Talking Simpsons - Talking Simpsons - And Maggie Makes Three With Justin Decloux

Episode Date: July 29, 2026

"I was in heaven. If horse racing is the sport of kings, then surely bowling... is a... very good sport as well!" - Homer Simpson Journey back with us to the distant year of 1993—which wasn't so distant in 1995—to hear about the fabled birth of Maggie. When Homer at long last reaches the coveted rank of "pin monkey," the birth of his second daughter threatens to blow the Simpson family eight ways from Sunday. Don't forget, listener: you're here forever. Our Guest: Justin Decloux from The Important Cinema Club Podcast Support this podcast and get over 200 ad-free bonus episodes by visiting Patreon.com/TalkingSimpsons and becoming a patron! And please follow the official Twitter, @TalkSimpsonsPod, not to mention Bluesky and Instagram!

This podcast is brought to you by patreon.com slash talking Simpsons. Head there to check out exclusive podcasts like Talking Futurama, Talk King of the Hill, the What a Cartoon movie podcast, and tons more. Event or product. Ahoy, hoy, everybody, and welcome to Talking Simpsons where we can't stop using the Shino Bolo. I'm one of your host, the All-Star freelance terrorist Bob Mackie, and this is our chronological exploration of the Simpsons. Who else is here with me today, as always?

This is getting very abstract, but thanks. Thank you. I do enjoy podcasting, Henry Gilbert. And who is our special guest on the line? It's a boy. And what a boy. It's Justin DeClew. And this week's episode is, and Maggie makes three. This week's episode originally aired on January 22nd, 1995. And as always, Henryville tells us what happened on this mythical day in real world history. Legends of the Fall tops the box office for the second week in a row. creep by TLC unseats boys to men

and number one on the Billboard charts and live broadcasts of the OJ Simpson trial begin dominating daytime television nice I'm just realizing now or remembering now that in the mid-90s we had dueling creeps we had TLC and Radiohead pick your lane I liked both I would pick creep back then the Radiohead version of course

and now that I have to measure everything politically it's like well you know Radiohead They'd still play concerts in Tel Aviv, but at least one member of the two surviving members of Creek has perhaps gone, MAGA. She would say she hasn't. So it's really hard to pick by only defining quality of songs by the political vision of the people who make it. I mean, famously, one of the members of TLC, anti-seatbelt. Yes, yeah. I can't stand for that.

Making her a libertarian, I guess, in that way. Actually, I learned about the video for creep and the song CREP, the TLC version. I had not really thought about what it mean. It's like it is about cheating on your boyfriend or a partner. It's like, so I creep, I just keep it on the down low, so nobody has to know. That apparently Lisa Lefti Lopez did not like that. I thought it was, you know, against their kind of feminist message of the song and almost didn't want to do the music video and said she wanted to have black tape over her mouth

during the music video because she hated the idea of it so much as they're a need single. Anti-creeping stances from Lisa Lefti. I just recall that video being a very serious. sexy poker game. Is this true? Oh, yeah. It's strip poker? That sounds right. When all I can think of of TLC music videos, the CGI waterfalls of waterfalls

just sticks in my head so much. I can't imagine other TLC music videos. Well, I was a young man coming of age, and I found their game very interesting. Yes. Do any of you have strong opinions on Legends of the Fall? No, I'm more of a Legend of the Hidden Temple kind of guy. I can get down

with that. What exactly is, I've never seen it, I've never sought it out, I don't recall any current discourse about this movie, Justin. You are the king of movies on this podcast compared to us. Oh, wow. I get a little crown and everything. Legend of the Fall was a movie that was directed by Edward Zwick, if you can recall, the director of The Last Samurai.

And I remember seeing it in class. Our teacher showed it to us, but he only showed us the scenes that take place during World War I. He's like, nothing else. Just these things. Okay. I think of it as a mommy and daddy movie as a kid, of course, meaning it was boring.

And it's a 1900s period piece. of like a generational tale and it's full of important actors like it's early Brad Pitt but also Anthony Hopkins, Aiden Quinn and then yeah Zick with Zwick I've seen glory in school as I think most American kids

were forced to do of our age and then and I'm in a limited apologist for The Last Samurai I think people get the Last Samurai wrong that it's like oh the Last Samurai Star is like some white guy in it like no it's not it's about like the first weeb an American who goes to Japan and he's like no I must become a samurai

and get a Japanese wife. I saw Last Samurai with multiple parents. And in that last scene where he goes and he's like on his knees, the parents leaned over to me and went, he is the last samurai, unironically, what it happened. That's chappy. That's chappy of its day. I confuse this movie with Legends of the Fall.

I know it's just me, but it's like Brad Pitt, period picture, water is involved? Yes. Presumably. It sounds like someone saw Legends of the Fall in a classroom. Is this true? And then somebody saw Glory in a classroom. classroom. Well, they wheeled in the cart when in the OJ trial verdict was about to pop in my eighth grade

classroom. I'm jealous because I think they were scared of reactions in my middle school. So they refused to play it and they only like, a teacher told us when it happened. I remember them saying it on the PA system, which is wild because I was in elementary school. I had no idea what was going on. Today's lunchroom food is fish ticks and also OJ is innocence. And I remember when we did the history of Simpsons and syndication, the OJ Simpson trial was like its biggest nemesis in daytime programming or like 6 p.m. programming because it just because it was, you know, free access TV.

It was played on every channel during the daytime, overtaking a lot of daytime television. It's what made, you know, all of these like cable channels exist. It changed the true crime market. and for the worst. The broadcast of the O.J. Simpson trial worsened American culture in like every way just from what became popular.

And because of that, we're still feeling that today to the, well, for the last like 20 years, we've had to know who the Kardashians are because of the O.J. Simpson trial, to an extent. Yeah, I guess so. I guess that put the Kardashian name on the map, perhaps, for our generation.

If the character played by David Schwimmer is anything to go by, nobody heard of him until he was talking about his friend, The Juice. Yes, well, we all knew about Alan Dershowitz for his work on the Klaus von Buello trial, and I would know him for other things. Yes. Like not being able to purchase parogis.

Innocently walking around Martha's Vineyard and being judged by haters. The OJ Simpson trial will be a huge part of 1995. Already was a huge part of 1994. It changed America. I can't stress it enough, but I think that 10-hour documentary that was an ESPN 30-for-30, OJ Simpson made in America is like one of the best documentaries I've ever seen. And it's kind of the last word on it to me. Off the top of your head, and I know I'm putting you guys in your place.

Do you remember the first time The Simpsons made a reference to the OJ trial? Oh, we, okay, so this just happened on a recent episode we covered again, Homer Badman. So I feel like the Simpsons was taking a stance. We don't want to do OJ jokes. They're kind of cheap. They're kind of tacky. And then the first one we see is in Bart of Darkens at the beginning of this season, the broadcast season premiere. Bart is looking around Springfield with a telescope and he peeps on Dr. Hibbert and Dr. Hibbert is watching Leno and the punch line, which is clearly an ADR line, is indicating that Leno has just told a no J-Joe.

And then we get a reference to DNA evidence later on in season six or season seven. So they're very light. I think David Merkin and Oakland once I knew this is the J-Leno area. We don't want to tread it. And also we're working nine months ahead of time. We don't know what will happen in this trial. So we have. have to be careful. It's funny when you say that, it reminded me that was in part of darkness. Technically, they did it as soon as they could do a joke about OJ jokes because the murders happened after the season finale of five. And so the season premiere of six is the earliest they could have put it in there. So they technically did do it as soon as they could. I was expecting you to say like a future episode, but no, they get in there through the magic of the Denver Broncos. And I think it was a really vague gesture towards OJ. The J. Leno punchline is, oh, turns out it was his evil.

twin and then Hibbert laughs at that. So you could read that however you want, but given when the episode debuted and given that it's ADR, you can say, okay, Jay Leno telling an OJ joke. And certainly stuff in part two of the Who Shot Mr. Burns gets all the Simpson DNA evidence stuff in there. They really hit the nail on the head in the referring back to it in the 138 episode spectacular. Also worth mentioning the Simpsons, we mentioned this in the Union episode that in season

for they dodged a bullet of not having O.J. Simpson in the show. They wrote he's in the script. They wrote lines for him. It just didn't come together. And they got very lucky it was Dr. Joyce Brothers instead. And she didn't murder anybody. Yes. Thankfully, she never committed a double murder with her own Mike. But that's what happened the week. This episode of the Simpsons aired back in early 1995. And joining us for the first time is Justin DeClew from the important cinema podcast. Welcome to our club, Justin. Hello, thank you for having me. I am a loyal listener, and I'm happy to take a peek behind the curtain. Yeah, you and Will Sloan do some great work, and you have a Patreon with the Important Cinema Club.

I also, as well, I'm aware that you are a comic book aficionado as well. Here's something that you can appreciate this weekend. I got to get my classic copies of Amazing Spider-Man signed by one, Randy Emberlin, the anchor of Mark Bagley, back in the early 90s. Wow. Now, is this somebody that you saw? thought out that you're like, I need the anchor of the Mark Bagley issues. Yes, yes. Mark Bagley, I already had signed those a long time ago. And I was like, well, oh, Randy Emberlin's here.

I got to meet him. And he was a very nice guy who runs a very good business of selling his prints with, I believe, a spouse or partner. A female partner is there with him. I didn't ask the relationship. But she's really running things very well. So he can free up his time to answer nerdy questions by perhaps me about working on certain pages of carnage. Now, I do want to launch into the pros and cons of Eric Larson's work on Spider-Man in the 90s, but I can already feel Bob giving a thousand-yard stare. I'm looking at my emails right now and preparing my taxes. Ooh, it's a hot deal on Amazon today. We're in Prime Days, fellas.

Yes, yes. Well, and also, Justin, your work with Will Sloan is really great. Also, I just saw you on a DVD bonus feature with Toby Jones interviewing him on AJ goes to the dog park, his film. Yeah, that was wild. Toby Jones. I was a fan of his work. because I heard about it, OK-K-O, when you guys did an episode with him. And he just reached out to me out of the blue and said, hey, I have this movie. It's, you know, I just finished it. I like your work on your podcast. Would you be willing to watch it?

And I was like, oh, I know who Toby Jones is. So I watched it. And it was so funny. I like, stopped at 10 minutes in. And I got my wife, Emily. I'm like, Emily, Emily, you got to come and watch this with me. After that, I wrote a letterbox review, wrote back to him and said, thank you very much. If you need any help getting festivals, maybe I know some people.

And he wrote back. being like, you're the first person to watch the movie of someone that I don't know. And I was like, oh, my God. And I'm glad it got plate festivals. It came out on Blu-ray. And I did that interview because Toby was like, hey, man, I really appreciate it. Anything that you want to do for the Blu-ray, I'd be happy to facilitate it. So that's how that came about.

This episode is an episode about, you know, well, to my knowledge, you've only had one child. But it's another childbirth episode. We like to have, as proudly childless men, we like to have guests who have had kids to help us with some insights of these. I mean, I'm going to come guns firing. I have one son. He is almost two years old and he rules. The great thing about having a kid is you can play with some. They're always laughing. They're running around. Like just two days ago, I walked by a house and there was a giant box of Spider-Man toys. If I was coming back with those, my wife would be like, do we need more junk? But I'm like, listen, he can play with this gigantic Spider-Man car that we got you. Like,

yeah, it's fine. So, man, if you like playing with toys and one, watching cartoons, that's what children are for. And have you determined if he's more of a Simpsons kid or a Family Guy kid? You really learn early with them, I've heard. Now, I will say, me and him watch the episode under discussion today while he was kind of sleepy and laying in bed. And he was locked in. So, he may be a Simpson kid.

I'm not 100% sure, but he will definitely see more Simpsons and Family Guy until the world invades. And I have no more control over that. In the second grade, a kid will have come up to you. He'll come back from school and say, Dad, you never told me about Family Guy. My friend, you showed me a TikTok of this. I'm like, oh, you kept Stewie from me for this long?

It got canceled after season three and never came back. Do you guys remember when Family Guy came back? I was so excited. I watched all the DVDs. And I watched the first episode and I was like, hmm, is something wrong with me? Or is something wrong? I'll keep watching.

And I like gave up after 10 after it came back. I was like, it's just not the same. I didn't make it too far into the reboot of Family Guy, which has now been going on for 21 years. Yeah, 21 years. Yeah, we're about to hit its broadcast debut of the return season in our covering of season 16 of The Simpsons. In about two or three months, I think.

Coming up very soon. And yes, this is another flashback episode from The Golden Age. We've covered the births of Bart and Lisa previously. Now we're covering the birth of Maggie. The rock solid timeline is beginning to shift a bit because we're flashing back to a time the Simpsons has already existed. And we should have seen these things. We should have seen the three.

hairs on Homer in season four, but they were nowhere to be found. I think the real difference between this and the previous flashback episodes is we are having a lot more fun with the format and the idea of, oh, there could be unreliable narrators telling this story. And I feel like that is the murkening up of this idea. 100%. Yeah, this is, by, it's surprising that they did three of them before this. And even by the third one, while they are having like more fun with it and no, sorry, it's a fourth because B Sharps, yeah. Even in the last one of those, they are not breaking with the format of like, no, what you see in the past is what happened. It takes Merkins, you know, layful, Loki-like spirit to fuck around with the tropes of sitcoms once more in a flashback episode.

It's also them just paying off the thing they've been waiting on for the longest time. Like, I would guess in season three, or even season two, once they show Bart's birth in season three, they know, well, we got to show the birth of Lisa. and Maggie eventually. We know these episodes will come at some point. Yeah. I think another difference is those previous flashback episodes were dedicated to laser focus references to things from the eras in which they're depicting here. Because we're depicting 1993, we're not doing that at all outside of the things

Homer mentions up front because this episode likely written in spring of 94. So 93, not too far in the rear view. So it would have been a very funny high concept joke to have 1993 nostalgia in early 95, but they're not doing that in this episode. I was really hoping for like, and a middle-aged Joe Piscopo was thrilling audiences of Batman the animated series was his portrayal of Mugsy and Police number two.

That's what he sunk to. It's something Gene and Reese loved so much and did a great job with that to be laser-focused on, here are jokes about 1984, specifically 1984 for an episode. And Merton, not that Merton doesn't like jokes about the past, but that kind of specificity, that's not what he's into as much as like just fucking with the audience. He loves

doing that much more than saying, here's a Rubik's Cube. Those were stupid. This is quite a big episode of two new folks getting their first credits on the show. That's right. We have a writer's corner and a director's corner for both Jennifer Crittenden and Switten O'Scott the third.

I will sit silently while you guys go over that. So we have two corners to explore this week. Let's first talk about Jennifer Crittenden. So notably, the first woman to be hired as a full-time writer on The Simpsons six years in. So she started at the beginning of production season six and stayed until about midway through production season eight.

But weirdly enough, she never got a producer credit. Can we blame sexism? I don't know, but I find that odd. I mean, it could also be ageism, too. She was quite young. Yes. Or perhaps it just leveled up the sexism towards her. Like, well, you're also pretty young.

