Tangle - House Republicans launch Fani Willis investigation.

Starting point is 00:00:00 Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages six months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at flucellvax.ca.

Starting point is 00:01:00 From executive producer Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, and welcome to the Tangle podcast, a place we get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking, and a little bit of my take. a place where you get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking, and a little bit of my take. I'm your host, Isaac Saul, and on today's episode, we're going to be talking about Republicans' investigation into Fannie Willis. House Republicans announced they are going to be executing a probe against Willis, looking into her investigation into Donald Trump in Georgia. We're going to talk about

Starting point is 00:01:42 what's happening, what it means, what might come of it, as always, with some views from the right and the left. Before we jump in, unfortunately, we do have to issue a correction today. In yesterday's edition of Tangle, we erroneously referred to Vivek Ramaswamy as a young, successful immigrant in the My Take section. Elsewhere, we correctly noted that Ramaswamy is the child of immigrants. He was born in the United States in Ohio, though he frequently discusses their immigration story on the campaign trail. This section should have said something to the effect of Ramaswamy's immigration story rather than explicitly calling him an immigrant. A few readers also noted that we once referred to Ramaswamy as a nominee for president. While this is technically

Starting point is 00:02:25 correct, a nominee is basically synonymous with candidate. In common political parlance, it denotes someone who has won their party's nomination, which Ramaswami obviously hasn't, and we should have described him as a candidate. Thanks as always to all the eagle-eyed readers and listeners out there. We appreciate you. And even minor corrections like this give us a chance to update our stories online. This is the 90th correction in Tangle's 214-week history and our first correction since August 22nd. We track these corrections and place them at the top of the podcast and the newsletter in an effort to maximize transparency with readers. All right, with that out of the way, we're going to jump in with some quick hits. First up, the United States announced $250 million of additional military aid to Ukraine,

Starting point is 00:03:21 surpassing $43 billion of total military aid since Russia invaded. President Biden requested another $24 billion in aid earlier this month. Number two, Hurricane Adalia strengthened to a Category 3 hurricane and made landfall in Florida this morning. Number three, Miami Mayor Francis Suarez suspended his campaign for president, becoming the first Republican presidential candidate to drop out. Number four, U.S. job openings fell to the lowest levels in more than two years, according to new government data. And number five, former President Donald Trump has raised over $9.4 million since his mugshot was released, including close to $3 million in merchandise sales with the image of the mugshot on them, according to his campaign. The House Judiciary Committee is launching an investigation into Fulton County

Starting point is 00:04:15 District Attorney Fannie Willis, questioning her, quote, motivations for prosecuting former President Donald Trump. Meantime, on Capitol Hill, House Judiciary Committee Chair Jim Jordan sent a letter to the Fulton County District Attorney, Fawnie Willis, demanding information related to her investigation. And right now, a federal House committee is launching a probe into Fulton County District Attorney Fawnie Willis' handling of the indictment of former President Donald Trump and 18 other co-defendants. It is also demanding she turn over information on the investigation. On Thursday, House Republicans announced an investigation into Willis, the district attorney in Fulton County, Georgia, who is charging former President Trump and 18 co-conspirators

Starting point is 00:05:02 with felony racketeering in an attempt to overturn the 2020 election. Trump specifically is being charged with unlawfully pressuring Georgia officials to reverse his 2020 defeat. The House Judiciary Committee announced its investigation into Willis just hours before Trump was set to report to jail for his mugshot on Thursday. The chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, Jim Jordan, wrote to Willis asking if her investigation was coordinated with the U.S. Justice Department, including special counsel Jack Smith, and if she was using federal tax dollars in the investigation. Jordan's inquiry was aimed at discovering whether Willis collaborated with any Biden administration

