Tangle - The Disney controversy.

Episode Date: April 5, 2022

A closer look at what is going on with Disney and and the events unravelling in Florida. There are two threads to this story, so we will try to flesh them both out properly.You can read today's podcast here.You can subscribe to Tangle by clicking here or drop something in our tip jar by clicking here.Our podcast is written by Isaac Saul and produced by Trevor Eichhorn. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75.Our newsletter is edited by Bailey Saul, Sean Brady, Ari Weitzman, and produced in conjunction with Tangle’s social media manager Magdalena Bokowa, who also created our logo.--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/tanglenews/message Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight.

Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. From executive producer Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, and welcome to the Tangle Podcast, the place where you get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking without all that hysterical nonsense you find everywhere else. I am your host, Isaac Saul, and on today's episode, we are going to be talking about the controversy around Disney.

we are going to be talking about the controversy around Disney. This is a tough one, a pretty intricate, nuanced, and apparently very explosive story. But as always, before we jump in, we'll start off with some quick hits. First up, Senators Mitt Romney and Lisa Murkowski said they will support Katonji Brown Jackson's Supreme Court nomination, becoming the second and third Republicans to say they vote for her. Jackson is expected to be confirmed later this week. Number two, Senate negotiators say they've struck a deal on another $10 billion coronavirus aid package that will not include billions of dollars to fund a global vaccination push. Number three, President Biden called Vladimir Putin a war criminal after new images surfaced of dead civilians in the Ukrainian city of Bucha. Number four, Twitter announced it will appoint Elon Musk to its board a day after the company said Musk bought a 9.2% stake in the

company. Number five, GOP Representative Fred Upton from Michigan, one of the longest tenured Republicans in Congress, has decided to retire. All right, that's it for our quick hits today. That brings us to our main topic, which is the Disney controversy. Before we jump in, I just want to say a couple of things. First of all, I've written a lot about these issues and we've done a few podcasts about them before about LGBTQ bills and critical race theory bills and trans youth. So I have to just refer you a little bit to some of our previous writing and podcasts

about this stuff. We can't cover everything in every single issue. Also, I want to note that because of the sensitivity of this topic, we are actually skipping our reader question today just because we wanted to give this a little bit more space than usual. All right, so let's jump right in. Now, Disney is taking a stand against the parental rights bill just signed into law by Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, and journalist Christopher Ruffo has now posted videos of the meeting that executives had with employees about it. Florida Republicans are threatening to revoke an unusual rule specific to Walt Disney World.

It effectively allows the company to act as its own autonomous municipal government. Lawmakers floated the change after Disney denounced what critics are calling the don't say gay law. One of the biggest donors here is actually Disney. In the last two years, it's given nearly $300,000 to DeSantis and the legislators that voted for this bill. John Oliver is slamming Disney CEO Bob Chapek and his response to Florida's don't say gay bill. There are two threads to this story, so I'd like to try and flesh them both out properly. There are two threads to this story, so I'd like to try and flesh them both out properly. The first thread is Florida's Parental Rights and Education Bill, dubbed the Don't Say Gay Bill by critics, which we covered in previous podcast editions. The most controversial part

of the legislation bans classroom instruction on sexual orientation or gender identity from kindergarten through third grade, and later on calls for a prohibition of sexual orientation or gender identity classroom instruction in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards. The bill also requires schools to tell parents if their child is seeking school counseling, among other things. Florida Governor Ron DeSantis' press secretary, Christina Puchaw, referred to the bill as an anti-grooming bill. The bill's passage was an important moment for Disney, given its deep ties to Florida. The Orlando theme park alone employs some 80,000 workers.

