TFTC: A Bitcoin Podcast - Rabbit Hole Recap #179: End of year holiday chop special

Episode Date: December 27, 2021

Happy Holidays from Marty and Matt. Enjoy this end of year holiday chop special of Rabbit Hole Recap from 2021. Shoutout to our sponsors: Cash App Unchained Capital Braiins - Daniel's thread Compass Mining HodlHodl Bitcoin 2022 - use the code TFTC for 10% off

What is up, freaks? It's your Uncle Marty coming to you live from my father-in-law's bedroom. Back here again for the holidays. Here to introduce a little holiday chop-up for you freaks. An end-of-the-year chop-up that Carr has put together.

I hope you guys enjoy it. I hope you enjoy your holidays. I hope you enjoy your lives. Love all y'all. Peace and love. Okay. This was brought to you by good friends of the motherfucking Cash App.

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6-9. Nice. It's going to be an incredible event. I'm going to be there speaking. We're doing a live RHR. It's going to be a massive party in Miami. Again, April 6th to 9th. You can go to b.tc.com to buy tickets

and register for the event. Use the code TFTC, you're going to get 10% off. That helps out the podcast too. If you haven't gotten your tickets yet, get on it. The ticket prices are only going to go up as more and more sell. So enjoy this, Rep Freaks. I believe that in a world where central bankers are tripping over themselves to devalue their currency, Bitcoin wins. In the world of fiat currencies, Bitcoin is the victor. I mean, that's part of the bull case for Bitcoin. If you're not paying attention, you probably should be.

We are live. Yeah, yeah. I told you we're live. Classic Marty. Cheers, freaks. I'm going sober this week. Cheers. This is water.

going mezcal it's a mezcal kind of year i like that mezcal kind of this isn't a champagne bowl run for you it's never really a champagne it's more of a champagne is more complimentary it's not really a base alcohol it's more of a popping social kind of environment like i don't i yeah it's it's different champagne will still be involved we will still be popping bubbly uh this bull cycle it's more experience than substance with the champagne it hasn't really happened yet but uh we're getting we're we're every day we're getting closer to to moon culture yeah how's uh how's nature culture i feel comfortable talking about this because you posted a picture on twitter yeah i'm in i'm in a cabin in the woods there was i was i was i had

i have a there's a buck on the wall over there but i couldn't i'm in the loft so you can't see it but it's great out here it's good to be um i don't know i i i always i always love it in the woods it's uh it's truly peaceful and relaxing uh without all the bullshit so um and it's really cool that i can just broadcast out to all of you freaks out there um from this cabin i mean i mean if you look at 2021 like we just hit the ground fucking ripping i since the new year started uh i did a like a live stream event with bitcoin magazine um i did citadel dispatch on tuesday then today we ripped with jack mallers i'm excited for the freaks to get that rip which are going to release tomorrow um then i immediately jumped into the casa key fest and now i'm here now

so uh uh no sleep till 2022 let's fucking go first off i want to say shout out to all the freaks in the live chat on youtube love you guys thank you for joining us again uh you guys really make these live episodes super fun um the tour issue uh i uh this was a pretty crazy one i mean so so the tour developers said uh i think the exact quote was something like someone's fetching uh information in a rude way, which causes a denial of service attack. To me, I just assume attack. And I think like when you're talking about these adversarial networks,

like you should assume attack. You shouldn't assume that it was an unintentional bug or whatever. It definitely was an unintentional bug, but the exploitation of the bug could have been unintentional or intentional, right? And I think it was probably an attack. I don't think it matters either way.

You should just operate under the assumption attack. But basically, the result is the way TOR's trade-off model works is they basically operate under an assumption that the US government will not outwardly go after them. They have the protection of the US government. They have the sanctity of the US government that is basically giving them protection. So because of that, they're able to take some centralization on, at least in their trade-off balance. It makes it easier for them. So ultimately, with all these networks,

when you're talking about distributed networks, the issue is Sybil resistance, denial-of-service resistance, right? This idea that you have traffic that just keeps hitting you and keeps hitting your nodes and it takes the whole network down. With Bitcoin, we actually handle that

in a distributed way because we don't assume that the US government will protect us. The strongest government in the world will protect us. And the main instrument there is the fee market. And there's this idea that if you're pushing more bandwidth through the network, it's going to come at an increased cost for you. And ultimately, you're going to run out of money eventually. With Tor, what they do is they have these centralized directory servers. Because like I said, they've been funded by the

Department of Defense in the past. And in general, the US government tends to allow them to exist and protect them. And those directory servers are what we're getting attacked. So ultimately, what does that mean for a Tor user? It means that if you're using Tor's most recent address format, Tor v3, you're going to have a lot of reliability issues over this last week. And I still see these issues. I've been noticing these issues for Bitcoiners. A lot of times where you see Tor v3 is when you're connecting back to your home node right so like i'm on the road right now i'm trying to connect back to my lightning node or connect back to um any kind of a node service a blockchain a blockchain explorer that i host mempool.space that i host back back home connecting it through tor v3 you

wouldn't be able to do that it was hit or miss and basically what happened was uh the the really scary aspect is that the the sovereign bitcoin lightning network pretty much relies on tor v3 reliability like this idea like that that uh like we need uptime like like uh if if you're if you're running an independent lightning routing node that's tor only your node was going on and off over this last week or so. And technically, there's fund risk possibility there, right? Like if a bad state gets sent, tries to get sent on chain while your note is down.

Yeah. Doesn't seem good, but they had a quick fix to it, correct? Yeah, that's the worst part. The worst part to me, and maybe it's me just confirming my biases. i've talked on this podcast many times about my love hate relationship with tour right yes and and i just don't think there's something to be said about culture of the community and the and the developer community specifically and it feels like they're just not adversarial enough you know and i am i throwing am i like you know i can't do what they do so i'm not saying like i

don't appreciate them i appreciate them tremendously um but just the way like concerns were like kind of dismissed i felt like it wasn't like think about when there's when there's a concern in bitcoin like how much concern there is how much messaging there is how much importance there is to communicating what the concerns are what the issues and stuff it was just kind of radio silence out of tour yeah you know out of out of like the tour lead maintainers and stuff so i was like So to me, and maybe that's because the idea is, from their perspective, Tor downtime isn't the end of the world. It'll be up again eventually.

Don't rely on Tor uptime. But for Bitcoiners, I think a lot of people assume Tor uptime. I think you just can't assume Tor uptime. Yeah, it's interesting how Bitcoin and Tor, we talked about this in the past, becoming more intertwined. Bitcoin dependent on Tor for the privacy assurances that it's supposed to provide and then Bitcoin potentially helping Tor

by Bitcoiners realizing they need to leverage Tor and running more relay nodes or exit nodes. But I have talked to Bitcoiners, developers specifically in the past who think Tor is just one huge, and we've talked about this as well, one huge honeypot. And it's like instances like this

where they just brush over it. Like, oh, no big deal. like has the alarm bells going off but we've talked about that in the past too like even if you do assume that it is a cia honeypot i mean you should have that assumption but it's better than nothing at the end of the day so let's go through just real quick let's just go through uh like some of matt's shower thoughts this week um so like let's say it is an attack everybody everybody take a second close your eyes deep breath in for a second driving in the car don't do it. Maybe even if you're driving, just picture Matt naked in the shower thinking this.

So the tax started on January 6th, or the bug started on January 6th, which was the same time the Capitol incident happened in the US Capitol and all the censorship events happened on the outside. The only services that were affected was the new address format. right so anyone using the v3 addresses were affected the v2 addresses were not affected the directory service for the you know for the v2 addresses was not affected so the v3 addresses are improvements in all these different ways publicly for for why why we why as a as a community people on tour want to move to v3 addresses um maybe there is some kind of concern with v2 maybe there's some kind of undisclosed bug

that the attacker knows about that allows them to locate de-anonymize do some kind of traffic analysis to v2 services and they're hoping that by continuously knocking down the v3s that some of these dark markets will will get will get anxious and want the money that their revenue provides in the dark market and will switch to v2 right or or these censorship resistant platforms and they'll switch to v2 and then they hit them and i guess that would be that that to me would make sense is what this attack is right yeah just a herding of users to to a certain format the the freaks think you're a never nude person matt they also they're asking where the cabin is i'm in between cabins i'm just on a road i'm just renting houses by the way guys i rented

the last cabin, then I'm renting this house, then I'm going to a cabin after this. The cabin life, baby. The emperors are naked and they're running around with their heads cut off. Buy Bitcoin. They are running around with their heads cut off.

Obviously, I'm sure you freaks are aware of what's going on. Let's just do a little rehash. The Tendi Army on our Wall Street Bets, a subreddit, has targeted GameStop as a stock that they want to buy because a hedge fund, particular hedge fund, Melvin

Capital and others were short, net short, 140% of the overall stock issuance. So the attendee army saw that and saw an opportunity for a short squeeze arbitrage and a bunch of retail investors using Robinhood and other brokerage accounts bought a bunch of GameStop. Are you listening And they took advantage of it and were successful for the first few days of this week. It got to a point where the powers that be did not like what was going on yesterday. CNBC was going crazy. Everybody was talking about it yesterday. People were saying, these inmates are running the asylum.

Somebody needs to step in. And this morning, Robinhood and other brokerage firms basically said, you can't buy the stock anymore. You can sell it. And in some instances, Robinhood just stepped in and sold GameStop stock on behalf of their users without even asking. And it's insane, man. So let's jump into it. Let's get your thoughts first, because I have some theories. I'm going all over the place right now. I'm so jacked up. I couldn't even write this morning, so I got to write to Ben after this. Well, first of all, apologies to the freaks for that little bit of echo there. That was on me. I mean, yeah, this is craziness. I didn't even know about the forced sales. That's something else. You didn't know about that? No, I mean, I know they stopped people from selling and it wasn't just Robinhood. Stopped people from buying.

I mean, yeah, they stopped people from buying. It wasn't just Robinhood. It was also, I think, E-Trade and TD Ameritrade as well. So all popular brokerages for like a general retail type of trader, like the average user. There's a couple of things. I mean, I think this is kind of part of our thesis in terms of the Great Awakening.

in terms of people need to get burned before they really realize shit is wrong and they get motivated to try and improve their situation. And it just happens to be on this epic scale. There's so many different facets here. I don't know where to start, but there's so many different facets here from free markets to what is manipulation to decentralization to just this general concept that if you have have these centralized third parties that are controlling um any of these systems they are ripe for abuse they're gonna there's gonna be corruption there they're gonna they're gonna always abuse their power that's just the human it's the human spirit that's the way the humans work um and and the only way we can avoid that is if we have systems

and networks um that are designed in a way that a few cannot change the system um and you know bitcoin is is is perfectly positioned in in that ability um even even something like i mean this is this is like what we've been speculating for the longest time in terms of self-custody bans or uh you know freezing unregulated custodians regulated exchanges like this is the playbook the playbook is is unfolded in front of our eyes and they didn't need any kind of new laws or anything to do it it just it just there was a couple calls that were going on behind you know back doors and the powers that be just cut off the on ramps and in the case of bitcoin you can see them cutting off withdrawals at the same time yeah so there's so much to this story there's so

much interconnectedness between robin hood citadel uh janet yellen ben bernanke that we should really I think we're going to spend like an hour on this topic alone. So it's disgusting what's going on. Yesterday, everybody, Pearl Clutching, CNBC, all the hedge fund managers like, oh, this isn't happening. This isn't fair. This is manipulation. When Melvin Capital, excuse me, itself was arguably manipulating GameStop's stock down

toward zero. Again, the retail investors stood up, saw this opportunity in the open. It's within the rules of the regulations set forth. And they took advantage of it and were extremely successful. And this scared the shit out of the powers that be. So I don't think this is censorship. It certainly is censorship. It's not a censorship issue.

I think what the 10D army from Wall Street Bets was doing was pulling forward a systemic collapse to the present day because Citadel has their hand in this. So they're loaning funds to Melvin Capital to take the short position. And so if Melvin goes bust on that particular position, Citadel is affected negatively. And if you freaks remember, back in September of 2009, when we had the overnight repo market spasm, when there was a liquidity crunch in the overnight lending markets for banks and primary dealers that was incited by a months long transition out of cash and into treasury bonds by JP Morgan. So JP Morgan went from cash to treasury bonds and that cash otherwise would have been lended out to these hedge funds to cover their margin trading. So when JP Morgan

pulled that liquidity out of the market and went into bonds, the liquidity for margin lending dried up and you had that overnight repo spasm where the rates spiked to like 14% or something like that, which is astronomical in those markets, particularly, especially considering the interest rate environment we've been in. And what we came to find after months and months and months, what happened was that the overnight repo bailout was very swift. It happened in the course of 12 hours, I believe. And what the Fed did is they expanded the amount of primary dealers that could access its window. And so usually it's just typically banks and some other clearinghouses and stuff like that. And they added the FICC to the list of primary dealers that could access the

Fed window, started pumping liquidity into the FICC. But the FICC was essentially a proxy for the Fed to fund the margin positions of Citadel 0.72 and Millennium, particularly, who weren't able to access the liquidity from JP Morgan anymore. And so what we had happen was the Fed basically bailed out three hedge funds, two of which are very heavily involved in what's going on right now this week. And so we know from that instance alone, it came out, that is what happened. The Fed had to bail out these hedge funds in 2019. Moving forward to this week, I think the Tendi Army and their GameStop short squeeze

is a black swan to Citadel and Point72 specifically too. Again, lending to Melvin Capital. And it's something that highlighted and again, pulled forward the systemic collapse of Citadel, which is a very important systemic business in the hedge fund world and the banking system. Or not the banking system, but just in the hedge fund world. And so basically, I believe that...

So this is the crazy thing. Again, Robinhood didn't stop. They just won't allow you to buy the stock, so you can't go up. And they're selling it. Fucking scam. They're selling it automatically to drive the price down to get it closer to the short position

so these hedge funds don't go bust. The way the fashion and the abruptness of everything that's going on right now leads me to believe that there would have been a systemic collapse if this stuff didn't happen. Freaks, we got 183 of you right now in the live chat. We have 12 retweets on Twitter. So if you want to support the show, the single most important thing you can do for the show is retweet our live stream on Twitter. We would appreciate that. that that is a it's a big deal for us yeah we get we get a lot of dopamine hits when we get the retweets so make sure you make sure you smash your freaks and if you know me well you know it's

hard for me to say that but that's the single request i will make everybody's on clubhouse dude podcasting's dead no they're not on they're not on fucking clubhouse they're here with us i'm looking i'm not looking at the live chat right now um but if i were i would request for them to to give us a retweet on Twitter, guys. Or at least give us a little sad squeeze in the comments. Give us a little sad squeeze. Let's go. Matt, don't mark it by.

All right, people are retweeting. It works. Thank you, freaks. I love all y'all. Thank you, freaks. Thank you, Matt. Thank you, Matt. Appreciate you, freaks. Well, Marty should be thanking me. I should be thanking the freaks. This is how it should be.

We move along it's a little what do you call it it's order of operations it's math science there's an order of operations

to these things that's what I'm trying to tell thank you I love you I've been trying to say this for Castle Islander boy Dick Carter and Matthew Walsh are boys It's Nick Carter, Matthew Walsh, Walsh, Walsh. Raise the second fund, Castle Island Ventures 2, $50 million.

