TBPN Live - 2025 Predictions, Clocking Zuck's Wrist, Bullish on the Everything, LA Fires

Episode Date: January 8, 2025

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Welcome to Technology Brothers, the most profitable podcast in the world. Today we are breaking down a bunch of hot takes and predictions for 2025, getting you ready for this year. It's a new year. We had to cover Vale yesterday, but today we're looking forward to the future. And we're starting with a great post from a friend of the show, Molly O'Shea. She says, top 25 plus hot takes. There are in fact 33 hot takes for 2025. And this was fun. We participated in this. She asked us for a hot take, and we gave one.

And she posted the full takes, and then she boiled them down. We should start with ours. It's hilarious because ours got boiled down. She clearly ran these through ChatGPT to give summaries, and you lose a lot of our humor. Yeah, yeah. But what was ours? What matters is ultimately that we're correct and vindicated.

Yes. So what was ours again? Ours was 31, the equestrian market will boom as exited tech founders and nepo journalists buy horses. Yeah, that's accurate. And yeah, it's not, the only thing I would say here,

it got condensed. It's not just nepo journalists. There's people like Kara Swisher who make $100,000 an episode. She's also... Yes, yes. But I'm just saying she can buy her own horses, right?

Now, now. Yeah, yeah. She doesn't have to go to the transplant. She could buy, you know, a pretty world-class stallion almost every episode. Yeah, there's kind of two dynamics going on in like the liquidity markets right now.

It's like the IPO window's open. So there's going to be more liquidity for early stage founders and employees and entrepreneurs who have been working really hard, creating a lot of value, building real- And the M&A market broadly coming back.

And then secondarily, as another factor, a lot of trust funds are unlocking now for the journalists. And so there's just going to be a flood of cash coming in. And obviously that's going to drive equestrianism. And we'll be participating as well.

Yep. Yeah, exactly. So let's go through these. Number one, Don't Die will become the blueprint for Maha. Okay. So one thing that's interesting too is these predictions were made by individuals, not just Molly. But we don't actually have the context on who did it.

So that allows us to be pretty unconflicted and ruthless. So anyways, Don't Die will become the blueprint for Maha. I'm going to say a hard no on this. I think Don't Die gets a bunch of stuff right, but Maha is so much more about getting the basics right. Like let's clean up our water supply. Let's, you know know fix school lunches you know these sort of basic things where don't die is this sort of hyper optimization you know

get your biomarkers checked monthly type thing and it's kind of like overkill for the average the average the average person should exercise daily eat whole foods yeah get some good sleep you can kind of think about it like don't die is like bench pressing two plates. Maha is more about benching three plates. Yep. And it even goes further with like Brian Johnson is a vegetarian, doesn't eat meat. Maha obviously consuming a ton of meat,

bread meat almost every day, multiple steaks per day. And so there is a decent amount of alignment there. They're both like directionally in the same direction, but, uh, uh, you know, that's by the way, it's like 10, 10% of guys consume like 80% of the meat in the United States. Of course. And, uh, we know that our listeners are firmly in the, in the, in the 10%. Yeah. I've been on this for, for weeks tweeting about how if you get a wedding invitation you and they ask for you know

chicken or fish you should be able to say double meat double steak you should be able to say double steak yeah i want double steak that was my that was my that was for for a period of my life i would live on two yeah uh i would get going to chipotle, get two bowls, double rice, double beans, double meat every time. And that was like that was at least one meal for the day. Yeah, fantastic. Yeah, everyone has every bro has that story. It's great. I think Sweetgreen could really win over, you know, the our listeners.

They took away all the salad stuff. By making the regular meat like amount, like the the double for a kava or whatever. So if you go into Sweet Green and you get double meat, you're actually getting quadruple. Yeah. There needs to be an arms race in the meat category of all these fast casual slop bowl places. Just like all the AI firms are benchmarking, oh, who's doing best on MMLU? I want to know, okay, which fast casual restaurant is the most protein per dollar. Yeah. I'm pushing it extreme. I want

the base case to be a hundred grams. I'm trying to do a pound per, uh, one gram per pound of body weight. Honestly, but why stop there? Why not go to three pounds per, you know how you were joking? Oh yeah. One and a half, one and a half grams of protein per pound of body weight yeah for me that's 400 grams of protein a day and i was like damn to do that i would need to drink a gallon of milk a day go mad right you should you know how much protein is a gallon of milk i actually don't 120 grams solid solid three gallons of milk be It'd be great. We got to rip through these. I will do what I have to do. We got a lot of predictions.

AI will gain rights, religions, and even sue humans. For 2025, though, that's a little soon. I don't know. Yeah, rights take a while. But I said this yesterday. I think that AGI will be achieved when AI agents are striking and forming labor unions. There's been a little bit of that. Park City style.

Where people have been like, they behave lazily on certain days. And people think it's because it's been baked into the LLM memory that Friday is a chill day. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so it acts like an employee on Friday. And you have to say, work like it's a Monday. Work like it's a Monday, yeah. there will be a twitter files for government that's interesting i think torenberg said that i've never been happy with the declassifications that have gone on there's been so many times where it's like oh this person's gonna blow it wide open even the twitter files i didn't think

were that crazy yeah it was like oh really like they they blocked some accounts like we knew that when it happened i don't know the new the new x files is they were um you just can't post about the the guy adrian dipman or whatever yeah oh yeah post the article it just says like error yeah isn't that because it doxes him and he's a non and so elon's been against doxing. And so I think that that's actually kind of consistent. Sure, but like the information's already out there. Yeah, it is culturally important.

Corporations will pay for emotional harvesting to train AI. I don't get it. Luigi Mangione and Sam Bankman-Fried will launch a blockchain healthcare protocol from prison. Silly. Silly. Pass. I don't think that they're aligned in any way. And it's just a wildly different...

Like, SBF still maintains that, like, he, like, you know, fucked up on accounting and Luigi, like, murdered someone. Like, I don't think they're as aligned as people think. Yeah. Privacy will become a luxury with offline life becoming a status symbol. Wrong. Obviously, you want to be extremely aligned. yeah i mean the second the second part is true but that's also been true forever

but the classic thing if you're making if you're a vc making predictions just say what was true for the last year sure and you sound like also it sounds like people who just are bad posters are like, actually, privacy is a luxury. Yeah. I don't want a thousand likes on my banger. Yeah. I prefer having a locked account with five likes. Kerry No Interest, our friend, he had a banger about wearing a nice jacket, got over a thousand likes, and then he deleted it for some reason.

Oh, he did? He made some posts about, oh, I never wanted to have an account. It's like you can't handle the heat. Stay out of the kitchen. You're a menswear account. Sit down. Stop posting about buying out companies and buying rare minds. Start posting about acquiring rare jackets.

Exactly. There's a huge market for the conservative menswear guy because the the current menswear guy derrick is like he only targets republicans and he's just clearly very left-wing he's like more of a political project than like actually yeah yeah it's a political project larping is but no one's done it on the other side yeah like here's bill clinton and it doesn't match i feel like people make fun of like fetterman or whatever for wearing his basketball shorts a little bit but there's no one who's like that's their shtick yeah right uh opportunity seven fertility rates will drop globally prompting governments to fund reproduction startups so uh at the rate that we're having children I think we're going to be able to keep uh rates I don't buy the government's funding

reproduction startups drop the startups There are other ways for governments to fund reproduction. And it's just like increased child tax. Cool incentives. It's just the child tax credit. The tax credit's crazy. You don't want the government funding startups. We learned this from Solyndra.

They fuck it up. I don't remember what the actual tax credit is that you get for hiring staff to help raise your kids. But it's something like we spend 15 times that credit amount on child care every year like just bringing up that makes a lot of sense yeah and would be a you know it would be cool if there was like a maha style movement for for pronatalism fertility in america like what laws would be changed there's a big one about uh car seats you know this because the car seats are so bulky now and they're so big and they're required like

super late like you can have like a seven-year-old who's like 100 pounds and you're like still in the car seat yeah and you can't like uh so it requires families have bigger cars station wagon anymore so you can't even get a station wagon so they don't make them anymore so you have to buy the three-row suv that's obviously more expensive every suv is like 10k more than a car and so uh yeah and you talk to any parent it's like yeah like we wore seat belts but we sat in the back seat and there were four of us and we just like you know buckled up and it was fine um ai agents will disrupt traditional search and internet business models applying real pressure to google's dominance interesting this is funny funny because i don't know who made this prediction,

but we're going to talk about this later. Fred over at USV says, Apple and Google will leverage their existing market power to surpass OpenAI, ChatGPT, and Consumer AI prompts by the end of 2025. It's a classic strategy. I feel like the real risk here is that Apple just builds in basically. I think it's Apple.

I think Google is the one. No, I know. But eventually Apple will say, hey, this $20 billion a year from Google is nice, but we could just create a better. I disagree with that. You think they're just going to keep it going? I disagree with that because that $20 billion is 100% margin. They don't have to do anything. Yeah, yeah.

And they know that anytime they need to manage a new business line, there's risk and it could go wrong and stuff. And Google is just the best. And so, uh, AirPods, which are like the biggest hit ever, but this is the classic, like is AI a disruptive technology or sustaining technology, sustaining innovation, disruptive innovation. Um, and yeah, I mean, uh, there's a poly market now for who will have the best model by the end of Q1 or Q2 or something. And Google is actually in the lead, which is interesting. They certainly have the scale and the data. And so it'll be interesting to track that.

