Talking Simpsons - Bonus Holiday Podcast - What A Cartoon Movie - Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990)

Episode Date: January 15, 2025

Happy New Year! In case you didn't know, every month we release the premium podcast, What A Cartoon Movie. And, as we take a week off to rest and recharge, we're giving all of our listeners a chance to hear a free sample of this Patreon-exclusive series. So please, enjoy our ultra-long look at Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990)! And if you'd like to hear 70 more episodes of What A Cartoon Movie—with a new one to come every month—simply head on over to the Talking Simpsons Network and sign up at the $10 level. If you enjoy hearing us talk about cartoons, you'll be glad you did!

Cartoon's were present in the past Every week will be an animated bash What a cartoon, what a cartoon Maybe you're short for mostly shows We'll talk while analyze exploring as we go What a cartoon, what a cartoon What a cartoon, what a cartoon What I can't do What I can't do What I can't do Hello everybody and welcome to What A Cartoon Movie where we love penicillin on our pizza.

I'm your host, the purse-grabbing puke Bob Mackie. This is an audio exploration of every animated movie ever. Who is here with me today as always? Hey, it's Henry Gilbert and I'm going to put a domino box right in the middle of this podcast for proper product placement in this month's subject is the 1990 live-action Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles film Major League butt-kicking is back in town And yes, it is live-action month What a Cartoon Movie, where you are the fool, but we appreciate your patronage, and that's why this month we're covering a

real crowd pleaser, the original Ninja Turtles film. Yes, yeah, and accidentally on the 29th, or sorry, 34th anniversary of the movie, yes. Hey, we're getting in early before all the thought pieces are written, or people are just republishing their 30th anniversary thought pieces. Or their 25th, a big part of my research was a 25th and a 30th anniversary oral history, both of which were very well done.

And I say it's a crowd pleaser, but really, it's a crowd pleaser for elder millennials, and we welcome anyone else who's interested, but this is firmly in our demographic, Henry and myself. Absolutely. And after we both tapped into such a fertile turtle material when we covered the original five episode season of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, that it seemed like it was finally time for us to cover this one.

And also, I suppose it fits in an accidental niche I didn't realize until doing this research. Like, most, not all, but most of our live action ones involve the Henson Company or Henson employees in some way. Well, for the longest time, if you wanted to make any sort of live action, cartoony thing, you needed puppets. And that's where our old friend Jim Henson comes in, or his company.

Yes, yes. And this is no different. But yeah, I really loved this movie when I was 10 years old, or at nine when I saw it in theaters. And I'm sure it touched you deeply as well, Bob. Actually, I hate to be contrarian here, Henry, but also we were seven, I believe, when this movie came out. Shit, you're right. To do some millennial math here. And I don't want to think that I'm older than I actually am, by the way. I'm not 44. I'm going to be 42 soon, sir. But not to be a contrarian, I was kind of lukewarm on this movie because I was a future podcaster.

When I sat down to watch this movie, number one one I made the mistake of having bought the Dell paperback from my book fair in grade school So I knew what was going to happen I learned that lesson for that movie and I never repeated it again. Don't read the book before the movie But also it was a special day because you know money was tight at this time We were living with my grandma. My mom took me to see this for my birthday in May of 1990 we waited a bit and when I walked away my main impression was oh I mean I guess I had fun because I got to go to a movie but in my head during the movie I just kept thinking well that's not like the cartoon and that's not like the cartoon

and why is the channel of the news different than on the cartoon I just kept thinking of how it didn't align with the version of the show that I actually like, the version of the characters and the story. And then, you know, leaving the theater, I see the poster that says, hey dude, this ain't no cartoon. And I thought, no, why are you trying to diss the cartoon? I like it. Over time, I grew to enjoy this film.

For whatever reason, I had it on VHS as well. But yeah, I didn't really come to appreciate it until my 20s and my 30s. But at the time I was just a pedant about how it was so different than the cartoon that I loved. Oh man, well I, did I also feel, and yes, I was seven when I saw this. But did I miss bebop, rockste rocksteady Krang and a lot of the

other like cart more colorful stuff of the cartoon sure I also missed those guys but I loved this movie when I first saw it I thought I was watching magic on screen when I first saw it I I pulled up the like original trailer on YouTube just to remind myself the first time I saw a trailer for this movie, I was like, what? What, like I had never been more excited for a movie when I saw that trailer. I mean, I really did enjoy how they looked on the screen.

I wasn't even thinking of puppets or how they functioned, even though I think around the time there were a lot of behind the scenes features on TV to promote the film showing like here are the robot heads and here are the people inside of them. But once that all began, the movie began rather, I completely forgot about the fact that these are men in suits that are killing them actively on the screen.

And then later in life when DVD and Blu-ray releases come out, you get the freeze frames of their horrifying faces in the mouths, which I hope at some point they edit out, they digitally erased those faces. They have somewhat, and the director of this movie notices those things too, and it drives him crazy, and he wanted to fix them, and I have all the stories about that. But no, it was a magical time when I got to see it in theaters. I'm going to guess it was spring break of the first week of April.

I don't think it would have been like literally March 30th of the first day I was in theaters, but it was definitely as early as I get my mom to take us. I loved it so much, my brother loved it so much, and then we got the VHS tape that fall, watched it eight trillion times, so much so that the pizza commercial at the start of it has also been forever etched into my memory. What that baseball team the Little League

baseball team? I'm playing right field it's important I know this. Did Randy Newman write that? It was a wannabe Randy Newman. It was a great it was a real great fake charity thing too because it's like Pizza Hut has always supported the Little League Baseball of America or whatever it's like so it's like Pizza Hut has always supported the Little League Baseball of America or whatever. It's like, so it's not just a pizza commercial, it's like a pretend charity commercial. I like that you mentioned Spring Break because it literally was Spring Break,

but you were also in first grade. So you were thinking, God, I can't wait to get away from these shapes and colors. Thank you. I only just- You finally relax. I only just learned what a Spring Break was. But no, I love this movie now. If you'd asked me when I was 10, I would say I like Secret of the Ooze more because it was more fun and silly and more like

the cartoons. But as I got older and cooler though, I realized that the greediness in the the first movie with more of its violence, that's a lot more fun than the second movie. Yeah, and then as you get older and you learn more about filmmaking and indie filmmaking, you walk away from this film with the idea like, oh, this is just an indie movie that rented puppets. That's essentially all this is. Yes, yeah, and that has a real great feel to it. They filmed it well, it had a great director,

and yeah, it's this amazing perfect storm that easily could have led to just a gigantic failure but it's able to come together into a actual good film. Now look I'm not saying it's it's not Citizen Kane, I'm not saying that. I'd even say like you know Tim Burns Batman is a better movie than this, but it's a good It's so much better than it deserves to be it could have been very very bad I think the last time I watched this I gave it a three stars on letterboxer. I think is more than fair Oh, yeah

No, and meanwhile, you know in the sequels they they toned down the violence, but we kids loved the violence They the it's funny to go back and watch all the interviews where they go like, you know, the turtles teach his kids confidence. It doesn't make them violence. But we, as kids, were like, yeah, I like the one with the swords. I like the one with the size. I want to hit people with nunchucks. The violence was the appeal. Well, you know, now I'm thinking more about it. And I was a huge Raphael fan, you know, going into this movie as a seven year old about to turn eight eight. And I just thought, well, Rafael is wrong too. He should be fun loving, wisecracking, sarcastic,

not this guy with all this malaise. Yeah, he is very angry, and he's the main turtle of the movie. The other turtles kinda have to take a back seat. I mean, I get it, Raf is, he's got the red bandana, which makes him the lead turtle, because that's what all their turtle colors were and him as a grumpy Gus is it feels the most teen age to me. Well we'll get into it but like I do enjoy the film but just how it

is so misaligned with how things are in the cartoon I find very funny where in this movie Michelangelo and Donatello are the same character and they're always like huffing paint in the corner of every scene. I think the closest to doing machines is working on a truck with Casey Jones. Yes. That's all Donnie does. Don't make Corey Feldman your brainy character.

That's my casting advice. I think the Feldman was maybe their biggest mistake in the movie, but yeah. I mean, lines in this movie have lived in my head for a million years like a special Rathlines, especially like I don't want to fight you What lives in my head is for baby turtles Yes Or also like the exchange of like I lost a sigh then it is gone. I can get it back

I think when we were talking about this movie. I just went splinter Yes, yeah, I do that. I go up to my roof every night, and I do that to the moon. I'm crazy. Okay I'm a loony okay. I got we're gonna be doing this for the next five hours people lock in We're gonna be doing this for the next five hours people lock in It's funny to me cuz that actor John pice like he stars in real things is like cops and stuff He's been in a lot of actual like real real movies and TV shows So it's just funny that he like one of outside of the mask He's one he's most famous for an incredibly broad New York accent as a turtle You know if they made this film a year or two later,

the turtles could have been Michael Ian Black and Robert Ben Grant, at least two of them. They would have been cheaper. But all right, so the history of how this happened, it is very well documented all over the internet because it's a beloved film by many. And also there's a lot of great, very dedicated Ninja Turtles fan pages and wikis out there that I

appreciate for their stuff. But also in our you know, news sourcing era, want to say one, the German DVD director's commentary, but the 2015 Hollywood Reporter oral history and the 2020 oral history that was published on the ringer by Alan Siegel Who is a nice guy and he did a very good history that had some facts Many places even the Hollywood Reporter missed out on but I guess since we already did the pure History of the turtles and how they got to be toys in a cartoon show I think it's best to start with the director because I do think he is the key. If one person should get credit for why this movie is as good as it is, it's

the director. He had a lot of great decisions that made it this. I still don't really know who this guy is. Ah, well you'll learn now, Bob. He's the Irish-British-Nepo baby director, Steve Barron. I stay out because his father was an actor, his mother was a director. He had an early in in the world of filmmaking in England. But yeah he's unforgettable to 90s kids and 80s kids for many reasons. Mainly he, at least in the United Kingdom, was arguably the top music video director of the 1980s. Like if you were directing a video in England, you wanted this guy.

Yeah, I'm looking at the list of music videos right now and there's some very iconic ones. And actually, my wife and I have been watching her collection of those DVD collections that are organized by directors. Each director has their own DVD full of all of their videos with commentary and just realizing how so many filmmakers just came from this world at this point in time. I don't think that pipeline exists anymore. No, yeah. I was thinking about this when Blank Check did their David Fincher series because they did an episode where they just did commentary over all of his major music videos or maybe all of his music videos. And he was like, yeah, he was one of the best music video directors of his day

and he translated it into great, great films. Some can and some couldn't, but that doesn't make, like, Mark Romanek, I don't think, or Romanek, I don't think he did any great movies, but his music videos are still unforgettable to me. Hey, One Hour Photo is really good. Oh that is good, okay I take that back. I forgot that was him.

It is fun, like I will say the Weezer videos on those DVDs, it's at a point in time where Rivers Cuomo is the most up his own ass. So every interview with him is just hilarious. He's just this little wispy nerd boy who's like, I didn't like what he wanted to do but I guess people liked it. Oh man, that's, you know, there's a little bit of that spirit that comes up in other

parts of this history that I'm like, yeah, the music, the guys who started the music videos, they're either totally on the same wavelength as the director or they have lead singer syndrome and they don't like a director being the boss on a set and don't like listening to them. But so some of his first big hits, he did Toto's Africa video, speaking of Weezer, the better version, Toto's Africa. Oh yeah, the video where they play on top of a giant book. Yes, yeah, I love that video.

Like it's so, it's very corny, but also it's like, I believe it's a 1982 or 83 music video. It's setting the tone for what's music videos. It seems corny now. Even in the nineties, it seemed corny, but it's, it's a fun music video for Toto's Africa. And then, uh, if there wasn't thriller, I think this would be the most famous Michael Jackson video, Billie Jean of like him dancing down the light up streets. Dun, dun, dun, dun. Yeah. That, dun. Yeah, that's Steve Barron as well. And he also did a ton of British ones.

This was also why New Wave got so big in America with British bands because they were making more music videos. I'm also seeing here, he did the video for Take On Me, which is legendary. It's like, could be the best music video of all time. Yes, yeah. Or at least in the top three. So 83, so 83 is that Billy G music video. He does a bunch of other ones.

84, he gets to make his first movie, which is the what if a nerd had a computer that told him to date Virginia Manson? Well that would be Electric Dreams. Da da da da da da. It has a great trailer. I remember the actual movie's not that great. Yeah, this is a corny classic that I hear a lot of people

say is fun but not great. It's about an evil computer that ruins your dating life, I think. Played by Bud Court, yeah. Harold Amod? The Harold Amod, yes. Harold himself from Harold Amod. He's the computer who is first going

to help him start dating and then decides he doesn't like it and it causes problems. But yeah, it was a big box office flop and Steve Barron feared he'd never get to, he'd be put into directors jail forever after that. So he goes back to music videos. That's when he does Take On Me,

which yeah, one of the best music videos ever, but also in 85, he does the Money For Nothing, Dire Straits music video also. Hey Hey that brings us to Simpsons because David Silverman designed the characters in that video. And this connects it to when we covered Reboot because the people who made that are the you know the seeds for what grows into Reboot. Steve Barron wasn't that involved in Reboot but this is the reason he is an executive producer on the Reboot series as well. Oh really? Wow.

But then Steve Barron, he's a quality director and he seemingly is good at working with lots of different people. 1986 brings him to a very important moment in his life. He is going to get to work with David Bowie on a music video for the song Underground as featured in Jim Henson's Labyrinth. Which song is that? Underground, underground, get me, get me, get me out of here. That's the one. Okay, got it. The credit song I think is one. Oh no wonder I don't remember it because it's not a performance, right? Yes. It's not performed in the movie? Okay. By the way, I love

Labyrinth. I have seen it in its original print of it that played in San Francisco one time. It's great. Look, it's kind of quirky, but I like it more than Dark Crystal. I think Dark Crystal, too, up its own ass in lore. Labyrinth, more fun. But so David Bowie, the music video is actually not him playing his character from Labyrinth. It's actually him playing David Bowie who basically in take on me style he sort of becomes a sketchy cartoon character that gets teleported into the world of Labyrinth and so it's all of the puppet characters from Labyrinth including Hoggle are chasing after him. You know, I'm surprised I've never seen this but I guess guess in its day, Labyrinth wasn't a big hit.

No, no, it was. It also, like, I never saw it until you talk about those music video collections. When I worked at a video store in 2007, I put on the David Bowie music video collection just as, you know, easy background. You get to listen to David Bowie all day, and that one would come up, the first couple of times I was like, right, I guess they did make music videos outside of the film for this, I like that. Now apparently David Bowie himself thought it was kind of mid. He didn't particularly like the music video. But you know who did? Jim Henson, he thought this guy is great.

I love Steve Barron's style. He can work with these puppets really good. And Jim Henson is trying to pitch a brand new TV series. In 1986, he wants somebody to help him with the pilot. Steve Barron is tapped to be the director of the pilot for The Storyteller. Oh, wow. Okay. So that's him.

Yes. He directs the pilot for The Storyt the Emmy winning nightmare fuel Hans my hedgehog Which I watched the one everyone remembers. Sorry to interrupt you That's the one everyone remembers for being the most nightmarish and it really really is I just I just rewatched it yesterday I think I started like having to like control my emotions because I was like Oh, yeah, this is reminding me of how scared it made me as a kid And I think I started like having to like control my emotions because I was like, Oh yeah, this is reminding me of how scared it made me as a kid. It's like, it starts with a woman having a hedgehog, a human hybrid baby, and it gets

worse from there that his father, and it's just horrible abuse the entire episode. And it's, it's a dark European. That's what Henson wanted. He wanted dark European sensibilities of a, of a, of Grimm's what Henson wanted. He wanted dark European sensibilities of Grimm's fairy tale type stuff. Yeah, and if I recall correctly, it was made for British television. Mm-hmm, that he hoped, they were the key financer.

It's all British actors and writers and director, in Baron's case. And Henson used it as, Barron directed the pilot. It is so heavily edited, and maybe that's because they have the storyteller as an easy device. You just cut to John Hurt, and he's like, well, then 20 years later,

sometimes the story doesn't flow that well, and you wonder if it's bad editing or just intentional. Or not having the budget to depict certain things, I guess. I, Steve Barron, I think was used to having the deep pockets of record labels to pay for his music videos. And I do think he faced budget problems on his movies a lot, as we'll see in the Ninja Turtles as well. So after the storyteller's pilot gets sold, it gets two more episodes

directed by Barron of its like eight episodes, Fear Not and Sap Sorrow, which are also very creepy. Two of those, including the Hedgehog one, are written by the future Oscar-winning director of the English patient, Anthony Minghella, as well, who is an important part of this story too. So that takes us up to 1987 with Steve Barron.

Now it's 1988. Turtles, the cartoon, really starting to take off. It launched in 87. 88 is when it gets big. 89 it's getting even bigger and the Konami video games are coming out too. So it's getting big with kids but it can't be. It's the movie future not looking so good. Yeah, if I recall the timeline, it's 87, late 87 you have the five part mini series, 88 you get 13 weekly episodes, 89 is the full syndication push of 65. So that's the year, you know,

there's a big push for TV daily episodes. That's the year the video games come out. It's a peak year for Turtles, except the movie is the following year. Yeah, that's why these fads usually, if they can stay big three years in a row, then you know it was a giant fad toy. Like if you get one Christmas, lots of fad toys have one Christmas. Two, you're doing pretty good. Three, then you're an unprecedented hit like the Ninja Turtles. Yeah, 89 gave us full turtle saturation

So we'd be prepared for a movie in 1990 And a quick rundown of the key players in this who aren't Eastman and Lair the creators of turtles You've got Mark Friedman Who is the savvy toy vet who hooked them up with playmates and Fred Wolf to make the show and the toys and Mark Friedman was their like entryway into Hollywood because he was and honestly like I think Mark Friedman I said it before I've seen him in videos call himself the fifth turtle I'm like you were a lucky guy who landed them and got them in meetings and you collected a third of the pay and

then they you stopped working with them in the early 90s and you haven't had anything since and we all know the fifth turtle is actually Venus de Milo. Boo. In The Toys That Made Us, that is what causes Eastman and Laird to break up apparently. Laird hated Venus de Milo. We gotta put breasts on these things now? Great.

But yeah, so Mark Friedman is having meetings with people all over town. This is where we bring in the now passed away Professional surfer turned Hollywood agent Gary proper now Gary proper He is his big claim to fame at that point was Gallagher's manager and agent so he was working with the big time hit maker slash future very sad man, uh, Gallagher. Yeah, I mean that may be a funny fact now, but in 87 you wanted to be on the Gallagher train. For sure, for sure. Like, uh, and this is why Gallagher late in life when he was mad at everybody, one of the things he was mad about was saying like, and I almost had a piece of the turtles,

you know, and they kept me out of that. But I think that's wishful thinking on Gallagher's part. I think he just happened to be by Gary Proper as Gary was working on all of the turtle deals. You know, I'll confess, as a kid, I loved Gallagher. I rented every Gallagher special at the video store. If I saw it was playing on Comedy Central, I'd watch it all the way to the end.

I loved it every time, yeah. Oh, he's gonna sit on the giant couch. If I saw it was playing on Comedy Central, I'd watch it all the way to the end. I loved it every time, yeah. Oh, he's gonna sit on the giant couch, I can't wait. Now comes out the guy from just the 10 of us to pretend to be a typewriter. But so Gary Proppers is manager, and if you wanna read some funny articles, you can read about his later war with Gallagher

as Gallagher and him are kind of suing each other or sniping each other in the press for who owes people what. But so Gary sees the turtles comic. He early on like I believe 86 or 87 he sees this turtle comic and thinks this could really be something. I think this could be a big movie. Apparently the timeline is a little spongy here but my impression is he seems to notice it before the toys, like just as a somewhat big in the indie comic space hit that most people have never heard of.

Yeah, and one factor that led to me appreciating the film is realizing that it's actually based on the comic book, which as we covered in our What a Cartoon episode, that comic book was not available to children. No. You had a much softer, more colorful comic book on the shelves of your grocery store comic book rack. But the Eastman and Laird one, you have to have found

a comic book shop, which was not, you know, that's not on the map for me as a seven year old or eight year old. You had to hope an older brother would let you read his copy, or some friend's older brother would. But yeah, so proper though, he was, he thought it could really be something. And so he had a friend named Cameron Kim Dawson, who was a one time Disney exec. And both of them were like, this could really be something we want to sell this to Hollywood. So propering Dawson, then talk to Hollywood. So propering Dawson, then talk to, uh, Friedman. Friedman says to the Eastman and Laird,

Hey, we have a deal outside of the toy and cartoon deal I'm trying to make. I have these Hollywood guys who say they think they can make it into a movie. And again, these guys are the middlemen and things don't happen without middlemen who get you into meetings. So I don't want to say they did nothing. But if Eastman and Laird didn't learn from guys like Jack Kirby who got ripped off, these fucking assholes would be the ones who stole the turtles from Eastman and Laird. So I also don't want to be too nice to them. But yeah, so when Friedman brings proper and Dawson in, Eastman and Laird are like, all right, they can try selling this movie, but we get final say on the script and we get

actual real creative involvement. No stealing and the executives just tore off their hats and stomped on them. D'oh! Fine, we'll only take a third of the money instead of 80%. So Eastman especially makes the point of like you you know, everybody thinks, oh, comic book movies how they are today or even 30 years ago. But it's like, if you think of the mid eighties, you've got Superman four, swap thing, Howard the duck, huge failures. And you have as far as toys, the comics that failed. You have Masters of the Universe that almost basically does kill Gollum Globus in 87. And Garbage Pail Kids, a massive failure.

Yeah, even as a child I knew it was beneath me, that film. Oh, I never, I still haven't watched any Garbage Pail Kids. I've seen clips in reviews. I think I read it just to see what could this possibly be and I watched it just like, oh, you think I would like this? I may what could this possibly be and I watched it just like oh you think I would like this I may be nine sir, but I have taste Well, yeah, just a little viewer or listeners know that I did have a teeny tiny amount of taste as a kid I saw Masters of the Universe in 87 at five years old in theaters. I did not like it. It did bore me

I've TMNT was so much better than it. I was having this chat with my husband and he was saying, why would somebody say no to making a Turtles movie when it's the biggest toy around? And I told him, he manned before that was the biggest toy around and did terrible as a movie. So for that reason, the two guys who got the rights to shop around to the studios a Ninja Turtles movie said they were getting nothing. Every studio said every studio looked at them like they had lobsters coming out of their ears was how it was described. They all turned it down even as the cartoon started to gain traction they're just like a turtle movie? What?

So if everybody in Hollywood's saying no, what about in Hong Kong? Bum-bum-bum. Here's some quick Hong Kong movie history for folks out there. At one time the Shaw Brothers was the biggest studio of motion pictures made in specifically the Hong Kong region of China, which at that time was I believe a sorta British colony. Definitely the Brits still had an interest in it and mainland China wouldn't get ownership of it until 97. So, but this isn't a history of Hong Kong. But from the Shaw brothers, two guys of their top producers quit that and wanted to start a competing company.

They call that company Golden Harvest and they pay their stars better. They give them a lot more free rein. They are known as the better place to work at than Shaw Brothers, though Golden Harvest is full of like terrible treatment of its stunt men and all that, it's hardly that good. But Golden Harvest, they are the first believers in the Bruce, in Bruce Lee. They make Bruce Lee a star.

They even start working on American films. They're like, oh, well, they make that Enter the Dragon film, which does very well. Unfortunately, Bruce Lee doesn't live to see its release. So that really kind of fucks up Golden Harvest's plans. And then they start even working with Jackie Chan, and he gets big, and they try to sell him overseas. That's why Golden Harvest makes those cannonball run films, partially to try to launch Jackie Chan. You know, I'm only watching these Hong Kong movies

from the 80s for the first time in my life, and from the 70s too, and I can't help but think, why did you keep these for me? I think they were just jealous where we can't do action this crazy let's hide these only weirdos with catalogs can watch these films. I am very lucky I had a friend who introduced me to Ron Moen half and then many of these classic 70s and 80s and 90s Hong Kong action films as we refer to them back then. And so I fortunately do know them, but yeah, they were incredibly hard. And that was only because my friend knew to go to a certain store that sold bootlegs in Florida,

in a Chinatown in Northern Florida. But so Golden Harvest, they were trying, they kept trying to really become an international film company. They didn't just want to be about Hong Kong and Jackie Chan also wanted to be a Hollywood movie star. He made that movie, The Big Brawl or also it's called like Battle Creek City, I believe is an alternate title for it. But, uh, it's crazy to think that Jackie had all these attempts, but it was only thanks to the Weinstein brothers marketing of him that

he finally became a thing in America. And hey, future splinter Jackie Chan. That's true and man it's all connected. Yeah so so but partially to distribute films overseas and to try to make Dent in America, Golden Harvest does have a arm in North America, in Los Angeles. And so they're trying to work on some films. And the boss of Golden Harvest at that time is a man named Thomas Gray. And he knows just the thing that's going to make Golden Harvest popular in America. He loves the BBC sitcom, Are You Being Served? And he's gonna make it work for America. Oh boy, I mean, maybe I could appreciate that now as an adult, but the second Red Dwarf ended,

that theme song started up, and I was just scrambling for the remote, much like when MASH would come on late at night, like, no, no, no, get away from MASH. Just the sound of the registers going off. Yes. It's like that, yeah. Like Pavlovian response after a certain amount of time. Yeah, I wonder how non-American listeners,

especially in British areas, like, do they, what do they reflect on are you being served as? Because to us it really was just like packaged with the fancier, nerdier stuff like Monty Python and Red Dwarf as equal on PBS in America. It was basically Pardon My Zinger. So they're working on making it into a movie called Department Store. How exciting.

And so working on that script is a 70s comedian turned sitcom writer Bobby Herbeck. And Bobby Herbeck worked on different strokes, The Jefferson, Small Wonder. I would bet he was friends with or knew Mike Scully. I would bet him and Mike Scully were buddies. Based on which sitcom? Small Wonder. Oh, no.

Mike Scully was Out of This World. Oh, God. My bad. All right. It's about the space girl not the robot girl. Oh how can I get those confused? I watched a ton of out of this world I have never seen one second of small wonder that was kept for me and I'm grateful. So Herbeck says he's hating working on Department Store and he's more than happy to talk about his involvement in the Turtles film. Well, honestly, I think he overrates it.

But so Herbeck, he knows Gary Propper and Kim Dawson and also Gallagher because he's from the same class of comedian. And so Herbeck is working at Golden Harvest. He's the guy who says, pitch this to Golden Harvest with me. I'll write it and I'm sick of working on this are you being served thing so help me pitch it. And I'm sure Gallagher is around in these meetings too but Gallagher before he died he seemed to think he was part of those meetings and had a piece of it. That's right his

many complaints laid in life about how he could have gotten that sweet sweet turtles money. That was one of the most shocking parts of his famous Mark Maron interview. Him saying the turtle's like, what, turtles, huh? That's the second most famous part. The first most famous part is, come on Gallagher, get back here Gallagher, oh, he's gone. That's his legacy, that's that old asshole's legacy, man. Okay, so, Herbeck's getting in meetings with Golden Harvest,

but Thomas Gray still thinks it's stupid. This is 1988, coincidentally, as the toys are starting to take off. And as the story goes, they tell, after a couple more meetings with Thomas Gray, who keeps turning him down, they tell Gray, ask your kids if you should make a Ninja Turtles movie. And Gray said he did, and his kids told him you have to make a Turtles movie. They were

that excited about it. And that's when Thomas Gray finally goes like, oh, all right. Okay. Okay. The kids have spoken. So he is able to get a green light from his big boss Raymond Chao. Hollywood Reporter even gets a date for it. They say they have a June 13th, 1988 memo of Raymond Chao approving a three million dollar pre-production investment and gets them to start selling it to distributors. Though Gray also has a very, just to let you know the level he thought this movie was going to be at. Here's a quote from Gray on how he imagined it, from the Hollywood Reporter.

Wait a minute, this is nothing more than four of our Chinese stuntmen in rubber suits. We can make this movie for peanuts in Hong Kong. So imagine that originally this was just going to be four guys in a mobile rubber suits kicking people and that would be a pretty bad movie. With no robot heads. None of those emoting robot heads yeah and Herbeck is very funny because as he remembers it he's like Eastman and Laird were a little too precious they didn't like any of my ideas they kept looking at their shoes and I was talking to him and from Eastman and Laird's side they're like yeah his script sucked he didn't get what's special about the turtles. Like he

was a sick cop guy who wrote bad jokes. Yeah, I mean credit to them for having dignity and not willing to just take whatever paycheck came their way. Yeah, they actually cared about having a good movie. Like they were sick of seeing bad movies and they also, thank God, they kept all of their rights to this stuff and could do that. Like again, if East Middler didn't do that, this would just been a shitty movie that would have been made as fast as possible by Golden Harvest, like all the other horrible comic book adaptations.

So Herbeck gets written out of it, but he still gets to have co-writing credit and the money so he can't complain too much In all the versions of the script by the way This is a quick aside in all the versions of the script This is something to say about how that the oh they took it from the comics Well the love of pizza April working as a news reporter their colored bandanas saying cowabunga And more of their personalities that is much more from the cartoon than the comic book. Yeah you know what you are correct now

that I think about it when I walked away from the movie upon my last viewing I thought you know I think the 10% of this that's like the cartoon made me wonder why the other 90% wasn't like the cartoon. It seemed like they took the spongy things that they're like well Mattel, playmates and Fred Wolf can't sue us over this. They can't sue us over the word cowabunga, but they could sue us if we put bebop and rocksteady in this who never appeared in the comics. All of this stuff that is clearly from the cartoons and the late David Wise who listeners from that What a Cartoon will remember was the showrunner of the original turtles cartoons

There's this one classic interview where he's like, I'm not bitter. I'm not bitter, but and This it's funny you mentioned that poster Bob because this is actually what he complained about When describing the original poster he said David Wise said quote it shows them coming out of the sewer and it says hey, dude This is no cartoon. Well dude, you wouldn't be saying dude, if I hadn't started saying that in the cartoon, that really pissed me off.

You know, he was right. Yeah, no, all of the surfer guy personality, that is not on the comic page. Honestly, I think the tagline is obviously a way to let people know, this is not the thing you're getting on TV for free. This is something different. It's their way of saying in case,

because the poster is not in motion, and you might think, you know, the poster in case you don't know is them peeking out from under the sewer grate so you don't really see them, because you're supposed to pay money to see them. You don't want to give it away on the poster, but then when they show that little, then I guess they do have to go like,

hey guys, this isn't a cartoon by the way. This isn't like the Heathcliff compilation movies that decrypt you off with. Yeah, I guess animated movies were coming out of their bad reputation at the time. Coming out of their shell, no. Why not? So okay, this is where Anthony Minghella comes back

into the story in a very surprising way. And again, this is the late director of the English patient and of many classic films. But at the time he was a screenwriter first and he was working at Golden Harvest, trying to do punch-up on a script that I've seen called A Night in Bangkok, which I have no clue what it is. I wondered if it was like an adaptation of the concept album One Night in Bangkok that

has the classic corny song, but whatever he was working on called A Night in Bangkok, he's in the Golden Harvest office. He hears about their turtles plan and he's like, oh this is like a puppety live-action thing. I know just the guy who I just work with on the storyteller, Steve Barron. Wow, so Anthony Mengella is the the connection there. Yes, if Anthony Mengella wasn't working in Hollywood on a Golden Harvest thing, then Steve Barron would not have been even gotten a call to be brought in. And it totally makes sense.

His music videos, like that's very impressive, like internationally. You can see why the Golden Harvest team would have seen on either coast would have been like, wow, these famous music videos that everybody's heard of and he'll direct our movie. That's awesome. Also, the understanding was probably, Oh, kids love those damn things. Yes. Yeah. And we want teenage cool guys and this guy makes things for cool teens.

And on top of that, Baron was really wanting to get back into making a full theatrical film and I think he knew to get another shot he was gonna have to do this like he needed to take on a Golden Harvest kids film if he wanted to get back into the movies. So Baron signs on to do it he agrees to do it. Sounds like it wasn't much of a convert like it didn't take a lot of time and once he signs on this is where Baron identifies that and this is why I think out of anybody who could have taken that job then Baron was probably the best because unlike I think everybody else who made comic book movies back then He actually read the comic books and liked them. He he was like I want to make this comic book We're taking from the comic books. Let's

read the comic books. And so if you read the original 12 Turtles comics, you can pick out 40 pages that are this movie. Now that's across a lot of weird shit, but there are 40 pages that are this movie. Yeah, it does seem like he loved the comics and not in the way people have to pretend to love the comics when they're on press junkets. For sure. Like, oh yeah, I love, what's that say? Madam Webb, favorite character of mine. You know, by the way, I just heard Bobby Moynihan

say this story that he's a real comic nerd. He said that despite what some may assume about her, that Megan Fox was a real comic nerd fan and when she hosted SNL one year, years before she was April O'Neil in the movie, that she said to him, oh you like comics? You like Eastman and Laird? My dream is to be April O'Neil. And it came true twice.