So not only are you a woman, but this is your first real credit. You should be happy you even get to be in the room, lady. Maybe if you're 26, you can be a producer, but you're 24 or something like that. So notably, okay, notably she's a woman, number one. That makes her stand out in the writer's room. Also, not a Harvard grad. She went to Wesleyan University, which is a private college in Connecticut. So she's out of the Ivy League, I think, although still going to a private university,

which kind of ties to the other Ivy leagues. I have met in my career back at the gaming website. I met a couple Wesleyan people, and one was nice, one was not nice, but they both had their own high opinion of themselves as Wesleyan graduates. So there's some level of pride there. Yeah, I'm looking it up now, not in the Ivy League, although I'm sure there are still some vines growing up and down those walls. So yes, a woman, not from Harvard, and also very, very young. We don't know her birth date. We're still investigating this. We've got detectives on the case. But she likely joined the Simpsons when she was 24. So at the time, she was part of a young

writer's program at Fox, and someone was impressed enough by her to set up a meeting with Merkin. Merkin was impressed, and she was so professional and mature that Merkin assumed she was at least 30 years old. But before this, her only TV writing experience was being an intern on Letterman. So this is it. This is where it all starts for the very young Jennifer Crittenden. Yeah, Merkin pats himself on the back a little bit on the commentary, rightfully so that he hired the first woman to be on staff on the Boys Club that is the Simpsons. I do wonder Jennifer Critton, her skill and is obvious, and I do believe she is. earned her position just through being just a great writer at a young age and instantly taking to sitcom writing. I wonder as a comedy writer, like she is in two places. Simpson's known for

being a bit of a boys club then. And David Letterman has since apologized for how he treated female employees in the past. So I hope she had good experiences there. Yes. Well, we know someone who worked for David Letterman and it turns out that you don't really get to see him very much. So maybe she was out of his orbit. Who knows? Because there aren't a lot of Jennifer Crittenden interviews out there. We'll get to that later, though. So I do want to underline here to remind everybody, The Simpsons used to hire young writers,

and I think they're getting better about it now, but this was a prime era for people in their 20s to be writing for The Simpsons, which sounds crazy now, because now we're making a big deal about movies like obsession in the backrooms. Can you believe somebody in their 20s did this? Well, it used to happen all the time,

and now it's not really happening anymore. like Steven Spielberg got started in his early 20s. It used to be a common occurrence. Like our careers started in our 20s, our writing careers. So like this used to be more of a commonplace thing. So they were hiring younger people back then and letting people show run the Simpsons before they turned 30, like Oakley and Weinstein. It was crazy in retrospect.

And I was looking at, not to be ages, just trying to draw a comparison. The oldest current Simpsons writer is 68. So there is somebody who was born in the 50s as a current writer of the Simpsons who just wrote an episode that went live recently. No offense to that gentleman. It does great work. But it shows you that in 1995, there was someone who was 24, and in 2026, there was someone who was 68 writing for the show.

And it's my experience that you do get less funny over time. Thank you for staying with us. Yes. Yes, thank you. We're the outliers, of course, in that. We've joked about it before, that the current writers, when they hire a new writer on The Simpsons, who's like a promising funny person that you or I might recognize

from either stand-up or social media or, writing for other television shows, the new people they bring in are still likely in their mid-30s, if not older. Like, that's the young writers a lot of the times they hire. Like, I think it's still pretty rare that even a freelance writer on a Simpsons episode is 29, even. Yeah, it's very, very rare. But they trusted younger people back then. Maybe it is people like David Merkin having more of an open mind. I'm sure he had a lot to do with Oakley and Weinstein running the show.

So I feel like we can credit David Merkin for bringing a lot of young. blood into the Simpsons. Merkin has, and it's underrated, Merkin has an incredible eye for talent. The people he would hire and cherry pick, not just the Simpsons, but also on Get a Life, and the other shows he was staffed on. These are big-name people that he,

some of them, it wasn't like their first job, but when he gets Bob Odenkirk and Charlie Kaufman, he knows they're worth getting on Get a Life, for instance. And I'd say, Crington Den is an example of that, too, that he has a very good batting average for choosing new talent on his shows. Oh yeah, absolutely. And in total, she wrote five episodes of the show. They are all bangers.

And also notably, while on the show, she met and married fellow Simpsons writer Jace Richdale, although they were only married between 1995 and 1998. And I will say, as far as I know, there are no interviews with Crittenden about The Simpsons, about her work with the show. And I don't want to speculate here, but I'll do it anyways. She might have not had a great time on the show as the only young female writer in the room full of rowdy men and the fact that she had a marriage that broke up that started with The Simpsons. Maybe that is another reason why I don't like to talk about the show is what she would say. So I would love to talk to her.

I'm sure she wouldn't want to talk to us, but I really would like to know what she thinks about the show and her time on it in the episode she wrote. Because is she on commentaries ever. Man, I don't think she is on her later ones because I remember on the PTA disbands, Merkin jokes about how he named it that as a way to kind of goof on how dramatic she thought it was. And so she's not present for that either. On this commentary, he's like, well, she wanted to be here, but she was very busy with a pilot script, which either will become a popular show or it didn't become a show at all, and you know that she missed this for nothing, which was a funny joke.

And Merkin was right, the show did not become a show. Yeah, we don't know what that is. And if you're thinking, well, what did she contribute to this show? I know our episodes are great, but how is she as a writer? Where where she goes next really explains just how great of a writer she is, because she goes from The Simpsons to Seinfeld immediately. Like Seinfeld in its final year, she jumps on and she writes, I believe six episodes of that show across the final two seasons.

So this resume is amazing. You start on The Simpsons and then you go to Seinfeld. I feel like you can just quit after that. You're like, okay, well, the 90s are done and so am I. Where can I go from here? How can life get better? The only example I can think of somebody else doing that it's in the reverse order. And that's Tom Gamble and Max Pross were Seinfeld writers who then eventually came to Simpsons.

But they were desired as writers in season one. They just were unavailable. And they wrote for Seinfeld. But to be that young and go over to Seinfeld at that age from Simpsons is your only job, even if it's late Seinfeld, the show was great to the last episode. And that is incredible. Like I just remember Sam Simon on his WTF, he kind of, he made a. sideways comment about the Simpsons

of like implying that the Simpsons was not a great place that fostered talent that well because he's like what writers created anything else other than the Simpsons. It just makes you a good Simpsons writer. And already just talking about her future career just starting with going off to Seinfeld,

it's like, well that proves a lie to that right there as Simon's observation. I wonder if Sam Simon made these comments before the rise of Greg Daniels. That is also true, yeah. So she has a lot of really good credits and I'll go over where she went after Seinfeld. Just a few stops. Shows that we would know, shows I want to call

out here. But again, just check out her IMDB or her Wikipedia or whatever you want to check out to see the extent of what she's written because she started very young. She's still doing it now and she's worked on so much stuff over the past 30 years. So other notable shows she's written for include the Drew Carey show. Everybody Loves Raymond. Arrested

Development. The New Adventures of Old Christine, Veep, and only murders in the building where she was an executive producer at some point. And she also recently created the short-lived animated sitcom House Broken, which received two seasons and 30 episodes. Unfortunately, that show has been canceled. But that is the one show she was able to create like 25 years after she's writing for The Simpsons.

That was the one that like, I think this has come up before when we've looked into it. But it's what Mark Kirkland left The Simpsons for was to be supervising director on House Broken. Like he's the supervising director of the two seasons of it. The longest running Simpsons director of the most episodes left so he could supervise, the House Broken series. Yeah, and I have not seen it, although I know Friends of the show have written for it. It's got a lot of great people attached to it. Unfortunately, it is just one of many new animated shows that don't get a lot of promotion, but at least it was able to go on for two seasons. Yeah, Scott Garner, when we last had him on the show, was very

complimentary about his time on it and enjoyed working under Crittendenden. I was trying to find, I'm sorry, I keep struggling with her name. I couldn't find my old file of it from Mike Rees's book. But when she worked on Seinfeld, I think I remember in Reese's memoir, Springfield Confidential, that he cited her as the person who tried to pitch Kramer's stories with things she knew that John Swartzwelder did and that the Seinfeld writers rejected them or they're like, that's too crazy.

And she's like, the Schwarzenelder did them. I don't want to say definitively that's what happened, but that sounds familiar to me. Okay, yeah. One of just her many great things she did. But yeah, the House Broken Show, someday I'll at least watch Scott Garner's episode. I need to.

There is too much adult animation right now. And it's a good problem, but it's a lot to keep track of. Yeah, I just remember, like, I would see her name would stand out to me when these episodes were going live because, oh, a woman, okay, this is new. And then I would see it in Seinfeld thinking, like, oh, that's a Simpsons writer I like. And then I'd see it on a rest of the development, like, oh, cool, I'm glad she ended up here. And then I kind of lost track of her, but she's had a really great track record. And again, nothing on record about The Simpsons, as far as I know, that indicates she doesn't really want to talk about it. I feel like people would have asked her about it by now.

Somebody would have reached out, but maybe it didn't happen. I'm just saying, I'd like to have that opportunity. I don't know if she'd like to grant us that opportunity. We've talked to so many writers over the past decade-plus of our show. And she's one we've not been able to talk to or reach out to. So hopefully in the future one day, either we or someone else can talk to her about what it was like to be a very young woman in arguably the funniest writer's room that ever existed in this period specifically. I would love to hear what stories she has to tell. And, you know, she's in a powerful position now.

Maybe she has some stories that aren't so happy, but I would also feel like they're worth the world knowing, too. She wanted to share them. And other women like Mimi Pond and Susie Deeter, we've talked to them and they have told us the not-so-sunny side of working on The Simpsons. So those stories were great. I'm glad we were an outlet for those stories. I always appreciate it when they share those with us and they feel comfortable in sharing them and not pressured or treated. I would like to think that we could offer a similar platform to her if she wanted that at some point. So the Crittenden Corner has been fully explored.

Now let's move on to corner number two. Let's shift our perspectives a bit because it's a director's corner for Swinton O. Scott the Third, a real fancy pants name that I love. So Swinton direct seven episodes total up through season 10. And he was actually there at the beginning of production season one, episode one, some enchanted evening as a layout artist. And apparently he was also David Silverman's assistant director at that time. So he gets in on The Simpsons very early, but then he gets in.

it's an opportunity to go to Tiny Tune Adventures and he leaves. So there's a little side quest to Tiny Tunes. Yeah, it's funny how Silverman kind of prompts him into the story of when Scott is trying to be nice on the commentary about it. And based on the timeline that you and I know as also Tiny Tune viewers, regular Tiny Tunesian viewers, if he leaves in season three of Simpsons to go to Tiny Tunes, then this is late Tiny Tunes with much smaller orders.

This is not the original 65, right? Based on the credits I found, he leaves after season one of the Simpsons. So presumably he's probably working on the second order of Tiny Tune Adventures episodes. Yeah. But his Silverman prompts him into saying it. It's like that he offered him Scott a chance to come back as his AD, his assistant director. Scott turned it down.

And then when they were being handed like busy work, walk cycles to do for unnamed projects, that's when he's like, I got to get the fuck out of here. To clarify, he was the AD for David Silverman. And then the chance came to hire an experienced director. and he was invited onto The Simpsons. But yes, he was working on Tiny Toon Adventures. He got to do layout work and a few other things, but he found himself doing very boring development work.

Like, okay, here's a new character. Figure out their walk cycle so other animators can follow it. And he thought, I didn't come here to do development work. I came here to draw Looney Tunes and you're not letting me do it. So he jumps back to The Simpsons. And in that time period, in that limbo time period, he was actually doing a lot of work on a lot of 90 shows like Darkwing Duck, Goof Troop, and Batman, the animated series.

So he is spreading himself, pretty thin while also working on Tiny Tune Adventures. So he's in like Kitty Cartoonland for a while. And to be fair, working on some really great stuff until he is summoned back to work on The Simpsons. And I was looking at his directing credits. And it seems that based on the timeline I'm looking at, while on the Simpsons, he was also directing episodes of Bobby's World and Sea Bear and Jamal, both film Roman productions. So he was just in the film Roman building. So like David Silverman probably had just to go to a different room and find like, can anyone direct it? How about you? Yes, it's funny that a lot of people, if you were just a film Roman employee, if you had the time, you could get assigned another job if you had the skill and the availability. And as we've heard in other previous times talking with Simpsons artists, you know, it is not exactly a full time of year job sometimes working on the Simpsons like production ebbs and flows on episodes. And if you don't have an assigned episode, your contract might not be paying you something if you're not working on an assigned episode. So when you've got an opening in your schedule, maybe you do work on C Bear and Jamal.

It's what's open to you and you can't be choosy when it's time to pay rent. Yeah, it's just whatever's happening at the Film Roman Factory. You can just jump on the assembly line and get to work. So yes, his history and animation goes back to 1984. He's been doing this for a very long time. And like many talented folks on The Simpsons, he was headhunted by Futurama. And he directs four episodes during the Fox Run of that show before he goes on to be series director on What's New Scooby-Doo, which is the first. new Scooby-Doo series after a pup named Scooby-Doo.

So they waited a very long time, like I think 13 to 15 years to make another new Scooby-Doo show. Yeah, if it hadn't been for the live-action film, they probably wouldn't have brought it back. Listen to our Scooby-Doo on Zombie Island episode to hear about the weird 90s for Scooby-Doo that it was like reborn as a slightly more adult direct-to-video franchise. but then the Scooby movie did so well that they decided like, no, we're going kids regular daytime with it. And yeah, as far as Scott going to Futurama, we've talked about it before, there was a bit of a brain drain, talent drain on Simpsons,

first with King of the Hill because Wes Archer leaves and he knows who great directors are on Simpsons. He hires who he can on there. And Rich Moore had been gone from the Simpsons for a while, but when he becomes Superizing Director on Futurama, he knows also he's got his own Roll at X-Dex too. So Simpsons are losing talented people as the

animation world is growing by the end of the decade in the 90s. And we already had a writer's corner so I don't want to go on too long about Swinton O'Scott the 3rd. Please check out as like IMDB and his biography is elsewhere. But we'll say he's still working after more than 40 years of animation. His most recent credit is as an

animation timer on the Great North that show. So he's still doing it. And I say Switten, good on you. Animation is tough and you've just been doing everything. for the past four decades. Yeah, it's impressive how many. I gave a little scan of his IMDB, so many timer jobs,

more timer jobs than just directing gigs. And I think it seems to me from previous research we've done, like animation timer is such a specialized skill that more seasoned veterans, I think, are counted on for that these days. And you end up with that, even if you don't get to be the lead

to director on the project or you're not seeking it out, that if you know how to time animation well, you're in a select class and you can get like dozens of jobs a year on episodes or direct to video movies being an animation at timer and with these two corners fully explored

let's go back to our discussion of and Maggie makes three and this is quite a great first episode for both of them that has a lot of great animation moments it's fun to hear them on the commentary it's also funny they date to the commentary as wow this episode's 10 years old

so meaning that the commentary is 20, 21 years old now. Yes. I was surprised that they mentioned that Swinnell Scott the third is really good with action because I don't associate him as one of those guys.

Like we've covered in our corner for him, he's just kind of done everything and at this point it's been an animation for 40 years. He's done every kind of show. Definitely has a lot of super credits in his work. And then this episode opens with some really great action just to show you like,

oh yeah, he is pretty good at action. And then other than some gunplay later, it's light on action. And in case you're wondering the title in Maggie Makes Three as reference to and Baby Makes Three, which is a lyric in the 1927 song My Blue Heaven. Later on, that would become the title of a 1949 movie and Baby Makes Three. So if you look up that title online, there are about 10,000 books about child rearing with that name. It's a perfect name for a book about you've got a baby now, like Baby Makes Three. And we can't forget My Blue Heaven, the 1990 film that is the sequel to Goodfellas, starring Steve Martin and Rick Moranis. Yeah. I saw this. I saw this. that, I don't know, five or six years ago, all I recall is Steve Martin saying, Arugula. That's it. You know, despite being a person who will watch Goodfellas in its entirety if I ever came across

it on TNT or has watched it eight million times, I have still never seen all of my blue heaven. Like, I've never put the, it just seems so ridiculous as conceptually to me. It's merely okay, is what I'll say. But if you want to see like a spiritual sequel to Goodfellas, well, then that's it. But no one gets shot in the face. Oh, that's too bad. Speaking a shot in the face, we see Homer shoot someone in our couch gag here. They do the classic James Bond barrel of a gun thing.