Starlink will become the dominant internet and cellular provider, a critical layer for AI data stacks. Interesting. I don't know about dominant internet or cellular provider. That's like, that's super fast. I'd love to hear why

this is directly relevant to AI data stacks. I don't understand that part either. But sounds cool. Yeah. I mean, super pro Starlink. I do think that every founder,

CEO should buy a Starlink and have it because you cannot afford to not have good internet whenever you're traveling. Like, you're going to be in some weird place.

The internet's not going to be good. You're going to miss calls. And the cost is so low that you can't afford not to have good internet whenever you're traveling like you're gonna be in some weird place the internet's not gonna be good you're gonna miss calls yeah the cost is so low that you can't afford not to have it and you can expense it um the s&p 500 will end below 6 000 down or flat on the year huh bearish i completely disagree i think things are gonna rip but we'll see cool uh the rise of ai slop will put a premium on handcrafted content much like this filmed in a beautiful possibly restoring trust in in mainstream media i actually said i think that's an interesting point so the rise of ai slop will put a premium on artisanal content possibly restoring trust in mainstream media and it's funny because mainstream media despite everything that they've done still is the most trustworthy place to get news.

If you just go for like the facts, like the fact checking at the New Yorker or the Wall Street Journal. It wasn't until we launched the Truth Zone that we became the most trusted news source. And I also think it was very important that we launched this podcast when we did. Because like people joke, oh, it's AI generator or whatever, but clearly we're not actually generating three hours of above Sora level video per day. Just the cost, even if Sora was good enough, which it's not, there would be- It would destroy our profitability.

It would be so expensive and it'd be impossible. And so anyone who knows the technology knows that this podcast is real. And so this is the last moment where where we can prove that this is real and then we can carry that forward forever yeah so even if any other thing is and the other thing is you will know that we we didn't do it and then we stayed forward as long as you trust us that we didn't swap ourselves out in the future well the reason that people can trust us is that we love podcasting so much. We love podcasters high.

It's a high that cannot be experienced in any other way. And so even when the models get good enough to just fully generate the content, we would be not doing our favorite thing in the world, which is podcasting. So it will never happen. Let's go to 12. AGI is a marketing scam. It's overhyped and far from realization we talked about this earlier yeah uh sam altman runs a company with built

not billions but hundreds of millions of daus yeah and so he's basically has credit now every once a month to come out and say you know in some new dramatic way agi is right around the basically figured it out so we know how to do it now. So I think it's cool. I mean, it all goes back to the definition. Like when I use, when I use ChatGPT for the first time, I was like, this is AGI. Yeah. Like it's artificial for sure.

It's very general. You can ask it about anything. And it's definitely intelligent. Now, is it the smartest thing in the whole, smarter than every human? And can you make it, make mistakes? Yeah, of course. But like, it passes the bar for me for just like being artificial general and intelligent show

show chad gpt to somebody in the 90s yeah and they they would and so clearly i i think we need to move from like there's the agi stuff which i think we've achieved and then there's asi the super intelligence where it's smarter than everyone it's reinforcing itself there's no employees at open ag it's just building its own system or whatever but then there's ASI, the super intelligence, where it's smarter than everyone. It's reinforcing itself. There's no employees at OpenAI because it's just building its own system or whatever. But then there's this massive gap in the middle. I was kind of trying to come up with a phrase for it, but I liked AEI, like artificial economic intelligence, and trying to measure it just in terms of profit, essentially. And say, right now, OpenAI 01, a ChatGPT Pro subscription, Sam said they're losing money on it because people are using it so much.

But there should be an evaluation where you go and the prompt is just make money and it goes and finds a job. Maybe that's just on Upwork doing little tiny tasks, but it goes and does that and just makes money. And then what is the total value and at some point the value of like these ai systems directly producing cash flow will be higher than humans yeah what's happened to the the market caps of of fiverr and upwork and these these i mean i

think that those will still be valuable because they're they're aggregation platforms around like the type of task they they are independent of who's doing the task. No, I just mean more, that's true to some degree, but I'm just saying so much of the work being done on those platforms is very low hanging fruit for models. True, true. The question is just like, how does the model go and find the job?

But it's interesting, Fiverr's still up 30% over the past. Yeah, so I mean, yeah, I like tracking things more quantitatively than these like qualitative, oh, we move the goalposts every six months for what AGI is. It's like, the Turing test was great because it was binary and it was very clear that we jumped past that. And's like, I, yeah, I think the Turing test was great because it was binary

and it was very clear that we jumped past that. And then, we need to change, swap the benchmarks to the models getting money. Yeah, yeah,

yeah, exactly. It's like how much, yeah. How much money are they making? What's your hustle? Exactly. And are they making,

are they making 1% as much as humans in terms of total global GDP? Are they making 50%? At a certain point, there's going to be like, okay, they're doing everything, but there aren't humanoids yet,

so they aren't doing the farming and the plumbing or whatever, but they're doing a lot of the white collar work. And then there'll be a question about, also just literally just tracking how big the models are and how much energy is being expended on AI. That's a much more valuable thing to track because everyone's saying,

if we scale up another two orders of magnitude, it's A it's asi whatever but the question is just like how are we tracking against that because if we go through like a moore's law flatline for a couple years like we're going to feel that one way or another yeah and so i think i think one thing's clear clearly intelligence is a spectrum yeah we're already on that yep we're already on it and yet it's still beneficial for people that are having to raise billions of dollars to constantly say, we're on the precipice of this great moment. You need to get in before AGI is achieved. So I wouldn't call it a marketing scam, but it's certainly a buzzword.

Yeah. In the sense that the cloud was a buzzword, but it wasn't a scam. What's the next one? Climate startups will rebrand as energy independence to appeal to conservatives. Yeah, that makes sense. If you're doing solar or wind or nuclear, like Isaiah Taylor's going down to Mar-a-Lago

in a few days to do a conference on nuclear and a lot of the nuclear companies that, I know a lot of these founders, they don't care about politics at all, really. That's just about, and energy itself doesn't really care about politics either no of course not when there's subsidies involved yeah but in general energy is energy yeah we need a lot of it yeah we should make more of it yeah and uh i don't think it should be yeah i talked to a guy who is uh consulting for like the oil and gas if you take your climate tech company rebrand around energy independence you might be able to get some cash from Donald Trump Jr.

There you go. 1789 Capital. He's big into the anti. Let's go 14. AI wearables will flop, but meta will dominate AI hardware. Those seem at odds. What is an AI wearable if not a headset? If not AI hardware. Yeah, I think Lindyman said something recently where he was like,

we need to get the phone built into glasses because the aesthetics of a bunch of people at a cafe sitting around with your neck cranked over just using your device are terrible. So I think AI wearables will flop and i also i just i think it's i think it's too early to say that i think you have smart people like avi who are who have so much i was thinking vr wearables yeah yeah okay ai wearables like this is like friend.com the humane well a lot of them are have already kind of flopped yeah yeah uh there was that there's the humane pin that was really rough and then what was that other one that was a little...

Rabbit. Rabbit. Rabbit. That one seemed cool for kids. So Humane also pivoted. I don't know if you saw this. They basically are making this OS for your devices now

and that seems... I really thought Rabbit should just focus on a cool device for kids that gets them off the screen. Go take a picture of a flower, tells you what the flower is. Or it's basically redesigned it as a radio for parents and their kids exactly like we've talked about the yodo how that's a really cool device like there's a bunch of things

that you can do there yeah i always felt that they a lot of the wearable companies would have done better going for the kids market because kids don't have phones already parents want them off devices so if you give them an audio native device yeah it makes sense and so meta will dominate ai hardware the ray-bans are decent it is cool to be able to wear the glasses and listen to a podcast and then immediately say hey meta you know uh what what year was this building made that i'm looking at like that is cool i like having an llm just that I can talk to whenever. That's nice. But Apple still has like

so many moats there with the AirPods and the watch and the phone. Like I think that they're, I don't know, dominate is the right word. Let's move on to 15.

The taste renaissance will replace content creation with artists. I like that. We think of ourselves as artists. We think of ourselves as creators. Capitalists.

Capitalists first. Artists. A good artist is, the best artists are highly commercial. So, ourselves as artists we think of ourselves as capitalists capitalists and capitalist first artists a good artist is the best artists are highly commercial so yes andy warhol said that but i do so i think like i would just take this in a different direction where i think that it's going to become increasingly hard to compete as part-time content creators yeah when there's any when there's billions of machines creating AI slop constantly. Yeah, you look at David Senra. He just focuses on his podcast 24-7

and it's impossible to compete with him. Independent media will overtake mainstream media, number 16. That's the flip side of the other, restoring trust in MSM. I agree. I just feel like there's still so much value in the stamps of CNBC said this is true. CNN said this is true. There's always going to be. I guess the question is like, if you're adding up the market cap of News Corp, New York Times, CNN,

all these different, everyone that owns Wall Street Journal and all that, you add up all those market caps and then you add up how much cashflow is Rogan making, Huberman, and you apply some sort of EBITDA multiple to that. Yeah, independent media is probably still smaller and it's probably not gonna overtake it in 2025. That's an interesting-

But do we include Spotify? Do we include YouTube? Because YouTube is definitely bigger than the mainstream media if you include that in the market cap. I do think independent media will eclipse mainstream media eventually from a revenue standpoint.

I think it already has if you include YouTube. Yeah, yeah. And Spotify. Yeah. But then the question is, what, you know, like. But the only thing, this to me is kind of a bullshit prediction because it's calling out a bunch of things

that have been happening for decades plus. Yep, yep, yep. So not the most interesting. Number 17, empire building will be valued over get-rich-quick schemes. A little bit of a shift in the trend there. A big question about the Zoomers. But I feel like every, it's always been cool to build empires.

