Tetragrammaton with Rick Rubin - Tyler Cowen: From Avant-Garde to Pop (Bonus DJ Episode)

Episode Date: October 18, 2023

Tyler Cowen has long nurtured an obsession with music. It’s one of the few addictions Tyler believes is actually conducive to a fulfilling intellectual life. In this bonus episode, an addendum to Rick’s conversation with Tyler, Rick sits with Tyler as he plays and talks through the music that moves him: from the outer bounds of the avant-garde to contemporary pop music and all points in between.

Tecro Grammerton. One of your passions is music. Enough so that you've organized your life to travel the world to listen to it. Is that correct? Music has dominated my life. I listen to it every day. I try to consume it as veraciously as possible and just learn what's new out and just keep on taking it in. And at age 61

years, I've been doing this since I was seven. Would you say your enthusiasm for music has diminished over the course of your life? Oh, I think it's intensified. The more music you know, the more music you become curious about, right? And the more people you know who can recommend more good things to you. So it's an all-consuming addiction. I don't think I have to tell you that, yes? Yes, I'm addicted. And unlike most addictions, I think it's actually good for you. So you can learn history, you also can learn economics, you learn about the world. I've been to over a hundred countries, often in quest of different music. and I love also reading

books about music composers, classic rock, and so on. Great, what are you going to play for us today? I thought we would start with something very classic. We'll get to some more popular music, but for me the most universal of all composers is Beethoven. It's a lot of very famous Beethoven pieces, so I thought I would pick one that hardly anyone listens to. And he wrote these small pieces called baguattels. There's three groups of baguattels. This is the latest group, Opus 126. And Beethoven fought those with the best.

And he called them in a cycle of Kleiningkite, which means small things in German. So whenever Beethoven is downplaying something, you actually ought to suspect it's quite profound. And for me the perfect mix of Beethoven's profundity and humor together. So that's the piece. This comes from 1825, but also important is the pianist. And the pianist, here we go. nd … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … nd I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … I'm going to play a little bit more. nd Are they rules to a baguette? They're just from his imagination.

That to me is the whole Beethoven universe in miniature, the storminess, the passion, that the universality, the positive vision, the embracing of mankind, the humor, the starting and restarting, but doing it different ways. And it's, I think, our most universal pianist playing that piece, and that's Fatislav Richter from the Soviet Union. And he was the one pianist who could play everything wonderfully, but it would all sound different. So it could be Chopin or Skryabinin or it could be Schubert or Beethoven. He has a dreamy, wonderful Bach. And so often he sounds so nervous. It's always on edge. He doesn't quite ever let you relax, but he brings in the voice of the

composer as well. And he was quite an eccentric. He grew to hate giving concerts. He hated flying across the Atlantic. He stopped visiting the United States. And he would quite an eccentric. He grew to hate giving concerts. He hated flying across the Atlantic. He stopped visiting the United States, and he would love to just have a sudden announcement of a concert. It might be in a dark room on short notice. He didn't necessarily care if he was paid, and he would play where he wanted to play. He passed away, I think, in 1997. But he's one of the pianists you can go to and he's just always interesting. Like Lynn Gould can be amazing, but can be terrible.

Richter is always interesting, quite consistent. Great. What were you thinking or feeling when you heard that? I loved it. I was more interested in the form of the piece and I don't know the rules of Baguettelle. I don't know if rules of Baguettell. I don't know if they do they always have dynamics, so they always from loud to quiet and back loud again, or can they be anything? I think he picked that form to be liberated from all strictures.

So keep in mind how heavily influenced he is by Hayden. And Hayden, typically, things have forms and you're supposed to follow the form. And Beethoven's piano sonatas are like that. Symphony start off being like that, they break out of the form. In Beethoven's piano sonatas are like that. Symphony start off being like that, they break out of the forms, and this is just like a fantasy. You know, do what you want. Blank canvas. Beautiful. Now I thought we would next go to Fela Coutie and then go back to some avant-garde precursors and see some of the connections. The people will relate to Kutti, on a podcast, in a way that they won't, if I just start with Stravinsky.

Does that make sense? Absolutely. Tell me about Felikuti. Felikuti was from Nigeria. He was a remarkably productive and creative musician. He pioneered a brand of funk and rock and roll and percussive music in Legos. There's still a club in Legos owned by his family. His son, Famacuti, is also a very well-known musician.

You can go there and hear Famacuti play in many evenings. It's a fantastic thing to do. But Fala Cuti is the supreme Nigerian creator. When Paul McCartney was in Legos to record band on the run, of course, he went to hear Fala Coutie is the Supreme Nigerian creator when Paul McCartney was in Legos to record band on the run. Of course he went to hear Fala Coutie and it's percussive music and it's polyrhythmic and it's originally West African ideas but turned into popular music.

Well, did he have a role in politics as well? He was so famous in Nigeria that everything he said mattered. It's believed he died of HIV AIDS, and he was extremely significant in politics. He had a large number of wives and children. I had a very particular kind of lifestyle, and it was just extraordinarily dynamic in everything he did. He made dozens and dozens of albums, some at the time put out on cassettes. He was a key figure in cassette culture in Africa at

that time. And maybe the biggest two-way influences between Fala Kuti and James Brown. Do we know what came before Fala Kuti? There's plenty of African popular music, say, in the 1950s or even earlier. it draws upon Cuban rhythms, African families are starting to get radios, starting to be able to listen to music. There are many more dance clubs, and all of these styles were played in the dance clubs and dance halls of the time, and then on radio. But they weren't celebrity in the way that Fala Kuti would become. So he observed rock and roll and James Brown and he picked up on those earlier traditions and turned them into a rock star persona.

And I would say made them better, amplify them. Would you say that his music sounded different than the music that came before it? Oh, absolutely. Yeah, there's no one like Fala Kuti. The closest would be his son, Fama, and Fama, of course, is coming afterwards. Great, let's listen to him. Original sufferhead is one album if you want to hear all the way through,

but let's see what cut we have. Three, four. Huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, huuu, hipano, humido Malano, chacuera, olipano, humido Very much a dance music, of course. Beautiful. Reminds me a little bit of Tito Puente in the way that it feels. Yeah, big Latin and in Cuban cross-pollination. And James Brown's is called Sweat, the very clear connection. There's been a Broadway show called Fala, which is actually quite good. And it tours around different places.

