Tangle - President Biden's age.

Episode Date: July 12, 2022

President Biden, who is now 79, became the oldest president in U.S. history to be elected when he was voted into office. He will be 82 at the end of his first term, and if he is re-elected and finishes a second term, he'd be 86 when he leaves office. Plus, a question about the Supreme Court.You can read today's podcast here.You can subscribe to Tangle by clicking here or drop something in our tip jar by clicking here.Our podcast is written by Isaac Saul and produced by Trevor Eichhorn. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75.Our newsletter is edited by Bailey Saul, Sean Brady, Ari Weitzman, and produced in conjunction with Tangle’s social media manager Magdalena Bokowa, who also created our logo.--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/tanglenews/message Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages six months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at flucellvax.ca.

From executive producer Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, and welcome to the Tangle Podcast, the place where you get views from across the political spectrum. Some independent thinking without all that hysterical nonsense you find everywhere else. I'm your host, Isaac Saul, and on today's episode, we are going to be talking about President Joe Biden's age. This is obviously something people have been discussing since he was running for president, but a couple stories over the last few months have thrown some gas on the fire and there's a lot of commentary out there and we figured it was time to address it. As always though, before we jump in, we'll start off with

some quick hits. First up, the PGA Tour is now under Department of Justice investigation for potential antitrust violations in its competition with the new Saudi Arabia-backed LIV Golf. Number two, the Food and Drug Administration says it is considering an application from a French pharmaceutical company for what would be the first over-the-counter birth control medication available in the U.S. for what would be the first over-the-counter birth control medication available in the U.S. 3. The House January 6th Committee will hold its 7th public hearing today, focusing on the role domestic extremist groups played in the day's events. 4. Russia says Vladimir Putin will visit Iran next week, and the White House said it is expecting Iran to provide Russia with weapons-capable drones for use in Ukraine. Number five, new CDC estimates indicate that Omicron BA.5, a more contagious subvariant, is already the dominant strain in the U.S. Hospitalizations are up 4.5% this week.

For some Americans, age is just a number. When you are commander in chief, many feel it means a lot more. If elected, you would be the oldest president in American history. I'm in good shape. It's that they're worried about President Biden running again, especially since he is showing signs of age now. Donald Trump says you have dementia and it's getting worse. Hey, the same guy who thought that the 9-11 attack was a 7-11 attack, he's talking about dementia? President Biden, who is now 79 years old, became the oldest president in U.S. history to be elected when he was voted into office. He will be 82 at the end of his term, and if he is re-elected

and finishes a second term, he'd be 86 when he leaves office. The question of Biden's age has been around since his campaign began in 2019, as have allegations of a cognitive decline by critics. But there has been an extra surge of commentary on the issue after several stories about the topic were published by news outlets over the past few months, including in the New York Times in June and then again in a front-page story published just yesterday. In that piece, the Times quoted several sources, noting that the topic had become an increasingly uncomfortable one for Biden's team and the Democratic Party. Quote, engaged, asking smart questions at meetings, grilling aides on points of dispute, calling them late at night, picking out that weak point on page 14 of a memo, and rewriting speeches like

his abortion remarks on Friday right up until the last minute. But they acknowledge Mr. Biden looks older than just a few years ago, a political liability that cannot be solved by traditional White House stratagems like staff shakeups or new communication plans. His energy level, while impressive for a man of his age, is not what it was then and some aides quietly watch out for him, the Times reported. He often shuffles when he walks and aides worry he will trip on a wire. He stumbles over words during public events and they hold their breath to see if he makes it to the end without a gaffe. Mr. Biden's public appearances have fueled that perception. His speeches can be flat and listless. He sometimes loses his train of thought, has trouble summoning names, or appears momentarily

confused. More than once, he has promoted Vice President Kamala Harris, calling her President Harris. Mr. Biden, who overcame a childhood stutter, stumbles over words like kleptocracy. He has said Iranian when he meant Ukrainian and several times called Senator Mark Warner, Democrat of Virginia, John, confusing him with the late Republican senator of that name from Virginia. The White House has had to walk back some of his ad-lib comments, such as when he vowed a military response if China attacks Taiwan, or declared that President Vladimir V. Putin cannot remain in power in Russia. Along with the Times piece, Republican political ads regularly feature Biden stumbling over words or appearing to lose his train of thought.

