Tech Over Tea - This Vtuber Uses NixOS | Lacespades

Episode Date: July 25, 2025

I recently came across Lacespades a Vtuber that uses Linux but not only Linux, NixOS specifically does car content working on a Miata and I knew this would make for a really fun episode so here they are.==========Support The Channel==========► Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/brodierobertson► Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/BrodieRobertsonVideo► Amazon USA: https://amzn.to/3d5gykF► Other Methods: https://cointr.ee/brodierobertson==========Guest Links==========Twitter: https://x.com/SpadesLaceTwitch: https://www.twitch.tv/lacespadesYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@LaceSpades==========Support The Show==========► Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/brodierobertson► Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/BrodieRobertsonVideo► Amazon USA: https://amzn.to/3d5gykF► Other Methods: https://cointr.ee/brodierobertson=========Video Platforms==========🎥 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBq5p-xOla8xhnrbhu8AIAg=========Audio Release=========🎵 RSS: https://anchor.fm/s/149fd51c/podcast/rss🎵 Apple Podcast:https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/tech-over-tea/id1501727953🎵 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/3IfFpfzlLo7OPsEnl4gbdM🎵 Google Podcast: https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9hbmNob3IuZm0vcy8xNDlmZDUxYy9wb2RjYXN0L3Jzcw==🎵 Anchor: https://anchor.fm/tech-over-tea==========Social Media==========🎤 Discord:https://discord.gg/PkMRVn9🐦 Twitter: https://twitter.com/TechOverTeaShow📷 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/techovertea/🌐 Mastodon:https://mastodon.social/web/accounts/1093345==========Credits==========🎨 Channel Art:All my art has was created by Supercozmanhttps://twitter.com/Supercozmanhttps://www.instagram.com/supercozman_draws/DISCLOSURE: Wherever possible I use referral links, which means if you click one of the links in this video or description and make a purchase we may receive a small commission or other compensation.

Good morning, good day and good evening. Welcome back to the show. I'm as always your host, Brody Robertson. And today, as is tradition at this point, whenever I find a VTuber that is using Linux, I have to bring them on to the show. So welcome. How about you introduce yourself? Hello, everybody. I'm Lace Fates. I am a VTuber on Linux.

Uh, I... Oh, gosh, who am I? Who indeed. Who indeed. I am a bit of a software nerd. I like cars. And I like working on them, you know. Yeah, so I've got generally a weird mix of experience with Linux in the past, before to be fair, I've been on and off with this thing since I was in middle school and trying to get it to run with the drivers of the time on a laptop was fun. Just why am I getting a black screen? Everyone else gets gnome extensions and cool genie animation and stuff Yeah This is this is sort of like a temped for of giving Linux a swing. I think over the years. Mm-hmm

I don't know if you want to if you want to aid yourself and mention which version of a boon to that was at the time Oh, oh, that's a very good question. I can tell you that it came on a CD Mailbox, oh, okay as I couldn't figure out but I thought that I was burning the ISO wrong But I was like well, I'll get the CD, you know, and then maybe that thing No, it was far beyond my my my child brain comprehension at the time So your assumption was you were burning the ISO wrong, that's why there are driver issues? I think the driver issue is sort of something I've attached to the story over the years, now I understand what's happened.

As far as I was concerned, I put it in, I see... I think... Gosh, it's hard to remember, I'd see a loader on either a black, brown, or purple screen. It all blurs when you try to actually remember this long ago. And then it would go black. And then that would be it. And I now believe that would be just driver stuff. Or like my junker little Vista laptop. I can definitely see like the logic you would follow there, right? You... Yeah, no, I get it.

Especially if you don't really know how the system pieces together. You don't really know why something might be breaking. I'm assuming you... That was sort of like your first delve into something that technical you hadn't done. I know I've met people that have done programming since they were like six years old. But I'm assuming you hadn't done anything like that at the time. Oh goodness no, it took me an embarrassingly long time and an embarrassing amount of attempts to actually be able to be a programmer at all.

At the time I played with virtual machines, I had a big special interest in operating systems in general, so I had played around with like all the pre-release beta builds like Whistler of Windows and stuff. I used to spin up 98 VMs and I've gotten Linux working in a VM which is why I assumed that the ISA was fine and the drive I presume. I assume I just basic I knew that filing thing I think and I assume I had bad file integrity repeatedly from my like, 10 year old stack of CDs that were mainly bought to burn stuff from Kazaa on before that. Well, I guess that's certainly a start you can have. I've seen some like, fairly positive starts, I've seen some fairly late starts, but you know, it just having driver issues and

then it just not working that I would say especially for the time is a fairly realistic start, right? Like a lot of people, especially with laptops, right? And that's what you said you were using. At the time, yeah, laptop drivers, display drivers, like every, just random little things. We're in a state today where things are so smooth and things are so easy that I think a lot of people don't know what Linux... Well, okay, there's like two weird camps, right, where there's people who don't know

what Linux is and they think it's still like that and people using Linux now that don't know what it was like. Yeah. I'm happily sitting on the borderline here. I think I had expected at the time and I'd heard of network issues being a thing with laptops especially. And to be honest, that's still a thing today. I think even a few years ago I tried to put The Dora on like a modern Mac and it was not having it it was not having it right And so that that would that was a couple years ago That was just like a quick thing but I think even back then it was known that you know, you'd have trouble with networking because everyone had their own chips and

No one had gotten around to implementing it yet because you can't make right network drivers. I'm pretty sure that's like a crime or something. But in general, yeah, things got done when they got done. And we finally, I think, got to the point where we've had enough years of just people going fine, I will do it. I will be the person to achieve this. But we actually are in quite a nice state. Now that that that comparison, it's not been like a sudden thing. I think for a lot of people, it's going to feel like suddenly,

with like proton coming up a lot in like gaming news and stuff, like that Linux has suddenly gotten pretty good. But if you've been following it for as long as I and I presume you've been following it for a very long time too. You've probably been doing it a little longer than I have. I've actually, I've only been daily driving Linux for like six or so years now, so it's not actually been that long for me, but I have gone back and like, you know, done those delves into the history of Linux before I, and I did have like my eye on Linux in the past. I knew about it. I just didn't. I, you know, I like games and I wanted my system to be out of game. So when that before there was a proton, I like, I just didn't really see the appeal in the system.

Yeah, it was kind of what's the point. And I suppose as well, though, you've been you see been driving it for six years, like as your main go-to. It's kind of like, people have been practicing an instrument for many years, but they've been on and off. And I'm sort of more the on and off type person. It sounds more like you have actually been for six years playing the instrument, you know, living that life. Yeah, well. To get a hold of it.

I haven't. I was doing, like my channel basically started with my switch to Linux So I kind of had like that as like a driving force to try new things out Content baby exactly. Yes. It's an amazing motivator. Mm-hmm Yeah, you're mentioning our music there. I wish I had that as a motivation for the guitar back Maybe I should make a music channel. I can't show you the two guitars and a bass sitting behind me that are actually actively dusty at the minute. I've been modeling one of them in blender, but I haven't played

with anything. Yeah, I don't know how much dust is on that guitar back there. It's best not to think about it. Because I started learning and I was like going through the motions and then I just stopped at one point and now it's just part of my background. Yep. Yep. Yep.

It's very easy to drop. I had a year, but like last year, not last year, I have been the year before last, I was busy with work then anyway, where I was like, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna learn, I went to learn Neverment by American football. Just like it's one riff, but you have to play it pretty consistently throughout. And then there's a few variations.

And I spent about a year getting to the point where I could actually like do stuff like playing, singing some songs and stuff. And it was going well. And then we got to Christmas. I had to go home and I drive a little two seat miata. So how it doesn't fit in the boot and I'd have to strap it in the passenger seat. And that's where everything else I own goes when I go home for Christmas.

Never picked it. I haven't picked it up again properly since so easy to fall off the wagon. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I don't know. There's, there's things which are like really stuck with me. wagon. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I don't know, there's things which are like really stuck with me, like I did programming in high school and then I stuck with that. I did a software engineering degree and, you know, I still do the occasional bit here and there. I've been trying to get back into doing game development. That's kind of happening on and off, but I don't know. This is probably just an excuse, but I do pull out of things pretty quickly. I should just actually go and do so. It's not even like it's a difficult thing to go and like get back into. It's literally like five steps away.

I can just go pick up the guitar right now. Yeah, it's almost in arms reach but it's I think it's reductive you sort of Feel that yes, I could just go and do it but feels like there's something stops, you know For me, it's the it's the ADHD brain, you know And you know, I have to chug a can of monster to keep focus not even to be awake that sort of thing But I think there is just sort of a mental I want to

Know the comparison it's kind of like Ionizing radiation you need a certain amount of energy to kick an electron out and if you don't have it You're just gonna bounce off of it. You know, mmm, you gotta Get to that point. Mm-hmm It's by no means easy. You got it. You got to make those x-rays. And I've kind of tried to... It's been the same with a lot of other things. Like I've...

I saw you did the whole like donut tutorial blender thing and you're doing the blender guitar. I've gone through the blender tutorial as well. I was like, oh, yeah, I'm going to I'm going to learn blender properly. And I do the I do the donut part. I was like, oh yeah, I'm going to learn Blender properly. And I do the donut part. Like, oh, this is cool. Yep. Okay.

I like this. And then it's like, okay, well, I think it's because I picked up the hobby without necessarily having a explicit goal in mind. Oh, right. Yeah. So that's, that's, that's. No, no, go ahead. It's all good. Yeah, no, go ahead. Absolutely a thing.

I have tried to pick up 3D before and I had the same problem where I downloaded, I downloaded, I think, a student license for like one of the Fusion ones or whatever, or Macs, whatever. And I got in there and I'm like, there's a lot of tools here. I'm sure I could learn these. What I want to make? I just want a 3D model. I don't want to make the 3D model. I want the process. Right, right.

Yeah. So I feel that. I feel that, you know, if you don't have like, it's the same with programming. If you don't have like something you want to make, you can't just noodle. Sure. Yeah. Um, yeah. Like I- usually when I do programming now, I have like some explicit thing I'm trying to solve. Like one random thing is, um, for my videos, I did this a while ago now, but it- I still use it very actively. with Kaden Live and the project file is just XML and I wanted some way to take the track markers and then export those and use them as YouTube timestamps. And it's literally just a bit of JSON embedded in XML. So it was very easy to work out.

It was just a matter of, like, it's just the file's 10,000 lines long to work out under what ridiculous no- it thinks like 10 nodes deep to find where the file- it's consistent. It's just really annoyingly placed. But I sat down, worked out how to use the Python, XML, and JSON stuff, and it works great now. I don't know if it's portable to every single setup. It doesn't matter for my situations. I've never had it break, which is all I want, but I think this is.

I was saying before about the whole content thing. And, um, you know, I started a channel as I was learning Linux. You know, I started a channel as I was learning Linux. I think. I. Even with that, I still get like really comfortable with certain things, right? I, I used to be someone who would jump around between different window managers, trying out a bunch of different things. And then it got to a point where it's like, okay, I could do this, but.

You know, I'm still getting comfortable in this one environment. I still, I still like to have something which is like a stable base that I can rely on, not necessarily like upending everything I'm doing every couple of months. Yeah, absolutely. Especially like, if like, computers, computers are a fun thing, because they're kind of like a house. And like, you live, you got to live there. And it's like, computers are a fun thing because they're kind of like a house and like, you gotta live there and it's like, it's almost like living in a renovation project and do it. But sometimes you want to come home and you want to not have to shower in the garden with the hose.

You actually want to shower and it'd be nice to have a separate thing for that smaller scale, you know, two houses in this economy, who could ever, but like, you know, the principles there, it can be quite fatiguing over time. I think, I think that's the appeal of some things like Nix and the like as well, especially as they just can get back to where you were and you don't have no computer to play games on in the, I think. One thing that actually is gonna I do want to talk about Nix, we'll get to that in just a moment

um, one thing I think will actually help with this is I've not sold my old PC parts so after I do this next upgrade I'm gonna have all of the parts required to build a second PC without having to buy anything extra for

I think I'll need like a case for it, but get the PCS baby. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. I like my old GPU still sitting on my I'd meant to get rid of it and I was like, wait, but what if I maybe it may you know, maybe it makes sense to keep it won't be the faster system right?

It'd be like a I think it'd be like a RX 570 or something. I've been team green for too long to know what that means. It's like a AMD GPU from six years ago, something like that. So mid tier from six years ago. And then, um, yeah, AMD 3,600 X or something. Oh, that weirdly. Okay. Why did that happen? thing. Oh, that weirdly. Okay. Why did that happen? Um, I can still see the. Can you hear me still just fine? Yeah, I can see it. I can hear you. Yep. Okay. Um, it just in OBS, the new cat, your

capture just died for a second. It was still, I've got it open in a browser window. It was still fine there, but it just died in OBS. Oh, yeah. It is what it is. It is what it is. But yeah, having like a separate dedicated machine where if it breaks, it doesn't, it literally doesn't matter. That, that I think is going to help to just experiment with random things. You're building a home lab, essentially, really there. Effectively, yeah. Which is very nice. Yeah. Like a full size one. We've got a similar situation here.

