyd? Your guy. Still there? He's still there. Tereke Scuba and Casey Mize will be getting the ball and being on the bump. They made their debuts last year and there's a lot of hype around him. Michael Fulmer, still there. Spencer Turnbull and Jose Jorraine.

Who they just picked up, as Jake told you. Who did they got in the pen? Let me check real quick. Soto got gross for a little bit last year. The lefty. Brian Garcia. Buck Farmer. Excuse me.

Buck Farmer. Edit that out. Great name. Edit that out. Tyler Alexander made some waves last year with his, what did he do? He struck out like nine in a row or something like that. Yeah, he had that crazy strikeout festival. I did a breakdown.

I think it was nine and eight, maybe struck out eight guys in a row. Something like that, yeah. It was pretty cool. Yeah, the Tigers are doing things. I'm very interested to hear where you guys are at with this. I mean, Casey, Mies, Scoobel, a lot of their prospects are supposed to be coming up and being there. I don't know. Like, what's their ceiling?

I guess I just want to jump to that right away with you guys. Can this team finish third in the AAL Central? Jake, you said you were on them, so I'm interested to hear what you have to say here. So I think it's interesting when you ask the ceiling question because I like what I see from this tiger's roster. Just compared to the first two teams, I even think the next couple teams, I think if on my personal list, I would have had the Tigers a couple teams higher than that. But you're right. It's what does that mean?

In my head, like best case scenario? is it's a team that's coming into the last month of a season, there's a shot they end up around 500. I'm not saying that they can get to 500, but I think it's one of those things, and then it's like, oh, the tail falls off a little bit. And in my head, I've got them finishing, you know, well, we'll get to there with the overunders.

But I just think there's a lot of young guys on this team. I mean, when you start talking Scoobel, Casey Meis, those guys are real prospects. You know, Matthew Boyd, Turnbull, Michael Fulmer. We'll see what he's got in the tank. You know, these are major league pitchers. It's how good of major league pitchers can we've been? Because a lot of Boyd and Fulmer have been on both ends of the scale at this point of the career.

Same with Urania. But these young guys coming up, and you see some of these ages in the lineup, too. Willie Castro's 23. Paredes, when he gets his chance, he's 22. You know, there are some young guys here that are getting an opportunity, and you're excited about. but they went out and got Robbie Grossman, another pro guy. And I think the AL Central's week where I think these guys,

if they get that young energy flowing a little bit, and, you know, if Casey Mize Day could become a thing, if Scoville Day could become a thing, you start getting excitement as a baseball team, and, you know, yeah, get yourself a 73 win season. So that's my excited about the Tigers. Do you think they could finish third? A lot of things have to go right for that to happen.

So it's twins, white socks, In Cleveland, no. You don't think they can finish third? I do not. The stealing is four again. Okay. It's four and five sealing for the 20th ranked team per big talking baseball fans. If Mize, Scooball and Matt Manning, who is, you know, the ninth overall pick a couple years ago,

there's a lot of talk about him as well, big dude. I mean, they all got to come up and just like be. guys, then we can talk. But it's, it doesn't happen that way. It really doesn't happen that way. So give the, give the tigers a few more years. Maybe all they need is one more year. Get these guys up a little bit of experience and we'll see where they go. But yeah, I think the ceiling right now is that four spot in the, in the AL Central. The big bad man you were talking about Miguel Cabrera, the one that everyone knows, Triple Crown, McGee. He led the Tigers last year in home runs. Yeah. And RBIs in walks.

He was all in on the 60 game season. Let's do this. Where I'm at, this is awesome. It's perfect. I know, you know, I know we're just like kind of messing around and it's just so tough to see a guy like that kind of being talked about, joked about a little bit. Like he's old, so he's not going to be what he was. But when he was in his prime, there was maybe not a better right-handed hitter. I mean, Poo-holes, Miggie, and Trout.

I mean, those are the... What about Manny and his prime? Mani and his prime, sure, you can start throwing those guys in. We're talking about rare air there. Guys that I really played against, like... Flex. This guy was incredible. I mean, to hammer home, your point, for a four-year period,

I'd like to repeat that, a four-year period, he hits 337 with a 4-25 on base, a 1.037 OPS as four years. Two MVP awards. So he's insane. It's starting to get weird as we get older. You see Cabrera and Poole Holes now and how they're talked about. It's like those those dudes for the dude.

