Talkin' Baseball (MLB Podcast) - Breaking Down Latest MLB Trades, Signings & Extensions

Episode Date: January 8, 2025

Get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs more visibility at https://indeed.com/talkin.Head to https://ZBiotics.com/TALKIN to get your Pre-Alcohol today!Download the DraftKings Sportsbook app and use promo code TALKINJustin Verlander signs 1-year $15 million deal with The San Francisco Giants! Jolly Olive and Talkin’ Jake breakdown what this signing means for the Giants, how Gavin Lux fits into the Reds lineup and the A’s extending Brent Rooker! Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello and welcome to Talkin Baseball. Justin Verlander is a San Francisco giant. Another big trade. Trevor Plouffe is like anarchy avoiding the fire. Jolly Olive is here. Let's talk ball. Hello and welcome to Talkin Baseball presented to you by Seat Geek. My name is Jake Storelli.

I am joined by Jolly Olive, Jack Oliver, Metz Nation. Rise up. Producer Rob Seraco on the ones, two's, threes. And yeah, Trevor Plouffe, I guess everyone go tweet at Trev, be safe. He's living in a post-apocalyptic society right now. He called me this morning while I was at the gym, no good deal. He called me and he's like, I'm literally I'm driving around with my new puppy, Palmer, Palmer Plouf, and they were just hunting for gas stations or things with electricity. So, hey, I know Serious isn't our normal beat on this show.

But yeah, if you got friends out there, looking some of the stuff on the interstate is insane. Doesn't look like the real world. So check on all your friends and family out there. For now, let's talk a little ball. And Jolly Olive, you're here. I am, Jake. The Trevor Plufer placement.

You know, that's my nickname in high school, actually. The Royce Lewis, some people. Oh, easy with that. He says that. How are you? I'm good. I had a crazy commute this morning. probably not the commute that Trevor Pluth is currently having.

So best wishes to him, I should check in on him, send him a text after. But I'm good. We got a little bit of news to talk about. We got some rumors to discuss. And I'm excited. My first TB of 2025. Wow.

Yeah, we're definitely, we're in January. Well, hey, Justin Verlander's resume is enough to lead off any show. And the Lux trade is just weird. and then there's Rooker and Rasmussen extended by your A's and Rays. I don't know the deep dive on that. And I do, I want to ask you a couple Mets questions along the way because Pete's still out there and there's, you know, three from 90 from the Mets. Boris is looking for not three for 90.

About three times that, literally. Yeah. Nine for two. Nine for two something. Two plus. I like Pete Alonzo getting a contract. I don't like Pete Alonzo getting that contract. We can daydream on that in a little bit.

First, let's talk about Justin Verlander signing with the San Francisco Giants. One year, 15 million, the Giants, always in the mix, always in the running, and they get it done, and they kind of round out what looks like an interesting rotation. and it's all brought to you by Zbiotics. I have to tell you about this game-changing product. Use it before a night out with drinks.

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first order when you use talking at checkout. Pre-alcohol is backed with 100% money-back guarantee, so if you're unsatisfied for any reason, they'll refund your money, no questions asked. Head to zbiotics.com slash talking. Use code talking at checkout 15%. So jolly. JV., the old horse, we were joking, you know, what else does he want in this game at a certain point?

Turns 42 on February 20th. 2.20. 420's cousin. He has nine-time All-Star, two-time ERA champ, three-time Saly-Young, two-time World Series, a famous wife, a famous brother.

What's going on here? Well, I first want to say, looking at his baseball card is just a great way to start the day. Like, I mean, this is just, it's getting, it's bonds level for pitchers. I mean, there's just so much bowl. I mean, I'm serious.

But 42 years old coming off a year where he pitched under 100 innings, ERA above five, you look at that, you balk a little bit, but also it is Justin Verlander. And I can speak from a point of experience. A couple years ago, my Mets signed Justin Verlander, and there was a lot of talk about age and does he still have it? And I'm not going to lie to you. When they brought him in, I was excited because of the name,

Justin Verlander and everything that comes with that. that was season 18. This is season 20 for Justin Verlander. So how much is truly left in that tank? I like him as a five, but I honestly thought that with him and Max Scherzer and even Clayton Kirshah, who seems like he goes back to the Dodgers every year

on a one-year deal. Shout out Hiroki Karota. That it might have just been the end for those dudes. And you don't always get the perfect send-off. Like I wouldn't say that 2024 was the perfect send-off. off for Justin Verlander. But it felt like the end for me. So I was pretty shocked to get this notification.

I'm curious to see what tinkering the Giants can do with them. And the rotation of Logan Webb, Robbie Ray, Jordan Hicks, Kyle Harrison, and Justin Verlander, it definitely gets your attention. I'll say that. It's got a little bit of everything. You want the reliever turn starting pitcher? Here's Jordan Hicks, who throws 100 and let's see what a full season in the rotation looks like. Robbie Ray

with one of the, that's a unique baseball reference page, was the leader in like strikeouts from a starting pitcher for a while into his career. One of Cy Young, he's been off the map, her moved around a little bit. Let's get him a full season instead of his seven starts last year.

