Tangle - The Hollywood strike.

Starting point is 00:00:00 Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages six months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at flucellvax.ca.

Starting point is 00:01:00 From executive producer Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, and welcome to the Tangle podcast, the place where you get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking, and a little bit of my take. I'm your host, Isaac Saul, and on today's episode, we're going to be talking about the Hollywood strike. In case you missed it last week, actors in Hollywood and members of the largest actors union joined writers who had already been on strike for several weeks, which means you may be watching a lot of reruns here pretty soon. We're going to talk about what exactly is going on, some arguments about the strike from the

Starting point is 00:01:49 right and the left, and then as always, I'll give you my take. Before we jump in though, we'll kick it off with some quick hits. First up, hundreds of thousands of Israelis hit the streets to protest a highly contested judicial overhaul backed by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Number two, North Korea fired two ballistic missiles after a second U.S. submarine arrived in South Korea. Number three, Twitter owner Elon Musk shared a new X logo for the website, saying the company would be transitioning to new branding and an all-in-one services app that includes payment transfers and long-form content. Number four, the Justice Department formally filed a lawsuit against Texas over its buoy barriers that were deployed in the Rio Grande to limit border crossings. And number five, Republican Senator Mitt Romney from Utah published an op-ed in the Wall Street Journal calling on Republican donors to cut off support for candidates who can't beat Trump. Tonight, Hollywood is completely closed for business.

Starting point is 00:03:08 Members of the Screen Actors Guild voted to go on strike today after failing to reach a deal with major studios. The last time actors and writers were on strike at the same time was 63 years ago when actor Ronald Reagan was head of the union. There is no end in sight for the actors and writers strike that for the last 10 days has mostly shut down Hollywood, with studios so far refusing to negotiate. This is having a big impact on businesses

Starting point is 00:03:35 which depend on the movie industry for survival, including those far from Los Angeles. What we would be striking for if we strike is unbelievably important. We ought to protect the people who are kind of on the margins. Twenty-six thousand bucks a year is what you have to make to get your health insurance, and there are a lot of people who, residual payments are what carry them across that threshold. If those residual payments dry up, so does their health care, and that's absolutely unacceptable.

Starting point is 00:04:04 We can't have that, so we've got care. And that's absolutely unacceptable. We can't have that. So we've got to figure out something that is fair. Last week, actors joined the screenwriters strike, marking the first dual union strike in the industry in over 60 years. Many scripted late night shows have already been paralyzed, airing only reruns since the writers strike began in May. But the addition of the actors union has the potential to further upend the television, film, and streaming industries. For more than a month, the Screen Actors Guild American Federation of Television and Radio Artists has been negotiating a new three-year contract with studios, streaming services, and production companies. Union leaders for the actors say the

Starting point is 00:04:45 new streaming model has hurt shares of income they used to see from royalties and instead is funneling more cash to executives. On Friday, 65,000 actors voted overwhelmingly in favor of striking. Their decision comes after the Writers Guild of America, or WGA, failed to come to terms in a deal with the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers, or AMPTP. 97.8% of the Writers Guild had voted to authorize their strike. Both actors and writers participating in the strikes are worried about two major issues, streaming and artificial intelligence. Under the television model, many actors and writers were used to receiving royalty payments anytime a show like Seinfeld was shown on television, which helped sustain them when other jobs dried up. But the streaming model offers less income from royalties, so both writers and actors want to find a way to get long-term revenue.

Starting point is 00:05:40 In addition, writers have seen their pay decline by 4% on average over the past decade, despite the expansion of streaming, news shows, and investment in production. On top of that, streaming shows tend to have shorter seasons than television shows, which leaves more time between work. At the same time, actors and writers have expressed concern about the advent of artificial intelligence. Actors are worried about studios using their likenesses without hiring or paying them, while writers are worried about the prospect of artificial intelligence writing

Starting point is 00:06:09 scripts. The Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers, or AMPT, says it offered a generous deal to include the largest minimum pay bump in 35 years and a groundbreaking AI proposal that protects actors' digital likenesses. But the unions regrettably chose to strike, as the Associated Press reported. With the strike in place, actors and writers are prohibited from more than just contributing to productions. They can't make personal appearances, promote their past work, attend premieres, audition for roles, or even attend award shows, including the Emmys, which are planned for September. Nearly every U.S.-based show or film currently in production will now go on hiatus until actors and writers

