Talkin' Baseball (MLB Podcast) - 305 | Great Third Basemen, Using VR, & Clubhouse Dynamics

Episode Date: March 18, 2021

Go to https://kushydreams.com and use promo code 'BASEBALL' for 20% off your next order today Timestamps: 11:45 - Third Base depth around baseball is insane 35:50 - Using VR and sharing tips around baseball 53:45 - Clubhouse Dynamics Presented by DraftKings Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Today I'm talking baseball. We've each got a topic that we want to discuss. Jake and I got some questions for Trev. Let's do it. Hello and welcome to talking baseball. Thank you very much for joining us. Today, we are presented by Draft Kings as always. My name is Jimmy.

See next to me is Jake. He's got a gray. I love baseball shirt on BBD in the corner of the room with his John Boy Media Windbreaker and Trev in California. Sweat shirt with the laces tied. Someone commented that, Trev, on YouTube. They said they like how you tie the strings of the hood tight. They've never seen anyone else wear it in that style.

When did you start doing this? I'll be honest. I stole it from somebody. I stole it from Francisco Indoor. Wow. I did. He used to wear it like that on the fields. And I thought, hey, it's pretty cool.

So. And then I think I saw Duky. who's Carson Tucker do it. And then whatever he does is obviously cool. So I just follow that. Okay. Look at you getting credit. You know, sometimes all you got to do is be in the know.

Yeah, I don't want to take credit for it. Jake, how are you doing? I'm good. I'm good, man. I mean, I'm excited to chat today.

Me and Trev have been bickering about my topic a little bit the past couple days. So excited to flush all of that out. Duky Tucker wearing the hoodie tied and not even knowing that's not how. a lot of people wear it is obvious. I mean, that's just, it's what comes natural in that family. And Jim, you got your talking baseball hoodie with the tourist hat.

And tomorrow you'll be wearing something a little different. Savannah bananas. Treb, you know we're going to Savannah tomorrow? Tomorrow. I do know that. bags are packed. We're on our way. Leave in on a jet plane to Savannah.

Roosevelt's is sending us there. Our dear friends at Roosevelt's are sending us to Savannah. covering the Savannah Banana's baseball. They're doing like exhibition games to get some of these minor leaguers paid. A little more time getting paid playing baseball since so many minor league teams got cut. They play weird-ass rules, so we're excited to like watch that and make a video and take it in. Like real weird rules, Trev. I don't know if we've told you about those at all yet.

Like if a fan catches... No, we're not playing. We may. We got free rain. Do whatever we want. If a fan catches a foul ball, it's an out. Yeah. That's awesome.

Yeah. And like that's the easiest rule to explain because the other ones are so crazy. We're going to make a video on it and witness it and talk about it. But yeah, we're going to Savannah with Roosevelt's sending us there. If you listen to the show before you know that us and Roosevelt's have worked together a lot in the past. You can go to Roosevelt's.com slash johnboy and use code Johnboy for 20% off. A ton of Roosevelt's.

Wink, wink, wink, hint, hint. We are making like an announcement for Roosevelt's tomorrow because there's some Roosevelt's fans that are crazy Roosevelt's fans. So eyes peeled Roosevelt's fans. I don't even know what announcement it is. So, yeah, I can't wait. I just found out like an hour ago in our meeting, in our prep meeting. Huge.

Excited. Jake, if you don't have like skin knees and like bloody elbows from chasing foul balls, I'm going to be very, like, upset. I need the effort. Treve, I'm show, bro. I'm on the field, man. I'm like you don't. I'm going to be everywhere.

Will you be? I'm going to be everywhere, Trev. Coaching, playing. I could be in a banana suit. I don't know. You could see you as a first base coach. Yeah. No, they're great first base coach.

You know what? Their first base coaches are like professional dancers. So like at first I was like maybe not. Then I was like, yeah, actually you could. Well, now that I've thought about it. Jake did a ballet. When I was in Kiwi. Fucking ballet.

I was in a ballet. When I was in a ballet. Little Kicker Soccer. I used to, I was in goal. I was goalie and I used to dance. And now in hindsight, it's pretty weird because, like, all the moms would be like, yes, dance for us, boy. And that's, I don't like that. That's who you are.

Yeah. You're everyone's a little monkey. I'm a puppet. Yeah. I'm your puppet. Okay. That's not. BPD did.

You were thinking about moms? Is that what he said? We were talking about moms pre-show. We were talking about moms. Did I miss that? Trev hooks up, Trev's been hooking up with a mom a lot. Oh.

Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. It's his wife. It's kind of my thing. He's like really into it. She wasn't a mom. You're out.

Nate Steele donated 20 bucks in the chat. Jeez, Nate. Thanks, Nate Steele. Appreciate that. Confidence, baby. All right. So in these episodes, we've kind of been like thinking about how do we want to do these episodes

before the season starts. Before we get into series recaps and all that. And the best thing is like, let's each bring one thing to the table that we want to discuss. I like it. So we each have a topic. And first, I got to tell you about our newest patron members. So here we go. Jimmy goes through the gauntlet of names.

Let's see how I do. Pam Danish. Andrew Mellinger. James Stover, Chris Thomas, Zach Stubing, Matthew Poudons. Courtney Maya, Nick Kaiser, Ryan McKenzie, in Almeda Logan Armenders

Sam Brown Nailed it Liam Oliver and Nick That was the easiest crop we've had in a while I think I think maybe

Maybe Patreon Sam rearranged the order for me She did a little Nice Niceness Poudons couldn't have been right I don't have the list In front of me

But Pudans Doesn't sound right But Well Pudan Pudans Pudans PUD

A-N-S. Poudon. Poudon. That's Jake's favorite pastime. What happened to you? Yeah. No, Jake came out of the womb covered in shit. Yes.

Big time. All right. Here we go. We have some notes to B-B-D put on here. Markegaugus retired. Mikel Franco gets a deal with MLB. Is it Franco? Isn't his name like the one that you would pronounce normal?

I know it's Mikel. Michael. Franco. It's not Michael. I think it is. No, it's Mikel. Oh. Ray send down Wander Franco.

Two Franco's making news. Look at that. Sunny Greatest starts season on IL with back issue. That sucks. I didn't know that. Ostenola, broken left middle finger. Flipping too many people off. Francona hints at Andres Jimenez being Cleveland shortstop. This was before they like officially did the Ahmed Rosario playing center field thing and they had a very bad inning.

so. I think we've had some opening day starters, like confirmed to. Gioledo's getting the pill for the White Sox. Grankies is the opening day starter for the Astros. Surprise, surprise. Gibby, our boy. Gibby, yep. So I talked to Gibby yesterday before we get started.

I got to give him a little shout out on talking baseball. So I think one of the things we do is we let people know who to root for, like the good guys. I like that. And Gibby's one of those. He's helped us out of the company. Anyways, yesterday. Four innings pitched. 6K's shuddy baseball from Gibby.

He says he found a cutter. No. He says he found a cutter. Lance Lynn's school of fastballs, dude. Which is going to go into my topic later, but he said he found a cutter and his sinker sank in again. He feels really confident. Opening day starter.