Disney is also a major political lobbyist in the state. It donated $4.8 million to Florida lawmakers in the 2020 cycle, 80% of which went to Republicans. to lawmakers in the 2020 cycle, 80% of which went to Republicans. But Disney has often lobbied for and against Bill's Democrat support or oppose, which left many Democrats surprised and upset when Disney fomented very little opposition to the legislation as it moved its way to Governor Ron DeSantis' desk. It also left many Disney workers, who take pride in the company's LGBTQ friendly culture, enraged at CEO Bobappick's tepid response. This resulted in several internal company protests, including staff walkouts at the park, all of which culminated in the CEO sending a note to Disney workers. He told them that corporate statements do little to

change minds or outcomes and that the company was reassessing its political donations. Chappick then called Governor DeSantis to voice his opposition to the bill, and when that didn't work, paused all Disney donations to Florida politicians. He then told workers, I missed the mark in this case and I'm an ally you can count on. DeSantis responded by calling Disney woke and pledging that there was zero chance he wouldn't sign the bill. He then signed it a few days later. In the midst of this controversy, there was the second thread emerging. In a company-wide Zoom call, Carrie Burke, the president of Disney's General Entertainment Content, said that as the mother of two queer children, she intended to ramp up queer visibility

in Disney productions. She expressed a desire to have more Disney characters that are lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, queer or questioning, intersex, and asexual or allies, often referred to as LGBTQIA. Disney's website, meanwhile, promised that 50% of regular and recurring characters across Disney would come from underrepresented groups. Another employee, Latoya Ravinos, spoke in the meeting about her, quote, not at all secret gay agenda, end quote, as an executive producer where she gets to add queerness to some animated shows she directs. Ravenew directs a revival of a show called The Proud Family that now includes both an openly gay friend of the main character

who deals with bullying as well as another character who has gay dads. Burke and Ravenew's comments along with the pledge on the website, were elevated by conservative activist Christopher Ruffo, who added allegations that Disney employees had an insidious record of sexual crimes, sparking a campaign to boycott Disney in conservative circles. Many parents expressed the fear that Disney was trying to indoctrinate their children. As a result of these two controversies, a lot of ink was spilled about Disney's response to the Florida bill, Rufo's allegations about Disney, and the push to boycott the company. In a moment, we're going to hear some of those reactions to the two story threads from the right and the left, and then I'm going to share my take. First up, we'll start with what the right is saying. The right is calling for folks to quit Disney, saying it has succumbed to, quote, wokeness.

Some warn that Disney's programming is trying to indoctrinate children into being LGBTQ. Others say Disney is in a lose-lose position, either stuck upsetting its employees or risking upsetting Florida parents and lawmakers. Kristen Hawkins, the president of Students for Life of America, said, quote, I'm a mom and I'm saying goodbye to Disney. Disney has now transformed into a political propaganda machine that grooms children for abortions and sexual promiscuity, and nothing showcases their regression into a progressive pumpkin better than their new movie, Turning Red. Rated PG, it's the story of a 13-year-old girl named May who inherits her family's curse to become a red panda whenever she feels passionate

emotions, including sexual tension, which feels wildly inappropriate in a movie targeting young children like mine, Hawkins wrote. The adults at Disney create a storyline for the young main character and her fictional friends around their attraction to an older boy. It's even more appalling when May begins to draw this boy in what the Turning Red YouTube channel calls dirty drawings. The abortion lobby gets in on the action at the very end when May goes out with her panda tail and ears on display. When her mother disapproves, May apes the abortion lobby's signature and sinister catchphrase as she says, my panda, my choice, Hawkins wrote. It doesn't seem coincidental that as this movie projects

sexuality into children's thoughts, Disney is also engaging in a campaign for politicized sex education in its home state. Disney recently spoke out in opposition to Florida's parental rights and education bill, which would prohibit the discussion of sexual orientation and gender identity in grades kindergarten to third. The LGBTQ plus community has already been featured multiple times in Disney productions. For parents who proactively monitor what their child is viewing, it's likely time to say goodbye to today's Disney if you want to protect your children from the grooming tactics of the left. We're not dealing with Mickey Mouse anymore.