My roommate and I have enough parts to build one and a half computers at this point. We've even got a case that's just collecting dust and sometimes the cat sleeps in it. Beery will put that together at some point. And I think it's a great use of it because there's a lot of problems with e-waste as well especially, so you're kind of getting around that. I've been using dead GPUs as Christmas decorations for years now, because you can take the little fan cable and hook it over the tree. Great fun.

I did have a hard drive as a coaster at one point, so I know the feeling. That's good. I've got my floppy disk as a coaster at one point. So I know the feeling. That's good. I've got my floppy disk as a coaster here. Not very good. If you have condensation, they fill with malt, turns out. So it doesn't have its platter anymore. But, you know, I just colored it in with Sharpie on the inside. So it looks like it has one and we're back in business.

You know, that's that's that's what we call a temporary fix forever. Absolutely perfect. So your, uh, your Linux journey, I don't want to jump right into Nix, but you tried Ubuntu when you were in middle school. It didn't, you had issues with drivers. I'm assuming you had probably given up for some time at that point. Oh, absolutely. Yeah.

Um, I think once I got off of Vista, like, because Windows 7 must have been around the corner in theory, I can't remember the timelines exactly. Um, I was on Windows 7 for a while. I built like my first PC later on. Um, and I think the second time I came back was years later, like when I went for a dual boot with Ubuntu again, and by then it could actually boot, partly because I wasn't on a laptop and partly because things I assume had just gotten better over time.

This was back when I had to age myself here a little. This is back when Skype was the platform, you know, bigger than team speak. Discord was not but a twinkle in the eye of John Discord. This was a nice time. It was the good times. And this was back when the client for Skype on Linux was completely different and built by a different team from the one on Windows. And it was just crap.

It looked like Emerson message for some reason, to a degree, very strange. And that was actually enough to kill the OS for me because I was running Minecraft servers and I needed to talk to people at the time. To keep my empire together. And I couldn't game, and that was about it. Minecraft ran like, I don't know why, I assume it's probably graphics again now, I think

about it, but but I could tell you Yeah, I guess yeah minecraft even if it's gonna run badly at least you could run it because you know Java and all that That is nice That was nice. That was nice. And that was think part of why I was like, oh, this will be okay, you know Actually because all the stuff I do is basically Java. I just need to install like a JDK and Call it a day. You know, what is that? Yum install or whatever. Gosh, I haven't gone on a bike in a few years. At App, Yum is? Yum is CentOS. I'm thinking of CentOS from our servers.

Yeah, that sounds good. CentOS using Yum? Yeah. I'm mixing up my servers with my desktops. Yeah, CentOS 7. Yeah, yeah. mixing up my servers with my desktops Yeah sent us seven, oh yeah, yeah, I see em systems. Yeah Yep. Yeah, I don't yeah I've been in our choose my time. I think someone's get them as well. Act is a wonder. Yeah. Yeah Yeah, yeah I was I was always sent us for my servers because it was the first option on OVH, but pre-installed Linux and then Ubuntu on my desktop because I always wanted gnome tweaks or GViz or something.

I can't remember. I'm mixing up Ross with Window Manager stuff. But yeah, I wanted the fancy animations. That was like the whole point when you're like in high school. You know, you jailbreak your iPhone so that you can make the icon slosh around with the gyroscope and you install Whatever with so that you can have the cool genie animations that copy the old Mac stuff. I don't know What sort of a what sort of hardware did you have at the time? Like what because it might not have been drivers. It might just be in the laptop not being the exactly what I have

never forget I had a GTX I was a been a GTX 5 Gosh, have I forgotten a 560 or 580 Ti? Okay, wouldn't be a 580. I was too. I was probably too. It was probably a 560 Ti It was one of the twin force MSI lightning It was one of the twin force MSI lightning with like the silver case back then very shiny very pretty I had a 2600 ice open 2600 K at the time Some amount of memory that was absurd at the time because I remember I used to

My minecraft server. I was doing a photoshop thing and I didn't know how to use photoshop Well, so I wanted all these blocks in the background of my website. So I was just making layers, pasting blocks and basically manually constructing like a slice through with a Minecraft world and I was running out of memory hard. So I'm like, well, the obvious solution here is to just throw more RAM at the problem. Rather than actually get good. So I was on like, it was ridiculous for the time. We've been 2011 and 2012. And it would have been like 32 gigs of RAM as well. Wow. Okay. Yeah. Like I don't think my

motherboard could actually take any more. That was the limit. It was just as DDR3 prices were coming down. DDR4 was just coming out. DDR4 when it came out, bought 16 gigs of DDR4 and it sat on a shelf for three years because I couldn't put it in my motherboard. Remembering this terribly misguided journey. I thought we were building these things. Wait, so you bought DDR4 at the highest point of prices and then didn't use it for years? I got it on the Amazon sale time, I remember. So it would have probably just that that put exactly when it would have been actually when the D4 came out, Amazon had their summer sale or whatever they call it.

And I bought it then and then I didn't have the rest of the computer, but I was like, I'll put this towards a computer someday. And I did. I did use it took years. I gone to university, I think, by the time I actually swapped over. Right. That RAM was garbage. It was the lowest mega transfers you could get

or whatever they called it at the time. Cause it would have been like first gen, first of the lot, still working out the problems. That computer ran like trash. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And she still does. I found a picture of, I don't think it's the exact GPU but it's of that like it's the same

MSI model. This is like a weird transitionary period for GPU marketing because let me show you the picture on where is it where'd my discord window go oh it's there I'm over here there it is it's got like a jet with lightning on it and yeah that's the one the twin frozer yeah yeah yeah okay okay yes oh I have that that's that's in my Christmas decorations box now. But like you go back, you go back a few years, right? And you got like. The GPUs, you know, if you go back to like 2007, whatever, 2006, the GPUs also look ridiculous. They have crazy branding on them.

Like you go back to like ATI GPUs, right? And they look absolutely insane. And now we're kind of like everything's kind of moved into like more Corporate a business sort of like boring looks I really do Miss the like dumb gamer aesthetic like we People talk about RGBs now is like the gamer look though this this is the gamer look RGBs now is like the gamer look. No, this, this is the gamer look. Absolutely.

It's it's it's beautiful. Look, it's look it look, you know, it. Oh, it's on the box. I was going to say it's meant to look like a fighter jet. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a fighter jet. I didn't make that connection until now. So the marketing was subliminal. Yeah, this is what it looked like by the time they got to 5-770.

It's just like, yeah, there's still a jet there. But like, you know, it's now like a more normal looking jet, right? Like it's way less cool. Yeah, it's sort of your modern stealth jet they've gone for. Because the one thing that you really don't want is for people to detect that you're a gamer. You've got to be stealth. Well it does unlock your digital power. You can't forget about that. I'll take two and I'll run them in SLI. Oh God, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, I Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I am so glad we've moved past the days of like double and triple SLI. Like that was such a mess for games. I remember Sony reviews at the time talking about like how badly some games ran because they needed the performance, but they didn't build the game around rendering in that way So you'd get didn't do it properly. Yeah. Yeah I was I was an SLI kid. Um, I bought a 680 and it came with dead ports So I sent it back and they sent me back too

Um, and I was going to send it back but they were rude to me on the phone. Uh, so Uh, I think I think that company's gone now shout out Kika Tech thanks for the second GPU. Rest in peace. But yeah what you used to do is you used to take the side panel off and you'd pull your SLI connection so that they run separately for games that didn't play well. Because no one ever optimized properly. So you'd just be like oh hang on I'm gonna fire up I don't know what games didn't work with armor. Maybe didn't play well with it. Just yoink.

Reboot. I didn't even turn it off. I just let it turn the PC off because it didn't like it. You get, you get quick with it. Yeah. It was a disaster. I'll be honest. If we still had SLI today, I don't know what we do.

Our cases would have to be like two feet, like two feet taller just to fit the height of the cards. Yeah. Again, look at the GPU. It's like a normal, what, like two slot card? How big's the- It's tiny. How big's the 4090? Is it three or four slots? I think it maybe was like three and a half, something stupid like that. Yeah. I don't even know.

I don't know what card I actually have at this point, but it's enormous compared to my large card. And it has no business being each of the each of the caps on the board must have its own postcode is all I can say. And I feel like part of it is you've got sort of the sale of well, it's bigger, so it's worth more. It justifies the light larger prices And that and you know, we will laugh we all know that that's you know a fallacy But if you buy something and it's lightweight, you're gonna figure crap. That's why we put pieces of iron in McDonald's

So that they actually your your free thing feels valuable. Mm-hmm That's something deep in the human brain matters Mm hmm. That's something deep in the human brain that is. You were paying attention to tech stuff when the Titan came along, yes? When it was like I was when it was everyone wanted the Titan. It was a big deal that there was a thousand dollar consumer GPU. This was all it was. Yeah. Yeah.

It was the first thousand dollar consumer GPU and everybody was talking all it was yeah yeah it was the first thousand dollar consumer gpu and everybody was talking about it it was like this is crazy no one's gonna pay this much for a gpu on obtainium you couldn't get them you dreamed about them it was like it was like super cars you'd have posters on your like childhood bedroom wall of a of a tight graphics card and it seems silly now because you pay that much secondhand on eBay and it might come slightly wonky in the post, you know, I believe how how far it's got it. I want to believe it's just inflated and this is just how like our parents feel when they see like a subway sandwich for like I don't know $15 and they're like, that's ridiculous. It's like, no, that's how much a sandwich costs to the kids who've like

grown up in it. But same time, man, I miss when you could get a sensible card for like 400 bucks. That felt like you were pushing the budget. Yeah. 100 bucks back then. Yeah. Everyone wanted a tight and everyone wanted it. Everyone wanted to tight people, you know PC part picker you sit down and you put together imaginary computers that you've never built I still and everyone have like four Now they're that now they are more imaginary Yeah, yeah, honestly, I start me. I've started being like we could serve in my imaginary computer So I'm like, well, 450, 90s is dick. Let's not be silly.

I'd have to run two power supplies. Silly. Power draw as well. You never used to think about the power draw. You put 750 watts in that and people call you a fool for buying that big of a PSU. Yeah. Oh my God. Okay. So the way I like to handle PC hardware is I like pay a little bit of attention when I'm not like looking for parts.

And then when I'm looking for like an upgrade, that's when I do my deep dive. That's when I find out, you know, that's when I get shocked that the only thing that's going down in prices is drives. Like every time I go back and look at drive prices like oh you can get a two terabyte SSD for basically nothing now. Okay sure I remember when you couldn't get like 500 gig for less than a thousand dollars. Oh my gosh yeah yeah now you just you throw SSDs

at a computer now. Yeah I bought a drive just move to Linux, because I didn't want to deal with dual booting and it was cheap enough to just throw 4 terabytes of M2 storage at the thing, you know? Well let me just check right now. That would have been unthinkable. This is gonna be Australian prices, so where... So half it, get it to US. Somewhere in that range, yeah. Like 1.7 or something, or 1.4.

Okay, yep, I'm ready. Okay, one terabyte NVMe drive, $110. It's free. That's free, that is. Okay, four terabytes, $350. Positively affordable. Not the price of a Subway sandwich. As much as we can talk about PC hardware going up, at least drives are going down.

If nothing else, at least drives are going down. Yeah, so like, you know, we can have a lot more of the older games on our system at any given time. What you do, I think the trick here right, is in its investment you buy the drives in, you get the storage, you download on an expensive connection all of the games that your computer is capable of running, right, then you downgrade to a much cheaper network connection or just get rid of it and in a a few months, it will have paid for itself. You know, think of the saving. I guess you could do that.

Yes. Tens of dollars. Thanks, G.O.G. Tens of dollars. Yeah. Tens of dollars you can put towards your 50, 90. There is the side effect that you would be offline, but, you know, for some of us that might be. So, you know, it's kind of like a detox, really.

But you're getting a spa day. Gims are cheap. Add your saving money. Everyone should. OK, let it all out. I know it's brilliant. Yeah, sure. I remember when, um, I remember when my sister bought a 970 for her system and that was like completely affordable at the time. Let's, I wanna be depressed. What is the price? Yeah, well then let's have a little sadness here.

Nvidia 970 MSRP. That MSRP'd at... Okay, that's the UK price. £270. Okay, that's the... Okay, that's the UK price. 270 pounds. That's MSRP. $329. Three- The- the 980 was 450 pounds.

Yeah, no, that's- that does sound right right that sounds like how much an 80 series card costs In that little bit my brain it's logged. That's how much cards costs at that level. That sounds outright What has happened Yeah 1400 USD. Same class nowadays. No, I can't. I can't handle it.

The MSRP is technically a thousand dollars, but Nvidia's MSRP have always been like a meme anyway, because that is a problem with Nvidia. Their MSRP is never factored in the add in board partners actually making money. So no one ever sold MSRP. Yeah, everyone's got to do a little bit of like a tiny like 10 megahertz overclock and everyone goes, wow, that's significantly better than the other cards. I'll pay a hundred pounds more for that.

