Talking Simpsons - Special Free Version of Shrek - What A Cartoon Movie!

Episode Date: January 12, 2022

Happy new year! As we podcasters wrap up our holiday break, we're taking a week off from Simpsons to give you listeners a special treat: Four HOURS of Shrek chat! In case you didn't know, each month we do a premium podcast, What A Cartoon Movie, for our $10 Patreon subscribers, and now we're giving everyone a taste of the massive animation podcast fun we have each month. And of all the movies we covered last year, Shrek best of all covers the same early 2001 feelings that we're experiencing when discussing season 12. So enjoy our in-depth history and dissection of this ogre-rated film, and be sure to subscribe if you want to hear more! Support this podcast and get dozens of bonus episodes by visiting Patreon.com/TalkingSimpsons and becoming a patron! And please follow the official Twitter, @TalkSimpsonsPod!

Happy New Year everybody. I am Bob Mackey, one of your hosts, and I think Farquaad was the original Short King who is here with me today. Hey, I'm a believer. I could leave this podcast if I tried. It's Henry Gilbert. That's right. You're legally bound to stay here, Henry. And just like last year, we're giving you a little New Year's bonus. You're not going to be hearing your regularly scheduled Talking Simpsons episode. Instead, you're going to be getting one of our What a Cartoon Movie mega-sized podcasts. That's right. If you saw on the free feed last year when we took the first week of January off, that was for the Iron Giant podcast. And this is no less of a monolithic movie that we're covering this week or this time.

That's right. In April of 2021, very long ago, we covered the movie Shrek for its 20th anniversary. It's been affecting pop culture or infecting pop culture for 20 whole years and we covered it in detail we covered the history of it and we went blow by blow through the movie tons of clips all the stuff you like from our podcast oh yes yeah and we i mean if you love uh it focuses on the main character of what a cartoon movie as well jeffrey katzenberg we can't escape talking about in most of them yes uh he is he is the third chair on what a cartoon and and you know it's fun too because uh it just hit me

now that we are at april 2001 in the simpsons timeline of covering season 12 right now so we're actually lined up pretty well with the premiere of shredrek and with Talking Futurama we're also in spring of 2001 so it's a real fleek before the bad times era we're talking about here and Shrek represents pre-911 epoch as as much as anything does the arrogance of America yeah putting that big green monster on the screen so yeah four and a half hours of Shrek talk you're gonna be getting here that that's what we do every month on the What a Cartoon movie. Yeah, if you like hearing this mega long podcast and want to hear more,

I think there's maybe 37 other ones you can listen to. They're all between three to five hours long. Go to patreon.com slash Talking Simpsons. Sign up at the $10 level. You get access to the entire What a Cartoon movie catalog. We've covered so many things

over the past three complete years of What a Cartoon. Very varied subjects. Things likeace and gromit curse of the were-rabbit end of evangelion beavis and butthead do america so many things going on on that feed tons of disney movies i think this was our first dreamworks movie uh yes yeah then and then we not too long after that covered the rotel dorado and i'm sure we'll cover in other DreamWorks, either good or ill, we'll be covering other DreamWorks stuff too. And if you're a Simpsons fan, that Rotel Dorado one's pretty interesting

because we talk about David Silverman's involvement in that too. Yes, he left the Simpsons to go to DreamWorks and then ended up at Pixar briefly. Yeah, he was after like a year and a half at DreamWorks. He's like, nope, I'm out of here. Check out the entire archives at patreon.com slash talking simpsons if you want to hear us talk about animated movies super in depth just like we do in this one but now let's celebrate 2022 with our deep deep dive into the first shrek

film cartoons from present in the past every week will be an animated bash. What a cartoon. What a cartoon. Maybe a short but mostly short. We'll talk, we'll analyze, exploring as we go. What a cartoon. What a cartoon. What a cartoon. What a cartoon! What a cartoon! Hello everybody and welcome to What a Cartoon Movie, the podcast that's never ogre-rated. I'm one of your hosts, the hilarious Mike Myers character, Bob Mackie, and this is an audio exploration of every animated movie ever. Who is here with me today, as always?

Hey, it's Henry Gilbert, and I know the muffin man who lives on Drury Lane. And this month's movie is Shrek. They judge me before they even know me. I know you, Shrek, and I hate you. Come on, it's a happy Shrek-iversary, everyone. Yes, the 20th Shrek-iversary. Yes, now when you're hearing this at the end of April, that is when the first premieres of Shrek was going on. I guess a month beforehand it was at Cannes Film Festival.

Did not win the Palme d'Or. Some people say it got a good reaction, but they have an interest in saying that. We've been living in the world after Shrek ever since. It was four months before 9-11. We all saw Shrek, and the world was never the same again. And then in post-9-11 world, we had the DVD and that really brought us up. It pulled us back together that Christmas with that Shrek DVD. With all those extra songs at the end, all the donkey outtakes. It's been 20 years since Shrek farted his way into our hearts.

It's a beautiful thing. I saw Shrek in theaters. Did you, Bob? Oh, I saw it twice in theaters. Does that shock you? Yes, yeah. It should. theaters i did you bob as well i saw it twice in theaters does that shock you yes yeah it should i only saw it once and on first watch i thought it was good but over very quickly i was seeing people go like oh pixar's got a new challenger i was like what no like because i definitely even

on first viewing i was like that was good no way was that as good as toy story and it was a lot of cheap jokes and then i was getting increasingly pissed over time seeing people go like, oh, this is better than Pixar. This is better than Monsters, Inc. I was like, no. I was really caught up in the spell of Shrek because I saw this movie on a trip to see my friend who lived in Southern California. And I had like a week or so there. So we had a lot of time to kill. So we ended up seeing Shrek twice.

And the previous trip I went to see him was in the summer of 99 and we saw austin powers the spy who shagged me twice yeah baby yeah baby uh does that make you horny i hope not no but uh obviously growing up in the 90s as a comedy fan like huge mike myers fan this is before the cat in the hat and you know his terrible aughts with the love guru i love the first austin powers i'm okay with the second one the third one's awful but yeah i couldn't be more in love with mike myers and his comedy so of course i was there and yes i loved it i loved it enough to see it twice although the second time i was like oh i can take a piss during this hallelujah crap i don't care about it you get cloying garbage you don't want

to feel bad that was when a hallelujah cover was only slightly cliche but now i'm resentful toward trek because i grew up with with Disney stuff and I love Disney. But when I saw Shrek, I was like, get that Disney stuff away from me. I'm a man now, baby. All that crap was nothing. This is the future of entertainment. And I was still okay with Pixar. I'm not a big Monsters, Inc. fan, but yeah, I was there.

And then by the time the DVD came out, I was working in retail and that same friend was working at Suncoast and Shrek was on a loop. So he was watching Shrek four or five times a day. And every time I go into the store to say hi, Shrek would be on. He grew to hate Shrek. I grew to hate Shrek. And I think like the over merchandising of Shrek over that holiday season. The ogre merchandising? Yeah.

Fuck. Yes. The ogre merchandising of Shrek. It really, really pushed me away. And I never saw any of the other movies. merchandising yeah oh fuck yes the ogre merchandising of shrek it really really pushed me away and i never saw any of the other movies the only fun i had with shrek when tim and eric did unsolicited advertisement for shrek 3 yes i actually just watched that this morning they're like an expedia.com want to thank you shrek 3 oh man so many good friends here the weight is ogre weight

is ogre them and their little dealy bob head things and painted green. Yeah. Oh, one more thing though. As a Mike Myers fan and as an animated movie fan, when I saw this, I loved it, but I had an issue with it. Number one, Mike Myers,

I saw that character and so I made her an axe murderer. Yep. Number two, Eddie Murphy, I saw that character in Mulan. Yep. So totally unoriginal takes on these characters.

Well, Jeffrey Katzenberg wanted it to ride in true things, not a new idea like that oh and also fat bastard duh yeah how did i miss the most obvious character well shrek is like a slightly nicer fat bastard yeah that's who he is i mean fat bastard is a jerk but it's just in in a way it's mike myers just going like yeah i can do a scottish accent i have like scottish family members i think it's an imitation of his dad he described the accent as a scottish person who's lived in canada for 20 years okay that's that's how he describes it but not just the release time but if you weren't paying attention

in 2001 that christmas it was the dvd like i pulled up those commercials that were from then of like it is the dvd to own get it like it was the one of the first times because i think they noticed disney hadn't gone fully into dvd yet so they're like don't get the vhs get the dvd like this has all these extras the the karaoke dance party yeah i think they added a lot more singing over the credits right yes because the original movie ended with i'm a believer but then it kept going on the extended version yeah the extended version on the blu-ray it's a separate video it's the regular credit and you can then pull up the karaoke dance party well in the december of 2001 holiday season our president ordered us to buy shrek he did yeah we were

commanded to go out and shop shrek was he is a perfect symbol of like post 9-11 consumption and just whatever and the saddest thing about shrek though is that even if it was a good enough first film that was kind of funny its success made the next 10 plus years of animated feature films in america awful so much worse every shrek copycat whether from dreamworks or all of their competitors like the shrek copycats from within dreamworks were bad enough but then you had the stuff like sony animations open season oh yeah or nomio and juliet Over the Hedge. Yes, yeah. Happily Never Nafter, whatever it was called. I think it was our friend Scott Gairdner,

but somebody did this great video loop of all of those trailers that you got in the odds of just like a celebrity name over a hideous looking CGI creature. That was probably Lindsay Ellis because she has that great video of how the genie opened Pandora's box. Robin Williamsiams as the genie yes definitely look up that that video she also coined the term jeffrey katzenberg petty asshole or petty asshole jeffrey katzenberg but

everything after it had to be a celebrity fest of just like well how many famous people could we get in a room for like seven hours and say that no they star in this movie and doesn't this character look like them and and plus it it killed 2d animation like its success killed it on a feature scale i think it took a long time before a certain level of personality and expressiveness could come to 3d that you could get in 2d like and that that took many years for people to figure out yeah disney had to get their shit together really quickly and their first two cgi movies are not good i know i know people like meet the robinsons i thought it was bad i i didn't like it either now yeah even even things that i

heard were okay like robots i was like that wasn't disney though no no that was fine okay yeah you're right yeah but yeah that was another robin williams thing though it was yeah well hey go with the best if you're gonna get somebody get robin williams but yes i do hate the film shrek i watched it again uh before recording this uh and i'll do my like full rewatch note taking after we record this but when i watched i was like oh these scenes are better i remember that's legitimately funny and then a horrible thing will happen on screen i'm'm like, oh, no, a Matrix joke. No. 2001. Also, we'll get to it.

But All-Star in 2001. Even then, even in the theater in 2001, I was like, this song is like four years old. What are you doing, guys? Well, now it's an American anthem, Bob. We all are All-Star. Everything that glitters is gold. It's a soundtrack to every meme uh but yes what possibly could have caused shrek to enter our lives well listeners you know in these history

segments i usually focus on the director or like a key creative figure on it and while there are several great directors on this there if there's one auteur of Shrek. It is executive producer Jeffrey Katzenberg. Aw, is he okay? We are post the death of Quibi. I think he's gone into a cave for the last like six months. Once they shut down Quibi, Jeffrey Katzenberg didn't have to do any more interviews. So he's like, I'm going away now.

I think we're a year after the launch of Quibi officially because it was launching alongside the pandemic. So actually it's April 6th. So by the time you hear this, that will be in the past. Wow. Another great anniversary. Yeah. The thing about Quibi mastermind Jeffrey Katzenberg is that from doing research on his professional history on all these, I read Disney War. I read multiple articles that came out of the fall of Quibi that were like, Jeffrey Katzenberg actually has been like this forever. And it really is true. Quibi was just his biggest failure in part because he just didn't have enough people to lift his ass up out of the gutter. And also, he's 20 years older than he was when he had a success. So he's even more out of touch gutter and also he's 20 years older than he was when he had a success so he's

even more out of touch and clueless but he is such a ambitious asshole that he would never listen to anyone telling him like you don't know what's popular anymore jeffrey's like fuck you fuck all of you uh and well jeffrey katzenberg he'd even say himself like yeah i'm a napoleon like that's me yeah he's also he's if, if not a billionaire, very close to it. And Jeffrey Katzenberg doesn't need to do any of this, but he wants to work 18 hour days forever. That's what's wrong with all these people like Mark Zuckerberg and Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos. They go into work every day, even though they're billionaires, because they're all psycho. And that's how they made their money.

Katzenberg is such a psycho because he is in his late 60s now, and he could have retired 10 years ago. He got another giant payday, $400 million, in addition to already being half a billionaire. And he still is like, well, it's time to start a new thing. Time for Quibi. I'm still with it. But yes, before Quibiibi from 1984 to 2015 jeffrey katzenberg

was one of the most important figures in the united states feature animation and i would say global animation in general uh we've touched on him quite a bit in our podcast about almost everything but on the movies you'll hear a lot about him in black cauldron great mouse detective duck tales aladdin one and two goofy movie and toy story and nightmare before christmas and the walson grumman movie i think if you put all those clips together you will have an entire what a cartoon movie podcast 100 yeah just the five-hour cats and cast uh cat the cats and cast man we could fill a whole year of weekly podcasts about things where he's just credited as executive producer. Two years, honestly.

I would say out of all movies that Jeffrey Katzenberg takes ownership of, I would say Shrek is his crown jewel as a creative executive on these things. I also want to say if you want a more in-depth version of some of the stuff I'm telling you, definitely I would check out the books Disney War and The Men Who Would Be King. Those are both really great, very listenable audio books that your eyes will glaze over a bit when you have to hear a bunch of business bullshit. Or you'll hear stories about people who have since been canceled and that might upset you hearing about them of just like, oh, right. Harvey Weinstein has to come up in this story, doesn't he? Or the very normal David Gethin, there's nothing weird about him at all.

At least as of this recording. Yeah. All right, so Jeffrey Katzenberg, born to the upper class son of a New York stockbroker. Yes, yeah. He wasn't born as rich as Michael Eisner. Michael Eisner is a rich boy, too. But also, they are old money they are guys who are like you know 1950s rich not 2000s rich uh but he was an incredibly ambitious

troublemaker most people target him as that a college dropout bouncing from job to job trying to get in with the most well-connected people in new york whether it was in the restaurant industry or in politics. By the mid-70s, though, he's like, I got to go to Hollywood. That's where it's really at. And so he becomes like an assistant to top Hollywood producers, slowly working his way up. And those producers end up liking him because he would do anything. He really was like a vicious prick. He really is. Yeah. so katzenberg this the myth is that jeffrey katzenberg got to start in the paramount mail room and through dogged determination and prickishness he worked his way up to be an assistant for barry diller oh my god that's why

the system no longer functions like that because now all your mailroom guys are like outsource contractors who don't actually work for the company so there's no way anyone could work their way from the mailroom anymore that's right all of this outsourcing you can't even get like homegrown talent anymore as crazy as jeffrey katzenberg is and barry diller is a weird old man it's time for my theory again but it has only been more reinforced since then if you look at barry diller next to jeffrey katzen. I think you will see what I see, which is Mr. Burns and Smithers and Waylon Smithers. That's what I see. And at Paramount before he came to Disney, Katzenberg and Diller worked a ton with Jim Brooks on Terms of Endearment.

And they know them well. I definitely I feel like there is some credulity to that. Well, and also like it kind of is a, Jeffrey Katzenberg is a straight man, married to a woman, has kids, not saying anything. But he was an assistant and a beloved assistant of very powerful gay men, Barry Diller and David Geffen. Both befriended him and took a liking to him in the 70s because they're like, this guy gets shit done.

And of course, as I said, David Geffen is a very normal guy. Both befriended him and took a liking to him in the 70s because they're like, this guy gets shit done. And of course, as I said, David Geffen is a very normal guy. You could never say anything weird about him. Anyway, by the late 70s at Paramount, there was a new boss who was moving up the ranks. Michael, hello, Eisner. And he gave Katzenberg some of his first film jobs producing on movies. One of Jeffrey Katzenberg's first films he produced on was Star Trek, the motion picture. Really? Wow.

And he said it was hell for everyone involved. And it turned Jeffrey Katzenberg into one of the favorite hatchet men in the Paramount industry. Like he kept the cogs moving. He'd make the tough decisions. He'd say, this movie sucks. Fuck you. There's a story of Katzenberg being one of the people who told Jim Brooks, like, hey, you can't go a million over budget with Terms of Endearment. If you need another million, get it from somebody else, you asshole. And Brooks was really pissed about that.

But apparently they're all friends now. But you're like, of course you are. You're all very rich. They're all rich. So 1983, Paramount has been doing great with films like Raiders of the Lost Ark and E.T. they're all friends now but you're like of course you are you're all yeah they're all rich so 1983 paramount has been doing great with films like raiders of the lost ark and et and many more katzenberg is starting to make headlines alongside michael eisner that's where katzenberg is called the golden retriever of those guys which is the name he hates to this day sounds very flattering

yes yeah everyone's like he goes uh i think he should feel happy that he was given the name of like not a tiny dog like not a pug yeah he's he's not a tall man so 1984 paramount gets a new owner that owner hates michael eisner and jeffrey katzenberg they're already eyeing the exit and they think they were going to get barry diller's job or eisner thought he's going to get barry diller's job and he moves up katzenberg with him that's not going to happen but already the embattled disney company is reaching out to eisner and wants to hire him and eisner is going to take jeffrey katzenberg with him but katzenberg will not be number two to eisner he'll be number three Frank Wells will be the president of the

company until his mysterious accident yeah that's it yeah yeah you know what I gotta say that's kind of suspicious I mean it happened in a helicopter uh never get in a helicopter yeah boy you know you're giving me Epstein brain here Bob I can't it's like if someone invites you onto a boat don't do it oh yes yeah just me and you on a private fishing trip so yes katzenberg was given several jobs at the disney studio in 84 the main one though was to rehabilitate the broken animated features division where he would team up with roy e disney talked a ton about that on black cauldron he took all of these beleaguered burbank animators who thought they were going to be shut down and that katzenberg was going to shut them down and Katzenberg said very quickly he took a shine to feature animation I think I think most biographers say that Katzenberg saw it as like this is a

fiefdom I can control and I can have so much more control over it than I do with all these live action people I can just treat animators poorly and who are they they don't matter like you can only yell at a famous actor so much you know and so katzenberg became this would-be napoleon figure who knew little of art everybody made fun of him as a philistine who drank diet coke every like eight times a day overcompensated perhaps for a small tick, and just disrespecting lower creative people. But he would say, and I kind of have to agree, it's like, well, if you look at Black Cauldron, compared to what was finished by the end of the 80s,

he made better movies. Yeah, again, check out our podcast on the Black Cauldron. It's rotten. So they do Black Cauldron. They do Grey Mouse Detective. Those start to ramp up. 1988, though, is when really the first true Katzenberg-Eisner films can come out. That's Roger Rabbit and Oliver and Company.

I don't love Oliver and Company, but I have to say, statistically, it made way more than Black Cauldron and Grey Mouse Detective combined. And it was star-studded. Star-studded. And same with Roger Rabbit, though. Yes, Oliver & Company had the real Katzenberg stamp, which was famous voices, Billy Joel, Cheech Marin, Bette Midler. You know what? I'm surprised they didn't keep doing that with the Disney movies.

That was the outlier for a long time. Yeah, it's weird. They did all these star stuff, and I think maybe they felt it didn't work as well for them as they thought it would. It was a pattern he'd finally figure out on Shrek. Because after that, they would have famous people in it, including one very famous guy who was the selling point of Aladdin, which we talked about that. But they didn't really cast like every role as a famous person so yes very successful 1989 with directors musker and clements songwriter howard ashman katzenberg begins the disney renaissance with the little mermaid like an undeniable hit

huge critical reaction everybody's like disney's back this is the greatest and for katzenberg give or take a duck tales or a rescuers down under it was success after success after success beauty of the beast aladdin nightmare before christmas lion king i'm sure those lesser movies made a ton of money on vhs oh god yes yeah well and we talked about it on return to jafar but katzenberg also discovered like the direct-to-video or, well, honestly, he was just copying Warner's success with Tiny Toons, but he made it so Disney would do direct-to-video stuff that was also making them a shitload of money. And as we mentioned in our Toy Story podcast, Katzenberg was one of the people instrumental

in making the multi-picture deal to get Pixar to make a CGI movie at Disney and as you mentioned on that Katzenberg's notes were like be a little meaner yeah like and also it does have famous people in it too oh it's like every role is a famous person in that movie yeah so you can see the Shrek template there and also it's where Katzenberg can see that like oh CGI films might be the future of animation. He's learning a lot of lessons. But Katzenberg is also feeling increasingly stifled. For one, doesn't like Roy Disney and Roy Disney sure doesn't like him. They both are feeling the other takes way too much credit for everything they do.

Eisner is also getting pretty sick of Katzenberg. They both sound like assholes, to be honest, in most of the stories I've read. Now, there are two Roy Disneys. Is this the nephew of waltz yes yeah the nephew of walt yeah who everybody thought like ah it's just the dumb nephew but he sounded like he wasn't a bad leader and he did respect the animators at the very least uh so all that came to a head in a truly tumultuous 1994 the start of the year katzenberg still number three frank wells is president in april frank wells dies in that helicopter accident katzenberg was a little too eager for eisner's taste that right after wells died katzenberg is making very clear overtures of like

well and of course you're going to make me president i'm ready to take it over boss nicer's like this guy just died fuck you show some respect and so eisner instead says you know what no one's president i'm also president i'm taking that katzenberg you're staying where you are at the same time over the summer of 94 katzenberg is taking center stage and promoting lion king he's like oh well lion king's my movie and it's actually a movie about me and how how i grew up and how my dad and all this stuff really okay yeah they frame that as the breaking point in the waking sleeping beauty thing they show all these crazy videos of katzenberg on the press tours for lion king of like him posing with real lions and just all these interviews about it right lion king's mine it's uh

you know what i had a great 1994 he should have played more final fantasy 6 and super metroid just chilled out a bit he should have yeah well donkey kong 94 play some of that donkey kong country sure well katzenberg can't chill out like no no he makes people have morning meetings on a sunday like that's what that's an in person in 1993 like that's when he wanted them there's another great story in waking sleeping beauty that is katzenberg he would hold back on spending things he'd be like well we can't put spend money on that we're wasting too much money on this but the guys tell the story of like for roger rabbit they were flown from burbank to england where he was and told stop wasting money fly yes buy some souvenirs for the kids so by october well actually by august eisner tells katzenberg he's done there he's like resign or i'm gonna fire you katzenberg says i'll resign if you give me my deal that i get an xm percentage of disney movies eisner thinks it isn't in writing ultimately

in a lawsuit it will be proven it was in writing. And what would have been, I think, $50 million, Katzenberg is ultimately paid $250 million by Disney in 97 for being fired before. Yeah, that would have made three big budget movies back then. And that wasn't even the biggest check Eisner signed to an executive he fired without cause. Eisner was bad at his job in many ways. I know we all want to love Eisner now, and he's more exciting than Bob Iger.

I'll give him that. He's the lesser of two evils. So Katzenberg is out of Disney, and this is an important thing you need to know. It is not hyperbole to say that Jeffreyffrey katzenberg is driven mainly by iron rage and spite well so are we yes i that's how you succeed and and his spite and rage was at michael eisner and the disney company he ran and he was going to prove via vengeance that he could run a better place than disney and beat them at their own game and he had some very rich friends who were going to help him with that and so october 12th 1994 katzenberg alongside steven spielberg

and david geffen would launch a brand new studio which in january would get him a name dreamworks skg s for spielberg k for katzenberg g for for Geffen. You know what? As a little kid, like a 12-year-old, 13-year-old, I was very excited for DreamWorks because I loved all the Geffen albums that came out with the Geffen logo on them. Some of my favorites from that era had the Geffen logo. Of course, I love Steven Spielberg and Katzenberg. I associated with all the Disney movies I like. So I was like, well, these are going to be the best possible forms of entertainment coming out of this group. Their PR rollout for it was so tremendous, too.

And they're like, I watched an interview with katzenberg from five years ago and he was still saying we launched a company that was the first new studio in 65 years they had the pr rollout perfect for it and also i found multiple old articles that had the classic katzenberg quibby quote oh which anytime you tell him that quibby's dumb and it's like five people watch this over youtube he'd say that's like comparing apples and submarines jesus yes zing them again jeffrey he's been saying that for 30 years at least on the record but but yes katzenberg spielberg geffen along with 800 million dollars from microsoft co-founder paul allen and a korean company called the cj group

they dumped a bunch into it they're like shit like that was a lot of money in 1995 i believe it was 2 billion almost 2 billion that quibi got yeah oh my god and so one thing katzenberg was quick to find out was that despite being an equal partner in it spielberg and geffen made it clear that he would not be in charge of live action films which pissed off katzenberg he would instead though be in charge of dreamworks animation he's like you know what i can prove i'm the best i can replicate my success at disney and this time michael eisner and roy won't be holding me back so dreamworks animation actually starts out faster than i thought because they didn't have to build an entirely new studio because all right steven spielberg had emblemation

and london that was already starting to get moved over to la and then when they launched dreamworks like you know what emblemation just is dreamworks animation so that was roger rabbit and then we're back a dinosaur story. We're Back and... One more thing. Balto. Okay, Balto. And the second Fievel movie.

