Tangle - PREVIEW - The Sunday Podcast: Isaac, Ari, and Kmele talk about Juneteenth, MAGA fight over Iran, Tucker v Ted, and the federal land sell off.

Episode Date: June 22, 2025

Happy Juneteenth from the Tangle crew! Isaac, Ari, and Kmele talk about the MAGA fight over Iran. They also discuss the controversial interview of Ted Cruz by Tucker Carlson followed by a conversation about the potential federal land sell outs. And, as always, the Airing of Grievances, which is a particularly uplifting one today. Ad-free podcasts are here!Many listeners have been asking for an ad-free version of this podcast that they could subscribe to — and we finally launched it. You can go to ReadTangle.com to sign up! You can also give the gift of a Tangle podcast subscription by clicking here.You can subscribe to Tangle by clicking here or drop something in our tip jar by clicking here. Our Executive Editor and Founder is Isaac Saul. Our Executive Producer is Jon Lall.This podcast was hosted by Isaac Saul and edited and engineered by Jon Lall. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75 and Jon Lall. Our newsletter is edited by Managing Editor Ari Weitzman, Senior Editor Will Kaback, Hunter Casperson, Kendall White, Bailey Saul, and Audrey Moorehead.  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Some things just take too long. A meeting that could have been an email, someone explaining crypto, or switching mobile providers. Except with Fizz. Switching to Fizz is quick and easy. Mobile plans start at $17 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details at fizz.ca. What's better than a well marbled ribeye sizzling on the barbecue? A well marbled ribeye sizzling on the barbecue that was carefully selected by an instacart shopper and delivered to your door. A well marbled ribeye you ordered without even leaving the kiddie pool. Whatever groceries your summer calls for, Instacart has you covered. Download the Instacart app and enjoy zero

dollar delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart. Groceries that over-deliver. Did you know that socks are one of the most requested clothing items by organizations addressing homelessness? It's true. And it's also why we started Bombas. Every time you buy, well, anything from Bombas, an essential item is donated to someone facing homelessness. That's Bombas's one purchased, one donated promise. Bombas makes socks, underwear, slippers, slides, and t-shirts all designed to feel good and do good. Since we're new in Canada, all new customers enjoy 20% off your first purchase.

Just visit bombas.ca. That's B-O-M-B-A-S.C-A. And use code MUSIC to start doing good and feeling even better. All right. Coming up, happy Juneteenth to Camille. I'm just kidding. That's a joke. We talk about the MAGA fight over Iran, Tucker versus Ted. We discussed the federal land sell-off and then maybe the worst grievances episode of

all time, but kind of nice and uplifting, maybe a little warm too. It's a good evening. Welcome to the Tangle podcast, the place you get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking and a little bit of my take. I'm your host, Isaac Saul. I'm here with Tangle Managing Editor, Ari Weitzman, and Tangle's editor at large, Camille Foster. You'll notice that the intro is completely the same.

We have not settled on anything with regards to a name, though we appreciate the many suggestions that came in. The consensus, I think, from all the emails that I saw were like, all of your guys' suggestions suck, don't do any of these things. Here's what I think. I got almost zero. There was some endorsements from my perspective

from the listeners, so I'm grateful for that. I don't like you misrepresenting that, Isaac. Okay, maybe it was, I heard everybody told me all my ideas were bad. Well. Yeah, so I guess I had a different experience than you guys. We're back in the lab, I guess.

Is there anything else to say about that, except thank you for all the suggestions? Ari, you feel like you have something to say. I see your mouth opening. Yeah, I just think that there was one suggestion that kind of crowdsourced in the comment section of the Sunday newsletter that we had, which was for the name unwinding,

which kind of fit nice. And I don't want to lose tabs on that one. So thanks for organically bubbling that to the surface to our hive mind out there. I agree. The unwinding was one of the few reader suggestions that I felt kind of everybody raised their eyebrows out a little bit.

Like, hmm, maybe that could be it. So, all right. Well, we just wanted to close the loop on that a little bit. I think maybe we'll get back to our, our private discourse. These changes will be coming soon. Hopefully we, it's worth saying that we had big grand plans to do some kind of rollout this week. But John Law, our executive producer of the podcast is on a surprise vacation that his incredible life plan for him. She sort of inspired with me. Yeah, she conspired with me to get him off work for a week, which I knew about and then

consequently forgot about as we were planning some of the renaming and rolling out that he was gonna be out this entire week. So shout out to John's wife, Summer, who took him on a lovely vacation, I won't say where, to an undisclosed, very nice tropical location, and they seem to be having a good time, but it has put some of those production things just a little bit behind.

