TFTC: A Bitcoin Podcast - #453: From Barstool to Mash with Louis Roberts

Episode Date: October 17, 2023

Marty sits down with Lightswitch Lou to talk about Mash and its integration with the new TFTC website. Louis on Twitter: https://twitter.com/Buddyloveless 0:00 - Intro 5:28 - Riffing 15:37 - Mash and the new TFTC site 24:26 - Incumbent monetization models 29:06 - Enabling interaction features 31:58 - Controlling your own flow of funds 39:27 - Ending the subscription model 47:22 - Convincing other publishers 50:29 - Verifying humanity 54:51 - Lightning compared to advertising a decade ago 1:00:39 - Barstool 1:03:24 - Death of the old model 1:06:27 - Riffing after an interruption 1:11:26 - Chicken and egg of Bitcoin adoption 1:17:39 - Demo-ing donations 1:19:33 - We’re gonna win 1:25:42 - Twitter and Nostr 1:29:30 - Riffing 1:32:56 - New site launch 1:36:08 - Saving the world with Bitcoin 1:40:30 - Politicians are nuts 1:48:21 - War 1:58:35 - Rising from ashes of the American empire 2:01:27 - AI 2:03:26 - Ending riff Shoutout to our sponsors: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠River⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Bitcoin Talent Co⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ TFTC Merch is Available: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Shop Now⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Join the TFTC Movement: Main ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YT Channel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Clips ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YT Channel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Website⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Twitter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Marty Bent: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Twitter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Newsletter⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠

what's up freaks it's your boy marty here to introduce this rip of tftc big rip big announcement rip back in the studio with the godfather of the show uncle lou light switch lou working at mash now he's in the bitcoin industry and tftc is partnered with mash to create a whole new site a whole new experience big changes happening this fall tftc go check out the site go to tftc.io lou and i describe the changes that are coming to the site are now on the site that are live today i'm very excited for this truth for the commoner we're gonna get the truth out there logan do the people deserve the truth absolutely can they handle the truth. We'll have to see.

We will have to see. This report was brought to you by our good friends at River. Added a new feature last week. Pretty cool feature. I used it. But unfortunately, Cointelegraph ruined my chances of hitting it.

You can now set price targets on River. So if you want to set limit orders to buy below or above the price at any given point in time, you can do that. I said $100. buy level i think around 26k last week and then the intern from coin telegraph came out and said a uh blackrock etf approved price ripped to 30k settled down around 29 right now

uh blackrock etf was not approved that was fake news price is still pumping yeah river you can set limit orders now rivers uh doing it the right way no fee ds dca they have river lightning services if you're looking to build on the lightning network you can auto withdrawal they want you to take self-custody that's why they added their auto withdrawal feature allows you to stack to a certain point and then auto withdrawal to an address of your choice go check it all out go to river.com slash tftc sign up for an account today strip is also brought to you by our friends unchained down the hall launching hot shit as well a lot of building in this bear market unchained just launched their enterprise

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It's a beautiful thing. Go check this out. check out all their products their lending desk their ira product their trading desk their inheritance protocol just set up a consultation with their team unchained.com slash consultation tell them the tftc sent you learn about what they're building why they're building it how they're building it and how they can help you secure your bitcoin and leverage it to sit in an ira to be used as collateral for us dollar alone all that jazz unchained.com slash consultation.

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you've had a dynamic where money's become freer than free when you talk about a fed just gone nuts all all the central banks going nuts so it's all acting like safe haven i believe that in a world where central bankers are tripping over themselves to devalue their currency bitcoin wins in the world of fiat currencies bitcoin is the victor i mean that's part of the bull case for bitcoin if you're not paying attention you probably should be Yeah, we just hit it. Why are you shitting on my setup? Because headphones are for fucking losers.

Get a real studio, dude. Wait, wait, wait. Is this how we're going to start the show? Oh, I've been here for a month. I got a lot to say just about you in general. What? Wait, wait, wait. If we're going to start the show, we got to get nicotined up.

There's no way we're not. Well, get the nicotine out of the shot, please. Okay. In my beautiful studio. Is the nicotine out of the shot? Like, I'm going to have it on me the entire time. I'm putting nicotine in my mouth right now. Does nicotine work for you?

Does nicotine work for me? I don't drink. I don't do anything anymore. I don't do drugs. This is the only thing I do. Without nicotine, I wouldn't even be able to get up in the morning. Load up. Let's load up a big lip for this one.

This is going to be a long one. Let's load up a big lip. Did you ever think you'd be sitting in Austin, Texas in a studio that I own? Yeah, I've been here a few times. No, I'm going back to October 2017 when we were at Barstool. So you were running crypto capital from the second floor. Did I think we would be here? I thought it was like everything else I've ever done in my life.

It's either a fucking boom or bust deal. It's a you were a boom or bust deal, and I don't know if it's still boom or bust with you. Are we booming or are we busting right now? We're still teetering on the edge of both sides of boom and bust. Bitcoin will do that to you. I know. you got i mean there's too much i told you in june of 2017 it was going to be a long game

we're six years in i know you said it was going to be a long game but you want to know what really really like had me like it really has me like going how you be you're like a vc guy now like having dinners on sundays and like that's such a vc move that's not an operator move i'm an operator too that's the beauty of it are you i'm operating right now we're recording we're working we're operating yeah but like i'm being like the real operators are going seven days a week you're having you're having a soiree every sunday every sunday i've been here there's a new soiree we have sunday family meals it's an important day it's a very important day but like when we're in the middle of launches i just you're just like a vc guy you're like a you're like a

oh i just gotta travel here to talk to these people about raising money it's like okay dude But, like, really, we never needed any money. We just made everything work. We're making things work. You're such a VC guy. I can't imagine where you're going to be. You took me to Capitol Grill and said, that's your favorite place. You're 60 years old, dude.

That's not. Yeah, I was there. Let me add some context to this. I was there once. It's my favorite. All right, everything else is out. It's the most reliable. It's my favorite reliable option in the city.

Capitol Grill's always there. The Bar Capital Grill in Austin is always there to provide you with good oysters, good steak, good wine. I literally felt like I was sitting with a retiree. A bottle of red at Capital Grill on a Wednesday, and Capital Grill was like, we close at 10 o'clock. It was Thursday. Wednesday, tomato, tomato.

We're still sitting there, and I felt like I was sitting at a retiree dinner. That's all right. That's who you are. I'm an old soul. You're right. I'm a different, I go at a different speed. i go at my own speed my own pace my own way but that's why i'm here because that's why we work probably yeah i'm the ying to your yang you're going a thousand miles an hour and i gotta always

be there to pull you back in and say hey long-term vision slow and steady that's probably true at this point in my life when you're closer to 40 than 30 i probably definitely need someone who's not like just let's just burn everything to the ground or something like just go as nuts as you can and the house may burn to the ground yeah i got kids now you do have kids a lot of kids i got two kids more than one is a lot more than one is like okay that's a lot yeah it's fun i did i do like kids but forces you to level up i do like kids but but i like handing them back to hand them back to you hand back my sister they can just like i don't got to be there 24 7 yeah my kids like their uncle will i know they

know my name it's crazy yeah you know i am it's weird that's that's also a weird world where like there's like kids around that know my name why is that weird i don't know dude we like the internet world is different dude i don't we're not i'm not a vc sunday dinner guy i'm just like how did i let's get it clear i sound like a vc thing that's just like a you have a sunday dinner with your family and friends it's a good age-old human experience okay all right it is it does feel like it's like a 1950s thing and i guess i'm just not a 1950s guy but i i'm a girl i'm a grill dad but i respect it i respect it thank you but that's why we end up here because it's like oh i'm in new york i'm in california oh we got a good idea i'm in austin and i live here

we do have a good idea that was it but we're finally getting to the point all right so why we here to talk you're fully in the bitcoin industry now i am in the bitcoin industry for better or worse i'm in the bitcoin industry i have a bitcoin company we have a bitcoin startup now yeah it's it's didn't think this was ever going to happen always thought you guys are just going to scream one bitcoin is one bitcoin and i was going to just go like this and pray that it worked But it seems like it's going to work now. That's why we're here. Yeah.

And what's working is something I told you six years ago was going to take time. You did. I will say that. This was pre the Lightning Network hadn't even launched yet. I will say that. The number we were, I was talking in 2016 or maybe, I don't know what it was. 17. 17.

We're sitting in the Barstool merch room and you're drawing on a whiteboard. I have the picture. Maybe we can pull up the picture. Maybe we can't. I still have the picture. you draw you drew something on a whiteboard about lightning and me and caleb were sitting there and we were like we have no idea what you're talking about but it was such a crazy looking drawing that i was like he's either totally scamming us for everything or this has to work

like there's no other there was no there was no other solution it was never going in the middle it was either you were totally scamming us or it was definitely going to work because the picture you drew hope we can pull it up it looks like it's like a you can you can slack it to logan on okay we'll get it up it looks like a square it's like there's all these things nodes driven into it and i'm like i have no idea what this is yeah zero it was lightning network and it was i think i brought it up back at barstool because i think it was like december 2017 when the ico boom was going off and i think you pulled me into like a shernan group email where they were getting asked whether or not barstool should launch an ico and i was like had to politely

join the email thread and be like barstool can't even manage a wordpress website there's no reason to ico and icos are scams like stay away yeah i don't know how we ever would have done anything like that dude that would have been that would have been the end of us because we couldn't even you're right we could barely build a website so it's like we could barely build a website like we like there was not i mean we said it there was squirrels that ate our internet like you never knew who ran the website big cat would do the like the emergency thing that was drew at mspaint i don't know how we would have done anything when bitcoin yeah like we never could have did it even we wanted to and then at that same time remember i sat next to barba and he was big on lisk and

he was like we're gonna like lisk is like the future of applications so i was like no this thing called the lightning network's gonna come out and that's how you're gonna be able to monetize content in the future it's over the second layer it allows the audience to engage peer-to-peer with the creator you did say that i i think i lost forty thousand dollars on list that day because we're up to zero because i was like andrew knows how to code this dude does it and i barely know but you did say it that's the thing is i will give you credit you have been more right than wrong about this stuff by a large margin by a large margin because i've seen all the i've seen all the all the uh all the grifters i i don't want to mention any names but i've seen some grifters

people that know me know i've seen some grifters you are not a grifter thank you i try not to be i mean i would grift if i could i just don't know how to drift like i don't even know you wanted to grift in episode one of this show i did yeah you wanted to take all the ico money i had that i mean there was money was it was flowing like i was flowing like i can't even think of like what's like the Capistrano. It was flowing like the salmon of Capistrano. There was just flowing money. Why would you not look at it and be like, okay. Cause then you sell your soul. Yeah. That's a thing, but I didn't look at it as like, you knew more than me. That's why I kind of glad I listened to you. It was just like, I was like, oh, this ICO stuff is just companies.