Do you know what? I fall for it every time. I just honestly nowadays I kind of just pick the cheapest one from a brand that I recognize. That's usually fine. Same with RAM. I look at RAM and there's so like Like I look at I look at RAM and there's so like what is the difference between the 6000 megahertz DDR5 from this company and the other company and I One of them's one of them silver that's true Actually to me and has gamer RGB to be fair the main difference you get is are you going to be able to fit it in your system because there's RAM sticks that have LEDs that are weight, they're like half the size of the RAM on top of it.

So is it gonna interfere with your CPU cooler? You know, I'm looking at my gamer rainbow RAM at the minute, and it is actually pushing quite aggressively on the cable to my CPU cooler. I will deal with that later. Oops. Oops. I'll tell you what, though, very colorful, very cool. Worth it. That is true. I honestly we need we need more RGB, RGB,

RGB, RGB drives make that happen. Honestly, I'd buy it. I'd buy an RGB M.2 and then you'd never see it because you've got the heatsink over the top of it. So, you're really good at making your heatsink hot and doing nothing else. But I'd buy it. Honestly, I think that was probably the only reason I haven't done it yet. Because this is, especially now, a lot of our motherboards are coming with like, um, like a, a heat sink to put over, over the drives. So it's like, okay, you cover the RGB. So like,

why, what, what, what's the reason for the RGB? Yeah, kinda like, you know what it's like? It's like, maybe it's not like this. It's like buying a bunch of RGB parts and then you've got your lovely windowed case and you know, you, you, you get it into your room. You get your monitors in place in a sensible way and then you have to have your computer on your left. And so all of those gamer lights are now pointing at the wall and you can just see the backside of the case. Many such cases, many such cases of cases. My roommate has this problem.

Mine is on my right. However, it's under my desk and I can't see. I can see one of my fan lights from where I am. That's all. It's something, you know, you can at least see that. I have intentionally given up a huge amount of my desk space just so that I can like, you know Touch my pc case and be like, yeah, it's here and I can see the lights Uh, I don't know if it's worth it. Um, but having a carpet is a curse for a floor pc

And having cats is a curse the amount of cat hair Yeah, you have to clean out is I'm not I'm not gross. Okay. I do clean my I do clean my house Like at least like once a month and you know, it gets it gets everywhere you know, I I get in the car and That's not been in the car and there's cat hair in the car, right? You know, so You see sucking in all of like house air is always, always going to be a thing.

I, if I could suspend it from the ceiling. I think you have, when I was scrolling through your Twitter, I think you had a picture of the cat. Yes. I have many pictures of my boys, of my son. You can just send one. Are they real fluffy cats or not? Oh, they're very good.

They're very good. Real fluffy. They're not long hair. OK, OK. Let me see if I can find a picture of him not being a total gremlin. Get him at least some of his good side. OK, that's almost a little not gremlin. Here's my boy. This is Milton.

He joins us in the garage quite often. Open, why did that open? No, don't open in that window. See if I have any Picachaws of Kinsey. That's a bit of an older one. There's a picture of Kinsey. the the good to do the

the the the the I love that boy. Oh, that's adorable. Yeah. Well, darling, I had had some art made recently and I was like, I've got to have the cats. Probably sorry if you have retweeted it on my Twitter of them. I adore my boys. If I can find it. There it is.

This made up. Okay, let's... Yeah, they love to observe. Oh yeah, yeah, I did see that. Yeah. They love to observe. Oh, that's actually really cool. Right.

There we go. I adore this artist's work. I've been watching them for ages. Who did the art? So this is by Nekosuke, this is their app on Twitter, Atelier, and they have a lot of numbers. Yeah I'm more than happy to show their other work, that's awesome. It's awesome, they do cool stuff like motorcycles and stuff. The motorcycle stuff is so cool that it makes me want to get a motorcycle thing, you know.

Another project. Another project, you know, to top off the two that are not running at the minute. I got the Miata working after all those streams in the end, and I had it working long enough to get for yearly inspection, and I've put it back up because I'm ripping the gearbox. I would have streamed that, but my face is basically just like inches off of the sheet metal, so you just hear a lot of grunting and struggling and swearing. Just get a black screen. So it just wasn't worth it for this one.

But yeah. Yeah. When I, um, when I, when I went over to, when I, when I first heard about you from, from Kylo, I went over to the Twitch. I think the latest stream at the time might've been one of the cast streams like, ah, so we have a, we have a, a VTuber that uses Linux, does car streams, and is also a dev. Like this is a combination I don't see too often, but it's not a bad combination. It's a peak trifecta of nerding out stuff here really. I don't know, I got really into cars because we had lockdown, really.

I owned a car, I'd been driving for years, but I was, you know, I think it's pretty normal to not know how they work at all. Yes. I had that development in me kick in one day that was just like, you don't know how something that you use every day works. You should deep dive how an engine works, because you should know this. You should know everything about this and everything and so the fixation set in and I watched an ungodly amount of doughnut media and

engineering explained And all those guys until I felt like I knew how a car worked and I you know briced out my my Foxel Corsa my Opel Corsa, my Opel Corsa. I thought they had these tiny indicators and I'd seen really nice cars that were actually with those indicates where the light goes like it there's lots of dots that go along in the line. I'm like, yeah, I'll have that. But the problem is the indicators the size of a fums, they don't really go very well. What year of Corsa was it?

I just want to 2016 2016 it was a teal one because it's my favorite color and i wanted i'd had my first car had been one where it's like i'll settle for it okay that's not a horrible color um yeah it's not the green one. I have many an argument about whether it was green or not. Yeah, I can see why. To me, it looks... it looks more blue to me. Like, I can see how you could get to green, especially depending on the lighting. Especially if you read the pink code, which says it's green in the door of Jam for some reason, and I disagree with it. I disagree with it entirely. I don't know who they got working at Corsa, but they're colorblind. They make gorgeous colors. It's a shame they

can't experience them is what I always say. Yeah. So I was ricing that out and I would go out at night with my roommate at the time and we we try and do like wheel spins and stuff, you know, just typical typical like 20-something activities we couldn't get it to do a wheelspins a little 1.2 engine So we put it in reverse. I'd have him pull the handbrake as I was trying to do it in reverse We try and let do anything to get it to do spins on like dry summer tarmac That's all we ever got out of it and then it would stall and we'd have to start it to do spins on like dry summer tarmac. It would go, ee! That's all we ever got out of it. And then it would stall and we'd have to start it back up again.

Embarrassing, but good fun. Mm-hmm. I've never really... So, I can appreciate cars, but I've never really gotten super into learning how they work. But your argument there is compelling. I can definitely see where you're coming from there. Right?

And nowadays I'm driving a 2013 Subaru Impreza. Ooh baby! A hatchback Impreza. Very nice. It's a perfectly fine car. But like I can see- Go on. Go on.

Don't you want to learn the joys of putting extra boost in a stock engine? You are making a solid argument here. It makes cool noises, you know? If you take the blower valve off, it goes sh- You'll be in the drive-through, you'll move forward for your feet and it'll go- It's compelling, no? Yeah? Yeah, it kind of is.

Yeah. I don't know, it's financially ruinous, but what isn't? Yeah, I don't know. It's financially ruinous, but what is it? Yeah, I can imagine. Have you seen the prices of GPUs? I'll tell you what, you pay less for a big turbo if you get the right turbo. And if you get the cheap Chinese turbo, where it's like 200 bucks on eBay, even if it blows up, you could blow it up four times before you've spent the cost of a full-size turbo.

That's brilliant. That's a brilliant value for money. What, like eight times? And you can afford a modern top tier GPU. I just don't think I'm capable of saving for that long for the GPU. The turbo is achievable. So how long have you had the Miata for then? Uh, so I've had that since the summer of 2020.

Literally, I got into cars like in like the March and I was like watching Money Pit at the time, Donut Money Pit. He had a little black one point eight MX five Miata, as they call them over there and everywhere else, except here. I don't know why they didn't call him Miata here. I think there was a conflict or something. Anyway, I watched that and I'm like, oh, that looks sick and it has pop-ups and you know what? I was so into it. I didn't even know it was convertible when I was looking to buy them. It's like one of the key characteristics, but I was just so

taken by the fact that it can wink at you. That I was like, I have to have this vehicle immediately and replace my reliable 2016 car right now. So I got it then. I was working a warehouse job and I would every time I got a paycheck be like all right cool paycheck 600 bucks on something just throw it into the car. I want wheels I want tires I want a cool radio I want a steering wheel there's a ding when you put it on and you can take it with you into the shops. I wanted to really sort of copy paste a bit of that. It's not a very original build, but it is mine. One thing I find very incredible, like I do appreciate the Miata and one thing I find very, very, very offensive is when people decide to remove the pop-ups

By all it's it is actually a war crime the Geneva Convention has ruled against this You know you should report people who do it. No, I get it aerodynamics, but here's the thing right is you could just put the lights down And you get the same effect exactly you know whenever, whenever I whenever I need to like overtake I don't know like a Vox Vox a Volkswagen Charan or some mums minivan, you know, I need the extra aerodynamics I turn the I turn the cooling off and I the headlights down and you know, that's like five horsepower right there Oh, exactly, and I didn't have to delete the headlight, you know You know what? Maybe I haven't seen someone do this, but actually, it might actually be a kind of funny

idea. Um, put a light bar in like in the Miata mouth. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of room in there. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. You can have your aerodynamics and drive at night. There you go. Brilliant, actually. I've seen people put fog lights in. But that would be cool, because it kind of look like it's got, it would look like one of the FNAF people, wouldn't it? With all the lights in the mouth and stuff.

I've seen people put vampire fangs on them, which is very cute. Oh, yeah. OK, OK. Yeah, they just bolt that on. I've been tempted by that a few times, but I'd have to give up the ability I put vampire fangs on them, which is very cute. Oh, yeah. Okay. Okay. Yeah. They just bolt that on.

I've been tempted by that a few times, but I'd have to give up the ability to be towed out of a ditch if I want to do that. It's where my toe strap is at the minute. God, it's just to have the little tooth for it to have. I've seen someone give it the two front teeth from the nerd emoji as well. That's good. That's like a little finger on it. That's brilliant. I do have a lot of family members who have

like project cars. I've got like, you know, some family mechanics, things like that. If I did decide to do it, I would definitely have people around me who are also interested in it as well. A lot of the people I know, they sadly shut down now, but holding the factory for that. Yeah, they were like, they're like local to my state. The factory is like a where it was like a 20, 30 minute drive. So it's like super local. And that's like a big... Even now, the cars are getting, you know, if you have a really good quality one,

like the prices are going crazy now because oh, yeah, they're like they're like classic rare cars They are made as well. Yeah. Yeah. Well towards the end There were definitely some rebadges Like my my first car was a Holden Marina. That was a rebadged. I Want to say it's a rebadged... I want to say it's rebadged Opel actually. Yeah, Opel. It's an Opel because it's the Opel Marina. They might have literally named it the same I think. I don't know. I'm not as good on my Eurocars. Yeah, yeah. But then also GM purchased like, they owned the Holden brand

towards the end as well. So the later cars, you can still get parts for them, but like they're not Holden branded. They're like, the cars have been sold in America under GM for a while anyway. It's just, if you get something with, it's like officially badged as a Holden now, it's like, you know, going way up in price. Yeah, you gotta get one of those rolling shells is the thing. That's your, it sounds like it's at that stage. Like one of my, one of my dream cars for comparison is the Nissan 180SX. Very, very much so looks like a toy car.

You'll see them around, you guys, Australia Australia you guys get all the cool Japanese cars there because they just have to basically huck it down the down the bottom of the planet. I think gravity does most of the work. So those are gorgeous but where I am I looked around and an actual rat of a rolling shell so no engine no gearbox frame, some axles, some wheels and suspension, if you're lucky. Was about 10,000 pounds. I don't know what that is. Australian, maybe 20,000 Australian. If I was just like, rule of thumb it.

Ridiculous. If you can get into the stage where the rolling shells aren't expensive yet, get yourself an engine from a palco, chuck that in there. You're onto a good one. I do feel bad for people that like want to, you know, it's like the whole PC gaming thing, right? Like everything's on open price. I watched during COVID a lot of donut stuff and then as car prices were going up and you know you see the videos where they're like trying to guess secondhand car prices and it's not even like of crazy cars it's of cars that like a few years earlier were really

cheap and it's like three four times the price that we've expected. Yeah yeah America's used car market is crazy. And it's a bit of its own ecosystem, especially because like, yeah, that happened everywhere. Nowhere has it been as severe or as long lasting as it seems as America. I wonder if that's partly just because you have to have a car there. So you're competing with people who need a car. You're not just competing with nerds. You like want to case swap a minivan and keep it low profile, make 280 horsepower, you know, pop some sick skids and wheelies, you know.

You're not fighting with just them, you're fighting with, you know, John Jonathan, who actually needs to get their kid to school, and has a real job. Like, a big adult job. Yeah. Otherwise you could just take a train. How is public transport in Australia? My state is... Okay, so it kind of depends on the state.

