TFTC: A Bitcoin Podcast - Rabbit Hole Recap: Week of 2019.07.15

Episode Date: July 19, 2019

This week Marty and Matt discuss: - This week in Bitcoin - https://twitter.com/matt_odell/status/1150840995808010241?s=19 - Wasabi - https://twitter.com/matt_odell/status/1151882688053334016?s=19 - C-Lightning - https://medium.com/blockstream/new-release-c-lightning-0-7-1-9fca65debeb2 - Binance staking XLM - https://www.binance.com/en/support/articles/360030727092 - https://twitter.com/matt_odell/status/947551556546760704?s=19 - ETH on BCH - https://ethresear.ch/t/bitcoin-cash-a-short-term-data-availability-layer-for-ethereum/5735 - Much more Shoutout to our sponsors: Cash App. Head over to the App Store or Google Play Store, download cash.app and start #stackingsats today. Use the promo code: "stackingsats" to receive $5 and contribute $5 to OWLS Lacrosse you download the app. Unchained Capital. Head over to www.unchained-capital.com/vaults and checkout their 2-of-3 multisig vaults. You get 3-months free of Saifedean Ammous' The Bitcoin Standard Research Bulletin when you sign up.

What is up freaks? Welcome back to Tales from the Crypt. It's your boy Marty Bent, coming drunker than ever and from a bachelor party in Montreal, recording remotely with my co-host Matt O'Dell, looking at him through a computer screen right now. Matt, how the fuck are we doing today? There is so much dedication here by Marty. He is already lit, so this should be a good one. I am pretty lit. I'm sitting here. I've got a friend from high school sitting next to me. He's got a microphone in his hand. Don't speak at all. Very little if you have to.

I've been explaining Bitcoin to him all day. We've been getting lunch here in Montreal. And I think I've been breaking through. How have I been breaking through to you, Craig? I don't remember Jesus speaking about Bitcoin on the Ten Commandments. I don't believe in that. You've got to hold the mic closer to your mouth, please. Sorry.

And Jesus did throughout the money makers in the world. So Jesus did talk about Bitcoin at one point, if not indirectly. Before we get into the vast topics that we have to talk to today, we got to give a shout out to our sponsors, the Cash App. You know all about them. They're the number one finance app in the App Store for the last two years. The first P2P payments app to let you freaks buy Bitcoin. And guess what?

They're letting you deposit Bitcoin on their app and they're slowly allowing you to withdraw all Bitcoin to BEC32 addresses on their app as well. On top of that, they got their boost program. You get the debit card. You go to merchants like Chipotle, DoorDash, local coffee shops, Whole Foods, the list goes on. I believe Taco Bell's on that list as well. You save money there. And then on top of that, if you use the promo code stacking sats, if you've already downloaded Cash App, tell your friends, use the promo code stacking sats. They're going to get $5. and $5 is going to be donated to a charity very near and dear to our hearts.

That's Owls Lacrosse out of Chicago. Outreach with lacrosse and schools. So go to the local app store that you frequent today and download the cash app. And then after that, go to www.unchained-capital.com slash vaults to check out Unchained Capital's two of three multi-sig solution for your Bitcoin custody. if you're looking to uh secure your bitcoin and bring in somebody like unchained into the mix

they will be the third or excuse me the second of a 203 multi-sig solution for you and on top of that they have their their loan program so if you have your bitcoin in a vault with them they're going to allow you to get a bitcoin collateralized usd loan right in the same suite so go to www. www.unchained-capital.com and you're going to get three free months of Saifedean Amooses, the Bitcoin Standard Bulletin Research Paper. That's three free months.

And then you're also going to get their Volt program. There's two, three multi-sig. It works with Ledger, Trezor, and other hardware devices. Go check it out. Matt, I'm slurring my words already. We're not even through the intro yet. What a fucking week it has been.

How are you? I mean, I thought you killed the ad read. It was well done. It was impressive. Thank you, sir. I'm really fucking pumped right now, if you can't tell through the screen. The current price of Bitcoin is 94 sats per cent. And the current block height is 585,982.

Ooh. We got mempool stats at all, Anur. The mempool, no, the mempool, a mempool is at 43,000 unconfirmed transactions. Ooh, a little higher, a little higher than expected. What a fucking week it's been, dude. Like, I know we're not at 13K like you were calling for this time last week, but given that fact, I'm still happy with where we are. What are your thoughts? So since the last time we met here on Rabbit Hole Recap, we've had two Capitol Hill hearings, one in the Senate, one in the House.

And we've had Steve Mnuchin come out and say the cash has never been used for a nefarious action in its whole existence, in the U.S. dollar at least. What a week it's been. Yeah, we had Powell Fed comments. We had Trump tweet. Then we had the Mnuchin presser. And then we had the two days of Libra conferences. And we have Joe from Squawk Box is just completely woke and just loves Bitcoin now. Hey, Joe Kernan, if you're listening right now, the invitation is open.

If you ever want to come across the Williamsburg Bridge, Matt and I are here with open mics, ready to talk about your your bitcoin wokeness you know i i still can't believe this is real i feel like it's it's i yeah i i'm in shock i'm still in shock i don't know um i'm still trying to uh really digest everything that's happened what is uh shocked you the most the fact that the government is even broaching the subject the fact that the government is uh as well versed on the subjects uh as it as it seems to be or the fact that um people are as sort of open-minded towards bitcoin as uh some of the politicians on capitol hill and uh some of the the uh talking heads on mainstream media have been marty they defined shit coins in u.s congress what the fuck how did

that happen this is the most ridiculous timeline ever i don't know i first of all a lot of the politicians seem to get it really surprised in that respect um a lot of them understand the value prop of bitcoin understand that you know allowing innovation here in america is is best case scenario for america the country um yeah i who was that um are we talking about patrick mchenry here yeah patrick mchenry patrick mchenry came out and said i'm looking at my buddy craig right now sitting to my right here he's got a he's got a mic but i'm not gonna let him talk that much but patrick mchenry a representative out of north carolina came out and said bitcoin the protocol developed by satoshi nakamoto and built by a bunch of other individuals after he

left the program cannot be killed any other government that has tried to kill it has been unsuccessful in that endeavor we better come to grips with the fact that bitcoin is going to survive from here into perpetuity and adapt to that that is a huge admission from somebody who is a ranking member of the house financial committee so it's him it's maxine waters and then it's him and he's like the second in command after her so having him stand up and not only did he so he started in the morning on squawk box yesterday and then he went to capitol hill and He had an opening statement, and he had questions during the hearing, and then he had a closing statement. And the closing statement, in my mind, was one of the most impassioned, needed speeches on Capitol Hill that we've seen in years, maybe decades, possibly a century.

