Ten Percent Happier with Dan Harris - 158: Tal Rabinowitz, Forgoing Hollywood and Finding Meditation

Episode Date: October 24, 2018

Tal Rabinowitz was a top executive at NBC, developing some of the network's high profile comedy programs, but after nearly 20 years in the business she was let go. And then, SHE let go. Rabinowitz found herself burned out and ready to take her career in a new direction. She tells Dan how and why she decided to open up her own meditation studio, what her meditation practice looks like and how she's introducing meditation to her two-year-old daughter. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

It kind of blows my mind to consider the fact that we're up to nearly 600 episodes of this podcast, the 10% happier podcast. That's a lot of conversations. I like to think of it as a great compendium of, and I know this is a bit of a grandiose term, but wisdom. The only downside of having this vast library of audio is that it can be hard to know where to start. So we're launching a new feature here, playlists, just like you put together a playlist of your favorite songs.

Back in the day, we used to call those mix tapes. Just like you do that with music, you can do it with podcasts. So if you're looking for episodes about anxiety, we've got a playlist of all of our anxiety episodes. Or if you're looking for how to sleep better, we've got a playlist of all of our anxiety episodes, or if you're looking for how to sleep better, we've got a playlist for that. We've even put together a playlist of some of my personal favorite episodes. That was a hard list to make. Check out our playlists at 10%.com slash playlist. That's 10% all one word spelled out..com slash playlist singular.

Let us know what you think. We're always open to tweaking how we do things and maybe there's a playlist we haven't thought of. Hit me up on Twitter or submit a comment through the website. Hey y'all, it's your girl, Kiki Palmer. I'm an actress, singer, and entrepreneur. I'm a new podcast, baby, this is Kiki Palmer. I'm asking friends, family, and experts,

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Another great guest this week folks, Cal Rubinoids. How does somebody, how and why does somebody go from, with the upper echelons of network television to running a meditation studio? Tal runs Dan Meditation in LA and in the LA area, part of this explosion in these secular meditation, kind of drop-in centers all over

the country, and many of the big cities around the country. It's got a really interesting story and an interesting view of the world of meditation in a busy life. So we'll get to that in a second. First though, a few items of business, then your voice mail, and then we'll get to the interview. A little business item is a couple of notes from the 10% world. We are hiring. We're looking for a meditation of notes from 10% world. We are hiring.

We're looking for a meditation producer and also a senior producer. The meditation producer produces meditations, as one might imagine, both our video courses and our audio meditation. Also, a senior producer is much more sort of a TV role, video production role, really working on the video for the various courses we do, and also for some stuff we're going to be doing outside of the courses. You can go to jobs.tenpercenthappier.com to check that out. Speaking of checking out things related to the app, we've got a new teacher up there.

Her name is Jess Mori. She's been on this podcast. You should go back and listen to her story. She works with teenagers and has a long personal practice herself, a very interesting story. I recommend going back to that podcast. I just saw Jess today, actually, at an event. And she's got some parenting meditations that are going up on the app. On the app, one's called Parenting in Hard Moments and another is Meditation 14s.

So check Jess out on the app. She's a star. All right. Your voice mails. Number one, here we go. Hi Dan, so my message is, how do you keep from getting more stress trying to schedule time to meditate? Because I look at my half-do list or my gotta-do list

and get stressed and meditation is on that list because I feel it's something I need to do. That's my question. Have you ever struggled with trying to get it all in? I watched your video how you get in two hours a day. And that would make me stressed trying to add them all up. Okay, thank you. Bye. Great question. I feel your pain. It's not unreasonable. Just as a biographical note, I actually cut down my amount of meditation. For three years, I was doing two hours a day because I was really,

and continue to be really interested in exploring the deep end of the pool as they say. But I've talked about this a little bit on the podcast before. A few months ago, I had what's called a 360 review done. That's where it's done a lot in corporations and we did it more as a... I did it initially because I wanted to have it be this sort of kickoff thing gambit in my upcoming book, which if I ever finish it on kindness. So we did a 360 review where you basically talk to people who know me from different angles in my life. People I work for, people who are my peers, people who work for me, people

in my personal life, and really got a sense of what my strengths and weaknesses were. And I've joked that the real title for the 360 in my case should be You Suck from Every Angle. Because it was pretty harsh. 41-page report that came back and it was quite eye-opening and making some significant changes in my life as a consequence. And one of the things I got dinged for, I think all of it, all of the things I got dinged for were legit, and this one was particularly true,

which is that I am stressed and pulled in too many directions. And one of the things I think was stressing me out, Adelaide, was trying to get in two hours of meditation every day, even though I really was getting a lot out of it and I thought it was improving my practice, but it meant that at the office, my door was closed quite a bit, and it was less available to especially junior colleagues who might benefit from a little chat. So I cut down to an hour, which is still a lot, but I found that it's really been nice

to have a little bit more time. It's meant my eyes on the clock a little bit less. So I think different phases in your life, maybe their schedule may be more or less amenable to certain amounts of meditation. Long way of saying, I completely understand what you're saying. And I think it's counter totally undermines the purpose of meditation to have that be a source of stress for you. So what I would recommend is to set your sights really low, meaning shoot for one minute of meditation most days, or what I like to say daily-ish.

We've been testing this philosophy with your friendly neighborhood Trillion Dollar company, Apple. The 10% happier company, we run annual challenge, an annual month-long challenge for all the employees at Apple, and we designed it in such a way that said, okay, for the month of October, do one minute of meditation, 25 out of 30 days or something like that, maybe 31 days or wherever,

how many gather, 31 days in October. I should know that since my three-year-old is obsessed with Halloween. So in other words, do meditation daily-ish for one minute, and we find that the buy-in is great. So that's really validated in my confidence in this recommendation. So it's totally fine if you're getting stressed by trying to find the time to fit this in. So I think the way to have a steam release valve here that might allow for you to actually

get some practice in, we would say just do one minute. I think one minute is eminently doable. And if you miss a day or two, if you're following this daily-ish, if you're pursuing that rather flexible goal, then if you miss a day or two, the ego can't swoop in and tell you a whole story about how you're a failed meditator.

So that's my recommendation. Try that, try that for a month, try it for two months. As I like to tell, a long time listeners may have heard me say this before, but I've, you know, in the four and a half years, since 10% happier came out, I've had this challenge that I've issued to people all, you know, many of my public interviews,

which is try meditation for a month. And if you find, you get nothing out of it, send me a note on Twitter and tell me I'm a moron. You know people tell me I'm a moron on Twitter all the time but never for that and and so I'm pretty confident if you do it and you do it in this kind of relaxed way that it may be the kind of the best of both worlds. So don't stress give this a try call me back let me know if it worked. All right here's voice mail number two. Hi, Dan, Mark here.