And it turned into a nightmare. But so yeah, Steve Barron actually read the comics and gave a shit. He was not saying, oh, this is like, you know, a dumb kid's cartoon about stupid turtles. Who gives a shit? Like when he met with Eastman and Laird, they loved him because he came in with noted versions, copies of their comics where he's like, okay, so this page will be this scene and then this page is that scene. And also they really respected him because he hired a British comic artist, Brendan McCarthy, who was doing some really good stuff with Peter Milligan on 2000 AD, and he worked with Baron on the storyteller.

He's the storyboarder for it. He'd go on to, McCarthy would be a major storyboarder on Reboot, and also co-writer, storyboarder of Mad Max Fury Road. Oh wow. A lot of major people worked on this that I was not keeping track of, or I didn't was not aware of, but Baron had the funny story of meeting with McCarthy and saying, hey, do you want to help me with making the boards for this movie? Have you heard of the turtles? And McCarthy, being a comic professional, knew exactly who they were and was very excited. So yes, he comes in

with all these things scenes from the Mirage comics where he got say a rooftop battle, a battle in April's apartment, a trip to the countryside to reach to charge, Splinter being kidnapped, Raph versus Casey Jones. All these big moments that you mix and match in the the movie didn't it works to be a real movie that of course though meant her back script went down the toilet and Steve Barron's like thank you very much flush and instead they needed to tap a new screenwriter real fast and they got a guy who was fresh off of the Wonder Years, Todd Langan. So if you think this movie feels like it was written

by two 80s sitcom guys, that's why it is. Hey, at that point, a very acclaimed sitcom. No, this was a trade up from Different Strokes. No offense to Different Strokes, but Wonder Years is a better show. I don't think it ever wasn't acclaimed because it was only around for six years and just won a boatload of Emmys. No I remember loving

it as a kid too when I didn't know any of the references. But yeah so Langan works with him over a feverish few weeks at a fancy LA hotel. They have funny stories of him. Langan says like he was poolside acting out how Splinter defeats Shredder because like Barron apparently couldn't conceive. Like, all right, how does the rat beat Shredder anyway? And Langan apparently acts it out by the poolside. Barron's big vision, though, he said he wanted a kids film that was more grounded.

He didn't want all the blood and dismemberment that was in the comics. But he wanted it to be PG. But he didn't want violence. He didn't want it to be just a Cartoon we still want to crush a man on screen. Oops As long as they oops, it's PG that makes it into a joke He cited two major tonal sources for two one

He grew up watching three musketeers films a ton as a kid and he's like, yeah, it's sort of guys having adventures It's a these are just ninjas instead of musketeers. Well, that makes sense. I mean, they're fighting enemies and making little quips while they do it. Exactly. So, yeah. What if there were four musketeers? And the other thing he wrenched into? Who's four guys who have adventures with weird things in New York City in a kind of grounded, gritty way in the 80s? The Ghostbusters! So he was looking at both of those things. I bet every kid in 1990 wanted them to crossover. And I assume, just going to assume, there's at least three comic books where they do. And toys! And toys. Oh yeah, they're toys! There are toys of the Ghostbusters crossover.

The Ninja Turtles will crossover with anybody for the right money. Like they, my, my husband actually bought, uh, I think almost the full collection of the Power Rangers meet Ninja Turtles toys that they'd put out a few years ago. I just saw the other day that they announced, like it's, it's basically the turtle van that is a transformer. And the real trick of it is it comes with four different interchangeable heads, so basically the van turns into a turtle, and you put the turtle head and weapons on them, but if you're a real crazy collector

who wants to have all four turtles, well, they gotta buy it four times. Jesus, you know, I wanna tell our listeners that when I said there was probably a crossover, I assumed there was just one thing that happened once. Just upon a cursory search, I'm seeing frankly too much Ninja Turtle Ghostbuster crossover to the point

where I'm gonna say enough. But if you make a seventh film after Frozen Empire, throw the turtles in, who cares? It gets Sony to deal with Paramount to make it happen. Oh and also Baron said, "'The tone of it was similar to the storyteller. They were darker myths, but still for families. And yeah, I think some of that upsetting tone is a little there in TMNT. But okay, so what Golden Harvest has in mind is stunt men in

crappy suits and you film it cheap. How does Jim Henson's not cheap company get in there? Well, of course, that's almost all Steve Barron's doing. Jim Henson loves Steve Barron. That's what every many people say this in the history is like, yeah, Jim Henson loves Steve Barron. He loved working with him. He trusted him. That's why an unprecedented thing happened of making the deal to have the turtle costumes be in the made by Jim Henson's creature workshop to be extremely pedantic about it. Some people will say this is the first time it ever was on a non Henson movie, but technically the French production of the film the bear from

1987 has animatronic bears in it built by Jim Henson. If you didn't point that out, someone else would have, so you're right to do so. Also I got to tell some writers of Incorrect Wikis who say that Return to Oz was a Creature Shop related production. No, they hired many Henson Company vets who had left Creature Shop and did build puppets for it, but it was not the Creature creature shop just like how little shop of horrors hired a bunch of Henson people But did not work with the creature shop to make its puppets

So distinct we're tasking all of our $10 patrons to go out and correct those wikis for please I dug deep into this I still I never watched that movie the bear as a kid It looked too scary like big bears yelling at each other in a movie I don't even recall what this was it's one of those fake nature movies that were all the rage in the 80s were like they you know exactly yeah it's sort of like that except about bears in in apparently the British Columbian countryside so it's French people in BC filming bears and calling it a movie. Well whenever I record I'm looking at the mountains of British Columbia, one of

many mountains. I'm just wondering how many big feats and bears are just out there in the woods and I just can't see them. But other than the bear Jim Hansen Creature Workshop had never worked on a non-Hensen production before this movie. And when Steve Baron comes to him in I believe late 88, he's presenting to Jim Henson the comic pages and his storyboards. And Henson isn't a fan of how bloody the comics were. He doesn't like the violence. I could never find a real actual like quote of Jim Henson said this was too violent. That's one of those bullshit lies you see on the internet of like they actually toned it down because Jim Henson didn't like the violence

in the first movie. Jim Henson was fucking dead a month after the movie came out. Yeah, yeah, I actually recall, I saw this for my birthday in May and probably a week later was his passing in mid-May. Yeah, exactly, it was six weeks after the movie came out. And then the turtles were his pallbearers if you watched that funeral video. But yeah, so this is late 88. Barron shows him this stuff, but he tells him,

trust me, this won't be too bad. It's not going to be smirched the name Henson. And Henson did trust him. Though there's, I I think two bits that are not talked about in all these things about how Baron landed Jim Henson. It wasn't just like a handshake deal. First off, as you know, Bob, you've read the Henson biography or gone through a ton of it. The late 80s are not great for Henson money-wise. He would take on a job like this. Yeah, just trying everything. We talked about Labyrinth, we talked about the Dark Crystal. Those were not bombs in the way we view a bomb today,

but they really underperformed. He wanted to get away from the Muppets, but they just kept pulling him back because people wanted him to do the thing they liked the most. They didn't want all this new adult stuff from Jim Henson. So of course, wouldn't he want a cash infusion of like $3 million to make these turtle puppets on a thing on a thing he trusted. And another part of it that I don't think is talked

about enough and how Baron landed it is that Brian Henson was a big believer in the project and wanted to work on it. So I think he was also telling his dad, no, dad, let's, let's do this. I think this can work. It's not going to be too violent. Like Brian Henson, his second unit director on this movie, though Bob did a whole great biography on him on our Muppet Christmas Carol. That's right. That was the first film he ever directed at age 27. But he was getting practice on this movie in 89. To be fair, he was working on movies as a child. That's true. On his dad's movie. So he was getting practice on this movie in 89. To be fair, he was working on movies as a child. That's true.

On his dad's movie, so he was just living in the world of filmmaking. So by most accounts, Steve Barron does think he got Henson friend prices, though it was still three million dollars. They are the movie stars in this movie, is their puppet suits. Golden Harvest series, he was like, we cannot afford Jim Henson.

And Baron was able to convince him like, if Jim Henson wants to do this, you pay what he can do because this makes this a real movie. Like the Garbage Pail Kids movies, or say Gwildor in Master's Universe, look like shit, because they didn't have Jim Henson's company building them. Yeah, and I know you're going to get to this Henry, but just based on what I was reading about Jim Henson and the Muppets and doing my research for the Muppet Christmas Carol

podcast, they had really been experimenting with radio controlled puppets since the maybe second Muppet movie. So this is the result of 10 years of experimentation. And then the next year we'd have dinosaurs, which is basically what if what we did here was a TV show? Yeah, this was a real creature shop R&D thing for them. Like they got to build upon what they've been doing. So yeah, you can see radio control full bodied suits, like full body suits are as old as Big Bird or no bit older than Big Bird. I think that Chinese dragon for the commercials they've done is actually an older full body suit. But this would be their first where you don't have a hand

and one arm that doesn't move. Both arms can move because the face is radio controlled by a hand puppet off screen. And it is a highly choreographed, multi-synced character act out. And you stick a man in there who doesn't mind dying inside of a little prison. Yes. Like you can see earlier examples of this like the the poor little person who has to play Hoggle in Labyrinth is in one of those things or everybody who

played the Giants in Fraggle Rock, those type of suits. Or the Bears in the later, in Muppets Take Man In, suits like that. Oh wait, let me go back and correct myself. They were working on radio controlled puppets as far back as Emmett Otter, Jugman Christmas. I just rewatched that last Christmas, and I watched the extras,

and that was really the first time they were doing it. And you can see their efforts when the Muppets are going down the water and they're being controlled by radio controls not a person's hand. Right right right yes yeah the same and with the Doozers had the same stuff in in Fraggle Rock also yeah yeah but yeah so what the Henson company is gonna build they have to build four distinct turtle suits. Then they have to build a complex though more traditional splinter puppet. Then they're going to build four baby turtle puppets and a rat puppet for the flashbacks and they have to build a turtle. Sorry. And they have to build

machine free suits that stunt men can wear in fight scenes. And the puppets were using what was called the Super Waldo tech, which was called the same for the CGI puppet you saw in the Jim Henson hour or the Muppet Vision 3D. Right, right. It was the CGI guy, right? Yes. Yeah. So Super Waldo, they also came up with a really clever thing in the design. Thanks to the turtle shells, their backpack is the costume. You can hide all of their stuff in their turtle shells. So, like you were saying Bob, if you're a performer, think of it this way. You're basically wearing a helmet that's a 1989 computer and the rest of it is on

your backpack. Then that's covered in foam and plastic that covers every inch of your body, except for tiny holes right below the mask line for the eyes and a little bit in the mouth for your face to come out. Now you have to do that acting in middle of North Carolina summer in crazy humidity. That's right, this was the weird North Carolina film boom, which is why this and like I think

The Wizard and Super Mario Bros. are all filmed around that area. Yep. It's thanks to tax problems of a certain other filmmaker. But yeah, honestly it sounds like the people who got to play the dinosaurs a year later in 91 had it a lot easier in a controlled LA set than the turtles did. Air-conditioned sets, was there air conditioning or some kind of cooling system in the suits at this point? Apparently they didn't get installed until like midway through the filming. Like there are stories from a couple of the actors saying that like the first day of filming they

did 36 takes of one scene and by the middle of the scenes, like Rafael's actor in particular was saying, get his fucking head off of me right now. Right. Like he is going crazy. I think you're going to point this out, Henry. But now I'm remembering there are some shots where you can see like sweat flying out of the costumes. Yes. Yes. Yeah. They were apparently they said they lost like they were five to 10 pounds lighter at the end of every day. They sweat it all out every day. It was it's the turtle diet. If you want to lose 20 pounds fast star in a Ninja Turtles movie. So they basically are the price of big famous actors. That's why there aren't actual famous actors in this movie. I mean, no, I think it's a really good cast, but it's not famous actors. And this thing that they thought would

be a $3 million movie is getting bigger and bigger. But that's okay, because they signed a deal with 20 Century Fox to be the distributor, and they're putting up $6 million. So everything's going to be fine. Oh, and also they also they already signed a deal with Domino's for both product placement, and apparently Domino's sent them free pizza all the time at the set, so. Wow. Yeah.

Conflicting with what the video games told us was their brand of pizza. Yes, yeah, Pizza Hut usurped them. It's a very interesting story, I'd love to hear some too, but so. You know what, there were no Domino's in my area, so I could not eat the turtle's choice of pizza in this movie.

We loved Pizza Hut growing up, and I just assumed, this is the true turtle's pizza. This is the first one they talked about. I also barely ever had, I had Domino's if I went to a friend's house, and they were at Domino's house, but we were at Pizza Hut house, probably thanks to the advertising for Lamb Before Time and Book It. That's probably

what they brainwashed us good. Book It warped our brain chemicals to prefer Pizza Hut and it made us literate, slightly more literate I guess. That personal pan pizza, it feels like heaven even though it's like, it's as greasy as hell. I guess if we should explain Book It to people if you don't know what it is, if you're not American and 40, it was basically this program where

if you read four books a month, you got a free personal pan pizza at Pizza Hut. And boy howdy did I take advantage of that. And you had to prove to your teacher you did. You couldn't just say, oh yeah teacher, I read four books. You had to fill out a survey about what the book was about or something. Just to prove, yeah, it's just like a program the Democrats would run. It's all these hoops you have to jump through to get your goddamn free pizza.

And of course, if you're going, I mean, it pays off for Pizza Hut because nobody gets their mommy and daddy to take them to the Pizza Hut for one free pizza and don't buy anything else. Well, I surely felt like a special boy eating my personal pan pizza. I earned. And you get your sticker too, I think. Yeah, those were good times. See, this is how well advertised too we were.

So the actors they did get though, the guys in the suits who aren't stunt men, or some were mixed stunt men, but mostly were real actors. Real, sorry, stunt man, you've garbage people. You're not real actors. Try a little harder stunt man. We're calling you out.

But it was John Pais, Leif Tilden, and Mitchell and Sissy, who were all New York based actors. And then a UK actor stunt man named Brian Foreman. Now, all of the actors, when they were filming, did their lines and said their lines out loud, all with the expectation that we are the voices and the bodies of these turtles. We're going to be all of that. But only Pais got to stay as the voice of Raph.

Everybody else got recast. You know, and it really shocked me to think that the cartoon voices were not even on the table for these guys, given that they were all dubbed. I mean, it would make them more expensive, but also the closest to stunt casting the movie has is the voice actors or well, one voice actor. One of them. Yeah. Is there a story behind that? I'm always curious. He's the one known person in the film known to cinema goers of 1990 and he you don't see him. He's a lesser character. You don't remember Robbie risk cousin Oliver. He don't think he's famous. Oh he's one of the guys. He's Mikey. Yes. Yeah, that's Mikey. They have they also say Pais went a bit method playing Raph

because, oh, yeah, Raph's in a pretty bad mood this movie, probably because he's going insane inside of his costume. And all four actors do in suit actors do cameos in the movie out of costume, and we'll name them as it comes in the movie. But but yes, after the movie is done that's when they start stunt casting for the voice actors like Baron said he didn't mean to like trick the guys they it was the idea they would be the voices too like they weren't told that ahead of time but then afterwards like no we're gonna recast everybody for wrath and so

yes they get Corey Feldman as Donnie, and he was the most famous. Apparently he was a real douche to everybody. Like he was a dick. He also apparently had recently been like arrested for cocaine possession when they were promoting the movie. He was like just off of being at the height of his powers with I think license to drive in that era,

the era of the two Corys, which is referenced on The Simpsons a couple years later. It was pretty sad that he could barely even promote the film because he was in a very bad place. He's had a lot of problems. It's hard, but nobody who worked on the film seems to have happy memories about Corey Feldman. Mm.

But yes, then Robbie Wriste, who was Cousin Oliver in the final season of The Brady Bunch, who we talked a bit about him. He also was a voice in the Baby Doll episode of Batman. Right, they were getting a bunch of old sitcom people. Robbie Wriste hated by TV viewers as a child. No, he's a fun guy. He takes it pretty well for being such a hated actor,

child actor. And then Leonardo is voiced by Brian Tocchi, an actual Japanese-American actor who is most famous for the surely unproblematic roles of Takashi in Revenge of the Nerds and Nogata in Belize Academy. Oh my lord, that's him? Yup, that's him. Okay. in Belize Academy. Oh my lord, that's him? Yup, that's him. Okay, hey, probably the first Japanese person I ever saw in my life is this guy.

If it wasn't a role taken by Getty Watanabe, he was the other guy. You know what, I have not seen those films in, I don't know, let's say 30 years or longer. I think in my head I just assumed it was Getty Watanabe. I saw it still on his IMDB, and all the scenes came flooding back to me from, I believe he is introduced in the third police academy, and of course he is shocked

and confused by the strong sexuality of Kim Katral. He doesn't know what to do with this sexy American woman. I mean, honestly, I'd be in the same seat as him. Well, I would bet you didn't have gongs playing behind you as you said these lines. No, there'd be some sort of, I don't know, Irish-Hungarian instrument. I don't know what I am.

But I did like learning, like, oh wow, they actually did have one Asian-American voice actor among the group. That's kind of cool. But then in the major live action roles we've got Elias Coteus as Casey Jones. He was fresh out of Montreal working his way up in the US film industry. He is a very established actor. Now this guy who is Casey Jones has worked with Martin Scorsese, David Fincher, Steve Soderbergh, Terrence Malick, and a hundred episodes of that Dick Wolf Chicago PD show.

Yeah, whenever he pops up and I see his name, I think, oh, it's Casey Jones. Sorry, that's who you are to me. But congrats on the very, very long film career you've had. He's a very successful guy and a great character actor. When I watched Zodiac, it was only in the credits. When it came up, I was like, oh shit, that was, that was Casey Jones. Damn. And yes, again, it's we're damning him forever to be his character. It's like Roger Ivan and Casey Jones, both in Zodiac. And going back to the cartoon, Casey Jones, a character seldomly shown in the cartoon because they thought too violent. I mean, he is the joke of Casey Jones is they took

the Punisher but made him a guy who loves sports instead of guns. But he is an insanely violent freak. If it wasn't for Coteus being such a charming guy, he would be an insane, scary person in this movie. You wouldn't like Casey Jones if it wasn't for his great acting. Yeah, as a kid I thought, oh, he's showing up in this movie?

And then I just looked it up now. He was only in five episodes of the original TMNT series, which is what, like 200 episodes total or something? Wow, that is so few. I feel like Usagi Ojinbo's in more episodes than him. Or the duck pilot guy, I can't remember his name now. The neutrinos, I think you're thinking of Ace Duck. Ace Duck, thank you, Bob, yeah.

But the neutrinos showed up in more episodes. Sorry Ace Duck. Ace Duck, thank you, Bob, yeah. But the Neutrinos showed up in more episodes. Sorry, yeah, almost 200 episodes, he's only in five. Dang, wow, that's shocking. That's because Casey Jones makes such an impact in this, but Casey Jones is so cool in the comic. You could see why Steve Barron, when he sees him on the comic page,

is like, oh, this guy's great. Him and Raph have this fight in the comic that is what's put into the movie. Named after the famous poem? I think so, the Casey at the Bat. Yeah, though also there is a Grateful Dead song by that name too, which maybe they're pulling from. I see. Then we've got April O'Neill played by Judith Hoag.

She has the funny story that she was encouraged to take the role. She thought it was dumb and looked down upon it like a turtle's thing or whatever. But when she first took it, but she is filming the movie Cadillac Man and she's having to leave the set to go straight to North Carolina to film this movie and her co-star and Cadillac Man Robin Williams ask what she's doing. She's like some Ninja Turtle movie, and Robin Williams instantly knows what she's talking about. He's like, oh my God, are you April O'Neil? And she's like, oh, okay, now I care about this. And Robin Williams thinks it's cool.

Hey, Robin Williams secretly a nerd, names his daughter after a video game character. And then if you watch one hour photo, Henry, you can see him, you know, inaccurately show you Evangelion figures and saying these are the bad guy, or these are the good guys, and it's the mass-produced Evangelions

that Oscar fights. Unit 13 is hardly a good guy one hour photo man. Hey, he was crazy. If you watch the movie, you'll find out. That's true. Yeah, Judith has funny stories about like she got Robin Williams like on the set and him and his kids like got to take photos with like

the guys in the costume and was really really cool like she though some reports say that Judith didn't love filming on the set. She she found the hours and the working situation uncomfortable and had the nerve to complain about it and so if you wonder why she's not in the sequel that might be why. I assume there was money involved. I also met that. Yeah so yeah going back to Cadillac Man I need to watch that movie and use cars because I confuse them all the time I have not seen either I don't want to embarrass myself publicly while talking about either film. I just think of both being advertised on Comedy

Central and not watching them. Me too, me too. And then as Splinter, both as the voice and the lead puppeteer, you got Kevin Clash who was Elmo and you know he's gone away since 2013. I thought he made a comeback of sorts. Of sorts. His public image has recovered at this point in the past decade. I mean, he will do lightly credited things. He still does his star and stuff.

He will do some puppet work. Like, he worked on the Dark Crystal movies, but, or sorry, the Netflix Dark Crystal show. Like, he will do some jobs from time to time, but he is not back to like, he'll never be Elmo again. Well, I mean also to when I, when I read the Wiki page and I didn't want to learn more, but it's like, oh yeah, what happened with those lawsuits? And it's from the look of it, it seemed like most of them were only dismissed because of statute of limitations, which like, no, then

you're still guilt. I gotta say you're still guilty in my eyes then, sorry. It just shows you how powerful Elmo is if he could survive his puppeteer being canceled like this. By canceled, I mean, he suffered no repercussions in terms of jail time, but he's no longer allowed to be a public figure or play a very popular character. Yeah, Elmo as the inheritor of Elmo and Elmo the character is bigger than ever

thanks to quote tweets of him on Twitter. The Elmo Twitter stuff is some of the weirdest Twitter things to me. Yeah, adults getting a little too emotional about Elmo saying Elmo cares about you and Elmo wants to know you're okay. Elmo says drink water. I mean, we're all pretty fucked up right now.

We all, people slightly older than us, Elmo was the new character to us listeners. Oh, that's true. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to make fun of these people. I guess it just shows what a state we're in when Steve from Blue's Clues can post a TikTok and everyone just weeps and wails and rinses their garments. Finally, somebody told me he's proud of me.

So yes, Kevin Clash's Splendor also probably wouldn't be cast in the role now because sometimes I feel weird with his voice he does in the movie. I mean, you can show this clip to anyone but when I say four baby turtles it brings me joy. It does. And I think it's hurting no one because I guess the accent could have been worse.

Oh, absolutely, yeah. And then also as Shredder, you have Japanese-American actor James Saito as the body, though British white guy David McCharran is the voice. So it's like, you know, I feel like if you're gonna hire James Saito, how about you have him actually like say the lines instead of having a white guy speak

for your Japanese character? Yeah, I think he was capable of doing that. Though hey, at the very least, the body of a Japanese actor played a Rokusaki. Yeah. And then of course, famously as Head Thug, you've got Sam Rockwell, future Oscar winner. He's the guy showing the kids around

and offers them cigarettes in the cool home base. Refresh my memory, what did he win an Oscar for? I honestly had forgotten too until this year's Oscars. I had to look it up. It was that three billboards movie, remember that? Oh yeah, it has a very long title. When he showed up on the Oscar stage of like, you know Because it was the the theme of the Oscars this year was five previous winners

Present the nominees and so when Rockwell was on stage and I believe he was the one presenting Robert Downey, Jr And Rockwell was talking I was like wait He won an Oscar and I I love Sam Rockwell, but I was like, I don't remember what he run an Oscar for I had to Google it. And apparently if you squint in this movie, you can also spot Skeet Ulrich and Scott Wolfe into some early young actor roles too. I guess hanging out in the teen zone.

Yes, yeah, they're not as famous as the actor playing Denny. This is secretly also a QAnon movie about abducting children. You're probably crap you're right. Back then we feared the Japanese would do I mean this should also be to give extra context to this was of course written during a big 80s Japan bubble yellow peril fears that's why I'd say the most like racist joke in the movie is when she says what am I behind on my Sony payments? To the ninja. That's a pretty bad one

Also, it's full of stunt performers who were flown in from Hong Kong Steve Barron on the commentary goes like yeah They worked really hard and some of them actually got a bit hurt on this movie and they were real troopers I was like, could you tell me their names these people who got hurt? I feel like when he says they got hurt, I was like, did insurance cover them at all in this movie? Cause I don't think so. We don't know their names. They're all buried in poppers graves. So they're under the dealer at the studio foundation. The one stunt performer, uh, the Harvest folks took a real shine to, who mainly played Donatello

in fight scenes, that was one, Ernie Reyes Jr. You can see him on the set in the turtle costume in some photos, and so they liked him so much, they make up a new role for him in the sequel. And he is great, I like, as Keno, he's a lot of fun. So that's how you end up with, you've got got Jim Hansen puppets, along with stunt performers who worked on Jackie Chan films in the 80s, working with a British music video director of take on me, all in North Carolina. It is a crazy mashup. And of course, they're filming in North Carolina because it is cheap. And technically technically the state at that time owned the production house because do you know De Laurentiis' company defaulted on loans from the state so they owned it before they sold it off.

Okay. Was one movie in particular the culprit of that? I cannot, you know, I'm sure it was but I forget which one here. Well we did talk about how De Laurentiis released that Transformers the movie in 86 and that did very poorly for them, but it wasn't even their biggest money loser. But yeah, they have like built city streets. That was one positive of it in this giant warehouse they were filming in. They already had a lot of fake New York streets built for other movies that they could just like rebuild

to fake New York in this movie. You know what, I just watched Manhunter for the first time and I welcomed the appearance of the credit, Dino De Laurentiis at the beginning. Isn't it like a lion or something, the De Laurentiis logo? I think something like that, yeah. Yeah. But so everything seems to be going logo or it's I think something like that yeah yeah but

so everything seems to be going well as its cast they got the suits they're all ready to get going July 1st 1989 is when the filming is about to begin and they should also be known for people who go like oh yeah it was a reaction to the Batman Michael Keaton movie they're starting to film when that movie comes out the movie's already gonna be made. This drafts off the success of Michael Keaton, Batman, but is not made in reaction to it. Yeah, maybe some choices were made

during filming that reflected, oh, I guess people like this dark thing, or they don't mind this kind of depiction, but yeah, we can't say that it was directly influenced by the Batman film. I'm sure the marketing took some of it into account, I bet, but yeah. But so it's July 1st, 1989,

and this is when things go bad thanks to Barry Diller, who we've talked about before, is like the real Mr. Burns, perhaps. Yes. Turtles, eh? So he has taken over Fox films, and he's wiping the board of projects, and that includes distributing this Turtles movie,

which this is insane. Fox is like, nah, we went out of the Turtles in 1989. We don't wanna work on this. Crazy, right? That is nuts. The impression seems to be that it was that they just wanted, the Diller and Diller's cronies wanted to get rid of stuff

the old regime did, which happens all of the time, still happens all the time today. Yeah, it's the oldest, most boring story as to why something is not released. So when 20th pulls out, that is apparently like $6 million most of their budget going away. The producer, Tom Gray Gray is saying like Jim Henson is about to fly in and if he shows up and we are gonna tell him oh

by the way we actually can't pay you he's going to sue us and we are fucked like this film will never happen and we're sued by everybody involved. So Tom Gray is in a bad situation he is making some 11th hour calls, calls Golden Harvest, and he's like, can we please get more money? And Golden Harvest is like, I can get you three million more dollars, but I think this is going to fail. And then meanwhile, they're meeting with New Line Cinema, and Tom Gray definitely remembers it as like, yeah, New Line Cinema knew they had us over a barrel.

They knew they could get a good deal out of us. Though, when executives who worked on it at New Line at the time talked about it, they reflect on it like, it's funny how every Hollywood executive you talk to is like, oh, I thought it was a great idea, but everybody else hated it. It's every story. It's a weird coincidence. But they say that the boss of New Line Cinema, Bob Shay, hated the idea, said it would lose money but he's like, fine, I'll let you fail, but you know, this is, you can give it a shot, but this is gonna fail. It's funny because the studio, I think at this point in time, was known as the house

that Freddie built. And they made all of their bones by producing the Nightmare on Elm Street films, and Bob Shay was a huge part of that. Exactly, yeah they were it's it's easy to forget to the like New Line in 94 they got bought by Turner and technically it is still a label within the bigger Warner Company but it was an independent studio then and not a big one. To put perspective on it I looked it up what were their big 1989 releases? Nightmare 5, The Dream Child, Garbage.

I hate, that's one of the worst Freddy's, I think. Oh, absolutely, yeah. And one of the worst movies ever, Hulk Hogan's No Holds Barred. Oh, yeah, rented that as a kid. I, by the way, this is more my bad taste. I loved that movie as a kid. Hey, and also I wanna say New Line, great logo.

That and Touchstone, I think, are some of the finest logos of that era. I think part of the reason I instantly loved the Mortal Kombat movie is because it had the New Line logo at the start of it that I knew from the turtles. And I was like, all right, quality is ahead. Though also I do think a good thing that helped them going to New Line

instead of Fox is, at Fox they'd have been a small fish or they'd have been a big fish in a big pond or even a medium-sized fish in a big pond. Here New Line had to make them a priority. It was their biggest release of 1990. They get the New Line money, they're able to avoid stopping production, so they get to work in North Carolina. It was a lot of hot days, a lot of tough filming days. One funny story they tell is that they were in a direct flight path of the nearby airport, which is already a terrible place to film movies. But one thing that airplanes have is radio waves, which also are trying to talk to your turtle heads.

The turtles are all freaking out as planes are flying overhead. That's great, I want those outtakes. They said on some filmings that like, all of a sudden, like Donatello's face would just like stop, like it would just like die, and they'd have to restart the scene all over again. So they're filming in this and while Barron said

the heat sucked, he would have loved to film in New York City for the whole movie and it was obviously a cheap shitty place to be in Wilmington, North Carolina. He did have to admit it was pretty awesome to be far away from studio executives who could barely come in and give him notes. He called it a hick production in a good way.

Yeah, we have learned that the further you make your movie away from Hollywood, the more you get to make it according to your own vision, because they just don't want to get on a plane. This is before video meetings and stuff, by the way. I don't think this is true anymore. That's what's wrong now. They can just have a video conference

all of the time so easily. It sucks. But yeah, they so he is making this movie the way he is wanting to do it. He's kind of and and he says that sometimes he has a couple stories where while filming Golden Harvest executives showed up and they're like, this is too dark. This is too dark. And he'd be like, no, we're making it this way. And they also meant like, visually, this needs more light. This is too dark. He said he caught an executive trying to talk behind his back to the director of photography and say like, could you just brighten the scene up? Don't tell him. And that kind of pissed Baron off stuff like that. But also Steve Baron, here's another great hire he had on that movie.

The primary editor of the movie, Sally Menke, who would go on to be Quentin Tarantino's editor on all his movies up until 2010. That is incredible. It's crazy how they had one of the best film editors of her generation in an early job on this. He jokes on the commentary that he's like, I would have worked with her on all my future movies, but that darn Tarantino kept taking her away.

Some people think editors are the true directors of the film, and I halfway agree with them. At the very least, when the director's in the meeting with the editor or in the editing bay with the editor, that's how the movie becomes the movie. Like, yeah. And so he's got Sally Manke on it. I was also reminded how sad, like, this is a learn from her sad passing. If you go hiking and it feels really hot, don't keep walking by yourself with no water. Oh no, okay.

I think that happened in Berkeley when we still lived there, like right before we left. There was a family. It's very sad. It's like, we've all had like, you know, you go on a hike and you're like, well, yeah, I'm sweating a lot. It's a hike, but you know, be careful. Like it was such a sad story.

I read that like basically her friend left her on the hike because she's like, it's too hot. I'm going home. She's like, okay I'll see you later and then She's walking her dog and when the they find her body the dog is sitting right next to her though when they find her It's yeah Yeah, I guess we just mentioned the family that had passed away because of overheating or whatever son sun exposure Whatever the the official terminology for that is don Don't go hiking alone, number one. No, no.

I mean, there's that James Franco movie, come on. Right, yes, fully charged cell phone too, water, battery, flare gun. But back to happier times, yeah, so Sally Menke is his editor on it, and he loved working with her, they're working on it, it's coming together in this sweltering filming in a cheap studio

this is so Maybe Steve Barron just lost track of his budget Maybe he overshot his budget and didn't film enough stuff Perhaps it was just a troubled production with a lot of tech issues that were constantly Making him lose time in the seven week filming. But for whatever reason, he felt they had 10 to 12 pages left unfilmed by the time the money stopped. And so he's told, you can't film anymore.

He's like, I wanna do reshoots, please. We gotta film these. We're cutting together the movie. Me and Manky are cutting together the movie and it's coming together, but we do really feel like we need these extra scenes to make it work. And he's told, you've already gone over budget. This $3 million movie is a $13 million movie.