Starting point is 00:06:50 strike a deal with AMPT. Negotiations will continue, but you can expect a pause in new entertainment. Today, we're going to break down some arguments from the left and the right about this strike and then my take. Today's podcast is sponsored by Arnold Ventures, a philanthropy dedicated to improving the lives of Americans through evidence-based policy solutions. As part of their efforts, they also support journalism throughout the United States, including outlets like the Texas Tribune, ProPublica, and the Institute for Nonprofit News, among others. To learn more about their work, go to ArnoldVentures.org. That's ArnoldVentures.org. First up, we'll start with what the left is saying many on the left support the strikes and argue that there are solutions available to network executives some suggest conditions for actors

Starting point is 00:07:54 were already in crisis before streaming and artificial intelligence others say these issues go well beyond just hollywood in bloomberg tyler cohen wrote about how to end the actors and writers strike. The strike covers many issues, but one of the most controversial concerns the rights to artificial intelligence likeness by individual human beings. The studios are requesting the right to offer contracts that allow them to scan the bodies, voices, and other features of individual actors, including extras, and then hold the rights to the AI likenesses in perpetuity. The actors are upset for good reason, Cohen said. Most actors don't become famous, and so their likenesses end up being worth nothing. That means studios can't afford to

Starting point is 00:08:36 offer any more than a small sum for the likeness rights on such a large number of initial acting contracts. It also means that if the studios get their way, potential stars end up significantly underpaid for selling their likenesses before they've become famous. I suggest that the eventual strike settlement forbids studios from buying the rights to AI likenesses for more than a single film or project, Cohen said. Or, as a compromise, the contract could be for some limited number of projects but not in perpetuity. Actors thus would remain in long-run control of their AI likenesses, yet if they want to keep selling

Starting point is 00:09:09 those likenesses project by project, they could do so. In the Los Angeles Times, Maria Prudente said we've long been in crisis and it's not just streaming or AI. SAG-AFTRA has trenchantly described how streaming services and AI technology are transforming and threatening the existing creative landscape of Hollywood. But this dispute is not at its heart about new technology or AI, Prudente said. The crux of the union's argument is that actors finally deserve proper compensation for their work. Our profession isn't suddenly in crisis in 2023. work. Our profession isn't suddenly in crisis in 2023. Actors have always been in crisis. Actors are out of work 90% of the time, and most spend their days working a job that has nothing to do with their skill set or passion so they can pay their rent and utility bills. Unless it's a

Starting point is 00:09:57 contract for a long show, an actor seldom gets an opportunity to work numerous times in a row. Even if they do, if they're new to the industry, they often start off non-union, have to work numerous times in a row. Even if they do, if they're new to the industry, they often start off non-union, have to work in low-budget productions, and get paid little, she said. Actors have long been conditioned to feel grateful that they are being included and paid for it. Actors have always been worthy. That's why SAG-AFTRA members are willing to strike, to sacrifice the pay and exposure they need right now. They're tired of always getting a bad deal. In MSNBC, Hayes Brown said the strike is important for all American workers. SAG-AFTRA president Fran Drescher stressed that what's happening in the entertainment industry is

Starting point is 00:10:38 happening across labor, calling it the result of when employers make Wall Street and greed their priority and they forget about the essential contributors that make the machine run. Drescher is right. It's not just actors who are affected by the shift in the entertainment industry. The 160,000 performers in SAG-AFTRA will be joining the members of the Writers Guild of America on the picket lines in one of the largest labor actions the country has seen in years. Drescher's outrage also reflects how necessary the protections the guilds are seeking are, especially given how much studio executives have been gambling and losing over the last decade. We've seen big budget

Starting point is 00:11:15 productions shelved for tax breaks, shows, and movies wiped off of streaming platforms to prevent having to pay residuals and untold millions wasted on flops. Meanwhile, studio executives like Warner Bros. Discovery's David Zaslav and Disney's Bob Iger rake in massive salaries. Drescher is also right about this extending beyond Hollywood, as labor has racked up a number of wins in the post-pandemic era. Yet the pendulum is starting to swing away from workers again, with layoffs and inflation hampering the leverage employees have recently enjoyed. All right, that is it for the leftist saying, which brings us to what the right is saying. The right is mixed on the strikes, with some saying Hollywood brought this upon themselves, and others suggesting conservatives should support the strikes. Some argue that woke

Starting point is 00:12:10 content and the wrong focus is what has hurt Hollywood profits and undermined the industry. Others say that even though Hollywood is condescending and liberal, the strikers are right about the threat of artificial intelligence. In the New York Post, Dan McLaughlin said woke Hollywood cut the nation a break and cancels itself. Maybe they'll learn something in their time off, and maybe the country could use a break from them, McLaughlin said. Hollywood has been its own worst enemy. Moviegoers like superhero movies, name brand franchises, and Pixar cartoons inundate them with so many sequels of such declining quality that viewers turn out. Me Too scandals reveal the industry is overrun with sexual predators