Starting point is 00:05:38 officials and if her office received any federal funds. In his letter, Jordan accused Willis of carrying out a politically motivated prosecution. Turning first to the question of motivation, it is noteworthy that just four days before this indictment, you launched a new campaign fundraising website that highlighted your investigation into President Trump, Jordan wrote. Additionally, the forewoman of the special grand jury you convened to investigate President Trump earlier this year bragged during an unusual media tour about her excitement at the prospect of subpoenaing President Trump and getting to swear him in. Jordan also criticized Willis for the timing of the investigation,

Starting point is 00:06:15 noting that charges were not brought for two and a half years, meaning they've now come down in the heart of campaign season. He also argues that the charges seek to criminalize conduct of federal officials acting in their official capacities. In count 22, for example, the indictment seeks campaign season. He also argues that the charges seek to criminalize conduct of federal officials acting in their official capacities. In count 22, for example, the indictment seeks to criminalize under Georgia law internal deliberations within the DOJ, including in a meeting where a formal DOJ official requested formal authorization from his superiors to take an official act, Jordan wrote. And in count one, the indictment seeks to criminalize under Georgia law, the White House chief of staff arranging meetings and phone calls for the

Starting point is 00:06:49 president. Jordan requested all documents and communications related to any receipt of federal funds, any communications between the Fulton County District Attorney's Office and the Justice Department, and all other communications between the Fulton County Office and executive branch officials. He gave Willis until September 7th to turn those documents over. This is the second time Republicans who have a narrow majority in the House have launched a probe into criminal investigations against the former president. Previously, they launched an investigation into Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg, who brought charges against Trump for alleged hush money payments to a porn star during the 2016 campaign.

Starting point is 00:07:26 Bragg responded by suing Jordan for a campaign of intimidation. Today, we're going to break down some of the responses to this investigation with views from the right and saying. The right supports the investigation in Tiffany Willis, arguing that her actions amount to an abuse of power. Some praise Jordan for fighting back against the powerful forces that are conspiring to take down Trump. Others say there are more than enough questions about Willis' conduct to justify an investigation. In The American Spectator, Jeffrey Lord praised Jordan for taking a leading role in the fight against the weaponization of government. Willis' prosecution of Trump is a brazenly corrupt enterprise engineered by a far-left prosecutor

Starting point is 00:08:24 who used her Trump prosecution to raise campaign funds, Lord said, Trump represents an ongoing threat to the political establishment, so it's no surprise that massive corrupt prosecutors in Washington, New York, and now Georgia are coming after him. Fortunately, Jordan used his own power to push back against attempts to silence a former president. The significance of the House Judiciary's investigation cannot be underestimated, Lorde added. The hard fact here is that the American left and its Democrat Party operatives have set out and determined decidedly fascist authoritarian style to weaponize the American legal system to intimidate, silence, and imprison their political opponents and the opponents of

Starting point is 00:09:03 the Biden administration. Jordan is showing that despite the corruption on display, there are ways to fight back. In National Review, Andrew C. McCarthy said Willis is clearly acting on partisan grounds and has crafted an ill-conceived case designed to elevate her own political profile. Fannie Willis has a case. It's just not the case she brought, McCarthy said. Her partisan motivations are made clear by the fact that she could have charged Trump on a number of competently drawn charges, narrowly tailored to address state law offenses, but instead distorts the facts to paint Trump as a shrewd political mafia boss playing multi-dimensional chess, choreographing the diverse plots of compartmented crews.

Starting point is 00:09:49 Willis is an elected Democrat who seeks re-election next year, and her indictment is the progressive fever dream. The Trump-orchestrated insurrection, with all the villains the left loves to hate, Rudy Giuliani, Mark Meadows, John Eastman, Sidney Powell, Jeff Clark, et al., McCarthy wrote. But because Willis, like Smith, lacks proof of violence and hence proof of an actual insurrection, she is left groping for a unifying crime that would tie them all to the same conspiracy. In PJ Media, Chris Queen said the House Judiciary Committee has Willis in its sights. Jordan is making the case that Willis had a political motive to go after Trump, evidenced by the questionable timing of filing the charges now that the Republican presidential nomination process is underway, after two and a half years of conducting an