He said unstoppable force was his words. That's crazy. Well, first of all, I love it. second of all you know i i i kind of disagree with him like i think there's ways for them to stop it but i'm i'm i'm happy with that like that's fantastic you're not mega how could they fucking stop it matthew how could they stop it i mean they'd have to get really aggressive right and that's part of his statement part of his statement was the chinese who are you know trample on on their citizens rights even they haven't been able to successfully stop it so like

The ways they'd have to do it would have to be really aggressive. Yeah, he referenced the Chinese firewall in particular, saying the Chinese firewall, something that's been a stalwart in the digital age of deflecting information from reaching Chinese citizens, has been basically ineffective in stopping Bitcoin, which is a huge admission. Do we have fifth-pillar actors in the U.S. government right now? I mean, you've got to imagine some of these guys own Bitcoin, right?

like they're supposed there's no doubt in my mind that mchenry owns bitcoin that dude has is sitting on a fat stack of bitcoin in my mind who patrick yeah patrick yeah yeah i mean i don't think he has it disclosed they have like there's some some of congress people congressmen and women i think like kirsten gillibrand had to disclose that she owned some um and so they have like an official disclosure form now that they're supposed to fill out if they own crypto No, this is something on par of Donald Trump Jr. owning Bitcoin instead of Donald Trump Sr. And he's definitely got people in his family. Actually, I shouldn't say definitely.

I'm speculating. This is huge speculation right now. I'm just jacked up, drunk. I think Jared Kushner is probably his Bitcoin guy. But maybe it's Donald Trump Jr. But yeah, so maybe he has kids who have it. maybe he it's really hard to enforce disclosures in an age of of bitcoin um because there are ways to get it with cash and there are there are ways to protect your privacy so um so so they could

own it and if they do own it they have a direct incentive to see the price go up um so you know greed rules the day in that situation right exactly right so that's the question i guess that is bubbling at the top of my mind right now like is uh the power of the potential of bitcoin powerful enough to uh swayed individual politicians into making it a reality or um is the other contingent of politicians like steve munson who came out this morning on squawk box and said that uh cash has never been used for nefarious activities um are they going to win out like is is the entrenched uh incumbent going to win this it will probably be a battle of attrition in the long run right because it is a battle of of logic and and um basically

utility at the end of the day so is steve munchin coming out this morning and saying that the u.s dollar uh cash wise like cash dollars not being used for nefarious activities sort of a framing for him to uh villainize bitcoin in your opinion um so well first of all i'd like to say joe pushed back on him on that and it was fucking beautiful to watch i i've never seen anything like that for mainstream media like that was i he keeps impressing me every single fucking time um the other thing is uh yeah mnuchin in his presser he was like constantly saying uh illicit activities he brought up terrorism he brought up drugs but he also was was pretty clear in saying that speculation is fine that if you if he's like i'm not going to comment whether

or not the price is high or low which means to me that he thinks it's low obviously um but uh But that speculation is fine. You have regulated entities in America that do KYC to you, yada, yada, yada. So the question is, they kind of seem like they're setting up a war against private Bitcoin usage and self-custody and stuff like that. But in general, with both the presser and the Libra hearings, I've come away being way more optimistic about how the U.S. government, our government, is going to is going to handle these things. I expected this was like the like the best, best possible outcome that I could see. and that's sort of where i may disagree with you is are they so that's where the ambiguity lies for me is it was very clear that munchin and the u.s government is uh sort of keen on handcuffing the on and off ramps they they want to make sure that the the on and off ramps to buying selling accessing bitcoin are completely kyc aml'd

and i think they've left open this this sort of ambiguity of like me and you not saying that we're doing this but like if we wanted to send bitcoin transactions between each other we're technically not kyc aml'd entities we're individuals sending bitcoin to each other so after this whole week i think for me that's where the most ambiguity lies is individual use of bitcoin and do you think uh they're they're i don't want to say avoiding that subject in particular but um there's their focus on institutions over individuals says anything um do you get what i'm saying yeah i mean i that's been their game plan this whole time right i mean i i don't think uh in in that respect nothing has really changed for me

because that's that's how I assumed they were going to combat this stuff that that I mean even first of all Meltem did a great job in Congress one of the things one of the things she she said she made clear is that you know you can enforce these KYC laws on a like a on a per app basis like on the fringes of the sides of the protocol you don't do it at like the you can't do it at protocol level um so so yeah i i see them can you know still pushing for that i mean look every american exchange every pretty much every exchange that officially allows americans to trade at it requires kyc now right um so will we see that start seeping into wallets and then the real issue could be um you know like thamos uh had a response to the unstoppable force comment by

patrick mchenry um where he said like one of the avenues that you could think about if they wanted to stop bitcoin would be or stop private transactions would be to attract miners to mine in america and then make those miners comply with the regs um so so yeah there there's issues um there's ways that they can attack this stuff do you think they'd be more compelled to do that in china which has been the predominant mining geography of the world up to this point yeah i mean i mean you could see a world where like the chinese miners are complying with the chinese regs and the U.S. miners are complying with the U.S. regs. And that's one of the reasons why it's so important

that you can mine through Tor, right? That's why mining distribution is important. But the question will be if there's the political will for that. And my takeaway from this week has been that that political will doesn't exist. There is way more support for Bitcoin in Washington than I thought. These guys get it way more than I thought. um so so and i hope a bunch of them just went out and bought some bitcoins so that they're

even more incentivized to continue this route like i feel have you played starfox 64 before yes you know the episode two when uh the rabbit's like it's quiet too quiet and then they get ambushed i feel like that's the point we're at right now as bitcoiners it's quiet it's too quiet it's too good why is this too good to be too good to be true it feels like there's been a concerted effort to get in front of this narrative specifically by the u.s government with pal with trump with munich and um and now the u.s senate and house of representatives like where are our blind spots i guess that's the question um if there are any to be sort of found i mean i have some blind spots in mind but i'm not i don't really want to talk about them