Great. You know, one of my themes in music that I find the most interesting is how popular music is rooted in classical music's avant-garde. So think of classical music as a kind of research and development laboratory for popular music. Sassanic youth comes out of Glen Bronca, the Beatles drawing on Cage in Stockhausen, among others, and that if you know avant-garde classical music, to me, so much popular music makes more sense, especially the weird parts of it. So to study avant-garde classical music, for me there's three places to start.

Well, only here one of them, but they would be Scherneberg, Theyburn, and Stravinsky. And it's worth listening to almost everything that the three people did. Stravinsky is the one that works best on podcast. And he's in classical music, deciding there's a whole different way to carve up the space of music. And to think more rhythmically and poly rhythmically, he was influenced by African rhythms, just as Picasso was influenced by the African

visual arts. And Stravinsky is one of the first rock and rollers, you could say. And was this at the same time as Picasso? At the same time as Picasso. So it makes sense. It's almost like a movement of embracing African culture in the arts at that point in time. But of course, there are earlier precursors,

one being Beethoven. If you listen, listen to Beethoven's of Batschionata, Sonata, which is very rhythmic. And you hear it through the years of having just listen to Stravinsky. It just makes a lot more sense. You see Beethoven was in that way also, so ahead of his time. Let's listen to both of those. Let's listen to Stravinsky first and then Beethoven.

This is a piece by Stravinsky called, I'm not sure how to pronounce the French, French but Le Noce, and it's about a wedding, and it's done by her percussion ensemble, and it's directly brutal in your face. — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — Un po' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a' a La stasina, la suqueta, la suqueta, m'hier, la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, m'hier,

la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, la suqueta, la supani me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la, me la But here's something else from Stravinsky as well, just to paint a broader picture of him.

Stravinsky is the composer who may be succeeded in the greatest number of styles. So he has percussive rhythmic styles, he has a purely neoclassical style. Later he was a pioneer of 12-tone and atonal music. And they're all really good. So what do you want to do with Stravinsky and then a bit of Beethoven? You tell me, you tell me another good choice of Stravinsky before we get to Beethoven. Or if you'd rather do the Beethoven first, so I follow you. Let's do the Beethoven first. Okay. Well, now hunting down the Apache and Otis and Otis, which is Beethoven's Opus 57. I'm

going to play it just the very beginning and then go to the third movement, the third movement, is where all really explodes and comes together. First we'll just hear briefly the rumbling at the very beginning, where you can just feel the revolution starting to come. Let's go to that. … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … So, already get the picture, and in the Stravinsky there's four pianos used mostly percussively Beethoven being the pioneer, and now if we go to the third and final movement of a Pascionata, the Allegro. ... I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man.

I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. I'm not going to be a good man. ... ... You can see where that's headed. Yeah, what's interesting about that, the Beethoven seems much more narrative-based to me.

I feel like the music is telling us a story here, whereas in the Stravinsky, it's not telling us the story, we're in an atmosphere. And in the atmosphere, we get to dictate the story. It puts us in a place, a new place, where this feels more narrative to me. I think it is, and a lot of Stravinsky is deconstructing things. Let's try another Stravinsky piece to show his diversity of styles. This is called Petruska, which I, you know, he did two versions of it. The first I think is 1911 and here we have one of my favorite conductors, Pierre Boulez conducting Petruska with the Cleveland Symphony. … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … ... ... You can still hear over percussive elements, but it's more like normal classical music.

And is this earlier? He was published in 1911, but he worked on it, trying to improve his whole life, is also what I think is a 1947 version. And although he was Russian, very influenced by Russian folk tales, he ends up in Los Angeles, of all places. How was he received in his time? When Riot of Spring premiered, the legend has it that people through chairs unriated. The mayor may not be overstated, but he became very well-known pretty quickly and was seen as a giant amongst other composers.

I'll play you a short bit of some of his 12-tone music from very late in his life, and this will not sound nice to many listeners, but it makes more sense than where you'll listen to it. Maltéia, adermel, valdeia, So a lot of different styles there. Yeah, I imagine that was very new for people hearing it at the time. And no one really liked that at the time, I'm not sure many people like it today. Yeah. Was Stravinsky considered the first of the avant-garde classical composers? He and Scherneberg also veberned a bear a bit later or surfacing it broadly the same time. So the others are in the German-speaking world Stravinsky from Russia, Soviet Union.

And it's striking in how many different fields there's this common set of changes. What do you think the conditions were in the world that brought this music up? That people, first there was a lot of chaos in the world. So we're near the World War I era, though actually before it, but people feel something is brewing,

but then just the intellectual idea that it was possible to reconstruct everything from the ground up, which is not in every way the right idea to have. It's not good for society, but in terms of the arts led to the remarkable creativity of modernism, that you should try everything, which of course popular music picked up on. But it really comes in music from those individuals, Trevinsky and Chernberg, most of all, that you shouldn't let anything stop you, you could reimagine any part of it, you didn't necessarily have to have a melody or rhythm or meter the way you had been taught or told you had to have. And just people

saying to themselves, like, hey, we can can redo this was a remarkable moment in human history. Was it in some ways a punk rock of the day? Absolutely a punk rock of the day. It sounds like that's what you're describing. And more radical when you, if you know this other stuff and you hear punk rock, punk rock, a. Immediately makes sense, but b. Sounds conservative.

And it ended up being conservative. If you look at what happened to many of the punk rockers, not in a bad way, but it became clear their true identities, and that's another way in which classical avant-garde and popular music fit together. Like I love the sex pistols, but it's like putting on Hayden for me. It doesn't feel like rebellion. It also seems like a new version of a back-to-basics, a different kind of a back-to-basic.

