TFTC: A Bitcoin Podcast - #278: Dissecting the Clown World with Ben Kaufman

Episode Date: October 25, 2021

Join Marty as he sits down with Ben Kaufman, Chief Conspiracy Theorist at Clown World Today, to discuss: - The madness of the last 18-monhts - Logical inconsistencies around COVID medical advice - The power of propaganda - Vaccine passports - How to push back - Using humor to highlight absurdities - much more Follow Ben on Twitter Follow Clown World Today on Twitter Subscribe to the Clown World Today Substack Shoutout to our sponsors: Cash App Unchained Capital Braiins Compass Mining

What is up, freaks? It's your boy Marty Bent here to introduce this episode of Tales from the Crypt. I sat down with Ben Kaufman to talk about the clown world, the state of the clown world, his newsletter, Clown World Today, and a bit of the logical inconsistencies that exist in the mainstream and have been perpetrated over the last year and a half, particularly. Trigger warning, trigger warning, trigger warning, trigger warning. a lot of topics that are discussed during this conversation will trigger some people. So I'm going to give you that trigger warning. Though, I think it's important to have these conversations and more importantly, to have

the ability to have these conversations. You don't have to agree with everything discussed, but I think you should agree that we should be able to discuss these topics. And it seems that in today's day and age, the ability to even discuss these things openly and critically is being hindered and censored by some of the powers that be

again you don't have to agree with the conclusions we draw but you should agree that we should be able to attempt to draw our own conclusions and not have them thrust upon us by a kleptocratic elite that really doesn't have our best interest

at heart at the end of the day and you can prove this via their actions over many many decades This report was brought to you by our good friends at the motherfucking Cash App. Cash App. Also sponsoring Max Verstappen, Team Red Bull, was at F1 yesterday.

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And again, trigger warning, trigger warning, trigger warning, trigger warning. We discussed some touchy topics. It should be okay to do that. Let me know what you think. Tiki! You've had a dynamic where money's become freer than free. You talk about a Fed just gone nuts. All the central banks going nuts.

So it's all acting like safe haven. I believe that in a world where central bankers are tripping over themselves to devalue their currency, Bitcoin wins. In the world of fiat currencies, Bitcoin is the victor. I mean, that's part of the bull case for Bitcoin. If you're not paying attention, you probably should be. What is up, freaks? It's your boy Marty Bent. Back for another episode. Speaking with a Bitcoiner, but a Bitcoiner that is looking to step outside Bitcoin and thinks there's bigger problems in the world.

I'm sitting down with repeat guest Ben Kaufman, who is the chief conspiracy theorist at CWT News Now, The Clown World Today. What's going on, Ben? Yeah, I'm doing great. Thanks. How are you doing? I'm doing well, doing well. Happy to be speaking with you. I mean, you are a young man who seems to be one of the most principled gentlemen I've followed on the Internet over the last few years. I mean, we know you. Matt and I had you on the show, what, last year to talk about the work that you're doing on Spectre. You announced recently in the last couple of weeks that you're going to be shifting your focus from Bitcoin work, which you'll still be doing.

But you feel like there's a pressing need outside of Bitcoin in the world right now. That is to highlight the insanity of the clown world. Why do you think this is such a pressing need right now? Yeah. So first of all, yeah, I think Bitcoin is probably the most important thing right now. But I think it's not the only thing that is important. I'll definitely still be doing work on Bitcoin probably even most of my time. But I think there is also need to talk more about about basically all the insanity that is going on outside of Bitcoin, all the Corona totalitarian nonsense that is going on, basically how governments are right now stepping up their game and trying to basically encroach more on freedom of people, trying to do stuff that we're basically unimaginable.

just two years ago um and i think we need to we need to also talk about that more and need to you know to to deal with that more yeah no i completely agree and i'm very happy that you've decided to step out on this limb and and begin highlighting this i mean i've been writing about the mass psychosis in the world in my newsletter and and one tool against that mass psychosis that i've sort of honed in on and wanted to lean into is is ridicule ridiculing the the clown world operators that seem to be pushing us down this total totalitarian state and i think what you're doing with clown world today the newsletter that you started um is doing an incredible job of that so i guess like let's start with clown world today um how you're using that that newsletter

better um to to sort of ridicule the the insanity in the world or what are some examples of uh insane either policies or quote-unquote facts that actually end up being misinformation that that you've highlighted yeah sure so basically just started this clown world thing just as a way to express my my thoughts on all the all the nonsense that is basically going on right now um i've just felt that they have to you know i have to write on it in in um in a bit longer form that's on done on twitter and also that i want to basically make sure that even if i get banned from twitter i'll still have some reach to to people and doing this with mailing list makes it makes it possible to have like this also this backup plan kind of um so yeah i just started

this this newsletter and just started writing whatever whatever was was up on my mind that at the moment um whatever if it is like to to basically the first issue was basically just on stopping to you know stopping complying with with all the nonsense um just stopping you know stopping the compliance like how how do we end this all this nonsense just need people to you know to step up and stop cooperating with all with all that's been going on you know people just think usually most of the people just imagine that if they just do this if they just take the booster shot now if they just take uh use these qr codes for you know for this um vaccine passports if they just like if they just stayed home two weeks as it was in the beginning this you know

we will get back to normals or you know this madness will end but it's absolutely the reverse as the more that you continue to comply and more to continue to do what you're told and the more that you give in with your freedoms and with everything that you cut uh the the worse that it will be the more that the the governments will want to take away from you the more they can feel that they can take away and the more that they will yeah and i mean does being from israel is that another sort of impetus for this i guess many are viewing israel australia canada as sort of these testing grounds for a lot of these totalitarian moves i mean the the evac passport was very popular in israel uh now you have the booster

passport as well if you're double vaxxed you're not you're not uh you're not allowed to go to the store with without getting a booster what's going on in israel what are you seeing is there any pushback um are you seeing any non-compliance there uh i hardly see any non-compliance to be honest that's really disappointing unlike you know unlike places like in the u.s or in europe i think there's a lot less um you know disobedience and you know defiance of this this nonsense in israel which is extremely disappointing Israel was probably the first I think that started with the vaccine passport system and now it's you know it's everywhere now that you don't only have to to get you know the double box as you said you have to get the booster shot and not only that