Like, why would I, yeah, I mean, I think that to have, like, a solid basis, like, argument about anything, like, you should know how to argue back against yourself really well. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to, why would we give them the playbook? Let's just hope that we. I agree. That was a trick question. I was testing you. No, but it's, it has honestly been a crazy, it's almost been surreal. where it's it's making me question like are they worried about the current state of the

the financial system and are they or some politicians at least trying to uh like create a quasi insurance policy by backing by backing bitcoin and and being for the free and open uh source nature of this monetary system i mean i we saw it kind of fall fall along party lines right yes which it was mostly republicans that supported well before we get into party lines can we shit on brad sherman for equating libra to oh yeah that's a good idea what a motherfucker right what a fucking asshole brad sherman his line was 9-11 was the most innovative innovative thing that's happened over the last decade was that it i yeah not decade two decades what did he say century i don't know what was his period of this century

yeah i believe of the 21st century as he was alluding to but he like even had like a visual like arm like saying like the planes flying into a building where innovation and libra is a innovation on par with that which is fucking disgusting no as it's like i feel like i can't speak to this you're a fucking new yorker like you born and raised in new york how does that make you feel as a new yorker no yeah i mean it was it was i i couldn't believe it i couldn't believe my ears i was that was i mean like you kind of could because it was fucking brad sherman right but uh that was that was a new new low for him he said he said libra could be could be worse it could be worse than 9-11 i fucking hate libra i would that's that's ridiculous

absolutely ridiculous what does that say about the state of current discourse or not even discourse but like the state of the mentality of the people in charge like if they have to defend against libra comparing it to 9-11 like how scared are they like what the like are they scared or is brad sherman just a fucking egotistical maniac looking for attention uh i i mean i think this is like their classic playbook right like that we saw this with we We saw this right after 9-11. I mean, we had the Patriot Act was put in place. They constantly, we saw with the school surveillance cameras,

they do it because they fearmonger over Sandy Hook happening. So they take fear and they weaponize the fear to get more control over the populace. It happens all the time. It's a classic move. he took it a little bit too far you know but but expect expect these guys to constantly i mean you said it great in the bent multiple days now we expect these guys to literally throw every blame it at bitcoin and environmental effects they'll blame it maybe they'll do like maybe they'll be like an actual real terrorist attack that was like partially financed by bitcoin and

then they just run it down you know run it down with it even though it was mostly financed with usd they they'll blame bitcoin so let's go down this path the so the the ongoing villainization of bitcoin as a funding mechanism for quote-unquote nefarious activities will be used as uh fear uncertainty and doubt against the system like you should not use bitcoin because it enables this thing but and that's the reason why i've been writing the bent why i have this week is because i've i feel like i've been noticing these concerted efforts by uh by individuals within entrenched institutions trying to demonize bitcoin and that's what like people fall too easily for these narratives and that's what you have to be able to call it out at face value like hey

if they're saying bitcoin will lead to terrorists and in the world ending you have to question their motives off the bat like yes it's possible that terrorists and money launderers and drug dealers can use bitcoin as a tool but what you have to realize as an individual is they can also use the fucking wheel as a tool too they can use a bike to go deal drugs to go cause a terrorist attack like these bitcoin is just a tool a monetary tool a wheel is just a tool and and what you have to realize when these politicians like brad sherman in particular come out and try to demonize bitcoin in this way uh saying you cannot use this tool you just have to realize that the tool can be used universally and people can use it in bad ways and you have to decide is it worth

not using that tool at all for everybody because somebody uses it in a bad way i would argue bitcoin in particular as a tool can be used for much more good than it will be used for bad and i think over time we will come to find that to be true and i would actually argue that the the instances which uh sherman would argue bitcoin being used as a tool for bad are are more highlighted in this current sort of fiat monetary system that we live in because it's it's easier to leverage fiat currency to do the bad shit that Sherman's talking about today. Yeah.

I mean, I couldn't agree more. Obviously, Bitcoin's a net benefit. We obviously both believe that. And as for criminals that use Bitcoin, they can catch them with good old-fashioned police work, just like they catch all the criminals that use the U.S. dollar right now. Do you believe he came out?

That's his king. Yeah. And not Sherman, but Munchen came out today and tried to say that fucking cash is not used for any nefarious purpose. Wait, did you see, like, he didn't disclose, like, supposedly he didn't disclose, like, $100 million? He had $100 million in the Caymans, dude. Just chilling in a tax haven.

Yeah, and his, you know, and Trump knows all about it, too. All these guys know about it. So, like, that's, you know, they can say what they want. Look, no one who was watching that segment believed Mnuchin, and that is a huge step forward from where we were two weeks ago, in my opinion. Like I, I literally, I watched that segment and I was like, wow, like I, I don't have to like, like the, the, our, our mainstream media reporters are starting to pick up the torch for us and we don't have to like respond to everything. It just gets responded to directly in the clip.

Like that's fantastic. Let's give another shout out to Joe Kernan, one of the hosts of Squawk Box. Is he, is he chasing Twitter clout or is he a full on Bitcoiner? What do you think? doesn't matter the incentives work either way perfect answer perfect answer but it's it's crazy to see like if because the last two days in particular in the bent and i've i've written about squat box for two days in a row i've written about cnbc for two days in a row and i would have if you told me six months ago that i was going to write about cnbc in a positive

of light two days in a row in the bent i would have been like fuck you there's no way that's happening but it is crazy to see you got to give credit where credit is due joe kernan in particular on squawk box has been asking some pretty hard questions bitcoin related to steve mucin the fucking secretary of the treasury he asked him some very hard questions that i have not seen uh a mainstream media reporter ask uh an authority figure in quite a while like he's being he was being very uh what's the word i'm looking he's very very thorough in his questioning which everybody is used to throwing up softballs and getting back sort of scripted answers that they're they're expecting but i feel like joe the last couple days last week in particular has been