Oh, Fievel Goes West. Yeah, it was after his blue breakup. He's like, well, I still own Fievel, so Amblemation's going to do Fievel Goes West. And the Fievel TV show as well. All part of Universal, which Universal was longtime friends with DreamWorks. It's why you go to the dreamworks theater to see 3d movies at universal orlando and hollywood so yes they were going to start out though with a 2d animation team to make films like he'd been doing like really katzenberg's

first thing was like i need to beat the lion king and he was also working on pocahontas and you know the story on pocahontas is like that was the one they thought would win the Oscar and it's very serious. He hires away as many Disney talents as he can with big money. There's lots of people who talked up that after DreamWorks Animation launched, everybody got a raise whether you left Disney or not because if you stayed at Disney, they were going to give you a raise to stay and you were getting big money bonuses so at the very least the usually underappreciated animators like got big money deals and if you were a big name guy like glenn keen you got huge money well he deserves it yeah and and same with james baxter kathy altieri brenda chapman richard chavez

lorna cook the four biggest names they got at the start for launching it. And so they're going to work on a big biblical epic, the kind that Disney would never touch because it might offend people with its religious storyline. The Prince of Egypt, which is, you know, the Ten Commandments. It's their version of it. Yeah. And it's good. I'm sure it's good. I have no interest in it.

And maybe I'll watch it one day. But I went to Catholic school and after that was over, I was just done with God. I don't need to hear about it anymore. I understand the commandments. I saw them every day. Let's move on with our lives. No burning bushes for you. No, no.

But I think it's some of the best. If you just want to look up videos of like character acting in it, it's some peak animation there or like fire, like drawn fire on the screen has rarely looked better than it does in Prince of Egypt. But as a film itself, it's kind of boring. And they thought they'd out Disney Disney with a 1998 planned release date. Wouldn't work out. And it even had an Elton John song, right? Yep.

They got Elton John back again, too. They're like, yeah, we can do it all. Like, I'm sure they would have hired Musker and Clements if they could have, but they couldn't. Like, they were tamped down at Disney. And of course, getting part of Amblemation opened a door because Steven Spielberg, one of his producers named John H. Williams, not the composer. John H. Williams, they got the rights to a 1990 kids book by William Stieg, who already was in his 80s at that point. And he was a creator of Dr. DeSoto if you read those books as a kid no what were those uh they were about the mouse dentist

do you remember that I remember those well by 1990 me and you were eight we would have been the audience for this book but my parents never got me a book called Shrek with an exclamation point I think I was reading Arthur oh yes yeah i was much more of an arthur kid yeah so uh that book was the story of a 32 pages long a parody of fairy tales about a nasty ogre who shoots laser beams from his eyes as well that's much cooler he befriends a talking donkey for like two pages and ultimately at the end when he meets his fairy tale princess it's a big ugly ogre princess they have a big ugly wedding and it's a big, ugly ogre princess. They have a big, ugly wedding. And it's a fun, silly little book, you know.

And Shrek also, the name comes from a Stieg because he was the son of Jewish socialists who had moved to America. And I believe I've read that Shrek is Yiddish for monster. Okay, cool. I didn't know that. So after the 1995 success of toy story katzenberg knew he couldn't just have 2d films he needed cgi films as well and there were only so many people who can make those in 1995 especially well only pixar had made a feature-length film nobody else could really even make like a 30-minute film very few could and one of those was the second

biggest cgi place in the bay area pacific data images they were the cutting edge of cgi character animation they had existed since 1980 they were one of the top groups who had done famous stuff already they'd worked on wild oc graphics for jim henson oh that guy yeah nobody likes him but he was one of the last original muppets created by jim henson they also if you were a kid of the 90s you watch spellbound as michael jackson morphed from character to character in the black and white video that is pdi and of course as simpsons fans in 1995 we all watched the tim johnson directed segment of homer cubed which they did for free yes yeah an incredible calling card for them honestly looking at the timeline i think homer cubed is why dreamworks wanted to work with pdi oh me too

they could have also seen the work they did on commercials for the Pillsbury Doughboy, but I have a feeling it was probably Homer. So out of all that buzz, DreamWorks decides we're going to partner with this company. By the spring of 1996, DreamWorks Animation buys a 40% stake in Pacific Data Images. I'll call them PDI from now on. And they were going to make a film slated for 1999 pdi had been wanting to do a feature film for the longest time they just never had the money for it and also they were going to help launch the fledgling dreamworks interactive gaming division which i learned a very funny

story about that that like steven spielberg for a time he thought of an idea for a game that basically sounds like The Sims. He briefly hired Nora Ephron to write a script for it. Jesus. And apparently after like a month, she realized, like, you got to write how much for a video game? I'm out of here. That label did exist. I remember there being a Lost World game. And the secret ending is Jeff Goldblum clearly on the set of The Lost World being filmed against his will saying, go outside.

Go outside. get some sun. That's right. Oh, my God. I forgot. They also almost created Medal of Honor, but then they sold it to EA. Like, Medal of Honor was supposed to be like saving Private Ryan the game. And then it turned into EA's like, we want it to be a brand we own. So DreamWorks Interactive did lead to Medal of Honor, which led to Call of Duty.

It has a very big footprint in the world of video games. So this is a whole podcast on its own. But PDI's first assignment was Ants, which Jeffrey Katzenberg says he had had that pitch way before he ever met Pixar. And that he had been thinking at Disney of making a film called Army Ants didn't get it approved and so now he's finally making his Ants film he was dreaming of getting the dialogue you da ant on the screen oh god or talking about drinking out of the animal's anus yeah so it's Woody Allen's least offensive movie because you don't have to see him that's true yeah so Jeffrey Katzenberg that's his story

the story that john lassiter and andrew stanton say boy i'm saying a lot of bad names here but the guys who worked on bug's life they said they directly told jeffrey katzenberg more than once their plans to make an ant movie that famous meeting where they outlined the next 10 years of pixar movies and they also tell a story that not only after that meeting but like that in 95 lassiter and stanton were in la doing post-production on toy story and they just happened to meet jeffrey katzenberg he's like hey so what you guys working on and he told him about bugs life and then they find out pdi is making ants then jeffrey katzenberg gets pissed off seeing the bugs life is gonna premiere within a month of prince of egypt and he's like hey don't please don't do that i want prince of egypt to be

big and like michael eisner is going to listen to jeffrey katzenberg saying please they're still in lawsuits so instead out of more spite katzenberg moves up the release of Ants to October 1998. Somehow PDI completes it in time. And so they get in theaters a month before Bugs Life, though they don't earn more money than Bugs Life. You know, Bugs Life is just fine. People trash it all the time. I honestly don't know why they didn't make Bugs Life University or whatever spinoff they could have made out of it

because it's fine and give Dave Foley more work, I say. Yeah, it's too bad. You know, those poor bugs, they got their Bugs Life torn down a couple of years ago to make room for Avengers Campus. it's fine and give Dave Foley more work I say yeah it's too bad you know those poor bugs they got their bugs life torn down a couple years ago to make room for Avengers Campus like there's no sign of the bugs anymore I guess maybe you'll see a look of like Flick the Ant if you really search for him at Pixar Pier in Disneyland but yes Ant's even less successful honestly a giant failure and it sucks also one has kevin spacey

one has woody allen there they're both like your poison but at least kevin spacey's the villain who dies yes you're guaranteed that instead you're supposed to be rooting for woody allen to get with sharon stone at the end of it yeah but also he's way too old for him and you can see it was the pdi style too oh god sorry i just uh that's here the too old for him. And you can see it was the PDI style too. God, sorry. The too old joke caught up with me there. I apologize. But it did show PDI style. Like, well, here's a famous actor.

Can you make this CGI person kind of look like him? And also, how good are you at making green know green areas and like naturalistic backgrounds like pdi definitely felt they were better at doing humans and leaves and stuff than pixar was i think for a time occasionally you could see that they did get ahead of them tech wise though i never felt a pdi film look better than a pixar film so unfortunately for pdi ants kind of who knows how successful it could have been if it wasn't rushed to theaters just to fuck with Bugs Life but it was hardly the last time a film similar to a Pixar film would be released by DreamWorks in the same year so what happened with Shrek before Pacific

Data Images were handed it well Katzenberg liked the idea but he didn't want it to be their main deal he bought the film for dreamwork animation in 1995 but he's like well this is our small budget film like 20 million dollars and he knew just the guys to hand it to a bunch of recent college graduates who had a tiny cgi company called propeller heads which was run by jeffrey abrams who now goes by jj abrams what really yes okay and rob letterman who would go on to direct shark tale and detective pikachu so and they'd impress people because in 93 or 94 they did a student film that was like the silver surfer and it which basically was a pepsi man commercial it's like silver surfer land in a normal street in a shiny silver man's walking around and so katzenberg after seeing that was

like you guys could do like motion capture and draw some funny stuff with these characters and he very much was like well this is going to be a fractured fairy tale like out of rocky and bullwinkle that was the energy they were going for from day one on the Propellerheads version of it. And of course, they knew just the famous person that they wanted to be Shrek, Chris Farley. Oh boy, I wish someone could have just locked him up in 1997 and cleaned him up. I mean, we've read the Chris Farley story.

It's an amazing, the Chris Farley show. Yes, I think Chris Farley story is the name of the uh documentary but oh there's documentary yeah yeah it's really or it might be called show too but anyway that book is so sack is like two years before he died he did get cleaned up and then he fell off the wagon even harder but in 1995 hey happy times for chris farley and then that was the year of tommy boy i like tommy boy the original screenwriters of shrek, Ted Elliott and Terry Rosio, you talked about in the Aladdin one, is like, oh yeah, the famous screenplay guys David Katzenberg loved.

It was like, no, these are real writers, guys. All their scripts for cartoons seem to get thrown out and heavily rewritten by actual cartoon writers. They originally did see Shrek and Donkey, as least this is how david spade tells the story as a chris farley david spade cabo donkey would be david spade and chris farley would be shrek and when you see the scenes of shrek and donkey arguing with each other like that could make sense yeah i could see i can hear their voices well especially if you're jeffrey katzenberg who's just like i just saw tommy boy could we do a cartoon thing of that? Let's just do that.

Unfortunately, David Spade got trumped by the guy who he had just made fun of as a falling star, Eddie Murphy. By 1996, as this team is working on Shrek, Eddie Murphy was the biggest box office star in the world. He just had Nutty Professor. It was only going to get bigger for him and eddie murphy's big success in theatrical was in part thanks to katzenberg katzenberg put him in 48 hours he had produced trading places and beverly hills cop before he left paramount murphy has a long time friendship with katzenberg still to this day like a few years ago and murphy won some lifetime achievement award katzenberg was the one who presented it so they're still bros those guys and it probably was not a coincidence that

in 1996 Eddie Murphy was almost certainly already recording his voice audio for Disney's Mulan and the character of Mushu oh for sure yeah I mean the film came out in 98. So I think Murphy might have been cast before Mulan came out, but he definitely wasn't cast before he signed the deal to do Mulan. And I mean, knowing Katzenberg, you'd think he'd even have told him like, could you quit Mulan and just do this? But Mushu and Donkey, the same character, basically. I bet whenever Eddie Murphy is cast in something animated, Phil Lamar does a little fist pump because he gets to do all of the replacement dialogue for TV shows and toys and theme park appearances. He's like,

yes, I can wheel out my Murphy again. I know you're right. Yeah. He has made Phil Lamar so rich just being a being TV donkey and Walmart commercial donkey. So the real struggle was in 1996. They were doing storyboards the cgi was really having trouble coming together the story behind the scenes was quote if you failed on prince of egypt you were sent to the dungeons to work on shrek and being sent to work on shrek was called being shrek'd like is like oh god i got shrek'd i'm working on shrek like it was just seen as like this no-go like it was just not going well this no-go like it was just not going well no script would get locked down katzenberg still believed in it over time the

character you can see some early character designs like a little more like chris farley and a little more like they they gave him more of chris farley's nose they gave him hair which shrek does not have in the original book but they they want to look more like chris farley with little to show after more than a year the animators have a quick demo reel of test footage it was one minute of it i couldn't find it out there anywhere but you can't find pictures of what their shrek look like it's hideous and they said unlike the final version oh yes no it'll make you appreciate real shrek more if you see original track i could find online a storyboard of it it's like shrek strangles a guy and he turns purple like out of a looney tunes cartoon and katzenberg hated hated hated it fired the propeller heads they're like you guys but it

also didn't help too that the propeller heads were already starting to get hired for other stuff jj abrams had sold a couple scripts and he's like what am i working on this shrek shit for like i'm a well connected like son of hollywood katzenberg kills that version of it brings on new writers to start back over that's joe stillman of king of the hill and beams about head to america and adventures of pete and pete that's right right and rogerulman, who had just worked on Balto for Amblemation, and Alf, he was an Alf of it. So they're reworking the script, and not only that, but briefly Nightmare Before Christmas director Henry Selleck

was brought onto it, and it sounded like he did not have a good time and was not very long of the director of it. Millions of dollars later, the production was briefly shut down by late 1996 seemingly it was all ogre oh even though they had all this chris farley stuff so 97 they start it back up they're working on it some more they record more stuff with chris farley they have a completed ish storyboard that is not that close to the film but close enough that you can see oh they could make a film with this and chris farley has recorded 85 of his dialogue but then a week before christmas

of 1997 chris farley passes away from a mix of drug overdose and heart disease 33 33 awful just it's tragic every time i say it i got the thing now he wouldn't even be 60 like he'd be i mean to imagine chris farley living to 50 but i can't imagine a 50 year old chris farley what that would even look like i know it's like that's not the life he lived it was only known as like oh yeah chris farley he had played shrek but that was just like a story there was never any footage until 2015 someone got two minutes of the footage released it online so here is a scene that is pretty close to what is in the final movie you can hear how chris farley would have played it oh this is another one of those onion things. No, this is one of those drop it and leave me alone things.

Well, why don't you want to talk about it? Why do you want to talk about it? Why are you answering the question with a question? Why are you asking questions I don't want to answer? Why are you blocking? I'm not blocking. Then why do you have problems expressing your wants? I don't.

I want you to shut up. See? No problem. You're just displacing your anger. Believe me, it's properly placed. You're really mad at whoever did this to you. No one did anything to me.. See? No problem. You're just displacing your anger. Believe me, it's properly placed. You're really mad at whoever did this to you. No one did anything to me. Yes, yes, yes. Someone hurt you so bad. Someone hurt you many years ago.

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with chris farley i feel that this is gonna sound terrible but i feel that mike myers is like an empty human being that's why he's so good at playing characters because he has nothing to him a lot of comedians are like that a lot of actors are like that but i think chris farley doesn't do like a lot of voices he plays one kind of character and there's a lot of pain in his in his life and there's a lot of he's got a lot of demons so i feel like that portrayal has a lot more humanity than the fat bastard impression we get well yeah i think to the mike myers like he buries a lot like yeah whatever his real feelings are are just buried beneath like eight layers of onion like layers but like so many layers of self-hatred or just like love of comedy or also like weird sexual and race stuff

as well all mixed in to come out in his films i mean how many times does he make movies about like well then my girlfriend got fucked by a guy all right but you're right that chris farley shrek is just him like chris farley's not playing a character there like that you're feeling the pain of chris farley through there it's a much more natural performance yeah you're not at the distance of like well i know this is like a scottish accent that he loves to do in so many characters i'm thinking of two other characters that for movies i like well don't same time and also like his snl characters too right he played like the if it's not scottish it's crap but before mike myers came in at some point after chris farley's passing nicholas cage was offered

shrek he would tell this story when he was doing promotion for the croods he's like yeah i turned down track kind of regret it i did the croods to make up for the croods he's like yeah i turned down track kind of regret it i did the croods to make up for it because i i was like oh i should have been track he would have been a bad trick and another thing that came out way later after the film came out was that along with chris farley in the original cast fiona was played by janine garofalo oh okay a very different energy than cameron diaz would bring to the role garofalo was let go she had funny interviews later saying just like yeah i was let go never said why but it's not like that became like a big movie or anything poor janine but then she had ratatouille

fame yes yeah and plus she was on what criminal minds or a thing like that like she's doing fine but i could see if i'm janine ruffalo and see how cameron diaz got paid 10 million dollars for shrek 2 for her flat performance and look cameron diaz she's a good actress she's fine she's fine also apparently she's like retired from acting now she hasn't been in a movie in like five or six years now that's the way to do it is she one of the bad moms no that was christine apple okay she was she could have been a bad mom she was a bad teacher oh she was bad teacher yeah i forgot the that the other seo movie uh and also sex tape she was in the sex tape where she's like the sex tape is in the cloud uh but when she was hired to play fiona uh she was hot off the heels

of there's something about mary and My Best Friend's Wedding. Like, Cameron Diaz was the it girl. By the time this had come out, she'd also had her first, like, big starring, big, big starring role in Charlie's Angels, too. Right, and she was in another movie with another green guy, The Mask. That's right, yeah, that was her first movie.

She loves green men. With her old face. I'm just really bitchyy today i'm sorry uh but that's where shrek shrek is such a nasty mean movie yeah it puts us in this way but but so they still don't really know what they're gonna do with shrek they then decide you know what pdi is done with ants let's send it up to them So while there was a lot of boarding and stuff being done in Los Angeles, it would get sent up to the Bay Area to work on a PDI. And folks said that every single frame of Shrek, Katzenberg is very involved in.

He approved everything. But also, a thing that really helped PDI was, they're up here in the bay area and katzenberg lives in la and while he could fly up once a week you got four whole work days a week where you didn't have jeffrey katzenberg yelling at you that's the benefit of working outside of la yeah you can better believe that's why eventually pdi got shut down but that's uh that's farther off so so following Farley's passing what was the biggest film of 1997 in comedy of course it was Austin Powers Man of Mystery International Man of Mystery no one thinks about that subtitle uh yeah you just call it the Austin Powers Mike Myers

huge huge huge comedy guy by then And at first he wasn't interested. And I think part of it was, he would say part of it was he felt bad that his friend Chris Farley was dead and didn't want to replace his voice acting. And I think they, for a time, they even floated the idea of like, we could just get like Kevin Farley to do the remaining lines we need. It's an 85% done film but I think Katzenberg in a smart business strategy realized if this actually succeeds well are we just gonna have Kevin Farley in every movie after that like we need a person who can be in more movies and sequels and everything if it's a success so they went hard for Mike Myers Mike Myers agrees to do it but he wants his own team to rewrite the film more to his feel that's why

there are so many mike myers one-liners in the movie of just like the mike myers trick of saying a bad joke and then going like hey i'm sorry like that that's there all over the place i guess it's kind of smart for him to have writers like that because it's why dana carvey never rose to the myers level exactly he didn't have that kind of quality control for sure. He just wanted to be the turtle man and turtle it up. Oh, this was not the year of Master Disguise. That would be next year. Yes.

Yeah. It was filmed this year. We all know the story. The Turtle Club was a moment of silence for us all. So Mike Myers in his original line readings did something pretty close to his Ontario accent. I read this was kind of fluctuating. I read other reports that said his voice was more like his Lothar of the Hill people voice from SNL. They were also starting to find a lot more heart for Shrek with Myers in there.

Like Myers, there is usually a little moment of like heart and humanity to his jokesters they bring in there but and they got rid of the parent stuff too so they then got some co-directors for it Katzenberg was a big believer in co-directors on most of his early DreamWorks animation films for example Road to El Dorado has I believe five credited co-directors one of them david silverman who got fired after a year from it oh i forgot about that then went to monsters inc on this one the first two co-directors andrew adamson who would stay with the film to the end and kelly ashbury now adamson was a new zealander trained in visual effects he had worked on frighteners and batman forever asbury meanwhile

was a disney feature veteran so the strategy on shrek in general was we'll get a 2d guy to work with a 3d guy and they can fill in the blanks on each other's discrepancies will they get along i actually think they did not get along because kelly asbury did not stick around but apparently it was adamson that story goes that while katzenberg wanted Shrek to be edgy, Adamson kept pushing it to be edgier and edgier. Like it was Adamson who came up with the, there's a joke where a sheet rises ever so slightly while Farquaad is looking at pictures of Fiona in bed.

And then he like kind of blushes and everyone's grossed out you have to the joke is he has such a small penis that a boner rising raising the sheets is almost imperceptible but they still kept it in there that was adamson who wanted that he also wanted a scene where welcome to the jungle would play while uh shrek is being chased and katzenberg's like no we're not we're not doing that one we will pay smash mouth but not sons and roses everybody was shocked how much adamson was like forceful with katzenberg they thought he'd get fired but i think katzenberg actually kind of respected you've got spunk they also had three high level board artists so i'll get more into in the the film when we talk about it but they really were invested in these board artists who in pixar style as well they're like you know what you're so funny at this temp voice you can be the magic mirror you can be

the three little pigs and you can be the gingerbread man pinocchio too right oh yeah they were like joe ramph too just like oh you're so funny forget it like so i believe jimmy fallon was originally going to be the mirror voice and they're like you know this other guy's funny get him out of everything he can't do anything without giggling that guy uh so 1998 asbury not enjoying it they do keep some of his storyboards but he leaves the director position he moves over to spirits stallion of the cimarron which is like hey it's the best drawings of horses you'll ever see i bet it is believe it or not bob spirit is actually got turned into an incredibly successful netflix series

in the last five years and they're about to have a sequel theatrical sequel to spirit in theaters you know what while skimming around on netflix i think i saw it but i forgot it was a dreamworks thing it's like skylanders my husband was like oh they skylanders it because it's like technically it's a spirit sequel but they changed all the parts of it um but yeah so asbury though would go on to direct shrek 2 and a whole lot of shrek shit rip-offs like i believe he is the nomeo juliet director so instead brought in his co-director with somebody who had moved up to like head of story, one of their top storyboarders until she was eventually co-director. And she was like one of the first women to, I don't believe the first, but one of the first women credited as a director on a feature length animated film. That is Vicki Jensen.

She was a Spumco OG. She had worked on Mighty Mouse and the original run on random stimpy had left that i think uh she was like an early visual designer on random stimpy a lot of a lot of the look of random stimpy some of it can be credited to her she left that for fern gully and pretty much it's stuck in feature from that so when you see especially random stimpy and fern gully this is a woman who knows how to do gross farts and forests which makes her perfect for shrek so in a way random stimpy inspired shrek okay so jensen was brought in post farley to get a new feel for the character as jensen and adamson

would say they kind of split it 50 50 directing like as in i take these scenes you take these scenes and it'll be a movie in the end and with katzenberg overseeing it all so that's why too i'm like well this is katzenberg's movie because it's like multiple directors who just oversee stuff and he oversees them without farley involved they also redid the look of shrek into the final version we see which while DreamWorks has not said this it 100% looks like the old-timey wrestler slash carnival performer Maurice Tillet aka the French Angel. Really? I've never seen a picture of this guy. If you search just real life Shrek and see this black and white photo of Maurice Tillet you will be like yeah that's just Shrek they just did that oh my god yes yeah he was a pro

wrestler back in the days where being a pro wrestler meant you look like a freak and you shove people you have some kind of genetic disorder correct yeah he did he he had like andre the giant's gigantism but it was selective his body was like it wasn't a small body but it wasn't in proportion to his head his head was much bigger as were his hands he looks like the brute man he does he does and also they cut out shrek's parents no more of that also as the edginess kept growing they took many more swipes at disney particularly in all the scenes set in duloc and the eisner faced villain lord farquad voiced by john lithgow in one of the things i read even they acknowledge that while far quad's face well one far quad sounds like fuck one yeah but far quad's face definitely looks like michael

eisner but other people do acknowledge and i think even katzenberg himself maybe was forced to that lord far quad is an overcompensating little man who uh created his own fiefdom to fight other people and it more sounds like jeffrey katzenberg than uh than michael it really does i think he's projecting i think so i i think it could be that also the artists who are sick of katzenberg they're like let's say it's making fun of michael eisner but we all know it's making fun of him or hey maybe katzenberg actually had a good sense of humor he's like fine make fun of me it's a good character i don't think so yeah so we're in 1999 the film is really starting to finally take shape like adamson said in 1999 they finally had a real storyboard they're like this can be animated this film which we've taken forever to figure out to turn a

32 page joke kids book into a 90 minute film they felt they really captured it they're starting to work on animation most everything's locked in the place mike meyer sees a work cut of a lot of tip stuff and mainly storyboards and he thinks you know what my accent isn't good for this he felt that with a fancy kind of english villain in far quad he's like i need like a rougher guy i need a scottish accent and the thing he seemed to not understand was with locked story and animation already starting on trek scenes where his lips are moving to the old lines they would have to redo a good third of the film. And they did. They paid an extra $4 million.

As Katzenberg tells it, he knew it would cost a lot, but he's like, I gotta trust Mike Myers on this. And so he ate the cost and paid $4 million. And also I'm sure Katzenberg did have to do a lot more work because of that but so did a shitload of other people who worked a lot longer than katzenberg on it i think that gave them a lot of austin power's goodwill because he made that choice before the second movie came out i'm guessing and that was huge even bigger than the first movie yeah fat bastard was 2000 and right 99 oh 99 so yeah it was and yeah the shrek i do think he does seem a little more

hardscrabble if i was like his lothar the hill people voice is a sillier even sillier voice like you kind of it would feel the you wouldn't feel for shrek when you're supposed to feel sad for him as opposed to like when he's talking about how he's like i push people away before they can reject me that feels better in in a Scottish voice, I will say. They decide, fuck it, we'll just redo all of these Shrek scenes to redo the mouth movements and acting. Production designer on it, James Hedges, was tasked by Katzenberg to create what he called

hyper-reality look to the film, inspired by artists like Grant Wood. Originally, they thought they were going to have to make real small model sets and then put cgi into it because they just thought like there's no way we can do the lighting stuff that is demanded for this but pdi they figured it out they're like you know what no i think we can i think we can do it and parts of shrek that don't feel like showing off now like when characters are just walking places were showing off in 2001 because they're like here's a sunflower field here's them walking up a hill we go to all these places you never go anywhere in toy story you go three places in toy story one hat two houses

and an arcade and the scope of a bug's life was very small yes yeah very small and and very similar looking places too shrek was really showing things off for them and they felt pretty much like they could fold off. Now, they also seem to think they could do better humans than Pixar, which, I mean, if you compare in 2001, the one human who's in Monsters, Inc., like Boo, she is a much better executed human than, say, Princess Fiona or Farquaad in this. Like, she feels much realer.