you have to get it now every six months so the vaccine passport that you get from getting the booster shot only last six months and then once you once these six months are over you need another booster or we once again are not you know you're unhealthy you cannot go to the stores you cannot do like anything um so yeah so this is like Israel is is not doing well in that regard I think it's not as bad as Australia but it's definitely really bad um and there were a lot of other stuff that was completely madness in Israel. For example, for a few weeks or a few months around the beginning of this year, I think,

they basically closed the country so that even citizens not only couldn't get out, they couldn't even get in. So Israeli citizens, you have the passport. The only thing that you're expected to be able to do with the passport is get in Israel. for like a few weeks there was like a period where you couldn't even do that so that that's as far as i know only happened in israel like i don't think any other country closed the borders

for citizens to get back in basically um there were a few like australia that banned people getting out like israel but getting in for example is an israeli nonsense yeah it's insane man and like you said like the more you give the more they're going to take and the more they're going to try to take right so how do you see this max pass evolving right now it's like oh every six months you need a booster and then you see you see it evolving into like a cbdc wallet um i mean these are the things we have to worry about just getting a little complacent state uh in which you can be manipulated even further oh oh you're willing to get the vaccine and the boosters now here here's another thing we're gonna throw on top of that that you need to

show um to purchase things yeah so the vaccine passport system is is nothing but the social credit system in its early stages so it's exactly the same you it's all the infrastructure it's all the difficult parts let's say uh getting implemented first so the first thing that you need to do in order to implement the social credit system is you need to get people used to showing their qr codes to get into everywhere and to get people you know to actually check those qr codes to let others enter their business their whatever um so this is the first and hard part the second part would just be to tweak the criterias of the qr code uh this is like almost nothing technically so right now if you already accepted that you have to show your qr code that you're vaccinated

uh why want to like show your qr code that you have also not i don't know didn't like any content that the government doesn't approve of um that you didn't uh use um that you didn't use your money in certain ways um that you you know basically everything that happens in china with their social credit system is spreading to the whole world right now um and you know people are just complying with it they don't see that they're being turned into basically slaves in this in the system uh that they're losing everything and all of their freedoms and basically just being compliant with the government yeah it's man a very important inflection point in human history and it's again i think it's important to ridicule and highlight the

the hypocrisy and the insanity of this right like it's it's i mean israel too like is another testing ground and basically case study in the fact the vaccine may not you may not you may not yeah did i go in a loop uh yeah you kind of went on a loop yeah it's like i need to get a new computer this computer doesn't have a lot of connection um what i was saying before that happened was Israel was a great case study in the fact that the vaccine itself may not be as effective as it has been marketed to the masses. It was 100% effective, and now it only has something like 40% efficacy after six months. And it's crazy that there's either cognitive dissonance or an overt attempt to suppress quality information, a lot of which I think

has come out of israel which is acutely highlighted you guys what was the percentage of israel's population that was fully vaxxed um at one point i think it was like 90 i think it was like 90 of everybody eligible to the vaccine so excluding like children under like 12 or something yeah and then after most of the country had been vaccinated you saw a surge in cases cases went higher before the year before correct yeah so the uh the peak of the cases ever like the most daily cases ever has been after like the whole country has been vaccinated it has been like two months ago one or two months ago yeah so basically there was more people uh getting covid after everybody was vaccinated than before

the vaccine rollout even yeah and so again youtube sorry for trying to talk about this hopefully you don't ban me but is it irrational to look at those numbers say hey maybe the vaccine is potentially making things worse is that is that a conclusion to draw i cannot see from this from this you know from everything that from the data in israel that anything that it's making anything better so i've been looking at the the israeli data so they have like this dashboard um of the israeli ministry of health of all the coveted data uh for a while it didn't include enough data on like vaccinated versus unvaccinated but last they checked like a few weeks ago it had like uh data on vaccinate like categorized by vaccinated unvaccinated sorry double vaccinated

unvaccinated and triple vaccinated so and basically from from when i was trying to to look into it and also uh actually some guy on trader was also uh that's also from israel was analyzing the data as well and you don't see any any influence of of basically of the of the vaccine uh based on you know on the cohort so you see that roughly based on the population that is vaccinated the amount of population that is vaccinated the same percentage is you know is getting sick with covid uh compared to those unvaccinated so basically you you just don't see any effect of of being vaccinated um it's it's really it's really crazy to to see that and you know when people still pushing it so so hard um i mean at the beginning i was thinking maybe

the vaccine actually will work or something i mean i always say that the coercion will be wrong but i was hopeful that at least we'll make a vaccine that works but as as we got more and more data it just doesn't seem like it's effective in any way yeah and you're would you be considered domestic you'd probably be considered domestic terrorist here in the u.s for saying that and i won't just we're not allowed to look at data and make our our own inferences correlation is a causation you can't you can't prove that directly they don't they don't connect if you're not a scientist you're not allowed to look at data this is too dangerous i'm sorry you can't do science if you're not a scientist the science exactly in quotes that's another thing that's like the

clown world too like so let's dissect the clown world what in your view what does it build on like there's a lot of propaganda there's a lot of misdirection like what as somebody who's writing uh clown world today and you have an incredible twitter account that's blown up in short order how old is it like three months and you've got almost 35 000 yeah it's like two months i think yeah and yeah 35 000 followers or something Yeah. And it's, I mean, I think, I think that fact alone that you've been able to grow an audience that large and that quick of a time acutely highlights the fact that people agree that we are living in a clown world. And so as somebody who's observing the clown world very intently like yourself, what have you noticed? What are some of the patterns that you recognize the quote-unquote regime or the kleptocratic elite,