Speaking of incredible wives, happy anniversary to Camille and I. We found out that we share, almost share a wedding anniversary. Yeah. Yeah. My wedding anniversary is on Thursday, Juneteenth. Happy Juneteenth as well to Camille.

No, I'm just kidding. Exclusive. Yeah. Yeah. Only. There is some interesting, I actually, before we get into some of the stuff we have lined up, I would like to chat about the Juneteenth stuff. Trump and the MAGA writer are a little bit all in on like,

like we should delete this holiday. They're really into deleting stuff right now. I don't know if you guys have noticed, but there's been some delete this holiday discourse. I'm pro Juneteenth, I'll tell you why. One, it's on my wedding anniversary, so I get a federal holiday on my wedding anniversary. It's great.

Two, I think we should have more federal holidays. I like being off work for the day. That's nice. The Thursday day off was actually kind of nice. I really appreciate that. Three, I despite how the left has sort of, you know, made it, the rights made a divisive issue to I shouldn't just say the left. But despite the fact it's gone through the partisan wringer and has become a little bit of a divisive holiday, I do think like, we could just have Juneteenth be a celebration of freedom and that's great

and I'm good with that as a holiday. But yeah, I'm curious what you guys think about this discourse around the, yeah, there's just kind of like an anti, Trump was like super pro Juneteenth, he pushed for it in 2020 and now he's completely flipped the script, and it's just like all in on it being a horrible holiday that everybody should be working. We have, he said, he posted something about how we have too many federal holidays, which is a weird,

like I don't know that it's a consensus that everybody's like, yeah, we don't work enough in this country. We should definitely have fewer days off. That doesn't seem like something that's a popularly held position. But yeah, I'll lob that out there, roll that grenade into the room and see what you guys think. I mean, in general.

Yeah, Donald Trump. Donald Trump in 2020, this is June of 2020, this Juneteenth we commit as one nation to live true to our highest ideals and to build always towards a freer, stronger country that values the dignity and boundless potential of all Americans. And that's pretty good.

That's pretty good 2020. That's a different man than today. That's a different man. But it's also a different circumstance. And I think one has to take the context into consideration when talking about this. And the reality is that by June of 2021, when Joe Biden was president,

and there was a proclamation issued to formally make Juneteenth a federal holiday, not just a thing that some people were observing. And Isaac, how long have you been married? This is my four year anniversary. Okay, so you and Juneteenth kind of came into being together. And I don't know, were you aware of Juneteenth at the time that you got married? Vaguely. I remember specifically a conversation I had with my wife where she was like,

is this bad form? Like, should we be thinking about? And I was like, no. And then there was sort of like a, should we- A celebration of freedom, bad form. Yeah, she was like, and then we had the like, well, should we say anything about Juneteenth like at the wedding? And I was like, if we got married on July 4th,

I don't think we would be like happy Independence Day, everybody at the wedding, you know, like, maybe, I don't know, it's hard to imagine a holiday that we'd like incorporate that. I feel like you would a little bit though. I feel like you would a little bit. Yeah, maybe I would. Yeah, I'd be like, America.

But it was like the first. It'd be theme cocktail, it was 100%. Yeah, it was the first one. Juneteenth is a weird holiday. ["Summer's Day"] We'll be right back after this quick break. Some things just take too long. A meeting that could have been an email, someone explaining crypto, or switching mobile providers. Except with Fizz.

Switching to Fizz is quick and easy. Mobile plans start at $17 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details with Fizz. Switching to Fizz is quick and easy. Mobile plans start at $17 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details at fizz.ca. I'm Joshua Jackson, and I'm returning for the Audible original series, Oracle, Season 3. Murder at the Grand View. 640-somethings took a boat out a few days ago.

One of them was found dead. The hotel, the island, something wasn't right about it. Psychic agent Nate Russo is back on the case, and you know when Nate's killer instincts are required, anything's possible. This world's gonna eat you alive. Listen to Oracle Season 3, Murder at the Grand View, now on Audible.