So go, you know, if there's anybody you want to root for, it's a nice guy, it's Gibby. Gibby season. All right, Gibby is a nice guy, and we like him a lot of Jamboy. He likes us. He's very nice to us. But also, Glassnow is a co-host on a podcast on our network. He debuted his new slider.

Did you guys see that? I mean, it's what Glass Now has needed forever. I think last year, obviously, I was pretty tough on him because I was like, dude, you need a third pitch. And now he threw 22 of these sliders. I don't know if you guys saw him. They were nasty. Yeah. And he located him pretty well.

He said he didn't locate him afterwards, but he's lying. Like he was down and in with the slider and the results were crazy. Actually, he got our boy Kotuck. He got his boy Kotuck. I mean, they're buddies. He got Polanco. He was cruising. Yeah, I mean, it'll be interesting to see where he lands between the slider and the curve. You know, if he starts leaning one way or the other, you still, you'd hope it's a change-up or a split or something.

Because the curve and the slider, Treve, I mean, you tell me, you were in the box. But, I mean, those are, they're doing similar things that when Tyler's in that tight spot or whether you're, you know, facing righty lefty if you've got that change or something going away from them. That's an ideal third pitch, but hey, a third pitch is a third pitch. No. I love you,

but no, it's fun. That's the third pitch he needs. Righty is just the change-up splitter thing is very rare right-on-right. Most guys do the curveball slider, especially when you got like the 12-6 type of curveball that he has. I'll call it like a power

power curve. Yeah. And then you had the slider on top of that. Because a slider, I haven't seen it. So I have to see it, Jake. Okay. I need to see the shape of it. But if he's throwing it hard and it's coming out, then that's more of like a tunnel with his fastball thing.

Because what Jim was alluding to him being a two-pitch guy, it was the heater coming out straight and the curveball pops for him. So you can see that out of his hand. The curveball does the slider now coming out of the same tunnel as the fastball. That's the difference. He has a 12-6 curve. The slider that he used, I can put it up for us to see, was definitely sweeping. Like the catcher has to move left to right, where the curveball is very vertical.

So I think if he can use both of these. I mean, this guy already had weapons with two pitches. Any third pitch helps. He did need a third pitch. Yeah. He threw the change up a couple. Link me something to the slider if you can. Just go to Twitter and type in Glass Now Slider.

And the first thing that comes up is like a pitching ninja who's someone you want to talk about later. And there's a disgusting backfoot 88 mile per hour slider that pitching ninja posted. Disgusting backfoot 88 mile per hour slider. And then if you scroll down, you can see him getting Polanco and getting Cole. It's really good shape of a slider. You like it, Trev? It's a great third pitch for him. Yes.

Yeah. It's exciting if you're a race fan. not if you are not a race fan and get to play Glass Now a lot. Anyone else? Yeah. Good for him. All right. I don't know if there's anything else around the league.

Jake, let's jump straight to your conversation. You're bringing to the table today. I didn't know you guys had been bickering about this. Yeah. But I'm excited to hear both sides. So I've been doing my list videos. The catchers just dropped. I just asked producer Zach for that

So I could post it on my own Twitter in a little bit But it dropped on the YouTube I've been doing the list And we want to do it in our own silly way So we went full weird science And we also did the worst in a silly way Just just poking fun at guys That aren't obviously going to take it to heart

But so going through these lists I was trying to I wanted to be fair And obviously people are going to get mad You're going to like your blank Over the other team's blank Like you become attached to these guys We're baseball fans.

The one position with insane depth, and I put a couple tweets out there, and then actually diving into these positions and seeing the depth on them and where you start getting to, you know, those seven, eight, ninth guys, or, you know, a lot of the positions, like, you had 12, and it's how do you fit him in the top 10? You know, you're going to miss one guy at first base, or you're going to miss one guy here or there. Guys, third base in this league right now, I think it's the best it's ever been.

And I know Trev wants to discuss that a little bit. And I had some comments on an old tweet about that. But I think what needs to be appreciated, first and foremost, because, you know, you can fight over those top six guys. If you're a Chapman, Bregman, Machado, Ramirez, Rendon, Aeronado guy. I mean, pick your poison. Like, those guys are all lights out. going to be an MVP races if they're healthy for a full season type of dudes.

So, I mean, that's pick your flavor of ice cream. Now, you go to the second tier. You've got guys like Donaldson, Justin Turner. I mean, Eugenio Suarez, Devers, Gio Orchella, which me and Trev had a lot of discussions about. And then Chris Bryant, another guy with an MVP in the bag. And I'll even add, I think, Yohan Moncada deserves to be in that next time. of guys for what he did in his last full season. These guys are special impact players that you see them on the right day.

I've already named 13 guys. And I'll keep going. I'll get my full speech out and we'll start to dissect it how we want. Let's go to the Youngbloods. Who's next? Your top prospects, dudes you're into. I'll start with a couple guys who are more established. How about Bo Bosh, or not Bichet, excuse me, Vizio.

Vigio's sliding over to third this year. He's supposed to be there for the whole season. Simeon's supposed to be up the middle with Bo. I mean, Vigio's established. Like, he gets on base. He does a lot of other stuff. He's going to be locked into third this year. That's a really good young baseball player.

Keep it on the East Coast. Alec Bome, Carter Keyboom, Austin Riley. Those guys are going to be prove it. I mean, they're big prospects. Let's see what you've got for a full season. Sure. And then, Brian Hayes.

Hello, could he hit? He did that in bunches last year, and he's supposed to be as special as a fielder as those other guys. So now we're up to 18 guys that you're kind of, you're excited about. I mean, I talked about the premier guys that next tier is really good baseball players. These are young guys that if they're on your team, you're stoked. And then you keep going. How about guys that are just good baseball players?

Like, no shots fired, you kind of know what you're going to get. Brian Anderson with the Marlowe. He's good, man. It's in the middle of that lineup. He plays solid defense. He's a good ball player. J.D. Davis, man. That dude can hit.

A little suspect with the glove, looking for a position, but, man, OPS is in the eights. Like, that dude can rake. Kyle Seeger, he's done it in Seattle for a decade now. Gold gloves, All-Star appearance. Lefty bat with power. If he played at Yankee Stadium, he'd probably have another 20 homers in his career. Guys got what, 300 plus in the bag? Who cares?

it. Eduardo Escobar. I love watching that guy play. He's a five-tool light guy. He'll run on you. He'll hit with power. I'll hit with contact. He'll play defense. Love me some Eduardo Escobar. We're up to 23 guys out of 30 teams who are impact third baseman. Let's get to the platoon teams who aren't given guys kind of full run. Tampa Bay. Joey Wendell. Mike Brasso. Yep. Switch them up. Throw Yondi over there for a day. He'll party sure. San Francisco, don't sleep on Longoria and Lestella combination. Don't sleep on that. In Milwaukee, we're trying to talk ourselves into Shaw.