whatever you want to call them, using to either propagandize or send people in the wrong direction? Basically, the first thing that they do is just speak absolute nonsense. So in a sense that everybody that can think logically, you know, cannot follow up with their logical process, basically. So the first thing that they do is just, you know, they they just present a logically sorted argument that is completely illogical. For example, that, you know, now that the vaccines are working, but if you don't take your vaccine, then it's not working anymore for those that did take the vaccine, even though now they are protected. But because of you, they're not protected. Like, it's, they're just trying to make arguments that do not really make sense in any way. that's I would say the first thing and it's it's not supposed to make sense it's supposed to to test the compliance of people if you're willing to to accept an argument that simply contradicts

basic logic you will accept everything that the government tells you so I would say this is the first thing like the propaganda that does not only doesn't need to make sense it should make no sense um i would say yeah and i would say that the second thing just repeats this the same message all the time you know that people they just bombard people with with a certain message all the time basically uh if it's the vaccine is effective or we need more lockdowns or i don't know whatever whatever it is that at the moment uh but they're just bombarding people with with certain message across all news boards across everywhere yeah uh speak illogical nonsense get people to believe that it's the truth and then repeat repeat repeat repeat it has to be true

they're repeating it so much and they're saying it with such certainty there's there's no reason it wouldn't be their authority figures they're on tv look at she's wearing she's wearing a pantsuit she's sitting behind a desk she's got a nameplate in front of her listen to her yeah exactly there was the study i think i've heard about it like quite a while ago uh like an old study that was um testing psychology of people uh under group pressure like you know showing uh there was like showing people uh two lines you know they entered like a single person that is you know uh the start the case study he doesn't know anything about the others the others are just cooperating with the study and basically they just show you for example two lines one long one short and ask

everybody to point which one is the long and which one is the short and everybody that is the cooperators are supposed to say that the long is short and the short is long and see what what you you know what the the other the one person that is basically outside of this um outside of this cooperating group will will say whatever we will yield to this pressure of you know being like uh say whatever everybody say or you know do basic logic and think for his own and basically most people will just yield to the group pressure and if everybody says that the short line is longer they will also say okay this the short line is longer yeah it's madness of crowds yeah so if they can if they can bombard you with with all this you know all this nonsense

uh on the tv on the news on places that you supposedly trust then they will manage to convince more and more people just by this pressure yeah and it's It's frustrating, right? Because they're dividing too, right? Now you're seeing, especially here in America, they're at least trying to. I think I'm actually proud of some of my fellow citizens here in America over the last few weeks

that have been standing up, particularly in the airline industry, in a lot of industries actually across the board that are standing up and saying, no, we're not going to abide by these mandates. We're not going to allow you to mandate this and divide us. but that is another tactic they use it'll use logical nonsense they'll repeat repeat repeat and then they'll try to divide create another exactly create somebody to point out and say

you're the reason why we're still in this um exactly which is yeah evil it's evil when you get down to it it is it is just trying to divide people and you know divide and conquer so they're trying to blame this group of people now it's the you know the scapegoat is now they're unvaccinated basically, or people that don't want to wear a mask or whatever. So they're just trying to divide you, divide the people, and trying to make, again, illogical arguments to explain why this group of people is responsible for the failure of the government policy. You know, it's not the vaccine that doesn't work, it's just the people who didn't take it are to blame that your protection from the vaccine doesn't work.

You know, again, it's an it's an illogical argument that they're basically trying to bombard you with and divide, divide the people and make those who are vaccinated hate the unvaccinated, basically. yeah it's fucked up and so i don't know if you have an answer to this question but i think this is what you're trying to do at clown world today is to again ridicule the power structure to point out their illogical nonsense and the methods that they're using to to brute force these messages and actions onto the populace so what do you think is the most effective way to convince those that have been convinced by the propaganda and the illogical nonsense that that we shouldn't be fighting each other that that they have been somewhat hypnotized yeah it's it's always to different degrees so there is always these people that you will never

be able to really convince anymore i think there are there um a small minority of everybody that does believe this propaganda for now i think there is this small core minority of believers fanatic believers even that will you know you can throw anything at them and there will never be any you know you can never convince them otherwise uh and then there is the masses basically like most of the people that are just you know they believe it because you know there is these people that on the news that tells you that and everything uh but i think first of all that the most effective thing is you know it's just time it's just waiting so basically because people are waking up to you know right now for example they see that the vaccine just doesn't work that you know in the cases

everywhere where people are vaccinated cases are just soaring again so they basically can see all of that and most people are not are not stupid they will see that if okay they can make this this logical conclusion sometimes you just need some help you know just point this out and some people will already start questioning stuff if you just point it out for them um for for others it might take more it might take you know that you you need to walk them through the logical conclusion like okay we vaccinated people and now there is more cases uh you see that there is you know you have to explain to them that okay why is that it's does the vaccine work then can we say that the vaccine work if if there is more cases now than before the vaccine why you know just ask

them these questions why do you think then that it's working if there are more cases just you know just interact with that and try to you know to ask them questions and why do they think certain stuff and if if they basically if their answer is just uh i saw that on tv so it must be true then you it's it's probably a lost cause you're not talking with someone that is thinking you're talking with someone that is you know parroting the the media and what he was told but if you can you know if you can engage with with people and most people you can engage with them and just you know why do you think this way uh why is it like that why do you think that this actually makes sense if so and so and when when they see that they cannot really answer these

these questions in any logical way they they will start questioning stuff too yeah and then there's like the whole concept of like the sunk cost fallacy a lot of the people who have gone with the with the mainstream narrative and have listened and thought like oh if i just do this like we're going to be free we're going to be free like they've gone from two weeks to flatten the curve to oh you need to get your booster every six months and there is that that sunk cost fallacy that that exists where a lot of individuals don't want to admit that they've been misled or or or lied to almost overtly by the authorities that they may previously believe they can trust so i think that's another another issue or

variable that needs to be taken into consideration with all this like you have to think put yourself in these people's shoes this is the way some of some of these individuals are thinking like oh there's no way i could have been this wrong for this long um trying to have them snap out like hey it's okay to admit you were wrong um exactly there's like a lot of pride and ego that that is attached to that sunk cost fallacy yeah exactly so this is also a problem this is why they make it so slow such a slow process so they didn't say at first they didn't say oh now we're mandating we will mandate the vaccines and you will have to show a qr code they didn't say that in in the first they did just say oh just two weeks stay at home and then everything will be back to normal