But you're always going to have that uncanny valley. Even today, you still do. All of this tied together with a soundtrack brought to you by Geffen's DreamWorks Records that included Smash Mouth, as we said. I'll talk about that in the intro of the real film. The Baja Men man rufus wainwright the eels and many more was sold on like yeah get the soundtrack like the film is full of songs that you wouldn't hear in most disney films because it's like no these are just pop songs

meant to sell soundtracks because they didn't want trek to be a musical so they're like well then how do you sell a soundtrack without a musical and they realize like well just have like Cohen cover playing over montages yep yep there were multiple times where they did a cover in the movie that then afterwards like shit this person isn't signed to DreamWorks uh we'll get a DreamWorks person to just do a separate cover so the version of hallelujah you hear him shrek is different than the one you'll get on the album so they're working on shrek but they were still pretty nervous they were like i don't know if it'll be a hit it's a weird film about like farting and and gross stuff with a very annoying donkey character in it will it work they debuted at con they think they're going to be

laughed out of the place but they say it was like they in the story standing ovation at con they loved it like i could see the french sensibility for humor loving shrek they were putting it out in theaters like i think this will really work and also shocking you look back on in 2001 it was a critical success. It really was. It wasn't like four stars most places, but just about every critical. Like Roger Ebert really liked Shrek. It was a breath of fresh air for a lot of people after the Disney renaissance.

That's true. I think it was an overcorrection. An ogre correction. Oh, no, we can't do this anymore. But yes, it was an ogre correction. Yeah. Well, I guess you do need to put yourself in the headspace of we're five years of lesser Disney films after Hunchback of Notre Dame. No true.

Since then, we're just kind of sick of them. And so having a film that's like, hey, aren't these fairy tales fucking dumb? Here's a cool guy. He's too cool for those Disney fairy tales. I can see why people. And also, it's a meaner uglier time of jackass yeah we need a mean movie about an ugly guy who farts things are too easy in the 90s and before 9-11 it's time to be mean yeah it was a huge hit released in may of 2001 would rake in 265 million domestically it quickly became the most successful DreamWorks film to that date and just giant giant hit Katzenberg was smiling ear to ear he was like finally I got the hit I needed he was so worried and unfortunately for them though they had several

other Disney likes in the pipeline very humorously they'd be like oh well we recovered from road to el dorado then right after shrek they put out spirit yeah sin bad which almost kills the company that movie i've never heard anyone even reference it's just a movie that doesn't exist yeah like no one remembers that yeah that's if you wonder like if you look back and say like shrek 2 was merchandised on every single thing that existed in part it's because simbad cost them a lot of money but yes shrek 1 giant hit first in theaters in may by november it was on the then new dvd format it became to that point the fastest selling dvd it sold 2.5 million in the first month

it beat disney at making good dvds with a ton of extra features like it was a highly featured with like you got like three or four original shorts worth of content on that original one of like shrek talks behind the scene on making the movie and and all of this shit it was incredibly popular why then right after dreamworks buys controlling interest in pdi because they're like we need this to be a yearly movie factory now apparently behind the scenes though pdi was really pissed because they had stock options and they think the owner sold out for way too little to dreamworks so they all got like fucked out of a bunch of money. Oh, it sucks.

Even worse for them, they'd eventually get shut down, sadly. In, like, 2015, right? Yep, yeah. But Shrek itself sold so many toys, soundtracks. Xbox launched with a Shrek video game. Oh, that's right. It was one of the big games of the Xbox launch, like, exclusive to Xbox, the shrek video game on the

green console it was perfect it was perfect you drink your surge you play your shrek game on the i mean also too he's right there with master chief it's it's a green system i recall that at my grocery store at the time where i was working we had green ketchup because of shrek oh yes yep god i forgot that green ketchup all right and by shrek 2 they would have green filled twinkies as well because they were supposed to be shrek's like swap sludge in a twinkie they just recycled the ooze from ninja turtles it was just a turtles ripoff yeah and yeah that would be all topped off cherry on top of shrek's first year was in the newly invented first time ever oscar's best animated feature category shrek was the winner they beat out only two other nominees

jimmy neutron and monsters inc jimmy neutron get out of that category i don't care if you're animated i do recall in 2002 when that happened i was bad monsters and gloss yeah i felt that it was should have won maybe i don't know if this is a surprising fact but monsters inc did make more money than shrek that's right yeah it did yeah even though it didn't seem to have as much of a phenomenon but it still made more money and now i'd say you can look back at shrek now and it's like they haven't made a new Shrek in 10 years. I mean, there have been the Puss in Boots side shows and stuff. But Shrek is only really kept in our memories because of like horrifying memes. Yes.

That's really why Shrek sticks around. Shrek is up there with Garfield in terms of memory. You're right. He's Garfield 20 years later. Well, because he is such, just like Garfield, a specific look and sensibility. Yeah. And also just this feeling of like, oh yeah, this was merchandised to shit. Like it's meaningless.

Let's put meaning back into it by it being weird. And there's no Shrek ride at Universal, right? So there was Shrek 4D for a time. Okay. And you can still see Shrek 4D in some other places. But no, I think Shrek 4D might still be in Orlando. But it was replaced in Hollywood. When you and I went to Universal Hollywood, the DreamWorks Theater, Shrek 4D was replaced by the Kung Fu Panda thing.

But in both cases, they're not rides. It's a theater where your seat moved around. At least California Adventure has the Ride the movie ride for Monsters, Inc. You can be reminded of the plot of that movie. That one I've never ridden, though, because it is like the baby ride, and I just don't want to ride a five-year-old's ride. It's still fun. You could be like, oh, that's Regis under that radiation suit.

Of course. We could all love it as like the dressed-up bones of the Hollywood limo ride. But, yes, Shrek was so successful katzenberg for a time still said well i i don't want to give up on 2d in interviews i found him he's going like look we definitely see a future of 3d but we still believe in 2d films and the artistry of that after spirit and simbad made a decision from the top down, no more 2D. Cancel 2D or make it into a 3D film. And after Shrek 2 came out, it was then just everything they made was a 3D film that on some level was a smirking, eyebrow-lifted, famous person going like,

um, I'm over the hedge, guys. I don't know about you. We've all seen just Google DreamWorks face. The DreamWorks face, yes. And a million other rip-offs from it. It was a horrible decade if you loved feature animation. It was a horrible decade for everybody in 2000s. Yeah, always it was a horrible decade.

I don't say this lightly, but after re-experiencing the decade of Shrek and looking back on it, I actually do welcome the minions into our lives because I'm like, you guys are better than Shrek. You are cuter and you have a funnier deal than like farting ogre. A decade of Shrek is a Shrekade. You totally missed it. It's a painful Shrekade. I much prefer the Minions or also Frozen. It's like, you know what?

Frozen has more artistry to it. Like Frozen was kind of finally their response to Shrek. Like, Shrek was like, isn't Disney dumb as shit? Like, come on, these fairy tales. And Disney did all these things like, we can joke about fairy tales too. And then by Frozen, they're like, no, back to fairy tales. They are good. Wasn't Tangled was their Shrek, right?

Where they started to be self-aware. Yeah, yeah. Well, I guess Home on the Range was a bit of a Shrek as well. Still want to see that. I bet it looks looks nice it feels like a shrek answer and that also killed 2d animation for them too for a time but so that's why it's hard the legacy of shrek for me is the death of the animation i prefer to 3d yeah it's and also the creation of some of the worst movies and also the supplanting of some of my favorite voice actors by just famous people who can talk like it led to so so so many bad films it was the road to ruin for mike myers and by the way those wayne and garth uber eats ads or doordash ads whatever they

are uh they make me sick they're uh yeah sickening is the right way to put it it's uh hey you know the characters you like how about if they're puffy and just mutilated by plastic surgery i mean i know mike myers went through a divorce and stuff but like he you don't need to do this no no sure bring the characters back i don't care they're bringing everything back but don't do it for this i mean even if it was a giant paycheck and also mike myers is like well i haven't done anything in a while maybe he also feels like this is a rollout of a reintroduction of me to society like i'll remind people of wayne and then they'll be ready for like another austin powers or something i'll be 10 times sadder seeing his austin powers though my husband and i came up with a perfect pitch for it i swear i'm sure maybe other people said this but we just talked about

this of like okay austin powers his last film it was what 2002 2003 so after that in 2002 austin powers again gets frozen for 20 years and he comes out in 2022 and people have to tell him hey that stuff you did in 2002 is not cool anymore buddy you can't do that oh my god that's perfect because it's been 20 years and i guess the old premise was he was frozen for 30 years yes yeah yeah i do like it he was frozen from 67 to 97 now it'd be 2002 to 2022 austin we don't do ironic racism anymore oh can i play me cds so so there free idea for an austin yes as for for Jeffrey Katzenberg, he would go from success to success. But a funny end to this story and a sad one is when Comcast bought DreamWorks Animation, which had been spun off into its own company separate from DreamWorks,

they paid an extra $400 million so they wouldn't have to work with Jeffrey Katzenberg. Like if you bought DWA with Katzenberg, it was a certain amount. If you wanted him to not be boss, you had to buy out his contract, $400 million. That's how much they did not want to work with Katzenberg. I want to be paid to not work. That sounds awesome.

And you know, since then, Comcast, I was like, oh, I don't even think of DreamWorks movies anymore. Trolls is some of the biggest movies around. And those are dreamworks animated films trolls world tour famously killed all movies last year yes around this time yeah i guess we'll see if it kept it dead but yeah that's and meanwhile if you look at any ugly ass cg movie like say ugly dolls or uh any of those smurf ones just look at the credits you will find at least

one person who worked on shrek or a shrek sequel katzenberg himself meanwhile he'd use all that money to start a little dream called quibi and meanwhile unfortunately as you know how just recently we saw that blue sky got shut down by disney after they bought this big company comcast did that in 2015 even though pacific data images made the biggest hits they ever made at dreamworks they don't get to keep existing comcast like we don't need another office that's in northern california some of you can come to la the rest of you here's your pink slip what a fucking thing to do after 15 years after they saved dreamworks animation pdi gets shut down i don't

recall saying good luck oh it's so so cruel to think that there could be like a crueler task master and not even in a fun way of like there's no fun stories about those comcast guys like there is of a psycho like katzenberg it's just just clean efficiency of shutting something down so that is the history of shrek i'm sure if we'll do shrek 2 or another one i can get more in depth of the things that happened after shrek but a very interesting long road to the theater for shrek impossibly it turned into not only a critically celebrated film but one of the most successful films of all time and shrek 2 would make a fucking billion. And that's not counting toys and games. It's just the film.

But yes, so that's the story of Shrek. Why don't we take a quick break? When we come back, we will head to the land of Far, Far Away. Actually, this one isn't set in Far, Far Away. It's in Duloc. Anyway, that's the other movies. But we will head to Duloc and talk about in depth the film shrek all i ever learned from love is how to shoot at someone who outdrew you

And it's not a cry you can hear at night It's not somebody you've seen the light It's a golden, it's a broken hallelujah Hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah. Once upon a time... Seize him! There was trouble throughout the land. Now tell me, where are the others? You're a monster!

And the only one who could save the day... Don't look down. Shrek, I'm looking down! ...was the unlikeliest hero of them all. Shrek. Shrek? You were expecting Prince Charming. Mike Myers.

Eddie Murphy. No! Cameron Diaz. John Lithgow. Shrek. Shrek. You're expecting Prince Charming. Mike Myers. Eddie Murphy. Cameron Diaz. John Lithgow. Shrek. Rated PG. Starts May 18th everywhere. Shrek. Music from the original motion picture.

Shrek. Featuring music from the Baja Men, The Proclaimers, Leslie Carter, and Smash Mouth with a new version of I'm a Believer. Shrek, the motion picture soundtrack. In stores now. How we use electricity can be smarter, cleaner and greener.

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on November 2nd the number one film of the year arrives on video it's idiot oh that's not very nice it's just a donkey it's one of the top films of all time. Man, I'd really love to stay, but, you know, I'm an asthmatic.

Newsweek calls it smart and hilarious. It gets two big thumbs up. That's right, fool. And now Shrek has an all-new longer ending, and the only place you can get it is on the video and DVD. Own Shrek on video and DVD Friday, November 2nd. Once upon a time, there was a lovely princess. But she had an enchantment upon her of a fearful sort,

which could only be broken by love's first kiss. She was locked away in a castle, guarded by a terrible fire-breathing dragon. Many brave knights had attempted to free her from this dreadful prison, but none prevailed. She waited in the dragon's keep, in the highest room of the tallest tower, for her true love and true love's first kiss.

Like that's ever gonna happen. tool in the shed. She was looking kind of dumb with her finger and her thumb in the shape of an L on her forehead. The years start coming and they don't stop coming. Fed to the rules and I hit the ground running. Didn't make sense, not the real ball fun. Your brain gets smart but your head gets dumb. So much to do, so much to see, so what's wrong with taking the back streets? You'll never Hey now, we're back from the break, and I'm sure you all enjoyed hearing basically America's national anthem, All-Star. Please stand for the playing of All-Star. You know, it's a song about America. It's about everything's dying around the sky. You know, the ice we skate is getting pretty thin, but you might as well swim. All the clitters is gold.

Like, it's about the denial of living in America. It predicted the gig economy, right? Yeah, yeah. Who knows? So it's been a few weeks since we recorded the history segment. I just had these podcasts work. And I've watched it for the first time in 20 years. And I got to say, if you were born after 1990, you might not like my opinion about shrek because i uh i didn't think it was bad i just felt nothing i felt

nothing i was going through a green corridor of shrek and i reached the end and i just felt nothing and i thought usually even with a bad movie i'll smirk i'll go huh or whatever but nothing no no reaction from me from shrek and i have a lot of issues with the storytelling there are a few things that did impress me like the animation at this time they're doing a lot of things that are very ambitious and sometimes they work but overall i'm panning shrek yes okay i i understand that i mean that you know when you compare it to 2001 other cgi films like well it wasn't 2001 it was 2000 but dinosaur by disney like this is way better than dinosaur dinosaur had to cheat by having filmed backgrounds shrek makes its own backgrounds you know i think i mentioned this in the history segment but what i don't like about

shrek is that it makes me defend disney and while watching this movie there's all these jokes about no singing songs are stupid you know what's harder than complaining about writing songs? Writing a song. Writing a good song. Yeah. I mean, you could have put songs in this instead of just doing these needle drops of things that I found very cringeworthy. And I'm going to get mad about this podcast. About this movie, sorry.

I'm also mad about having to talk about Shrek. You voted for it. Oh, wait, no one voted for it. This is Henry's idea. Well, was it yes or no? Yeah. So, I mean, they could have saved you from my idea but i will say it's important culturally for me to know more about shrek so i'm happy for that opportunity but you gotta learn about shrek sometime it's true they're

not teaching in schools anymore and uh yeah i i watched this uh three times yesterday with one version of the dvd commentary another with the other commentary and then full on and uh the dvd commentary is interesting because it is recorded before shrek becomes really shrek like it was definitely recorded after shrek is a big success in theaters but they didn't know that it would also be the biggest dvd of all time when they recorded it but it's an interesting kind of quiet commentary of uh producer aaron warner directors vicky jensen and andrew adamson and i learned a couple things uh overall one i don't know if the pipeline's different now but they talked about how hard it was for some people to get into it because they

did not have a lead animator for characters like on 2d it was just if you got a scene you animate every character in it so if you're wondering why there's not more consistent acting with fiona or donkey per scene it's because a specific animator had different views on okay i kind of noticed that just oh shrek is acting different in this scene or his face he's making different faces or he's not making any real uh faces at all he's kind of robotic i don't know if they fix that for later shreks of like oh you're the lead shrek animator you're the lead whoever animator and who who is quality control on that i i also uh learning about it like vicky jensen and andrew adamson they are a funny pair because that really gives you the flavor of this film because jensen comes from 2d 90s fart cartoons

right right and and adamson comes from a visual effects background who'd never directed a film before so you put that together a guy who's you know good at special effects for 2001 and somebody who does farts that's shrek special effect farts uh and and also an interesting thing that maybe you've seen it on the internet of their in between storyboard bits where it's just you you know, static action figures like flying through a scene of like, here's how the run would go. And it's just a Shrek in a T-pose flying forward. Those are just so funny to look at.

And I found out they animated most of the scenes with the characters essentially naked. And then they'd add the clothes afterwards because like, this is a pain in the ass to do clothes. I want the naked Shrek cuts. And I mean, Donkey is hairless, I guess. Yeah. Boy, this movie made me remember a lot of memes and recognize a lot of memes online.

Like, oh, there's that face. There's that gif. I just, like, I knew they came from this movie, but that's all I could think of when I saw it on the screen. And I will say, in this movie's credit, the sequels have to be better because I feel like their hands are tied because they have to adapt this very simple book. They feel tied down to the message of the book.

And they also want to tell their own wild, cynical 90s story. But it's at odds with what the book has in it. It's at odds with what the book is trying to say. I think Shrek 2 is better. But it also worsens the things that are in this. They're like, oh, well, if you like that Matrix thing, they will reference visually specific films over and over and over again like in the just the opening bit set to counting crows accidentally in love they do like the spider-man upside down kiss and i think like one other movie reference too yeah

i was also surprised and uh happy to see maybe we'll find them in our discussion but no gay jokes in this i i fully expected to be like oh farqu falls over, he's wearing a bra and panties or something. Or something like that. An easy joke for this era. But maybe just because they didn't have any other characters that could make them. And even with Robin Hood. I was sure with the Merry Men they were going to do that. Instead, it's that he's a creep.

But a heterosexual creep i guess well i do remember in shrek 2 when they need pinocchio to lie and make his nose grow for some escape plan pinocchio says i'm not wearing women's underwear and then the nose grows you know i was also expecting more pinocchio and gingerbread man i remember them being in the movie a lot more uh they well because they got one scene in this that people liked. They then were in all of the marketing, all of the... Like, if you watch the bridge film between this that was also a theme park ride, Shrek 4D, they're all over that.

Because once Katzenberg sees that a side character was more popular than he thought, that goes in your face instantly. And it's an animator you don't have to pay as much as Mike Myers. Well, okay, that's also interesting, too, because all over this thing is storyboarders doing the voices. And I think about how in the future ones, they'd say, well, we can't give this prime character in Over the Hedge to some storyboarder. Just find a mid-tier sitcom star.

French Stewart. French Stewart. And just give it to him. If we're going to give five lines to somebody, give it toimmy fallon tony danza what's he doing yeah yeah you you wouldn't make a star out of a storyboarder that that's kind of what i i like about this that it does have kind of the pixar feel and pdi was a similar sized and located place that i think just like how joe Ramft just did voices. Yeah.

Because they're like, oh, well, that's just an awesome voice. He's funny. Just keep it that. Same deal. And I don't want to disparage anyone who worked on the movie in the artistic side because I feel like they're working very hard. They're doing some ambitious things they really can't pull off, but they're trying. Yeah.

And I do think it was a mistake to try to do photorealistic humans in 2001. You can even see that Pixar was very, very selective for their first five or six years of movies of how much humans you would see. Oh, yeah. Until Incredibles, and even then they were very stylized. And even now they don't do photorealistic humans. They are a little cartoony.

Yeah, like, say, Brave, whatever her name is. Bravey McBrave. Merinda, Melinda, Merida, Merida. Thank you. Merida. It's an all right movie all right yes yeah it's not the last dinosaur give it a break uh but yes but she looks cartoonish and big like the way they they do people or like any of the characters in wreck it ralph for instance i i can't deal with human fiona and my skin crawls it's just that she's bad it's bad news you know maybe they also wanted her to live in the uncanny valley so you'd like her uh ogre form more you'd be like oh this is who she should be i like this farquad's a little better because he's a bit cartoonier but

you could tell why there's a lot of helmets on his guys oh yeah oh yeah well well i guess we should start with a very crass in your face 90s opening where we have a storybook tale being told. Like it's the opening to Sleeping Beauty or Beauty and the Beast. And then Shrek literally wipes his ass with those stories. This ain't your mama's Disney movie. I know. I don't think when I was a teen, I was going to say like, oh, I was a little kid. I'm going to pretend that I am 10 years younger.

Whenever you're talking about a movie from 2006, you're like, I was a baby. Yes, I was a baby. I was chewing on something. But no, when I was- An illegal adult. When I was 18 watching this film, I don't think I even fully got that he wiped his ass with that page. Oh, innocent Henry. Even though they go so obvious with even the another page is stuck to

his foot like every every obvious joke it's they take some very very obvious swings here but the storybook being told is fiona's story and kind of the story of shrek it even does end with all of the villagers watching uh celebrating their wedding day in both this film and the book and yes he says yeah right like that's ever gonna happen what a load of flush like another beloved thing katzenberg did like in lion king is have a swear almost be sad that they say ass so many times in this referring to the donkey though correct i i don't think they ever say ass in a way that's like not where you could get away with saying no no, no, no, we're talking about donkey. I'm saving my ass.

Yes. Or you're an ass kisser, right? Yeah. Nobody likes to kiss ass. Yeah. If you're born in Catholic school, you just go to the Bible, find the place where they talk about asses. It's great. And also when he slams the door on his shithouse.

Somebody. Yes. The directors apparently wanted the Crescent moon logo on the shithouse to be the dreamworks logo oh that's great uh but they weren't allowed to that was they were prevented from doing that uh i kind of enjoyed the dreamworks logo the s is turning into shrek s's yes yeah i was like i like when you play with logos it can get a little uh offensive at times but uh i like it i mean look you don't have to say you love this film but are there a few things more iconic from a 2001 film than shrek bursting open that door and it's somebody

like i i think it's the only used track in this song that works the only a licensed track in this song that fully works a lot of them feel like well that's too obvious or why is this a montage what's happening you're only playing 20 seconds of this song. Yeah, man. I just think that term from our podcast, The Ride Friends of 2000 Core, like this whole sequence is so 2000 Core. Like it's just slime and gross shit everywhere while Smash Mouth's All Star is just playing the entire time.

I'm also sad that there was a time where you could say all-star was cool as in they aren't the jerks you thought they'd be because they were very like pro trans rights and pissing off any reactionary fans of theirs and then they did that fucking show in sturgis the super spreader event and when everybody told them please don't do this you don't need to and like all these bikers at sturges why do they care about smash mouth smash mouth made covet 40 percent worse worldwide they did uh you can like literally now say all-star killed people yeah that song like it it would be accurate i was warning people for decades and we see the character's name spelled out in different things that he's doing like mud and slugs and john lithgow's name is spelled out in maggots later are there any artistic credits up front or it's just like the three or four stars oh yeah no just

the star yeah so it's like mike myers eddie murphy cameron diaz and john lithgow and that's it that's all the credits we get up front right that's right that sucks well you know blame iati for not having as good of union as sag or wag you know like it's the director should be named on the screen but that also is very much the katzenberg style like well we got famous people tell people how famous there is yeah and also make people think you're watching a mike myers movie this is just like an austin powers movie it's just mike myers and a murphy goofing around no one made this yeah not a person animated it when it when you see shrek that's uh mike myers made that face and then the character did it's you know it's it's really similar to like a year later when gollum was getting all of that

praise every piece of media was about just how andy circus it's like oh look at andy circus he made this face and then gollum made that face and andy circus is probably the best motion capture actor working but animators made a lot of choices with his performance and made it work. MoCap was so primitive back then. They really dressed up his performance with so many little touches. Yeah, I think that kind of, you know, advertising and that pitch went so mainstream that even to this day, people think that if you do MoCap on it, that no animator did any work or anything. Like there's,

there's definitely bits in this movie where I think, oh yeah, they probably did start with motion capture for like a movement to character did, or even a facial expression. But then an animator had to make it work way better than the, the uncanny Valley it lived in before. But, but it's also in Katzenberg's interest.

Like he doesn't care about pissing off people below the line. He to be very friendly to mike myers and cameron diaz and eddie murphy and john lithgow we'll get to this but i have a feeling that they told eddie you know the script is just a suggestion eddie have fun have fun we'll record it all we'll use it all yep there's lots of lines in here that i can just tell you like well no that's just eddie murphy making it i think mike myers actually had even more control than than murphy like they just said hey murphy you know have some fun here while mike myers said well i think shrek is this and i'm gonna do this bit and this bit and shrek says so many things in here that just as a fan of comedy you know are just mike my ears like words yeah yeah but but yes about all-star early in their their temp track editing of the film in storyboard form,

they were using All-Star and they were thinking, boy, this is good, but I don't know if we actually can use it, but this works better than any other song we're trying for this opening sequence. They really wanted to do it. They contacted Smash Mouth. They said no at first, but then they gave them the closing song in the movie as a second song on the soundtrack to make them even more money. And so they're like, fine, use All-Star. How much money did Smash Mouth make off this movie? I would bet Shrek alone has made them $100 million.

Why did they need to play Sturgis at all? Just stop. Stop playing music. You're done. You know, they wanted a third house in Venice, Bob. Who are you? Yeah, well, you some Marxist trying to take away a third house in Venice, Bob. Who are you? Yeah, well, you some Marxist trying to take away their third house, Bob? The guy needs to buy more bowling shirts.

