Tangle - The Mark Robinson Controversy

Episode Date: September 25, 2024

On Thursday, CNN published an exclusive report on Mark Robinson, North Carolina's Lieutenant Governor and Republican gubernatorial candidate in 2024. In their piece, CNN’s Andrew Kaczynski and Em Steck alleged that Robinson made a series of inflammatory comments on a pornography website’s message board over a decade ago, including calling himself a "black Nazi," expressing support for reinstating slavery, and describing his preference for pornography that included transgender women.You can read today's podcast⁠ ⁠⁠here⁠⁠⁠, our “Under the Radar” story ⁠here and today’s “Have a nice day” story ⁠here⁠.You can watch the replay of our live stream of the Harris Trump debate with commentary from Isaac on our YouTube Channel!Check out Episode 6 of our podcast series, The Undecideds. You can subscribe to Tangle by clicking here or drop something in our tip jar by clicking here. Help share Tangle.I'm a firm believer that our politics would be a little bit better if everyone were reading balanced news that allows room for debate, disagreement, and multiple perspectives. If you can take 15 seconds to share Tangle with a few friends I'd really appreciate it. Email Tangle to a friend here, share Tangle on X/Twitter here, or share Tangle on Facebook here.Take the survey: How much do statements candidates make outside of the campaign trail matter to your voting decision? Let us know!Our podcast is written by Isaac Saul and edited and engineered by Dewey Thomas. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75. Our newsletter is edited by Managing Editor Ari Weitzman, Will Kaback, Bailey Saul, Sean Brady, and produced in conjunction with Tangle’s social media manager Magdalena Bokowa, who also created our logo. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. Working in the trades is intense. It can be stressful and painful.

Some guys use drugs and alcohol to cope. But when we ask for help, or we see someone struggling with addiction, our silence speaks volumes. See how you can help, or get help help at Canada.ca slash ease the burden. A message from the government of Canada. Thank you. this year, garnering rave reviews and acclaim from both critics and audiences alike. See A Real Pain only in theaters November 15th. From executive producer Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, and welcome to the Tangle Podcast, a place we get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking, and a little bit of my take. I'm your host, Isaac Saul. Today is Wednesday, September 25th. It's a rainy day

here in Philadelphia. You know, one of just like the first rainy, sleepy days of the fall. That's kind of what we're getting right now in the Northeast. I'm very jealous of Congress, which I found out today is about to go on a vacation till after the election. Members of Congress are going to vote this week to pass a stopgap spending bill. And then they're going to leave D.C. and they won't be back until after the election. That's kind of nutty to me. But anyway, I was just reading about it in Punchbowl's morning newsletter and it got me thinking. And I can't believe they get a break up until the election. And we're about to be head

down, grinding through the next few weeks, because as you can imagine, I think things are going to continue to ramp up and get more and more interesting. With that, today we are covering an election story, and this one is about Mark Robinson, the Lieutenant Governor of North Carolina, who is running as Republicans' gubernatorial candidate this year. And it's not going great. So with that, I'm going to pass it over to John for the quick hits in today's main story, and I'll be back with my take. Thanks, Isaac, and welcome, everybody. Here are your quick hits for today. First up, Vice President Kamala Harris said she supports eliminating the Senate's filibuster rule to pass legislation to restore abortion rights nationally. Senator Joe Manchin said he would not endorse Harris in response to the comments. Number two, President Joe Biden delivered his

final address to the United Nations as president, affirming his support for Ukraine and expressing optimism that a ceasefire deal between Israel and Hamas is within reach. Number three, Israel said its air defense systems intercepted a surface-to-surface missile launched by Hezbollah towards Tel Aviv. Separately, Israel announced it had killed senior Hezbollah commander Ibrahim Koubassi in an airstrike in Beirut. Separately, tens of thousands of people fled Lebanon on Tuesday as Israel continues to conduct airstrikes against Hezbollah targets in southern Lebanon and in the Bekaa Valley. Number four, the U.S. Justice Department sued Visa, alleging that the company illegally monopolized the debit card market. And number five, the National Hurricane Center