Yeah, Juneteenth is a weird holiday. And it's weird for a bunch of different reasons. I mean, the first is because it was heavily politicized because of the way it came into being. There's a sense of which it was born in the midst of the not just the racial reckoning, but really the beginning of the Biden administration, which was heavily interested in the kind of ideological conflict around that stuff and was pushing more in the direction of kind of the equity, social justice agenda. And it's hard to, it would be hard for it, even under the best of circumstances, not to be kind of contaminated by some of that political climate.

But beyond that, Juneteenth is also a celebration not of the date of the Emancipation Proclamation, but this apocryphal date upon which it is suggested that some of the last people to know about this, slaves to discover, or enslaved persons to discover that they had been freed was on Juneteenth. And it is just not true. It's not true in the same way that Christmas is not, in fact, Jesus's birthday. And from my standpoint, that kind of matters. Like whether or not we're in the business

of meaningfully reflecting upon history in kind of a broad and thoughtful way. Sorry, but then is that an argument that we shouldn't be taking Christmas off then? Well, I mean Christmas is a religious holiday. And it's also just in general a kind of odd, but it's also an odd pagan festival that all of us indulge in at this point, where we're giving one another gifts and cutting down trees and putting them up in our house. The whole thing is weird. So if we're going to do anything, you can have Christmas and Christmas Eve,

and perhaps you can have Juneteenth as well, but four years removed from it, forgetting the fact that it had this kind of odd political genesis seems odd. So I acknowledge the fact that it has a weird political genesis. I acknowledge the fact that it's also very strange to be celebrating, like, Victory Day on the date that, you know, some guy who'd

been in the Pacific hiding in the jungle discovers, oh, the war is actually over. Like, that's bizarre. I'm not sure why you would do it in that way. So all of it just none of it sits particularly well with me. If Juneteenth had been left alone and people had been observing it freely or ignoring it, which is what most people were doing, then I suppose everything would be fine and there'd be no weird political shenanigans and Donald Trump would still be issuing proclamations

in support of Juneteenth. But because the circumstance has actually changed and I think it's just, again, the tectonic shifts that happen are not just a function of belligerent, awful conservatives who have these horrible recalcitrant values and think slavery was kind of okay. No, it's just that the political climate is weird and it came into being in a weird way.

And that's probably not going to go away tomorrow. My prediction, if I had one, is that in 10 to 15 years, most people won't remember the odd political milieu and will probably still be talking about and observing Juneteenth in some weird way but what will tell you whether or not things are actually healthier is whether or not there's a Juneteenth match or sale because what you want is for these holidays to become completely innocuous to the point where it's just like yeah you get 5% off because it's Juneteenth. What is Juneteenth? I don't know. Like that is what victory looks like.

That's what you know you You have a healthy culture. When it's like, that whole thing is so far removed from our everyday experience of the world, that we barely know what the hell is going on. I think as a former- That's the day I long for. Amnesia is the glue that keeps the country together. Just as a former mattress salesman, I'd ask you not to besmirch the sanctity of President of the United States. I am not.

I'm not, I'm not, I'm besmirching the unsanctity of not being willing to sell mattresses at a discount in honor of whatever it is we're supposed to be celebrating. Memorial Day, Labor Day, President's Day, VA Day, Valentine's Day. Especially. So guys, okay, pop quiz. Juneteenth is now the newest federal holiday. Do you know the last federal holiday created before that?

Created is... So I would say like... Signed into law. Okay, well, I'm pausing over created because Columbus Day being renamed Columbus Day slash Indigenous Peopleoples Day, still the same day. Not counting that. Okay. Yeah, not counting that.

Another politically contaminated observance. That's the thing. That's why I kind of want to come back to this conversation in a little bit of like, what is, like is innocuousness a good or a bad thing, even if it's a holiday people want to celebrate? But I want to play in the space here, Isaac, and try to answer that question of what the last created federal holiday is. It must be a while ago.

I feel like MLK Day might be the one. Is it President's Day? That'd be my guess. No, it's MLK Day. Yeah, 1983, Martin Luther King Day. Thought so. Good shot. Yeah, before that was Columbus Day. So you were kind of circling Bear Ari, which was first signed into law, first federally observed in 1971.

Yeah. Mafioso is promoting that holiday, creating, they created it because of the horrible stereotypes of them. And they said, you know, look, Italians, all of us, we's all not bad. So, yeah. It seems like they added in 1971 Memorial Day, Washington's birthday, both went from being kind of observed to being federally enacted. There's something called the Uniform Monday Holiday Act in 1971, which put a bunch of these all on Mondays. I think that's pretty interesting.