The same thing. If I took SeatGeek money or Roman money, I was like, I'm just taking the money. And you, you were the one that pushed back. I'll give you that. I'll give you credit on it. you push back on all that stuff yeah i said hey just wait it's going to take time i'll tell you what though if i took that money i would have been able to be on instagram like all those instagram models in europe all summer i would if i would have took that money i could have spent i could have been in europe posted on instagram all summer like they all do it drives me crazy i don't think anyone works anymore i could have been there yeah that's a big problem does anyone work i think people do or certainly there's a lot of people working out here there's a lot of people well

i'll say this do you want to i mean i was going to save it for a tweet but i might as well say it on thing you know bitcoin's going to win i've been here i've been in the studio for a month i've seen one woman walk in here everyone's just a nerd code and i love it building the future they are it feels i'm like okay maybe this thing is going to work because everyone's just headphones on computer seven screens one dude over there has got like a five thousand dollar screen just it's like it's like folding it's like this is in the mix yeah they're building a lot of people building on the lightning network out there it's interesting it's definitely getting to the point where there's going to be real companies on this thing yeah

i mean i think you're working for one there's a good segue into the meat of the conversation while we're here you work for mesh yes i work for mash why did you take the leap into mesh you are for how crazy you are and how fast you move in the house like you you remind me like the pepe silvia meme but like you actually know how to pull it all together on the media side of things you know media better than anybody i've ever met from the seo plays to the monetization to the trends that are emerging you're pretty early on podcasting on youtube yeah i'm i know media i know anything in that space any software product yeah we did anchor did that shot mcgonough and near the crew so like why'd i do it honestly i was reading the it was a reddit thing reddit got

me going reddit the apollo when they were like we got to charge you for more uh when they basically were like they they were like closing down the api access and all the reddit um like all the red pages were like going dark yeah the mods were not the mods were not happy the mods are not happy and i was like oh this is a real problem where these guys that don't get paid have these massive massive massive communities and they don't make any money and they basically are in control of this thing but they're not because reddit can just get rid of them but they've really built that those pages like there's pages that have 20 30 40 million people that got shut down during the Apollo Reddit thing, I want to say it was June-ish or May. It was really started to come

around May or June. I don't remember. And then I started to do what I've always done, but that's a Raven brain. I was looking at things and I was like, this mash thing is going to work. It can work because there's this whole community of people that don't make a dollar on the internet, but they run these massive, massive communities. And that's how we ended up here. That's how I'm sitting next to you. That was my thought process around it. Literally. That was the only reason why I was like, all right, I'm ready to go all in. Because you know me, I didn't go all in for a very long time. So I saw that and was like, there's got to be a way that you can get these people paid. And how can you do it? I found Mash and this guy, Jarrett, and this guy, Jake, and

these people from Toronto. And I was like, all right, this is a big one. And it's early enough where Uncle Lou can get paid still. That's what I care about. Honestly, that's what I care about the most. But I'm like, it's a good idea. And I'm finally like, all right, I understand why Lightning can be a technology layer. Because I'd always say it.

If we could pull up old buildings, but I'd say it's just technology. But I never understood how it would work. Now I get how it would work. Yeah. And what particularly about Lightning and MASH's implementation of Lightning gives you the confidence that it's going to work?

because it's the only way you can do a top-down structure of like the publisher gets, so the publishing company that owns it gets paid, the writer gets paid, and then you can go down to the two people that have never been paid, which is the curator and the content, sorry, curator and community. They've never been paid on those websites. If I think about Barstow's Reddit page, it's like that's a massive Reddit page with massive amounts of interaction and massive amount of time on site, but those people don't make a dollar and the way it works. And again, I'm not the genius, you're the genius, but the way

it's been explained to me and it's going to work and it looks like it's going to work is that you can start to do like different ways of paying everyone in a way that never existed before. And it's, it'd be impossible without lightning. You can never do that type of top-down payment structure. You can never go, cause right now it's just, it's publisher and writer. That's it. You sign someone to someone like that's someone like Barstool signs a writer. They work out a contract. They get like, but the people that are like curating the content and the community, they don't get anything from that, they get nothing from it.

So there has to be a new way to do it. And this is lightning is definitely the best way to do it. There's no doubt about it. Yeah. And this is, I mean, we're recording this episode because we're by the time this episodes out we're releasing this yeah we're releasing we're releasing this tomorrow which is the day that the new tftc.io website launches we've gone through a complete redesign and relaunch of the strategy and revamp of the strategy and mash is a pivotal part of this

strategy because we're leveraging mash to basically go and do what i've wanted to do for years which is bring on more content creators to the site i've just been self-publishing the bent and the podcast and met with um the sat standard which he hasn't posted in like months but we'll see if he gets back to that but long story short is i've always wanted to increase the amount of content on the site and diversify away from myself and matt and get other creators on the site but i've always had this problem number one uh frankly don't have enough money to pay people to be on staff to write continuously and then number two even if i were to be able to pay those people and find particular individuals to write for the site,

they're probably not going to be the best because the best content creators are creating content independently these days and self-publishing. And so when we started our conversations with Jared, yourself, Jake, earlier this summer was an unlock for me when you guys showed me the new tools that you have because it was like, oh, I can actually go do what I want to do. I can get more content onto the site.

I can just syndicate other people's content, inject these monetization tools on uh on the page and then do a rev split with them so like i actually can help them monetize in a very low touch fashion employee would zero hedges done very successfully over the last decade and a half which is just curate high signal content and backlink to the original piece and we can do that too at tftc but now we have the distribution with syndication now we have this monetization as well where we can actually monetize the content directly via mesh and then do a rev split with the creators on the back end 100 creates it creates a the first ever like essentially thinking way back because i've been in this forever because i'm old i've

been in this forever it's gonna the only way i can see the publishing industry competing with platforms is through something like this that's the only way they're going to compete you'll never be able to compete with a platform any other way unless you start to build out experiences and build out tools that are that bring platform-like experiences to to the publishing industry and this is the first one that we act i've actually seen that makes sense where you can essentially and um where the website will and it's gonna you're gonna say it tftc's brand new we put a lot of time in in the tftc now it's actually we it actually looks really good yeah um where we can turn it into you'll get platform like experiences with our first with our first launch on tftc which literally

was impossible before it was impossible and how you get paid from it and how you do the top down payment structure to the all the way from the publisher to the writer to the to the curator to the community that's impossible without lightning it's truly impossible and it really felt like to me it felt like what i was wanted to do with anchor when i was like i want to build anchor at barstool it was like oh it was the always the honestly my anchor i mean you know anger really happened it was fucking michael rapaport when i was like this motherfucker's leaving our show and i have 200 grand sold into his thing he's leaving barstool his show's leaving i'm like what do you do with that money like what the money just goes away it just goes in the ether

and i was like this sucks we should build something where even these people leave us they can we still make money on them forever and this can do that this is this is the type of technology for for the publishing industry where you can onboard somebody and they if it's they write for tftc write for their own website there there there can be a an actual payment structure that makes sense where everyone is happy no matter what because the because that influence the world's a tough game it's a tough game every you're right everyone's looking out for themselves so it's like there needs to be a way where your favorite quote or it's like a value for value system this is happening right now it's happening tomorrow yeah and so let's jump into

the comparison of the incumbent monetization methods of the publishing industry and like how this sort of changes it so and what metrics and kpis we're going to target post-launch to make sure that we're actually outperforming the incumbent monetization models of publishers So, yeah, so the current publishing model is you sign a writer, a writer comes on, you either pay them a flat fee or they get some type of upsell in terms of if they get more page views or whatever and they do that. But now the way it's going to work is not only, oh, sorry, let me take a step back. that's how it works but then the publishers they only do either advertising affiliate merch or like paywalls soft paywalls whatever we know i think everyone agrees nobody wants a paywall nobody's signing up for a pay no one under the age no millennial even the millennials are getting

old or gen z's signing up for a paywall just not happening it's not worth it it's not worth the time. I'm never signing up for a $10, $15 subscription to a website. This way with Lightning, and this is why it has to happen with Lightning, is imagine a world where you just have a wallet loaded up and you can pay a penny an article, two pennies, three pennies, and you just click on it and it automatically comes out. It's automatically going to work. So you're just surfing the web. Let's say we're 10 years from now, you're surfing the web and every time you read an article, just comes out of your wallet three cents two cents five cents whatever that is and i'm calling it like a reverse subscription model where i think people would pay for content if it was priced in a

way that made sense i don't think anyone wants to sign up for 10 20 sites at 9.99 a month or 5.99 a month and it's pretty obvious they don't because that's why the industry is going it's going downhill it's not in the same place it once was like i was doing a project remapping the internet before i started to do this with you and i was like if i did this project five years ago i could have found 50 000 websites and 50 000 names i had a hard time getting to my 4 000 names that i wanted to get to like being like okay this website it could work for let me target these people i'd sell it to i had a really hard time getting the 4 000. i really did like i was losing my mind trying to figure it out and i'm like yeah this thing is gone because everyone gave away all their

content to platforms and they never gave it back and they're never going to give it back they're not going to get facebook's not going to give you back your traffic that you gave them they're posting on the website they're not going to do it they're never going to do it yeah i mean we see this with x formerly twitter i'm just going to call twitter the elon's doing now he's trying to make it's like he made that change a couple weeks ago they were talking about where you can't even it's not even discernible that when you post an article it's a hyperlink out of x to your website just looks like a picture yeah it looks terrible and see they're trying to like cattle herd people to to just post all their content on x yeah and they was a there was a post some guy

tweeted it i can maybe we can pull it up it was like in july the lowest amount of july was the lowest amount of traffic ever sent off of x and facebook of all time in july so it's like you're not getting that traffic anymore it's not happening they're not going to give their traffic it's over they're not going to give you their track their tiktok's experimenting with with um with a subscription model instagram's experimenting with kind of what we're doing on product one which we're calling reactions at mash where it's like oh you you get you can badge people and then they're they want to pay for it kind of what reddit does with their with like reddit gold it's never coming back they're not going to give it back to you so what are you going to do you have to build experiences

that are like platforms into websites because if not they'll take everything from you and you'll never be able to do it will never work and they and they've been doing it for 10-15 years i've been doing it as long as i've been working i started doing this in 2011 2010-11 yes yeah It's not coming back. This is the only way it's coming back. This is actually one of those things where Bitcoin makes sense for an actual business model, not just money or gold or this or this.

There's a business model that's sitting there that's 100% broken, and it can be fixed using Bitcoin. Yeah. That's why I'm here. So you mentioned recreating the platform-like experience on your independent publisher. So what's that? And you mentioned reactions.

you mentioned reddit gold how does mash enable this platform like it's literally one line of javascript it comes up we can pull it up to now like maybe now we want to pull it up yeah show it it's literally one line of javascript to be the same thing as you're adding any anyone that's ever been in the ad operations world or ever built a website a content website and pull and pushed it up i mean there it is right there there we go essentially it's one line of javascript code you put on your website and you can enable these type first product we launched was reactions You can enable these platform-like experiences that people can either, A, do for free, or B, if they want to pay a certain amount of sats or money. Because I'm kind of over the idea of, like, sats and Bitcoin.

Like, this is just technology now. This is just a technology play that literally couldn't exist, where essentially you can pull up these experiences and have, like, you want to know, like, oh marty marty put a put a treasure chest on that thing uh i want to see where marty was what marty was reading i can see what you're reading and drop like these type of emojis and there's going to be a lot of different interactive features that we're building but the this right here what you're looking at is the first um iteration of it and it's as easy as as someone that ran ad ops did the ad ops at barstool it's the easiest thing in the world and to like integrate it's one line of code just drop it in the back end of your website wordpress

ghost whatever works instantly yeah and then mash has a back end where you can go toggle all these features and give your users the menu of interaction options that you deem sort of necessary for your site and so here we've got these interactions logan if you click the heart on the left side on the mesh uh clipboard there like people can if they really like something they want to donate to the site right away they can hit one dollar five dollars ten dollars put their own amount in and then boom pay the invoice send it directly to us over the lightning network uh and then which gets really eddy when we had jared on probably about a year year and a couple months ago it's really cool to see how far mash has come since that

conversation because i think this what you're seeing on our site right now it's just the tip of the iceberg and you were alluding to it which is with these interactions individual people reacting on sites like tftcs and others that will have mash enabled begin like people begin to be able to follow what they're reading and seeing their interactions and using that as a signaling mechanism to be like all right i really like this guy's taste like i can see everything he's liked yeah that's we're getting weight like just so everyone knows like this is this is very hard we're getting way down the line like but in the future there's going to be there's multiple things you're going to be able to do like that like the whole like being able to bookmark things like with

these interactions where you can bookmark it and you can see and and if you want to see what marty's doing on the internet and what his reactions are and what he's like looking at you can then open up your bookmarks to show them it's almost like bookmarking you can show them to people can also do like a almost a re-imagining of like what an old message board was essentially it's reddit on every website where there is actually payment where there's actually payment flow and flow of funds that go into it so you're not relying on on reddit or your or most of those message boards like i want to say like kinjo i remember kinjo was one back in the day for dead spin like they don't have this type of like technology that can do this so essentially

everyone, you can go, it can go across, you can go across publishers to create the platform like experience instead of you having to post on Reddit, LinkedIn, all that jazz, and then hope that you make money back on it. You, you take control back of your, of the flow of funds that come to a website. That's the, that's the huge, huge piece is someone that's worked in this forever because you don't, you don't want those people to control your revenue. You just don't, you know, that there there's always something that can happen i mean from there's multiple angles we've seen it on youtube where they just shut down channels one day it's just open to us tapping the marty there you go yeah so it's this is something that can actually be like all right

you can control everything because we're never going to be a platform we're just software we're not a platform we don't have any like ambitions to be a platform we want to really be like the the double click for publishers, like what Google does, like that's where people don't know. That's where you put, do all your ad, you upload all your ads and you do all your campaigns for advertising. Everyone uses it. We'll just be that for every website instead of having to be like, oh, we want to control the content ourselves. We'll never control the content ever. Yeah. It's a beautiful thing. It's desperately needed right now in this world. It's becoming increasingly centralized, particularly on the content side of things

with x facebook instagram tiktok and the monetization problem particularly the rugging of your monetization at any given moment in time they will rub they're going to rug your monetization every time no matter what you think like again back to the reddit thing was eye opening eye opening there was a stat that there was there that reddit runs off a 10 10 million dollars 10 million dollars i think of free labor a year i think they make 100 million dollars it's like I don't know how much they make, but I saw it was a very, it was at least $10 million of free labor to run the website, to run their business.