I bet he buys like $700 bowling shirts. These are the fans. These are the Armani bowling shirts. And yes, in the sequence here, they also talked about some of the most complicated stuff they did in the film was trying to animate mud sliding down Shrek's bare ass. That was some of the hardest stuff they did. I was paying attention to things like mud and water and fire. There's some really awful fire in this movie, but the liquids are pretty good for this era.

Yeah, yeah. The fire was as good as they could make it then. It kind of looks like N64 fire. There's one scene where they throw a book into the fireplace it looks like oh i saw that in zelda like oh yeah i lit that torch in zelda yeah when he had the uh late in the hallelujah section where he throws the sunflower into the fire that fire is the worst looking fire it's pretty bad there's better fire in the movie but the mud going down his butt that looks all right that's that's all right and the mud getting

pushed out of the log. Yeah, yeah. When you're thinking, what's happening in the scene? And then you realize, oh, it's him being shoved through a log or pushing himself through a log. They wanted us to think that was like shit. Yeah, he's shitting through a log. Yeah, he also in a very like a wink to Austin Powers. There's a lot of winks in here, but they hide Shrek's genitals with a, you know,

tree branches just in the way during the opening shower sequence of shrek they also say that like the pdi figured out facial animation a lot better after ants and also that's why this film though you wouldn't you doesn't read is showing off now in 2001 just seeing this like swamp area look real enough, that was them showing off like we couldn't have done this shit at all in Anson. Probably them saying too, UNC, Pixar, they couldn't pull off this sludge right now. It's three years later, so it's not really a fair comparison, but it does look a lot better than the outside stuff in A Bug's Life. I was impressed by the outdoor environments for this era. Yeah, well, you know, it's not just time. It is also like if you're a gamer, you talk about game engines a lot.

But PDI is using different tools than Pixar. And so PDI can do some things better than Pixar could do then. Do you think Shrek kills that bug when he gets the stuff out of it for the toothpaste? There's a lot of animal abuse in this movie, and I don't like it. Oh, I know there's one. I don't want our heroes doing these things to animals then shrek takes a nude plunge in a pool shout out to the twitter account every shrek frame in order uh that uh posts like a frame every 20 minutes and the at least at the time of this recording the pinned tweet is frame 3265 which is the frame where you can see

all of shrek's butt from his jump into the pool someone set that to be yesterday when i was uh watching shrek and i reported them uh you that's 218 plus for twitter account yeah and and when shrek rips a big fart in the uh and kills with it. They tell the story on the commentary that they were in a fancy French screening of Shrek. And when that fart happened, they all like shrunk into their chairs like, I can't believe I'm here. They're not going to like the Robin Hood scene coming up. You know, Shrek takes the fish. He doesn't eat the fish. What's he do with it?

I got to think he ate that fish. They should show him eating the fish. I thought that was going to be the payoff. Because mainly he just eats like slugs and bugs yeah and i where does he get those eyeballs from that's that's very wasteful if he's just eating the fish eyes and none of the other parts of the fish yeah he collects a bunch of bugs and bullshit and uh and then it's cross-cutting to him preparing for a nice evening while we see a bunch of villagers from very far away you don't you see them at night and not close up because even they admit on the commentary most of the villagers they refer to

them as potato heads because they just have interchangeable eyes and faces but it's basically this is man this is woman we can make them taller or shorter but you just change out the face they're not going to model individual characters for scenes like this yeah i mean that's why if you see incredibles which was really only three years after this incredibles has this these many scenes that don't feel like show-off scenes but like in the opening bit where it's a bunch of just people walking to work like it's you know like a scene from new york city like oh the many people that is a show-off scene. And they're showing off, we made this many bystanders who are unique enough that you can't tell that they all come from a formatting thing. But also, when Shrek lights his fire with his belch, I was just thinking of a little kid saying, like, and then, Mommy? And then Shrek lights a fire with his belch.

He's so funny, Mommy. Yes, very good. He's so funny. Let's go home. But yes, Shrek introduces himself to both the audience and a bunch of villagers. All right. Let's get it. Hold on.

Do you know what that thing could do to you? Yeah. It'll grind your bones for its bread. Yes. Well, actually, that would be a giant. Now, ogres, they're much worse. They'll make a suit from your freshly peeled skin. They'll shave your liver, squeeze the jelly from your eyes.

Actually, it's quite good on toast. Back! Back, fish! Back! I warn you! Right. I like his little scream with the blobs of spit flying out and hitting people. That's fine. Yeah, yeah. And it's an important distinction that Shrek does not kill any of these people. He just wants them to leave. He only hurts people in self-defense.

Yeah, yeah. If they're coming at him with swords and whatnot also you know when the villagers were walking there i did like the design of scarecrow shrek that was you know like a big pumpkin head on it that was fun uh but shrek's big scary ogre speech on the commentary they say was mostly meyers improv especially i mean quite good on toast that sounds like a meyersism for sure yes i'll touch on this a few other times where it becomes evident that they just had to reshuffle the deck but originally it wasn't the trek wanted to be left alone he wanted to prove to his parents that ogres could be knights so if you're wondering why there's a whole bunch of shit of him like putting on a knight

helmet competing against knights that is left over from it's him trying to prove to his dad that an ogre can be a knight as well i was actually looking up the musical just out of curiosity for this podcast and the musical follows that plot line okay i didn't know that the parent stuff is in the musical a lot oh all right see i didn't i mean that gets you to a three-hour musical yeah sure yeah because this film is kind of light on flood oh boy is it ever the only bit i watched from the musical because it's on the the blu-ray is uh the far quad song which is pretty funny if to just see the performer who plays far quad has to do a full like broadway singing and dance thing dorf style he's on his knees boy that guy that poor man he's in the hospital now he must have

like rock solid quads after that yeah i will say uh i don't know controversial take from bob mackie this movie would be much better with songs because there is so much dialogue that is inconsequential i feel like the 15 to 20 minutes of donkey saying random things over and over again that have nothing to do with the plot that That could have been replaced with songs. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, or just have Donkey sing more things.

Yeah. But you know that song thing? I just remember even the promotion for Prince of Egypt reading about that in the research that Katzenberg was like, this isn't songs. No songs. He was so against having songs to prove he didn't need them, I guess. Which is so weird because it was through Katzenberg's connection to Geffen that they even started having songs in The Little Mermaid. Like Ashman was hired through that. So I guess he could just be, he's like, I never understood why Geffen liked music so much.

It's dumb. Again, I'm just thinking with an animated movie for kids or for families or whatever, it's okay to have a plot this light. But usually a third of the movies occupy with songs so you don't have to worry about the plot being that light because you have an hour of actual storytelling to do around those songs but in this movie they don't have that so i feel like there's so much meandering that happens after the halfway point well i think too that you know another bit on the song thing is that especially as i dissected which songs were and weren't on the album and all that that the goal of dreamworks records was to sell an album with bands that are signed with dreamworks not to do a musical so it was in their business

interest as well bob to just play songs that happen to be by dreamworks recording artists or if they're not by dreamworks recording artists that have by dreamworks recording artists or if they're not by a dreamworks recording artist that have a dreamworks recording artist cover that song uh that happens later right yes it happens later like three times actually but so shrek scares off those guys and he could give a shit about the fairy tale creatures being rounded up and now man i have to say all this stuff of the rounding up of the fairy tale creatures by the army. I mean, it had obvious Nazi similarities even in 2001, but this really feels like something now, man.

The baggage of these jokes that used to be funny is really, you can feel it with this and the torture sequence when we used to make torture jokes. And now we were like, well, we were torturing people in 2001, of course, but now we're more so aware of it yes yeah gingerbread man pretty much gets waterboarded yeah yeah and one in this case seeing baby bear in a cage and saying this cage is so small i rewound i rewound the movie thinking wait did that just happen yeah because i'm sure i laughed at it i'm sure i laughed at it when i was 19 and now we we're in the age of camps there's so many camps yeah well also think about in 2001 and this is a film made in steven spielberg's production company like even if you didn't know the history of the holocaust and all that as much you definitely knew the scene that

starts schindler's list of the proper naz Nazi at the desk in the line of people. Like, that's what they're doing. Yeah. Except Jim Cummings is playing the knight who interviews the people. This is too edgy for me. It's just shocking. Like, to see that is the joke that, like, they are going to, like, a designated resettlement facility. Yeah.

They're being put in a ghetto for these marginalized citizens. Yes. it has similarities to you know what ice does every single day but in 2001 this was a nazi reference i guess you know in 2001 we all had more nazi jokes because we just thought well this will never happen again we're laughing about the past that settled if you're gonna put this in the beginning of your movie the movie should be about this and the movie really isn't about this actually when they get sent to shrek's home and then when Shrek gets rid of him, there's no scene of them being like rounded up again or making Shrek feel bad. It's like, hey, you just sentenced them to death, Shrek, or you just moved them out of your swamp.

I guess they fixed that at the very least by having them all at his wedding at the end that they got freed i suppose but yeah to deal in such heavy imagery of out of history and then not really return to it that's uh i don't know that's weird are these jokes also about disney expanding disneyland um yeah you know i think this was written during the california venture buildings it probably probably just opened when this movie went live because I think it was March of 2001 or something like that. It was spring, I think. Yeah, that's right. Because all the 20th anniversary stuff for California Adventure has just happened. So then they weren't working on this as the story of Disney taking over was in the news. Well, I also

think Katzenberg probably got off at the idea of like, disney's like the nazis they take away all these fairy tale creatures and force them into servitude also i mean not only does baby bear have to cry but this is the only time you're seeing mama bear breathing in this oh you're right i forgot about that yeah you see her as a rug later it's uh it's heavy man so they're also being killed yes yes some die well i think she is the only fatality that's provable in the film which on the commentary the directors are chuckling at getting away with that dead mama bear but uh but yes everybody is selling their magical creatures into slavery which it also makes me question like who exists as a legal person in this world again the movie should be about this because i have so many questions do do people own fairy tale creatures

do they were they arrested were they just uh chased down i don't understand like peter pan is right behind them in line about to sell tinkerbell yeah so peter pan owns tinkerbell i always thought they were on similar levels you know but i guess he like orders around tink a bunch i don't know it's it's weird and then on top of that a chucked plot line here as we introduce donkey is that originally in the plot where shrek wants to be a knight he saves donkey from a witch that cursed him with the ability to speak in this case it's just some old lady who never returned she doesn't appear in other movies if uh correct me if i'm wrong but i don't think they ever really set up

a backstory for donkey no donkey's owner gets a lot of uh screen time too yes yeah she's voiced by the late kathleen freeman who was a character actor known for uh well she was peg's mom and married with children if you remember her or Or she was the mother superior in Blues Brothers. She was a mean old lady. That was her character. She played Mother Wanker on Married with Children. Oh, the wankers. Yeah.

And then this was one of her final roles, sadly. But she says damn. I was like, wow, that's weird. I'm a chonking-ish damn donkey ever saw. There's some dams and hells. Is this a PG movie? It's PG. PG, yeah. Yeah. Which also was like, Disney wouldn't do that, would it? conquering this damn donkey ever saw there's some dams and hells this pg movie it's pg yeah yeah

which also was like disney wouldn't do that would it and also speaking about cold geppetto sells pinocchio like it's like god damn though i was very distracted the the guard was jim cummings i was like me too especially because a couple times he's in jim cummings where i think they for one version of the film and they kept the majority of his lines but when they're like oh when he's gonna scream let's not call cummings back we'll just have have a storyboard to do it who cares in general about donkey's design i find his soulful eyes and human mouth very distracting they disturb me uh i will say i don't like the character design in this movie but i will give it to donkey

for being a cute character sure he may be in his animations uh not necessarily in his face in his cat-like animations or when he acts like a dog those are funny he moves in ways donkeys do not move yeah they also talk about both with shrek and donkey's design a reason they try not to have them be face to face with Fiona too much is because you think about how huge their heads are in relation to Fiona's head. Yeah, I was actually thinking of that when they're in scenes together. Like, God, she's just so weird looking next to these characters. Like when they have their little cute moment of her on top of him, you can just think like

her entire head would fit in Shrek's mouth with room to spare. Like not to get into vore pornography she ends up looking like the weirdo in this movie you're right yeah well hey bob maybe that's what they meant to say like what is normal really bob it was all planned from the beginning yeah but but yes behind the scenes the donkey design is based on perry a donkey that lived in palo alto near the pdi studio so it's like after the movie Alto near the PDI studio. So I was like, after the movie came out, the tourist board for Palo Alto was like, come see Perry, the real life donkey. But all donkeys kind of look the same, right? Not to disparage donkeys.

His stature is similar to it. Look it up. He kind of looks like donkey. I don't believe Perry is still with us though but uh you know hey it was 20 years you know but yes peter pan is selling tinkerbell so a caged tinkerbell lands on donkey and then he starts to fly and i also think these jokes are also why disney stopped doing public domain fairy tales as much because they realized by doing peter pan they could then have somebody make fun of them and just have the character called peter pan yeah in this movie or the three little pigs and we did duck tales last month if you haven't heard that one what happens in that movie happens in this movie too and i absolutely hate it a character looks at the

screen and goes uh-oh and then something bad happens i can't fucking stand that he he literally goes oh and then he falls it's it's terrible it's terrible he's letting the kids in the audience know something funny is about to happen you know what i like eddie murphy i just feel like all of these riffs feel like just total first drafts they are like the the 90s of riffs it is sort of like the taste like chicken. That's going to leave a mark. Like all of those. Somebody needs a Tic Tac.

Yeah. Paper or plastic. Like all of those meaningless riffs. I feel like that's all he's doing in this movie. And when I do these notes for these movies, I usually write down a lot of dialogue. With Shrek, I rarely wrote down dialogue because it just feels so inconsequential.

Well, because they're just a tossed off line by a famous person half the time yeah and watching the picture in picture thing was also really funny because they tell the story of like oh and Mike Myers came up with this line and then they show footage that's supposed to be like oh here's when he said it and I know they're like no no no you called him in for this day and like, let's pretend we're recording that line, Mike. He's like, okay. Oh, it tastes really good on toast. Is that a good line? Like it. It feels like those things they do for EPKs where the people get dressed up very nicely and pretend they're doing the dialogue that they've already recorded. Exactly. Exactly. By the way, it's electronic press kit. Yes. Yeah. Not to be confused with the item that the Ghostbusters use, which I've often said it backwards. P meter yeah uh but the german accents on the pigs who say like oh you can fly

they have german accents because it sounded funny like there's no other reason to it for that and those are also all story borders i i assume so again i don't know why i misremembered i remember these characters being in the movie a lot more yeah yeah they just say like a second line i i think it really is because they were in so much more of the advertising also because they can be their real voices too i don't care if an ogre feels good about himself there are people being rounded up and murdered yes you know there's a bigger story happening in this movie and they're not telling it yeah yeah i guess at least you don't feel bad at all when farquaad dies at the end of the movie but yeah it's it's weird to to open that can of worms and not deal with it uh so donkey starts

flying and he says now i'm a flying talking donkey and then has a very weird riff uh referencing the dumbo crows which is like you may have seen a house fly even a superfly oh but you've never seen a donkey fly and also referencing the movie superfly yes also on that one i have questions every time donkey references a thing that we know because i have to say like well then how does donkey know that thing that doesn't seem to exist in this world superfly would be the first of those and the pina colada song is coming up yep yeah yeah and uh but yes they donkey gets chased and it is intentionally if you see it's not very long but when you see the camera behind donkey's back and he's running through all the trees it is supposed to be a reference

that bit in return of the jedi of the the fly through the indoor forest okay i didn't get the reference but i like the shot yeah i thought it was a well-done shot i did write down the things i liked about the movie visually because there are like i was like oh that's impressive they probably took a lot of work to move the camera like that yeah they also talk about the little things that you wouldn't notice of say a tree tree leaves blowing or the all that of like they say if they were static you would notice if we put in a ton of work to make them not static and to move naturalistically you don't notice so it almost feels like not worth it but it's just a thing you don't know if they're not

there so donkey of course bumps into shrek's butt like directly just to get more butt humor in here i almost feel like there was a note that said if we go 10 minutes without a joke about shrek's butt we have failed has to something has to happen back to the drawing board where can we fit in a butt joke even here for Shrek's butt so uh yes Farquaad seal is pulled out and it really does look like the Facebook logo I couldn't stop thinking of Facebook I had to remind myself no this is not a Facebook parody Facebook is still a few years away yeah do you think somebody in the offices when they designed that little f were like hey this looks like that far quad thing from shrek remember shrek let's steal it yeah this is where

they bring up the term of the jim cummings guy tries to arrest shrek and says he's going to be sent to a designated resettlement facility which man oh man yeah uh hey they've got wi-fi there now uh yeah and you know well they're they're spaced out a lot more than you'd think. Some of those kids are actually like 16, so I mean, it's not even like, we're not talking like babies here. I'd like a free foil blanket. They look nice. Yeah, yeah, come on. Free meal every day?

What are you, anyway. Yes, lots of things are happening in the news. Yes, and that's when Shrek scares off all the guys just by how huge he is. A guy who's not Jim Cummings screams as they run away. And then we get to see that Shrek is correct. The donkey is annoying and he shouldn't want him around. And that was all I was thinking this entire sequence. I agree with Shrek on most things.

Politically, I'm not so sure. Well, you definitely wouldn't be like, hey, it's not my business. You know, I'm not political here. He is an isolationist too he yes yeah that's a really good way to put it but in this case he saves donkey's life just because he hates those guys more and then this annoying hanger on shoves himself into his life like can i just move in with you no you can't it's my home go away shrek has a point at least donkey does have a point of like well i'm the only person who even talks to you isn't that kind of nice and that's when shrek yells in his face and he says like

another obvious like you need some tic tacs here buddy your breath stinks there are too many moments where you feel like oh shrek crossed the line with donkey he got too mean and then when they finally have to sell that moment you don't really believe it because there's like three moments before that where donkey just bounces back yeah you're right the when he says do him in here is twice as mean as what he says in the final moment of of their friendship at the big end of second act breakup but yeah when he says tic tacs i was like what are tic tacs in this world you can you go to the local convenience store and it's still the brand tic tacs are here it's just so like just have him say breath mints like why does it have to be a branded word you know i was thinking about donkey in terms of other

characters who are similar to him like iago and i was like well isn't iago the same character but then i thought no everything he says is related to the plot yeah he's just not riffing on things all the time yeah he's he's at least funny of saying you know i hate that guy this dumb broad i like yeah and here it's just donkey saying well it feels like what you'd ask of just a comedian to think off the top of their head okay a guy growls in your face oh your breath stinks you smell bad like that's it's the first joke i think by even 19 i by 2001 i knew there were so many jokes of pu somebody needs a banaca i was thinking banaca banaca is funnier than tic-tacs if you want a comedy word it's banaca well i guess they think you know tic-tacs you got you have the hard c's which the comedy science says is funnier and also he tries to silence donkey

and donkey halfway tells a story about eating berries that makes him like fart a bunch which is the fourth fart joke in nine minutes in this film give the kids what they want uh and so uh donkey follows shrek home and he's he's got a song in his heart and then i ate some rotten berries man had some strong gases eking out of my butt that day. Why are you following me? I'll tell you why. Cause I'm all alone. There's no one here beside me.

My problems have all gone. There's no one to deride me. But you gotta have friends Stop singing! Well, it's no wonder you don't have any friends. Wow. Only a true friend would be that truly honest. Listen, little donkey. Take a look at me. What am I? Uh...

Really tall? No! I'm an ogre. You know, grab your torch and pitchforks. Doesn't that bother you? Nope. Really? Really, really. Oh.

Man, I like you. What's your name? Uh... Shrek. Shrek? Hey, you know, I like you. What's your name? Uh, Shrek. Shrek? Hey, you know, I, okay, I do sort of like the moment that Shrek says, oh, you're not scared of me, you're the first person I ever met who's not scared of me, and you want to know my name. No one's asked me that, because he goes like, uh, Shrek. I guess he had to think about it.

Yeah. I read one reading from a person who worked on the film who thinks of that scene as Shrek making up his name on the spot because he's never been asked his name before. He's like, my name's Shrek. Yeah, Shrek. But yes, that song sung, that is 1973's Friends by Bette Midler. Oh, it's a real song. It's a real song, yes.

No song he sings is a made up song. I just never heard that before. Well, you know, Jeffrey Katzenberg certainly had because he worked with Bette Midler quite a lot in the 80s. I see. All in a favor. Like in 1989, I found a New York Times story that absolutely feels like Katzenberg getting placement in New York Times.

But it was about how Bette Midler saved Disney because once Katzenberg and Eisner came in, they loved working with middler before and they had her star in like four different films that made pretty good 80s money for for a movie and they're like oh bett middler saved it and so it was one of those beaches yes one of them was beaches another was terrible people horrible one of those something it was the one with devito yeah she did yeah and so i think he probably was like hey i should give my friend bet another payday let's just license that's all i know i don't know eddie murphy could have just said like oh i like this song and start singing

but i have a feeling that was in the script to sing a bet middler song also the commentary in a way that feels like they are trying to assuage somebody's ego. Uh-oh. They say, like, in real life, Eddie Murphy's a much better singer than Donkey, and he's trying to sing bad on purpose as Donkey. Oh, come on. This girl wants to party all the time. We've heard it. Yeah, that is a good song, but... Rick James helped a lot with that, though.

Well, that's why that comment to me feels like Eddie Murphy said, don't let people think I can sing this bad. I'm a better singer than this. And he is a good singer. He is. I'm not saying he's not. He just celebrated his 60th birthday i think wow and you know i haven't watched uh the coming to america too even though it's just on the amazon no it's coming to america pardon me

yes you have to pronounce the two like the number uh and something i think they do really good with in this movie are eye twitches when a character twitches their eye like shrek twitches his eye as he is listening to the song sung in his face and uh and yeah so they just keep walking i do like the little shot of walking over the flowery hill into the shrek's home and all that donkey insults his home before realizing it's his home then he just invites himself to live with shrek which shrek i think is correct to not like that. He's right. Donkey's annoying. If anything, Donkey owes Shrek a favor. The favor should be to go away.

Yes, go away. I mean, in Donkey's defense, he will die if he's without Shrek. If he just walks away from Shrek, those soldiers will just grab him again and put him in chains. Like I said, the story should be about that. There's only one other moment in the entire movie in which he has that fear. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. And that bit's funny funny they could have at least got more comedy out of

it but but then comes the iconic line we can stay up late swapping manly stories and then in the morning i'm making waffles in all the commercials every commercial well you know it's it's a fine enough line yeah it's inoffensive but it's also one that in the extras uh in the picture in picture thing they show jeffrey katzenberg saying do we want these pancakes or waffles i think waffles is funny we're going with waffles you know what he's right he is right well you're mr waffles over waffles are superior breakfast food and uh they should be in more jokes they're a funnier comedy word too i'll give them that yeah i that. Though apparently they talk about localization, too, on the commentary that in Mexico, it's I'm making tamales. In France, it's I'm making crepes.

So not universally waffles all over the world. What does the Japanese track dub say? You know, it's not on the DVD. I should check that out. What would he say? Omi rice? Yeah, you know, that would be nice omirice yeah just the big ass toast like the characters eat in whisper of the heart i love that giant toast

and so yes shrek getting fed up tells him to go outside i also kind of hate donkey because he is so annoying of like you should feel bad for me i guess i'll sleep outside it's like he's being nice enough to let you stay on your porch you're not dead and then we get a quick crossfade to shrek preparing his meal you know what this is uh too relatable during lockdown we're now in month 13 i'm like well this is my every day making my little eyeball platter drinking a cocktail dinner for one every day yeah you think like man i did the presentation of the purple stuff in this pumpkin really well and just for me. Eating the same like five meals for a year.

I bet you felt that even more watching the bit later where he's eating and then it cross cuts to Fiona at the table too. I don't pull earwax out of me to make a candle though. So they say apparently their original pitch was a grosser looking earwax and that's as gross as Katzenberg would let him be with it. I guess it's convincingly earwax, but not really it's just like it's like a perfectly pulled out candle from his ear it's disgusting for sure definitely gag inducing but i do think like well then wait how does he keep that wick centered in his ear to pull it out because really gravity would pull it down to the bottom of his ear you know i too many questions what do you think of shrek's many ear actings and moving uh i find his ears disgusting i i don't like them especially when you see the

sun through the flesh in his ear the the semi-transparency yeah and we were all about things on stalks in the late 90s early 2000s like jar jar binks oh yeah i find them hideous ear stocks uh eye stocks a stocky time for america and yes then a bunch of nosy jerk fairy tale characters move into his house which you know i'll forgive them because they they have gone through this horrible trauma of having their homes taken from them and shoved into a swamp by a fascist uh. So I don't feel too bad for them. But then this just feels like, okay, this is another thing that I didn't like even back in 2001. I'd already been through years of hearing comedy of like, well, you know, that Snow

White fairy tale. And if you think about it this way, it's actually kind of funny. These jokes aren't as funny as the movie thinks they are. In fact, we were talking about this in the history segment. Rocky and Bullwinkle was doing this 50 years 50 years earlier yep you're right or 40 years earlier yeah you're right 40 yeah it's it's all the same deal you are correct yeah the again when we saw the big bad wolf dressed as grandma i was shocked there wasn't a real like cross-dressing joke you know okay so i guess i didn't chuckle the movie. My mouth might have moved when the wolf goes, what?