Logan Webb, ironically as stable as a thing as you'll find in baseball and Chris Rose rotation, so we love that. And Kyle Harrison, the young talented lefty that there's some days he looks awesome and there's other days you're like, he'll one pitch pitcher? And now Justin Verlander is listed as the five. I'd love to see if this rotation's healthy coming into opening day.

I don't know if you do that to the cat just out of respect to the resume. The stuff I don't know, how much does having Justin Verlander around actually matter? And whether that's being a young pitcher and talking to. to the Kyle Harrisons and Jordan Hicks and, you know, Tristan Beck and some other guys on deck. What does that actually do to a pitching staff? Is that really cool? Is it everyone actually picking his mind and he's that guy and he's about that role? Is it not? Is Justin Verlander here to pitch? And sure, like any other pitcher on a staff, there's some conversations, but what can they really learn from that guy? I don't know. We can pocket that for maybe

coach Trevor, Buster Posey next time we talk to him. Jolly, we're both baseball nerds in an endearing way. Logan Webb, Robbie Ray, Jordan Hicks, Kyle Harris, and Justin Verlain. This feels like a video game out of the park. How did we get here? Rotation a little bit. Can you talk yourself into it? Let's leave the NL West out and the Dodgers and all of that.

Just looking at that rotation on paper, are you like, hey, we could look up in September and be like, okay, Robbie Ray found it, Verlander's pitching in a big ballpark, Logan Webb's Logan Webb, if Kyle Harrison or Jordan Hick, like, can you talk yourself in? I think it's all about innings.

Like, you mentioned some other options they have, Hayden Birdsong's another one. Like, this is a team that could roll out a six man, and I think it would be beneficial to everyone in that rotation except Logan Webb, who is as reliable as they come, as you said. I mean, first eight starts of last year, before he got a neck injury and it basically derailed his entire season.

Erlander had a 3.26 ERA in 47 innings. Small sample, sure, but that's two months worth of starts. But that's also very online what he did the previous two years. Exactly. So it's about can you keep him healthy and it only gets harder every year that passes. I don't know. Is it worth a $15 million gamble? I know that they have capital to spend.

One thing about the Giants, they will always spend their money in some capacity and you have to respect that to a certain degree, it's just, was this the right gamble to take? Because there were other, there's plenty of other starting pitchers still available that I think are probably going to land on one-year deals. But at the same time, I don't know how much it hurts the Giants, if that makes sense. Like if Erlander does show up and he's not healthy and this is the final year and the send-off, I don't think the Giants are too much worse for wear.

It's kind of, in my opinion, a low-risk middle reward kind of thing, because if you keep him healthy, you know, you know what he's capable of even at this old age. He won a Cy Young at age 39, you know? Yeah, I think with Verlander there's upside. I think the rotation, each guy you can give yourself a pep talk, but that might be the problem. Like Logan Webb is as stable as stable can be for a one in this league. But the rest of the guys, something's going to click. Like Robbie Ray can tap into something.

Erlander could. Like, I won't bet against him. I don't know if I'm going to bet on him either, but for one year, and, you know, that's kind of the, one of the corny baseball things now, but a one-year deal, is there anything that's a bad one-year deal? I would say yes. Yeah, if it goes wrong. I would.

Yes. I guess it's interesting you bring up the other available pitchers because who's still out there. It's Jack Flaherty who wants to get a bag bag, so we can rule that comparison out for now, although let's see what happens. And, you know, the Giants, they were supposedly in on Corbyn Burns. They were in on a couple other guys.

So it's not like they didn't have the money to necessarily spend, but they decided to go the one year Verlander route, which, okay, Povettas, probably not in that mix. He's probably going to get a multi-year from someone. So then you're looking at, okay, Heen Dog, Andrew Heaney Gibby, Corby Corby.

Kintana might get a multi-year deal. I would have loved Kintana for this team. I think I agree with you. Ground balls with that infield defense? Willie? Yeah, they still think Kintana might get a couple years. So again, maybe it's apples and oranges a little bit. But you have to assume it's going to be in the same ballpark as this.

Scherzer, which again, these old bulls, Scher and Verlander, you know, when we did the Free Agency episode Chris Rose and Trev, we had a lot of I'm going to say cockamamie, but I don't know. I don't think that's the right word either way.

But we had a lot of fluff or debate about what these old guys want to do because they're not going to Justin Verlander, okay, career earnings. Oh, oh God. This guess might be terrible by me. I have to assume It's above like 300.

Justin Verlander career earnings listed as 404. Dude, go spend time with your wife. No, it's a nice chunk of money. A million dollars. That's wild. He's got that times 400, quick math. Max Scherzer, you want to guess? I think more, actually.

Maybe 425. 351. It's okay. I think they're both in like top 10 money made all time. I was thinking his nationals deal was a lot. We wondered how they were going to treat their free agency. I was kind of leaning into a Verlander Tigers thing, kind of put a bow on it.

Trev was like very mad at that for some reason. San Francisco, kind of interesting how people view that city now. It was kind of viewed as one of the coolest cities. Now there's some middle area on it, that it's kind of an anxiety city a little bit. I don't know. I guess the thing for me, Justin Verlander still wants to do it,

which I will appreciate. Because I would think we're still going to get some good Justin Verlander outing. I was going to say this before you lumped Kershaw with them. Kirshaw's 36. That's crazy. Crazy. I had him closer to 40. I know.