Get rich quick schemes have always been appealing. It's also very cool to get rich quick. Yeah, yeah. Isn't that what you did? Yeah, yeah. I did get rich quick. Yeah. But.

I mean, you would describe your business as a scheme in some ways. Every business is a scheme. I think so. Yeah. It's a conspiracy theory. Every business is a conspiracy. It's just a small group of people trying to get money together. Now the AIs are trying to figure out how to get money.

Exactly. But humans have an edge there for now. For the next year, humans have an edge on getting money. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, if you could become a millionaire before 40, I think you got rich pretty quick. So you just don't want to get rich slowly. That's not the way to do it.

Yeah, do not. Do not. 18, AI-related litigation and fraud will accelerate. Yeah, we've talked about this. A little bit of interesting game theoretic dynamic where it's like, oh, it's going to be so easy to sue people with AI. There's going to be a million losses. It's like, well, it's also going to be so easy to sue people with AI there's going to be a million losses it's like well it's also going to be very easy to defend yourself with AI

and so the AIs will battle it out and maybe it'll net out and there's just like the courts are going to get even more and more and more backed up like they're already there's already year long delays and cycles. I mean the adoption level of some of the tech is insane I mean they still don't use

cameras they use a person that yeah the bull case for ai in the legal industry is it's so good at text yeah and the legal industry is just completely dependent on documents and text sure and so that adoption could be faster it's been 100 years since we invented the camera and they're still doing courtroom sketch artists and and then they also have stenographers that write everything down instead of just recording it and transcribing it yeah it's crazy uh yeah rough um a lot of this stuff is just so entrenched in like a bunch of like laws and stuff and then there's jobs and politicians and people don't want to change it's just rough

number 19 state governments will increase sales tax audits to address deficits what a wonky prediction just like i i wish we knew who did this i mean it's probably true just because that's true in general with governments are trying to you know constantly squeeze i don't know i mean i i don't know how big sales tax is in some kind in some states but i know that like if everyone says like, oh, go to Florida, no income tax, but Alaska actually has the lowest state tax burden of any state because they have, they might even have an income tax.

It's very, very low, but then they also have really low fees and really low sales taxes and stuff. So something like Florida or Texas might have no income tax, but they might have higher business taxes or higher licenses, or they might make money in different ways. Cause you can't run a state with no money.

Like it doesn't make sense. Number 20 tech consolidation will accelerate with bundling cycles dominating. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I feel, I feel like the, the unbundled, like it's, you can't say that tech is just bundling or tech is just unbundling because it's such a ridiculously massive industry at this point.

It's arguably not even one standalone industry. It's hundreds of industries combined. So I don't know i i think that we're going to get into this later but um goko rajaram talks about how really there's going to be this battle between new agentic b2b software and traditional sass and these sort of like dashboard model yeah and how much of a dance can they do like yeah even salesforce is changing their business model to like performance outcomes instead of seat licensing. Yeah.

And so if a company as big and old as Salesforce is leading that charge and like, hey, it's okay to change your business model. Yeah. I could see a lot of like the mid-tier SaaS companies that are charging seats say, hey, yeah, we should do this switch. Like if Salesforce could do it, we could definitely figure it out. 21. And video will peak. I don't like this. I don't like when people are bearish i mean look at it also get a real hobby look at the breakdown in in uh by dylan patel and semi-analysis of amd yeah i mean it was like a

fucking nuclear bomb going off on that company it was so rough just like yeah their culture is broken they can't do anything george hotz has been talking about this for a long time like like you literally cannot train a model on their chips because it's so buggy and their software is so bad. And it's like on a performance base, AMD is in some ways better than Nvidia just on like cost per flop. But like you just cannot actually run the training.

And so it's like, who's their competition? Who's gonna do it? And yeah, there's a couple startups that are doing custom chips and stuff, and there's TPUs, but everyone just needs NVIDIA, so they're just going to keep buying it for a long time. I don't know.

My shoeshine boy has not told me to buy NVIDIA yet, so that's the top signal usually, or the taxi driver. What's that phrase from the Great Depression? I think it was shoesushan Boy or something. Yeah, yeah. It was like when your butler's giving you the stock tip, then you know it's down.

Yeah, yeah. Sell everything. The IPO market will see 12 plus high quality debuts. Let's go. We'd love to see the window open. Yeah. Brain health will be prioritized with the creation of aura for the brain.

Yeah, there are some pretty cool people working on brain stuff. Obviously, Neuralink's like the big one, but that's more for a paraplegic. What's that dreaming, the dreaming, lucid dreaming one? And then the former Neuralink guy has left and started a new company. And then also Fred Ursham started one with Jeremy Barinholtz, who was at Neuralink. And I think that's non-invasive.

And all the, I mean, just seeing what's possible with Neuralink opens up so many new opportunities. I mean, imagine a device that gave you podcasters high throughout the entire day. Everybody would put it on. You could just sit in a tank of fluid and live in the matrix. It'd be great. AI innovation will shift from scaling compute

to algorithmic advancements. Yep, that makes sense. That's kind of happening. We're seeing that with like the 01, 03 models. Like there's clearly so much lagging. Yeah, but at the same time, Microsoft is saying we're going to spend $80 billion

on new data centers. Yes, but it's unclear if that's inference or training. I don't think that they specified that. Yeah, it's clearly both. Yeah, I think it's clearly both. But they're clearly scaling. They're clearly both. Yeah, I think it's clearly both, but. But they're clearly scaling. They're clearly planning on scaling.

I think everyone is scaling, like everyone is, everyone is thinking about what's the next order of magnitude larger pre-training run or whatever. Yeah. And there's a bit of a data wall, but they'll figure that out. And once they get all that together, there should be another level of value just from getting a GPT-5 model under the hood of something that's already been reinforcement learned to death like the 0103 models. 25, real world AI will impact Fortune 500 companies showing up in their financial performance. That's kind of vague. I mean,

certainly... I don't know if this is saying it's good or bad, but I think you see companies like... It's certainly affecting the stocks because everyone needs to call McKinsey and get something. Yeah, and you see companies like Klarna. Klarna, the CEO, has been very smart on getting out, just saying, we haven't hired anybody in a year type of thing. I don't know if that's true.

You should take it further. You should be like, I don't even go to work anymore. Yeah, yeah, yeah. My team wants something to just ask. I am not actually doing this interview right now. Yeah. This is, I'm fully generated.

I'm retired. Yeah. I'm post-economic, post-AGI in my, you know, what is it? Fully automated luxury communist era. Yeah. I love that. Data center sending will shift significantly towards inference that's what we were talking about with microsoft we don't know we'll see um uh tier one gps from firms

like sequoia will leave to start their own funds maybe maybe not it's unclear there's a lot of people that made a ton of money in the last run and and they might just retire. Yep. And so I agree with the departures thing. Or you do the smart thing, Sean McGuire, you just make, take over the fund. Yeah. Just become the fund. Yes. And then pivot the entire brand towards being Dark MAGA.

Dark MAGA, yeah. That's great. Big move. The creation of Doge will bring back civic duty with tech talent competing with see this is my favorite kind of prediction you just say the thing that's been happening for the last three months everybody's like wow what an insight but it's cool it's cool it's cool trend i'm i'm it is definitely happening a lot of tech people are going in and considering government jobs that

wouldn't have in the past. But it is rough. I mean, you need to be post-economic because I think like, yeah, like a lot of these jobs are 150. Or there is a thing where if, when you go into certain positions in the government, you have to sell all of your assets. So, uh, the private markets are often, you know, a lot of insider trading happening, happening. If you're sitting, you know, if somebody's sitting on a $10 million position of something they don't If you're sitting, you know, if somebody's sitting on a $10 million position of something they don't actually think is worth nearly that much,

then they can go into the government, sell their, you know, bags, and then, you know, it's a good way to get out. Yeah, AI will accelerate drug development timelines by three to five years. I buy this just on the paperwork side. I mean, honestly, when we were dealing with the FDA and submitting PMTAs for these different nicotine pouch products,

every single one of these, different color, different application, another 100,000 pages of text. We actually got to a point where I was talking to our software developer about using a Python API to manipulate Word documents to see if there's a way to go and basically do a very advanced like find and replace. Well, LLMs do that basically perfectly. And so there's a million ways.

So just the paperwork side. Just the paperwork side is huge on reducing the cost of this higher throughput. And then also, ideally on the FDA side, they're using these tools too to comb through and find obvious errors and act as a first pass. Now I imagine there's a bunch of laws that tell them that they can't do that and it needs to

be human and stuff. And it's going to be very difficult, but, um, and then there's also all like the actual AI drug development stuff where it's like, Oh, let's pull all the data from modeling and prediction and stuff. I mean, they solved the protein folding problem with, uh, with, uh, AI. What was interesting about the protein folding thing was that when DeepMind solved that, the biotech stocks didn't move. And so I talked to a buddy of mine who's a biotech investor, and I was like,

everyone in tech is freaking out about this. They're acting like it's like AGI, like the biggest breakthrough ever. And it is really cool because it was this fundamentally hard problem and DeepMind solved it. But why isn't it moving the market? And he was like,

well, it's not actually that big of a, like protein folding is something that you can, like, yes, it's awesome to be able to just like click a button on the computer and get the result. But before that, it was like, send it off to a machine that costs 50K and a research like assistant at a PhD program will do it for you and it's and it's

it's annoying and it takes time but it's not actually the real barrier to like innovation in the space um happiness will be seen as the key to health even over strict wellness routines it is funny ai is making trying to predict the future so much more interesting because five years ago six years ago ten years ago it's like okay we're gonna have more mobile apps yeah have more sass and now it's becoming harder and harder and harder because we're getting the sense that AI is going to disrupt so much of our lives and the way that we work and how our governments work and all these things yep it actually makes these um you know predictions uh quite a bit harder but definitely so much of our lives and the way that we work and how our governments work and all these things. It actually makes these predictions quite a bit harder,

but definitely more interesting. Software development will become as easy as creating YouTube videos thanks to AI coding assistance. Wait, did we miss 30? Happiness will be seen. No, I just said that. Okay, so I have got to disagree with this. Business performance is the key to health,

even more so than strict wellness routines. That's where I push back. I love it. Because if you have business performance, you'll be happy. But if you don't have business performance, how could you possibly actually be happy? So software development becomes as easy as creating YouTube videos thanks to AI coding assistance.