What? So there you go. That wolf was also voiced by a producer on the film too. And yeah, the three blind mice, two of them are producers. One is Mike Myers. Very obviously Mike Myers. Like, oh, that's the Mike Myers English voice he does. I kind of like him trying to grab the mice and the blind mice bumble around. But if you try to grab them, then they have like super speed and can dodge anything and yeah they shove a dead body on the

table like oh no no no dead broad off the table uh and so shrek heads out season is swap it is full of fairy tale creatures including a airport style landing of witches on a runway that this shot looks uh very impressive for 2001 even now just the amount of characters crammed into the screen all moving and this is the first time i've seen this movie in 4k yeah i saw it in theaters twice and then never again so i'm seeing this the most pristine quality ever and it looks good this scene is interesting visually and they're doing a ton but they don't go this far ever again and you know why yes yes it's too much work watching it on my blu-ray i i was impressed

at bits i didn't think i'd be impressed with i think it's because i had before seen them just in sd if i ever re-watched shrek i'd see him in 480 or something so and this made me realize why the movie is not about this because they can't put all these characters on the screen they really only want to focus on shrek and donkey and fiona for most of the movie well they got it they had a very firm 2001 release date bob yeah there's they tell the story on the commentary that nine hours per frame to render some of these shots which when a shot has hundreds of frames that's a long time it's 24 frames per second in movies yeah the producer on the commentary says he didn't even want to okay this but the director said oh no we'll have them like be in the dark they'll just be like eyes you see and then when they're looking at it on screen doing

the commentary like those aren't eyes you lied to me and yes we also see baby bear is crying no mother is there oh no seemingly he i hope he didn't witness his mother's murder and he just can assume she's dead let's at least see that but yes they say he hoofed and he poofed and he just can assume she's dead. Let's at least see that. But yes, they say he hoofed and he poofed and he signed an eviction notice. Also, all of them are demanding that somebody do something and Shrek has had enough of it. Don't look at me. I didn't invite them.

Oh gosh, no one invited us. What? We were forced to come here. By who? Lord Farquaad. He hoofed and he poofed and he signed an eviction notice. Ah. All right.

Who knows where this Farquaad guy is? Oh, I do. I know where he is. Does anyone else know where to find him? Anyone at all? Me, me. Anyone? Oh, pick me. Oh, I know, I know, me, me. Okay, fine. Attention all fairy tale things. Do not get comfortable. Your welcome is officially worn out. In fact, I'm going to see this guy Farquaad right now and get you all off my land and back where you came from. So now Shrek has something to do.

Outside of yelling at people. He has a thing to get people out of his swamp. And apparently when he said, attention all fairytale creatures, originally it was just recorded by katzenberg himself on a digital tape in the back of a car in new york and it sounded so shit that that one there at the end they're like we just have to redo this like it did well he recorded mike myers in the back of a car yeah like he was like oh we need this extra line i'm gonna fly i'm seeing him in new york anyway i jeffrey katzenberg have a dat and i'm just gonna record it myself it's good enough and i did have a little chuckle that his angry

speech that's meant to push all these people away they then go like yay the hero's gonna do it that that's funny though that pinocchio this isn't saying the the people who play them are like bad actors but anybody can do that pinocchio voice it's true it's like it's a voice anyone can do but so hey if anybody can do it and you laugh at the storyboard or doing it then just do it which is why they do it twice in the movie with another character yes yeah actually right after this yes well i mean too the pigs are that voice because they they all say it like the yeah or the big bad wolf it's it's all the same deal yeah and as they walk away donkey starts singing 1979 willie nelson hit song on the road again and i roll my eyes yes yeah like

what hey what's the obvious song you could do like on the road again then we cut to our villain of the film farquad i had a little smile with these cross cuts to him looking so scary and then the forced perspective of his walk forward. I will say the movie, I enjoy the villain. I enjoy the performance, but he's just out of the movie completely. And there should be more of a ticking clock. Well, we'll get to it. The sunset is ticking clock, but it's very boring.

We should, he should have a grander scheme. I mean, he does, but the movie doesn't even care about it. I feel like we need to see him more. Yeah. The, his wants and needs kind of, he should either really want to be a king so he could conquer everybody or he should really want to have sex with fiona yeah one of those two should be his drives they kind of just muddle them in the middle of the movie another story issue i have is this confused me upon watching this because i forgot this was an element in the movie. He wants to be a king. How we use electricity can be smarter,

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what is not making him a king right now. He's a ruler of a land named after him. He has knights. He is the leader. Well, if you want to do the semiotic reading

that he is actually a Jeffrey Katzenberg mockery in disguise, then even though he is the leader of DreamWorks, he is not the king, a.k.a. in charge of Disney. Yeah. And so this is about him wanting to have more, even though he already has his own fiefdom. It needs to be, if he becomes king, he can do something. Like, only if I'm king can i do this or have this power my magic spell book does not unlock unless i am officially a king so it just it makes it not an issue like what is his motivation he wants to be king he is king what are you talking about

but lithgow is so good it is great it makes me sad that he's dead so he can never come back in the other stuff i've heard he comes back as a ghost in the future movies. In Shrek 4D, he comes back as a ghost. Yes, it's if you never experienced as a ride, if you see a Shrek short called The Ghost of Farquaad or something like that, Lord Farquaad's Ghost, I think it's called. That is Shrek 4D, except it's in 2 2d which makes all the scenes of like shrek swinging bugs toward a screen seem very boring on your television well when they're spraying water at you in a theater yes and you've got comfortable glasses on it's more fun well that we find out

that in the shrek world you can kill a ghost like he is a ghost and then the ghost dies oh cool and we also get to see thelonious the uh he's a recurring character in it as well the the masked uh executioner type dude voiced by christopher knight animator who would go on to be the lead a lead person on madagascar and one of the lead madagascar penguins so he's private penguin whichever one of the penguins that is i like those penguins it's uh the only good part of that movie it's not the shatner voice penguin it's it's also i'll say another thing on that blu-ray of shrek they have the dreamworks jukebox which just plays you random songs from other movies and one of them was just from madagascar of the um lemur guy going like

i like to move it, move it. He's just singing it. You know, Madagascar is probably worse than this. I think it is. 100% it's worse than this. Yeah. I bet, Bob, you'll like Shrek more if you watched all of the, like, Over the Hedge. Shark Tale.

Shark Tale, Megamind. You know, I've heard Megamind's not bad. But Shark Tale will make you pray for Shrek. You'll be like, oh, please get Shrek back. Pray for Shrek. Pray. You will beg for Shrek after you see these fish. Get some fun torture here.

Yeah, yeah. Waterboarding in milk. Yeah, but you're right, Bob. Why are they doing this? There's no... Okay, he's torturing him, asking him for something. He's telling him about the Muffin Man, but then when the mirror shows up,

he's like, don't tell him anything. But what he asked the mirror is like hey aren't i great and the mirror says you're not a king and then he says oh then i need a princess what was i don't see how all that logic of the scene is bizarre i feel like they had all these ideas and didn't know why they had a function in the movie but thought they were funny enough to leave in yeah i think when they dropped that night stuff with shrek they dropped some other stuff with farquaad and they just wanted to keep like well this torture scene's really funny like it what's it matter what he asks him about he's he's relocating the he's relocating the fairy tale creatures because why to go over this again well because he doesn't like them yeah and he wants the place all to himself i guess i guess maybe there should be more of him

trying to find the princess than it just being told to him explicitly you know just being brought into him like well here's the information you want i thought maybe it could be interesting if he's rounding these creatures up because one of them knows yeah one of them knows where a princess is they can't let him find out because if he becomes king something happens yes wow that's a much better plot line instead he seems to he only knows he needs a princess because a mirror tells him that but yes i mean this is i think some of the better fun acting yeah outside of the scene making no sense lithgow is very funny wait wait wait is it lithgow or lithgow i know my wife's gonna yell at me go okay yes i apologize

uh for any misuses of his name to prevent myself myself from doing it, I wrote his name in my notes as L-I-T-H-G-O. So I don't even see that W that makes me think to say gal. I say go. Pokemon, let's go see Shrek. Yes. Yeah. But this is him with storyboarder Conrad Vernon as the gingerbread man. monster i'm not the monster here you are you and the rest of that fairy tale trash poisoning my perfect world now tell me where are the others eat me i've tried to be fair to you creatures

now my patience has reached its end tell me or i'll no not the buttons not my gumdrop buttons all right then who's hiding them? Okay, I'll tell you. Do you know the Muffin Man? The Muffin Man? The Muffin Man. Yes, I know the Muffin Man. Who lives on Drury Lane? Well, she's married to the Muffin Man.

The Muffin Man? The Muffin Man! She's married to the Muffin Man. My lord. That goes on a bit long yeah and i also think boy i'm just punching up this movie constantly sorry this is annoying but he should have some motivation for not liking the fairy tale creatures i feel like yeah there he is just so unexplored and that's why he's a bad villain with a great performance well so i will say on the

commentary they say that in defense of all the short jokes which seems to go against the moral of the movie which is you should accept yourself as who you are except if you're a short guy yeah well we all hate ben shapiro yes well that's true but the reason we hate ben shapiro isn't just that he is a tiny man it's that he's an awful person and i married a short woman and it breaks my heart every day uh so that's why all these short jokes with far quad they think they're justified and also they think that his this is the director saying it his distaste for the fairy tale creatures is because they aren't normal just like he isn't normal well then put that in your movie he should have said a line like yeah instead on the commentary they're like well i think you can

you know guess that from or infer it's like this is a children's movie have him say yeah you should be normal like me and so he's like you're not normal or whatever like just yeah that isn't it that is an easy voice to do uh yeah the gingerbread man you're a monster the muffin man we can all we can all be gingerbread man when the economy sinks again i'll be adr for shrek five or six or whatever when they're on it'll be five if you count puss in boots as one then it's the sixth shrek movie if they make a shrek five but uh conrad vernon also will be talking about him next month because he was a character designer on cool world okay interesting and he'd go on to be

one of the co-directors of shrek 2 so you know what i don't like this dating game parody it sucks it's been dating game parodies have been done a billion times before this and i remember uh i used to like movie walrads i've come to my senses and on the commentary which i've heard a billion times when that dating game parody comes up on walrads kevin smith was like what am i doing why did i think this was funny oh let's stick it to the dating game that's great i know let's take it down uh the dating game was over 20 years old in the mid 90s how many snl mad tv and living color etc sketches were this yeah exactly well because every sketch is so easy to set up uh like a game show sketch you have very clear characters you introduce and it's just like three characters

three characters three characters each is a joke we write a joke for that one like you had dating game parody in 2001 like it was over 30 years old at that point but i'm sure it entertained you know xers like yeah in those positions i think i gave the animators a break too where it's like here's a painting oh yeah a character nothing is moving the thing flips around i guess oh one other thing in the uh torture bit the darkness of ripping off the gingerbread man's legs dancing with them in front of them and then he crushes one in his hand and tosses the other way and then he throws him in the garbage i'm happy he reappears at the end of the movie but

gingerbread man only has one leg attached to the end of the movie because he crushed the other leg though in shrek 2 gingerbread man has two legs they bake them a new one yes yeah he's i also do like he's like not my gumdrop buttons i will say when i was a teen i was shocked they got away with him saying eat me yeah i guess context wise they could say he's not saying suck my dick he's saying literally eat me because i'm the gingerbread man i mean yes the magic mirror appears he's also voiced by a story border i think they say in in some interview but i couldn't find it that jimmy fallon was supposed to be the magic mirror at one time i'm glad it's just this i wonder if he would have been doing a voice or anything because at the time jimmy fallon was uh doing a ton of impressions on snl oh yeah

and then he was like i don't want to be the impression guy but that's the only thing he was good at the only thing he's good at otherwise he just like giggles that's great i love it oh my god ah it's very depressing to see any clip of his show his uh his late night show these days now i do like the joke of them threatening the mirror by breaking a mirror behind him yeah that's that's clever but but yes it's time for the dating game which is where you get more of these edgy ish very easy jokes about like dirty readings of fairy tales like cinderella is a mentally abused shut-in snow white lives with eight guys but she's not easy there's not even really a joke about fiona yeah yeah well i guess because they just

save that for later but yes it's time to play the dating game. Bachelorette number two is a cape-wearing girl from the land of fancy. Although she lives with seven other men, she's not easy. Just kiss her dead, frozen lips and find out what a live wire she is. Come on. Give it up for Snow White. And last, but certainly not least, Bachelorette number three is a fiery redhead from a dragon-guarded castle surrounded by hot, boiling lava.

But don't let that cool you off. She's a loaded pistol who likes piña coladas and getting caught in the rain. Yours for the rescuing, Princess Fiona! So, will it be Bachelorette Number One, Bachelorette Number Two, or Bachelorette Number Three? Two, three!

Two, three! Two, three! Two, three, two, three, two, three, two, three, one, two, three, three. Three, number three, my lord. Okay, okay. Number three. Lord Farquaad, you've chosen Princess Fiona. Princess Fiona. She's perfect. Okay. If you like pina colada, you can't go on and tell me. Fiona, she's my heart. Okay.

I remember all the laughs in the theater while we were watching this, and the she's not easy was a big laugh in the theater. Also, when the pina colada song came on, or Escape, as it's known. Escape, yes. By Rupert Holmes? I think so. I think you're right. Big laugh in the theater. Yeah, yeah.

But you know what? An easy laugh easy ass laugh also like when we saw this in 2001 we'd seen a million pina colada song jokes like do you like pina coladas and getting drunk in there like all that stuff getting caught in the rain it's it's just so lame and then do you think that they always thought they'd play that song there or that after doing the storyboard of describing her as somebody who likes those things then somebody else says let's just license yeah let's just everyone's buying that song using their in their tacky parody let's do it in our tacky parody and he'll license that song to anybody

like whoever has the rights that's like we will sell it to you two for a penny like a second one for a penny it's much more rare to do a joke about timothy like that's cutting it a little deeper right from the same song writer not about a donkey yeah but yes we get our first shot of fiona which on the commentary they say that if you think she looks freakish in this human form you should have seen her first version they said was was way worse i'm glad they turn her into an ogre forever at the end of this movie because i can't deal with human Fiona. It sucks. They said in their original version she had much bigger anime eyes.

That's how they described them. And a tiny waist, which made her look even more like freakish. So though, you know, if their point is what is normal, then Farquaad seeing her and saying she's perfect, then she should actually look freakish but in an extreme beautiful way of taking what people call beautiful traits and making them more disgusting you know but the mirror almost spoils the entire plot of the movie by telling him that she has a problem i forgot about this part of the movie this is too much too soon i think yeah i think when i saw it for the first time i wasn't paying attention or i just didn't think it was consequential what he was saying because i was surprised by the ogre thing yes the first time i saw it me too but then once you know it and you hear him in the background

say well there's the thing at sunset i guess far quad talks over it and he's so distracting in the foreground that you don't pay attention to it and okay i'll compliment more animation again when he says i'm gonna do a tournament and he like ar his eyebrow and kind of grinds his teeth or moves his jaw. I kind of like that. I thought that was good. Now let's talk about another thing they don't commit enough to. If you're going to do Disneyland jokes, don't do just like two minutes of them. Again, I misremembered this.

I thought there was more Disneyland jokes. They go for the easiest targets. And you know what? I'm dying to go to Disneyland againland again disneyland is good yeah universal studios sucks uh you've you've been in the dreamworks theater bob yes you've seen it who are you to throw stones universal they also say on the commentary that even though like the lancelot parking lot is is clearly a a disney old disney parking lot reference yeah which is now california adventure when they enter the empty town they say they actually base that

on universal city walk that's great which also i sneered at universal city walk before but now i miss universal city walk i'd walk through that any day i've been on it's a small world it's not fun i just love the tackiness and the kitschiness of it all well talk about it i mean in 2001 okay probably when we were entertained by the duff parody of it's a small world yeah in 1993 right yeah which even then it was probably kind of an old joke but in 2001 to do a small world joke i at least think they animated it well yeah i like the little figures and i guess a tiny chuckle indecipherable to most people over the you know wipe your face the pause yes yeah keep

off the grass wipe your face also the far quad guy in the giant head that's kind of funny but they they don't do enough with that no they i mean they don't have the resources or time to put more people or things in this setting i do like him running through the turnstiles though and then shrek just walks right through those are called stanchions by the way thank you those things that hold up ropes are called stanchions take that knowledge with you and also the guy saying that no no that's director adamson okay and he on the commentary jokes that that was him doing an impression of any time jeffrey katzenberg asked him to add anything so i like that i uh but yes they they get into there they walk they see the duloc song they say that the entire welcome to

duloc song was laid out by ants co-director eric darnell so uh you know that's it's fun i like all the posing on it while you're why don't we just hear the song right now where is everybody hey look at this Welcome to Duloc, such a perfect town. Here we have some rules, let us lay them down. Go big wave, stay in line, and we'll get along fine. Duloc is a perfect place. Please keep up on the craft. Shine your shoes. Wipe your face.

Duloc is. Duloc is. Duloc is a perfect place. Wow. Let's do that again. No. no then at the end they get the photo taken of themselves as well so they should have to pay for that photo though yeah unless they have fast pass they're not being properly gouged here you know it should be you can't take the photo out without putting in like five shillings or whatever you know the jim cummings guy says british currency

like oh it's worth five shillings so i guess it'd be shillings is what they pay nobody else mentions money in this movie it's so weird the disneyland stuff stops here though because there should be a disneyland related thing that they do inside instead it's this tournament which is not that interesting it's it's pretty much your standard tournament i guess there's wrestling involved uh well yes so when they enter first uh that's where shrek threatens donkey with like you're on your way to a smacked bottom that's another myersism they say that he would just say that to a director a voice director giving him too many line readings he'd be like you're on your way to a smack bottom you keep giving me these lines but uh myers loves saying it so much that fans of austin powers may remember at the end of the beautiful stranger video the austin powers says to madonna you're right on your way to a smack bottom and she says

i hope so and then of course austin power goes oh oh my yes yeah also when they enter the arena and you see all the people around doesn't read that way 20 years later because who thinks about the movie gladiator but it is a gladiator reference oh they're doing a gladiator thing which also was a dreamworks film the theater was i think the first dreamworks film to be nominated for best picture so at the time big deal to have gladiator shots in there you know speaking about memes when farquad said some of you may die but it's a sacrifice i am willing to make i saw that memed a lot these days i've been seeing i was thinking of zap branigan yeah okay look it's not an original joke either but a lot of the millennials

mean that scene because it's the one they remember and so yes here's another big change originally when it was shrek wanting to be a knight it is him competing in a night tournament with a bunch of jousting and competitions like that and then when they're like oh we're gonna read that night stuff an unnamed animator they mentioned on the commentary says it should just be a wwf style battle royale then just do that they're like yeah let's do that this tournament thing feels like so complicated though, because okay, Farquaad wants to get the princess and now he's going to have a tournament to decide who's the strongest man to get it.

Just send everyone out. Yeah, why can't they send an army there? Yeah. That doesn't make sense. No, actually. He'd have much better odds if he has this huge army of knights, send all of them.

But they don't hit hard enough that the joke is he's a coward and he would never go himself yeah to get her so they say that shrek has to be killed it's like okay the new tournament is kill him and whoever does is the winner shrek gets to drink a whole beer on screen which i also was shocked by maybe thirsty for beer but i was watching this at 10 in the morning on a monday so no no beer for old bob and then again talk about obvious things joan jett's bad reputation starts playing i wrote i roll in my notes like come on uh well here's

something an extra lame on the soundtrack if you bought it you don't even get to hear that song it's the real version in the movie but on the soundtrack you get a cover by a band you've never heard of named half cocked oh don't like that i like that song and i like freaks and geeks and i played in rock band a lot but as soon as those chords started i was like you're not doing this right oh you're doing it well bob you don't get it shrek has a bad reputation oh wow it's about okay so the song is telling me what's happening in the movie that's very smart so shrek also does like kind of a hockey thing, which is a wink towards Mike Meyer. They say it's a wink towards Mike Meyer's love for hockey.

I feel like he said, and then Shrek does a hockey thing. I like hockey. I have him do something with hockey. Also, when they arrive at the place and Shrek just says, ooh, maybe compensated for something. Like Austin Powers and the love guru had like 17 jokes about like, this guy's got a small dick, don't you think? Yeah. That felt like a Myers edition. And everyone in the movie theater was tickled by that they're making a dick joke

shrek should have said he needed a swedish penis pump or something they are his bag baby but yes then a big wrestling sequence happens and i gotta say they did this good like these are real moves done with accuracy they look good yeah they they are really well done i'll tell you move for move which moves shrek does let's break it down so first he hits the guys he comes off the rope hits him with a double clothesline then it hits a flying head scissors on another guy he goes up top does a top rope crossbody or if you're a new japan fan that was a high fly flow the finisher of hiroshi tanahashi then he puts a guy in a full nelson so donkey can headbutt him then he does a seated senton off the top rope followed by an irish whip into a drop kick then he does a classic vertical suplex then kurt angles ankle lock followed by the undertaker's

tombstone pile driver and then finishes with an airplane spin how popular was wrestling in 2001 as big as it would ever be okay i think at least in america some could argue that in the mid 80s the wrestlemania hulk hogan era was bigger but having lived through both though i was more conscious of it in the 90s 1999 to 2001 was the hottest pro wrestling has ever been in american history i wasn't sure how it was doing in 2001 but by the time they were making this movie it was at its peak it was at the peak yeah actually the month that this came out was wrestlemania 17 which most wrestling fans view as the crest of it it was just it was all downhill from then it was still very popular but it was like the last big rock match the last match

where stone cold was the good guy like you can just see all these things like, oh, that's over now. That's over now. That's over now. And then 9-11. And then 9-11, yeah. And also XFL. The decline of America. And the XFL launches as well, yeah.

And there's also a very Attitude Era unprotected headshot with a chair. Yeah, a chair. In 2001, very normal to just smash a guy as hard as you can in the head with a chair yeah chair in 2001 very normal to just smash a guy as hard as you can in the head with a chair that caused a whole lot of death and misery uh and so i'm glad that's over and i i also took note of another 90s riff that's not really a joke but it said with the intonation of a joke where shrek wins the tournament he says i'm here till thursday try the veal it's one of those tip your waitresses kind of line it's not a joke it's not funny you could put a joke in there but it's just like well this is what a joke would sound like if we were to write one let's just drop that in there are so many lines like that in this movie just filler

of like well somebody should say something here like and that is such mike myers patter like he would definitely say try to be like i'm just kidding so here comes another bit that got cut here they speed this up so much shrek beats all those guys then farquaad instead of killing him says you know what you do this and i'll get everyone out of your swamp in the original version of the script this was much longer farquaad gives shrek an entire tour of the castle and also it's where farquaad explains his plans a lot more but they're like i just speed this up he just agrees to right there i mean i don't want to see's where farquaad explains his plans a lot more but they're like i just speed this up he just agrees to right there i mean i don't want to see more of farquaad and what he's

up to i feel like it would have been a smart move also to maybe farquaad doesn't trust shrek and he goes off on his own to follow shrek and he has his own like clumsy adventures with some knights get him out of the castle get him out of the castle right they also bring up another problem that they had later in the film that they were just like who cares they originally had shrek hanging out with farquaad but from this vantage point shrek just sees farquaad up there who's standing on a stool he doesn't know he's short if he had walked around with him like in the original one he would know he's short so shrek making all these short jokes about him oh okay he shouldn't even know that he's short really okay I didn't even realize that well then hey then I guess it wasn't too bad of a plot hole but yeah and this deal he makes with Shrek is that if Shrek gets the princess he gets his land back

what happens to the fairy tale guys I would guess they move to a worse prison yeah I suppose yeah so Shrek is just like fine get just get him out I don't care as long as they're out of here I don't care yeah I also Bob did you think when all those guys with crossbows popped up in this, you know, cast Larry, did you think of Demon's Souls Tower Knight battle? Oh, yeah. That first boss fight. I was definitely. Take those guys out first.

Yes. Take them out first. I learned that very quickly in that match. Yeah. Honestly, when he's scrounging around in the castle later, I was thinking like, this feels like a Souls game. Shrek Souls. that's because i've gotten soul's brain now i've played enough of those games that i have the soul's brain but yes as they leave the place donkey very helpfully just explains like so let me get this straight this is the deal and you're gonna do this that

skips over all that i was like couldn't couldn't Farquaad have delivered this in a funnier way? Yeah. Well, no, he can't, I guess. They just rather like, ah, Donkey should just saying it. And yeah. Again, there's so much inconsequential dialogue in this movie that when it feels like something that was actually written as in a script, it hits a lot harder. It calls out a lot more.

And this thing about onions, I was like, oh yeah, this was something written down. Oh, for sure. Because everything that's said is just so you know riffy and and like pointless but here is something that matters and talk about the theme of the movie in in the history section i play that clip from the chris farley the one chris farley scene and it calls back to this of donkey says to him oh this is one of those onion things so this line was in the chris farley version or a version of this onion speech this is one of those rare times where it seems like they're thinking about a theme and just have it spoken out loud at the very least and again i've watched shrek for the first time in 20 years as of this recording but for 20 years every time i cut open

an onion i think of shrek and seemingly every meal I make starts with cut up and cook an onion. So I think about Shrek a lot when I cook. I've been incorporating more onions into my meals too. It's just, it's a nice little extra. You know, I like it. Especially they caramelize great. I didn't like onions for a time as well. I don't think I even like a raw uncooked onion on like a burger.