This news doesn't really matter, but they're our boys, so it's dope. Matthew Walsh helped me break the micro-strategy news. It's good to see Castle Island getting some money. I mean, they're like the signal in venture capital, right? Like there's no There's no real venture capitalists In Bitcoin that are actually Targeting Bitcoin focused companies

Like they are In my opinion Everyone else is too They're getting like tokens and blockchain And all that fucking bullshit Dude if you see that NFT I'm gonna get your hash mash Or whatever it's called

What the fuck is Like all these NFT shits It's all noise freaks It's all bullshit Like just like everybody's like oh no like you want that digital scarcity you're gonna want to have like no the standards are dumb the standard for non-fungible tokens are sats that's why you need to use coin join right yeah do you want like to own would you spend a hundred thousand dollars

for a jpeg no would you ever do that stupid why would you ever do that that's some money they're jpegs are unique like hash certified like it's a fucking jpeg at the end of the day it's so it's some poor man's logic is what's going on there like that's some like ridiculous fucking shit that's how you end up shilling shit coins for like 500 000 sacks like that that's how you end up in that hole it does i mean honestly like i i like to think that i uh approach things with intellectual curiosity and earnestness. Earnestly, it doesn't make any sense. I would never

ever spend a hundred grand on a fucking digital NFT, digital JPEG. Maybe I'm dumb. Maybe I'm missing something. Honestly, that's earnestly how I feel. It doesn't make any fucking sense. It's a really

bold claim from Marty Bent that he would not spend $100,000 on an absolute piece of shit coin. really bold i'm i'm glad you put your name on that one well they'll gaslight you man and be like it's you it's you don't the artist is gonna revolutionize it's gonna do all this it's gonna do that it's a new wave of art it's like is it is the current wave of art even good is the current wave of art even worth it like no no i respect our bitcoin artists and i'll buy

their art yeah like crypto graffiti making like the the silk road stuff and like the like dollar Cutting up the dollar Making paper mache art Maybe there's something there If my certificate of authenticity Is tied into the Bitcoin blockchain Instead of I get the physical art

I want physical art I don't get the JPEG art I'm saying I have the physical art And then it's also tied into the You can't tie the physical You can't tie meat space to a blockchain It's just impossible Well, no, you could because somebody could come and say, Matt, I took your physical art.

You may own all the blockchain, but I actually possess it. So you could take a picture of the art and you can hash it into the Bitcoin blockchain. And you can enjoy that picture all you want. You can present it as a certificate of authenticity for the art that is bought in physical form. And it's still physical art, though. yeah somebody steals that physical art and you own it on a blockchain like you owning it on the blockchain doesn't mean dick like okay but i'm just saying but regardless either way uh art is a horrible store of value and i love all my artists but like it's gonna it's trending to zero

when price insets like with everything else like you're also in the same boat as the owner of the building i'm not saying that uh you're in a different situation there like that's the case It's like you're still in the same situation as Elon, who the majority of his wealth is in Tesla stock. So it's all trending to zero in terms of Bitcoin. MIKE GREEN That sucks for Elon. He can't liquidate that without inciting a mass collapse of that stock, sort of stuck in that frame, until it gets priced in sats.

Maybe it should get priced in sats. I added these to the list, we'll just lightly touch on them. Janet Yellen, my bitch lover, she made some sense. Because you put the GIF. I put this line in our Telegram chat. Oh, my God, it's so good. Yeah, I did the Marty kissing Yellen GIF. I'm thinking of, what's his name, from Wedding Crashers, the brother.

Your owl is saying that Yellen is hot. He's attracted to her. She could have been, back in the day. Is that Aegis, maybe? Do we have a young Yellen photo? Look it up, freaks. That's kind of creepy. BlackRock, again, we mentioned it in the beginning a bit.

They announced that they're dabbling in Bitcoin. It's a cryptocurrency a lot. What are you known for? Talk about buying Bitcoin until they have a position, right? And he begrudgingly had to answer that question on air live because he was asked that question. But that's why they're just dabbling. You know, this wasn't a formal announcement.

This is him, you know, getting put on the spot when really he doesn't want to talk about the fact that they're short Bitcoin and just realizing. Yeah. Are the people at BlackRock that smart? Like the dude kept saying storehouse of value. I've never heard that term before. I'm like, why are you saying storehouse?

It was triggering me. It was like... I also was triggered by that. Is it just me or did that annoy anybody else? I was also triggered by that. Yeah. Yeah. The storehouse of value.

It's like, dude, you're working that buck. Let's get your economic terms down. down pat here never heard storehouse value well what I was thinking what I thought of was remember when backed launch they kept saying like your bitcoin will be held

in full custody at the backed warehouse yeah so I was thinking maybe in his head he was like mixing the two together like store value and warehouse and storehouse but I don't know yeah it was very like bro come on

yeah so black rock forced to mention about it like it is funny cmb sits they ride the hype cycle as well but we have come a long way from brian kelly uh specifically coin and and telling people to buy ripple at the top uh they seem to have stayed away from the the altcoin space at least up to this point in this particular run and focused on bitcoin Joe Kernan and Aaron Ross Sorkin were actually in a conversation talking about crypto. They said, oh, wait, it's a big crypto.

That's what they started the dispatch with, that clip. You know what's an interesting thing about it is, so Joe Kernan is one of us. He has a bag of Bitcoin. Everything divided by 21 million. He dropped it. And historically,

we've always said, when you own Bitcoin, you have an incentive to talk about it, improve it, shill it, right? So I expect financial journalists, these anchors and stuff that have Bitcoin, they want to talk about it a lot. And that's what we saw with Brian Kelly last cycle, right? He had all the shit coins. So he was trying to dump them on retail. So he wanted to talk about them a lot. What's really cool to see is Salty, No Corner, Sorkin, his co-anchor, who has to bring it up all the time. And because his editors or whatever, his producers are telling and he has to bring it up

and he is so deflated. He is so deflated just watching Bitcoin go up. He looks destroyed inside and yet he still needs to ask the question. He's visibly, physically triggered.

Like when he has to bring it up, he's like squirming and his voice changes a little bit. We're talking about voice changes. How about your boy? Portnoy. Which one? Portnoy's video.

Dave. Dave, you got to pump it up, pump it up, pump it up. You got to pump it up, pump it up, pump it up. Dave, I know you probably don't like me, but I would not want to see the success that you've achieved in life be diminished because you miss out, because you're short Bitcoin. Just get it, bro. I know you probably don't like me,

but this is advice coming from the heart, not trying to troll told you to get in bitch we're going to the moon back in october listen then be okay right now okay i told him it's all across the average i don't know if you want to step in here he uh you know i still blame the wink across average back in 2017 yeah the wink the wink of us twins fucked him over and that's what they always do you know this is the problem with the space right it's like they know bitcoin is designed to pump forever they know bitcoin is the future money they know bitcoin is the best money we've ever had they own a shit ton of fucking Bitcoin, but their exchange is based off of shitcoin trading. They make a ton of money off

of it. So God forbid they ever talk about the real thing and they always need to pump their fucking bags. And it happens every fucking time. The crazy thing about this Portnoy thing was he literally said, I'm never going to buy Bitcoin, which is usually the last step right before you end up capitulating and buying Bitcoin. We capitulated this morning. Did you see that? Did he buy some? Well, he said he's getting it. He's not going to be swabbing the decks on the pirate ship because Bitcoiners are getting so rich

like he doesn't want to be the peasant swabbing the deck so he's got to get some skin in the game got him very volatile Dave your visions

around Bitcoin just stick to it I told you this in 2017 just buy a little bit on a consistent basis and forget about it just forget about it

like he was I saw he did a video this morning is that what's the Wall Street bets guy's name. Yeah, I responded to that one. Peak fucking value,

is that his name? Yeah, but that's not his account. His account is... Anyway, the point I'm trying to get to is... Roaring Kitty. Roaring Kitty, that's who it is. Are they trying to bring legal action against that guy? Yeah, because security is violations. Well, anyway, Dave was alluding

to that fact, saying that He would lead a revolution in the streets against the suits if Warren Kitty was to be arrested and thrown in jail. Bitcoin is the revolution. This is how we fight back against the suits most aggressively and most potently. It's probably a more accurate descriptor of Bitcoins as a tool against potent. So, I mean, I tweeted at him in all caps in response to that tweet. Bitcoin is the revolution. Join us.

And like 15 minutes later, he joined us. So caps work, people. Caps work. Credit goes to you. Credit goes to Caps Odell here. Caps Odell. Change of minds. No, credits go to all the plebs who've just been telling him to have fun, stay poor for like the last eight months. We got to give a shout out to... I want to make sure I get his name right.

it like that that pump it up montage from yesterday just got me all hyped up actually listening to it my son pump it up is now my son's favorite we were dancing to it yesterday like i just heard me playing in the background and he just like naturally started dancing pump it up you gotta pump it up pump it up it's high vibes and then like memes thrown on top of it so dr BitcoinMD at drbitcoinmd at our incredible

montage to the Pump It Up song. Legit gets me pumped up. Should we be staying humble here, Matt? We're at all-time highs and we're just losing all of our humility here. The thing is

I've been trying to distill my feeling but they why how can you be how can you be humble in all caps at the same time and i'm not trying to grandstand and say i'm humble because i've always said that one of the reasons i i i've said stay humble over and over again is is to remind myself it's a thought experiment you know every day stay humble it's the alexander the great you were only a man you were only a man it's the alexander the great like having somebody walk behind except there's a humility to seeing this massive wave coming ahead of you i posted like the interstellar clip today right like this you have this massive wave coming at you and the humble move is to like let it flow

through you you know and and and and express the urgency to people you know all caps you know there there's urgency here this thing is coming we have never been in this situation before ever in terms of both Bitcoin and just humanity. These guys are different than last cycle's whales. These guys are billionaires, large corporations, and they have to telegraph every move they do way ahead of time. They have to get front run by design.

So there's all this messaging out there. And also in combination of the fact that we see Bitcoin often repeat relatively similar to previous cycles. So you have the combination of the two and you're sitting in this position right now and i just trying to help people get on the lifeboat can't exactly exactly and i feel like the humble move is is is is to concisely say that to people and say it loud uh now until instead of afterwards you know like to to to just and and look lower

case odell's been here for fucking years now like i i feel like i've reached everyone that the lower cases we're going to read. So now you got to say clearly for the people in the back. I think that's admirable. I don't think there's anything that shows lack of humility. It shows a lack of compassion, if anything, or excuse me, a sense of compassion, not a lack of it. Arguably, you have more compassion than most people because you're trying to get people onto the lifeboat. So I commend you for your efforts, Matthew. And I commend you for starting a movement in all caps movement you're pulling me in too i don't want to like rip off your shtick but like it's hard not to when things are going i'm like this it's not a shtick

it's a yeah it's a lifestyle it's a it's a lifestyle i was gonna say that i was like nah it's not really a lifestyle it's a feeling it's mostly a feeling that i feel inside all the time right now like uh i mean i i had i'm not gonna blow up our spot but like i had a conversation with you yesterday, like you're feeling the feeling too. Tons of people in this space, anyone who's been paying attention feels this feeling right now.

And that's why other people have started going caps because we all feel it. I mean, there are people that have worked in this industry for five years or whatever that still don't fucking get it. And we're going to front run

all those people. But there's a large portion of us, a lot of the freaks especially, that are sitting here and they're like, oh my God. Like, you know exactly what's going on. Like, I've never had more FOMO than I have right now.

Yeah. We talked on the phone yesterday. I was saying your comment towards the end of last year set a SATS goal for a yearly salary and try and hit it. Doing my daily, weekly purchases and seeing how little Bitcoin you're getting for it compared to this time last year. It's like, holy crap. I need to turn it up. Got to pump it up. Yeah. It comes quick. We're in the bear markets It's like, I can't wait for it to pump And then the pump starts It's like, holy shit, I need more

You never have enough sets You never have else You go to sleep at night March feels like a fucking decade ago Not even a year ago yet There were people that sold in fucking March There were people that got liquidated in March There were people that rage quit in March

And we're sitting over 10x from them almost 20x really close to 20x you know what the crazy thing is we're closer to 100k than we are to zero I saw Joe Rogers tweet that out yesterday or the day before

and I was like whoa big facts big facts big facts what about what about censorship resistance signal with payments

it's so much more than that though it's a podcast player you can't play podcast and signal i mean you can send it you can send an mp3 and signal it's true it's true actually this is a good debate here too is paul and i were talking about it this morning a lot of freaks being like why do this why like there's other free privacy apps out there they're not really free right like signal depends on donations they just started accepting bitcoin donation i'm sure you have that on the list somewhere cross it off the list you cross it off the list no no it's on the list but now we've covered it so they have to monetize you like hoping people donate um and then telegram big article in the wall street

journal yesterday like they they're in a shit ton of debt if you don't remember they did an ico like a ton token that they had to shut down because the sec refunded yeah um now they're going to investors like jared leto uh and they have to go like raise a bunch of debt i believe between Well, they already raised from Leto. Leto or Leto? Yeah. The thing is, Telegram's weird

because they just haven't implemented a business model yet. There is no business model. Did you read the Wall Street Journal article? No, I kind of. Like I saw... They want to insert ads in public channels and then they have Apple and Google.

So first of all, I have a love-hate relationship with Telegram, okay? I think it's a really fantastic app. And and and he but it's obviously centralized. Right. And it's and the encryption is questionable on the secret chats and they don't have encryption by default. All that said, it's a very interesting situation he finds himself in because he made a lot of money. Durov made a lot of money on Russian Facebook, the Russian version of Facebook, and then got into a fight with Putin and was forced to sell his shares. And then when he left Russia, he created

Telegram, which is why one of my favorite pet theories is that was just all a manufactured fight between him and Putin. And really, it's a Russian state operation. But anyway, that's besides the point. Up until this point, they've never implemented a business model. But they have all of these public channels, like we said earlier, like crypto quantum stuff, where they have hundreds of thousands of viewers, right? Of viewers of those channels. And Durov has explicitly said multiple times that he doesn't want to do like what Facebook does and like troll people's messages and give them targeted ads. He doesn't want to monetize user attention and monetize user information. So what their path to monetization is, is he wants to give those

public channel creators right now if you if you look at some of these public channels they serve ads in the as a post they'll do like a sponsored post that pops up in the feed in the middle of the feed and they'll say this you know use our sponsor here the robe he wants to include it he wants to build it in and then take a cut so that any of those channels can add in ads if they want to and then he takes a cut which is a different business model than something like a facebook chat or like a Google yeah you're still

adding ads a lot of times but it's optional and it's the creator that's deciding yeah it's like what YouTube does

right here but obviously YouTube does way more tracking than Durov says it's going to do yeah if you're on YouTube

smash that subscribe button like we need to get I'm kidding big week Matt big week 200k by conference day are we going to make it well I don't know about that anymore huh hey

what happened yeah you know it would be a really fun two weeks if that fucking happens right that would be is bitcoin 2021 pivoting to just a huge struggle session alright I know you're behind

the scenes are they going to have like huge circular chairs where everybody can sit down and talk to each other I saw your tweet of you and Crypto Graffiti going back and forth on that. Yeah. And by the way, freaks, I may sneak into this wave every once in a while. I made the mistake of wearing a green shirt with a green screen. I mean, I don't think, you know, Bitcoin Twitter is, you know, a global support group.