expects Tropical Storm Helene to strengthen into a major hurricane as it approaches Florida's Gulf Coast, projecting landfall on Thursday. The Trump campaign reeling tonight after a stunning report from our own K-File, which reveals the Trump-backed candidate for governor in North Carolina, Mark Robinson, has made dozens of disturbing and damning comments on a porn website. Some of the comments are frankly so disturbing that we cannot air them. But they include Robinson writing, quote, I am a black Nazi and I wish they would bring it, slavery, back. Robinson also calling himself a, quote, perv while discussing his affinity for transgender pornography. Keep in mind that he has called transgender kids sick and demonic. These comments were made between 2008 and 2012. And at this hour, Robinson is defiant, refusing to step aside. On Thursday,

CNN published an exclusive report on Mark Robinson, North Carolina's lieutenant governor and Republican gubernatorial candidate in 2024. In their piece, CNN's Andrew Kaczynski and MSTEC alleged that Robinson made a series of inflammatory comments on a porn website's message board over a decade ago, including calling himself a Black Nazi, expressing support for reinstating slavery, and describing his preference for pornography that included transgender women. Kaczynski and Steck linked the comments to Robinson through an email address and the

username ManySoldier, which he has repeatedly used on his public social media accounts. Robinson worked in furniture manufacturing before entering politics when a clip of him defending gun rights at a city council meeting went viral. On the campaign trail, he often describes himself growing up in poverty, his religious renewal, and his challenges with bankruptcy.

Robinson has been a rising star in the party for his speaking skills, and former President Trump called him Martin Luther King Jr. on steroids when endorsing Robinson in March. The lieutenant governor also has a history of making incendiary comments. During his campaigns for lieutenant governor and governor, he has come under fire for once describing abortion as killing the children

because you weren't responsible enough to keep your skirt down, despite admitting his wife once had an abortion, proposing that trans women should be arrested for using women's restrooms and making controversial comments about the Holocaust in a Facebook post. Robinson has also claimed Michelle Obama was secretly a man and once decried religious freedom because it means Muslims are free to do as they please and anyone who says anything about it is a bigot.

However, his latest controversy linking him to an account on a pornographic website has created a wave of condemnation and staff departures. On Sunday, Robinson's campaign announced that campaign manager Chris Rodriguez, finance director Heather Willier, senior advisor Conrad Porgezelski III, and deputy campaign manager Jason Risk had all resigned, leaving his campaign almost completely devoid of staff. National Republican groups like the Republican Governors Association did not renew their financial support for him. Former President Trump has not pulled his endorsement of Robinson since the report was published,

though his running mate J.D. Vance described Robinson's comments as pretty gross on Monday and would not say whether the campaign still backed him. comments as pretty gross on Monday and would not say whether the campaign still backed him. North Carolina has become a critical battleground in this year's presidential race, with polls showing Harris and Trump neck and neck. However, Robinson has consistently trailed his Democratic opponent, North Carolina Attorney General Josh Stein. While Trump has consistently led Harris in Georgia polling, one recent poll from Milan University found Stein leading Robinson by a 49 to 35 percent margin. Robinson has vowed to rebuild his staff and continue on in the race. He's also promised to come after CNN full throttle, implying a potential lawsuit. Today, we're going to share some perspectives from the left and the right on the report on Robinson

and the state of the race in North Carolina, and then Isaac's take. We'll be right back after this quick break. Are you sure you parked over here? Do you see it anywhere? I think it's back this way. Come on. Hey, you're going the wrong way. Feeling distracted? You're not alone. Whether renting, considering buying a home, or renewing a mortgage,

many Canadians are finding it hard to focus with housing costs on their minds. For free tools and resources to help you manage your home finances and clear your head, visit Canada.ca slash ItPaysToKnow. A message from the Government of Canada. From Searchlight Pictures comes A Real Pain, one of the most moving and funny films of the year. Written and directed by Oscar-nominated Jesse Eisenberg and starring Eisenberg and Emmy Award winner Kieran Culkin,