That's right. I think the downside of it was that socially, people decided that the 19th century classical liberal world order also was gonna be overturned. And in many countries, they replaced it with something far for our worst, fascism, communism, terrible, brutal acts. But you see it in literature, right? There's James Joyce, there's Franz Kafka, there's Proust, writing kinds of novel stories, poems that, you know, would have been unimaginable, not

too much earlier. But it's been highly influential, including on the New York scene of composers. My favorite composer, who works with voice, is Robert Ashley. And we can listen to a bit from Robert Ashley. He's speaking, you know, the late 1960s, 1970s, his key works, and maybe about 1987, but he still has works after that. And he's a hard composer to describe. Some of it sounds profound, some of it sounds like lounge music,

and he keeps on confusing you as to which of the two he's doing. And Ashley had Tourette's syndrome. So his central obsession was the difference between voluntary and involuntary speech. So he's always trying to figure out what does speech mean, what does it mean to want to say something, or to say something when you don't want to say something? That's a case where a supposed disability led to what was an extraordinary level of creativity. Now, the Ashley, we will play as an excerpt from his opera Improvement. This is Act I, Scene 8. No George, there is no mother, my mother and birth control. These are three reasons why we should not get married.

I have how to promise this as a third of the party, rather not. This as a third of the party, rather not. We should just decide to do the right. This as a third of the party, rather not. We should just decide to do the right. We should just decide to do the right. This as a third of the party, rather not. We should just decide to do the right.

We should just decide to do the right. the Father of the people of the right. Another reason George is your background, or my background. We seem to see things so differently. My family's pain, and I'm sure we've achieved it. We've been granted the best way we have to solve. Still we're in for the existence of the South, not the end. And silent pain breaks so the joy of my eyes For a side pain, and my mother's stepby is

To be considered forever the byer is His kisses to the sky the bright As he's the black and the person I'm not being read And I'm hearing the secret of the need to lie Another reason George is your name Their customs in my family about how men should be named George is practically unheard of They would never get it straight, Do you know what I mean?

As you can walk that instantly, George, he meets like 100 dead dancing on his face versus the word they do, but they walk back in the first state, to the first test of every heart, he sells them for how long, to meet the candidates later at the end and they grow up north,

give them the audience of their history, say, meaning safely, is the position of the creation that has various set of enemies to the record, I could bear it here again. And that is when we play, just that's why we saw the sea looking out. The answer is, if you're looking out, I love these things right. I love this.

It's great, isn't it? Great. It's an early kind of rap music also. The other amazing Ashley work, the two best I think, the other would be Perfect Lives, which is my personal favorite. And then he has some short of a guard piece, like automatic writing, purposeful lady slow afternoon, that are amazing and again just quite different. Let's see your favorite. I hope they don't have automatic writing. But here's in Saramink and Christen Beethoven,

there were men and women, which is a good piece. The very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very Nebraska, very herrrowly, James Weldon, Johnson, Carl McCarrion, Obert Cullinio, Farrell Washington, Caldwell, Cullinco, Saran Diel Merriston, Chief Till, Walter Francis, White and James, Langton Hughes, a very excellently come amongst his very, really grand, Benjamin and Martin, to Dominicos, Theo Tacopoulos, Barry Tai, Tannically, and his very truly great manners of Jesus Christ, very heroically, Megan Aspapa, have very ironically come amongst his very, really grand, Benjamin and women to Helen Maria. Anyway, you get the idea. That's true avant-garde. Not. And in the sheet music for this, would it have the words, would the words be there? I'm not sure there would be sheet music. So there would be

things programmed in a primitive way. So this would be probably the late 1960s from the sound of it. And he would partly improvise the words, and so that's actually speaking. That's his voice. That's his voice. I see. And not that piece, but he often had a pianist named Blue Jean Tierney, who hung around New York, was a great, like Boogie-Wooogie, jazz lounge pianist, and Gene Tyranny would show up to these Ashley events and just play stuff, which was also semi-improvised. And the best parts of Perfect Lives are Gene Tyranny and Ashley semi-improvising together and making stuff up like it's a

reality TV show or something. So what was ever written down? I don't know. Other people have performed perfect lives. You know the group Mottmos, sort of electronic. They're obsessed with perfect lives. They've done some versions of it. And whenever anyone else does it, it's quite different. So I would imagine and do they make up their own words? Because are they, if the words are improvised, is the idea that they're improvised words here or once the words are improvised forevermore,

those are the words? No, I think it's more like a platform. Like here's the perfect lives platform. I see. You slot your own America into the content. I see. And Ashley, as far as I can tell, seemed comfortable with that. My very favorite avant-garde

composer, Ashley, maybe in my top two or three, but is Morton Feldman, who is minimalistic, but not like Philip Glass, a beautiful, surreal, calm, meditative, communing with the infinite, you could say, shall we hear just a bit of more infeldments for John Cage? Yes, please. Okay. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it.

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I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it.

I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it.

I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. It forces us into the moment. Nothing that comes is what's expected. So there's always the sense of discovery, but it's within the same framework so it's never like a shocking change. More of a delicate reminder

to be here now, repeating over and over again. It's like the Portuguese author, Pessoa, you know, the book of very small things. I want to listen to it for a long time. I like the way it makes me feel. There's a string quartet with piano piece by Feldman, which I think is one of his best. And that takes up five compact discs. It's probably about five hours. And to hear that straight through is mind blowing. Sure, the son of a little piece. Let us see if we can find it. How did you come to this music in your life? I had a friend in high school. His name was Eric Lyon and he became a professional composer. He teaches that Virginia

tech and I would go over to Eric's house for other reasons and he started playing Paul Intimate for me, which is in retrospect conservative. But in a way, it's very different. Was your doorway into it? Yes, and then from Hindemann you go to Stravinsky, and then just everything all opens up. But Eric Lyon, definitely. Okay, piano and string quartet. We have it. This is with Kronos quartet and Aki Takahashi, and he is one of the great

Feldman pianists. He understands more in Feldman's piano music very, very well, I think. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go. I'm going to go back to the place where I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room.

I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room.