being a bit more um a bit more of like a thorn in the side of authority that that you're not used to seeing in the mainstream media yeah and you know like his co-host sorkin for a while was like was like the crypto guy on the show but he's like pretty statist so like he always oh he's very statist yeah yeah so he always let us down and now we have like i don't know he's just he's he seems like a bit corner he seems like he gets it you know and he's asking the right questions and i fucking love it it's fucking dope that's all you can why why is it this hard to get mainstream media reporters and journalists to be good journalists and good reporters like this is it's it blows my mind that joe kernan this week has been refreshing and it's like oh my god thank

god he's asking these questions like why do you have to say that i think one of the reasons is I Joe's not restricted from purchasing any assets right that he talks about like I'm assuming he's active in the stock market and stuff right yeah what I'm at he's not bk where he's running a fund and has to pump like nautilus coin and ripple and all that shit but I mean I actually think that's positive I think part of the reason we've had such issues is if you're a mainstream journalist covering bitcoin you think it's ethically impure for you or sometimes your organization says you can't own bitcoin so like if you're someone like popper for instance like nathaniel popper like you wrote a book in 2013 about bitcoin digital gold buy any right so now

you're just sitting here and you're just super salty like he's just everything he and it's not even his fault like he i would be salty too like like i would be so salty in that situation his article this week was salty as fuck what did he say he said um i don't want to say i don't want to say this outright but i think it was something like akin to like bitcoin is for like not terrorists what what do you say he like he came out with an article yesterday which was like completely anti-bitcoin like bitcoin's not working it's an index for measuring the desire to launder money in the world yeah it's an index for tom or craig here reads the new york times and it's an index for laundering money throughout the world.

That's not what it is. It's ridiculous. Yeah, so I feel like in that way, like kind of these like ethical disclosures or whatever, actually they hurt the journalistic integrity, right? Because like, well, first of all, they all have stake in the USD, right? They all have stake in like the current economy.

So they're not even unbiased from the story begin with and then the second thing is like if you actually get bitcoin then your i i think your immediate next realization is holy shit i need to make sure i get as much bitcoin as possible before everyone else does which is i mean that was my realization so you how do you level those two like how does someone get it not buy any and then stick around still be a reporter in like four years still covering it right and have the experience because all this stuff takes time and you need to actually like learn about it and you know educate yourself and yeah i don't know i i feel like in a lot of ways the disclosure uh the the like but so buy some and disclose it but

they don't even do that they just say we disclose i don't own any that's why we're lucky here at tftc where we don't have to worry about that uh traditional finance financial journalistic burden of i mean obviously we own bitcoin but oh i i actually don't own any bitcoin i think it would hurt my journalistic integrity dude yeah i came up here on a flight today actually dropped my uh my hardware wallet out the plane fucking lost all of it i'm gonna start rebuilding though here you go complimenting air canada then and then they lose your hardware wallet that's too much they got too much goddamn leg space it's too much too much area to lose your fucking hardware wallet i'm gonna call them hopefully i'll find it um but yeah we'll figure it out but

it is uh it's been a weird week dude like what's the uh so let's go back to the hearings what is this week meant for libra will libra launch will it not has it been good has it been bad is it just temporary noise that politicians wanted to hop on and talk about and they'll forget about in a week or two or is this like a serious like motherfuckers this isn't going to happen yeah i mean i think the odds of it launching just went down significantly and i mean i i think it's exactly what we were saying we've been saying for a while now is like they either aren't allowed to launch or the reason they're allowed to launch is because they bend the knee like tremendously and then it's clearly not competing with bitcoin so how about david marcus giving the e-corp behind the closed doors

fucking pitch to to the federal bank and the in the senate in front of the senate banking committee like he literally said we will work with you we will track transactions we will do kyc aml we will do whatever you want we'll make it happen just follow us and for like you're david if you're listening to this right now i know the leader of facebook libra listens to this podcast you're supposed to do that behind closed doors bro do not do that in front of the whole public they know the charade is up as soon as you do that yeah he also said the e-corp line which was uh like if you don't if you don't let us do it like china will do it and then we'll all be using the chinese version yeah so what does that say about the current state of uh corporations and in cryptocurrency

are they completely far gone are they too far gone will they ever come around will they ever adopt bitcoin can i just say that like mr robot was just i feel like it's like bitcoin research at this point and right it was too perfect dude literally word for word i was listening to him on it was tuesday give his testimony about how they would basically make it so any central bank or government could know who's using the libra cryptocurrency it's like you are giving the e-corp pitch in like in front of the whole world it was almost word for word it was almost verbatim dude yeah i mean i agree with you i mean that's that that is the pitch that they should be making but to make it in public is pretty i mean it's it shows that they're that they're worried right

that they don't think that it'll launch otherwise they need to like point it out straight up to the congressman this is what we're going to do for you well i think that may be the biggest uh sort of thing to gleam from the rest of this week is that Bitcoin, maybe not even Bitcoin specifically, but cryptocurrency and disgustingly quote-unquote digital assets and crypto

is on the radar of governments and institutions around the world and they're trying to react to it, but I feel like after observing the last seven days of announcements and hearings that these people are way out of their depth. Am I wrong? Am I naive in saying that?

Should we underestimate our, I don't even want to call them an enemy, but should we underestimate the people that are competing with us on a monetary scale? I thought they got it more than I expected. I mean, I had a low bar set, but they beat all my expectations. They seem to, in general, understand it more than I expected. I think it's always a bad idea to underestimate anyone. you should always go with you know go with caution but I think that the divide between them was way bigger than I expected and I think that Bitcoin has a

lot of defenders in our Congress and I and I think I I think that time is ticking I think the longer it takes to make any kind of definitive action against bitcoin the stronger bitcoin gets the more people own bitcoin the harder it'll be to have the political will to do anything about it and i think these sessions while i wish they happened later on uh they happened sooner than i expected because of libra because facebook kind of forced the hand um i think they show that uh we're still a bit off from any kind of real political will or you know to do some kind of definitive action trying to like really um basically i i the way you would like the what we would see is like a clamp down on self-custody