A Real Pain is a comedy about mismatched cousins who reunite for a tour through Poland to honor their beloved grandmother. The adventure takes a turn when the pair's old tensions resurface against the backdrop of their family history. A Real Pain was one of the buzziest titles at Sundance Film Festival this year, garnering rave reviews and acclaim from both critics and audiences alike. See A Real Pain only in theaters November 15th. All right, first let's start with some agreement. Both sides believe the report about Robinson and say his past behavior legitimizes the story. Writers on the left and the right agree

that Robinson can only weigh Trump down in North Carolina, but differ on the expected magnitude of his impact. All right, let's go over to what the left is saying. The left says Republicans missed their chance to distance themselves from Robinson long ago. Some suggest Robinson's rise through the GOP is a direct result of Trump's own assent. Others say Robinson could tip the scale in Harris' favor. In MSNBC, Billy Ball said, in Mark Robinson's fall,

Republicans are getting what they asked for. CNN acknowledged many of the things Robinson is accused of writing were so lurid, they couldn't be published. If these statements offend you, congratulations. You're a thinking, feeling person, Ball wrote. You're holding your elected leaders to a higher standard than the North Carolina Republican Party, which doubled

down on its support for Robinson on Thursday night after the report was published. Most folks wouldn't let the guy in this story watch their dog, much less lead their state. His candidacy was damaged and unhinged from the start, fetishizing violence, demonizing gay people, and talking about women like they're trash. The party had literally dozens of opportunities to disavow Robinson, Ball said. North Carolina Republicans have shown that the MAGA movement doesn't believe in such limits, but voters will, which is why Republicans and Robinson will stay this way, locked in a doomed embrace through Election Day. In Bloomberg, Mary Ellen Claus called Robinson another MAGA failure.

Robinson has denied writing any of it and vowed not to drop out of the race, but the statements are credible to anybody who knows about the stream of anti-Semitic, sexist, and transphobic comments he posted on his Facebook page before he became lieutenant governor in 2020, Claus wrote. Robinson's record of vitriol and hateful rhetoric should have disqualified anyone from being nominated to lead the state, especially one as politically significant as North Carolina. But none of that mattered to Tar Heel Republicans

because of one person, Donald Trump. Most MAGA supporters are indifferent to Trump's history of sexual exploitation and lies. At the North Carolina Republican Party state convention in May, delegates I spoke with expressed indifference to Robinson's negative personality traits too, Klaus said. They were deluded, just like Republicans in Pennsylvania, Arizona, and Georgia were when they nominated

failed Trump sycophants like Mehmet Oz, Doug Mastriano, Herschel Walker, and Kerry Lake in 2022. Robinson is just the latest data point. In the Washington Post, Aaron Blake asked, could Mark Robinson actually damage Trump? With Robinson's decision to press on, the question is less what it means for the governor's race, in which Robinson already trailed by double digits in most quality polls, than what it means elsewhere. Most notably, could this damage a Trump campaign that might have preferred to rid itself of this nuisance, Blake wrote. It's complicated, but Robinson's decision to stick it out gives the Trump campaign and Republicans reason to fret. North Carolina is crucial to Trump's most readily apparent path to victory, which runs through it, Georgia and Pennsylvania, and every little bit counts.

The conventional wisdom is that things mostly happen in the opposite direction, a bad candidate at the top of the ticket harming candidates for the down ballot. After all, the presidential race is generally voters' number one priority, Blake said. But those two effects aren't mutually exclusive, and just because one is more prominent doesn't mean the other doesn't exist. North Carolina was decided by just over one percentage point in 2020, so even a slight shift in voter preference or turnout, caused by delusion met with Robinson could matter. All right, that is it for what the left is saying, which brings us to what the right

is saying. The right is dismayed by the report, but doubts that Robinson alone will sabotage Trump's election chances. Some say Trump's candidacy could elevate Robinson despite the allegations. Others say Robinson is a product of Trump-era politics. National Review's editors wrote about the costly Mark Robinson lesson. The North Carolina gubernatorial race is lost, a month and a half before it even is formally set to take place in November, the editor said. The most salacious of Robinson's postings reveal the sorts of private sexual piccadillos that cannot be discussed with

dignity yet are politically fatal. Far more relevant to voters' concerns were comments in which Robinson proudly labeled himself a Black Nazi or averred that he would happily own slaves himself if he could. Such was his contempt for many of his fellow African Americans. Some fret that Mark Robinson is so toxic that he threatens Donald Trump's hold on a state he requires for any plausible national electoral victory scenario in November. It seems unlikely, though. That is not the way national elections typically work.