It is a good way of putting it in general. But I mean, look at what happened. I mean, Bitcoin went down like 10K in like a matter of hours and then went back up 10K. And it felt like we went from panic to FOMO like within four hours or five hours. Like people have FOMO right now. I mean, I've had FOMO the whole fucking time, but people have had FOMO right now like pretty hard, it seems. um so i mean even if we're at like a humble you know 80k or like 90k by conference day i think like vibes will be high yeah i agree especially if we win the indy 500 if we win the indy 500

card number 21 like sky's the limit sunday memorial day put on the indy 500 and the lacrosse uh actually the final four will be over on saturday so there'll be lacrosse off day on sunday good day to watch the d500 i will happily admit that i was wrong about 200k by conference day when conference day happens but i want the record to show that tina was being too bearish i will not i will not uh apologize for that uh are we gonna force everybody to to spot buy bitcoin on stage this year i mean we won't force everyone but we'll peer pressure and encourage them to do it of course uh freaks we will be i don't think we've announced it but uh we're gonna be doing live rhr at the conference on the second day that's

saturday at noon during lunchtime we have a 90 minute slot um and we got like a great fucking setup so it's gonna be really fucking fun and we hope to see as many of you there as possible i mean i think it's gonna be like 11 000 people there so you know i i imagine we're gonna have thousands of freaks in attendance and i'm pretty excited for it damn pressure's on that uh we had are we gonna have guests on stage we're gonna go i think i like i like that we always do that for the conferences that we do uh like we'll have we'll have two or three guests i think two is the sweet spot we'll probably do two guests um i guess bit block boom yeah we had we had two up there i think we went up to three we had we had justin and we had vanju came up right yeah

Pierre and Michael weren't there this year we had Justin and Van Drew right yeah yeah those two yeah I like I like two as a as a target yeah I love the live shows they're always fun so freaks if you show up you might be one of the two you never know

the yeah I'm really excited for that Marty we have some person freak in the chat that says your your shirt is horrible so he just wants you to know that he doesn't like your shirt if you want i can just keep talking to freaks if you want to run and change your shirt real quick do you want me to just take it off it's up to you

i'm not gonna go full there is i'm gonna go get a new shirt but i think uh while we're at that there's a freak in the comments who has a good um good public service announcement for the bitcoin 2021 around wi-fi maybe talk about best opsec practices with your technology good idea yeah So we have Sam Bradbury in the comments that wants us to remind plebs to be wary of the Wi-Fi at the conference. The Bitcoin conference will be a hotspot for scammers trying to skim your data, logins, etc. Put your phone in a Faraday cage. Now, you know, not bringing a phone is obviously the most secure situation there. um there's a lot of thought being put into the wi-fi uh and there will be extensive wi-fi

throughout the premise for free provided to all users uh you know you're better off using cell data if you're going to use anything but regardless either way you should be running a vpn on your phone consider molvad.net i do like it the best um consider calyx os for your phone uh just in general, completely unrelated to the conference. But I think conference things, it's a sensitive topic, right? You're going to have 12,000 people there. It's going to be a Bitcoin event. Don't put yourself in vulnerable situations. Don't travel with Bitcoin. By all means, bring some spending cash on a mobile phone, on MoonWallet or something, so that you can pay people in Bitcoin for different things around the event. But you shouldn't be traveling with

or cold storage or any kind of significant amounts just in general you just shouldn't be traveling with sensitive information when you go through tsa or border especially for the international freaks that'll be coming you basically have no rights at that point and they can just take anything you have on you and just try and get into it so think about with your computer think about your phones um yeah and just in general you know you definitely don't want to use an open Wi-Fi hotspot without a VPN. This is bad practice. Yeah.

Don't have your mobile wallets loaded when you're coming. Just assume like you're going to get hacked. Go to the conference assuming that you're going to be hacked. I think that's the best way to put it. That's what I'm saying. If you have a million sats on a mobile wallet

so you can buy like swag and shit. Maybe like buy a beer for someone with lightning. what's the worst that could happen? You lose the $400. And at this rate, it'll only be worth $200 by the conference day.

$20K by conference day. Muggers throughout Miami disappointed by a recent Bitcoin crash. Maybe it is good. Maybe it is good. The price could dump even further. People won't want to mess with us because we're too poor.

Congrats on $1,000, Marty. Thank you. this one is an interesting one i didn't mean to get uh i didn't intend to get a little mushy with issue number 1000 but uh it went that way and i i've actually been very um uh overwhelmed i guess is a word to say with the response a lot of people on twitter and emailing back directly thank you freaks i love you all i hope uh the inception story of marty's bent um helps some of you it's that's one other thing i got a lot of emails I was like, hey, I'm in a similar spot.

I'm happy that you articulated that. Can you give the Freaks some context on how you weren't able to get a collar or a harness on a French bulldog? This was ultra embarrassing. So it was like one of those Uber dog walking services. I had to go to a WeWork in Dumbo. Was it like WAG or something?

I think it was WAG. And you had to get a... you had to get basically certified that you can put leash on different types of dogs. And I got to the French bulldog harness. This is ultra embarrassing because my sister and brother-in-law have a French bulldog that we've dog watched many times in the past for weeks on end. And I just sort of freaked out. It wasn't a live dog. They usually like walk into it and yeah,

I put it on backwards apparently and didn't get the dog walking job. So it was the lowest point of my life, Matt, walking out of that WeWork, being like, holy shit, I can't even get a dog walking job. So it was like their certification center or something? Yeah. It was like some 21-year-old hipster. And they had all these fake dogs of different sizes and different harnesses and stuff? Yeah. Yeah.

I failed. That's pretty funny. Funny. Well, thank you for sharing it with me and the freaks. Well, thank you guys for reading. that's why i keep coming back thousand issues down many more to come hopefully definitely how's your week going sir you know those harnesses are they're kind of a bit like i i have two dogs and they both have harnesses they're kind of a bitch to put on especially you can get confused

if you have a clip in the wrong place and stuff yeah it's not it seems a little bit unfair yeah yeah i mean i'm already in sunny florida and i'm super excited for miami next week uh you're already in sunny florida lucky you i'm in my flight up a day i'm gonna be arriving on wednesday now but before that it's memorial day weekend at the jersey shore brother you got out of town too early vibes are high down here well memorial day weekend i'm going to be spending in indianapolis oh you're watching us win that race so you're down to florida up to indy back to florida couldn't help myself god bless you are you like in the box yeah boss you know when jack invites you you have no choice you just got to put down everything make it happen you got to go

We got to go. We need all the freaks to pressure the Bitcoin exchanges. The only one so far that has contributed any funds to the Bitcoin IndyCar is Sam from FTX. The shitcoin are beating you to it. I mean, he always puts up. Right. You got to give him that.

Did he wind up going on consensus last night with Tom Brady? Or would that be tonight? I don't know. I didn't watch any of Consensus. I know you were on it. You didn't watch my panel, Matt? No, but you got quoted everywhere. That was fun. Well, when we did the live RH on Miami,

we knew the big news and we kept it to ourselves. And we couldn't talk about it. I mean, we told the freaks to stack, but that's as much as we could say. Yeah, that's all we could say. It was worthwhile. Hey, it was good stacking advice. I think we're higher than where we were on Saturday

when we record it. Yeah, I mean, I'm... I mean, the freaks know I'm always bullish, right? But this is the single biggest news item. The single biggest historical event that has happened on a macro level to Bitcoin ever in the history of Bitcoin, right? Outside of Satoshi leaving, yes.

I would... Like outside of the Bitcoin network itself, somebody adopting it, number one. I mean, like, external of the protocol. It is, like, the biggest thing since Satoshi left, in my opinion. We'll get into it. But before we get into it, should we reminisce about last weekend? What's the...

You went all caps on the tweet. I did. I did. I'm feeling it. I was. I mean, there's a lot of important things to talk about. I'm going to talk about the volcano in the background here. Is that the actual volcano, or is that just a stock picture? It's a volcano in El Salvador.

I'm not sure if it's the volcano where they're doing the geothermal energy. But it is located in El Salvador. Yes, I believe this is the volcano in Santa Ana or something like that. Santa An. What's the Bitcoin Magazine team saying after the conference? Dude, vibes are high. Vibes are high. I mean, a lot of lessons can be learned.

But I think overall, it was just a really fantastic, I would call it a festival. I think it was more of a music festival than anything else. Agreed. But look, it was amazing seeing so many freaks there. I mean, for the live show, my guess was like 400 to 500 people were watching us live in person. I must have hugged like 2,000 freaks

over the course of the week. To me, it was a massive success, right? Wouldn't you agree, Marty? I think it was a massive success. I had a lot of fun. I always enjoy meeting you freaks in person. Overwhelming. There's a lot of you freaks out there.

Freak Nation is strong. as we've been saying since we left Miami. It extremely warms my heart meeting you guys in person and that our content has affected people or resonates with people the way it does. It's really mind-blowing to think of this just starting as, I don't want to say a joke, but as I got forced into the podcast, I forced you in for Rabbit Hole Recap.

I would say you more seduced me, But if you want to use that verbiage, you can as well. Yeah, seduce is better than force. There's a bit of a rapey vibe. There was consent. There was consent. There was. Thank you for clarifying that.

I've just been holding Matt hostage for two years now. Have somebody who sits behind the computer with a gun pointed at him and says, That's why I got the Moscow time behind me. Yeah, it was a great event. Great satellite events. Vibes were high. Miami traffic was terrible but other than that

it was pretty pretty incredible I will be incessant and repetitive that the most profound thing of the whole week

to me was Ross's interview Ross Ulbrich's interview we have to free Ross we have to stand together as big corners

and if you haven't gone and listened to it you really need you really need to go listen to it every single every single freak

should Every single person, but every single freak needs to go listen to that interview. Yeah, I mean, he sacrificed himself to get that message out there. He got thrown into solitary confinement, which he talked about during the voicemail. So it seems that the... So as punishment, first they gave approval to do the interview and they said it had to be with a journalist. and then they cut him off from communication for like five days

and we thought it wasn't going to happen. And then it happened. They like allowed him to contact Peter Chihuahua of Bitcoin Magazine who did the interview. And then it appears afterwards as punishment for the live interview going out. They threw him back into solitary and it was really fucked up

because we didn't know like, We didn't want to talk about it at the conference because we thought maybe he'd get punished more. But I guess for better or worse, Lynn Ulbricht, his mom, decided that it was important that it became public. So I saw that she tweeted it out. So I feel comfortable talking about it now

that she tweeted it out. But that's why it was played a second time at the end of the conference on the second day. It was because we had found out while we were there. I mean, Lynn told me personally, and it just was fucking... This is brutal, man. There's no heart there.

None. None at all. Go listen to the interview. I mean, I can't do it justice, but a combination of holy shit, I can't believe this guy's in jail considering the facts that he's laying out about his particular case

and how there was a lot of fuckery that went on from the prosecution side. By the way, Katie Hahn, she's still in the space. She works at A16Z. She's on Coinbase's board From what I understand She was the prosecutor in that

She gets away She's able to like walk free And go invest in companies And work for Anderson Horowitz All that bullshit So We got people in the comments saying it's the murder for hire They dropped those charges man

That was a smear job They didn't He didn't get convicted on any kind of murder charges Or any kind of hit charges They dropped all of that shit go read we're gonna talk about it up on it yeah it's like the typical fbi fucking bullshit what's the word i'm looking for where they they basically create a scenario in which they make somebody a criminal they did this

in florida with i believe it was a gentleman who had asperger's was on some random internet forum and they convinced him to go buy bombs to blow up and basically create a terrorist plot that the FBI created so they could arrest terrorists. They created one out of thin air and convinced him to go buy a bomb and allegedly try to blow it up somewhere.

And they arrested him where they concocted that whole situation. And I think it's very similar with the hits. It may even be more egregious than that. Yeah, that's the number one thing people...

Because I wrote a newsletter about it earlier this week after seeing Lynn's tweet from the Free Ross account saying we need to speak up against this bullshit and you all have to go listen to the interview and all the comments were like, murder for hire. It's effective.

It's super effective. It's like you pop out the headline in the beginning, you do a character assassination and it sticks. It's the same thing with all fake news. It's way more difficult to battle back against it after it's already out there in the general consciousness. And just to be clear here,

I'm not saying no crimes are committed, but he's done a shit ton of time. He was a young kid. He's apologetic. They're making an example out of him. They're going to keep him in there for the rest of his fucking life if they have their way. And they're going to put him in solitary at the same time. This is just not the country that it's supposed to be. And as Americans and as Bitcoiners, we need to stand together on this one. It's very important. I'm sorry that we started this off on this, but it's super fucking important.

No. It's really important. What are we in this for? Yeah. If you listen to the interview, Ross was very I don't want to say disappointed in himself, but he was very reflective

of what he did, the impact it had on others, his family. in his thinking back then when he was running the Silk Road. Go listen to it. That's all we're going to say. We'll end it at that. Hey, how about Max's performance?

So maybe we can sidebar here, talk about Bitcoin 2021 again. What did you think about the no-coiners, shit-coiners saying that it was a cringe fest? Was it a cringe fest? I didn't think so. Did you think it was a cringe fest? Oh, no.

Look, I mean, honestly Honestly, like I didn't like how much Shaquan Uri was in the sponsorships But I don't know if you can throw an event of that size Without some Without some, you know, questionable Not, quote-unquote, pure sponsors, right?

I mean, like the Bitcoin-only companies are extremely long-term focused and very frugal and don't really want to sponsor these kind of things, at least not to a high degree. They won't spend like the big bucks on it. The content lineup could have been better, but I think it was a pretty solid content lineup and you take what you can get.

You know, you don't, we've seen some horrible, like look at my, like, I mean, am I just, am I making excuses? Maybe a little bit, but like consensus is fucking horrible, man. it's like so it's so bad they're

and it's like completely pay to play yeah it's not gonna be like a BitBlock boom or like a Riga where it's like 200-400 people

I agree like Kevin O'Leary gets on the main stage Kevin O'Leary Mayweather the Mayweather one was super cringe Mayweather only talks

about himself in the third person Mayweather this Mayweather that yeah that was pretty brutal it was that woman interviewing him

Voorhees should not have been there Voorhees go fuck himself They put him on right after the toxic Maximalism you know Yeah yeah you had a comment What would you say to Eric Voorhees I mean I think you just said something but

I mean Eric Bitcoin made you You have a shit ton of Bitcoin When was the last thing you did for Bitcoin Do something for Bitcoin man It's like It's been like 8 years since he's done something For Bitcoin he sold satoshi dice for what like 200 000 bitcoin it's like it's all public knowledge

it's out there isn't that a scam would you consider that a scam what hawking off satoshi dice for no that's good business that he deserves all the credit for that in the world he did it right before fees rose he made it completely worthless and he did it all in Bitcoin like a fucking smart man we'll give you that Eric but so let's explain Satoshi Dice for the newer freaks

who may not know what it is you want me to go? so Satoshi Dice was basically an online dice game where you would try to guess what you would roll right? the cool part was

any game previously on the internet you had to trust the operator and the operator could fuck you right but what was cool about satoshi dice was it was provably fair so it used the fucking block hash so like you the numbers that one or not you knew were real because you could just check the bitcoin blockchain yeah um groundbreaking literally ground it was groundbreaking in terms of provably fair online gambling hadn't really existed previously um but it relied on super low fees and it was um it relied on on super low fees and it was completely priced out like right after he sold

it because they were like basically i mean it wasn't spam because they were paying fees but they were spamming the blockchain for a period there the overwhelming majority of bitcoin transactions were satoshi dice transactions yes i got up to like 70 percent of the amount of transactions at one point pivotal part of bitcoin's history satoshi dice eric vorhees love him or hate him and then so he sold that and then he switched into shapeshift shapeshift fucking profited off all the shit coins until he had to bend the knee and do kyc so he had a one-two punch really quick one-two punch that he just made a shit ton of money on and then since then

he switched it all over to ETH now it's all ETH based so he could get rid of KYC because as soon as he added KYC it destroyed his business and to be clear he was like always like super anti-state

but as soon as like they fucking came down on him he had to add KYC which I assume he tried his best on that but at the end of the day like dude hasn't fucking done shit for Bitcoin for like

eight years nine years so he shouldn't be at a Bitcoin conference period has he not done anything or is he like actively wouldn't you say shitcoin is actively attacking it that's a good question i don't think maybe it's an attack i think it's a weak attack because i don't think shitcoins will ever be

bitcoin but it's like that whole line he attacks bitcoins on twitter and shit he makes his whole narrative about attacking bitcoiners toxic maximalist let the free right it's like well yes the free market is deciding we'll continue to decide that's a classic shitcoiner tactic let the free market decide i believe in free markets too i don't believe in selling at your audience exactly and part of the free market is calling the shit out right so i mean i was waiting to talk about this because we have one more topic um that i wanted to talk about we get that topic later because it's not as important it's whatever topic did breed love disappoint you well i didn't know we were going to talk about this we have to talk about this the

freaks demand we talk about this this is a very important topic yeah that was his tweet that was his tweet it's pretty obvious i'm curious what the free market thinks about insert shit coin here it's pretty obvious that bit cloud is an overt scam i mean just the way it's so fucking obvious it's like james press which called them out months ago for storing private keys on their servers like if you forget about the private keys the private keys on the servers is an operational clusterfuck right like that's that is just immature amateur hour but even if they did private keys perfectly. Even if their private

key execution was perfect, it's fucked. Yeah, I agree. I agree. What's our first principles? BitClout. Should it exist? No. You shouldn't have a social media network built on a blockchain. You shouldn't have a token per influencer. Again, this

sort of piggybacks on the Voorhees thing. The reason I'm what someone would define as a Bitcoin maximalist, a dirty maximalist, because I'm true, truly believe having done the research and thinking I have a good grasp of monetary economics I think

we're trying to get away from a barter economy and that's what a token economy represents is bartering tokens and that's only part of it like other parts of it is most of the tokens that are spun up have centralized

figures that create them that are going to benefit greatly from their success and BitClout is no different. All the elements

of BitClout are like... Why BitClout? That was my question. I was like, you're going to go with BitClout, bro? I think someone got to him

at the conference, man. I think he decided to sell it to his audience. So the... What I've heard too, like other people think about doing similar things

that would surprise some people is that if you do a tweet like that with the link to your BitClout... No, he didn't unlock it yet. You can get access.