right that's what they said at first and you can see a lot of you know a lot of videos of fauci or whatever saying that they will never mandate vaccines in any way that they will be never be vaccine mandates uh you can see a lot of that stuff basically that from the beginning and now everything is called the complete opposite uh so they didn't start with you know they don't start with the insane stuff that we see you know that we see one year after they don't they don't start with that they start with small measures they start with two weeks just to you know get people tempted to okay let's listen to them uh they that's why they do it in small steps basically they wouldn't nobody would listen to them if they would start with what we have today if they would

started with it like two years ago uh when when everything started um yeah so so there is a lot of you know there is a lot of thought on on making it a slow process to make people accept it and now it's it's very hard for people to to go back and admit okay maybe i was wrong uh but eventually i think people will have to like that most people are logical persons they they can think and if eventually you see that stuff just doesn't make sense you'll have to admit to your wrong um even if it's uncomfortable people will just do it out of you know out of necessity i just hope it's not too late for that well i hope so too that's what i worry about is that too many have been have such a high sunk cost into everything that they just become unwilling

to admit that they may have been wrong and probably were wrong and that's a scary that's like that's what we're fighting against here right that's it and that's why again i wanted to bring you on because i think what you're doing by highlighting the hypocrisy and the illogical nature of a lot of things that are going on right now is a very potent tool against the the nudging towards totalitarianism and like are you confident we can turn this around and get back on the right path like again you're seeing australia canada yeah israel um going nuts insane literally it doesn't make it's literally insane they're doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results and

different results are never going to come until you're they're literally building concentration camps in australia yeah i've seen that so i think unfortunately for for some places i do think it's too late already i don't think australia will ever be livable in the in the you know in the next few years at least i don't think it will be a livable place let's put it that way a place that you would want to go to um or even can go to um but i think that you know i think that in general it's it's too late for some places it's not too late for for all for everybody i think there are first of all there are places that are you know resisting this nonsense very well in like texas and florida i mean it's really it's really great to see that and i think there are a lot of places

in uh latin america and in general mexico also um and you see the scandinavian nations as well going back to normal um sweden that never actually really cracked into this pressure in the first place so you do see that some places are getting more and more you know are getting worse basically but some places are also getting better uh compared to what they were like at the beginning uh compared to their initial reaction so i do think there is there's a lot of hope not for them not for everybody but for most people or at least a large part of the world yeah i like that i like hope i'm hopeful as well as i i moved to texas i think a large part obviously i want to be down here but by the bitcoin community i think there's a lot of opportunity

in the world that we're in in bitcoin but also i do i was attracted to the the respect for civil liberties and autonomy that the state of texas provides individuals um yeah we make this more pervasive and that's the other crazy thing about today's day and age too is that we have so much access to information so much action access to quality information above that however obviously the the stereotypical there's a lot of noise and so finding the signal and and that's why again i love clown world today you really highlight the signal or even find the noise and make fun of it um and really drive that point home so what is the reaction to clown world today been like do you have a lot of people dming you a lot of people emailing you um saying keep it up is there is

there like a silent majority that you're that you're noticing um that really like what you're doing but don't feel comfortable speaking up in the way that you're doing it yeah so i get a lot of dms and stuff and a lot of submissions you know of nonsense and a lot of people are like please don't don't tag me in any way or don't credit me in any way because they don't want any of the you know any of the fire uh they they're worried about that stuff and it's totally understandable but it's also you know a bit sad that you know you have to to worry about that stuff um sometimes so yeah there is a lot of people that want to to speak a lot more about it but are worried about about what you know about the personal consequences that they will face

um personally i think i mean it's understandable but i think it's also really important to try and do your best to to you know to really stand up against that uh even in in your personal way so um i do appreciate everybody that is you know doing submissions and i really appreciate all the all the help and you know the support from everybody uh but i also think that it's if if you if people could could speak even more about it it would be better uh they basically did the governments are trying to silence people about you know about everything uh one post that i think was yesterday that i uh that i uh one thing i uploaded on on clown world today um twitter yesterday was that uh canada was basically banning in like uh correspondence of government's official

uh the use of let's go brandon really yeah yeah so this is yeah so they basically are now like banning the government workers or something from from using that in like correspondences um so and this is like again this is clown world this is like absolute you know this is ridiculous but and people can can see how how stupid and ridiculous it is but the governments are freaking out about people you know saying stuff people saying their opinion and yeah i think so i think back to the original question I think people are very you know like a lot

the clown world think they can identify with that but yeah a lot of people seem to be afraid to speak up on their own right like think about how crazy that is like people will be astonished that I had the balls to have you

on and to have this particular conversation to post it on podcast youtube they're like oh my god why would you you're gonna get mad like freaks think about the state of the world if we can't even have this conversation i mean we're just literally having a conversation about how we're looking at what's going on in the world in the last two years and how we're dissecting it you may not agree with it you may not agree with it i don't care if you don't agree with that and i i would not ever try to censor you for not agreeing with it but the the fact that people can't even have these conversations you can't utter the words let's

go brandon which is just like a sly like dig like a three word euphemism to say i i you're lying to me like like you can't even believe you can't even utter the belief that somebody's lying to that you don't believe what somebody's telling you you can't you can't just you can't voice displeasure or discontent with anything that it is scary it is it is not okay and that's why i i mean obviously if you guys are listening to this podcast and have been for a while you know i don't really care uh whether or not these people don't like the conversations that we're having these conversations need to be had you think you need not even that they need to be had you need to be able to have them we don't live in a free society if you literally can't

talk about things it's insanity it's scary if we allow them to keep censoring us like this and allow them to reduce the frame in which you can have acceptable conversation we're going that's that's in the digital world and in the audio space in the physical world like they're doing in australia they're gonna they're gonna control your bodies to some extent and what you do with that i mean they already are arguably with with the vaccine mandates with the attentive band it's like if you're out there and you're skeptical and you don't like the conversation that we're having you don't agree with it i'm completely okay with that you don't have to agree with anything we're saying but i think you should agree that we should be able to have this