basically i think which would be you can't withdraw your coins no so you get an audience with any speaker you want any senator you want what is your pitch to them other than them buying will with the millennials of the world of like yeah i'm up on cryptos i get it this is the future what is your pitch to them of why it benefits them and their pursuit of yeah uh re-election or benefiting their constituent i mean i i i think i think bitcoin is better money and i think that it's going to be pretty damn hard to stop so i i think you should want your constituents to have access to the best money we've ever had otherwise you know we'll get left behind like america will get left behind yeah no and i think

harping back to your your previous comments like today this week if anything was like an illumination of the uh i don't want to say inconsistency but um so the lack of coordinated understanding on behalf of the government which like you alluded to works in our favor like the more confused they are this is the better way to describe it this week if anything has uh highlighted the confusion that exists between uh individual regulators and regulatory agencies between each other that have to coordinate to make regulation about this and they don't even know how to fucking communicate about this between each other let alone communicating to the greater public about it and and setting policy about it so i think this works in our

advantage more than more than anything is is a lack of understanding from our incumbent government system yeah but like i said i just think they understand it more than i expected you know i was i was i was pleasantly surprised but that might not be a good thing but i just I it seemed like they in general they understand I wasn't like ripping my hair out screaming at the screen you know I was like oh yeah that's like pretty close right yeah no yeah it was like a very and there was a long long hearing both days the second day was like six hours first day It was like eight hours, like 14 hours of hearing between Tuesday and yesterday. But we've spent 37 minutes on this topic, and Matt's got a closing comment on this topic.

One more thing is the Mnuchin presser started this all off, and he took a question and answer at the end of his presser. And there was like a couple questions trickled in, and they weren't very good questions. and then he was like finally he's like okay we could take non-cryptocurrency questions and like a million reporters wanted to ask him about Harriet Tubman on the $20 bill so still as far as mindshare goes of the American populace like this is not something people are concerned about right like they're more concerned about who which face is on the 20 so we can take and that yeah and white supremacy i felt bad for him at that point like is that i don't want to get too i'm drunk right now i'm at a bachelor party but that particular instance of that press

conference was like are you fucking kidding me journalists like this is a dude the secretary of the treasury i don't love him i'm not a big fan of him but like he has a a core competency that he's focused on he's not gonna fucking answer whether or not donald trump is racist like i don't want to get too far into it and matt wait let me hit you because i've been listening to this idiot all day for four hours and three bottles of wine what is what is that little snippet to the common layman that says be interested in this and tell your rep to be interested in this like what about it benefits their life where they get excited about it i have a speculative interest but beyond that i'm still waiting to be convinced he's looking for the human rights cause or

anything sell me you know i i think i think bitcoin like i said earlier i think bitcoin is the best money we've ever had um and i i think that it's very low adoption right now so i think that if you buy it now like the price should go up it's like that's the thesis so uh your your congressman shouldn't stop you from from getting into the best money that's ever existed right now while people in china are doing it while people in turkey are doing it while people all around the world are doing it and you're not allowed to do it like that doesn't sound like a free country to me so this is some very american at all does it no um but we spent 40 minutes on the topic of the the conversation of the last week it is

probably not going to go away anytime soon this will probably just heat up from here like we like we were talking about last week we were we hopped on right after trump's tweet like we were freaking out about trump's tweet last week that feels like six months ago at this point and we're on to the next topic and actually this is important topic that we should touch on and talk about pretty thoroughly uh the wasabi uh the wasabi information that's come to light over the last couple days apparently it's not even apparent is if you are mixing with wasabi and you have more than the the minimum uh mixing limit and you're gonna have uh change with your with your original mixes that that change dust may follow you throughout your mix so

it's something to be aware of and then on top of that if you're creating uh new wallets within wasabi you have to double triple quadruple check that you close out of the software before you open that new wallet because you could get stuck um uh putting utxos in a wallet that that is not uh what you think it is right you can be putting while you can be putting utxos in an old wallet of which you forgot the passphrase. The example we're using right now off the top of my head is Vake, our buddy Vake. He fucked this.

He didn't fuck it up, but he had a kerfuffle, if you will. Yeah, he lost a million sats on it. He lost 10 million sats on it. For the second thing, the key is to switch wallets in Wasabi, you close out the software. Okay. It gives you a warning. It shows a little yellow warning on it when you, when you do it, switch out of the software. Um, the first thing these are, we've known this, um, uh, one of the guys from the samurai team, uh, wrote it out really well, um, to, to really, um, illustrate the issue here. Um, so the issue is obviously, uh, so if,

you put in five bitcoin into wasabi um it splits it up into uh utxos that are that are the size of the coin join round because everyone has to have the same amount um which in this case is is 0.1 bitcoin um so when it does that it's shaving it off every time right so it takes a five and then it makes it 4.9 and a 0.1 and mixes the 0.1 um as it does that that original utxo you can track it as it's like dropping off the shaving shaving fees throughout the whole way right right now this is not completely true the whole time because because wasabi does mixed other amounts if if someone else has like a 0.8 utxo and you can mix a 0.8 utxo it'll it'll do a one round with them or whatever like it'll also shave off other ones but and and the best way you can

combat that is by making sure to remix um you want to do at least at least a second round and one of the ways to do that to do that without doing extra manual remixes is to set your default anonymity set to at least over 100 so if you set it to like 101 then it automatically does at least two rounds of wasabi um for every utxo you have the second thing is that change you have at the at the very end we the unmixed change you have at the end is like the most toxic change is is is the way i think about it because it's basically followed you through the whole mixing stuff right right exactly so that change you have to be like very careful with you should never be combining your change. And to also reduce this attack vector, you should not combine your outputs

as much as possible. So this really does highlight the main issue here with all these privacy tools is that there's a lot of pitfalls in the way to use them, right? It takes a lot of user interaction. And if a user fucks up one little thing, then they could compromise their privacy. So you have to be very careful. Samurai attempts to get around this by doing the method where they have, it's a transaction zero, which puts it into the premix. So you can do them all at once. So they basically pay the fee up front. They pay the fee up front and then mix after that, right?