You can tell if he unlocked it yet. The only way to unlock it is if you do a specific tweet to your BitClout. Yeah. And so the theory is there is that you'll see some people doing stuff like that so they can get $5,000 worth of Bitcoin on BitClout and liquidate it. So first of all, if you did any research, you can't get shit out of BitClout right now, which is one of the reasons it's a scam.

It's a one-way market. You can buy BitClout, but you can't get out. You can't trade BitClout for Bitcoin to get out. so you can't even get out even if you wanted to but it's so I have a tweet from March

like if you just do a cursory look at the fucking website you can tell it's just the worst fucking scam of scams it's it's a coin of shit coins his name's like Nadir N-A-D-E-R he came from like Princeton I'm pretty sure he's like part of

Basis Protocol like serial scammer like the the the difference is almost a perfect example between bitcoiners and shit corners the comparison between sphinx chat and sphinx relay open source on lightning with no pre-mined token versus value for value versus bit cloud with pre-mined tokens trying to get influencers and having all these influencer plays whether you'd like trick them you know you like convince them you incentivize them you incentivize them into getting pre-mined tokens to shill your shit on twitter and you create accounts for them ahead of time both of us have accounts that were created

for us ahead of time that we haven't activated that are just sitting on the platform and they threaten us like if we get rid of them like an imposter is just going to come in and take them i haven't even checked my big cloud profile have you well so i'm actually in a dicey situation because I switched to at Odell. So someone has the at Odell on BitClout, but the at Matt under dash Odell still sits there. Obviously, I've never activated it.

I would never sell out our audience. I would never sell out my people. I would rather fucking die than sell out my people. And I expect you guys to keep me honest. I don't want like I'm not you shouldn't trust me on that. I expect you to fucking keep me honest.

But that's why I'm fucking here. And this is why it fucking pisses me off so fucking much because we've been here for such a long fucking time. And I see so many fucking people, even so-called Bitcoiners fucking constantly selling out other Bitcoiners. And it pisses me off because it's a bad look on our whole tribe.

You know, it's a bad look on us as a community. And I know Beautyon will say, oh, there's no Bitcoin community. These are my people. These are our people, you know? Well, what do I tell you? Like, all fair, a lot. Blinders. Like, we need to like racehorse blinders.

We just need to stay in our lane, keep doing what we're doing, and worry about all that other shit. People are going to fall. They're going to rise. They're going to fall. And that's something we try to do here at Freaks is just stay true to why we got into this in the first place.

I like to think that we're principled. We are upfront with you guys and we disclaim as much as we have to and need to to stay pure in your eyes. I mean not even to stay pure in your eyes true to ourselves like it is fucked it's sad to see it's like

I don't feel compelled like I don't feel I feel lucky I guess I'll say this I feel lucky because I don't think I'll ever be in a situation where I'll be tweeting that stuff out like I'm gonna

stay humble stack sats I guess that's what I'll say to that is like i feel lucky that i don't feel literally an ounce of pressure to do something like that again maybe it's just because of my conviction in bitcoin and the belief that this is going to be a winner take all type of market you can't replicate bitcoin's uh immaculate conception you can't run everything on a blockchain nor do you need to it doesn't make sense to do social media on the blockchain at all doesn't make sense to have a token for everything maybe it's that but yeah i don't see myself ever if you ever see me tweeting something like that there there's

situations there's situations where especially newcomers come in and they're confused they're confused they think we're gonna live in this like multi-coin crypto world with all these different digital assets and shit that is fucking one thing okay breed love spent fucking years cultivating this fucking affinity scam he cultivated this idea of like a bitcoin only thing spent three hours on lex friedman talking philosophy about fucking bitcoin and shit super successful businessman super successful bitcoiner yada yada yada and then he fucking does this and he doesn't even fucking admit he's wrong he fucking doubles down on it he goes i will die on this hill fucking Jack Mauler said he would die on this hill

because fucking governments are going to come after him because he convinced a nation state to adopt Bitcoin as a legal tender. And two days later, you're going to say you're going to die on the fucking bit clout hill. Are you fucking kidding me? That's fucking ridiculous. This is 2021. This should not still be happening at this point.

Yeah, no, I agree. I mean, somebody talked to Brie Love at length, I believe Friday or Saturday night. It was just like, a shit it's like are you a clout but i completely co-sign it yeah it's a there are people with much more on the line putting their necks way further out that are truly the embodiment of the integrity

necessary to bring this forward and uh yeah it's tough to see is it an affinity scam do you build that like it's it's a prime example if let's see and maybe there's room for redemption here but if not like you can spend years building up a reputation but it takes literally one tweet to destroy it that's all it takes that's one thing you should be hyper aware of um if you're in the space and keep keep people hold people accountable us put us on like a higher threshold of accountability if anything um yeah it's fucked dude it sucks to say it sucks yeah i agree like came out of nowhere built up a great brand um you can lose it in an instant you can lose it in a tweet i guess that's the lesson to

learn from this you look angry right now are you okay over there you didn't lose it in a fucking tweet it was it was calculated and you fucking doubled down the lesson isn't you don't lose it in a tweet. You lose it because you fucking have no integrity whatsoever. Reputation's fucking everything in this new world. That's true. Family's fucking everything. He gets his way in these things, man.

People wonder. They're like How? How? People wonder like why Bitcoiners get angry. The dude from CNBC South Africa. Blinders. This is why it's like blinders. This shit happens literally every cycle. We can go back to Ryan Kelly's

Shilling Nautilus coin on CNBC in 2013, 2014. People are like, this is stupid. It just happens every cycle. Yeah, but there's new freaks that aren't aware who Brock is, who this is, and they're learning experiences,

right? So we should be focused. We shouldn't... Life is short. you shouldn't let it hurt you but definitely should let her you but these are educational experiences and and i think you know there's a there's a place both on bitcoin twitter in individual communities meetups telegram groups rhr this podcast where we talk about these things as educational experiences right these are these are these are learning lessons yes um and every

time a Bitcoiner does something good, there's a thousand fucking scam corners waiting in the winds to take advantage of that opportunity. And we're always up against it. And you have to be active. You have to be actively. And I know this for a fact. Then when our boy Jack Mallers was talking to the president of El Salvador, like he warned him ahead of time. And because you have to, right? You have to be like, look, as soon as this legal tender bill comes out, Tron is going to build a headquarters there Balaji is going to tell you to do El Salvador coin you know Brock Pierce is going to come

with his official delegation it happens every fucking time and if you're prepared then maybe you can stop some of the pain maybe you can stop some of the hurt but ultimately the majority of people are going to have to touch the fucking stove and learn from that yes and don't let it distract

from what you have in front of you to accomplish on an individual basis than Bitcoin is to be successful. Just focus on that. And that's why I said in the newsletter, me personally,

I have insane confidence that Bitcoin's going to succeed seeing what's happening in the mining space alone. So just blinders on. It's only going to get louder, especially if price goes up. So Marty,

do you think it's a coincidence that fucking Big Cloud got listed on its first exchange this week? no it would be a very interesting coincidence could be you see Breedlove says he's still investigating

he hasn't made his decision yet on BitClout is he trolling though? is that like a trolling response? no way did you see Brian Armstrong open his BitClout yes I did see that he's got 4 million dollars with the Brian Armstrong tokens

you see Coinbase added Shiba Inu token I saw that regulated a regulated Bitcoin exchange that's selling surveillance software

to the US government added Shibu Inu token hey that's what you're able to hawk when you give all the information

to the government the thing is I see where you're coming from I know exactly where you're coming from if we don't call out our own who the fuck are we

we have to call them out but like the point I'm trying I think with the energy stuff I was and again I wrote that letter

to myself today because like the energy stuff has been exhausting the last six months like consistently talking about it's like

in my mind it's like alright blinders like everybody's made their decision it's like see you on the field like just wasting time

did you see Lex Friedman Charles Hawkinson longest podcast five hours why do you spend five hours with Hawkinson dude is he 33

he looks like he's if you needed proof that Lex Friedman's an idiot pretending to be a smart person There's your fucking proof I was like holding back

Because he talks so fucking slow But damn man Clearly a fucking dumbass Well if you talk slow Does it make you Seem smarter Lex is going to have to live with that for the rest of his life On his podcast there's going to be a five hour fucking episode

With Charles Hoskinson Did you listen to it Of course not I can only imagine what they talked about I think I saw one clip where Charles just contradicted himself within the span of three seconds. I think that's the tweet I saw. Apparently

he said Bitcoiners have been calling it digital gold, but now called it store value and not realizing that gold is a store value. But yeah, no, it's... Again, it's only going to get louder. Charles Hoskinson, Vitalik, Brock Pierce, they're

all going to be around. Because remember CNBC South Africa came out and that dude just had a bunch of shit coiners and you're yeah sure he's gonna be back crypto man ran yeah i mean cnbc though cnbc proper the only responsible thing is to diversify into 100 different shit tokens well dude it's crazy that cnbc still lets brian um kelly talk about anything outside of bitcoin because he did an auto list coin in 2014 2015 and then he like told noobs how to market by ripple literally at the all-time high in 2017.

Three years later, pushing more people into another scam. One thing I would say, though, is and maybe I know I'm a broken record freak. This shit's bullish as fuck. A five-hour podcast with

Charles Hoskinson on Fake PhD Man over there, that is bullish. That is extremely bullish. He got a ton of engagement off of it. He thinks he's the coolest man ever interviewing the founder of Cardano. Dude, that is like the number one shit coin.

People ask me, what do you think about Cardano? I don't think about Cardano. It's getting repetitive now too. A lot of noobs are getting fucking washed up into it, Marty. Yeah. Yeah, it's fascinating. It's perplexing.

It's cheap. It's a unit bias bullshit. How do so many people know about cardano like i don't see like an immense amount of cardano shilling my every day where's that happening i don't know where is that happening and what is being said that's what that's what i'm interested to find out it's definitely on binance wouldn't be a surprise and it and it's probably on coinbase it might not be on coinbase because the vcs didn't get into it and coinbase usually only

lists things that the VCs want to dump on retail, which is why they didn't have Dogecoin until like a couple weeks ago. Yeah. I mean, that's the play, right? The VCs just get in early. Their bags aren't pumped well enough. Like, alright, Coinbase

launch it. Let's rip. Rip dump. Who cares about Shiba Inu coin? What is the value prop? It's the token. It's not even it's not even a proper shit coin it's like an NFT

no it's just like an ERC 20 token or maybe it's on Binance chain I don't even know I assume it's an ERC 20 token because I don't think Coinbase lists Binance chain tokens but I don't even fucking know anymore it makes me feel like such a

boomer sometimes I was going to say we are the biggest boomers in the space probably I wear that with pride okay I'm happy to be a millennial boomer I like that hat is that a new hat now this has had this worn in on a couple live streams but yeah i'm uh very uh getting close like peak butthole surfer right now um it's that time of the year down the shore where just put a t-shirt shorts don't put don't put flip-flops on even i like your i like your

background how are you able to breathe on the moon without an oxygen tank it's uh a feat of human ingenuity the moon isn't real i'm here to tell all the freaks we made it up the earth is flat the moon doesn't exist you're in a pod right now um cheers to ride or die freak kita uh who lets us know from wikipedia that shiba inu is an erc20 token on the ethereum blockchain and is based on dogecoin it brands itself quote unquote the dogecoin killer coinbase are you buying coinbase to stock are you buying coin short it i mean don't short it just buy bitcoin don't turn to zero in terms of bitcoin don't short it it's not financial advice don't short any equities or anything just fucking all clown

market just buy bitcoin stay humble and stack stats agreed mayor front runner he seems to want to make new york a bitcoin city dude doesn't even know what bitcoin is he just was saying buzzwords yeah he's like we're gonna bring bitcoin people like don't don't what people say doesn't matter what they do matters more yes yes just uh judge you know i'll believe it when i say it what they do not know what they say the good thing is at least it's like a positive buzzword talking point now right and he could have said blockchain or crypto or digital assets and he said bitcoin um i think he specifically said bring bitcoins to new york it doesn't even make any sense grammatically.

But at least it's a buzzword, I guess. We have that going for us. We got the buzzword. Bitcoin is a buzzword. Is it a trigger word? I guess that's a question. I still think the plural of Bitcoin is Bitcoin.

It's Bitcoins. Yeah, no, we disagree on that. This is one of the important debates of our time. I think we disagree on it at least bi-weekly. On how that works. I buy Bitcoins bi-weekly. You buy Bitcoin bi-weekly?

I buy Bitcoins bi-weekly on the cash. I stack multiple Bitcoins. Just kidding. I wish. That would be dope. Iran. I think sats is plural. It's not sat.

It's sats. Yeah. You know, 43 million sats, but 0.43 Bitcoin or 143 million sats, 0.43 Bitcoin. 100 million sats is one Bitcoin. 200 million sats is two Bitcoins. It's very simple. Very simple. It's very straightforward, Matt.

I don't see how you can. What is 1.2345 Bitcoin? It's 100 million. That's not my point. 123 million sats is 1.23 Bitcoin 43 million sats is 0.43 Bitcoin

no it'd be 1 Bitcoin so it'd be 1 Bitcoin 200 or 23 million sats or whatever what was that? it'd be 1 Bitcoin 23 million sats and if you get to like 200

if you get 2.3 that's how we're going to pronounce it? We got to work this out. The decimals, because of the decimals, it just makes more sense if it's just Bitcoin. Okay. All right. And also, it's just better for op sex sakes too,

especially as the price continues to go up. That's true. Yeah. And I'm sorry if you could hear my son crying. I hear him a little bit. I'm not sure what's going on. Can you hear the storm that's going on outside right now? I heard a little rumble.

And now I'm worried I'm sitting outside. Is it going to come get me? I'm trying to theoretically, I'm trying to mute on point. No, you're fine. You're fine. Is it like pouring there? Yeah, it's pretty bad. Shit.

I got all my... Hey, babe. Yeah. Can you shut the door, please? Picking you up on the mic. What's our next topic? Former CFTC advocate advocates for a bit. He's not a CFTC advocate.

He worked for the CFTC. He's the chair, a chair. Yeah, he's advocating for a Bitcoin ETF. This is a Bloomberg article, and I have exceeded my Bloomberg article limit for the month, and I refuse to subscribe. I will, Bloomberg, if you're listening, Michael, I will pay.

enabled paywalls. You can get through the Bloomberg paywall with an archive link. Yeah, an archive link. But you didn't provide that for me. But from what I remember people talking about ex-CFTC

chair. Was it Gene Carla? Who was it? No, no, no. He was Jay Clayton. No, no. It wasn't him either. Timothy Massad. Okay.