As a kid, I did not realize that was like a barrel of a gun, and that implies that James Bond is shooting somebody defensively because you're seeing that he's at a gun pointed on him the whole time. Yeah. It took me a while to figure that out too. And at this point in history, we were on a bond break. This is the year of Golden Eye, if I'm not mistaken. At the end of the year, right?

Yeah. Were there any openings that when you guys would see them, you get excited. Because I remember as a kid, like, locking into, oh, these openings repeat. What does it mean not knowing that it's like, Al Jean's show was a little short, so they need to stretch it out when you get that circus one. I like the ones that were a little high concept. And now the high concept couch gags are three to five minutes long, it feels like,

and I'm very tired of them because they're all designed to go viral. But I liked when they would include guest characters, like the Flintstones or something like that. Or they would be like violent or strange or play with a new animation style. Like the MCSher one is really cool. I think that's from this season. Yeah, the eventful ones I always like to. But to see them a second time or in reruns,

I did like the circus one. It felt like an event before I knew that it was a sign of a lot of things were cut or it was under animated. And same with also in my crazy brain, I would get bothered in the 90s if I knew watching a rerun in syndication that they changed the couch gag for whatever reason. Now I know would they do that? I didn't even know. It was part of the list of things that were.

change for syndication to make more space for the ads just again for timing. That would also make me angry, unnaturally so, to know like, I know this is different. They changed it. Bob, you've recently just played the I.O. Interactive James Bond game. Does they do the barrel of the gun thing and that? You know what? I don't remember. Maybe they do it once because I think they're contractually obligated to do it at least once. But yeah, it's a very different kind of bond because it's baby bond. I've seen people call it James Bond Jr. without recognizing the fact that canonically, James Bond Jr. is the nephew of James Bond. He is not young James Bond in that. It's in the song, he learned the game from his uncle James. Come on. Do we not have the song

memorize? What's going on with this world? Now, I am certain that uncle is like just means that he was born out of wedlock. Oh, so James Bond is his father. That's an octopusy bastard is what I want to say. The episode begins with one of the best TV parodies I think they ever did. I just love this so much is we come in on the exciting adventures of one talking seafaring vehicle. We now return to nightboat, the crime-solving boat. Faster nightboat,

we've got to catch those starfish poachers. You don't have to yell, Michael, I'm all around you. Oh, no, the headed for land. We'll never catch them now. Incorrect. Look, a canal. Oh, nightboat, go! Oh, every week there's a canal.

Or an inlet. Or a fjord. Quiet! I will not hear another word against The boat. Okay, TV off. It's family time. Oh, but Mars, nightboat.

The crime-solving boat. Homer, you promised. One night of family time a week. Besides, that back-talking boat sets a bad example. Says you, woman. My mom. This is the first time it's dawned on me that this is a mix of Night Rider and Baywatch. I mean, Nightboat is Kitts, and they're doing a parody of the Night Rider song.

But obviously, we are deep in Baywatch being the number one syndicated show. on television. And of course, that's why David Hasselhoff in this is shirtless and on the beach or on a fjord, perhaps. And I recently been watching or half watching a lot of Baywatch on Pluto. And like Star Trek The Next Generation, it has all been remastered from the original film element. So it looks amazing. I have heard that, yes, that it's gorgeous HD. They have to replace some music here and there. But, I mean, for such a trashy show that they took the care to film all of it like high definition film, all the beautiful bodies on the beach. That's an impressive level of quality to me.

Yeah. And eventually you'll be able to move on to the racier Baywatch nights. I don't know if that's been preserved. I mean, Baywatch, I watch a lot of it. It served its purpose. It's fine that it was restored. But it's funny that Baywatch and TNG are restored. Meanwhile, Deep Space Nine looks like someone kept the film in their mouth.

And that's what they're putting on Paramount Plus. Well, I mean, the story goes with all those Star Trek shows, is that like, they finished them on video. They did all the visual effects on video. So they'd have to like redo all those effects again. And maybe Baywatch doesn't have that much computer-generated effects to do that. There's less portals in space battles. But hey, they did it for TNG.

I'm just saying, Voyager and Deep Space Center look like shit. It sucks. And all I ever see are headlines that are like, oh, Voyager and Deep Space Nine, they're the hottest old show on streaming right now. So why not invest in it? Obviously, the Ellisons are not going to invest in that. They're too busy doing the Lenny Reefinstall stuff that they've been doing lately. That's what's important.

They'll run it through an AI filter. get like hideous deformed faces every 10 seconds. Oh man, what will an AI feature even think of a Cardassians or a Bajoran's face markings? Hmm. It'll just smooth them all out. Nightboat, I also love how Castleneta doing the Hasselhoff type guy is a bad actor. Like, is there any like nostalgia for Knight Rider? Culturally, we all know it exists, but it wasn't in syndication when I was a kid.

I always found it very boring. Friends in college got a kick out of. of the it for kitch value but i tried watching as a kid and i wasn't really into it what the opinion was on it in 1995 i think at that point it had been off the air for like probably since the 80s and it seemed to have just kitsch value as a reference like as opposed to say i think you could watch if you didn't grow up watching either if you watch the brady bunch i do think there is some fun intuitive just like oh this is so like can't be and silly that you can have fun watching it but knight writer also probably it's hour long format i think makes it just

take forever. And nobody, and they even did multiple, at least one TV reboot of it. Nobody cared. It was a one season thing. 2008, 2009. I mean, I was grabbing the remote to watch Matlock and McGiver. But like Nightboat, I was like, too silly for me as a teenager. This will shock everyone. There was a Knight Rider reboot in 2008. Did not last long. And I really love this parody because it recognizes the flaw of Night Rider and that every problem needs to be solved by driving. Here, we have an even more limited premise. Every problem should be solved by some sort of watch. And there's always a solution for a nightboat.

And I feel like we have internalized this. There's always a fjord into stories about premises with like limited kinds of executions or premises that always stick to the same kinds of stories. And on Baywatch, they definitely had to part of the fun of going back over Baywatch is seeing how they had to come up with every story has to somehow tie back to the beach or being in the ocean or something. Like starfish poachers in this too. It also can't be just drugs because that's like too dirty for the show or like too risque. Starfish posters are basically a Scooby-Doo style villain there. Sunday, Homer gets the most shocking news of his life. Merge is pregnant?

On a brand new Simpson, Sunday at 8-7 Central. Hey, it's Henry Gilbert here, imagining items I'd like to buy. And a big thank you to our guests this week, the long, to first time appearance of Justin DeClew from the Important Cinema Club podcast and the very fine comic book podcast. We had such fun talking with Justin about his Simpsons love and also how this

even compared to his own fatherhood foibles. A big thank you again to Justin for being on here. Check out all of his cool stuff. Links in the description for this podcast. Thanks so much again, Justin. Love to have you back. And if you enjoy the Talking Simpsons podcast, you should know that me and Bob are only doing this

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Talking Simpson. I told my wife how long Baywatch went on and she was like, how do they have this many problems on the beach? And I told her, well, there's romance. There's all of these side plots. And then one of the most recent ones I had on, there was a ballroom dancing competition. That's where Baywifax. watching it up sometimes. Well, I mean, just look at all the shows that are on now, like all those naval drama mystery shows, and there's like multiple of them that play every week. Yeah.

Well, you look at regular network television right now. Every show is some sort of cop show. Even the comedies, like, I keep up with the cast of community, and I go, like, what are they doing these days? And, like, the Danny Pouty is on like a military comedy show. Like, oh, all the jokes on the base and its army people, it's like, fuck me, man. If I want to see Danny Pooty in a news show, I have to watch, like, pure propaganda for the American military. That's our version of Beatle Bailey.

Yeah. All he has to say to you, Henry, is, what is it? He's like, I'm on duck tails. I'm on duck tails. Yes, I know. He's got bills to pay. It is great that the kids know Nightboat is a bad show with limited possibilities, but Homer just says, go Nightboat, go. He's excited.

Yes, yes, I know. And he's so mad that the kids are poking holes in the show he loves so much. Also that Bart, they get to do a meta joke of Marge hates the back talking boat as a bad role model. The thing people said about Bart in Bart Mania. And it's Bart who says, who talks back to the mom being a bad role model for children watching still. I was one of those kids. Love the Simpsons. I had Bart Mania and so excited for the Halloween episode that was going to play.

Like counting down the day, scratching them on my calendar. it starts up, Marge Simpson comes out and warns the parents. And my mom was like, nope, TV's off. And I was like, no. And I became a non-Simpson household until the magics of divorce allowed me to watch it at my dad's house. Wonderful. Oh, that's the important. That's great.

Wow, that the warning. It actually worked. Yeah, I feel like that's the first one we've heard in these stories. Like you were either parents banned it from the beginning and you snuck it in or they just let you watch it. But the taking away of it from the warning and it's. sticking like that feels new to me. Have we heard anybody else with that? I don't think so.

Well, yeah. I didn't need the show. I had my pogs to look at and imagine the adventures that they'd be going on. What if they're all round discs, these characters? This one-hour family time seems like a, you know, a fun idea to commit to, but even Marge is bored by it once it's instituted. There's so many great drawings of this. Whitten Scott and his team did such a great job, just them all sitting bored at the couch.

and then the sound of the egg timer speeding up, Homer is caught with it in his hands, and he still says, it was Bart. Yeah. Hey, it's 1995, and we are still concerned about screen time. Yes, yeah. And me and you just watched it, even did a quick reaction thing to screen time the movie,

Toy Story 5. It turns out screen time is fine as long as you're on Disney Plus. Yeah. As someone was a young kid, we do try to keep him away from screen time, but I hear people who say stuff like, yeah, my kid hasn't had more than two hours of screens until he was eight.

And I was like, boy, that kid is not going to be okay, I don't think. I do wonder as an uninterested party in this, it's like, well, is your kid failing to catch out? Are they going to be left behind in the future of everything is sending emails and tapping screens for children? I mean, it's just like a media literacy thing too. My mom knew all those grade school summers I spent watching the Andy Griffith show. I would have nothing to talk about come fall if I did not watch those episodes. So, yeah, I'd be like, did you see the new matlock?

And by that, I mean the one in syndication. They then turn to the photo albums, which is a cute idea of Lisa's. And I mean, now in this situation, do you just pull up your photo rolls on your phone and scroll back through it? Or is photography that cheap now that nobody even, like, bothers with a family album? Well, for my son, we have a shared family album on Google that currently has 2,200 photos, I think. But my wife likes to print them out and put them in an album. So you can like flip through them. So it still happens.

Yeah, I think most people have a gallery on some social media site. Perhaps there is still a photo book out there. How much do you take photos of your child dozing or getting a visit from the Sandman? Oh, all the time. And because he looks the cutest that way. Even though that we don't post photos of his face online, but man, if you want to see the back of his head, I got it all over my social media feeds. Sorry, earlier I said photo book. I meant to say photo bucket.

That's how obscure that website is. I'm sure some form of it still exists. Now, as they're going through the beginning of this, there's that photo of Bart riding the cat. And I was like, have I seen this in a promotional image somewhere? Does it remind me of something? That made me go back and flip through the Simpsons uncensored album from 1991. I'm sure you guys are familiar with this. Yes.

Justin, is that drawing of a photo on the back cover or something like that? Right now, Henry is searching through his many possessions. and it's not coming up. Yeah, I flip through it on archive.org. And what I loved about it was, if people don't know this, it was like a promotional thing that they put out. You know what? It must just be Bart naked on the front,

on the bearskin rug, made me think of that image. I am holding it up right now, the listeners, for the guys to see. What's great about that book is that, like, it's filled with stuff that's not canonical, just like story after story after story. There's even a family tree in the book.

Where Homer is related to, Mr. Burns. Yeah, you get the Simpson and the Bouvier family tree and it also just, it always bugged me that's right there on the page. We've said it a million times before, but it's Penelope Olson on the page. That's the mom's name

of Homer, and it bugs me that it's not that anymore. Well, they include a reference to that in Mother Simpson. That's one of her aliases, right? Yes, I do appreciate that, and that's the only difference you get of having Bill and Josh doing it, that they at least recognized it to that extent. Well, importantly, that is Snowball 1, which is why it is a white cat. Yeah. And I will say, too, reading

that book, I'm like, I love these images. Hmm, Bill Morrison. Did you have something to do with that? In the tiniest fine print on the back of the book, it's creative team and like Bill Morrison is third credited. And I'm sure he probably did most of the drawings in that. I would bet so. When they reprinted that book, they changed the cover from Naked Bart to Homer. And I guess they thought, well, you probably don't want to buy a cover with a naked boy on it. I think that was before the Simpsons movie, when we were crazy about Bart's penis. Summer of 2007. We all had her little boy penis posters

all over our rooms. Man, you cannot search Bart naked on cat without just images from the Simpson movie showing up and tattoos that people have. I also like that it's Snowball the first there because it's canonical in the show that Snowball died at some point in Maggie's first year, though you should be seeing Snowball then in this flashback

because to get super granular Marge's Christmas newsletter in the first aired episode is giving people the update that they just got Snowball 2 and that Snowball 1 went to Kitty Heaven. So that would imply that Snowball was alive when Maggie was born. Just imagine that Snowball is off screen in any of the flashback scenes in the house. Also, I know one of Bob's favorites is I skipped over to get to the baby pictures bit, but the photo of the TV is so good. Yes, I mean, it is revealing a certain kind of sickness. But also it's kind of, the Simpsons predicted it, but I feel like we would love a photo

if it looked like we had two phones. Do you guys have like memories of a childhood television? Like that was the TV that I watched everything on as a kid? I definitely remember the main big TV, which was like a 32-inch one that was in the living room, not just because we watched it the most, but because it was where we played the most

four-player video games with friends, including Golden Eye, the aforementioned Golden Eye. Play that long. Yeah. I mean, for us, I guess my family was against family. time, which is why the kids would often get the hand-me-down TVs from like relatives or they would buy a new TV. We get the old one. So I was a TV in the room boy. And you didn't see much of me. And I think they would like that. We had one in the main room. And my memories is one of the old ones that still had the clicker on it that you could like click to the main like channels. And also the static

coming off of it, which would always shock me when I would play like duck hunt and you put the gun right up to the screen so you can make sure that you hit the ducks. And so this is where they realize that out of all the fun photos they have, there's one character missing in the group. Here's Bart sleeping. Here he is dozing. Here he is after a visit from the Sandman. Here's nabby time, Bart. Here's a cute one. He's all tuckered out. Why aren't there any pictures of Maggie? Well, I'm glad you asked. It's actually a very interesting story. It all began about two years ago before Maggie was even... even bored. Bart, you were Lisa's age, and Lisa, you were the age Bart was several years ago.

Get the camera ready, Bart, very sleepy. Listen carefully, and my words will shape images as clear as any TV show. It was a tumultuous time for a nation. The clear beverage craze gave us all a reason to live. The information superhighways showed the average person with some nerd thinks about Star Trek, and the domestication of the dog continued unabated. So I guess we only get really get two 1993 hallmarks, and then they're pretty vague. We did cover Crystal Pepsi back in Marge on the Lamb. Yeah, that's the thing. Invisible Colo was already a joke in the Merkin Years.