We have this weird thing with Kershaw where we were talking about him retiring at like 32. Arguably he got the best send-off. I know he didn't pitch in the run, but he got the ring. And when does he sign with Texas? No. I feel like that's got a... That has to happen at some point. I don't know.

Hey, if Verlander wants to pitch this Giants team, maybe they find something this year. They extended Matt Chapman. They... William Thomas with one of the bigger contracts. Been a good offseason. Of free agency. Jung Hu Lee,

hopefully coming back and being healthy this year. And then they're young guys who will fully click. Patrick Bailey, offensive prowess behind the dish. Ellie Ramos, celebrity of the show. My God. Tyler Fitzgerald, what he did in his sample size, Hayden Show Me Your Bird Song.

If this is where the N.L. West is, Dodgers are in another world. I guess who do you like next? And it seems like it's a Diamondbacks' Giants conversation, which feels rude to the Padres, but they got a whole other. Yeah. That's a whole other legal pod that we debated.

Being honest with the people, we debated doing something on it. And we're like, this is kind of out of our round. I mean, I think a labor pot on that would be good for the people because it's a hairy situation over there. Ownership tug war is always bad. And they haven't done much. So I think it's fair to say that it is giant's snakes right now. I think I still lean snakes.

You got to remember that they were the most high-powered offense in baseball last year. They just happened to miss the playoffs due to a tiebreaker. and they added Corbyn Burns to their rotation and they're probably going to do more things because they're going to trade Jordan Montgomery. But I think the Giants put themselves deeply in the conversation because of what they did this off season. They have one of the best left sides of the infield in baseball

and this Verlander signing is kind of like a little cherry on top. We'll see. I wonder if they get in the mix on anything else. Right now, Wilmer Flores is listed as their DH. Hey, the Wilmer Flores pod. My guy. And he had some amazing years, and then last year was not as amazing.

I wonder if they're in the mix for anything else, because right now, it looks like a Giants team. There's a little more upside than past years. I think that's fair to say. Willie Thomas, I mean, that can be significant. If they could do one more thing, and I don't know what that is,

I don't know if they'd want to be in the Pete Alonzo game. I don't know if they'd want to, I mean, hey, you got a DH spot, and Lamont Wade's listed at first who he gets on and I guess he plays first base. Giants fans let me know what that looks like on a regular basis. To really get into the Giants, you'd love to see one more move,

one more bat that you can believe in the lineup. Because right now I don't... About a switch hitting guy who probably profiles best as a DH and loves to hit in the gaps. Anthony Santander? I'm very interested to see where his market is. Right? about him at all.

And there's a ton of fits. Blue Jays, I think Houston's an amazing fit for him. I liked that. That was your thing. I think, and yeah, San Francisco should be. So I'm interested to see where that market goes next. A lot of teams should be in on that, and it's been oddly quiet on the Western Front.

Anything else on Verlander? Dalton added one good nugget down here that I got to mention. Verlander's worn 35 his entire career. the giant that wore 35 famously for the team most recently? Brandon Crawford. What do you do with that? Do you think they talked about that? Because Crawford is like number retirement level for the Giants.

Three rings, you know, the best shortstop defensively during his time. 30 war? Like, he did there. Jolly slash Stalton. You're forgetting that Justin Verlinter wore 59 when he first got called up. Right. His rigue year, which was I think when you were 10 and I wasn't a lot. back to that.

I'm still wearing this jacket and I'm in my build a bear phase. So as a gift from my mom, you're going to comment below. I know. We haven't talked about it yet. We're going to get some office reaction for socials. It's a lot. I think I could do better with it. The green is just throwing everything off.

It's reversible too. Straight brown on the other side. Well, now you have to show. You can't just drop that and not show. You got to do that at the end of the episode. That's how you see. What are we got? Ahmed Rosario to the Nationals.

Oh my God. $1 million. Wow. Wow. The Nats are loading up. Ahmed Rosario kind of just playing baseball in the wrong era. Hitting 300 and ability. Can't find a home.

Kind of available to play every position. Does this make the Nats the favorite in the NL East? Let's talk about that. Actually, other stuff. in a second. I think that's it on the Giants, right? I think that's it. Best of luck, and Giants fans,

close your ears for this. If the first half of the season doesn't go as hoped. Oh, can't end with that. There's a reason Justin Verlander still playing baseball. Crazy. One more stint with the asteros? The 15 mil isn't how...

I saw him sign with another team and do that. It's true. What cap does he wear in the hall of him? Indeed. Today's episode is sponsored by Indeed. Just realize your business needed to hire someone yesterday. San Francisco, JV. How can you find amazing candidates fast?