That's true. And happening with cursor and Devin. Um, we're seeing this, uh, I mean, even like the software developers, like people in the community are just building tools now for us that

previously would be like a 10 K contract on. Yeah. Or something. And they're just doing it in like an hour for their free time for fun. And it's great. Like, uh, we have these these ideas and like they can just be instantiated so quick it's amazing and i do think it will be very cool um this guy uh you know trevor who from broad oh no um he uh so trevor why am i i don't, I'm blanking on his last name. But he just posted today that he, I tried to put it in the stack, that he just like made a SaaS tool for artists that are managing their like tours basically.

And it's becoming, it's so much easier. It's now in the same way that 10 years ago it was like, oh, I want a website. And you just like make a website. Becoming like, oh, I want this app. And you just make it. I got to get back into some sort of development stack and like get the tooling ready. Like the hardest part is for me is not actually like,

I'm pretty good at like writing the actual code. What sucks is like setting up the environment and figuring out how to deploy it and making sure it stays up. And if there's a cron job, it needs to run every hour and stuff. Like all these different like DevOps stuff I always get hung up on.

Back in like the Heroku era, it was good and i've seen like replit and i've played with like a bunch of these different tools but i like i i want it i want to be able to just like yeah get with this but i always need like a couple days of dedicated time and i can just never find the time um in the last one molly o'shea will become the next jo Rogan. Do it, Molly. Do it. But you got to podcast a lot more and you got to podcast for a lot longer. These one hour. Rogan built his business on the three hour podcast. Yep.

And he started with people that were comedians. You go back and you look at the very first Rogan episodes and they're literally everyone's famous. It was insane what a tastemaker that guy was. It was like Bill Burr. Oh, they weren't necessarily, were they not famous at that time? Yeah, I mean, they were like okay comedians back then because it was 20 years ago or something.

But it's literally every single person from the first season or first year of Rogan has been on Rogan the last year because he picked everyone correctly. And that's what you should ask when you're doing an interview show is do I really think that the person I'm doing this interview with,

I will have them on in 20 years because I'm that confident that they'll be successful. Joe Rogan should have been a hedge fund manager, venture capitalist. Okay, great. Let's move on to Romine, Seth.

Romine. Met this guy in New York with Pomp. Great dude. He also hosts a very cool event down in Newport. Intersection of pro sports and venture. He did some sort of like, I think he made his money rolling up staffing agencies.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And built a staffing agency and then I think sold it to private equity. We love private equity. Really, really interesting guy. He gives 25 predictions for 2025. Bitcoin hits 200K. Love it.

A little bit lower than our price target, which I believe was 25 million. But we'd love to see 200K. That's a good start. Yeah. One Bitcoin really should get you out of the Nautilus territory and into the grand complication territory at retail. S&P 500 sees another 15% gain. I agree. AI deflates SaaS.

We're still iffy on that because maybe the SaaS companies pivot, but in general, yes. And the SaaS companies have one thing that upstarts don't, which is distribution, big customer bases. A lot of them can introduce new products. So we'll see. Ozempic GLP-1s will cross a hundred billion in annual sales. I don't know what the annual sales are right now, but that sounds right. I was thinking about what is holding people back from being on GLP-1s. There was this kidney risk for a while. People thought that it gave you

thyroid cancer. Shrinks your heart a little bit. Is that true? I've seen, I've seen. You got to put the tinfoil hat on for that or? No, cancer. Shrinks your heart a little bit. Is that true? I've seen it. You got to put the tinfoil hat on for that? No, no, no. Studies came out showing that it might shrink your heart a little bit. Well, that could be good because you could be more ruthless. Yeah, you don't want to have too big of a heart in this world. If you have to fire a lot of people.

Yeah. Venture capital reverts to a cottage industry. Interesting. It's interesting. Not going to happen in 2025 with feel like sizes we're saying i feel like i we probably agree on this if we were to have a longer conversation i think it's clear that if you want to be an independent gp you got to be really fucking good yeah but it's also never been more commercialized it's also yeah it's also like a definition issue because well like if i think about venture capital in it's also like a definition issue because, well, like if I think

about venture capital in the sense of like a person with $50 million fund, who's going to write $51 million seed checks, lead them and, and really be the first money in at these very early stage companies that feels like venture capital. That feels like a cottage industry. You can go and raise a $50 billion fund and say, I'm only talking to companies that have a market cap that's higher than 10 billion. And I'm just going to do SpaceX secondary, Stripe secondary, and that can also be venture capital. When it's like clearly a different thing,

you're just like, I mean, we saw in the dot coms. It's private market investing. Yeah, it's private market investing. And during the dot com boom, these companies were overvalued. And it was like, they IPO to $500 million. It's like, yeah, that's a series a now.

Yeah. Um, uh, valuation dispersion widens. Okay. It seems reasonable. Um, I mean,

there's still a washout from the post Zerp era, uh, seven us IPO market reopens. M and a accelerates. We talked about this. A new top-tier college is born. How would that happen? Would that just be like an escalation of existing ones?

That'd be like a new UT, University of Austin. Oh, you think he's talking about a brand new one? Or just like all of a sudden- Well, born to me says- Because it's possible it's like all of a sudden like Cal has a couple of good years and it's like Cal's in the Ivies now. Yeah. I mean, Stanford certainly did that where Stanford's like, you know, above Brown clearly.

And it's like MIT, Harvard, Yale, Stanford, basically. And a lot of the Ivies have kind of fallen off. An AI teacher teaches millions of students at zero cost. I don't know how like concentrated the AI teaching will be. Because I mean, yes, you could say like ChatGPT will teach a million people. Already is. For sure. That's already happening.

But then you could also say that there's going to be like someone that uses AI to create a YouTube channel that's like introduction to economics. And that gets a million views. But then there's going to be someone else that does it for physics and someone else that does it for chemistry. And it's like, is that all one AI? There's going to be a constant question about what constitutes a single instance of an AI.

But I do agree, AI, it will be incredible. I mean, it's teaching me so much. I'm constantly looking stuff up. India has a blockbuster startup IPO. Don't care. Outcome-based software pricing models just because it's international uh outcome-based software pricing models go mainstream we talked about this with the sales force with sales force uh independent media overtakes legacy media this is the exact same phrasing as the other one we're doing it here We're doing it here. We're doing it here, folks. Private credit bubble pops.

We will LBO Bloomberg. Private credit bubble pops. Hopefully not. I don't know that much about private credit, honestly. Hopefully not. I'd hate to see bubbles pop. Yeah, Mag7 continues to outperform the rest of the market.

True. Longevity products go mainstream. Brian Johnson's kind of doing that um smb m&a arbitrage goes away true you're harvard i think that it's going to be hard to yeah plumbing company yeah that we're going to look back and and laugh that it became high status making the search fun repackaging smb ownership and smbs are awesome uh in so many ways but there's a lot of them that are better built from the ground up than you know buying a company with 700k and earnings digital detoxes go mainstream hopefully not in this podcast it'd be devastating to the show if we if we did a digital detox i mean hopefully the ipad thing the ipad kid thing yeah it was more mainstream i definitely

it's it's there's a very firm divide among moms and parents from what i'm seeing between the iPad, the pro iPad, because when anti-iPad moms see a kid glued to an iPad, they literally look at it like the kid is just smoking heaters. Like that is the reaction of the mom. They're just like, I cannot believe that this kid is just glued to the slot machine, basically, just going... It's funny. Inflation moderates to sub 2.5 i think that's right waymo becomes a clear market leader for self-driving probably already depends on how you define market leader for self-driving there's a lot of teslas on the road total value of teslas

yeah but our tesla is really self-driving. Level 3 versus level 4 or whatever. It's like all these levels and stuff. I don't know. I mean, yeah, with Cruz out of the game, who else is even trying in full self-driving? Greg. Who? Holtz.

George Hotz. George, sorry. George Hotz is an aftermarket kid. He is firmly in the level two camp. He is, wants to be, he thinks Tesla will still win. They will be the iPhone. He will be the Android. Yeah. And he thinks Waymo will go away because of the cost structure and the design and stuff like that. But I don't know. I'm a little bit more bullish than him on Waymo. It seems to be working really well. And when I was in one, it was a great experience. It wasn't slow and it seems good. Um, patience reemerges as a virtue. That's funny. Uh, hubris

decreases, humility increases. You know, I, I don't know about hubris. Like I've been thinking about getting into it and cause I just think I think I'm built different and maybe it doesn't work for other people, but maybe for me. I think it wears nicely on you. Yeah, I think I could pull it off. It's got to, when you do it, it's just awesome. When other people, not so much, but other podcasters. Other people struggled with it,

but I think I could pull it off. Yeah, and hubris is just one of those things you gotta you gotta indulge in it and see if it's right for you yeah exactly not everybody looks i mean i was gonna say not everybody looks good in a suit not true everybody looks better in a suit but you get what i'm getting at let's go 22 logic and reason return to all walks of life business and politics that's hilarious that's a good that's a good it feels like the opposite of what's happening it feels like crazier than ever i i'm full on but in some but in some but in some ways like the zuck announcement today true true saying hey free

speech is important it's also content moderation is also important we're going to try to throw the needle here better that just seems like logic and reason. Yep. Uh, standards, standards, standards have been going up better place. Dramatically. The innovation train continues to roll. Love it. Great list. Good list.