We'll see what he's got this year, and they've got the young guy Urius who came over, so they're hoping to find a solution at third base. Detroit, I know you're looking for love right now. Heimer Candelario. He racked up two war in 52 games last year. He's a switch-hitting young third baseman. We'll see if he can do it, but Detroit likes that guy, so you should like that guy. Guys, we're down to three teams with three base situations that you're like,

eh? Treves, Texas Rangers, Rough Ned Odor is moving over to third. We'll see what he's got. Kiner Folefa, he's moving over to Shortsop. He won the Gold Glove at third last year, so they didn't mind third base last year. But they're kind of just throwing Odor there and Trev's most hated franchise, so we're down on them. Colorado Rockies, they're putting.

and Ryan McMahon. They traded Aeronado. McMahon's got a 20-plus Homer season in the bag. He's going to be locked in at third base for a year. The Rockies don't hate him. They want to see what he's got for a year at third base. They're not going to be Aeronado. I'm sorry. And the other team that really doesn't have the impact 3B you'd like to see is Ruiz with the Baltimore Orioles. They do have Ryan Mountcastle who played some shortstop in the minors and they experimented with third. And that dude can hit. So I'm low-key rooting for them to give him a shot at third base. right now they don't have them penciled there but guys going through the league you've got 23

slash if you add the platoon situations like 25 third base situations you should like your team is into and i don't know i was just blown away going through the list i think i left out hunter dozier on kansas city he was supposed to be in the brian anderson tier he just got the bag himself like They really like him. So I've just been blown away looking at the third baseman. Top tier talent and depth. It's almost unbelievable. Very good.

He crushed that, bro. He crushed it. Thank you. Oh, and yeah, the O's just signed Mikel-Franko. So, and I don't know. I want to put him in probably that Dozier-Anderson tier, but dudes hit a little bit and he's around. Trev?

I got it. I mean, I loved everything you just said. Thank you. He mentioned everyone. I need you to mention. I think the first thing that maybe I disagree with is I think there's another guy you need to put in that elite tier. And that's Josh Donaldson. I love me, Josh.

Glove, bat, everything that he brings to the table. We'll talk about his, his, God, I can't think of the word I'm trying to say. His impact on clubhouse culture. Okay. You can't understate that. But yes, I mean, this is. Hard to take that into, like, position. list. I appreciate

that a lot and it's actually the next. We're just talking about tears and where he belongs. I think that you have to add that with a guy like Josh because he's such a wealth of knowledge on the offensive side. He's been around for a long time. Glad you mentioned Longoria. I didn't think you were going to.

Oh, Treff. Come on. He's like he's like the guy that he's your favorite player's favorite player. All these third basemen, they look at Longoria. He's had the sustained success. He's had he's got everything you want. Three gold gloves. He's a guy.

But I do agree. I mean, yes, if we're talking deepest talent pool position in the big least, it's probably it's probably a third base. I think there's a reason for that. I think that you know, if you get these short stops

that, you know, can play short and they're good enough to play short defensively, but then they get a little big, they can move them over to third. And I think that has the position out a lot. It does not work the other way. Besides with Kinearolefa, he went from third to short. He's been all over.

It doesn't work that way. So I think that's, they get a little bit of that extra like a runoff from the short stuff position, which helps a lot when you're talking about depth. But yeah, this is an exciting group of players. And it's been that way, you know, since around like 2010, it started to become that way. And it's just sustained with guys that came up. Like, you know, we had Aeronado. He's been around for a long time.

and here comes Chapman and Turner's been doing it for a long time. I mean, Chris Bryant, I think he should also be in the elite tier. And I know that, you know, it hasn't been that last year. But 2019, I'm pretty sure it's pretty damn good for Chris Bryant. It's good. Do you want to hear some offensive stats between all of them? Like, I did the last 18, 19, and then the shortened season 20. I feel like you go beyond that.

You're really pulling out. No one cares about your 2017 anymore. I don't think. So that's the most three recent seasons in 2020. I usually would just do the last two, but 2020 is so weird. I'm including 18 as well. You got 15, you got 16 guys that have had an OPS plus above 100,

so above average hitters. But I think that's very normal because you're not going to run out a third basement that can't hit. It's not catcher or shortstop or centerfield where you'll run out a guy day in, day out, that cannot be an above average back. What's crazy is the glove that a lot of those top guys have. So over the last three years, who would you guess has the highest OPS Plus or OPS? Bregman, Aeronado. Yeah.

Bregman's number one. He's got a 153 OPS plus, and then it's Rendon. He has a 147 and then Turner with a 139. You don't think of Justin Turner. But he's the third highest in OPS Plus over the first. the last three years at third base. And man, people... Then it's Jose Ramirez, then it's Mani Machado,

then it's Matt Chapman, then it's Ah, Eugenio Suarez, then it's Gio Orchella. Josh Donaldson goes down to 10. Aronado goes down to 11. Is his OPS Plus? Yeah. Yeah.

Pretty wide. Donuts only played 52 games in... Yeah, yeah. He was hurt in 2018, so that hurts him. Yes. Because 2019, he had a 900 OPS, 126 OPS Plus and then last year 131.

Yeah, there's caveats for a lot of you. I mean, Chris Bryant drops really far down. Devers on this list is 13th, which Boston fans will probably freak out. But there's a lot of different things about that. Jim, the only other thing I'd say about Aeronado there is the OPS plus does take in ballpark factors. Yep, there go.

So I'm not, I wasn't presenting this to downplay anyone. I was just presenting it to say how good third, It's a height in your thing. Like to have half the league, third base are really good, and the top 10 are really good is Jake's point. So what's your, what are you countering, Traff? Well, I guess my thing I don't have any counter. What do you mean?

What counter? You guys said you've been bickering about this? My thing, well, we've been bickering about a few of the guys. Well, he put Gio Rochelle as the ninth best third baseman in the game right now and left Chris Brian off the list. So that's, I bickered with that. I had some nice conversations with Cubs fans, and they, you know, it's very much, KB needs to,

prove he's still KB this year. And there's a very good chance he can't. That's such recency bias. It's freaking ridiculous. No, Trev, the other part you're missing. One season in 2020, get out of here. Trevor. Didn't we just do the last three seasons? This ties back into the conversation of the past three seasons and you're underestimating what Gio Orchella has done offensively as well. Where's Gio Orchella on that list of last three seasons? He was six. He was six. He was six. So that's like the whole point. So in the last three seasons, Giorchella has a 305 batting average Chris Bryan is a 269. Gio O'Shella has a 353 on base percentage.

Chris Bryant has a 368. So Brian's beating O'Shella on base percentage. Giorchella is beating Brian in slugging, beating him in OPS, and beating him in OPS Plus, and he's better at defense. Yeah, I mean, you know. I get what you're saying.

Chris Bryant has an MVP in the bag, and I hope he bust that out this season. But, dude. Over the last three years, Gio O'Shella has a 305 batting average with an 863 Ops. He's been really, really good. I'm not seeing Gio O'O.Rcella on my fangrass page. I have the third baseman is listed. Is he not listed as a third baseman?

Is that what it is? I don't know. I'm not sure what you're looking at. But I would say Chris Bryant probably has a higher ceiling, but he hasn't been coming close to his ceiling less. Him and Gio hitting-wise have almost been even. On the roof. He's been on top of his ceiling, almost.

We don't... He's catching birds. We didn't know he had that ceiling. I have Gior Shella the last three years is a 128 weighted runs created plus. I like that one a little bit better. And then where is Chris Bryant? Chris Bryant is 125. So you were right.