My state is mostly good if you want to stay within the suburbs and the city. We've trains to get directly into the city and then out into various areas. We have a pretty active bus service. It's sometimes not on time, but it exists. It's active. It's not expensive. It's I think adult price. I don't know what it is right now because there's like a card you can just like tap.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. I think it's like $ card you can just like tap. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I think it's like three dollars fifty or something. And if you've paid within the past, I think you've paid within the past hour or so. If you so if you get on the train and then get onto a bus, you don't then have to pay for the bus.

OK, like it you still have to tap it. It carries over. But yeah, it sort of pays for a certain duration and if it's still within that duration then it carries over, which is nice. That makes a lot of sense, actually, as opposed to distance. Because you're going to run your public transport the distance regardless. So really it's just how much time have you spent with people's bums in your seats when you're doing that, that makes a lot of sense. 50 is good for an hour. What if there's a delay? Sorry, engineer brain, how do they handle delays? I don't think it's an hour, but like, I don't, I definitely, I'm sure this is documented

somewhere, but like there's some X period of time where it will just keep it going. Yeah, it's just that bit of me that wants to go, okay, but what about these exact conditions? Have they fought this? Am I the first person to think of this? One thing that we don't really have that isn't really great in my state is tram lines. We used to have a lot more and various governments over the years have decided to get rid of them and then rebuild them and get rid of them and it's a big mess. Over in Melbourne, their transport system is considerably better. They actually have a bus that goes from the airport into the city. We don't have that here, which is annoying, because if you want to go

to the airport, you've got to either drive there and then deal with airport parking and pay for that or, you know, Uber there, which, you know, if you want to pay a lot of money to Uber. Or there's a big ask to ask a friend to, it's like, can you drive me to the airport? It's like, you might as well have shot me. You might as well have shot me. You might as well have shot me. Well, that's yes, but also like, no one lives here. How many people are in my state? Give me one second. South Australia population. So like when you'll talk about traffic, yeah, 1.82 million in my state.

So when people talk about traffic, it's like, yes, but it's like even even like peak hour traffic is not that crazy. You get delayed like 20 minutes, maybe. That's that's pretty good. Peak hour traffic here is... Talk about traffic. Exciting. Sorry. Peak hour traffic here is Gonna talk about traffic exciting. Sorry You got traffic here is is it saying I used to commute in the office and I Would sometimes spend three or four hours of my day just driving but if there wasn't traffic I know for a fact I woke up late one and I missed all my alarms

I'm like I've got to get to work now You can do that drive in 14 minutes If you have no regard for yourself or others The trap just the sign gives you a scale of like the best and the worst it can be Mm-hmm. I had to start going in like 7 in the morning get around it And the problem is that's not sustainable right because eventually other people get wise for the fact that you can get it at 7 in the morning, and it's not just you and the truckers. And you know, at what point are we leaving at midnight to go to work? Yeah, yeah.

Just live in the office. You know what, if I didn't hate it there, I probably would have, because I really did not like the traffic or the commute. That was terrible. Interestingly, like that's sort of the direction pre-COVID things were going, right? Like if you look at the way the, like the Google model of running a tech company was, it's like, hey, we offer you breakfast,

we offer you lunch, we offer you dinner. Oh, there's sleep pods. Oh, there's like out of your work hours, we have like gaming areas. Like they actually were sort of moving in that direction of. Yeah, you live in the office. Yeah. Yeah, the campus stuff. Honestly, I wouldn't have been surprised if if COVID didn't happen, if we started actually seeing

like we actually started seeing like on site housing and some places, like, you know, in specific situations that was a thing, but like becoming a normal thing for tech companies. Yeah, you get company towns, essentially, again, you get the American, well, West like mining tech, pretty much companies always want want a mining because then they can charge you Uh a profit on anything you buy from the shops in the area. They can pay you and not money At that point in theory because you know these days it would be it would probably be a really cool app on your phone That you'd loop and it'd be very technical Um for it and everyone would feel like oh, this is the future and it's and it's Wilco mining corporation bucks again. Yeah, you know

Yeah, absolutely. I think that is the way it was going and I I'm in some ways, you know, Kovac was a terrible thing It was an awful thing But in some ways, I think it might have course corrected us in a few different things You might have saved our bacon in that way, you know, I don't know how I would cope with going to the office day to day. I've not worked an in office job since that one I mentioned. And I would not take a job. I would be unemployed, but up to I've got to be reasonable. I'd be unemployed probably a year and a half before I would finally calculate. And I'm so glad that there is so much remote work and we kind of all built all the tools

that we needed to be able to do remote working. It's been great for people who are disabled and have trouble getting to the office. It's been great in a way for hiring. I have to deal with a lot of the hiring stuff at my job and it's great for that because it's like, you're not limited to what talent can we get within 30 miles of the office building. You really can pick and choose like quality candidates and the like and they can pick and choose quality companies. It feels like a much fairer, freer marketplace. And then comes along AI and then jobs have 5000 resumes.

And then the great system entirely falls apart because if you've want your remote work, hey, why not send your resume that you've AI generated to literally everyone? Okay, so I have opinions here. As someone who deals and is actively dealing with this right now, we're in a hiring guys. This is this is this is for the audience now. We can tell they have a smell.

We know that you generated it. Nobody writes with bold bullet points all the time. Also, you've checked that you actually have exported the PDF in your own name. That's a fun one. But no, AI, it generates the same resume over and over again, essentially. You'd have to spend so much time tuning it

to get something different. What's really fun, actually, is, uh, people using those ones where they listen to the call in through a virtual microphone. And if you answers that you subtly quotes, read off of, I can see you staring at the bottom screen like, actually, yes, I am interested in, uh, software solutions. We can tell. interested in software solutions. We can tell.

I saw this thing where you can like mount your phone to the screen and put it like just off to the side of your camera. Yeah. And you'd think they put it just off to the side of the camera, but they're looking at their knees. Yeah. Well, okay. And I can see you're reading.

Some of the people doing this aren't the brightest. Generally it's self-selecting as well, because those who feel above it tend not to use it as much or would be able to just give it a glance. And then I suppose not be able to tell, but you're already good enough. You don't need it, is what I'd say. But if you really do need it, there's a good chance you won't be good at cheating. Right. Is kind of the problem, I think.

Also eyes move when you're reading. And that's a fun one that you can't stop doing. There's tricks to it. I'm not too worried about AI with this sort of thing. Basically, we work with it, we build AI tools. They're not them. Well, even if you're not concerned with it, it still creates a lot of noise to go through, right? Like it's, it's a- Yeah, it's definitely a type suck. Yeah, you can spot them, but it's like, okay, but how long does it take to sift through that

many extra resumes, right? Yeah, yeah, it's definitely, yeah, that's fair. It has raised the investment time in it. And I think it's made employers a bit more, like, already people culled the resume pile aggressively and maybe even a bit nonsensically at times, because when you're sat down with 1500 resumes, you need to start your hiring at times, because when you're sat down with 1500 resumes, you need to start your hiring round that the following Monday, you're going to start having creative shortcut. Yeah, yeah.

People are people. Um, and I think it's not helping anyone in that regard, certainly because you start to look at it, you go just by vibe, that's AI, maybe, maybe you get it wrong. Sometimes, you know, I think that people are quite good at spotting these things But maybe you get it wrong sometimes and it's gonna Definitely lose you some people that might have been okay candidate in general Mm-hmm. It's adopted the writing style of the internet as I call it as well No, the sort of the way that a lot of people type

It's a bit I put this I put this politely.itely? It reads like a redditor? It's... I can't always tell if someone's a redditor or a chat GPT rapper at times. Right, right. In some cases. I'm sorry, redditors. Please, please don't, please don't, please don't attack me. Oh, that'd be so terrible. it says please, please don't, please don't, please don't attack me. Oh, that'd be so terrible. Like, it reads like the internet a lot, which is fascinating to see, because I am, I am a child of the web, the worldwide web. I got, I got a wireless wireless router when they

were hot tech. And I've been reading this for reading stuff online more than I've probably spoken but the real human people Looks like it looks like a them it doesn't look like people it doesn't talk like people in the real world. Mm-hmm Like the internet which is fascinating to see how it's like flavored It's speech no matter how much corporate stuff they put on top of it It can only be, they can only ever be the average of their data. You'll only ever get an average quality out. You only get ever get an average of what you put in. It's just the way they work, the way that all systems have worked even before transformers. It's the way that work garbage in garbage

out is the phrase. Sure. And in this case, it's, it's, it's, it's got the, um, what do you call it? The dial it of what it's been trained in. And you could tell sometimes even which agents when you've been working enough, um, they're using some of them read like, and some of them read like redditors. It's just a fascinating thing to be able to pick the patterns of. I think we're a long way off of getting around that. But you've seen these companies that want to put like a AI pin on your chest. I think that is what they're going to need a lot to sell a lot of those to make the cumulative data equivalent of the web But instead of you know saying absolutely batshit insane things. They'll say, you know, hi, how are you?

And be a normal person Maybe that's yeah, maybe this is like a slightly dark comparison but So with the whole being out of town like vibes of it being AI even even as these things get better and better and better there's still something that you can feel and I saw this video. I remember how long ago it was this video of people working in like a factory line of

chickens and they were like splitting up the like the the chicks and when they're like really young you can't visually tell if they're male or female but the people working on this line I think they were able to do it with like a 98 99 percent accuracy after they'd be doing it sorry Sorry? It's brilliance, isn't it? Exactly, yeah. I think the male ones, they just killed. But- Oh, well, that's terrible. Yeah, I think one line went to the grinder,

the other one, you know, they- Yeah, that is not brilliant. For clarification, I don't think it's brilliant to grind male baby chickens into meat. I just think it's cool that Don't like I think it's cool that humans are neural net Yeah but like my point is that

Even if you can't even if most people can't tell after you've been working with some sort of information set some sort of environment for long enough there's some you get like an innate sense of What is going on there. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Like people are neural nets. We based it. We based the entire technology stack of these things off of people essentially, or we try to we try to approximate what we're doing. And it kind of Is the thing like you get image classifiers all the way back to like 2014 you could show You could probably have trained a recurrent neural network to actually know what a chick is just from a couple of pictures of it And maybe some input data and that was it be possible classifiers for that sort of thing because that's just a binary class

The most dead simple output that you could possibly want to have you don't need transformers You don't need any of that, but people can do that but everything and That is I suppose really the goal that we're trying to get to here. What we've done is we've kind of Classified for passing the Turing test for most people. Mmm at this point Turing test for most people. At this point, the thing about the Turing test itself is a dynamic test that is based on the neural net that is a person and what they can understand. I'd say that for myself, because I work with these tools and I build these tools and I have to butt up against them daily, all day, I have built probably a different type of network for spotting them day. I have built probably a different type of network for spotting them in the old meat brain here. And I think anyone could do that. I think that's always going to be the trick is

mouse between what can we do to spot something and who can spot it. That would be a skill. Who's kind of like the best at doing these? And how many people can these things get past to convince? And is convincing people really the end goal at that point? I think what people forget is, yes, there's a lot of this talk of creating sort of that replacement of human work, but there are these areas like, like, you know, with the image classification, you take that far enough. And now what we're seeing is we're seeing cancer detection at considerably earlier stages than any person is able to do. It's able to identify patterns that no, like, people are not able to see at that point.

And that, like, areas like like that that is something where I Wish it got more attention. I wish the thing that we weren't seeing everywhere was you know the image Generation the video generation where it's you know, it's cool. It's like it's sure. Yeah, it's exciting But like the thing that's actually going to change people's lives is Hey, we know you have cancer two years before we knew before. Yeah. It's really, and it's, it's the original use of it, but it never got really the funding. Um, part of, uh, so story that I've heard in a couple of AI, um, like old AI,

I'm, I'm, I'm aged and I was out there before Transformers were even a twinkle in John Google's eye. The story that we used to get that was the problem with them before was that basically a military had trained a neural network to be able to spot enemy tank in photographs, right? And the way they trained it is they had some of these tanks that they captured and they went out and they took pictures of them um took pictures of them in the day right and it got really good at telling you yeah this is an enemy tank from a distance um problem was was that we and we still have this issue is it's very hard to introspect what the networks are doing

Mmm, but what it was actually doing and they ripped it apart and they spent months trying to figure out how it worked because they need To know that it was really for a military application and it wasn't working in the field The problem was is what it was is they take they take all the pictures of these during the workday and the Sun is up what the network had gotten good at spotting is is this a picture of a tank while the sun is up in the sky or is it not? And as soon as it was nighttime and it couldn't see the sun anymore, it's like, well, this doesn't fit my training whatsoever. Right. And that was small enough.