Questions for those of us who've been at this for a while, and for me it's been three years of almost daily practice. How much will it advance my practice to one, get a teacher? And number two, work with a group. I've been going solo now for three years and I'm wondering to what benefit, what requirement and what outcome I will have with a teacher and or and or with a group. Thank you. Well first of all good on you three years of nearly daily practices good solid run

i in my own experience both of those things have real benefits so i have a teacher at his name is joseph goldstein and i found that uh... checking in with him you know once every couple months and really talking about where things are going in my practice has been incredibly useful. He now has a sense of my mind and can give me really good advice about new areas to explore or areas where I may be incorrectly applying what I thought was his advice. So that in my experience is really helpful. I think it's not mutually exclusive

to try to pursue a group. Sometimes in fact, it's the exact same thing. You might start sitting with a group of people all of whom see the same teacher and the teachers in the room. So, for example, if you're in Toronto, my friend Jeff Warren runs a group up there called the CEC, Consciousness Explorer's Club, kind of somewhat goofy name, which fits with Jeff who's somewhat goofy and just an incredible superior human being.

And you know, you go sit with him, he's teaching a class, you can ask him some questions, and you also have all group of people. And I often describe the impact of having a group of friends who do this as having an HIV lane effect. That, you know, you really being around a group of people who take this stuff seriously can speed your progress. I know people sometimes get nervous when I get overly Buddhisty. Maybe you guys don't, but sometimes out in the real world they do. But the Buddha talked about the three jewels, the three things, the three pillars that you

know that are an important part of any meditation practice. One is the Buddha and he wasn't, he didn't mean by that. You know, you need to worship me. He meant more of the idea that at the end of the road there is such a thing as really waking up. So the Buddha, the Dharma, which is just another way of saying your meditation practice and the attendant sort of intellectual infrastructure, and the Sangha, which is a fancy ancient term for the community. And so right from the jump, for 2600 years,

if not longer, the idea of having other people with whom you do this has been central. And so I think it's really powerful to have a group of people that you can, even if you're only just sitting quietly and you never talk with them, the idea that there are a bunch of other people in your universe who are taking this seriously and endeavoring to apply meditative principles in their lives and be somewhat diligent about the practice can be really an accelerator. So yeah, I would I would if I were you and

At your stage in the game and you're sounds like you want to up your game a little bit I would I would I would investigate both those Really appreciate the voicemails everybody keep them coming Let's get to our guests this week as I said Tal Robino. It's I don't I don't need to give you her whole CV Because she's about to in a much more engaging way than I ever could. But I really enjoyed this conversation and I love bringing people in from all different walks of life. And she has a deep experience and the good and the bad of Hollywood and then took all

of that and is now bringing it to the meditation world. So here she is, Tal Rubinoids. I just met you, but you don't seem like a stereotypical meditator. Me? I'm not. It's probably because I'm a little type A, and I have a lot of energy.

Yeah. Yeah. But if you know, I say that as a compliment. Oh, okay. Well, then thank you. Yeah, no, I'm a very, I'm a go-getter, simultaneously. But I think part of the reason like I did what I did and opened up what I did is because I think meditation and spirituality is for every single

person no matter what you look like, who you are, what your vibe is, that's part of it. So I'm actually glad I don't fit the stereotype. Yeah, so when we were talking before, we started rolling that you're half-Israeli, you spent a lot of time in Israel. Yes. I too have spent a lot of time in Israel as a reporter, also as a, I mean, I'm half Jewish, but I never went there until I started covering the second of Nevada. He had to.

Yeah. But I mean, I love Israel. I love Israelis. I also, you know, spent a lot of time in Palestine too. I love everybody there and the land there is beautiful and the city's there is amazing. My point is that I know enough Israeli people to know that there is a bit of a personality type. I don't know, or Ruby, or really, uh, general.

Yes, but you, you kind of seem to fit it a little bit. At least on first impression. I do fit it for sure. I mean, very much so. And anytime anyone who knows me knows, there's definitely like a heart exterior, but it's very sweet inside. And yeah, I do fit it, but I love that. And frankly, the cool thing about Israel, I don't know if you got this vibe when you were there too. It is very spiritual. Like, there's a huge part. I mean, if I went there right now and talked about meditation,

like probably almost every other person I spoke to would be like, oh my god, I was meditating today or this. I find it's actually their little head of the game in that regard too. So how did you get into meditation? You know, I wish my story was more interesting. I always, because I feel like most people hit a crisis point and then they find meditation. And mine was the opposite, but it is very me. Things in my life just kind of do happen. I've always been a very open person. I was working NBC was my last job. I was on the television side. Tell me more about that. So I was a TV exec. So I was running comedy at NBC. He was my last job. Running comedy. And what does that mean? So like I always say if you really

know nothing about TV, if you're a sign-fled watcher, remember when they used to go in and pitch their shows to like the NBC execs? That was me like on the other end, like telling you, yes, no, great. Let's work on it. And then developing the shows. And so I'd be here every, you know, every, you know, spring for up fronts and all that. So actually being in the conference room, I was like, ooh, this is kind of like flashbacks, like on the TVs and the feeling, which I love. And I really did enjoy it. We parked you in a conference room before the podcast

and they were saying, okay, ooh, sorry. No, not at all. It was great. I've been here because I traveled. So, no, that's fine. Like I said, it brought back actually, like good memories. So, for me, I was doing that and I was in a crazy job. My life was a little insane. I was about to kind of go through a divorce and I woke up one morning and was just like, I think I need to meditate. I don't know why. And it wasn't even, it was before

the time article came out. It was before like everybody was talking about it. And something just made me say it and typical male is like, all right, let me get into that. Let me research it. And that day at lunch, I was telling a friend of mine. And I was like, oh, I feel like I want to meditate. Do you know anyone I need a teacher? I need something. I don't even know where to begin. Like I knew nothing.

She's like, oh, that's so funny. Here, I know these two great girls who are actually on NBC at the time, who just did it too. I'll get their name of the teacher for you. I go, perfect. They were on NBC shows. Yeah, they were two actors. And so I went to go take out my phone to text one of my best

friends who worked with me at NBC to say, hey, would you want to do this with me? I'm about to get this number. And I'm not joking. When I took out my phone, she just text me and say, hey, I just got hooked up with this teacher to learn to meditate. Would you have any interest in my head?

I mean, it was bizarre. And so we did. It was me, my friend Renata, our head of casting, and the three of us learned TM from a teacher, transnational, transnational mediation. And it was great. And it was kind of hilarious because we were doing it. We would literally do it in our conference room or in one of our rooms.