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Indeed.com slash talk. In terms and conditions apply hiring. Indeed is all in need. Look at that. Jolly, I said, I didn't know when I was going to punch you in the face with this, but again, when I looked at that San Francisco Giants lineup,

they could use 35 homers in a DH first basement. So I want to, um, I want to get a little Alonzo pulse check on you. Because I think, I think your Mets are still the favorites to bring him back. I don't know if that's your opinion. I don't know if that's Draft King's opinion. I guess where are you at with Pete this offseason

or your Mets who were loud on the Western front and now it's been a little quiet? Yeah, it's been a funky offseason in Queens. We all know the big ticket move, but Pete was kind of an expected return. And I honestly, I thought it was going to happen way sooner than it has because it hasn't happened at all.

I think the Mets are in a situation where they don't want to bid against themselves. For those who don't know, there was a report that the offer was three years for 90 million. Pete Alonso was going into his age 30 season. That would have taken him to his age 32 season. Last year, Pete turned down a pretty hefty extension. It was a seven-year, $150-plus million-dollar offer. He turned that down, wanted to bet on himself. had a good year.

By all accounts, we can't say that Pete had a bad year. He hit 34 home runs. 123 OPS plus. Played every game. Played every game, which matters a ton. But it was down from his previous years because Pete Alonzo had some really big boy years. Go check it out if you don't know what I'm talking about.

Nice postseason. Really nice post season. I think that should matter as well. Great point shake. We're watching. So now we're in a predicament where Pete wants to, basically outdo that extension offer and his new agent, Scott Boris, his job is to get that deal done.

There was a report that came out from Will Salmon, who does a great job for the athletic covering the Mets, that Scott Boris is currently using Prince Fielder's nine-year, 200-plus million-dollar contract with the Tigers as the barometer for what he thinks Pete should get. To Prince's credit, Prince played up to that contract up until that neck injury, which basically ended his career very abruptly. It was a very unfortunate situation. But he was that guy for the first three years of that deal before he got hurt.

The problem is that the market just isn't there for Pete. I think the only other team we've really heard is the Angels, which whoever knows what's going on around there, they don't want to rebuild, they want to spend. I guess that makes sense. With Pete, it's gotten real quiet, real fast, though, ever since these rumors and reports have come, come out. And I'm worried. And I'm going to use a comparison because you ask for the temperature,

I'm going to go from Mets experience. Our good friend who just signed with the Los Angeles daughters on a deal that I think is going to work out great for them, Michael Conforto had a pretty decent five-year extension offer from the Mets that he turned down. Unfortunately, Mike got injured. So it's a bit of a different situation. But he wanted to bet on himself. The bet didn't go through. and then he's kind of been floating around for a little bit in San Francisco landing with the Dodgers now. But you think about how different things might have been had he said yes. The same can be applied to Pete here if he doesn't come back on this three-year deal. But I don't think the Mets should overextend themselves if that's what the question is.

I think that their offer is what their offer is and you can't bid against yourself in the situation when you're trying to build a championship caliber roster. So if they have to pivot, like we mentioned before, there are still guys out there. your Santander's, your Bregmans, your Ahmed Rosarios are unfortunately off the board. But the Mets have options they can pivot to. I just think that with the fan base and the lineage and what he's done here, I think all sides would like to see you. It's just where does that number land?

Yeah, it's interesting because, you know, Pete has, the defense isn't electric. I think if you've got enough defense around Pete, It doesn't have to restrict your team in any way. You know, the stat that was out there, the scoop king, Jimmy was deep diving into that. That video come out. Oh, yeah, that came out. Yeah, I was going to say, that was last, last week, three weeks ago.

That was one of the cool, like, I feel like I watch this guy every day and I noticed this thing. Is this real? And then he proved it. And it's like, you know. Alonzo, this feels rude, but it's what teams give out free agent contracts. There's questions about how it can age. Yeah. And if he is on a decline, which it's interesting if you're looking at 2022 to now, yes, also no.

Like, offense was down last year as the same OPS plus as 2023. It's starting to feel to me like he is going to land in one of those Matt Chapman, Cody Bellinger contracts, which... bringing up my friend James again, he was horrified at that at first. And he's like, this sucks for the players, they're not getting the guaranteed money. And you're right. You're absolutely.

And if, hey, if one of the teams comes to Pete with that six or seven years and 175 or two, wherever it lands, I think he will sign on the dotted line. If teams are playing chicken with that, Pete'll probably get himself that three-year contract with opt-outs after every year, which if you're a player of Pete Alonzo's ability

and you put together one good season in the next three years, then you're going to get that contract and maybe more. Look at what Matt Chapman did. He got what, 6, 162 or something like that? 162 is a number. I forget the years. Which, again, it's not, you shouldn't be stoked about it because we're comparing this to guaranteed,

no matter what happens, it's done. I'm interested to see how the other shoe drops with Belly because if my guy Belly plays some center field and hits 30 homers this year for the New York Yankees, you know, he's all in, he might get more of a payday than he originally would have got. So it's tough to think about it that way. And for a lot of people, you don't care anyways,

because it's so many millions of dollars, it's ridiculous. I mean, it's not that Burlander money, but it feels like it's going to land there and I wonder if you're Pete Alonzo, then does the team become more important? Because obviously him being a pure power hitter, you know, San Francisco, who we just mentioned, Pete's got that right center field power gap,

that that might go away, that I wonder, I wonder what ends up back on the table. I wonder what silly rumors we get. Like, I think the Mets are going to be in play the whole way. I wonder, like, if Houston could get back in the table. involved? Like, I know they signed Christian Walker for first, but could they do Gita, D.H, Jordan, and left? I don't know

if they want to do that with Yordon's body. It'll be interesting to see who comes out of the woodwork if that price continues to go down. Are my diamondbacks flush with cash? They could use a 1B, and he would hit there. Oh, yeah. Not a doubt. Seattle always rumored.