It's true that Trump is in danger of losing North Carolina, but if he does so, it'll be on his own demerits, not those of a down-ballot candidate long since given up for dead, the editors wrote. But it is appropriate to ask why Mark Robinson cruised to the GOP nomination in 2024 when the contents of his opposition file were already an open secret in state politics for years. and the contents of his opposition file were already an open secret in state politics for years. In the Washington Examiner, Jeremiah Puff suggested, don't write Mark Robinson's political obituary just yet. Robinson dubiously denies the allegations and is vowed to stay in the race,

but for a candidate who has consistently trailed his Democratic opponent, State Attorney General Josh Stein, the revelations of his online activity will do him no favors in a race he is widely expected to lose at this point, Puff said. But even as conventional wisdom indicates that the scandal-ridden Robinson is headed toward a historic defeat in a key swing state gubernatorial race, any expectation that he is going to lose is premature, and the reason has nothing to do with him. North Carolina is one of only a handful of states that holds its gubernatorial election at the same time as the presidential race. And in presidential years,

the top of the ticket drives the campaign as voters associate the two political parties with their respective presidential candidates, Poff wrote. In an era where partisan divides are more pronounced than ever, voters have shown less and less willingness to vote for candidates from both parties in the same year. If Trump carries North Carolina on election night, his presence at the top of the ticket might be enough to drag Robinson's long-decaying corpse of a campaign to the finish line in what would be an unexpected but predictable upset. In the New York Times, David French said, MAGA wants transgression, and this is what comes with it. While I'm interested in Robinson's potential impact on the presidential race, I'm also concerned with the ongoing impact of MAGA on the heart of the Republican Party,

French wrote. The years-long elevation of figures like Mark Robinson and many other outrageous MAGA personalities, along with the devotion of people in MAGA's inner orbit, J.D. Vance, Elon Musk, Lindsey Graham, and so very many others, has established beyond doubt that Trump has changed the Republican Party and Republican Christians far more than they've changed him. In nine years, countless Republican primary voters have moved from voting for Trump in spite of his transgressions to rejecting anyone who doesn't transgress. If you're not transgressive, you're suspicious. Decency is counterculture in the Republican Party. It's seen as a rebuke of Trump, French said. Both parties have always been vulnerable to nominating or electing the occasional crank,

but Donald Trump's ascendance meant that a crank led the party, and the best way to join him is to imitate him. That's how you get a Mark Robinson. All right, let's head over to Isaac for his take. If Robinson's own team, Republican governors and conservative financiers, are abandoning him, you'll be unsurprised to hear that a middle-of-the-road person like me has no defense for Robinson. Let's start with something the left

and right pundits did not get into. The porn site account is quite obviously Robinson's. His denials and explanations are totally insufficient. The unique username was associated with his public accounts across YouTube, Twitter, Discus, Pinterest, Black Planet, and porn websites like Nude Africa.

Robinson made the comments, and he got caught. Aside from the obvious offensiveness in the content of his comments, like wishing for the return of slavery, one of the most offensive things to voters is disingenuous politicking, showing a different character when the cameras are on. Robinson makes shallow, blith jokes about abortion in private, but campaigns on stopping it as a major issue. He talks about jailing trans women for using the girl's bathroom, but posts about how much he loves their pornography. He calls himself a Black Nazi, but denies allegations of anti-Semitism. To me, I'm less concerned about these comments than by how he has gotten this far in the first place. The Republican Party has blamed its recent election losses on a lot of things, ranging from the reasonable, a pandemic few world leaders handled

well, to the unreasonable, baseless, and still unproven claims of election fraud. But one of the biggest reasons they keep losing elections is that candidates like Mark Robinson keep getting the party's support, winning primary races, and then running headfirst into the reality of a general election. Robinson, in the most simple and basic terms, is not very likable. He is a conspiratorial crank who spends a lot of time saying and doing awful things. This is not a partisan opinion. Just look at how nobody from the right is defending him in today's podcast. He's trafficked in Holocaust denial. He's called the teenage survivors of the Parkland, Florida shooting

spoiled, angry, know-it-all children and media prostitutes because their advocacy after surviving a mass shooting. He said mass shootings are karma for abortion. He promoted conspiracy theories that Michelle Obama is a man, that Barack Obama is an American, that Bill Cosby was taken down by the Illuminati, and that the Summer Olympics opening ceremony contained hidden occult symbols, just to name a few.