Right. And then you have unlimited remixes. so so they their claim is that it's harder to analyze that and it seems like that is possibly the case um but uh but either way i mean i mean look in this situation i guess what like i mean you could use both in combination um you could use it to spend i mean one of the issues here is the unmixed change in wasabi can be like nine million sats or something like it could be just under the 0.1 amount um and like that's decent amount of money so like i don't see people just leaving that change there uh but you have to like be very careful about it and and and so

wasabi goes with the coin control method uh where they expect you to properly you know use those utxos afterwards and send them uh without leaking additional privacy without combining them in certain ways and stuff like that and samurai on the other hand um basically has a mixed pool and an unmixed pool is in the wallet is the is is the ultimate goal and that's what they have right now but it'll it'll be even better ui wise when they overhaul it and they have their their post spend transaction types where you can basically like simulate a coin join among your own wallet or with a friend or something like that so when you actually do the spend the final spend is also a coin joint itself um so hopefully we see like wasabi implement some stuff like that as well

um you know yeah these are these are things that you have to keep in mind all the time um my would you would you agree that uh this stuff is somewhat temporary like if we were to get snore signatures and have the ability to do p2ep payments this would be completely irrelevant or Or is that a false assumption? I mean, I think, you know, Schnorr helps, especially on, like, the cost side. And, you know, if you have, like, MewSig or, you know, some kind of Sig aggregation, then, you know, it helps on the cost side. uh and but it's it's i it's still not you know i i think the key here is better ux on the on the wallet side right like we need we need the tools to be like as foolproof as possible

um and i i think like we'll see hopefully we'll see um i mean and look this is the samurai's goal is is like a holistic um view of it right so like you receive with a paynim you like run the dojo node you mix with whirlpool you spend with stonewall like they i think that's probably the route that wasabi will have to take as well where you're basically if you don't control the whole process it becomes too hard for the user to um because like look at the end of the day like it doesn't you could add snore you could add snore and you do p2ep transactions and like you look up your balance on like a block explorer or something and you're fucked you're right so like there's like the it's the the privacy guarantees aren't strong enough and i've been saying this for a

but they're way stronger like the the the improvements wasabi and samurai have made to uh accessible bitcoin privacy are massive and especially when you couple that with you know um with lightning yeah funding lightning nodes um that are running through tour uh so so i'm optimistic on that front and i like to see competition among it's good that we have more than one team working on this uh and but but it is more difficult when when when this different sides embellish claims and stuff like everyone should just our goal here should be to make using bitcoin privately as easy and as effective as possible um like regardless of the software you're using i would completely agree and i think that's one thing that you freaks out there

let you freaks out there but like we all not you freaks i'm sorry for for being drunk being drunk and disrespectful in that way but we should all notice is that yeah this is something that you have to work on it's something you have to be aware of and let's just be up front like that's something i was trying to do this week in the bent let's Just be up front with the capabilities, the vulnerabilities, and the boundaries that you're working within. And privacy in Bitcoin is not perfect right now. And the way that you achieve privacy is, I don't want to call it janky, but it's not straightforward. And it does take work and it does take sort of minding what you're doing at each step of the way.

And the more you know about each privacy solution, the better. and that's what we're trying to do here so with wasabi in particular something we've been pumping for a while and um something that we're still very i i would still use wasabi just be cognizant of how you're using it and and what can happen matt i your point you know i i i just i i think that people like shouldn't be dissuaded from using either wasabi or whirlpool or both um um the key here is no matter what you're increasing you're using you're you're you're getting more privacy than you were before um but wasabi without the coin join is still the absolutely best way to access your hardware wallet and especially if you have your own node

which you should then it's very easy to connect to your own node if it's running on your own computer it automatically works it connects to your connects right to your hardware wallet like that's super useful that is the i in my mind that's the the best setup in terms of of easily using your hardware wallet privately um yeah and and i i think these things will improve and and hopefully we'll see you know what the wasabi team's response is here but uh if if none of these none of these tools should be used in like life or death situations on their own like if if you absolutely need it like you should be layering things on top of each other so that if any individual thing is fucked like you're in a in a in a good situation whether that's a centralized

mixer whether that's going into you know an altcoin exchange and then coming back out whether whether that's you know switching into a a like monero or something and switching back or paying with monero stuff like that like you have to layer these things on top of each other uh for now would you because of the privacy guarantees so layering it on top of each other would you analogize that to something like uh hashing a password like for final message when you when you hash the password and send it is mixing this through wasabi and then samurai similar to that obviously it's not perfectly similar but it's a a better guarantee than than one over the other yeah I mean I yeah I think the idea is just that is is that you're you're reducing the trust in

any given uh tool to work the way you think it's working right so they that multiple like in terms of like final message for instance like if you use it with like a multi-sig key it not only is it encrypted but if for some reason the encryption was compromised if they got it they would just have a single multi-sig key there's nothing they can do with that they can't take your funds right so um it's important to and that this is like if you're using it in like a life or death situation right um if you're just you know if you're if you're trying to privately hold bitcoin um and you you know you did kyc at an exchange like cash app or something like that and and you don't want your government to know like the exact amount you have um then it's you know it's it's a

different threat model than if you're like a political dissident or something like that right so you have to um and because because keep in mind when you layer these things they get more expensive right um but but like yeah for like if you went into yeah yeah i i just it's this has always been the issue with bitcoin privacy uh it's less so the issue now and i think it'll continue to get better hopefully yeah speaking of uh allocating resources to it to another software uh vitalik buterin came out this week and said that they're thinking about or he would posit that ethereum should should store some data in the bitcoin cash chain before they transition to Ethereum 2.0.