I think it's going to end up being Mets. I don't know. Yeah? I don't know. Like, I really, I I do not think with David Stearns in charge that he is going to go any higher than that offer for a first baseman who is turning 30 and is not a plus defensively. And I think Pete gets shafted a little bit by the defensive metrics. I think he's fine defensively. I think he's improved from what he was a couple years ago.

But he was, I don't want to say doomed, but his situation got worsened a ton on that day where everyone signed a first base. Like we even got Santana. Arizona got Nailer and who knows if he DHS or not. Walker went to Houston. Like his market went from eight teams to one and a half if you want to count Angels thing as being real. Whereas like, you know, before that all happened, I was like, yeah, Pete could totally get a five-year deal and I wouldn't blame him if he left.

Now I don't know because the Nats added three first baseman in the same day. I have Josh Bell and Nate Lau now or Lowe, whatever it is. Sorry. Nathaniel. Thank you. My bad. So I don't know. And I think Pete's going to have to play a little bit of the waiting game.

And will that better his market? I wouldn't say so because I think everyone's eyes are kind of shifting to Bregman now a little bit too. It's a tough situation to be in and you kind of just think, what if he just took the seven-year deal and be in the situation? Yeah. And I guess that's because Stearns offered that deal or no? Yeah. That was a Stearns-led deal. So that's got to be in the back.

of everyone's heads. I think the Mets are, the Mets still have to do something with their lineup. They need another bat. Yeah, no, no shots fired at Brett Bady or even my guy, Siri, playing in center, although I think they like the way he plays defense.

A little platoon there with Tyrone. Oh, my God. Remember that? Remember all that? No. I don't know. Louis Sarian. Ragman and Pete are definitely in play.

for the Mets, and I wonder if you can get Bregman for the same price and we're playing defense, but there's questions. I don't know. I don't know. The first base supply and demand definitely hurt Pete this free agency. You can't plan for that kind of thing. Nathaniel Lowe is a 120 OPS plus solid defender, lefty bat. You got traded for a lefty reliever.

What? I mean, guys got good stuff, years of control. but yeah, like that was, that was a, like, realization point for me of like, oh, I don't think he's going to get what he's looking for. Like, if you're the Washington Nationals, it was, okay, get two years of Nathaniel Lowe, maybe his prime years for $10 million and $14 million for a reliever or pay Pete $25 a year for six, seven years? Nine years?

Yeah, I don't know about that. I understand what our guy, Scotty B's doing, but, um, Okay. So you're, so you want, the Mets need one more hitter. They do. I think you're right. And you don't, Alonzo, Bregman. I don't think Sontander's a fit. D.H spot's kind of available.

Kind of. But yeah, you need an infielder. Bregman is arguably a better fit than you can move Mark to first base. That feels a more natural position for him. Your defense gets better. and you still get the same offensive production. Out of the Park Markman. Remember all that?

Oh, yeah. The barrel of his bat, just making home runs happen. Full season. Got to link up with him. Connecticut ties in there. Seems like you're cool, dude. Do you follow him on Instagram? I don't.

I'm open to it. I follow someone else on Instagram that was hanging out with Mark Viantos, and they seem. I got a story like, but I didn't get to follow. And I was like, oh. I'm right there.

Story like it. Story is nice, though. You got to go out of your way. Everyone knows. I'm around. Careful with those story notes, okay? Don't just be throwing them out. Sometimes the claps, because that ends up being like a DM.

Don't tell me you've done a clap. No, no, no, I don't do the clap. I think I've got people clapping. Hang on. I think I've got people clapping me that don't understand the significance of the clap. You paused and you still said it afterward. Why don't you guys head to draft kings? Top for that. Football fans. Holy smokes.

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Graph Kings and you get permission from a baseball show. If you're looking for a Thursday through Sunday to watch some football, you found it. and do that with Draft Kings as well. Jolly, what we were expecting to have is the first topic on this show. 24 hours ago. It was the Gavin Lux trade. And it's an interesting one. And maybe part of the reason it got pushed is it feels like

it's a trade away from the trade, but I don't know because there's some interesting quotes here from Nick Crawl, Reds GM, which always makes me laugh because Nick Roll. Yeah, that's what I was thinking too. I think I followed him on Instagram the other day. He's a good follow. He's a good follow.

He's a follow. He's a good follow. Oh, no. He's big, but I don't know. John Mullaney. Right. They're like this. Gavin Lux, Dodgers,

two-time World Series, winning middle infielder. Remember there is that postseason? He was thrown in centerfield. Former. For a little bit. Former top top. prospect.