We're not giving you more money. This is when Steve Barron is a little bit of a naughty boy. So, and it also is, believe it or not, Bob, time for what a cartoon movie super villain to come into the story here. No, he can't be here. It's impossible. Jeffrey Katzenberg is here. It's true.

I couldn't believe it. Okay. Dun, dun, dun. I especially appreciate Alan Siegel's 2020 oral history because nobody else had this. This is mentioned on the commentary by Steve Barron, but I couldn't see anybody else telling this story. So what happens is Steve Barron is complaining about how he's out of money. He does say that the final version that they were cutting to Erp, what you saw in theaters is pretty close to the version him and Sally Menke were editing together. And that's why when we watch it closely, I'm sure

we'll notice like, oh, that voiceover is the bridge that covers a lost scene or whatever. Yeah and in certain turtles are dubbed over with different voices the thing I was making fun of where it's like splinter that is Raphael's voice but it's actually Michelangelo or one of the other ones on the roof. Oh yeah it's Mikey they they cut a whole thing for that's that's why you don't see Michelangelo's training in April talking about them on the farm. April omitted that for time reasons. In her turtle's diary.

And also, you know, this sounds like I'm talking about in a modern movie for digital effects, but Steve Barron, like I said with Reboot, he was on the ground floor of digital effects. He knew that you could do early digital effects to black out the visual of seeing the faces come through the puppet masks in the movie. He did want to do that, but it would be expensive. He needs more money.

He's not going to get it. So Steve Barron, much like he did before to get friend prices with Jim Henson, he's telling Jim Henson, I believe this is either late 89 or early 1990, he's telling Jim Henson his money problems. Now, what's Jim Henson doing in late 1989? He's about to sell the Muppets to Disney. I can see what's going to happen next year. Jim Henson tells Steve Barron, I can get you a meeting with Jeffrey Katzenberg.

You can screen him this film and then tell him we need more money to finish this film. Would Disney give us some money and become a partial distributor of this movie to finish this movie how I want it? And Henson gets him in the room. Now Steve Barrett admits, I didn't tell my executives about this. I took a cut of the movie to a competitor, showed it to them, and did not tell my bosses. Now you can't do that without problems basically. Yeah I assume when you're making a movie

there's some sort of NDA involved where you can't show the the work prints to a competitor And especially not Disney and but but then again, I mean Golden Harvest were jerking him around They didn't seem like they were a great people to work for and it sounded like a lot of other stuff is informal there And he probably was slightly informally getting Jim Henson So maybe he was thinking well, I can formally got got Jim Henson. I'll just ask for permission later. Oh, and they'll be so happy with me that I got Jeffrey Katzenberg. So he shows Jeffrey Katzenberg a cut of the movie. Katzenberg apparently said, show me in a make these changes. I think it'd be better though. Technically, you could say this is just him giving free consulting on it. I'm thinking like as a lawyer

here. So Barron shows him a second cut where they make some of those changes. He's like, you know what? I think you got something here. I think Jim Henson, this is me after the fact. I think Jim Henson was just being a nice guy who was like, I can get you a meeting.

He's not trying to steal the film. I do think Jeffrey Katzenberg is trying to steal the film though. Oh, absolutely, yes. Yeah. Because Steve Barron wants $750,000 to finish the movie in his way. That doesn't come for free from Jeffrey Katzenberg. Like they're going to take the movie from New Line is what's going to happen. So this all happens. They have the meeting. Steve Barron takes the film back and this is when Jeffrey Katzenberg calls Tom Gray at Golden Harvest. And I'll just read what the

other producer Kim Dawson has to say about it. I was in Tom Gray's office the next day and he gets a call from Jeffrey Katzenberg and he says, hey Tom I saw the picture last night. You know I turned it down before but would you consider letting us release it because we think it'll be a success? And Tom goes, and I remember his exact words, you know, I think we have a home run so we're gonna stick with New Line.

Thanks very much. Click. And guess what? Tom Gray doesn't like learning that his director showed a movie, showed the movie to Disney and tried to make a deal behind his back. Hey, that's fair. Also, like New Line literally could sue them over this. Like it could, they could

be in court from this. Like I, it's easy to be like, oh, you know, the director, I always want to say I have a director in this, but this seriously is like, you can be sued for millions of dollars for doing what he did here. He's jeopardizing his personal life and entire career. So Baron basically gets kicked off the project in the last month or two. It's why he doesn't do much promotion of the movie afterwards. He's not on board for the sequels either. So yeah, he gets cut off.

He doesn't get to do final cut, though Manky finishes it. She didn't get fired, I believe, but they finish it. But there's still a lot of stuff left on film that we'll get into the deleted scenes later But they finished the movie they get it in a workable place Internal reaction to the first screening is not good among the producers playmates especially hates it. They say this is too violent I'm glad we're not making toys out of this and We're still worried that you're gonna kill all popularity of this toy line because this

movie will be so unpopular. They either need to say damn a lot more or a lot less. Work on it. That's why it took a whole year for them to make toys out of the second movie, the the rubbery toys. Did you have those rubbery toys Bob? I had a total of two toys from the Ninja Turtles in my entire lifetime no no three none from any of the movies. The the rubbery guys they made for the second movie my brother and I split them both we each like I he got Mikey and Raph I got Donnie and Leo and we split them as our two two sets of toys. I can name all three of the toys I had by the way I had vanilla Raphael vanilla rocksteady and then much later I got

Whatever line of toys or action figures had the shells that opened up you could put all the weapons inside right? I had the Leonardo of that one of my favorites was I I bet they did make one of Raph in the trench coat back then but I had it was Donatello in the trench coat I love that trench coat look I didn't only later did I realize they were inspired by the thing in Marvel Comics and Jack Kirby wearing the trench coat. That's why they did it. And I don't know, as of maybe five or six years ago, there's an entire line of very expensive versions of these turtles that you could buy. NECA finally made the toys and they look, they look perfect. I saw, I didn't buy it, $90 on Amazon two pack of Casey

and Raph in his overcoat for their big fight. I think they're the size of toddlers, aren't they? They're pretty big. Oh, you can buy a 1-8 scale. Yeah. Yes, yeah, but they also have, you know, seven inch versions that look pretty great too. So playmates thinks it sucks. It's going to kill the thing. But the producers also recall their first test screening with kids. Kids loved it. Loved

it. They were like, Oh shit, I think we got something here. They said they ordered double the prints they were going to originally do. and they pick late March for the release because they figure last week of March into Easter then you get the Easter break kids you got two good weeks but they didn't realize just how good those weeks were gonna be. They actually opened up against the hunt for red October and they slaughtered the hunt for red October. Oh really this this defeated the hunt for Red October. Oh really? This defeated the hunt for Red October. Yes, yeah really. Hunt for Red October did fine, but it was a $25 million opening.

It was, and to give you an idea, the only things that had bigger openings than that at that time were Batman, Temple of Doom, Back to the Future 2, and pretty much that's it. So nothing had a big opening weekend like that back then, and The Turtles was doing that at a, you know, tenth of the budget of those big, big movies. And it was technically the first independent film to break a hundred million dollars at the box office. Again, it's like, is New Line really independent?

Is Golden Harvest really independent? But, you know, it's a spongy definition. Yeah, they're upstarts, let's say, at this time. It would make 350 million worldwide. It'd hold the record as the highest grossing independent film until the Blair Witch Project at the end of the 90s. Truly independent, let's say.

Just a bunch of students. And I think the hit of The Turtles is what fattened up New Line to be purchased by Ted Turner by 1994. And I assume that they would release the next two films. Yes, they kept the sequel option going. They did say that a bunch of other people contacted them to be like, oh, can we get the sequel rights?

Can we work with you guys again, Golden Harvest? But they stuck with New Line, though Fox did get some marketing rights for the sequel. And then there's also a lot of international distributors. Apparently, ownership of this movie is very complicated. It's why there's never been a truly good Blu-ray release or DVD release of this movie is very complicated. Like it's why there's never been a truly good Blu-ray release or DVD release of this movie. Oh yeah, yeah, I'm seeing that Fox has

international rights to the sequels. Yeah, and this movie was put out on VHS by FHE with one of the worst logos ever designed by man, or child in this case. They were extremely lucky to have gotten the music video, sorry, the video rights. I believe they were the, the turtles cartoon show distributors. So they got the video rights too, which was incredible that they, yes, I remember seeing that FHE logo in front of many at VHS tape I got and thought this looks

dumb and yeah, also by the time it came out on VHS on October 4th 1990 which by the way that is seven months no six months basically after there wasn't that kind of turnaround then for a VHS movie that was unnatural yeah normally you'd wait a year or 18 months until you could purchase it yourself they would they would sell the very expensive versions of these VHS tapes to video stores for like $200 just for rentals, but then the direct to consumer version would be much, much later. When I close my eyes, I can see that green and black VHS cover with the four turtles on it right now.

And like Donatello in a truck on the side? Yes, yeah. Him on the back. God, all those great production stills. And of course, it also came with a coupon book for Pizza Hut because Pizza Hut usurped Domino's, even though Domino's is still in the movie, it's Pizza Hut all over the ads for it. Too much brand confusion, but hey, I was a Pizza Hut boy. One of the, there's like a Pizza Hut somewhere in Vancouver

I always see and I tell my wife, we gotta go there. I know it's gonna be bad, but I wanna check in on Pizza Hut. It's been about 15 years. Let's see what's going on there. Only if they still give you drinks in those big red cups. Only that. That era's over, but I can tell them how many books I read. They won't care.

But I read four books this month. Yeah, sir, that'll be $30. Pizza Hut invested heavy. I did find a old press release they put out in late 1990 saying they have a $20 million ad campaign for Pizza Hut branded with the turtles, which included the VHS, also the coupon that was in the NES version of the arcade game, and the coming out of our shells tour Pizza Hut invested heavy in turtles. You know people were eating pizza before Ninja Turtles obviously I really want to know I want a study done to show what this IP did for pizza because maybe pizza would be like getting paella or something in 2024 if the turtles weren't around maybe it would be this like oh

let's get that. We haven't gotten that in a while. Instead of just kind of like one of the default things you get for food when you're just, you lack imagination. I think Pizza Hut knows that the turtle endorsement was worth its weight in gold because every kid would eat like, oh, this is the pizza the turtles eat. Well, I'm having that pizza then.

Which makes it even stranger that in Secret of the Ooze they don't have a branded pizza in it. When they get their pizza in the star of the movie it's just like it basically has the waving Italian man on the box. It's such a brand-free pizza. They couldn't nail the licensing in time. Also speaking of the international release like you said Bob kids love the hero turtles in the UK. Parents don't like nunchucks and you can find on Moviesensorship.com a crazy list of all the ways they had to edit out Michael Angel's nunchucks from this movie including darkening scenes, taking out cuts when he turns his back. It's nuts. That's what happens to your country when there are no guns. You just you fear

nunchucks and meanwhile in America kids I knew were just bringing their nunchucks to school and hitting themselves with them because they're really hard to use you sorry I took the words out of your mouth there That's why Mikey Stopped using his nunchucks in season 2 of the cartoon or season 3 of the cartoon and stopped using them in that in the he Didn't use them much in secret of the Ooze either. Though then again, Leo basically only used, I mean, Leo doesn't stab anybody with his swords in this movie, but he really doesn't use his swords

in the second movie. Yeah, a friend of mine had nunchucks in like 1991 or whatever, and he could do basically two things before he started hitting himself with the nunchucks. And really, when he would hand them over to me, I would just spin them, you know, just easily spin it away from my body. It's like, that feels kinda cool.

That's what happens if you press the B button with Michelangelo in the Turtles games. It looks cool. And yeah, I tried skateboarding once and I realized this is never gonna happen. So the eating pizza element of turtle lifestyle I could do. And hey, we could all pick up a broomstick and pretend to be Donatello.

Oh, ease like super achievable turtle, you know, play acting. Yeah, the Pizza Hut and turtle stuff has continued to this day. They just, for that new movie, they're eating Pizza Hut pizza in that new movie, even though again, they live in New York City. And we didn't talk about that new movie. Thinking about it, I might've liked it more than the Spider-Verse film.

And I think it is the first true success of a Ninja Turtles film. I feel like, and successful in terms of showing me a CGI movie that I've never seen before. A style. Going beyond Spider-Verse's interesting take and pushing it even further and more experimental. I love that everybody looks like the weird toys that they were back in the 80s. Like yeah, I like how they're weird and ugly and I love how, unlike in this movie, it actually does feel like teens are legitimately playing the characters in it. I was on a Discord, it might have been RetroNauts, I'm not trying to call anyone out, but someone said, oh I watched the new Turtles movie,

and it's okay if you can stand kids saying mid and things like that. And I just, I replied saying, oh, mid is just the bogus of 2023. Yeah. They're updating. Exactly. Yeah. They're saying Riz and mid and Lizzie

instead of Cowabunga and Radical. Radical, Radical, Radical. See that? But no, I think that's the best Turtles movie for sure. Though I didn't see it when I was a child, so obviously I like this one more. And also for whatever reason, Facebook, it will just show me AI generated stuff

to suggest like, hey follow this page. And recently I've been getting a lot me AI generated stuff and to suggest like, hey, follow this page. And recently I've been getting a lot of AI generated turtle stuff and I find it funny that the AI will often generate a fifth turtle. And I'm like, who is this? Facebook definitely is the worst social media platform I check in on because it seriously is, every other suggested post is an AI thing.

Yeah, like a fake AI poster. And although I say it, like Facebook will go through different phases with me, like it'll be pushing this thing, it'll be pushing that thing. Recently, it's been showing me a lot of Calvin and Hobbes comics, and I'm cool with that. It's moved on past the Ghostbusters and Ninja Turtle AI stuff, and now it's just showing me

scanned Calvin and Hobbes comics. And I'm like, this is fun. I enjoy this. See, you don't follow, Facebook doesn't think you like pro wrestling like it does with me. This is where I also fall into the thirst trap zone of the AI things where it's like,

it's a female pro wrestler who's popular now, except if you look at it for more than two seconds, you're like, oh, her boobs are twice as big as they are in real life. Like that's what the AI is doing for those pictures. It sucks. It's bad out there. But okay, but back to the happier 1990. If it wasn't for, I think the VHS release of the Little Mermaid, it would probably have been the highest selling VHS of 1990, the turtles movie. And what a Christmas that was. You're getting your Turtles VHS for Christmas. You're

then going out to see Home Alone in theaters. It's a beautiful time to be a child. It's great to be eight. Also that FHE versus New Line thing. This led me to a teenage argument with a friend that basically almost stopped being friends with him. Oh, geez. Because he said that TMNT was released by FHE, and I was saying, that's who put out the video. It's a new line movie.

And we almost came to blows before. This is before you could just look it up on a Wikipedia. Yeah, those arguments almost ended friendships for me. And I guess I will recommend people check out our What a Cartoon on the original series. We did an episode of RetroNauts about the Ninja Turtles in 1989, the phenomenon, and also an episode about the Cowabunga collection with Chris Kohler who worked on it. And that's a great collection of almost all the Turtles games lovingly represented as they were intended to be. It's a

perfect thing to play while listening to this podcast and perhaps it's yeah No, I've there's been a lot of turtle content lately, which has been very nice And okay, so the movie comes out huge huge hit what happens for Steve Barron? He does say he had right of refusal to do the sequel But he obviously wasn't very happy with the new line or golden harvest and also he didn't want to do a sequel He wanted to do something new. So he stepped away. And also as any ooze viewer knows, Barron's style wasn't going to work with what they wanted in the lighter sequel anyway. So what would Steve Barron do? Well if you look at IMDB, his next project is Coneheads in 1993. That's the next movie he directs that's

released. A film I did not see in theaters I saw the VHS and I thought like oh, this is pretty fun but then I found out later always a huge bomb and everyone hated it and He's also the executive producer on their reboot and he tells a very funny story on the commentary that After the movie came out he had a meeting with Steven Spielberg and Steven Spielberg said me and my son Love this Ninja Turtles movie. I want to work with you. You know, I'm executive producing the Casper, the friendly ghost movie. Would you like to make that? And Steve Baron on the commentary is kicking himself for turning that down

and not working with Steven Spielberg. He's, he's had a fine career since, but he, that's a big regret for him, he says. I forgot that was a Spielberg produced film. It's the fifth movie, or the third movie, where Dan Aykroyd puts on the Ghostbusters uniform. And instead they got, the guy who directed this movie is Peter Silberling, and that's his first movie. Wow, I didn't know that.

I do remember it's one of the writers, his slappy squirreler self, Sherry Stoner. Mm-hmm. And hey, also Ariel, going back to Little Mermaid. Oh, right. So Baron leaves the turtles behind, though he definitely has appreciated in the years since hearing what a success it is

and how many children of 1990 have grown up to become very intense fans. He really appreciates them. Eastman has done multiple interviews saying like, oh yeah, this is the best movie. They truly captured it. He's still very proud of it. It's barely available. It's not on Paramount Plus right now, which is also crazy. I don't know what the deal is. Is it streamable anywhere right now in the US? I mean, you can pay for a streaming rental or purchase, but not on any of the major streaming services, no.

And I have like a $9 Blu-ray iPod of it that is just the movie with no deleted scenes or nothing, even though they're out there, because ownership of this is very confused, and so they can't, that's how I had a fun post of on the back of the DVD or the Blu-ray. It's still the old approved credit, so that's why it says read the Dell paperback.

And I say, hey, don't read that paperback until you see the movie. If you're eight, it's gonna ruin the movie for you. It might go towards a free pizza, but at what cost? But yeah, I think it still has a pretty good legacy to this day, but does it hold up? Well, I guess we'll have to watch it again with a fine-tooth comb, won't we?

Oh, by the way, the commentary is very funny to listen to that's on YouTube because he did it for the German DVD, Steve Barron did, and so when the audio of the movie bleeds in, it's the German audio. And so you're just hearing German Raphael. Oskar Lieber, Splinter. Now I will say before we close up here,

the history section, until the new movie that came out last year, this had the best reputation for a Ninja Turtles movie, right? Oh yeah, I think so. Cause I mean, the other ones were like, you have the less good sequels to this, including the third one where they cheaped out

and didn't pay for Jim Henson. Then you have the okay TMNT CGI movie. Then you've got the hated Michael Bay movies. And now you've got the mutant mayhem, which is, yes, very good. And only happened because Spider-Verse was so successful. So they got to run with that ball and be creative. And also Seth Rogen's like the one rich comedy man

who can make a good cartoon or facilitate a good cartoon. And now it's getting a sequel and a two season Paramount Plus series. It leaves them in a good place at the end of that movie for a TV show. Not to spoil the movie, but I was like, oh, this would be a cool TV show if they do that. I'm not gonna spoil the movie,

but did you notice that their main villain isn't in the first one? Well, guess what the teaser is, folks. They're doing what the Batman film did recently. It does what every superhero movie does at the end of like, well, hey, you know, next time. And what Nolan did in Batman Begins. Or all of the Marvel movies lately have just been like,

well, you know, this Marvel's, the Marvels might have bored you, but what about B-Stuff? Wait, do you like him? Sure, sure. I know Henry likes certain incarnations of him. Or there's also the fourth Thor movie that ended that was not that great.

But then it ends with like, hey, we got a Hercules. That'll be fun if we make another one of these. Hercules? Yeah, Hercules. Marvel's Hercules is one of Thor's greatest frenemies. OK, well, now you're just making things up. I don't believe you. It's fun.

Thor and Hercules are both public domain heroes that Marvel has their own versions of. I actually didn't know about the Hercules thing. I thought, like, what? Are they just making a Hercules movie, but not the Hercules comic character? It's sort of like how Dracula is a Marvel character as well. Where is the Dracula movie?

They haven't actually put a Dracula in the MCU. Maybe that'll be in the Blade MCU movie if that ever actually happens. I hope. Sorry last thing actually talk about that compared to now. Marvel movies now they basically film their movies twice now like they they're refilming like everything of the new Captain America movie and that Thunderbolts movie to know that this movie was like can we refilm a little bit and they're like no no reshoots-shoots. Like, every movie is re-shoots now. Every movie is $200 million now.

Yeah, you got to make every movie twice. Yeah, $13 million would not pay for, like, one of the stars of a Marvel movie. You're getting 70% of Chris Evans. You're getting all of the digital effects of Spider-Man for two minutes. That's $13 dollars right there. So why don't we take a trip back to the quaint year of 1990 and we talk about Teenage Mutant

Ninja Turtles when we get back. Let it spin, for real, legit, you feel it I'm talkin' bout the real deal, I'ma make you feel Yo DJ, spin that wheel Half-word, any way is okay When the record starts to play, legit, you feel it Yo DJ, spin that wheel Spin that wheel I'ma make you feel, yo, DJ! Get up and party!

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Get them while they're hot. I'm gonna be a good boy And we're back from the break. Hope everybody enjoys hearing the I would say fairly derivative opening music they play over it like oh yeah real one when I was rewatching this I thought oh you really were trying to fool people because it's like that I thought that that that that instead of that it's so it's so cheap it's like honestly the actual compositions of a new music in this movie feels pretty cheap to me at times. The music is kind of bad in the movie. When they're trying to play up the comedy with the music it's kind of cringey. Oh yeah, which is really crazy.

I don't think I said him on the history thing, but the composer for it is John DuPres. He is affiliated with major stuff, including like he is the composer on many of the Monty Python films and like Terry Gilliam and Terry Jones stuff too. It's crazy that he didn't take a long time on this one, I think. I can't hate him too much because the previous year he wrote the score for UHF. I feel like that could be a future What a Cartoon movie. Absolutely, man, that could be,

I'd be up for that next year. But yes, and also another interesting thing has happened since we last recorded, which is, Bob, did you see the news that there's another live action Ninja Turtles movie in the works? No, I totally missed this and I think that made me a happier person. It's, well guess what Bob, they're finally gonna break the R barrier with a live action Ninja Turtles movie. You've heard of the last rone in comic series they did, right?

Yes. So it's getting adapted into a movie which totally fits. It's their version of the Dark Knight Returns. It's the last turtle story. There's an unmasked singular turtle who has all four of the weapons and he's on a hunt for revenge for his three dead brothers. You don't know who he is and it's sort of a mystery thing it Yeah, currently Paramount has announced that they are working on it They only have a script but they're working on it as an actual movie I I never asked for this but I'm sure other people were asking for I'm just disappointed that We won't get the next mutant mayhem movie until

2026 October of 2026. That's the current until October of 2026. That's the current date that it's set for. So over two and a half years from now, we'll get a sequel to last summer's Mutant Mayhem, which I think we talked about it up front. By the way, we recorded the history section maybe like two weeks ago, I think. So apologies if we repeat anything from that section.

Man, by the time they finish that, the teens they got to record it are gonna be like 23 by the time it happens. Oh yeah yeah they're gonna be young adults. Also last time I meant to play this but to set the tone of what people thought when this came out I do have about a minute from the Siskel and Ebert clip which is really funny. I went to the funniest bit. I just know that Siskel did not like it and he was dumping on it. Ebert, though, he liked it a little bit more. Yeah. And why would a pizza company want to advertise that it's the pizza preferred by turtles who live in sewers? That's an interesting plug. I was also interested in the high level

of your criticism when you pointed out that these turtles only pay lip service to ninja teachings. I suppose you would have liked it better if it had been a more devout and religious film. Well, no. But if somehow, I'm looking for something there for kids. If the kid, you know, like the karate kid film, at least there's a suggestion of some kind of altruistic behavior. What you have here is marketing carried to the ultimate degree. Now you mentioned the Saturday morning TV show, you didn't mention the Nintendo game which is one of the top selling Nintendo games in the country and I played it for our Christmas gift guide last December until it drove me crazy, these little turtles running around

and doing their flip flops and actually the visuals in this movie look a lot like not only the TV show but also like the video game and so kids have already been brainwashed to the point where they've Got to see this movie. That's why it opened so strongly they had to be taken to see this movie and I guess they liked it I don't know. Maybe they're not that critical when they're five years old He had to bring up the Nintendo game I think we pointed out up front that he was obsessed with a Nintendo game and that's the one game He played a lot before he decided I can't play video games. They'll take over my life Yeah, it's so funny. That's the one that broke him the turtles one and yeah, just hearing it like

Cisco craps all over it, but even Ebert is just like, you know, well, yeah This is for five-year-olds who were advertised to very well. It was like, yeah, nope, he's right, he's right. I don't think I actually read Ebert's quote upfront about having played the Ninja Turtles game. I wanna read that now, I just pulled it up. Oh boy. Ebert says, quote, I got one of these NES sets at home and I started playing Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

After a week of this, I'd find that every time I had a spare moment and every time I came home, I was in front of the set playing with these mutant turtles. It got to the point where it was making me quite unhappy because I was so obsessed with it, and I finally unplugged the machine and said, that's it for Nintendo. Now, this is Bob speaking.

I wanna be a fly on the wall when Mr. Roger Ebert is playing the damn level of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles for the NES. I want to be there. He probably was screaming to the heavens about that. Man, oh, that's so... To think that that's the one that broke him in, that he was like, oh yeah, I would be completely obsessed with this and would be late on every review if I kept playing video games. I had to stop it. And on a related note, I am reading the newer book about

Siskel and Ebert called Opposable Thumbs and I'm really enjoying it because there has been very little information about Gene Siskel despite how famous he was. And this book says a lot about him that I've never seen before. And so much about their relationship. So I definitely recommend that. It's a nice follow up to Roger Ebert's autobiography, Life Itself, which I read about a decade ago or whenever it came out. That's really it. I'm going to give that a read Roger Ebert's autobiography, Life Itself, which I read about a decade ago or whenever it came out. That's really it. I'm gonna give that a read too. I watched the doc, Life Itself.

I should read that or pull that one up in the audible as well, Life Itself. But the documentary was amazing. Yes, the book is fantastic. The documentary is, I mean, the book, this is about Ebert, by the way, so forgive me. The book is Ebert's memoirs, basically. And the documentary is half that,

but also partially about how he's dying and doesn't wanna make a documentary for obvious reasons. And it's very, very touching and I love it so much. But they both are separate works, I think. But the Supposable Thumbs book, new, very good. If you love Siskel and Ebert, new info about them, especially Siskel It's also funny that the Ebert's replying to a good point Siskel makes which is like

he is Offended by the amount of product placement in this movie, which is totally fair the more on close watching I was like, oh, yeah, I guess that's an ad and that's a product. There's a product in like 50% of the shots in this movie, I think. Maybe I wasn't looking close enough, but there could have been more. I noticed, oh, at the teen hideout,

they're playing the real arcade games, and they're eating Burger King and things like that. But I didn't really see, I mean, there's nothing going on at that farmhouse where they can stick an ad on something. Unless they got a payment for turtle wax. Oh yeah, maybe. But the stuff just kind of falls into the back.

Well it's also like there's Pepsi cans everywhere. There's also like Archie Comics gets labels in the background on some boxes. And JVC, I always notice the JVC products that the Footcline are stealing. Because JVC makes such great products, the Footcline has to steal it. Well, I recently half watched part of Happy Gilmore, a movie I don't really like, in a hotel room. And there's a scene where they're just in Subway,

eating Subway. Yes. Oh wait, we had on Ian Boothby, tell us this tale of being in that commercial. Yes, of course, my wife and I watched for that scene. We were waiting for Ian Boothby to have the sub hit into his mouth by Happy Gilmore, but I forgot just how much Subway, the Subway Corporation had its shadow looming over that movie. No, he is a pioneer Adam Sandler of in-film advertising. He makes this look inept by comparison, which literally has a Domino's commercial

in the show, in the movie pretty much, of a turtle ordering Domino's and loving it. Watching this again with a very close eye, I still really like it though. Definitely you can see like flaws or like, boy, they're killing time here kind of stuff, or where they completely avoid showing any kind of fight scene of like, oh no, a bunch of fog appeared and the lights went out. I also noticed, and it's something I like, how grainy this movie is. This is a low budget indie movie.

It feels like it's filmed on 16 millimeter or something. Ah, there are a couple scenes that are intentionally filmed on a Super 8 camera. Okay, I guess you'll get to it, but I think I know which ones you're talking about. But yeah, I think you can tell when they went to New York City for some of the outdoor filming that they were able to rent better cameras in New York City than the ones they had

in North Carolina for that stuff. Oh yeah, for sure. And another thought I had upon watching this again is this does feel caught up in the idea of what are we to do with gangs of the early 90s? Where are our children, they're going to join these gangs and we have to stop it. And I'm sure that's still a concern,

but it's not something I hear about anymore, but it was every kind of media had messages about that in it around this time. I mean, we would have seen this within a month of then seeing the cartoon All Stars to the Rescue, which also is about how like, oh, little boys like Danny are gonna be turned into gang members who do drugs, except it's ninjas in this movie. Yeah, there's no drugs in the movie,

which is, I guess, something that they could've included as, you know, a cautionary tale, but they didn't. But yeah, I just thought of, you know, when we covered Bart the Murderer, which aired on TV like a year after this, the network was concerned that Bart was joining a gang when he was joining Fat Tony's mafia. That's right, yes. I think it's a clever thing they do in this movie that they're like, oh yeah,

well the fear, let's take the rampant fear of not just the increased crime rate in New York City, but also like teens joining gangs, except the Foot Clan does the things you hear that they do, like you're, you don't have a family, where are your family, I'm your father, all that stuff do like you're you don't have a family. Where are your family? I'm your father all that stuff except it is you know a Japanese immigrant ninja doing these things I was also thinking not to do too much preamble stuff But whenever they're fighting these ninjas and knocking them around and hitting them with bats are these all children You know we see the guys training that I would say, you know, that I would bet at least 17 at the youngest of those people.

But you know, the turtles are only 15, so this is like minor on minor violence here. Yeah, I guess that's less of a crime than what Casey Jones is doing to them. Yes, no, that's yeah, I'll get to that later, too. But yeah, it's like Elias Koteis is so, or however you pronounce it, he is so charming in this that they completely forget that he is written in this movie to be like a violent nutcase, but he plays him too nice and lovable. Yeah, yeah, he's very cuddly. I guess we never see his living situation or learn too much about him, So I guess knowing as little as we do, he is very charming.

So the opening of the film, when I learned that they had four days, that's what Steve Barron said, they had four days in New York City. To know that, they got a lot done in four days. Like all of this, a lot of this establishing stuff of the crime wave is what they filmed in New York City on one of those four days. Okay, I was guessing, I was trying to guess

what was North Carolina and what was New York as I was watching. There's a few key bits where like you can see North Carolina, or New York become North Carolina, but most of this is New York, the walking around, especially the newsstand stuff. Okay, because I don't know New York, the walking around, especially the new Stan stuff. Okay, because I don't know if the Super Mario Brothers film, the first one, had any time in NYC,

but a lot of that movie is doing North Carolina for Brooklyn. I believe you said it in the history, Bob, or you've definitely told me it before, but I was reminded again that Shredder's warehouse in this is also where they built Dino Hatton. Like, three years after this is where Dino Hatton was built. But yeah, the newsstand, this is where you get your first product placement, a ladies

drinking Burger King, just to give you the timeline, in 1989 when they were filming this, that's when they had the TMNT BK Kids meal of like the belt buckles and stuff I don't know if you had any of these Bob no I just recall the Pizza Hut tie-ins Pizza Hut got them the next year in 1990 but in 89 it was cartoon tie-ins of like there's like a wrath belt buckle and now like a door thing that you would open the door and shredders behind it and they they sold for like four bucks VHS is that had episodes open the door and shredders behind it. They sold for like four bucks VHSs that had episodes of the show on it. Oh speaking of merch and tie-ins, I was just looking through the IMDB gallery for this

film and after you get through some of the stills, you start seeing pictures of the premiere and one of the pictures is Pierce Brosnan holding his young son and his young son has a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles denim jacket and a red bandana across his eyes. Wow. They got so much free publicity because so many movie stars like Steve Barron had the story that Steven Spielberg contacted him because his kid made him watch the Turtles movie three times with him.

And so it's like, yeah, you have all these movie stars that they want to get cred with their kids by taking them to the Ninja Turtles movie premiere. But at the time he was Mr. Remington Steele, he was not James Bond yet. I'm not sure what films he was in, Pierce Brosnan. Oh, that's true. He probably wasn't in much then.

Yeah. Also speaking of British people, when we first see Danny in this whole pickpocketing handoff thing here, this is where you'll note he's wearing a Sid Vicious t-shirt, which he wears multiple ones into the movie. Okay, I was like, is this Jim Morrison or something?

This shows how little I know. Yeah, they're all Sid Vicious, and Steve Barron says that he did that on purpose. They you you can't characters can't just wear a t-shirt in a movie that's copywritten images so but he had been working with the Sex Pistols manager who owned the likeness rights to the late singer Sid Vicious. Singer's being very generous to what Sid Vicious could do. Lead Screamer. Yes. I guess the fact that his initial shirt says Sid, very large on it, was a big clue that I missed.