I'm going to go to the next room. I'm going to go to the next room. What do you think of that one? I love it. I actually prefer this recording to the recording we just heard. It's more properly slow and to me a little more atmospheric. I love it. There's five hours of that waiting for you anytime you so choose. Of the places you've gone, you've heard music that you've not heard reproduced well recorded, is that correct? Correct. And percussion is the hardest to translate onto a sound system.

And you think that's because the recordings are just not that good of the music or is the nature of the music impossible to be captured? I think the nature is very difficult to capture, and the visual element is very important, and the ceremonial element or the relationship with the audience is important. Obviously, a better sound system will capture more of the actual music, but there's a way percussion fills the room, that you have to be there.

And it's supposed to difference between hearing gospel music in your car and the difference of experiencing it in a participation, participating within the church. Yes, and it's much, much better in the church. Let's try to see if this cut will work for us. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it.

I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more.

I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to play a little bit more. I'm going to do that. He's so versatile, as you know, he can play a kind of bluegrass with Bala Fleck.

Shall we hear a tiny bit of that? Let's do. Just to see his range. From all the places you've been and heard music in person, What's been your fondest memory? Taking my daughter to the Indian classical music festival in Chennai, which is held early every December, runs for, I don't know, maybe two weeks, and bringing her around to all these different concerts.

And we were able to hear the great Serene Vassan on Mandolin, a full concert, some like a fifth row seat. Maybe, I don't know, did the ticket cost just 50 cents or something? And it's sweltering heat, but no one cares, and it was just unbelievable. Beautiful. Let's try It's a drum iron double bass. I'm going to to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do a little bit of the same thing. I'm going to do a little bit of the same thing.

I'm going to do a little bit of the same thing. I'm going to do a little bit of the same thing. What does one even call that? It's beautiful music. It's beautiful music and you can see how the different traditions fit together so seamlessly. It doesn't, it's interesting because the juxtaposition is an unusual, it's an unusual collision, yet if you don't know anything and you just listen to it, it makes perfect sense and it blends beautifully well together. Why don't you tell us about your encounter with Newsort Fate Al-Iqan? When he sang in the recording studio, it was strange watching through the window, seeing him sing, because what we heard coming from the speakers

and his mouth motions didn't line up, was almost as if the sound was coming from somewhere other than his body. And it was a mystical experience. And I remember this was in the day still where we were using tape before Pro Tools. And because the length of the pieces were so long, we had to have two tape machines. We're at one point in time, the second tape machine would take over for the first tape machine because we'd run out of tape because tapes reels for about 15, 16 minutes long

and the music kept going. So we had to be able to revolve and go back and forth. And I think that may have been the only session we've ever had to do that. Shall we try hearing a bit? Yes. What I like so much is how erratically supercharged they are while still being spiritual. نمست كلا ندر مست مست مست مست كلا ندر مست مست مست مست كلا ندر مست مست مست مست كلا ندر مست مرہا بل دہتا مطام و آلی آڈی

مرہا بل دہتا مطام و آلی سخل آل قلام در مست مست سخل آل قلام در مست دولل آل قلام در مست مست مست قلام در مست مست مست قلام در مست مرہا بل دہتا مطم آلی آڈی میرا بل دهتا مطم آلی آڈی

سخل آل کلندر مستقل کلندر مستقل پولل آل کلندر مستقل مستقل مستقل مستقل مستقل مستقل مستقل La más de más de más de más de cada vez más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de cada vez más de más de más de más de más de cada vez más de más de más de más de más de cada vez más de más de más de más de cada vez más de más de más de más de más de más de cada vez más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más de más आपाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब पाश तुब प ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔

۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔

۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔

۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ ۔ बाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वाश्ट वा� Beautiful stuff, isn't it? Absolutely. When you hear something in another language, how important is it for you to understand lyrics? Do you do research to know what they're talking about or is it more the visceral reaction to the weight sounds? I often prefer not to know the words. I've read a fair amount about zooffyism, so I feel like at least a small bit immersed in that universe. And if I can imagine what he might be singing that can for me be as good. How about yourself? I'm open to the sounds. I like this. And I would say the same is even true for most most music in English. I'm listening more for the sound of it than

necessarily the meaning in the words. The meaning of the words usually is if I like it, then I make it interested in that. Yeah, I agree with that. My favorite South Asian vocalist, if I had to say, is pondid Kumar Gantarva. It's usually bad sound, slow to build. But for me he is the most profound vocal lines. Let's listen a bit. Let's see what we have here by him. I hope it's not too slow to build. Oh, love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, oh love me, love, oh love, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, love, oh love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, oh love me, love, love me, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, love, oh love, oh love, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, oh love, love, love, love, love me, oh love, oh love me, love, love, oh love me, love, love, oh love, oh love, oh love, love, oh love, love me, love, love, oh love, oh love, love, oh love, oh love, बूला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बिला बूला विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा विगा वे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे तावे ताव Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull out the heart. Yeah, but not pull if I can find it, it's one of the Goldberg variations, and it's the beginnings of A tonal music. Glyngold, of course. And either Glyngold one should work. I actually prefer the older.

Yeah, within without repeat. Different tempo. Okay, that's it. 25. Perfect. You know, the theme of early being unified with late. We talked about atonal music of uncard, percussive music. Box Goldberg variations can be highly percussive, but it's also a starting point for atonal music and one of the variations, it's not literally atonal, but you can hear it moving in that direction, and it's short to me quite beautiful.

Why don't we play that? Let's do it. ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃən ʃə I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful.

I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful.

I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom.

I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to go to the bathroom. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful.

I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful.

I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it.

I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be able to do it. I'm not going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful.

I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful.