A tale of two kitties for him last year. A weird first half, a 562 OPS, balled out in the second half. 304 batting average in 899 OPS. He gets traded to the Reds who feel like they've had a glut of infielders. Like, isn't this why we traded away Jonathan India to Cincinnati for a,

prospect, our guy Mike Soroda, careful which baseball circle you say that around, was on his page yesterday, interesting, got drafted out of high school by the Dodgers. And then he didn't go. And then they go and get him. So the Dodgers really like Mike Sorota, which, watch out for that.

And a competitive balance pick. It should be around pick 37 of the draft. So I don't know. Two guys you'd consider decent prospects or pick your prospect with the other one for two years of Gavin Lux. And it's what are the Reds going to do? Because right now their lineup looks funky. I guess they have options for me.

This feels like a move before the move, but it could also just not be. Yeah, I mean, I think you nailed it with the whole domino theory. I think something else is coming. Also, I want to say, given the Dodgers, the 34th pick feels dangerous. It feels like they're going to get something good there. that's just what they do.

With Lux, yeah, it was the tale of two halves. You remember in the first half, people were ready to run him out of town when Miggie Roe came over. Everyone was like, play him every day. Throw him in the Willie Adama's trade. Figure it out. Instead, he turns in a pretty solid year, ends up league average offensively,

and contributes on their postseason run. He had the sack fly in the World Series game that helped them get that win in game five. With Lux, it's kind of funky because, like you said, they finally did the end. India trade, which, you know, everyone has their takes on that. I thought it was a fine return for that. And now you're in the same predicament.

And this is all stemming back to the Condolario deal they signed last year, which still kind of confuses me because, again, wasn't the whole thing that we have too many infielders and some of them are young and really talented like Matt McLean. And now you're creating a logjam. So right now he's listed as their nine-hitting DH on roster resource, which that's a problem, right? And I guess the question becomes, what is the lateral move? I don't think the move is trading Lux again.

I think he's on this team. Is Lux an outfielder? Because you already have a really good defensive outfield between Friedel and Frey in center and right. So what is the move? Because if it's trading Matt McLean, I'm not a fan of this deal. I know that McLean missed all of last year.

He had the shoulder injury, which gets scary, a little bit less scary for position players, in my opinion, but still scary. But McLean put together a three-war season in 90 games in his rookie year. That's basically six-war pace for a 23-year-old second baseman who's a plus defender and can really rake. I'd like to have him play a full season at Great American Ballpark and see the ludicrous numbers he can put up. If the Reds are shopping him, it one means that maybe things are off with that injury and it's a little bit more severe than maybe we all expect. or two, they really believe in Gavin Lux

and they see something that maybe other teams are not seeing. Either way, this was not the landing spot I had for him. I thought he was a possible Yankee, thought he was a really good fit there. A lot of teams can use the second baseman. The market was pretty weak for infuri agency. Instead, he's the Cincinnati Red, and now it feels like we're kind of back at square one

with our Reds predicament of we need a trade to happen. Yeah, I, you know, I was doing a quote-unquote, instant reaction just as as it came to me. And I was like, all right. So we've got, you know, in this lineup is not listed, Noel V. Marte, who was supposed to be, you know, a massive part of their future. You know, he obviously popped for PEDs, came back and was not good.

So where is he currently at? Back to Seattle. Matt McLean. Matt McLean, like you said, I mean, missed a whole year with a shoulder, which for a hitter, for any baseball player, actually. kind of scary. Yeah. But he's 25 when he was up there.

I was hammering the table. People should be talking about Matt McLean instead of Ellie Day La Cruz. In that window. I agreed with you. In that window, because Matt McLean was bawling. Yeah, I'm interested to see, like, is this, are they viewing this as, hey, this is a situation that can take care of itself? Because in theory, they have a rotation.

Hunter Green, Brady Singie, Brady Singer. Andrew Abbott, Nick Martinez, Nick Ladolo. Right now it has Graham Ashcraft as depth. Williamson has heard, do they have any other guys in AAA? Ret Louder? He came up and he pitched last year. Keep your eye on him. So in theory, like, you could say the Reds have their team heading into the season

and that that positional stuff will figure itself out. and they always felt like they kind of had a hole last year. Like Friddle was missing for a chunk of time. Noel Vy. So maybe, you know, Trev, I was going to say, the biggest baseball laugh, Trevor's gotten out of me, was talking about teams, when we talk about teams having to trade a guy

because there's depth. And Trevor was just like, we call that depth. That used to be incredible. Like teams used to want that. That's what the Dodgers do. They get everyday starters and make them benchers. players or AAA farmets. Somehow it figures itself out.

So, yeah, I'll be interested to see. Could there be like a jamer dump for them? Because that contract has turned sour kind of quickly. Go check out that baseball savant. Scary. You know, I was daydream. Could that be a bad money swap for another team? But I don't think they need to do that.

Yeah, I mean, you know, Stuart Fairchild always plays for them and gives it hell. at least defensively. Santiago Espinall always feels like LOL kind of same just in the infield. That maybe this is the team they like. I would love if they were using one of these players of value. And the original dream for me was Dillon Cs.