Over the weekend, a new Siena College New York Times poll revealed that 64% of Democrats want someone other than Biden to run in 2024. Today, we're going to explore some arguments from the right and the left about right says it is finally not taboo to talk about Biden's age. Many say his cognitive decline has been obvious for some time. Some argue there should be an age cap on who can be president. In June, the Wall Street Journal editorial board wrote about breaking the age taboo. A pastime around our office in early 2021 was guessing when Democrats would begin to point out that President Biden was too old for the job and should pack it in, the board wrote. The consensus was after a drubbing in the midterm election, but congrats to the colleague,

he knows who he is, who figured sometime early this year. He wins the office pool because the drive to shove the president out the door has already begun. The New York Times kicked off the kicking with a story quoting various progressive sages, suddenly admitting what everyone has known all along. Mr. Biden is the oldest serving U.S. president at age 79, and he'll be 82 when he finishes his term. He looks and sounds every bit his age. This declaration of the obvious has now moved along the progressive media chorus line to the Atlantic, with a piece that asserts, let me put this bluntly, Joe Biden should not run for re-election in 2024. He is too old. These stories treat this as a revelation, as if Mr. Biden suddenly showed

some dramatic decline, the board said. The truth is that the president demonstrated he had lost a verbal and maybe mental step in the first Democratic candidate debate in 2019. He hasn't improved. Democrats admitted it privately at the time, but they rallied to him during the South Carolina primary when it looked like he was the only Democrat who could hold off the nomination of Bernie Sanders and defeat Donald Trump. Why the Democratic turn now? One obvious answer is that the president is down in the polls and his low approval rating may cost Democrats control of Congress in November. In Deseret, William Tatera said there should be an age maximum on the presidency. There are few things that both Democrats and Republicans might agree on, but one of those may be the merit of also providing

a constitutionally mandated upper age limit, he wrote. Only 38% still approve of Joe Biden's performance. Many believe he is too old for the job. Others believe that Donald Trump is unfit for office and would gladly support any measure that would limit his eligibility to run in 2024. According to a poll conducted earlier this year by ABC News and the Washington Post, 54% of Americans do not believe Biden has the mental sharpness it takes to serve effectively as president. Age does not discriminate based on whether there is a D or R by one's name. All are susceptible to the effects of aging.

Fortunately, some seniors remain quite sharp mentally and may even improve in wisdom and insight. But that is the exception, not the rule. Given the increased likelihood of age-related issues, shouldn't there be a constitutional age limit for the president, Tatera asked? So, how old is too old? That depends on the individual, but it is noteworthy to consider what the government says about retirement age. The Federal Aviation Administration mandates that pilots retire by the age 65. Currently, the full retirement age for Social Security is 66. In the Washington Examiner, Byron York said, of course Biden is too old to be president. Anyone who has seen a video or two of Biden at presidential functions would say the same thing, York said. The point is not that some

of the Republican attacks on Biden were true. No, Biden did not have dementia, as some of his adversaries said. He was not disoriented, not knowing where he was. Those were hit jobs from people who clearly did not watch Biden participate in 11 Democratic debates. He got through them all. He wasn't very good, but he wasn't very good 20 years ago either. The point was that Biden was inexorably slowing down and was increasingly not up for the most demanding job in the world. At this point, it is inevitable that some on Twitter will say, now do Trump.