I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. I'm going to be a little bit more careful. ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا ھا nd d d d d d d

d d That's spectacular. You can also hear the more infeldman in that, right? Yes. Incredible connection. Yes, incredibly modern. And I've listened to this particular recording of the Goldberg Variations many times over the course of my life. And I've never noticed how interesting that particular one is

because in the context of the overall, it doesn't stand out. I've never listened to it. I've never listened to it as a standalone piece. But when you take it out, it sounds revolutionary. Wagner is the next step in a way. And it's one of Bach's greatest achievements, which is really saying something. So beautiful. Now I thought we would go to something very recent. So I thought to myself

an interesting question, like the last three or four years, what's the single song from that time that has impressed me the most? And you think about it too, because I'll ask you what your pick is. It's not easy and you may offend some people by choosing anything, right? Yeah, I don't, I don't, I can't even come up with, I don't know that I could come up with one. But I have one and I'll play just the first, I think two minutes, 15 seconds. It's a nine minute song or so.

All nine minutes are great, but I wouldn't say all nine minutes are great on a podcast. If you understand the distinction. Yes. For this, why don't we put it on your system? This is Lana Del Rey and it's called Venice Bitch This is the song I keep on going back to

Hopefully you my favorite Lana's song after this great Feel fun, feel life, fresh out of fuck jeans and leather, life's dream, I'm sweet for you Oh God, miss you on my lips, it's me a little Venice bitch, I'm a st street with the never kids Calling out band-band kiss-kiss We are in the art I like the fire And as the summer fades away Nothing gold can stay You're right I do, we make it work, a beautiful phenomenon We're American men Give me home art One dream, one life, one lover We're being happy and brave

Norman, Rob, Bob No hike under our covers It's just me and you Oh God, miss you on my lips It's me a little thin, I switch On the street with the never-kids Calling out, bangband kiss-kiss You are in the art I like the fire

And as the summer fades away Nothing cold can stay You're right I do, we make it work You're beautiful, I do, we make it work A beautiful, an arm inside Where American men hate There's more, but that's just the beginning of this entrance to this whole musical universe That just leaves me on the floor. What do you think, how would you describe what it is about

and who to analyze what you think you're reacting to? What is it? It's one of those songs like Strawberry Fields forever that it's even difficult to talk about, but it's a kind of dream pop, and it's creating a dream. It keeps on shifting like a dream. There's this extreme willingness to admit her passion for her lover's kiss, creating or harkening back to this world of an earlier America where things seemed much simpler,

but the music is complex and it all comes together. And then there are seven more minutes of it where it becomes weirder. And you're always longing for the earlier, more melodic part to come back, and it never does, and it just makes you want to have to listen to it again. Great. But what were you thinking? My favorite one is also on that album.

And it is. That's my favorite album by her. Yeah, it's this one. I was reading Samarins, and I got to thinking that I thought Maybe I'd get less dressed if I was tested less like all of these debutants Smiling for miles and pink dresses and hires and white yards. But I'm not, baby, I'm not. No, I'm not, that I'm not.

I've been tearing around in my fucking account 24 seven selfie a plate Writing in blood on my walls cuz the ink in my pen don't work in my note pads Don't ask if I'm happy you know that I'm not but at best I can say I'm not sad. Because hope is a dangerous thing for a woman like me to have. Hope is a dangerous thing for a woman like me to have. Also, wonderful. Yeah, it makes me cry. Every time I hear it, it makes me cry. It's the power of the lyrics. Hope is a dangerous thing for a woman like me to have.

It's such a radical line. And I think her strength is, she paints this world that's clearly in a looserie world. It's not a palpable real reality that she's talking about. Yet, we can have this emotional connection of these personal stories in the context of this dream world. It's odd. Like, why would something so dreamy reach us in such a personal way? And how would you describe what is special in the production and in the sound?

It's how ordinary it is. It's um, she does very traditional songwriting, the way that it's written other than lyrics are very traditional. The lyrics are what makes it super modern. I thought now we'd moved to a different kind of gut punch. So this song, I'm also sure you know, it's by James Brown, whom I discovered I was about 30 years old. It completely shook up my musical universe. And my favorite James Brown song, it's from 1960, it's from the Think album, it's called Be Will Dredd. And there's oddly enough, there's a bunch of earlier versions of the song, I think Tommy Dorsey did it first, maybe in 1935, and it sounds nothing

like the James Brown version. It's a scene. Mostly a different melody, obviously a different style. There's some later rhythm and blues versions which are okay, but don't really connect with me. And just somehow he picked up on this song and delivered with it. And it's one of these songs, the first, second, you're entranced. Be well done, uh...

Love, still a dream of you Why, is love my name? Why, did we will live, have life, have life, life, wish it, well your heart to be Well in my heart Must die You sleep last night And in love day, world, world. Why did you keep my soul? With love's power, I am in the dark, you will die.

I need you, I need you, I need you. May the God name, I never know I'll never stand. I need you, I can love me We, I hear you, I can love me I hear you, I can love me I can love me, I can love me, how you can love me, and leave me bewildered, beware of God. What speaks to you most from James Brown? I would probably pick Cold Sweat, which is also an early choice, and it's later than

be wildered, right? I don't know. Cold Sweat is what the late 60s, and it's much funcier. This is more duop with...... I suppose the thing that Lane turned up. I think that James Brown is one of the greatest artists of all time. One of my very favorite. And his voice is... There's so much energy in his voice.

And obviously he's performed some leave-able, but his singing is spectacular. There's nobody else who does what he does. No one can touch him. I love watching him on YouTube. You know the Tammy tapes? Yeah. And then there's a very long Paris concert he did that used to be on YouTube. I think it's still there. And like you, he was very influenced by professional or semi-professional wrestling, right? Yeah, no gorgeous George.

Absolutely. Because gorgeous George had the cape. Yeah, that's one reason why I picked the James Brown. I thought I had a bunch about your parents. I just want that six years later. So that's as early as 66? Yeah, 67. That's incredible.

67. Yeah. I think Be Wildard was made 58 or 59 when it comes out in 1960. Yeah, 67. That's incredible. 67. Yeah. I think Be Wildard was made 58 or 59, but it comes out in 1960. And some of Brown is, you know, 1953, and the style is fully mature right away. That's to me one of the amazing things about him. There's a great episode about James Brown on the Andrew Hickey podcast, about 500 songs, telling the history of rock and roll.