And since I ran the department, I could carve it out in our schedule. So my friend and I, every day day at X time for 20 minutes, like they knew not to interrupt us. That's what we were doing in anyone else who wanted to join. And to be honest, like that's how I got into it. And the reason I ended up starting doing what I do was because I was looking to keep my practice regular and I couldn't do it.

I'm such the average human being where actually getting up and doing it and doing it at home was difficult for me. So I was trying to do it twice today and I kept saying, where can I... Because TM, they tell you do 20 minutes twice. TM, at that time, I've heard now they've gone down to 10 minutes. That's what I heard. Really?

Okay. Because I think there are like, yeah, people are really struggling with that 20. But yeah, they tell you 20 minutes, twice a day, and a perfect world. And so I was struggling with that second 20 minutes. So I kept saying, oh, that's a big deal. I'll go somewhere before work or I'll go somewhere after work and just hit a class. And then I can do my mantra while I'm there. And I'll be held accountable. And then I'll have a great practice. I'll be actually doing it regularly. And it didn't exist. So, and I couldn't believe that. I'm like, I can do yoga booty ballet. I can do any possible thing I

want. Really, there's crossfit. There's yoga. There's, I mean do any possible thing I want really. There's CrossFit, there's yoga, there's, I mean, really everything you can take a class for and there was no meditation. So you opened up Dan? Yeah, the Dan meditation. Not like the not the next day, but yeah, that's when the idea started percolating for me. Now TM, which is the type of meditation you do? Yes, I kind of do a combination. You know what, as I say, you always have your mantra. So I always kind of rely on it and I mix it with other things.

But yeah, I mean, I expand. It's kind of why I love having a center. I kind of open myself up to all these different, but that's me as a human. I like different things. I like to be stimulated in different ways. So I like having variety. But you can't teach TM outside of TM.

So what do you teach in the studio? Yeah, we don't do TM. Though some people come in and do Veda classes, which is essentially the same idea. They do a four-day class, but yes. Now, in general, we do either mindfulness-based classes, some Buddhism-based classes, focus-based classes, anchor classes, all different styles,

and they're anywhere between 30 minutes to 45 minute guided classes. So they guide you through 30 minutes to 45 minute guided classes. So they guide you through a meditation. So instead of like an app, you're coming in and you're actually sitting down with a teacher in front of you and guiding you through a meditation. So I read, and this may be not true, so you'll correct me, that part of what led you to the den was that you had you you were kind of Elst it from your job. Oh, well typical and anyone in those jobs. Yeah, that job ended

I took time though. I I knew what happened there I mean, it was just I was running the department when you're running a creative department It's a matter of time you either leave or like your contract ends my boss who and also I wasn't happy like I was at a studio Before the network. I was at Sony, which I loved, and I think inherently as an executive, I was probably more of a studio exec. Difference being, I know I can see your face, difference being, you're more hands-on on the projects on the studio side, like really, at least back then, I mean the world's changed so much, but creatively, I was more part of the process on a studio side. On the network side, you get it,

like three steps removed. So you're still creatively in it. It's just slightly more corporate, a little bit more about the marketing and getting it on the schedule. And the studio, like you could really, for me, get behind a project, be super passionate about a bunch of stuff and creatively stimulate your brain, which I love doing. Like one of my favorite things of that job was sitting now with the writer and just like getting into it. So, so for me, I think I was my soul,

if we want to speak, and that broad sense was a little bit less happy. I was also going through a ton of stuff, like I said, I was going through a divorce. And I know me, and this is where my ex-boss and I have not spoken about it since, but where I would love to say, sorry, to her is, when I'm not happy or not being fulfilled, especially in my job, the thing you have to do every day,

oh, it's the worst version of me, like any of us, when you're not doing what you're supposed to do, it brings out the worst version of yourself. So she got that last year or so, the more, I get very impatient. Like very impatient. What does that look like? You do it.

The Israeli side of me comes out. It's, I'm a little bitchy. Like it's, I mean, to be honest, like get impatient, I get, I think, you know, if I feel like someone's not smart enough, it's, I wear everything on my sleeve. I, the good and the bad and with me, like you see it clearly.

Like if I'm annoyed, you feel it. So that's hard to work with sometimes, especially when you're, higher level, you're running the whole place, like you need someone a little bit easier, I think in that regard, even though I kicked ass in the job, I think it was more. And I get it. So I mean, I had already been laying the groundwork the last year of my contract, like even having conversations with my boyfriend slash husband, which we talked about earlier,

saying, hey, you're referring to him as your boyfriend slash husband, depends on the conversation. So I had already been laying the groundwork there within the last year saying, hey, my contract's up this year. I don't feel like doing the, you're supposed to go out and like do a bunch of interviews and get another job lined up because frankly, I need a break.

So if this, you know, even if they offer me another round, I don't know if I necessarily want to do it. Are you okay if I take time? Like if I just don't. And he was amazing about it. I have to say he was. And that's what I did. I took a break and nobody could believe it.

I mean, all the phone calls I got afterwards because people were so supportive and job offers. Nobody believed. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, I actually, I'm giving myself three months minimum. And everyone's like, no, like someone came. It was great. Offered me a job. I said, I need three months minimum. They call me a week later.

They're like, so I said I said three months. It offered me a job. I said, I need three months minimum. They call me a week later. They're like, so? I said, I said three months. It's been a week. Oh, we thought it was like a Jewish three months. We totally thought you were going to be back. I'm like, no, I actually need the time. So I followed, I've always been really good about following what I need

and not even not always understanding it, but following it. And so I think the more distance I had and this job was, I mean, this idea of the meditation studio was always in the back of my brain and something we were talking about. And it was actually a big deal. I didn't do it right away because I did really need the time. I needed a time to kind of refuel, but that was always kind of percolating. You said before that part of why you want to do this is that to bring a meditation studio

into existence was that nobody else was doing it. But there are other people doing it, right? For sure. And now every day, it's crazy. We laugh. But when I was looking, nobody was doing that type of studio. You could, for instance, when I came for up front that spring, I was in New York. I'm like, oh, New York has everything. They'll have it here. No. And at that time, it didn't exist either. So I was at the Dharma Center for like three hours, which by the way, I loved and had a great afternoon, but that's when the whole thing crystallized for me.

I was like, hey, most people don't have three hours every time they want to go meditate. Like you have it in a special occasion or when you have it, but in today's day, most people are running around a little bit crazier. Secondly, I remember looking around and even though I loved the Dharma Center and I loved everything about it,

I was like, I could not bring half of my friends. this they'd be freaked out. What are we supposed to do? I eat meat are they gonna smell it on me like what's happening? And that's when it crystallizes me to this Has to if we can create a place that's easy Nobody feels like there's a stereotype like oh, I need to be super woo-woo or I have to be a vegan or I God What if they know I like to drink or I've done any of that. It's like, no, just be who you are. I say that to everyone all the time. I don't care if you eat meat or if you're a vegan. I don't care if you're super woo-woo or the idea of spirituality actually makes you nervous. All of that is acceptable because it's who you are. And we're always evolving and we're always changing.