He's right there together. I just give the total body of work more credit than... I understand. I understand. And that's where we're not saying stuff that's too different. But I mean, I think Chris Bryant defensively, you'd rather have Gio a third. I hope Chris Bryant proves me wrong too because he's in a contract here

but it's just the point man that like Devers Suarez Urchella of Chris Bryant those guys can be left off a top 10 where if you look at other positions and I think this is what I want to kick back to you Trev is I get the third base thing like you're saying a lot of short stops

they start there they push off third base is kind of the natural progression you either lean to third or second some guys kick out to center field whatever First base has for years seemingly been the position that, you know, it was kind of the old Little League stereotype. You'd put the big hit who can hit over there.

For years, it was almost the major league stereotype that like, well, he's not doing it anywhere else. Can we try him at first base? First base, when I was doing the top 10 list, you start getting towards the bottom of that list. And guys who are fighting for the 10 spot are Carlos San Francisco. who I put there, and I love. I mean, he's an on-based specialist later in his career at this point, and he's at an awesome career. Jesus Aguilar, Josh Bell, which I know those guys have seasons in

the tank and potential going forward, but I think the juxtaposition between third base and first base, first base doesn't have that excitement right now. It doesn't have nearly the depth of third base and that's that's kind of confusing to me because that that in the back of ever baseball fan's head is the let's try him over their position kind of the final try him over their position yeah you know I think it's more of like an older position too because you want to get if you have a guy that can move around still and still play some defense you want to maximize his value and you're seeing some guys come up as first baseman but a lot of guys don't come up as first baseman they end up moving there so

you know, as they move there, they tend to be a little bit older. If you have a guy that can pick it, you're not necessarily at first base. You try them at third base or in the outfield or something. I think first base is the last position defensively that you're focusing on. So you can stick, like you're saying, kind of the little league thing, you can stick a guy over there, hide him over there better than any other position in the field. Who are some of the best first baseman? Like Freeman, okay.

Freeman's number one. No, I was thinking all time, but I went to Freeman anyway. Oh, all time. Well, I wanted to see... Pool holes. Freddy, like, did they... When did they switch to first base only? Like, Descheris started out as a third baseman and outfielder.

And then he became a premier... Freddie came up as a first baseman. So he... Albert didn't. Albert started at third. Yeah, first... Freddie was first base at 17 years old. He was playing first base.

He played a handful of games at third. So Freddie was first base through and through. I was trying to think of really good defensive first baseman. Very few people do that. Yeah. No, Trev, that's an interesting point because kind of what you were saying about third base is that there are guys that are third baseman. They come up, they play third base, and then they kind of get the shortstop boost.

First base is the final destination for some guys. I mean, look at Vladito. like next year's top 10 first baseman list, I would not be shocked if Vladito's there. But for this year, it was kind of tough to put him on because, A, he's still got a lot to prove hitting-wise, and defensively it's going to be his first year over there. So, yeah, I mean, you know, I think people would be shocked if you go through the top, if you did top 20 first baseman versus top 23rd baseman, I think people would be shocked, you know, how quickly you start running into guys like

Brandon Belt and these aren't shots fired or anything. Brandon Belt's a very nice ball player, but again, we're talking about these third basemen who are game-changing, you know, kind of future of franchise potentially type guys. Yeah, I think just, I think the whole defensive thing, that's the last position you value.

So they're not going to get a lot of value out of their defensive war. I think that has something to do with it. And it is kind of a spot where it's weird to say this because there are so many responsibilities as a first baseman and it's not an easy position to play but it's the easiest one to learn if you've never played it like if you've never played outfield they just throw you in the outfield it's very hard some guys can do it because they're still athletes you know if they throw you at second base

or source that that's not going to work but if you they throw you at first base and you've played the other positions before you can learn first base pretty quickly and be adequate whereas the other positions is just that doesn't happen. And I would say third base is probably the second one where defense doesn't matter. But we've had such a influx of

talented dudes. And I have another thought on that. I think most of these guys could be short stops, but the way people lift now and the way they want you to look and hit for power, they just you just lift yourself off of the shortstop position. You're too big.

Got to be wider. Eventually, we're going to see Fernando Tatis Jr. move over to third base. Oh, you got 14 years to do it. That Mischado guy going to be hanging around with him too. That's true. But I don't think Machato's there for 14 years. Yeah, also true. Yeah.

First base is really important too. Like, we can't dismiss that because if you have a good first base bin, wow, like what a difference in it. A lot of people will cite that when you talk about Matt Chapman. They'll say he's got Matt Olson over there picking. his, all of his throws. Yeah. And that big old body, that big old target.

You know, Hosmer gets, he wins gold gloves. The analytics are kind of weird with him defensively, but it is a huge target, dude. And that, the confidence that gives people on the left side of the infield to throw the ball over there is huge. Treve, I love you bringing up the power because I didn't really think about that. Because you're so right. I mean, Matt Chapman, Aronado, if they weren't focused on being power hitters at the plate, Those guys would be fantastic shortstops if they wanted to be. Like there's nothing stopping them.

So that's a really interesting angle. Huh. Huh. Huh. That's what she said. It's nice to have a good third baseman. The Yankees didn't have a good third baseman for a long time after A-Rout retired. And we got the opposite of spoiled, even though the Yanke's fans are always spoiled, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And then, and then Gio came, which is partly why our hearts are just so big because I. He's loved him. He's been good. It was like, it was like Young Jervis, Sir Larte. Chase Headley, Andue Har had the worst defensive season of the third basements had in the history of the sport. It was bad. I will point out that if we're talking about war

that from 2018 through 2020, Chris Bryant has about three more wins. He has exactly three more wins than Gior O'Shella. That's including 20. Yeah, I mean, I mean, that's very, you're, there's a big difference. Chris Bryant's better than Girochella. But according to the recent two years,

Giochella's name is up there. I mean, Gio three years ago, which we included in this, didn't, like, was a minor league baseball play. The Yankees picked him up for 20 grand, Trev. Do you know that? No, that's great. I know.

He wasn't even getting any shine in Cleveland. 20 grand. Well, he couldn't hit. I went out to the club with Gio before. You did? I did. Him and Jason Kipis. we went to the club.

The crew. Wow. You Kip and Geo. Even the last two seasons, last two seasons, Brian's at 5.3, Gio's at 4.7. Yeah. So, look, I'm just saying,

I would take Brian. I get why you did Ershund. Everyone should take Brian. You very well could be right. I don't necessarily agree with that. I think that's backing off too much. But the Gio side can also be very right. I think Gio-R-Sheld is better looking to Chris Bryant.

That's a hot take. Gio's very cute. Give Gio or Shela Chris Bryant's eyes and you're got a Oh my gosh That's scary He's opposite

No I don't know I'm scared His eyes are too much They're too much Too piercing Yeah Jimmy's a leader I love the discussion

You know I love the third base position So this is nice to go ahead And give some boys some shine I mean look We go back just a few years Mike Musochus was putting on a clinic over there We talked about Longo already Donaldson and Aeronado

Turner is like this sneaky guy. Like we know he's good. But then when you really look at the numbers, like, holy shit. Justin Turner, you've been doing it, man. It's been very good. Trev, you're, you pointing out the bounce pass from third base.