Starting point is 00:10:29 investigation without major updates. Jordan also intimates that the original schedule Willis set for the trial is meant to interfere with Georgia's GOP primary. Another issue that Jordan's letter to Willis' office addresses is that the investigation and upcoming trial implicate several significant federal interests. Those interests include acts that Trump and then Chief of Staff Mark Meadows engaged in while Trump was president and certain actions the Department of Justice took. The amount of federal funds Willis spent in this investigation is unknown, as is the extent to which she communicated with Special Counsel Jack Smith. All of these factors make Jordan's investigation warranted. All right, that is it for the rightist saying, which brings us back to

Starting point is 00:11:18 what the left is saying. The left is opposed to Jordan's investigation, but don't think it poses any real threats to Willis. Some argue Jordan is trying, in vain, to protect Trump from Willis' case against him. Others say the right is normalizing attacks against prosecutions they don't like. In MSNBC, Norman Eisen, John Stanton, and Fred Wertheimer said Willis should call Jordan's bluff. Jordan is running back the same playbook he used against Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg earlier this year. Interference, investigations, and intimidation. Jordan's move, however, is an abuse of power. The Constitution gives no express power to our

Starting point is 00:11:55 national legislature to engage in investigations, they wrote. But it has been understood since the very first Congress that the legislative body has such implied powers within Article 1. The limits of those powers have been emphasized ever since, including by Trump himself. Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight.

Starting point is 00:12:31 Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is nearly double the historic average of 52,000 cases. What can you do this flu season? Talk to your pharmacist or doctor about getting a flu shot. Consider FluCellVax Quad and help protect yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu

Starting point is 00:12:54 vaccine authorized in Canada for ages six months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at FluCellVax.ca. side effects and allergic reactions can occur and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at flucellvax.ca. Willis should call his bluff. If it comes to litigation, the courts will see through Jordan's efforts for the distracting and partisan political theatrics they are, they added. The careful balance of power between the states and the federal government, although long debated ever since our nation's founding and in the decades following, is now well-defined in all but the most extreme circumstances. This is not one. In the Washington Post, Greg Sargent said there's

Starting point is 00:13:34 nothing Jordan can do to save Trump from a jury's judgment. Jordan's game, using House investigations to protect Trump at all costs, is transparent, Sargent said, but this strategy carries substantial risks, as pursuing this investigation could force other Republicans to take difficult votes on future subpoenas, aligning them with Trump and putting their re-election at risk, without protecting Trump in any meaningful way. Accordingly, the whole project is almost surely a doomed charade at the outset. In his letter to Wills' office, Jordan hints at nefarious coordination between her and special counsel Jack Smith, but federal and state prosecutors often confer on cases with violations of federal and state law. And even if Jordan successfully subpoenas

Starting point is 00:14:15 Willis, she can fight back in court. In the grand scheme, even if Republicans did get everything they wanted from Jordan's investigation, it's unlikely to reveal anything that would derail the prosecution of Trump in any case. In the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Bill Torpy called the response to Willis' case against Trump part of a prosecutor's dilemma. The right's reaction to the charges against Trump in Georgia hits on familiar themes, with Republicans essentially calling Willis a radical left lunatic who's on a witch hunt. Jordan, a Trump toady, is leading the pack, but Willis also faces strong criticism from within Georgia, including a state senator who said he will ask the state's prosecuting attorney's qualifications commission, PAQC, to also investigate Willis. The truth, though, is that Willis is a hard-nosed prosecutor who has also brought cases against figures like rapper Young Thug and his associates that might make her a right-wing celebrity in a different context.