And so for me, it was important to create a space that everybody felt like they could come and belong because spirituality or meditation or just inner calmness should be for everybody. It shouldn't feel like only certain people can subscribe. So you were talking about Dharma centers before. You can go to a Buddhist Dharma center. They're all over the place. Absolutely. It makes things.

Absolutely. It makes things existed before. Yes, they existed before. But now we have these secular centers. Like in L.A., there's unplugging you and some other places in New York, we have Mindful MDFL, which is Lodro Rinsler, is a friend of mine who's been on the podcast.

What's the difference between what the dentist is? I love Lodro and them, they're great. I would say, and I'm sure Lodro talked about this too, it's, I think it's not only the secular, because I think there were also areas of secular meditation that you could go to, but it was the same thing. There were these intense places

where you were signing up for long programs, or you'd be there for hours. Again, amazing. I think what these places do is they fit a different need, which is how in the busy society, whether you're a parent, or you have a busy job, or you're just creatively entwined in something, can you fit it in and feel like, not only can you learn to do it, make it regular, and for some people

just be held accountable. I mean, everyone's different. Some people can go home and do push-ups and sit-ups every day, but other people need a trainer. You can always go outside and run, but some people need to be in the gym. You can do a yoga awesome at home as well, but people need someone to guide them through it. So I think having a place where you're accountable

and can go in and out and it doesn't necessarily take all day is hugely helpful. Not only that, I mean, and every center is different, but to have the opportunity to hear from different teachers and get different insights and really figure out what works for you is also huge. Do your customers use it every day like they would use a gym?

Everyone's different. So yes, we absolutely have people like that who are members that have their set classes that they love and they're there. And we also create a community. We have bigger events. We also do workshops. So you can come in for the two and a half hours and do those longer practices. We do retreats. We're all over. Like we're going to Italy and Marge. We are in Bali before and Greece in the summer. So we do retreats as well. We're about to early February and bark on a five day silent retreat, no hi. So we really do make sure there's other ways to expand your practice.

So it doesn't feel like you're just a beginner in coming in for 30 minutes. There's tons of ways. Once a month, we do a two hour sit. So there's tons of ways and an ability for people to feel like they belong and can constantly evolve with it. But everyone uses it differently. For some people, it's like they wake up,

they're having a day and they're like, I want to run in and take a class. Some people, it's just regular and that's what keeps them going. I always wondered about that in terms of using it the way you use a gym because, you know, so my wife and I go to a soul cycle, right? So, but I can barely fit that in. That's the problem. If I had to go to a meditation center center too as part of my daily meditation, it would be, I wouldn't have time to go. So the key word there is you said too. And I think it's all a matter of priority.

And I think where meditation hasn't gotten quite yet, it's not yet on people's priority list. Now it feels like something superfluous. I'm like, oh, it's great. And when I go, I feel amazing, but I don't need it. I really need to sweat because I need to be healthy. And I think what, where it's slowly becoming part of the vernacular is people are really like, no, that is also part of being healthy. And it might not be a

physical sweat, but it is just as important for like my mental, you know, well-being. So again, and then it becomes the priority. Like you said, well, I go to SoulSycle and probably the reason you squeeze it in is because that's where you actually exercise. It's harder for you to do it at home. Or my wife wouldn't be mad at me. Or she drags her. Either way, she's dragging you because that's where you actually exercise. It's harder for you to do it at home. Yeah, or my wife wouldn't be mad at me. Or she drags her. Either way, she's dragging you because that's like what's important in your household. And I think, like that tells me, and I hope just for everyone's, you know, well-being,

that that's what's going to be happening with meditation. I think people will start to understand the importance of it as the full well-being package. No, I get that, but I guess my question is if you believe that both are important as I firmly do, how do you go to both locations in one day if you are busy? Right. I mean, I think I know that's the problem. I think that's when it becomes priority what works for you and I think you split up like if you really are someone like that, I'd be like Monday I do my meditation on Tuesday, I go to yoga on Wednesday, I do do whatever it is I think you at least that's how I do stuff

I kind of mix things up in general. I rarely do the same. I mean I barely exercise anymore anyway, but that's a problem We can discuss that later. Why is that why stuff? I mean, it's just more of the same like you said busy I run a I run a business I joke I joke that like the thing I do is work my ass off to put out the ability for other people to Find space in their day is running a meditation center as stressful as being the person who runs comedy at NBC? Different, but yeah, it's on my shoulders entirely, meaning like if it doesn't, you know, it's still a business is what I like tell people I don't want anyone who walks in the door to feel that it's a business that's not their concern like they should feel that it's the space and the calmness.

It should be a sanctuary for everybody else, but in order to create, it's like hotels, in order to create the most calm environment where people go and can relax, behind the scenes are working their ass off, you know. So it's the same idea, it's still a business that you're running and making sure it's, you know, running smoothly and that you can still provide it. And how is the business going? It's going well. I mean, I can't complain.

We just open our second studio. Oh, really? And I don't know how well you know Los Angeles, but in the valley. And it's great. And again, I mean, the best part about it is just watching the community grow and watching people grow. And what is your vision for? Do you think we're going to see secular meditation centers all over America

the way we would see Pilates studio and things like that? I do. I think it's already starting. It's just, it's small, but it's already starting. I mean, LA is always a little bit out of the curve and you can already see it. They're popping up everywhere. So a thousand percent. So meditation studios are popping up everywhere. How do you compete? We just, you know what? Like, and you'll appreciate this because I know you do the work. It's like, I just keep doing what I'm doing and I try not to look at it like that. I try and know that there's, you know, like the business side of me is always like, whoa,

and then the other part of me goes, look, there's a room enough for all of us. Everybody in this world needs some of this and just keep doing what you're doing. And if I keep doing it well and like what I write, and I think I am, if I keep doing it well, and keep, you know, doing it 100%, it'll go the way it's supposed to go. Stay tuned more of our conversation is on the way after this. Raising kids can be one of the greatest rewards of a parent's life but come on someday parenting is unbearable. I love my kid but is a new parenting podcast from Wondry that shares of our freshly honest

and insightful take on parenting. Hosted by myself, Megan Galey, Chris Garcia, and Kurt Brown-Oller, we will be your resident not-so-expert experts. Each week we'll share a parenting story that'll have you laughing, nodding, and thinking. Oh yeah, I have absolutely been there. We'll talk about what went right and wrong. What would we do differently? And the next time you step on yet another stray Lego in the middle of the night, you'll

feel less alone. So if you like to laugh with us as we talk about the hardest job in the world, listen to, I love my kid, but wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen ad free on the Amazon Music or Wondery app. What is your personal practice? So my personal practice, kind of a little bit on the exercise practice, is it's finally a little bit back on track. I have a two-year-old at home as well.