You like opened up a key to my brain that I love now. You know when someone points something out in a movie and then every time you catch it, you're like, aha, that's that thing. Like in movies, they take all the headrests off the driver's seat. At the driver's seat. take the headrest off the back. If you've never noticed that for,

now you'll notice it every time you see it, and you're like, oh my God, that's weird. And they take the rearview mirror off because the camera films from the back seat and they can't have the reflection of the mirror. So now you won't ever be able to not see those. Or like the FedEx truck has an arrow pointing to the front of the truck in between the E and the X or the D and the, whatever it is.

You've done that with the bounce pass from third base. Every time I see it, I like go like, aha, ha! A bounce pass trev told me about. Give him a chance. Yeah. Very much. And Turner does it so softly and, like, so on purpose, it's not a spike throw. It's, like, very much a planned bounce pass.

Yeah. Long hop. That's all you got to worry about. Get him a long hop. First baseman, love it. Yeah. I like it. Anyway.

Long hop. We're going to move on to Trevor's topic, which is weed related. So Cushy Dreams is sponsoring it. They're not even weed, though. They're just CBD. But smells like weed, feels like weed, tastes like weed. But it's just CBD. It's smoky.

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Baseball for 20% off today. It's K-U-S-H-Y. Chill out, relax. The flour looks, smells, tastes like high-quality marijuana. And every run is a limited small batch. So enjoy that. Trev. You want to talk about how much you love pitchers?

I do. I do want to talk about it. And it's going to be short because I don't love them that much. You guys know that. but okay so for my topic i want to talk about tech i want to talk about a little bit of pitching ninja and the effect that he's had on the game and then i want to talk about a dream i had here we go i think i'll start out with the dream and this is true i really had this dream okay in my dream i was still a baseball player so you know it's a dream okay and i guess because we've

been talking about this tech and how it usually just benefits pitchers. I started using this VR, these VR goggles that showed pitchers giving it bats. And I also read an article that I guess two, I forget who the players were, but they mentioned that they were using this VR thing now prior to their bats and they both hit homers. So it started to get me thinking. I had this dream that I was using it and it worked. That's the dream. So that's cool. But then it started to get me thinking. All the tech helps pitchers. Pitching Ninjas got all those guys showing grips for all the different pitches.

I mean, you, Darvish is just giving away a wealth of knowledge, how he throws every single pitch, how his thumb placement on the ball will dictate if it's 86 miles an hour, 88 miles an hour, 92 miles an hour. And every single guy is out there now trying to throw these nasty pitches. So the rich get richer. But. But I'm. From this dream, I started to think about how can hitters counter this? If this VR thing gets up where you can feel like you're having real at bats against pitchers, the third time through the order thing, that might start coming around first time through the order.

If you could legitimately have at bats against a pitcher where it's simulated and it felt real, the amount that that helps you going into an abat is astronomical. This could be the thing. If they get this right, this could be the thing that turns the tide where pitchers aren't just absolutely dominating hitters the way they have been. Because we know all the numbers. First time through the order, pitchers are big advantage. Second time through the order, pitchers still have the advantage.

Not as big, but still pretty big. third time through the order it gets even or the hitters have the advantage if a hitter has the ability to go and take it bats virtually against these guys and then go up there and face them in real life already having that muscle memory and the vision it could absolutely change the game so i was off the vr because i've tried some that aren't they weren't there yet but then i had this dream and i'm thinking it's coming like we're we're this VR sets are coming. What is that going to do to the game?

I think it's going to revolutionize the way you prepare to face a pitcher. Because right now, you can't do anything. You watch video on him. You talk about what pitches he throws. And now everybody throws every pitch. So when you get these scouting report,

just like he throws this, this, this, this. And you're sitting there as a hitter and you're like, well, fuck. what am I supposed to do give me the plan what's the plan but if you can go simulate these at bats and then go face them and it's real I think that is

that's the little key opening it up as Jimmy likes to say how do you guys feel about that do you think it's enough well who do we have on doll was the first person that told us about that when we had him on and he said in Colorado they were they had the machines that simulated

like the pitcher's breaks and stuff to help them on the road where they were like kind of And then yeah It was some tweet that the guy Two guys was the A's guys They faced the pitcher Yeah these guys yes

I think it was A's guys They faced the pitcher before in the VR And then they both homered off of them I forget what pitcher it was Yeah I don't know man I mean it sounds cool It sounds like one step into the wrong direction If you just have like robot baseball

robot human baseball. Yeah. But there's just, you know, as a hitter, you don't control any variables. You're up there and you're at the mercy of what he's going to throw you, what the umpire's going to call, all of that. But if there's a way to, you know, get some sort of advantage in that first at bat, I think this is it. And I'm curious how it'll be received. If you can just have VR goggles and sit in the on deck circle or you can go into your cage, or you can go into your cage, and do this right prior to your bat?

It's going to help so much. And it almost makes me think like they're going to try to outlaw it. Yeah. What you're saying to me makes me want to. I'm calling for position cards to be outlawed. I don't want guys wearing goggles on deck facing the pitcher. But I mean, as a tool, it probably helps before the game.

Well, they just take away batting practice and everyone just does, everyone just standing in a, like socially distanced across the outfield with goggles on taking their virtual BP. Is that the future of prepping? I don't think you still have to do it, but if you're able to see and see the flight of the ball, how much it's breaking, when it's breaking,

get your cadence, all that stuff, which is impossible to do right now. Even if they have those machines that simulate the pitchers, it's still not the same. I can't wait for I can't wait for, you know how pitching ninja has the flat ground app to help guys get discovered that are thrown really hard. I can't wait until this VR

at Bats becomes like a video game that everyone can have in their home. And like the best high score we're in like you get like you get drafted now like oh i took mac shurser d i took 2017 max shirzer deep three times today like i'm gonna spend i spend every 10 hours a day just taking at bats and after a year i'm like hey i can guarantee you a single off max shirzer i know exactly what it's gonna happen yeah imagine the guitar hero effect going on here and there's kids who said, like, there's going to be a kid in Juneau, Alaska, who's never played a baseball game, but he's the best hitter ever.

Ever. That sounds like a disaster. Treve, the only thing, I want to bounce this back to you, and I'm not doing this in a rude way, you're the guy who played baseball, but the guys who had your number, because that's the question, because I've realized, like, how good hitters are. Like, when you actually think what it means to go through the order, the third time and all these MLB hitters hit is insane that they can see a pitcher twice and

say, okay, well, now I'm going to rake. Like, that's nuts to me because that's not how it works for us pedestrian MLB players. So I guess the question is the guys that had your number, and I know Scherzer was one of them, you brought him up, like, I guess is it just their pitch mix or like How would pitchers try to have that effect? And I know that sounds dumb. Pitchers trying to be Max Scher, but it's just like, would this just make the elite more elite? Like there's no way you're just going to be able to hit them in real life?