In National Review, Alexandra DeSantis said that Disney is trying to play to its disgruntled employees. One such concession to wokeism appears to be preparing to cram sexualized content into children's programming. If we can't get them in the classroom, we'll get them at the movie theater or something, she said. If we can't get them in the classroom, we'll get them at the movie theater or something, she said. In several leaked videos, Disney executives pledged to depict more transgender and gender nonconforming characters in their films, or queer leads, as the one higher up put it. In the same vein, they aim to erase all references to ladies and gentlemen and boys and girls at Disney parks. The company, in short, finds itself engaged in a game it simply cannot win. On one side is some number of its own employees, we do not even know if it's a majority or simply a very loud faction,

berating the company for not doing enough to stop this law, as if Disney has been elected to run the state of Florida, DeSantis wrote. On the other side is Florida's government, its vocal governor, who is insusceptible to bullies and, important to note, some not insignificant portion of its customers. It is hard to imagine that some not insignificant portion of its customers. It is hard to imagine that even if some number of parents oppose Florida's legislation, most parents are hoping Disney's children's movies will respond to the law by featuring more sexual themes and queer leads. What's more, polling suggests that most American parents actually don't oppose Florida's law at all. When presented with the actual text of the legislation,

as opposed to merely being told about it by the pollster, 61% of Americans say they support it. In the New York Post, Carol Markowitz said Disney is brainwashing kids into gender theory. On Tuesday, Christopher Ruffo, known for his exposés on schools and corporations under the spell of critical race theory, released internal Disney videos in which those in charge discuss how they want to insert the quote, not at all secret gay agenda end quote into children's programming. Those were the words used by Disney television animation executive producer Latoya Ravino, who said she is adding queerness wherever she can with Disney's blessing as the company is going hard to be supportive. The shocking footage also featured Disney Parks diversity and inclusion manager Vivian Ware saying the company has removed all of the gendered greetings at its theme parks.

Until wokeness overtook it, Disney could be counted on for safely age-appropriate entertainment, Markowitz wrote. But why should parents continue to trust a company that is putting this kind of brainwashing into children's entertainment? Why should kids be getting any sort of gender identity lesson in school or at a theme park? And why should Disney be in the business of sexualizing kids in any direction? What Disney doesn't understand is that pushing gender dysphoria onto even younger children will never be popular among the very people who make up Disney's core audience, families. Parents don't want their small children being introduced to the idea that they may have been born into the wrong body.

Children are extremely susceptible to suggestion, and parents don't want their kids told their gender is malleable. They certainly do not want outside forces instructing their children on gender identity. Alright, so that is it for what the right is saying, which brings us to the left's take. The left says conservatives are creating false outrage that endangers already marginalized communities. Some say Disney actually has a history of treating its LGBTQ employees poorly. Others call out the hypocrisy of Republicans who call on Florida's government to punish a corporation for asserting its political stance. Michelle Goldberg wrote about the right's Disney freakout and how she felt bad for LaToya Ravineau, whose comments about adding queerness to Disney shows are now being framed as her grooming kids. Ruffo obtained video of the all-hands meeting, and he presented the clips of Ravennau's remarks, along with those of several other Disney executives, as evidence that Disney is sexualizing

children. The story has blown up on the right, where Ravennau's arch reference to a gay agenda is being treated as an admission that she has a plan to corrupt kids, Goldberg wrote. Ravennau has landed in the middle of a renaissance moral panic, one that combines elements of QAnon with old tropes about gay predators. Now, a new wave of legislation is targeting what teachers can say about LGBTQ issues. As PEN America reported, the fight against critical race theory has primed the public to support sweeping censorship of classroom speech. For anti-LGBTQ plus activists, this is a once-in-a-generation opportunity, a chance to ram through bills that are far more restrictive than anything the public would normally accept. This is, of course,

not the first time that gay and gender non-conforming people have been framed as a moral threat to children, Goldberg said. In 1977, Anita Bryant, a former beauty queen and spokeswoman for the Florida Citrus Commission, started the anti-gay Save Our Children campaign. Homosexuals cannot reproduce, so they must recruit, she said. And to freshen their ranks, they must recruit the youth of America. Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes

a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. the Republican Party has largely eschewed such language, appearing to make their peace with the presence of gays, lesbians, and transgender people in public life. Now such rhetoric is back, and it's potentially explosive. Alex Abad Santos said Disney's decision not to fight against the Don't Say Gay Bill wasn't the first time it betrayed its LGBTQ fans. The current controversy has illuminated the disconnect between one of the world's biggest companies and its very devoted fan base, which includes large numbers of devoted LGBTQ fans, Abbott-Santos said. Disney has parlayed the feel-good, empowering messages of its movies to position itself as a progressive, diverse, inclusive, and highly profitable company.

Its inaction in Florida paints a different picture. Perhaps more realistic picture is that this company isn't living up to the promises it's trading on, and it's far from the first time the company has fallen short on queer issues. For Disney's LGBTQ fans and employees, it's a betrayal that can't even come as a surprise. When it comes to supporting its LGBTQ fan base and its employees, Disney conducts itself in a similarly understated fashion, Abbott-Santos said. It's only recently that Disney has begun to create out-LGBTQ characters, like the lesbian Cyclops cop in 2020s Onward. Audiences who watched the movie found out that the one-eyed law enforcement officer was queer because she mentions that she has an unseen girlfriend.

Some critics said that character was more of a hollow pander than a genuine effort at creating its first animated LGBTQ character. Burge explained that these small actions have allowed queer fans to forget about how Disneyland once had a policy that prohibited same-sex dancing, ultimately struck down by the Orange County Superior Court in 1984, or that a gay executive filed a sexual orientation discrimination suit against the company in 2021. Disney's stance on Don't Say Gay and its alignment with Florida's anti-gay lawmakers was a reminder that the company isn't as progressive as it says it is. In the Washington Post, Greg Sargent said Ron DeSantis' repulsive war on Disney will face a reckoning. A big question is whether DeSantis will seek to

revoke Disney's state tax incentives as a weapon in the war over that measure, which opponents call the don't-say-gay law, Sargent asked. If so, that could alienate Republicans who are fine with a bit of performative culture warring, but want to keep corporations happy where it really counts, i.e. on their bottom line. If not, that could disappoint right-wingers who actively want Republicans to wield state power wherever possible to bring woke corporations to their knees. Yet here's the thing. Some on the right, particularly the new nationalists seeking want Republicans to wield state power wherever possible to bring woke corporations to their knees. Yet here's the thing. Some on the right, particularly the new nationalists seeking to build a post-Trump Trumpism, actually do believe the state should be weaponized to fight the culture wars as aggressively as possible. Fox News' Laura Ingraham is urging Republicans to

use every tool of government possible to break corporations economically as a weapon of retaliation against excessive wokeness. It's sometimes said that Republicans are turning against large corporations in a fundamental shift of economic ideology, but that's mostly nonsense, Sargent said. Republicans have mainly threatened retaliation for corporate transgressions, such as standing up for African-American voting rights, trying to protect customers and workers with vaccine mandates, cooperating with a congressional investigation into Trump's insurrection, and now speaking up for LGBT people.

All right, so that is it for the left and the right's take, which brings us to my take. The Oxford definition for moral panic seems pertinent at the moment. Quote, a mass movement based on the false or exaggerated perception that some cultural behavior or group of people is dangerously deviant and poses a threat to society's values and interests. I'm not really sure how else to describe what I'm witnessing. Look, I've written about Florida's parental rights and education bill. I've written about critical race theory and Republican efforts to legislate it out of classrooms. I've written about trans youth and gender dysphoria. If you've been reading this newsletter or listening to this podcast for more than a couple of weeks, you know where I stand. I think these bills are silly.