So the business and the baby happen all at the same time. So I always say the honest truth, because I'm not a great liar, is, oh, my personal practice went to, went this place for a soap. And that's what I laughed. I was like, oh my God, the one person who's like, it just, anyone has become a mom, a practice or an exercise or anything,

usually kind of goes on the side anyway. So if you add both of those, it was, there's a lot. And it's nice, I'm getting it back, which has been great. But it is all I do it when I can. So, and it's harder for me to personally do it in my own center because it's my own. So I go in as a business owner. So, you know, because I'm always trying to make the space better and make it perfect for people. So I do a lot in the shower, which is a waste of water, I know. But, and a lot of times like when my daughter's napping, because you know, it's just one less thing

that's in front of your face. My practice, I still do a lot of TM, I use my mantra, but I do mix it with a lot of gratitude practice. I kind of make up my own stuff as I go. I hate to say like I'm a big, it's like, it's hard to explain. Like, I do tend to feel like I connect to something.

And depending what I need for the day, I kind of go in that direction. Connect to something. I don't know. Like, the bigger, whatever you believe in, whether it's like a bigger power or a God or those watching, whatever your spiritual philosophy is if you have one or not. So for me, I always feel like I'm connecting into like, people taking care of me. If that makes sense. Tell me more.

Like, power, whether it be like, I start like souls or like guides. Like my guides, like my spirit guides. Like I do feel like I have spirit guides that look out for me. I feel like I'm very lucky that way. And my meditation, if I ask a question, the answer usually comes pretty quickly. So and I always giggle. It's kind of like, sometimes I'm loud in meditation. Like, there's been times I've meditated over something,

and I just start giggling, because I'm like, I know, it's almost like I'm arguing with someone. Like, I get it, and I am. I'm arguing with myself, but it's like, it's like, I know, I know. I didn't have to meditate for that answer, but thanks. When you say meditate over something, you mean sit and quietly think about something? Yeah, like, sometimes if I'm in a bad place,

or if I have a question that's really bothering me, like about something I know I need to work on on myself, I will sometimes put it out there, like I'll just meditate and just put it out in the beginning of my meditation. Like, I need help with this, or I need answers with this, or I'm struggling with equanimity, or I'm struggling with, you know, acceptance,

whatever it is, like anything, you know, and usually if I really get to that place where I'm asking, I don't ask all of the time. It's not like every time I sit down, I'm asking for something. I don't think the world works that way. But if I'm really struggling with something internally, and no matter how much I kind of analyze it or accept it, I feel like I know there's something else I should be personally doing to kind of work with it. I'll kind of put it out there and almost always, by the end of the meditation,

it's pretty clear what my next step needs to be. Does that make sense? I know that sounds really weird. Yeah, well, I, you know, I, I, I am an avowed anti, or sort of, I know, I could tell by your face. Well, I'm not, I don't believe in things I can't prove, right? So that's basically, I'm an agnostic. That being said, I can just only speak from my own personal experience that there are

times, especially in the creative process of writing, where I'll bump up against what seems like an unsolvable problem. And if I can walk away, if I can tear myself away from my work and sit and meditate where I'm not, you know, consciously trying to think about anything. I'm trying to focus on my breath and then when I get distracted, which I do a million times, I start again and again and again. Sometimes an answer will come. Sometimes it's not the answer I want or it's not even the answer to the question I thought I was asking. That's what I was asking. It's always the answer you need. Right. Or it's not even the answer to the question I thought I was

asking. Right. But sometimes things happen that way. And there's some, from what I understand, there's some brain science that explains that the best way in creativity is to think, think, think, work, work, work, stress, stress, stress, and then stop. And then the answer may come in the show. It's funny that happened to me the other day too. I was kind of struggling with a creative idea myself, and I was in the shower. And I was like, just met at the same time,

I was like, oh, I don't have an idea for that. I can't do it. And then I was in the shower meditating and I literally was like, oh, that's exactly the idea. So I agree. So yeah, whether you believe in higher power or just yourself, which honestly in the long run, I think that's exactly what it is.

It's just a version of like tuning into yourself and actually being able to communicate with yourself. I would say, because people are like, oh, I do meditate, is it this? And they go through all the benefits and there's a million. But for me, it's always, and it always has been, you just, honestly, just get to know yourself better. Period. Like that to me is the best thing about meditation. Because when you know who you are, for good or for bad, and you accept it and learn to love it, everything's just so much easier. Like it just helps you navigate life. I find just much easier.

That was actually leads to what I was going to ask you. How have you changed since you started meditating? You were by your own description, type A, hard charging, network, executive, and what I would have to imagine is a very tough environment. Yes. How are you different now? You know, I'm still the same person. I think it's where it helps me the most because I've always been the type of person who kind of, you know, marches would be to my own drum. Like even in those atmospheres,

I was the one like showing up with like flip flops and a t-shirt and went to work. And I mean, I would get the lecture all the time. I really should dress better and stuff like that. But I was always like, I got it. Like I'm creating, like let me do my thing. I was always very secure with who I was. And I knew if I pretended to be anybody else, I would just suck it all of it. So that was always like, I got it, like, I'm creating, like, let me do my thing. I was always very secure with who I was and I knew if I pretended to be anybody else, I would just suck it all of it.

So that was always something I've always known, weirdly, from a young age, which has been helpful. So I think meditation for me just enhanced that. And also, I also say it allows you to take like a global look at everything. So you just have the ability to react, whether it be in situations that you're in, or even just seeing other situations more clearly. Like I just find that you have the ability, I say like it gives you like a nice maturity. Do you know what I mean?

Like, you don't, if we all get angry at things, we all get pissed, we all get jealous. I mean, these are all things none of us I think can avoid, or I'm impressed if you can't. I can't. Like I still have all of those basic emotions, but I have the ability, I think, sometimes to stop and put it in check. And know sometimes, okay, let's go back to NBC. When that job ended, and I knew I didn't want to be there, I knew it, the brain part of me knew it,

but the minute it was happening, I'm like, oh, here comes B-go, like sad, upset, and I remember telling my boyfriend slash husband that night because I was, I had to go through the motions, I was sad, I was crying, I was at a Billie Joel concert that night because I was I had to go through motions I was sad I was crying. I was at a Billy Joel concert that night just getting my drunk and He was like are you all get gonna be okay? I'm like, yeah, yeah, I'm really good And I knew it like I have the ability in that moment to say I'm actually really good I know I didn't want to be there my ego needs to heal

So I just need time for this ego and frankly I think because I was so aware of the difference of my ego and me, it wasn't very long. Like I'm saying, like within a week, I felt like I was like, oh, good, feeling great versus I think any other time would have taken me as far as that emotional component would have taken on much longer to heal. It's interesting because a lot of people worry. One of the big obstacles, I think for some people to meditation is that they fear they're going to lose their edge. No, you're always who you are. If you have edge, your edge is just going to still come out.