I think it's like when you can't hit somebody or you just have horrible numbers, usually it's because you're just not picking the ball up. You know, your recognition phase is shorter for some reason. You don't see the ball out of his hand. he maybe hides it or he just knows how to exploit you but the more and more you see what he's trying to do with you the more and more you face him and if you got to you had a way to get your timing down and then you like had enough at bats against the guy that's the thing is like if you could just take like jimmy said if you could sit there for 10 hours i mean not 10 hours but you sit there

for a long time and just take at bat after a bat after a bat after bat after bat you're going to be able to pick up his release point at some point. You're going to be able to, you know, lay off pitches that you're going to swing at because you're like, oh, that's that pitch. Oh, that's that pitch. Oh, okay. I think this is going to change the game in a positive way for hitters. Like I said, almost to a point where they're going to have to have some limitations on it. If it gets to as good as some of the guys are telling me that these things are getting. And it's only a matter of time, right? Pitchers will just have to, like, you know, is that Granky is immune to this because he changes his delivery and his timing so much.

That's going to be a thing. Yeah. That's, pitchers are already doing that. You see what Stroman is doing. We see Granky, the one of the Ephis and stuff. But still, this, if you could randomize the delivery and something like this, there's so many things you could do. I think it's just, it's interesting. Can we get you this, Treve and turn into a content series?

And then like, we can, we can, like, I would love to. Yeah, well, and then, you know, we'll have like your VR book. Like, we'll clap. Like, you come on the pod one day and you're like, you're like, a sponsor, a VR sponsor, I believe. I think it's the company that does all this stuff too. I don't say it, but I think it is.

And then you have a VR book, you know, like you, you come on the pod and you're like, DeGrom's in my book and we just clap for you now. And then maybe we get it. Maybe we get it over here. And we see like Jake and mine's Bunt single book. I always thought that the like video game, you know, like you went to some really cool arcades or Dave and Busters that had like the home run derby machine.

Yeah. Like if you could really make that happen and like have people see like what it's like to face a majorly pitcher, that would be, it would be awesome. And I think this is, this is a way. I would love to see Jake get up there,

put the goggles on and face to Grom. I mean, I was ready this spring. I was ready for Flaherty. I want them. I've got them. your hands through. But the reason I started thinking about all this

is because of the amount of information being shared via pitching ninja. It's crazy to me how all these pitchers are now going on and showing their grips. And it's almost, it sounds weird, but I feel like it's not a good idea

for them to be doing that. You don't want your hitters dominated by the pitch that you taught the other pitch, her to throw is you see that a lot these grips that's it's what it is that's why pitchers are using tech now and they're using the edutronic cameras they're changing their grip you know centimeters millimeters millimeters at a time until they get what they want they're creating pitches and now if you don't even have to go through that process and you're like oh you Darvish just showed how where he puts his fingers on the baseball and he explained the feel that he had uh at release and you just

go and try it and all the sudden now you're throwing you got six or seven pitches now that you're trying to establish and maybe one or two of them you figure out, well, you just added two different pitches to your repertoire and here we are. And hitters cannot. You're going to hate our coffee table book. Yeah.

We can't say it. We can't say it. Yeah, we can't say it. Trev, the story that's of Yankee lore is that Mariano Rivera taught Doc Holliday his cutter at an All-Star game and all the Yankee hitters were pissed at him. Yeah.

That's what I'm saying. And that's just becoming normal life. Like it almost used to be a baseball code. You don't share that outside of the team. And now pitch ninja, you know, you could see Stroman's pitch mix in one video. And we, and it's interesting because we as hitters have things on pitchers. I'm releasing a sequence today that is by far my favorite episode I've ever released. So go check that out.

And it's about the tell that I had on Jordan Hicks. Now, I could have kept, I mean, I did. I kept it. I told one team that. I told the team that I was on that. But if I was a pitcher and I figured something out, I'm going on and sharing it. Hitters don't do that. We don't share that information with everybody.

Maybe some mechanical stuff, whatever, whatever, but that's not really going to give you an advantage in the box. Well, it's because like the pitcher, if they find out it's being talked about publicly, they can make the adjustment. It needs to be secret. The pitching grips don't need to be a secret. it. He should be a secret.

Because hitters can't hone in on the fingers unless they see the knuckle sticking up at second base or something. Do you think Gierme had a Hicks? Do you think Hicks was tipping in his first time back pitching again? That's why Gior may. No, he didn't.

So go watch the video. I talked about it. All right. Because I eventually told Jack that he was doing it. I didn't want him to blow any of Jack's save. It wins. So I told him he definitely fixed it,

but it's a great episode, so go check that out. It's just interesting, like, who's sharing the information, what is being shared. The whole pitch grip thing that Pitchie Ninja is doing is, it's insane. Jojo Romero, pitcher for the Phillies, has a new slider that he learned from watching Pitching Ninja videos, and it's disgusting.

And it could change his career. It could freaking change a guy's career. if they figure out a pitch like oh shit this really works for me gibby i don't think he learned his on pitching ninja but he learned it from somewhere learned his cutter from summer now he's saying dude i feel like i'm gonna dominate well i mean i i like that that's cool and and stroman said like his grips are so weird because his fingers and his natural release of his wrist is different than a lot of guys sure he said like sherman was cool he said like you know however the normal person holds the ball

he turns his fingers completely diagonal from that, like every pitch swear. Something with his wrist. I saw him talking about. The guys that weird me out is when they throw their slider and their fastball with the same exact grip, they just pressure points different and like little release is different.

I'm like, what? That's crazy. The fact that you can practice all those and really dial them in now with like great accuracy, like even to the point where you're trying to match the spin axis the RPMs, that's the difference maker.

Someone could show you a pitch, you're like, oh yeah, throw it like this. Unless you have the info on it and the data and an ability to in real time get their results, like they do now, you wouldn't be able to shape your pitches that quickly. Now it's like, it could happen in one bullpen session. And it's scary for hitters, man. We already control nothing, no variables. That's why we're the real deal. hitters.

That's the position for, I want to say men, but I can't say it in 2021. That's the position for real deal guys. Pitchers, you guys are all sissies. Wow. There it is. I just reached out to our director. I had to win too much. I just reached out to our director of sales.

I asked, are we in touch with this company? She said, yes. She said they're buying some ads, certain places. I said, we can make a series where we all use it. she said they don't have it out for like fun right now it's like for actually it's like for baseball players trying to like use it and i said we can make a series where trev is trying to get back into melb by using it and she said oh that's cool so now you're making your return to MLB i'm gonna be a 50-50 guide i'm gonna work with donaldson over uh yeah no more 70 30

fucking what an idiot i love you being i love you when if coach trev ever graduates i just want you to be like the voice of hitters like I want you to you can't be I was thinking about that who's going to be the pitching ninja for hitter you there's nobody Josh Donaldson has the most knowledge probably he's like the face of the swing revolution and he can't help guys out that much maybe you're the face and he kind of monitors and whenever he jumps in he kind of alphas you like he did when he changed your whole career path yeah hey BB one what time are we at we in an hour. 53.

Okay, we can do a real quick 10 minute conversation of what I wanted to talk about. I wanted to talk about the White Sox because Gialito was on Chris Rose rotation today and he was talking about TLR, which is the cool new way to type out Tony Larissa everyone's doing. And he was saying he was awesome. And that like, he talked about his first phone call with them. I won't spoil a lot of it. Go listen to Chris Rose rotation for it. But he talked about how the clubhouse culture is great.

And the clubhouse culture in the White Sox has no. in the last like five years to not be great. You had Chris Sale cutting up jerseys. You had Adam LaRoche quitting because his son wasn't allowed in the locker room. You had Ozzy Gehans say that nobody liked Adam Eaton. And Todd Frazier said no one liked Adam Eaton. And now Adam Eaton's back in the White Sox. And I was just thinking about this clubhouse stuff.