Another fun stat about Megacabs is that his salary of $30 million makes up 46% of the Tiger's payroll this season. Look at the contract. 30 mil this year, 32 in 2022, 32 and 2022. And then their vesting option. So Miguel Cabrera is supposed to be on the Tigers for the next three years, making $30 to $32 million. Hey, he had a 102 OPS. He had a 102 OPS plus last year.

So, I mean, he's just got to keep doing that. God, golly. Dude, you know, I'd say this all the time, but there's value in that, not $30 million value. He's not going to put those numbers up, but the way he's able to help young hitters. Ask J.D. Martinez how valuable Miguel Cabrera is. you know, these guys, ask another one, Castellanos, ask him how valuable Miguel Cabreras.

He's turned those guys' careers around. And I think the Tigers, although they probably wouldn't want to pay him $32 million, they're saying, hey, McGee, go be a good influence on these guys. Turn some of our young guys into young Miguel Cabreras, please. Be nice. Jacoby Jones had a really good 30 games last year. Yeah, hell yeah. Don't know what that's going to translate to.

My man. But like really good. 127 OPS last year, OPS plus last year. So I don't know what that means. It's a lot on these young pitchers. It's make or break a little bit, and you hope you really have something with this crew. But again, they also have the new manager,

which needs to be talked about. Hinch comes over, and maybe he works some magic. Maybe, I mean, see who Hinch is, I guess. He did well with the Astros, plus some cheating stuff, but it's going to be a fun ride over there. Trev's manager test, we'll call it. What does a manager do? We'll find out if Hinch can give these young guys a boost.

Guess what, A.J. Hinch is going to look like a lot better manager if Casey Mize and Scoobel are studs. If they have young guy problems this year, he won't be that great of a manager. So we'll see. I think these Tigers team with some of the other young guys that are going to get the call, We'll see if Riley Green could make the jump this year. Torkelson's going to be in the hole. I don't think he's getting the call this year. He needs some action,

but he's supposed to be one of the most MLB-ready bats we've seen in the draft for a while. I think this Tigers team is going to have us excited for 2022. So I guess when I say I'm excited about the Tigers, what does that mean? A couple free agents the next year, maybe Torkelson and Riley Green on the way, and you're starting to look at a transformed franchise. Do they have any people that we might see traded? Oh, okay.

I like that. A lot of the guys they signed to one-year deals, right? Wilson Ramos, if a team needed a catcher. Jose Urania, he's amazing. Daniel Norris, other than that, not really. Boyd and Fulmer, if anyone, I mean, talk about trading at the wrong time. Should have traded them before they were both garbage, but. It's true.

Didn't Boyd start to turn it around last year? Yeah, like, ah, good start. Credit enough. Yeah. Daniel Norris, yeah, what he, yeah. Former top kind of, top end kind of guy. We'll see what happens with him, but he's a trade candidate, I guess.

I mean, look, I think they should start hoarding assets. I mean, they have a lot of these guys. They've had top 10 picks for the last 50 years. Boyd had three good games in a row. Again, two of them against the twins, so I guess the twins just couldn't hit Boyd. So then I started giving him some love. But then he finished terrible again.

His last seven starts, he was a league average pitcher. He had a 480RA, which again, not great. Yeah. He opened up the year with an ERA in the tens, five starts in. Yeah, he's three and four. I mean, it's pretty bad. And again, this was a. guy that was beloved. Same with Fulmer.

They didn't pull the trigger. He gave up 15 home runs in 12 games. And that's the, what would we be saying about this Tigers rebuild now if they had flipped Fulmer for three good prospects at the time? If they had traded Boyd for three full prospects at the time. And that's, you know, the fear factor. We didn't fully mention this in the Pirates one, but, you know, what would their, what would this team look like if they had Glassnow in Austin Meadows? So there's, I don't know, there's been that fear factor with rebuilds and trades. They will be trading at the deadline.

But not a ton of pieces that fit the mold. What about fantasy here? Who would you draft? You have to take one tiger. Who's your number one pick? Is it McGee Cabs? Just because, hey, why not? God, the number one tiger going off to board this year.

Candelario has third base eligibility. I don't know. Is a tiger getting drafted? in fantasy leagues. Willie Castro, what do you got, kid? Not a big fantasy. I don't play a lot of fantasy baseball. Like, is Grossman a valuable guy to have on your bench?

You get him hot for a little bit. I mean, he always walks. He's on base percentages. He's a pretty damn good. Yeah. Willie Castro, if he plays shortstop and he can hit enough. Yeah, that'd be a deep league. Maybe like 15.