So Baron apparently at one point was trying to make some sort of biopic about the Sex Pistols, so that's how he could get the rights to it. But again, this was such a small time movie that it was all these favors. And a lot of them were Steve Barron favors, which is a real credit to what he did for this movie. And yeah, we see trucks getting emptied out,

which is a fun little like in-camera trick. I would guess they just had just a wall of the cardboard boxes and then they just took them out and then got back in the next shot. Yeah, I assume they're all empties. There's a lot of empty cardboard boxes flinging around here. Yeah, I assume they're all empties. There's a lot of empty cardboard boxes flinging around here. Yeah, actually, I was thinking,

but by the time we get to the Foot Clan's headquarters and Casey Jones battling Tatsu in there, I was thinking, this reminds me a lot of Future War. Yes, that's right. The empty cardboard box factory. They didn't put in crunching metal sounds when you hit the boxes. It's like, these are just empty boxes.

No one's crushed them yet. We're not pretending this has stuff in it. Uh, and the, the foot client guys, they, they run off. They, uh, it's one of the few scenes where you can see they actually did. Put something in the background to fake New York, because you can tell the skyline of when the kids are going under the fence to get to the warehouse. That is where they put a fake New York skyline behind this. One of the few times they spent the money out in effect like that.

And I know you mentioned it before the recording, but I don't know if you want to bring it up now. You said you saw the trailer with different voices and stuff in it. Yeah, so this is really interesting that the original trailer is even on Paramount Plus right now, at least in the US. When you go to the movie page, it says watch trailer, and sometimes they cut together new trailers. But this is them using the original teaser trailer for the film that is selling it to somebody in January of 1990. And the interesting thing is it has several

deleted scenes in it and talk about them trying to rip off the opening. Early in it they have a shot of a manhole cover popping off. I was like, oh, come on, that's cheap. That is so cheap. But yes, they also have original voices in it that were the temp tracks So yeah here I can play it real quick here. The only two big ones are this is original shredder and Original or at least temp track Michelangelo saying two of their their famous lines is a new enemy, freaks of nature. Together, we will punish these freaks. What the heck was that? Looked like sort of a big title in a trench coat.

Yeah! I love being a turtle! Not nearly as good, sorry. Is it Robbie Wriste? Is he Michelangelo? Robbie Wriste does a much better job in the final movie, yeah, than that voice. No, I mean, and that's the end of the trailer thing of like,

I love being a turtle. A mortal line in the movie, he's not selling it. No, yeah, you can see why they replaced him. My bet is, after hearing that, when they cut together that trailer, they're like, well, this will only be so big and then the trailer got such a great reaction that that's when they thought Okay, let's set aside $50,000 or whatever to hire some better voice. We need the star power of Robbie wrist. I

I saw an unsubstantiated thing that Corey Feldman said that he did it for just like I saw an unsubstantiated thing that Corey Feldman said that he did it for just like $1,500 because he thought it was an indie film and not a giant film. It's why he didn't come back for two. He was in too much of, let's say, a haze to understand the phenomenon of the turtles for the past couple of years.

He, you know, for those three years, he had other things on his mind, yeah. So, yes, we then go to the Foot Clan warehouse that would later be Dino Hatton. We get to see Tatsu played by Toshihiro Obata who had small roles in the Shadow and Demolition Man, but not much else to his credit. He's good in this.

He always scared me as a kid. I was like, oh man, he's so scary. Even in two, he scared me. He's kind of disp. He always scared me as a kid. I was like, oh man, he's so scary even in two He scared me. He's kind of dispatched Unceremoniously though when he's hit like a golf ball and he is in two you said I have memories of two. Okay I I remember they I feel like I liked it more Him into because the turtles actually directly fight him instead of they they save him for Casey Jones in this movie, but Elias Koteas could only do so much stunt work and so they couldn't actually do a real fight for his character. Also the kids who are the

the hoodlums, they're eating a Burger King Whopper. There's like an open Whopper container next to a Burger King drink there. I noticed the Burger King. That's like the first product placement I did pick up on. If I was Burger King, I'd be calling them after the movie comes out and say like, what, so the turtles eat Domino's and the bad guys eat our food? Why don't the turtles eat Burger King?

Hey, any publicity is good publicity, right? Though I guess this too shows you where they're at of like, you know, they've got Burger King B-level pizza, B-level burger place, Domino's B- level pizza place. They don't get the A level stuff till after the success of this. And this whole thing is a voiceover narration from April explaining what's going on. I thought to myself, oh yeah, she's a perfect mainstream journalist. Her only arguments with the police is they're not arresting enough people.

Yes, we need more funding for the police. And I watched this a few years ago, but I forgot all these elements of April that are in this that are not canon or just invented for this where she's an investigative reporter, which you know is part of all the turtle stuff, but she also owns an antique store. She's very good at life drawing. She's got a VW microbus. store. She's very good at life drawing. She's got a VW micro bus. Oh, and she also, her family owns a farmhouse too. Right, she's got all this property. What's going on April? I know it's like, oh so you're just a friggin rich kid playing around being a TV journalist. Good for you April. Unfortunately when I watch this I just think of all the things that have frustrated me about it when I was a kid and I brought this up in the first section but we get to the new station and it's WTRL 3 and I can just go back to nearly 8 year old me thinking no it's channel 6. Exactly. Well you're probably also thinking like where's her boss? Where's Irving?

Yeah, yeah. Vernon's the camera guy. Irving is the boss. Oh, that's right. Or in the end, her dorky friend, I forget her name too. Irma. Irma, that's it. Not Irving, Irma. I forget the boss's name.

He was in the cartoon that we covered on the What a Cartoon episode. But yeah, I guess Charles is kind of the mean boss, but he's not the like Perry White, J. Jonah, J. Jonah Jameson? Yeah, yeah, he's not the like Perry White's J Jonah J Jonah Jameson. Yeah Yeah, he's not enough. That's his problem. They give all the mean boss stuff to the the chief of police You know, yeah the boss here. It feels kind of like the dad from elf Now I also in this scene you get to see Danny

He opens up the walk man that he'll be using later in the movie to ignore his father. So I gotta say too, when I watched this, I was like, yeah, I remember why as a kid I completely erased Danny. Danny is the kind of kid they add to like, this is for kids to have a self-insert character. Like, we don't need Danny. No.

Yeah, I didn't like Danny, and as a kid, I like him now. Casey Jones is a character I like now. But as a kid, once the mask comes off, I'm like, this is just a guy hanging around. Yeah, Keno is way cooler in Secretly Used, though also unneeded, but. I'm surprised the Casey Jones mask never comes back.

It's so iconic. Was it just skirting copyright law by being parody? Oh, yeah, I mean, too, I bet they just, the Casey Jones is such a handsome guy that I think it also is them going like, well we didn't hire this guy to cover him in a mask the whole movie so that's why he gets knocked off in like eight seconds after his first appearance. I was just thinking he's kind of like Punisher Jason and maybe that was too much for the lawyers. Yeah I could could see that. Well, especially because New Line is in direct competition

with Freddie against Jason at that point. And now it's all owned by the same people. Great. But yeah, also the big change, again, we said it before, why David Wise, not the rare one, was mad about this because she was Baxter Stockman's lab assistant in the comics. She was not a news reporter.

Making her a news reporter is stealing the character from the cartoon while technically only licensing the comic rights. Oh yeah, I forgot about that element of her from the comic. Yeah, yeah, all of the stuff that happens with April in this movie is pretty close to what appears in the comic,

except that she is a news reporter here. And if they ever considered her being in the yellow jumpsuit, it never happened in the movie, but this yellow jacket is the most you could get. If only, yeah, I think I might've said this up front and I apologize if I'm repeating myself, but I think they use just enough cartoon elements to make me think, well, why is the rest of this

not like the cartoon? Yeah, and this is where they wanted to have more stuff. Like this was gonna be the big thing Steve Barron wanted in those reshoots with Katzenberg, which was he wanted to show during that crime wave, cuts to the turtles running through the back alleys of New York and everything and them stalking the Foot Clan. If you watch that original trailer, you see a shot that's not in the movie of the turtle

shells popping out of water, kind of like at the end of the second movie. That was supposed to be part of that opening sequence of seeing the turtles. Instead, this time, they just happen upon April being robbed as she has some bad luck. And Baron admits on the commentary, the lights go out because we had a deadline and we only had so many days to film. Yeah, there's a lot of deadline fights involving darkness and steam. But it also seems like they don't want to reveal

the turtles quite yet because when they're revealed it's when they're having fun, they're the more comical, fun, family-friendly versions of the characters. If they were introduced in an all-out brawl with these kids, I think some parents would be pulling their kids out of the theater because they're like, well, this is what you like? Well, no more turtles for you.

I think they wanna show the turtles having fun and partying and eating pizza before they actually hit people. That's true. The first punches don't happen until the Casey fight, I guess. That's the first time you actually see violence on screen. I also forgot, I always think that Sam Rockwell first appears when he offers the cigarettes,

but he's one of the thugs beaten up by the turtles here. And Sam Rockwell is very funny here because I had to look it up, I was like, okay, wait, was he a New York actor? No, he was born in California and had just moved to New York to start his young acting career. So his cartoonish New York accent is not real. It's a California doing a New York accent. But yes, the turtles, Raphael though, unlike his action figure, doesn't have a ninja star to throw at the thing. So he has to lose his side to take out the lights.

Yeah, they really need more accessories. If you're gonna be tossing around your side like this don't be so sad when you lose it. Even the original ones they had like they came with the ninja stars they came with like what tonfas or something or also like a glaive sort of thing like a pointy thing on the end of a handle. I mean him losing his side is kind of like when you're a kid and you lose a ball on the roof of your house and you're like well I knew what I was getting into when I threw it up there so. Maybe that's why we all the kids loved Raph in this movie because they're like oh man I'd be sad if I lost my favorite

toy too. Yeah like I said up front this is the Rafael movie and as a Rafael super fan I was you know on board I think that helped me get around all of the the lack of canon or what I felt was canon as a seven-year-old I you know Leo was my favorite I think Leo is the turtle with the most disservice done to him in this so the least screen time or story I think if you were a fan of Mikey or especially if you're a fan of Donatello you must have hated this movie or felt shortchanged because I said it up front, but they're like Beavis and Butthead in this movie. They're just doing bits and they don't really have their own characterizations.

I guess Michelangelo might be more sensitive because he's the one who's crying later in the film. And twice Donatello does something that reads to me as, this person is smarter than Michelangelo, but that's kind of it. But yeah, Raph, I love the shot of Raph peeking out from the manhole cover with his side poking it out. Like, that's so cool.

And as a kid, I was in shock hearing him say a swear. Damn, damn. Damn is like his catchphrase in this movie. Yeah, this time I counted the dams So we're gonna we're gonna go through the movie and count them all but I counted six and I think only half of them are Raphael dams there's there's a Donatello dam at the end of the movie. Wow. I forgot that one Wow Okay, I I caught the Mikey dam, but that's they soften it I think just those dams went such a long way in getting our generation

as we grow up thinking like, this is such a dark and gritty movie, like this has silly things in it. Yeah, they're fighting with props in an antique store. That's why April has an antique store, so they can have a bunch of fun props. Yeah, it's like, you need symbols to fight ninjas with? Well, I've got a store. Though, you know, Jackie Chan, he would comejas with? Well, I've got a store. Though, you know Jackie Chan, he would come up with a lot more cool, him and his stunt team, you put him in that antique store, he's gonna come up with more fun bits than they do in this movie. Absolutely.

Like, well actually I guess that basically is the fight scene in Rumble in the Bronx, filmed in your neighborhood, Bob. Right, it was a convenience store, right? filmed in your neighborhood, Bob. Right, it was a convenience store, right? And also they have a, the gang basically has a Foot Clan style warehouse they hang out in too in that movie. Also not my neighborhood, but I've been there and it is iconic.

The iconic rumble in the Bronx district. Nina had some great pics of her discovering filming locations from the movie movie I really like that but so yes after all of this we then get to see our Turtle Boys on screen in our first clip Huh? Bossa Nova? Chevy Nova? Oh, man. Excellent! Yeah! Come on, let's move it.

I'm starving. Ooh, work rocket. Major pizza attack. Pizza unneeded. Oh, baby. All right. All right. I'm gonna win, D.D.! Same to Rose. Woo! Oh baby Oh baby Alright I'm gonna win

Give me three You got it I like how up front the turtles are how adults saw them in 1990 Catchphrase goblins that like pizza That's right You're right, they're just all try out catchphrases It took many viewings before I realized that the Undercurrent of all of these catchphrase scenes that book in the movie is them trying to discover the word cowabunga like yeah

I always forget the movie is about the discovery of cowabunga That's fine. By the end of it. They'll finally have it like as a kid Chevy Nova bossa Nova My mom had to explain that one to me. I think she, she had a good chuckle at that. One oral history said that one of the first things they filmed in costume were this walk through the sewers and it apparently took 36 takes and drove the performers insane. They all were ready to like die. They're walking through these dark tunnels that have ankle deep water in them.

It looked difficult. I wanna know later how they did the Donatello skateboarding through the tubes fighting guys. Was that 60 takes? Man, yeah, it had to be, cause they had a specific skateboarding performer. When he does the skating a little later, you can bet that it's just wearing

turtle legs, like not the rest of the thing. Yeah, and by the way, damn number two comes when they're talking about their pizza rich future and he's just like, damn! So that's a shouted damn. So I believe his third damn is the establishing or the shot over the city at the end of the Casey Jones thing where he goes, damn!

That's a big damn. Yeah, no, Raph is not ready to celebrate with the other bros as they're so excited. Also, when he says Major League butt kicking is back in town and you see their shadows, it looks more like he's singing into his nunchuck like it's a microphone. It's really clever to set up. You show them as silhouettes first and then they come around the corner and you're like, these are the turtles. You've been waiting to see them.

Here they are. Yeah. I wonder, so you saw the trailer. How much of the turtles did you actually see in that trailer? They give it all away. They show multiple fight scene moments. They show Mikey do the head duck. That's the last shot of the movie,

is the God I love being a turtle with a head duck. So they give it all away, which is funny. I would bet that Steve Barron didn't want that, but he had no control over how New Line Cinema was gonna market that. As a kid not watching a lot of movies and theaters around this time, I'm sure I had not seen what they looked like

until they rounded that corner. And note too, these credits, three editors that stands by the thing of Sally Menke being fired for being part of the Steve Barron goes to Disney story. So too bad because she's an Oscar-winning editor and the other two people are fine. Too bad we can't see her cut. Yeah, no, it's sad. she's an Oscar-winning editor, the other two people are fine. Too bad we can't see her cut.

Yeah, no, it's sad, I am thankful to whatever German production company was able to work with Steve Barron and probably slightly illegally include some deleted scenes on the German Blu-ray, but I appreciate that. Thank you, thank you German Turtles Blu-ray releasers. Then in a very Leonardo move, he's the one who rushes in and be like,

teacher, teacher, we did a good job tonight. Now, I have been obsessed with doing the splinter voice around the house since I started watching this, mostly to my Ninja Turtle, which is my Parrot Louis. So I just go up to him and say, Parrot focused on peanut has troubled mind. And things like that. Yeah, I have a little clip here of him talking to the boys through their first fight.

We have had our first battle, Master Splinter. They were many, but we kicked. We fought well. Were you seen? In this, you must never lapse. Even those who would be our allies would not understand. Our domain is the Shadow. Stray from it reluctantly.

For when you do, you must strike hard and fade away Without a trace I Lost the side then it is gone. I can get it back. I can get it back Let it go I Love that then it isE-T's gone. That's another one. Very Buddhist.

At a certain point I get tired of his, this Confucius style lecturing of everyone. I just want him to give us direct information. It's, yeah, I mean, he's got a lot of Yoda to him, or, well, I mean, he's a ripoff of multiple trainers in movies. Like the Kung Fu, I mean, he's a ripoff of multiple trainers in movies. Like the Kung Fu, I mean, it all came from something, but the classic Kung Fu 60s TV show

had a guy like this in it. Well, like, get the coin out of my hand, Grasshopper. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, calling the guy Grasshopper. Yeah, but this does set up, you know, again, as a kid watching this, I knew every single thing about the Ninja Turtles So these set up lines were needless to me because I was like well. Yeah, they're the turtles I know everything but

Splinter needs to explain to some people who don't know the turtles that like this is why they stay so Secretive and why they have not they don't want anybody to know they exist Yeah, and I gotta say the Splinteret is the best puppet in this whole movie, mostly because a person doesn't have to be inside of it. So they can do a lot more with it, it doesn't really need to walk around. I will also say that the previous year, the Jim Henson Company put together the adaptation of Roald Dahl's The Witches, which I just rewatched, and it has some amazing mouse puppets, some of the most adorable mouse puppets.

So they had mastered the rodent by this point in history. Yeah, wow, you're right. I didn't connect it like, oh yeah, this is another great, they were doing a lot of strong mouse work at the time. And yeah, I mean, the acting on it too is just, Kevin Clash's hand is in the bed doing traditional puppeteering though It's got servo eyes and all of that like it's it's fancier than just you know Elmo

Yeah, but there's radio stuff, but splinter I almost call him Skinner splinter is either sitting or chained up There's one shot of him standing and honestly, it's not that convincing but no I think it took me a million watches as a kid to realize that he was, you know, a traditional Muppet that wasn't a guy in a suit. And also when you're when you're watching the movie with extremely close eyes in 4k, you definitely can see how turtle lips don't always work perfectly. And they're doing their best with the rerecorded dialogue to match lip sync that happened on the set.

This was a new detail I heard that sounded truly insane about how they filmed it, especially for the scenes with the human actor instead of this is just puppets talking to puppets. But to do the turtles, basically the guys in the suits were saying to sync up everybody, the guys in the suits are saying the line in the suits, but then off screen the guys controlling the rotors for the mouths. So they sync up. They're saying the lines too. So two people are saying lines at the same time. So when April says, Oh, do you guys, what do you guys like on your pizza? Two people are saying the line is Michelangelo back to her.

Wow. Wow. That must have been a challenge for the humans in this film. It sounds rather frustrating, so credit to any of the human actors who could, that's why I felt like later in the movie when April and Casey are acting with each other, I was like, wow, this has to be so freeing for these actors to just talk to a human instead of a puppet. It does feel like the most natural scene in the movie.

And you can see Mikey in the background making his Domino's order. It seems out of character that Mikey would want anchovies, because in the cartoon, the joke is they have ridiculous pizza. I always hated those jokes as a kid, like peanut butter and banana pizza dude or whatever. I mean, that actually sounds pretty good.

But it'd be like, I know, jelly bean and bacon or something like that. I think they had like ice cream on their pizza, a raisin brand in the episode we watched. Yeah, something gross like that. And this is all part of this industry-wide degradation or they really wanted to put down the anchovy. And I'm a late in life anchovy adopter.

You gotta go to good restaurants, get the good anchovies. But anchovies are great on pizza. My husband is a big anchovy fan who's gotten me to try them more. Oh good. So yeah. But all these jokes made me think it's bad. I mean the anchovy jokes were second only

to sushi jokes in the 80s. These jokes have been replaced with pineapple on pizza jokes. That's pizza jokes now. And you know what? Let's all calm down pizza jokes. That's pizza jokes now. Yeah, and you know what? Let's all calm down about that. That's also fine. Those pineapple on pizza jokes are as hacky as no anchovies dude jokes were in 1990.

Also this is where you can note that he has a missing ear or a half off ear. That was an invention for the movie, entirely to set up the ending, so Shredder can recognize him at the end. It's strange that he does recognize him at the end. You know, if a rat scarred me for life, and then later a giant rat missing an ear, but then again, he should have recognized that at any time, it was only when the talking rat calls him

by his name at the end of the movie. He sees him a lot. It's like, you know what? This Japanese rat I've been talking to for weeks, he finally, I know where he's from. He's the little rat that scarred my face. What are the odds? So Splinter telling everybody they gotta to hide and also he's setting up

the arc of the emotional journey all the boys are going to go through is learn to live without him. Yeah. I mean he's going to be in every movie so it's like one day I will die. Yeah. Well not for I mean ever really. It's like when you're a kid or it's like he's gonna leave them the you know his store and he's like I'm not gonna be around forever kids you know like ah dad and as the boys are celebrating we get a legit record scratch joke of Splinter meditating and then a record scratch wakes him up. And that's tequila right right? You know, as a kid, I love that joke because I loved Pee-wee, but it is,

it's a big ripoff to do that. They don't say Tequila, they say Bodacious or Zucchini. No, they say Ninjitsu. Ninjitsu, okay, thank you. I guess they could have said Tequila because it's the name of the song, but whatever. They put their own fun spin on it. It's the only way to not make it just a pure ripoff

of one of the most memorable scenes in Pee-wee's Big Adventure of like, when they do it, they say ninjitsu. And Raph is like, I'm gonna go see Critters. Yeah. I hate you. And then meanwhile, Leo's like, sure, get out. Like yeah, Leo's got nothing to do.

He doesn't even get to have the fun dancing. He just goes like the the walk like an Egyptian style He just sees seated Egyptian style dancing. No, it's fun that Mikey and Danny Donnie walk in the background Yeah, like dance through the back. It lets you know This is what they'll be doing for the whole movie if things get too serious They'll be like palling around watching cartoons dancing watching cartoons, dancing, playing trivia pursuit, you name it. When they start dancing together, that's your first indication that these are the same characters and will be doing the same thing in every scene. Uh, and, uh, but yeah, this is where he, uh, oh, and Mikey also says,

socket to me, this is like one of the many times in this movie where they want Mikey to sound like he's a current day teen, but he references things that would make him, you know, at least in his 30s in 1990. Yeah, he doesn't say 23 skidoo, but he comes close. Every 15 year old in 1990 was imitating Cagney. They all love to do it. Boy, yeah, I only knew that through Looney Tunes,

I think, at this time. And so Raph gets dressed up in his trench coat, which taken from the comics, it's entirely a thing that they love Jack Kirby. Like I completely forgot I was rereading the old Mirage books. They did an issue where Donatello teams up with literally Jack Kirby. They draw Jack Kirby in the page and he meets up with Donatello, and they fall into a comic book. It's crazy.

Well, they didn't put on those weird, weird, like, bald white men masks that they had in the cartoon. No, they didn't do that. I always thought, even as a kid, these are disgusting, and who is falling for this? No, I did hate those two. But the trench coat and fedora look,

that's how the thing Ben Grimm would dress up in old Fantastic Four comics when he was trying to be in disguise even though it's very obvious he knew who he is Then yes, we see in a very poochy way Donnie skateboards into the next scene And here's a quote from Donatella's actor explaining how hard this scene with Michelangelo was. The first scene I did with Michelangelo when we're waiting for the pizza in the sewer, that's all we did that day. It was just sitting there and putting together all of that choreography. Head movements, eye contact, taking a breath, one moving the mouth, and then you're timing everything

together. Six people trying to make this very subtle, delicate scene work and look believable. Hmm, yeah, sounds like a nightmare. Yes. In some ways CGI is a blessing as much as we like these costume characters. Yes, Baron on the commentary says like, we did the best we could at the time.

He was saying he wished he could do, he was saying if I could do this over again now and when he says now he means 10 years ago or over 10 years ago, but he's saying he wanted to do it like the where the wild things are movie where it's full body puppety suits running around, but then the faces are CGI for the talking. And yeah, this, this scene of Donnie and Mike, of them talking, this shows that Donatello is a little more in touch with his feelings than Michelangelo,

because he's like, whoa, you know, of not having him about Splinter, Michelangelo does not care, he's only thinking about pizza. Yeah, he's got a one-track mind. Yeah, I forgot that Donnie brings this up and it's immediately shot down. And I actually, I looked into this 30 minutes or it's free thing or 30 minutes or money or the prices reduced thing. It ended in 1993 because a woman's car was struck by a

Domino's driver. She sued the company successfully for 78 million dollars. This caused Domino's to discontinue the campaign because they were getting a lot of complaints about reckless driving from their drivers. And the offer used to be 30 minutes or it's free but over time that was winnowed down into 30 minutes or you get three dollars off. That yeah which is what Michelangelo is saying here that shows you that this had they had a Domino's consultant on the set who's just like three bucks off dude like he's following the letter of the law of the deal. Yeah, and he's not tipping this guy,

so I immediately loathe him. Boo. He's the worst turtle. No, yeah, I read about that too, Bob. I was like, okay, when did this end? Because I feel like as a kid, we didn't order Domino's all that much, because again, we were, as Ebert said, brainwashed to get Pizza Hut,

which was the dominant Ninja Turtles thing. But you'd always hear about like, oh, 30 minutes or it's free. And but I never experienced that. That was now to know the 93 date of the ending. Yeah, we had no nearby Domino's. I can only imagine what it tastes like. Who the Noid even was was a mystery to me. This Domino's thing to read about it of like, you know, it made Domino's famous when they started it in the mid 80s. But you have to know that like the drivers were driving very thing to read about it of like, you know, it made Domino's famous when they started

it in the mid 80s. But you have to know that like the drivers were driving very unsafe. There's probably, I would bet there are hundreds of them. There's only a few lawsuits. There was another lawsuit where the family of a woman killed in a delivery accident got like 2.8 million from them. And honestly, who is deliberating the time here? I imagine there was violence done to drivers who were insistent that it was not 30 minutes and someone pulled out a gun I mean delivery drivers delivery people are in more danger every day than police officers I mean most people are to be honest, but they have a very dangerous job They're always getting robbed and I mean they're always getting robbed and having violence done to them

dangerous job. They're always getting robbed and I mean they're always getting robbed and having violence done to them. And man you think of the Karen videos we have today or all of the videos of like look at this person being an asshole to an employee somewhere. That had to be a five times a night occurrence for some delivery drivers to they show up on time and they're like no I think you're three minutes late like no I'm not like you have an argument. Guns are probably pulled out. Yeah. I mean, consumers are going to abuse that level of power when the arbiter, they're the arbiter, I guess.

They're like, well, I say it's 30 minutes. Here's when I called. I don't know. I don't know how this was judged. You know? Yeah. It was, was the like time on the receipt of like, this is when your order came in and this is when it starts and like

Not only are people driving recklessly, but also as happens in here Unintentionally by Michelangelo, but I also read that like people would turn off their porch lights or try to not Make it hard to be found god. This is like uber eat scams where you pretend you didn't get the food or like Oh, there's something wrong with it But but it's delicious Yes, yeah, this thing is being on forever But yes the dominoes that ended at 93 so this gets out of date fast And then on top of that too like the the vision of the noid we see in this movie

I I looked that up the noid hostage incident happened the year they were filming this. So they put the Noid stuff in here as he's about to be discontinued. God, yeah. Not a great year for Domino's. But yeah, so this is when the Domino's pizza guy appears and this is the first of the four cameos in this film of the suit actors. So this is Michelangelo delivering to himself here of this is Michelin Sisti. Hey Mikey, did you ever think about what Splinter said tonight? I mean about what it would be like, you know, not having them. Hmm. Time's up.

Three bucks off. Here. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, one twenty-two. One twenty-two and an eight. One twenty-two and an eight.

122 and an eight. Terrific. Where the heck is 122 and an eight? You're standing on it, dude. Just slip it down here. Give me that. Hey, this is a ten. The tab's thirteen. You're two minutes late, dude.

Ah, come on. I couldn't find a place. Wise man say, forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza. I gotta get a new root. Ba-dum-tsh. I gotta tell you folks, because of this movie, I'm getting pizza tonight for dinner. Mostly because I have been eating much more healthy

because summer's coming. I'm replacing one meal a day with a giant salad and going light on the carbs, and I'm just seeing pizza all over this movie, hearing talk of pizza, I need pizza tonight. The indoctrination works. I know I was I was telling my husband today to it's like, okay, I've, I've also been wanting to slim down for the summertime or get, you know, especially because I just I went on a trip last weekend and indulged a little bit while on a vacation. But I was like, okay, but this whole week I've been good,

but today I was like, okay, I'm gonna exercise extra, I won't eat anything else today, but we're gonna order pizza. Oh, we're both having our own separate pizza dates. That's true. The Pavlovian training, conditioning, totally worked. It's powerful, it's sickening, really, like the turtles. Like, in a world without the Ninja Turtlestles would pizza be half as prevalent in the United States as it was is

But now as an adult I can have beer with pizza. I didn't know as a kid. It was a great pairing The turtles didn't tell us sell us beer as well Michelangelo would scold me. You're a total loser man only idiots drink beer I forgot it as cartoon all-stars. He's like total passive aggressive, like, oh yeah, you're way cool, dude. Oh, I love that special so much. I wish you were dead. Listen to the, we did a great,

what a cartoon podcast about it. Bob connected it to our current president, Joseph Robinette Biden. It's it's one of the best things he's ever done next to the Patriot Act. So yeah the pizza gets delivered and then I mean a $10 pizza boy oh boy that's that's a pretty good deal. Oh good lord I feel like pizzas just your average pizza is like I don't know, $25 maybe? Yeah, you know, I ordered a Papa John's pizza

not too long ago, and it broke my, it is how I feel like a boomer. I broke my brain of like, no, Papa John's pizza cannot be more than $20, this is wrong. I hate to tell you this, but that's cheap garbage. Hey, look, it is, but there was a deal on it. And that was with the deal, it was over 20. You can't satisfy your pizza craving

tonight with Papa John's, I forbid it. We'll be buying, it'll be a local place. It'll be a local place. But yeah, also good pizza, fake pizza here I'm assuming, on the cheese drip when it's Blatts on Splinter's head or the cheese stretch on the bite oh yeah they're not getting actual cheese anywhere near these million dollar puppets I mean it's a risk with whatever fake stuff they put on their yeah whatever these things are

like rolling around in water I'm just like good lord I hope they're okay I hope these suits are okay it well that's why there's the rotted Donatello puppets that got sold. No actually I watched a making of that I watched a making of that was purported to be the making of for the first movie but it actually was them at Henson Creature Workshop building the puppets for the sequel and in it they're saying like yeah for this we're using latex. We used foam in the first one and that's why they all fell apart like the the second movie suits I think had a lot a little more longevity you also

note the Noid on Donnie's napkin they were still advertising with him that oh I missed a rare Noid appearance in a film and Mikey doing the infomercial thing that's one of the few times he actually feels like a teen of 1989. Like that was a thing on real TV. The the the marketing speak he was using there. Then we cut to Raph. I believe in the script. They just had like the comedy of Raphael goes to a monster

movie and thinks it's silly. But fortunately New Line Cinema released in 1986 the movie Critters so they could reference themselves. You know what I've never seen Critters and looking more into it I want to. It's a horror comedy and it stars both the mom from ET Dee Wallace and also the recently departed M.M. at Walsh. Wow I didn't know this I've never seen it either. Yeah and also child actor Scott Grimes now known for playing Steve on American Dad, he's in it. Oh wow, man, see I should watch it to get over my childhood fear of seeing it on,

the VHS cover always scared me as a little, little kid, and this movie didn't help it. Are you sure you're not thinking of ghoulies? Because that to me, I still don't wanna watch ghoulies, they're gonna bite my butt when I take a poop. Obviously that scared me too, as did the VHS cover for Monkey Shines. That was another one that really scared me as a kid.

But no, Critters was up there as one that scared me. It didn't look as fun. I bet it'd be a fun watch. I wonder where that is streaming. It's basically one of the many Gremlins ripoffs, but I feel like it's one of the best, from what I've heard. I'm sure it wallops Hobgoblins. So yeah, we see Raph walking down the street.

This is another like, oh, they got some good outdoor New York City scenes here. I swear, when they're running outside of what I assume is Central Park, it looks exactly like the same block in Ghostbusters where Rick Moranis gets chased by the the big dog Hmm. I don't know a lot of New York geography. I really want to know if you can visit April O'Neill's apartment at 11th and Bleecker It does sound fake right I've heard of Bleecker Street as a real street though in New York City. I was just there I didn't explore too much, but I got around. But this is where

they after walking down the street, Raph sees a couple of hoods, grab a lady's purse, a classic my purse content here, which also happens in the Muppets take Manhattan too, except it's Piggy who does the karate chops instead of Raphael But Raph trips them and then they keep running off and that's where they run into a bad man Yeah, apparently in the original script They had a scene earlier of Casey Jones like suiting up while watching a news report on the crime But that's cuz like you were guessing, Bob, he was written as a Punisher parody,

who's like, only I can clean up the streets, the dirty streets, I gotta kill everybody. Yeah, in the cartoon, again, he made five appearances because he was a little too edgy, even though he was a parody. He never took off the mask, and he spoke with that deep, stern voice. Yeah, that's probably why I just did that voice there.

I was like, oh yeah, that's not how he talks in the movie. But I think in the movie, they make him more like Big Trouble in Little China's Jack Burton. He feels like a Kurt Russell ripoff. Yeah, like a world-weary dirtbag with a heart of gold, that kind of guy. Yeah, yeah. Though I think they also figured he was,

while Elias Koteas was sold as like a young De Niro, and I get that feeling. Oh wow, yeah, I can really, he's got, he's a handsome, very handsome man. He's got kind of like an older face, or like more mature face that did remind me of De Niro. And he's been a bald actor for years now, so seeing him with his long flowing locks is impressive.