It's like, why would those people not be paid? It makes no sense. Yeah. And like, let's dive into, I mean, we've talked about like comparing it to Barstool site and the amount of revenue that's driven by the ad space on the page. Like you think this model could be significantly

more profitable than just putting. Doing the straight CPM and RPM math, it's more profitable. I can tell you right now it's more profitable. Obviously, you need people to use it. We need people to use it. But if the consumer uses it, it's more profitable for a website. There's no doubt about it. Now, there's the chicken and the egg problem of why would consumers do this?

But I think that the world, the way the world works, it's everyone's going paywall. You don't want to pay that. Like I said earlier, you don't want to pay the 1099 a month for all these websites. I want to read one article. I want to read one article. That's it. I want to read one article and I don't want to put in my credit card information, my email, my name. Yes, and having to then call them like the New York Times with those black site subscriptions where like you can't get out of it.

You can't get out of the subscription. you'll never get out of it you'll just call a million people and they'll never let you out of the subscription it's like why would anyone want to do that yeah and this enables it where it can be it can work anywhere in any currency in any land because that's why you i finally i finally had the light bulb moment why bitcoin would work on the internet because you couldn't do this if you were like trying to if you're let's say you're a massive you're you're half your traffic is outside the United States, how would you do this? It's impossible. You're going to take a 10 cent payment, 20 cent payment from people from all over the globe. That's not going

to work. It's just not going to happen. The amount of chargeback fees, it would be insane. It would never work. You can't do it. So now it's like, all right, there is an internet money that can make this happen. We're here. We're here, Marty. This is real. This is a real business. It's not like a lot of these things where it's like, just build a wallet. And I, okay, cool. Like that seems that's way too like FinTech-y for me. I'm not in that world. This is something that goes into a total different world.

Yeah. And this is earlier this summer, Patrick O'Shaughnessy from Invest Like the Best had, I believe it was the first product officer at Twitch or maybe one of the first investors. And they were really leaning into this idea, particularly on streaming sites like Twitch and now TikTok, where like the user interaction with the streamer via things like emojis is really helping them monetize. So like in that particular content medium, it has had a lot of success and that hasn't really been transported to written content yet, which is exactly what MASH does. And so the idea is that there's some validation of this type of interaction on these streaming sites. And now we have it on written content sites as well. Yeah, I mean, this exists. Like Reddit, this is Reddit's business model.

This is Twitch's business model with Nitro. This is their business model. This is 100% their business model. Like if you go on, if you go on Twitch, no, sorry, not Twitch. If you go on Discord, sorry, not Twitch, Discord, their entire business model is this. This is the business model. the difference is, is that you don't control any of that. You want to do that. You want to open up a discord channel is like a publisher or let's say an independent website like yours. Like if

you're like, you can't do that. It's not going to work. They, they can, they control the flow of funds here. You control the flow of funds forever. That's the, that's the big play here is that it's not like this business model is like completely brand new. It's just, it's impossible for publishers to do it any online media publisher eventually we will get the podcasting we'll get the video but it's we written content is real real long form sought out written content is like going away as quick as like newspapers were when the internet came around like it just doesn't exist no because no one will pay for it because everyone has a lemming brain now and just like 15 seconds on tiktok it's like you're really not learning anything on that 15

seconds on tiktok so it's like that is that's why we're attacking that business model first because it's needed in the world and it it keeps going to the point where there's not going to be monetization left for for websites like yours or bar even bar this won't won't exist anymore yeah the ad model is broken in your mind it's so broken it's the most it was always kind of broken but now it's like really really broken it's extremely broken like there has to be a way where you onboard somebody onto the website and you know if if they actually are worth the money you pay them no one knows that you could sign someone you could sign someone to a massive contract but they're useless they don't make any money they have no time on site no one engages

with their articles you don't know if they're worth anything this brings back an actual like value for value system the barometer yeah to determine whether or not people are actually bringing value to your company as a publisher yes yes just as yeah and and it helps individual people too because it's like is all the sub stacks and all those things they're cool like yeah that's a good model but like you're probably i mean i'm gonna say probably but i i would say i know like you're you're going to cap out on subscriptions like i know how many descriptions you have your cat you're going to cap out like you're like i i'm i have like two or three and i'm like i don't want anymore it's like the tv no screaming i meant your subscription on the back

end of your website yeah like i was doing when i saw it i'm like your cat like to get to enough to double that number would take you five years three years it's just it's just too hard because too many people there's too many people trying to run a subscription model so it's like why would you like so there has to be a better way to do it and it's totally just democratizing to get rid of that industry no more subscriptions at all eventually there's no point of it not everything is worth a subscription model because you watch like even video you watch all those guys they hike their rates every two every two months hulu's like cool is expensive as cable now and they've got commercials yeah yeah every netflix is going to have commercials it's just it doesn't work

it's not going to work everyone's going to there has to be a better model or all those people are going to go out of business it just it's going to happen there's just no doubt about it within five ten years i've got a business yeah because no one's going to be able to pay for seven different streaming services especially in the economy we have now you can afford seven different streaming services seven different publishers subscriptions like are you kidding me yeah and then your card you have to get a new card and then like you find out which things you're subscribed to and you're like uh i don't know again i mean literally true bill built a billion dollar business off of just being like let's get rid of this yeah they built a billion dollar business off

of like let's stop it like when people cannot figure out where their subscriptions are at we'll figure it out for you and stop it like okay they built it sold for a billion dollars the rocket mortgage because it's literally that because nobody wants nobody wants it but no one knows how to stop it so there has to be a way to do it and it's happening in bitcoin i don't see it happening anywhere else in any other way it's not going to happen and you were bearish yesterday i'm not bearish on bitcoin you're like yeah it hasn't happened yet what's going on boom i'm not bearish i'm not bearish on bitcoin i'm bearish on you becoming that 60 year old vc guy who's just like it's just like oh i flew you yesterday you were like i'm so tired and i look

i'm like dude you flew and like got a massage in in in utah and you're tired okay like okay you're like oh i'm so tired you went that was it was exhausting exhausting to fly and get a massage no that's not i did not get a massage let's be clear oh you got you got the cups or whatever the things they stick on you they're everywhere that's what you got a portfolio company retreat there was one afternoon where we did an activity where you could go yeah you went went to a spa for you went to a spa for a weekend not for a weekend for an hour you went to a spa for four days it's all right i'm not i'm not hanging out you're a big vc guy now this is being embellished quite a bit it's it's it's more than half true no it's like less than

half true you need to go out there and talk to john john was there from zapper i am i that's not my that's not my real source of information it's your wife i asked her what's going on oh she yeah if she tells me she'll give me the real she'll give me the real story she'll give me the real story about what's really going on yeah

well what really happened is we had a portfolio company retreat and there was a lot of good things that came out out of it I'm happy for you getting all the

getting all the people building in Bitcoin together to see how they can collaborate what they've seen in the market we talked about

potential banking crisis rolling on that was a big thing last year people were scrambling for bank accounts trying to get everybody on the same page like all right here's a strategy so you're just exactly you're a strategy guy now

no i'm an implementer too this model that mash has perfected that's the other thing too like we've been trying to do this at cftc for years we had our btc pay server implementation where we had the paywall but it wasn't automatic like it can't be with mash um we've always wanted to get to this direction and let's be honest we're just a media company here where i can write i can host podcasts i can have conversations i think i can see the field pretty clearly and try to get people on particular trends but when it comes to actually building the software i can't code i've got to pay people to do that and um it is what it is we were never able to get the end experience to the level that mash has a company dedicated to creating this experience and so we've been

trying to do this for years and obviously i've known jared for a couple years now and had him on the show this time last year but mash has evolved and developed to a point where it's like oh yeah this is exactly what i need when i've been looking for like i'm not going to go build it might as well just implement this yeah i don't even know like i guess you can answer this better than me like i don't even know this is possible a year ago like like what we're doing i don't know if it was possible like really possible not to this level of this level of scale yeah yeah i don't know if it was possible that's his level of interaction like i could have vanilla btc pay server invoices that would allow you to get access to content in terms of creating like

an interactive experience with the audience it was not possible yeah and that's what's going to make it awesome because it's like there may because even because like we talk about like a subscription description like there may never be any subscriptions if enough people use the interaction model yeah i guess stacker.news may be an example of something like a reddit like or a hacker news like how would you describe it logan more reddit or more hacker news like it's not his mic's not plugged in but probably more hacker news combination of hacker news and reddit um but yeah you can upvote using the lightning network and stuff like that but i think that's completely separate from what we're doing at tftc with mash now which is

try to create this interaction and going back to that that twitch cpo like that's where it really clicked for me like i listened to that the morning before we had our first call about like all right are we going to engage in a partnership and it was actually beautiful timing because i listened to that i was like oh shit like we need this on written content on the web yeah exactly what you built i will say this that we're not doing this because we're buddies like you you didn't do it in the beginning like you could have done it a year ago you said no we're not doing it because we're buddies we're doing it because they're they really know what the fuck they're building and uncle lou's now all in that's what that's why we're doing it yeah that's it like are you we

could have this didn't just like happen because we're friends we're doing this because it's really it's now really time to do it yeah and what do we need to do what do we need to prove at tftc and mash to then go convince other publishers like all right it's time for you to get on board with this first we'll do time on site with the reactions start with time on site? Can we, can we up your time on site from what it was prior to now? And then we're going to just going to do straight revenue. It's going to be a revenue play. Is there more money in a no subscription world in a world where you can have a platform like experience? And how can you then do that in a world where strictly it's just, okay, if I'm putting site A versus site B and

this site makes a, makes a thousand dollars, how, how can we do it where you can make two or you can double the money and make a site, you can make $2,000, $3,000. And it's really going to come off of the platform like experiences and no subscription model, the model of saying, let's do a pay per article. And there is some type of world where you, I mean, everyone is, I think people are kind of like, okay with paying for what they like paying for what they use. Like if I use a website a lot, I would pay for it. If I'm on a website every single day, like I pay for Twitter because I use it. Like I use Twitter all the time. I'm okay with that one subscription, but I'm not okay with, I want to read one article and I click on it and you got to, you want me to pay $10 a month

and I got to read one article and get out of it. That's not, that's not going to work. Like the amount of traffic people get from that come to their site and they drop off, like what's the average subscript? Like, I think it's like, it's gotta be less than 2% of the amount of page views when someone or unique users people go to a site what about the other 98 doesn't it's you you either monetize them off of off of of of an ad network or you have to sell ads for it and if you sell ads you have a shit ton of or a merch team or whatever affiliate team but like that's a ton of people that's a ton of people you need a big big business and the margins don't make sense for websites to do that anymore they just don't no they don't it doesn't make any sense and that's

the other thing about mash too is we're really leaning into this like automatic paywall via the lightning network but you don't even have to implement that you can experiment with different monetization schemes there's going to be a mash multiple different monetization schemes we come up with we're starting with reactions because reactions is definitely like an experience that publishers I know sorry the platforms already do the publishers never have done but there's going to be multiple different ways where we do it like I'm I'm very bullish on like the reverse subscription model where if people let's say it's like I said for five cents an article and you just say all right it sits in a wallet and I'll pay five cents an article all day long but I don't

want to put in my credit card I don't want to do it I don't want to do it if if I read 500 articles in in a month i don't mind paying for that but i know it also too like it's going to be thinking about that model too it's like with the world going with everyone with ai with ai attacking the written world first without a doubt it's first place they're attacking like i would like to know i'm reading a real person i'd like to know that i'm reading something that actually is like was written by somebody and we can do that as well like we'll know that as well it's like this is a real person or not we will be able to detect if this was written event we've talked about this this is like uh this is down the road though but they'll be able to technically is this

written by ai or not this is written by a real person kind of what like an ad blocker does like like you could go on and like people can stop you using an ad block like you can go on and be like oh you have ad blocker um implemented you can't read the site eventually be like we know this is written by ai we yeah i don't want to you i don't want to pay the five cents for that I don't want to do that. I want to know that I'm reading a real human's thoughts because the way where AI is going, it's getting weird. And how do you know someone has like a genuine thought?