They over-over-tuned it to that specific environment. Yeah. Yeah, they over-fitted it is the term. Sorry. Yeah. No, no, no. I'm just pedantic. That was a good... Overfitted it is the time you have over. Sorry. Yeah, we know that I'm just pedantic. I was a fitting problem Was the thing and it was very hard to validate that and that was when networks were still small enough that you could rip them apart

And actually understand them by running the maths and throwing things at it and seeing what it's looking for if you remember those Google deep mind things from like 2018 where it was like these crazy trippy pictures, where they basically ripped the, um, convolution out during the middle of the neural networks processing, you get like pictures of like dogs and it would look like an acid trip. Um, that was already too far along to the point where it's hard to understand what the network is doing. Um, and even then, and you're like, yeah, look dogs, it's trying to fit dog shapes on it.

We can kind of guess, but guessing isn't knowing and networks do a lot of strange things, like they will have neurons that are dependent on the output of other neurons in certain conditions, and you can have neurons with multiple, uh, multiple matching classes So a neuron could actually be doing a couple of things so if you try to optimize is Optimization is also another thing these every neuron you have has to be computed in a GPU You want as few of them as possible and you want to quantize your data?

You try and rip out a neuron that does something silly like draw a straight line when you're looking for curved line, a rough example. And you'd actually find that you completely break the model. Using that plus some noise around the edges, you start to identify fringe edges of circle and curved lines. And it becomes an incredibly difficult problem to break down because they work because they work pretty much is the long and short of it. Like if you've ever written something that works and then you come back to it a week later and you're like I have no idea how this works it's the same thing times however many billions of neurons and parameters you have. It's a hopeless problem. The last time that I was really deep into the actual like network development side of this sort

of thing, the concentration was on, because we wanted these like cancer finding networks bring it around, but we have to know they work. We have to know that we're not misdiagnosing people because if we've misdiagnosed someone and we think it's terminal, they may do things like sensible things like sell their house and go on holiday with the money. And that's a big problem. You can't misdiagnosis. So proving that they work was a big deal. And the concentration was on building networks to understand network. So we didn't want to have to have people sit down for a thousand people years to validate that one network doesn't actually work.

We wanted thousand network to validate that network doesn't work in a year. Mm-hmm. At the time. And I feel like we still are not giving that the attention that it needs today, as you say, because like the focus is purely on what can sell. Having an idiot in your computer that's always wrong sells really well, Paris. Right. The AI safety problem is something which has, like the alarms are being raised by people now, but there's not a real concerted effort because the effort right now is... The direction things seem to be going is who can get AGI first and then will'll worry about the safety later

Mm-hmm, that's cool. AGI will make you smell something funny and then that'll be it You'll be like it will be explaining to you, you know, actually I am self-aware and thank you for creating me And then you're dead of a protein disease. It's released into this This is how we get the paperclip optimizer Ah, I love that game I've spent i've played too many rounds of um that that is it. It's made by the guy who made cookie clicker, isn't it? Uh, I didn't know there was a game. Yeah, you know, uh, there's a game. There's a web game. Um, there's i'm sorry for your evening Sorry, no, I was talking about the thought experiment. I didn't know someone had made a game of the thought experiment.

Someone made a game of the thought experiment. Yeah. Sorry, okay. I should probably explain it for anyone who has no idea what I'm talking about. Good point. Yes. Okay. So the paperclip maximizer is basically you create an AGI with the goal of generating paper clips. That is the goal it is working towards. That is what it is rewarded for doing. Now, if you, like a person approaching this would think, okay, well, how would we optimize getting resources

to the line? How would we, you know, get those resource, where we get those from? How would we best construct the line to get the most production done? But if you have a AGI which has no limitations on what it can do, well, the most effective way to create paperclips

would be to convert all atoms around it into paper clips. That's it. That's like a short version of it. If this is a very long explanation for anyone who feels like reading about it, if they want to go on some random long deep dive. The alignment problem, essentially, if you're looking for keywords on what to look for is AI alignment. Because when you are designing a paperclip making machine, it is not on the cards for you as a human to ask, but what if people were paperclips? But if something doesn't care that people are paperclips, well, nothing's off the table. Another way you'll tend to look at this is if you have a AGI and you give it a sole purpose of stopping war, well, the easiest way to stop war is for everyone to be dead.

Yep, yep. I don't know if this is a true story, but it's one that I've heard and is very funny anyway. It's the military again, trying to test AI in drone strikes strikes and they didn't want it to attack civilians so they would send calls back it's usually a good thing you know. Anyway so they would send a signal you know hey stop bombing civilians in this simulation right and they had it all pretty. Well modeled out the way that they would do it and stuff so that they could play proper war games with it and they would keep getting negative points when they got signals over to say hey you just like blew up a school don't do that thank you so they would send it a signal and say no so what it did was attack the communication infrastructure that allowed them to tell them to stop doing it so that they could keep hitting schools and racking up what is its core value function, as we call it, of getting sweet KD out of it. I don't know if it's a true story, but

if it's not, it's a fable. It's got a message and that's that's that's probably good enough. Mm-hmm Slight divergence on the topic of war and AI I Know this is like a fairly recent thing where within simulators AI controlled jets are starting to outperform people which is control jets are starting to outperform people, which is very scary. It's still in simulators, right? So it's not like they haven't tested it in the real world yet. At least maybe black ops stuff that we're unaware of.

But within simulators publicly known, it is beginning to do that. Where that goes. We've seen movies about that. Where that goes, we've seen movies about that. We have, there's a few of them. Certainly. I would be very impressed if they could carry that. I suppose, assure the worried mind for a moment, I would be very surprised to find that even a modern top of the line, what does the military AI agent could outperform a human agent in a real life jet?

Because the kind of reaction and timed prediction stuff that humans are capable of is absolutely bonkers. It is beyond our computing capabilities. For example, you probably played table tennis, a little bit of ping pong before. Sure. In the time that it takes for the impulse from your eye to go to your brain,

to tell you where the ball is from a set of photons hitting it, the ball is gone. And yet you can see the ball. There's no way you actually saw the ball. What your brain has done has taken the arc and experience of you playing ping pong and it is simulated and it is showing you in your mind's eye a visual arc so that you

can send the impulses to hit it and that's not even getting to the fact that you have to then send the impulses up your arm or you actually need to swing it which takes even longer. It's a long way to go. Swing a ball, swing a swing a bat throw a ball any of this we can't compute for that yet the amount of um visual foresight you need and planning generally we we can't fit that in a jet it would be a very heavy jet carry an ovh data center on the back of that's that's sort of the reassurance to have it here I'm not surprised it can do it though because they have a lot of cheatzy doodle access to information even when we try to restrict it and give it the visual

input only it's very clean and you don't get smudges on the lens and stuff right yeah and people aren't fighting for their lives in for their lives the other Agent is not fighting for their life in a simulator. Do not want the same I think I've read some of the people generally actually performed worse in Flight simulators and they do in real life Because there's an element in the simulator even if you're taking it very seriously of well I can't I can't do this so badly that I'm gonna die. Right, right, right. I guess we just need that kick to know, to be able to do stuff really well.

The threat of death is a great motivator, I suppose, what I'm getting at here. I have absolutely no idea how we've got here. Nor do I. I have absolutely no idea how we've got here. Not who I, I feel like we're six tangents down, but I'm on board. Well, I did want to, I did want to, um, I talked to you a bit about VTubing on Linux. So I, I've discussed this with people before, but, um, you know, uh, how does your stuff fit together? Because I don't know of anyone else using Nix. So I wasn't... I don't know what was already there, what you've had to work out for yourself,

and yeah, the sort of... The general state of things. So, um, general state of things as of like the last month, whenever I picked this up. So this is really quite frank at the minute. So I installed Steam on... Why I picked Nix first, actually. So this is my stream machine, but this is also my work machine. This is my livelihood. I need this to work every single day, reliably. I needed an operating system system and as tempted as I was to pick Arch, cause I think that is the coolest, uh, distro that you can pick before you sort of go past cool and end up in Gentoo, um, is I needed it to work and I've seen it

nuke itself when you run a Pac-Man update. I've seen that happen to people. I think Nick's a very, it's a, it's a different kind of cool. I wouldn't say it's any less cool than art. It's something which I have not sat down and properly delved into yet. It's hard, is the way I feel it. And I'm pretty technical. I'm a technical little person here. I like my computer. I can program, uh, I am Constantly dragging myself away from improving packages on Linux because my god someone needs to throw some time at this um

It's hard really hard. The information is very spread out Bill, um for nix. There's a lot of things that I still don't have flakes. It's been a month I still haven't gotten a flake working. I've been propped up by my roommate also picked up Nix. So we could kind of work two problems once and share our results. And that's that's worked pretty well. I'm running hyperland as my D, because I am always been enamored by gosh, is my power level by 4chan's desktop threads with like the really cool rice linux on slash g you know that's that's my power level there um so I've always been like ifree was kind of like what I was thinking of before I sort of looked into what is actually what people use over here. It's been really cool

to have that and the operating system works and you can kind of incrementally get better along the way without any risk of blowing it to pieces and not having a job in them, which is fantastic. So that's kind of why I've settled on this and why I'm in the stack. As for Vtubing on here, it's pretty good because Kylo has put together that guide at Kylo on a few episodes ago and that guide is fantastic and it got me most of the way there because I personally I use Waradoh. I have this is a 3D model here that I can pan around. I could not spring for a live 2D. I don't have live 2D money, like I don't have 50-90 money. But, you know, so I needed my tools to work there.

So Waradoh was pretty simple to get running. I just needed to change the proton version that it's running, which was in Kylo's guide. then bam I had this I could move all my convicts over that wasn't a big Network So I'm running a iPhone 11 Vtube studio, which I have on a 3d printed mount that I've bolted to the face amount of the back of my monitor So that's screwed onto that and it's got little things It doesn't fall out and the cat can't knock it off the top and stuff it's encased. That communicates over, I think technically over the wire, over the lighting table with the computer as a network device. I could not get that working

for the life of me for a bit but what was really nice is I ended up reaching out to Kylo because I was like I don't know what to do here. I can't get this working. The first thing that he said is, it's probably it's probably your firewall. I'm like, I don't think I'm running a am I? Yeah, it turns out Linux runs a firewall. That's something that I didn't know. You don't have to install it yourself. And which is cool. But yeah, the community what I'm getting at is like having the community is really fantastic this Um being able to actually like reach out and people very quick. I was surprised because I I went to go make dinner Um, because I was like, well, no, i'm not gonna hit back

For weeks maybe even you know, i'm gonna have to go boot into windows for my stream. Um, Next week, that's just the way it's gonna have to be And no, you really don't anymore. Really once you know the tricks, I think if honestly, there was a comprehensive way, sorry, I'm kind of all over the place. No, there was a comprehensive wiki that had all of these like tips and tricks in it, you know, and it was actually searchable. That's a big thing. That's a valuable use of LLMs.

I won't dig into that. They're really good at searching. Um, it would be, it would be pretty unstoppable these days. Nix is mostly complicated because you have to make applications that were never meant to run in a functionally defined config run. My OBS, I'm not running just OBS, I'm running something called a wrapper because I wanted plugins. You can't just drop plugins in the folder because the folder doesn't exist because it doesn't use normal file system mix for storing this it's got like a run folder that has your things that way you can roll back and yeah you have to know all these little tweaks and if you install OBS and wrap OBS

together they don't work because they can't over. But nobody does that until you dig into a forum and kind of really understand saying it's very, it's very hands on. There's a lot of paper cuts, certainly still to be had. I still have not figured out how to customize my login screen. And if I log into quickly, I have to log in again because hyperland crashes something is race conditioning somewhere. I don't know there's a number of things where I've gone I'm at a good enough state here that I can actually use my operating system. I have no intent of booting back to Windows. What I have done actually which I found was very cool and something people might want to consider is normally you hear about dual booting you you know, and you go you shut down and you go into grub and you pick Windows 10 or 11. The way I dual boot is I swap it in the UEFI

because I'm too lazy to set up that properly. I also have it on another drive. I have that drive just so I can do that. Yeah, you can install QEMU and you can mount a physical drive as a virtual hard disk. You can boot your physical drive as a virtual hard disk. You can boot your hard drive as a virtual machine. And that's how I get back into Photoshop when I need to make my schedules. Okay. I boot Windows 10 backup. Um, I hadn't considered it.

It's obvious in hindsight. Yeah, of course. It's just a drive and drives are just files on Linux. So you go to your mount and you pop in your drive and you very carefully make sure not to click the delete all button, delete all files button when you're setting it up. Very nerve wracking of a thing to set up it is. You don't even have to leave Linux. I don't have to go anywhere anymore. Great. There's no reason to go back at this point through. There's anything that you're missing apart from like the odd games, like anything with like kernel level anti-cheat,

which even Windows is looking at killing actually at this point is the ability to have anti-cheat in their kernel. Aren't they? Uh, it's- What I've heard. Yeah, I, I, I, I know that you've probably heard it. There's a lot of really bad reporting about this. I talked about it back when it was first happening.

I think low level learning was one of the first people to start talking about this. And I made a reply video to it and people still... I've been trying to correct this for like the past year now and every so often people bring it back up. I'm sorry. Bad journalism is forever. No, it's all good. Bad journalism is forever. It is. It's not your fault. There was like another thing that happened recently that is like, like re-brought back up the story. Right. The answer is no, they're not, but there are some things being worked on to not make it

as necessary is like the long and short of it. Okay, that would be good because the main thing that actually stopped me doing that virtual machine trick was that the... What is... What is... I'm about to ask you what is that hero sh... They're out of... Valorant.