Starting point is 00:15:09 Instead, she's being targeted by Jordan and Georgia Republicans who want to sanction or even remove prosecutors for ethical violations or not properly doing their job. In reality, Torpy said, that's code for going after woke prosecutors. All right, that is it for the left and the right are saying, which brings us to my take. So I'm going to be honest here. I am getting a bit exhausted by all the investigations. Even as a political journalist whose job it is to keep up with this stuff, I find my own head spinning. Consider this. In the beginning of what feels like an endless stream of investigations since 2015, we had the FBI and Congress and the State Department investigate Hillary Clinton's emails,

Starting point is 00:16:00 which was turned on, then off, then on again, then off again by FBI Director James Comey right before the 2016 election. We also had Comey's FBI investigating the Trump campaign's ties to Russia. Then we got Special Counsel Robert Mueller taking over that investigation. Then we had the Inspector General, Michael Horowitz, investigate the investigators. Then we had a special counsel, John Durham, appointed by the new Attorney General, William Barr, investigate the origins of the investigation into Trump. When Durham released his final report, Democrats suggested they might even launch an investigation into his review of the investigation. All the while, we had the Manhattan District Attorney, Alvin Bragg, investigating Trump and eventually charging him for alleged hush money.

Starting point is 00:16:41 So, House Republicans launched an investigation into Bragg, which Bragg responded to by suing House Republicans. We also had the investigation into Hunter Biden, with a plea deal that fell apart, an investigation that Republicans also now want to investigate after a pair of IRS whistleblowers came forward with very credible allegations the investigation was corrupted. Now, we have a special counsel investigator for the Hunter Biden investigation, though it's the same person who headed the investigation in the first place. There's the investigation into Donald Trump's handling of classified documents, as well as the seemingly forgotten investigation into President Biden's handling of classified documents, which is still ongoing.

Starting point is 00:17:17 There is the investigation into the Trump campaign, the Trump organization, and Trump's alleged efforts to overturn the 2020 election. There is a federal probe and this state-level Georgia probe into those actions. And now there might be an investigation into the investigators for those investigations too. Are you having fun yet? Isn't America beautiful? I honestly have no idea how any American could possibly keep up with all this stuff and understand what is truly going on. And perhaps that is the point, what one or both sides want in order to simplify their talking points into something reductive like Trump is a criminal or Democrats are on a witch hunt. Frankly, there are

Starting point is 00:17:55 legitimate questions about Fannie Willis's investigation. As the reliable Never Trump or Ken White put it in his very even-handed piece on these charges, quote, no, Fannie Willis is not making tweets or phone calls into crimes, but maybe her indictment is a bit indulgent and gratuitous. As I wrote when this indictment came down, I think the Georgia indictment and Jack Smith's indictment cover the worst acts of Trump's presidency. That is a separate judgment from their purported criminality, but they do cover the actions Trump took as president that I find the most reprehensible. Of course, Trump's promises to share exonerating evidence of election fraud in Georgia is not one I expect him or his team to fulfill because the election in Georgia wasn't stolen. At the same time, there are many novel

Starting point is 00:18:38 arguments to Willis' investigation. There are very real questions about the logistics of how this trial might go down, and there is a very real chance the RICO statute she is using either don't hold up for some of the charges or don't convince a jury. Nothing about this is a slam dunk, and liberals should understand that Fannie Willis is not some infallible character in this story. It very well may be that she loses the case at trial, or the judges overseeing it significantly alter the contours of the charges. the case at trial or the judges overseeing it significantly alter the contours of the charges. It's also true, as Jordan notes in this letter, that Willis is an elected official who's campaigning at this very moment, and I'm sure she wants to squeeze as much juice out of this investigation for her political benefit as possible. Do Republicans have a right to know whether

Starting point is 00:19:19 federal funds were used in this indictment, or if Willis was coordinating with the Justice Department? Sure, they have some oversight here, at least it appears so to me, and if this is how they want to flex it, they can go ahead. That being said, Willis communicating with the Justice Department wouldn't be criminal or corrupt. It's actually pretty common in cases like this. Do I think this has any chance of impeding Willis' investigation or slowing down the trial or stopping Trump from being prosecuted? No, I don't. Further, as Sargent noted under what the left is saying, I think it has a real chance of blowing up in their faces. Pushing such an investigation to its limit could leave some GOP

