Tangle - 2,000 protests and a parade.

Episode Date: June 16, 2025

The military parade and “No Kings” protests. On Saturday, the U.S. Army held a festival and parade in Washington, D.C., to commemorate its 250th anniversary, an event spearheaded by President Donald Trump. The same day, protesters gathered in over 2,000 cities across 50 states to demonstrate against the Trump administration. Ad-free podcasts are here!Many listeners have been asking for an ad-free version of this podcast that they could subscribe to — and we finally launched it. You can go to ReadTangle.com to sign up!You can read today's podcast⁠ ⁠⁠here⁠⁠⁠, our “Under the Radar” story ⁠here and today’s “Have a nice day” story ⁠here⁠.Take the survey:  What do you think of the parade and the protests? Let us know!Disagree? That's okay. My opinion is just one of many. Write in and let us know why, and we'll consider publishing your feedback.You can subscribe to Tangle by clicking here or drop something in our tip jar by clicking here. Our Executive Editor and Founder is Isaac Saul. Our Executive Producer is Jon Lall.This podcast was written by Isaac Saul and edited and engineered by Dewey Thomas. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75.Our newsletter is edited by Managing Editor Ari Weitzman, Senior Editor Will Kaback, Hunter Casperson, Kendall White, Bailey Saul, and Audrey Moorehead.  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Instacart, groceries that over-deliver. From executive producer, Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon and good evening and welcome to the Tangle Podcast, the place we get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking and a little bit of my take. Today is Monday, June 16th, and we're going to be covering some of the happenings from over the weekend, the military parade in Washington, DC, and the no Kings protests that took place basically all across the country, as far as I can tell. Before we jump in, I do want to give you a heads up on a couple of things. First of all, on Friday, we publish a special edition on Israel strikes in Iran. It's unusual for us to publish an episode like that

on Friday. So in the event you missed it, I encourage you to go check it out. On Sunday, we released our weekly podcast where we discussed Camille's interview with Rand Paul, our visit to representative Jake Auchincloss, some of the unrest in Los Angeles, and also a convo about renaming our podcast,

which we're gonna be relaunching pretty soon. So some fun fodder there for the true fans. And also on Sunday, I wanna give you a heads up that we published a really awesome reader essay for Father's Day from a reader who just recently discovered that he had an 18 year old daughter. It's a pretty captivating piece. It's in the Sunday newsletter and it's up on our website

if you want to go check it out. Finally, all this content for what it's worth, you can get ad free and straight to your inbox or in a special podcast feed when you become a Tangle member. Memberships are what keep the lights on here at Tangle. They unlock those Friday editions and Sunday editions. They unlock ad-free podcasts.

If you're annoyed with the big ad roles at the front or in the middle of the podcast, you can get rid of those. You can do that by just going to readtangle.com slash membership, where you can become a member. It's less than $5 a month when you just subscribe to either the newsletter or the podcast. And you can bundle the two of them together for just $99 a year, which is still really affordable compared to what everybody else is doing.

So encourage you to go do that. Retangle.com slash membership. You know, pull over your car first. Don't do it right now while you're doing whatever you're doing. But put the phone down or pick the phone up or you know what I'm saying. Don't distract the right now while you're doing whatever you're doing, but put the phone down or pick the phone up or stay. You know what I'm saying. Don't distract the driving or something. That's when I listen to my podcast. All right, I'm gonna send it over to Will for today's main podcast and I'll be back for my take. Thanks, Isaac. All right, let's move on to today's quick hits.

Number one, law enforcement arrested a suspect in the killing of Minnesota State House Leader Melissa Hortman and her husband and the attempted killing of State Senator John Hoffman and his wife. The suspect is charged with two counts each of second degree murder and second degree attempted murder. Number two, Israel and Iran traded attacks for the fourth consecutive day with Israel claiming to have killed Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps intelligence chief Mohammed Kazemi and Iran striking an Israeli oil refinery in several locations in and around Tel Aviv. Israel says Iran strikes have killed 24 people,

and Iran says Israel's strikes have killed 224 people. Separately, President Donald Trump reportedly rejected an Israeli plan to assassinate Iran's supreme leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei. Number three, President Trump reportedly instructed immigration and customs enforcement officials to pause immigration raids and arrests in the agricultural, hospitality, and restaurant industries, which Trump recently acknowledged had been negatively impacted by his immigration crackdown.