And I guess also that makes sense of like, well, if you got a young De Niro, the Punisher is, well actually, the Punisher predates Taxi Driver, but after Taxi Driver, he became more of a Travis Bickle figure. So the connection is there too. But yeah, he, Casey comes down, beats the shit out of these kids. He's seemingly going to like put them into

comas at the very least. He loves brutalizing children with weapons. That's his real gimmick in this movie. And Raph, this is what happens in the Raphael one shot from Mirage back in the day where he runs into Casey Jones and just tells him, no, you know, beat these kids to death. Like I stopped him, it's done. And Casey is like, no, I gotta teach him a lesson. After he says that, you don't feel like he's the type of guy to beat someone to death.

Maybe that too is why the ending of the movie where he does kill someone or thinks he kills someone. Oh right, he's a dangerous murderer. Yeah it made his whoops moment makes more sense if you actually write him as a killer or would-be killer. But yeah also Raph knocks him over instantly that's what his mask gets knocked off and he does not wear it too much more in the rest of the movie But yes, this is when Raph and Casey Jones start fighting That was a crime you per scrubbing pukes and this is the penalty Two minutes for slashing

Two minutes for hooking and let's not forget my personal favorite two minutes for slashing, two minutes for hooking, and lest I forget my personal favorite, two minutes for high stick. How about a five minute game misconduct for roughing, pal? Hey, bogey, now who died and made you a referee? You did your job, now get out of here and let me do mine. These J.V. Lowlifes need to be taught a lesson. Not like that they don't.

Not from you. these J.B. Lowlifes need to be taught a lesson. Not like that they don't. Not from you. Well, it looks like you're the one who needs to be taught a lesson, pal. Class is paying 101. Your instructor's Casey Jones. Look, I don't want to fight you. Well, tough rocks, pal.

Hup! Hup! Hup! A whole Zaykin' zanko bat? Tell me! You didn't pay money for this. I just realized this city has five Batman running around. Ha ha ha! Oh, wow, you're right. Well, there are ninjas stealing things,

so I guess you need five Batman. It's a day. Hey, New York City's dangerous, man. You gotta have these people beaten. But, you know, when he says these JV squad low lives, it's like, so you admit they're underage. You're beating minors up horribly here, Casey. We had different ideas about corporal punishment in 1990. So when he's like, who's sake can Seiko bet?

I don't know why they're making fun of who's sake can Seiko. I forget if there was a scandal, but there's a very funny miss translation of this or Mishearing of this apparently on the UK blu-ray and I saw a tweet about this and I pulled it up Oh the person who was subtitling this did not get the script I guess and was just doing it by ear But they didn't know what Jose Canseco what that that arrangement of syllables meant So in the UK subtitles, it is Hoseiken Seiko.

So the first word is Hoseiken, second word Seiko, like it's a Japanese name. What the hell? Because if you hear Hoseiken Seiko, you're like, if you don't know baseball, you're just like, well, that has to be a Japanese thing because it sounds Japanese. These are ninjas. These are ninjas.

These are ninjas. Wow, that's so funny. Man, that's the reverse of the cricket joke that's in here of like, that instead it's like, well, you have to know baseball to understand the Jose Kinseko joke. You have to know what a crumpet is to understand cricket. Well, now we know he's an absolute lunatic.

I don't know if he's been on Twitter a lot. I mean, when we covered Homer at the bat, we were talking about his crazy social media presence and everything. Yeah, I haven't kept up with the kooky old Jose Conseco, but I looked up, OK, what was his 1989 like when they would have been filming this? Apparently, he had a rougher season that year,

and maybe people were thinking he was a flame out or something something like he had he missed a bunch of games. Oh yeah. So sorry I'm reading this now. He missed 88 games which shows you just how many goddamn baseball games there are. So I guess then the joke is like this isn't as cool as it used to be this Jose Kinseko bat but it's a joke that only works for like four months or whatever. Yeah, I'll tell you what, that moonlighting joke later doesn't get a lot of play these days. That's true.

I mean, like we've been saying, this was an indie film that they figured nothing was going to add, so they're not thinking about timelessness. This is an extremely 1989 movie. And yeah, they he gets hit with the second bad and is told to for one sale pal. And I gotta say imitatable violence in this movie. They worry about the the you know, the sword slicing somebody or whatever. How many kids pretended to be Casey Jones and bashed each other with baseball bats.

How many kids went into the sewer? I mean, I never had the instinct, but seeing all the going into sewers and this, I thought there had to be some very stupid children, very unsupervised, who went down into the sewer. Hopefully, God willing, came back alive to tell the tale. It had to. I mean, I'd hope kids at least know not to open a manhole cover

and that they're not gonna meet the turtles down there. I think that's why in 1990 we had the Ninja Turtles movie and then the adaptation of It on ABC to let you know there could be turtles in the sewer, there also could be an evil clown who'll rip your arm off. It did push the kids back away, didn't it? So yeah, the fight scene, Raph gets one of the bats, he then takes a swing, whiff, as he's told,

but then he hits him the second time, and then stands over his body. That's again where they like play, bum, bum, bum, bum, very silly music. It does feel like they are aware, well this is violence. Quick, add comedy music. I bet you they might have been close to a PG-13 with this movie. I bet you they were, and they relatively knew PG-13 at the time. So a lot of this fight is from the comic page,

but the cricket thing was invented for the movie because Steve Barron, who's British, was in the UK with one of the writers, took him to a cricket match, and the guy put the joke in there that only British people know what cricket is and it's stupid. This is Casey Jones' limit break where he will just knock a guy upwards into an object,

it be it a pile of boxes or a garbage can. You're right, man, he can do, he does that to Raph and to Tatsu. He does them both, it's incredible. If he hits them that hard, really the cricket bat should have just like snapped Raph's neck in the movie. These are very powerful turtles.

Let's just say they're ducking their heads into their shells and we're not seeing it all the time. But yeah, it's funny how he like falls into the trash can and the way an empty suit flies through the air, I'm assuming. Though also too, they said, Baron says like, the purse thieves get tripped, then they jump over a guardrail.

That's in New York. When they land on the other side of the guardrail, then they're in a North Carolina woods that he's like, he's like, please suspend your disbelief and think this is Central Park. Yeah, it stopped looking like New York. They went through a portal. There's just like a weird portal in that area of New York.

Maybe Baxter Stockman is behind it. Oh, the neutrinos are gonna come right any second now on that portal. Also, you can hear, I would bet it's post-effect crickets going off or cicadas, but Steve Barron says that that was a major problem every time they filmed outside of North Carolina in the summer. All you heard were bugs.

Oh God, yeah. Oh yeah, when the turtles are training in the farmhouse, we'll get to it, and they're just, they're rolling around and fighting in the tall grass, I'm thinking to it, and they're just rolling around and fighting in the tall grass, I'm thinking the people in those suits must be just covered in ticks. Oh God, man, ugh, yuck.

Those poor men probably being paid very poorly too. And yeah, then I read this online, I wanna believe it, but when the stunt man in the raft suit after falling down gets out, he does like clutch his nose for just a second. They say that the guy's nose was broken during that scene as John pace, the, the raft factor described it in one interview. It's basically you have so much noise around your head from all the servos while you're wearing the hat, the, the mask that it's like grand central station all around your head from all the servos while you're wearing the mask, that it's like Grand Central Station all around your head except a computer's on your face and you can

barely see anything. And this is filmed at night. There needs to be a VR game called Ninja Turtle Actor where you have to perform scenes as a Ninja Turtle. Now, some indie developer is going to steal this idea, so I regret saying it, but wouldn't that be fun just to understand what that experience is like? You know, it could work with the Five Nights at Freddy branding and it'd be a great horror film, or horror game.

So yeah, this is Casey then gets chased after and that's when they hop back over the fence and we're back in New York City for a few seconds. And this is when Raph's actor gets a on-screen appearance too. What the heck was that? Looked like sort of a big title in a trench coat. You're going to LaGuardia, right? Come back here! I'm not finished with you! Damn!

So the actor in the taxi was the voice actor for Raph, right? Oh yeah, you can totally hear it. Hey, I'm going to LaGuardia. They should get, where was Ray Romano, young Ray Romano. Ah yeah, I'm Raphael, I lost my sight. He was too busy coming up in the ranks as a comedian to apply for this job, unfortunately. I love the voice Pace does.

That's why he gets to stay the voice. Every other actor They were like, yeah, just not really there But he brings so much energy to wrap with that damn or also how he goes Freak like he's so mad to be called freak and yeah, that is our third damn of the movie Over a beautiful shot of New York City, which also notice how the star of the movie It's like they it's a rule, you have to have the World Trade Center in your first shot. There's no, I mean, I guess they're like,

well, Statue of Liberty, that's so cliche now. World Trade Center, that's a little more obscure. I don't know what they go to now. I mean, you gotta think of the good old Empire State Building, right? You know what, I stayed next to it, or near, like just a few blocks from it when I stayed in New York City, looking out my window, I'm like, oh, I stayed next to it, or near, like just a few blocks from it when I stayed in New York City.

Looking out my window, I'm like, oh, I guess that's it. Every other building is so much bigger than it. It feels unremarkable. I love the Art Deco architecture, of course, but now it's just, oh, a tiny building, neat. Did they light it up any while you were there? Oh, they lit it up at night. I mean, there's a giant Starbucks on the first floor.

So I hit that up a few times, but, uh, yeah, it was fun to see in person, but now the skyline, it just, everything has dwarfed it in the Manhattan skyline for, for like decades, obviously. When, when I see it as a, the skyline, I always see the Chrysler building first and think that's the empire state building. I always get it mixed up. Also, this is something that's been killed in the age of app-based ride-sharing New York cabi jokes.

I feel like you can't, you don't have these jokes no more. Yeah, the cabis that have seen everything. I guess a less sensitive movie would have made this a non-white gentleman. I prefer the classic New York cabi thing, and of course you can't, making fun of like an Italian-American And who lives in New York like who can't like nobody's offended by that And of course when you get in an uber it's always a bummer when there's a white driver because they're gonna talk to you

Oh the worst I never want white drivers never that that's the one time. I'm racist against white people So I say yeah ref Is not able to catch up with Casey. Apparently there was again planned because this is in the comic book adaptation. They plan to have Raph then corner Casey Jones in an alley and then they fight to a standstill. That's why Casey calls him my little green friend later and he's kind of friendly because they kind of miss the part of, I mean it makes sense still why Casey helps them when he shows up because they're being ganged up on, but they didn't become friends at any point during this. No, no, yeah, there was never a reconciliation. He became like one of the group, but they never mended their ways.

He became like one of the group, but they never mended their ways But I also do love how he says like man I hate punkers especially punkers who shave their head and put on green makeup And his his description of why he hates punkers is funny Which tells you he horribly beats many people all of the time to have to have ratings of who they beat and now he's got a murder rap ratings of who they beat. And now he's got a murder rap. So then we go back home with Raph and Splinter meeting up. Now this looks like it was filmed for the storyteller,

for sure, like all up close, super dark. Yeah, and this Splinter stuff is totally, I think George Lucas stole this for episode one or two where it's like, fear leads to suffering, suffering leads to this, like it's just the, X goes to Y, Y goes to Z. Yeah, you're right. This is what, you know what? Siskel was saying, oh, where's the philosophy?

Where's the philosophy? This is it right here. He's given him philosophy. Yeah, yeah, it's very basic Buddhist stuff, you know? Get over the emotions, be okay with not having your things, but it's there He's telling him I'm tried. I tried to shape your rage, but I couldn't or whatever and apparently to he was Baron was warned like the the his puppet team said you really can't get the camera this close people are just gonna

See the wires and the seams but they they I think they hit it pretty well even in 4k They they hide it pretty well Yeah, it's it's a really good puppet and I think I might have said this on the recording But I was watching this in my very bright living room during the day And this is a hard movie to watch under those conditions not that it's a technical error or anything It's just the movie was filmed, you know, a lot of things are in darkness to cover up the the puppetry and everything. And Steve Barron also on that commentary, he lets the people on the internet know he's like, look, yes, I've seen you guys on the internet point out where you can see the eye holes or other

things. I could see it then too. I knew you'd be able to see it on the screen if you're looking for it. I wanted to do digital replacement, but there was no money. There was no money for the digital effects on it. But yeah, so after that, we cut to April. She's being, I was gonna say chewed out by her boss, but he's a real drip.

He's just like, April, come on. Yeah, it's kind of a nag. I do recall, you know, I was seeing this chewed out by her boss, but he's a real drip. He's just like, April, come on. Yeah, it's kind of a nag. I do recall, I was seeing this in the theater, I didn't get to go a lot, so it was a fun time, but I recall during this part of the movie just feeling a little listless and thinking, what are all these adults talking? Because we get a scene of April with her boss

and April with the police chief and then Shredder, well it's fun to see Shredder. And I think they jump back to the turtles just to keep the police chief, and then Shredder will, it's fun to see Shredder, and I think they jump back to the turtles just to keep the kids interested, where the kids are watching April on TV, or sorry, the turtles are watching April on TV, just to remind the kids, oh, they're still here, they're still here.

You're not too far, I mean, that's why, like, April doesn't appear in the movie for like 20 minutes, to let kids see all these turtles. Charles just showing up to be like, you know, not only is he whining to April, but then he's also whining to April of like, Oh, and, and I have to drop off my kid at school because otherwise he skipped school. It's how it is. Sucks.

Yeah. He's a real problem child. He's got this mystery Walkman. We see him stealing from April's wallet as she talks with Charles. What a bad boy, man. I do kind of like that Charles is complaining about like, oh, the crime today, which is like, that's literally all media hysteria is all of the time.

Crime is always on the rise if you listen to the media, all that, but I do kind of like that Charles is saying, oh God, it's so dangerous out there when the stealing is happening in this house right behind him. Yeah. Yeah right under his nose and When she mentions a little Tokyo that is a real place. I don't think I've been there though I do think I've had ramen near there, but it's it's described as for people who know New York City It's located in the Lower East Side between 2nd and 3rd Avenue and 8th and 10th Street. Well, the real historical bummer in terms of neighborhoods

is that little Tokyos are never quite as big as Chinatown for the reasons you would suspect. Yeah, well I mean there's many more Chinese people than Japanese people for one thing. And also the government took all of that property during internment. Oh, also that, of course, too. That's what I was implying. Oh, sure, sure.

Well, and also, you know, after, when Mao took over, a lot more Chinese immigrants came to the US, too, as well. Well, I just, I learned about the history of Vancouver's Japantown. Oh, yeah, also the, I think it was after Nina shared Pixar that I read up about like Oakland's lost Japan town which suffered from that internment camp area shame.

And then San Francisco built the We're Sorry block. That's right. Which, hey, it's better than nothing. I'm not making fun of that, but that's essentially what it is. With the peace pagoda and everything, like, oh, we stole from you, we put you in camps. Here's a fun little mall.

You guys love these pagodas, right? We'll build a big one for you. It is a nice mall, though. It is a nice mall. At Nihonmachi, which I of course learned means Japan town, thanks to Duolingo. But I like that April, she's doing the research, all these other racist people are there.

I mean, Charles is probably saying, look, we know who these gangs are, right? Right, April? And April's like, no, I've spoken to Japanese Americans and they think it's the Foot Clan. This element of the plot needs to be investigated more. Who are these whistleblowers on the Foot Clan, these Japanese immigrants?

Yeah, that is, who does know the Foot Clan? There are some deeper questions here, that's true. And then we cut to a police precinct in not a bad parody of bullshit cop speech, which is now like Felix on Unchopped makes fun of it all the time, like we assessed a tactical situation. Yes, the criminal was struck by a fired bullet. Yes, yeah.

Things like that. I mean, this is the Stearns guy, not from the comic or anything, right? I don't think so. He might as well be a cartoon bulldog. The actor Raymond Serra has not been in many other things. Usually he's just like, he's in a law and order here and there. He feels like a guy who failed the audition for Police Academy. He couldn't get mad enough on cue.

Gutenberg just didn't like him, but yeah, I mean his screaming, he's perfectly fine for the totally cliched screaming police chief. Though he's yelling at April like, but you're not April's boss, but now we know cops love telling the media how to do their job and being friendly with them. He should be yelling at some kind of loose cannon style hunk

on his force. You're right, instead of wasting it on April. But yes, we said it before, April is just doing this as all regular media does of saying like, why won't the cops do something? That's her problem. And we also cut to our first vision of Shredder, who has a really baller setup of a ton of

TVs. He basically has the, this show ain't no good, kind of setup where he's got a ton of TVs, they're all cracked, and when he sees something he doesn't like, he just throws a dagger at it. Man, you're right, he's like Elvis. Shredder is just like Elvis here. Elvis wishes he could do as good karate as Shredder does. There are no ninja stars in this film.

These guys are throwing daggers a lot, but maybe there was a concern about ninja stars because I recall kids bringing them to school and the ninja stars were taken away from them by teachers. And then a decade later, UCB would tell us all about the danger. Oh, one of my favorite recurring bits. Kids listen to Throwing Star albums.

They love their favorite Throwing Star celebrity. Throwing Star pornography. Ha ha ha ha. God damn those. Okay, so I also kind of like that they show Shredder with all of his big TVs, and then meanwhile, he showed the turtles with their little black and white TV that they got out of the dump.

So you see, the turtles aren't doing so hot by comparison. We also see the turtles are completely getting extra thirsty for April. Mm-hmm, yeah, that is a, I guess even in Mutant Mayhem, some of the boys have a crush on April in that too, but yeah, the interspecies relationship stuff thing has always been strange with the turtles in April.

Yeah, there's that famous clip of Oprah interviewing them and the characters improv-ing as to whether or not they would date April. Yes, oh God, man, also, now you're reminding me of in the horrible Michael Bay turtles movie, I believe it's Michelangelo who says, "'My shell is getting tight' when he sees Megan Fox's April. Because of his internal genitalia, probably.

Yes, I assume his turtle erection is making his shell tighter on him. One thing I noticed that's true of this April, but not the second one, is that Judith Hoag, actual redhead, she is just covered in freckles if you see her in certain shots. Oh, you're right. I didn't catch it.

I could only find one of those IMDB trivia with no follow-up things of like, why isn't she in the second one? And it's like, it's either pay, or some people say that it's like, she didn't like the violence or she didn't like the shooting schedule, but yeah, it's hard to pin down.

Yeah, I've heard pay because when the movie makes that much, she expected to get a lot more the second time and she was not offered that. I mean, so few people return in the sequel because Golden Harvest and New Line Cinema, despite having a giant hit, they didn't get rich by paying big checks to people. I feel like they've even, Robert England talked about

getting low-balled by New Line when he's the movie. But yeah, so April, while she's on TV, I do, I want a GIF of Raph putting on his hat, on his fedora. That should be another like, Malady shot. Oh yeah, yeah. Again, it only looks good on them, I think.

Don't try this at home. You need to have a giant turtle head. You can also really appreciate in 4K, each turtle's head is different. They didn't just make four of the same heads. I did notice watching it on a bigger TV this time than I did a few years ago, all their eyes are different too.

Yeah, and some have wider jowls than others. Mikey has a more like circular head while Donatello's is more like an oval, at least a mouth area. And yeah, then April is called into the office and she misses Danny being arrested. She isn't able to see it. It's part of this blackmail plot

that is barely in the movie. It did not register with me as a child at all. No way. I only on this very close viewing, I was like, oh, Danny gets arrested and then his dad gets blackmailed. It's totally, I totally missed it. But then, but we'll get to it. But then April does not stop

and we don't see what happens to Charles. Well, Charles fires her. So I assume that's made things good with the police chief that he fired April, I guess. Honestly, this deserves an entire citations needed podcast about how the media is being interfered with by the local police in New York City. Absolutely. I'm sure this happens every day

in the Eric Adams administration based on everything we hear about them. Yes, yes. But yeah, April says time her, but if you actually time her, the scene with the police chief is only 27 seconds. The camera guy says 107, so let's just say her walking into the door

is when the guy counted the time. He had to have an elaborate series of heart attacks first, and then he could start screaming. Yeah, the screaming at her is It's it's every cop cliche and it just it keeps you away from the turtles But fortunately once that's over we then cut to outside her walking out of the police station and I love I actually love the shot of the the up that says, it's worse, is the headline.

Good New York Post headline. And they really should show it again, but it's implied Raph is following her to get the Psy back. Yeah, yeah, I guess they do show him like fidgeting with his Psy right before he puts on the hat, but yeah. Because when she takes it out to try to fight off the Foot Clan,

I remembered, oh right, she has that, and then I understood why Raph is following her, but maybe they should have shown it one more time. Maybe when she's doing her makeup, when Charles is visiting her, like she looks in her purse and sees the, these are the things Steve Barron wanted the money for reshoots for.

And so I guess it makes sense too. So Raph saw this on live TV. Then he goes to the police station to see April leave. And that's how he stalks her. Like it, it makes sense. He doesn't just like magically find her. And this is a real subway station in New York city. They were able to get one and a real subway train car gets to go through.

So they're able to stand on the damn tracks. It seems dangerous, honestly. It was apparently filmed very late at night. And this is when, is this the most racist joke in the movie that am I behind on my Sony payments again? Like on a racism scale, it's about a two out of 10, I guess, where you're just associating ninjas with other Japanese things.

Also, what are Sony payments? That's not a real thing. Yeah, there's better one-liners in this movie. There's another joke we'll get to later where I'm like, I understand the joke you're trying to make. This wasn't it though. I guess, you know, she could say she's leasing a stereo system that is a Sony one,

but no one would call those Sony payments. Though also the accent on the Foot Clan guy, that also is a rather broad accent. Yeah, it makes me glad Splinter just doesn't pronounce the R's like a British person and speaks haltingly. It could have been like this, it could have been much worse. And this is Leaf Tilden, Donatello's body actor, as the foot messenger who slaps April. That's his cameo in the movie. It's like, we're here to send a message. Shut up, slap.

Were they just going to leave after that, or were they going to kill her? I would guess they were going to beat her up more horribly. Yeah, I have a feeling. I wonder if bullies learned a trick from that, of like, I have a present for I wonder if bullies learned a trick from that of like I have a present for you open hand slap Mm-hmm. Hey, fortunately that never happened to me as a kid not not to me either. Although we just taught a generation of listeners Make sure your children if you watch this movie with your children tell them don't do that

Mm-hmm. I also like that April pulls out the sigh and she even when it's knocked away She's like, all right guys, and she, and even when it's knocked away, she's like, all right guys, and she grabs her bag to try to fight back. She does not run away screaming. She's ready to at least try to fight. It seems like that purse must be full of bricks or something because it's pretty hefty.

The man, she just gets lamb in the face and then down. Poor April, she has a concussion the rest of this movie. Yeah, so Raphael appears, but pointedly does not use his weapons. I love keeping track of what they actually do with their weapons in this film, because Raphael, he holds the scythe inward, and the handle's pointing out,

and just like fights with his forearms. Yes. For the most part, yeah. Little kid me, when he gets his side back, I was like, oh boy, he's got it. And then when he jumps out, he has them pointed out, and then he instantly turns them around inward. And I was like, what the heck?

But these Foot Clan aren't robots, so you can't stab them. Can't stab them in the head. So a question about the plot of this film, certain elements of it are escaping me. It seems like later in the movie they imply that the ninja following them and finding the headquarters is Danny, but Danny was just arrested.

Later dialogue implies that Danny is the one who found the hideout because when he goes missing, they're like, what happened to the boy who found the hideout? And they're like, he's the boy who found the hideout and they're like he's gone Right. Okay. Yeah My guess is the ninja that follows wrath down the train tracks is just Unnamed ninja then Danny tips them off to their that the turtles are at April's But okay at some point Danny learns where the hideout where the sewer hideout is because he is staying there for a few days

In the movie. Yeah while they're at the farm But how he learns about where the sewer hideout is that is a mystery and not explained in the movie Also, something you don't notice until you're watching extremely closely In all scenes like this all of the turtles have a persneer on their face because to do the stunts you're not going to have the millions of dollars of servos in the bodysuit. No, and hey they're permanently sneering in the video game so the kids won't mind. And the toys! All the toys have the same perma-sneer on them. This is where they also play around a little with the frame aperture or

whatever to like, it was a trick they learned on Little Shop of Horrors that they're bringing into this with like, not all the puppet mouths move correctly. And when Raph wants to run at the guys, hard to run as fast as you want to. So film it at 20 frames and speed it up by four frames. He then runs off. He almost looks like Quasimodo or Frankenstein holding the girl. Yeah, it seems like a lot of

work for that stunt person to be in the costume and to be holding a human being. Oh man, and I think it could be a stunt actress in, you know, the silhouette shots, but Judith Hoag has to be held by a guy who can barely see while running through like tunnels. I have to assume it by a guy who can barely see while running through like, uh, tunnels. I have to assume it's a body double. Yeah, for some of them, but you can see your face in other shots. That's true, that's true. You know, I was just thinking, uh, we're in the midst of X-Men 97.

They really should at this point make, uh, TMNT 96. They should. Uh, they could bring back most of the cast, uh, make it look better than it did after the first five episodes. I feel like X-Men 97 proved there's an audience for this. Make a show that is the memory of your old show, basically. And someday, if we were to do another turtles cartoon movie,

my pick would be Batman versus the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles because it is actually good and has really good animation. I was not aware of this. It's a lot of fun. So, so yes, we cut back to the boys in their lair and this is where Raph, again, I love these lines Raph says here when he's asked about why he brought April there. Are you crazy? Yeah, Leo, I'm crazy. Okay? Aluni, okay? Why? why he brought April there. What are you doing? She got jumped in the subway. I had to bring it here. It's the news lady

Can we keep her Bring water cold washcloth below Far out modern modern slang I guess cowabunga was kind of dated I guess it was being used we covered the history of cowabunga on Talking Simpsons It was a how, we covered the history of Kyle Bunga on Talking Simpsons, it was a Howdy Doody show reference that surfers picked up that grew up with it. So I think it was like purposely retro, like Ash saying groovy in Evil Dead.

I mean, Michelangelo made it current again for us. And then, hey, they made Bart say it, it was so big. Twice. Yeah, it's so funny, Bart just says it, we've said this before on the podcast, but like that on some commentaries, Al Jean will be like, they put it on the t-shirts, but we never had him say it. And then Bart says it in an episode. He's like, Oh, we did say it.

He says it in a telltale head when it just, I think it's just Nancy doing Bart improv as he's skateboarding down the street. And at one point she goes, Cowabunga. And then in, uh, I think it's, Bart gets an F when he's getting ready to head out anding down the street. And at one point she goes, cowabunga. And then in, I think it's Parkinson F, when he's getting ready to head out and play in the snow, he does go, cowabunga. Yeah, he's like running with a toboggan over his head, right?

Or the sled, yeah. So April then wakes up and freaks out. Oh yeah, I had a good chuckle at this because she rightfully assumes I'm dead and I have gone to hell and these are the demons that will be brutalizing me for eternity. And then also I swear they give her like almost the there's more gravy than a grave of you speech of like well I saw that red in the alley and so that's what you are and you guys. Yeah there's not like a quote there's

not a reference for everything she has seen in the past to explain what's going on now. She should have, in the alley, she should have been spooked by a rat, then spooked by four separate turtles. This whole scene though of her sitting on a couch and having it explained to her, this is in issue two of the Mirage comics, like almost exactly.

And I swear to God, Splinter is like that Aqua Teen Hunger Force character, like Christmas ghosts from the future or past or whatever it's called. Right, the futuristic ghost of Christmas past. Yeah, because every time we talk to this guy, he's always like thousands of years ago. He only exists to give backstory, it happens three times.

And here's the thing, I forgot that he gave backstory to Danny, He's like, time for the backstory, Danny. This is kind of my bit. I thought it only happened once. So when he talks about imitating the moves of his master, I thought I had a different cut of the movie that didn't have like the little rat doing the moves. But that happens later when he's explaining, when he's reminding people of the backstory. And for whatever reason, he's like, I didn't tell this to April. Here's the part about infidelity. You know, and for whatever reason, he's like, I didn't tell this to April. Here's the part about infidelity. You know, and she didn't need to know that part, but you, Danny, you do.

I'm going to tell you. So this is where he starts the story, and another of the favorite lines we've oft repeated. Fifteen years ago. Why don't I ever dream of Harrison Ford? For 15 years now, we have lived here. Before that time, I was a pet of my master Yoshi. Mimicking his movements from my cage, and learning the secret art of ninja. When we were forced to come to New York,

I found myself for the first time without a home, wandering the sewers, scavenging for whatever I could find. And then one day I came upon a shattered glass jar and four baby turtles. That was us! Shut up! Oh no! The little ones were crawling into a strange glowing ooze from a broken canister nearby.

He really should have been like, now this is just the Cliff Notes, because in the beginning it sounds like his master just dumped him in the sewer, but there are reasons why he ended up like that. I don't know why the backstory is split up into two chunks, but I guess they want to save the mystery of who Shredder is for the end of the film.

Yeah, I guess, let's say he's thinking like, look, you don't need to know about how he got killed and his wife died too. Like, you know, that'd be a bummer. You've had a hard night. I also like the shots of the turtles just all in blackness. Yeah.

I love the choices here. When they go to flashback, the backgrounds drop out and the people in the present day are just set on top of like a pure black background. It seems like the same place where they did the photo shoot that's on the cover of the VHS too of just all four of the turtles against a black backdrop. Yeah, I was scrolling through the IMDB photos and there's a ton of photos in

that same style. So maybe they just repurposed it or they're like, oh, this looks cool. We should do more shots like this. I would think their PR team, you know, said we need to send out the official photos to, you know, newspapers and stuff. So let's them against a black background is what's going to look best in, you know, HD level photography to send out and is this the the super 8 footage because this is the super 8 Yeah, what was there a reason behind that? It is I mean I let it's charming but it's so grainy

It was a big stylistic choice by Baron because he wanted the flashbacks to feel old so he's like, oh then then let's, for real, film this on Super 8, and then it'll look old and grainy. Though, of course, he now, when he was watching it for the Blu-ray, he's like, boy, this really looks grainy on this TV now. Hey, canonically, they're all born in 1975. That's, wow, you're right, that was 15 years.

Now they're all 49 Holy shit, man the super anything to he mentioned it was a real gamble that the producers were rightly worried about because They it's already hard enough in the pre-digital age to film the stuff and know how it's gonna look when you get the dailies back But it's not the same With a super eight that it then has has to be chemically treated in a different way and it comes back later. So if they fucked up the filming of these puppets in Super 8, they're only going to find out a couple weeks later to have to re-film it again.

And they're, fittingly, their first... How we see them for the first time, their first words are declarations for how much they love pizza and also their catchphrases. Instant catchphrase machines. My mom loved their first words were pizza. She thought it was so cute how they say pizza. She loved it. These are some very cute puppets.

Yeah, this is like, this is the Muppet folks doing their cutest cute puppets, even for a growing rat, it's pretty good. And seeing the rat, seemingly with real, I think those are real turtles that he's scooping with the spoon. That is so crazy. Like herding them into a coffee can.

I am hopeful that his non-toxic ooze, they were filming those real turtles walking around. They just got some of the TMNT pudding. Oh god, that is, that's toxic though. That's worse than toxic waste. Though you know what, unlike in other versions of this, they don't have Splinter say, I love Renaissance painters, and there's no other joke. He's just like, and so I named them.

Like no reasoning why he named them after Renaissance Painter. There should be a follow-up question and then he just says, and so I named them. Like no reasoning why he named them after Renaissance Painter. There should be a follow-up question and then he just says, and so I named them. Out of all names, why? I also love, my favorite of the reaction shots is when Michelangelo points to himself like and says, it's me, it's me. That's a cool guy. The ref picking his teeth with his side is also pretty cool. I like that too. So April finally figures out that this is not a dream and this is when she's gonna get escorted home. This joke still doesn't fully make sense to me here. Yeah, this is like weird joke misfire number two

in the film where I can kind of understand what they're going for. So they're going to 11th and Bleaker and I believe, is it Donatello who makes the joke? He sniffs the air and he goes, I think this is only 9th Street, get it? Is the joke that 11th Street is two streets away and number two means poop and he just smelled poop because he's in the sewer? Oh man. It requires way too much explanation.

I think it is a number two joke, but it's so complicated. What did you get out of this joke? Yeah, so that's a better interpretation than me, especially when he says get it, like that does maybe make more sense. So my reading on it was that it like that does maybe make more sense. I, so my reading on it was that it is that they spend so much time in the sewer that the distinct smell

of sewage from Night Street smells different to them than 11th Street. But no, I mean, nine plus two would be 11. That could make sense. And the way April says ew, it does imply it's something about poop. Yeah, yeah, I think he's trying to make a pun involving number two, but it's so complicated.

Stick to, it's not a teller, right? You know, it's him or Mikey, they're so interchangeable. Stick to machines, buddy. I always wondered if it was like, well, if I lived in New York, I know that like 9th Street smells worse than 11th Street and this is for locals or something, but I don't think that's it. Oh, by the way, looking it up, there is a bleaker street in New York, but there is no 11th and bleaker because that grid does not intersect with bleaker.