Let's go to Fred Wilson with his, what will happen in 2025. He's been doing these. He's been doing these for a while. We should honestly go back. Yeah, we should. And look at some of the dive for sure.

Yeah. Uh, I've done a lot of these january first look forward posts in the 20 years i've been blogging use many different approaches here are some of his predictions apple and google will leverage their existing market power to surpass open ai chat gpt and consumer ai prompts by the end of 2025 what's interesting is i mean but so that so they arguably google already has because i'm now getting so much AI summaries. And I don't know about Apple because,

I mean, have you tried the new Apple intelligence? I mean, you sent me a summary. I mean, the summaries are funny and they're okay. They're not super useful, but just actually opening up Siri, I want to be able to just treat it like ChatGPT. Like, hey, Siri, give I want to be able to just treat it like ChatGPT. Like, like, Hey, Siri, give me a summary of, you know, uh, of Fred Wilson's predictions over the last 20 years. And

I should just get ChatGPT. But with this, it's like, you have to link your account and then tell it like, Hey, go to ChatGPT. Don't stick around on the local phone. I want you to go to the actual big model. And it's like, it's iffy. They'll figure it out, but it's like, it is tricky. And I still think chat.com and chat GPT is still just like mentally a place where people go. And I think underrated is like, I see, I think if you look at some of the new product developments that OpenAI is working on, it's a lot of like creating like a notebook almost where it's more collaborative and you can edit and develop a document. And that's, I see it as a new workspace, like a spreadsheet. And I'm like, okay, I'm going to

go do some work with an LLM and I want to, and I need a new browser tab for that. And Google doesn't have that yet. Like they have Gemini studio and a million different like, like beta products. They have the Google search results, which are like kind of helpful. If you're just searching, you don't want to see a million sponsored posts and links and stuff but i'm never going to google with like i'm going to work on collaboratively and really understand this topic in depth and yeah because if i'm if i'm researching cars or something i'm going to want to follow up and ask a bunch of different questions okay give me the full history of ferrari now compare it to lamborghini now create a table now export all that now give me the highest rank it resort it all this stuff

that's something i want to do in its own environment its own ui and and they don't have that uh waymo will surpass uber in rides taken in san francisco and los angeles by the end of 2025 certainly seems like that's happening in san francisco um and i can see it happening in la uh i don't know about la just based on they would have to drop 10 times more i mean depends on what a lot a lot more i bet you could figure out how many they're planning are we talking city or county fred you got to be more precise because there's wildly different geographic areas between los angeles city and los angeles county um but the if they're just in downtown absolutely yeah no problem direct bank-to-bank payments will surpass credit card interchange payments in a few categories in the u.s in 2025 i have no idea how they're tracking right now yeah

um it could have been either one of those could be 10x the other and i wouldn't know but cool the real prediction, will the technology brothers use stable coins to purchase a GT3 RS by the end of 2025? We'll definitely be using that Bitcoin leverage. Yeah, yeah, lava. Lava, where

we can pull the debt out of the Bitcoin. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I want a GT3 RS secured by my Bitcoin for sure. A decentralized clinical trial attracts millions of participants and produces a favorable outcome and trumps FDA. Not only approves the drug, but celebrates the approach. Seems like an aggressive timeline. Short timeline. Yep.

That sounds somewhat reasonable. But what's weird is that it's like, how do you do a decentralized clinical trial that also requires testing a drug? Because like, so let's say I'm a drug developer and I'm like, okay, what's a very basic thing that like, okay, everyone's having trouble sleeping. So I'm going to make melatonin 2.0, right? And I formulate it in my kitchen. And I'm like, I got something that I think is good, but we don't know if it's safe or effective. And so we're going to do decentralized trial. You're listening to the podcast, go to melatonin 2.0.com to like test it out and we'll send it to you.

Okay. You're immediately violating FDA rules. So they need to change those. I could see a decentralized clinical trial happening where it's like everyone is sharing their sleep data. And then something, a recommendation comes out. It has to be data oriented. I would see, I could see Maha pulling something in where it's like, we want to know everyone in America now has the opportunity

to share their seed oil consumption and their body fat percentage. And we're going to run some massive correlative study on this. Like that could be interesting, but just, just alone, like drug development, I just think a year is too short. A housekeeper robot named Judy is launched by Dyson, and it becomes a massive success, selling millions of units. Huh. Again, timeline issue here. Are they planning to do this? I looked it up, and I didn't see anything from Dyson.

I think Judy is some reference to a robot in some movie at some point. I just wonder, like, okay, so Dyson doesn't have a Roomba, right? And would Roomba count as a housekeeping robot? Yeah. I don't know. Dyson's such a cool company. It is. Senra's done three episodes.

You got to go listen to Founders. I don't know the exact numbers, but he's posted about it. So you can go find those. NFT art left for dead at the in at the end of 2024 makes a remarkable comeback and the moma purchases the 6529 museum of art for an undisclosed sum i don't know exactly what nft project that is um i don't it's not a specific project it's a collector who's put together yeah a bunch of stuff a bunch of great nft works i mean i i think that art values come from stories yeah you like wasn't it van gogh cut off his ear yeah like by doing that he canonized

himself and the art there's probably another person brother era cut off your ear put it on the blockchain yeah sell it to the mama no i mean da vinci like why is the mona lisa so valuable like it's not it is like this like, Da Vinci, like why is the Mona Lisa so valuable? Like it's not, it is like this like groundbreaking, beautiful portrait, but also like there's the whole history of Da Vinci inventing flying machines and stuff. Like that gives it more value. Yeah.

And it's the same thing with like, you know, Andy Warhol and commenting on capitalism and consumerism and stuff. Like the story is always what drives the value with these things. And so will some nft project wind up having a fantastic story absolutely i think moxie marlin spudgy penguins selling in

target pudgy penguins is almost a different thing because it's like it's just a commercial like business it's almost like yeah it's almost like a brand like supreme or something where it will have value because as a commercial brand but i think just pure NFT art, which I wouldn't even put Pudgy Penguins in, will have value in the sense of like the- One of my favorite things that we did back in the day at Party Round is we posted on, there was this time that was like,

it was like everybody would post like, reply with your wallet address and we'll airdrop you something. And so we had a bunch of people do that. And then we airdropped everyone NFTs that were ads for Party Round, which is great because you send somebody an NFT and it just sits in their wallet

and they actually have to pay to get it out of their wallet. So we just airdropped. I remember we put an ad in like Dylan Fields' wallet that was like, this is an ad for Party Round and like Comic Sans. Yeah, see like that has a provenance where it's like this stunt,

there's history around it, there's a provenance where it's, like, this stunt. There's history around it. There's a story. Like, those might actually ironically wind up being worth something. Yeah. The NFT that I think has almost the most value is Moxie Marlin's Spikes As You Sow. So he was very bearish on NFTs. And what he did was he said, you know, everyone's saying these are decentralized. But he created an NFT that when it's viewed on OpenSea, it shows you one thing. When it's

viewed in a Ethereum wallet, it shows you a different thing. Phantom wallet shows you a different one. And one of them was just like, it showed, it rendered a poop emoji. The other one, it rendered some joke. And that's funny. Yeah. And he wrote this real blog post, like taking down and like really analyzing what was wrong with NFTs and where people were getting over their skis. And, and I was like that NFT, it's only, it's a one of one and it's by Moxie Marlins, Mike, the founder of signal, like a world historic figure in terms of like cybersecurity. Yeah.

It's like, and he's not an artist, but he's the only one he's made. And it's like super interesting. I tried to buy it off of him, but he was like, how much do you, how much will you pay me? And I was like, I don't actually know. I haven't thought about what it's worth, but I should go and buy it from him. Um, let's keep going. An AI doctor with the personality of Mr. Rogers will treat millions of patients at zero cost in 2025.

This is basically just chat GPT and you just prompt it to, to, to talk like Mr. Rogers and then boom. i actually do wonder i wonder how many queries on chat gpt are already like medical diagnoses type things probably a lot um i just wonder like this makes it sound like it's someone fine-tuning it and when you go there you always get mr rogers and I don't know if that's the winning world. What's up? Breaking news? You can see the fire from... Whoa.

There's a fire going on in... In the Palisades. In the Palisades right now. Yeah. Ooh. And this is my brother-in-law sending a picture from Century City. Okay. So you can see the flames just ripping.

Not good. Crazy. All right. Back to the podcast. Bitcoin mining operation will pair with a wind farm in Newfoundland and grid-scale battery storage to power an AI data center showcasing a new model for sustainable infrastructure. A lot of buzzwords.