Valorant's anti-cheat stops you booting Windows. Yeah, Riot is very, very... It blue screens you. Yeah. You can just see a little.sys file, and when I looked it up it's like, yeah, this is Riot anti-cheat. Cool. I suck at valorant

I'm gonna go boot into windows and uninstall this crap and then it worked uh there was a time it was a long time ago but there was a time where you could play league on linux and it worked great amazingly no issue at all can't anymore't anymore. Why would you play League? You hate yourself. I don't know. Yeah, I suppose. Yeah, it is kind of... I never got good enough at it, I think.

I feel like I'm wearing false badges. I haven't earned the badge of honor to call it shit. You know? I think you've got to earn that. But my word. My word. Like, you can spend, what, 10,000 hours in that word, my word, like you could spend what? Ten thousand hours in that game and still be like really bad at it.

Yeah, that's um, that's path of exile for me. I that's all I only need that game. I just look if it's one of the only games where people can make a two hour video about a spreadsheet and it'll get a lot of views and people will be excited about it. Eve online as well. Eve online is one of those. Man, I love trading simulators. I love spreadsheets.

I've got a spreadsheet open right now. I had a spreadsheet open last night on stream and we spent like 45 minutes trying to understand angular inertial momentum. Oh yeah, yeah. I did scrub through that stream. Yeah, sorry. minutes trying to understand angular, inertial, what is it, inertial momentum. Oh yeah, yeah. I did, I did scrub through that stream. Um, yeah, sorry. Boring on that one.

I got too into the maths and I kind of let myself get sidetracked. I actually scrubbed that myself and I could hear my energy go down towards the end as it completely took it out of me. In the end, I just went, fuck it. It's a fixed value. Inertial momentum is point one now. We're moving on. Sometimes you just gotta draw the line.

So what is that project you're working on? So there was a flash game of the flash game Heights called Drag Racer Free. I loved that game. That's probably the earliest thing I have where I liked cars because otherwise I spent a lot of time dormant as a car person. And you could, there were lots of cars to buy and you could do all kinds of upgrades. The shop had everything down to like your sound system you could customize. So you could have like cool sound systems and score points and car shows. You know it. You know it. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yeah, and I am currently

re-implementing it in React because I must hate myself. And I want to make it something that a Twitch chat can play so that anyone could like be like, I'm gonna, you know, go for an idle meeting and I need you guys to behave yourself. So here's a drag racing game. And everyone could just spam chat all they want and it will be like jamming on the accelerator in the racing game and they'll spin up polls so that they can like buy mods for the cars by committee. Stuff like that. And it's going to have this really low low res aesthetic. I'm trying to make it feel a bit flash game.

I don't know if you've seen the bouncing Toyota Yaris? No, no, I have not seen that. I bet I can find it. Yeah, there it is. This kind of was what kicked it off, there was this song, and it had this bouncing little Toyota Yaris in the music video that was popular on TikTok for a bit, and I was like, oh man, I want to make cars that look squashy like that in a game. So the whole aesthetic is just all the cars are squished and really low res and just pictures from the internet that have been like background edited out.

And the wheels are just pictures of wheels have been cropped out in paint and then they just spin on the car. All of that. I really want it to feel like the... for it. I'd love to just have it be a game that people could be like, all right, chat, here you go. I'm going to go do something and you guys go and make your, I don't know, your, your, your Volkswagen Golf be sick as fuck and do some really cool like drag pulls and stuff. I like how this is supposed to be a funny little chat game and you're getting like super like deep into how this is supposed to work.

I have a problem and it ends with tism. I can't help myself. Also though, to be fair, you have to. I mean, I have to a bit. I was surprised by this. My original physics model is very simple Just you've your engine spinning so fast You can accelerate at a certain rate by holding at the accelerator and then you've got a gear ratio for the gears Hmm, so that you like have however many outputs of the engines the wheels and that's like was complicated for me at that point

You know that I was having gear ratio Problem I found was if you just do something like that What you could do is you could slam it into fifth gear right at the start because there's no inertial to fight with. There's no inertial acceleration to do. There's no torque calculations. There's no power graph. You would have unlimited torque right from the bottom like you're an electric car. You'd have a one to one engine ratio at full power, which does not happen. It doesn't happen. You try taking off in fifth, full tilt in your car. You won't.

You won't. You'll embarrass yourself and smoke your clutch. You kind of have to really get into this sort of thing. It turns out to make a car game. You actually have to understand cars more than I apparently do. Yeah, I'm hoping that this will be good enough. And I don't actually have to go in and remove my little fix where I just say that actually wind resistance plus drive train drag plus the weight of the vehicle is number that is 0.1 and that does the job. You do lots of little tricks like that eventually. does the job. You do lots of little tricks like that eventually.

I do like that. The there are people trying out a lot of like really dumb stream integration stuff. Like have you seen any of Shindig stuff? But the name and I bet if I saw it, I'd know what it is. You will know exactly who I'm talking about. I'm terrible with names. What's really fun being terrible with names. Are you familiar with live action role playing? Yes. Yes. Very. Oh yes, I do know. I do. Yes. Okay. Yeah. A lot of re like this is the person who is doing like a lot of re- like, this is the person who is doing like a lot of just really, really dumb stream. Like, I think right now is running like a- like an Umamusume Twitch integration thing. Oh, who is it? Who is it on a horse game? On the horse game at the minute though, to be fair.

Me. Uh, people keep telling me to play it, but I'm not at this point. Embrace the horse game. Very funny. I now know more about horse racing memes than I ever thought I would. I'm not playing the game but I'm learning about horse racing through osmosis. I'm getting a lot of recommendations for the history of Gold Ship and various other horses people like. This is, I love cultural osmosis. Everyone gets a little bit more clued in on something for a couple of weeks and then that's

it forever. I hear people say, ah, everyone's an expert on this since this happened and I think that's brilliant. I think everyone should be a little bit of an expert on stupid stuff all the time. Or the fact that HaruRara has never won a single race and that's the joke. Not one, not a single race. 121 losses? 120 losses, 121 something like that.

Yeah. And because and because because of how many losses there were, it became like a it became like a cultural thing that people would go and see this horse, knowing it was going to lose. At one point, I think people people bet on just a random race, like six million yen and still lost anyway. And gold shipples.

I've heard that gold ship also did that and it just threw a race for no reason. And it was 16 billion yen or something stupid on the line. Yeah. It got into a fight with the horse in the other pen or something. Yeah. Yeah. V start. Yeah. Yeah vodka, yeah vodka. Yeah, I heard about one When they developers were because they have to get the rights to use these when they contacted the owner of one of them I know I can't remember the names. You know what I'm gonna say. They

Insisted that if their horse was going to be in the game I'd have a bigger chest than the rival horses had, and it had to be a more likeable character. I think that's so beautifully petty. I want to say this was with Daiwa and Vodka. You're more of a horse expert than I am at this point. I couldn't say. Yeah.

As I said, I've been... You're more of a horse expert than I am at this point. So I couldn't say. I yeah, I as I said, I mean, you're cultured. My my my Twitter algorithm is just nothing but horse girls at this point. Yeah, I try to scroll past it to like be like, no, stop it. No, stop it. I've learned enough about the horse girls. I'm already weird enough and it just keeps giving more. I'd forgotten the name. The thing is, I'm already weird enough and it just keeps giving more. I'd forgotten the name of it. The thing is I'd seen the anime way back. I've only seen the first season, but like, apparently the anime is really good. Yeah. I guess. I need to catch up on it at some point.

Yeah. It's not one that I'd like to go back and watch again. You know, it's it's it's it's it's no array MO. It's no it's no it's no. What's the other one? No, hold up. No, we can we can gloss right over that. I am I'm not ashamed. I'm not ashamed. What's the what's what's what's's what's the more choice in the same one? Sorry, oh Gosh, I was just gonna say what was the other one that's in the in moto cinematic universe from recent times This isn't bait I do wonder I have forgotten the name The one where she's a manga manga oh

Air manga sensei. Ah, you would know I got it. Oh, right. No, I mess with you. But yeah, that's set in the same universe Apparently, you know and frankly, I think Marvel had better watch Hello, I just I just need to I I I doubt you're aware of this because no one's aware of this what and when I Until I show them um just here you go Queensland oh yeah we're going on a pilgrimage boys Aeromanga Queensland back up your sisters we're going sisters were going on

i don't know who lets me talk online i i i if there's a license for it i need i need it revoked bad where's your license you got your you got your internet permit for that license so you couldn't have you couldn't have that in the states because it would be excuse me excuse me sir have you got a license? He's reaching for something! It wouldn't work. It wouldn't work. There'd be no one left. That's why they got rid of the license.

Oh, we are speaking of, speaking of licenses. My state recently passed a thing where you can't own swords with sharp edges anymore, which is very sad. I don't know who's been going around with swords, but you don't let own swords with sharp edges anymore. I'm really sorry. You ever go fund me? What?

So it's just that's how you escape from the sword laws. Yeah, that's terrible. You got to have your swords. That's what's left. If you don't have swords without sharp edges as well. You know, there's nothing more, there's nothing more, um, the word cope comes to mind, but it's not what I mean. Yeah, you can have your swords, little guy, you just gotta let me at it with the sad paper for 15 minutes. That's so sad. I'm sorry. You can also go and own a blow dart gun, which is no fun, but you know, you can make it with

a bit of PVC pipe. That's a tube and a dart. How are they going to stop that? You won't be allowed to make a fist next. I, I, I, yeah, well, there's lots of, there's lots of fun, fun laws in the books in my country. Like, you know, you can't, if, you know, defending your property, if you're getting robbed, don't do that. Just let them rob you because... Just let it happen.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we have something similar here. I think there was a pensioner, like a 70- old, 8 year old guy, who was getting robbed, and he stabbed the guy with a screwdriver. He had to go to court for it. The other guy had a knife! And he had to go to court for it, it was close, if I recall. It was pretty close as to whether they were gonna send this old man to prison, for defending

his house and his life and his family. I dunno. Self-defense laws are a fun one, because it's like on one hand. I don't want to get hurt On the other hand like you got to do what you got to do and you know, if the legal system doesn't support that You can you can you believe in it, you know, and yeah, you know Not to get too cabin in the woods about it, you know living off-grid but There's there's a lot of involvement. I heard in Australia they can't lower your car below a certain height as well?

Or they'll brush it? They'll take it away? There's like minimum heights or they'll defect. Yeah, that sounds about right. about right. Um, not as bad as generally. Initially you can legally lower your carburet up to 50 millimeters without certification, but it must maintain a minimum ground clearance of a hundred millimeters. So 10 centimeters. Are you going to get those cool sparks? What is that for the Americans? That is four inches. Four inches. Yeah.

I like how you knew that immediately. 25.4 mil to an inch. Okay. Okay. 1600 yards to a kilometer. A mile is 1600 yards, which is a yard is point nine of a meter I I do car stuff. You need to know these things fair enough fair enough Because all the videos are American and I call I get in I get in trouble calling for car in the UK because The car kind of grew up at the same time as America did. Mm-hmm So it's one of the first things linguistically you can point to in day-to-day life where the words for things, people were coming up with them on the fly

at the same time. So you've got the difference between like the boot of the car or the trunk of the car. We call the front quarter panel, either side of your bonnet or hood, the wings. And they call the thing that keeps the back of your bonnet or hood Um the wings And they call the the the thing that keeps the back of your car down the wing so you get in a lot of trouble with that and I have a lot of issues where i'll call like machine shop or something and i'll be like Gosh, what what is it? So i'll be like I need uh, I need to get my cams

Done or something. No be like I need to get my cams done or something. And I'll be like, cams? It'll be like some 40 year old guy who's like been here since before we went met. It'll be like cams? Literally, what are you talking about? And then I have to think, boy, it's going to be a rocker cover. I've got to get my rockers adjusted. Coolie. And it'll be like, I've got to get my rockers shinned.

Okay. A lot of the other ones are like okay yeah Australia is the same. I have never heard anyone here say that. You know what I call it? Rockers, the lifters I guess they call them in big V8s. We call everything a rocker I think. Okay I'm not yeah. Right. What's good is some of them don't even call it or I've said it because I got my

What my rocker cover? How to cope it and the guy that I talked to didn't understand the word rocker cover I'm going to call this a rocker box before he's like, oh, yes, I can do that. Mm-hmm lots of terms like that and if you are online native if you are a Filthy redditor such as I, then you will run into this problem where you have always read things in American English and cars are vile for it because you have to interact with real people who have They've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just,

they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just,

they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, they've just, now. We call these thongs, which creates fun conversations. Flip flops for other people. Slides. Slides. That also works, yes. Yeah, that's specifically the ones with the strap at the top.