Massad. Interesting last name there. With an A. Okay. Just one letter off. What's the gist of it since I haven't read the article yet? I mean...

I don't know. He's just like, we should have an ETF. Yeah. It's pretty straightforward. You can just read the headline. Yeah. I'm like so jaded by ETF talk

after years of ETF talk. It's like, all right. You say it time and time again. BTC is the ETF, obviously. I mean people were like pumping off of it or whatever they were tweeting about it how many times we have to learn the ETF

which is why I put it on the list remember like the Winkle loss what was the beginning of 2017 when everybody was like yep we're getting an ETF in three weeks there was ETF talk in the 2013 pump yeah yeah I mean look fuck the ETF

I'm glad that we haven't had the ETF yet yeah me as well It's ridiculous that I both agree that it's ridiculous that we don't have an ETF and that it's actually kind of a blessing in disguise that we don't yet. Because it forces people to at least use a little bit more sovereign methods of buying Bitcoin than just buying the ETF. How much supply do you think an ETF launched? What do you mean? How much would it take?

Well, imagine if it were launched in 2013. Imagine if it were launched in 2017. It would take so much. look at gbtc gbtc is a shitty fucking product it's not even a real etf and it's taken up so much bitcoin yeah it just can't it's like i mean recently it's been going down but in general it's just a straight line up yeah yeah it's uh but like now that's like an interesting thought experiment to have like the more this etf gets delayed for whatever reasons like does that equate to that ETF amassing the last

Bitcoin? Do we want the ETF to be launched at the last possible moment? I think you can make the argument for that. That would make sense. Imagine if it was launched in 2013 and then went to the 2015 bull cycle and that ETF was just scooping up $250

Bitcoin. Yeah, I mean, if you think it's bad that MicroStrategy has 100,000 Bitcoin, it'd be way worse if there was an ETF. But, I mean, even as it stands, like what, Coinbase has a million and a half Bitcoin or something like that. I mean, I'm not looking at the numbers right now in their custody and there's no ETF involved there. The good thing is we're not proof of stake,

right? If you have more Bitcoin, it doesn't give you more power over the network. You can dump the price if you sell it. But I mean, the proof of stake proponents should be more worried about you know what these centralizing factors have have to deal with in terms of ownership at least yeah yeah matt are you are you monero shill no i'm not uh if anything uh that influencer who's calling me out shows it more than i do but uh i'm waiting for him to increase his bounty that's why i didn't answer that narrow is clearly a shit point yeah i've said many fucking times well Well, people ran with that tweet that you put right before Dispatch. Oh, that was a trigger tweet for Dispatch too.

Yeah, yeah. They thought you were shilling Monero. But if you actually comprehended the reading comprehension of the tweet, you're just saying, hey, don't get mad. Get even by competing. I'm in the unique position where the status Bitcoin influencers don't like me and the Monero stans don't like me either.

It's a great position to be in. uh i'm i i don't know if i'm in a similar position but i'm definitely in a position where i think a lot a lot of the statists are not happy with me there comes a point where it's you know like i don't block people so they can you know they they can run around in my comments if they want to run around in my comments but i'm not going to engage with someone uh that continuously acts in bad faith and has zero respect for me whatsoever so like uh if if you're wondering why i don't respond to certain people um it's because they can simply go fuck themselves and uh there's there's never enough for them they'll never be quenched you know i i could say whatever i want

to i could say exactly what they want to say and they'll still they'll still be you know making up baseless accusations um so like that's just exhausting there's not enough time in the day to deal with that shit well that's why i take the exact opposite approach and i i block liberally because I just don't have the mental time to expend mental work on trolls and other people. It clears your headspace too. I really recommend it. No blocking.

I block. That's why we come here. That's why we meet here. Different perspectives. My very good friend, Matt O'Dell. Matt, how the hell are we doing? What's up, good friend, Marty Bent? good friend great friend incredible friend brother how are we describing our relationship

who knows i've been up since 4 30 a.m i woke up in miami took an uber to fort lauderdale took a flight to atlantic city i've been putzing around all day trying to get my energy back and why'd you fly out of fort lauderdale instead of miami it's just much more convenient with atlantic city oh it's there was no miami to atlantic city no no we don't get those direct flights atlantic city must be a shithole fucking airport it's not necessarily a shithole it's very small doesn't have everything you'd want it is convenient like the uh walk from the front door through security to the gate is very short because it's small yeah likewise when you get off the plane not a lot of walking not too busy at any point lord lord of dale is pretty small

airport too it's bigger than atlantic city and that's way smaller than miami yeah i've never even flown into miami every time i go down there i fly from atlantic city and into fort lauderdale it's not bad 4 30 in the morning the uber from miami to fort lauderdale was uh like 25 30 minutes wasn't that bad i was pleasant i was pleasantly surprised by miami airport i flew up uh for bitcoin 2021 i flew back from miami yeah actually i actually yeah i i went to indian back and then flew about so I was there three times it was a good airport the whole

mask thing in the airports is just infuriating really is I ripped it off this morning as soon as I I got off the plane like walked through the thing and got to the gate ticketing booth in the one spirit representative

was like sir please put your mask on in the airport and I just completely ignored her and kept walking the freaks uh no i don't really need that much of an excuse but it's turned me as a traveler into way more of an alcoholic than i was before because the bars are like the mask free zone yes so you just as soon as i get through security i just go sit at the bar and i just fucking pound drinks until like 10 minutes before boarding closes five minutes before boarding closes and i just get on the plane and then as soon as drink service goes i just start drinking

again yeah the uh the ways in which you try to avoid the mask in the airport on the plane on the plane this morning i was tired i wanted to go to sleep obviously mask on hurts of breathing so i just pulled my hat down like this and just hit put my mask under under my mouth it's so fucking ridiculous i had to hide the fact that i had my mask down like using my hat just so i could breathe correctly federal crime literally federal crime i'll tell spirit i did this they You might make them at me for being a viral terrorist, if you will. It's crazy. It's ramping back up.

It's ramping back up. Delta Bear. Should we launch an airfare-focused podcast that we just talk about traveling on planes? Traveling on planes, our experiences. I hate airports. They're just getting worse and worse. Ooh, way there. We'll get to Bitcoin eventually, but I have to tell you.

uh the way to miami monday morning ac to fort lauderdale going through security and ac i had to go through the scanner and i had uh shorts on with um uh with a tie like what is a tie rope what the fuck is it what am i thinking belt not a belt but strings that i tied into oh like the elastic not elastic it was it was strings i had strings that i tied and so like it was like a little bulky in the front of my shorts and i go to that fucking scanner whenever i get through that scanner i give the double bird because it's just when there's boys you're supposed to put your hands up or whatever this boy's my displeasure with the whole process because it's all bullshit but i get out and uh i'm like waiting to see and nothing in my pockets nothing and just like

my whole dick area is red he's like sir i'm with the pat pat down your groin i was like are you fucking kidding me and like the the guy next to him and then like i was just wearing shorts no underwear i was wearing flip-flops on the plane i was like barefoot like a t-shirt and he's sure it seems like i'm about to run i'll have to pat down your groin i was like are you fucking kidding me and the guy like next to him he was like all right no need to no need to get angry sir like step back in we'll see if like something happens i go back in nothing it's like what the fuck is this process what is going on here well the original he was ready to like grab my dick too i was like get the fuck away from me the the original design of the machines if i recall

correctly was it was actually like would show like an x-ray image but for privacy preserving uh concerns now it just shows like uh a heat like a square like it'll show a square like this area is concerning but they don't actually see like an they supposedly don't see like an x-ray image of your junk i'm surprised you don't get more trouble for flipping the bird when you go through i do they some not they don't always catch it sometimes they will be like hey that wasn't and cool there's kids here and i'm like fuck you i hate you have no rights in the airport whatsoever i hate tsa i hate that whole process am i just a contrarian that hates everything that that is mainstream maybe no i mean the tsa is just fucking it's a bunch of mouthwriters like

they waste us a shit ton of time they waste us a shit ton of time ton of money and it's not really actually effective at you know preventing terrorism i mean we saw i mean in general terrorism seems to have subdued but we even saw for a little bit there we saw bombings just happened on the opposite side of the tsa line right they had that massive bombing in uh what was i think it was belgium where it was on the other side it was it was they bombed the people waiting on line yeah just just next time you're in the airport if you've never thought of this just look at the tsa uh employees and think to yourself like is this really the last line of defense that's going to save save us from a terrorist attack well i would just push back

well i agree that's probably not but i would push back at being angry at the actual employees like they have a shit fucking job they do um they do like their power trip too and some of them some of them do but i feel like most of them are just they know they have a shit job and they just do it every day and they take your shit job and they and they focus their anger and angst about that shit job on the people that are being cattle herded through their process that's like yeah if you're going to take this job don't take it out of me when you're angry you're frustrated and you're not like that could work somewhere else the tsa is actually it's kind of relevant right because it's a perfect example of using fear for government overreach and then that never

getting rolled back right and this is kind of what we're seeing happening with covid like i most of the shit that's getting implemented i'd be very surprised if it ever gets rolled back It's just going to get worse and worse. Yeah. These temporary agencies, solutions are never very temporary.

We're 20 years into the TSA in their current form and they're restrictive. Think about how much time is wasted in those fucking lines and that whole process. It's incredible. Incredibly

depressing. Yeah. Not temporary. Two weeks to flatten the curve. Guess what? LA, mass back on. Austin, thinking about mass back on. Delta variant, cases up.

It's coming. It's coming. If you're vaccinated, you're 100% safe, except for all these people who've got COVID and died from it after being double-vaxxed. It's crazy, the discrepancy of messaging across the world. You have Israel, something like 64% of hospitalizations our people have been double vaxxed

similarly in the UK and then like here in America somehow the statistics are like 100% of the people who are hospitalized because COVID right now are unvaccinated it's like definitely bullshit I think Israel like closed their borders even to

vaccinating people now and Sydney's going back into lockdown did you see the video clip of them and Sydney talking about using financial surveillance to enforced lockdowns yep yep they're gonna track your they're gonna track businesses and debit card transactions to make sure people aren't going out and eating they'll know the dystopia again we we mentioned this last week in the tone of last week's rip was very

unemotional i don't want to say unemotional but very serious i would say um because i think we both agreed that it feels like a palpable escalation of authoritarian narratives and attempts to clamp down on the populace has picked up in the last couple months and it's accelerating and i would i would argue that trend continued over the last seven days since we last met yeah i i feel like it's heating up right i don't know i am i i maybe i just have a constant bias about these things um but it it it feels like uh yeah i don't know i don't know man it's like you you it just it's i've i've i feel in my normie circles um a lot of a lot of you know resurgence in like the covid fear tactics and as a result

i expect and i think i talked to you about this off the record back in miami uh where that we were like kind of we oh maybe we're like in the eye of the storm it kind of looked like maybe we had passed the point of of you know people have pushed back they said we don't want vaccine passports. It wasn't going to happen in a lot of different places. And there was like some hope, like for a little bit there, there was like, oh, maybe it won't be like wide sweeping vaccine passports, surveil everyone, track everyone, make them comply. And I said, I was like, they're just going to go one variant after the next. They're just going to be like this variant, this variant, this variant. You need to get your boosters. You need to do this. And once the,

you know once everyone who volunteers to get the vaccine does it then the pressure begins to try and get the the remnants of that yeah and it's again incredibly logically inconsistent like it's just like oh my god but the whole vaccine and again it's divide and conquer techniques i think that's the thing that scared me in the last few months, specifically about the perceived escalation that we may both believe is happening, is the overt divisive tactics, particularly the messaging around vaccinated versus unvaccinated. The pandemic of unvaccinated people is one of the lines the media and the political class has been running with to try to stigmatize people who have decided that

they would rather not be part of a an experimental vaccine rollout um it would rather risk uh getting it and surviving to me the biggest the biggest fucking thing that pisses me off is this idea that it's anyone's fucking business right somehow i forget about the conversation about the efficacy of the vaccine or the safety of the vaccine or whether or not you want to get if you want to get it get it if you don't want to get it don't get it but like to think that and and this is not just from government, right? I've had family members who think they have a right to know what my decision was. Why the fuck do they have a right to know what my decision was? How is that any of their business? It's fucking crazy. And it's just, I feel the pressure only getting

higher from here. And we see the UK is rolling out passports now. I expect it to go all throughout europe and governments can't secure data they just fucking can't so if we're just going to give them even more data we're going to give them location data we're going to give them medical records have them all keep that in their insecure databases it's a fucking mess agreed and we're going to pick up this this line of thinking after we get to the dashboard because there's so much is this a bitcoin podcast it is it is well bitcoin plays into this right we will connect it back to Bitcoin I'm sure Janet has taken the baton

in the treasury and is looking to slow down the Bitcoin industry to a certain extent or co-opt it Portman got a payoff and he slipped in there yeah what payoff what was his payoff do you think

money I don't know maybe he's like going to be a future cabinet member or something yeah is this slander right now we're slandering yeah i mean we're just speculating we're speculating yes but obviously he hates freedom that's not speculation and do you say he hates america because this is bad for america yeah who he's getting his pecking orders from what do you think it is do you think janet hates america or do you think she has such a beef with bitcoin sign guy for how bad he embarrassed her that he she has a vendetta it's not even about the fact

that bitcoin's like a new uh distributed cash system that is separate from central banks and governments is that that one blonde fresh-eyed sailing yuppie uh held up to buy bitcoin and embarrassed her while she was asking being asked if uh congress could audit the fed i mean if it's if it's a personal vendetta that's almost reasonable you know she should be embarrassed by that that would haunt me forever yeah no but these guys in the fed like bitcoin's bitcoin goes against everything they've spent their life doing they understand bitcoin let's make that clear i think i think we should make that very clear like they're not stupid about what's going on that's why they're trying to coordinate across the global central banking system the ecb the bis

that type of banking entity are really pushing central bank digital currencies hard particularly Augustin Carstens and Christine Lagarde. And obviously, you have the Chinese digital yuan, but I would consider that separate from the other CBDCs. CBDCBs. CBDCBs, excuse me. They know what's going on. They understand the threat that Bitcoin poses.

I mean, you're going to have to show your papers to eat dinner in New York City. I think most people will roll over and just take their surveillance coin, whatever. Let's talk about that. How does it... Are you officially a New Yorker with me now? I've been unofficially one for a bit now.

It's insane. It's insane. It's so fucked. I will not comply with that bullshit. Yeah. I'm done. They've destroyed our city. I have to boycott Shake Shack now.

Yeah. 100%. How ironic is that Shake Shack? Clogging arteries day in and day out. Trying to force people to carry vaccine passports to make sure they don't spread the common cold. COVID, whatever it is now. Or coronavirus, which is the common cold.