I still would say like, eh, could you caramelize that for me? It's got to be a purple onion. Yeah, I guess. put it on pizza it's good times but yes shrek explains how special ogres are ogres are like onions they stink yes no oh they make you cry no oh you leave them out in the sun they get all brown start sprouting little white hairs. No! Layers! Onions have layers. Ogres have layers. Onions have layers. You get it. We both have layers. Oh, you both have layers.

Oh. You know, not everybody like onions. Cake! Everybody loves cakes. Cakes have layers. I don't care what everyone likes. Ogres are not like cakes. You know what else everybody like? Parfait.

Have you ever met a person you say, hey, let's get some parfait. They say, hell no, I don't like no parfait. Parfaits are delicious. No! You dense, irritating, miniature beast of burden. where Shrek is just like, fuck off. Leave me alone, you piece of shit. Drink bleach. He's like, gee, Shrek, that's weird.

And then he just runs up next to him. Also, that whole parfait thing just feels like Eddie Murphy riffitude right there. Yeah, and there's got to be a tiramisu. If you're going to do a stupid pointless riff, just choose the funniest word and go with it because it's not going to be a joke. Yeah, tiramisu is a funnier word than parfait. That's my feeling. Though also, did Shrek just steal those onions? Sure.

It's like he walked through a farm and just grabbed an onion. He doesn't have a job. Yeah, I guess, you know, he doesn own that uh the hovel in the swamp it seems like he just built it there yeah i just feel like that scene was going somewhere and then it's just like well now the donkey riffs a bunch and then he just gets mad at him again and yells at him and the scene is over just it's there's so many scenes like this yeah also the bye-bye see you later that also feels very Myers to me too yeah bye also when donkey says like damn like nobody says no to a damn parfait or whatever again I just thought wow that's just so weird just like a casual damn in a kid's film I think they thought

this was for older people like oh this is for tweens but the kids saw like parents took their five-year-olds to this movie which they really shouldn't have everyone who's 30 now love shrek from being a kid and seeing shrek yeah well you just said it on a recent retronauts we recorded but a lot of this is just remembering ads we saw as children it's just like oh this is how we were advertised to i there's a lot of negative things you can say about the streaming world we're living in but if you're a parent who can just have your kid watch non-stop in a row no commercials things on a streaming service maybe you're doing a better thing for them than them watching commercial television yeah we had worse tv babysitters than our modern children yeah we had to see ads not just watching old spongebob's over and over

again but then an ad for a toy that we shouldn't own or fast food or fast food yeah snacks yeah the the shrek oh man shrek loved being a fast food tie-in there's eight million commercials for that i worked at a grocery store during the summer of shrek and we had all the shrek foods uh just shrek on bags of chips we had the shrek ketchup i think that was green oh yes was that for shrek or shrek 2 the uh it was 2001 so shrek one i couldn't find as many tie-in product commercials on youtube for original shrek shrek 2 you can find 8 million of them like it's the green twinkies with shrek filling i think the cat in the hat that awful mike myers movie broke a record for the most marketing tie-ins and i remember walking through a grocery store

when that movie was out it was just the cat in the hat was on everything he was on swiffer refill just he's in he's not in the corner of the box going like i guess i'm i'm on this uh clean your house with this i guess he makes your house messy he's the cat in the head so then we get again what in 2001 was very show-offy of them walking through a bunch of natural settings to places to a proclaimer song yeah and they walk by the windmill that'll be very plot important later in it but yes it's uh the proclaimers song on my way and this i don't know but i feel very certain they wanted to use 500 miles there and the proclaimer said we'll license you this other song about walking we won't we won't give you our most famous walking we mostly do songs about walking

and it's a song from the late 80s yeah it's not a new song that's a good song i'm on my way to from misery to happiness they're scottish so i guess there's some scottish representation in this movie sure sure but yeah 500 miles it makes me me think of Benny and June, a film no one remembers for any other reason. Johnny Depp? Yes, Johnny Depp and Dermot Milroney or Patrick McDermott. One of those guys. I just recall the music video.

Yes. Oh yeah. It just cuts to that film. Let me complain about Benny and June. I realized I was lied to that that film, I didn't know all the shit that it was ripping off of uh when johnny depp does a bunch of the routine of charlie chaplin i thought he was inventing it i didn't know they were charlie chaplin references yeah when when abe simpson did that in the episode in season five i thought he was referencing benny and june yeah in that episode yeah it's uh okay

so the uh the woman was Mary Stewart Masterson. The other guy I'm thinking of was not either of the McMoronies. It's Aidan Quinn, who basically is that type of guy. And Julianne Moore and Oliver Platter in it. Maybe I should check this out. Now's the best time to watch a Johnny Depp movie.

If you went out and told someone I just saw Benny and June, they would call the police just this man has snapped also we get to see uh donkey pissing on fire i forgot that you just literally see donkey piss in this movie like just center of the frame there it is you would never see a character like actual urine escape from an animated character's bladder in most films and they get to this big volcano and castle we have another fart joke of donkey thinking shrek farted and shrek saying believe me donkey if it was me you'd be dead so they've seen his killer farts earlier in this movie that's

true donkey just keeps embellishing it's just like i i that didn't come off any stone it's not brimstone and and i was right in your face i was like all right please it wasn't even again a lot of these aren't jokes they're just things said with the cadence of a joke like when donkey says that didn't come off any stone yeah that doesn't even make sense and then i think donkey is right to not laugh at truck's joke because it's not funny yes yeah it's uh that also felt like a meyer's line of him telling a bad joke how many scenes are there in in the Austin Powers movie where he just says a joke and Basil or one of the women says like, oh, Austin, please.

He's like, well, I mean, here's another bad pun. It's just Mike Myers loves to say bad puns. That line was like, but think of the location. That feels very Mike Myers as well. Then you see one horse skeleton. Apparently they wanted more horse skeletons there because the joke was supposed to be that it was like a horse parking lot where every knight who goes there parks their horse they die inside the castle and the horses starve to death and die in the parking lot which

for a character that appears in all the other movies dragon has killed a lot of people yeah yeah it's yeah i guess not enough is made of the fact that these knights are trying to rescue her but i thought that her being in this tower was a secret or something you know i think other royalty knows about her it's they don't fully engage with this in shrek 2 but even in this they set up that the parents put her in there and they hope that whoever saves her would kiss her and change her into a full-time human i'm just confused as to also why the gingerbread man didn't want him to know about this because isn't ellie if you live with farquad it sucks but isn't that better than living with a

dragon well maybe because she's not normal the gingerbread man knows he'll kill her or lock her up perhaps and also other motivational questions here is why does the dragon have her well her parents put her there okay and had somehow they got a dragon there to guard her though well the dragon is magical in that it's a dragon but the dragon seems to have about human level consciousness yeah so is the dragon paid to live there is it paid in getting to eat nights and it's like oh if you live here you'll get all the nights you want because they'll keep showing up like that is not particularly well explained either then we have a fun rickety wooden bridge walkover sequence they tell an interesting bit about how

positioning in movies changes things how this scene was originally later in the film and they thought uh this looks too much like shrek is bullying his friend. So by putting it earlier in here, they then found a tone that Shrek sort of is bullying him, but he's doing it to make him not think and be able to walk over the bridge because he's too scared. Sort of clever. Yeah. I forgot that that was his strategy. And I agree with Donkey. It's not cowardly to be afraid to walk over a rickety bridge.

And if you fall, you definitely die. You know? Donkey isly to be afraid to walk over a rickety bridge, and if you fall, you definitely die. You know? Donkey is correct to be scared. Donkey doesn't even need to be with Shrek at this part of the movie. Yeah, yeah. He can just stay behind in the horse graveyard, I guess. That's true.

And the fact that he doesn't, I agree with Donkey later. He does earn half of that swamp. He does half of the work in this. He's a key part of it. He seduced that dragon. He did. Well, we'll get they have children later in the movies they do they uh yep but i kind of like the camera motions as they're

walking over the bridge like that looks kind of good i like that and yes of course we get another just thing of like that was in a movie type moments of that'll do donkey that'll do and then a jurassic park reference coming up right oh yeah when they walk into the place yeah yeah 1995's babe if you did a that'll do pig reference now would people get it would anybody no absolutely not and i don't think so this was almost too late to make a babe ref but i think it was too late it was it was 95 right yeah it was 95 i i remember it being closer to the rays of shrek but maybe that's because like Pig in the City had been a little closer to Shrek's release. Yeah, that was like 98 or 99.

When I saw it was 95, I was like, wow, that's, I was one of those kids who was made to read Babe in school before it was made into a movie. Because I remember our fourth grade teacher had to say, because he loves the book, had to upfront say, this is a book written in another country when they use the word bitch in here all right is meant to refer to a dog that it had puppies called the dictionary people i bet that was the last time he could even get away with that kind of like warning beforehand and believe me for a bunch of 10 year olds to know that you could like get away with saying bitch in class we we had we all had some giggles there so yes they enter the

place they i think again of like five-year-olds in the theater they see those bones sticking out of the like boots of the night that's scary that's scary for a little kid and i'll compliment the lighting design of the castle i like the like black gray and red coloring of that i like that and then donkey says to shrek where is this fire breathing pain in the neck and trek says inside I like that. of like yeah it's this old battle axe here you know women right yeah it's a lot of austin powers is about women am i right guys yeah and another scene of him saying uh donkey shut up it's like the 40th scene of that uh but i mean he really should they're sneaking around but but then it wouldn't be funny so it's this is where shrek puts on armor needlessly like he just does it's it's because key to their plot in their original version where he

wants to be a knight he has to have on armor so fiona doesn't know he's an ogre when she first meets him but in this bit he just is like hey a helmet i'll put that on like maybe it's for protection i guess he has no plan going into this he doesn't have weapons going into this what was he thinking was going to happen yeah he uh he just kind of just goes with the flow yeah he's like well that's the castle guess we'll walk in hmm she's got to be in here somewhere he's not the deepest guy this shrek you know what i also think i get a little tired of shrek i feel like he's like talks too much about how special he is he's like actually i'm a lot better than you think or i'm a lot better than you think. Or I'm a lot deeper than you think. Like, yeah, yeah, you're begging for attention.

Get a job. Then Donkey says, he'll go up the stairs. I'll find the stairs. I'm the stair master, which is a reference to a line Eddie Murphy says in 1996's Nutty Professor. Really? Yes. Is that a reference to a line or just a reused riff? I think it is Murphy reusing a riff.

So after Sherman loses all of his weight the first time and turns into Buddy Love, one of his celebratory things after seeing that he can see his penis now, after that joke, he then runs down the steps of the college. He's like, oh my God, I can do these steps all the time. I'm the stair master. And that's a reference to the famous workout equipment. Yes, yes, that as well well so it's everything you recognize you know the things that passed as jokes in the 90s to shame uh it's shameful do you think we're in a better world now where people can

say like um that's not a thing or and by that i mean this uh it's also bad just a different style of bad uh boy she woke up on the wrong side of bed this morning too much coffee yeah um too much information yeah more than i wanted to know every decade has owned that style of comedy but this is definitely of the 90s where it sounds like a joke but it's not yeah could i be any more of a donkey so yes they wake up the dragon the dragon first almost kills donkey blasts its tail with with fire and then when she's about to crush donkey shrek then pulls on her tail and she flings him which on the commentary they joke about like boy that's pretty economical that the tail just flings him into the place he needs to be into fiona's room pretty helpful though i do like the

animation on donkey being all like scared and cornered i think it's i think it's well done you do feel bad for the little guy i also i had a good giggle at the line like i'm sure you hear this all the time from your food but and then we get another tic-tac reference of saying like do i detect a minty freshness and then comes uh so look i don't want to say it's definitely transphobic but these jokes about how the dragon is a woman and how murphy's like oh and you're so obviously a feminine making a feminine beauty yes that's the line yeah that that one it seems to be jokes about masculine looking women. And two, I can't not think that it is a reference to Eddie Murphy's real life run in with a trans sex worker. If it is, he didn't know that.

I don't think he wants to talk about that. I suppose not. I don't know. He could be like, all right, we all got a good laugh. But I mean, especially it's a drag on. So it could be a drag joke as well. Could be. I'm happy they didn't take it any farther, though.

They get kind of close. I mean, also, Eddie Murphy in several of his movies, like, say, Norbit, he writes scenes about him being dominated by a larger woman like that. That crops up a lot in his stuff. I'm just going to that's uh it's a consistent thing in the murphy worldview but yes donkey then gets uh carried away which i have to say too uh you know now this film wants to make jokes about like all these old fairy tales if you put modern views on them aren't they kind of like weird sexual politics this has weird sexual policies donkey is carried away in a no

means no situation yeah but then he later falls in love with his attacker like that's weird there's the threat of sexual violence against donkey in this movie played for comedy it's a little too much and again then he ends up with her like he's like oh you know what i actually love my attacker that i don't like that no i don't really like that bad message so meanwhile shrek lands in fiona's room we get to see fiona on screen for the first time uh in person i do like her getting in position for her kiss that she's been dreaming like oh boy i'm finally gonna kiss somebody this man's coming in here she's been waiting for this forever and then shrek basically snaps her neck shaking her up and down to wake her up her character at this, it goes on for a bit too long about how she wants things

to be like a fairy tale and Shrek has to keep telling her, no, this is not a fairy tale. I kind of get sick of that. You know, at least it's a message. They understand that the story is Fiona was raised on all of the dreams about what a princess should be and Shrek is shaking her of those misconceptions. I like that. But yes, we have Cameron Diaz here. When they cast her, she had not been in there something about Mary, but that had come out

in between in this. And she is, I think, an underrated comic performer. Like, she's also a very pretty lady. But I think she is good at being funny, you know. And she does all her own belches in this, they say. But here is Fiona saved by shrek but we have to save her this moment you could recite an epic poem for me a ballad a sonnet a limerick or something i don't think so well can i at least know the name of my champion? Um, Shrek.

Sir Shrek. I pray that you take this favor as a token of my gratitude. Thanks. You didn't slay the dragon? It's on my to-do list, now come on! But this isn't right! You're meant to charge in, sword drawn, batter fight. That's what all the other knights did.

Yeah, right before they burst into flame. No, that's not the point. Wait, where are you going? The exit's over there. Well, I have to save my ass. What kind of knight are you? the exit's over there well i have to save my ass what kind of night are you one of a kind that's a real trailer line there yeah yeah that uh and she was coming right off of charlie's angels the previous november i think yeah yeah yeah she was a bigger star than ever then now now i believe that that's one question about a shrek 5 if they were to do it

i mean i bet she'd come out of retirement for this but she hasn't been in a movie in i think three or four years at this point which i mean sure you know she's in her 40s she still is a gorgeous woman but roles start shrinking as you get older as as a woman in hollywood she could be an aunt may in two more spider-man cycles uh she'll be aunt may's best friend anna watson actually please mcu cast her as anna watson i want cameron diaz as anna watson but yeah apparently too when she was doing all this acting she actually did ask uh the cartoon people who are recording her like hey somebody come in the room with me like pull on my arm when shrek is pulling on my arm so i can physically act it out more she was very invested in it and also that one of the guys who helped her in their recordings his last name was Cameron and the director said they eventually pushed him to

finally tell her a joke of like you know you should marry me so then your name would be Cameron Cameron please get him out of here yes I I think he was probably very embarrassed to say that. Very, very sad news about Cameron Diaz. She's become a lifestyle person. Oh, man, she's gooping it up just like Paltrow. She really is gooping it up. In 2013, she released the health book, the body book, Feed, Move, Understand, and Love Your Amazing Body. And then she released the longevity book,

The Science of Aging, The Biology of Strength, and The Privilege of Time. And now she has an organic wine brand all right i think the secret to all of those is like probably be rich i think be rich first yeah be rich first also start out beautiful with perfect skin yeah boy that's weird at least i don't believe lucy lou has started a wellness brand so she's the only angel who has not started a wellness brand uh you know hey whatever there's worse scams out there i don't want to begrudge her that uh then comes a joke that i never really caught until very close watching not only does donkey say this is unwanted physical contact yeah but the dragon starts to suck his tail i didn't see that he says hey what are you doing to my

tail he says you're gonna tear it off and the dragon's head moves below frame they did a tail sucking joke he's getting a tail job on this kid's movie yeah i know on top of him saying like no means no i don't want this and the dragon starts sucking a donkey's tail. I can't believe that. I've got kids here. It happens so subtly that if you're not listening closely to what he's doing. Well, then the dragon gives Shrek a rim job. She does.

She does. Again, that does feel like another note of like, it's been a little while since Shrek's butt did something. Come on. I always forget that joke, probably for my own sanity sanity i don't want to think of the dragon kissing it also looks like shrek's pants fell down so it is his exposed butt yeah the the the logic of that scene physically doesn't make sense like how did shrek knock donkey out of the dragon's tail wire his pants down i i just i don't i know what they wanted to do but like the setup wasn't there yeah you know physically i guess i guess he's swinging on the chandelier then he falls down and i guess his gut smashed donkey out the other side out of the tail yeah i thought i don't know

i don't know uh and then the chandelier in a clever thing the chandelier falls on the neck of the dragon which is now the leash and collar on her so she can't chase them all the way out. Then some music pops in that they, the commentary I identify, go back all the way to the J.J. Abrams propeller head version of the film that they were working on. Like one of the earliest things, they played this like, music as Shrek is being chased. That dates back to like pre-PDI, like 95 version as shrek is being chased that dates back to like pre-pdi like 95 version of shrek this thing with the dragon getting tangled up in the chains is pretty interesting i think they over complicated by adding that sword how we use electricity can be smarter cleaner and greener at electric ireland we can help guide you there. You see, our new Net Zero Hub has all you need to know about smart meter plans, EV tariffs, solar panels, and much more.

Making your usage clearer, your trips greener, your home cozier, and your world brighter. Find our Net Zero Hub at electricireland.ie. Because it's not really clear what the sword is doing between the chain she's already like tied up in the chains and then she's free later so yeah i guess it's just for the joke that shrek picks up a sword and says i'm gonna take care of that dragon and then stabs it into the ground instead of you're supposed to think he's gonna kill the dragon but he doesn't i thought he was gonna pin the chains to the ground but instead he just sticks them in between the chains which i guess makes so the chains are tighter but it's not very clear

i guess it's a locking mechanism i suppose also we get a ball hit joke too of him sliding down the banister thing and it the one hits him in the crotch that bump is not big enough for comedic purposes and trek has testicles trek has testicles think about that when you go to sleep you know it should be a bigger higher thing yeah i would guess too he's got low hangers which for it to hurt in that way from that bump it'd be funnier if it was like a gargoyle sticking up out of the pillar right yeah something like that funnier yeah then it would be like the mouth of the gargoyle smashed him in the crotch like that you get some mouth to crotch comedy there too actually the chains in the pillars which is kind of a scooby-doo scene of him like running it's a static shot and the characters

run in from different angles credit that to being boarded by the director of prince of egypt eric camel who would go on to direct the mega mega flop mars needs moms oh boy he got that job i think because he had worked on roger rabbit with zemeckis so when zemeckis was doing mars needs moms oh boy he got that job i think because he had worked on roger rabbit with zemeckis so when zemeckis was doing mars needs moms he he put him in charge but that's just so sad that i bet disney wouldn't have bought star wars if mars these moms hadn't been that big of a flop i'm still curious about that movie maybe one day when i'm drunk enough yeah i'll put it on we've done a lot of movies we complain about so i wouldn't do it again soon but maybe one of these days and our next poll will be like a shitty movie pick which one of them i'm looking at it now it's a merciful 88 minutes and that's

probably with credits without credits probably like an 80 minute movie right yeah you know that's that's not so bad i'd rather watch it than dinosaur i'll say that one poll it has to be the zemeckis poll one of those cursed movies god and so we get a slow-mo run away they run over the collapsing bridge shrek saves donkey from falling and the dragon can't chase him any farther and so they escape and another bit the dragon looking like a sad puppy and sad that it can't follow that idea came from steven spielberg himself oh wow they had the scene as it was and when they screened it for spielberg he said the dragon should look sad and look back at them because she wanted to follow the donkey and she misses him so uh they joke on the

commentary like uh what does steven spielberg know about making a good movie we can just cut that it was a good idea i guess the dragon at that point is no longer a threat. And that communicates that fact. If the dragon's going to be their friend at the end of the movie, it's good to have that little scene there to set it up. So yes, Fiona is thanking them for saving them. They have a little laugh that Shrek would be the one

to kiss her and that's his true love. She then demands Shrek take off that helmet how will you kiss me what that wasn't in the job description maybe it's a perk no it's destiny oh you must know how it goes a princess locked in a tower and beset by a dragon is rescued by a brave knight and then they share true love's first kiss with shrek you think wait what was it you think that shrek is your true love well yes what is so funny let's just say i'm not your type okay of course you are you're my rescuer now now remove your helmet look i really don't think this is a good idea just take off the helmet i'm not going to take it off no now okay easy as you command your highness and then she's disappointed but shrek reads it as her

being disgusted at him but she actually is thinking oh he's an ogre like i secretly am that's weird yeah but okay i like the shot of shrek doing his like a face like that's a funny drawing or well drawing's not the right word it's probably drawn and then uh modeled to look like the drawing i'm guessing certainly probably yeah yeah they all they all have a good laugh that fiona says she's like he asked her were you expecting uh prince charming she's like well yeah which she literally was expecting prince charming because he's the villain of the next two movies who thought he was going to end up with her so the next two movies have better villains way better villains way better villains

so we did ducktales last month structurally i see some similarities this is better than ducktales by the way although actually i'm not sure but we're talking about this movie this second act it's the saggiest thing ever it's there's nothing pushing anybody in any direction they're just going back to the castle we go back to far quad once but not enough and again he needs a bigger scheme he needs a grander scheme than just making some woman live in misery with him it's a lot of long walk in from one place to another like yeah when you when you analyze the film it is that a guy goes from his swamp to a castle to another castle back to that castle back to a swamp then back to the middle castle yeah and that's all the movie is just a walk a walk from a place to another place i remember

being in the theater watching this and i again i liked it a lot when i saw it but i thought okay the movie's halfway over what happens now and it turns out it's 20 minutes of just hanging out like hanging out and misunderstandings yeah i guess it turns into a romantic comedy at this point you know it's it's like a mini romantic comedy it's like 20 minutes of a romantic comedy in this kid's action film and i don't buy any of it i'm sorry the shrek fiona stuff doesn't really work for me well so look fiona is secretly an ogre and she actually likes eating bugs and farting this also is the time of the perfect girl to bro guys in movies just one of the guys just one of the guys gal who weighs you know a hundred pounds but eats and drinks as much as the guys she loves chicken wings and wrestling yeah

but she's got the foulest mouth in the room uh but also the body of a playboy playmate yeah yeah that's and that is kind of what fiona instantly becomes yeah once she stops her princess act and then shrek and donkey they make a bunch of short jokes about her betrothed which uh i mean he's like well you can do the measuring on her wedding night it's like all right okay we get it and also when he says measuring does finger quotes that is a tribute to chris farley and his many finger quotes characters you know he might not smell great or have gone to high school wasn't that kevin nealon i think he did that too but i think of sweaty matt uh of the matt foley character okay on the update set doing his finger quotes who may not have learned to take a shower yeah

again all those short jokes though i just think like so are you supposed to judge someone for how they look or not you know figure it out shrek yeah there's more to my far quite to make fun of well i mean saying he has a small dick too like that he's also judging someone for a physical quality and they're walking around with her first he carries her then she convinces them to get to walk around they say they're gonna have to camp for the night somewhere and she just tears the bark off the tree to make a doorway for it i guess is that the first hint of what her true abilities are her true background that she's that strong yeah yeah and and then shrek has a joke about locking her in the

cave just putting the stone in there and leaving her and then shrek goes like i'm just kidding come on so then we get the heartfelt donkey see this is where the emotion is in the movie yeah donkey and shrek why why does shrek have to also fall in love with the lady just have him have a friend now and i like this scene it feels written it feels like it was a written scene not just that fun goof around find some jokes riff riff a bit it dates back to the farley version yeah like it it was there from the beginning though the bit mike myers definitely added when they're pointing at constellations blood knock the flatulent is a reference to a character peter sellers played in the goon show, of course it's Peter Sellers. Yep, and of course it's a deep cut like The Goon Show. And yeah, again, I think Shrek protests too much.

He's begging for attention by saying, you know, people are more than they seem, okay? I'm actually really deep. That just feels like a person on Twitter is like, I'm actually way deeper than people think. I've taken the introverse test. I'm better than everyone. I guess, yeah yeah this is real gifted

kid syndrome yeah yeah and donkey though correctly analyzed shrek is wanting to push people away in this next clip you know what i think i think this whole wall thing is just a way to keep somebody out no do you think are you hiring something never Never mind, Donkey. Oh, this is another one of those onion things, isn't it? No, this is one of those drop it and leave it alone things. Why don't you want to talk about it? Why do you want to talk about it? Why are you blocking?

I'm not blocking. Oh, yes, you are. Donkey, I'm warning you. Who are you trying to keep out? Just tell me that, Shrek. Who? Everyone, okay? Oh, now we're getting somewhere. Oh, for the love of Pete. Hey, what's your problem, Shrek? What you got against the whole world, anyway?