This is already happening. This is Crusoe Cloud. They were a Bitcoin mining operation. They had peaker plants on natural gas uh extraction and but they also use wind and all sorts of stuff they use grid scale battery storage and they power a data centers now so yeah bullish on crusade i guess um arizona's esa program attracts over 25 of k-12 students in the state leading to a number of local school closures i don't know enough about the esa program to comment on this is that a home school something like that yeah um but always bullish on

new models of education 10 an ai produces an animated feature film that is nominated for an oscar not going to happen in 2025 but probably soon i wouldn't be surprised if there's an Oscar-nominated film that uses an AI-generated image or sequence. I don't know about the whole film, and certainly not one-shot prompt. If Hollywood is not creating their own proprietary tools to generate content, they're fucked. It is the best example of AI being used in hollywood right now there's a few one was in uh in the marvel endgame avengers movie with thanos they have to animate

his mouth and his skin and when they uh did he not chew enough mastic or something yeah when they put the dots on his face and then they uh the facial capture to get the motion, but it's not high resolution enough. And they use an AI model to upscale the motion capture data, essentially. And then I saw another version where a film that was produced in maybe Polish or German was translated into english and they used ai to replace the mouth movements interesting but they also use cgi so a lot of these a lot of this ai stuff is going deeper into the cgi pipelines and so right now if if you're whenever you see those behind the scenes and it's like some some soldier fighting on a green screen it's like that's not always just one click the button and the green screen goes away a lot of times It's like, that's not always just one click the button

and the green screen goes away. A lot of times it's like, well, there's wires and stuff. So they still send it out usually to abroad and they have a bunch of people literally drawing around the edges of every single frame and they just have hundreds of people doing it called rotoscoping. And then there might be an AI tool

that also is integrated in there. And so, you know, a lot of it's like, what's the definition? I disagree with the idea that there'll be a AI tool that also is integrated in there. And so, you know, a lot of it's like, what's the definition? I disagree with the idea that there'll be a one-shot AI. Like, make me a movie. Oscar. No way. But if there's someone who has a great vision

and they need a couple frames of like B-roll and stuff and they fill in the story. Yeah, I think in 2025, the one-shot videos are still going to be slop. They're going to fight back against this and they're not going to give it just because of the statement it makes. An air taxi service launches in New York City offering an alternative to the L train commute. I would love that.

Are we talking helicopters or are we talking flying cars? What about the VTOL? There's Archer the the figure founders last company will someday none of those are at scale in terms of manufacturing yet and i don't think many of them are fa but the thing so i think what i like about what fred does with these is he's just putting out what he wants to happen he doesn't really care if it happens now or in 10 years he just wants it to happen.

No, no, no. These are just like, it's almost like a request for starters. It's great. TikTok turns all video into meme coins that can be traded on decentralized exchanges all over the world. That's funny. I wonder, like, that feels like useless if it's just collector items. But maybe valuable if you're able to instantly sell the revenue from a video the problem is is that tiktok doesn't have really long half-lifes like you get a million views and then you're done and maybe the creator payout that week is yeah it's kind of interesting to think okay i'm watching

this video at sub 10 000 views can i buy a piece of it and maybe it trades for more. Some of my videos get millions of views every month forever like like I put one out that's on the history of Donald Trump it has three million views now that video alone probably generates over a thousand dollars a month yeah and so I could in theory sell that off and then yeah share that whoever buys it gets that revenue stream yeah and there are services that do that it was called there was something that was really hot in the youtube space and a bunch of youtubers like sold their back catalogs and then like oh yeah it's pretty sick yeah it wasn't i i do think that um spotter didn't mr beast do that yep to help fund some of these bigger videos which is great and there's a long history of this with like the beatles selling the back catalog michael jackson

yeah big artists have been doing this forever there were a lot of people that made a ton of money doing that because they bought low. Hedge funds. They bought the right asset and it went really big. And then there's obviously like the famous Taylor Swift argument about how she sold it and then buyer's or seller's remorse. Very interesting. And number 13, the USV librarian goes rogue,

gets access to USV's crypto wallet and starts making seed investments one of which turns into a fund returner he's just manifesting at this point love it he's like yeah so i guess the librarian is like a ai that they trained on something else uh should we go to nikhil basu trivedi who writes the next big thing in 2025. I've always, Nikhil's got a very dialed format. Yeah, these are great because he runs a blog, but for his predictions, he asks a ton of people

to give their predictions. Then he just aggregates them and he gets some really top people. I mean, general partner at Benchmark. Dara from Delphi. Partner at Timitor. Oh, he's in here. That's great. Jess Lee at Delphi. Partner at Timeter. Oh, he's in here? That's great.

Jess Lee at Sequoia. Lots of good people. So we should just kind of skip through these, pick like maybe the best one from each category. Let's go with AI agents. And I want to hear what Claude has to say. That's funny. He asked Claude 3.5 Sonnet.

And Claude says the next big thing in 2025 will be the widespread adoption of AI agents that can autonomously handle complex multi-step tasks from scheduling your entire vacation to managing your small business operations while being fully aligned with individual users' preferences and values. This shift will mark the beginning of truly personalized AI assistance that goes far beyond today's basic chatbots and virtual assistants. I mean, it's certainly happening in niche categories right now with dedicated startups that do things from end to end. And I would love to see more of this because we have plenty of multi-step tasks

that can be prompted. I mean, we saw Dwarkesh talking about just doing the transcripts from his messy podcast transcripts with lots of ums and uhs, and he has a master prompt, but it's really just one-shotting it. It's one prompt. It's much better if he could just have

an AI agent sitting there and says, hey, as soon as this RSS feed gets updated, step one, download the MP3. Step two, send it over to Whisper, get it transcribed. Step three, run the transcript. Step four, upload the MP3. Step two, send it over to Whisper. Get it transcribed. Step three, run the transcript. Step four, upload the better transcript. Do that for me too.

Don't just give me the text. I want it live and I want it just sitting there. There was a fan of the show who wrote in and said, I'll do your title ideas and send in some chapters. We get a lot of people asking for chapters on YouTube and that's a great thing that AI should do. Eventually YouTube will do it automatically. They have some automatic chapters functionality,

but, uh, we'd love more fine tuned control over it. So an AI agent would be fantastic there. AI interfaces. Uh, let's go to altimeter. Uh,

Jameen ball says I'm on the second page here. Uh, and on AI interfaces, uh, Jameen ball says i'm on the second page here uh and on ai interfaces uh jameen ball says the next big thing in 2025 will be a cambrian explosion of voice ai applications latency on inference latency on networking and more advanced turn detection background background noise detection will lead to truly human-like experiences with software. See, this is, just to make it relevant to some stuff we've talked about before, this is the bull case for Friend, is that if the underlying technology gets dramatically better,

and then you have this device that's with you 24-7, it could turn into the craziest relationship you've ever had, right? Yeah. Yeah, it's also interesting like like what are you looking for in a relationship like if it's capable of being like a friend then you know it's also capable of just being like an assistant yeah just bouncing ideas off your secretary yeah nothing will ever replace a world-class secretary let's talk through eric newcomer um he on on ai applications he says

the next big thing in 2025 will be in the world of artificial intelligence where it's going to be cool to be a gpt rapper again consumers and businesses both need help figuring out how best to use already very powerful language models so we're going to see a bunch of applications crop up that help people get the most out of these models startups will build sales motions integrations customer know-how etc and won't need some huge technological moat to justify their existence of course no one will want to call their company a wrapper think more gpt refiner these companies will get data particular to their use case do some human reinforcement learning and deliver an easy to use product that leads the horse to water instead of intimidating empty textiles. Yeah, you're basically building the

interface for the model. Yep. That makes sense. AI generated content. Let's go to Damir at Index. He says, the next big thing will be video generation models. Video is the ultimate form of creative expression and how we produce it will fundamentally be transformed as a result of next generation models yep i agree have you played with sora yet i think i think i have access because i'm gpt pro but i haven't actually done it um i think it should be useful for our editors to pull b-roll and stuff but just make the most unhinged slop b-roll some of the some of the slop b-rolls like it's the question is, like, when is it helpful to illustrate something?

And usually I feel like you want a very specific shot, but it can be helpful in storytelling. I'm ready for somebody to make the – somebody just needs to fully lean in. I don't endorse this, but it would be funny. The ayahuasca visualization engine with Sora, where it just takes you through the giga slop, like mental journey of ayahuasca. Yeah.

Let's just keep moving. Scott Belsky, always sharp. He says the next big thing in 2025 will be top AI talent shifting from working in companies, pioneering the latest and greatest AI to taking leadership roles in the industry that benefit most from AI. I won't go in further, but that's interesting. It's basically, you know, right now the top AI talent is working at AI companies.

But then eventually it's like, hey, could you have a bigger impact if you went and worked at a company like Flexport, right? And like became a leader at the intersection of AI and logistics, right? Oh, let's go to Dara. In the not AI category, the next big thing in 2025 will be a counter movement to AI content overload, bringing focus back to human curation and authenticity. Infinite AI generated content

is still in its wow and novelty phase, but anytime there's an abundance of an asset, the pendulum swings to the other side where people appreciate the scarce assets that come with quality, which in information's case is trust. As trust becomes scarce, influence will concentrate among select curators

and experts who can use AI to scale their validated perspectives while maintaining credibility. These curators will have unprecedented reach and impact as they'll be able to maintain personal connections at scale through AI enhanced interactions while preserving the authenticity that made people trust them in the first place. Interesting. Dara, always sharp.

Nicole Wischoff. You got to know what questions to ask. Yeah. Nicole Wischoff says the next big thing in 2025 will not be AI as the main character. Bets have been made, and there are many hot takes on commoditization and models. The physical infrastructure will be the really important conversation. Energy, data centers, and the Trump admin coming in.