And like we were talking about during our 90 year old dinner at the Capitol grill, it's like, it's like, how do you know, like everyone's on the internet, everyone works from home. How do you know this is real? How do you know a real person wrote this? So like a real person thought about this and like, this is their actual thoughts. You don't. Yeah. And that's where I shared a little of the tap signer.

so like one way you can get around that is having like a private key that you sign it's like a pgp key but now we have these devices these card form factors that make it very easy yes but i think we'll be able to do that on the internet soon too where it's like you know you're reading marty bent you know you're reading them you know it's how you know you're not reading some ai generated content because like all those publishers like buzzfeed all them they they fired all their they fire the writers they're just like oh we'll just use ai to do it yeah like okay like what does that mean though like that i'm not getting your like as someone that grew up in the grew up and why i ended up in this world it was really honestly i remember reading in high school i

read bill simmons all the time on page two and i loved reading bill simmons when i was a kid and that's why i ended up in this world like literally and i'm like i don't want to read ai content i want to know it's like a real person like it's weird like the ai content is weird to me yeah it does serve a purpose i'll say that but like for like certain information but you also like don't don't humans want to know you're getting another human's point of view i think so i think so too i think so too but we're getting to the point where it's not gonna you're gonna it's gonna be way i saw someone tweet the other day we're probably at the top of human written content versus ai content this is probably the peak it's gonna go more ai than it

as human it's very soon so you have to know what's actually written by humans i don't want you guys to release this product because i don't want people to know that i've been using chat gpt4 to write the bed for like last six months i'm kidding obviously yeah knowing you and now now that you're a vc guy that wouldn't surprise me wouldn't surprise me if you're gonna start tweet i wouldn't surprise me if your twitter becomes like a like a one of those tool like like how hard you work today it's like okay dude we sit on the internet like what are we talking about no one's really working that hard we're working hard we're working you're one of the hardest workers i've ever met don't sell yourself short yeah but like i said this before it's like yeah

we do work hard but like i don't think people put the world in perspective like when everyone's like oh my god fedex drivers are making 170k they should make 170k a year anyone that's out there grinding and doing like actual manual labor should make a lot of money like it's way harder it's way harder i've been on a roof it's hard you're a muck roof it's it's like crazy so i think that they're and i'm only bringing i'm going to bring up because i don't think that like the world is so broken maybe we can fix the one piece i know how to fix and this is it yeah and then we can go fix other stuff i'll let you handle the big problems you know content i know content i know content i know the internet i know i know how to do the internet yeah and i know how to

i'd like to think i know how to look into the future and be like all right this may be where it's going i'm the most consistent person you ever met in bitcoin that's true i do i hate giving you credit right now because because you were you were you were at a spa last week telling me you worked hard but you are the most consistent you've never wavered on what this is going to be and now it just keeps speeding up yeah yeah what are your thoughts about the world generally right now it's getting pretty crazy oh we're fucked it's fucked it's so fucked everyone's sitting there like we're not fucked we're fucked we're fucked we got to fix the money we're fixing the money yeah i've always said this like we're fucked things are gonna get crazy the economy is gonna

get crazy it's only gotten crazier and to go back and begin fixing things like it's not a panacea but i think it's the base of everything that's happening in the world is money it's literally one half of every transaction you fix that then you can begin fixing all the fucked up things in world i agree and it really is happening so maybe we can pull up one other thing and i'll find it i'll find it we'll pull it up where it's like how i learned how to do all this was the 2011 loom escape where i would just read every company on there and i was like okay this is how you actually do advertising and so you actually monetize a website this is how you make money someone put up a thing about the lightning network the companies in the lightning network it looks

like the same exact amount of companies is the 2011 loom escape it looks like the exact same amount, 170, 200 companies, because a lot of landscape had about 200 companies. It's like, oh shit, people are really starting to work on this thing. Yeah. And you showed me like the updated ad landscape. Oh, the updated one. It looks, there's five, you can't read it. There's 5,000 companies. It looks like it's, it looks like a map of the world because it's that big. Yeah. And it went from there to here. It's like, okay, this is getting serious. People are

really getting serious about this thing. yeah look and try to find the river lightning research report on the map of all the companies in the space if you pull up my twitter had the one where i put up the loom escape too i could find it for you yeah um no but it's happening i mean i've seen it it's really what i was doing last week was sitting down with the people building a lot of the companies that were on that loom escape i don't know what you can call it now i just call it loom escape we call in advertising yeah and uh just vibe checking right here we have it up oh yeah this is if you pull up this and look if you type in 2011 loom escape pull up that one too because just pull

this time in 2011 loom escape l-u-m-a l-u-m-a-s-c-a-p-e you believe i have a producer now it's crazy it's crazy you got a producer it's crazy anyone would want to work for you but that's look the exact same amount of companies it looks like the exact same yeah mobile looms because everything was going mobile then the exact same amount it looks like the dead same thing i'm like holy shit how many companies on this loom escape made it big clg uh it's i mean this is a little different because like you're not looking you're looking at straight techno you're looking at straight advertising companies like you have the holding companies like ppp omnicom twitter's on

there twitter's on there yeah like basically you have all like the social media companies you had this straight from marketer to subscriber and this is how i learned how to do advertising this is how this literally this one thing i just literally wrote down every company and what they do and just like dug deep in all of them and then i saw that i saw whoever pulled whoever made that lightning thing and i'm like oh this looks like something i looked at 12 years ago yeah and that and obviously that was right it's because like that's how i figured out how to like help make barstool's advertising big so there's something happening here that is getting it's getting real serious yeah and like riding that wave so how first of all how long ago does 2011 feel to you

right now man it's so hard because it's like it's so long ago and it doesn't feel long at all that's what i was hoping you would say because just project that forward with what we're doing now in bitcoin it doesn't it feels like there's there's times where it's like like twitter yesterday someone shared something about this guy dennis drinkwater who's like sat behind boston the entire time sat behind the red sox home like red sox and he's in every game you go to every game And someone shared like a viral video on them. I'm like, I remember reading about that guy in 2011. And I was just like, blast from the past.

I'm like, it feels, but that feels like it was yesterday. Like sitting in Milton, Massachusetts, reading about this guy. I'm like, no, that was 12 years ago. And now we're, so if really when you told me it was going to work, we're like the halfway point to that. So if in next, I think in the next 10 years, you'll start to see like digital empires rise and in the lightning Bitcoin space, like really that, that are not just like,

hold your Bitcoin or buy Bitcoin, like actual products that you're like, Oh, this is way better. This is a hundred, this is a hundred X product compared to the, compared to the original way of, of, of doing something kind of what, like, cause I always say to you, I was like, Uber was a hundred X product. I don't care if they didn't make any money. It was a hundred X product. It didn't exist. You couldn't get a cab. There's going to be a hundred X products being built now where you're like,

this is 100x better experience yeah and i think we're one i think mash is going to be one i think mash is one of those ones if we do it's 100x better for everyone on the internet yeah once they get it and learn about it and understand what it's going to do because it's better for everyone literally it's better for everyone i mean we saw i saw the i saw like lex freeman tweet about like i just want to pay a dollar an article everyone wants to do it just no one's been able to really like capture the practical make it practical people have tried to do like the the the like subscription model or the like the i guess the micro payment model but i never thought it was practical there was never a practical answer to it until i saw mash that's

why i didn't jump in because there's no practical answer to this thing yeah bitcoin's the answer it it is and that but and then going back to like 2011 and you learned ads you build up barstool's ad book help them get the churn in investment send them off on their way to where they are now pivotal part of that whether people don't recognize i was a part of it but it's always important yes yes obviously i was a part of it yes but with that in mind obviously dave just bought the company back from penn for a dollar he's got full control the way it should be he should always own that company that's one of those things where agreed okay but But I worry.

I don't know. I haven't seen or heard anything about what they're thinking on the business side. But you can just see, having been there, worked there for myself on the podcasting ad team, falling back to the ad model as the monetization path. What would the pitch be? It doesn't even have to be particularly the bar stool. But hey, at this moment, this is the time you begin experimenting with this particular monetization model because ads are dying in a particular way.

Yeah, I mean, my pitch, Dave, would be pretty simple. You got a $42 million house. You want to buy a sports team? That would be it to Dave. You want to buy a sports team? Because you don't got anything else to buy, Dave. You got nothing left to buy. You want to buy a sports team?

This is the way to do it. Because this is the way where you're the only person who will never care about how, like, you could hire a million writers if you wanted to. You could hire a million personalities and everyone would be paid what they're worth. That would be the pitch. But from a strictly like actual business perspective, it's like, it would be like, you don't have, you don't want to hire out a 50 person e-com team, a 50 person sales team, a 50 person affiliate team.

You don't want to have to do that. Like, why would you want to do that? It makes no sense. It's the amount that it sucks, but I hate to say it, but I can say it because I worked on all commission. That's a lot. That's a middleman industry. It's a middleman industry. You don't want the middlemen to be taking,

like you want to be in control of the flow of funds. And if you have something like MASH, you can see instantly like, like is this person, like is this person that writes making me money? Is this person, eventually is this person that's podcasting making us money? Is this person who's making video making us money?

And then you don't have to work. And he could, Dave could sign on one dashboard and look instantly. This person makes me money. This person does what this person does. or you know what you can stay on and work here but you're getting paid only what you provide if you don't want to work hard and you don't want to write 10 blogs a day you don't want to do it okay you want to write one you get paid for one that's it it totally changes the model it does and

it's interesting because it's got to be scary for the content creators right you got to imagine there's gonna be a Pareto distribution of the ones that are producing the best content getting paid the most and it's sort of but isn't that the yeah it's the way it should be so you should incentivize good content good product it should i mean everything else in the world is and you it runs off incentivization so why would you not have to like like again going back to like the fedex thing if you don't deliver the boxes to the house you're getting fired why do you get to sit on the internet all day and do nothing like that's just the way the world works like why would you that doesn't make any sense it makes no sense how it currently works and i mean in this economy too

I think where interest rates are too, the companies, publishers, any internet company does not have the luxury that they were afforded between 2008 and 2020. Oh, the good times are over. The interest rate regime is such where you need to produce. They're over. Like we, again, everything's timing in life. Like if you had to start Barstool today, you'd be in trouble. You'd be in major trouble.