Starting point is 00:12:50 protected by an insular liberal elite, overcompensate by turning casting and programming decisions into a festival of representation-focused identity politics and ham-fisted leftist agitprop. If your creative class is churning out content this devoid of creativity and alienating half the audience in the process, you may as well replace them with machines, McLaughlin said. Say what you will about AI. It doesn't grope its co-stars, vanish on coke binges, send ill-advised tweets, or promote polarizing political causes. Machines work cheap. They're always in shape. They don't care about race or gender. They never ask to renegotiate, and they don't have a union. Of course, the actors and writers may not

Starting point is 00:13:30 be especially sympathetic, but neither are the studio bosses who made a lot of this mess. They're the ones who produced all those dreadful films, and they're no less politically wacky than the talent. In The Daily Caller, Grayson Quay said conservatives should side with the whiny liberal actors in the Hollywood elite. The most insufferable people in America are on strike, demanding protections against artificial intelligence, and it's the duty of every conservative to support them. Yes, Hollywood actors are awful, Quay said, and yes, screenwriters are almost as bad. None of them have produced an original idea since 2008, but they continue doubling and tripling down on woke garbage even as movie after movie

Starting point is 00:14:10 bombs at the box office. But for now, the enemy of our enemy is our friend, and AI is the enemy of all humanity. It's easy to see what AI could do to the film industry. In the futuristic society of Margaret Atwood's novel, Oryx and Crake, it pretty much no longer exists, Quay said. AI will devastate the entire arts industry, and it won't stop with arts either. Truck drivers? Fired. Call center employees? Fired. Most journalists? Fired. Sure, we'll still need plumbers, landscapers, nail technicians, and maybe a few lawyers, though not nearly as many as before, but it's entirely possible that almost everyone you know will be out of a job. If any of that sounds bad to you, then we need to crush the head of the AI serpent

Starting point is 00:14:52 while it's still in the shell. Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is nearly double the historic average over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada, which is nearly double the historic average of 52,000 cases. What can you do this flu season?

Starting point is 00:15:30 Talk to your pharmacist or doctor about getting a flu shot. Consider FluCellVax Quad and help protect yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages six months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at flucellvax.ca. In red state, Jerry Wilson said this is a perfect time for conservatives to strike. A deeper dive into the matter reveals how the pop culture complex's continuous disrespect of conservative and traditional values has become the proverbial turning worm and a genuine opportunity for conservatives to regain a portion of the entertainment marketplace most commonly considered

Starting point is 00:16:15 forever lost, Wilson said. The streaming video and film television industry is in the same scenario as the music industry. The three major record labels are flush with cash from streaming services, while the artists receive a pittance, if that much. Combine the above with the open disdain major content creators demonstrate toward conservatives and traditional values. Even as they are hemorrhaging red ink, the major studios will not stop insulting vast swaths of their potential audience. They cannot help themselves. They are so addicted to their ideology and utterly convinced of their righteousness that they dismiss the cratering revenue numbers and believe all is well. It isn't, at least for them. This is where the opportunity

Starting point is 00:16:55 for conservatives and holders of traditional values enters the frame, he wrote. Twice this year, we have seen major box office action from films that regular studios would, and at least in one case, did actively run from. Jesus Revolution was a hit. Sound of Freedom is a hit. Now is the time to strike against those saying, which brings us to my take. So one of the hardest things about making a determination here is that it's not entirely clear who is telling the truth. Consider for a moment comparing how actors have described their offer versus what the production studios have said. Here are the actors characterizing the position of the studio's position on artificial intelligence. Quote, we want to be able to scan a background performer's

Starting point is 00:17:55 image, pay them for a half day's labor, and then use an individual's likeness for any purpose forever without their consent. We also want to be able to make changes to principal performers' dialogue and even create new scenes without informed consent. And we want to be able to use someone's images, likenesses, and performances to train new generative AI systems without consent or compensation. Here's what the studio said in a statement to the Associated Press. The AMPT said in a statement in response that its offers include an AI proposal which protects performers' digital likenesses, including a requirement for performers' consent for the creation and use of digital replicas or for digital alterations of a performance.