Number four, President Trump signed legislation blocking California from banning the sale of new gas-powered cars by 2035. The measures revoke the Environmental Protection Agency waivers that enabled California's EV rule. And finally, number five, flash flooding in San Antonio killed at least 13 people over the weekend. ["The Daily Show"] There have been rallies across the country opposing President Trump's agenda on the day of the president's military parade.

They cap a week of demonstrations against immigration raids that began in Los Angeles and spread nationwide. Today's events in about 2,000 cities and towns were organized by the No Kings Movement, which calls the administration's actions authoritarian. There were rallies near Mr. Trump's Mar-a-Lago residence in West Palm Beach, Florida. No lights, no KKK, no fascist USA. In Boston, where it was raining, in Atlanta, with Proud Boy counter protesters looking on, And in Philadelphia, the flagship no-kings rally. Local officials urged protesters to demonstrate peacefully and avoid blocking roads.

On Saturday, the U.S. Army held a festival and parade in Washington, D.C. to commemorate its 250th anniversary, an event spearheaded by President Donald Trump. The same day, protesters gathered in over 2,000 cities across 50 U.S. states to demonstrate against the Trump administration. The parade commemorated the 250th anniversary of the Second Continental Congress, voting to create the Continental Army

after the first battles of the Revolutionary War had Lexington and Concord. In his first term, President Trump had pushed for a parade to celebrate the US Armed Forces, but planning was halted due to cost and logistical challenges. The Army had been planning festivities to mark the occasion prior to the start of Trump's second term, but did not begin parade preparations until April. The event also coincided with President Trump's 79th birthday. Approximately 6,700 soldiers participated in the parade, which

also featured roughly 84 military vehicles and 50 aircraft. President Trump framed the event as a celebration of America's military achievements, remarking, quote, every other country celebrates their victories. It's about time America did too. That's what we're doing tonight. Also on Saturday, no King's protests were held across the country. Organizers said the protests were quote, the largest single day mobilization

since president Trump returned to office, calling them a rejection of quote, authoritarianism, billionaire first politics, and the militarization of our democracy. They also said the demonstrations were timed as a, quote, direct response to Donald Trump's self-aggrandizing $100 million military parade. Organizers from Indivisible estimated that millions of people participated and a litany of progressive organizations, including the ACLU,

Common Cause and the Service Employees International Union helped plan and support the demonstrations. Quote, No Kings is really about standing up for democracy, standing up for people's rights and liberties in this country, and against the gross abuse of power that we've seen consistently from the Trump administration. The ACLU's chief political and advocacy officer, Deirdre Schieffelin said, the protests were largely peaceful with only a few reports of confrontations with police.

However, at a protest in Salt Lake City, Utah, a bystander was killed when security officials shot at an armed man in the crowd. Additionally, police said a man intentionally drove an SUV through protests in Culpepper, Virginia. The man has been arrested and no injuries have been reported, though at least one person was struck by the car. Lastly, authorities in Texas briefly shut down a planned demonstration at the state Capitol following reports of a credible threat against lawmakers planning to attend. The protest eventually went ahead and one arrest was made in connection to the threats. Today

we'll share views from the right and the left on the military parade and the no-kings protests. Then Isaac gives his take. We'll be right back after this quick break. When does fast grocery delivery through Instacart matter most? When your famous grainy mustard potato salad isn't so famous without the grainy mustard. When the barbecue's lit, but there's nothing to grill.

When the in-laws decide that actually they will stay for dinner. Instacart has all your groceries covered this summer. So download the app and get delivery in as fast as 60 minutes. Plus enjoy $0 delivery fees on your first three orders, service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart, groceries that over-deliver.