There's no more direct to consumer money like there was where everyone was just pouring millions of dollars into every mattress company and every travel company and every beauty company those that money's gone it's gone i know it's gone like that's not uh that's not me saying it as like as lewis rogers's opinion that's a fact these companies don't get funded anymore go and look at any vc your vc go look at the vc thing go look at the vc that's why i brought it up yeah go look at vc newsletters you can see they don't fund any of those companies anywhere that money is gone how what are you going to do in the next that money was sustaining a lot of the publishing industry. Oh yeah. We made 2010s. I mean, Barstool is the best, most engaged audience and one of the

best companies ever, but not everyone's Barstool. So like you can't sell products the way Barstool can sell products. Like Barstool has so much O&O owned properties now, like the High Noons and I know Big Head has a coffee. Like that's the, I'll let you, it sells because they've been building that business for 10, 20 years. How do you do that today? It's very hard. It's really hard and they've and do you want and all that money all those direct consumer brands they all went like you know who's really doing that's all like like mr beast does it logan paul has one that didn't exist five ten years ago you're gonna get you're gonna get tooken out by them like all the money's gonna go to those guys or not even really the money not even the money they're gonna

just take the market share you can't advertise you can't advertise a drink if you walk into 7-eleven and it's prime the entire thing like you can't even get the money because guess what he ain't giving you the money to advertise it here. He owns the, all the shelves, he owns all the shelf space and that's going to keep happening. So like you have to think of a new model now, like you go in the, go in the, go in the seven 11. You want to know what half of half of the, uh, shelf space is,

is prime or Mr. Beast's candy. It's like, okay, you couldn't even advertise M&Ms if you want to, cause you have no shelf space. They're not even, there is no shelf space for those brands. So you have to think of a new advert, a new monetization model like now. Yeah. And this is kind of it.

this is one of them yeah i think we talked about the chicken and egg problem earlier but i do think we gotta stop i can make one call hello oh we're back that was your call your only guess that would ever just let take a 30 minute call in the middle of an episode there would be no podcast without me so really wouldn't there wouldn't so i know we've reminisced about this in the past but It is crazy to think that just a random DM to you and a lunch at the Smiths in Flatiron led to this show. I mean, we're here.

What do you want? I mean, we're still going. I'm proud of you for still going, to be honest with you. Well, it's the first thing you said to me. What? Consistency is key. It is. It is the key every day.

I try to stay true to that. It's never, it's never, there is no, the internet doesn't sleep. It doesn't sleep. I watched people, I remember the dude, there was one guy that we were fighting with one time and he was like, oh, I'm taking off, he's like, he's like, to refresh, our company's taking off an entire month on the internet. You take off an entire month on the internet, you lost. You're done.

You're done the day you decided that. You were done before you decided that. There is no off on the internet. It's always on. 24-7, 365. Double-edged sword. It is, but it's also, like, I don't know, man. Would you rather be like an accountant?

Like, I don't know. Would you rather be like an accountant? Like, I kind of like to look at everything from perspective. Like, would you rather be an accountant? I know I wouldn't. No, I left the finance world. Yeah. So, like, it's a double-edged sword, but it's a better tradeoff of, like, you do something you actually like to do every day.

Yeah. I like working on the internet. I like it. I think it's fun. I think it's fun thinking up new things and doing new things. I couldn't imagine having a 9 to 5 normal job. Do you like working on Bitcoin? i do now that i understand we're going to build before it was just like

i don't know what this is dude i just did it i just did it to do it and i just i don't know why i did to do it but now it's like all right there's things that can be built there needs to be companies that are built big companies really big companies it's happening it is i it's happening in a way where there's now companies, I think people that don't understand Bitcoin can understand. That's the answer. That's why I'm in. If you don't even understand Bitcoin and I showed up to you, I showed up to a CRO or CFO of Forbes, and I showed up with the deck and was like, this is what I see. This is what I see now. They could understand, would understand nothing about Bitcoin. Yeah. That's actually the key. Now I'm thinking about that's the key. When no one says

word bitcoin anymore then it won agreed when you never say the word anymore you're just like oh this company just does this thing it just works it just works there's no talk about bitcoin there's no talk about anything there's no talking about the underlying technology you just talk about the companies no one talks about email as a company it's like vo or their their substack or b it's like one talks about email oh and i feel like we're getting there we're just breaking this it's like beginning game which it sucks dude because like it's a grind i wish i was like 21 doing this what would what would 21 year old lou look like in this in this industry i mean i was a maniac maniac dude i knock on people's doors i would sit in people's offices i'd be like you're

doing it or if you don't do it i'll be back in a year with the data and you're gonna do it i know gonna do it i mean i guess i can still do that i'm just i get tired now dude i get tired we're getting older i know i miss meetings because like i just can't wake up because like i'm out partying like before i was out partying now it's like i just can't wake up i'm too tired i need to sleep eight hours singing i was not even like oh like i was at the club all night it's like no i just can't wake up because i'm tired right now i'm old yeah i'm old i'm old we're not old we're still young we're young but my body tells me i'm not young anymore yeah my body used to be able to rip it i could go out every night and get up and work if i go out one night it's over if i have

more than three drinks it's over it's done i'm done more than three i'm not getting up i like older sober lou though yeah i mean you're at that you guys are ripping wine at the house if you see me drink one drink no no you didn't no because i just know my body now i know i can't do it i know We're at the point of like, if I'm going to go build something, I cannot be out. It's got to just be build it and do nothing else. I haven't seen build Lou. What? I haven't seen build Lou in six years since we were.

Yeah. Because I mean, I like, I do like, no, I like, I like to have fun. No one likes to have fun. Like I like to have fun, but now I'm like, all right, if I'm gonna build something, I can't go out. I don't go out anywhere. I just don't go out. I can't do it.

I can't go out. back to what uh i wanted to touch on before you hopped on your call chicken and egg problem which is like and i was thinking about it while you're on your call that's the biggest hurdle not only that mash has to get over but just bitcoiners in general had to get over this is a very obvious problem not everybody has bitcoin and yes we are building an industry and tools and companies that are essentially dependent on people using bitcoin correct mash being one of them and comparing the value for value model that mash is tapping into with individual publishers and comparing it to podcasting 2.0

where you just plug it into your rss feed and then you hope that podcasts all right i gotta change my dip too sorry you didn't have to interject you could have just done it while i was yeah yeah i felt like if people see it on the screen they're like what's this guy doing but go keep going yes but podcasting 2.0 you're dependent on apps to implement lightning wallets and connect to that value-for-value model in RSS. But I think what MASH is doing, I think it's really interesting because the way you're going after individual publishers,

so tftc.io as an example, like the content I produce there, obviously we're syndicating other people's content, but like Marty's Bent, my newsletter and the content I write lives on that site and that site alone. And because of that, like if you, like I own,

i don't have to go and depend on somebody to build something to syndicate my content like i depend on fountain to put a bitcoin wallet in like people want to interact with my content they have to do that on my site so in the chicken in the chicken and egg problem you freeze on me keep going i did freeze a little bit but in the chicken and egg problem like i'm trying to articulate this appropriately um i think it's much stickier online publisher model than podcasting 2.0 where people are forced to go to these publishers to consume the content they want and then as soon as they see others reacting to that content they'll be incentivized be like all right i'm gonna load up this wall and begin interacting as well yeah i mean if where people can listen to this episode

on spotify that doesn't have that and they're not forced to see like the the boostograms and stuff like that so i don't even know it exists like on my site it's gonna be very obvious if we can go two or three years in the future it's like if a hundred sites have it and they're charging five cents an article every site's gonna have to do it because they're just gonna be like the the economics of the they just won't be able to do it they won't be able to compete with those people yeah they won't be able to it just doesn't make sense they won't be able to compete in the world of like okay everyone now is going to pay pennies on the dollar to read something your subscription model is gone because why would any no one's going to want no one to do

subscription to begin with so that's the that is the the knock on wood inherent feedback loop that ends up happening eventually yeah is it like you pay for content either interactive features or reverse subscription model or donations in a way that that makes it seamless easy and you're not locked into anything yeah no that like but that is all dependent on the wallet being funded in the first place which is like that's the biggest hurdle for this whole industry is getting the wallet funded which means getting bitcoin in people's hands and so well the problem i thought about that too because that was my biggest fear too it's still the biggest fear of this thing is that there was never a reason to fund the wallet you never had a reason to fund your wallet

what was the reason that you would do it like like it's not like like you want to walk down to the store and buy something it's on apple pay there has to be a reason to do it this is a reason that didn't exist before it doesn't it you have to give you have to give the end user a reason to do it and just the simple fact of being like i don't have to i don't have to do a subscription and i can read something is like the friction it becomes frictionless you don't got to worry about the idea of like i don't i never can read this article because i'm never paying for the subscription Yeah. And that's where the reason we were on that retreat last week was just like,

all right, as an industry, how can we collaborate to make that? It's not the sole thing we focus on, but one thing we talk about to make it easier for people to get off zero. And like, when I think about mash and just web wallets, generally like extensions,

progressive web apps, it's partnering with companies like cash app strike river to make it as easy as possible. I mean, it works on every wallet. Yeah, I know that, like literally we'll just use cash app because it's the most downloaded fintech app in the u.s

like once they implement a strike like feature where somebody doesn't even have to own bitcoin on cash app but they can just scan a qr code and spend from their dollar balance on cash app and get bitcoin on the other end i think that's game over and if you can articulate that to the end user where it's like hey you have cash app you can fund this wallet in three seconds just put five dollars on it you want to know what i think was one of the i mean covet was the worst fucking time ever but you want to know what really helps the bitcoin industry is everyone had to use qr codes for like two years like a year it helped the world like it helps that industry it sucked because it was the worst time ever and it makes no sense and covet was a fucking price scam but

from a simple fact that every user had to go on and use a qr code no one used qr cards been around forever nobody used them no people are completely comfortable with them no everyone uses it because used because they had to go to a restaurant use it it's like you had to do a daily something you'd have to do you do daily you had to use a qr code you had to use a feature that the bitcoin lightning network really needs bang everyone knows how to use it now not even they knew how to use a qr card before but no one did it the consumer behavior just didn't shift it made them shift and now everyone has to do it yeah coven made them force uh that force them to practice qr interactions yeah and that's that's actually a huge play for something like this because it

takes two seconds to pull up your phone and plus an article takes two seconds you just click it done yeah yeah and then once like if you have a mash account to that you don't even have to like scan qr code no but i'm just thinking from the straight like people that are gonna be like what is this what is this play like yeah if you have them if you have a mac we have a wallet we have a wallet you just you can load up you can load up 15 into it because i don't i don't know the fintech rules. I stay out of the way of the finance side.

Hand me my phone. Let's do it right now. Logan, pull up the site. I'll donate a dollar to myself using a QR code. Let's see how long it takes. And then I don't...

So hit the heart on the left. Let's see if it works. Hit a dollar invoice. This is a test site, guys. I just want to be real. I've been using this, though. It works. The real site goes live tomorrow.

You got to hit support $1. Pay with lightning wallet. oh marty's standing up he's on the chair he's on the table live it worked it worked oh it worked it worked your payment of 3 502 sets it worked there we go yeah it works you made it work just did that with cash i And so it's like, hey, that's probably something we need to work on on our site, too, for people who come and are Bitcoiners. It's just educating them, like, hey, if you want to contribute, we don't take dollars. We've been, there's a lot of education needs to go on.

You need to write some articles. You need to do some videos, maybe a song and dance. I don't know what you're going to do. You're not going to want me to sing. I can tell you that. I don't think I want you to sing. These eyes. Stop that, dude.