conversation yeah exactly so the crazy thing is that people are afraid to speak basically people are afraid to speak their mind or you know say something because they were will be cancelled because they will lose their you know their youtube account or twitter account or whatever people are just being afraid to to speak up basically um and they're afraid of the reaction from from others or something i don't even think we're saying something too you know too crazy or something we're not talking about how the even about how the earth is flat or anything but i think it's not okay to you know to talk about anything that you want but we're not even there we're just you know speaking a very normal conversation on on facts so basically on stuff

that you know on data that we we've seen uh and you know trying to to draw conclusions from from this from this data and i don't think this is that radical that people you know that the fact that people are afraid to to talk like that right now or you know have to think twice or three times before they speak about it is is quite insane and obviously you don't have to agree with anything here but if you even disagree that we have the right to to say that that we should can be discussing that and have this conversation this is like this is crazy it's insane it's insane like you said it's not like we're saying people are being injected with 5g receptor chips that are going to be able to depopulate them at any point in time we're not saying that we're saying

hey like i'm looking at the data something here is wrong yeah for me personally i'm like i'm looking at the data i'm 30 years old i was like all right okay the risk of getting again i'd rather get covid didn't get the vaccine i don't want to compound risk and that's this is the way i approached it i got covid now i have natural immunity and i'm like happy covid frankly it wasn't fun it was it was like a bad flu um i never thought i was gonna be hospitalized but i was on my ass for a few days until i got ivermectin uh then again you're not allowed to speak about no i'm not allowed to speak about that either you can't look at japan and say that they they offered they mandated ivermectin as a prophylactic in the middle of august and

their cases have basically gone to zero um you can't you can't say that um but yeah the guy again it's about personal autonomy being able to make these decisions on yourself like i'm i'm a i'm an adult who went through schooling university no that may be used against me um or may not be a benefit that's probably a better way to put it uh like i'm gonna make decisions for myself and you know what if i got covered and died that would have been my fault like and and it was a risk i was willing to take i took it i don't want to say paid off but it was good risk analysis in my my opinion and now again just looking at the data like you're trying to mandate vaccines on children it's like these children aren't dying like why would you ever

put them at risk for with these vaccines and then you can't talk about the bears data either with the adverse um adverse reactions like you can't talk about that the vaccine is pristine the vaccine is pristine and there's there's no adverse reactions don't look at the tens of thousands of various reports that have been been verified and issued they don't exist yeah i was looking into the various basically the various data as well around mid-august i think it was and it was just you know i was trying to analyze it more or less but it was difficult because there was so many that you know there were like hundreds of thousands of reports that i needed to search when my computer was simply not strong enough to do this analysis i was just cracking with it but

But it's it was, you know, it was crazy to see all these reports. And even, you know, I'm from Israel. Everybody's vaccinated there. And I've heard about a lot of a lot of cases. So, you know, there are people that got COVID in Israel and like, you know, didn't feel, you know, bad or anything or just like flu. And it was people that got the vaccine and were completely fine. but again there were people that got COVID and were bad and there were people that got the vaccine and got rid of that so there is in both cases there is there is some risk but you also see the

data that the you know another data from Israel that the vaccine is basically 30 times or 27 times less effective than getting COVID basically so the the rate of people that got the vaccine then got sick compared to the people that got covid before and then got covid again is like you know it's it's like 30 times difference um so and you know you can you're not allowed to talk about that so if you got covid and like after six months or something you need again to to get you know you need to get a booster why why do you need that you know you cannot prove you can even you know prove that you have strong immunity but you will still need to get this booster just you know just because this is the regulation um it's it's just crazy to to see that it doesn't

make any sense in terms you know that they basically made the term healthy or the term vaccinated or the term immune you know a political term it's no longer you know the antibodies that you have in your body or how do you feel if you feel well and you know and don't feel bad then you're not sick no you maybe you are sick or you know if you have immunity like you can check your antibodies but you didn't get all the official booster shot then you're not immune even though your body is technically is immune so all of this all of this madness basically all of this politicization of scientific terms and all of this nonsense yeah it's insane yeah they changed the definition of like natural immunity to like being like having a population that's where herd

herd immunity excuse me um they literally changed it on the go oh it's it's not 180 percent or whatever the percentage was of the population as uh it's contracted a disease it's it's if they're vaccinated it's like what they're literally changing definitions on the go they changed the definition of herd immunity they changed the definition of a vaccine of what a vaccine is even uh a few a few like months ago i think that the cdc basically changed on the website even not only herd immunity i think that was before but even uh what is the definition for a vaccine and instead of saying that it's like gives you immunity for disease it says now that it gives you protection or something from a disease so it's they basically just you know

they made a vaccine it didn't work uh or didn't work as well as they hoped and now it's basically you know so okay it's not that that you know it's still good it's just that okay now we changed the definition of what the vaccine is and now yeah it's good we don't need to to make a better vaccine we just need to change the definition of what a vaccine is and now it's all good yeah it has temporary protection that's all that's all you need it's a temporary protection it's insane and again like i'm just thinking in my head we're gonna get so much for having this conversation and posting it on the internet i do think so it's like it's crazy like how can we not have this conversation without getting labeled as either domestic terrorist or insane people

conspiracy theorists you are the chief conspiracy theorist at cloud world today so you do own the mantle um yeah yeah i mean now that you know you you just speak your mind you're a conspiracy theorist for you know looking at the data and making conclusion that makes you a conspiracy theorist uh if you don't agree with everything that the media says right now even though it is like the media changes that there's stand so fast that even if you what you were saying like six months ago is now the accepted narrative like you were saying for example that the the vaccine is is not as effective it's not definitely not 90 effective or in any way then six months ago you were a conspiracy theorist now it's the official narrative but again what they are they're trying

to make the logical conclusion from is again it's nonsensical is okay the vaccine didn't work well it's like it's not 90 effective now they're saying it's like 30 or 40 effective right that's that's what what they're saying that's what the media is saying right now that's like the fact and ignore that this is what we we said like months ago i said that you know the natural immunity for example is better than the vaccine and now it's again it's the facts and in the media as well uh but the logical conclusion that they're trying to draw from from this stuff is that still okay the vaccine didn't work now you need more of the vaccine that didn't work you know and that then that will work let's compound our mistakes here so they're yeah they're compounding the mistakes and they're