Here's what the right is saying. The right criticizes the message and organizing themes behind the No Kings protests. Some suggest the value offered by the military parade was not worth the cost. Others say the left continues to protest ineffectively against Trump. In the Daily Caller, Adam Johnston said the No Kings protesters are wrong about flag dead. When the left speaks of defending our sacred democracy, what they really mean is defending their hold on institutional power while utilizing regime aligned direct action events like no Kings to intimidate their legitimate political opposition.

Johnston wrote. Despite the left's fear mongering and rhetoric about Trump acting as a king, his presidency has been marked not by unchecked power, but by the subversion and nullification of his legitimate executive power under Article Two of the US Constitution, while fighting constant resistance from within the very institutions he was elected to lead. When the left cries no kings, as Trump attempts to exercise his authority to remove criminal legal

aliens from the country, it is not fighting against despotism. It is fighting against the reassertion of national sovereignty," Johnston said. Ultimately, judging by the Mexican flag-waving rioters in Los Angeles, No Kings means no borders and eventually no country. Trump is not a king. He is a duly elected president attempting to dismantle a hostile regime that treats democracy as a slogan and subversion as a sacrament. In reason, Billy Binion criticized the military parade as a waste. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. The parade will, however, objectively be big,

from the contents of the parade itself, 25 M1 Abrams main battle tanks, dozens of other military vehicles, aircraft, 6,600 soldiers marching to the price tag, which is currently estimated to come out somewhere between $25 million and $45 million for an approximately 90 minute event. That comes out to $277,788 to $500,000 per minute, Binyon wrote. A majority of Americans, it turns out, do not think that big cost is beautiful. 60% of respondents in a recent poll said the parade is not a good use of taxpayer money. The

millions of dollars the public is paying to fund the parade, which will take place on Saturday, Trump's 79th birthday, are peanuts, the president said, when compared to the value. Yet, it is difficult to reconcile that position with one of his hallmark campaign promises, reigning in wasteful government spending, Binion said. Indeed, during the 2024 campaign, Trump promised to slash $2 trillion, the size of the budget deficit in federal spending. campaign, Trump promised to slash $2 trillion, the size of the budget deficit in federal spending. That was always a bit hard to believe, particularly when considering the immense amount he had added to the national debt during his

first term, trillions of dollars of which came before the COVID-19 pandemic. In the Wall Street Journal, Kimberly A. Strassel wrote about diminishing protest returns. Political memories are short, but none more fleeting than that of the democratic collective. We've been doing this for nearly a decade, and always to the left's detriment, Strassel said. A brief walk down protest lane. In the opening months of Mr. Trump's first presidency, the resistance staged the Women's March, airport protests against his travel ban, demonstrations against pipeline projects, a day without Latinos, a day without

immigrants, not my president's day, Resist Trump Tuesday, protests for transgender rights, a day without a woman, a tax march on April 15th, a March for Science, and May Day protests. Aside from a few images of ladies in funny pink hats howling at the sky, do you remember any of it? The protestors' history, message, and tactics are, in any event, obscuring any moral claim. Ten years into Mr. Trump's political career, this looks and feels like any other protest of Mr. Trump. I.E. like a partisan moment, Strassel wrote. The bigger problem for Democrats? For too many weary Americans,

it continues to feel as if protest is all the left's got. The foot stomping is unaccompanied by serious plans for immigration reform or an outreach to Republicans on a way forward or a discussion or regret for the mistakes that led to their loss last November. It's all outrage. Now onto what the left is saying. The left mostly criticizes the military parade as a partisan exercise with ominous undertones.

Some say the No King's protests were a success and demonstrated the popular opposition to Trump. Others argue Trump is politicizing the military as a tool to consolidate power. In Vox, Zach Beecham called the military parade a warning. Donald Trump's military parade in Washington this weekend, a show of force in the Capitol that just happens to take place on the president's birthday, smacks of authoritarian, dear leader style politics," Beecham wrote. The totality of Trump administration policies, ranging from the parade in Washington to the