This is all unverified chat GPT information. in many ways. So, based on AI, complete nonsense. Yeah. I'm wondering if the holiday trend is going to be, this is like a back door into getting the Andrew Yang four day work week. Like if we just have a holiday every week, maybe, I mean, I feel like a lot of people could get behind that movement. That's a good way to do it.

Yeah, well we took off yesterday for Juneteenth at Tangle I mean, I feel like a lot of people could get behind that movement. That's a good way to do it. That's interesting. We took off yesterday for Juneteenth at Tangle and Will sent a Slack message to me and Ari in the middle of the day, like, yo, Thursday's a banger day to have a day off. We should do this a couple times a year. I was like, yeah, I agree. It's been pretty nice.

I don't know if we're gonna just take some random Thursdays off in the middle of the year, but. I think Will was doing a little tongue in cheek thing because we have a couple other Thursdays that are going to be off on the calendar already. Oh really? Yeah. Like I think we're, we're taking Thursday, Friday for July 4th.

So yeah, we are. So that's like, I mostly was just thinking about, yeah, I was just thinking about jokes I can make about cutting his salary and giving him what he wanted. We'll be right back after this quick break. We'll be right back after this quick break. Looking for a better place to call home? Discover Watercolor Westport by Landark Homes.

Nestled in eastern Ontario cottage country, live connected to nature, neighbors, and the necessities with high-speed connectivity. This walkable, vibrant waterfront village offers shops, dining, scenic trails, a winery, and the harborfront. Just steps from your door. Escape the city to a net-zero ready bungalow at Watercolor Westport. You're only 75 minutes from Ottawa and a short drive to Toronto or Montreal. With new homes starting from the 600s, you can live better in Watercolor Westport. To find out more, visit watercolorwestport.com. Some things just take too long.

A meeting that could have been an email, someone explaining crypto, or switching mobile providers. Except with Fizz. Switching to Fizz is quick and easy. Mobile plans start at $17 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details at fys.ca.

And for more information, and to get more information, get the full version of the video on our website, which is www.phys.ca. And for more information, and to get more information, get the full version of the video on our website, which is www.phys.ca.

And for more information, and to get more information, get the full version of the video on our website, which is www.phys.ca. And for more information, and to get more information, get the full version of the video on our website, two heavily armed powers exchanging gunfire. I mean, we have a new war in the Middle East. So I think that's the story of the week. Before we get into some questions about that and some of the stuff that's

happening there, which I have a couple, I guess, ethical questions I want to scratch at. But before we do, I think the kind of subplot story to this new war is that there's a big fracture happening in the kind of MAGA universe over what Donald Trump should do vis-a-vis Iran and Israel. There's this divide about the degree to which the United States should support Israel. There is fear among some people who think that Trump is about to drag the US into a direct conflict with Iran.

And some people who have basically already said, he did it, he greenlit Israel's actions, we're supporting them and I'm out. Like he's been a huge disappointment. I mean, I know probably the most prominent of them is the comic Dave Smith, who like literally called for Trump to be impeached for backing Israel's actions, which I thought was a little overcooked,

but you know, it's happening. And maybe the thing that exemplified it the most was this pretty remarkable Tucker Carlson, Ted Cruz interview, which I thought illustrated the way in which this could divide people in a really strong and meaningful way who otherwise agree on a ton of stuff. I mean, in the interview, Tucker and Ted Cruz are saying, you know, over and over, they're kind of like,

we probably agree on 80% of this, you know, over and over, they're kind of like, we probably agree on 80% of this, you know, 80% of American political stuff. And they're, you know, Ted Cruz will answer a question and Tucker will say, I agree with everything, you know, before doing that like psychotic laugh he does, which I don't know why he really has to stop doing that. But then they get to the Iran stuff and it's like really combative.