There's a big admission by Vitalik earlier this week that, hey, the Ethereum 1.0, 1.x chain, whatever you want to reference it as, is getting a little too fat, and they may need to expedite some data storage to other blockchains. What are your thoughts, Matt? And also, in terms of privacy,

cash is still king. If you want the most privacy, use cash. not according to steve mnuchin yeah not according to mnuchin correct um i uh i completely with everything that went on i completely forgot about this uh announcement this blog post until i was like well it was like one of the last things i added to to the rhr agenda and i was like oh my god i completely fucking forgot about it uh how is it i thought it was like an april fool's joke or something like i just couldn't believe that that was the reality um that he meant that with a straight face he said the one of the most crazy parts of the whole announcement

um the block time what yeah like him shitting on the block time like oh the only the main drawback of this is the 10 minute block time it's like what the fuck are you talking about that's the only drawback that's what he came up with when the drawback of using bitcoin cash just a completely insecure chain that has checkpoints and no usage has been double spent and has been 51 percent attacked in the last six months your biggest your biggest gripe is their block time what the fuck is going on yeah i don't know i haven't i hope they use the bitcoin cash chain to store data you know like whatever that's great would that be enough incentive to 51 percent attack uh bitcoin cash into oblivion i don't know i'm surprised i'm surprised it doesn't get

51 percent and more since you can short it on max um right that's what confused me this week because i thought he would have come out and said let's do it to bsv because you can't short that oh but you can actually i found out you can short bsv on finx so i'm surprised they don't get 51 percent attack more i guess like you need actual like activity on the chain to fully profit from like a like if if you have actual activity on the chain then you can get guaranteed profit by by doing an attack um but if there's no activity on the chain then you're just banking on the price falling and i don't know if that's actually a guarantee with these e-liquid uh forks because you know i mean look at when etc got 51 percent attack it went up at first because people were

like talking about it yeah so so then you like get liquidated you like did the attack and then like it moves in the wrong direction and yeah so i don't know it's weird it's too dumb but maybe if they start storing data on the bitcoin cash chain then fees will go up um which would also be hilarious unless they raise the block size and then if fees go up then then maybe it'll be worth it the 51 attack maybe they'll just keep increasing the block size maybe nodes will start failing that'll be fun maybe they're right you know maybe that's the way to scale this shit well so he proposed it as like a stop gap for it's like it's like eth 1.5 right it's like a way to test eth 2.0 but with that x oh and that's another thing so uh for you freaks that are unaware uh ethereum

set a deadline for eth 2.0 to be launched uh the 11th anniversary of the bitcoin genesis block uh january 3rd 2020 came out this week that that is not the deadline eth 2.0 will not be ready by then um whoever put that deadline out there is an idiot they're dumb they don't know what they're talking about it's going to take way longer um which has been made made evident this week but one thing we don't have to harp on that i've got plenty of threads on how ethereum will never transition to prove a stake but one thread i want to focus on right now is your thread matthew on uh the centralization factor of exchanges allowing people to stake on their exchange and And this week, Binance came out and said people will be allowed to stake Stellar on Binance soon, correct?

It's even funnier than that. They've been accidentally staking for like the last six months. Wait, what? Yeah, they didn't realize. How do you accidentally stake? They didn't realize. They brought like the Stellar team in to like set up the wallet or something. And I guess like staking was enabled and they just realized.

So they have like 3% more Stellar than they thought? They have a lot. Wait, what did I put in the link? It's crazy how much they have. So what they're doing is they announced that they're going to allow you to stake it. It'll be the fifth chain that they're supporting for staking. And one of the things I theorized in this thread, which is from 2017, is that exchanges will actually incentivize people to stake by rewarding them more than they would get otherwise

because the exchange makes up for it in the fact that first of all they are a larger validator of the network so they have more influence and second of all you'll stay at their casino and spend money um so what they're doing is they're going to give all those rewards proportionally out um in the next the next month um so they're trying to draw people in right now yeah exactly so like you'll get basically the equivalent of a year's worth of staking in one month if you stake with them right now. They accidentally staked

9.5 million Stellar Lumens. That's almost a million dollars. $775,000 worth of Stellar they accidentally staked. Stellar's worth like 90 cents right now? If your math was correct, I don't feel like looking it up.

I don't think it's correct, but it might be. But yeah, I... Yeah, continue. For you freaks that may be new to Tales from the Crypt, Matt is somebody who's very on top of this very particular trend of exchanges staking proof of stake coins. And Matt can do a far better job than I can at explaining the inherent risk that comes with exchanges staking on behalf of users. Matt, dive into it. Yeah, I mean, basically, we already have the issue that exchanges have too much influence, too much control.

I mean, we saw, first of all, they choose what they list, which we saw that type of style attack almost happened with SegWit2x until the market pushed back. So it's hard to do it against something like Bitcoin, but you could see it working against some of the altcoins where like Binance got into a fight with Craig Wright and they like delisted SV, which was hilarious. this gives exchange all of a sudden the exchanges aren't just the exchanges now they're also basically your miners of your network right they're the validators the stakers of your network they're securing your network now do you want binance to be like one of the top validators

of your network like i think that's pretty obvious to people that that's a bad idea not only does it give binance a lot more power binance is a very easy to target organization they have banking relationships they have stuff like that they're a multinational organization like like if they want to pressure them um they have a really big target on their back not not even just being a validator they already have a target on their back now imagine if they start staking they're already staking five chains now imagine if binance is like the number one validator for like 10 different chains like then they don't even have like loyalty to your chain at all either right like there's no and then they have loyalty the most profitable i was gonna say

they have loyalty to the most profitable at that point right right exactly and then the users the users are giving up their control um usually and my my theory is for for better payouts whether that's quicker payouts whether that's more amount of money um because the exchange can offer that um and it depends which system you know because there's all these different proof of stake systems being floated about and stuff like that but in some cases there's thresholds that need to be made and in terms of how much you need deposited so so there's already a direct incentive for for uh smaller smaller holders to to have to go to these exchanges to stake i mean they could use they could use like some kind of pool uh but but like i said i i think

exchanges will make it convenient for them they will make it potentially more give them more rewards than they would have otherwise and just make it overall really easy and the same reason we see um coinbase holding hundreds of thousands of bitcoin because people don't want to take custody of their own coins we'll see the same thing but even more so for proof of stake chains and don't even get me started with what will happen when like the proof of stake chain etfs happen and like if that happens like that's crazy like imagine like an ethereum etf with proof of stake then all of a sudden you know you yeah i'm down on the etfs i'm not as bullish on them as i was before we don't need etfs they're bear instruments you can get access to them directly

like why do you even fucking need an etf no i mean i agree but i think they're inevitable and i i think with bitcoin there's no risk to them i mean there's risks to the people holding the ETF shares. Are the coins actually there? Will it follow the chain that I want it to follow? Is it going to go off on some bullshit KYC fork or something? You know, not your keys, not your coins, all those issues. But for Bitcoin, the system, there's no negative effect from a large holder, whether that's an ETF or whether that's an exchange. But in proof of stake, large holders are also large validators and it becomes extra risky sorry dumb question uh etf goes into my traditional finance world why is an etf beneficial in cryptocurrency so in my opinion an etf for