Like who's going to be the Dillin C's team? What kind of package do you have to give up for him for one year? Because I mean if my Cincinnati Reds that have mildly tortured me the past couple seasons. I guess just last year. I need to pump the brakes on that. If I could look at my Cincinnati Reds and see Hunter Green, who broke out last year,

26 starts at 275. It happened. They added Brady Singer, who I was going to say a stable that could come back and bite me, but he was 32 starts to a 371. You know, I mentioned all the other guys. Nick Martinez took the qualifying offer. Lodolo, if Red Lauer were to happen,

I feel like you could dream on the Cincinnati Reds a little bit more, or maybe the problem with the Reds right now, which I'm struggling with, is like, what's their team identity? Do they hit? I don't know. They were supposed to hit last year. They kind of didn't.

Do they run one guy? For sure. Do they pitch a few guys? So I don't know. I guess a little more identity from my Reds would make me feel a little better. And we're missing a little pop. Yeah, I was going to say. We need an outfielder.

I have no problem. It's almost like I have no problem with any of the hitters. But I can't look at a hitter and tell you I'm getting 25 homers next year. Ellie, you would say that. He did last year. And he should take a step up. He's also just on another planet. So maybe.

But that's the thing. Like you have a hitter on another planet. That's true. We need an impact move. I mean, things can go well with Christian and Carnacio and Strand, who I think they have a lot of belief in. We obviously mentioned Matt McLean. Like that is a top three that you can get behind. But, yeah, I mean, all the laughing in the NL Central, I feel like goes towards the pirates

because they're just routinely last place. They flame out. They have bad management, whatever. They've been to the playoffs more recently in a full season than the Reds. which I feel like doesn't really get talked about. The Reds have kind of just been living in the middle for a long time. And I feel like every year there's like a couple weeks where they're the most fun team in baseball. Like last year I think was the Dodgers series where they came to town and Ellie stunting on everybody.

Maybe that was two years ago. But I feel like at some point every year they grab hold of the national spotlight. And then for some reason it just fizzles. And now you're in a situation where like you said, this is a pretty reliable rotation. Like Singer of Nothing else is going to give you 30 starts. Green broke out fully. Nick Martinez was a four-war pitcher last year. Like, I don't think that's an issue at all right now.

Yeah, I like the pitching more than the hitting, which feels bizarre. And what's the narrative with Great American Ballpark? Anybody goes there and has a really fun weekend if you're a hitter. Imagine getting to play 81 games there. So if you can give me one more bat in the middle of this lineup and then hope that a couple of the other pieces click, like Condolario just isn't as bad as he was last year, or Steer plays every day and has a nice, like solid year, then this is a team that should compete in the land of opportunity division that is the National League Central, which the Brewers just kind of waltz into every year

and win. Yeah, I'm now daydreaming. I mean, put Santander in this ballpark. I was thinking of the same game. It's just, it's tough because I don't think Reds fans can dream on that. But it's kind of wild that their pitching looks okay. Like any team, you'd love to see one more arm in the bullpen, but I don't. know, Alexis Diaz and then a hodgepodge of guys that can be really good for a year, which is a lot of

offense. But, yeah, I don't know. Hey, pro far? Maybe the point that should be said a little more. Gavin Lux is 27 and just had a second half that was like almost 300, 400, 500. So maybe the Reds have found a winner there and a hitter's ballpark and all of that. and that's just the simple part of it. Yeah, I guess I'm a little surprised looking at this lineup

that used to get me excited with what's the next step for Christian Anconaccio Strand, Spencer Steer, Devenson, McLean, Ellie, and maybe I'll still feel that way come summer if all those guys live up to what they can do. But yeah, the pop, the pop pop, feels just a little thin. We'll see.

Well, Benson and AAA. What happened? He just got pushed down because of the signing. So, like, they, they have bodies that make me think something else is coming. I remember when Reese Hines came up and hit seven homers in one day? We don't talk about that. Crazy. Yeah.

They got guys. Dude, that's, they have another move. Yeah. I'm going to confidently say that with Noel V. Marte currently listed in their minor league, with Will Benson currently listed in their minor leagues. And again, this is on fan graphs. This isn't last day of spring training and the rosters are coming out. man the rotation has depth that I like that doesn't there's a lane

and now I'm mad at the pirates a little bit why I'm always mad at the pirates just how it works always um there's a couple boxes to check on the way jolly I'm just going to say them all and if there's anything that that feels important to you I'll let you cook the a's extended brent rooker so if you had him on your team's trade wish list pirates um Every team, actually, unless your DH was clogged. Definitely pirates. Because that's the question here. Brett Rooker, kind of awesome.

He was taken off the twins' scrap heap. It didn't click. The athletics game opportunity. And over the past couple years, he has turned into one of the best hitters in baseball. 30 years old, five-year 60 million extension with some, what's the word? Multipliers?

Escalator. Nice. That can get you to 90 million. So there's that. Michael Lorenzen, one year seven mill. Okay, welcome back to Kansas City. He's got something going on there, mutual option for the next year. And then there is a Drew Rasmussen extension,

which I'm happy for you, Drew Rasmussen. I just don't know what we'll be able to add to that. So what of any of that speaks to you? Lorenzen is cool. I feel like Kansas City is kind of becoming a little pitching factory over there, which is nice for their fans. Let's see if we can get a little more offense, but he's kind of been Mr. Reliable.