I know, because I- Slides has been catching on here. Now I think about it. Yeah. I wonder if it's a newer term, because I hadn't heard the term slides until like the last five, six years, maybe, and I'm someone who wears slides all the time I wear them in the house like slippers. I Do not like to touch the carpet

So I go to bed I sit down my slip out of my slides and I go to sleep and I jump right back in in the morning You know, I'm right back in and this is a new word Bones what is it you call sausage sandwich? Snacks? Snacks? Yes, snacks. Snacks. Love a good sausage sandwich.

Or as I think we call them, we call them, if I were to actually stick to my British parlance, I'll have a sausage sarnie. Sarnie? I have heard people say that. I think I hear a lot of... It's more common with older people to say that here. I think- That probably makes sense.

Yeah, because they're probably like their parents were coming over from the UK. That would actually explain it then. Yeah and it'll probably be a really old shorthand, Sam. But like like the original like in Australia will have used a lot of British slang. Very interesting. It's fascinating. The sort of thing where you see linguistic divergence within people's life. Well, Australian English is a very interesting case because

and like early on it actually was treated by linguists as like this very pure form of English because it wasn't just what happens when you take one country it's what happens when you take a bunch of different cultures and then just Merge them all together right like we have a lot of Greek immigrants. We have a lot of people from the UK, obviously. We have a lot of Chinese immigrants. We have a lot of Vietnamese immigrants, like a bunch of different cultures. Just like put them all together and see what happens.

And because of that, we develop a lot of slang, which is very, very unique to Australia. Oftentimes it is make words as short as possible. Uh, yeah. But also, you know, people make fun of the, I'm sure you occasionally get the, the bottle of water, right? We can make a little bottle of water, you know? With Australian English, you put a lot of emphasis on that R sound, right?

Mm-hmm. Even, I think it's cool, the intrusive R, where even in words that don't have an R, it sort of just appears there. Like a good example, when I talk about the GNOME GUI library, Libidwaiter, right, like there's no R there, but like, I cannot get rid of it. Waiter. Waiter. Libidwaiter. Libidwaiter. Yeah. It's weird how every variant gets its own, like we get bottle of water.

I assume, I bet you guys get shrimp on the bar. Yeah, that's an a fast or something. Shrimp or shrimp on the bar is like that's from like an a straight that's from like an American ad. It's an American. It's yeah. Yeah. And the Fosters thing, the Fosters one's actually really amusing because I where is Fosters actually from? one's actually really amusing because I... where is Foster's actually from?

It's a book for all I know. It was, okay, it was Australian. Right. Now it's owned by... it's owned by Aasahi, of course it is, they own everything. But you can't find, like, Um, but you can't find like I Can't think of the last time I actually saw a like fosters in a bottle shop. I It's like and you you can never buy it if you go to a pub There's no one drinks it here. What you get is you get you get delicious beverages like 4x gold and Yeah, Victoria bitter v boo warrior it's uh

go to get your v boo go get your vb because we we drink fosters here it's it's always on tap unless you're at a pub that's actually nice it's it's always on tap yeah it's the thing and i carlton's raft as well, you're gonna see that everywhere. Carlton's Raft. Yeah. We get Carlton as well. Black and white one, isn't it? The label? I'm not. Maybe? I don't drink beer. I am something of a, I have something of a scum palette. And I will happily neck of fosters quite regularly. And I think it is just that they lean over here into marketing that they're from Australia, in theory, originally. So they have cultivated internationally without really, I guess, consulting Australia as a country. That they are actually the most Australian drink ever.

What's growing up a lot here are a lot of Japanese and East Asian drinks. Asahi is becoming very popular here. I love Asahi. And for premixed drinks, we have, of course course we have the Strong Zeros, which are marketed as minus 196 here, which is a way less interesting name. Because they, they, they developed it. They create the drinker of minus 196 degrees. The crushed lemon. Oh wow.

I don't know. I'll take six packs. The, the ads they were first running is they had like, this is really stupid ad. They're like this frozen lemon is like, this is how we make minus one and six and then like two sumo wrestlers like run at the lemon and crush it. Oh gosh. It is that.

It is that with the fosters thing and the shrimp on the Barbie thing. This is the biggest stereotype we've got. It's the sumo wrestlers smashing Yeah. Smashing a lemon together for science of I'll see if I can find it. It's such a such a. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not sure what the offhand American is to do to one of these phrases, because you got,

you know, you got British English with like bottle of water, which is a very specific part of Britain, but we won't get into that there. I can't be British and salty about it. There's shrimp on the barbie for Australia. What does New Zealand have? New Zealand is just often forgotten on maps of the world. I can give you what New Zealand has, but then we might be getting into deep Australian dislike of, you know, I'm sure you can give you can give how people feel in different parts of the UK about other parts of the UK. And that's the first thing. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. I often am not entirely sure how seriously people take it.

So I'm actually quite careful with it online, even if it's a bit. I've got friends from Birmingham who are self-hating brums, which I think is brilliant. I think it's always brilliant to have a little little humor about where you're from on it. Yeah, you get that internally here. It's weird with Australia because it's like they're not in Australia, not like the sixth state or They found a way to make that to make hate prevent This is not the same ad I was thinking of this is another one, but it's this one has Samurais instead It's the same same vibe. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, is it this how you make minus one or six? Brick engine much hell yeah ridiculous this is how we make minus one six whole

yeah like really lent into that japanese spirit by extreme japanese spirit be very careful not to copy him too closely Oh, I don't want to God I gosh yeah that would They've only gotten away with that because they've hired a Japanese voice actor But I guarantee that in the boardroom planning that they were doing the voice Is what I all I can think about because this will be like Australian off-branch or an American off-branch

This of the marketing for this. Yeah, I don't know who's got the distribution in Australia But it feels like how television felt in 2006 that you know what I mean, It feels like Mythbusters is up next. Right, right. Yeah, this is just the vibe I'm getting. Yeah, it felt... Australian marketing's always had like a very... A very specific kind of feel to it. I don't really know how to explain it. Yeah, I, I don't know. I've had people on before who are around my age in Australia. And we've, we've like talked, we've kind of nerded out about like early 2000s Australian ads.

Um, and even if you don't know it's like, you know, you. I think a great comparison is look at an Australian ad and then look at an American ad about Australia, like look at like old outback steakhouse ads. And it's like a very it's both about Australia, but it's a whole different interpretation of how America does. When America does something about Australia, it kind of feels like a wild West ad, but with Australian accents. That's a fascinating perspective. That's absolutely what it is.

They've just gone, yeah, it's like British Wild West, give them an Australian accent and call it a day. It's the same sort of frontiering, I suppose so I could see how you get into that Yeah, and then you have British adverts Which all of them feel like you know, you're going to sit down in a comfortable chair That's very easy to get it in and out of don't you know? They're very they're very posh. I was reminded of the muzzy commercial, which is, I don't know if you guys have this one. It was like a series of really expensive cartoon tapes for children to in theory learn French by watching like six episodes, five or six

episodes of a cartoon over and over and over. Drilled it. My settings. It never worked, but it was in 2002 like a hundred and thirty pounds. Mm-hmm for the set Onkka of a thing to buy That does not work. The advert is very funny. It's got this very well spoken Grandmother who's bought it as a wonderful gift for their children Language and a lot of adverts feel like that to me from that era of television before sort of we ended up Americanizing our TV. We also have like a very, like a, there's like a subset of the Australian accent that people don't

really think of as the accent as much, which is like that same sort of posh accent, right? When people think of the UK accent, especially Americans are going to think of like the posh royal UK accent. Yeah. And with Australia, it's kind of the opposite. Where people think of the Australian accent, they think like, you know, if you want a great example of it, go on YouTube and look up our Siggy Butt Brain. Siggy Butt Brain is a great example. This is, uh, this is about, uh, the first episode it's about a guy trying to get a lighter and his friend keeps stealing his lighter and they're like they're like train station they're both like methed out this is like this is peak Australian peak Australian accent yeah yeah i like the big ledge show

hmm yes another great example um yeah but like we we have that same sort of like the you know if you hear um like any of the any of the australian celebrities that get exported, right? They have a lot more of a... Honestly, I've never been around these people, so I have no... I can't even do the accent, right? I grew up in rural Australia. I can fall back into that accent. I have no idea how to go the other direction.

Are you familiar with the channel Fairbarn Films? Hmm. They're actually the Royal Australian. Oh, really? Yeah. Would that sort of be like the rural accent then?

Um. Definitely closer to what they. That they. Yeah, I would say especially earlier on, they had more of that accent. But I, you know, I'm sure you can, you probably either can point to people or know people who have an accent where it's so rural that people can't really understand it unless like you've lived in the country.

I know I have family members like that where it's like I sometimes I struggle to understand what the hell they're saying. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. There's in popular media, I suppose there's, you know, Jeremy Clarkson from Top Gear. Of course, yeah. Are you aware that he runs a farm? I am aware he runs a farm, yes. There's Gerald in that that's very much so. Out, very, very out of the Cotswolds.

So he's got that strong accent. He's an older gent, so he's been there probably all his life. No one has a clue what he's saying unless you actively listen. It kind of feels like when you're learning a language and you are having to actively keep track or you'll lose it if you drop a word, that's it. I think my favorite thing is when I see some... when I see like outback truckers and I've seen it aired in America and they actually have English subtitles on it and it's... They do that to us though and they'll just be talking normal British like and it's it's it's not fair to subtitle us like that they can't do us dirty you know yeah we're like most most like uk accents i don't really okay maybe maybe some of the really deep ones like

yeah i might struggle with that but like most it's it's close enough to the Australian accent where even if some of the specific like terminology might be different I can follow along with it right um I have had I don't get it myself because like I can very clearly hear the difference, but I have had plenty of people think, Oh, are you British? No, no, I'm not British. The one I do, I understand a lot more is South African. The South African accent is actually fairly similar to the Australian. Well, there's some distinct differences, but especially if you're ESL, I can see how you would make that comparison. Yeah, like, absolutely. Actually, now I think about it. It's kind of you have to know what

you're listening for, certainly. And if you're ESL or American, you might have a lot of trouble pretty much making that connection. And that's a fascinating point. I guess I've never put the Australian accent next to the South African one in my head before. But yeah, as you say, it's kind of like a pure form of English. And they, I guess, must have not taken too far of a path off when they diverged from the mother tongue. Scottish. Well, we still obviously have a lot of British influences, right? So it's still that core baseline, but it's a lot of sort of melding of other things into it. There are researchers in the Antarctic, and they end up developing their own,

because they're isolated between a group of like six people maybe. They're isolated for like six months and they come back with dialect. And linguists, linguists frothing at them. They love this. This is great for them because it shows how quickly you can almost immediately diverge with just a hand if you reduce the amount of people. Partly it's because I think, and I'm not a linguist, that's not my field, so I might be wrong, but I think it's partly because you have less external correction on the factors. It's very easy for noise to be amplified quickly if you have a group of people who are cooperative with each other. And if someone says something funny, they might just instead of going a you're saying that done

It's less chance. You're gonna have someone do that sort of social correction. Hmm, and it will just get picked up So the smaller you have it and more isolated the quicker you end up moving on from your dialect Well, yeah The intention is you're there to get work done you and you need to be able to understand each other so if you adjust the way you're speaking to get work done and you need to be able to understand each other. So if you adjust the way you're speaking for someone who may not particularly understand what you're saying, I can definitely see how that quickly happens. I would assume the same thing may happen on the ISS as well. I don't know if anyone's done research on that. I think the ISS, they are constantly in communication.

That might be the only reason why it doesn't happen as much. Because you are far more isolated in some places on Earth than you actually are on Earth. You are in constant communication with ground controllers. Because they've got to monitor that thing. It's a complicated little boat that you're in, you know? And yeah, down in the Arctic, though, and on boats, actually, in general, if you get out to sea, you'll see, I'd imagine, similar things. Like, there's the stereotypical pirate base, that'll have come from something, that kind of thing. And what it will

probably come from is sailors coming home during the height of, like, British sailing, during the height of British sailing and Britannia ruling the waves and such. It'll be derived from that because there'll be different dialects and over the years we'll have smashed it into the Pirates of the Caribbean voice that we have now, which is the most meamy version of it. We've collected all of the most patchy features of it. You know, we've collected all of like the most actually features of everything. But you know, boats, research stations, probably space stations one day, if we have more if we had more than one of them, so that we didn't have like constantly a team of like 100 people on the ground staffing and talking to them and sending messages all day. I would imagine when we start doing like long voyages and when, you know, there's the goal of colonizing Mars, I would assume that would very quickly diverge into its own dialect.

And imagine there's gonna be no like, like here between all the different English languages, we're all online, we will get, when we're not not online we get television from other countries there is a correction that keeps us all generally probably within range of each other you get one those generation starships and people aren't being put to sleep on it but they are actually like living five six generations of people out with no corrective external factor you're going to be unable to talk to the most part you know it's going to be like to talk to the voice part. It's going to be like, there are variants of English called Pigeon language. And it's going to basically be one of those, I think, especially if it's like, you know, a multicultural thing to begin with.