And I wanted to figure out who wrote the article because I want to give them a shout out. But there was an article on the athletic written about Drake LaRoche and that whole White Sox stuff from five years ago. Hold on. I have the author's name up here. Dan Hayes. Dan Hayes wrote it. And so one, I wanted to, I was just kind of reliving that.

So first I wanted to talk about the White Sox. And I wanted to talk about clubhouse culture in general. And if you want to read it that athletic story about Drake and Adam LaRoche, it's really weird and interesting. And you don't know whose side I'm on, but like all the players refused to take the field for a spring training game when La Roche quit. And it boils down to LaRoche when he signed with the White Sox. He said, my son, he told the White Sox, this is a two-player deal.

You get me and my son, who was 14 at the time. And then he said his son caught fly balls. He caught balls for the batting practice hitter. He cleaned cleats and shined shoes like he worked. He was part of, he wasn't just hanging around playing on his game boy in a clubhouse, blah, blah. So then after the first year The GM What's his name? Kenny

Kenny Williams William's? Said like can we dial this back a little bit? Like can he not be here a hundred percent of the time? Because apparently he had complaints from some other players on the team. They asked LaRoche like if they could dial it back. He said no, I quit. And he retired on the spot.

He left 13 million on the table and left. Then the players almost boycotted a game. because they were so mad at Williams for doing that. And like, how did you not work out a deal? How did you not figure this out? The players that went to Williams never spoke up because they were like in the minority. And then, but like Adam Laroast was like,

no job allows you to bring your kid 100% of the time. So I fully understand that. But it wasn't the deal I signed with them. So I left. blah, blah. Trev, clubhouse culture. What's a good clubhouse culture? What's a bad?

That's kind of easy. My other question is, how many people are around the clubhouse that make the clubhouse that make the clubhouse? that make the clubhouse different. Be it kids, be it wives, be it girlfriends, be it reporters, be it other people. And how often is the clubhouse closed and just the guys and how much does the mood swing between those two types of environments? That's a lot of questions.

I know, I know, but I was just throwing it all out there. Just talk to me about clubhouse culture and all that. I'll talk about Drake and his kid first, I feel like. I've heard from a lot of people like Kenny Williams is kind of the problem. Like kind of an ego kind of wants it to be his way or the highway thing. I don't even know what his official title is anymore. I don't think he's a GM. I'd be president of the White Sox.

One of those made-up roles that... Yeah. Well, yeah, you have to like continue to improve your title so teams can't interview you or something like that. Whatever it is. I believe his official title is executive vice president. EVP. EVP. Okay. Yeah, you know, I'm, I don't, I wasn't there, obviously, but I've had many of sons and friends in the clubhouse and it doesn't bother me whatsoever. I do like the fact that you said that Drake, the son of Adam the Roach was not just sitting around messing around eating the spread. He was cleaning cleats, helping the clubhouse guys, because that's, that's what the good kids do. Like Eddie Gordado used to bring his kids in all the time. And I love them. They're awesome.

but they would go to work. And he told him, he said, you are not going to just be here. Like, get your ass to work. And so that's cool to hear that. But, yeah, the whole asking him to dial it back, in my mind, what happened was a couple of guys

maybe mentioned it in passing to Kenny Williams, and he just ran with it because he didn't like it. But that was a weird situation. I don't think that affects clubhouse culture. In fact, I think it's probably good for clubhouse culture because there's a couple of things you need to do to have a good clubhouse. You got to be able to forget about

you're pointing to me, Jake. No, I was saying that's rule number one. You're about to say it. Yes, you have to have a short memory. Like, good clubhouse cultures have a short memory. Win or lose, you forget about the day before and it's back to work the following day. That's a Tory Hunter thing.

That's what most good leaders will tell you in baseball. Just because there are so many games, you don't want to get the classic saying is don't get too high, don't get too low. So I think that's a big part of it. You don't want you don't want sulking too much. And you also don't want like extended like, I'm feeling myself,

I'm feeling myself, I'm feeling myself. You want to have the confidence, but get to work every single day. So I think that's, to me, the biggest like culture drainer are the guys that sulk and are like,

woe is me and it'll sit and just sulk. And like everybody goes through it because it's such a long season and because there is so much failure on the offensive side, you're going to feel sorry for yourself, but you've got to try to hide it. You got to try to wait until you get home. You got to wait until no one's around. Like, don't bring that into the clubhouse. That's my, that's the biggest thing for me is what makes a good clubhouse culture.

And then it's, and then it's staying loose. Like you've got to have a guy. So you got to have a guy like Eduardo Escobar or Tori Hunter, a guy that shows up positive every single day. And that is one of the most difficult roles to have as a big leaguer showing up and just like smiling and making sure the atmosphere is light. And sometimes that role passes from person to person. If Tori Hunter, which he never was off, but if he was off one day and like wasn't going to be that guy, like I think there'd be enough sense where somebody would feel that and take that roll up for that day. Tori was one of the unicorns that was always in a good

movie always cheering people up but for the mere mortals you always got to have someone that can take that role for me if you if you were feeling bad you have to have someone that keeps it light i think there's a famous quote about nick swisher and derrick jeter didn't didn't swisher say like we got to have fun to win and jeter says we got to win to have fun is that you guys know that i could see that i could see that sounds like both of those guys right perfectly yeah but that so they're I also know that Nick Swisher, a lot of people in the Yankees Club I felt he was too on. Could be too much.

100%. So there's the fine line there that you have to teeter. You can't just be like, dude, are you not taking this serious? Are you not being professional? So there's a lot of nuances that go on in the clubhouse. But like I said, the main thing I think is the main thing that I think makes a good clubhouse is short memories and then just like putting the work in and trying to keep it as light as possible.

Throughout the season, the regular season. Archie Bradley was on the Chris Rose show as well. He said that something Martine Prado taught him that he loved, that Prado did was he said hi to everyone when he walked in the clubhouse, like did a circle and said hi to everyone by name. And you just felt like, oh shit, like, thanks, Prado. And then Archie was like, I'm on a new team now. And I'm really trying to do that with like the security guard.

He's like, I go up to every scurabic, what's your name again? And all that. Were you, I mean, that seems like exactly who you are because we went to every spring training and you knew every groundskeeper and every social media intern at every team we went to. So is that kind of who you were in the clubhouse? And those guys are very important too.

The clubhouse managers, the clubbies, the traveling secretary, the PR guy, they keep everything moving. They take everything off your plate. And I think that's important too. If you have someone that's kind of shitty, not doing his job, that's going to affect the clubhouse culture.

well. How often is the clubhouse just the players? After BP. After BP before the game, it's going to be just players. I mean, you're going to have the clubhouse guys and all those guys that work for the team. They'll be in there, but they try to stay out. I would say after BP, up until game time, that's the most closed off the clubhouse is going to be. And is that like a different vibe? Is that like if you watch a sports movie, like everyone's kind of like getting focused quieter?

Or is it? It's whatever you need. to do to get ready. So the music will be playing. But a lot of guys now have their headphones in. And whatever you need to get ready for the game, that's when you do you. What kind of guy were you? I play it like my senior year of high school.