Starting point is 00:18:36 Those are two very different things. To be upfront, I'm partial to the actors and writers here. Yes, Hollywood is about as quote-unquote woke as any industry on the planet. And yes, we continue to get inundated with reruns and remakes and total busts. I'm happy to put on my film critic hat and dismiss much of Hollywood's output as unoriginal and uninteresting. But that's not really the core issue here. And even if it were, that isn't a reason to be opposed to the strikers. The creatives aren't the ones generally deciding the content. At most, that power is shared. Even more, based on the available evidence we have, it seems actors and writers' characterization of what the studios want

Starting point is 00:19:16 is closer to the truth. I also think they just have been getting hosed by studios and executives for years now, and AI is just the straw that broke the camel's back. I am not an alarmist about emerging technologies, and I've said in the past that I think and hope much of my own work is unique enough to be insulated from the threat of AI. But I do think the threat to actors, voice actors, and writers is particularly acute. And I think Grayson Quay, under what the right is saying, is correct that if you're imagining a war between workers and AI, it certainly looks like Hollywood laborers are on the front lines, which is good reason to support them. Already in its infancy, AI can

Starting point is 00:19:54 write corny hallmark scripts that dominate some television shows. We have seen streaming programs like Star Wars bring a young Luke Skywalker back to screen with artificially generated faces. And one of the things AI is best at already is mimicking someone's voice, a mortal threat to all voice actors. If I were in that profession, there is no way I'd sign any contract that didn't have the strongest assurances possible that studios would be limited in how they can use or repurpose my likeness, or in what ways they could simply feed an AI my work and have it spit something back out for the masses. Outside of that, the rest of the fight here seems like a pretty standard union versus executive battle. It's a fight over wages and

Starting point is 00:20:34 royalties and working conditions. On the surface, the actors and writers seem to have a strong case there too. Executives are seeing unbelievable amounts of money pour into streaming services, but actors, writers, and crew are losing avenues to profit off their work. There's no denying the industry has undergone incredible change in the last decade, and writers and actors seem nearly unanimous in their desire to demand more than what they are getting. I'm certainly in no position to tell them they are wrong. And even though we probably think of superstars when we imagine Hollywood actors, I think Prudente is right to point out that most actors and writers are low-wage workers,

Starting point is 00:21:10 struggling to get by. And if we think of these strikers in those times, it's interesting to consider its broader implications. The ratio of a typical CEO to typical worker pay was 59 to 1 in 1989. In 2021, it was 366 to 1. In 2022, it was 399 to 1. And guess what? Major strike activity went up 50% in 2022. And in the post-pandemic world, we've seen workers demanding more pay, better benefits, and more job flexibility. I don't think those things are a coincidence. Workers are making their value known and getting what they can while they can. I'm not always a supporter of union action, but coming out of an era where the middle class shrank and workers' pay became increasingly distanced from executives, it should be encouraging to see so much bottom-up activity across industries. For the vast

Starting point is 00:22:03 majority of the country, that is a good thing, though you may be stuck on reruns for a little while. All right, that is it for my take, which brings us to your questions answered. This one is from Adam in Middlesex County, New Jersey. Adam said, we, my family, were at the beach earlier and someone set up their chair with a 40-foot pole flying a Trump 2024 flag, as well as a flag of the original 13 colonies right under it. I've never seen those two flags paired together and I'm legitimately interested in engaging with discourse to understand why someone would go through the trouble of packing an elaborate 40-foot flagpole just to sit at the beach for the

Starting point is 00:22:45 day. My wife would have been mortified if I walked over and engaged. Any advice on how to approach situations like this when you're legitimately curious to understand why people feel so strongly but also don't want to come off confrontational to complete strangers? Why would someone fly the original 13 colonies flag anyway? Okay, so I love this question. First of all, thank you for sending it in. It is a long story, but the original 13 colonies flag, also known as the Betsy Ross flag, named after its purported creator, is the subject of some controversy. In 2019, Nike actually pulled the release of a 4th of July themed shoe featuring the flag because of its connection to the quote-unquote slavery era of the United States. To be upfront, there are some people

Starting point is 00:23:29 who allege the flag is used by hate groups. Some NAACP chapters say it has been associated with racial supremacy groups, but experts on that kind of thing also say the association is weak, especially compared to other symbols. Some anti-government groups also fly the flag because of its connotation of revolution. And some totally normal people probably fly it too. I happen to think the flag looks pretty cool. It's not on our hate symbols list, Roy Tatum, the president of the East Valley NAACP, said in 2019. We view it as a historical patriotic flag that is usually innocuous. So depending on who you ask, even at the NAACP, it's either a flag associated with a hate group or a usually innocuous flag