basically you know everything that the conspiracy theorists were saying like at first saying that vaccine passport will be become your reality was a conspiracy theorist now it's you know it's the narrative but they're just trying to change it to okay now but but it's a good thing so basically the conspiracy theories kind of have been right all for for you know for over a year and a half right now something uh but they just keep changing this you know the the logical conclusions that they that they draw from from this from this stuff yeah what do you think do you think it's malice or incompetence at at the top of where these decisions are being made i'm still struggling with that i think it's both yeah um it's it's hard to say i think it's mostly incompetent but i definitely

think that there is something that is just just bad you cannot there is no way that you know that you enforce lockdowns on people and force them to to vaccine mandates and uh to vaccine passports and you know and the people that are actually generating all these nonsensical ideas are good people uh but i do think that a lot of a lot of a lot of it is just you know people that are echoing what they've heard um that you know they're it's not my list that's incompetence with most of the people yeah i mean there's an obvious incentive profit incentive on on the big pharma vaccine side as well yeah that needs to be taken into consideration yeah and for and it needs to be taken into consideration that there is a lot of incentive for profit on their side

that they have already been convicted you know Pfizer have already been convicted of malpractice in you know in their marketing and bribing doctors and all of that you know that they've already done that and been convicted about it and got like the well what was that like the biggest um fine in the yeah in the in the history of the u.s or something so this is you know people why do you trust them now if if you see what they have done if you know what the conspiracy theorists they have been convicted exactly of what the conspiracy theorists say just you know just a few years before also so what makes you think that now you can trust them hey your life saving vaccine brought to you from the people who brought you the opiate epidemic

exactly we're here to help you here take this vaccine you know what you got back pain after that here's here's some percocet enjoy it exactly thanks for your money it's frustrating it is frustrating frustrating to know that we're going to be labeled as dangerous theorists and conspiracy theorists. I've already been labeled that. You own the mantle, conspiracy theorists. But there's going to be a lot of anger that we have this conversation. People, don't be angry. We're just having a conversation. We're just talking through some things, trying to highlight some illogic, illogical inconsistencies that are out there. Logical inconsistencies yeah i guess they're illogical inconsistencies too um and i want you to know

we truly care about the fate of the world of humans of others i don't want anybody to die i'm not like cheering on the pandemic okay i just think there are other options exactly so what what people are trying to you know and part of the narrative is like you either agree with us or you want people you just want people to die and this is you know i i just think that there is a better way to to deal with this i think there is a safer way than what you are proposing basically i think that there is a better way than taking a booster shot every few months uh you know and locking down and doing faxing passports i think this is not the way to to save lives to protect people and you know just

just because i disagree with your methods doesn't mean that i want people to die or anything this is like this branding is is insane it's ridiculous like oh if you disagree with me then it must mean that you just want people to die no i just think that your way doesn't going isn't going to save people or isn't going to save to be as effective as another way basically yeah another thing i just remembered that i was thinking of earlier when you think like you can't say that and then like there's another thing like not only are like illogical and like i'm talking about like the build back better crew is behind the podium we're banging this propaganda into your head day in and day out just the way they speak literally like the inflection in their voice the tone in their voice

to me at least as somebody who is completely turned off by by the power structure and the mainstream media it's just like literally the way they speak you can tell they're just droning it's like a droning politic speak you know using the thumb out and um it doesn't seem authentic in any way shape or form which is like one thing for me is somebody who likes to fancy himself as somebody with a good bullshit detector that's that's like literally the inflection of somebody's voice the tone in their voice and the way they project a message can says a lot to me at least and a lot of these people are just speaking like drones um and for some reason people pick up that tone and that inflection and and don't see that it's complete bullshit being spread to them

yeah you you can you can see basically that what they're saying they don't really believe in that and you can also see what's in interactions that you can you always hear about this world the leading politician that was unmasked in in you know in their own regulations joe biden this week exactly for example uh and all these uh you know from even from the very beginning of the pandemic and not just in the u.s it's everybody in israel there were a lot of scandals on that and how for example i think i don't remember exactly who it was i think it was the mayor of new york or something that closed gyms but uh still went to his like private gym or something you know because and when he was caught it's like oh but i really need this this

exercise to you know to be able to protect you people that is that is animal farm that is literally the same argument from from animal farm on the pigs taking all the apples the good apples and stuff this is like you know that was directly from animal farm it was insane and everything every time that the leaders are getting caught with this nonsense they're breaking their own laws you know that's okay they don't get any anything from you know they nothing happens to them and as i think one was like quit but then got a job in the june or something like i think it was um from britain uh like the health minister or something that was caught in like uh uh with his mistress or something and then it was the dude who made the models he made the models

that shut down the uk exactly exactly and then basically he he violated his own rules and then he got you know fired but then got the job in the un in like covid something uh so basically they don't get any any any any pushback or anything it's kind of a privilege that only the leaders can you know defy that their own rules basically um yeah so you can see that they're not they are if they were really scared of this they were you know wearing their mask all the time and they were also like you know just staying home and not going to these vacations that you have seen many politicians take while they urge people to stay home and they wouldn't you know go visit their family or do all of this stuff like they were urging others not to do so if they were honest

about it if they were really scared but they are not they're just doing this stuff that they tell everybody else not to do um just because they you know you can see that that they're insincere with with their kind of fear mongering uh they are not truly scared about it they're just they want to scared the population they're hypocrites and they're hypocrites yeah and that's that's another very strong potent tactic in the war against the clown world is not only pointing out their a lot their logical inconsistencies but pointing out every instance of them being hypocritical right like why we are all humans we all have the same basic anatomical structure just because they are voted into office doesn't make them uh less susceptible to