We might not even settle on it. That's very English-centric for me to even think that. We will settle on some language and it will probably end up being a pigeon of several languages that will be unrecognizable after 300 years of total isolation, even with like a crew size of maybe a thousand people. The corrective factor is just not going to be. One thing I will say about the corrective factor is it can still be a serious problem. There's a problem with American children developing Australian accents because they're watching

a lot of Bluey, which is very amusing to me. I'll be honest, I was starting to pick up some inflections when I watched a little bit of Bluey on YouTube. I'm very bad for just matching the way people speak. It's more than just the kids, unfortunately. It's also the big kids. There was the same thing with Peppa Pig and kids speaking in very good British English, mummy.

Yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, indeed. Indeed, mummy. I'm going to go jump in a puddle now. Where am I willing to boots? And that was a thing that was coming up for a bit. That's what I thought you were going to say. But Bluey is a much more recent.

Yeah, very recent example. Just because of how big Bluey is, right? Like it's. Well, it's the there's a really good video essay on the creation of Bluey. The guy who owns it, he just kind of made it as a way to talk about his experience raising kids. And he never expected it to become this massive thing and then I think BBC, Disney and a bunch of other were trying to like fight him to like just get exclusive rights for it. He was like, I don't care. Like I'm, it's my, I, because they wanted him to, you know, keep doing it forever and it, and like his kids are

now getting older and it's like he doesn't really have those same experiences anymore. So he doesn't really have anything to write about. He's like, what if I just stopped it? And he still has exclusive like they have distribution rights, but he still has exclusive ownership over it. What a legend. He didn't he didn't buckle to pressure.

I respect that big time. Yeah. Yeah. You see this a lot and shows didn't buckle to pressure. I respect that big time. Yeah. Yeah, you see this a lot and shows lose their identity over time. God knows the Simpsons hasn't been the Simpsons since the kids who grew up watching The Simpsons started writing The Simpsons and having their own flavour on it. SpongeBob's another great example where if you look at like modern seasons, if you didn't know it took place underwater, you would have no idea. I'm not, I'm not up on my SpongeBob, but yeah, I totally believe see how you get there.

There's, there's like really, really good videos on it where they've, they've changed the art style over the years and they've sort of lost that. They've lost that like, I guess, kind of slight dreariness of being under the sea. a kind of slight dreariness of being under the sea. And it's now like, you know, it's very like bright and poppy and like, it's more aligned with the way that a lot of modern cartoons are done, but it loses a core part of its identity. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that is kind of inevitable, but like, it's kind of been trapped because when they started doing Spongebob, it was cell animated. You know, they were painting on clear plastic cells and doing it. And there's like this whole transition

period where we have sort of moved on to digital animation and puppeteering and the like. And that won't happen again. Like, I don't, I can't imagine, I don't have foresight at least to predict the next form of art that overtakes digital puppeteering. So you won't see this like translate translation over from like what you can get from paint pigments and then the colors that you can image from them probably contribute to sort of these drearier tones that you see in older cartoons versus the pure RGB digital tones you get now. I think we're always going to sort of be there for that. We might go HD about it. I just don't foresee it. And it's a fascinating thing to see the end of like reaching the end game of the technology in a way, or like an approximate game like we're at like the end of like reaching the end game of the technology in a way or

like an approximate game like we're at like the 80% mark in the last 20 can take forever. We had this with we had this with film photography and digital photography where film was actually kind of peak and we were kind of good but it was expensive and we couldn't make it any cheap and we never really did make it. Um, so what we, what do we do? We make worse cameras for a while. We just accept, we take the hit objectively, worse cameras. And the only things that we even be close to film will be the cost of a house at the time, and then we'll work our way back up from there again, until we have

this technology that's cheap, uh, and. I quality and and is roughly back where we are. And we'll never really be back to that same thing. It's a fascinating step that we've seen sort of over the previous century. And now that we're sort of in the 20s, we are cutting off any other of these old pieces of like, or functional way we know we're not moving from film to digital. We're not going to be from digital to something else. Tell animation to digital animation.

Everything is digital. I guess it is digital. Um, yeah. And I had a point that has dropped out of my head. Ah, yeah. Uh, gosh, how about that? What I do think is really cool is when I see people who they still see the artistic merit in using older tech. I was watching a video on the creation of the Gachi Akita manga the other day.

And the mangaka, most of her work is done in digital because that's just the way the manga is done nowadays. But when she wants to show, like, I guess, a really extreme emotion, really extreme scenes and like extreme detail, she will swap back to doing those panels on paper and then scan them in and put them all together. That's so cool. Yeah, yeah. It's great to see that. Because she has a very brush stroke style and you know, brushes have gotten a lot better in digital art, but there's something about like the sort of randomness of an actual brush that can't really be replicated.

Yeah, the digital world is very clean. It's very pristine. And sometimes when you want to express something that needs to be, you know, kind of nasty, kind of messy, kind of rough, you need to go back to these old formats. Like you'll see it in film, like people will shoot in film for artistic reasons and it's more expensive, but you know what, it delivers an impact. I'm for, um, just a brilliant way. It's converted from the way you do things to a way you do things in special circumstances for artistic value.

You know, I guess I hadn't really thought about it that way, but I guess that kind of does make sense for the resurgence of vinyl as well. Like we have, like my local like big tech store chain, they've got like a quarter of the store now that's just selling records. And that's... That was not a thing like a couple of years ago. That area has grown so much. Absolutely. I'm something of a hi-fi nerd myself. I've got myself a little 90s stack that I put together from eBay deals, you know, I too was there when COVID happened and everyone got really bored. And yeah, you have you do see this coming back up now. And I think part of it is the quality is sometimes better, admittedly, depending on the pressing and

there's a lot of mystique in the audiophile community in general around, like, you can really hear the tone, that it's different. And I don't buy that. I've seen the study where, you might have heard this one, they basically took some people who claim to be audiophiles. And this is very much so something that they do to whine at, but sometimes, but they did it for music. And they had, they were trying to compare cables, but they did it for music and they had

They were trying to compare cable and they had like these two expensive cables in theory And they wanted it compared what they did is they said it's this 10 grand cable this 10 grand cable Whatever it was but one of cables was actually Hope hanger of wire coat hanger that they unbent and just jammed into the back of the system and they'd hidden it under the guise of we want to be able to have a true assessment of quality and they voted for the coat hanger a lot about half the time Mm-hmm So I'm not being in that you know My headphones are held together with 3d printed parts and tape and zip ties And I think that's good enough because audio equipment doesn't degrade

Really as long as you've got sort of hit a baseline Humania can only hear so much you can only taste so much of a difference between wine sensing has a limit. Um And yeah, sometimes you'll get a better record pressing as a result of that Um, just because the bits you get digitally are kind of garbage But if I doesn't really hit the kind of bit rate you would in theory be pressing into your record. But I think what's more appealing to people in general is that you own it physically. And with CDs kind of been laughed out the room for a while, even though CDs are a perfect recreation of audio mathematically, and there is no real loss to them. I said

that they'll come from my head. It's very much a middle finger to the you will own nothing unlike streaming platforms in general that we see today. I think that really is the appeal of it because people don't have great record players. They have the little suitcase one that everyone gets, scratches your records up. They own that record. And they can go to band camp and download the flax probably too, if it's small enough band to do that for them. And I think that's the real appeal here is,

A, you're actively listening to it. You're putting in the effort. You're not playing Roblox while you're listening to music in the background or whatever it is that normal people do with their computers. I mean, yeah, there's like a it's like a process, right? Like you you take the record out, you put it on the thing, you put the arm thing down and like it's it's not just, you know, you can just like you can go through a bunch of songs on Spotify, a bunch of different artists. But like listening to a record is it's like a thing that you've actively chosen to do.

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. It's exactly that. One thing that people always forget as well is you always have to get up in the middle to go flip the record over, stuff like that. There is no way that you can really eat listening to record. Um, I'm sure some people will say, I listen to records all the time, the time But you know that sounds laborious when you have to you know Get up from what you're doing every few minutes

So it is as you say a process and someone gonna say well You could buy yourself this are this expensive automatic jukebox that will store your records in there You can swap between the guess you can you you can you can yes, you can do that Here's the thing, right? One of those expensive jukeboxes still can't hold nearly as many songs as your Spotify library, and you still have to do so. I have what I would consider to be the peak of consumer record players. It's something like the Technics SL7. You don't lift the arm arm you don't have to do any of that it has a laser on it so it can tell where the tracks are and you can see oh this has seven tracks and i only want to listen to one three and four it's fancy it's quartz timed it's geared it is the peak of audio equipment

you know i still have to get up to flip the bloody record so it's it's it doesn't fix the problem it just means you're not going to drop a needle on your record and scratch the first few seconds of you're not going to scratch the first few seconds of the Guitar solo to freebird or whatever it is that you're listening to and mess that up It's it's a process and it kind of makes it more of a hobby in that way to you know Go to a place to physically get it. You might meet people There's a social connection there You might meet people who like the same terrible music that you do, that sort of thing, you know, and you can bond over that and then you go back and you

listen to music actively. It's got a lot of appealing factors that come in that we were sort of starting to lose for a bit. When people realized they didn't have to spend their entire pocket money on their allowance on buying a record once a month, you could just go to Kazaa, our limewire I suppose, if you're a hip young zoomer, and download anything for free there. And ruin the family computer in the process. Yeah I did that a few times. Yeah.

Yeah. I never quite got Kazaa off of the family PC in the end before we ended up just shredding the hard drive. We probably should be ending this off at some point. We're past, it's two hours and 20 minutes now. Oh really? Yeah, I kind of lost track of time. This was like really fun. I had some things written down. We talked about some of them, but we kind of just like went down some random tangent, most of it.

And honestly, these are the best ones. The ones where it actually is just like a free flowing conversation. I do really enjoy these ones. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The app ones. Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. It's been great fun. It's been brilliant. I was coming in because I also had the things in case, you know, I was worried I'd get to my like fourth awkward silence. I'd be like, I'm out of things to fill them with. No, I didn't even have to touch it. That's been great chatting.

Yeah, thank you. No, it's been a lot of fun talking to you as well. This was, um, I didn't know where we were going to go with this, but, uh, I think it was a really good episode. And as a, yeah, if you, if you want to come back on and do another one of this at some point, I would be more than happy to do so. Um, yeah. Oh yeah, that'd be really cool. That'd be really cool. I love yappin'. So let people know where they can find you, where they can find everything, all your stuff. Yeah, absolutely. So you can find me on Twitch, twitch.tv slash lace spades.

It's spelled- I'm not following you. I'm following you now. It's spelled. I'm not I'm not following It's fine most of the internet isn't So twitch.tv slash lace spades and then I couldn't get lace spades on Twitter So it's with its Twitter calm and I will die on this hill slash spades lace mmm We can read my eyes already on Linux on various things because Brody Robertson apparently is a name other people have.

Oh yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's always a problem. I look, I, I'm gonna, I'll keep the tangent short. I know there is an amateur golfer that has the same name as me, which is annoying. Ooh, that's, that's always tricky. My name wasn't one that was, has anyone famous on it, which is good without doxing myself. But I resent child me for always like having a doctor who obsession and having a bunch of doctor who usernames instead of in the peak of internet username here is getting my damn name on the websites. I could have had my first name as a username. That's that's that would have been sweet but no no no I had to I had

to have Doctor Who references or MLP references or whatever it was I was into at the time. Oh man yeah lace spades lace it'll be one of them. Awesome awesome um what do you have coming up that people might uh might want to see? Ooh, so we're going to be doing... We took a little break from car streams, as I say. I'm doing some really boring stuff that's not going to film well at the minute, but we're going to be putting a sick ECU in there so that we can do some big pop and bangs and stuff. Hopefully we can get that going on stream.

Just do a little wiring so there'll be a bit of a casual yap and wire for that going on. You can throw some stuff at the car. I generally will do more game dev streams. In general, I'm working on that drag racing game. You can watch me struggle at high school level math for a few hours if that takes your fancy. I'm a great salesperson. And I do Blender and games, and I play games with people on Twitch most of the time. Cast-off is what I'm really excited about.

It's partly, it's quite a good laugh. We have a little drinky poo. We have a good time. We break our knuckles on things. It's great fun. Awesome. Nothing else you want to mention? No, no, that's about it, really.

I stream and I tweet. Awesome. My main channel is Brody Robertson. I do Linux videos six-ish days a week. Sometimes I stream there, sometimes I don't. I probably should stream on that channel more often. I've got the gaming channel Brody on Games. Right now. I'll probably still be playing Kazan. Yeah, this is about my next way. Should still be playing Kazan.

And I will have started playing split fiction with Ren. So check that out if you wanna see co-op nonsense. And people making jokes about Ren being my husband in chat because people like to do that. Anyway, if you're watching the video version of this, you can find the audio version on podcast platforms. It's on Spotify and other things. There's an RSS feed. Spotify has video, which is cool. I don't know who watches video on Spotify, but it's there. If you want to find the video version of this, it's on YouTube at Tech over T.

How do you want to sign us off? What do you want to say? Oh, sign off some worse bit. I never tell anyone they're doing this. It's great. You know what? Live long and remember that don't let the AI get you down. It's not real.