I highly recommend it. Yeah. Good. You ever get to see him live? James Brown? No, you know, I made so many foolish mistakes in my life. And that was one of them. I had the sense incorrect in retrospect that later on, it was somewhat of a degenerate act, not as good. But it just seems I was completely wrong. I never saw Miles Davis. So many foolish omissions I've made in my life. Yeah, I understand.

I got to see him several times and never disappointed. Yeah, never disappointed. From the world of classics, let's try Chopin, A2D, Opus 25, number 6. And there's so many good recordings of this one. I think the one that comes up is certain to be good enough. I'm curious to see what your software will serve us. There's so many wonderful Chopin pianists. … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … Just perfection, isn't it? Very playful, very beautiful. Interesting that the two hands are two different characters.

The left hand is telling us one story and the right hand is running free. And they don't feel, in most pieces, they work together to create this bigger hole. In this one, it's like the two characters are really distinctly laid out for us. And it's almost like the right hand is having fun at the expense of the left hand. This Parisian culture in them, a lot of Polish military culture in Chopin, Italian opera

arias, and somehow all brought together into a truly European music. Very beautiful. I never heard that piece before. I can just listen to the Chopin A2s or Chopin anything, again and again. And they're so little he did that is not amazing. Beethoven, there's a fair amount. Maybe it's only 20%, but 20% of Beethoven's work is still a lot.

Chopin, you're hard pressed to find anything that isn't just jaw-droppingly good. Of course, he died at a fairly young age. When did he first get into him? I started going to classical concerts when I was 19, but I had heard plenty on what was then LP, and the A-tudes were my first love. I don't know they're the best Chopin, but they're the most accessible. I actually do think they're the best. The nocturnes may be are deeper, dreamier, more languishing, but the atudes they just hit

you. And as a sequence, you know, there's Opus 10, Opus 25 to hear them in sequence straight through. I never get tired of that. Andrei Gavrilov is one of my favorite pianists playing the atudes, the Hungarian Chifra, but again they've seen so many wonderful recordings. How different are they from recording to recording for you? Oh very different. So if you hear a Richter who played that first Beethoven cut,

if he's doing a Chopin A-tude, it just sounds so eccentric. He's like taking a part, putting it back together again. Our harwits did a lot of Chopin A-tudes. He was like Richter, it made it all sound eccentric, but somehow it worked. Pianists today, they're more technically perfect, but also more mainstream. Which we listen to next. I thought we'd go to a group we both love, and that's the birds.

They were huge early influence on my musical taste. The birds, of course, also intersect with Bach. So many of them, the McGuin, 12 string cellos are taken from Bach, Bach corals, Bach cantadas. They blend in psychedelia, Indian music, folk, beatle beat. You know, McGuin talks about this in his live shows, different permutations of birds. I think I've seen in concert more than any other performer, maybe 25 times, but the song, and there's two versions of this, we need to get the better album version. It's Old John Robertson, and it's on notorious bird breathers,

and it has the phase shifting and the violin in a way that the single version I think is actually pretty mediocre. Let's get with this one. I'm so glad I've been spent No one cares who take any time to find her When he's all gone, he'll keep him out Children are back in their living quarters They keep telling us kind of just the same To walk in slow and old, Jones could win by fire inside

Then she sighed, And she sighed I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I All in vain was no pain or a thirst or a break And here in the end Won't you come to me or the steps of that? People that we were with love behind this back No one can take it. It's all about the idea. 1968 Gary Usher was the producer. Did you know him?

I did not know him. When you hear that, like what occurs to you? Bizarre. Bizarre that the... when the effect comes on after the bridge and then goes away, odd choices, odd choices. It doesn't seem as intentional as experimenting. It feels more experimental than intentional. I don't think they quite ever knew what they were doing when they made that album. For me, it came out very well. It's transitional between psychedelic rock and country rock. That's

a Chris Hillman cut. John Robertson was, in fact, a guy in Los Angeles, an old movie director who walked around with the Stetson hat on. The the songs about him, but it becomes this weird birdsy psychedelia, builds its own little world in two minutes and then vanishes. And the breakdown in the middle is really beautiful and unexpected and interesting. That's my favorite part. And then missing on the singles version. They cut it out. I think they maybe did the singles version first and they just didn't put it in.

And then they heard it and realized something was missing. The birds were in chaos at this point. This is the album where they took out the picture of David Crosby and put in a picture of a horse because they were upset at Crosby as many people were in those days. And Crosby was purged from the tapes, and his songs were not allowed on the album. Those songs I tried, which you know from us, you know, later, CSNY days, I was supposed to be on this album, Lady Friend, to Crosby's song, which I like was supposed to be on this album, and they had to come up with other stuff because they kicked out Crosby.

And why did you choose it? I think the Taurius Bird Brothers is their best album. I think for a podcast you want a song that's both short and starts somewhat abruptly so people understand what it is they're hearing and I've always loved the energy of it and the spaciness of the middle part. And people, you know, turn, turn, turn, all that, better song, but everyone knows that. So in part, we're here to listen to things that not everyone knows. Yes. Now, I thought in other direction, we would take, there's two songs from popular music,

both strongly influenced by Calypso. And I've been very interested in Calypso, I've been to Trinidad to hear Calypso. That was a big treat for me. Golden Age of Calypso is less over than people think. And one performer, obviously very famous, but more influenced by Calypso than people realize, that's Chuck Berry. And this song is Havana Moon. And it's one of those songs where throughout the song you're waiting only for one moment. Maybe that makes it not an ideal podcast song, because if you're not listening for the one moment, the whole song makes no sense. So the second time you hear the song, it's much better than the first time you hear the song, because the anticipation of that moment matters and it's a scream but if you can find

Chuck Berry, Havana Moon, I'm guessing that's from 1957. Let me try Chuck Berry's. And this song just builds, you know, at first it's not great or it doesn't seem great. Songs like that are interesting. They're like puzzles. And there's the sense of mystery that he's telling you a story throughout the song. Here we go. I'm on a moon, I'm on a moon

Meet all along with a jubble rum Me standing wait for both to come As long as night is quite the dark The boat she laid since 12 o'clock Me watched it tide, easing in Is loading moon, but hide away Have I never moved Have I never moved

Me all alone, me opening the wrong Is long to wait for both to come. A American girl, come back to me, will sail away across to sea. We're darkening New York, the building's high. We find a home up but in the sky. Have I never moved? Have I never moved? Me still alone, me still found it wrong.