And one of the first written episodes, they already joked about it. But it's because Maggie is forever almost two, between one and two and can never age. It really screws them when they have other babies born in the show who do age, and then Maggie stays the same. I can just imagine the hell of my parents taking me aside and being like, like, let me tell you a story from two years ago. And I was like, I was conscious. Why are you telling me this? That's, I guess, why they're so bored as well.

Bart and Lisa, like, I know this. I mean, I guess they realize, well, Bart and Lisa are only two years younger. And according to the director, their models are slightly different in ways that are really imperceptible to me. But Lisa still acts hyper-intelligent despite being six. And Bart remains 10-year-old Bart, even though he's eight. Silverman, the commentary, he's like,

hey, wait, you did redesign these a little, didn't you? And Scott's like, oh, you notice. Only here are David Silverman, the man who designed or helped to design them, do you notice this is a little slightly different? Maybe Bart's like smile line is one tenth smaller than it normally is or something. He could be missing a spike. His ninth spike came in when he was nine. I guess maybe Bart gains a spike every year.

He's forever 10, so his 10th spike is about the bus through. We'll never see it. And yes, the question is, where are these Maggie photos? Now, I never caught this as a kid. never questioned that Homer doesn't love Maggie. I know he loves Maggie. But this set above, like, oh, this explains like, well, Homer hates Maggie. And that's why he doesn't have pictures. Like that, from the jump here, they want you to expect is the answer. I think this, so far the show has had recurring jokes about Homer forgetting Maggie exists. And there's even

one in this one. So I feel like that is a springboard for this story. Like, oh, Homer actually loves Maggie in ways you don't know. And he's just stupid, I guess. And we begin the flashback with Homer, a bunch of all-star terrorists, sorry, all-star team of freelance terrorists, meaning they have no belief system or anything, just like the villains in Die Hard. And they're even, the voice on the radio is doing an impersonation of Alan Rickman. And this was a hot time for Die Hard on a blank because like Under Siege had just come out. And I think Speed was 94, right? Yes.

Speed, I think 94-95. It's incredible because first act of speed. is a diehard scenario. Second active speed is the bus. Third active speed is it's the bus, but now it's a train. So speed gives you like three action movies. It's really great. I mean, in 1995, we had Under Siege 2 dark territory.

That's right. Then it's die hard on like a submarine instead of just a boat. It's actually a train. Oh, it's a train. That's right. It was a train. Apologies. So diehard was already pretty hot again at that time.

And Homer's not on my shift. It's a great little line there, as is. when he says his one-liners after a bunch of action of killing people, everybody laughs at them. Like, it's a great joke. I love Mr. Burns laughing too. He's like, Yeah, Mr. Burns, Lenny and Carl tied up.

They laugh at his joke. Homer tries to make this plausible by saying, Simpson's 10, terrorist eight, meaning the terrorist killed eight people. So Homer is not an indestructible killing machine. He still lets some people slip through his fingers, but still. Casualties happen is what Homer's saying. Like, you ought to accept it.

He saved most of everybody. Let's say everybody else that was held captive is dead except for Lenny, Carl, and Mr. Burns. But this is where Homer is told. He has to tell the story right. And we then match cut to, instead of him doing Tai Chi, he's actually airing out his underarms, which smell impossibly bad.

We're back to Homer being the smelliest man in the world. I mean, this is a throwback to Lisa's first words when they're at the, is it the Lard Factory or something like that? Yeah, rendering plan or something? Yeah. Matt Groening, not a big fan of that. that one where he's like, wait, he's the smelliest man in the world now? He smells worse than melted hog fat.

I remember the line, a healthy man shouldn't make that kind of a smell, but I forgot how it's preceded by a lot of coughing and gagging and they're holding handkerchiefs over their face. So this is the smelliest Homer has ever been. This is where Homer gets his payday and he says he's completely out of debt, which would seem to imply his mortgage has been paid off by this as well. This is rough to watch. Homer is, has he been aged up to 39 yet at this point?

I guess in this, he's 36 in this era. Yeah, right. And so in this flashback, I guess he'd be 34. Man, to be 34 and go, all my debts are paid off. It's like, what a fantasy world. I think I have like a 30-year mortgage that started just a few years ago. So let's see if I make it. Homer has paid his mortgage in eight years.

He says, that's for employing me for eight years. So yes, he's paid it off in eight years. Grandpa Simpson paid for a lot of the house, too, though. That is true. Yes. He sold off his house for the down payment. So you know what there. I guess, let's say,

Well, what? And a house back then was probably like $100,000 tops the size of their home. My parent, I mean, we don't have a luxurious Simpsons house, but like in 1991, I think our house is under $50,000. Oh, boy. I was being too high there on the estimation of a house bought in 1984, the Simpsons house. Or that's where they moved in ahead of Lisa's birth. It was probably like $30,000 because you're living in Springfield. Yes, that's true. So, you know what, then taking that way, him being able to pay that off in a, ears with his power plant job. I can believe it. And now Homer after we peruse his many plans for

Dick Clark, we see that Homer is out of debt and he's ready to quit. And he has plans for Lenny and Carl that he accidentally let slip to them. He doesn't say he didn't mean it. He just said it slipped out. He is going to fix them good someday. And this is now when Homer can finally tell off Mr. Burns. Did you hear me? I said I quit, Monty. And since I quit, I can do anything. I want. Is that Sue? Ooh, lovely desk. It would be too bad if someone, oh, I don't know, didn't use a coaster!

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Such a nice tiny office. Maybe it's time you started living like a pig! Oh, I hope I haven't upset you. Bongo head! I should be resisting this, but I'm paralyzed with rage and island rhythms. Lost his head like a bago, Holba. He's getting a pretty good sound out of that guy.

That's for employing me for eight years. Man, employed for eight years. What a fantasy. Yeah, we are living in 1995, and ultimately Homer's punishment is job stability at the very end. It's not a great job. It's the era of the end of history, all that stuff, the same stories being told in Fight Club and American Beauty or The Matrix, all the 1999 films,

that you're trapped in a job that is unfulfilling, but it's stable. That Homer, I mean, man, the quitting, I mean, this feels we're farther out from it, but nine years out, me and Bob told off our bongo head. Bob led the charge on it, but it felt so good to tell off our bongo head and burn that bridge behind us. To his face? Unfortunately, he was via, I think, Zoom or something because, man, this is getting into the weeds here. But it was a boss that joined our company and then like 25% of the company was laid off worldwide.

And the boss was like, sorry, I have to stay home and monitor the renovation of my bathroom. So that is when we quit. Yes, yeah. It was a run-up to planning E3. We were both so miserable. And also we do, I think Bob correctly predicted, the layoffs for us are coming eventually. And it's just the countdown till they lay us off, too. and the big layoffs came about six months later at that website.

So yes, we instead got to leave with dignity and piss off the boss so much when we privately told him we were leaving. We're like, but we'll finish up the two weeks and help you do this. And he's like, I want you gone now. And he actually paid us for two weeks of no work just to get rid of us sooner. And I said, I'll take your money. Under duress, but I'll take it. And he said that we were making a big mistake, and he was right. Yes.

Oh, yeah. We regret it every day. We would have lost four more jobs since then if we'd have stayed in that industry. I checked in on old Bongo Head, and sadly, he still has a job. They always just fail upwards. It's like it. It's like lead content gruer at Schmerchie or something like that, some new app. Something like that.

Icebox TV. It's coming back. The guy who is right before him, he's at Google now, that Bongo Head. Hey, are you disparaging his job title of Engagement Ninja? Man, that, ah, the shove on Mr. Burns, his tumble and wams into the drums is so great. And the timing could not be better on the instant bridge burning. The tiny little bridge, Homer lights on fire, fush, like it's, oh, so good.

So good. Maybe one of the greatest visual gags and Sinsons. Just like, because it passes by so fast, too. This is where there's one of two tiny deleted scenes in the episode. So as Homer drives by getting pretty good sound out of it, his friends have a couple extra lines to say to him. Go to hell all you losers. I don't need you anymore. Hey,

I don't think he's going to miss us at all. Boom. So I guess he was going to fix Lenny and Carl Good by disparaging them on his way out. He does not want to stay friends after leaving the office either. Homer, just like us, Homer has his own vision of leaving, but his version of a full-time podcast via Patreon is, well, first it seems like a beach, but it's actually a bowling alley. He's a pin monkey. We're pod monkeys. Yes.

Yes. All right, starting a rival Simpsons podcast now called Podmonkeys. Oh, we've left so many in our wake. Here we are left. This is them finally. Grainting talks about it on the commentary. This is addressing a problem they've had since season

one when they came up with the idea of Barney's Bolorama, which they thought would be as visited as the Quickey Mart, I bet, in season one. They thought, oh, we're going to go to the ballorama all of the time. Yeah, it's featured in a lot of early Simpsons like merchandising and artwork.

It was going to be a fixture of the show. Then they decided, well, Barney is too much of an alcoholic to run a bowling alley. So we have to figure out a way around this. And also, in Mowing Lisa, there is a joke that the bolorama has burned down. It is a newscast that Homer is watching on TV, getting very upset about.

But the thing is, they really lost bowling after the first season. All the first season was Homer loves bowling. He's going to buy an expensive bowling ball. All the video games have bowling balls and bowling pins in them. That's his thing. That's his thing in season one. After that, it's gone completely until now.

I think this brings it back to the show. In the Simpsons Uncensored album, there's a photo of Barney with a Barney's new bowlerama shirt. So I assume that comes after that it burns down. Man, the incensored family history is really coming in here in this. I think they thought maybe it's when they finally showed the first time of Inside Barney's apartment that is just so messed up that they have to go like, well, there's no way this guy can own a bowling alley. But I think we can credit this episode for bringing bowling back to the show.

And then next season, David Merkin produces Team Homer for the show, which is a big bowling episode. And I always felt like Homer's love of bowling. It was just one of those vestigial like, well, he's Fred Flintstone. He's the new Fred Flintstone thing. He likes bowling because Fred Flintstone would bowl in classic episodes of the Flintstones. Homer, I think, has done more bowling jokes since season one than he has done like pork rind jokes. Pork rinds are generally pork products. Those really also fell to the wayside after season two.

Or mamba dancing. Yes. There's no mention of pork chops and applesauce. It feels like a very rare callback. That was Homer's cowabunga. I remember hearing about pork rinds on the show and being like, these must be delicious. Homer loves them and be like, ugh, no. They have to also mess with it in the episode.

they take away the name in one establishing shot they take away the name Barney's the possessive it's just Bolarama on it because I think they realize it's distracting to see that it's Barney's possessive when you just see Barney get fired in the previous scene at the Bullar.

Yeah I guess it's a very brief shot but Barney's working the snack bar at the Bullarama this is the one time we've seen Barney with steady employment. Until listening to the commentary in 2005 or six I did not get the joke was that Homer quit his job without having a new job lined up. And that's part of the Homer's stupidity joke there.

I never got that like now for the final part of my plan, which is ask for the job now that I've quit my secure job. And Barney goes along with it to help him out. And Homer's dream job is fulfilled in our next clip. And now the final phase of my plan. Hey, Barney, any chance you can give me a job here? Oh, sure, Homer. I told you, my uncle owns the place.

I have a job. Sure. Woo-hoo! He's he. Bonnie, you're fired. Okay. Show up tomorrow. Bring three rags.

Oh, and change your pants. Why? When it happens, you'll know. You're a pin monkey? Wow. Finally, I don't have to be ashamed of my father's job. I think it's romantic, throwing off the shackles of the workday world and following a dream. Of sorts.

Why do you think Homer needs a pair of pants? What's happening at the bowling alley? Yeah, I think it's left to your imagination here, but perhaps you've got to grease those wheels inside the machine that returns your ball. It's just going to spray fluid all over you. Who knows? Although leaning over to pick up things, maybe splits the pants, or something disgusting happens.

Or sexy. It's a great line just about starting at a new job that there is some secret. You'll discover in time, and maybe it'll even be kind of a right of passage at this job. of like, well, hey, it happens to all of us, and when it happens, you'll know. But it also fills you with, like, dread of something is about to happen there. And I guess Barney's vindictive attitude in Mr. Plow makes sense now because Homer took his job. That's, yes, yeah, though I'm going to think his Uncle Al, you know, I don't think Barney's a good employee.

Maybe his Uncle Al was waiting for an excuse. Isn't it Sweet, how Lisa and Bart are both supportive of him, like, that they actually have pride in him? like it's a better job on Bart's angle and Lisa does see the, you know, passion that's in it. And it's I guess a general tragedy of the episode is there's

people who would be great at jobs like Pin Monkey that it does not pay a living wage. And even though it would be their passion and they could do it the best anybody does, that it isn't a living wage is the tragedy of life, I suppose. And I just want to highlight in that sequence where he gets the job.

He does something that I associate with like, more classic episodes than like the modern era. He does like the little dance, like, whoo, whoo, which is not specifically a reference, but it's just a moment of character that I really like. Yeah, he's got a nice jig stored up for this occasion. After this, we get a real season three scene where they're going over the budget,

but because it's Homer's decisions that he's making, there are just two items. We get cheaper toilet paper and only one kid goes to college. So I want to put the writers on blast because I don't remember what episode it is, but they're watching a scene of them doing the budget. And the writers on one of the commentary, tracks was like, who does this stuff?

Like, why do we put this in? I want to be like, I've done this hundreds of times in my life trying to budget things out to be able to survive. I have to tell our patrons though, with your money, I do buy the fancy toilet paper. Although I've got a bidet, so isn't that necessary, but still, I like the softness. I wouldn't trust

Marge is right to question this, because I would not trust Homer's math on this. I think, despite what Homer says, I think the family budget will be hitting dire straits in three months. And even it gets sped up by the health care costs of having a baby in America. I would think even so, no baby.

Marge is either going to get a second job or she'll get a job and there'll be a two-income household to support this. Bart's little punch on the wall is very cute too. Very funny. Also Marge, I guess, but she takes the diamond off of her ring to stop Homer from hawking it. I think she turns it so he doesn't see it. She spins it around, yeah.

If the diamond could just pop off of her ring, it's not a good thing. You're right. Not a good sign. When did Homer get her a diamond? Well, also, the ring is normally invisible. It's a very magical ring that it only exists when a joke needs to happen. Yeah, she threw the ring in the fireplace. She did upgrade from the onion ring at some point.

So they celebrate with a Simpsons level of cheap night out, which is very cute. It's a very nice, like, busy parents' evening of just dancing. They dressed up to go to the Krusty Burger and dance in their car. and then drive to the beach. I guess because I know the punchline now, I take the setup for granted, and the setup is we hear Copacabana, we're panning across all of these nightclubs,

and then we end up in the drive-through. So they're trying to set up that they're at one of these, but then the mislead is, oh, no, they're actually bopping in the car. Do le cicaracha. When you know the joke too much, you're right. I miss that as the great setup for first viewing. And Copacabana is a good comedy song,

the Barry Manilow song. I think of it more as a song sung by Muppets. I think that's how I first saw it as a Muppet show performance. Well, he's kind of a Muppet. Yeah, I'm like, was Copa Cabana popular suddenly in 1993? I do think it's like a border at the Copa, parenthetical. It is also a novelty song or borderline novelty song because it is like a joke song about the sad old woman who still is at there,

even though she's like, lost her mind as Mendoose sings. Yeah, I think it's more that Homer and Marge having a great time and just listening to the songs from their youth at this point in history. Before children ruined things. They listen to a song from 78 right before Bart ruined things. Now songs like Creep are too new for young Margin Homer to listen to. Sadly, yes, that's true.