If former President Donald Trump were to be elected to a second term, he would take office in 2025 at age 78, the same age Biden was when he became president in 2021, York said. Trump would serve until age 82. So, if serving between the ages of 78 and 82 is too old for Biden, wouldn't it be too old for Trump? The answer is, yes, it would. Now, the Trump of today, he just turned 76 last week, is much more vigorous appearing than Biden. If you watch one of Trump's rallies, you would see a high energy performance

that goes on somewhere between an hour and an hour and a half. Trump appears to be infinitely stronger and more energetic than Biden, but age is coming for Trump, just as it did for Biden. All right, that is it for what the right is saying, which brings us to the left's take. The left defends Biden's current state, but many argue he should step aside in 2024. Some criticize the smear campaigns by Republicans. Others say this is a real issue for voters, not just the media-concocted story. In The Atlantic, Mark Leibovich said Biden is fit to be president right now, but is too old to run again. It all feels impolite to point this out, disrespectful, ageist, and taboo, especially given the gross Republican smears about Biden being a doddering and demented old puppet, Leibovich said. No one wants to perpetuate

this garbage. In fact, people who have had regular contact with Biden describe him as engaged with the day-to-day aspects of his job and generally sharp on details. He will sometimes mangle sentences, blank on names, get tortured by teleprompters, lose his train of thought, or not make sense, which is not so abnormal for someone his age. Biden is by no means the more eloquent character he was in his younger days. It can be painful to watch him give prepared speeches. His tone can be tentative, and certain sentences can become hopscotching journeys. His aides in the room look visibly nervous at times. Biden worked to overcome a stutter during his youth,

and in general it can become more difficult for stutterers to conceal these effects as they age, he said. Geriatricians are always emphasizing that the effects of aging vary widely from person to person. By every indication, Biden appears to be among the lucky ones. His doctors cite no major health concerns, he takes care of himself, he does not drink or smoke, is not overweight, and works out at least five times a week. He looks great for a guy his age. Biden is fit to faithfully execute his duties, the White House physician said in his most recent health summary.

The question is, should he? The answer, sure, for now, but not a day after January 20th, 2025. In the New York Times, Michelle Goldberg said he is too old to run again. Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight.

Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is nearly double the historic average of 52,000 cases. What can you do this flu season? Talk to your pharmacist or doctor about getting a flu shot. Consider FluCellVax Quad and help protect yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages 6 months and older, and it may be available for free in your province.

Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at flucellvax.ca. I can't help feeling very sorry for Joe Biden, Goldberg said. He's wanted to be president for most of his life, first running 34 years ago. Had his son, Beau, not died in 2015, Biden might have entered the Democratic primary then. As vice president, he would have been a favorite and likely would have beaten Donald Trump. By the time he finally achieved the office he longed for, he was far past his prime. Trump had left the country in ruins, its institutions collapsing, much of the population gripped by furious delusions, and millions traumatized by the pandemic.

Biden was elected to bring back a normality that now appears to be gone for good. Now, I didn't want Biden to be the Democratic nominee in 2020, partly for ideological reasons, but even more because he seemed too worn out and unfocused, she wrote. In retrospect, however, given the way Republicans outperformed expectations, Biden may have been the only one of the major candidates who would have beaten Trump. Voters showed no appetite for sweeping progressive change. So, I recognize that I could be wrong when I make a similar argument today. But the presidency ages even young men, and Biden is far from young.

A country in as much trouble as ours needs a leader vigorous enough to inspire confidence. In CNN, Chris Saliza said the question is catching up to Biden. A New York Times-Siena College poll released Monday showed that 64% of voters planning to participate in the 2024 Democratic presidential primary said they want the party to nominate a candidate other than Biden, Saliza wrote. Among the youngest voters, age 18 to 29 in that group, a critical part of the party's coalition, just 5%, not a typo, want the party to re-nominate Biden. As for a reason why they would prefer someone other than Biden, 33% of Democratic primary voters cited his age, while 32% said his job performance. Among Biden's rough age cohort, those over 65,

60% said age was the main reason they wanted Democrats to nominate someone other than the president. Those are striking numbers that speak to the fact this isn't just a summer story being driven by the media. It's a legitimate concern for voters, even those who are favorably inclined to the party to which Biden belongs, Slizzer wrote. Biden himself, during the course of the 2020 campaign, acknowledged that voters should consider his age as they made up their minds about their vote. The question of how big an issue Biden's age will wind up being for voters if he runs in 2024 remains to be seen, and could be dependent on whether Republicans nominate someone who can drive that contrast

with Biden or not. At present, the leading Republican presidential contender is Donald Trump, who at 76 is no spring chicken. Alright, that is it for the left and the right's take, which brings us to my take. All right, that is it for the left and the right's take, which brings us to my take. So when I wrote about this last year, we did a subscribers only Friday edition that I think was headlined, Is President Biden OK? I said plainly what I thought was fairly obvious. Joe Biden looked markedly different than he did just five, now six years ago. All you have to do is watch videos of Biden from 2016 to see the obvious. When I wrote that piece, I also predicted many of the arguments that landed in my inbox.