Once again, regardless of what you think about the virus or the vaccine, we should not be fucking showing papers when we go to eat dinner or go to a concert and it's it's almost even worse than papers because it's all digital and it's all stored on their insecure fucking databases it's an absolute privacy nightmare it's a civil rights issue and retail in new york city is already hurting tremendously and they're just dropping this on top of them in addition to it and and i'll just i'll reiterate that this is one of the reasons why i see so much value in bitcoin is because it's hard to change right like we've seen bad governance in new york within the last decade just absolutely destroy the city like the beauty

of bitcoin is there there's there's no centralized governance that can destroy it in a decade yeah yeah well so if you listen well if you listen to the episode i dropped yesterday with laser hodl i think this is a very good point to highlight the point he was articulating throughout that episode which we have to zoom out what are these vaccine passports in new york city a bigger part of and that is monetary reset like they need uh the the push towards these vaccine passports is a very easy way to get an app in people's hands that would could easily transition to a cbdc wallet which is part of this monetary reset like they want people so scared and so compliant that they're

like you said uh just willing to walk into the digital panopticon and so this one pressure point with the vaccine passport specifically uh like people are just fed up they're like fuck it i'll do whatever i'll take the vaccine i'll download the passport just let me go back to my life tell me what the rules are and i'll play within the rules i'm so tired of dealing with all this shit and that is what they're actively trying to they're trying to get as many individuals as possible to that point so they can get them hooked into this digital panopticon the chinese surveillance state that they're trying to export or import it's the thing is is like yeah we're we have a focus because we're focused on bitcoin we have a focus on these cbdcbs and like it's the

new hottest buzzword but it's already here you know your credit card is absolutely a surveillance card your apple pay is a surveillance app like they could integrate it tomorrow they can integrate the whole vaccine system into apple pay if they wanted to and when you go when you go to pay or you go to enter the place, you use the same app to enter as you pay and they can track every single person and they can check where you ate. They can check when you ate there and they can check your vaccine status. They can do all of that without CBDCBs. That's just the natural evolution of where it's going. It gives them a little bit more control instead of outsourcing it to a private company. But it's already basically there. And we saw it in Australia. They're looking at bank

card statements. They're looking at credit card statements. Their relationship with their credit card provider is data slave and master already it's already there it's already happening every time you swipe agreed now i would also say so it's a bit politically untenable using the means you just described credit card history shopping history venmo history whatever it may be it's a little untenable to to thrust the uh basically the social partner digital panopticon on those applications out of the blue like i think what they're trying to get individuals to the point of is openly accepting and accepting the the overt trade-offs the the trade-offs that are basically explained up front hey we're going to give you this vaccine passport if you don't have

a qr code that says you're vaccinated you can't go there and then it's also going to turn into your cbdc wallet and we're going to airdrop some some cuck bucks into that every two weeks you have x amount of time to spend it you can spend it at yza merchants these are the conditions of using this and they're just again it's politically untenable to force that on the incumbent means via which people interact with the economy if you get basically permission out of a point of of exhaustion and just desperation to get back to normal it makes it more politically tenable or palatable, if you will. So, okay, you accepted the chains.

You saw the terms and conditions. We explained it to you up front. Like you have Christine Lagarde and Augustine Carson. Again, the two pushing this the hardest, I would argue, explaining these things out loud, in public, confidently. It's infuriating. comment freaks beware beware what do we got next we got any good news net now gotta start with vulnerabilities the good news is far off they are beginning to launch their

attack on bitcoin it began i would say many years ago with i i went through it earlier this week i wrote something in june of 2019 on fatf and the guidelines that they started writing for virtual asset service providers i i think that's when the war started when they started making guidelines for this stuff the first shot to me was a bit license that is that's good we can go back to 2014 license was like 2014 right yes and they're trying to do bit license at the national scale now at what point do we stand up and just say fuck this tyranny like that's all it takes You need to embolden more individuals out there who believe in Bitcoin and the freedom-enabling properties that it provides individuals and the world at large to stand up and say, no, this is right. This is virtuous.

This makes humanity better off, and you will not ruin it for the rest of us, you old, out-of-touch, corrupt puppets. Get the fuck out of the way. Get out of the fucking way. Go die, please. I'm not saying be murdered or be killed. Just die. Just go lay in your bed. Close your eyes.

Been a good life. Leave us the fuck alone. There have been a large number of potential malicious Bitcoin nodes graphing the network since July 21st this year. I'm sorry. Did you have anything to add to the end of that? No, no, not, no. No.

Okay. All right. I'm sorry for another go die rant, but. That's how I feel. Like, just leave us the fuck alone, you guys. Term limits or something. Your career needs to die. Maybe that's the more palatable thing to say.

Yeah, like, maybe, like, be less corrupt. Yeah, try. Could you try to be less corrupt? Is it possible? I don't think so at this point. The only way out is civil disobedience and taking what is ours. Yeah, I mean, that was never actually going to happen. Yeah. Asserting our rights. It's not waiting for permission.

Hey, please, sir, can I send a peer-to-peer transaction to Matthew? Can you let me do that without having to send him a 1099? Please, sir, please. No, just do it. The P2P network enables it. Tell them to fuck off. Just keep hashing, keep sending transactions, keep coin joining. that's the only way out of this the only way out of the COVID restrictions and lockdowns too is to disobey the air I'm not going to get into that though because it triggers too many people too many pussies I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry

Uncle Marty's heated, he just got out of a long car ride hotel room's not ready had to push back, the rental car wasn't ready I've been sleeping on a mattress on the floor all week I've been stretched thin stretched thin I'm going to try and relax from here on out maybe I should have an edible

let's get on with the Bitcoin news we only have like 50 minutes left 40 minutes left BitMEX I just want to say Marty first of all I love you brother and we had a freak who like tweeted at

me and you and was like mad salty about your success at Great American Mining I just want to be absolutely clear that I fucking love what you're building at Great American Mining I don't know why anybody would... Sometimes you become more obsessed with mining. So it might come off that I'm a little bit salty,

but it's just, you know, it's like, oh, Marty's going on a mining tangent again. But I absolutely love what you guys are building and it's super important. And I think it's going to change the world for the better. Thank you. And I don't know. I've never gotten the inclination that that freak had.

That's good. I'm glad because it made me feel bad. And I was like, that's not what I meant. I don't think... I've never felt that way. I've never had that felt like you are salty about Great American Mining. That actually reminds me. So did you participate

in Casino Night at BitBlockBoom? Mm-hmm. So Gary killed it. He had this Casino Night that I thought was going to be like... I love you, Gary. I thought it was going to be kind of shitty because it was with fake money. He used BitBlockBoom bucks that you

could then convert into raffle tickets to win prizes um but it was a lot of fun i really enjoyed it um our our uh dealer at the blackjack table was this lovely woman i'm not gonna dox her name but i do remember it um she i was like can we tip you in bitcoin she had no idea what bitcoin was right she had an iphone she was at two percent battery life and we i we got her to download moon wallet with two u's and everyone at the table tipped her in bitcoin both on chain and lightning in a in a relatively self-custody trust minimized way and she still had one percent battery life left which was like the greatest bitcoin onboarding experience i've ever had that sounds incredible well then

we tried to get the craps table dealer to accept back when he wouldn't do it like he's like i am I'm not doing that. But no, so the 2% battery from zero to accepting on-chain and lightning payments before that phone died with time to spare. Fantastic. It's getting easier, freaks. The UX is improving.

Yeah, it's going to take time. It's going to take patience. I think that's been the theme of this podcast for the last four years is patience. We've been talking about all this stuff, visualizing what may come. It seems like things are coming together. uh i will say though uh the casino night even though it was like bit block boom bucks it's

hilarious how like the human psychology works it's like just trying to like accumulate chips like it uh you still even though it was fake money you literally didn't put up anything uh you can buy back in yeah you can buy back in but it was uh they gave you like five dollars worth of credits it was hilarious i was like it was literally worth nothing other than raffle tickets to potentially get you donated gifts and you were just like fuck I hate that I lost that hand there's something about like the psychology of that

that was fascinating to experience in real time I had to like literally take a deep breath and be like this is this is not worth anything and why am I getting pissed at this I don't know we had a great my table I walked in and there

was just like there's this table young plebs and I just sat down and we just fucking went for it for like what was it like two hours or something here i would never left the table yeah i came in for the last hour and i played blackjack for like that was fun 30 minutes and then kelly lannan and uh and grant from 1031 were teaching me how to play craps craps is still no idea what's going on in that game no idea my table was young lurk uh I don't know his

I don't know his Nick Don Nick can't mind Tyler Casey and I'm forgetting and Dylan Dylan LeClaire

it was a fucking fire table yeah it was a fire fire weekend again next year it's going to be in Austin does it lose its luster in Austin next year

in June I hope not I don't think it will I'm very happy it's happening in Austin because I'll be able to sleep in my own house yeah it is going to happen

I think he said he was going to go bigger I hope it's not too much bigger right that's the beauty of BitBlockBoom Gary if you're listening I'm sure you're on vacation right now I hope you are at least the intimacy of BitBlockBoom and the

camaraderie especially if you've been like I've gone four years in a row and it's just same faces same people I know it's like a family reunion it's not really a conference it's a great vibe

no shit coinery obviously hardcore bitcoiners it's a very Philadelphia 1775 vibe lobbycon probably nothing like 1776 or 1775 but it's fucking hilarious

just like in the lobby of the Marriott just constantly just bitcoiners drinking talking bitcoin yeah shilling that was another funny uh story apparently um the list isn't that long so we can we can go off so apparently uh will cole made me aware of this but did you notice there was like an orthodontist conference going on at the same time on the other side really yeah well apparently they do it every year at the same week it was last year i remember the orthodontist they were there again this year

and apparently a couple of them came up it's like Will Cole and them were like yeah we were here last year we bought Bitcoin and we're very happy like we're shilling the orthodontist of the world too what the fuck

is multiple Bitcoin multiple Bitcoin makes more sense no it doesn't you already fucking got cake in your face over that you can't pull it back I retract team Bitcoins. It's official in El Salvador, McDonald's.

McDonald's is going with Bitcoins. There's nothing you can do about it. No, they had Bitcoin. No, they had plural Bitcoins. It's a win for Bitcoins there. I don't know. That doesn't make any sense. We need to get a tally going. It doesn't make any sense.

Is it 1.23 Bitcoins? Or Bitcoin? Is it 1.23 crypto? Or cryptos? crypto isn't a thing crypto doesn't exist it's not a real thing

bitcoin is a thing what if there was a coin called cryptocurrency or do you like life's running around in a field with the deers it's actually believable

a shitcoin called cryptocurrency that's just like a huge marketing how is there not one yet right you'd I wish I was

could take a time machine back to 2013 Marty's about to release a shitcoin called cryptocurrency uh disclosure Marty is on the board

of a publicly traded Canadian that is doing it I don't know if we have to disclose that considering the company I'm on the board of has nothing to do with this conversation I mean I'm just helping you out do I have to disclose when I talk about other Canadians?

I don't know I'm just providing insight okay but we're all going to buy the stock tomorrow morning right? I don't know if I'm going to buy Bitcoin tomorrow morning. I know that. I don't know if I'm going to be going to buy Crew Energy stock.

The one we all missed was Athena Blockchain. That stock just fucking went parabolic. They were publicly traded? Yeah, they were publicly traded. I didn't even realize that. They went parabolic about three RHRs after we talked about them getting the contract for el salvador they're the el salvador they're the chivo wallet

atm provider i saw some chivo wallet atms on fire on twitter did you see that i did see that apparently there's some i guess to be objective give you guys all the news out there apparently there's some protest about the bitcoin legal tender law in el salvador people are setting Athena Bitcoin ATMs on fire the Chivo but could be a false flag

could be just like Christine Lagarde sending in some goons being like set them on fire make it seem like the people don't want this

we can't have this happening they need to take our billions in IMF loans they're like professional loan sharks

that's what they are the IMF yes it's disgusting like just think about like again it seems like everything in this

episode is wrapping back around to the Foday reason, mini doc, the interview. Just think about that. The IMF basically went to the French Central Bank and was like, hey, you need the Senegalese

currency that you're running and you're controlling. We're going to ask you to devalue that overnight. Just cut it in half. These millions of people living in this country that are affected by this have all the savings in these bank accounts. They assume that the savings in that bank account

has a certain purchasing power. We're just going to reduce that purchasing power in half overnight. Boom. The IMF pressures the French Central Bank to do that and just did it overnight. No warning to anybody. Just happened.

This is how money works in many parts of the world. Every part of the world outside of Bitcoin. It's pretty insane to think about. Loan. Yes, they do indenture you with their big loans. she woke up

it's a beautiful room this is it's one of three rooms we're not staying in this room this is the recording room okay we could wake up tomorrow and this woman right here this beautiful

beautiful woman right here could just be like yeah people aren't allowed to self custody exchanges you're not allowed to let people remove their coins from the exchange to personal custody. She could mandate that and they'd have to listen

the next day. I'm pretty sure the way things are going. They're a little bit inept. So like my guess is if they did it, there'd be like at least some kind of notice.

But it just depends how big of a crisis unfolds. Like there's a large crisis then things can move quicker. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Like, Marty Jones is coming out now.

Like, how much do we have to put up times do we have to put up with this incompetence? The government, the US government, I'm going to focus on our government. It is completely incompetent. It is inept. It is making things worse. It is taking more and more tax dollars and producing a worse and worse product over

time. Why do we put up with these people? Fuck these people. They should have no say on what we're building here. We're building the future of money and finance for the digital age. These old dinosaurs who don't understand

anything they're greedy they're kleptocratic they're evil i would argue a lot of them are evil and are making these broad brush regulations on the most incredible technology that humanity has ever come into contact with it's just very frustrating that is why i'm a strong advocate of civil disobedience at the personal end i hope companies start disobeying i hope the base companies like river cash app uh other exchanges sorry for putting you guys on the spot but you're on the spot you're on the spot we need people to stand up and say this is enough like get away from us leave us alone the bar is so low i'm just like impressed they haven't sold surveillance tools to the u.s government did you see that board elon musk tweet

um he let me find it real quick but it's just like a perfect depiction of like that's a power account right like he doesn't yeah but it's not elon but it's just uh it's a parody account with 1.7 million followers but it's like he uses the word crypto i know we don't like it but it really highlights the absurdity of the focus on bitcoin and the overarching cryptocurrency landscape most money lost by consumers through crypto scams last year 80 million dollars 2020 80 million dollars Money lost by consumers through overdraft fees last year, $12 billion. Banks are literally robbing poor people of $12 billion in overdraft fees. And nobody says anything about it.

Some people get scammed. They took risk. I would argue they probably understood the extent of the risk they were taking. And it got burned. And now we just need to completely cuck this, again, revolutionary. technology, potentially the best technology that humanity has ever come into contact with because it finally allows us

to create a globally fair monetary system that can't be manipulated by people like this beautiful woman. He's kissing Janet Yellen for the audio freaks. Yeah, audio freaks. She's on my green screen today. We got the Bitcoin sign guy sign. Yeah, I mean, it is

crazy times we live in. Tools like Bitcoin and other open source tools, free and open source tools are needed now more than ever. The education surrounding them is needed now more than ever. I really do think that Bitcoin and the adjacent open source community is hope. It embodies hope. And if we are able to empower ourselves and help empower other people, we'll have a brighter future. And that continues to be my focus. But this week really solidified why we do this every week. Some weeks, especially during summer when the weather's really nice and news is slow, it's easy to get into a headspace where you're like, why do I do this every week? And this week really solidified why it's so important that we come back and the freaks come back and that we put our heads down and are humble enough to know that we need to keep learning and keep improving ourselves. Love that.

What particularly for you is driving home these stark reminders that we need to come back and educate people and talk about this stuff and really force the issue of Bitcoin being an imperative for our future? Well, we had three things this week. I guess we'll just throw them all out here, even though they're all on the list. Um, we had, uh, treasury secretary Yellen and president Biden both separately, uh, advocate for wealth taxes, wealth confiscation. Um, we had, uh, an explosive report come out of Yahoo news that, uh, the Trump administration along with the CIA in 2017 drafted up plans to assassinate or kidnap Julian Assange. Well, I think some clarity there, the Trump administration, the lawyers actually stepped in and told the CIA you're going a bit too far.

I believe that's the case. Well, I think it's like mostly like the documents and stuff haven't been declassified. It's, I guess, Trump officials spoke to Yahoo on the condition of anonymity. But regardless, they changed his designation. they like designated that's what they always do they like unhuman someone right before they decide they're gonna like drone strike you or i don't know why i'm laughing it's not funny at all uh drone strike you or assassinate you otherwise or kidnap you or whatnot but the point is is that this kind of stuff is stuff that was labeled as a conspiracy theory right and here we are

It's clearly not a conspiracy theory. We weren't crazy. And then the last one was the Associated Press released an article about how far-right extremists are using Bitcoin and Monero. And this is a talking point that I've expected for a very long time. And I expect all three of those things to just... well, especially the first and the last to continue to be louder talking points,

to continue to be louder narrative shifts and actual execution of those narratives. First you, the first thing before you do wealth confiscation is you talk about it and you try and normalize it. You call it something like unrealized capital gains. You say, it's only going to be for the top 1%. It's only going to be a small amount.