Speaking of old references, then we get what has to be the second or third from here to eternity reference in the show, which I only know. I don't know anything about from here to eternity other than people making out on a beach. It's very long. That's what I'm saying. So the title is truth.

then in its link. It feels like eternity. Rest in peace, Gene Shallott. Because I'm sure that was probably in his review. I really love the bit of Homer saying, I've got Sid and my underpants. He is turned on. The fact that he goes back later is because it's turning

him on, but Marge takes it as, oh yeah, I'm uncomfortable too. Let's go home if we're going to have sex. But Homer meant it as eh? Sand in your underpants is like a get at home and you realize it's still there somehow. And you're like, oh, man, now it's in the bed issue. I love him running back into the frame and putting more in there.

The shaking of his pelvis to make sure it spreads around correctly is such great animation. And so they get home and they pronounce that everything is perfect right now as it is. He wished you could pre-sentence in time. And then seconds later, quite a joke about Homer's performance as well. Instantly impregnated March. Yeah. And we're calling out good animation. I really notice this this time.

As Homer is carrying Marge into the bedroom, he's actively taking off clothes while holding her and navigating her towards the bed in a needlessly complicated way. So I like that touch. It's great. It's probably hard to figure out in animates. I also notice that the sperm homers have three hairs reflecting the homer of the episode. Yeah, until he rips that third hair out, I always forget to look for it in these flashbacks to see if it's consistent. As a kid, and even in rewatching, like, often I never noticed the third hair until it is plucked out for the act two break joke. And then they get it on the semen.

Now that they get the hair on the semen is what I just said. But I do have a cell of Homer's ears. But it is from the Brother Can You Spare Two Dimes episode. That's his lethargic sperm in that one. This is Homer's sperm. Perhaps for the last time it had any energy to him. Yes. I love the David Silverman like drawing of Homer just like wiggling around.

Yeah, he dropped in to do that scene because no one else could figure it out. I think David Merkin was one who mimed it out for them. It should look like this and no one could really figure out how to do it, but it's great. It's so rules. I love that because they've done cut to the funny sperm jokes before. So how do they top it? And the topping it is that this is being explained to the children and acted out by Homer as part of this flashback. So it adds, it takes an already funny visual gag that they've done on the show multiple times at this point to then step it up to.

And Homer is telling his kids. I then put sperm into your mother and it impregnated one of her eggs. Yeah, I was wondering how much he mimed up until that point that we didn't see. Well, they paved the way for this kind of filth in school it's Homer's cover for that.

So it comes to the next day and they go to commercial break with Homer accidentally almost sitting on Maggie, but still it's cute. Not he's just like, hi Maggie, after he stops himself from crushing his child to death seemingly. Yeah, see.

by Lisa at the last second. This has never happened to me. I've never sat down and my wife has yelled, Justin, no! And it's like, oh, hey, Archie, how's it going? It's like stepping on your dog's paw. They're fine. They have to learn eventually.

They'll yelp a little. And we come back from the commercial break. Homer says there's no way to even know back then as Marge is having all of the morning sickness and all of the obvious tells that she would have had in all of her previous pregnancies. Homer then compares his time at the bowling out. to a wonderful waking coma.

A great line to not just say it was a dream. It was a waking coma. And it's so nice to see Homer is good at something and he's appreciated. It never happens in the show. I find this like a very heartwarming episode. Yeah. It's weird that like the bowling alley job is not like a high concept gag. It's just something that he genuinely enjoys doing.

He always wanted to work at the bowling alley, the things that would maybe most people when they have jobs like that. Like when I worked at an AMC movie theater, I did not like cleaning the bathrooms or making things urinal fresh, but Homer takes great pride in it. And same with like his little rotation of waving at all of the regulars, like how he just spins around in place. Like that also staged very well in the layout phase there.

And when I was a kid around Simpson season one, we did a lot of bowling. And I was fascinated with the real version of the Shino Bolo, but no one actually ever used it. I just wanted to see someone use it in real life. Now I did look it up, would not recommend, considering it's a brace of pads. Yes.

It would result in lacerations, blunt force injuries to the face, and probably burns and a scalping. I'm surprised that third hair didn't get yanked out by the Shino Bolo. An awesome name, by the way, just very unimaginative. And Al believes him as he uses Homer's head like a mirror to fix his hair. They also, it's great on the commentary.

Silverman and Graining both just pop up and like, whoa, they drew Jacques in there, a season one. Because Graning can remember, you know, Graney got less involved with character designs after the first season, but he knew Silverman designed Jacques from Life on the Fast Lane, and he's like, hey, that's your character, David. Like, that's great.

And it's always nice when they can get in the ridiculous character of Jacques, who even by season six, looks nothing like a season six character. Yeah. And then we waste, I think, close to a minute on this great Looney Tune scene that includes the Raymond Scott's song Powerhouse, where we find out what happens to bowling pins when they are knocked over, well, they're shoved outside and then an entire tree is destroyed to make one new bowling pin. And for whatever reason, bowling alleys can hire this old-timey artisan and an engineer to finish the job.

That is the overhead that Homer needs to try to get rid of and then they can afford him. I was surprised. I obviously did my research. I was like, all right, Powerhouse. When was it first used in Looney Tunes cartoons? It wasn't utilized on a conveyor belt scene, but in 1943 on Porky Pigs Feet. And they just kept using the song over and over and over again. And the big iconic one is when it's like the conveyor belt and a factory and everything goes wrong.

Yeah, I saw it. Well, this was from the Wikipedia, so I'm just going to be paraphrasing it. But yeah, that there is powerhouse is really, its use in Looney Tune songs is really two types of uses. The wiki classifies it as Powerhouse A and Powerhouse B. The first half of the song is the more chaotic, one of like, that's used for like chase scenes. And then the second sequence of the song Powerhouse B is what's used in this episode,

which is unusually for factories. There's a really good cartoon brew article that breaks down the history of Powerhouse. I'd recommend people check out if they want to know more about this one song that is basically the defining one of Looney Tunes. Oh yeah. I think for a time it was Cartoon Network's theme

or they would use that theme in a lot of their advertisements because you naturally associate that with cartoons, classic cartoons. Yeah, I mean, the list is, I want to read that cartoon brewpiece on Wikipedia. It's hardly a complete list. They have like a dozen Lutie tunes. And then the things imitating Loonie tunes as well from that going forward.

And it even goes full circle from a couple years now ago. The day the earth blew up has maybe the best sequence in it, or my second favorite sequence in it after them trying to get jobs, is their elephants on parade in the movie is a powerhouse arrangement. it's really good. Yeah, yeah, it's when Daffy Duck goes super Daffy, right? Yes, it's when they get their job and turn, like, I mean, it's so perfect. They're like, well, we got our job at the bubble gum factory time to turn on the machine.

And when they turn on the machine, a version of powerhouse starts up. And it's just like this gorgeous experimental animation that like breaks the style of the rest of it. Again, if you haven't seen the day the earth blew up, it seriously, it is the actual quality-wise, the best Looney Tunes movie there ever has been because I love everything that is in. in a Chuck Jones, you know, compilation film, but I don't count that as an actually good movie. It's the only real Looney Tunes movie. You can count Space Jam one or two,

and all the other movies are just compilation features. Looney Tunes Back in Action. You know what? That does count, but I don't like that movie. I know. The day the Earth blew up is better than Looney Tunes Back in Action. No, no offense, Joe Dante. He would agree.

He would absolutely agree. I think Powerhouse is also a song that it didn't get used a lot until people assumed it was in public domain, because, like, the Honey I Shrunk the Kids TV show, used it. And they actually got sued. Oh. Because they're like, oh yeah, you don't have the rights of that. But it did show up in Duckman in an episode where Duckman goes to women's prison when he's on a conveyor belt. Oh, nice. Yes, the powerhouse is from 1937, so it will be in the public domain in like 12, 13 years,

however that works. Then it becomes our theme song. I can start using it. Going to make a movie, powerhouse the movie. You can record your own My Blue Heaven. You can record your own powerhouse. It's all happening in the future and it's going to be great. So I'm going to look forward to. Then they end with Homer's pronouncement of, if horse racing is a sport of kings, and surely bowling is a very good sport as well. Which I think about, like, that defines bowling for me forever.

My mom, my stepdad, long time in a friendly bowling league, and my mom is joined up with him. They are regular bowlers after they had to put a pause on it when a fire in Northern California got rid of their bowling alley, but they found a new one more recently. I'd be curious to know, like, when I was a kid in the 90s, Like, we go bowling all the time as the go-to-kidst activity. And is that still the case as they'll, like, bring a bunch of kids to do something

that you don't have to worry too much about them? I mean, it does keep them in place, too, though. An appeal to the bowling alley for me as a kid, like, I did like bowling enough, though. Of course, rolling a bowling ball is hard when you're little. But it was that they had arcade games there, too. That was kind of a hundred percent. Bowling is also, like, a pure failure of sport as well? Is that like you're good at it or you're bad?

And if you're bad, you're always bad. Either every role is a strike or it's not, and that's it. Yeah, yeah, at a few of the bowling alleys I would go to in my hometown. There'd always be like a little side room full of video games, and that's where you'd find me. I would still bowl, but of course, it's like there are video games I haven't seen before. I'm going to be pumping quarters into those. Then they end with a Mary Tyler Moore show reference. Very quick one that, again, there wouldn't be a Simpsons without the Mary Tyler Moore show

because it was a launching pad for the career of James L. Brooks, and if he didn't get that powerful, then, you know, it's the falling domino's thing to make Simpsons happen. A reference as a child, I had no idea what it was, but I thought it was funny that Homer threw the ball and then it fell on the ground. You know, it works on multiple levels. I don't know if Nick and Knight had started the Mary Tyler Moore Show reruns just yet, but whenever they did, I had become invested enough. Like, I think I'd probably read enough TV guy to that point that would put Mary Tyler Moore Show episodes on the best episodes ever list that I, became a regular viewer on Nick at Night of Mary Tyler Moore Show. So this is the disconnect I have with you guys or any American podcasters is we didn't have

Nick at Night in Canada. We didn't have any of those old like rerun shows. We had Teletoon, which was kind of our version of it, but the oldest they got was like Scooby Doo and the Three Stooges. To answer your question, Henry, Mary Tyler Moore Show began on Nick a Knight in 1992 and it kicked off with a Marathon. How about that folks? We used to schedule things properly on television. I remember that Marathon. It was one night. for every season of the show, and it was like a curated list of the best episodes from each season up to the end. So like in a week, I got to experience an overview of the entire Mary Tyler Moore experience in one week as a kid. And speaking of arcade machines, I noticed this in the background when I was watching when Homer's giving out the drinks.

There's an arcade machine called the Time Waster, which I did not know appears in multiple episodes of the Simpsons. Although, weirdly enough, in the background here, it's misspelled. It's misspelled. It normally isn't. That really shows you their perspective on video games in 1989 where a video game is called Time Waster and you played at Noisland. So Homer's having a great time while meanwhile Marge learns something. I'm going to make it after a...

Congratulations, Mrs. Simpson. You're pregnant. You might have to take it this is an unwanted pregnancy. Oh, no, no, no. Not exactly. It's just that I haven't told Homer yet. And with his new job, I don't know how we're going to be able to afford this. Well, you know, a healthy baby can bring upwards of $60,000. What? Well, of course, that was just a test. How'd you react differently? Why, you'd be a day right now. Simply a test. So in a few months, both of you will have a brand new brother or sister.

Been there, done that. I hope it's a girl. You know, nothing about genetics, lease. It goes boy, girl, boy, boy. Boy, girl. You're worried about telling Dad, aren't you, mom? Why do you say that? Well, you've been in my room for about four hours now. Hey, I'm just hanging. The most evil Dr. Hibbert has ever been on the show?

At this point, yes. I mean, I think before this, he had the tube that would send you away if you didn't have insurance. But this implies that he is running on the side of black market selling babies business. That he has asked this question a number of times to women who seem to have an unwanted pregnancy. Underrated March line, I don't see reference. I'm just hanging. That's great.

Hibbert jokes like that. It's what kills Dr. Nick. It's why, not literally, the movie kills Dr. Nick, literally. No, well, you can't kill Dr. Nick. He'll always be back. Yeah, he came back. But they don't need Dr. Nick. If Hibbert's not a good doctor,

then you can just do bad doctor jokes with Dr. Hibbert, and you don't need Dr. Nick Riviera. And this is where the only other deleted scene on the DVD is, which is after Marge leaves the room and sneaks out, from her just hang-in session. Bart and Lisa share a little more dialogue. A new baby. This means I'll be the dreaded middle child sentenced to a life of neglect and indifference.

I know. If I want to stand out, I'll have to become an overachiever, precocious beyond my years. Oops, that's redundant. Hey, I'm going to hang of this already. That's good. I don't know if we needed the Lisa origin story because she's already precocious and too intelligent. She wasn't acting any different than regular Lisa before this. scene. But I do like it as just a

great Lisa moment that is lost by cutting it that Lisa is so defined by being the middle child that you can make a whole episode about Lisa's perspective on this of like, oh, I have become the middle child. She could even come to dislike Maggie at the start because Maggie

definitely makes her the middle child. Though they do an all right episode that, well, I don't want to be too complimentary, but in season 16, the episode where Maggie is deemed smarter than Lisa and Lisa gets jealous. Right. Smart and smarter, right? Yes. Yes. That's the closest of them recognizing that Lisa could be jealous of her baby sister, like any middle child would be. Yeah, I don't think any of us are

middle children, right? Nope. I'm the oldest. Bob's the youngest. So you get to rein it over the younger child. Again, all my older brother perspectives like Bob, Bob can't understand. I'm the enemy in this, yes. Don't worry, Bob. I also have a sister that was not always nice to me. Yeah, we don't really talk, you know. It's been a while. Yeah, me neither. Half sister, half sister. So we then cut to Homer praying as Marge.

It's also just great that Homer, they are beginning, the Homer doesn't notice stuff. And Marge is visibly pregnant. Like she seems to be in like at least the second month based on her size, I would say. I don't know. Maybe Justin, you have a better insight into where Marge is at here. Oh, you know, let me check my archives and my photos of my wife each month. This scene did give me, I was raised religious, and we would pray every night before going to bed.

So this struck a chord with me. All I remember was my mom would say, okay, can you tell me one good thing that you did today? And without fail, every night, me and my brother would go, we didn't do anything good. What are you asking? Yeah, Justin, we weren't religious at home, but I went to Catholic school and I thought this was brilliant that Homer figured out a way to game prayer because it's like, well, God is not going to intervene ever. So you can totally technically win at prayer if you just. say, well, if this is okay, give me no sign. All right.

They will be done. Did you go to, like, hardcore Catholic school? I went to a French school. They're all Catholic. And what's great about it was that, like, we said the Lord's Prayer at the beginning, and that's it. No outfits, no nothing. It's like, listen, we're going to do the bare minimum.

It was uniforms, mass every once in a while, but we had to, like, share a priest. There weren't enough priests to go around. So it wasn't, like, full of nuns and priests and getting hit with rulers. It was a clergy shortage in the 90s. There was no one there to abuse it. And everybody had Bartmania. They didn't have enough to control the rowdy teens. They've taken the can't talk eating and now used it for can't talk praying for Homer.