Back to back, two war seasons, 150 innings. That's nice. I would pay for that as well. The Brent Rooker thing is great. I mean, it's a little bit of a middle finger to Oakland fans, which everything has been that Sacramento has done, you know, the past couple weeks, months. It's good for Brent, the human, who was, like you said, on the scrap. He played for three teams in one year at one point,

and then found a home in Oakland and found the best version of himself. And I think that some people were saying, how can you not get more, whatever? Like, you know, this was a guy that wasn't sure if he was ever going to get an everyday role after his window kind of passed with Minnesota. So it's great for him to get that contract with the escalators like you mentioned. You just wish that, you know, they were still in Oakland and doing the same thing because then we wouldn't be in the situation that we are.

So good for Brent, still mad at John Fisher. But, you know, that's beyond all of our control. Far for the course. Yeah, there's a lot of different ways you can look at it. and if you're in the weeds of baseball or not. Brent Rooker had a 5.6 war last year, a 927 OPS. He also has a 6.8 career war, and he's 30 years old. So, you know, we just talked about Pete Alonzo hunting free agency for a contract.

Brent Rooker got offered something that a couple years ago he might not have been able to dream on so good for him. And that's actually why I was laughing the other day at the Charlie Morton contract that you heard of from Rob Sorocco. Yeah, I was not tuned in. Charlie Morton with a negative war, I think the first six years of his career, is still getting offered 15 mil to pitch.

So there was probably a time when that seemed like that he might never get 15 mil, and now he gets that whenever he wants. Let's go, Chuck. Yeah, Lorenzen, sure. Sure, why not? Co-royals go. Hey, I'll say this.

There hasn't been a ton of central talk this year. After looking at the Royals and the Reds on paper, two teams that I think you'd put in similar-ish buckets, you'd expect the Royals to maybe come down a notch, the Reds with a little more optimism after what happened last year. I like the Royals. And maybe that's me being ignorant. Looking at the Royals back-to-back,

I'd much rather, much rather this product. Especially when you compare the divisions two of like twins are in a weird spot right now. The tigers refuse to do anything besides a couple one-year deals. Alex Cobb? Come on. Oh, yeah, I forgot about Alex Cobb. Still the same thing. It's the same thing.

The Royals have had a really nice off season. The Jonathan India trade gives them their lead-off hitter. They have Seth Lugo for another year for like 10 mil or something like that, which is absurd. Their bullpen looks nice. Yeah, like the Lucas Ersake trade was a year and a half of control. There's your closer. Good job. they've done a really nice job opening up this window.

I didn't understand the Pasquantino trade stuff. That didn't make a lot of sense to me when it was happening. It looks like he's going to be part of the equation too. So this is a, why not? Let's go back to the playoffs. Yeah, I think a lot of the Pasquantino trade stuff was you being an office of 80%. Yeah, a little bit. The echo chamber of the live stream lounge where the five Yankee GMs just kind of talk about what players they're getting.

And he's entering the time period, two or three years left. He's a lefty and he's got pole power, Rob. He's Italian. Do you know about the short porch? Aswantino. I have a flex for the people who've made it this long in the show. Had a nice FaceTime with Vinnie P. The other day.

He, he FaceTime me, which is scary. Me and Vinny P don't talk a lot. I was like, oh, God. Who tweeted what? Who's got to take down there, Michael Garcia tweet? Who said something about Hunter Renfro? No, he was excited to tell me.

I was in the Royals like hype video From their season First like five seconds Yeah bat and lead off So that was cool And then a brief little catch up That was nice Sorry about his Jets

Yeah that's tough Hey Brent Rooker Vinnie Pasquitino Kind of two social media I love it Baseball content stars Wasn't Brent Rooker like doing like stuff Or MLB? It felt like there was three weeks

Where if there was a microphone Brent Rooker was front of it. Live it up, babe. Yeah. Live it up. Why not? And it seems like it's, I've enjoyed him when I've seen him.

So that's huge news. We will see what other huge, what is the next piece of huge news that happens, Jolly? I think it's Alex Breckman. Yeah. Plenty of big time six, seven year deals have happened in the past in mid-January. So I think that it's coming soon. Like you think, I know we mentioned it before, Max Scherzer signed his National's deal. in mid-January.

Like there are big-boy deals happen around this time. I think Bregman made the right choice waiting out the storm seeing what was left because I think he's going to get a nice deal. Where'd you say he was signing again? I wanted to be the Tigers, but I just don't believe at all. I guess the Mets. Why not? What a homer.

That would be cool. Are they ready? Aks would be cool. No. He's got some option. I think Brady. I think you're right. I think Brady's going to land in a good spot.

I think we've landed in a good spot. Thank you guys. Send your best wishes to Trev. And Chris Rose, I texted him like, hey, hope everything's all right. He's like, about one mile away. Jeez. I suck. I feel bad that we're laughing.

Chris Rose is pretty serious man. First text message. Chris Rose ever sent to me. He signed Chris Rose at the bottom of the message. Flex. Oops. On email. He looks.

loves a good email. He does. About anything. He's pro. Pro email. He's a pro. Every facet of Chris Rose.