to a global pandemic and just that hypocritical example right there of these politicians gavin news and mayor london of san francisco mayor kenny of philadelphia lori lightfoot um in chicago um the list goes on here in the united states uh i mean and there's plenty of people on the other side that have done it as well um i just listed off a bunch of democrats i'm trying to think of like well a lot of republicans are and not a lot of them a few of them are against everything that's going on but again a lot of these people are extremely extremely hypocritical and it's so frustrating to watch the masses just take it hook line and sinker and take it in the face they're pissing in your face

and telling you it's raining and it's just it's infuriating to watch people fall for these again like i said most of us 99 of us i believe most people are good most people just want the same thing which is a roof over their head food in their stomachs a happy family a good friend group the ability to live a happy life um and they've they've successfully divided us which is goddamn shame and it's and it's like they yeah people are infighting and they should be looking at the true source of our plight which is the the hypocrites and in charge the clown world we focused a lot on uh covid and the vaccine but that's not the only thing you cover in the clown world what else are you seeing out there in the clown world um yeah so i think right now this is

the most urgent issue and the most prominent thing but it's definitely not that the only thing there is you know i always post also some stuff about ridiculous articles uh ridiculous nonsense either with with you know climate stuff that is just doesn't make sense in in how they how they uh with with the arguments there or whatever it is just you know just random stuff that is just completely ridiculous um it's it is mostly right now it is mostly about with with the vaccines or with the covid stuff and there is a lot of stuff that is you know just weird photos and weird you know behavior of people in that but also in general this censorship you know this let's go brandon thing that they banned in in canada for example um or just you

know or now with all these supply shortages for example and how again they're trying to hit again all all of the the stuff that is kind of you know there is the supply shortage shortages and the inflation and you know i try to to do all of that stuff but they keep you know they blame now the supply shortages on the unvaccinated or something so they're trying to do all of this nonsensical stuff um that even if it's not really related to COVID and it's like you know the general clown world stuff uh they are still insisting that it is all they're unvaccinated or still trying this stuff to COVID um yeah so I just cover everything I try to cover everything that seems you know that is ridiculous that it's like doesn't make sense that is um that is you know that the people you

know that the media is spreading nonsense i just try to call bullshit on on everything that is bullshit yeah well thank you for doing it i think it's empowering people emboldening people and for those anons or not anons even those those who are dming ben and clown world today saying say this on behalf of me i would urge you to develop and gain the courage to speak up for yourself too because i think that like you like the first clown world today newsletter you wrote like the only way we get out of this is if people stop complying and part of not complying is voicing your discontent i think i think you'd be surprised at how many individuals out there again the silent majority i believe there is a silent majority that thinks that things are

going crazy but they are afraid of speaking up um and it's getting to a point at least for me where i know i'm lucky i will concede this i'm lucky that i have uh the the life that i do and I'm sort of inoculated from the ability of an employer to cut me off. Maybe my advertisers could. I guess I do run that risk of advertisers cutting me off and demonetizing me. And that way I do think that I've aligned with strong-willed advertisers. But I think more people need to speak up. And I think what you're doing at Clown World today is giving people more courage.

because again once you highlight and use humor i think that's a very important tactic and in this fight against the insanity is using humor is bringing bringing a light humor to it and just saying hey look at this this is this is fucking hilariously dumb like we're really going to put up with this and it's like hard to deny when you make somebody laugh yeah exactly so i think yeah i think i'm also i feel very lucky that i don't have to worry about you know um getting fired from from my job and and stuff i i'm still young and i have quite some you know i can go uh go places i don't for example i left israel and they could you know there are a lot of people that cannot just go and and live or it's way harder for them with kids with family with stuff that

they have to you know that it's harder for them to just go and live and or that it's harder for them to leave their job or something and yeah i totally understand that and but i would still like you know try i would still say to try your best to still speak up if you can um because yeah i just think it's really important and i think that they're just you know they're trying to make people feel that they're alone basically that you know everybody disagrees with them no that that's not true a lot of people agree with you a lot of people agree that stuff just doesn't make sense they're just afraid to speak up and they are just being silenced on on the media and being ridiculed on the media uh and not given any platform on social media and being

censored but you know that the i wrote it on also in the i think the first newsletter basically that the goal of their propaganda is not just to you know they're not trying to convince that the critical thinkers they're trying to convince them they're alone um they're just you know they try to make you feel that there's no one that agrees with you and this is part of you know making you making people yield to the group pressure is that to make people feel they're alone because if you know if if you're alone pointing something and saying this doesn't make sense then you know maybe you're you're insane it's that's a lot like in 1984 but if if there is a lot of people around you that also say okay this doesn't make sense then it makes you feel more confident this is

what they want to eliminate yeah and this harkens back to the study that you referenced so you have a bunch of actors basically saying hey this the shorter line is actually longer than the longer line like you're an idiot if you don't see that me me isolated subject of the study uh eventually goes along with like oh i know that's shorter but i'm gonna say uh it's longer than the longer line like that the demoralization is is a very very strong tactic of propaganda um propagandizing people and it is what they're trying to do they're trying to demoralize critical thinkers uh into just going along don't you are not crazy and again for anybody out there who thinks we're crazy for having this conversation i think please concede at least please agree with us that it we

should be able to have this conversation i don't think nothing we're not are people going to try and say this conversation is dangerous harmful it's going to kill people yeah i think they're going to create models are they going to create models that say uh marty and ben had this conversation on on tuesday october uh 19th or whatever today is it was posted on the 26th and and since then covet cases have gone up x amount because of this conversation two people on completely different sides of the planet i think yeah it's just that the idea that words are now so dangerous that they cannot be said that you know that your words are now dangerous this is like this is absolute nonsense this is what the the

us have the first amendment the words are not are not dangerous they're words they're you know deprived of free speech even if you're you know you're allowed to be wrong and you're allowed you know even people that you disagree with or that they are wrong even if somebody is wrong he's allowed to be wrong if he wants he's allowed to say stuff that is you know that is wrong that or that I disagree with and the idea that this is now dangerous and that you have to suppress speech because now speech is dangerous it's it's absolutely nonsense it's absolutely dangerous it's it's the character of every totalitarian regime or every murderous regime in in history is you know to silence people for saying that they're you know their opinions or their thoughts