It's becoming a latter day catchphrase for him. That Homer even convinces himself that he gets to eat cookies and milk in this. And also that Marge gets to feel guilty about it by association just to hear that like Homer says, just freeze. I mean, it's a perfect prayer too of like just freeze everything exactly as it is, never change anything in life and everything will be great. which this is kind of in the stone cutters too of like whatever says

everything is forever nothing ever changes. Have you guys ever felt that way? We were like, this is the greatest moment of my life. I wish it would all stay the same. At times, but it was 1995.

Okay, yeah. Probably around the time the episode aired. When I worked at my first video game website, it was more of the other cliche of like, you don't know how good it was until it stops being that good. Oh, yeah.

It was my first job at a video game website. We had, as I look back on it, surprisingly free range. less overhead and less involvement. And you only realize it once you get a new boss who then lays off three of your coworkers and starts looking down your back every move you make and you have to have 10 times of meetings.

And that's when it would be like, oh, I should have wished to God as a wish to freeze this all. Yeah, I had a similar situation. I mean, at my video game website it was stressful, but there was like no boundaries, no rules. But then you realize, oh, we have no rules because the company that bought us to improve its portfolio, is going to get rid of us as soon as they sell themselves as someone else.

So the time was ticking on that freedom. Right. They have to keep your website open so it can be sold. If it was a closed website, then they can't sell it for more. Technically your job, it's very fulfilling to know that your job didn't really matter. And all those late nights didn't really matter as long as anything was posted. Well, it's a good thing. All the work that you guys did is archived and easily accessible and still, you know, available to the public.

Well, for Henry, that's true, surprisingly. Most of it is, yes. I would say top 5% of it has been turned into Google redirect, but the website actually still exists. And that's because the main owners of it are British, and they can't just lay everybody off under UK labor laws. So the Americans aren't employed there anymore. But yes, my stuff hasn't been delisted, unlike Bob's website exists in the Wayback Machine, I think, if it is anywhere.

All those listicles. How are we going to access them again? People need to know my reviews from the year 2011. We need to check in on those. Those all still count on Metacritic, by the way. Wow. Just deadly. I made sure some people didn't get bonuses that year, and I'm proud of that.

So Marge, she's fretting and guilty about this. And I think on some level, Marge knows talking to Patty and Selma. I don't know. I think if I were to psychoanalyze her, I think Marge is being self-sabotizing here. I guess she has to tell her sisters at some point, or you would expect she would, but she should know. I think the problem here is Marge has no friends. Oh, that is true, yes. So she literally can't tell anyone else.

Well, she has one friend that mysteriously shows up later in the episode, even though that she hasn't met her yet. Yes. Yes, thank you, Justin. Ruth Powers just drops by, like, right before she moves to Springfield. Yes. Via a time tunnel. Maybe she was checking out the house.

Yeah. prospectively. And she's a little party. Hi, I'm Ruth. But she hasn't yet left to divorce her husband yet. Like, she's scoping out things in the long term. I like that. I like that.

Patty and Selma have their own. plans after first poisoning the baby with second hit smoke. Bucky, fucking, fucking, fucking, boogie, buggy, buggy, boogie, boogie, boon. I've got to tell Homer about this baby in just the right

way and at just the right time. Until then, please, keep this to yourselves. If he found out now, it would probably destroy him, huh? Oh, yes. Gotta go. Wait a minute, wait, I know that look. Now promise you won't tell Homer.

Oh, we promise we won't tell Homer. Hello, is this A. Aronson? It might interest you to know that Marge Simpson is pregnant again. Just thought you liked to know, Mr. Zikowski. There. Aronson and Zikowski are the two biggest gossips in town. In an hour, everyone will know.

Fantastic. I've said this before with this era, but there are many jokes I wish I could wipe from my mind because I remember being blown away by this punchline. David Merkin is very unsure about it on the commentary track. He's like, I don't know if people get it. And it's like, they vocalize it though. Yeah, I got it at age 12, but it could have been funny on its own if they literally called everyone in the phone book. It would have been an insane joke.

But then they decided to go one step further. Yes. So that's what makes it a truly perfect joke. One of my favorites in the show, it's them being ahead of their audience. It's something I can sometimes moan about when we're talking about season 16 of just like, oh, they just did the sitcom joke. but these are jokes of we understand what you, a savvy sitcom loser who watches too many sitcoms,

knows whether the joke would be that they called everyone in the phone book. That's their trick around. They won't tell Homer. But it just so happens that the first and last person in the Springfield phone book, each of those two men

are the biggest gossips in town and they are going to tell everyone. And the time cut of like, it also, the animation backs it up so perfectly that it looks like a time cut that they've been chain smoking for hours as they call everyone in town. She's tired.

She's like, ugh. Yeah. They took a big break or Eranson kept them on the phone for a very long time. Yeah, maybe that's what it is. Yeah, with all the gossip.

It's almost as good as the Bort joke. It's just so, there's so many layers. It's such a mislead. It's so good. Now, is that Yardley Smith doing the cough for Maggie Sinson,

do you think, in the stomach? I think it's almost always Nancy making Maggie noises when it's not Elizabeth Taylor the one time. My bet would be as a Nancy cough there. Yeah. And so,

Everybody in town does learn Zikowsky and Erinson did their jobs as Homer just doesn't get it. Another perfect day in my perfect life with my perfect job. Hey, just heard the news over the squat box. That's nice work, Homer. Thank you. Thank you very much. It is nice work. Oh, Mr. Simpson, I've just heard about the little bundle of joy.

Congratulations, sir. It's true. The bundle is little, but I'm. I'm not in it for the money. Hey, Homer, way to get Mudge pregnant. This is getting very abstract, but thank you. I do enjoy working at the bowling alley. It's nice that Homer's B-sharp band members can all congratulate him on the birth of his new baby.

Yeah, Wigam doesn't hold it against him. Skinner, nowhere to be found. Actually, this being a flashback, it's only been like four years since that happened when they're doing this right. Well, no, Lisa's like three in it. Well, no, at least it's like two of them. It's been six years. No, four years. I was right, four years.

Yeah. Okay. Then Homer, that, you know, nice work. This is, again, perfect writing of sitcom jokes. Nice work actually does function as a wordplay joke. It is just a fine sitcom joke about clever wordplay. The bundle is little, maybe even does work. But way to get March pregnant.

And he thinks it is an extremely abstract way of saying that working at the bowling alley is great. is so funny. So funny. So we cut to Marge getting a surprise baby shower from Patty and Selma, also meant to expose it to Homer and destroy him. And yes, this is where Ruth Powers is there. I would assume it just is that the animators were told, Marge needs to have, there need to be eight women who are guests at this.

Three of them are her family members buying five other women. And so it's also Helen Lovejoy, Bod Flanders, Bernice Hibbert. Marge's good friend. And Ruth Powers there too. The gang is all here. It's before Lindsay Nagel has existed. So definitely Lindsay Nagel and Cookie Quan would be there in season 16. No Brandeen.

Oh, yeah, no Brandein allowed in yet. Also, it's funny seeing the mom, there are no jokes with Mother Bouvier there, other than her saying, surprise, baby shower. But she has to lip sync with the other characters, so she's moving in a way she would never normally in her very slow, aged way. and now Homer, another great joke, the door blows open. Oh, it's fine. March closes it. Homer just opens it again.

Man, it's Winnie's hell out there. Another amazing Miss Lee. This is Merkin's favorite kind of joke, and I love them so much. Would you guys as kids ever get stressed out when something stressful on a sitcom would happen? I remember being like, oh, man, the Fresh Prince is going to get in trouble now. I got to change the channel before it goes down. I think only when there was like parent punishment involved because this could shock a lot of you out there. I was a good little boy, and I was rarely ever punished.

So just the thought of punishment made me very anxious. I think maybe it's just because I just recently watched the great pop arena YouTube video from Nick Nacks about the history of Doug. But definitely on Doug, when he would get anxiety about things, I would feel secondary. Like when he lost his journal, I would get secondary anxiety from him or like, oh, the teacher's going to see his mean drawing of her. Like watching that video again. And we covered Doug in the past with Greg. the creator of Popperina. And I just, I did identify with Doug because his childhood anxiety, which was always misplaced

and pointless in the show, I was like, oh, I feel that anxiety all of the time, too, as a little boy. Yeah, I guess it's something that you don't see very much in cartoons of that time is like a concrete, non-physical, like anxiety. And you're like, oh, oh, my God. I remember watching Doug and it being like, hey, Doug's on. I guess I'll watch it. Controller's too far away.

What is my friend Doug? have to do. Now you guys got to get into like, did you ever watch the Canadian cartoon sticking around? Oh, boy. I don't think so. I think it came out of something called stick figure theater maybe, which was a bunch of shorts. So they animated a lot of shorts to classic movie dialogue or like famous speeches. But then there was a show. I think it did Aaron Fox, but Henry and I are a bit older. So it might be late 90s too old. We were too old for the show. Yeah, I thought it was early 90s because it was in syndication. But like as a Canadian, we have so many other cartoons that you guys didn't watch. because of Canadian content laws. But they're like, we're going to watch these cartoons over and over again, even though no one else in the world will know it, because we have to hit that percentage. I don't fuck with the raccoons.

I'm sorry. That's before my time, too. Yeah, they disgust me. I'm still jealous that you guys got uncensored and complete Cyber Six in its first season when it got cut up for America. Oh, yeah. And reboot. Yeah, yeah, I was going to say that.

You guys got the secret dark reboot season way before we did. Speaking of things that gave me anxiety, reboot absolutely did, the fact that, like, a character dies, and then there's an insane time jump. It's like the rumors you would say on the playground, like, hey, did you know in reboot? He fails, and his eye gets plucked out, and then he's giant, and he goes on the web, and it's like something a kid would lie to you about.

And Tony and Jay's voice is just terrifying. Oh, yes, absolutely. And so everybody is surrounding Homer. It should be obvious to him, but he learns the truth in an unexpected way. By the way, congratulations on your new job, Homer. New job. Marge is pregnant! Wow, Dad, you really threw a tantrum like a little sissy girl?

Oh, just that one time. Actually, when I was about to have Bart... You're pregnant! And then when I told him about Lisa... You're pregnant again? Well, who wouldn't be upset? That new baby in your mother's womb was a ticking time bomb, threatening to blow his family eight ways from...

Sunday. Hey, where are you going? Dad, you can't expect a person to sit for 30 minutes straight. I'm going to get a snack and maybe go to the bathroom. I'll stay here, but I'm going to think about products I might like to purchase. Oh. Hmm. Oh, I don't have that. Well, okay, Henry and I are going to put on our comedy continuity policemen's helmets right now

to let you know that. I love the joke about Homer tearing his hair out. It's the origin story of that. But the flashbacks we see are incorrect. because they find out about Bart's existence in Hibbert's office, and when they find out about Lisa's existence, they don't live in the Evergreen Terrace House yet. So wrong.

It's all wrong, and you're wrong to laugh at it. It's wrong. Homer also slowly loses his hair in those scenes, too. He does not rip them out. And Homer gives like a dough, and he is upset to learn about Bart's birth. But when Marge tells him about Lisa's pregnancy or pregnancy with Lisa, he kind of doesn't really react much at all to it.

He's more focused on Bart flushing down his wallet and keys. Here's the way to deal with it is that Marge is telling this to the kids, and the kids are imagining what it would look like. The only context that they have is the house that they live in. That could be it. Unreliable story hearer in this case. Now, as a six-year-old watching this, I assume this is one of the ways that you could go bald.

You could just rip your hair out and it would grow back. And that it is, Homer does grab his third hair and pull it out and completes his current look. Another really great Merkin joke about the format is these characters are so poisoned by TV. They have to adhere to the TV rules when they're just hearing a story in the living room. It's like, well, we need to take a bathroom break at a snack, and Marge needs to think of products. So I like that. They're poisoned by TV, but I like the high-level idea that when the show takes commercial break, the characters have to kind of stop what they're doing until the show comes back to them.

Marge is happy also that it's a perfect Marge joke that she likes fantasizing about the products, means Marge likes seeing commercials. This feels like a joke David Merkin probably did like 10 times on Get a Life, I would bet. Some throw to commercial break and acknowledging it. He does a lot of great commercial break jokes in there. The one I'm thinking of first when I think of Get a Life is in season two, both Chris and Brian Doyle Murray character he's living with seemingly just die and lay on the floor for like a minute of TV time.

Then it goes to commercial when they come back. They're still just lying motionless on the floor when the commercial comes back. Also, you know, another continuity thing, because they just use the layout, you know, three times in a row of Homer running up the stairs, even in the flashback of him running up the stairs from thinking about Lisa, Lisa's picture is on the wall as he runs up by it. So again, another real continuity goof him up there. And of course, I hope somebody got fired for that blunder. No, they still let Swittenhouse got work for another 30 years. He must justify why he was not firing. when he quit he did like Homer he burned the bridge behind him and he's like I'm going to work on I assume some kind of Bob's burgers rip off because that's all you can really work on these days hey I think he gets to work on real Bob's burgers oh does he okay at least he dabbled in the burgers for a bit because I was looking like Jennifer Crickenden she created that housebroken show oh yeah that has like tons of great comedy writers that worked on it but every time I see a clip I'm like oh yeah someday I'll give it a shot and yes including Scott gerrude who worked on it he He's done our show.

He had nothing but nice things to say about his writing the episode and working for Crittenden. But yes, I haven't watched it yet either. I can't say. Yeah, I'm sure it's funny. But the premise is, what if dogs could talk? I mean, I feel like there should be more there. But I know they use that premise in some clever ways. So I will one day watch some Housebroken.

Elliot Kalin was a, like, co-executive producer on the show, too. Right. Yeah, I was scrolling through the list of writers. I was shocked to see his name. Like, oh, he was visiting the World of Housebroken for a bit. And also one that co-creators is Cleodoo, I like her. I like her a lot. She's great. I just loved seeing her for a small cameo appearance in the final season of the comeback for four instances.

Don't they keep making those talking animal shows? Isn't there a Jason Shortsman one that just started? There was an Aubrey Plaza one that just happened. That also called Kevin that just got canceled. That also has voice acting from multiple Talking Simpsons guests on that as well, including Mike Mitchell does a voice in it. Right. Yeah. Schwartzman does the voice of Kevin in the show. Okay, yes. So he works thing into the same one. I guess there's like a quota you have to have every year a talking animal show. Yeah.

It does seem like it's a go-to pitch for celebrities who, hey, celebrities are just like us, they have pets and they think it'd be funny. What did my pet do when they're with their sitter and I'm being a famous person? You know, working on the show that's probably better than any of like being

thrown at the Brickleberry minds or something like that. That show's still going on? I assume it is. I think Brickleberry wasn't around for as long as we assume it was, but the stink remained behind. We come back from the commercial break, and Homer cannot take it. And you know what?

Oh, yes, one last thing about Marge fantasizing about the ads, that I hope that if you have the ad tier of Disney Plus, I hope they do time it to play ads there, because if they don't, then it's a waste of a joke. Like, if you're working at Disney Plus, put the ad marker where it's supposed to be to at least have the joke work with ads. They're taking the gun out of their mouth as they're listening this.

They're like, oh, wait, something to live for. Point. Like you, Henry. So, yes, we come back for a commercial break with another, like, another perfect joke. I think we all love so much. Oh, you're pregnant. We're going to have to have a baby. All our financial plans are ruined.

We're doomed. Doom. Doom. I told you. Yeah. Let your father tell the story. Yeah. Okay. But I know funny.