I don't want you singing ever. Dude, that was enough. That three seconds is enough of me. I can't believe that's in my ears right now. I can't believe I just have to do that right now. Are we going to win, Lou? I think we're going to win. I think I don't like to make promises that we're definitely going to win

because this has been a long journey. I told you it was going to be long from day one. But we're closer than we were when I met you. Way closer. Way closer. way closer where the technology can do stuff that uh that current technologies cannot that's the key once you can start to do things that no one else can do you win yeah so it's we're getting there we're getting to that point where it's like oh this is not possible in the current ad stack or

monetization stack for a publisher and then if we do it on this side someone else does it for another industry that i don't know anything about and that's how we just keep going yeah talking about ads too we've been shitting on ads but there's a way that you could actually make better ads with this we have a way to make better ads too we have there's a few things up our sleeve i don't want to get too into like the wheat the weeds of everything that can be done because then you make you start making you start then you have marketing leading engineering and the engineering team doesn't really like that yeah and i don't i don't know if i'm like i said i'm they build the furniture i hold the sign outside the first sign i'm holding is tfdc

i ain't ready to hold any other signs right now but i'm holding the sign i hold the sign and but i'll pull the sign if i have to yeah and i'll not if i have to i'll hold the sign when i think it's gonna work yeah i don't want to hold any old sign outside it's gonna be the best furniture it's got to be the best fucking couch it's got to be a cloud couch from from uh from restoration hardware i don't want to hold it that's what i have you like my couch what i have too but it's not here it's still in new york city it sucks well it's in philadelphia it's just sitting in a in a thing yeah i mean no couch because your brother left me with no couch yeah he told me that yesterday i was pretty disappointed where's where miles gonna sleep we don't know we gotta get miles of ease

at first well how'd you get like your life is crazy the lord man just just in my life now in my life you pull all these characters into your life i i don't i think i might be the calmest character you are the calmest of the people i got miles is the most he could probably be the biggest youtuber in the world one day but he is the wildest i've ever pulled in by a large margin wilder than portnoy from a strict i'll do literally anything yes not saying that you pulled portney no i meant no i that was the i got lucky and met dave but miles is the wildest by a large margin yeah no i've seen it i know i see i went to i went to the i went to the border with him yeah i was there i was in i was at in one of the videos it is not for the faint of heart

i had to help you guys rent a car you did rent us a car because i couldn't rent one i don't know what happened that day contributed to the miles concept freaks um do you view this as like a redemption arc for me yeah i don't know about like redemption arc it's more just like i think at one time i was always like redemption redemption redemption and then they put me on like fucking saraquo and i'm like i don't think about that stuff anymore i'm very calm now it's kind of crazy i'm calm i know you are relatively i'm relatively calm now i'm very calm in the past six months which is very much calmer just like it's more just like let's just do it i mean what else will we do there's no revision arc it's like what else will we do what else would i do am i gonna

just get a nine to five job and like and like sit there like i would i would quit in two days like i can't do that i can't do that so like it's got to be something i do something that's that's like a grandiose thing that's bigger than anyone ever thought of i can't work any other way i get bored i just quit so this is the biggest idea i see i did a lot of dd on ideas ai i mean been part of some big ideas i've been a part of some big ideas this feels like it's the biggest one without a doubt if it works total addressable market it's the entire internet it's not just let's just build a web it's the entire internet it's and the only thing that's left it's it's internet like what else would you everyone works on the internet everyone needs the internet this

is take trying to go after the entire internet yeah and i know it's a buzzword but like re-decentralize the internet too yeah i mean we're either i mean people would be scared of this but i'm not scared of this i love it it's either we're taking out some fang companies or we're not we're losing that's it there's no middle ground in this one i'm telling you there's no middle ground of this one there's no like selling out there's not it's we're taking out a fan company like these things we're gonna we're gonna mess with their business or we ain't this ain't gonna work that's the that's the power of what bitcoin and lightning is it's re it's, it's just an, it's going to happen that way or it's not going to work.

Relying is sent incentives in a way that pushes people away from the platforms. And that's the other thing too, like ghost, what we run on our site, when mash is integrated in with TFTC, like that is getting better and better. And it's getting easier than ever for people to run their own websites, to run their own publishing platform. Yeah. Like think about like what you're seeing with chat GPT and all those things. It's like, i thought about this too like a couple months ago when i was like i was like you're gonna be able to type in and create a website instantly it's gonna be better than wordpress and gonna be better than all these you're gonna be able to do things that are better than shopify instantly i saw will cole

playing around with one of those he was literally prompting all right here's what i want this screen to look like i need these buttons these shades these colors and i was like he said it would have taken a competent front-end developer like six hours he did in 30 seconds exactly so if that's the world also on the just a strictly business perspective of like everyone can build a plus websites and it doesn't take any time to do it you're you we can go back to the world where websites actually matter you don't got to worry about like twitter content and you and content that like is controlled by the platform so you can just build a website in 30 seconds yeah and i also think i do i do think elon's one of the most perplexing characters in the world right now

Like, I'm not sure I'm picking up what he's putting down, particularly with Twitter. I think it might be. He has some really good ideas, but then I feel like there's a lot too many ideas. Like his idea of turning Twitter and like the universal, like. Everything up. No, no.

But the universal, like I can call you on the phone or it turns, like basically take out LinkedIn is the best idea he's had. And they tweeted about it once. I never heard about it again. It's like, like go, like you get rid of LinkedIn. Because LinkedIn's trash. No one goes on it. No one uses it.

I haven't had LinkedIn since, like, 2017. Yeah, it doesn't work. So, like, that was, but then there'll be 50 other ideas, and it's like, all right, like, what is the, what are you really working on? Like, what is really happening here? Like, okay, like, yeah, obviously they are paying people, which is good.

That's smart. Finally, people spent 10 years tweeting about it and didn't make a dollar. Like, all the engagement, didn't make a dollar. but i don't he just has too much going on and like there's they need it turning into an everything app which obviously we know that's huge in asian countries like it i don't that's going to take probably a long time not only that but i think the pressure from government's going to be so immense that it may be in everything up it'll be extremely neutered yeah i could see that happening too where

he just gets he's got he's got his hand in so many things it's like mate i i don't know i'm twitter's still the answer though to like the best place to get information that really matters that no one in the general public is going to know for six more months yeah that's true like i'm in the back end fixing your website i'm like you're writing about inflation a year ago now it's like oh it's really we see all those people like putting off their twitter like being like i can't afford food i can't afford food you were writing about a year ago your company a year ago yeah everyone on twitter was talking about a year ago yeah you can go back to march 2020 when they started the the capital injections into the economy i was like this is not gonna end

well you're shutting down the economy cutting off supply injecting dollars prices are going to go up but that's why i think twitter still has value because where are you going to get all that information at once maybe noster in the future are you on noster yet i don't understand noster The things you tell me about Nostr are wild. Like the things you can do are creepy, interesting, and awesome. But I just, right now, I think that's one of those ones where I'll understand it in three years and you understand it now. Like, oh, he's like, I don't understand it yet.

I get it, but I don't understand the work, like how it works. Nostr is where Bitcoin was when we first met, I would say. Okay, then I want nothing to do with it right now because I can't understand all this. With that being said, it's much easier to build stuff. I think development in Nostra will happen faster. It seems interesting. Some of the things you show me are crazy.

Crazy, crazy interesting. But it feels like it's going to be super hard to just like, I don't know though. I mean, TikTok did it with people dancing. We got some teenagers that dance. Next thing you know, we have a massive app. That's literally how it worked. That's how TikTok got big.

That's how I think Nostra gets big is Elon and others in his position across social media companies in the industry are just forced by the governments to completely cuck and neuter. And Nostra makes it literally impossible to do that. And so people who are fiending for that particular information, I would not be surprised if you're not allowed to talk about inflation in countries like Canada, the UK, the US. What is Canada doing?

you got the cuban nipple crisis you got fidel castro's son as president like do these do you think these people really believe what they say do you just believe it or they're just like they just know it's or it's what i always say that that that washington dc is just it's basically it's basically hollywood it's hollywood everyone just making up shit they're just making up shit they're all actors like is is like that that's what i feel like they're all actors they're just everyone in washington cc is just an actor they're just talking a line like the same way a director would come in like talk this line yeah lobbyist comes in says all right yeah today this there's money yeah say this yeah yeah it's pretty much

how it works they're all scumbags it's scary i couldn't imagine working in politics seems so miserable but we gotta tell people our plan for philly politics though well if we get rich i ain't doing it but if we don't get rich i'm going to become the mayor of philadelphia and you're going to be i'm going to be a miniaturian candidate you're going to run the back end i'm going to be the guys out there screaming like let's go let's go we're doing this one more year like yeah no four more years whatever i don't even know how i don't even know like but to be honest philadelphia may be unsavable no we can save it philly's you think i don't know if we can save the northeast dude told you i was in new york at one thing you'd be in texas no i was in new york

1 p.m there was nobody on the subway on a tuesday it was like i was like this is wild there's nobody here where is everyone yeah and do you think people like it i think i would hate it i think i hate it i hate it well you just left no but i mean like i just hate the whole like work from home culture that was like people are like i want to work from i want to like it feels like everyone has to be miserable it's not easy with kids i can tell you that like i literally need to come in here to get work done yeah and it's just being like there's no routine in that there's no routine and like sitting in your sitting in your underwear all day long and typing on your computer it is a routine it's just not a good one it's not a good one it's not a good it doesn't really bring it and

and also like the other thing i think about a lot too it's like how do ideas get done you're not doing real ideas over like just over zooms ideas come off of just crypto capital is not built without zoom you ain't here no it's like doesn't happen this doesn't happen you got to meet people you got to be in the mix you got to learn things you got to do no shit you're like you got to be there for those times of inspiration yes like crypto capital we were just sitting that quarter and then we're like oh first episode about the history of bitcoin start right yeah like how does that even happen if you're just like sitting over zoom yeah doesn't happen i hope humans want to be around other humans though i just it weirds me out it's weird we'll always want to be around

other humans that's why we do the sunday dinners you're shitting on the sunday dinner it's literally a tradition just to get people together i'm in on the sunday dinner i'm just out on you telling me you're tired from going to a spa that's the way i felt i wasn't mad about the dinners i like food i like to eat but i'm just like you saying oh i'm tired going to a spa i'm glad i'm glad your wife was like ripped that right away she snatched that one back i was like thank god someone snatched that one back you're making it seem like i was just like out of spot the whole time i was at a spot for an hour during a three-day trip i i'd like to see some receipts of what was done there you can go ask there's some people who were there outside this window we'll

ask them tomorrow after when we launch this website because this is this is the i mean we're in i'm in i'm here i ain't said i ain't going anywhere i live here now until we're big minimum We're going to be big. I think it's going to be big. Timing of this is going to be perfect because we're relaunching the site, new strategy. We're going to have a shit ton of really good content on the site. Obviously, we have the MASH tools integrated.

That's going to drive a lot of interaction and allow you guys who read the stuff and listen to this podcast to really have a fun experience on the website and then contribute to the show if you want to, to the media company. Thank you for contributing. um but then timing all this you have like the fake black rock etf approval announcement today like the price is gonna do what it has done historically inflation is going to keep doing

what it's doing looks like world war three is about to break out and people are desperate for an answer to these systemic issues that exist in the world like i told you day one bitcoin solves a lot of these things you fix the money i think you fix the world like the timing of launching this now before we get into the bull market the show we've seen this historically since we launched in 2017 we got a lot of people listening right away because we were in the middle of a bull market bear market comes you drop down a little bit plateau next bull market comes you overshoot the last one it's like follows the bitcoin price chart like we're setting up with this relaunch of the site and the show just keep doing what we've been doing i'm very excited for

next bull market because i think we're going to see a lot of people coming particularly learn about bitcoin and inflation we'll come to tftc we're going to get our seo right we're going to get everything right we can't we're going to get everything right because this is like i said uncle lou's getting old he can't keep doing this forever i can't be doing this when i'm 60. my goal is to help you make this your last one and then we can go chill thank god let me go chill where are we we gonna chill monica you're pumping my i love it but i can't go dude that's too much you got my wife i'll build up on monica we can go but i can only go for a few days i have too much fun it's too much fun i'm gonna go to f1 it's too much we can go but that's too much fun i've been

there it's too much fun it's fun like that's a place where you know what we can go and i'll just you can hold my wallet okay that's how i'll do it we'll go but you hold my wallet and i'll and i when I'm like, I need this for the casino, you'd be like, no. And I'd be like, all right, that's the move. Well, you haven't been betting. Yeah, I don't. I don't do it anymore.