Along with a nude Africa account where he left comments about cheating on his wife with her sister, he also had an email registered to Ashley Madison, the website designed for married people seeking affairs. Everything about him just reeks of a low-character person, which is a shame. On paper, there is plenty to like. He was raised in poverty and climbed out of the foster care system to launch a successful career. He studied in school while working full time to become a history teacher. He served in school while working full-time to become a history teacher.

He served in the Army Reserve. His story, simply put, is one of resilience. His foray into politics came through happenstance and his gift for public speaking. If a person with his resume became North Carolina's first black governor, a person who climbed out of poverty and the foster care system

all the way to the governor's mansion, that would have been a hell of a story to tell. My hottest take about any of this is that something feels invasive about mining a candidate's comments and shadowy internet corners like adult websites. I'm impressed by CNN sleuths, but also a little uncomfortable by this kind of journalism. And as much as people want to contrast the comments he made on the Nude Africa website with his current political stances, they're also a decade old. People's views change and their comportment changes. Robinson himself claims to have undergone a religious renewal. I have no idea what he believes today and how genuine his campaign is, but I don't think his posts on an internet porn forum 10 years ago are the best way to judge his quote-unquote real views.

The bottom line, though, is that none of that excuses him. When you run for public office, you agree to turn your life inside out. Robinson made that agreement. Then he made the decision to embrace anger and divisiveness, to spread genuine conspiracy theories, and to run a scorched earth campaign. Now the chickens are coming home to roost. He'll lose in North Carolina because thankfully voters in our country still reject candidates like him more often than they rally behind them. I'm sure he'll find something to blame. Fraud, the Jews, Obama, the media, maybe even his fellow Republicans who are jumping ship on his candidacy.

But the only person truly responsible will be Mark Robinson. person truly responsible will be Mark Robinson. We'll be right back after this quick break. From Searchlight Pictures comes A Real Pain, one of the most moving and funny films of the year. Written and directed by Oscar-nominated Jesse Eisenberg and starring Eisenberg and Emmy Award winner Kieran Culkin. A Real Pain is a comedy about mismatched cousins who reunite for a tour through Poland to honor their beloved grandmother. The adventure takes a turn when the pair's old tensions

resurface against the backdrop of their family history. A Real Pain was one of the buzziest titles at Sundance Film Festival this year, garnering rave reviews and acclaim from both critics and audiences alike. See A Real Pain only in theaters November 15th. Based on Charles Yu's award-winning book, Interior Chinatown follows the story of Willis Wu, a background character trapped in a police procedural who dreams about a world beyond Chinatown. When he inadvertently becomes a

witness to a crime, Willis begins to unravel a criminal web, his family's buried history, and what it feels like to be in the spotlight. Interior Chinatown is streaming November 19th, only on Disney+. Whether renting, renewing a mortgage, or considering buying a home, everybody has housing costs on their minds. For free tools and resources to help you manage your home finances, visit Canada.ca slash it pays to know, which brings us to your questions answered. This one is from Brooke in Flower Mound, Texas. answered. This one is from Brooke in Flower Mound, Texas. Brooke said, do you have any resources for middle school students to learn about politics and proper ways to research and develop opinions? I want to do lessons that are similar to your newsletter where the two sides are laid out,