Deep league. Tigers are a good. the pitchers. I would take a chance on one of the pitchers. I think if you're playing a straight-up 10 teams, 10 categories, 10 teams, 10-team league, I don't think a tiger's getting drafted. I'd have to get into the ADPs. Not there. Turnbull was good last year, huh? Yeah. Look at that. All right. Yeah, I don't know. I have the over under set at 72 and a half games.

And again, we don't have real. um over unders here because for the third worst team well we went we went what 56 to 62 to now we're in the 70s i wanted to make it 70 but you talked me up high on them like i i have their best case scenario as like 73 74 you said you thought they could go 500 you said going into the last month of the season i we checked the tape on this very easily just happened i said you said you Best case scenario. I'll change it. I'll change it.

I thought Jake said they were going to be 500, so I altered it. No. No, no, no. I thought you said their best case was 500, so I was trying to find a line. I said almost verbatim that their best case would be heading into the last month of the season thinking about 500. And that it would fall off after that. Okay.

So I'll set it at 65. They haven't won 65 games since 2016. 65. I am over that That would be 97 losses If they win 65 games They lost 97 games His team lost 114 games in 2019

I think they're in a pretty tough division Because I even think the Royals Are going to give them a run for their money I'm going to take the under I just I'm not a believer in the Tigers right now Like they need a lot of young guys to step up I don't really want to root for Hinch So I'm going to take the under on this one.

You've sold me. I'll take the under as well. I'll go over. Get me excited for 2022 to T. Grays. They're on the right path. Their rebuild took. I think AL Central rebuilds just take a little longer. White Sox took a little longer.

Tigers. Royals are slow dancing. They got Dave Dombrowskied, man. Like they went for it. They crashed and burned. and now they're slowly crawling out of that hole that Dave left. So I think they'd done all right in the draft, right? You know, by all accounts, like they went and got out a bunch of pitchers and we'll find out.

We'll find out. Because it's the show. And I guess that's the- That's the exciting part. We're about to find out if Casey Mize and Matt Manning and Scoobal and these guys are the truth. And then right behind them, Torkelson and Riley Green. You know, these are guys that are well-liked. But, you know, that rebuild could become a really nasty rebuild again if those guys aren't in.

If they are, then you're excited. I'm so cynical about pitching prospects, though, so. You should be. It's very tough. It's so hard. But, you know, you go to the Tigers fan forums and other, and, you know, they're all excited about my brain, if you were to tell me that the Yankees had five, like, dynamite pitching prospects, I'd be like, okay, one of them might work out. Like, that's how I think. And the Yankees are bad at developing pitches.

But that's what I, you got so many names here. It's like, I don't think all these guys are going to. And these are bigger time prospects than the Yankees have had in a while. Much bigger because the Yankees never drafted. A couple, two things I'd say we miss in the lineup. Willie Castro last year was 23 years old, played 36 games, had a 932 OPS, 349 batting average. If that guy, you know, again, those are lofty numbers. But if that guy coming off the Texas Rangers, nobody had anywhere near the.

those stats. And Heimer Candelario, 872 OPS and the 52 games played a switch hitting quarter infielder. So, you know, if those guys follow up becoming solid MLB starters, you've got a baseline. Were you surprised by the order that our fans voted this in? I thought the Tigers were going to be 29 and the Rangers would be, I thought they'd be switch. I personally have the Tigers higher the other way. Like I would have thought, just blindly guessing, I would have thought the tigers were like 25. Like I thought maybe the Orioles would have been lower. The Rockies now. The Rockies now.

I don't know what we did the bottom. Yeah. The bottom 10 teams is a crapshoot. 100%. It's true. Seems like pirates were consensus then it's crapshoot time. We have a fun stat from researcher Max here. Left-hand pitcher Tarek Scoubles average cutter speed of 95.4 miles per hour was the fastest in all

of MLB in 2020. none of his other pitchers ranked in the top 90 in velocity among all pitchers. So got him to fast cutter. Throw that lefty cutter on your hands, Trev. Woo! I mean, I'd open the hips up on them. I'd open the hips up. I'd get inside that cutter.

Oh, hell yeah. Flip that for me. All right, there you go. That's the Tigers tweeted us. Tell us what we missed if you're a Tigers fan. Appreciate you. Who's our Tigers fan from last year? Ray Rodriguez.

Ray R. Ramirez? I don't know what the second arm meant. Should have kept Gardy. That manager. Shout out Ray. Did he quit halfway through the year? He retired halfway through the year.

I mean, he kept him. Should the captain. Lock him up. Money talks.