I mean, I'm in on building this thing. I'm in on building now. There's parts of my life where I'm like, all right, now I got to build. I know that there's a part where everything in the world's fucked. If we don't build, you're going to get screwed. And this is definitely the most fucked it's ever been.

Like, I knew it was fucked. I knew college was fucked. That's why I didn't really want to go. But this is the most fucked. it's going to be and it's not getting better yeah we were talking about i think it was two weeks ago when you're driving me home like yeah you mentioned it it's like we talk about a lot of this show and i i love using you as a barometer for like people outside of bitcoin how they view the world and don't obsess about like the macroeconomic landscape inflation monetary

policy but you said something that's really sad and i've been opining on for years there's like People, like, literally can't afford to have kids. Like, you're, like, telling your friends, like, don't have, like, how are you going to have kids? You can't. How can you? You can't. I think you can, but it's just very hard.

You can, but how is anyone living off of, like, how is anyone living off of just their 9 to 5 job? I don't know how people do it. Like, I don't know how, like, I don't have kids, so I can't, I don't got to worry about it. You have multiple income streams. how do people live off of just like the nine to five and guess what the people i meet that i think the people i meet that are outside of bitcoin and i think they get it but they don't get the

real ramifications of like there is no answer besides this like that's the thing i don't is this if bitcoin's not the answer what's there is no answer that's it it's bitcoin but that's i'm saying there is no other answer if you if this is not the answer what if it doesn't exist right now and we're in this environment what's the answer no one has one we just all go broke the government just prints more money but that means we go broke we're going broke can't keep printing unlimited money doesn't work like that it doesn't work like that everyone sees it now like we said we're in the car i was like we didn't see the videos of people being like i can't afford my grocery bill three years ago it's everywhere on twitter now didn't exist three years

ago yeah like i know everything's more expensive i just know i don't have kids around like i don't gotta worry about myself so i don't really worry about it but i couldn't imagine if i had like a family to feed what i would do because it's not going to get better anytime soon yeah it's pretty heavy it's scary it's really scary if people aren't scared then they're just not they don't if they're not scared they just don't want to think about it it's like one of those things where like you're in like a copy of dissonance yeah you're like in a bad marriage you're like i'm staying in the marriage for just ever just because i'm i've been married for so long it's like no it's not going to get any better this isn't going to get better we ain't getting

the government's not going to fix this problem there's no doubt about it that's i mean truth for the commoner that's the goal of the website and the show is like get that message true to people that message number one overall yes bitcoin but first of all do not look at the government to solve your problems they created all these problems yeah i mean the dude who did the dude the bearded guy who did that song like that was the first like i was like oh that's a wake up people are really starting to wake up to this thing yeah oliver anthony oliver anthony that's his name it's like okay that's a wake-up call like there's this isn't getting the ink fixing this thing for you i know it's just like i i don't know if i don't know how bad does that

get that people realize that it's bad really bad i mean it is pretty bad already it's bad But are we going to have to get, like, I hope we don't, knock on wood, are we going to have to get to, like, soup kitchen type things before it's, like, really, people really wake up and they're like, okay, this is not, we need to either. Yeah, the bread lines. Yeah, we need to learn about Bitcoin and learn how this can actually probably work or we're just screwed.

Everyone's screwed. Everyone's screwed now. But I don't think most people think about it. I just don't. I don't think anyone thinks about it. Well, you're punting me or shitting on me for being a VC, but that's, again, the vision looking forward, taking everything you just said into consideration, knowing that people have not fully woken up yet, but these problems are going to persist. they're going to get worse they need a solution i mean that's what we do at 1031 that's what we do at tftc 1031 we see all right people are going to need these tools let's invest in the companies

they're going to build them so it's as easy and seamless as possible when people wake up and they can just onboard onto the network and then with tftc it's like all right let's just continually put out the signal day in and day out so that when people are ready to seek the answers to the problems that they're living through the information is just there like hey i know biden and yellen and whoever are telling you that it's okay the government's going to fix the problem it's not going to happen it's 100 not going to happen i don't know why anyone thinks they're going to fix anything i mean i i don't like i think about like the trump stuff and i'm like that dude like they'll ruin that like is he gonna even be able to allow the run they're doing

everything to get that guy not to run they just put more gag orders on him he's not even allowed to like talk about particular things and he's campaigning and you know him he's definitely gonna get some loose lips i mean trump broke everyone's brain he he he was the he was the canary in the coal mine i think he's one of the funniest people in the face of the planet funniest person ever lives my favorite funniest person ever lived we take over the spectrum of the let's fight about Washington D.C. shit out and just being the funniest

he's the funniest one of the funniest people that ever lived yeah he's like he's been funny for 70 years 60 years

70 years he's been funny for at least at least 50 years a minimum 50 years he's been funny I think he's funny because he breaks

people's brains it's like why do you let this guy get to you so much that's the other thing I don't get like I don't get how people

would be that into politics like to be like to be like I don't like I gotta fight this guy like what like I could

see like lobbyists and in washington dc because that's if you look at it from the strictly hollywood thing there's like i want to watch my movie versus watch this movie but like any normal person who would care i don't know i i would i i would vote for whoever is going to do the i know not sorry i would i think i'm out on anyone that's a career politician going forward if you're a career politician i'm out on you and i think trump was the first one who like totally chipped away at that where he's not a career politician and i think that's that if we're ever gonna fix the world bitcoin and really fix it there can't be any more career politicians ever they got to just go away every four years maybe maybe we do like an eight-year term limit just like get out of here

get out of here you can't be in this thing forever why are you still here i mean dine feinstein was literally we couldn't even say yes someone said someone tweeted the other day joe biden was closer to the fucking Abraham Lincoln inauguration when he was born than his own inauguration. It's like, that's how old he is. Yeah. Yeah. He was closer than the Abraham Lincoln.

I don't know if the tweet's true. I saw it on Twitter. That he's closer to the Abraham Lincoln inauguration than he was to his own. It's too old. When was, I don't know, when was Abraham Lincoln inaugurated? 1850s.

When was he inaugurated? 1850? Could someone tell me this? He's Googling right now. We got Googling. No, it had to be later than that. that'd be 80s when was if he was when was he born when was joe biden born and when was abraham lincoln inaugurated because if that's true it's like dude what are what are we doing why are these

people like yeah that's like the uh the dinosaur stat um we live closer to the t-rex and the t-rex live to like uh the bronchiosaurus or something i'm butchering the actual dinosaurs i really i saw someone tweet that and i i hearted it and i was like this is if this is true this is the wildest thing ever why is this dude our president he has no he can't even speak he can't speak he can't walk we don't know if he's a like he's pretty corrupt he's pretty corrupt can't speak can't walk can't walk it's like but then you have those people those are the people making rules about the internet like in the next level of the internet they don't even know how to use a phone they I don't think they know how to use it.

They can't even speak. Are we right or are we wrong? It's pretty close. I just calculated the years, but it's almost the same. It's like right there? Yeah, it's right in the middle. Close enough. Close enough that he shouldn't be the...

He was born right around the time that he got inaugurated, that Abraham Lincoln. Well, he was closer to Lincoln's inauguration. He was born then his inauguration after being born. Yes, yes. It's pretty close. If it's even close, that's a little bit of a sign. Yeah.

That this guy should not be president. And then it's like, oh, we're going to run him out of here for four more years? Get out of here, man. I don't think he's going to make it. No. I don't think he's going to make it to, like, the next election. He looks like he's, I mean, I don't want to speak uncouthly about the president, but he's not looking good.

You can speak uncouthly about him. These people are morons. They're evil, too. They're morons, too. I don't like to think anyone's evil but I just don't know if anyone is like like it's not a job anymore that anyone is like

proud to have it's like just like oh I just went in the like would you really go into politics if you were smart no no like no the answer is 100% no so like it's what is the you're really going to tell me that people in like their 30s and 40s like like I always

say she's an idiot I'd say it she's not smart like Because would I really want her to run the country? Like, there's nobody that, like, has, like, any, like, oh. But then you have people that come out of nowhere and, like, that's what we need. Even more people like Trump that, like, actually did something with their life and then just got into it later. That's the only way we're going to ever have politics is going to come back

in a way that makes sense. I think we just need to dissolve the federal government, push it back to the states, just let the states make their own decisions. But if the states make it, we're in. Philadelphia's dead. Right? I don't know. Maybe Western Pennsylvania could save the state.

Maybe. Western Pennsylvania, I mean, as soon as you get to Lancaster, everything else, maybe minus Pittsburgh, is pretty red in Pennsylvania. Yeah. I mean, Philadelphia's one of the scariest places in the world. So it's like literally one of the scariest places in the world. How do we fix Philly?

I don't know. i mean maybe in the manchurian candidate would work but we got i ain't doing that yet i don't know if i'm ready to be in that world yet i gotta see how this all this world war three thing plays out i don't know if i want to leave texas i'm dead serious like seriously i don't know if i want to be in those states do you feel safe in texas it's safer yeah it's definitely like a it feels like it's like all right if i if i have to go buy something for protection i can do that i don't got to worry about like like can't do that in new york nope like if if if they want to someone's take over new york they take it over manhattan there's no there's no you can't like there's no

there's no one here that has like that has guns it's it's over the criminals do criminals do yeah guns like drill doesn't work criminals are always going to criminal they're always going to get their guns so like that's why i'm like i don't know if it's savable i don't know if it's savable i mean you look at the videos like like san francisco looks like san francisco looks like a fucking third world country yeah so does the frank fordell but that always did though yeah it always did when i was growing up but now it feels like it's getting it's more like getting worse where it's like all right we don't even have time to police all this stuff because it's so bad yeah and we're not hiring the police a cab as a policy has not been good no i don't i never

understood to get rid of the police thing like that's crazy like what what do you do if there's no police you're gonna police yourself like no like no one's gonna no one's gonna do that you're gonna send in mental health workers to de-escalate the situation no that ain't gonna work either like there's no none of this shit works dude none of this works it's like we live in a i don't want to say live in the weirdest time everyone probably thinks that but like this gotta be this gotta be a wildest time since world war ii it has to be we are on the precipice of world war iii there's no doubt about it it's literally like at their doorsteps i saw a tweet today that they told that the 2000 told 2000 troops troops to get ready yeah what yeah that's

that's the start i think it started years ago it'll be like it was covet future history history books would be like yeah world war iii actually started in 2020 and 2022 Ukraine, Russia, maybe. Who knows? Yeah, if they can't tie it to COVID. I mean, yeah, maybe it was COVID. If it was a bioweapon, it's becoming pretty clear. Yeah, I mean, I don't know if we're...

I don't know where this all ends up, but I know nothing is going to end up good. I know... That's going to end up good. We're going to get through the other side. Yeah, but where is everyone being like, we don't want World War III? You don't want war.

war is not the answer to anything agreed you don't want it there's no one that wants war especially in this day and age with all the technology yes you don't want more like you just don't want it everyone can scream about war from their twitter but if war shows up on your doorstep on your doorstep you ain't gonna want more you ain't gonna want to be a more someone that gets their hair cut at the at the frankfurt and l line still to this day still gets his hair cut there sometimes you do not want to be in that situation no you do not well that's like going back to the scumbag politicians you have people like lindsey graham out there like come on let's go bomb iran it's like here he's never gonna go yeah you want to bomb around how about you go over

there yeah you go look the ayatollah in the face yeah you go over there that's that's that's also why i just hate old people it's like why are they making the decisions do you hate all people not all people but i hate just just politicians sorry that's a bad one i let me let me walk that back so anybody who goes to the capitol girl and sits at the bar and drinks some wine and a steak is you hate no i don't hate i don't really hate i mean i hate that you're you're closer to 30 than me and that's what you do i wish i like that's kind of it gets a little boring but like why does it get boring it's nice we had a good conversation it's all right dude you're you're You know what?