And I had a couple takeaways. I'd be curious to kind of hear you guys read on. But the first thing I'll just say is it was pretty cathartic to see Tucker kind of use his powers for good, which in my view is challenging somebody in a combative and direct way who's on your team. I just like so rarely ever see him do, I mean, most of what he does is just bringing on, at least what he used to do on Fox News was like bringing on the furthest left people that he really disagreed with and eviscerating them

in a really calculated way. It was like going on Tucker was just a dumb move if you were some like lefty academic. creating them in a really calculated way. It was like going on Tucker was just a dumb move if you were some like lefty academic. He was always so good at it and he's incredible on TV. And then in the new kind of Tucker era with his independent show, he's just bringing on a bunch of people he agrees with

and just letting them say whatever they want without challenging them in any meaningful way. Kind of like the Joe Rogan approach. And this was like, here's somebody he agrees with on a lot of stuff, but he was holding his feet to the fire, I thought, in interesting ways. The clips all look terrible for Ted Cruz. And then when you watch the full interview, you realize that Ted Cruz held his own in a lot of other instances in a way that I don't think, you know, we're going viral on X.

So I don't know. I'm curious what's stuck with you guys about the exchange and the interview and how the shapes of this debate are kind of taking form. I think most importantly, it was the first time that I felt like I was getting a look into what Ted Cruz actually thinks. I think he's one of those politicians

who's so good at representing what he thinks the best message is. And in my mind, Ted Cruz is kind of like the epitome of the guy who does what he needs to do to continue to be elected. And I've never really been sure what his principles were. So I thought Tucker pushed them and pushed them and pushed them to the point where he was, there was no artifice anymore. And Ted Cruz is like, this is what I believe. I think all of our foreign policy should just be about what's best for America. That's my touchstone. And when he pushed them to a place of stress, I think we're learning about what a very powerful

U.S. Senator thinks. So I really was appreciative of that. I think one of the things that exposed to me is that Ted Cruz is still sort of trying to justify what the right message is to support whatever the White House is saying in this conflict. Because it does seem like his foreign policy ideals are a little scattershot. He's saying he's flexible depending on what the moment requires. And I do think he was actually defending a pretty defensible position about we can support Israel in our national security interests without entangling ourselves as directly. And I think that's a pretty defensible position, but Tucker kept like really stressing it like making him fall into traps and explaining where his positions come from,

which felt a little insufficient as well. There's that whole exchange about Tucker saying, why do you believe that we should support Israel and Ted Cruz is saying that because of the Bible, you guys have seen that clip, I'm sure. And yeah, Tucker just embarrassed him on that, which rightfully so. But in general, I think Ted Cruz's argument

was actually pretty cogent, I thought. Just a quick interjection on the Bible thing that I thought was kind of interesting, is that Tucker was also wrong that it wasn't from Genesis, it's from Numbers, I think. So there was sort of this classic like Tucker being like, it's from Genesis in like his sort of confidence smarmy way. And then there were a bunch of people. Which is a very odd, yeah.

If you know anything about the scripture, it's not in Genesis, dude. Are you getting me? Yeah, and then there are a lot of people being like, this is weird. Like Tucker just really confidently was like telling Ted Cruz, like, how do you not even know the context for this quote you're using?

It's in the early part. It must be Genesis. I was sort of, I will say, I was kind of torn on that exchange. Like, yeah. I'd be, yeah. I mean, look on the surface of it, I think Tucker Carlson's point,

like obviously the Bible's not talking about present day Israel. But like- And Ted Cruz says that it is, which like, he's just kind of wrong there. Right. But the Bible's discussing a group of people who live in a nation that's roughly defined as the land surrounding Jerusalem, who are speaking Hebrew,

who are all adherents to a specific faith, who are like, you know, they're defending and fighting for this, these like holy sites. All of that's basically true to, I mean, like the Israel of the Bible obviously looks and is much different than the Israel of today, but the sort of the whole point of modern day Israel and Zionism was to kind of recreate the reality that this land was being controlled

by this specific people. And so I don't know, I was just a little bit torn on that exchange, like I think, and we should cue it out of, do we drop it in? I was just a little bit torn on that exchange. We should cue it up, do we drop it in? Growing up in Sunday school, I was taught from the Bible, those who bless Israel will be blessed and those who curse Israel will be cursed. And from my perspective, I want to be on the blessing side of things.

Those who bless the government of Israel? Those who bless Israel is what it says. It doesn't say the government of it, it says the nation of Israel. So that's Israel is what it says, it doesn't say the government of it says the nation of Israel. So that's in the Bible as a Christian I believe that. Where is that? I can find it to you.