Starting point is 00:24:12 that symbolizes patriotism and history. Did I help clarify anything? Anyway, I do wish you would have engaged. I personally do that sort of thing all the time. My advice is just come with a smile, genuine curiosity, and maybe even a beer. Americans are getting worse and worse at talking to each other. But someone flying a giant Trump flag and a Betsy Ross flag together is not out there doing that because they're interested in avoiding the conversation. Saying hi, shaking hands, asking about the flag, and coming to the conversation in a way that is not accusatory is a perfectly reasonable thing to do. If you hear an answer you don't like, or one that worries you, you can walk away. Alternatively, you might learn something,

Starting point is 00:24:54 or make a new friend, perhaps even one who sees the world a bit differently than you do. Alright, that is it for Your Questions Answered, which brings us to our under the radar section. New York City agreed to pay 1,300 Black Lives Matter protesters who were beaten during the 2020 protests. Each protester is receiving $10,000, totaling a $13 million settlement that still requires approval from a judge. The class action settlement would be one of the most expensive payouts ever associated with a mass arrest lawsuit. The prosecution successfully argued protesters were exercising a constitutional right to peacefully demonstrate and were then corralled into places they could not escape and assaulted by police

Starting point is 00:25:41 officers. The settlement applies to 18 specific marches or demonstrations in Brooklyn and Manhattan between May 28th and June 4th. The New York Post has the story, and there's a link to it in today's episode description. All right, next up is our numbers section. The number of actors represented by the SAG-AFTRA union was 160,000. The number of writers represented by the WGA union is 11,000. The percentage of SAG-AFTRA members who earn less than $26,000 a year from acting is 87%. The potential economic impact of the combined writers and actors strike is $4 billion. The decline in the average writer-producer pay over the last decade, according to the WGA, is negative 4%. The decline

Starting point is 00:26:32 in that number when it's adjusted for inflation is 23%. All right, that is it for our numbers section, which brings us last but not least to our have a nice day story. As record heat mates headlines across the country, the power grids in the hottest states are humming along reliably. California Utility Pacific Gas and Electric Company, whose reputation has been marred by equipment failures and outages during wildfires, said it would be able to meet heightened demand for electricity this summer. able to meet heightened demand for electricity this summer. Meanwhile, the Electric Reliability Council of Texas, also known as ERCOT, which has had its own high-profile reliability issues, hasn't asked residents to conserve electricity since last month, even as power demand hit a new record last week. For California, record snowpack has given a major boost to hydropower, which produced more electricity in May than any month in the previous three years, and is combining with an increase in solar production battery storage to provide reliable service. In Texas, wind and solar farms represent nearly 40% of the

Starting point is 00:27:34 installed capacity, with natural gas accounting for about 42%. The number one thing is having so much solar on the system performing at the peak, said Doug Lewin, the president of Stoic Energy Consulting and author of the Texas Energy and Power newsletter. We have 12 or 13 gigawatts working like clockwork during these summer heat waves. The Wall Street Journal has the story on this surprise success, and there's a link to it in today's episode description. All right, everybody, that is it for today's podcast. As always, if you want to support our work, please go to readtangle.com and consider becoming a member. And keep an eye out on our YouTube channel. We have a new interview that's coming out soon. We've got new content all the time. Tangle News on YouTube. And of course, don't forget, live event, Philadelphia. We are

Starting point is 00:28:23 almost a week away. It's happening August 3rd. If you haven't gotten, live event, Philadelphia. We are almost a week away. It's happening August 3rd. If you haven't gotten your tickets yet, go get your tickets. We're close. I want to sell this thing out. Need your support. You can find more information at readtangle.com forward slash live. Thanks so much.

Starting point is 00:28:38 We'll see you tomorrow. Same time. Have a good one. Peace. Our podcast is written by me, Isaac Saul, and edited by John Long. Peace. was produced by Diet 75. For more on Tangle, please go to readtangle.com and check out our website. Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, Thanks for watching. buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. The flu remains a serious disease. Last season, over 102,000 influenza cases have been reported across Canada,

Starting point is 00:29:53 which is nearly double the historic average of 52,000 cases. What can you do this flu season? Talk to your pharmacist or doctor about getting a flu shot. Consider FluCellVax Quad and help protect yourself from the flu. It's the first cell-based flu vaccine authorized in Canada for ages six months and older, and it may be available for free in your province. Side effects and allergic reactions can occur, and 100% protection is not guaranteed. Learn more at flucellvax.ca.

Tangle - The Hollywood strike.

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