That's the beauty. It just makes you a shinier version of you. So it doesn't make us all the same blob of one another. I think that's people's fears. We're all going to become, the goal is to become this, which means we're all striving for the same thing. Everyone assumes they're going to be exactly like the other person who's doing it. And it's not that, the goal is to become the best version of yourself.

So if your personality is still there, if you're funny, you're probably going to get funnier. If you know your, like all that is just going to get enhanced. It's just you have a clear sense of who you are. So you have a clear sense of navigating life and a clear sense how not to react like it. Yes, I agree with that. Although you may stop caring about some of the things you used to care about. But maybe that was getting in the way of you being the best version of yourself. Right.

But if you've, if you, if you're not clear enough yet to know that it's getting in the way or, or, you know, like some people really are convinced that actually the thing that's going to make them happy is endless accumulation of dollars. I'm, by the way, I'm a capitalist, so I'm not against, well, but some people are convinced that that is the, yes, or that, you know, in order to get there, you have to be limitlessly cruel. But, right, which is, I mean, that just actually made my whole chest get tight. But I always say, also being spiritual or getting in touch with this stuff doesn't mean you're also giving up, like you were saying, giving up the ability to make money or have

money. Sometimes that stuff ends up flowing better when you actually get in tune with who you are. You might just be doing it for the right reasons. So if you are someone who thinks, again, I also think we're all here for different reasons. And I'm sure this is past like where your beliefs are, but I do believe we're all here. So it depends what you're here and what you're supposed to be doing. So some people are here to be so really successful because it allows them to spread a message,

a certain message. And they're kind of born to be rich and famous. And that's just going to happen. They could probably try and lose it 10 times over and they're going to just stumble back into it because that's like they're meant to have that power in order to do a greater good or something else with it. I think we're all here doing something and I think the meditation kind of makes it clear what it is. It doesn't mean, oh no, also now I'm going to be going to foreign countries and saving

the world and helping kids. That's not necessarily your mission. I think everyone assumes one's equated with the other. Your mission might be as simple as something like a relationship with your parent. It could be as simple as teaching. It could be maybe a company and it's a capitalistic venture, but that company is providing something bigger. Who knows?

I think people get too wrapped up in, and that was my whole point about wanting when I had a specific vision for the center was, I don't want people to feel like you're entering this angelic world. I mean, I think if you meditate a lot and get in touch with yourself, you will feel more angelic, but it's not like you're walking into something you're leaving your identity to become this perfect human being. You're becoming a perfect you, whatever that means. What are the biggest obstacles you see among your customers to embracing this habit?

I think some people are also scared of getting to know themselves a little bit. I mean, it's a scary prospect for all of us. We're not all, you know, we all have ugly sides and I think it's really tricky for people to embrace the sides of themselves that aren't great, even from little things to big. I also think, you know, people get knocked down. People come in a lot of times when things are wrong. And it's hard, but I mean, I love that we can be there for someone, but deaths in the family breakups, losing a job,

identity shifts, things that really rock your world. You actually don't know who you are in that moment anymore. Identity crises, I find a lot of people come in looking kind of for salvation in that regard. So then I think what happens is it really helps them and then they're feeling great. So I think the struggle is kind of to bring this conversation full circle becomes again people realizing how important it is for maintenance versus being the fix. So I think people start to feel really good again and it really gets them something hard

and then they're like, okay, I'm good. Got it. Thanks. I mean, I actually think that sometimes it. Thanks. You know what I mean? I mean, I actually think that sometimes falling off the wagon can be valuable in that you see, we just stop practicing how you see how obnoxious your internearator becomes in those times and that can be very useful. Yeah, for sure.

I mean, like anything, you don't know what you have until you lose it. Right. So absolutely. But you just hope you can get them back because for their own sake, because a lot of times it gets confusing. Again, it's a message. It gets confusing people to figure stuff out for themselves. So when you launched, there were all these pictures of you with, I get some actors that you know from my old world. Yeah. So are those folks like Anna Kendrick was in the pictures? Do you get a lot of celebrities?

We do have some celebrities actually. And we get and it's nice actually because I'm not always in the center anymore. Did I do a lot of the business if I'm in there? I actually don't get as much work done. So it's nice everyone's one one pops up. I'm like, oh, I'm so glad they're visiting. And unfortunately, he's been unbelievably busy. So that girl's like running all over the place and isn't anywhere long enough to do to go into an actual center. But yeah, we do. Like Amanda, actually, who's in probably that same picture, you're afraid to stay free. She comes all the time. Wow. So yeah. The people don't bother her. No, you know, that's kind of the beauty about that space. It would actually be weird, since it is all about being like internal. And most of the time when you're in class, you're closing your if you don't have to but most people do.

So it actually is a very respectful place that way. When you were, I'm just curious, this has nothing to do with meditation, but I'm always so interested in the entertainment world. What were the shows you were overseeing in NBC? It's funny, someone was actually asking me this the other day and I forgot so much. I was like, oh my god, I'm so disconnected. I mean, it was still, it was the end of like the office days. It was like right before the office went out there. And we were struggling a little bit.

It was a hard time. And I'm trying to think of shows that even people know was like, I don't even, it's funny. I really had this conversation that I was like, I cannot actually remember half the, I did an entertainment. Isn't that weird? That's a lot of stuff to forget. It's a lot. Like, I literally was like trying to name it the other day. I'm like, I did an entertainment, is that weird? That's a lot of stuff to forget. It's a lot. I literally was trying to name it the other day. I'm like, I am so disconnected.

I can tell you the writers I loved working with, I can tell you, you know what I mean? You don't miss it. No, because that's not how I operate. I, everyone's like, so you're never going back. I'm like, oh, I never say never. I'm a creative human. And I do love that world right now in this moment.