LA troop deployment to Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth's firing of high ranking women and officers of color suggests a concerted effort to erode the military's professional ethos and turn it into an institution subservient to the Trump administration's whims. For all its faults, the U.S. military's professional ethos is a really important part of its identity and self-conception. While few soldiers may actually read Sam Huntington or similar scholars, the general idea that they serve the people in the Republic is a bedrock principle among the ranks. There's a reason why the United States has never, in over 250 years of governance, experienced a military coup," Beecham said. But we don't really know how the

U.S. military will respond to a situation like this. Like so many of Trump's second term policies, their efforts to bend the military to their will are unprecedented, actions with no real parallel in the modern history of the American military. In the Philadelphia Inquirer, Will Bunch wrote, At no kings millions of Americans show the flag is mightier than the tank. The 47th president had hoped to rule over Flag Day by deploying the artillery of a strutting strongman in his long-awaited

DC parade that rolled 28 Abrams M1A2 tanks and striker armored personnel carriers into the Capitol as Black Hawk helicopters and fighter jets buzzed at the wet and muggy skies, Bunch said. But Trump had already been defeated in the streets by everyday citizens who stopped his immoral invasion against the soul of America with a thin red, white and blue wall. On an unforgettable day when several million regular folks marched for an event called No Kings, the American flag was mightier than the tank.

The overriding message from no kings was one of courage. The organizers were never looking for unrest, but simply for big numbers. Not to show just other Americans, but an increasingly anxious world that Trump and ICE are not acting in their name. The longer term hope is that massive resistance from the people will change not only the warped media narrative after Trump's 2024 election, but also convince enough lawmakers on Capitol Hill to block his extreme agenda," Bunch wrote. Saturday's vibe shift was clearly felt in Washington, where the tank-driven parade that

so many feared would provide a chilling glimpse of North Korea-spiced totalitarianism on the Potomac turned out to be a surprisingly low energy affair. In the Atlantic, Graham Parsons said the parade was another step in an ongoing effort to turn the U.S. military into a partisan and personal instrument of the president. A mark of a free society is that its public institutions, especially its military, represent the body politic and the freedom enabling equal rights that structure civic life. If service members and the public begin to believe that the military is not neutral, but is in fact the servant of MAGA, this will threaten the military's legitimacy and increase

the likelihood of violent conflicts between the military and the public," Parsons wrote. The organizers have made it abundantly clear that the parade's purpose is to directly laud Trump and his politics. In promotional materials, they tell us, quote, under President Trump's leadership, the Army has been restored to strength and readiness. They credit his quote, America first agenda for military pay increases, enlarged weapons stockpiles, new technologies, and improvements in recruitment. The president now routinely speaks to uniform service members in his red MAGA hat, using his trademark rhetoric centering himself and belittling,

even demonizing his critics. He openly suggests a special alliance between him and the military. At Fort Bragg on Tuesday, for instance, Trump encouraged uniform soldiers to cheer his political agenda and boo his enemies, Parsons said. This is all extremely dangerous. Keeping the military a politically neutral servant of the constitutional order, not the president or his political ideology is vital to ensuring the security of civil society. All right.

Now back to Isaac for his take. Alright, that is it for the left and the right, which brings us to my take. So if you had asked me my feelings about the protest and the parade on Friday before either of them had played out, my reaction would have been pretty pessimistic. The parade seemed like a glorified birthday party that I felt was fundamentally un-American. I was concerned that the protests could break out into violence, and I was particularly worried that the protests would clash with the parade

in some meaningful, dangerous way. I did not make any of these predictions publicly, so I could pretend I never had these thoughts, but I did have them and I was wrong on all accounts. The No Kings protests managed to be both widespread and entirely peaceful. I leveled some harsh criticism toward the bad eggs demonstrating in Los Angeles,

so it's only fair to call out how remarkably without incident these protests were. Tens of thousands of people hit the streets in Philly alone, and I even heard of protests organized in the tiny west Texas town where I have a home, despite it being one of the most rural places in America. I saw zero reports of protesters causing any significant property damage or violently instigating the police, despite millions of people participating across the country. A couple of protests in Los Angeles and Portland got a little heated later in the day on Saturday,