Accusations that I'm an ageist, even though most Democrats Biden's age also think he's too old. Hollow counterpoints like you're not a doctor, you're not his doctor, and pivots to have you seen Trump. My counterpoint to accusations of ageism is that there are plenty of people of Biden's age who I don't feel similarly about. Senator Bernie Sanders, the Democrat from Vermont, is a year older than Biden, and he just debated Senator Lindsey Graham on Fox News. He looked a lot sharper to me than the president does now, even though Biden also held his own in the debates against Trump. My grandmother died a couple of years ago at the age of 97, and I would have put

her in Congress over a lot of the folks we've got now. She was sharp as ever until the very end. In other words, age is not my issue, and I don't think I'd even support an age cap unless it was very high, like something north of 85. Since I don't make endorsements entangle, all of this creates some tricky water to navigate. But here's something I feel comfortable saying. The odds-on favorite candidates for 2024 are the same as 2020, Biden and Trump. For a number of reasons, including both their ages and unpopularity, I don't think either of them should be running. I also reject the idea that we should feel uncomfortable talking about this. As Saliza noted in his piece,

Biden himself made it crystal clear that he appreciates and desires an open conversation about his age, and in return he aims to be transparent about his health. That's honorable, and it's the kind of thing that made him a popular candidate in 2020. As voters or onlookers or journalists or pundits, we should embrace the fact that the very subject of these conversations does not even view them as being taboo. So, yes, I think Biden is going to be too old to run in 2024. I don't think that means he can't fulfill his duties as president now, and I don't think there is really any debate about it. None of that means we should have an age cap in Congress or the White House, but it does mean voters should be able to discuss this openly without being accused of crossing some imaginary

line. Anyone who cares about the country can look at some of the gaffes Biden has had and wonder if he's lost his fastball, too tired or too old or too overwhelmed to be an effective communicator and leader. I certainly have, and I think the numerous articles about concerns from staff and allies just affirm what's clear from watching him from afar. All right, that is it for my take, which brings us to your questions answered. This one is from Jim in Eagle River, Alaska. Jim said, do you agree that SCOTUS appears to be focused on forcing Congress to do its job of writing nitty-gritty detailed law rather than allowing activist courts, as in Roe v. Wade,

to create controversial law or the bureaucracy to implement noxious or at least unpopular regulations in place of law in implementing some benign sounding act, as in the EPA's implementation of the Clean Air Act? Do you agree that Congress frequently passes the buck to courts or the bureaucracy when its honorable members do not want to go on record as being for or against some policy or program written to redress some intractable public issue? Okay, Jen, this is a great question, and I just want to say at the top, I mean, we've done entire 4,000, 5,000 word individual editions, 30-minute podcasts on many of these recent rulings, so I really hate to try

and broad brush or generalize here, and I would definitely refer to my writing or the podcast on those individual rulings for a nuanced sense of where I stand personally. That being said, I do think it is true that Congress has abdicated its duty on a lot of huge issues and that the Supreme Court's recent spate of rulings has at times collided with that abdication. For a lot of Americans, I think the recent rulings have been a bitided with that abdication. For a lot of Americans, I think the recent rulings have been a bit of a civics lesson. The court's job is not to rule in favor of the majority of the public's will. It's to be a check on democracy. It is, quite literally, to make sure that the people don't elect leaders who create laws that violate the