You get people to accept it. You make it more palpable, palatable, make it easier for people to accept. And then, first of all, you use that as justification to greater financial surveillance on everyone because you've got to make sure you're not above threshold. So even if you're poor, we still got to surveil you to just make sure that you're still poor so that we don't have to take your wealth. um and then unlike the the far right stuff is like it's it's perfect you know that's that's a strategy as it as old as time right you you target someone as an enemy and then you're able

to build support to attack attack a greater group of people because you say you know they're not really humans they're the enemy we we need to go after them and i expect you know both of those things to accelerate here i do as well what is up freaks it's your boy marty bent here on a lovely lovely thursday afternoon i got a stogie in hand i got some makers mark private selection courtesy of alex leishman and i'm sitting down with my good friend matt odell for another edition of rabbit hole recap and we are joined by tales from the crypts first ever producer car gonzalez matt how's it feel let's fucking go cheers to car cheers to the freaks for waiting this long it's uh yeah it's four and a half years in in however long in and uh

we've got a producer yeah yeah it's uh and we're also on a you guys are on a 33 second delay we're in the future and you guys are behind us just to let you know okay you're you're not so you just broke the fourth wall all right so i gotta let him know if like like neil just asked what kind of cigar already answered the question we're living in the future yes we are you know there's no you there's no governance rights you get nothing out of miami coin except promise of future cash flow of stacks which gives you a promise of future cash flow of bitcoin yeah so it does sound like one of those russian dolls that you were describing earlier it's pretty crazy when you wrap your head around it but yeah i don't know i think it's gonna get i mean

I think people should stay humble in stack sets to be clear this is not a I'm not pitching you stacks I just think like you're gonna see New York coin happen then like we're probably gonna have you know like Kansas City coin or some shit like there'll be like a challenger city that decides they want to compete at the

same time and they're gonna start all popping up and people have no idea what the fuck's going on I saw so much confusion on Twitter today that I felt like it was an important discussion to have yeah well I appreciate you doing the research and like that begs the question like should we just expect all this like and is bitcoin enabling this or are they just like leveraging bitcoin's brand like because it's the stacks holders can just produce okay well keep

looking car if you can find it let us know um that's how that's how when when joe when joe interacts with the producer that's what he does he says you know go look for it and then we just continue our conversation we found our jamie car is our jamie car we have to figure out we have to get used to that as a concept. Look at this up, Jamie. What's the... Pull it up. He says Google that, Jamie.

Or something like that. But Matt wants me to use DuckDuckGo, which is... You have to say DuckDuck that car. DuckDuck that. Just find it. Yeah, so Bitmain announced a new miner.

I'm so fucking bullish on this setup I mean I think carbon dioxide pipelines are a stupid fucking idea dude they're talking about putting masks on cows to catch their burping like acting like that's going to do anything fuck these people I mean I think someone

I was like questionable about the Ice Age farm like is this really happening today at KNC Cattle Ranch I asked Cole the owner of that ranch like is this happening he's like yes it's happening and it's fucking scary yeah quasi kind of quasi um yeah i mean the way developers describe is like sea lightning is way more performative um it's just better yeah it just seems better go check out sea lightning freaks after you close all your channels instead of reopening them in sea lighting like that is

that is their like i love bitfinex in terms of just being the honey badger of exchanges and they just constantly fight um but like i wonder if there's like a legitimacy issue i mean el sábado's government is already kind of questionable on the world stage then you mix in liquid tether and like the bond is using tether as well on the back end and so liquid tether bitfinex bitcoin all mixed together i wonder if they'll actually hit their hit their level i mean the last thing is i mean samson gets up on stage and he basically says uh this is the model and we want a lot of bitcoin bonds to follow suit and to me that reminds me of like everything eth did like eth has like ethereum stakeholders have like all

these constant ploys to make the market less liquid to pump the price like they always like the first one was the dow then it was icos now they're burning mining fees ultrasound money like they always have this bullshit like but the the common denominator is let's reduce the liquidity so samson's like alluding to we're gonna have hundreds of bitcoin bonds and they're all gonna take 500 million dollars worth of bitcoin off the market and you better buy some bitcoin now otherwise the price is going to pump and because the price pump it's good to buy the bonds and because it's good to buy the bonds the price

pumps so you should buy more bonds and it's like this circular you know number go up inducement kind of thing and to me that feels very shit coin I agree in that context

and there's probably an angle from Samson and Blockstream too like this is the model moving forward where they probably want people to do it on Liquid and Bitfinex and all that stuff. But that doesn't preclude some municipality or something doing a bond offering and taking portions of the funds. It doesn't have to be $500 million.

It could be a smaller percentage of the overall offering to buy Bitcoin from somebody like NYDAG or an Unchained Capital or something like that. You can do collaborative custody. I hope they would do that, but they probably would go for a NYDAG or Coinbase or something like that. And there's...

I mean, is Bukele doing collaborative custody? I doubt it. Maybe. He's just like holding it all in his blue wallet? I don't know. Let me get to the point. The point I'm trying to make is like, I think there is an economic argument to be made

for bond issuers, particularly people that have issued bonds in the past that aren't performing as well. And they're looking to create a better credit score, if you will, or have better performing debt facilities. facilities like again if it is a risk if you're buying bitcoin holding it as a bond issuer uh it does have to go up like i mean i think we would agree that we think bitcoin's going to go up over

the course of the next five ten years and depending on the duration of the bond like it could be a very smart idea for um issuers to to get the funds needed to do whatever they want to do with that debt and then have this cushion in Bitcoin that they purchased if they're unsuccessful in executing on the back end of what they actually tried to accomplish. At least they have the failsafe in the Bitcoin on that bond balance sheet. I don't even know if you could like within the bond to make bondholders whole at the end of the day. And this would be like a very unique opportunity that is specific to this particular point in Bitcoin's monetization path. like this isn't going to be in the perpetuity maybe it will be but like the the returns will

be much more compressed as bitcoin volatility suppresses and the value stabilizes relative to where it is today yeah um i like the public miners like the public miners it should be interesting what happens in the bear cycle agreed it honestly feels like i'm one of the few people in bitcoin right now and the but why like what's what's bad about it like if you're up front with it you're like hey we're gonna issue this bond raise some debt to do something as long as you're transparent about it there's no i mean everyone can do whatever the fuck they want to do right yeah i actually i think it makes sense i think it's a it's a logical move if you think bitcoin's gonna

appreciate value. Well, look, as a borrower, if you're El Salvador and someone will give you money at 6% to buy $500 million worth of Bitcoin, it is an obvious decision. Like, yes, let me do that. But it's a little bit different if you look at it from BlockChain's perspective, putting their name on this thing deciding that this wants to be their priority this is going to be the thing that they you know put forward they're going to send their coo down there one of the founding members of blockstream samson down there to to get on stage with this government figure in el salvador to present this bond to the world with bitfinex uh they made that decision that's on them you know bitcoin is for everybody is for enemies anyone can use it doesn't fucking matter

i'm not saying that people shouldn't be issuing these things i'm just saying that it will not outperform bitcoin it will uh it feels very shit coiny and i don't think with tether and bitfinex so you add that additional risk i don't think it's shit And I wonder how much liquid actually will distract from the interest in the product rather than going through a normal process. I don't think it's shit-coiny. Especially if you're clear they're going to use X amount of proceeds to buy Bitcoin, X amount of the cash proceeds to do something specific. As long as they're actually following through with the deployment of the infrastructure build-out part of the bond, then it's not shit-coiny. they're going to need it the part the shit coining part is when samson says in his projections that

bitcoin is going to be we'll go through the scenario that bitcoin's a million dollars in four years yeah this is what the return is and there's going to be tens and hundreds of other bonds that are similarly set up that way and it creates a nice feedback loop to increase the price that's the shit coining part well i mean shit coin if you say that's like the driving factor of price going up certainly a factor but there's going to be stuff going on in parallel to that that would uh would help i do believe it'll outperform most bonds not all bonds yeah um just because they're holding bitcoin and because their coupon is way higher than most bonds yeah so maybe that's how they draw people in to get it subscribed but i don't think this boosts

Liquid adoption. I don't think this, you know, I like I. Me and Marty just read a comment together because Carr put it up and it was long. That's why we kept quiet. Someone was saying. The U.S. is sanctioning Honduras over election fraud. What we have on the list. I mean, the U.S. says this is unrelated.

but this week they said that they paused relations with el salvador because of differing it's just like the relationship's not working out yeah this is an interesting topic and so they didn't bring up bitcoin city or bitcoin bonds so this has to be related you know it's that like the u.s came out and the uh what is it the diplomat for el salvador is that what you call the ambassador ambassador there we go the ambassador el salvador came out said that El Salvador isn't cooperating in negotiations or showing any interest in having an ongoing conversation with the US about what's going on. And then the IMF came out too and sent them a strong warning and saying they need to increase their regulations and really think about the

gravity of diving into Bitcoin as heavily as they are. It almost is a veiled threat. I don't even think it was a veiled threat. I think it was an overt threat. That's something I want to talk about the IMF. Actually, I'm writing about it in the bent today and I've been watching some YouTube videos on how the IMF started. So the IMF and the World Bank were created at Bretton Woods in New Hampshire after World War II. Obviously, Europe was decimated. Many parts of the world were decimated after one of the bloodiest wars in human history. And there was a lot of rebuilding needed to be done. So the world's leaders met at Bretton Woods, basically changed the monetary, global monetary system, made the US dollar the reserve currency of the world, created the World

Bank and the IMF. The IMF was created specifically for short-term loans, the World Bank for more longer-term loans. And after the reconstruction of Europe and all the war-torn cities after World War II, the IMF shifted from investing in infrastructure build back toward emerging economy investments. But what you find over the course of decades that the IMF is essentially pillage third world countries, bloating them up with debt and making them do things that they probably otherwise wouldn't do if they weren't beholden to the IMF loans. And so the IMF is an unelected and supranational banking entity. Nobody voted for it. Nobody asked for it. And you basically had a bunch of leaders meet at Bretton Woods in New Hampshire in the late 1940s and

decide this was a thing and that we're going to have to deal with it. And now it's gotten to a point in 2021 where these people think the imf thinks they can just tell people what to do sovereign nations what to do more importantly and it's pretty disgusting that they're threatening el salvador and they haven't they should not have any authority over anybody especially a sovereign nation the imf can fuck off like no 100 it's an evil organization and i like i i i support the idea of these countries specifically latin american countries who have been under the nose of america for a long fucking time um to raise funds on their own to use a monetary system that's independent in the united states 100 percent um yeah i just

it's hard it's hard right because you don't want to here's i i think i can explain the angst that i can see in your your body language and voice right now it's like bitcoin's like don't trust verify like what's going on in south el salvador is cool but it's also like you have president bukele it's like what the hell is he doing like is he is he trying to just make a name for himself is like it's a bit of a hairy situation because obviously marty you're my fucking brother if you asked to borrow money like a reasonable amount of money i would lend it to you thank you but if you told me you were putting half of it into bitcoin i might not lend it to you i would i would i would i would really question why you needed the money

in the first place i would i like i but i definitely wouldn't give it to el salvador well you can make an argument so the again i'll be the the steel man on this particular argument You can make the argument that El Salvador is afraid that they're not going to be allowed to issue the type of bonds that they have been in the past due to the positioning of the U.S. and supranational unelected officials like the IMF. What's going on? Are you okay? Yeah, it got dark here. I'm going to go turn on the lights. Matt's lights are on.

Yeah, go to Marty. What's up, freaks? What are you thinking about this light? I got my MacBooks, a Macallan. I bought a nice ashtray today. I got my stogie, my beer, my water, my phone. It feels good out here. It's feeling good.

But again, I guess going back to what I was trying to say, El Salvador, you could see it. Like, yes, I agree with Matt. If I were going to loan somebody money and they were like, I want to use half of it to buy Bitcoin. I'm like, I don't know how I feel about that. But in this particular scenario, it's different. A personal loan from me or Matt to myself

is different than a bond offering at the national stage, I would argue. It's a different context, more nuance. Malheur shouldn't give the IMF the time of day. No, he shouldn't. And with El Salvador specifically, again, I could see them having trouble raising capital through debt markets

and the traditional financial system due to the ire they're receiving from the United States and the IMF right now. Maybe the Bitcoin play is the most risk-averse play they can make, given the cards they've been dealt, potentially. Did you pick that up? I don't know. So, I mean, I really, I respect that everyone wants to accumulate as much Bitcoin as possible,

as well. And I respect that there's more appetite among people looking to buy bonds to have some kind of Bitcoin exposure that they couldn't get otherwise. and that definitely juices the the bond offering yeah yeah that's what i said yesterday in the maybe the and i'm torn on jack speaking at imf but uh he has a brother and uh he speaks really well and i respect whatever decision he wants to make on that yeah let's see if he um let's see if he just trolls them i wouldn't hold i want to hold that out of the realm of possibility maybe he goes there to tell them that they're fucking evil let's go i'm gonna i'm gonna hold out hope

for that maybe he just goes there and says you are obsolete you're you're you're worthless jack going to the history of the imf bretton woods everybody just met new hampshire was like yeah it's like new hampshire's a good place to meet though it is there's like 200 of us here let's just change the global monetary system u.s dollar you're the reserve currency now world bank imf you exist now yeah fuck the imf man yeah and the world bank yeah sorry nick carter um i do i mean i don't think you have to apologize to nick even though his dad works for the imf the world bank there's the world bank i think we lost matt what's going on on matt's side of things did we lose him no i'm here okay are you winning son yes pa yes father-in-law i'm winning i'm wearing a cowboy hat

smoking a stogie talking bitcoin the world's changing in front of us it's a beautiful thing we're here reporting it are we reporters are we journalists no car saying yes i don't think so marty you're you're like a bob dylan marty a bob dylan i don't know don't give fucking stay home fuck you car 1324.88 bitcoins or 200 okay wait wait wait we have tie here there's there's no such thing as bitcoins no it's bitcoin no there's no such thing as bitcoin there's utxos and there's no coins the coins don't exist you have utxos and every time a utxo gets transacted it gets basically smelted and new utxos are created there's no such thing as a coin a coin doesn't exist

duh then a bitcoin doesn't exist too like you're you're arguing your semantic argument right now is going to fail flat on its face because if i'm wrong you're wrong too in this case no no because is Bitcoin, the network, right? And then you have Bitcoin, the currency. Yes. But there's no coins. You have the U.S. dollar reserve system, the network, and then you have U.S. dollar.

But there are literally dollars. Like, I have dollars in my pocket right now. Like, there are dollar fucking bills, you know? But there's no Bitcoins. Matt is short Bitcoin. Matt is short Bitcoin. It is as evidenced by that cash on the table. He's not all in.

He's not all in. Get on zero, you. you see shit cash app is i have cash app cash is great for privacy it is i mean i have my wallet somewhere here i've got cash too uh austin texas everything's bigger in texas they give you hundred dollar bills at the atm what happened in new york i don't know if that was odell carries shit coins it's bitcoins freaks uh the point makes no sense though there's no coins i'm glad Ty agrees with me. I agree.

We're not going to spend too much time debating this. I'm right. You started it. The in-persons RHR hit different. They do. I miss this.

Yeah. Why didn't you move to Austin? Why aren't you moving to Austin? Yeah, ask them, is it a competition, though, that we were debating? Is it a competition between Nashville and Austin?

No. Yassine's asking if it's a competition between Nashville and Austin. It's not. It's not a competition. There is no competition. It's a sister.

Marty doesn't look convinced. Yeah. You got something to say? No, we need, we need, I agree. We need parallel citadels, monasteries, if you will. Who are we going to trade with? Yeah. Who are we going to trade with? That's what Carr is asking. Yeah, yeah. We'll give you...