they're you know what they're the things they're saying they're basically they're dangerous to the public this is always the excuse to you know to to you know to suppress free speech that it is dangerous to the public it is not dangerous it is just words it's just speech words don't you know words don't kill people yeah and if if the words and the ideas and the line of thinking is truly wrong you should be able to refute it with a better idea or line of thinking again here humans have been imbued with the ability to think critically it's part of the beauty of humanity if you're able to make a convincing logical argument or again we're all anatomically like pretty much the same you should be able to uh convince somebody with with a critical argument

yeah for example you know if if somebody is saying that the world is flat or something i i definitely disagree with it but i don't think this puts me in danger that he says that the world is flat or you know or that he will try to convince people that the world is flat no i can just tell no the world is round and you know because this is the logical argument and i can bring the logical you know argument i can bring arguments and facts and evidence to support my argument and you know people will just listen to me because this this makes more sense this is the right argument and they will just logically understand it um but i don't think in any way like oh people they say that the rf is flat or danger and endangering our society and killing

people no they just they just think differently and it's their right to to say what they what they want and it's their right to to be wrong if if they want but that's that's it and i want to start now with the fight with the flat earth society well you just you just invited a flat earth or fight expect your dms to get low enough i i will i will but i'm already used to it so just as an example i think this is wrong but you know everybody has their right to to talk about whatever they think um so and then people will call me like a conspiracy theorist again for for saying stuff that i think is right and maybe i'm wrong maybe not but i i have the right to at least think this way and say this stuff this is not putting people in danger if you think that i'm

wrong just bring a better argument yeah yeah let's meet on the battlefield of ideas that's these things should be you should be decided not um not be a dick tot ben it's been a pleasure we're over an hour here should we talk about bitcoin and all your thoughts on bitcoin these days well that's what i guess maybe that's how we can edit because you i think and this is a meme that's getting getting out there more widely now these days is that yes bitcoin does allow us to fix things but it's only a tool and bitcoin is only a strong tool in our in our tool belt that we can then use to to build a better world it's not a panacea in and of itself you need action external to bitcoin correct yeah exactly so bitcoin by itself is is an amazing tool it's

probably the best and most important tool that we have uh but it's it's a tool if we don't use it and just you know use it correctly then it's it won't solve anything by itself we have to use it also and we have to use it correctly uh this is again why i think using full nodes is so important why i think self-custody is so important you have to use the tool correctly uh in order for it to fix things um so bitcoin is a tool and it's an amazing tool um and we should all you know use it correctly and work to to improve it and to you know to make more people use it um but yeah again it's a tool in in this fight to to freedom freedom of speech and freedom of transaction basically um not you know not being dependent on payment processors or whatever or you

know governments not confiscating your bank account because you didn't get your booster shot or something uh this is the future that we can we can see that you know with especially with cbdcs uh that will probably come in the next few years and be connected to your social credit system and everything that is the vaccine system that will what it will evolve to in a few years um but again so everything that is going towards more control more totalitarianism and more you know control especially on how you can spend your money or you know how what do you what you do with it uh what you're not allowed to do with it when you're allowed to use it or where and yeah bitcoin is just the tool to say you know fuck you i'll use it however i want this is mine this is my property

this is my money uh you you cannot just take it away um if whenever you want like bank accounts you cannot just freeze it you cannot just block certain transactions because you don't like the the person that i'm sending to or you don't like me uh you cannot just censor transactions um this is the the amazing thing about bitcoin it's just that it liberates you from from these controls yeah it's a very potent tool but you do have to use the correct way and again bitcoin gives me hope and individual zoomers like you ben you give me even more hope because you're you're building these tools and you're putting your putting your reputation and your skin in the game um more so than than most of the people on the planet right now it's an extremely admirable

path that you've chosen and i feel very fortunate to to uh to know you and gotten to know you better over the last few years um thank you for for all the work you do on the bitcoin side for for those of you freaks are unaware ben has uh been an open source contributor to uh the specter open source project for quite some time and do you do some bitcoin core stuff as well review or um i didn't do much so we have like one commit there for you know for um documentation and did a very little bit of review but i wouldn't say that i'm a core contributor i definitely hope that i will have the chance now in the coming months to look into it more um so that's definitely something that i want to do and want to you know to be more active but for now no i wouldn't take

a credit on that okay all right sorry for sorry for getting that wrong but um hey it was fun being dangerous with you for the last hour and 20 minutes uh we're gonna probably gonna get a shit storm but again i think it's imperative that these conversations whether you agree with them or not happen um and again we're not saying that you're getting a 5g chip inserted into you and they're gonna they're gonna jolt a heart attack into you remotely at some point in the future we're just saying hey we're looking at the data it really doesn't make sense to us i think we we have the the mental capacity and uh and skills oh maybe not skills but uh ability to to look at data and draw certain conclusions that make sense to us and that's all we're saying this

is what we're seeing this is how we're dissecting it and this is how we're viewing it if you don't agree that's perfectly fine um i'd love to have to talk about your perspective and what you believe the data that you're seeing and why you believe that we may or may not be wrong um but again you these conversations need to be like it's so fucking crazy to me that i feel rebellious having this conversation with you like it feels like an act of rebellion just having an open conversation like this and that's and that's just part of my personality when authority figures try to tell me to do something i've been this way my whole life i really just do not like that and i would go that i usually go in the opposite direction like don't fucking tell me what to do

please i'm an autonomous free human i will i will do whatever no whatever i want i'm not gonna go murder anybody but like i'm not harming anybody fuck alone exactly exactly you you're allowed to speak your mind yeah exactly but hey maybe they will say we will we will be harming people with this but i don't think we are ben where can we find out more about you more about clown world today um more before you're up to yeah so there's the you know the the newsletter that you can reach at clown world dot today uh the url or you can follow on twitter clown world today cwt underscore news or you can reach me out at underscore ben kaufman on twitter or telegram or whatever um yeah right we'll link to all these in the show notes ben keep crushing

it brother thank you for coming on today yeah yeah thank you for inviting me yeah i can't wait to do it again hopefully in person next time yeah i hope so all right peace and love freaks