And since then, I've not missed it. That doesn't mean I'm not gonna wake up one day and be like, oh I'm having a hankering for doing a show. I also have friends who like some new material and like I help work on it like from behind the scenes here and there to like just exercise those muscles. But I know I've never that was never an issue for me. I never divine myself by what I do though. I never have like To me, it's always in addition to who I am, like something's fun that I'm doing in that moment. I think that's part of the reason I'm struggling

with answering some of those questions, which is especially in that job, I'm so glad I didn't define myself. I always went in and people are like, oh my god, you have this and that. I'm like, I'll be fire, I'm sure I'll be fired in like four years, that's what happens. And I was like, you're renting this chair,

like anyone who actually uses that power, it's sad because it's a rotating job. And we're just people, like we're all people just doing a job, like whether you're behind the scenes or in front of the scenes, whether you're the actress or the actor or the writer or the executive yelling at everybody,

we're all just people doing jobs. And so I loved it. I'm still so close to all of my close friends are all in the business, because that's where I was raised. So all my close friends and family in Los Angeles are still in entertainment. So it's not like I don't hear about it or participate in it. I just, it just was never, even this,

like I own a meditation studio. But if you met me on the street, or if we were at a dinner party and just chatting, unless you asked me, I wouldn't lead with that. It's just not how I operate, if that makes sense. It does. Yeah. So that was really helpful with the job ending and changing. And now I'm like, oh, I just, it's, to me, I'm always wherever I am.

So this is working right now. I'm loving doing it. And but I'm always open. I've always been open to seeing where everything takes me. What are the range of services you offer at the den? Tons of services. So the basic one that we open with, is the basic one of your classes, guided classes,

45 minutes, 30 minutes classes, guided meditation. Guided meditation. So different styles. So like we were saying earlier to repeat myself, whether it be a mindfulness class, whether it be a focus based class, whether it be a booted in the based class, we also, we split it, we do a little woo-woo stuff for lack of a better term, you know, we do rakey healing classes, we do actual healing classes, we do some

Kunalini yoga. Actual healing, what does that mean? Like it with class that's healing like through a satin om type of, you know, Kunalini breathing therapy. And that you can heal a disease? Yeah, they're teaching people how to connect with their inner healer and how to like understand people's like energy fields. Yeah. So that's what I'm saying. Some of our classes can go, we will also, we, we're, we're for everything. And my favorite thing about people walking in and like, no, that's not for me. And everyone always ends up trying everything.

And you just watch and see how people are really surprised what resonates for them. So I saw in the list sound baths. We do a ton of sound baths. That's... You do a ton of sound baths. Sound baths is the type of thing. I don't know anything about it. Oh my God, when you came out of LA. I've always made fun of them.

So why am I wrong? I mean, well, how are you making fun of them? I've just become someone idiot. You know, at the very basic, a sound bath really is a sound healing, which means, and there's so many different forms now, but whether it's like traditionally with like a crystal bowl and the crystals themselves, if you believe in crystals, which I know you don't, I can tell, have different healing properties. But even then, I think as just a human who, like, sound in general, you know when you hear a song you like, or if you're, and when you go to a live concert or if you go to the Philharmonic

or something live, the feeling is different than when you're hearing it on the radio, correct, or like on your screen player. Because you can literally feel the vibrations. So starting from there, that's the same thing you're in a room where someone's playing instruments that vibrate, I mean, it is pretty amazing too. If you have an incredible healer who can really play these bowls, you literally will feel the vibrations going through.

So I would say, at the very least, it's that. At that, you feel vibrations. If you believe in more and they're healing vibrations, and you have a really great healer who will tell you this is for this, and this is for that, and you can get, I also think it's a great time to just get into a deep meditation. So I tell people like you, when they come in,

they're like, I'm a skeptic, I say, at the very least you'll lie down and you're relaxed. That's at the very least, like at the very least. If you can go deeper and you have the ability to go deeper, you could probably have a really trippy meditation. You might have a really big opening because it just helps push you further, I find. And nowadays there's so many different styles. I mean, and it's interesting to see there's a lot of musicians who are just trying to like become sound healers. And it's fascinating

to see the different levels and different skill levels. And we have, there's shamanic killers, and there's people who just love the vibrations and the sounds and the mixing of it, but no matter what, it is a pretty amazing experience. You should give it a try, at least. Yeah, I probably should. And then they fun a bit afterwards.

Yeah, well, I reserve the right to do that. When you say healer, is that, do we have to be careful about saying, because you don't wanna say, yeah, you have breast cancer come on in here Well, he'll you say that it's funny that you say that It's funny. I was just who was I talking to a few months ago about this about like what are the you know like any industry you get terminology and the healers kind of the new one now some healers for lack of better word Hate using that word for that exact reason it feels like it puts them in like God complex, like in a higher realm, like who am I?

I'm not healing people. They have to heal. They're truly usually like people have to heal themselves. I can just aid in the process. You can also be the word practitioner. I think you have to be careful. Absolutely like anyone coming in and wanting a quick fix. We do get a lot of people struggling and are in chemo and come in and it actually has been a great

survival tool for people really helpful in the process. We had a lot actually, that's actually been more common than I ever thought in opening the studio. But no, we never like, we're going to fix you. I mean, because we can't guarantee that, we can't do that. I think it's again, we can help make you feel better, which hopefully in turn will help your healing process.

There are, I would imagine a lot of challenges to running a bit, any business, but in this business, in terms of the meditation game, what are the biggest challenges? Is it finding good teachers, is it getting enough customers? What's the big, what are the big things? Well, the good news as meditation explodes, the teachers are more prevalent. So there's just more teachers. You got to make sure they're qualified. 1000%. We actually just started our own teacher training program that we're in round two that just started this weekend actually.

And that's been really amazing for that reason because it's like we really want people to understand the history of meditation, the lineages where when they're, because I say there's a modern day meditation teacher now that's changed. Like the voice has changed a little bit. It's a little bit of a malgum. They're not all teaching necessarily just one lineage. I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing as long as they're educated and understand where their voice comes from and why they've chosen to blend whatever it is that their voice

is blending. It's a 400-hour certification. It's actually pretty intense. Yes, finding certified people can be a struggle, but they're more and more of them now than when we first open. For sure, people going through different programs on the UCLA program, which for us is, you know, because we're in Los Angeles. Also look on the customer service side, it's tricky too, because you have to, sometimes

you're really dealing with people in a tough time of their life. So you can be dealing with people when they're at a rocky place. And so it's the reminder that you're dealing with people's livelihoods too, and their happiness, and how to juggle that sometimes, like, and make sure we can be there as emotional support, but also make sure the boundaries are in place. I would say that can actually be a bigger struggle than people realize, because it's the one, it's a differenti shading factor than most businesses. Yeah, yes, I can only imagine.

I mean, I have an app business, but we have coaches who talk to our customers, but you don't know them. I'm not doing it. But you are probably in some of these cases actually interfacing with folks. In the beginning, I was everything. I mean, I was the front, I was everything, and I was completely interfacing. And it's, in some ways, it's what I loved.