Oh, okay. Right. Cause it's like avenues go one way, streets goes another, and they're all different numbers, but then Bleecker's outside of that grid, is that it? It looks like it based on me looking at Manhattan. Okay, well that's, I guess, what's her face, April, she does seem to live outside of Manhattan,

though must be in a rent-controlled place, right? Or does she even pay rent? It's on the island of Manhattan, though must be in a rent control place, right, or does she even pay rent? It's on the island of Manhattan, Leaker Street. Okay, okay, okay. But April's house, since it's above her dad's antique shop, I mean, maybe she has a lot of debt to take care of it, but then she's like, later she says, "'I barely keep it open, you know,

"'it's just for old memories of my dad.'" I'm like, all right, then you have rent control. Maybe in 1990, there were still like hovels you could rent that were just falling apart and very cheap. I think now everybody's been priced out just like every big city and you can't even get like a rat hole in a big city. You'd have to literally live in a sewer like the turtles. You know, the Night Street thing, I also think of it as like, I did have that kind of specific this street smells smelly type deal in, well, I watched the movie Milk, not the documentary, but the biopic that starred Sean Penn.

And they do have a joke in it that I feel like plays so it's meant to be laughed at in San Francisco if you watch it where they say like well What are we gonna fix and then they say like give? Get rid of the piss smell on in the tenderloin which if you don't live in San Francisco that joke makes no sense. Yeah. Yeah, that's it's for the locals also accurate There is a pee smell but no public bathroom. So people got a pee That's how you fix the the urine smell You make it less of a pee pee soaked towel hole if you get people a place to pee, but we don't want that

This is also where Baron on the commentary shatters the illusion of like one they built these manholes into the ground This is a fake street but also they had to do it like a double-size manhole because they're like, if you build a manhole how they're supposed to be due to city regulations, the turtles could not fit in them. They had to like double them in size. Yeah, I guess they're only going in and out of manholes on this specific street, right?

The video game made me think turtles and the opening of the show can just explode out of manholes easily, but the turtles are huge. They cannot fit in one. I mean, Mikey explodes out of this manhole thanks to an under-cranked camera. It's just like Little Shop of Horror.

Yeah. Actually, I have that little clip here too, because it's another like cartoony sound effect they put on it that's very distracting. I'd like to invite you all in, but I really don't have anything to offer you guys except for a frozen pizza Let's go for it

It's like let's go for yeah Hey, that's that's how I'm feeling right now. I'm thinking about all these mentions of pizza. It's been so long It's killing me two more hours till we probably pizza. You know what I was just in Milwaukee and I cannot find good pizza there I'm sorry Milwaukee folks you do everything good, but pizza So I'm happy to be back surprisingly Vancouver has every kind of pizza and it's all great Would it be an insult to the turtles if I got a Detroit style pizza today instead of a New York style? You know what? I think if they if they were alive today They would appreciate the entire rainbow of pizza. That's true.

Yeah, I mean, yeah. I guess I'm really against tavern style. I think it's not good unless you load it with meat and hey, if you like your pizza that way, go for it. But without that, it is kind of bland. Those Chicagoans, they hate hearing about you. Like real Chicagoans say, we don't eat the thing you people think

is Chicago style pizza. we eat bar pizza. The little cut up thing. I don't wanna hear any comments about how it's a casserole. I respect that you're listening to this and paying us a lot of money, but I will say no. It's still pizza and it's so good. We're shutting down your pizza pinions on this one. It's the one time we'll be extremely rude to people that give us $10 a month. Also note bad continuity here because

April gets out first. Donatello exits right behind her. Then Michelangelo pops up for that joke. And then who's in between the legs of Michelangelo Donatello who has somehow teleported back into the manhole. It's Donatello he built a teleportation gun. Okay it's right there with the zeppelin he built the teleporting gun. They also I do kind of like how she's asking you know what do you have on your pizza and they say dead flies and then Mikey says it's a joke it's a joke and then April laughs but it's her laughing in the kitchen at more of his jokes it's cool it's funny to cut from like that to her laughing and it's good acting Mikey's a real goddamn cut up he is ready for a night at evening at the

improv or something with these classic classic impressions of Sylvester Stallone and James Cagney. This would be fresh at the comedy store in 1979, I think. Or, no way, Rocky was 76, so I'm gonna say 1976. Maybe I'll follow, maybe I won't. It's hard to do the Rocky impression with your face when you have a puppet head and you can't do the, you know, one side of your mouth

sagging kind of Rocky impression. Also, if you want to look at weird mouths, Donatello is supposed to be sipping on a straw in the scene, but his teeth are all, it's all wrong. The puppet, don't look at the Donnie puppet if you don't want to be distracted in that scene. And yeah, the Cagney reference, again, it's like, what an old man.

Yeah, I don't know if they're seriously offended when April is like, oh, Splinter must love that impression because Cagney says you dirty rat, and they all kind of shut down a little bit. You're right, they are acting like that she did a racist thing of like, hey, you can't say that word. We can say that word, he's our dad.

We're allowed to call him a dirty rat. Then in classic Leonardo mode, he's the party pooper. He's like, well, speaking of him, we better go home. It's like, man, Leo, you're no fun. That's all you get to do is stop the party. They leave just to come back, though. Yeah, they're basically bad boyfriendsfriends the rest of this movie for April And then in the second movie, they're still a crashed in her apartment. Yeah, it's a little too much a little too rap

Yeah, only one toilet Well, so like I would guess the turtles well the turtles must have to like sneak it to the sewer to do it Cuz no way can they shit into a toilet correctly with their bodies, right? They're kind of humanoid, but they're just constantly surrounded by human waste. I think they just need to be scrubbed down any time they enter a building.

God, those bandanas have to be filthy. Yeah. Filthy. They're just walking through ankle deep piss and shit all day. This is the reality of a sewer. A sewer is built to carry waste away. Yeah, it smells horrible. I mean, that was considered a comical element of them when East Midland Land were creating

them, right? It's like, isn't it funny they live in the sewer? It's gross. Well, because it's all taken from like the baby alligator flushed down the toilet saying like, oh, the turtle or the rats. It's just about stories people have always told about what's in the sewers in New York City. Though comic books always, it's why I referenced it earlier, but Freakazoid had the great joke about why do superheroes always fight in the sewer?

It must smell horrible. It's gross, he doesn't wanna go in. He resisted as best he can So they all head home, and this is where we get quite a scream I'm sorry. Splinter. They said it was very easy for John Pace to get to that level of anger because he was going insane of claustrophobia in that Raph costume. The camera is spinning around him. Again, it feels like it draws from Steve Barron's music video background, a shot like that.

Yeah, it feels like a total music video shot. But the great, on the commentary he's bragging about, almost, he doesn't say the Matrix, but he's like, everybody does these shots now. But it was really hard back then, and we had to speed up the frame rate and all this stuff. But it's a great scream. But you're right, focusing in on Raph,

like this is the Raph movie, by focusing in on Raphael during the screaming, it makes him like, this is the turtle whose anger matters the most here. He has the arc, really, out of all of them. Though Danny has the deeper stark of all the characters all of them. Though Danny has the deepest arc of all the characters in this movie. Oh yeah, but who cares?

So then they head from that to, we get a quick scene of the police commissioner, and he's, you know, it's a- Oh wait, sorry, I hate to interrupt you. One thing, because they're like, oh, this is sad, this is too sad. So an old man is walking over the sewer grate doing a double take as a turtle screams

about his kidnapped father. That's true, yeah. Oh, and then April sees them in the doorway and they're looking so sad too. Splinter. Though as a kid, it did make me sad too, just because I was like, the turtle's lair is always untouched in the cartoon.

And now here, 40, 35 minutes into the movie, they lose their layer. It's a bummer. Yeah, I love seeing their little headquarters. But yeah, this is where we then cut to the cop who offers a sweet deal and expunges the records. Again, this is what the cops do to get good coverage, so not unbelievable. Then we cut back to April's apartment. The turtles are sleeping in her place.

This is when we get some comedy of like hiding from the, oh, we gotta hide from the boss comedy. I have a hiding the horse from the landlord style comedy. That's perfect. But you know what? It works too because they are ninjas and ninjas are good at hiding. I like that too.

But they're not good enough to hide from Danny. He spots Michelangelo for just a second. He's gonna remember that and use it against them later to earn points with Shredder. I also like how Danny says like, when she says, hey Danny, will you tell your father to relax? He goes like, I wish.

Though I wish our friend Mike Morono was playing him in this movie. He'd do a better job. It could have been him, a younger Danny? And he was playing him, well he was a New York based actor and I guess this is really a North Carolina production, not a New York production. Well this is where April is being told to like,

lighten up on this story, get help with it is where April is being told to like, lighten up on this story. Get help with it is what he's being told. I also like when Charles and his son, Danny leave, when Mikey reappears, I think Judith Hogue does a good reaction of like, ah, like an exclamation of seeing him. It's a good, a good shock. I might've missed this because I was taking notes. Is this the one where they're sticking to the ceiling? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, okay Okay. Yeah, a very silly. I feel like all anytime there's a serious plot element with humans There's always turtles dancing in the background to you know, keep things lively. It kept my attention as a kid Mm-hmm. So then after all of this at 30 minutes, we then get our first actual like

soundtrack music drop. I looked it up, this soundtrack sold a million, it is certified platinum, the soundtrack to this movie. And not one radio hit on the damn thing. Well, and this is MC Hammer in 1990, this song here. This is what we do. Oh yeah, and you know what, I think, it feels like it's put in there to be like, oh they're listening

to the rap, you know what's happening with these children. You know, all the rap is playing at the shredders compound, that's true. But yeah, the album has, this is, well my favorite song is the end credit song, Turtle Power, but I think there's three okay songs on this and then a bunch of crap you forget that's even in the movie. I don't know if This Is What We Do was written for Hammer,

but he was all over these silly movies for kids. He did the Addams Family rap as well, like I think the next year, maybe, 91? You're right, they're getting MC Hammer as he's going up. Like he hasn't, I mean, the next movie, they go even harder on the hip hop guest stars. Oh yes, yes. After his rise to power has ended.

Oh yeah, so Henry, you're a fan of Partners in Crime, Crime with a K. Yes, I love, well, because I loved it, no irony as a child, but as an adult I Love that it is a silly rap that tells you the plot of the movie. I love that so much Yeah, I mean I I love Ghostbusters one Ghostbusters two is now a good movie based on everything that's followed But I prefer the ending song of Ghostbusters two where Bobby Brown just talks us through the plot in case we forgot the movie we just saw. They need to bring that back.

I guess too because I'm thinking this the Will Smith at the time of this recording just went to Coachella and sang the Men in Black rap and I was just like man, I miss I miss the rap that tells you the plot of the movie. Mm-hmm. But that tells you the plot of the movie. But Baron said the reason he made this shift of Shredder having like child soldiers instead of just regular ninjas, he pulled from two things, very obvious. When the first thing you see is a shot of a child

playing pool while smoking a cigar, it's Pleasure Island from Pinocchio. Oh yeah, I immediately wrote that down. The first time we go to the Foot headquarters. He's playing pool and smoking. And then also Baron being a British man, he's like, oh yeah, this is also Fagin from Oliver Twist is what he was going for. So a Dickens reference in this Turtles movie.

But the Foot clan shredder, he hired the right contractors because he made a really cool kids hangout. This looks like a set of Nick Arcade or something. It looks super fun. Yeah, real Nickelodeon game show vibes to all of this. And you know, a lot of those arcade machines are lit like you're not supposed to know what they are, they didn't get full permission,

but one of them is lit like a commercial. Oh, which one is that? NARC, the Williams machine. Oh, NARC, yeah, you see footage of NARC. I think it just might be the CRTs and how it's difficult to film them, but you didn't actually get to see what they are. Oh, and we also, I'm counting all of these.

Dammit number four is when Danny flees Charles' car when Charles is driving away from April's. He goes, dammit, when Danny leaves. That's right. So four, we have two more damnits, stay tuned. When I saw the NARC in there, back when Williams was making it before Williams and Midway combined,

I originally wrote down Midway game, and then I was like, no, no, no, it's a Williams game at this point. But anyway, when I saw NARC, I was like, man, Konami already had the Turtles deal here, but clearly they fucked up and didn't get, it would be ridiculous if the Turtles arcade machine appeared in this movie, but get a Konami game in there.

Yeah, that would be crazy if, like, oh yeah, I recognize these guys from the game in our headquarters. That's weird. That would be too silly, but the use of that narc, again, it reminds me of product placement movies these days. I just saw, in that new Godzilla versus Kong movie, they have a shot of a Volkswagen car that is framed exactly like a car commercial

to the point that I was like, how is there not the little white text on the bottom of safety lines on it? What is the interest rate on a loan for this? I know, it should say, this was filmed on a closed test track this movie got till versus Kong And this is where we get a little of future Oscar winner Sam Rockwell Anything you guys want we got anything you want to do Do it I'm saying?

Anything. You got any cigarettes? Regular or mental? That little wink he does and then when he walks by and tosses one of the cartons to another kid, that's the type of charm that gets you an Oscar someday. I'm sure I was thinking of the scene when we watched, when I saw Bart the murderer for the first time,

and he was fencing all of those stolen cigar, sorry, cigarette cartons. That did teach me the difference between regular and menthol as a kid, which I probably shouldn't know, but. It's a good joke about like, okay, these kids aren't gonna do drugs, and I think only one of the kids in a shot

has like a beer in front of them, but there's not really, you're not supposed to notice any underage drinking here. There are no girls in the Foot Clan and now I'm thinking is April O'Neill the only woman in the entire movie? You know I did spot one girl in the warehouse who's like popping bubble gum. I did spot one girl, but you're right, it's a real sausage fest here at the Foot Clan. It's also funny how one kid bumps into Tatsu and then he's just like, go play.

That was cute. He's trying to be a babysitter of these children who eventually he wants to turn into murderers. He's less violent towards children than Casey Jones, the hero of the film. Though he'll get more violent later. Well then, also spot in the background, Archie Comics boxes too,

because they were published in the Turtle comics at the time. That's what bad kids read. Yeah, I gotta think those are, the Jughead books aren't being too touched at this height out. Oh sweet, you got all the digests. Then we see Tatsu training. This is them showing how like,

it looks like some kids just have fun and steal stuff, but if you really wanna move up in the Foot Clan, you train in kickboxing and eventually get to join up. Yeah, Shredder basically gives you knighthood in the world of the ninja. It's pretty cool. It's like what you hear about gang colors, except it's your ninja mask.

But Tatsu sucker punches or sucker kicks a kid and tells him never lower your eyes to an enemy, which I think it's meant to show that he's a meaner teacher than Splinter. He does not, he lacks honor. Honor is not important. Though Splinter throws books at the kids, so I don'tinter. He does not, he lacks honor. Honor is not important. Though Splinter throws books at the kids, so I don't know.

He's not so nice either. He's abusive. And then we get the entrance of Shredder. I really love the lighting on it. Like you have this long shadow, but then they light it that, like the shadow stops at this wall of light. Like it's really cool.

Yeah, just the, all you see is the light from the door and the shadow appears, then Shredder appears, but yeah, just the shadow is so huge, so looming. This costume's okay, I think. I don't like how much just loose, shiny fabric there is in the torso area. I feel like it should be more armored like the cartoon guy. I guess maybe Super Shredder is them trying

to be more like the cartoon. It gets a little closer, but yeah, you're right. His very shiny, almost sequined blouse, like he's like. Sequined blouse. He got it at JCPenney. His mask is great, and I also like the, it's an incredible long shot of like behind Shredder, and then you see all the kids who are watching over him like a ton of great extras who you know kid extras who I think Baron in some interviews

said yeah these were just local North Carolina kids who did it for pretty cheap just to be in a movie. It is funny to think of what a corny weirdo Shredder is in the cartoon almost immediately where he's like but I want to invade the earth In this universe it takes to the second movie for him to be a total joke of like baby Yeah, I I loved when we covered the cartoon again. I just love his weird odd couple deal. Yes with Crank Yeah, you make rangers so funny Yeah that the way James Avery in that episode we did delivers the line, but I don't want to live in the bitchin' ass

Oh RIP to a real king But here is shredder playing his own mind games here where he's basically like I'm your dad now Due to all of these impressionable children. Only effort, discipline, loyalty, earn the right to wear the dragon doji. You are here because the outside world rejects you. This is your family. I am your father. I want you all to become full members of the foot. There is a new enemy. Freaks of nature who interfere with our business.

You are my eyes and ears. Find them. Together we will punish these creatures, these turtles. I will say what helped me take notes in this session for getting ready for the recording, Splinter and Shredder talk very slow and I can just keep up with them with no pausing. You're right, not much need to pause and write it down

or have on the subtitles. Even sometimes with the turtles, they are stuck with the lip sync that they filmed with and it talks as fast as those servos can move the lips. So that is why sometimes Raph pauses unnaturally because this is out of the mouth. Or just there's these weird old anime dub style utterances out of nowhere where Donnie's like, yeah.

I don't know, just for no reason. Just because the mouth opened. But yeah, Shredder, I also love how Shredder says, you're here because you're outcast. He basically describes everybody's outcasts one of the helpful YouTube channels For the history of like deleted scenes in the commentary track They have that quote at the very start basically to say the viewers you are here because you are rejected by society

That's the implying that's why you're watching turtle stuff on YouTube I think this is the Hollywood sickos giving us clues about the child trafficking rings that are actually happening. Man, Eastman and Laird, they knew about it. They're putting all the clues right under our noses to mock us. So ultimately Shredder, if you can't make it in the Foot Clan, then Shredder harvests your pineal gland, I'm guessing? I guess so.

He stabs it with his big spiky wrist thingy. It's perfect for, yes, his big claw in his left hand that is perfect for piercing the pineal gland. Yeah, the word claw or wrist, claw, you said claw? I said claw, well, it is like a Freddy claw, almost, I'm thinking. I was gonna give a vocabulary lesson. Those shoulder things are called pauldrons,

in case you're wondering. Oh, that's cool, I didn't know that. Well also, here's some Japanese for you guys. The thing that he calls a dragon doji, the kanji that's on there, it's the kanji for oni, or demon. Yeah, yeah. Look, if you're enough of a weeb, you listen to us,

you know oni. You know oni, you played. You know, Oni. You played the Bungie game from 2001. And then they cut to Splinter to let you know that Splinter is not dead, he's being held hostage, which is also what happens in the comic, though it's space aliens that do it. But Splinter gets held hostage for basically like 12 issues of the comic. It is, I mean, it's funny to see an injured puppet no matter what happens and I do laugh sometimes when Splinter, we just cut the Splinter and he looks like shit, his eyes are watery.

Baron says they were in danger of destroying the puppet because of how wet they had to keep him for this stuff. And I guess Splinter overhears all this stuff, this is how he uses it against Danny later. Like, I thought this was your family. He overhears this speech. And also then Danny, what a long zoom on waiting for Danny to say, like he like licks his lips and is about to say, I know they're at April's place. Oh yeah. So he, I guess, yeah, he is the is the informant. We never get the line of dialogue. We just know why they show up at April's place. And that's why he's wearing the bandana later.

I guess it was his gift, like it let him get up the ranks. But they're definitely expecting you to make a lot of assumptions for this children's movie. So then we cut to April on TV. She's being interviewed by another reporter. What's her name? May. Get it? April and May. Oh, is that is that what's happening in this film? Yes. Yeah, it's a little a little cute joke there. I also am impressed that April calls them Japanese American. She's being very, you know, woke for her time. And it's

cute. She I like that she thanks Raph and then they're all kind of razzin' him and tellin' him like, he's blushing. None of them get jaded though when she falls for Casey at the end. They're all cheering her on. You think, maybe there's a little sour grapes, but they're all on board.

No one ever, none of these turtles ever seriously entertain the thought of being with April. I mean, they're kissin' the TV, but then when they lose, I mean, maybe they're like, hey, Casey's a good guy. I don't mind losing out to him. Also, on top of being, you know, interspecies, it also is like statutory, like they're 15 or 16. Oh yeah, I guess these are children.

April needs to stay, you know, keep her distance, wait a few years if she's gonna make something happen with Raph. Then all the fun stops as Leo and Raphael argue, and I feel like this is the thing, I like it in this movie, but I feel like most Ninja Turtles movies, they always have to have Leonardo and Raphael arguing.

Yeah, I can't, I mean, it's been a while since I watched Mutant Mayhem, I haven't rewatched it. Was it going on in that film? I think that's one of the rare ones where they all the turtles like each other They're not all arguing but like it's central to the film literally called TMNT from from 2007 but yeah in this time Leo and Raph are arguing and Leo's problem here I do think is that he refuses to lead, like he should be the leader, but he's like, I don't know. Also, Donnie and Mikey walk away because they're like,

eh, we're the same character, we don't wanna have a fight. We're gonna do a fun bit with pork rinds, where just the idea of a pork rind was funny, they don't do anything funny with it. Someone's just offered a pork rind. What if someone were to eat a pork rind? I mean, that was Homer as well in season one of The Simpsons. So pork rind comedy then.

So what do we do now? What do you mean, what do we do now? Splinter's out there somewhere. I know Splinter's out there. Fight? Fight. Kitchen? Kitchen.

Yeah. So what are we gonna do about it? What can we do about it? April's our only link to these guys. We have to wait until she comes up with something. Oh, so that's the plan from our great leader, huh? Just sit here on our butts. I never said I was your great leader.

Well, you sure act like it sometimes. Yeah? Well, you act like a jerk sometimes you know that and this attitude of yours isn't helping anything well well maybe I'll just take my attitude and we don't ya I will good great go ahead we don't need ya park rind well Wild grime. You know, Leonardo never said he was the leader. The theme song... Yeah....is the unreliable narrator there, I guess. And Turtle Power at the end of this movie

says Raph is the leader of the group. Oh, wow. I didn't listen close enough. You know, I agree with that song. In my heart, Raph is the leader. It's so funny, the guy names like there's this guy, he names all three of them and they said, and then there's one turtle left the leader of the group Raph. I like I was like wow You didn't check his sources

Also not to ruin the film for people but on the same level as seeing inside of Donatello's mouth At least on Paramount Plus if you stop at 38 minutes and 12 seconds during Leo and Ralph's argument You will see a crew guy right in the center of frame with an orange hat on. There's no cutting him out, he's just right there. Wow. Sorry Steve, he really needed that extra money. Now I'm looking at the Partners in Crime lyrics. So Leonardo, Michelangelo, and Donatello make up the team with one other fellow. Raphael, he's a leader of the group.

Transformed from the norm by the nuclear group. Well, very good. I love these lyrics, they're great. Also, I think a little after that he says like, but back to the story it had like, he's like, oh, I'm sorry, that was a tangent. Anyway, back to the story. These are like Parappa the Rapper lyrics.

I've been expecting Parappa to repeat them back like, pizza's the food that's sure to please. These ninjas are into pepperoni and cheese. Those are real lyrics by the way. Oh man, it does sound perfect for Parappa. But so yes, Raph runs off, then he goes to the New York City rooftop to basically, it's like in Footloose where the guy like

dance fights in the woods. Damn Four appears on the rooftop. Look out. He's that mad. Shield your ears. And they really got a guy in a raf suit on the roof in New York City and filmed him jumping around and looking over the edge of it. I want to know what Casey Jones is doing up on the roof. Is he trying to get a better signal on his radio? There's no other reason.

He's just like messing with it. We're like, what's going on with this radio? Then he looks over, oh, a turtle, okay. Yeah, I guess it is for service. So then again, he does have a pair of binoculars right there. So I do think Casey might be a peep. I think he might be peeping. I think he's creeping and peeping.

He says he's probably telling himself, I'm bringing these binoculars to look for crime. And we know what he's really doing. Oh, and you know what? We get damn number five immediately afterwards because Mike and Don are watching Rocky and Bullwinkle at Aesop's, sorry, Cracked, Fractured Fairy Tales, there we go, I got it right.

Or maybe it's Aesop. No, it's Aesop and Son. Aesop and Son, thank you. And then Mikey's like, Ninja Kick the Damn Rabbit, when there's a tortoise and hare kind of thing going on in the screen. I couldn't believe, yes, that actually, as a kid, I think it shocked me even more that Michael Angelo

says damn it, because he's supposed to be the nice it shocked me even more that Michelangelo says damn it because he's supposed to be the nice one. Yeah, Donna, everyone but Leonardo says damn it in this movie. What a nerd. And by the way, yeah, they do credit this footage at the end, like Rocky and Bull, Winkel footage, courtesy of J Ward Productions,

et cetera, et cetera. I am impressed. They got the J, they went to the J Ward Productions for, they could have tried to find like a public domain, you know, Fleischer cartoon. I'm sure there's a tortoise and hare cartoon out there that was public domain. Yeah, this is around the time when they were about to

all be on Nickelodeon in the early 90s. Yeah, I mean, I was watching Rocky and Bullwinkle soon after, I loved it. But I would have thought this was like a cheaper ricochet rabbit or something, but they got a Rocky and Bullwinkle soon after. I loved it. But I, I would have thought this was like a cheaper ricochet rabbit or something, but they got a Rocky and Bullwinkle sequence. Also Baron admits on the commentary is like, by the way, you will notice within a second that Raphael he's looking over the edge and you're like, Oh, that's really New York City. Then when it does the reverse shot and it is the foot clan behind him. It is clearly just a completely different

roof in North Carolina. This is taken from the Leonardo one shot from Mirage Comics. He is the one who fights everybody alone and they have a clever bit in the comic where basically 80% of each page is the big fight scene. And then trailed on the bottom, like almost like it's a newspaper free panel comic, is the guys in April's apartment not realizing what's happening. Yeah, and at this point they're all like in April's apartment because their house was trash.

Their sewer house. They're not paying rent either, I'm telling you that. No. I hope they at least help with the dishes or something. I noticed that with a lot of these extended fight scenes, they're always cutting back to someone else making a joke in another area, just to make it go down a little smoother

for the kids and the parents. Yeah, I think because this is just, we're also, it's a bummer as a viewer for a kid, you're like, oh man, Raphael's getting his butt kicked. But I do like that he, as a kid, I was thinking the same thing of like yeah Raphael can beat up like five of you guys at once and when he goes come on he's supposed to beat me yeah and it is it is a nice comedy moment I don't know if it's intentional

what Raphael's getting his ass kicked on the roof and April's like hey let's check out my antique store I hope no ninja battles take place within it. They have all of their little shenanigans there of like, Michelangelo hits the symbols and then they cut back to, well, I was gonna say his ears boxed, but basically he's, Raphael has hit on the side of the head like symbols in between. I think that's where they have ears. That's where my my bird's ears are and I think they share some similarities.

That makes sense then. They're ear holes. Yeah, they're just weird weird holes in the side of their heads. And Donatello takes a book off the shelf which feels like one of the few times they actually say, Donatello is the nerd of the group. He wants the book. I totally miss the one ref to Donatello being slightly smarter than them, the other ones. Yeah, him knowing War and Peace,

I thought was the big one. I'm like, okay, he's actually war and peace. Yes, yes. Also, I really like the, Leo has a big reaction of screaming after that. That is good puppetry on Leo's face there but yeah, all of the ninjas are beating the crap out of them and Then we get to see it's pretty impressive the way

Raphael's Puppet body gets flung through that window and crashes through it. It's good stuff. Yeah at this point They're still on they take a tour of the of the antique shop We hear about April's dead father, which I guess we kind of like brings her closer to the turtles because they understand Oh, you're we miss our father. You're missing your father There's a tiny a tiny tiny beat there then they go back up and that's when Raph comes crashing through This is more of a dad feelings movie though because it was made 30 years ago It's not about the parent apologizer,

like Splinter doesn't apologize to them at the end. There we go everybody, you gotta put it down on your bingo card. Parental apology movies. Yes, no, us commenting on that. Yes. So when Raph crashes in, this is when the rest of them jump in and the Michael Angeles says,

and I thought insurance salesmen were pushy. Again, very corny, corny jokes here. But as a kid, I loved, loved this part. And Michelangelo and nunchucks are not my favorite part of the turtles here. You weren't a big nunchuck fan? Oh, I mean, they're cool and I definitely, if I had anything near me that was like a nunchuck

or even just the fake foam ones I was smacking myself with him trying to be as cool as Michelangelo. Yeah, this is the display of Nunchuckery with the fellow chucker. Yes. Yeah, I I have a tiny clip of that And I thought insurance salesmen were pushy. Oh, a fellow checker, eh? There is something about just like the sound of, it makes me, again, Mystery Science Theater, think of the cave dwellers meat slappers thing, but just like, yeah, they don't make that noise in real life, folks. Though it's sound effects like that that let you know

this is a Golden Harvest production. Also the way it's framed, it reminds me of the, probably the most famous nunchuck scene in movie history, the Bruce Lee and Enter the Dragon one. Oh yes, yeah. Which is a Golden Harvest film too. But yeah, I would bet it's the same Nunchuck guy in both costumes, in the Michelangelo costume and in the Footclan costume.

That's just a smart use of stunt people. And yeah, this whole sequence cut out of the British version. You don't get to see this in the British or most European versions until the uncut release, I think on Blu-ray. There would have been anarchy in the UK, and they hate that. It's bad enough they have to be hero turtles, but if they saw Nunchucks, it's some fun stuff, and then it ends with him spinning it on his finger,

which I never got as a kid until much later. What's he spinning on his finger? His nunchuck. Okay. And that's when he says, keep practicing, dude. And then Donatelle jumps over him and smacks both of the guys in the head. Right, right.

And then it's a lot of action. I noticed that Leonardo loses his swords instantly in the fight. Yeah, and I guess it's Raph. He's blocking things with the Sai, usually. He's never stabbing anyone in the guts with it. Though in this fight, Raphael gets to take a little break. And if you have the British version, you'll see different scenes in this fight or like, you know I would say ten seconds of different shots because they had to cut to different coverage to not show Michelangelo using his nunchucks including in the Wheel of Fortune see oh man have to they get tighter on it

So you can't see his nunchucks. How are they so afraid of at this point? I guess this is when all of the axe enemies enter the picture. There's like someone handing out axes so they can all do their axe attack. And this is when, I guess, it's Mikey and Don are rolling around as the axes are coming down. And this is what causes the floor to break and drop

through to the antique shop, where they can have more silly prop fighting. Well, I guess as the only thing safe in the woods would be the trees. Also, the Vanna White joke still works. She is still the co-host of the Wheel of Fortune show. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I guess when the nobody laughs at the Wheel of Fortune,

Mikey says, well, everybody likes Vanna or whatever. I don't know what the actual line is. I thought everybody loved Vanna. But I just learned that I knew Pat Sajak was retiring. But I did not know until looking this up today who was replacing him. Do you know, Bob? No, it has to be a better person, right?

Yes, but not that much. but it's Ryan Seacrest. Oh, well, you might as well just have a glass of warm water replace Pat Sajak. When Pat Sajak, though, isn't on that show anymore, he bites his tongue politically, even though he is one of those Republican celebrities, but once he's not on the show anymore, I bet you he's gonna go full Chuck Woolery

of being like a mega guy on the internet. Oh, he's already most of the way there. I wanna see what he's not saying. And Vanna White, yeah, she's still looking beautiful in her mid-60s, still doing great. Also, Baron says they had one take of that floor caving in and he is thankful it worked because he's like, if that didn't work, we'd have been fucked.

I don't know if they all fall through, but suddenly April O'Neill's down there, cradling Raph's unconscious body. Thankfully he didn't land on his spine or his neck when the floor broke. Or land on top of her and break all of her bones. Yeah, it's not clear how they all managed to land safely to get up and fight more.

Well, you know, they're ninjas. They know how to fall. Let's say that. Also as a kid, the way Tatsu does the hand to fist that I was like, I thought it was the coolest thing when I was a kid. And then more fights happen. This is where like Leonardo grabs, I think it is bike handles to do a bicycle kick while hanging upside down and then falls off and The Mikey smashes guys with symbols

Yeah It's paying off the symbol gag earlier when he was sneaking up on Leonardo to crash the symbols next to him and Donatello gets his head smashed on the the keys of a piano I also I like they do a joke of that the turtles can breathe underwater, so when they try to drown Donatello in the fish tank, it doesn't do anything. But I wish they didn't add, it's not in the trailer,

it is just the normal sound of spitting instead of the video game sound effect of the spit that they put in the movie. Okay, yeah, I like his little spit trick. And when Casey Jones shows up, it is in the mask, so I guess there's two times when the mask comes into play. It's off not long after that. Yeah.

I also like when they say Wayne Gretzky on steroids, when it's like, the actor is one inch shorter than Wayne Gretzky, so I say he is not Wayne Gretzky. Maybe the steroids are contributing to his rage issues, not necessarily his largeness. Okay, he's got the roid rage that Wayne Gretzky would not have. Michelangelo again has to be a stand-up comic of 1989, so that's why he has to say blank on steroids.

Yeah, in a decade it'd be blank on crack. So Casey is there to save his little green friends. They start the fight, he's beating up dudes too, and then after a Foot Clan guy electrocutes himself in cartoonish fashion. Oh yeah, the building catches fire. I love he's fighting these guys, and the building's burning down.