They're overly broad, and potentially dangerous, and they amount to the very kind of government control many conservatives often say they are so worried about. Plenty of readers have argued about my positions, and we've even dedicated an entire special edition to the totally valid point that this is not really a right-versus-left issue on the ground, because among parents, plenty of liberals share the same concerns about critical race theory or LGBTQ classroom material that the right does. I've addressed all of this a few times, and I can't rehash it every time we have to cover one of these issues. But here's what I'll say about this Disney controversy. I think it is once again exposing a lot of hypocrisy on the right. For the last two decades, conservatives have been proudly fighting for the

right of corporations to have larger influence in politics. Now some are insisting DeSantis punished Disney economically with tools of the government for simply stating opposition to the Florida bill. They didn't even lobby against it. Conservatives constantly hammer the left about cancel culture, and now they're trying to cancel, of all things, Disney. Conservatives constantly talk about free speech issues, but they seem totally unperturbed when the government actually tries to limit speech in classrooms. Conservatives rightly hammer the left for baseless accusations of racism or bigotry, but many are now baselessly accusing anyone who opposes Florida's Don't Say Gay bill of being groomers or child predators. When I wrote about

my opposition to the Florida parental rights bill in Tangle, I received this accusation multiple times. None of this is actually that big of a deal. Christopher Ruffo, the conservative activist whose work I have elevated a few times in this newsletter, seems to be driving most of these conversations. He also seems to be veering further and further into hackery every day. This was best illustrated by his most recent viral tweet alleging that, quote, Disney has had employees arrested for child sex crimes in 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, and 2022. In other words, at least once a year for the past decade. This, I guess,

is supposed to be proof that Disney is coming for your kids. Of course, Disney employs some 190,000 people. A horrific reality in America is that among 190,000 people, many will be criminals. Some will commit sex crimes. I'm certain I could do the exact same exercise for Walmart, or police officers, or college athletes, or any other major group of people that exist in the hundreds of thousands and come up with similar results. This was best illustrated by the journalist Michael Kruse, who pointed out that Republican politicians and staffers have also been arrested or charged for sex crimes every year since 2012. It's funny that Ruffo is not investigating that. every year since 2012. It's funny that Rufo is not investigating that. Even Rufo's framing of Disney's pledge to make 50% of regular and recurring characters from underrepresented groups is a bit misleading. That's because anywhere between 9 and 12% of youth currently identify as lesbian, gay, or bisexual. Children of color, almost certainly now a majority in the

United States, read more than 50%. So if Disney were to make its characters 50% from traditionally underrepresented groups, that'd basically be representative of youth in America today. This isn't grooming. It's a company with characters that largely get shown to children that is trying to make its characters more representative of the kids who are watching them. In other words, these aren't informative snippets. They don't tell meaningful stories about Disney. They are tactics meant to distort the truth and to create the moral panic we're witnessing now. It's meant to make people scared of Disney and LGBTQ folks and wokeism in a visceral way, and I think it is incredibly irresponsible.

Is some Disney programming overtly political? Of course. Does some Disney programming feel inappropriate for kids? Yes, though it should be noted a lot of the fuss is about PG, that's parental guidance, movies. Have Disney employees committed gut-wrenching crimes? Yes, Rufo has documented many of them. Has Disney tried to cover some of those crimes up? Almost certainly. It is, after all, a giant corporation with a brand and reputation to protect, and that's what they all do. Should we tread carefully in how we navigate children questioning their gender or sexual orientation? Of course. I've written about that repeatedly. But are Disney employees trying to systematically groom children to become gay or

trans or overly sexualized? I find the suggestion absurd. Is Disney an overtly liberal or progressive company? I'm not really sure. Perhaps their programming skews progressive, it certainly seems that way, but the company works both sides of the aisle and, as has been widely reported, spent most of their political capital in Florida supporting Republicans, not Democrats, almost certainly for the obvious corporate benefits that brings them. They lobby for bills that help their bottom line, plain and simple. As Ruffo readily admits, this is all about punishing Disney for publicly opposing the legislation in Florida. He said it openly, quote, perhaps the lesson that they're learning, and certainly the lesson that they