More thoughts will go into how we power AI, not the outcomes of AI, which has dominated all of 2024. That's a good take. Let's go to Gary Tan. The next big thing in 2025 will be startups of 10 people getting to 10 million ARR in less than 18 months with less than 5 million raised. This is why, I mean, it's hard to imagine any company better positioned than YC. It's probably one of the greatest business models of all time it's fantastic um uh product so i like this one from from michael

at light speed he says the next big thing in 2025 will be the return of the product oriented founder the magic of ai technology that led to instant pmF for so many companies is starting to wane. What's needed now is exceptional products that solve real problems and the teams that can natively build them. So yeah, I think we've seen that in the last six months or so where founders that had been building something

and maybe exited like Jordan Singer are now getting back in the game, starting from scratch, thinking in a very AI-native way. There's another one here on GLP-1s. The next big thing will be a second win for GLP-1 drugs. This is from Nan Lee at Dimension. Already a blockbuster product in obesity and in diabetes, headed toward $50 billion of annual sales.

Remember the other prediction we saw that was $100? Size gone. It's like 2x. This class of medicines will be further bolstered by new research findings. First off, there seems to be no limit to what diseases GLP-1 biology is linked to. As label expansion studies continue to create strong signal in everything from sleep apnea, now FDA approved, to chronic heart failure. It's funny.

I saw, so there's a week ago at the Amman. It's a very nice hotel. I saw this individual who I spoke to at one point. Very large. a week ago at the Amman. It's a very nice hotel. I saw this individual who I spoke to at one point, very large. And I just kept thinking, like seemingly like uncomfortably large. And I was thinking like,

why? Like there's still, it seems like being overweight will become somewhat of a choice, but some people are still going to just choose to not because you want to physically intimidate your opponents yeah be a size lord exactly um maybe that's a good prediction wilmanitis puts the weight arthur arthur rock got a mention in here the next big thing in 2025 will be hemp-based thc the u.s market Delta-8 THC and other hemp-derived cannabinoids has increased by a whopping 1,200% in just three years, going from $200 million to $2.8 billion.

I think marijuana should be banned. But anyways. I like Arthur. Co-founder at Varda and partner at Founders Fund says, the next big thing in 2025 will be regular landings on the moon of equipment to prepare for people shortly thereafter. Love that. I love that.

We should send some full podcast studio up there just to get ready. The first podcast studio on the moon. It's great. Let's see. What else we got? IPOs. Gokul Rajaram at Marathon says, the next big thing will be tech

and IPO markets booming. Agree. Big tech earnings. Chad Byer says the next big thing will be mainstream adoption of agents and large enterprise leading to increased earnings and quarterly beats resulting in continued stock all-time highs.

I love quarterly beats. Among hyperscalers. I love it. Should we close with our own predictions? Let's do it. We asked 24 billionaires for their 2025 tech predictions, and here they are. Marc Andreessen gets hair transplants.

Artificial intelligence will get better. That's the best prediction possible, artificial intelligence, because it seems like you just can't miss on that one. Exactly. Predictions are all about, it's not about saying cool things. It's about being right. Exactly. Speaking of being right, Bitcoin hits $25 million per coin.

I think we got that one in the bag. Keith Raboy becomes a mass monster and gets his IFBB Pro card. Big. Most of the major cities will be replaced with vast pleasure domes used exclusively by the Excelsiites, who are the neo-upper class, while the displaced hordes of lower-class depth groblers will live underground in tiered cities endlessly toiling away for nuggets of neoplasmid. Do you know what that's from? Venture capitalist formally becomes a slur in the Oxford English Dictionary. I love that. Databricks IPO prices above $147 a share.

You got to have some. Just kind of pull the number out of the hat on that one. 50% premium to last price, I think. Yeah. Underperformance of European VCs results in mass famine and chaos on the continent. Most EU countries backslide into feudalism. Love it. performance of european vcs results in mass famine and chaos on the continent most eu countries backslide into feudalism love it i think that's as long as it remains a great vacation destination for hard-working americans yes yeah it's like you're at disneyland uh elizabeth holmes has a

stunning comeback i think that's in the bag venture-backed defense tech companies collectively rack up over a hundred thousand confirmed kills well on our way mark zuckerberg gets really into lawn care i think the bro arc of zuckerberg is like lawn cares he got into grilling he got into watches cars cars minivans you know minivans steak he got big in a steak yeah he's i think he's gonna go precision rifle series prs long range long distance custom rifle builds. That's definitely happening. He needs to buy an F1 team. That would be good.

Why does Meta not have Meta Racing? That would just be fantastic. Meta has the best advertising network of all time. He should buy the NFL, the NBA, the WWE, the UFC, and F1. All of it. Not just the team. The whole thing. Yeah.

At least two GPs at tier one funds will go to jail. I think we know what we're talking about there. Virtual reality will have a major moment. That's exciting. That's exciting. That's exciting. After years of financial mismanagement, the All In podcast will declare bankruptcy and be acquired by private equity.

That would be very sad. That hurts. We hate to see a good podcast go down. But the numbers are what they are. The numbers are what they are. They lost their top dog. They lost their star. Their absolute dog.

And the revenue has just been too low. Yeah. That's the problem. They're not going to be the most profitable podcast with relying on events for revenue. Yeah. A major investigative journalist will write an expose on humiliation rituals at venture capital firms.

We've heard a lot about those. Ramp will continue to offer a seamless corporate card experience to the best private and public companies on earth. Big game hunting replaces skiing as the go-to VC offsite activity. We posted this before all the chaos at Vail. You know, you're not hearing a lot of chaos on the Serengeti. There aren't a lot of lift lines to go hunt a tiger or a lion. So it seems like an obvious trade.

Big game hunting. We're going to do a brother's big game hunting trip at some point. For sure. Another VC will be fired for not being able to hold his liquor. I think we know who we're talking about there. Yep. But there is the blackout to fund manager pipeline. That does happen.

Which still exists. Yep. The new Tesla Roadster will finally ship and it will have a naturally aspirated V12 and a gated manual. Let's go. I'm excited for that. I'm seriously considering putting a reservation down on the new Redster. I think it's going to be awesome. It's a good buy.

I think this is the year he's going to deliver it. It's been forever delayed, but now everything's clear. Why not? Stock's at all-time highs. He's got all the approvals and stuff. He needs a new halo car. It would just be so sick. I think he's letting the Cybertruck kind of hype play out.

Yeah. It's going to look so good. The Cybericon will look like a Cybertruck kind of hype play out. Yeah, it's going to look so good. The Cybericon will look like a Cybertruck Huracan. That'd be awesome. That'd be wild. I really hope he takes the Cybertruck aesthetics into the Roadster. I don't want the Roadster to look like the old Roadster at all. That's true.

Or the Model S. If he makes like a very Tron-esque. They all look exactly the same and they look super boring to me. The Cybertruck, I think, looks sick. So take that, shrink it down. Yeah, that'd be so good.

Yeah. That would honestly be, if it felt more like a Lamborghini than a, like a futuristic Lamborghini. Yeah, it shouldn't look like an Elise. Yeah,

that makes me want to, what's the actual? I think you put down like 10K or something. Yeah. But the whole thing is like, you could just put money in Tesla in tesla stock yc will fund a company that makes humanoid robots with guns for arms i like that yc has been getting more into the military industrial complex we love

to see it lps finally start refusing to back gps that wear shorts in a business setting good to see one every tech podcast not releasing daily episodes will fade into obscurity in the face of relentless competition from the technology brothers. Fact check, true. It's not even as much of a prediction. It's just a fact. AI agents will cause homelessness in San Francisco

to fall to 0%, but their methods will be harshly criticized by the public. Oh, what's going to happen there? Deadly. Brian Johnson will die in a hail of gunfire during a raid on a top secret government biolab that contains a fountain of youth elixir. What did we miss?

Let us know. DM us if you have predictions. And that concludes our deep dive on predictions for 2025. We have to dive into something. We got to take, let's take a quick break gotta we gotta let's take a quick uh okay let's take a quick break welcome back to the technology brothers still the most profitable podcast in the world la is still burning down we're still podcasting we have some breaking news though mark zuckerberg has announced that meta will be relaxing the what do you call it censorship i guess hey guys we're not

dialing back the censorship and we got kind of out of control the announcement video was so funny because zuck has this style where he's just like a direct to camera he's like hey guys i just want to give you an update and normally it's like you know we're really excited to announce like creator monetization but with this one it was just like oh my god it's getting so much more extreme and it's just like we're not gonna penalize people for you know talking about politics anymore and it's like okay that's pretty reasonable he's like we're gonna have this community notes feature and we're gonna let that do a lot of the work so it's community policed and you know we're we're not like like the the the automated systems make a lot of mistakes. It's like, oh, that's reasonable.

He's like, oh, and by the way, we're moving our trust and safety organization from San Francisco to Texas. To the great state of Texas. It's like, oh, my God. That's like a bomb going off. It's a cultural change. Yeah. Wild. But all of that is just a sideshow to the real reason why we need to talk about this story.

And clearly the real reason why he made the video. Yes. 100%. It's because he needed to show off his beautiful $1 million Grubel Forsey handmade one watch. And so we have a post here from Didi. He says, Zuck was wearing a $1 million watch in his community notes announcement video. Nothing says, I understand the culture shift of the community more than a watch that costs more than most people houses. That's true. I don't know if he's joking, but like, that's true. It's like the era, this is authentic. He's a billionaire.