Constitution. So in that sense, yes, I agree that Congress frequently passes the buck, and that the courts are left having to resolve very complicated questions that better legislation could resolve without them. I also think it's fair to note that the court has its own law in some respects, like stare decisis, which is the commitment to precedent. It's easy to see why critics might be upset that someone like Justice Brett Kavanaugh voted to strike down Roe v. Wade just a couple of years after giving assurances that he viewed it as strong precedent. Many legal experts have noted that Kavanaugh was careful in his lawyerly phrasing to leave the door open to overturning it, but Republican senators like Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins made it

clear they felt betrayed. Remember, the Supreme Court justices are a product of presidential nominations who are confirmed by the Senate, which means they are, like legislation, a product of the democratic process. When the public or members of Congress feel they are being misled in confirmation hearings or traditions are ignored in order to place them on the bench, that creates a whole domino of effective legitimacy questions, which then produces the low trust in the court we have today. So yes, Congress is deeply dysfunctional, and we are learning now that much of American life is held up by tenuous court rulings, not complex and deeply affirmed legislation. But the court has a lot of its own problems that are making that even worse.

All right, that is it for Your Questions Answered, which brings us to a story that matters. So I had never seen this study before, but it was sent to me yesterday and I thought it was important to share. In 2018, the University of Chicago published a study that illustrates exactly how badly Americans misunderstand the major political parties. For instance, the study found that people believe 32% of Democrats are lesbian, gay, or bisexual when the actual number is 6%. It also found that people think 36% of Democrats are black when just 24% are. On the other side, the study found that people believe 38% of Republicans earn more than $250,000 per year, when the actual number is just 2%. And people believe 45% of Republicans are over the age of 65, when in reality just 21% are. According to the researchers, experimental data suggests that these misperceptions are genuine, end-party specific, not artifacts of expressive responding, enumeracy, or ignorance of base rates. These misperceptions are widely shared, though bias and out-party perceptions is larger.

We link to the study in today's newsletter, and you can find that in our Story That Matters section. All right, next up is our numbers section. President Biden's age when he took office in 2021 was 78 years and 61 days. That was the oldest of any president ever. President Trump's age when he took office in 2017 was 70 years and 220 days, which was the second oldest of any president ever. years and 220 days, which was the second oldest of any president ever. Theodore Roosevelt's age when he took office in 1901 after President McKinley was assassinated was 42 years and 322 days. That's the youngest of any president. The size of the world population by November 15th

is going to be 8 billion according to a new United Nations estimate. The size of the world population by 2050 is going to be 9.7 billion according to that same estimate. The number of calls to the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline that end without reaching a counselor is one in six according to a new estimate from the Wall Street Journal. All right, and finally our have a nice day section today. NASA is unveiling the first batch of full-color scientific images taken by its James Webb Space Telescope. Yesterday, President Biden unveiled the first of those images, which shows SMACS 0723, a massive group of galaxies clustered together that act as a magnifying glass for the objects behind them.

This is known as gravitational lensing, and allowed the telescope to capture its first view of the incredibly distant galaxies that have never been seen before, some appearing as they did 4.6 billion years ago. This slice of the vast universe covers a patch of sky approximately the size of a grain of sand held at arm's length by someone on the ground, according to NASA. In today's newsletter, you can find that image released by NASA. All right, everybody, that is it for the podcast. As always, if you want to support our work, please go to readtangle.com slash membership and become a member.

always, if you want to support our work, please go to readtangle.com slash membership and become a member. Remember, when you are a member, it unlocks Friday editions, the comments section, all sorts of perks for people who want a little bit more Tangled content. Either way, we'll see you tomorrow right here, same time. Peace. Our newsletter is written by isaac saul edited by bailey saul sean brady ari weitzman and produced in conjunction with tango's social media manager magdalena vakova who also helped create our podcast is edited by trevor acorn and music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75. For more from Tangle, subscribe to our newsletter or check out our content archives at www.readtangle.com. Thanks for watching! about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th,

only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is nearly double the historic average of 52,000 cases. What can you do this flu season? Talk to your pharmacist or doctor about getting a flu shot.

Consider FluCellVax Quad and help protect yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages 6 months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at FluCellVax.ca.