Me wondering when did Bo Chi come to bring me love? Oh sweet little thing She rock and roll She dance and sing She hold me tight She touch me lips Me eyes they close

Me heart she flip Have a move Have a move But still along Have I no moon? But still along me drinking the rum Began to think that it wouldn't no come A American girl, she tell a lie She say till then she being goodbye Have I no more?

Have I no more? Me lay down alone, was good and run, Me fall asleep, did it hold she come? Did the girls she look, till come the dawn? She weeped,ed cry return for home The whistle blow, me open when the eyes was bright The sun was blue, the skies, me grab me shoes Me jump and run, me see the boat hate for horizontal, have an amoo is gone, it wrong.

People she sail, me love she gone, have an amoo. Have an amoo. The diction in that I find so impressive. It's like he created his own English and all the songs, but in that song it's especially clear. But just how he is speaking is so different. And because it's less caught up in rock and roll, like a lot of other wonderful berry songs, but certain things are clearer, I find. It's so bare and spare.

Yeah. And there's Cuban in there, there's Calypso, a lot of Caribbean, and he masters those elements. Where do you think you would have heard Calypso music in 1957? Well, at that time it was extremely popular in the United States. Between the Beatles and others come along that Brazilian Calypso actually become much less commercially successful. So most people would have known those genres. And it's one of the unfortunate things about the era of classic rock, which I love.

But it swept away many other interesting things out of the public's attention. Who would have been the most notable artist in the clips of the world? The one I like the best is roaring lion. The famous figure in America would have been Rudy Valley. There's a wonderful... maybe see if you can find it on there. There's a roaring lion song about Rudy Valley. If you type in roaring lion, Rudy Valley, I bet nothing comes up. But if it comes up, we should hear it. I think mostly the best way to listen to Calypso is on collections or semi-randomly using YouTube or searching other services. You don't need to have a favorite artist.

Peck is. This sounds like it. You be parry your parry, let the lame lasse yo I'll tell you a story, you do not know it's about Canny Barlan Calypso You be parry your parry, let the lame lasse yo It is the folk song and ballad of that beautiful island of Trineta Canneval and Calypso Jubé, barrio, barrio, belame la seo It is the folk song and ballad of that beautiful island of Trineta Jubé, barrio, barrio, belame la seo Every year is Canneval, don't forget

That is Trineta, national fed Jubé, barrio, barrio, belame la seo On Canneval, morning six bell chained And every one day would start to rhyme You're by the Bellamelasio ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós!

¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! ¡Adiós! You be barrio, barrio, la melacio. Jump your jump dance your dances back on a brake mask for lemon and carnival.

You be barrio, barrio, la melacio. Jump in the line and break our way shake your head believe and think our way. You be barrio, barrio, la mel look like they may hit the colipsum I've. Well a lot of it does. He was the colipsum popularizer, not my favorite, but roaring lion did a song about Rudy Valley. I see. But that's an excellent song. It's a very famous colipsum. Cool. Call and response from West African music. It has everything. Cool. The background noises. But now let's try some what I call white calypso. And this is Harry Nielsen, another favorite from early in my life.

And it's not a well-known song. It's on an album that was totally dismissed when it came out. His voice was wrecked from smoking, from drinking. This was around the Pussycat's period with John Lennon. But the album is, do it on Monday. And the song is P It On Monday and the song is Puget Sound. If you just put in Nielsen Puget Sound, we ought to get there. And this is Harry at his most colipso. In a car bought down in a budget sound, a crack a jack was jacking up the bottom of the

front by a little wooden man and this tiny bit of nit downstered crazy chicks up All the head, a hidden head was locked up in an iron cage. So all the people passing by could see what you're only added to your age Headfold wouldn't have to wait tonight. In a cardboard town, a huge sand, Crackled jacked, was jacking up the bottom of the town While the little wooden man was tiny bit by mid Dice the crazy jigsaw puzzle to a tune of bup-a-moom You're more than men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, men, crack a jack, he's jacking up the other side of town While I'm in wooden man, he's tiny bit poppin' it

That's the crazy, too so pleasant, and he laughed it all that good But he didn't bit his life, don't mean an iron cage So all the people passing by could see were joined at a two-inch hit field, we left a link tonight. I'm gonna go and check the fuck out of sight I'm gonna go now Why did you choose it? Just collapses into incoherence, it's a huge party scene He was probably super depressed when he made it, but he's also having incredible fun I like all the cacophony in the background. It evokes, again, this earlier America, Puget Sound, is this very hoki place, and just

this drunk guy seeing it, giving it his best. I think this is the one that's the one I think of when I think of him in this style of in this groove. Also, Calypso inspired. Yeah, the same saying, I think of this one. I think he was Calypso. Yeah. Brought up all the cooking,

I bought it for the time of sister Hadnard when she paid it for the line. She put the line in the cooking, now she drank and pulled up. She put the line in the cooking Now she drank and pulled up She put the line in the cooking Now she drank and pulled up She put the line in the cooking

Now she drank and pulled up She put the line in the cooking Now she call it duck But walk her mother said Dutton Ain't there nothing I can take her said Dutton Don't really even spell it

Yeah, I said Dutton Ain't there nothing I can take a sedato. Do you believe it's Billy Yeager said? Nothing I can take a sedato. Do you believe it's Billy Yeager said? Now let me get this free. Put lime in the coconut you drank. Fun. All the people on the scene from what I've heard, including the Beatles, they considered Harry the polymath,

who knew everything. You could ask him about anything he would know. He supposedly had an incredible memory, remarkable mastery of different musical styles. His career never reached potential. It could have or should have. But if you can impress the Beatles, right, that says something. Absolutely. Both John and Paul. Yes, I loved them. Yeah, I loved Harry's stuff. Yeah, I loved them. Yeah, I love Terry stuff Yeah, he's great and his voice some believable these songs are not necessarily the songs that most show off his voice But I think in a way they do because he's not doing anything acrobatic. They're all these subtle little