Actually, let me take it. I'm going to walk this back now. I'm going to walk it all back. We need more people who are 30 who think like they're 60. We do. Let those people go around the country and think like they're 60, but they actually have to be alive for the next 30, 40 years to see what's going to happen.

That's actually what we need. So I'm walking it all back. We need that. We actually have to be alive to see what's going to happen with the decisions they make. Because these people are making decisions now. they ain't gonna be here in five years no i think that's like the founding fathers the average age was what like 28 yeah it wasn't like it wasn't like i think it wasn't john adams like 21 or

they're very young yeah very young yeah so even if you go back in time when it was like everyone lived to be 50 or 60 max you still had to live half your life in the country so you better have made some right decisions because if not you were getting you it wasn't going to work out well for you now it's everyone's 70 and 80 they're not going to be here they're going to deal with this no so they'll just run up the debt send us to war then yeah that's that's what i mean why is everyone not just like whoa let's not do this let's not listen to these old people i think you're starting to see it bubble up on on twitter like i think israel stepped back from doing a ground invasion of gaza because i i i am not a middle east expert i go to lord miles

for all my middle east content i don't know anything about the middle i don't even i'm not an expert on it either it's too that's that's too much i'm just regurgitating what i read online um so it's like i don't know we saw this in syria though like 2012 2013 when john kerry was like we need to go in there people got on twitter like fuck no john kerry we're not doing this yeah like more than energy we need people need to stop being like war is like this great thing for the world it's bad because we are a click of a button away from a nuclear war and then we're all dead yeah i mean this is a i know you don't believe they're evil but i do believe a lot of these people are evil maybe if not evil at the very least nefarious they want to control us and war

is a great way to drive division to get people scared and anxious and when they're in that state you could easily corral them to do things that give you more control over their lives covid being a perfect example that's why i like all this israel um palestine stuff ukraine russia it's like mind-blowing to me it's like did you not see what just happened in covid like they literally just got you all scared and then convince you to stay in your house for two years like they're doing the same thing with war as well that's why that's why i'm not on twitter like like like popping off about this like people that are popping off they'll know anything they're talking about because it's like what is the real point of

this like what is the real point of making these two countries go to war and then americans have to go over there and they're going to die and what's the point of that what is the real point of that it's honestly that's why i love lord miles we get to see what's really happening in the world yeah like he'll go in and be like what's really happening what's really going down in this world today because you can read everyone can sit on twitter from from the suburbs of whatever outside of every city they're in and be like oh we should oh i have this strong stance i have this strong stance but it's like you ain't you ain't the ones going in there the ones going in there um my stance is don't let anyone die ever because i mean because you don't want that you wouldn't you

wouldn't go well that's where like we'll find out if push comes to shove a world war three does come rumblings of drafts and conscription like and then there's people with mighty twitter fingers sitting in the suburbs could get a knock on their door like all right suit up you're going over there then you'll really learn like oh shit maybe i shouldn't have been pushing for this the whole time that's the ultimate fuck around and find out moment yeah if they're scraping twitter like you talked about you wanted this you're going in right yeah you seem pretty positive about this war like we're gonna need you son what's the draft age i don't know was it 18 to 35 i mean it depends desperate they are like in ukraine they're conscripting like 60 year olds and women

that's what i'm saying man like like like you know could you imagine sitting and being like just being like 40 years old and you're like you gotta go 50 or like 45 because they don't got enough people to go i'm 32 and i'm like i got two kids career a life i'm very anti-war if I get drafted I'll be a draft dodger I don't know if that's legal to say you just said it I'm not fighting

these old people wars yeah I don't know if if anyone really want to do that could you imagine Gen Z going to war no no I don't know if people were ready for like what war really is

people have been completely desensitized to it there we go draft age is 18 to 25 but probably if a war happens that'll change very quickly yeah right now it's 18 and 25. that would change in two seconds if it was a real serious war like well this has got to be the closest we've ever been to world war three has maybe the 80s i don't know the 80 i don't know the i'm not going to sit here and act like cold war maybe cold war maybe but other than that maybe since the bay of pigs that's probably the early last time it was like serious where it's like oh they have weapons that could get

to america quickly yeah no i think i hope not but i do think if world war iii does happen we'll recognize that it started before today's date in retrospect I think I think if the tweet that sent 2,000 troops is real we're probably going to World War 3 I don't think this is ending any other way unless

unless Trump gets back and he saves us who else is going to happen because you know Biden and that crew they ain't stopping this you think Trump will save us I think Trump did a lot more than people give him credit for i agree with that abraham cords that seemed like an actual move towards

peace in the middle east which seems like there was never going to be peace there yeah so it's like he did more than people will give him credit for he's did a lot more and did things that people will not now i see a lot of like people that were staunched down like people that are jamaat came out last jamaat said it that was the one i saw where he was like yeah like he's one like he said it where he's like yeah like i was democrat that i died but at least if i look at it from the lens of like objectivism objectivism don't think about think about the message and not the messenger you think about the message and not the messenger trump had the right message he did but people just didn't it was i mean it was uh delivered very abrasively for many people yeah i think i said

that last time i was on the show i was like i was like if someone could come in and do what trump does but don't deliver as abrasively but like he would win in a landslide instantly yeah instantly like he would but i don't know if that's possible i don't know if that i mean if he gets in he's winning it's already over in my it's a done i'd bet any i'd go to gambling again because he already won if he's allowed to be president he's going to be president but is he allowed we don't even hope he's allowed right we don't know if like some votes are just going to go away we don't know anything but if he's allowed to be president he's president it's already out i mean that's a sign that it's really bad if they're literally trying to jail political opponents and yeah that's prevent

them that's banana republic shit that's like we're we're not i mean it sucks to say it i hope it wasn't going to happen on my watch and my quick trip around this moon we may see the end maybe the end maybe the end of this empire like you know what i mean like everything die everything ends this may be the end i mean i i i completely agree i think again that's this is another thing where people look back and be like oh the american empire actually died in 2008 when they bailed out all the banks um but to bring this back to an optimistic tip to end it on an optimistic note like i do think bitcoin is a way out um for individuals and i do think if america were to embrace bitcoin and foster innovation like which mash is providing the world it could be a way to

yes recognize that the empire as it has been for 250 years is dead um own up to it recognize it admit it and then say all right we fucked this up but we had this new opportunity with bitcoin you could build an economy around this new monetary system let's lean into that and sort break the cycle of empires rising falling plateauing for for centuries and actually ride the s curve of technology adoption at the nation state level and say all right we're riding bitcoin we're not we're not falling behind okay let's even take about yeah let's add an optimistic note because we should what would you even work on what would like what would you really work on like you watch twitter do it they got rid of 10 000 jobs they realize you

can run this thing with that like what would you really i wouldn't work on anything but bitcoin or ai like that's it there ain't gonna be you ain't gonna go to you ain't gonna go to get your mba at columbia and sit on the sip pretty with the 250k pm job anymore they ain't gonna exist what else would you work on like if someone could give me an objective answer i don't think many people could what else would you really work on if you were like 20 and hungry but you want to be a content creator but that that's a saturated that's such a saturated market such a saturated market that's why we're trying to fix it in one way but what else would you really work on i can't even name anything else you want to work on like that's a and the crazy thing is is that well i will get

i don't want to i do want to give like gen z is smarter than us on the internet they can be they can do things that like like i know kids that have like 50k a month drop shipping companies they're making 50k a month on dropship but i wasn't making 50k a month at 21 years old it's like they can figure those it's like what else would you really work on like i can't think of anything else that would make sense over the next 20 years that could actually build new companies and new innovation ai and this that's it and make the world a better place and make the world a better place you think ai is going to kill us it's scary there's a lot of scary shit that can happen in ai deep fake shit scary that shit's

scary yeah i'm fucked everyone's fucked i'm fucked everyone that was online's fucked it's it's you're fucked everyone's fucked i haven't been online for forever um it's scary but it does have some there's a lot of cool things that can do a lot a lot of interesting business models that can do but where does it end that's the question it's like what is the how is that how how are the rails of that controlled i do not know the answer to that question there's those lms can do some things at least from a business perspective that are physically impossible yeah like the one thing we're using the scale mash it's impossible to do without it it's impossible to do without it i don't want to like because no free ads i don't

want to judge i don't want to give companies free advertising but when it goes i'm using i'm like it's impossible though yeah be physically impossible it's like when i found zapier back in the day it's impossible no um to prove that i wasn't only at the sauna last week we did have like a pretty long discussion about ai and how businesses should be thinking about implementing it and like a simple thing like going on um hugging face yeah running your own models and your own servers that really understand how you communicate as a business and the metrics like you can really cut down on opex significantly just by huge cut down on opex so it's like all these all those jobs that people were sitting there thinking they were going to have forever

like the 75th pm at facebook they're gone dude it's like lawyers lawyers discovery like you go to you have a case you go to discovery and it's like oh here's 10 000 emails you have 10 lawyers and paid 500 an hour to like scour through them to find evidence like boom pop it into an llm like oh it cost me 50 cents and it costs nothing 30 seconds 30 seconds costs absolutely nothing yeah so yeah you're right it's gonna be it's gonna be interesting we're an interesting time let's see let's see i hope we don't have to have an emergency world war three podcast but if not we'll be at a very interesting place in a year are we gonna what if we do have to have an emergency world war three podcast what are we gonna be saying don't do it don't do it no war ever no there's

no there's nothing that's worth what real war really is zero yeah dying for the uh the rich men north of richmond is not uh not an admiral death no it's not it's not worth dying for really not there's no point of war it really is not like i don't see it just go build shit build cool shit the world is abundant we can go to space and get anything we need and bring it back if we want to if it's like all about if we're fighting over like let's go to space and get what we need to bring it back we got plenty of land plenty of land you don't big the united states is i just drove it yeah there's nothing in half apparently we have too many people on the planet though we need less plenty of spots to put people billions of spots to put people

you ever drive across the country yeah yeah this place is huge this is just one country this place is huge there's more than enough for everyone to be okay yeah it's just incentivizing the productive class of people to get out there and actually build the stuff that gets them access to that abundance i don't know how to build like a well or like how to mine oil or mine anything but i can build internet things so hopefully that's a start yeah i've learned about it i know you have that's why i'm here you're you're like the you're the guy we already talked about this if things ever hit the fan you're the guy yeah you got it all figured out from from top to bottom you got to be prepared i'm happy you're here and i'm happy i i'm here marty everyone go to mash

i think i think we ran our course i think we just talked for two hours yeah mash.com i hope you enjoy the new site well if you're listening to this like you can see the site now go interact with it put on some reactions particularly for the content traders that we're syndicating we're really trying to lean into this model of syndication and trying to help creators monetize outside of the walled garden platforms like substack and twitter and then provide you guys like uncle marty's curating all this stuff tries to get you the signal get you the truth for the commoner the content that's going to help you understand what's going on in this crazy world

and where I believe the signal is to give you actionable advice and prepare you with knowledge to go out and understand the world better. Let's hope it works. Or if it doesn't work, we won't be releasing the podcast. If it doesn't work,

if it doesn't work, you'll be a mayor of Philadelphia. I'll be behind you and we'll be running shit. God, that sounds so cool. Like five years ago now, i'm like i want nothing to do with politics dude the more the more the more you see these people it's like this is miserable yeah it is that's why i was happy you were gonna be the front man i was just gonna be behind the scenes it's a good deal for me yeah maybe we gotta rethink the deal

seemed like a bad deal for me the more i watch this thing go down yeah like you're gonna have to like get in because you're shooting in the city you have to like drive and like show face and be like oh everybody calm down yeah i i had like a different vision i had me like standing like Eagles games like waving a tail but that's probably not it the new mayor all right

all right we're working together again for real this time I mean we're working for real Barstool too yeah but we didn't own it we own this one

yeah we can do this this is ours yeah all right peace and love freaks dicky Thank you.