We had a hockey team. And there was a group of guys that they needed to be angry to play. So they would play like this head smashing music. And it just would piss me off. And I would need like a children's like nursery rhymes. stuck in my head. Like la-di-da-da-da, light. That's when I played better. Like, I did not play good, angry. And it always was like a battle for like, I don't want to listen to this guys. You guys are just making me mad. Yeah. I was like I had a routine. So like an hour before the

game, getting the hot tub, get loose. Then I get a shower. Then you get changed. You show the stretch. You go in the cage and do all that. That was my routine. Headphones in. Listen to good music. Whatever got you pumped up. I think that's kind of similar to what. what most guys have. And going back to culture, and it's probably my last point on it, I guess. It's that veterans matter. Big time.

And it's hard to quantify it, and there's no data for that, so it gets overlooked in today's game. But it's so hard, and there's so many things going on. Like, you need the veterans that have been there to help the young guys. When they're going through an 0-4-6 games,

game stretch. You got to have a guy to talk him off the ledge. I've been there. This is what's going on. This is what you got to do because it can snowball like that for the young guys. And, you know, I was thinking about like Mike Minor on the Royals now. Like, what's his role? Like these older pitchers that go to these teams, you know, Felix Hernandez is going to Baltimore. A lot of the times, it's just so the young guys can see these dudes work, like how to be a professional pitcher, put the work in the right way, show up every day and do it the right way. and it's almost like a player coach type thing it's a very very important role and it was funny is every single team that wins the world series is like man we are so close we are so close our team is

so close and people always overlook the importance of that and yes i understand like winning makes everyone happy like that's really easy it's easy to be a good guy when you're winning but there's something to that full season, the body of work, keeping everybody uplifted, and you need the veterans to do that. You need to, hey, time for a breather, go into the managers off and say, we're not hitting BP today.

We're not doing anything. How about a show and go, Skip? Let's not show up to the park until 4 o'clock tomorrow. Like, you need the guys that know how to do that. And managers need those guys too. Because managers don't come in the clubhouse as much as people think. Most guys let the, veterans run the clubhouse. That's the player's space, and they rely on those guys to kind of

set the tone. So for the Yankees, I mean, obviously Brett Gardner is probably the guy, right? Yeah. Gardner and C.C. were the guys for a lot. So Booney relies on him for sure and a lot for a lot of those things. Yeah. No, I remember, and I'd love to talk to some of the guys that were there, but Jim brought this to light a couple years back. I think 2019 season, like Trey Mancini was looked at as the leader of kind of the Orioles at that point. And he was, like, 27 had like two seasons. And you wonder, I'm looking at their roster now. And, you know, Chris Davis has been around, but that's also been its own thing.

And there was a couple vets, Andrew Cashner. You just wonder what that environment is like, because a lot of those guys are young and don't know what the next day has to offer. And the veteran stuff, you know, obviously is important. And they can't quantify it. And they'll never be able to. and it'll drive people nuts. I guess, Treve, I think something Jimmy was also trying to,

trying to allude to while also not putting anybody under the bus, but were there ever, like, lingers, man, like, were there, was there any, I know, isn't it Nelson Cruz now has his, like, four buddies that are his posse or whatever, and there's crew, like, was there ever anyone who would just, like, roll through with his buddy, like, every couple games, and be like, come on, man, you can't just be bringing your dude around. I mean, you just have to respect the time. If it's early in the day, like, no one cares.

You know, if they're not acting a fool and stuff. And usually, like, if you brought someone in, there's a room off of the clubhouse adjacent to the clubhouse that they'll hang out in. Okay. But for me, it was never a problem. We never had anybody that overstayed their welcome. Everybody brought people. And I had my cousins come in and go shagg fly balls in the outfield before.

Like, it's such a cool experience. Yeah. And I think most people realize that And it's like, dude, it's one game, it's BP Get the fuck out of the way of everybody else And we'll be okay But there was never a time Where I felt like it was too much of

People who weren't on the roster being in Good Cool Good stuff Clubhouse culture Who's our veteran clubhouse culture? We got to teach BBD the ropes, huh? Yeah, I think it's you

I guess I'm the oldest. I always look to you. Yeah. I look to Jim, so sorry, Jim. I'm the Keep It Light guy, and that's obvious. Yeah, you are the Keep It Light guy. You are that guy. Learn that from Jack Skavone.

You guys know that. Why do you think the Cardinals love Yottie so much and Wayno so much? Like, yeah, they still can play a ball, but they understand the importance of those guys shaping the clubhouse, teaching these guys, how to play the game the right way.

And eventually, Jack's going to be that guy for them. And he's going to have learn from me. Thank you, Jack. You better not forget that. But Wayno and Yaddy. I'm going to say Wayno. You'd say Wayno and Yadi, where you started this whole speech. And Jack's going to be doing that in pinstripe.

So that's whatever. It's important. Cloudless culture is so dang important, man. It's funny because every baseball player will tell you that. And then front of an officer, like, oh, it's not important. It's like, man, come on. Did you ever get asked about a trade? I feel like I've asked this and we've got to go because we're towards the end here.

But like were you ever said like, hey, we're thinking about bringing this guy on? Do you know anything about him? Were you ever the source? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. A lot, actually. And I, there's a manager in the big leagues right now that texts me all the time about players.

And so, I mean, you know, they, people who know. TLR. Especially managers that played understand the importance of is this guy a good guy? I mean, look, I've had bad guy. Does his name rhyme with Laco Larelli? He has...

Alex Cora. He might not have asked me anything. Is Alex Cora? Cora. No, it's obviously Bob Melvin. AJ Hinch. You're getting closer. There's guys that I've hated in my clubhouse.

Don't get me wrong. But not enough where it caused anything. You ever seen like, you ever seen full punches thrown brawl in the clubhouse? Rasseling. Yeah. Like, yes. Yes and no. Like, I don't know about full punches, but fight, yeah.

Rassel, yeah. Yeah. No one's full. It was good. And that's sometimes you need it. El Duque and Horace Fisota was based around sulking, Jim. It was based around sulking. Oh, love it.

Love fighting the solter. Don't bring everybody else. down. Love fighting the sulker. Energy's a real thing. It is a real thing. El Ducke and Jorge Bersata used to get in like fist fights before games and then go out

and be the battery mates on the mouth. I like that. It's really funny. And now El Ducay's son plays on the same college team as Joe Girardi's son. My God. Wow. My Phillies. Joe Girardi, my Phillies.

They're both freshmen. All right. That's the show today. Thank you guys very much for tuning in. We'll be back next Tuesday. The schedule's about to change up as soon as the season starts. We'll let you guys know. We'll keep you go. But we will be back and TPPs will continue as we go. We'll be here soon. Two weeks on the nose. Two weeks on the nose. Jake's Trev's coming here for opening day. We'll be live. Do people know what we're doing? No, we soft announced it. We soft announce it for all the podcast listeners. They're like the secret Club. So podcast listeners.

We are, Trev's coming out here and we'll be live streaming companion watches all day on opening day. And we have like a lot of stuff going on around that to keep us entertained. It's kind of crazy. All right. We will see you later. Wrong one, Jimmy. Wrong music. Dumbass.

There it is.