I mean, it blends, doing what I'm doing now really does blend like a lot of sides of me in the most perfect way. And I love talking to people. I mean, I love it. I love hearing what people are going through, but it's a lot. Yeah, it's trying. And it's, yes, and it can be trying. And it can be trying and it can be hard. So that's been a big learning thing for me personally

of having to also know how to separate and make sure. So I can have the energy to keep growing the business so it can be provided for people. Because you do, people don't realize that they put their stuff on you, not on purpose. No one does it on purpose, but it does happen. They're, you familiar with the term, make mindfulness, you know about this?

No, but that's funny. So there's this, I mean, I get it. There's a school of people traditionally from the sort of traditional Buddhist world who worry that mindfulness is now being commodified. Absolutely. What's your, do you think capitalism and meditation, I mean, I think I'm probably closer to your view on this,

given that I sell books and have an app. Do you think there's any danger mixing capitalism and meditation? Look, I think it's how the world turns. I mean, it's the benefit and negative of trying to make something appeal to the masses. And I only think meditation appealing to the masses is better for everyone and only think meditation appealing to the masses is better for everyone and part of doing that is doing exactly what we're doing and making it easy for people to get to. And look, that's yoga. I mean, there's a yoga studio on every corner everywhere. And if you talk to the purists 15 years ago, I'm sure there was, or maybe more, yeah, 15,

20 years ago, I'm sure there's a bunch of people still reeling in the corner angry about what's happened to yoga. But in the long run, is it better that there's all these people who are kind of practicing and inward practice that's actually making them slightly healthier and mentally healthier? I think so. So I think that's unfortunately just part of

how you provide things to the masses. So it's the good and the bad. I get it. I'm a purist in some ways for many things. So I understand the feeling. I'm not a purist in this regard. So I understand that feeling. You get annoyed when people like discover it or like I get it, but in this regard, you want to feel like it's the better. It's the higher good. It's just better for

everyone. Yeah, I mean, my response is actually think that make mindfulness folks make some good critiques personally. I'm sure. But my view at the end of the day is more mindfulness is better than less mindfulness. Absolutely. You have a two-year-old boy or girl. Girl. What's your name? Levy. Levy. Yeah.

Cute name. Thank you. When and how will you teach her to meditate or will you? It's funny. It's just funny. I've been actually thinking about it lately now that she's like, not that it's going to happen tomorrow. But we do little things.

I won't teach her eventually. We're also in Los Angeles. It's in so many schools now Yeah, it's part of like the program which is really cute and great and helpful She we already do things like everyone's all joke. We'll be like love eat deep breaths with mom and she'll go And like to her it's just like a joke. I can't get my the three or like can't get them to take deep breaths like that You know what it is like she's learning cuz we're in LA. So she's learning to swim And I think honestly that helps her more than me doing it because like they take these deep breaths like that. You know what it is? She's learning because we're in LA, so she's learning to swim.

And I think honestly, that helps her more than me doing it because they take these deep breaths before they go underwater if I'm going to really out myself. I would love to take credit for it. But you know what I've started doing? I've realized I didn't realize I was doing it until my husband pointed out, I do things more like identifying emotions.

And she's too young to have a conversation, understand it, but she's a strong girl. I mean, she came out that way. She was just strong and feisty and knows what she wants and like just loud and tough. And so whenever she's like, you know, she's in the cheerleaf, whenever she starts like during the tantrum and you can tell where she's angry or I say no, and she wanted it. So then it's like screaming. And let her just kind of do it. I let her have it. And like somewhere in the middle like when she's taking a breath I'll look at her and be like, are you frustrated? Are you sad? Whatever it is, are you sad? Are you frustrated? It's funny. If I

say like, sad, she might ignore me. If I say, angry, she might ignore me. And then if I'm like, are you frustrated, she'll be like, yeah. So it's like this weird thing that even at two, like because I'm helping her identify it, she can say. And then I'll just say, yeah, being frustrated, it's a hard feeling, huh? Like I'll say something like that. That's tough, huh? And she'll just be like, yeah, and I don't tell her to stop. I don't tell her to correct it. I just, I'm happy she knows.

Well, just know that this is frustration. Just know that this is something else. It's not everything. And I started doing stuff like that with her too. Like the other day, she wanted to do something. And I asked her, I'm like, are you this, are you this, are you scared? She was, yeah, we'll be scared. And I was like, okay, it's good to know.

It's good to know you're scared. So in a weird way, I'm bringing it in that way. No, that's not weird, that sounds great. You know what I mean? I'm just trying to get her because I feel like, as parents, everyone's so afraid now of like, any kid having an emotion, which I think is so wrong. I mean, everyone like so coddling and every regard, they wanna to fix it like they won't let them fall. They won't

them get hurt. It's and I'm just a strong believer in the opposite. Like no it's part of growing up and like we get hurt, we fall down, we lose sometimes, like we're told no. That's life. I mean I think we probably both wouldn't be where we were if being told no was like break would break us. I mean if you're gonna break every time someone says no, then like, you're just screwed for the rest of your life. So, I'm a firm believer in that. So, I think I'd kinda bring it in that way. So, it's more about point of view,

I think it added to you now versus like, I think she's a little too young to sit quietly. I mean, I wish, but come on. I'm kind of, you've been so much trying to talk to you. Is there anything I should have asked you with it that I didn't? I mean, no, whatever you wanna know, I'm here, so no. I mean, we'll save it for next time.

In terms of, I always like to sort of open it up at the end to plugging, where can we follow you on social media, where can we follow us? Instagram, Twitter, everywhere, Dan Meditation, that's D-E-N. Please follow us, and we do so much. So, yeah, take a look at our website, even if you're not in L.A. I mean, like I said, dendmeditation.com.

If you, we literally do like eight retreats a year that are all over the world and the country. So you can join us in that regard. Like we do a lot of online stuff. We're actually starting our own podcasts. So I mean, just follow us for all this information because we are bigger than just two studios in Los Angeles. Like it is important for us to kind of reach everyone

because like you and I have been talking about, it's just, it's good for everyone. Yeah, absolutely. Thank you for coming. That was a pleasure. Thank you. Fun to meet you. Awesome.

Best of luck. Thanks. Okay, that does it for another edition of the 10% Happier Podcast. If you liked it, please take a minute to subscribe. Rate us. Also, if you want to suggest topics, you think we should cover or guests

that we should bring in, hit me up on Twitter, at Dan V Harris. Importantly, I want to thank the people who produced this podcast, Lauren Efron, Josh Cohan, and the rest of the folks here at ABC who help make this thing possible. We have tons of other podcasts. You can check them out at ABCnewspodcasts.com.

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