Anywho. Woohoo! We're doomed. Homer, you had a head. Check. And your bottom was a little bigger. Oh. You've worked hard at the bowling alley.

Why did you ask for a raise? Yeah, a raise. I've never been good enough at any job to deserve one before, but I'm damn good at this one. That's it. I'm going to march right up to L and say, Steve, I mean, L, I think I deserve a raise. I're a hard worker, and I'd like the good.

give you a raise, but the alley just ain't doing enough business to pay that kind of money. How about if I triple the business, then could I get a raise? Well, yeah, but Homer's head exploding to bring you back into the commercial. Like you say, Bob, you want to forget all

these things, just seeing Homer's head just grow and explode at the start of the first act. What a shock laugh you get on first viewing. Yeah, I like how they're playing with the devices here. This is one of those things that as a kid I would explain it to my friends who hadn't seen the episode on the playground. and it's like, this will not translate.

They will not laugh. But as a kid, you're like, you're trying to explain it. And then his head grows big and then it explodes. Yeah. I also like Homer in his story that he was telling it that Homer's not as fat as he is. And Marge forces him to be honest. And Homer's, man, Homer's pride in his job is very nice here.

It's very sweet that he's like he actually is good at this job and deserves a raise for the first time ever in his life. He actually is good at a job. And also he messes up like, Like, Steve, I mean, now. Homer decides he's going to need to figure out marketing. It is a great three-stage joke that works on its own of just advanced marketing, beginners marketing, the definition of marketing.

That could just work as the joke. And I'm sure I noticed this before, but like the mislead is even bigger because that joke is funny. Finally, going down to the basic term looking it up, Homer then stares at a bowling ball and then says, of course. And then the idea has nothing to do with that. So it's like a joke that is paired with another great joke that leads to this mislead. It's like such perfect construction.

Well, isn't it the holes in the bowling ball is the shape of the gun that he's firing? Is that the match cut or something? I think that's the match cut. Okay, yeah, yeah. This is one of the greatest smash cuts in the show's history. It's gun violence becomes more and more pervasive in American society. It only gets funny here. Of course.

That's what really happened. Oh. My marketing plan attracted a record number of police and fire officials, but few stayed to bowl. I failed. Winning my dream job was the hardest thing I've ever done. You did a great job, Homer, and I'm really going to miss you. Place has never been cleaner, and the way you kept the young people away.

That was beautiful. Anyway, we all pitched in, and we got you this little going-away thing. That clip is so much darker, just hearing the audio. of it. It sounds like Homer. It's firing into a crowd. That's true. Oh, man, just bowling. And I really appreciate it on this watch. Like the

Kavner and Yardley's performance of Lisa thinks Homer is making up a crazy joke. Marge knows all too well it really happened just in her flatness and then how it's animated that Marge barely even makes eye contact with Lisa. Like, that's what really happened. It's great because

we get two misleads earlier with unreliable narrators and this ends up being the truth. Yes, the Elmer brought a shotgun and that police and firefighters came, but few stayed to bowl, like a couple did, apparently. So something new I got out of this watch is the fact that Homer scares away the young people, they could have spent enough on bowling to justify Al giving Homer a raise. So I think he's kind of defeating his own intent there, his own goal.

Yes, it's great, too, that this is what was killing bowling alley. You go with an increasingly aging clientele, but they're celebrating. keeping the young people away. They don't want those young people there. It annoys them. When they say the going away present, you can note earlier in the episode right before the Shino-Balo scene, Homer is polishing a glass case. And the purple, leatherish, or maybe more vinyl jacket is in there, except it doesn't have the thing on the back. It's just front. So it shows that Homer was already admiring the jacket, making it an even more thoughtful gift from everybody, that they got it embroidered on the back to give him the

jacket he thought looked so cool in the display case. And sorry you had to split. A great little joke on the back there. This is where we even get to meet another friend of Homer's, who I'm sure we'll have a long time on the series. This was the happiest time of my life. I'll never forget you guys, especially you, Joey. See around, Mr. Homer.

Don't worry, Joey. We'll make it to California someday. Sure we will, Mr. Homer. Sure we will. It's going to be sad around here without you, Homer. Boy, this is depressing. Hey, I know what would cheer us up. Bowling.

That goes on for a very long time with some very funny ADR. Yes, it's great that they instantly forget Homer. You know, bowling's just so freaking awesome. They don't even remember why they were sad or that Homer even worked there. When I see something like that, I always wonder, like, when did this? get added to the episode. Was it in the script? Because it's a still frame of Homer in the big wide as that dialogue starts. Then they do cut to like an over the shoulder like him looking sadly. So I almost feel that Merkin's like, this is too sad. We need another joke here.

Maybe they could have done it just a little like one line could have been the script. And sadly, there's no script online for this one at the time of recording. So I can't tell you guys that definitively. But I could see that they maybe wrote one joke and then it was just a sad walk with music. And then they realize, like, this music's not working as much. Let's expand the bowling alley like chatter. And a classic, what is the Simpson Wiki talking about this episode? It's written on there. Obviously, Joey is a reference to the character in the wizard and how he wants to go to California. Sorry, guys. Nope. Nope. Nope. I do dislike those. Yes, it bothers me. The Simpsons Wiki is helpful in some ways. They do. If you want to know when characters were in which episode, I have referred back to it.

when needed, so I'm not saying it's terrible, but yes, I just cannot count on them for their references, because I think it's also like a lot of non-Americans writing it, so they don't understand the Boomer and Gen X reference things they're pulling from. David Merkin has no clue what the film The Wizard is at all. I am certain of that. A lot of those editors are real significance junkies. They think, oh, this secretly means this. And it's like, well, this guy born in 1962 wouldn't know what that is. And he doesn't care. They can't just write like a general reference. So the idea of. this. They need to like lock it down onto something specific. Though the coughing into the, I think of Joey every time as that

is used in films, I actually just saw a movie recently that had it. I have been on a real Ingmar Bergman kick. I've watched 10 Ingmar Bergman films in the last few months now. So you got the Blu-ray box set? Yes. Yeah, I was going to say it's because of your friend Will Sloan. Will Sloan

said, oh, you've got the box and Henry was like, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'll watch them all. I watch the ball right now. Yeah, he keeps asking about it. Henry's like, have he watched the movies yet? I was pod shamed. I had been slowly watching them. I had relatively recently watched wild strawberries from it. But we were talking about Perfect Blue on Will Sloan's podcast, Michael and Us.

And Luke Savage noticed in the background that a scene from Persona is the cover to the box set. And so Luke was like, well, Henry, you must know how this is similar to Persona. It's right there. And I was like, oh, man, I am pod. But I kept going with it after the pod shaving. So did Luke stop sending those threatening emails to you? Listen, you son of a bitch. How dare you?

You think you could just buy a Blu-ray and not watch it? Yeah, I've watched everything behind me in this room. Henry, no one can see the thousands of things. As we all know, life is infinite. We will never die. There will always be time to watch and read everything we purchase and play. I should say, though, I kept going with the Bergman films because they are very fulfilling and I enjoyed them very much. So I just, the most recent one I watched was The Silence, which was part of his kind of religious trilogy of films that I think all came out in 63 or this one came out in 63.

That box set is really interesting because they like organized it in like festivals, that they want you to watch them all and it's not chronological. Like, give you a journey through them. And I'm not exactly following it, but I'm kind of close. I'm following it a little bit. The Silence is an interesting film where Bergman, who writes in. credible dialogue, challenged himself to have a lot less of it in one of his films. And there's really only like three main characters in it. And in the first scene with one of them on a train,

she is doing the Joey cough into a handkerchief and a bunch of blood is on it. Well, I don't watch his movies because I already have a Bergman. That's Steven Spielberg. He's the number one Bergman for me. And you look in the mirror and you are a bird man. So owner of a parrot. Yeah, yeah. That's true.

true to. Don't worry, Henry. I will read all my Marvel omnibuses that I have on my desk and stuff like that. Of course. Spider-Man, Volume 1. Of course, man. The Web of the original Web of series, they won't like collapse one day and just kill me because they're just sitting there collecting dust. Yeah. It was my last move that made me go like, I simply cannot allow myself to buy any more Marvel omnibuses. My Blu-ray collecting is at least lighter these days, at least as far as sheer weight comparatively to a Marvel omnibus. Enough of physical media freakery. here. I did also update this. I'll put it on the record of a podcast too. I promise I will not buy that Kubrick box set. Oh, dot dot dot, until it is at least 50% off. Okay.

Still so expensive. Yes. That's still too much. Yeah. No, 300 for it is too much. And again, I will be a sucker if I buy it. I will try to stay strong because I own most of them, including the criterion versions, in 4K. I don't need another copy of Eyes Wide Shut in 4K. Just like in Looney Tunes, you have turned into an actual sucker in front of my eyes. Bob right now is holding up the screwball side. So yes, Homer has to sadly march back to the power plant. A beautiful sad walk animation as well that the imperfect, just like a little bridge burning instantly, as soon as Homer walks back, acid rain comes out of nowhere and

melts his jacket that he only gets to wear for about 30 seconds before it is destroyed. And it's so deadly that the security guard puts on it like a gas mask. I think grading is a little side-eyeing it on the commentary too. Like, what? This is so extreme. So Homer first thinks he can walk in through the applicant's door. And then we get the great joke of, no, they have a separate supplicant's door. The opposite of applicant is a supplicant. A good wordplay.

Good word. And we don't know what happens in that tunnel, but apparently it's very dirty. Graining on the commentary of this episode says, oh, I love how all these jokes are like so cinematically presented and the camera angles. And I want to shake him and be like, it's because of you that they stopped doing that. Yes. I know. When Homer comes out of that tunnel, like we're looking down at him, right? Oh, yeah.

It's nice. I don't know if you guys noticed. I posted it on Blue Sky, but I watched that scene a couple times out of I was taking notes. And I noticed something weird And I got the freeze frame His muzzle Disconnects from his mouse In a way that I've never seen in the symptoms before

Where it looks like the paste on For if they were doing the animation And it's like too low Right Oh yeah yeah I'm scanning through Frankie Yack It just seems like a layer was Oh yeah I see it there

Like a layer slipped Yeah exactly A cell layer slipped But you're right Justin 21 years ago on these commentaries Graney's like Why don't we do this anymore And you know I'm still waiting

I'm looking to my watch screen Yeah You have the power It's because of you Yeah. No, I know it bugs me. And again, we're watching when he's saying that they are working on the season that we're also covering right now where they are in so much more. And I, great animators work on it who are trying to do their best on it. But they have so many, like some of it is budget, some of it is time and all that. But also, yeah, they were told flat staging. Get it back to flatter staging. Graning says it always where he's like, I like comedy proscenium style. Yeah. Kind of see everything. As opposed to like, like, flat. Like the joke earlier in this episode where like the door closed and then opens,

it's like from a high angle the door comes in like a movie, for example. You wouldn't really get that anymore. Oh, go ahead, Henry. It generally comes off as a lack of trust in their animators to make a joke funnier when actually that's what they're so fucking good at and why the show is great. Yeah. I also feel that like in this era especially, every drawing of a character is between 2 to 5% off model and that makes it memorable.

And now as the years go on, everything gets more locked down and regimented and just pushed into these very limited forms when we remember the funnier drawings in the show because they don't stick to the rules. They break the rules in ways that we're not even aware of, but it's like, oh, it'd be funnier if Homer's eyes were a little bigger here, and that's a funny drawing to remember.

And now it's just like, well, Homer's face looks identical in every frame. It feels like someone at a party told Matt Grining, like, ah, you know, they go off model every now and then. Feels a little cheap, and it, like, just got in his head of like, okay, things that are on model means that it's, like, expensive and they take care of it. But then he loves Fleischer cartoons.

And that is the definition of going off model all the time. He is a complicated man. But like it's the reason why I kind of got tired of watching Bob's Burgers. I watched like five or six seasons. Then I thought, I have seen everything these people can do physically. It's visually tedious to me to keep watching that show. And then it sparked a whole, you know, everything is kind of including Simpsons, is animated Bob's Burgers, puppet-style.

Whenever I watch a new Bob's Burgers, I think it is still a funny show. But I kind of treat it more. like a radio play that is kind of. I watch it like I watch Dr. Katzer Home movies. Not that those weren't charmingly animated, but they were not amazingly animated. I wonder what the last 2D animated show

that didn't feel puppety and had more of those cinematic angles. Nothing comes to mind. I mean there's anime, of course. Well, sure. I think you mean like animated sitcoms? Yeah, like animated sitcoms in that style, yeah. Hard to say. Yeah, it's tough. I was always going to say BoJack Horseman, but no, it is so puppety. Oh, super puppety.

But it is that they do have some really great directors on it who push the limits on that as best they can on it. I even think of like kids animation 2D style like The Ducktails Show is great, but they're still trapped in that tune boom tweaking system. And it's like, ah, why? It can't be that much of a money saving, like, thing. But this is where Homer and Burns come to terms on their new deal. Yes, are you a new applicant?

Actually, I quit and I came to get my job back. Through there. So, come crawling back, eh? Seems like the classy thing to do would be not to call attention to it. Thanks for giving me my old job back. I'm afraid it's not that simple. As punishment for your desertion,

it's company policy to give you the plague. Uh, sir, that's the plaque. Ah, yes, the special demotivational plaque to break what's left of your spirit because, you see, you're here. forever. Don't forget, you're here forever.

The reveal that for this joke, in other times, Homer has a whole bunch of things he can monitor and clear glass on the walls, but for this joke, blue walls, nothing else on it, and just that sign. I remember in a video game going to Homer's, like, workstation, and looking for that, and it

wasn't there. I don't remember if it was the Simpsons game or virtual Springfield. It was one of those ones. Yeah, I guess it would have to be one of those because I feel like we don't visit that area in the older games. Yeah, now, man, I feel like in the recent Fortnite, I actually did, well, I didn't play it. My husband played it while I watched, but my wrist was broken at the time. I couldn't play. But watching it, I know you can visit Homer's Workstation, but now I wonder if the don't forget sign was there. I'm going to check this now online here. If I had to take a guess, yes, because there were so many little references in that game. So they were very good at references there. Okay, there's, let's see the image. And, ah, no, they don't have it.

It's a window into the world. Yes, they don't. People actually in this are complaining that they don't have it in his workstation. It's his regular workstation where you have a window into monitor the plant. Homer took it down. He's like, I don't need this anymore. It served its purpose. But yes, we were in 1995.

The threat is a job you'll have forever, and they even give you a personalized plaque when you return. It's the point. A job that we should point out, Homer does nothing at. He sleeps. He doesn't know how to use the controls. I guess if I really wanted to again put on the continuity police hat for our show, technically Homer doesn't have this job until he is rehired as the safety inspector in the third episode of the show Homer's Odyssey. So maybe he had to leave this cubicle. This is a different job. He had the job where he had to put his hands through the thing that you see in the opening credits and he had to move the nuclear elements. A perfect Burns joke, too, of like the plague. It's a plaques, sir.

It sets up the perfect ending, but I also love the drawing. Burns looks so funny as he's pointing at the words. It's a great line really, like, don't forget, you're here forever. He's just like indicating with his hand. It's a great drawing. I'm describing a drawing right now on a podcast, but if you could only see it, folks, You've had 31 years. Go check it out.

Hey, it's like Homer said. The words are painting a picture as vivid as any TV show. Yeah. That's how every listener to this podcast is just like lay back, close their eyes, and just imagine you guys talking. And so Homer is broken, but he heads home. He says he's going to keep it all inside, which is great that I feel like Merkin says this is from his own life. He's like, oh, I'm going to suffer in silence. I won't tell my partner about this.