should be learning, is that they should stay out of politics, he told the New York Times. But at what cost should this lesson be learned? Is our country not divided and hateful enough? that they should be learning is that they should stay out of politics, he told the New York Times. But at what cost should this lesson be learned? Is our country not divided and hateful enough? Must we now insinuate that Democrats are pedophiles? Are the lives of gay teachers or trans teenagers not complicated or challenging enough? Must we now frame them as groomers who want to convert children? Is being an underpaid, understaffed, and overworked educator not hard enough? Must we now hang the threat of lawsuits over their heads for mentioning sexual orientation or systemic racism? There is no good outcome here. It's just one more step down our descending trail of culture war hate and generalization being used to tear the country apart, all for the cause of punishing a company that shares the views of millions of Americans

and millions of Floridians about a controversial piece of legislation. It's an ugly, fear-mongering, political no-win playbook that is only further eroding our already broken political discourse. All right, that's it for my take. I'm fired up today. Next up is our story that matters. As I mentioned, we're skipping our reader question today. On Monday, the Supreme Court ruled in favor of a Brooklyn man who said he had been falsely accused by police officers of resisting arrest. He wants to sue the officers for malicious prosecution under a federal civil rights law, and the court voted 6-3 in his favor. The man, Larry Thompson, sued the officers under Section 1983, which allows citizens to sue state officials

for violations of their constitutional rights. From the Washington Post, the ruling was narrow and incremental, and Justice Kavanaugh noted that it left police officers with other ways to defeat unwarranted civil suits, notably including qualified immunity, the doctrine that requires plaintiffs to show not only that the officer had violated a constitutional right, but also the right had been clearly established in a previous ruling. Still, it was a significant win that will change the precedent for how civilians can fight unlawful arrests and charges, even if a conviction doesn't take place. even if a conviction doesn't take place. Next up is our numbers section.

The amount of money Disney donated in the 2020 election cycle alone was $20 million. The amount of that money that went to Joe Biden was $1.2 million. The amount of money that went to the RNC was $656,000. The amount of money Disney donated directly to the Republican Party of Florida was $913,000. The amount of money Disney donated to GOP Senate campaigns was $586,000. The amount of money Disney donated to Florida's Democratic Party was $313,000. The amount of money Disney donated directly to Governor Ron DeSantis was $50,000. And the amount of money Disney donated directly to Governor Ron DeSantis was $50,000. And the amount of money it donated to the Friends of Ron DeSantis PAC was $100,000. All right, last but not least, our Have a Nice Day section.

Israel is launching a unique new program to give free public transportation to anyone over the age of 75. Israel's Minister of Transport, Meirav Mekeli, just unveiled the program, which gives a 50% discount to those aged 60-74, 5-18, or those with disabilities, and free transportation to anyone under 5 or over 75. The goal of the so-called Equal Commute Reform is to encourage Israelis to use public transportation. Mekeli said he hopes it gets us out of traffic, reduces accidents on the roads, and helps us with our climate crisis goals. The Jerusalem Post has the story, and there's a link to it in today's newsletter. All right, everybody, that is it for today's podcast. Look, this was a controversial one,

and I took a pretty hard opinion. I know a lot of people are talking about this. Feel free to share it. Send the podcast around. Send it to some friends. Spread the word. It's a good one to get out there and get in front of people. And yeah, we need your help to get Tangle out into the ether.

Either way, we'll see you tomorrow. Same time. Thanks. Peace. you tomorrow. Same time. Thanks. Peace. Our newsletter is written by Isaac Saul, edited by Bailey Saul, Sean Brady, Ari Weitzman, and produced in conjunction with Tangle's social media manager, Magdalena Bokova, who also helped create our logo. The podcast is edited by Trevor Eichhorn, and music for the podcast was produced by Diet75. For more from Tangle, subscribe to our newsletter or check out our content archives at www.readtangle.com. Thanks for watching! procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history,

and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+.