The phone rings, it's like, hey April, it's your boss. I'm calling from the plot nobody cares about. Here's an update on that by the way. That's so funny. You know what, gotta let you go. It's funny, the only reason they do it is so Casey can learn that information to tell her later, but you're right, it's reminding you of like,

hey remember April's boss? That was something. Yeah, I guess it just, I mean, it keeps April at the farmhouse, but it also gets her off on the wrong foot with Casey when they get there. When April's on the news, what she says is, you know, not what the police wanted, so then the guy gets on the

phone with her boss and yells at him, and him being a loser then fires her because a policeman yelled at him. They then escape out of a secret trap door, even Casey, who holds him back. They would be out of a secret trap door. Even Casey, who holds him back, they would be chased after, but then the sirens go off and so that's when Tatsu says, ninja vanish, and they run away. And I guess this VW microbus is April. She's got this bus, microbus at the antique store. She's got the truck at the farmhouse. She's just rolling in cars

When I was a kid, I thought this was gonna become the party wagon like it's the same style But it's broken after this scene. I was pissed off I mean I did see this years before but I was really made aware of the VW Microbus with Mystery Science Theatre that became Pearl Forester's mobile mad scientists with Mystery Science Theater that became Pearl Forrester's mobile mad scientist headquarters basically. That was cool and probably inexpensive for the MSD3K folks to turn into a prop. Oh yeah, I mean they're really cool. Also when they were filming all this stuff with the fire,

that's when Baron says he felt most bad for his performers because they only would light it for the scene And then when shooting was done, they could turn the fire back off So it's not like a constant fire But these guys were already sweating to death in the suits in normal temperature Now they were lighting fires next to them and it was the hardest days on filming it sounded like these poor men And yes, they drive away in the van. We do get to see April watch her house burn down

and lose everything she ever had. I feel pretty bad for her. But of course, you're really supposed to feel bad for Danny. He feels such guilt. Oh, poor Danny. I just go renovate that nice house she has in the country. Or sell it. Sell it, yeah.

Flip it, flip it. It seems like a lot of property, honestly. In upstate New York, I'm guessing. Yes, that's gotta be worth a bit, man. She's part of the bridge and tunnel crowd. Though of course, Baron admits where she's driving to is clearly an abandoned home in North Carolina and not New York.

Did they film this? This seems like they found a home, they're filming inside the home, right? Yeah, yeah, it's both inside and out. You know, the bathroom might be a set they built, but I think a lot of it is inside the house they found. But we cut back to Shredder, much like with Bebop and Rocksteady,

he's pissed at his underlings failing him. He's trying to figure out, what are these freaks? I love his pause before he says any word. Thunderlings failing him. He's trying to figure out what are these freaks? I love his pause before he says any word. And then also is like, then hang there until you die. Yeah, he punches this bound rat man in the face and Tatsu, or Tatsu rather, is terrified of him and also feeling deep shame for fucking up.

And he says a word that we all know well today because we've all watched nine million anime episodes. It's Kuso which means darn it. It has literally nine zillion meanings but it's an exclamation of frustration. If you're watching Dragon Ball Z fansubs it was fuck. Yes, yep. It was always the filthiest word they could fit into the scene. It doesn't literally mean shit like poop either. I think that's a mistake people seem to make sometimes. Well, in general, people, you know, well, I was just seeing this in the newest Like a Dragon that contextually, you know, it does mean, like, yaddle.

It can mean you, like, I think literally means you, but it does mean like you bastard or you like you asshole, which is usually what they subtitle it as in like a dragon yakuza games. Yeah, it's like you in parentheses rudely. Right, yeah. I've started watching to supplement my Japanese learning. I've been watching Japanese language channels or things like how to learn Japanese from native speakers. One of them was like the many yous and Yaro

was like, never say this. You're going to get beat up. Unless someone has a gun drawn on you. Then he proves that he is better at brutalizing teenagers than even Casey Jones. Yes, apparently in the novelization, this is what the internet tells me, that guy that Tatsu then beats up, the novelization says he's dead and that they added breathing sounds to it in the movie to make it a PG. I detected ADR, my ADR radar went off when Tatsu just wails on this teen. He's seemingly dead, but we hear one guy go, he'll be all right. You know what, that totally is the like,

ugh sound you put in things. Yeah, though someone is groaning but alive. But yeah, I read the book once when I was seven. Maybe I was like, wow, they kill a man in this movie. This is gonna rule. And Danny's reaction makes way more sense if that guy's dead. Like Danny's reaction should be,

oh man, this place is fucked up. This isn't a nice place. I'm with the bad guys. So yes, then Danny heads over to Splinter, and this is when Splinter gives Danny some tips. How can a face so young wear so many burdens? Then Splinter gives Danny some tips. from inner turmoil begins with a friendly ear. My ear is open if you care to use it. No, I don't think so.

What is your name? Danny. And have you no one to go to, Danny? No parent? My dad could care less about me. I doubt that is true Why All fathers care for their sons

Yeah, no that's not true actually last part Need a fact check that I feel like if Splinter wasn't full of Asian wisdom, he would tell Danny, Danny, there's once a man like you, an outcast that people did not like, and his name was Jesus Christ. Will you accept him into your heart, Danny? If he was a church mouse instead of a Japanese rat.

Yeah, but I will say all fathers care for their children. I mean, that's why there are laws, because they often don't. I'm living proof. Yes, no, me too. We both have awful fathers. Splinter, come on. Though now I see it as like,

oh, this is a dad feelings movie, and what Splinter is saying is like, I miss my sons, is what he's really saying. Also all fathers care for their sons. Fathers don't care about daughters apparently. No, daughters, it's kind of a gray area. I, not my field of expertise. I, you know, I would have raised a daughter,

but these are all boy turtles. Who can say if I would have loved a daughter? Not me. Anyway, help. You know, as a kid, I remember being bored by these scenes with Danny talking with Splinter. It reminds me, I was just chatting with you

about how I watched The Nice Guys for the first time, and I think the teen in that is better, but it's similar to just having Danny in this, of like, you don't need a teen in these movies. Well, especially because that's an R-rated movie for adults. I think it was the comedic idea in Nice Guys to say, what if a child was part of this body 70s crime film? With all these swears and dead bodies and pornography?

Yeah, yeah. I was fine with that element of it, but I can see why it could grate on some people. We then cut to them arriving at the house that she grew up in, and another joke flew over my head as a kid. Didn't they use this place in The Grapes of Wrath? It looks like a real oaky hellhole.

That shows Casey. That movie was like 50 years old when this movie came out. So Casey is a classic movie buff. And you know I appreciate this now. When I was a kid I thought boring. Where are they? What are they doing here? Just like this weird rural thing going on for 15 minutes. Not what I wanted from a movie like this as a kid. I appreciate it now though, as just a little down moment before we have the final confrontation. Because otherwise then you're just in New York

the whole movie and they're just fighting ninjas over and over again. I get why they wanna chill out, but yeah, as a kid I think I maybe on VHS fast-forwarded through these scenes time to time. This is basically their version of taking Raphael to a mafia doctor and just hiding out until he gets better. So man, Raphael's in a coma for days at the very least.

He's lost a lot of brain activity by the time he comes out of this. They also, this is where they really set up the, like when Casey sees April at the big fight in her house, he does go like, ooh, who's the chick? But this is when he's really starting to make his moves on her. Also, I now get, he does, she's like, how's the van? And then he does a finger gun,

meaning he's putting it out of its misery. The the joke is it's dead I didn't know what an engine block was as a kid either their first free car doesn't work anymore that's why they have to fix the second free car isn't it again yeah it's lame they should have just kept the party wagon but yeah then comes another joke that I think flew over both of our heads as kids. Our nearest neighbor is about four miles away. I need to get to a phone and I need to call my boss. You mean Charles? How did you know that?

Well, he left a message on your machine just before we got out. And? Well, hey, you just saved yourself an eight mile round tripper. You were fired. I'm I just saved myself. You saved yourself on eight mile round, tripper. You were fired. I'm... I just saved myself? Uh-oh.

What did you do? Did you take classes in insensitivity? I was just trying to break it to you easy. Well, you failed miserably! Hey, Bratzella, you won't even be standing here if it weren't for me, okay? Oh, and what do you want? Do you want to thank you? No. It's me who should thank you for that privilege, right? Fine. Yeah. People in 1990 were howling. Moonlighting had just gone off the air in 1989.

I think mainly they're referring to the behind the scenes drama between Bruce Willis and Cybill Shepherd, them not liking each other, not liking to work with each other, but I believe the characters were very at odds with each other too, so. Yeah, it was a whole will of a, I mean, the show was about a will they,

won't they thing, right? And when they finally get together, then the story, the Hollywood legend says, that got rid of the tension and so people stopped watching. That's what I always heard about it. I just know it was a very crazy, ambitious show with just wild episode ideas, and that's where the creators of Duckman came from. I did most of my moonlighting research by doing Duckman episodes for What a Cartoon. Wow, I forgot that. I just read about what the

final episode is and it is an entirely like break the fourth wall, the characters become their actors and they're told the show has turned has been shut down and canceled. Yeah actually one of their most famous episodes of the creators of Duckman was called Atomic Shakespeare, and I'll read you the episode synopsis. A teenage moonlighting fan is forced by his mother to do his homework rather than watch the show. He imagines the regular characters enacting a version

of William Shakespeare's play, The Taming of the Shrew, in period costume and setting, but in the style of an episode of the show. Bruce Willis performs a song, Good Lovin', originally recorded by the Young Rascals. So that's all happening. The episode is about a moonlighting fan. Wow. Man. People think TV shows are crazy now. I think they wrote the entire episode in like iambic pentameter or something like that. So yeah.

Man. That's nuts. See, people just remember moonlighting for like, will they, won't they stuff. Not that crazy shit. And like 25 million people were watching every episode. It was a just massive, massive hit. And yeah, like I said, I think these actors are really enjoying not having to talk to a puppet either. Also, Donatello and Michelangelo are posed weird of like Donatello is getting his leg looked at

by Michelangelo, I think. Like checking for wounds maybe? Yeah, I don't know what their other injuries are. I'm mostly concerned with Rafael just being thrown in a bathtub. He'll get better eventually. I guess this is good for them, I don't know. Also, I was thinking when they have the shot

of like Donatello outside like Humminhold McDonald, I was thinking what did that look like on, you know, my small SDTV I watched the VHS on? How was it framed? It probably looked like garbage. I thought the joke is that he almost steps in poop or something, but I'm not sure what's happening. He gets spooked by something and then he...

I think you're right. I think it's a poop joke. Really? Okay, I thought it was at first, then I went back, I was like, what's happening in this scene? And he turns around like he's spooked by something and then continues singing Old MacDonald. I guess it is just like a chilling out moment.

Maybe he sees a bug or something, or he thinks he sees a snake, I don't know. It's unclear. Yeah, and then we see April O'Neill, ace reporter, she knows how to run an antique shop, also amazing at life drawing. Amazing, Steve Barron has to admit it on the commentary. Yes, this is me doing take on me again. I'm having a drawing that then cuts to the real thing.

It implies April is there in every scene, drawing the thing that they eventually cut to in live action. It's very impressive. This pays off for the deleted ending, but it works as a plot device later. But we first go to Donnie and Casey Jones. This is also Donatello sort of doing machines. Yeah, I guess so, in that he's sitting in the cab

of the truck while Casey does all the work. Really surprised, they're playing this alphabetical insult game in 1990. I'm very surprised they didn't land on anything truly offensive 24 years, sorry, 34 years later. You know, yeah, during one of the fight scenes, Michelangelo calls somebody a spaz in quotes, but that's the closest, like they're just saying like,

gack and elf lips. Yeah, these are all little Pete from Pete and Pete Insults, like, hey, crud spanker. Oh man, blowhole. Yeah, slime wad. That's totally right, these are little Pete Insults. Also, because this is back when there was a monoculture, Gilligan's Island arguments were key to comedy writing.

Did Quentin Tarantino step in and do this scene? Gilligan's island arguments were like key to comedy writing. Did Quentin Tarantino step in and do this scene? You're right. Or Kevin Smith? Did this inspire clerks? Like what if two guys did this for an entire movie? And what if one of them wasn't a turtle? And I'm with Casey Jones.

Gilligan is a loser. No way does he end up with Mary Ann. No, no. It's the professor. Absolutely, it's why they're paired together at the end of the theme song. Gilligan wouldn't know what to do with Mary Ann if he had the chance. He wouldn't know. I mean, honestly, McGillian's written as a child. Now, if he got hit in the head with a coconut and became a different personality, maybe then.

I'm sure there are six episodes where that happens. You'll have to consult those. I think I've only seen total 40 minutes of Gilligan's Island in my life. Wow, because it just happened to be something in syndication when I was a kid during the summer, I think I've seen it all the way through, black and white and color episodes, probably like four or five times.

That's incredible. Now I did watch in full the Gilligan's Island like TV movie where they get back to humanity or a civilization and then also the Harlem Globetrotters movie, but I didn't watch many of the real episodes Yeah, there's only 93 of them. So it's one of those things that they were just embarrassed that was popular So they only made so many and then it caught on in a huge way in syndication which is why they made those terrible movies. The last one we recall features the Harlem Globetrotters. I do remember Gilligan his his Hamlet song but that's because it was on Space Ghost Coast to Coast. Gotcha. But yeah this argument ends with him nearly running over Casey and

getting a the towel thrown in his face. So yeah, not very good at doing machines here, but this, I guess, is doing machines. Then we see that Leonardo has been watching over Raph the entire time, and it's cute. And then, oh, and then April comes in like dusts water on him. I guess this is good for giant, I don't know.

When they cut to Raph kind of upside down in this tub just with an arm and legs sticking out, I laugh every time, it's hilarious looking. Not good bedside manner, I'd say. No, I think as a kid I thought like, oh this seems painful, why don't they put him in a bed or something? Are they just out of beds?

And then conspicuous here is the lack of Michelangelo. I took this as April not liking Michelangelo because she's like, well, there's Donatello, there's Leonardo, and of course, Raphael. I've covered all of them, now Casey Jones. Now Casey Jones, man, he'd be hot if he wasn't so stupid. We did talk about this a few weeks ago during the history segment.

What was the Michelangelo story that was cut? So you do see a little of Michelangelo like punching a punching bag. This is in the comic book adaptation. Michelangelo does a bunch of training and he is kind of angry. And you pointed it out. You can tell it's him on the bar and screaming Splinter, not Raphael.

His nunchucks are super identifiable in HD. So the assumption made by the fans is that they show that Michelangelo is getting very serious and wasn't joking around, and it might have been viewed as this is too upsetting to kids to show Michelangelo being angry and not jokey, so they just cut it. Do you think the big payoff to that is him crying at the campfire? Well, also I think, I do think it fits with the turtle wax.

When he walks in quietly and then pulls out the turtle wax and everybody laughs, I think it's supposed to be Michelangelo's back to normal. He's making jokes again. He's back to being insufferable. I liked you better when you were, uh, when you were traumatized, Michelangelo. But yes, uh, we, she skips over Michelangelo instead, talks about how much she is into Casey Jones. Casey and her have a little moment alone

while they're off training. And yeah, she's so close to getting closer to him but then he calls her another series of sexist nicknames instead of her name. He calls her Toots, Broadzilla, all these things. I think he ends with Princess. That, oh man, he's coming from the Legend of Zelda school there.

But yeah, then she walks away in case he just has basically a little slapstick moment of his swing breaking. I don't know if this came up in your research, the story I heard, which seems apocryphal, maybe not true, is that the actor didn't know the swing was going to break They wanted to surprise him to get a genuine reaction his reaction is very good He's also a good actor, so I'm not sure if that story is true But I do like his reaction when the chain snaps on that porch swing you know

Baron on the commentary doesn't say it was spontaneous He does he seems to indicate it was planned But I also could believe that he knew it was going to break, but didn't know exactly when. So it surprised him exactly when it broke. But now I don't, uh, the commentary did not offer answers on that. Then we cut to Raph waking up and I just love, I love how Leo reacts to this. You're awake. Yep. How do you feel? What's the guy gotta do? To get some food around here?

Hey! Hey, he's awake! He wants some food! Bring some food! You're gonna be okay, Raph. You're gonna be okay. Yeah, yeah, alright, Leo. Get a grip, will ya? Listen, Raph. About what I said before. Oh. You know, about not needing you at all. Like... Leo, don't.

Oh, boy, we missed you. It's a Kodak moment. Oh. Ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha. Whoa. And if you're looking for actors inside these heads,

definitely could see some eyes and teeth peeking through the Donatello mouth when he laughs at the end of this scene. It's ruined the scene for me. I didn't notice it ever. see some eyes and teeth peeking through the Donatello mouth when he laughs at the end of this scene. It's ruined the scene for me. I didn't notice it ever. I only saw it shared on social media some years ago, and now it is ruined the scene for me because I can't not look directly in his mouth. Because the light is shining directly in the mouth because he's pulling his head back and

the light's coming in. You can see why so much of this was filmed in darkness. It just hides the actor's faces in the mouths. And you know what? They should have just not had the faces be visible and just prevented these guys from breathing. That's what they should have done. You can find new turtle people.

I love that in the 4K version that's on, or at least HD version that's on Paramount Plus They have never touched it up. You can still see the the actors face in there It'd be it'd be so easy with today's digital tech to just blacken that out and not show it Yeah, is there any version of this film that has the those changes? I had heard that was the case like I'd seen I, I can't remember where, but I feel like I saw on Twitter, somebody did a post of, oh, in this version, they've blacked out the mouth.

But that could also just be a fake somebody put on Twitter. It could be like a fan edit too, because we've had the tools to do this for a very long time. We could do that right now if we wanted to. But I also like, I like the brothers hugging and everybody, they make up, Leo and Raph are friends again. It's sweet, it is a Kodak moment.

Another old reference. It's 1990 so they're not allowed to hug for too long before someone's like, hey homos, break it up. Oh, you guys are, yeah, I mean, again, it's brother, like that's why they gotta joke about it and laugh at him. You're right, just let you know it's not gay. And yeah this is then when you see Michelangelo punching bag thing and the screaming of splinter which they have Raph's voice say but not when it's when it's Mikey's body. Which you do a

great impression of that, Bob. You did that in the first part. Splinter! It's basically just a you gotta get your rocky impression turn it down a few notches. And for one second, you can see this deleted sequence where Leonardo did a training sequence where he turns his blindfold around and can't see, and Donatello is wearing a straw hat. Like seriously, for one second, Donatello's wearing a straw hat,

and then in the training montage, it cuts to a different section. That was a deleted bit of the training montage. Okay, I imagine that's on a trading card somewhere. Yes. I had some of these trading cards at the time. I think they're still at my mom's house. The like one year I actually collected trading cards,

I did, or maybe two years, because I had Dick Tracy trading cards, Who Framed Roger Rabbit, Batman, and this. So maybe like a two year period. Did you get Simpsons ones? I think I bought one pack, but the Tracy Allman stills confused me. Oh right, yeah.

That was, I didn't collect the Tracy Allman stills one, but I definitely, my brother and I were voracious collectors of the Bongo trading cards. The Bongo ones are much better. The original training cards came out when there was one season, so not a lot of material to work with. And also, Matt Groening was not publishing them like he was with Bongo, so it didn't have as good quality control.

Then during the, it's a, it's a funny cut during the training montage. They then cut to seeing Leonardo's sword being used to chop carrots by Casey. I like that. Hey, pretty good. It's the only cutting allowed with a katana in the movie. And then Casey, honestly, oversteps his boundaries here, I would say, when he-

Throws a woman into a chair and insists on touching her? Yes. This is the most scantily clad April is in the entire film. Yes Yeah, but I get that it's hot but it's like boy This is a bit much for her outfit But all Casey has to do is say hey you you need a massage and she says yes But instead because he's a you know tough guy He just yanks her

and shoves her in a chair and she goes along with it. Thankfully this turtle wax joke really softens the sexual harassment that preceded it. It makes it easy to forget and sweep away at it. As a non-car owner, I have never purchased turtle wax or any of these similar car maintenance things. I assumed you owned a car at some point. I did, but I mean, I'd take it to a car wash or whatever,

but I never like buffed it with turtle wax. I wasn't waxing my car either. No. I mean, the turtle wax joke, it's a good, it's just look on Michelangelo's face, he's like, eh, eh? Like he should just be looking into the camera to be like yeah He really is trying to sell that joke. I also do like that Raphael is like Mikey when before he when Michelangelo does the cat knee thing he goes like oh not Cagney like now now raf likes

His his stick they're all bonding. And then Leonardo is so good at meditation, one try he can contact Splinter via psychic connection. And rudely interrupt this Trivial Pursuit game. I love he walks straight over it as they're playing Trivial Pursuit. As a kid, I was already getting into Trivial Pursuit, though we had the kids version, the Disney kids version,

so obviously this war and peace joke totally lost on me as a kid. Yeah, I think we had some Disney version too, but I had not seen any of the movies, so I didn't know the Aristocats from Peter Pan at that point in my life. Well, I don't know if this was your one, but in mine, it was made before,

the questions were made before the Little Mermaid So it only asked about classic cartoons. Absolutely And so yeah Leo convinces them that they all need to meditate together After a quick joke about roasting marshmallows Which makes me feel dangerous for the puppeteer that he has to have this lit marshmallow right next to all this flaming food and man Splinter is totally ripping off Yoda's bit by appearing as a blue ghost. It's such, it is pure thievery, man.

That's, you know, boy, now that you've said Yoda, it completely is lost on me that Yoda is also like a Ninja Turtle in that it is a sorta muppet in a non-muppet movie. Oh yeah, yeah, that's true, yeah. It's just, it's another movie that happens to have a muuppet in a non-Muppet movie. Oh yeah, yeah, that's true. Yeah, it's just another movie that happens to have a Muppet in it. Yeah, though in the same pedantic technicality

I mentioned in the history section, it was ILM that made the puppet, and while it was Frank Oz performing it, it was not made by the creature shop, so it's not the same as the Ninja Turtles being actual Jim Henson creations in a non-Jim Henson movie. Well, this ghost scene, I think it's very funny

because it's just Splinter praising his sons like you have mastered your mind and become true ninjas. And if I were Splinter, I'd be saying, you can find me on Fifth Avenue in a big warehouse. Here, let me write this down. Yeah, did you bring a pen? Okay. But I feel like you should say after this, I'm just your memory. I can't give you any new information.

That's what's great. So at first in my memory as a kid, I, or from my memory of this movie, I thought, oh, it's what they think Splinter would say. But when they cut to Splinter saying, Leonardo, it does mean there is real psychic powers being used here. Like stop moralizing, stop telling me I'm a good boy. We need to help you, where are you? The final thing you should know is, I love you. Bye bye.

You're right. Also, this comes up at the end of the movie. Tell them the guy you're facing is called the shredder. He does this Because when the shredder shows that not to get to the end the turtles don't know who the fuck he is when he shows up I'm kind of still don't and they don't even defeat him It's uh, yeah, it's a bit of a cop-out but The important thing for the plot is that the turtles get emotional fulfillment of being told you've grown, I'm so proud of you, I love you, a turtle cries.

And so they are emotionally fulfilled enough to leave the ranch. And also the truck is fixed so they're able to leave. So, though I also like that you get to see Casey and April getting closer, but then the turtles appear out of nowhere, real cock blockers here. Every time it seems to be a movie about a relationship between humans, the turtles show up to say, no, it's about the marketable creatures that you're here for.

And we get some Casey Jones backstory where he played hockey in the minor leagues until he got injured. Yeah, yeah, there's no time for it, but yeah, you at least get a little hint of what his deal is. And I guess the important thing is to see that Casey and April are becoming closer, so their kiss at the end doesn't make no sense. Yeah, he's not shoving her around anymore. So they get in the truck, drive back to the one part of the street that they still have

in North Carolina. And again, another joke flew over my head as a kid. Now I know what it's like to travel without a green card. Like damn. Yeah. Social commentary. And that Rafael, he's reading the New York Times. He's not reading the New York Post.

And you know what? Elias Kataeus as Casey, he has some really good facial reactions when he is soaking wet. He's like, you know what? It's not so bad. And then he turns to see them going into the sewer. The look on his face is so good. Yeah. Very good frown on that guy. But this is when they, we gotta rest here before heading out to fight the foot. And this is when they find out Danny is hiding.

And I like, he says, don't shoot. They go like, I don't think it's loaded kid. Yes, the return of Danny. I can't wait to see how his story was resolved. I guess the story ends with him saying, it's Dan now. I'm a man. He finally grew up enough, yeah. Well, I'm more interested in why,

so Casey Jones thinks he's being called gay when he's called a claustrophobic. Here is the third joke that's confusing, and I know what they're trying to go for. So, April's gonna call the dad from the sewer phone. Casey is still like, I don't wanna stay in the sewer because I'm a human being with dignity. And Don is like, you're a claustrophobic.

And Casey says, I never even looked at another guy before. So Casey is mishearing Don as saying, you're a homophobe or you're homophobic, but Casey is reacting as if Don was calling him gay. Yeah. So that doesn't make any sense, unless you reverse engineer the joke and be like, well, homophobic people are often gay.

If you try to take it apart, but it's a kid's movie, and that joke doesn't make any sense. The only other way I was trying to have it make sense is that I thought, did Casey Jones think he was called a closet case instead of a claustrophobic? But I don't know if they knew that term so well in 1990. I don't know. I mean, I guess homophobic would be more well known, but that seems to be the intent, but it's a complete misfire because for all the reasons we just discussed,

it's a very strange joke and it shouldn't be in this movie. No, also they shouldn't have a gay panic joke in your turtles movie. I think. No, I mean, if you're going to make a joke where Don goes, you're claustrophobic, he could be like, I love gay people. My brother is gay, something like that. But they're not going to put that in this movie. No, I mean, well, it would make Casey seem like not a regular guy.

He should hate gay people by being a regular tough guy. And yeah, they, oh yeah, this is when Casey decides he's going to sleep in the truck for plot purposes later. Danny then really appreciates April's art and April gives him a freebie, which, uh, can be used later to be found by Shredder. And that's all. I would have had this art locked down. The turtles know that they can't be found out, uh, their identities.

It drives me insane when Danny's like, Oh, I love your art, can I have this? He takes it, he folds it about 32 times, we're shoving it in his pockets. Yeah, this, well, this is why like I've had this, you know, where I hang out with friends and their kids and if you have a, if you have a toy, you or whatever, the kid will say, ooh, can I have it? And I'm just thinking like, if I hand this to you, this toy is destroyed and I just have to be fine with that. Well, you have to keep your toys at home. Yes, normally I do, but I did have this,

when we went to Japan at a gotcha thing, this kid was clearly standing around waiting. He got a one piece toy he didn't want, and he was hoping somebody would get a new gotcha and he could offer to trade. And we were watching him watch us get the gotchas the whole time, and my husband and I both decided like we're gonna offer him one of these,

and if this kid tries to get both, then we're gonna say, oh, then you can't have either. Like we wanted to teach the kid a lesson that we're like, well, we'll be nice and trade one with you but we're not giving you both our toys. Oh, that's very sweet. And we did, we gave him, I believe he had a Nico Robin but he wanted Luffy and we, but we also got,

I think it was a Frankie too, so we made him pick between those two. Okay, well I have the one gotcha thing I actually won for a 100 yen machine. Despite spending about 40 US dollars on gotcha or UFO catcher or crane games, I won nothing and they're all rigged and the country should be ashamed of themselves.

I lost 20 on, the one crane game I played, I played it for 20 bucks and then I was like, what am I doing, what am I, my husband actually did win one on about five tries, he did good on a crane game I played, I played it for 20 bucks and then I was like, what am I doing? My husband actually did win one on about five tries. He did good on a crane game. Yeah, Nina's much better than me. Though also, yeah, the gotcha I got, I did get a slime gotcha like yours at the airport.

It was one of those like, I got 200 yen left, here's the machine. Those machines are there to soak up the last yen you had before you fly out. And it's one of those ones where you almost always win something just because it costs two yen and you're putting in 200. You're basically getting an eraser.

Yeah. Yeah, so then Donnie and Mikey learned that there's pizza there, but do you like penicillin on your pizza? Again, joke, didn't make sense to me as a kid. I get it now. It's covered in bacteria, you turn into penicillin. I think it was a whisper to my mom,

like what's penicillin? She's like, oh, it's mold, it's just mold, don't worry. I feel like if this wasn't the brand Domino's, Donnie and Mikey would eat that pizza. They wouldn't give it a military funeral. A very, a very silly joke. I mean, they live in the sewer and they're not gonna eat like two day old pizza.

They're gonna eat it. We also get fun acting on Casey stuck in the truck and trying to get comfortable. I like how he brings down the window and then feels like he can breathe. The joke is he is claustrophobic. Yeah, cause he's like claustrophobic. That's crazy, I'm is claustrophobic. Yeah, cause he's like claustrophobic, that's crazy. I'm not claustrophobic.

And then he has to roll down the window because he's going to have a panic attack. He's a good actor. This guy's a funny actor. How do, okay. A question for the movie. How does he have claustrophobia, but he can wear a mask all the time?

Hmm. Hey, that's a good point. Are those different? Can he compartmentalize that part of his life? You know what? If he was trained on the ice and grew up wearing it, maybe that feels comfortable to him. Could be, could be. That's what I'll say.

I also always forget about Danny having his nightmares. Like this almost feels like a Freddy movie. This I feel like could be a Simpsons gag where Shredder's like, listen to me Danny, and Splinter's like, no, listen to me, Danny. They're just battling back and forth. Two echoing voices in his head, I am your father now. I guess it's the guilt drives him to go to Splinter

and tell him his kids are okay, but of course he runs away so Casey can follow him, and that way Casey gets to have his own solo fight away from the turtles. I don't want there to be more Danny content, but we should have seen more of a falling out with Danny's dad. Maybe Danny's dad made a mistake.

I don't see what the drive is to go be the son of Shredder, because his dad just seems like a normal dad. Yeah, maybe he's too busy as a single father, I guess. We don't even know that. Really, do we? Well, I would think a man who, a man back then, if he has a wife, he's making her drop the kid off at school. That's true.

Yeah. All you needed is a scene of Danny telling his dad, I'm not a kid anymore, dad. Then his Dan line at the end makes sense. But otherwise, otherwise doesn't really make sense he's not a kid anymore but he will be tried as one yeah well fortunately he's got a dad with connections to the cops mm-hmm so as Casey is sneaking around we get another of the soundtrack drops this is let the

walls come down by Johnny Kemp see very forgettable songemp's a... This is when Splinter runs into him and Splinter has a real, he's really getting Danny's ass. He's saying like, do you now hide from your surrogate family as well? And this is when Splinter tells the rest of his origin story in another Super 8 flashback. Shin's love was only for my master and rather than see him fight Saki for her hand, story in another Super 8 flashback. Master returned home to find his beloved shin lying on the floor and Then he saw her killer

Saki wasted no words and during the struggle my cage was broken I blip to Saki's face fighting and clawing but he threw me to the floor and took one swipe with his katana slicing my ear Then he was gone and I was alone. Whatever happened to this Oroku Saki? No one really knows. But you wear his symbol upon your brow. I think Splinter knows.

I'm pretty sure. He can't be this stupid. But yeah, we were talking about this earlier and he should say, oh, you know what? I should have told April and the kids this. Oh, well, you care about this, right? This would be a sin of that horrible thing. But when the turtles see Shredder without the mask on

and they say like, it's the guy, it's like you just have to assume Raphael and the rest of the turtles were told this story before by Splinter because they never hear this story. It's all he does in the movie. You figure he's just doing it once a day, 15 years ago. Yes, Splinter, Master Splinter, we know how you lost your ear. We know.

We know about the ooze, the secret's out. But I really do love the puppetry on the rat kicking and punching to learn. It's so insane that he had this super intelligent mind before the ooze hit. Yes, yeah, rats can't normally punch and kick in a karate style, but this one can. You can see why the animated series decided

it makes much more sense for it to just be Hamato Yoshi becomes a rat man. So in terms of the comics, is this the origin story? This is the comic. It is a rat that grew to man size in the comics too, yeah. I really prefer the animated story. It's smarter. I think in the, yeah, I feel like in the other movies,

it's all over the place. I do believe it is a rat that becomes human size in Mutant Mayhem as well. It is, yeah. They keep that element of it. I think it's done better though. Oh, my biggest, maybe my biggest laugh in Mutant Mayhem is when he hands the weapons to the child turtles.

That's such a funny scene. Just like, oh wait, you should not give a katana to a five year old and they just are all standing there, these little nerdy kids with their giant weapons. And he's played by a horrible father, Jackie Chan. That's right. Yeah, I I always forget what a bad dad he is. But until there was that fake video, somebody shared it of like there's a movie where he's watching clips of himself from other movies with a with a fictional daughter.

But people shared it of like Jackie Chan watches stuff with his daughter. And it's like, no, his real daughter was born out of wedlock and he disowned her and she's gay and she never talks to him. Wasn't he born into an extremely abusive circus or something like that? Some kind of insane circumstances? Jackie Chan was trained in Peking opera in the old school style, which is mainly beating and starving children. So I mean, Jackie Chan had a horrible upbringing. I mean, this is why that tradition then continue all the Peking Opera actors, they became stuntmen and martial arts actors in early Kung Fu movies.