Huh? Look, I'm not the one with the problem, okay? It's the world that seems to have a problem with me. People take one look at me and go, Ah, help, run! A big, stupid, ugly ogre. They judge me before they even know me that's why i'm better off alone yeah i like that shrek is just he's a guy who is judged by the world who also doesn't feel particularly attractive or or bluff so he just says yeah i'm pushing everyone away before

they can reject me like that that is a realistic problem for a character to have in a movie i like that and in the history segment we heard the chris farley version of that scene yes yeah with almost the exact same dialogue until up to a point yeah up to a point well that's where the turn came before donkey what he touches on is saying you know was it your parents he's like leave my parents out of this ah now we're getting somewhere so when you take out the parents thing it's just Shrek going like I just want to be alone because everyone hates me so and I like how sad Shrek is I like that you can see ogre Fiona watching and she understands that she's in the closet about being an ogre and she feels the same pain as

Shrek about how everyone judges you for how you look it's it's sweet i like that and i really like the shot of them looking at the moon and yeah they actually have like kind of a mature relaxed way of doing it like just pull out from it no cuts to their faces don't even do too many jokes just a nice shot of two guys sitting in front of the moon and talking the one joke is donkey asking what the constellation is that they're looking at. And he's like, that's the moon. Yeah. What's that big bright one over there?

And then we get the creepiest scene in the movie for two reasons. So we go to Farquaad's room, pan across it. The mama bear is a rug now. He has killed her and made her a rug. And she stays dead. I will say if you watch the karaoke dance party extra that's on the dvd and blu-ray she is back in that but for all the future films she stays dead so that that is non-canonical karaoke dance party not canon no it's not take it out of the wiki

that's oh my god when that dvd came out they sold is like the karaoke dance party this party never stops because they take the wedding party at the end of the movie and then they're like what if they sang 18 more songs in this that is the cheapest way to end this movie we'll get to it uh but uh farquad is staying up late making a mirror show him pictures of a girl over and over again i mean is he jerking off in front of this mirror well so here comes the grossest joke imperceptibly almost the sheet in front of him rises he has a boner and he goes and he like makes a sort of embarrassed face well he lifts the sheet up and looks at his penis yes yeah which he

seems shocked he had a boner like don't i don't think you need to lift up a blanket to know you have an erection if you're a man and you have an erection you're aware of it you're quite aware yes yes yeah that's how it works is is a joke that he normally is so impotent that he doesn't have an erection and he's like oh look at that i'm glad they don't explore this i can't believe they even got it in there on the commentary eerie silence over that bit when they have other bits they're like oh not everybody noticed this joke they talk about it but when it's the dick joke of the boner nothing they don't talk about that i think as they know they really got away with something yeah but but it's gross it's just

gross at least the mirror makes the face of like i know this is gross too guys i i don't like that is the joke of the scene yes yeah What the entire scene is leaning up to. It's a man up late at night looking at pictures of a girl on the Internet and jerking off to her. That's what. What's wrong with that? Well, for him, it's stalkerish behavior. I guess so. Yeah.

Then we cut to another scene. I'm sure Bob. Oh, come on. The bird violence. Yes. Yes. She and then she steals the eggs from the bird so it's a joke about disney that it's uh it is you know snow white singing with the birds or sleeping beauty singing with

the birds except in this case she sings higher in register than the bird can sing and it explodes in a feathery grenade and uh and the legs are left behind on the branch. That's also pretty intense. So look, it is bird violence, but I had a little laugh at her choosing that instead of it turning into a story of like, oh no, I orphaned these birds. She's like, well, I can't let these eggs go to waste and just kills three birds as well. It was a dark joke that got a lot of laughs fading from the eggs in the nest to them cooking on a stone. Apparently that bird exploding scene was originally in the love montage that comes a little later but they thought it kind of messes with the song to have her do this singing in the middle of the song so we'll just put it here and it works good anyway it's like it shows how resourceful she is and she makes breakfast for him now is that also very like the girl woke up early to make breakfast for the boys yeah hungry yeah she says well you're

gonna need your strength and donkey meanwhile is having a sex dream as well i wrote that donkey wakes up from a sex dream yeah i i'm glad there was not a visible boner again in this next scene and when fiona tells the boys to eat up they look at each other and that's that's a meme i see a lot with uh shrek's his mouth is drawn down and his chin is sunk into his neck and they're looking at each other that's a meme i see all the time i really love that drawing of shrek face it's a very nuanced good face there's some good face acting in this movie there's some bad ones like you said it was just like whoever was available to animate a scene did it uh so there's not a lot of quality control in the face acting but there's some good stuff in here yeah i like that shrek face of him looking at donkey like what the hell she's never now and as they're walking away shrek burps and says it's a compliment

and then donkey is grossed out by it but then uh fiona burps too to show she's one of the guys she's as nasty as you are as donkey says and then uh boy we get some more comedy here killing some time oh boy we got how many 25 minutes left movie, half an hour left in the movie. They need to do something before getting back to the castle for the two minute ending. So Robin Hood shows up. A very French Robin Hood, which is strange because it's a very English character. You don't get more English than Robin Hood. At first, upon seeing this 20 years later, I didn't know it was Robin Hood until the

Merry Men showed up and I was like, oh, well, why is he French? I guess French accents are funny. Also entire routine is peppy lepew so yeah there's there's also that we have the dragon who's a peppy lepew character too yeah they say on the commentary that he had more gross pickup lines but it eventually grossed them out too much like now this this is yucky robin hood is voiced by vincent cassell okay a french actor was just getting into the U.S. at the time. In a lot of very boundary-pushing films, Shrek isn't even mentioned on his wiki, which I

say somebody needs to fix that. It's on his IMDb, so I know it's him, but somebody on that wiki needs to mention that Robin Hood is Vincent Cassell. And this movie is up front saying, we're not doing songs. He's got a song. Yes, yeah. He technically has a song well he's a bad guy and everybody hates his song and uh he gets the shit beat out of him for singing a song

so i mean also the well here i'll just put in the robin hood song here what are you doing be still my dear for i am your savior and i am rescuing you from this green... Beast. Hey, that's my princess. Go find your own. Please, monster. Can't you see I'm a little busy here? Look, pal, I don't know who you think you are. Of course, Roodalala. Please let me introduce myself. Oh, merry men. I still fund the rich and give to the needy. Takes a wee percentage. But I'm not greedy.

I risk your pretty damsels. Man, I'm good. What a guy! Ha ha! Monsieur Hoold! Break it down. I like an honest fight and a saucy little maid. What he's basically saying is he likes to get... Paid! So! Ooh, and a noggin in the bush, got the lady by the tush. That's bad! That's bad! That's bad!

That's bad! When a beauty's with a beast, it makes me awfully mad! He's mad! He's really, really mad! Now I'll take my blade and ram it through your eye! So not only does he do a like break it down line, but then they also do river dance. Like just, uh,

it's every easy joke in the book there. Oh boy. We get river dance and matrix references. And you know that it hurts the Dulococ the duloc joke of face versus ass that's good but then when they do it again with like what he's saying is he likes to get paid instead of laid if you repeat that joke you're taking away from the funniness of that joke earlier in duloc and i was thinking going back to a movie that i think is good, Aladdin, why are we not as annoyed by the pop culture references in that movie?

Is it because they're just drawn better? Is it because they go by faster? Is it because, I mean, like the Arsenio Hall joke, why are we not screaming and upset about that? You know, I think definitely it's execution because Genie's very funny and Eric Goldberg as lead animator on him did an amazing job. I think we like 2D animation better too. And if this movie only had Donkey making these lines and no one else made a pop culture reference,

that is the difference there too. That's a good point. Iago is not aware of pop culture in the 90s. Yeah. If it were to follow Shrek rules, Gilbert Gottfried would say, I heard better jokes on Carson. He doesn't go for that easy thing. It's only Genie.

And at least with Genie, he is a magical creature who you can convince yourself, like, well, he knows all of time, so he can reference something in 1990. He has access to things beyond this time period. But when you have Donkey doing it, and then Shrek kind of does it, andiona does it and robin hood shows up and does it and the magic mirror does it and pinocchio does it and everybody does it it's not even special it's just everyone knows about movies the robin hood guys all do the west side story thing yeah in the fight scene there originally it had been a reference to jackie chan films they said but as they were making the movie crouching tiger hidden dragon and matrix showed up so the more obvious one is the matrix jump with her fixing her hair even in 2001 i was like no

i don't like yeah and then the hair fixing was not even it was too subtle yeah yeah you can barely notice it well the crouching tiger reference is even i wouldn't call it subtle but when she does the kick and they show the kick three times in a row it's basically almost the exact posing i think of a jean-gilles scene in the movie i also forgot there was a side plot of shrek getting an arrow in his butt too and this goes on for too long i guess the merry men are just all dead too they're just knocked unconscious and dead is the arrow thing basically i mean i don't think they do this very well, but is it Shrek trusting someone for the first time? I think it's that. It's also just easy romantic comedy stuff of like a guy who doesn't want a girl to touch him.

And she's like, but I have to help you. Let me tell you. I could see Katzenberg just saying, hey, we did this in like five movies when I worked at Disney and Paramount. Just to have an injury happen to the tough guy. And the girl also has to touch his butt. And fall on him. him and fall on him it's a very like meat cute kind of thing and yeah when she lands on him i just like he could eat you alive like this your your faces are just too huge trek should realize this is not going to work him not knowing she's an ogre what what's gonna happen meanwhile donkey's sent off and he can't find something because he's colorblind which that okay i like that joke i did like that it that also like you

said that feels written not like a thing eddie murphy would have said oh well you know donkeys are colorblind this is a funny eddie murphy could write that joke but i'm just saying if you're asking him to improv in a room i don't think he'd say oh if only i wasn't colorblind uh which donkeys really are colorblind. Flowers, I should call FTD or something like that. I mean, don't laugh at that joke, Henry. It's bad. But that's a riff that you would just think up on the spot.

I laugh because you did a good job of coming up with a bad riff. I'm sorry for scolding you. Don't laugh at my bad joke. So, yes, when Donkey returns, he's like, oh, you guys just wanted to be alone and they they both have to pretend that they're not into each other and we have another montage of walking somewhere and what song is this uh this is from the eels it's uh the song my beloved monster see what bothers me about this band henry it's not the eels it's eels oh yes yeah and that bothers me and i wish it was the eels it's too clever by half saying just

eels yeah and i guess they were pretty big around this time uh nova came for the soul that hit single was uh basically their only big hit in terms of crossover appeal i owned this album my beloved monsters also on nova came for the souls album uh so i own that album it was a fine song i like it uh this scene is all right I bought one of their albums one of their most beloved albums and it barely brought me down it was a little too much for me I wanted a thing to bring me down that's why I bought it also because the dude looks like just like oh you're a mopey looking guy you got glasses and a soul patch I think Novocaine for the soul was written about a friend who committed suicide as well that makes sense I guess that would be novocaine for the soul and of course most importantly the song title is so

on the nose yep my beloved monster and this is one of the ones where it's in the movie and on the soundtrack too because eels were on the dreamworks record label so apparently the eels sequence also is one of the last ones they animated so it's uh they said it was the one of their easier ones because they figured out so uh they said it was the one of their easier ones because they figured out so much of it another bit i didn't uh fully get until hyper close watching when fiona walks by shrek she pats him on the butt yeah and that's like her little like yeah i'm into you kind of thing like you know shrek has never had a girl like him ever so he doesn't know what to do i was briefly confused about this movie because

i knew one of the shrek movies had a weezer song in it that was cut and that weezer song ended up on make believe that rancid album but it was actually shrek 2 wow i did not know that yeah it's a bad song i knew that uh rivers had written songs for angus that got cut but i didn't know about the shrek one then she helps them catch a bunch of flies, and then she licks her fingers after making bug cotton candy to show again that she likes gross stuff. And then they kill a couple frogs. They kill a frog and a snake. This looks gross.

If this was a 2D movie, it would be less. You'd think about it less, but because they're realistic looking animals, you just kind of feel bad. On the commentary, they even say like, well, well yeah when they get to a certain altitude they're going to explode yeah these characters have killed this snake and frog you just feel bad for them they kind of take you out of the scene i didn't need to see the scene of them drifting upwards yeah it makes you sad it instead of ending the scene with thinking these two characters are in love you're thinking well they killed those things and also you're thinking do ogres breathe helium why do they float yeah

that's part of shrek lore that's why fiona that's an early tell that fiona's an ogre because she has helium breath too so uh they are about to drop her off at farquad and they said they cut more jokes about how small his dick is when they they were about to do a bunch of jokes to fiona of like oh and you marry farquaad he's got a small dick and that was eventually they were told think of parents with children in the audience like this is too dirty oh at this point donkey tries to basically repeat the shrek joke about overcompensating and shrek gets mad at him yeah yeah it's uh when fiona gets donkey to have a hypochondria reaction to just stay there i call this one a must-see tv joke of like i think i need a hug oh that's just it's just

so easy i wrote down something like i really groaned it i can't feel my toes i don't have any toes just yeah yeah i write a joke just write a joke i. I do like the animation on Donkey breaking his own neck. He's like, well, you know, I don't want to say anything, but when I move my neck like this, it really hurts. That's okay, though his neck quickly is fixed. That's nice. Then again, in another real-life tale about Fiona, Shrek finds a bunch of rats in the weeds and roasts them.

She's like, rats, and just eats them whole. They're killing all these animals. These guys are real sickos. I'm not for this marriage. Look, Bob, they can't go to the grocery store. They got to live off the land. And if there's rats in the swamp, they're going to eat them rats, you know?

I also like that he accidentally, as they're talking about the rats over dinner, he accidentally kind of asks her on a date. He's like, oh, I make a mean weed rat stew. You should, like, that's fun. I like that. He's like, oh, I make a mean weed rat stew. You should like that. That's fun. I like that. Slurping in the weed rat tail like spaghetti.

That's cute. I like that too. I will also say too, though, you think about it from Fiona's position. She knows two different men in the course of two days and is going to marry one of them by the end of that second day. And it's either Far quad or shrek and they just rush to the wedding so fast i guess there's a time cut between them in the church and then them in the swamp wedding you could tell yourself like well they dated for like six months

in between those things and then got married i think she needs therapy first before she gets into a relationship honestly uh well you could say that for most fairy tale uh princesses yeah which they actually i heard this argument from griffin newman on his guest appearance on podcast ride that because this movie mocks disney so much every disney movie after this had to be like hey we can make fun of ourselves too we we're we're cool like shrek like that's why in frozen elsa's sister when she falls in love with a guy and says she's gonna marry him after knowing him for like five hours Elsa says you can't marry someone you just met that's crazy like that is them crapping on their own tropes it took them a while to react to it just because of how long things take to make and wasn't enchanted

the first time they really were were like, this is stupid. Yeah, yeah, that's true. I guess you could say 06's Princess and the Frog has jokes about like, well, this isn't a normal princess. She's a princess who knows princess stories. And Tangled 2, I think, was a big one. Oh, very much Tangled, yeah. I only know the Kingdom Hearts 3 version of that movie, by the way, so apologies. Well, yeah, also in Moana, Maui.

I was going to just call him The Rock. But Maui also just makes fun of Moana saying, you have an animal sidekick. You're a princess. Are you going to start singing any moment now? Like it took him about a decade to incorporate Shrek style humor into Disney films. So as we're having this sweet little moment, playing in the background is Jason Wade's cover of You Belong to Me. Jason Wade was a member of the band Lifehouse. Anybody remember Lifehouse here? And now he spends his time polishing mixing boards.

You know, hey, if he signed a record contract with DreamWorks in 1998, he's probably got enough to live off of i think man i mean those shrek checks alone shrek checks those shrek checks those got to be like uh was that a cereal by the way you know boy what was the shrek cereal i'm sure they had just a shrek cereal let's see shrek official cereal this is important for all of our listeners i want to know so yes there was a shrek cereal i'm looking at the donkeys yeah it's uh well they're fruit loops these are just fruit loops with shrek donkey and puss on the cover and they're no they're ogres henry yes not fruit loops at all ogres oh i'm seeing some marshmallow cereal right here okay yeah i see the general

mills one that's some cereal bits with marshmallows inside yeah for sure of course shrek has been around long enough to have three different cereals same with all of the all of the characters uh but yeah so then donkey is a real cock blocker and just jumps in between them ruins the moment but then shrek ruins the moment himself anyway. It's like, you want to eat this? And he just hands her the rat. And he knows he struck out. He should have kissed the girl, you know?

Yeah, Donkey should have been singing a song about it. See, this is why we need songs in these movies. This is why you need songs. Things need to happen. So Fiona knows the sun's about to go down, so she goes to hide. Meanwhile, you know, the donkey's trying to tell Shrek, hey, go for it, buddy. And I like the little bit of Shrek messling with the stick to be like, well, if I did

feel something, man, I don't. But if I did, she wouldn't like me. I'm just an ogre. And so he just heads off. He says he needs to get firewood. They cut to show that there's a whole bunch of firewood. Apparently Katzenberg didn't want that shot in the movie and said, you don't need an insert shot of firewood.

But on the commentary, they celebrate that they got that firewood shot in the film. It's an important battle. And then I actually, again, complimenting the film by 2001 standards, the shot of Shrek looking at the sun and then it dissolves to time and it's nighttime a good shot i thought that was good yeah and of course fiona ran away because the sun was setting yes yeah so she heads into the windmill donkey follows her in looking for her it's uh it looks kind of good and creepy in there and uh then she falls down revealing herself in a cloud of smoke donkey at first

doesn't believe it but yes her with her cherubic face is this is her true form and it looks way better than fiona you're out of the uncanny valley ogre fiona looks way better yes i mean human fiona comes back but then the movies after this are just she's ogre forever yeah as far as i know i believe a magic curse gets put upon her to put her in human form briefly in a film but uh but it's always the point that she's happier as an ogre and that's how she wants to live but i also have to wonder is that dress magic because her body is not the same and is a form-fitting dress true lots of elastic is involved yeah i mean it could just be a magic dress her parents are rich they could buy her a magic dress that changes in size but c.s donkey doesn't believe it at first

but when he looks in her eyes he realizes that is fiona at first he jokes like oh my god you ate the princess and he even kind of very like cruelly calls her ugly yeah but donkey this is the point of the movie pay attention donkey is tactless i i understand that her her backstory is really skirted over a witch cast a curse on you why yeah why did this happen where is this witch believe me she does not come back in the second movie you even meet her parents and you get some backstory but not much talk of that witch at least i checked the shrek wikis for confirmation there's no character of witch who enchanted her but maybe i'm misremembering if guys say like oh no it was secretly the fairy godmother who did it don't you remember in shrek 2 i'm sorry i forgot it's been a while since shrek

2 and it's not on hulu and i don't have the blu-ray really not on hulu well you have to sign it for the live service oh come on soon enough they'll all be on Peacock because Universal owns them. But there's an over... I'm just talking about TV contracts now. Anyway, though... It's important. Donkey, though, in this next clip, is a good wingman for Shrek as he learns Fiona's secret. All right, all right.

Calm down. Look, it's not that bad. You're not that ugly. And where you are, I ain't gonna lie, you are ugly. But you only look like this at night. Shrek's ugly 24-7. But, Donkey, I'm a princess. And this is not how a princess is meant to look.

Princess, how about if you don't marry Farquaad? I have to. Only my true love's kiss can break the spell. But, you know, um, you're kind of an ogre, and Shrek, well, you've got a lot in common. Shrek? Princess, I, uh, how's it going, first of all? Good? Um, good for me, too. I'm okay. I saw this flower and thought of you because it's pretty. And, well, I don't really like it, but I thought you might like it because you're pretty. But I like you anyway.

I'm in trouble. That was a very Mike Myers-y section there, Chuck. Yeah. I'm in trouble. So maybe I'm missing something, fiona was always an ogre right and the curse was to turn her into a human during the day no that's what i don't get about this movie so on the commentary they say it should have been that they should say that she was always an ogre who was given a pretty curse but i thought that's why the movie wraps up the way it does

where that's the twist but i guess it's not the twist so okay yes it's not the twist in this film yeah in shrek 2 she has two human parents and she was born a human baby i believe it was her father actually had been the frog prince who gets kissed to turn into a human again that being her father i think that is the magic that brought the curse into it i think that is sort of it but that's that's retcon like that doesn't count the reality of this film in this film what she says you just have to take is the reality a witch cursed her to be an ogre that's what happened okay like that she was born a human baby and then a witch made her be an ogre well then to me the twist doesn't make any sense yeah well the twist is that she just it's a

transformation she's ashamed of i suppose like that's the twist but it works so much better if she's an ogre who was cursed to look like a princess they they waste so much time on this movie with these bits and these riffs that they need to tell these things to the audience they need to explain these things to the audience you know i think that's what when you have to make room for riffs and you're locked in of like well we can't animate more than 90 minutes of this and we need room for riffs then you got to toss out like story bits like maybe maybe the bits on the commentary where they say oh we like the idea that she was had a pretty curse put on her maybe that was a line before and then they said we need to lose six more minutes because we're keeping these lines that donkey says we're putting in every line we can but i i kind of

do like her sob i don't like her sobbing as a character moment her crying and saying this is not how a princess is supposed to look like it's it's an okay message about like the beauty standards put upon her and she feels bad about how she looks only because it's what everyone expects a princess to look like not because she personally hates looking like an ogre she just hates what other people think of her looking like you know and i think in the book it was always an ogre princess yes the ugliest princess for the ugliest ogre yeah they could be ugly together when she's only on like four pages yeah at the very end too it's just he it ends where the night shrek breaks into the castle and is like and then found out the princess was an

ogre and they got married the end again it's a 30 page kids yeah yeah this then leads to quite a cliched romantic comedy misunderstanding where one character says something but another person hears a different thing this is why in romantic comedies no character can directly say what they feel because that would defeat this cliche that stops them from being together and in this case Shrek listens in to her she's into Shrek when Donkey says she should go to Shrek she then talks about how ugly she is and how princess and ugly don't go together but it's her talking about herself. Shrek hears that and thinks that when she says princess and ugly don't go together,

it's her saying I could never fall in love with someone as ugly as Shrek. And that hurts Shrek's feelings. And he walks away and doesn't hear the very next thing she says. And that's why I can't tell Shrek because of this spell on me. Maybe she's just very self-conscious about this, but I don't understand why she would think shrek would reject this change well because he is an ogre well i mean her parents taught her to be in the closet all the time about this so it could just be she doesn't want to show anybody okay it takes her all night to get up the confidence to burst out of the room and be like i'm gonna tell shrek i'm coming out i'm coming

out they should have had that music played yeah that's a missed opportunity i don't know it just to burst out of the room and be like i'm gonna tell shrek i'm coming out i'm coming out but they should have had that music played yeah that's a missed opportunity i don't know it just feels like if anyone gets to see this transformation it should be shrek i mean i guess it takes her a while to come around to that but she's i don't know i don't buy a lot of this i guess as a romantic comedy goes they want shrek to get the confidence to tell her he loves her before he knows she's a ogre too because that it feels more earned for shrek's love that he's like if he knew she was an ogre that might make him like oh then what am i even worrying about like it gives him a bigger romantic obstacle to overcome in in cliched

romantic comedy yeah i think she's not an ogre i guess i don't like this romantic comedy stuff because i don't buy it for a second because later on uh when they're having their fight and we'll talk about it shrek goes like you said who could love a hideous ugly beast you should go oh i was talking about me you were misunderstanding okay let's let's talk about this but instead it's just so contrived well when he says that then she replies back but i thought that wouldn't be a problem for you because she then thinks he knows she's an ogre and she thinks that he's saying you're too ugly for me an ogre and that hurts her feelings but when she says i thought that wouldn't be a problem for you shrek thinks he's saying you think it wouldn't

be a problem that i'm you think i'm hideous it's all missed communication that's the joke it's too contrived i mean you feel this is not realistic dialogue but but i thought that wouldn't matter to you yeah well it does she should be like but i'm an ogre like you shrek and you're an ogre too oh wow it's uh a lot of 800 assumptions have to be made on top of each other and they have to be made while donkey is conveniently asleep because if he was awake if he was awake he'd say no i know what's going on you you misheard here but donkey has to sleep and for the one time ever not talk i do like his little eye twitches he is bent now donkey is a good friend to fiona though because she tells him please don't tell him my secret and donkey's like fine but you should and

he does even when it would be plot convenient for him to say she was talking about her later he doesn't do it he just says she was talking about someone else that's where there's a good the bit you said where you slightly chuckled was when donkey talks and he sees he's surrounded by knights and he's like who talks certainly not donkey that was okay and it was the one reference to oh right this is uh he has like concentration camps full of fairy tale creatures and donkey does not want to be rounded up even when he says that you almost forget as a viewer you're like oh wait yeah he's he's worried uh but yes far quad arrives you see the track angrily left that night and brought far quad to her

fiona is hurt that he would shove her to far quad meanwhile far quad is just happy like oh uh hey it's my girlfriend and he he even very meanly says like uh like you don't have to waste good manners on an ogre it's not like he's got feelings it's got feelings got feelings yeah and yes in this next clip the trio breaks up. How anxious are we? You're right. The sooner the better. There's so much to do. There's the caterer, the cake, the band, the guest list. Captain, round up some guests. Fare thee well, Ogre. Shrek, what are you doing? You're letting her get away.

Yeah, so what? Shrek, there's something about her that you don't know. Look, I talked to her last night. Yeah, I know you talked to her last night. You're great pals, aren't you? Now, if you two are such good friends, why don't you follow her home? But, Shrek, I want to go with you. Hey, I told you, didn't I?

You're not coming home with me. I live alone. My swamp. Me. Nobody else. Understand? Nobody. Especially useless, pathetic, annoying, talking donkeys!