I think probably most people can identify this like, oh, yeah, I won't put my troubles at work onto them. And like two bites into dinner, you're like, my stupid boss did this or were. Bob's really riding my ass today. In my case, it is more of stress of like family things or something. Henry keeps talking about box sets. Spider-Man again? Yes.

He will leave it, Spider-Man. That Marge also is very pleasant going, entering into labor. I know it's her third, but Justin, I imagine when the contractions begin, not as relaxing as Marge puts it on here. Well, for my son, they give you like a date. when the child is going to be born.

And because we live in Toronto and none of our, like, parents live here, Emily's mother came down for like two weeks, but the baby was not born during that period. So she had to go back. And then me and Emily had to go and she had to get, like, they have to induce the pregnancy because it's been too long at that point. Oh, okay. I see.

So not fun, a little stressful. Now, what did I make her watch, the beginning of loaded weapon, part one? And then she's like, no, enough of that. Please. And then some other movies that she liked on the laptop. I've told this story probably too many times for listeners, but my mom always tells me that she remembers the day I was born on the TV.

They were playing the Ronald Reagan classic Bedtime for Bonzo. So there's a very good chance it could have been called Bonzo. That explains your middle name. It did lead to a cute thing for me as a child. She would say bedtime for Bonzo when it's time to go to bed. Like she said it more than a few times. Wow. I think I was a doped up C-section baby, so my mother has no memories of my birth.

Yeah, my head was too big, so they had to get the pliers out to get me out. And when my son was born, not fun like it is in this episode because he was not breathing correctly. And so a bunch of doctors rushed in, and then they had to take him to the ICU. And they're like, we got to check it. He was breathing like a little breath every couple seconds. So not fun. No, man. And you probably had a funny one-liner set up for...

Oh, yeah. I was like what I was going to say, when I was going to cut the umbilical cord. Like, I don't know, let the race begin or something like that. But no. See, comedies, if only we could live in the world of comedy. Well, maybe not in David Merkin's world because it is a cruel and mean place. Although you get like the most sweetness he's ever exhibited at the end of this episode. He almost feel him gritting his teeth like in the commentary when the ending comes up.

Can't I undercut this, please? I do wonder if he let it happen partially because it was the first. female staff writer on the show doing it. That he's like, well, you know, this sweetness. I'd cut it down if one of the guys did it, but maybe cut it some slack because it was a young female writer he was giving a big chance to. I wish the script was online because they do mention that like the joke of marketing, that was in her original script.

But then they also talk about spending a lot of time trying to get the sign correctly to spell the words, do it for her. So maybe in her script, they had all her photos were on the wall, I imagine. and then they tried to elevate it with the covering up the words. They credit the wordplay to George Meyer, who usually was very good at the wordplay jokes in the show, that he would often joke were never worth the time for how long it to take the... John Vidi would say the same thing, too, like, boy, we work so hard on Bart change the letters around and a sign to make something funny, and it's not really worth it.

Guys, if you knew that decades later at Simpson Trivia, this would be the question that would stump everyone that was there. And so the kids are being born. We see Quimby as one of his many out of wedlock children with an unnamed woman. I always remember this is C-Captain standing next to a female partner, but no, he is alone. So who knows what? Again, I like to think if C-Captain is canonically by, but also he could just be gay, as many jokes have alluded to. But there's no visible female partner on this. So this could be surrogacy.

This could be, you know, a family member, something like that. And in any case, there is a bastard out there somewhere. Well, he could have sold it to Dr. Hibbert as well. Oh, yeah, yeah. Okay, that explains it. Thank you. That's how he got that new boat. Man, he explains it all.

And then meanwhile, Homer is just sick of this. Like, he's not sick. I mean, it's just great. Like, he's just so bored of it. Like, this is what you are as a viewer, the misdirect is you're seeing here. Homer doesn't care about Maggie. That's the joke. He's like, it's wonderful.

It's magical. Like, this baby has ruined my life. It's sort of like Bart's take when Marge announces the new baby. Bart's has been there, done that. Yes. They're not so special. anymore at that point, apparently. It reminds me of

the great joke in the Bart birth episode flashback where when Marge comes home, they high five that they are not pregnant. No fourth kids. Knocking the kids off the couch, I think. Yes, yeah, it's great.

Homer's like, yes, as he high fives. But this is where Homer finally has an epiphany. It's wonderful. It's magical. Oh, boy, here it comes, another mouth. One more push should do it. Marvelous.

Congratulations, Mr. Simpson. You have a beautiful, healthy baby. Okay. Only, I think someone is saying hello. Hello. Oh, it's a boy. And what a boy! Uh, that's the umbilical cord.

It's a girl. A girl! Oh, March, we have a wonderful boy. We have a wonderful baby girl. Not just a girl. The most beautiful baby girl in the whole world. Come on, Marge. Show a little enthusiasm.

And the kissing makes Maggie purse her lips and realize she needs a pacifier. Instantly. So we get the origin of the passfire instantly. It mysteriously comes from off screen somewhere, but that's the origin of that. Yep. Newborn Maggie is so cute.

And Homer's, like, terrified but loving reaction of like, hello there. Like, it's so cute too. Like, you're right, Bob. This is straining at the level of cuteness. Merkin will allow in it. But I love it. I love it. Merkin is trying to run in with a placenta joke to undercut all this stuff.

And James L. Brooks is like, no, no, no, no, no. We're keeping it like this. And then Homer falls in love with her instantly. Like, he views her as of another mouth until he meets her. And then you learn that Homer actually loves Maggie. He can forget about her, but I guess that's an argument again that's in the Simpsons movie, which is Homer isn't

actively an asshole. He just is incredibly forgetful and short-sighted. Yeah. I think a history of episodes would disprove that. I think he just has a drinking problem which explains all of the forgetfulness. But yeah, Homer thinks about Maggie all day and then forgets about her on the drive home.

That's how it works. While he's singing his song. Oh, yes. And it's such a cute little cutaway from that and that They then come back in the same style of writing of the old classic sitcom writing that this episode is built around. They come back to the original question

of like, but wait, why aren't there any pictures? Like how seemingly your story hasn't told us the reason you started this story. That's like, ah, but, and like, this just is like classic. This would be a thing and like leave it to beaver this kind of pacing. You know what?

There'd be a little more advanced of that. But it would be like all on the family, let's say. Like a Norman Lear type thing. Why don't we hear this? sweetest ending in Simpson's history. So you left her right from the start. Absolutely. Then why no pictures?

Oh, there are pictures. I keep them where I need the most cheering up. Oh. The Alph Clause and score is doing a lot of lift in there too. Yeah, you don't know what you got until it's gone. And Alclaassen did a lot of work to establish the musical texture of the show. and like with cues like that especially. But yeah, it's heartwarming and it's very clever.

So they're not just getting away with all the family hugs at the end. And it's like full house. It's like, well, no, we got this great wordplay on the wall that's also very significant. By seeing Do It for her every day, along with all of the very sweet pictures, it makes it understandable like Homer instead of suffering of looking at the demotivational plaque, it motivates him of like, well, you know, you have to do it for her. You have to like this is. And just the idea of.

of being a parent is doing it for her, as in you gotta do some things because it's not your life anymore. It's not just your life anymore. But I'm talking about it being touching as not a parent. Like Justin, right before recording, you showed us quite a home office declaration.

Yeah, after my son was born, probably in the first month, I came home one day and my wife was like, hey, look with me and Archie made you. And she had printed out all the photos of like one month old Archie, including one when she was in her stomach, like one of those, what are the call, it's not an x-ray. Ultrasound?

There you. Yeah. And she wrote, do it for her, but she scratched out the ER and put him right above it. So it's very cute. And it's above my desk right now. She even did the, like, frame that's in the episode as well for it. That is beautiful. Hey, he's a beautiful gift.

And you're looking at it as we're talking about the episode. Like, this episode has to touch you a bit here. Oh, yeah. I find this is a very sweet episode. Is it the sweetest episode? People always say this one and the one with Homer's mom, the two endings. Yeah, I mean, they're all around this time and also Lisa's wedding. Yeah, yeah.

But I did want to point out that while we record, I'm looking at my Do It for Bird plan. Meanwhile, I just look at all my Blu-rays and know that there could be somebody more. Why haven't you watched me? Yes, constant. Free me from my steel box. That is why I haven't. put back the box set over there because it is like literally like the huge eye from persona. So now it is like, oh, it is an eye watching me in judgment of like you haven't watched all

of these films yet. Bergman made 50 movies. Watch them. The good thing about all the photos that my wife used is that like, you know, babies when they're born for a couple months, they can't really make expressions because, you know, they don't react that way. So it's a bunch of like him raising an eyebrow like the rock or like him like looking like he's screaming. And you just know in most of them he's probably pooping because that's what that reaction would have caused. So Maggie is pooping in all of her photos. Oh, probably, yes. I mean, there's some funny drawings of Maggie in that.

There's like a really angry drawing of Maggie near the bottom left. Silverman says take a close look at those on the commentary. I think he's too modest to say he probably drew those. Oh, yeah. He worked on this, and it's important to note that, like, Silverman is like the first animator of the Simpsons, the second guy to ever draw them after Macraining, probably, and that Maggie is, I think, one of his favorites, if not his favorite. Like, he animated Maggie in the original shorts and made her into a real character.

He directed the first Maggie shorts, the longest daycare. I think he has a specific soft spot for Maggie. I mean, that's one of the things with Smack Graining is that I love that he made the deal that his name is on everything that is Simpsons related. But it does kind of diminish the work of other people, unless you're like a super fan, that you just automatically assume as a, Oh, Matt Grinning did everything. This drawing is Matt Graining or this.

Like, you guys have talked about before that one of the great things about Simpsonland, rest in peace, as it's probably going to go, is that there's a bunch of drawings with the animator's names on them. And that you can see particular style or particular things. That is related to that animator, like, for example, the David Silverman style. Yeah. They've never shown Matt Grading that room because he would burn it down. Yeah.

They're off model. It is a sad, I take it as just a sad irony that I do think Matt Graining, getting his name in that contractually was because he had come through the 80s and seen how in the 70s as a professional artist seeing how screwed over all of the people who created Marvel and DC characters and other creators got screwed over

and so he put it into his like, hey, you can't take away my name as the creator of this. And so to keep in a creator's rights thing, unfortunately then it makes it so on covers to Simpsons Comics, for instance, the artist can't sign their names because it goes counter to the contractual obligation from Fox to Matt Graining. I don't think Mac Grading likes that about it.

I'm not saying it's his fault, but it's a problem with the deal. Like that picture book we were talking about the uncensored one, if you look online, most people it says, buy Matt Graining. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, he did not do this. That's probably the good reads of credit on there. And it's like there's so many other people, but unfortunately, like, especially that comic book thing.

As a kid, I probably assumed Matt Graining. And that's funny that that's just an extension of the like Mickey Mouse strips that like back in the newspaper days that Walt Disney was putting his name on everything. And people assume he drew all those. It is good that in Simpsons Illustrated, I've been paging back through those recently too, that in that they don't put the names by the cartoons and who drew the cartoons. But by the time Bongo comics got going, they do at least in the interiors follow the rules of name writer, artist. that. But yes, perfect. Back to the episode, though, a perfect ending. I never thought it was too smaltzy. I'm glad they didn't go with a treacle cutter, as they would call it on some, like in this. I think they earned it too by having the most crazy and full of FUs of a flashback episode they had done

to that point. I guess you can count Lisa's Sacks, but this is really the last of the explaining the family lore episodes, really. Yes. Well, Mo's Rag. We get to learn where that came from, right? Yeah. We're Homer's Blue Pan. and like how Homer helped Mod give birth to Todd Klenders. Oh, my God. A lot of stuff is going on. Oh, and we learned how the Homer and Marge actually did meet each other,

but didn't realize they met each other as tweens. A summer camp. Yeah. A perfect episode. Well, Justin, thanks for joining us for the very first time. We'd be glad to have you back. But before then, let us know where we can find you online, what you're working on.

What is up with Justin the Clue. Thank you very much for having me, guys. I'm a big fan of the show, so it was an honor to be invited. You can follow me. I have a regular podcast called The Emple, important cinema club where it's me and my pal will sloan we just pick a movie topic sometimes a director writer sometimes just like a subgenre and we do a crash course every week in that topic you don't have to watch the movies they're fairly short they're like 25 minutes but just to like

introduce you to something and hopefully you want to keep listening because you'll learn about something new every week i just listened to your colorization one that done right after the passing of ted turner and it's really great one especially you know the riff tracks guys take a couple of hits on there has all been in colorization too. But it was great. And also you have a side comic book podcast too. Yeah, it's called the Very Fine Comic Book Podcast. With me, my pal, Mike Wood.

I have a lot of podcasts. As Will Sone likes to say, I'm more podcasts than man at this point. But it's just an excuse to talk with my friends about things that I like. So upcoming, I don't know if it'll be out by the time of this recording. Me and my co-hosted an episode on the Nine Lives of Garfield. So that's a fun one. We don't get deep into that. I'm going to listen to that one.

That one troubled me as a kid. Talk about childhood anxiety and animation. That one, it had some scary parts in it, of Garfield's deaths. There's a Bernie-Ritzen-esque Garfield comic, which are words that you never think that you put together. Oh, my God, that is in there, man. But, well, okay, I know what I'm listening to you soon. Well, hey, Jim Davis is entering the world of Magic the Gathering soon,

so perhaps the borders of Garfield can expand once again what they once did. There's going to be Magic the Gathering Garfield cards. So it's come to this, is what the title of those cards is. But thank you, Justin. Oh, thanks, guys. Thanks again to Justin DeKlu. Please check out the important Cinema Club podcast. But as for us, you want to support our shows and get them all ad-free and in advance

and also access a huge amount of podcast behind the Patreon paywall. Just go to patreon.com slash Talking Simpsons. Sign up. Again, you will get ad-free podcast. There are no ads on the Patreon. And you will also access an incredible amount of episodes from the past nine years of our Patreon. That includes episodes of mini-series like Talking Futuron. Talking of the Hill, Talking Critic, Blab and Batman, the animated series, and Talking Mission Hill.

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history, of behind the scenes, facts, of commentary from us about movies like this month we are covering Zootopia as part of our 2010's Disney Summer preceding it was Reckett Ralph and the 2011 Winnie

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And that's just the most recent one out of over eight years of What a Cartoon, movie podcast that you get in addition to all of the ad-free bonuses, Bob, mentioned before, too. We've covered all the Disney Renaissance, tons of classic Disney. A lot of bad movies, too,

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And if you're following me and Bob's accounts, don't forget to follow on Blue Sky and Instagram at Talk Simpsons Pod as the official account of this podcast. Whenever new things happen on the Patreon, on our free feeds, whenever we guest on other podcasts like say we hate movies or Michael and us, you will be up to date with that if you follow us on at Talk Simpsons pod. And don't forget that all of our previously released free podcasts for both Talking Simpsons and What a Cartoon can be found at Talking Simpsons.com. Thanks so much for listening, folks. We'll see you again next time for the latest episode of our community podcast. Talk to the audience and we'll see you then. Is that my workstation when suddenly... Attention American workers. Your plant has been taken over by an all-star team of freelance. terrorist.

I shift! Yep! Is 10, terrorists, 8. Homer, tell the story right. Okay. Homer, you should see a doctor. I don't think a healthy man can make that kind of smile.