Ways he's using it precisely because he can't sing properly anymore, at least for the Puget Sound Cut. How are we in time? Do we have time for two more? Yes, a stume. Okay. The first one, this is a cut for you in particular because his understanding of spirituality reminds me of you and this is a song that he himself described as about longing for place. And the artist's name is Guru Mowl, GUR-R-U-M-A-L. And the title of it's named after a bird, it's Y-A-Tool, or Y-A-T-H-U-L. And there should be a studio version and a live version. Studio version is a little overproduced. So if the live version is there, we'll do that.

But if we need to, we'll do the studio. He's sometimes called an aboriginal from Australia, but technically he would be a tourist straight islander. And he was born blind and was a kind of musical genius who sang about his homeland in his Oh Mmm... Marma nilao ka tinana Nambaw laru na na kuwali nilao Pidakayon mina, leagamiyo kare Nambawlarongong ka ba na wala na? Kod ko ka na liniyo

Kana ba huwalinong Kana ba huwalinong I can't I can't I can't You may not Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, Mmm... Ya or man, na tinana Mang patinan na Tiangunalang ino, tungong na yo Yababa, kapapa, cunga, cunga Miling tu rapana, maya lara ka

Yangan ni manda, para ka miri manda ھا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گا گ Ka lani manda mrakapni manda Numayagatiya na ni ngoruburra pho Ka naba kuwalimā Ka naba yumenga When I thought I had to pick one especially for you, that's the one that came to mind. Now that I know you a bit. So beautiful. And there's nothing else like it, is there? No.

No, his voice is so pure and there's so much energy in it, and we don't need to understand the words, it's like it's all there. My wife and daughter had the good fortune to see him perform in Paris before he passed away. Sadly, I missed that, but it leaves me without words. Beautiful. But, leaves me without words. Last cut, of course, it has to be Paul McCartney, right? How could it be anyone other than Paul McCartney? But, you know, you need to ask yourself, what is it you can play for people from Paul McCartney? That is new.

So, I picked a cut for two reasons. First is, there's, you know, so much this reputation that solo McCartney or early solo McCartney. It's all like sweet or sickly or too gushy and that's so wrong in my view. And this is a cut that it shows the sardonic side of early solo. You know Paul and Linda Paul and Linda did this together. It's on the Ram album. It's called Dear Boy and Paul said during a satellite radio special that it's actually addressed to Linda's previous husband. And they're telling him he didn't know what a good thing he had with Linda.

And Linda, of course, joins in. Now, I don't know any of the people or details. I'm fully on Paul's side, but to have the stones to do that, you know, to your relatively new wife, sex, husband, and do it so publicly as a beetle, that's wonderful, I think. That's radical. And then the harmonies, how much it's a tribute to the Beach Boys, and Brian Wilson, when the song came out, he was having his own troubles. He didn't know about it. He heard it many years later and was just overwhelmed by the job Paul did kind of reimagining Beach Boy style production,

but for Paul and Linda McCartney in 1971. Guess you never knew dear boy that she was just a good singer I guess you never knew what you had found dear boy Guess you never saw it, it's always the worst And only maybe when you loved her too Dear boy, you'll never ever go away Because you never need me cause, and dear boy, when I stay To the heart, we're still And I'll go to the heart, give to them,

God be young and alive. Just give to them, just give to them, God, give to them all, Give to them, just give to them, Just give to them, just give to them, Give to them, give to them, You've got the best of your soul, you've got the best of your soul You've got the best of your soul, you've got the best of your soul You've got the best of your soul, you've got the best of your soul I was down and I was home

You've got the best of your soul, you've got the best of your soul Deep to the top, deep to the top Don't be guilty and above Oh, you never know, you never know You're the one who should be the best You're the one who still won't leave when you're gone You're the one who still won't leave when you're gone You're the one who's got this? I've never heard it before. I don't remember hearing it before. You're the music producer, any comment? I've never heard of before.

I don't remember hearing it before. It's just perfectly composed, use of percussion. Yeah. Super cool. Yeah. I want to play you my favorite modern era, Paul Saul. I'd love to hear it. This is from 2008.

Mine is when Winter comes, but if you're wondering. And I'm too much just out of sight You say you love me here, this is true The best thing to do you, that's a lie down inside me I said I love you, I'm never new do much just outside Oh, do I wanna be found? You're a man, I'm a traitor Oh, I, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, I think he's 70 and on that. It's just his passion for the rock and roll.

He's so strong. As a closer, should we hear just a snippet from when winter comes? It's a nice, letting off steam. Absolutely. And it's on the very latest album. There's a wonderful animated YouTube video that goes along with it. I enjoy watching the video and listening at the same time. Must fix the fence by the acre plot Two young foxes have been nosing around The lambs and the chickens won't feel safe until it's done

A must-deak a drain by the carrot patch A whole crop spoils if it gets to the dump And where will we be with an empty store? When winter comes? When winter comes, when winter comes I must find the time to plant some trees In the matter where the river flows In time to come they'll make a shade

For some poor soul When winter comes And food is scarce We'll want our toes To stay indoors When summer's gone We're gonna fly away And find the sun

When winter comes Must fix the fence by the acre block Two young foxes have been nosing around And the lambs and the chickens won't feel safe until it's done When winter comes and food is scarce We want our toes to stay in doors. When summer's gone, we're gonna fly away. And find the sun when winter comes, and find the sun, when winter comes.

What more can one say? So beautiful. Thank you so much for doing this. I have a feeling we'll be doing this a lot more in the future. That would be great. Thank you, Rick. Thank you so much for doing this. I have a feeling we'll be doing this a lot more in the future. That would be great. Thank you Rick. Thank you. you you