I don't have the scripture off the tip of my, you pull out the phone and use the zoom tool. It's in Genesis, but so you're quoting a Bible phrase you don't have context for it and you don't know where in the Bible it is but that's like your

theology I'm confused. What does that even mean? Tucker. I'm a Christian, I wanna know what you're talking about. Where does my support for Israel come from, number one, because biblically we're commanded to support Israel, but number two- Hold on, hold on, you're a senator and now you're throwing out theology and I am a Christian, I am allowed to weigh in on this. We are commanded as Christians support the government of Israel. We are commanded to support Israel.

Is the nation God is referring to in Genesis, is that the same as the country run by Benjamin Netanyahu right now? Yes, yes. It is, okay. I think it gives me a weird icky feeling that like, I don't want Ted Cruz fighting for Israel as a US Senator because of his religious views. I don't love that. And to be fair, he said like this is a personal motivation. It's not the reason that I would give other people to support.

Right. And I actually suspect he would have said that if Tucker didn't cut him off, in which case one has to, in my estimation, give him a little bit of leeway. And it was exactly the right thing to say. Like, I am a Christian. My position on this, it kind of begins with that, but that can't be the rationale for the policy position that I end up endorsing because I don't represent a whole bunch of Christians.

I represent all of my constituents, which is precisely the right thing to say in a context like that. I was, there's a lot that stood out to me. And the first thing I should say is I'm not a particular fan of either one of these gentlemen, at least as they're currently constituted. I've had an awkward drink with Ted Cruz at one point in the past and won't get into the details. It's not exactly like that Tom Segura joke, but it's kind of similar. And are you guys aware of that joke?

I had to go back into my recesses to get it. Seek it out, it's great. It's great. They're neighbors, he like runs out to ask him a question. It's kind of funny. Seek it out. And the other thing is Tucker Carlson. I've done television with him in the past

when he was still at Fox, years and years ago. So I've known him a little bit. And I didn't think he comported himself in a particularly thoughtful or noble way. He certainly was interrogating him, but he's using like all of the slippery tricks imaginable. Like what is the population of Iran? What is this, trivia?

Like I can look it up on the internet the same way that you did. That wouldn't make my position any more or less valid. And he knows that. So there's a little bit of just kind of gamesmanship going on. But I do think that the underlying philosophical argument is super interesting. And I also think that Tucker's, I think, authentic sense that there is this risk of escalation, and it's something that I understand better because of the fact that I endorsed the Second

Gulf War very stridently and thought we could nation build and that didn't work out. And Tucker retreated from that position pretty early on originally and seems to be trying to embody the kind of wisdom there in the context of responding to this present conflict. You know, the biblical interpretation debate, you know, whether or not the interpretation ought to be kind of contextual and rooted in history or whether it's kind of broader and hermeneutical and we ought to be complying it to the modern context, I'm going to set that aside for the moment, although I do have perspective on it. But I think ultimately this question of how to think about this current conflict and how to apply one's principles is always fascinating and appropriate to get into.

And I thought that in both cases, in a different context, the thoughtful aspects of the conversation they were having would be worthwhile to get into. But the conversation was also derailed by all of the aspects of our contemporary politics that you would expect. Like at some point, you're a warmonger. And at some point, you're an anti-Semite. It's like, of course, that's where this ends up landing on the rocks and completely disheveling into absolute insanity. I'm curious.

I mean, I wouldn't say that the trivia pop question, can you just like tell me the general contours of this country, is that unfair of an inquisition? I mean, I... Had he said that, I wouldn't have made that observation. But that's not really what he said. What he says is like, what's the population? Like talk to me about...

You don't know anything about Iran if I don't know the population. Like I could get it within two or three million. And I think that that wouldn't really matter all that much. But that's not the actual substance of the argument here. I do think there's like a certain kind of question that journalists could ask that is not done enough, that I kind of appreciated about what Tucker did.

I always wish that during the debates with Trump on stage, somebody would just be like, can you explain the difference between Medicaid and Medicare? Or like, I actually want to know if he knows that and I'm not entirely sure that he does and it's not just Trump. I mean, they did this, you know, that there was, I can't remember exactly what the question was, but somebody with Kristi Noem in that congressional hearing, they asked her, I think it was something about like habeas corpus if she could like define and she just like,

she was like habeas corpus is like president like define. And she just like, she was like habeas corpus is like president can deport anybody he wants and any, and it's like, it's literally the opposite of that. But like, I don't know, there was just this, there was something about that that I found appealing was to just ask Ted Cruz if he could like speak. And the thing that he didn't do, like the landing that he didn't have,

was sort of making it clear why this mattered. Like why is it important whether Ted Cruz can answer this question or not? And I saw a really good tweet, I don't know who this guy is, his name's, he goes by T. Greer, but he said like the problem with this, the way that Tucker did this is

he doesn't really close the deal. Like he doesn't explain, you know, there's three times as many people in Iran as there are in Texas. And three times as there are, three times the number of people as there are in Iraq, like how many soldiers do we need to keep the peace in Iraq? We're getting, like this country's larger than that.