He should have a million dollar watch. Why not? And it's a cool story. And we're going to take you through what makes this watch so special and why it's actually fine and cool and great. And it's awesome that he's into it. It's a celebration of his success. Yes. Meta success. Yes. And watchmaking.

The numbers he's put up. Not just a billion. 1.5 trillion. Big T. That's how much value the man's created. Capital T. Capital T. I was trying to run the numbers, and I was like.

Anybody that creates a trillion dollar company should wear at least a million dollar watch as their daily driver. Yeah. Period. Arguably should be... If you adjust just for his wealth, I don't know if you can find a watch,

maybe on Timu. If you make $100,000, the equivalent watch as percentage of income is like a five cent watch. Yeah. Like he spent... Zuck is like a five cent watch. Like he spent. Zuck is at a point where I would actually like to see him utilizing the real estate on actually both watches.

Yeah. And also you got to ice this out. Yeah. He should definitely be icing this out. Flood it. Ice out the handmade. With the top tier diamonds. Flood the.

No lab grown diamonds. No, no, no, no. Straight from the earth. Exactly. Flood diamonds. No lab grown diamonds. No, no, no, no. Straight from the earth. Exactly. The most expensive. Organic farm to table diamonds. It's got to be in the 10, 50, get into 100 million. Make the, what's the watch where it's the hallucination.

You got to make that look like a Cassia. Yeah, make it look like a Cassia. Okay. So the Grubel 4C handmade one, it's a 43.5 millimeter in white gold. It represents the pinnacle of old world watchmaking techniques in a modern era. Priced well into the hundreds of thousands of dollars, often cited around or above 800,000. I saw one for sale for 906,000. Interestingly, there was a news article that said it was a $900,000 watch.

I found it for $906,000. Let's put it in the truth zone. I want a community note. I want a community note on it. There are only two or three produced each year within the realm of hot horology or high horology. It occupies a level of craftsmanship, exclusivity,

and finish that sets it apart from either, from even from other superlative luxury watches. There's incredible rarity, only two to three pieces made per year. Each requires 6,000 hours of handiwork. It's crazy too, because now every product manager in the Valley

is going to be trying to get this watch. Yes. And the question will become, are they going to increase their allocations because you know there's going to be people banging down the door saying please make this watch i work at i work at uber i'm a product manager i make a couple hundred thousand dollars a month i want you know a nice piece that i can wear to work uh and yeah so have you seen the other grubel forces they're incredible the the non the non-handmade so no no no uh they i think they're all well they're all handmade but handmade one is is this specific model look at this one dude it has a it has a physical model of the world.

It's like three-dimensional. You got to look this up. We'll put a picture up on the video. But it has a picture of the world that rotates to show you like what time it is across the world. That's wild. That's so amazing. Incredible. It's incredible.

It's a traditional method. Over 95% of the parts are fabricated using centuries-old fully manual techniques, making it distinct from even most hand-finished pieces. Time-intensive components. The escapement lever alone can take one and a half months to create. Yep. Three years of full-time work go into producing each watch. An incredible investment in time.

So these are very rare. Fewer than three pieces per year. One of the rarest series produced watches in the world typically quoted around 800k 95 handmade aside from the sapphire crystals pivot jewels gaskets strap spring bars and the main spring every single part is executed by hand and have you ever seen any of these videos breaking down like how these individual independent watchmakers work? It's like they actually have every single tool like they need to like file down.

Oh, we need a gear. Yeah. Let's make it from scratch. It's crazy. The escapement lever. That's like with us. Yeah. Podcasting.

We need a new microphone. Let's make it from scratch. We really should get some like hand made. There are some. Actually, one of my friends from high school his dad that was their business they made uh handmade microphones for recording artists yeah and when you listen to like you know oh like yeah like the rolling stones use this microphone yeah and it's just like actually like the top tier that was like his uh high school job was like helping assemble stuff very cool uh it has a tourbillon and train wheels that take 600 times

longer to produce uh i actually think in the era of just ai slot products these like ultra ultra handmade like it will become cool again for somebody to say yep i'm gonna hand make wine bottles right and and this is why you can't write this off as just like oh it's just rich guy shit because zuck is a technologist and watchmaking is in some way a pinnacle of technology like we didn't have the ability to make this it's just mechanical it's not computer science yeah but there's something that's when you look at a really fine handmade watch, you're, you're realizing like an expertise in craftsmanship that you want to bring to yes. Even the ad platform software.

Yeah. Like that, that's the same, same concept. Um, the dial and finishing the minute track and seconds sub dial are executed in true fired and animal enamel requiring multiple firings at 800 degrees Celsius. The silver bridges, known as malacourt in French,

they feature a frosted finish achieved by repetitive dabbing with a stiff wire brush. The copper content gives these bridges their soft golden hue. Mirror polishing every bridge and wheel includes expertly polished bevels. Many feature sharp inward angles which are extremely challenging to master each screw grow goes through 12 different manual steps and can require around eight hours to produce finishes vary between black polish and fired blue steel all color match meticulously incredible a one minute tourbillon made of 69 parts. The tourbillon,

I got to get a tourbillon watch for sure. It's so sick. Originally, I believe the tourbillon was designed to offset the, I think it was in pocket watches, maybe wristwatches too. But if your watch is sitting there at an angle, there's gravity on it in one direction.

And so that would throw off the timekeeping. And so the tourbillon was spinning to offset that a little bit. Now there's other ways to build a watch that keeps time more accurately, even in the mechanical realm. But the tourbillon is still just like a fascinating thing to look at. And with this watch, the tourbillon is actually exposed so you can look at it from the face the face from the uh from the dial incredible yeah uh you got to have screws that take at least eight hours to produce in your watch else what are you doing uh the large balance

is free sprung and adjusted in six positions beating at three hertz the hairspring is shaped by hand to include an overcoil, minimizing positional air. It has a 60-hour manual wind, which is quite robust given the large tourbillon assembly. Golden chattans, traditional pocket watch style chattans, hold each pivot jewel an homage to 19th century techniques while also aiding in serviceability. And the base plate on the reverse side features a gratemaine or hand-scraped finish. No two plates are identical. There's a ratchet wheel, a year plate, and name plate. Oh, yeah, that's a really fun thing.

It says the year that it was made on the face of the watch. And so one in rose gold, one in white gold, showcasing multi-metal accents. Each watch was also inscribed with a year and number, denoting its place among the two or three made that year. So you can instantly look at your watch and know exactly. It's kind of like with the super rare sports cars, limited allocation. They will say, okay, this is number. Inscribe on the engine.

Yeah. I mean, even for like a somewhat limited run, like a Murcielago or something, people will look at the VIN and they'll track all the VINs. Are you familiar with like VIN wiki? Have you seen this? Yeah. So people track down all the VINs and then they'll know, okay, there's 2,000 of these cars made. And then a lot of times people will track down the VINs and realize that there's actually a lot less of them that people thought. Because they crashed or they were sent overseas or something. And that can drive the value up.

But something like this, you look at the number right on the watch to remind you how exclusive it is. I love it. And the thing for me is he clearly was very particular about choosing this watch for this announcement. You don't throw this on by chance. You don't wake up in the morning and say, oh, I'm going to, you know, you're really, it's a very intentional decision. But with Zuck, it's thinking about all the watches that he could have, that he brushed over

and chose not to put on this morning. And I want to know about those. Could have worn the Cubitus. Completely different statement. Cubitus would have been quite the statement. Would have been quite the statement. Would have angered a lot of people. A lot of people wanted to see him throw on an FP Jorn, which he has, and it's beautiful.

BC Braggs was talking about this. Wanted him to throw on the FP Jorn. But the FP Jorn is still an independent watchmaker. Francois-Paul Jorn is obviously a fantastic watchmaker. But it's a little bit more well-known than something like this. And this should just be a wake-up call for tech executives broadly i agree that you need to be taking clocks more seriously yes yes take time more seriously yeah this is the thing about a watch people say even even elon in

many ways talking about on you know unregretted user seconds he's really making a statement around clocks and watches and time. And a watch doesn't tell you the time of day. It tells you the time in your life. And so for him, what is this moment? Where is he in his life? He's at a point in his life where he can wear something like this. And this symbolizes where he's at in his life. And that's meaningful. An incredible place.

That's meaningful. Making incredible signings. It's comparable only to itself. I love it. Epitomizes the devotion to genuine handmade craftsmanship. Nearly everything is done by traditional techniques seldom seen in modern watchmaking. Are you okay?

Yeah, I think we just got an evacuation order so probably gotta hit the road okay well it'll be a short episode i mean we will be on not exactly not exactly the shortest i think we still clock subscribe clocked a couple hours follow us on x follow us on youtube follow us on spotify brothers i'm sorry to cut the timeline out of this episode, but we'll be back tomorrow. And in my defense, there is an evacuation order at my house, and I can't in good conscience continue to record. And we have some great polished pieces going out on X. These are the Brother of the Week Award, the Reply Guy of the Week Award, the Size Gong, the Personnel News. We've stopped doing those within the episodes.

We record them before. We edit them down. And they go out exclusively on X. They're exclusive clips on X. And so make sure you follow us there. Turn the notifications on. And make sure you reply. There's a big – there's going to be about 50 Reply Guys of the Week this year.

Yep. And many of those people will go on to join the forbes list to start trillion dollar companies to raise mango seed rounds and do many great things you know to win the kentucky derby right to win ufc championships this one is encouraging to you you might be worried about your house burning down, but we're going to Josh Steinman and he's saying, good morning. We are going to win. And that's a great place to close it.

Thank you, brothers. We'll see you tomorrow. Bye.