But, I thought... Yeah, you know what? You thought wrong! Shrek. Shrek. You know what? I like the sad acting from Myers, but they've had this scene five times, and I don't buy that it has to matter this time. Maybe Donkey can tell with the tears in his eyes that shrek means it this time perhaps it's just the this scene happens too much in this movie

i do like he's like you're great pals aren't you myers plays it well of being just his sadness creeps through and then he kind of stuffs it back and he's like no i'm mad no i'm sad like it the push and pull of that that's good voice acting. I like that. But, but yeah, I, I do like the shot. Shrek is looking at the deed, the thing he thought he wanted. And then he looks behind him to Fiona leaving and he's like, no, that's what I want now. I thought I wanted to live alone. And now the woman I'd want to share my life with is about to leave to marry Hitler basically basically yeah the the framing is nice visually and also i okay i giggled again too at when farquad is taken off of the horse he's

lifted like a toddler out of his seat under his arms i that made me laugh you know and then of course comes another gigantic cliche the hallelujah scene yeah which uh was a bathroom break for me during my second viewing of shrek yeah so i was just i was making the jerk off noise in my apartment sorry no the motion i wasn't making the jerk off noise oh no that's uh yeah the hallelujah as a song originally written and performed by leonard cohen you know it had been around for a while it is it's a beautiful song but you've I've heard it used in so many places for a very long sex scene in Watchmen over the trailer for Justice League the Snyder Cut and in many other places it's just it's so corny it's just such an easy and also it's a song about like a biblical love affair it is not really

right for the tone of its characters miss each other it's too heavy and it's too emotionally manipulative yeah i will say tonally the line i used to live alone before i knew you or all i ever learned from love was how to shoot somebody who outdrew you those fit for shrek but lines like which are not in the movie remember when i moved in you and the holy dove was moving too yeah that's not in this movie or also she tied you to her kitchen chair she broke your throne and cut your hair also not in the movie and i do like uh visually i hate this this segment but i visually i like the cross-cutting between shrek and fiona sure and uh i think they realize, like, this is a little much.

So there's a shot of Donkey and the dragon reuniting. That got a big laugh in the theater during this heavy scene. Oh, yeah, yeah. It was nice to see them reconnect. But again, I don't like Donkey going back to his attacker. But here's more soundtrack funnies. So the film in the movie is sung by john kale who was a member of the velvet underground and just you know this very revered rocker but for some reason rights wise they

couldn't get his version on the soundtrack and i don't understand why if they were going to have rufus wainwright do his version of the cover why couldn't it be subbed in into the scene and just replace it like i can get that it's not exactly the same timing and everything but if it's close enough like and it's not said on the commentary either why it's a different song yeah these soundtrack mix-ups are weird yeah i mean i can understand that they thought john kale can't be on this album because we're only having dreamworks people and we just signed Rufus Wainwright. But why can't it just be Rufus in the movie? I will say when I was a cliched youngster, I listened to Rufus's version of it and the

Jeff Buckley cover over and over and over again. And I was like, I'm sad and deep too. I love this song. It's for when you're sentimental and growing up. I think it's good. Yeah. And as you get older, you go like, this is a song about sex. But yeah when you're sentimental and growing up i think it's good yeah and as you get older you go like this is a song about sex yeah but yeah you're right they are showing off at least with all these match cuts like them at the two sides of the table the broken mirror matching

up with the chandelier like this is what the n64 fire is yes he throws the flower in the fire and that fire looks like shit like yeah there's better fire in the movie the fire in the scene is just bad the big fireball that chases them is much more oh yeah quality than that this fireplace fire and you have to see it twice because it's like a match cut you see his fireplace and then it turns into the fireplace where fiona is and and you can see fiona doesn't like she's already realizing i don't want to marry this guy she shoves farquad into the cake like and when he cuts her off when she accepts his proposal that should have been like that's red flag number one right there but so after the song is over and

we all get to hear a beautiful song that you've heard in too many movies donkey then returns to to have it out with shrek and i agree with donkey he owns half this place he earned it he he risked his ass literally uh that's too funny for shrek yeah you know that's too good of a joke i made up too good a joke for it but yes donkey then has it out with shrek i also agree with donkey when he says you know what no i've had to listen to your bullshit this whole movie now it's time for you to hear about my feelings i'm tired of your feelings also i do like the ear acting on trek his ears are down and then when he finds out that fiona actually does like him his ears perk back up again he's like oh really i guess i didn't notice but i guess this i did like this scene because i was sick of the shrek telling Donkey to shut up scenes because there are so many.

And finally, Donkey gets to, you know, bite him back. Yeah, yeah. And I think Donkey has earned that right. And yes, Donkey and Shrek make up. Well, guess what? Now it's my turn. So you just shut up and pay attention. You are mean to me.

You insult me and you don't appreciate anything that I do. You're always pushing me around or pushing me away. Oh, yeah? Well, if I treated you so bad, how come you came back? Because that's what friends do. They forgive each other. Oh, yeah. You're right, donkey. I forgive you. For stabbing me in the back. You're so wrapped up in layers, onion Boy, you're afraid of your own feelings.

Go away. See? There you are, doing it again, just like you did to Fiona. And all she ever do was like you. Maybe even love you. Love me? She said I was ugly. A hideous creature. I heard the two of you talking. She wasn't talking about you. She was talking about...

somebody else. She wasn't talking about me well then who was she talking about no way i ain't saying anything you don't want to listen to me right right donkey no okay look i'm sorry all right and he legitimately apologizes to donkey that see that is the emotional arc that closes there that is more important than the love story i think you know and then donkey never has to explain who shoot fiona was talking about yeah yeah i mean look he said he'd keep a secret and he did it's uh yeah i mean it's just a sweet little moment of them going like we are friends yeah and then we find out that like the wedding's about to happen right now there's no way they'll get there in time i will say one thing the shrek

movies this shrek 4d and the second movie really depends upon is can't a dragon just show up and get somebody there like there's maybe six minutes left in the movie right it's so there it is a sprint to the end here i i remembered this being spaced out more but yeah the the dragon just shows up and donkey says like i guess it's just my animal magnetism which seems to imply that he's having sex with an animal not a uh a person of similar intelligence to him but then they just fly off they're like all right let's get there right now back to back to the far quad place and then we just fly off. They're like, all right, let's get there right now. Back to the Farquaad place. And then we just smash cut to the wedding happening.

Yes, yeah. I do like the joke of the applause signs. That's all right. It's been done before, for sure. I mean, this whole section of a woman forced into a marriage. Princess Bride did these jokes, you know. Spaceballs. I was thinking the priest almost sounds like the Spaceballs guy to me.

Yeah. Holy moly. I love Spaceballs. Everyone, stop talking about it. It's a good movie. Also, the way the dragon lands is inspired by the Harrier jet from True Lies. Okay. Was it meant to be like a visual reference or just inspired?

The first time it lands, it's supposed to be a visual reference to the Harrier jet. Yeah. And then that's also when Shrek calls Donkey. Donkey calls Shrek a kiss ass, which again, really gets him away with something there. But yeah, so then they do the joke twice. It's another one where I don't like they do the joke twice. Fiona's like, can we speed this up? And for the second time, Farquaad's like, oh, she wants to get to the wedding night huh kind of joke

they they already did it when he's like oh anxious are we then we have to assume that when the dragon lands it kills a bunch of knights just yeah off screen yeah and then of course though donkey has to waste some more time with uh with another song donkey tells him no you can't just go in there you have to be dramatic wait for the i object moment and then he sings the otis redding song try a little tenderness oh right i forgot there was another singing donkey bit in this section got to got to that apparently was all murphy and they're like yeah that's funny we're keeping now we gotta pay for it we gotta pay for the song he made the otis redding estate a lot of money that day and uh yes shrek then finds out that they actually have wasted too

much time and they miss the object part i kind of like that i like that they seem to know they're in a movie and they want to do the dramatic thing and then shrek fucks up and realizes he already missed that so he bursts in and just screams i object it's too late a time that's when uh this next scene starts with some more classic mike meyer stage pattern hi everyone having a good time are you i love do a lot first of all very clean what are you doing here really it's rude enough being alive when no one wants you but showing up uninvited to a wedding i need to talk to you oh now you want to talk? Well, it's a little late for that, so if you'll excuse me. But you can't marry him. And why not? Because, because he's just marrying you so he can be king. Outrageous. Fiona, don't listen. He's not your true love. i uh i mean oh this is precious the ogre has fallen in love with the princess

oh good lord is this true who cares it's preposterous fiona my love we're but a kiss away from our happily ever after now kiss me good sound on lithgow yeah you know what he is doing the john lithgow thing that's what you hire him for but it's good yeah he's great at it they you know you'll see him in stuff every now and again you're like man he's good but i forget that he was at his most famous when they cast him in this like he was the third rock from the sun lead actor winning emmys every year you know i would have liked to see an alternate universe in which he was cast as doc brown that was their original actor they wanted to play him he also you know another thing he turned down being the joker in the 89 batman really okay yeah which i can't imagine anyone but jack nick jack nicholas

doing that role but uh he i think he i think lith go would have been good i feel the same thing about lloyd christopher lloyd but i i want to see the alternate reality versions of those movies yeah just if they could exist yeah if we had the rick and morty portal gun or whatever or a better reference to a thing that's just the one that came to me but you feel for shrek there everyone laughing at him like oh the the nerd has feelings for the cheerleader everyone laugh at him and again it's a thing like he only wants to be king and it doesn't i i don't understand this i don't understand this plot point at all. It's like, this is his kingdom. It's named after him.

It's Duloc. You have it. It's yours. Like he's, I guess he wants to be king. When Shrek says he honestly is doing this to be king. That was like, oh, right. That was a plot point one hour ago in this movie. If you're going to do the scene of him jerking off in bed to her, have him say like, and

then I'll be king. Oh boy. I can't wait to be a king that's what i've always wanted all of these things they set up in act one they forget about until act three when they're briefly mentioned again uh just for the big ending like that's why this ending happens so fast everyone has to just shout like i'm in love with you i want to be king kill this person like yeah it's like the villain is dispatched in about five seconds yeah so fiona turns down the kiss she decides she's gonna turn into the ogre so everyone can see in a real cheat about body

morphing they have better technology by shrek 2 in this off screen yeah it's just a bunch of clouds that cover her it's a very myers line too and he says well that explains a lot you can see then Farquaad just turns on her and starts calling her it as well like he he sees her now as lesser than a person too I really feel like at this point Farquaad should really show his true colors and just say kill them he doesn't even say kill Shrek he just says get him get him out of here you know there's cross talk but he does says I'm gonna have you drawn and quartered okay he does say that if he killed her he might not be a king anymore so he says he's just gonna put her back in a dungeon yeah and she'll never get out oh yeah he says to shrek you'll beg for death to save you so you know he's the bad stuff's gonna happen to shrek and he's fighting off all those

guys and i guess again if we're gonna note this death, Shrek should be more active in his own saving. If you want to say, oh, well, Shrek whistles for the dragon to show up. That's it. Like, yeah, the dragon does everything for him. The dragon flies him there. The dragon saves Donkey as well. It's really a dragon's movie. It is.

And meanwhile, the dragon gets treated like shit. Most of the movie is a joke. If you're going to kill the villain, it should be an ironic death. Yes. Well, I guess that early in the movie like i'll never be eaten by a dragon uh but or say oh i'm not going to that that castle i'm scared of that dragon he has no personal connection to the dragon one way or the other it's just a dragon as the force of the story breaks through a window and eats him to kill him his knights are doing a poor job of protecting him too but i'll tell you what disney they'd have him fall into a chasm and you just assume death

this guy gets eaten on screen you see him try to get out and he is swallowed dead d-e-a-d dead also like donkey this one i couldn't tell if it was a reference to something but him saying i'm a donkey on the edge felt like a reference like i'm not sure what maybe it's one of the things that feels like a joke but isn't just like this should be a reference i guess it's a placement for saying like hey i'm a man on the edge don't push me but uh i it's a clever enough like you know statement of it and then eddie murphy just becomes a stand-up comedian himself say like celebrity marriage they never last do they i like that everybody's happy after they're he's dead they're like oh he's dead yay we're finally free so yes shrek is about to kiss her they say on the

commentary that it was myers playing that scene with his then wife at the time to make it feel real for him and that's when shrek says he loves her as for you my wife i'll have you locked back in that tower for the rest of your days i will have order i will have perfection i will all right nobody move. I got a dragon here and I'm not afraid of you. I'm a donkey on the edge. Celebrity marriages, they never last, do they? Go ahead, Trey.

Uh, Fiona? Yes, Shrek? I... I love you. Really? Really, really. I love you, too. And the guy writes awe on the sign yeah that's cute i i guess with donkey saying now go ahead trek i guess it's donkey who was on the dragon saying like hey kill that guy i suppose there's that

that gives a little more activity to our characters sure i guess it's implied with that scene though that kind of reminds me of uh remember ninja turtles when casey jones says oops and then kills a guy like you don't want your main characters to be that active in murder you know like only accessories to murder yeah that's acceptable like have tarzan say hey be careful and then a guy kills himself or whatever, or have... How we use electricity can be smarter, cleaner, and greener. At Electric Ireland, we can help guide you there. You see, our new Net Zero Hub has all you need to know about smart meter plans,

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And then it's Gaston's fault that he falls off of the tower. And Frollo falls off of Notre Dame because he's clumsy. he's a jerk uh clumsy corny yeah he's he's he yeah you know what he's too hard to keep his balance but yes he kisses her we then have what is certainly a parody of the beauty and the beast final transformation all right like not only does she fly in the air just like beast does but also falls on the ground in a way that you can't tell if they're transformed or not.

It actually reminded me of the third Matrix film when she looks up into the sky and looks like the magical power consumed her or whatever. One of three jokes I liked in this movie, but didn't laugh at, was when she levitates and there's like a gust of wind and light that breaks all the windows in the church. One of them is left unbroken and the dragon just breaks it. That I liked. It showed the dragon had more presence of mind. It was like, ah, I can't leave this one unbroken.

Especially because it's a picture of Farquaad on it too. Like, let's be done with that guy. Fiona, though, is revealed to be still in her ogre form. And she's like, I thought I was supposed to be beautiful. And of course we get a happy ending fiona fiona are you all right well yes but i don't understand i'm supposed to be beautiful but you are beautiful i was hoping this would be a happy

ending so there was nothing so like i thought it was a clever twist but i guess it's not because there's no like ambiguous wording in the curse that would imply that this would turn her into an ogre yeah at first my read on it was as far as the first viewing in the movie i thought it was if she had kissed a human she would have turned human all the time by kissing an ogre she turned ogre all the time that should be in the movie then yeah well they just no one explains anything of it like there should be some ambiguity in the in the words of the curse she says the curse or like the rhyme or whatever the verse into how to fix the thing and then she should go like oh blah blah blah blah that's what it meant yeah oh it meant i turned into the ogre all the time that's great i love being an ogre instead it's unexplained in this whole time i spent the movie

thinking oh she was an ogre curse to turn into a human during the day but they never they don't make that clear and in the second movie they make it obvious that she was a human like in the second movie it's also more jokes about like she comes back home with her new husband and they see like wait you turned into an ogre and you're married to an ogre what the hell like it's then it just turns into me to the parents as well but shrek then much like Deadpool, knows there's a camera and puts his hand in the way so you can't see the kiss. I can't stand this. And I think didn't every animated movie do this for a long time? Like, no, let's do a bunch of fun songs.

It's a dance party finish was pretty much every DreamWorks CG film after this. Yeah, it's well, this is where the Smash Mouth cover comes in, which is their payback toback to them they have a wedding which i think if they knew they were going to have a sequel they would have saved the wedding for another movie but they wanted if they thought if this is our one shot then let's have the swamp wedding and all the creatures come back so originally it was just supposed to be they get in the onion carriage they do the joke of the throwing of the bouquet and that the dragon gets it and then gingerbreadbread man says, God bless us, everyone. And after they did it, then had that as their final thing in some screening, Katzenberg says, not good enough.

We need a bigger laugh at the end. And so that's why they just had Eddie Murphy sing the rest of the song. Like one more time, I believe like like so all that stuff after where donkey starts singing that was a very late addition to it it's such a cheap way to make you think it was a good movie too just like everyone's having fun why aren't you having fun have fun like he's i definitely think in my audience uh in first viewing some people sang along when he says like sing along with me people in the back i believe i believe i think that happened in my theater too what made you cringe more donkey wearing the sunglasses the pigs break dancing or the macarena the macarena by 2001 illegal joke to

make in a movie illegal you have to go to joke prison like it it should be the meme of the dog bonking you on the head like you're going to joke jail yes go to joke jail a macarena joke in 2000 even on first viewing it made me groan and when i watched it on dvd i was like i write a macarena joke in 01 even i just couldn't couldn't believe we talked about this in the history segment they They added more, right? Yes, yeah. So the big selling point of the DVD was the karaoke dance party, which extended this sequence and made it longer.

And just every character sings like one line of a song. You know how in the movie, Donkey's the only one who's like, this makes me think of a song. He sings like a few lyrics from it. In the dance party version everybody sings it like shrek sings a song then fiona sings a song actually i'm gonna pull up the list of songs here there's a very dense wikipedia page that's only for shrek song i was on shrekopedia for this by the way so songs in the shrek in the swamp karaoke dance party just the way you are by billy joel performed by shrek like a virgin by madonna sung by fiona baby got back by sir mixlock sung by

donkey about dragon because you know dragons got much back that should be illegal too a baby got back song in 2001 yeah feelings by morris albert was sung by thelonius ymca by the village people was sung by robin hood and the merry men do you really want to hurt me by culture club is sung by the gingerbread man and the three blind mice oh boy staying alive by the bgs are sung by far quad inside the stomach of dragon who let the dogs out she's of course sung by big bad wolf and three little pigs uh it still goes on it's going on there are more of these dance to the music by sly and the family stone is then sung by the entire cast and then shrek and fiona and the dance party by singing happy together by the turtles that is one two three four five six seven eight nine ten songs they paid for

for just the dvd extra that's how much money they spent on i feel bad for every parent who had a child in maybe 1995 they had to sit through this a lot so many like no i want to watch it again mom just the donkey singing song when he sings that song about butts like that's so funny you know those minivans with the dvd players built in how many of these were uh how many of those are playing this it had to on a loop it had to be once shrek 2 came out they're like i'll switch between trek and shrek 2 please don't make me see both of them mommy needs a break uh i just have to as a parent you have to just go like all right i believe i but uh and that is still in uh though i think it's an sd on the blu-ray because i don't think they kept hd elements for it but you can watch it on on the blu-ray edition i think it's

about to get a 4k edition as well of shrek i think even they knew there were story problems involving fiona because now i'm thinking like i have all these questions and if you're working on the movie don't you have questions too and i think this dance party is just to be like no no no we're having fun now it's almost over just get the rest of your soda in your body and let's go uh you'll chuckle at seeing the Macarena be performed and that's it you have your keys yeah it's time to go uh your kid well it'll soon cut to black and then you can walk your kids out and put your jacket on oh and then that I mean those the credits talk about songs too four songs in a row it's longer it's more songs they shove in than we got in the space jam credits

you know like it's four songs in a row like including the baja men cover of the best years of our lives like yeah how do you feel if you get signed on to be in a soundtrack of a movie and you're stuck in the credits i know just at the end no one's watching it it just fills out a soundtrack that can be sold like but they seem to think the baja man was going to be the biggest hit from it because that was the first music video they made for shrek was the baja man they also must have got a big payday for that cover they're covered a who let the dogs out as well which oh man like what's worse hearing who let the dogs out or oh god or ymca2 i was gonna say baby got back makes me the most mad but i i think sir makes a lot seems like a fine guy but like it's such it is the cliche-iest of all cliche

are we in mambo number five town yet oh man had mambo number five come out uh i wonder let's see i am watching now on my youtube the bajaaja Man video for Best Years of Our Lives. An odd name for a song. Yes. And I want them to be dancing with Shrek, but no, it's just them performing and then Shrek clips. Yep. At the very least, in the I'm a Believer music video, they get people in giant Shrek costumes that Smash Mouth hangs out with. They couldn't

do any cgi stuff for it but okay so the lubega version of manga mambo number mango number five mambo number five that was 1999 so they could have had it in here and they didn't i i feel like uh something must have fallen through or like you know what i I'm seeing here? Lou Bago is on RCA. So RCA might have been like, we're not giving that to DreamWorks. No, no. I can see that. It feels like an omission to me. Totally.

But it was a scene that was supposed to leave you with a good taste in your mouth. And when you leave it, you're like, no, I feel bad. I don't. This is so many bad jokes in a row and terrible references the second i heard i just i knew i had to watch the rest of it for this but i just wanted to turn it off yeah you'd uh just hearing that if it was just the monkeys version i i wouldn't be so bothered by it but to hear the smash mouth of five i shut it off and i said you know what america deserved 9-11 and then i unsubscribed from Hulu

that was a joke by the way of course I don't mean that it was a sign of our opulence yes we thought this was entertainment yeah okay I think the nicest thing I can say about Shrek is that looking at other things that ripped off Shrek after Shrek's huge success make me think Shrek is a better movie than it probably is because it's not as bad as a lot of bad movies that other people than dreamworks made and also dreamworks themselves made like this is a better movie than shark tale yeah it's a better movie than over the hedge it's it's not a better movie than kung fu panda which is i'm not even saying that's an amazing movie but i think as a movie of like jack black Black is a big fat guy who does Kung Fu.

Hey, I'm laughing already. I'm thinking about it. That's funny. And I don't want anyone to have a sour taste in their mouth after this podcast because I was kind of mean to Shrek. But again, I liked it a lot. I saw it twice in theaters

and I like how this podcast lets us revisit things. I didn't think I was going to like the movie and I was right. But going back to other things, I've liked more like Toy Story 1 and 2 two like doing this podcast made me realize like oh toy story might be one of my favorite movies it might be number one for me and toy story two even better i recently went back to toy story three i didn't like it we'll probably talk about it in the future wow man i'm surprised and i loved it the first time i still love that movie i'm looking

forward to when we ever do that but but you know going back to one and two that shows us that it's not just tech tech isn't the problem that makes it a better or worse movie or age poorly like shrek shrek's i didn't even see too many scenes occasionally if a human talked i'm like oh that face technology sucks but mostly what it knew visually what it was good at doing and showed that off you know i really feel like the problem with this movie it's not just the bad jokes the storytelling is very bad uh we explained it throughout this podcast a lot but things aren't told to the audience there's not a lot of tension there's a saggy second act the villain sucks there's so many things that are going wrong story-wise and i think you're right henry they didn't want to lose the riffing yeah and the riffing just cut

out so much of what was important to the storytelling of this film and also they wanted to tell their own story but then their hands were tied by the message of this book that they were barely adapting to so it's a very conflicted movie and i have a feeling the sequels are better i they have to be better i yeah maybe not the third but definitely the second one's better i i guess for me to complete the circle because we started with the history of jeffrey katzenberg what is important to jeffrey katzenberg is making fun of disney and befriending celebrities and a way to befriend celebrities is to keep all their riffs in there and say that's brilliant you're the funniest guy in the world that's why we kept all your lines in here because you're so funny we kept try the veal

yeah yeah the writers wanted to cut it one of the storyboarders said oh this joke about oh but think of the location is so hammy we should cut it and i kept it in because you're so funny mike myers you're hilarious please keep working with me do we know if there's gonna be a fifth shrek movie they've been trying to make it on and off over and over again it's at the time of this recording it's still just a rumor i think the most i had heard was eddie mur Murphy on some interview somewhere was like, they're trying to make Shrek five. He was implying Shrek five meetings have happened, but that's as far as it goes. But there's a question of like, how many of the original can they get back every actor?

How many creative people can they get back? Why even do it without Katzenberg in charge of it? It's just not to make it sound like I appreciate the artistic integrity of Shrek, but I do think that if you're not going to make it without PDI or Kat the artistic integrity of shrek but i do think that if you're not going to make it without pdi or katzenberg's input and it's just some other like sterile executive at comcast i at least want the mania of jeffrey katzenberg coming through instead of just some executive who's like have we exploited that ip recently let's do that well shrek was so big that it can never go away forever no no no and i'm

surprised it has not been marketed more or milked more uh what i'm seeing here is like there could be a second puss in boots movie because puss in boots is the new shrek oh yeah yeah uh the the puss never went away he got his own he had a tv or a netflix series that like is recent ish like so yeah he he never went away kids probably know p in Boots way more than they know Shrek. He's a cuter character. Come on. Yeah, he is. He looks like a cute kitty cat.

I would bet 10-year-olds, if they see Shrek, they're like, oh, it's Puss in Boots' friend. Whatever happened to that guy? But, yes, that was our exploration of Shrek. And who knows? It could be a Shrek-quel in the future for this podcast. I kind of am really curious now. But as for us, it's it for this podcast. We'll see you next month for another episode of What a Cartoon

Movie. We'll see you then. I'm a believer. I couldn't leave her if I tried. God bless us, everyone. Come on, y'all. And I saw her face. Ha ha. Now I'm

a believer. Listen I'm a believer. Not a trace. A doubt in my mind. I'm in love. I'm a believer. I could believe her if I tried. Then I saw her face. Now I'm a believer Hey!

Not a trace Yeah! A doubt in my mind One more time! I'm in love I'm a believer Come on! I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe

Hey! Y'all sing it with me. I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe. Hey, y'all sing it with me. I believe. I believe. The people in the back. I believe. I believe. I believe. I believe. I believe.

I can't breathe. I can't breathe. Can I stay with you? What? Can I stay with you, please? Of course. Really? No.

Please. I don't want to go back there. You don't know what it's like to be considered a freak. Well, maybe you do. But that's why we gotta stick together. You gotta let me stay. Please! Please! Okay! Okay! But one night only.

Ah! Thank you! What are you... No! No! This is gonna be fun. We can stay up late, swapping man list stories, and in the morning, I'm making waffles.