You know, you're talking about evacuating Tehran, like you can drive across Texas in 24 hours. Iran's much bigger than Texas, three times the size, you're expecting people to leave the country, you're expecting us to manage this entire country and some sort of regime change, whatever it is, or you're sort of, he could have made the point, what happens after these strikes

and how are we gonna manage this giant, big, complicated country? like what happens after these strikes and how are we gonna manage this giant, big complicated country? And if you don't understand the country, how could you possibly be supportive of a war that might throw it into crisis? Because you're gonna be one of the people responsible for figuring out what we do next.

Connected back to Syria, which is a point he made earlier, yeah. Yeah, that to me is like a pretty, a fair line of inquisition, but yeah, I agree. There's obviously like a gotcha thing. And it was deeply embarrassing, I think, for Ted Cruz to not be able to answer that question.

Or even call out the trick, I think, would have been fine too. Yes. To say like, really, population of Iran, like we're going to talk about rote stats. Like I can tell you about the country, but I'm not going to get into this like, can you answer this question on Google

before the interview or not? He did sort of start to say something about like the Sunni-Shia conflict, and then Tucker kind of cut him off and was like, no, no, this is important. Like you don't, you can't tell me how many people live there, you know? That's what Tucker is good at.

Yeah, the cutting you off, not allowing you to get your footing back in the conversation. You're correct to point out, Isaac, that that is what he was doing on Fox on a regular basis. The universe of more respect. Hey everybody, this is John, executive producer of YouTube and podcast content and co-host

of The Daily Podcast. I hope you enjoyed this preview of our Sunday podcast with Ari and Isaac. We are now offering this podcast exclusively to our premium podcast members, along with our ad-free Daily Podcast, Friday editions, in-depth interviews, upcoming new podcast series, bonus content, and much more. If you want to receive all that and give your support to help grow Tangle Media, please go to ReadTangle.com where you can sign up for a newsletter membership, a podcast membership, or a discounted bundle membership which gets you both access to the premium newsletter and the premium podcast. If it's not the right time for you to sign up,

please don't worry, our ad Our ad supported daily podcast isn't going anywhere. But if it is in your ability to support by signing up for a membership, we would greatly appreciate it. And we're really excited to share all of our premium offerings with you. We'll be right back here tomorrow for Isaac and the rest of the crew. This is John Law signing off. Have a great day, y'all. Take care. Bye y'all. Take care. Bye, y'all.

Our podcast is written by me, Isaac Saul, and edited and engineered by John Wall. The script is edited by our managing editor, Ari Weitzman, Will K. Back, Bailey Saul, and Sean Brady. The logo for our podcast was designed by Magdalena Bacopa, who is also our social media manager. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75. If you're looking for more from Tangle, please go to readtangle.com and check out our website. Looking for a better place to call home? Discover Watercolor Westport by Landark Homes. Nestled in eastern Ontario cottage country, live connected to nature, neighbors and the necessities with high-speed connectivity.

This walkable, vibrant waterfront village offers shops, dining, scenic trails, a winery, and the harborfront. Just steps from your door. Escape the city to a net-zero ready bungalow at Watercolor Westport. You're only 75 minutes from Ottawa and a short drive to Toronto or Montreal. With new homes starting from the 600s, you can live better in Watercolor Westport. To find out more, visit WatercolorWestport.com. What's better than a well-marbled ribeye sizzling on the barbecue?

A well-marbled ribeye sizzling on the barbecue that was carefully selected by an Instacart shopper and delivered to your door. A well-marbled ribeye you ordered without even leaving the kiddie pool. Whatever groceries your summer calls for, Instacart has you covered. Download the Instacart app and enjoy $0 delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart. Groceries that over-deliver. Some things just take too long. A meeting that could have been an email, someone explaining crypto, or switching mobile providers.

Accept with Fizz. Switching to Fizz is quick and easy. Mobile plans start at $17 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details at fizz.ca.