So that's why they would be, you know, horribly injured on set and they'd be like, get up and fall down again. This is, remember your horrible training where you were beaten as a child. Steve Barron even has a story that when you know that context on the commentary makes you sad. He's nothing but complimentary to the Hong Kong stuntman who came in to film it from Golden Harvest. But he relates some story

of like one of the guys even got kind of hurt during the production, but he was right back on it, kept a great spirit, he was a great guy, and I was thinking, boy, it sounds like a nice story if you don't think about it. Yeah, yeah. Hey, you know, I hope that man is still alive and reflecting on his life as a turtle.

Fortunately, in the future, in the second Ninja Turtles movie, the stunt performer for Raphael will then be hired by Golden Harvest to be one of the bad guys in Drunken Master 2. Oh, cool. So there was still a connection of turtles in Jackie Chan films after this film even.

Then we cut to Casey slinking around. He even does the classic beat up a guy and steal his clothes to disguise bit. Yeah, very metal gear. And hey, it helps that it's just a mask, just a ninja mask. And then in the background, you can hear the next song, Spin That Wheel by Hi-Tec 3.

And I always misremember this as the same band who did Pump Up The Jam by Technotronic because it sounds exactly the same. But it's because it's the same singer from Technotronic but not the full band. Okay. But does Spin That Wheel versus Pump Up The jam. Nina and I have been watching a lot of music videos from this era of Euro Eurobeat whatever you call it

European dance music it's so great. I'm falling back in love with it. The singer from Technotronic who's in high-tech three is Ya Kid K so that's the similar singer. I guess the genre of that song is hip house, which I've never heard before. Oh, I hadn't heard that genre either. But I always as a kid thought, oh, it's the same band as Pump Up the Jam, but it's technically not. Now that video is nuts. You gotta watch that video. I'm imploring all of our listeners to stop and look it up, because I think it invented the backgrounds in the video game earthbound

It's just a woman in front of these wild backgrounds. It's a very cheap video, but it's very inventive and fun All right, I'm pulling that up after we record this what I mean pizza. I'm gonna be watching it So then you told me you're going to a local place now you change your story. It's delivery It's delivery from a local place. You should go out. It's a Friday night. You just recorded a local place. Now you changed your story. It's delivery. It's delivery from a local place. You should go out. It's a Friday night. You just recorded a four hour podcast. Okay, you're right.

You're right. I'll pitch that to the hubby. So then Shredder shows up and he sees that Danny has cast off his dragon doji and he's basically about to murder Danny, but then supernaturally almost he notices that there's a piece of paper on him that is proof that the turtles are back.

I can't help but notice there's a small folded piece of paper in your pocket. It reminds me of Bart talking to the exterminator in Bart Sells His Soul. He's asking about Millhouse and he says, did he have a small piece of paper in his pocket? And the guy goes, yeah, you can't forget a thing like that. It's true.

It's the same, man. Though what Shredder should do here is disembowel Danny right here. Yeah, just cut his head off. Like stab him in the neck, be like, there, that's your price for disloyalty. Or also Shredder in classic movie form, like a Bond villain, he's like,

you kill the rat, I'm outta here, I trust you, Tatsu. He never actually shreds anything in this film. Boy, you're right, very light on any cuts in this movie, but I mean, it's to get a PG, but yeah, it's like he says, I will make no mistake this time, I will go there myself, saying like, yeah, I'd let you kill, you guys are losers, I will make no mistake this time. I will go there myself. Saying like, yeah, I'd let you kill. You guys are losers. I'm doing this.

Then we cut back to the turtles lair. We think the ninjas are about to get the drop on them. They're sneaking into the sewers. Funny footage of a bunch of footclan ninjas climbing into sewer crates. Now I'm sure my attention picked up when I was a kid upon watching this section of the film, but now I feel like there's just too much fighting. It's sort of like in the Mortal Kombat film,

we did a commentary on it for RetroNauts a while ago. There's about like a 40 minute stretch of nothing but fighting and it gets kind of old. I will say this fight now as a kid, I think I loved every single second of this fighting. I was excited the whole time, but there comes a point where the fights, so like, okay, you're hitting the same guys

over and over again. Every footclimb member looks the same. It gets very repetitive, I agree. Though Baron admits they fill the room full of steam and have them get beat up off screen because they had to save money. Oh, great budget saving steam. I do love how it's then the steam goes away and Raph goes like, gosh, I do hope there's

more of them. Then we cut back to Casey Jones. When he runs into Splinter, I love his reaction of seeing Splinter. He's like, whatever. Yeah, it takes him and he's like, he sees the rat, it's like, oh my God, then he thinks, he's great at this dialogue free acting. You could tell the expression is, I've seen so much.

Well, who cares what this is? I guess it's a giant rat, no crazier than giant turtle. Yeah, it's all expressed, this is why this guy gets cast by Scorsese and Fincher. This is the kind of acting that he's wasting on a new line cinema movie. And Casey says, I'm Casey Jones of Friends. So he's really fallen in with the turtles. But then when he turns around, he sees, we see Tatsu and a bunch of guys behind him. Now if you see one of the

extras smoking a cigarette that's David Foreman, Leo's body actor. So that's all four of the turtle body actors on screen. Though they didn't give him any lines unlike Josh Pace or Michelangelo's voice actor or body actor. Then yeah we even cut back to Leonardo and all the turtles fighting. I mean, look, guys do a bunch of stuff. I do like Leonardo rolling around while still holding on to katanas.

That's some good stunt acting. And it's also rare time where he keeps his, like he actually blocks something with his sword and then disarms a guy and then does like a cartwheel flip off. That's a few times he actually uses a sword. During this part I noticed, oh the swords are coming into play,

what are the swords doing? Because they can't cut people. So I was paying attention to this. And seemingly April O'Neill has been playing the TEMNT game on the NES because she knows a down strike with that bow staff works great. Roger Eber probably lit up and he thought oh, that's how I beat Rocksteady He set it back up that night after watching it by the way no chapter about that game in life itself unfortunately

I get you know he should have he should become more of a gamer when he couldn't eat anything He spent his last years on this earth trolling gamers and I love him for that the crap he said about Transformers movies imagine that like he'd be wishing for the transformers movies now I mean still alive that poor man. I guess maybe you know, I wish he would have lived another 50 years Let's say but certain things about the state of motion pictures have degraded since he's passed one of my favorite bits our podcast pal Will Sloan does on Twitter is when he says he found a crystal ball and gives the review star ratings

that Roger Ebert would give to current movies. I feel like he's incredibly accurate. Oh yeah, Will Sloan knows his Ebert for sure. Then we come back to Casey, he's getting his butt kicked by Tatsu. Also, only now, I always thought that was a bad breath joke he did to Tatsu, but it's not. No, it's a, he makes like a chlorosceptic spray joke? Well, some sort of throat spray that I've heard before. He says Primatine, which is an asthma medication.

Oh, asthma, okay. So he's saying that like, oh, you're breathing heavily because you've got asthma. But as a kid, that sign always meant breath spray and just the easy joke of you have bad breath. Now, it's a very easy joke to go to. Speaking of watching things in hotel rooms, my wife and I were watching an episode of Family Matters in a hotel room,

and Carl and Steve were, they had to go to some police basement for some reason. I forget, we didn't see the first half of the show. Who needs to? And then all these criminals find out where they are, and this crazy gang descends on them, and one yells at Steve, and he's like, you need a breath mint.

But get this, he not only turns into Bruce Lee Steve Urkel, but Carl turns into Bruce Lee Carl. So there are two Bruce Lee's fighting at the same time, all of these gang members. It's great. Wow. Yeah. That sounds like the scene in Ninja Turtles. Yes, yes.

That's so funny. And then it's those moments where you realize, God, Jaleel White was so buff and he couldn't wait to show it off. You know, I bet he was, he started in good shape, but as he grew older on the show and was being known as the world's premier nerd, I think that probably spurred him into taking even better care of his body.

He didn't do an Asian accent for Bruce Lee. Instead, he's like, I'm wee-wee angwee. He did an Elmer Fudd style Bruce Lee. And I don't think Bruce Lee. Instead he's like, I'm wee wee angwee. He did an Elmer Fudd style of Bruce Lee. And I don't think Bruce Lee talked like that, but we were saved from something much worse. That's good. That's good to know. Well, I'm guessing this is second half of the series,

Family Matters, since it's just a Carl and Steve adventure. You know, we looked this up at some point to see when the show got crazy. There was Robo Urkel in season three, so it didn't take very long. So Casey is getting his butt kicked. It feels like Elias Kataeus didn't want to or couldn't learn a lot of choreography because he just gets punched like three times and then does two moves with a golf club and that's it. Like he sees a golf club and then just smacks a guy.

Yeah, he does the same thing he does with the cricket bat. It's the same move. And seemingly caving in Tatsu's skull. Though he's alive in the next movie. But Tatsu will return. But, and then I like how he mumbles it, but like I'll never call golf a dull game again. And this is the scene I was talking about earlier

that has Donatello skateboarding, and we don't just see the feet, we see the entire actor, and he's knocking guys out with the bow staff as he's skateboarding. This seems like it must have taken a lot of tries to get right. It's such a lot, and it's through the fake sewer they built,

which Baron said even that they went to such work that they wanted to have tide lines in the water there. Like they could show like, oh, well this is from where the water only goes so high at high tide. I'm like, wow, who thinks of that? They're nice looking sewers for being fake. But yeah, that probably took a ton of takes.

When people characterize Secret of the U's as having way cartoonier fights in it than this movie, you think of this skateboard scene, and also, twice in this movie, in two different fights, they do the two shells smack a guy in the head moment. Yeah, there's some realistic violence in terms of like, oh, that was a punch, that was a kick, but there's still goof-em-ups all over these fighting scenes. Uh, then we cut back to the uh, base after Tatsu is knocked out,

and I have this clip because I love how Sam Rockwell says these lines here. You want to be first, Junior? We have a loyalty to the Shredder. The Shredder uses you. He poisons your minds to obtain that which he desires. He cares nothing for you or the people you hurt. We're a family. Family? Is that what you said? Family? You call this here and that down there.

Family? And then he just goes like, eh, enough with you. Casey believes in a strong family, strong family values, apparently. He's a conservative guy, totally makes sense. But yeah, I just, I love the way Sam Rockwell says, we have a loyalty to the shredda. Such a silly, silly fake New York accent. And then they just walk out of there with Splinter

and we see later that all the kids like followed him out. So. Yeah, they don't do much. They just gather to watch a rooftop battle. How they end up on the rooftop is kind of confusing to me It's like during the fight when the ninjas run away And it is fun to see them like running out of the sewer the same way they came in but then some of them go up a Fire escape and the guys follow them up there. So I guess that's it.

Yeah, there's no reason for them to be up there. It just kind of like happenstance, I guess. And then Donatello Michelangelo briefly become the writer's room of pitching different ways to do the pun of shell. Oh man, they were so lucky they got shell because it just, an endless font of puns are available available and hey, they're naughty. They're naughty too. Yeah, they're part of fun I like not just saying shell shocked or whatever

Which is a joke about that's a joke about PTSD is trauma. Yeah from World War one They got to cancel that I got I guess the one that the so Donatello I mean in the beginning he was like bossa nova Chevy Nova he was trying out all these things he finally lands on that was a shell of a good hit. That's right that's the one they finally approve of and then there's a fun tracking shot up the fire escape as this is how they see them all get up there. This is when Mikey says, the trailer line we heard, but the right way. Hey, wait for me!

Whoop! God, I love being a turtle! As far as I know, that was not in the cartoon at all. They didn't really say that. I think it's just from the films, and then it would be repeated in the other films, right? Yeah, yeah, I think in the second one they say, God, I still love being a turtle.

Yeah, same with like, I made another funny. That's all that's in The Secret of the U. But yeah, it's fun. The duck, too, is fun, silly animation. Or like, you know, it doesn't physically work with how the puppets are built, but who cares? Yeah, yeah, it's a big trick, but hey, it's cute. Then when they get up to the roof, too, I like the,

I think it is Leonardo and Raph. It's definitely Raph at the end. They do a wheelbarrow, well, not even a wheelbarrow, it's like a tire thing, it's like out of the video game. It's like what Marge and Homer do in the Simpsons game when you have them stand close to each other, it's their combo attack. Right, that's why I was thinking video games,

not the turtles that do it, it's Marge and Homer in the Konami game. And what's going on here, Shredder descends from outer space? He was waiting the whole time and is able to do a slow-mo landing with his superpowers. This bit here is so funny when they go like, they say, who is this guy? Your heroes in the movie have no clue who the main villain is.

I hope someone tells him after he's murdered. Yeah. You know that was, that was the Shredder. He's kind of a big deal. But yes is when shredder shows up and He says the whole movie something about how you tell me they fight is Familiar like he can tell the way they were taught that it's the same as his rival But I like how he says you fight well in the old style, but you've caused me enough trouble now You face the Shredder.

So yeah, sorry, I guess when Splinter shows up, he does explain who Shredder is. That's true. Seconds before he's crushed to death. You know, also when I remember how Baron said he looked to Ghostbusters for this movie, this whole four guys getting their butt kicked by somebody much more powerful than them on a rooftop.

On a rooftop, yeah. That's Ghostbusters, man. But yeah, they each go one at a time at M. He beats them all up very easily. I like how match you for it is how Donatello and Michelangelo decide who's gonna go next. And yeah, this is the final damn of the movie, number six, when Don loses the rock, paper, scissors match and he goes, damn. Man, so Donatello, Leo doesn the final damn of the movie. Number six, when Don loses the rock paper scissors match,

and he goes, damn. Man, so Donatello, Leo doesn't say damn, right? He's the one. The only one that doesn't say damn, yep. That's like you said, yeah, he's the good boy. Fucking nerd. But Shredder is kicking all their butts. We cut to Casey with the Foot Clan kids,

and this is where Splinter somehow sneaks away. Casey doesn't know what happened to him. Also note the telltale dump truck in the background. Yeah, he backs up this garbage truck to knock over the fire escape to get the ninjas to stop crawling up the building, you know, to kill them basically. To knock them off the building and kill them, hurt their spines. At the very least, break some bones. Also, the way he says, oh boy, leftovers. What's that lisp? What's the deal with that? I don't know if that's a reference. I don't know what's happening here.

Yeah, it's very weird. It's very strange. But it's to get the dump truck in place for his murder later. But apparently the deleted cameo for Eastman and Laird in the movie is they were supposed to be the dump truck drivers who like Casey shoves away to take their dump truck Apparently they're very deep in the background of one shot if you know where to look for him But I couldn't even see him so it wasn't like hotwired or anything that the dump truck drivers were on the scene Yes, yeah, he so he stole a dump truck as well. Wait, this is a garbage truck.

A dump truck is something different. A dump truck's the one that like lifts at a 45 degree angle and empties. You're right, it wouldn't have a compact or anything. This garbage truck. As far as I know. Maybe dump trucks have been improved upon in recent years. And then we cut back to the boys losing the fight and this is when

Donatello almost like breaks the fourth wall saying like maybe somebody ought to tell him that we're the good guys meaning they should be winning and this is their movie. So then this is when Shredder crosses the line and is able to get the boys to make a mistake. Where's Splinter? to make a mistake. I just love I love how the shred shredder, I mean, it's a, it's a separate voice actor from the actor on screen, but the way he looks at the camera and you can see his mouth through the screen on it. He goes like, do I? Like he's just so smug of like, Oh, you think I'm lying? Like as far as he knows Splinter is dead.. And Leo loses his cool. It turns out running at him doesn't work. They learn that four times. He has to learn a fifth time and nearly be killed.

And I caught this as a little bit of storytelling. When he says them to drop their weapons, you can see Raphael is thinking about it for a little bit. But now to save his brother, he will give up the size that he chased after at the start of the movie. It's lucky the nunchucks get wrapped around the fire escape ladder that Splinter will be nearby for the end of the film. And you know what?

British people somehow cut around those nunchucks. How? The important part of the movie. I don't know how. How is any of this explained without the presence of spinning nunchucks? But so yes, he's he talks them into dropping their weapons and He tells them you know the three of you might have overpowered me with a loss of but one but now his your fate will be his and

Shredder would have won if a little rat didn't show up The three of you might have overpowered me with the loss of but one now your fate Yes Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooo ooooo ooooo ooooo ooooo Omato Yoshi. And this is when he uses Splinter, Splinter uses Shredder's own trick against him by pissing him off enough to make a mistake. Yeah, I guess Shredder, having seen four giant turtles and not questioning it, he would assume naturally, well, this must be the rat I wounded. That's why they gave him the cut ear, just to make it extra clear.

I'm like, oh, okay, that is the ear I cut, but we said it earlier. But he didn't recognize him before, only now when he hears the name Hamato Yoshi. It took me a few rewinds to understand what's happening in this final scene because Shredder runs in, what does he have, like a spear or something? Yeah, he's got a spear, yes.

He runs at Splinter, Splinter somehow parries the spear thrust with nunchucks. I didn't know you could do that. I don't think you can. And because of that, Shredder is hanging off the building from the spear with the chain of the nunchucks. I don't know if Splinter is going to kill him. It seems like he's not, but Shredder pulls out a dagger,

throws it at Splinter. It's only a few frames, but Splinter catches the dagger, and that's why he drops, he loosens his grip on the nunchucks, which causes the spear to fall through the chain and causes Shredder to fall. But the catching of the dagger is so fast, it's not really clear what's happening unless you're kind of framing through it.

Yeah, I, as a kid, didn't really follow what happens. Only on the framing for, and I guess the point of this is like in a Disney movie to make the heroes blameless in the death of the villain. Now in the issue one, when the turtles have their rooftop fight with Shredder, eventually they just slice him up enough that he like, they kick his ass and cut him a ton of times

and then he falls off the building and seemingly to his death and explodes. But they don't want the turtles. The turtles have to win a philosophical battle and Splinter has to actually win the fight for him, which as a kid, I did think was lame. I was like, oh, the turtles can't even win their own final battle in the movie they're in.

And he's taken out by a stationary rat puppet. Yes. Who has to reverse him. I mean, theoretically, I get that it's like Bruce Lee did the, this whole speech and this speech is copied by Spike Spiegel in the cowboy bebop show. But the thing about the philosophy of redirecting energy, right. And being like water. And so that's what Splinter does.

But like you said too, Bob, he has to catch the knife so he lets go of the nunchuck, which then makes Shredder fall, but it has to be self-defensively catching a knife, and also the Shredder would have been saved if he didn't try to kill Splinter in his last second. Yeah, but then they let Casey be the callous murderer. So...

Well, he says whoops! Actually, I have that clip here. The way he says whoops is very fun. Now I will finish what I began with your ear! Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh This is essentially an 80s movie, and every 80s kids movie has to have a horrific scene that's inappropriate and this is it. Yeah, that he falls into the garbage truck and you see the helmet he was just wearing be flattened. So you assume that's a man's head and skull

being cracked open by machinery there. Now in the sequel, they retell this ending to say, and then they just say, he took a swan dive into a garbage truck because Casey Jones isn't in the second movie. They don't say, and then our friend Casey pulled the switch. Yeah, they retconned him out of that movie. But in the movie, in the sequel, Shredder just shows up with a scar, another scar on his face to imply that he survived this. But as far as this movie cares, he's dead. Then it's celebration time, also all the kids

got to see Shredder's fall from grace, so they changed their mind too. And Danny's storyline ends one, he apologizes to April and gives her back the 20 bucks, which I like that. That's a lot of money in 1990. Isn't it nice to see the old 20 again without it's complicated line work? Instead, the giant Lincoln we've had, or it's not Lincoln.

Jackson. Jackson, yes. And I mean, there's a giant Lincoln on the five now too, but the 20 was the first to get the big head, right? I think so. It was the most counterfeited bill. Yeah, it was that or a hundred. I remember I worked in retail when they changed over

and I remember seeing it be slowly phased out. I worked at retail and you had to mark every bill over a 20 with a little marker to make sure it was real. Yeah, the little marker. Yeah, I had the same thing in the cash register box too. Yeah. I like that a guy making $5 an hour was also in charge of checking for counterfeit money.

If you took a bad 100, it's your ass, minimum wage employee. And then Danny reconnects with his dad, and he says, just Dan now. And I do like how his dad reacts of like, Dan, all right. Pretty crazy. Oh, my parents still barely call me Henry. They have to, my mom needs to remind herself like, I mean Henry, and like, cause I'm still Max to them.

I see. Well, my parents call me Bobby still and will forever. Well, do you never stand up for yourself like Danny? My name's Bob now. Just Bob. At the age of 12 I decided to just roll with Bob and my family didn't, well they were like, that's fine, but you'll always be Bobby.

I'm not that, I didn't tell my mom to start calling me Henry, but she went with it. My dad, still Max, I she went with it. My dad still max. I'm still maxed in. I do like how Danny says, uh, trust me. Like April doesn't even know why she got handed a 20 back. Then we kept to April chatting with Charles and that's why she gets a raise, her happy ending, she gets her job back and she's getting paid as much as May. Uh, the, her competing anchor.

And a corner office. And for some reason we get to see Police Chief Stearns again where he, the kids are giving him a tip as to where to find the headquarters but he's not arresting any of them. Yeah, it's, I feel like he should be like, oh thanks, now arrest all these fucking punks. It's, that's Sam Rockwell at the last one

which, listeners, I don't need to explain to you the joke reference here of check out the East warehouse over on Lairdman Island. Yes. Yeah, you get it, you get it. Then we cut to April, she's doing her own makeup because she's a professional, getting ready to get on camera right after this whole fight.

That's pretty cool of her. I like that. Yeah, yeah. She's just like using the side view mirror of a car to apply some quick makeup before jumping right back into her old role. She is a real pro. She is totally a lowest lane here that she's ready to get back. Fights don't phase her. Super villains don't phase her. She is ready to be a reporter. And now she's the more assertive one in the relationship. She's tossing him around. I like it. He's like, I look like I just called Mike Tyson a sissy. She's like, do you need to go to the ambulance? And then that's when she's like, so come on, are you gonna kiss me or what? We got to finish this movie. Some parent in this audience needs closure on this. The kids kids don't care Kids don't give a crap about the kissing. Yeah, I'm surprised all of the turtles cheer it

None of them do that like you mushy stuff look joke with it. They doing kids stuff I guess they're teens so they're ready for this kind of content and then Donatello shouts out 9.95 which I don't think is a coincidence That is the name of the song that is playing over this scene by the band Spunkadelic. Spunkadelic, disgusting, gross. He's screaming, yeah, I was like, 9.95, was he rating the kiss?

I did not understand this at all. I think so, but then it's also the name of the song playing on it, which is like, 9.95, name of the song playing on it, which is like 9.95. That's the song. Though it plays that for like 10 seconds, but then the Turtle Power song starts for the credits and then it plays 9.95. It's weird pacing.

But after all of this, it's time for one last joke. Woohoo! 9.95! Alright, it's roll! Alright, Casey! Yeah, that's the way to go! We were awesome! Bodacious!

Yeah! Big shit! Yeah! Uh... Gnarly! Radical! Nodacious! Big shit! Yeah! Uh... Gnarly! Radical!

Yeah! Totally tubulous, dude! Wicked! Hellacious! Omega! I have always liked... Kawabunga! Huh? KOWABUNGA!

I made a bunny! There we go. Yeah, I'm just looking over the lyrics for this song and they're delightful. No, yeah, I wrote down a few of my favorites too, like, when there's a battle, got the enemy wishing that they stayed at home instead of fighting, these ninja masters with moves like lightning.

They were once normal, but now they're mutants, splinters, the teachers, so they are the students. And then the roll call. Our science is not tight, it turns out. I also love that in the trailer they show the very end of the movie because who was ever cutting the trailer was like, we have to put Cowabunga in the trailer, but it's like, but that's the that's the end of the movie. Yeah, it turns out to not matter because I've seen this movie a number of times now and

I forget that it's the Cowabunga origin movie. And thanks to the German DVD, there is a very expensive looking cut ending that it totally makes sense why they cut it. It's a terrible ending. This works so much better. So basically the work print version they have on there, it's almost all visual. So I don't have the clip, but it is after they all celebrate it then cuts to a comic book office. April and Danny are at it with the drawings. April drew and they are pitching a Ninja Turtles comic to a comic book publisher, and he says,

it's a little far-fetched, don't you think? And then behind him in the window is all the turtles, and then Michelangelo like falls, like basically does like the third panel like fall back over being called far-fetched, and he's like, far-fetched, sheesh! That's called a Bazooka Joe reaction. Yes, exactly. Yeah, that sounds a lot like the stinger for the Super Mario Bros. movie, except the Japanese

folks are interested in the story and they're talking to one of the villains? One of the reformed villains? No, that's right. It turns, Iggy and Spike want to turn it into their own movie instead. Like, yeah, we want, or video games. Like, we want to call it the Super Koopa Brothers. At least they knew it was too silly to be shown as anything but a post credits thing. This they decided not even good enough to be post credits, but it looked expensive. It looked like they actually had like blue screen and stuff for it. That's nuts.

Yeah. It's so that's on the, uh, the German DVD, right? Yeah. And you can find it on YouTube. People, and stuff for it. That's nuts, yeah. So that's on the German DVD, right? Yeah, and you can find it on YouTube. People have uploaded it. And it's got all the temp voices in it, too. So I'm looking at the Partners in Crime discography. They didn't do a whole lot, but their next single was in the Cool as Ice feature with Vanilla Ice.

How do you like that? Wow, they must have thought that they were on, like it was gonna be an even bigger hit, though unless they got a bad deal, for them to be the like single, Turtle Power was the single off the album too that already was a platinum album. Unless they had a bad manager,

they should be set for life from being on the Turtle soundtrack. Yeah, maybe that's why they stopped making music They simply had too much money. I love the turtles. It's it's way better than Ninja rap that's that wishes it was as good as turtle power. Yeah, it's it's it's honestly not as creative And after that songs over in full then they play the rest of the nine point nine five song And I only have one other bit from the other credits that I noticed. I talked about it before that Mark Friedman guy who's like, Oh, I'm the fifth

turtle who I get annoyed with and seeing in the documentaries. He must've worked some magic on there because he gets a special thanks at the start of those credits, like special thanks, Renee and Mark Friedman of Surge Licensing. Yeah, I saw the Surge Licensing. That's up front, right? Yeah, it's the first thing on the credit. Surge Licensing is also on the pre-movie credits,

but for them to get to be the special thanks at the start of the finale credits, that definitely sounds like a lawyer got involved and said, my clients have to be the first name in there. And so they I guess licensing they represented Eastman and Laird and they sold the rights for the movie and is that the reason why? Yeah basically Mark Friedman is an incredibly lucky guy who well I mean he correctly saw

that the turtles could be something. Surge licensing was a group he just started on a lot. Like it was a business card. And then he's the one who got in the meetings with Playmates, with Fred Wolf, and with the film producer, Gary Proper, who then sold this eventually to Golden Harvest. So Mark Friedman is the middle ground for all that stuff.

But I again say, go to his IMDB page, go to his personal website. Did he produce anything after the Ninja Turtles when he stopped working with him in like 93? I don't think so. But I mean, he seems like he's doing quite well. Good for him for being in the right place at the right time.

But I was just shocked. I'm like, wow, he gets these special thanks in the credit. That's amazing He's he's on the one of the turtle documentaries with a funny story of he was like, oh I had faith in this movie But nobody else did he tells the story that after the screening with playmates It was playmates that turned to him of like mark. Yeah, fuck this up Like this is gonna be a failure and kill the business. God. So he had a fun, I told you so afterwards.

It's always great to have one of those in your pocket. And you know, after getting to the end of this movie, just like in 1990, well this time I won't be asking my mom to buy it, I'll buy it myself, but as soon as it's over, I'm like, all right, pizza time, better. You end this movie, you wanna eat pizza. Yes, this movie sold at least

one pizza and the pizza industry should be forever thankful to the entire property Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. It just again where would the where would the food be without the turtles? I feel like we should put up a poll after this post of like after listening to this did you order pizza too? Yeah think of all the kinds there's Detroit style, there's Connecticut style, there's New York style, Sicilian, Chicago. There's so many styles of pizza. Have you tried them all?

Mm, boy. Well, I said Detroit earlier. I feel like I want Detroit, but I think there's a Detroit style in this area, I think. I think we're going out for Connecticut style pizza. It's really flat, the pieces are square, but it's delicious. Try it at home. Wow, I never heard of this Connecticut style. Yeah, they're always

inventing new kinds of pizza or at least individual states are making new kinds and exporting them to Canada and other places. And Bob, you are spoiled for pizza choices nearby in your neighborhood, I would assume. Yeah, I live around the Little Italy part of Vancouver and I'm surrounded by Lots of great Italian food and I will say the stereotypes are true lots of old Italian guys wearing track suits Smoking cigars. I'm a little too afraid to get close to see if they're wearing gold chains, but I think they are So if you like Tony Soprano Henry, you got to talk to these guys Only if they're gold I got gotta see if those gold chains are sitting

in gray chest hair. They better be. They better be. Man, yeah, no, but this was fun to go back to. Now, I wouldn't rate it a 9.95 like Donatello does, but there's definitely parts that are like, oh, this is slower than I remember, but this is so much better than so many other shows.

This isn't like with the Super Mario Brothers movie where people have to tell themselves, you know what's actually good? Like, nah, come on. I don't have to do that with this movie. So I gave this a three out of five on letterbox. I still like this film. I like it more than I did when I was a kid.

I think I was just kind of bored with it, like I said earlier. I think when people were reevaluating this movie the 10 15 years ago, I think they were Thinking too highly of it. I I appreciate what it does But I think there was this idea like oh, it's mature and serious and dark and not really it is silly The other movies are sillier which makes this one look like very very Tim Burton II Batman in comparison makes this one look like a very, very Tim Burton-y Batman in comparison. But I will say it is the best this version of a movie could ever be, or at least in this year with this budget. They did a good job, the puppets are great. I can

forgive all the canon changes because they were running with what they had, but what we're left with is just very charming and anything Henson is involved with is fun to watch to anything Henson is involved with Is fun to watch to see the evolution of these puppets which again would later be the focus of the dinosaurs TV series A year later just this technology being on the screen every week We're just seeing a preview of the future of puppets in this film. Yeah, I think this this holds up very well soon We will see what a real grim and gritty R-rated Turtles movie will be. Unless of course it doesn't get produced like a lot of movies don't, but maybe we will. Which it most certainly won't. Or it'll get made and thrown in a tax fire and

I don't want to see this movie, but I'm sure some people out there do so I'm not gonna wish it harm. Well, Paramount is trying to get bought by somebody so that seems this seems like the type of movie that then gets cancelled by a new owner for sure. I guess we'll see but hey, we'll always have the 1990 Turtles with no special editions released thanks to a lot of weird ownership stuff between like 18 different companies owning it but Paramount sort of owns it but so does Warner through New Line. It's very complicated. So that has been it for What a Cartoon Movie. Thanks so much for listening and for being a patron.

And we'll see you next time for our look at the first Futurama movie, Bender's Big Score. And we'll see you then. Got the enemy wishing that they stayed at home Instead of fighting these ninja masters with moves like lightning They were once normal, but now they're mutants Splint is the teacher so they are the students Leonardo, Michelangelo, and Donatello Make up the team with one other fellow, Rafael He's the leader of the group

Transformed from the norm by the nuclear group Pizza's the food that's sure to please These ninjas are instant pepperoni and cheese Back to the story, it's not hard to find Ninjas not just of the body but of the mind Those were the words that the master instructed But a letter from Shredder had splinter abducted That was the last straw, spring into action Step on the foot, now they're gonna lose traction Now this is for real, so you fight for justice Your shell is hard, so you shout, they can't dust us off Like some old coffee table Since you've been born you've been willing and able

To defeat the sneak, protect the weak Fight for rights and your freedom to speak Now the villain is chillin' so you make a stand Back to the wall, put your sword in your hand Remember the words of your teacher, your master Evil moves fast but good moves faster than light Shining for your illumination, good vs evil equals confrontation So when you're in trouble, don't give in and go sour

Try to rely on your Turtle Power To you are too, Bellevue, now To you are too, Bellevue, now To you is we to build your turtle To you are too, Bellevue, now To you are too, Bellevue, now To you are too, Bellevue, now To you is we to build your turtle To you are too, Bellevue, now To you are too, Bellevue, now

To you are too, Bellevue, now To you is we to build your turtle To be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, to be, There's a power in the feeling, a power in the sound It's rising up from the underground Nobody's perfect, down here on earth But we can rock this world for a grand win And I feel it coming from the east to the west And one by one, we do our personal best. And we're doing fine, I give it a 9.

I give it 9.95. Put your mind in overdrive. 9.95. Make the motion, you're feeling star-eyed 9.95 You've got to keep the faith alive Yes, friends! The new Turbo Ginsu! Woohoo! It dices, it slices, and yet makes french fries in three different... Whoops!

Mmm... kids.