but they seemed to be more of an extension of the ongoing anti-ice demonstrations, and they were unrelated to the mass No King's effort. Given how big the protests were, this is a really incredible achievement worth celebrating. As for the parade, it ended up just not generating that much interest. It was a kind of sleepy affair that seemed to be organized poorly. It had some genuinely embarrassing moments like soldiers carrying drones instead of flying

them, but also some genuinely cool moments that showed off the incredible components of the US military. Trump did not make the parade about himself, as many critics anticipated, but instead focused on celebrating the 250 year history of the army. All the people hand wringing about how it would end up as a kind of dictatorship on display also vastly overplayed their hands. A lot of people showed up. They soaked in the interesting procession of US history.

They marveled at the tanks in the street. They gazed at the military aircraft overhead. And then they went home. Is the country fundamentally changed now? Are we like Russia or North Korea? Is Trump more like Putin? I think obviously not. It really was just a parade. The events seemed kind of interesting and slightly boring. It was a conspicuous example of wasteful government spending at a time when the administration says it's focused on saving money. But aside from that, I found it wholly unoffensive. In terms of their broader implications, the No Kings protests seemed far more significant to me.

The Democratic resistance to Trump has been pretty uninspired over the first few months of Trump's second term, but this weekend was a total shift in energy. It reminds me of the Women's March in 2017 that set the tone for protest activity and a string of electoral victories throughout Trump's term. No Kings is also an example of a strong, simple, attractive messaging that Democrats have desperately lacked. And I think it's a message that will resonate with a lot of independent and moderate voters who fear Trump's pension for power grabs. Certainly is an appealing message to me.

I don't want any Kings here. And finally, on the note of comparisons to modern despotisms in North Korea and Russia, 5 million plus people in 2100 towns just hit the streets to protest Trump without any limitations to their free speech. None of them were arrested or disappeared. None of them were thrown into a gulag. There was no organized attempt to limit their constitutional rights in any meaningful or

noticeable way. They all just went out in public, chanted critical things about their president, often escorted and protected by local or state police while holding up some offensive signs and saying pretty much whatever they wanted. To all the people worried about us slipping into authoritarianism, that simple fact should serve as a clear reminder that we are still a long way from becoming hungry or Russia. We live in a great big free country where you're allowed to say publicly that you hate your president and not get meaningfully punished for it. And that's a blessing. I found all of this, the peaceful organization

and appealing message of the protesters, the uneventful and kind of cool parade, the celebration of our armed forces without any clashes with protesters, quite heartening. And altogether, an incredible picture of patriotism. On the exact same weekend, both sides of the American tribal politics got to hit the streets to celebrate our military or protest the president, and they did so without any issues.

These moments that provide genuine political optimism can be so easily overshadowed, so we should celebrate when our messy pluralistic society produces some perfectly acceptable political expression. We'll be right back after this quick break. When does fast grocery delivery through Instacart matter most? When your famous grainy mustard potato salad isn't so famous without the grainy mustard? When the barbecue's lit but there's nothing to grill. When the in-laws decide that actually they will stay for dinner. Instacart has all your groceries covered this summer.

So download the app and get delivery in as fast as 60 minutes. Plus, enjoy zero dollar delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart. Groceries that over deliver. All right, that is it for my take, which brings us to your questions answered. This one is from Daniel in Chicago, Illinois, who said, what recourse does the judicial branch have if the president refuses to obey the court's ruling? Wouldn't

Congress need to start impeachment proceedings? What are the odds of this Congress, which has been sitting on its hands thus far, actually doing anything? So a few months ago when I was on paternity leave, Ari Weitzman, our managing editor, sat down with Ray Bresher, a professor at Albany Law School, and actually asked him some questions about the legality of the Department of Government Efficiency and the executive branch not spending federal budget. Brescher told us how a court order or congressional dictate is enforced if someone in the executive

branch defies it. Congress can impeach and remove them if there are the votes, he said, but individual agency heads can be impeached and removed if they don't follow the law as well. So yes, impeachment is a normal tool to use if Congress believes that the president or any member of the executive branch is defying the law. However, that scenario is probably not likely under the current Congress, which has a Republican majority in both chambers. And since a two-thirds majority is needed for a conviction in an impeachment proceeding,