that an opinion is given at the end, but the wording is far too advanced for my students. I'm a sixth grade history teacher in a Title I very poor area? Okay, so that is a great question, and the answer is both that there are a lot of resources that do something similar to what we're doing, but I don't know of one doing exactly what we're doing. That is, a lot of places give a comparison on what the right and left are saying about a given issue, but not many are following that up with an editorial. So at the risk of doing some free advertising for our competitors, with an editorial. So at the risk of doing some free advertising for our competitors, the flip side runs a subscribers-only left-to-right newsletter. The New York Times has a subscribers-only feature that compares the left and right. Ground News, which is a former partner

of ours, compares sources on a given story and lays them out from left to right so you can see them for yourself. The Week, which I'd describe as a more establishment-focused weekly magazine version of Tangle, also has a magazine for kids, which might be the answer. Good on you for looking for ways to introduce your students to media bias so young. Maybe a hard target to hit, as editorial bias is pretty advanced as a concept, but I can see how getting a few sources plus an editorial would be engaging in a classroom setting. I know many young people get their news from social media. Maybe you can compare a few examples from Instagram as a way to look for bias. If anyone reading is a middle school teacher and knows one doing

something similar, please leave an answer in the comments today. I'd be very curious to know how other teachers are trying to do this. Good luck to you, Brooke. All right, that is it for my take on our reader question today. I'm going to send it back to John for the rest of the pod, and I'll to you, Brooke. All right, that is it for my take and our reader question today. I'm going to send it back to John for the rest of the pod, and I'll see you guys tomorrow. Peace. Thanks, Isaac. Here's your under the radar story for today, folks. America's views on the economy in September declined by the largest level in more than three years, according to the conference board's Consumer Confidence Index. The board is a non-profit, non-partisan economic research group that tracks consumer attitudes about the U.S.

economy, and its latest report found that the confidence index fell from 105.6 to 98.7 between August and September, the largest drop since August 2021. Survey respondents aged 35 to 54 and those earning less than $50,000 reported the largest decline, but respondents in all categories said concerns over the labor market and inflation informed their feelings about the economic outlook. Notably, however, the survey was conducted one day before the Fed voted to lower benchmark interest rates by a half a percentage point. CNBC has this story, and there's a link in today's episode description. All right, next up is our numbers section.

Josh Stein's average lead over Mark Robinson in polls released in September for the North Carolina gubernatorial race is 10%. The percentage of Republican voters in North Carolina who said they planned to vote for Josh Stein in an August 2024 Fox News poll is 13%. Donald Trump's current lead over Kamala Harris in North Carolina, based on an aggregate of polls, is 0.5%. The number of Electoral College votes North Carolina will allocate in 2024 is 16.

The number of presidential elections since 1976 in which the Democratic candidate has won North Carolina is one. That was Barack Obama in 2008. The percentage of North Carolina voters who said they had unfavorable views of Robinson in an August 2024 poll from Milan University is 50%. The percentage of North Carolina voters who said they had favorable views of Robinson in August 2024 was 30%. And Robinson's net favorability rating with women in North Carolina in August 2024 is minus 30%. All right, and last but not least, our Have a Nice Day story. After moving to the United States from Ghana, Francis Aparaku began working as a janitor at a Virginia high school. Students at the high school described him as super kind and friendly and noted that he even says prayers for us.

Before his birthday, a group of sophomore boys asked Aprakou what he would like as a birthday gift. Speaking in jest, he said he just wanted a new Jeep, but the students got to work. The boys created a GoFundMe campaign and were able to raise enough money to buy Aprakou a red Jeep Wrangler. When they gave it to him, Aprakou gratefully said, this day, the 9th of September, I will never forget. Good News

Network has this story and there's a link in today's episode description. All right, everybody, that is it for today's episode. As always, if you'd like to support our work, please go to readtangle.com and sign up for a membership. We'll be right back here tomorrow. For Isaac and the rest of the crew, this is John Law signing off. Have a great day, y'all. Peace. Our podcast is written by me, Isaac Saul, and edited and engineered by Duke Thomas. Our script is edited by Ari Weitzman, Will Kabak, Daily Saul, and Sean Brady.

The logo for our podcast was made by Magdalena Bikova, who is also our social media manager. The music for the podcast was produced by Diet 75. And if you're looking for more from Tangle, please go check out our website at readtangle.com. That's readtangle.com.