Starting point is 00:19:56 members in purple swing districts defending Trump to the max, which is not a smart electoral strategy and not one they'll be keen on taking. It's also true, as Sargent noted, that this very same tactic was used against Bragg, who initially cooperated with very little glean from the revelations and then successfully countersued. Jordan has not subpoenaed any more sensitive documents from Bragg since, and his effort to protect Trump or prosecute Bragg has so far failed. Willis, like any other prosecutor, is subject to oversight and investigation herself. If it's going to happen, I'd prefer it be done by the Prosecuting Attorneys Qualifications Commission, the PAQC, in Georgia, which was set up by Governor Brian Kemp with a

Starting point is 00:20:35 law that he signed in May. The commission could investigate Willis if it receives a complaint about her and may even have the authority to remove her, though some legal experts contend that isn't clear. I find this whole scenario incredibly unlikely, but it is much more appropriate than Republicans in Congress trying to slow things down. In the end, Jordan is making political moves here, and I don't expect to amount to much. He will probably get some insignificant documents from Willis's offices, a couple talking points, and the investigation will otherwise go on without much interruption. The real drama is going to happen inside the courtroom, where we'll find out whether Willis's charges can hold up to judicial scrutiny and exactly how Trump's team

Starting point is 00:21:15 plans to keep him out of prison. All right, that is it for my take, which brings us to your questions answered, a section we are going to skip today. If you want to ask a question, get it answered in the podcast, don't forget, you can write to me anytime, isaac at readtangle.com. It goes straight to my inbox. All right, next up is our Blind Spot Report. Once a week, we present the Blind Spot Report from our partners at Ground News, an app that tells you the bias of news coverage and what stories people on each side are missing. The right missed a story about Fox News apologizing to the Gee family, a Gold Star family, claiming they had to pay $60,000 to ship their fallen relatives' remains from Afghanistan because Biden's Pentagon refused to pay. The left missed a story about the National Archives and Records Administration acknowledging

Starting point is 00:22:09 it had nearly 5,400 emails and documents showing President Biden use pseudonyms while emailing his son during his time as vice president. And next up is our numbers section. The percentage of Americans who say the charges against Trump and Georgia are serious is 47% or somewhat serious is 16%. The percentage of Americans who say the charges against Trump and Georgia are not too serious is 10% or not serious at all is 15%. The percentage of Americans who think Trump should have been charged with a crime in the Georgia case is 49%. The percentage of Americans who think Trump should have been charged with a crime in the Georgia case is 49%. The percentage of Americans who think Trump should not have been charged in the Georgia case was 32%.

Starting point is 00:22:51 The percentage of Americans who think Trump should suspend his presidential campaign is 50%. And the percentage of Americans who think Trump should not suspend his presidential campaign is 33%. All right, and last but not least, our have a nice day story. It's full sail ahead for the cargo ship Pixis Ocean. The vessel, now on its maiden voyage from China to Brazil, is outfitted with wind wing sails, which are 123 feet tall and made of the same material as wind turbines. This is the first real-world test of the wind-win sales, which are designed to cut fuel consumption. Because the ship does not rely solely on an engine, the sales could reduce its lifetime emissions by 30%. The BBC has a story, and there's a link to it in today's episode description.

Starting point is 00:23:41 All right, everybody, that is it for today's podcast. As always, if you want to support our work, please go to readtangle.com slash membership. And don't forget to go check out our YouTube channel, Tangle News on YouTube for our latest video. We'll be right back here same time tomorrow. Have a good one. Peace. Our podcast is written by me, Isaac Saul, and edited by John Law. Our script is edited by Ari Weitzman, Bailey Saul, and Sean Brady.

Starting point is 00:24:08 The logo for our podcast was designed by Magdalena Bukova, who's also our social media manager. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet75. For more on Tangle, please go to readtangle.com and check out our website. winning book. Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages six months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed.

Starting point is 00:25:31 Learn more at flucellvax.ca.

Tangle - House Republicans launch Fani Willis investigation.

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