a congressional proceeding generating legal ramifications is even more unlikely. Impeachment is not the only potential recourse though. Federal judges can find an agent of the executive branch in contempt of court, bringing criminal charges to a specific person. Judges can convict government agents of criminal contempt, which would carry jail time,

but have to be enforced by the US attorney and could be pardoned, or civil contempt, which would impose fines and is not pardonable. Enforcing charges against federal agents would involve the U.S. Marshals potentially creating an intergovernmental power struggle that could trigger a constitutional crisis. All this would be pretty significant steps, but it also isn't something we think is too likely to happen. As we've mentioned before, the Trump administration has complied with every court order it has received thus far.

All right, that is it for your questions answered. I'm going to send it back to Will for the rest of the pod and I'll see you guys tomorrow. Have a good one. Peace. Thanks, Isaac. Picking things back up here with our Under the Radar story. On Tuesday, June 17th, the Senate is set to vote on the Genius Act, a bill that would create a legal framework for regulating stable coins, a type of cryptocurrency designed to

maintain a relatively stable value. The legislation would require these coins to be fully backed by US dollars or similarly liquid assets, establish annual audits for issuers with more than $50 billion in market capitalization, and add compliance guidelines for foreign issuers. The House of Representatives is advancing its own stablecoin legislation separately, and the two bills differ in how they would regulate stablecoins at these state and federal levels. But if passed, the Senate bill would need house approval before it heads

to president Trump's desk. The block has the story and we'll put a link to it in today's episode notes. Now on to today's numbers section. I'm going to read today's number section a little differently than normal just to try to make the information flow a little bit more cohesively for listeners. First off, prior to Saturday the year of the last US military parade which celebrated the end of the Gulf War was 1991. Next, the estimated cost of Saturday's parade in Washington, D.C. was $40 million. Next, the weight in tons of military equipment used in Saturday's parade was 45 million tons.

Next, the percentage of U.S. adults who said they opposed the use of government funds for the military parade in Washington, D.C. was 64%. And that's according to a May-June NBC News Survey Monkey poll. A few other numbers from that poll. The percentage of Democrats and independents who oppose the use of government funds for the military parade was 88% of Democrats and 72% of independents. Next, the percentage of Republicans who supported the use of government funds for the military parade was 65%. Next, the approximate number of no-kings protesters in the United States on Saturday was 5 million protesters, according to organizers.

And finally, the estimated number of protesters in Los Angeles was 200,000. The estimated number in Philadelphia was 100,000. And the estimated number in Seattle was 100,000, and the estimated number in Seattle was 70,000. And let's bring things home with our Have a Nice Day story. A survey by Road Scholar, a nonprofit that provides education and travel services to seniors, found 94% of those aged 50 to 98 reported higher levels of happiness if they, quote, aged adventurously. The respondents defined the term as staying physically active,

traveling, and continuing to learn as they age. Some even said they feel just as happy as they did in their 20s and 30s. Good, Good, Good has this story. And again, we'll put the link to it in our episode notes. All right, that is it for today's edition. We will be back on Tuesday. Until then, have a great rest today's edition. We will be back on Tuesday. Until then, have

a great rest of your day. See ya. Our executive editor and founder is me, Isaac Saul, and our executive producer is John Lowell. Today's episode was edited and engineered by Dewey Thomas. Our editorial staff is led by managing editor Ari Weitzman with senior editor Will K. Back and associate editors Hunter Tasperson, Audrey Morehead, Bailey Saul, Lindsay Knuth, and Kendall White. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75. To learn more about Tangle and to sign up for a membership, please visit our website at retangle.com. When does fast grocery delivery through Instacart matter most? When your famous grainy mustard potato salad isn't so famous without the grainy mustard. When the barbecue's lit,

but there's nothing to grill. When the in-laws decide that actually they will stay for dinner. Instacart has all your groceries covered this summer, so download the app and get delivery in as fast as 60 minutes. Plus, enjoy $0 delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart. Groceries that over-deliver.