We got cows. They have cows, too. It's a very, like, there's not much to trade between Tennessee and Texas. Yo, Carr, grab this other mic over here. They have, here. I'll get... But Tennessee has cows up north. Big gun states as well. What are we going to trade? I love this. This is just like a party

episode. This is fucking great. We've never had an episode like this before. What do you guys have? Look, I intend to visit you and Cara and all the other Bitcoiners in Austin all the time. Well, we have Bitcoin developers. Developers. We can trade

you some Bitcoin developers. No, developers stay in Austin. You guys can build the culture up here. The developers are staying in Austin. Maybe we'll make one-off trades every once in a while but we need the intellectual capital you want them in texas too like yes tennessee is very free state but it's not a competition marty why why so

threatened yeah i'm not threatened am i threatened am i projecting right now you're blushing now i gotta do he is blushing a little bit but it's the whiskey it's the right it's the whiskey and i'm wearing this ll bean marty if you want it's the whiskey cheeks ll bean if you want to sponsor of the pod i love your i love your merch but you have to accept bitcoin first and hold it on your balance you should probably make that happen just interesting this always happens this happens like almost every bull market this is why like we were talking about before we hit record but like there's so many like bullish signals going on like uh newsletter open rates going up podcast downloads going up uh shit coiners emailing me to come on the podcast like these are uh historically

pre-bull market leading indicators for the TF2C crowd. We literally had the Stellar team in front of Congress dragging Bitcoin through the mud saying it was bad for the environment

and that proof of work is bad for the environment and that Stellar is the solution there. That proof of stake is I don't even, Stellar's not even really proof of stake, is it? It's kind of like a weird validator model. um just like permission validators anyway but but the point is is like that is toxic what is toxic is taking your pre-mine and like dumping it on retail um are there bitcoiners that

are you know that that will just personally attack people yeah sure but i i think if you take a certain bitcoiner and say that and and then just say that all bitcoiners are like that then you're the toxic one yeah like you're part of that issue it's low effort and you've done a good job of calling this out in the past like the low effort like clout chasers quote-unquote bitcoin maximalists on twitter just like doing it to get aroused and get attention versus like just stay true like we have the moral and logical high ground like you don't need i'll say something from an architect? So I think that this is like a really interesting question, especially as like someone who is so philosophically and ideologically aligned with Bitcoin.

And as like a sort of investor asset manager, I think there's no current or future use case for me that is as exciting as an uninflatable, uncensorable sovereign money. With that being said, it's so interesting to see some of the like interest beyond Bitcoin that at least we're getting on a daily basis. And I think it's, it's almost like a, an apples to oranges comparison where Bitcoin's conservatism is actually like its primary value proposition and like a hyper progressive world that is focused on extremely, you know, advanced technology. It's like Bitcoin survives because it's extremely principled and has ethos and is you know not is anti-vc like we like to internally at arc say like the reason why a16z is shilling pos and saying bitcoin is bad for

the energy for the environment is because they can't make massive returns on bitcoin and that's something that's like extremely compelling as a as a holder and as a retail investor uh and and so it's like it's it it's a non-starter that bitcoin is competing in a league of its own i like and i follow a lot of what you're talking about marty it's it's won the energy game and a lot of people don't realize that uh where where i'm having trouble like reconciling even even my own thoughts and my own investment approach is that there is still a ton of mind share that's being captured by things outside of bitcoin yeah we had a discussion about this one or two months ago Yeah, we did. We did. We, we, we had this discussion where, where it's like, it's hard to dismiss a lot of the things that are going on outside of Bitcoin. And it's not to say that it's a replacement to the monetary revolution that Bitcoin is capturing. And it's not to say that there is going to be a legitimate competitor to becoming a global based money like Bitcoin is positioned, but there is mindshare and it's like innovative in what it's doing.

And in a way that like, whereas Bitcoin needs to be conservative to survive, I think when you're seeing with like this whole ETH and Solana and all these like smart contract platforms. I love that knife fight that's going on right now. It's the exact opposite where they're like, they have to compromise some of their ethos and censorship resistant properties and decentralization because what they're competing on is like better, faster, cheaper. Bitcoin doesn't want to be better, faster, cheaper, and it shouldn't be. And so it's like, there's kind of stuck in a very, very hard, like, I don't know what the saying is, the rock in a hard place or whatever. That's the saying. Okay, good. But it's like, how do you innovate at the pace of like centralized status quo?

Well, I guess, this is what I always fall back on, like, not how do you innovate, but at what pace do you need to innovate? Like, I'm a big believer in there's like an order of operations to all this. Right, right, right. you need to sound money you need it to be sufficiently distributed you need layers on top of that and that's always been my thesis and my approach to how we get all that mind share to come to bitcoin it's like it's going to come eventually this is my view yeah uh but we just need the order of operations to play out but how does it come if you get so much pushback from what's being defined or labeled as the maximus yeah when he's like he's a he's a bitcoiner like

I actually met him before he launched the Stacks token. Blockstack actually existed without Stacks, and they were able to create a really interesting stack that didn't rely on a token. I'm just curious on your take of how do you reconcile that we're hyper-conservative because we need to be, and we're going to welcome experimentation, and we're effectively going to assume all the properties

that these other platforms are trying to take lead on. Yeah, well, again, it goes back to the order of operation. I think Matt does a good job of... So there is a temperance, I believe. I'll just speak for myself. The temperance with which I approach these types of arguments is like, hey, I recognize all this is going on. And I do think...

It's just they're competing on two different axes, is my point. well like then you get then you get back to like the economic argument like like why do these things have like it's the utility token argument it's like i agree i agree but there's there's there's so much more going on i i here here's my my general take if you're if you're a shit coiner that's coming to me and shilling your shit coin because you don't like bitcoin i i can't take you seriously it's like you kind of first need to understand like what Bitcoin's value proposition is before you explore things beyond.

But I think it's, you can't have the cake and eat it too where you pride yourself on how conservative Bitcoin is and then assume it's going to create sort of as much interest in the applications beyond just being a base money.

Okay, Yasin, take this mic. Matt, I think you do a good job of... Wait, wait, wait. I just want to jump in here real quick. Okay. I believe, to me, I'm pro free market. I like the idea of free market. I think the idea of Bitcoin is super cool that we have a mic for Matt's bottle.

It's the most important mic. Anyway, I think it's important that Bitcoin ended up, this ecosystem that Bitcoin created, the birth of Bitcoin created, is this idea of permissionless innovation. Anyone can fork Bitcoin. Anyone can launch their own network. They can do whatever the fuck they want. It's code. It's open source code. That is really fucking cool. And there's inherently skin in the game. So you can trade these networks against each other, whatever their tokens are against each other. And if you win, you win. If you get wrecked, you get wrecked. And I think everyone has the right to get wrecked. And when they do get wrecked, they should take personal

responsibility and realize that they got themselves wrecked with all that said um in this in the specific situation of stacks yeah we're going to talk about stacks and we were talking about this earlier and i'm going to say it again because now we're on fucking air and we were talking about it is sorry that is they intentionally conflate the idea of mining with this idea of sending bitcoin to these tokens they they intentionally took the bitcoin meme of stacking and now like stacking sats is using their pre-mined token to stake their branding they took that from you dude they they they put they put well i would like to yeah i mean i think stacking sats was a community thing like i i think the reason it's a powerful meme is because the

community adopted it it's not because i said it stay humble um the the co-opting the brand that's probably what it is it's conflated right and this idea the original distribution of Stacks was done in a way that was very insider not open

not permissionless I don't want to focus on Stacks alone though no but I'm saying that's where this is coming from I can't speak on behalf of it but Stacks is the new one all of these things tend to be equivalent with ETH it's it's it's the same thing that happened with ETH ETH just happened in the past generation

and stacks is happening in this generation that's how I that's how I see it so you know you should disclose trade-offs you should disclose conflict of interest uh you shouldn't try and intentionally hide it with marketing and messaging and that's where the you know that's where the that that that's where the issue to me lies um and I just want I think people should have all the information in front of them if they want to gamble on things if they want to play around with new tools they want to do whatever uh you know like so be it like that that's what a free market is um i think ultimately the overwhelming majority of people if they stay humble and stack sats rather than trading these tokens will do better long term like if you're a vc or a hedge fund yes incentives are

skewed i mean you get into the pre-allocation we're vcs now no no but but i mean we're bitcoin only we're bitcoin only venture fund in bitcoin companies bitcoin only you also have an incentive to just talk bitcoin but that's true that's true but i think historically historically if you are retail if you're retail and you are just uh accumulating bitcoin long term putting work in and accumulating bitcoin long term you will probably do better than if you try and gamble on If you try and trade mentally, you'll also feel a lot. But my point is the reason I say probably is because there is a theoretical situation where you, you, you sell the top, you, you like actually trade successfully, right? 99% of people will not trade successfully, but there's a scenario where, you know, you trade the top and it's fucking fantastic for you.

And there are people that successfully do that. Like they do exist, but the overwhelming majority don't. Uh, so, you know, that's, and, and, and we only have so much time. We only have so much time in this world. So like, where does the focus lie? And most people don't have enough Bitcoin. Everyone does not. Even Michael Saylor doesn't have enough Bitcoin.

I think he owns no Bitcoin. I, I, you know, the focus should be trying to accumulate as many stats as possible. That is, you know, high signal to me. And that's, you know, where my focus is. So like a perfect example of this. I went to my cousin's wedding two months ago and my second cousin who was telling me why I should buy Shiba is probably not going to sell the top of Shiba.

He's probably not going to make it. No, he's probably not going to make it. And then he gets burnt out afterwards. He's like, it's all a scam. And then he like fucking walks away. Exactly.

Definitely. There's stuff, there's massive opportunity costs. And if you, if you just stuck to just Bitcoin, it is a prudent strategy. I, I still think that's independent from the fact that things are still

happening outside of bitcoin that bitcoin might not right but these things are never gonna stop like we're not like shit coins will never go away and there's gonna be new ones next cycle like more innovation or whatever yeah at what point do we say do we like completely like detether from shit coins like you know for me i'm coming to the belief that bitcoin is you know bitcoin has won his money nobody's coming after that role as you know that hard money role shit coins are products they're like tech products vc tech products who the fuck cares let them do their thing and you know what we're not here to police adults you know who want to gamble like they can you know buy uh you know they can buy gamestop they can buy eth who the fuck cares we're not

here to police them so why don't we spend our time instead of fighting shit coins you know just uh doing what we do and promote i have 100 agree with that that's and that is what i've dedicated like the last two years because again like you've seen you caught on to it like the energy thing is like the biggest thing that's going on in bitcoin right now and that's like where a lot of my efforts gone in the last two years like just get bitcoin integrated into the energy sector stack and it's game over i mean but that reminds me like that adds another aspect to it and i kind of touched on it earlier i mean shit coin like even if even if you're saying okay so i'm being a little bit toxic by calling them shit coins well you know what so let's say alternative one

second alternative chains okay should not be in the same boat as bitcoin it should not be compared to as bitcoin and so we're focused on bitcoin people other people can be focused on whatever the fuck they want if they want to collect you know hello kitty dolls or whatever it's fine with me. If they want to work on trading ownership of baseball cards, that's fine with me. If they want to trade stocks in a more efficient manner, that's fine with me. But the problem is those altcoin promoters will then come out and say, this is Bitcoin 2.0. This is better than Bitcoin. Bitcoin is slow. Bitcoin isn't efficient. Bitcoin is a dinosaur. And you will make more money if you come and give me your Bitcoin,

which I am going to hold, by the way. Like, Justin's son has a shit ton of Bitcoin. Look at EOS. The EOS guys have a shit ton of Bitcoin. They have $4 billion of Bitcoin on their balance sheet. And that's what goes wrong with all of the things outside of Bitcoin is that they're also comparing themselves to Bitcoin

when they're positioning their own projects. But how much are they doing that now? Like, I don't hear we're the next Bitcoin that much, you know, in 2021. Oh, super, or what is it? Ultrasound money? Yeah, but those are like, That's like five ETH cards.

That's more like the meme-ing, but I think fundamentally there is an acknowledgement that they're competing on two different paths. Well, now they're all like, we're the next ETH. Yeah. Right, exactly. That's why I love the Solana ETH play fight. It's so interesting.

What we see now is mostly it's the next ETH, but I will say that the Stacks concept is an interesting evolution of that strategy where instead of saying we're the next Bitcoin, we're built on top of Bitcoin and our consensus mechanism is better than

proof of work or our, you know. Keep the mic, dude. We're fucking vibing right now. This is, I mean, I love that we're having this conversation. It's important because I Because we had this conversation a month ago. Yeah, we did. There's just a lot of mindshare.

I I don't take anyone who doesn't understand Bitcoin seriously if they're talking another crypto book. Like, and that's the fundamental, if you understand the energy play that Bitcoin is in, if you understand that it is conservative by design, if you understand that it's a monetary and not a software revolution, I'll listen to what you have to say. I think the problem is that the majority of people are looking at this as like Bitcoin is obsolete. Bitcoin is boring. It is a failure of imagination

to think that we're not going to have anything beyond just sound money. I push back heavily against that, and it goes back to just where I am philosophically. Well, that's tech product mindset. Exactly. It's tech product mindset. That's the point I want to make right now. This is a monetary

revolution over a tech revolution. It certainly is a tech revolution with the combination of variables that Satoshi put together, proof of work, difficulty adjustment, distributed systems, stuff like that but it is at the end of the day that tech revolution enables a bigger monetary revolution and for me coming from an economics background and really digging into Austrian economics like what really irks me about like the shit coin world is like the token stuff again the

utility token like everything's going to be priced in bitcoin like why do you need to tokenize everything and have like well with stacks you need the token exactly like why do you need no no but stacks you need the token yeah no but like the way stacks works you need the token the token needs to exist my issue with stacks is more the distribution of the original token you can't do stacks with sats is my point why like but again going back to super critical of stacks i just want to make clear this point like there are some situations where why do you need the token going back to order of operations are like why can't you have a token on a second third layer where that is possible again like i think we're just stacks you're literally trying to

incentivize hashing into the bitcoin blockchain and you need another token besides bitcoin to incentivize that and that is the stacks token the problem with that to me the biggest problem to that to me is that it was uh private sales uh to closely held investors and then icos happened they like got very excited that they had like the first regulated ico which is like to me I like look back with nostalgia to the unregulated ICOs like at least those were like permissionless without KYC

remember fair proof of work launches fair proof of work launches which in 2013 were like oh shit coiner what you could do is you could fork stacks same exact tech free and open source software fork stacks

instead of the stacks token being held by privately held individuals, having the founder who wants to argue in bad faith on Twitter, holding 8% of all Stacks supply and getting 8% of all new Bitcoin that are coming into the Stacks ecosystem. You could do that with a snapshot of the Bitcoin UTXO set. If you own however much Bitcoin at that time, you get that much Stacks 2.0 token. And then you can do the same exact thing they're doing. You can do all the Express to Smart contracts that they're doing that are Ethereum style. You can do that with a snapshot of the ledger that dictates the global wealth of the world, which is Bitcoin.

You could do that, but they wouldn't make the money. Exactly. That's the point. You're much more eloquent than I am. But you need the token is my point. Exactly. Do you need the token? You need the token, but you can use Bitcoin as the snapshot for the token.

Yeah. To do a fairer distribution of the token to Bitcoin. Yeah. God, we're getting down the rabbit hole here. This is rabbit hole recap. I think I mean obviously we've had

Udi going on his rant Was Udi on? Oh, you said his name Udi-verse No, it wasn't on Udi, Udi, Udi Alright, we're rambling I love you Marty, I love you car

I love you freaks I love you too, Marty Care about your people Stay on with StackSets I love all y'all, Matt, Car, Freaks, haters, lovers, people who want to destroy Bitcoin, people who want to make it happen. I love you all. Love is what's going to get us through these dark times.

Peace and love, Freaks.