bitcoin just from the consolidation of supply or the concentration of supply dynamic uh is risky in many regards it's not as risky as a proof of stake coin so proof of stake coin uh with bitcoin is proof of work i'm explaining proof of work for proof of stake to my buddy on the bachelor party here so proof of stake craig craig so proof of stake means that you need to have a certain amount of supply of a certain coin to basically validate the chain up to that point in history so you have to put up a bunch of capital uh denominated in the cryptocurrency of that particular chain. We'll use Ethereum as an example. They picture themselves transitioning to proof of stake at some point. And so at some point in the future, people want

to put up a certain amount of Ether to basically validate that chain, the Ethereum chain, and they'll get rewarded via interest rates for that. Whereas Bitcoin is a proof of work system where you have to expend a bunch of computing energy to prove that something happened at some certain point of time and if you do that you are rewarded with bitcoin right away you don't have to stake bitcoin you have to have a certain amount of bitcoin you just have to have hardware and software running you don't have to have capital well you do have to have capital to uh pay for that hardware um that runs the software but it's it's arguably much less than the the capital that you would need to to gain a certain amount of stake in a proof of stake system and what matt

is describing here is exchanges are uh naturally uh sort of via gravity and and centralization factors they they they accrue a lot of supply so in a proof-of-work system uh which is happened to date like coinbase square uh tcgb they have a lot of bitcoin supply but they do not have any effect on the consensus of Bitcoin. The fact that they have a lot of Bitcoin has no effect on whether or not something is validated. Where in a proof of stake, if you have a lot of a supply and you stake that supply, you have a say in the consensus of the system. And this is a very fundamental difference between proof of work and proof of stake. The argument for proof of stake is that it takes a lot of less compute energy. So it's quote unquote better for the environment.

But what a lot of idiots don't realize is that the capital expended to acquire the amount of stake needed to validate a chain is almost equivalent to the amount of energy expended in a proof-of-work system. Paul Stork at truthcoin.info has pointed this out a lot. Is that accurate, Matthew? Yeah, that was pretty good, especially considering how drunk you are. Wait, wait, wait. Let me just do my one thing. the only thing i can add here isn't the idea of an etf someone big out there gets to go out and buy all these things that would be prohibitive for me as an individual to access and i get to

access it in this pulled vehicle where isn't a crypto always supposed to be accessible to me efficiently as an individual isn't that the point of it exactly exactly so that's why i would say you do not need an etf you can you can buy it directly like why buy the derivative when you can buy the bear exactly it should be accessible to me without big markups or margins or whatever exactly okay thank you for proving our point except that two things the an etf makes access easier because people are comfortable with etfs they're not comfortable with storing their own bitcoin they might still want exposure to the price of bitcoin but they're 60 years old they can't send an email and but they know how to use td ameritrade or call their broker up um so so it

does give it does give further access to people um it's not make or break we don't need an etf i think it's a net positive though um i think i think from bitcoin's perspective it's a net positive because uh it'll make the number go up and the price you know because more people buy bitcoin the higher the price goes um and i think for for the average like tech illiterate person like it gives them the ability to get some exposure um we've seen robin hood uh be very successful with that and they they don't allow you to custody you're not allowed to take your take your coins off you're just able to get exposure and people use that and the reason people use that those people i think wouldn't be buying bitcoin otherwise they they would not be able to go

through the process to and it'll get easier it'll get easier to store your own coins in the future but but right now it's it's easier than it's ever been but it's still you know you you still have to have some kind of tech literacy yes and the difference between a proof of work chain like bitcoin if you allocate your custody to an etf versus a proof of stake coin like it or ethereum's not proof of stake yet a proof of stake coin if you allocate that to the etf the etf and a proof of stake system would then be able to validate that chain and dictate basically the rules of that chain where to prove a work chain like bitcoin that's simply not possible just because you own a bunch doesn't mean you get to dictate the rules well miners don't dictate the rules

just to be clear exactly exactly but validators do right and approve a stake system well i mean you still have nodes that are running that aren't uh that that aren't staking nodes um yes but yeah but yeah you wouldn't you wouldn't want control over block creation and stuff like that to be held by the largest holders exactly um it's been a fun episode what do you think this week is this week the most bullish week ever or the most uh like questionable week ever like are you are you more nervous more bullish more bearish than you were at this point last week you were calling 13k let's not forget you're calling for 13k by monday last week um where are we right now that didn't happen uh i think we're like at 10 5 or something last i checked unless it collapsed while we were

recording um i do feel the same way i don't want to say it because i don't want to like jinx us or something but i guess i just kind of said it so maybe i don't know maybe maybe we crash here i don't know but i feel really bullish i'm always feeling bullish but this feels like particularly bullish um before we wrap up there is one uh they updated sea lightning um that i wanted to just touch on real quick because what's really cool about this update to sea lightning is um they added uh what they're calling external wallet funding so now it's possible to open channels from hardware wallets and open multiple channels with one transaction which means also basically fund LN channels

with CoinJoin with other people. You know, so it's the actual funding transaction for the channel is a CoinJoin that funds multiple channels. This is pretty cool. So it's like layered anonymity. Anonymity. Anonymity. Anonymity.

There we go. I'm sorry. I'm drunk slurring right now. Yeah, but I'll let you go to the bachelor party and we can touch on any of the other topics. No, but before we leave here, one thing that we didn't touch on, and we're probably not going to touch on in depth here, but we've promised we will touch on is BNP, uh, LN is the, the, the, the vernacular for the Bitcoin stack. And it's something we've been meaning to touch

on. We promise people we touch on it a little too drunk to talk about it tonight, but we will get to the vernacular of the Bitcoin stack because I think it does need some clarifying. Yes. And we also have not forgot about you. 100 M Satoshi. We will, we also, we will demystify the blocks we will demystify the blocks actually thank you for saying that i gotta look up um before we're gonna end it on shout outs here i like ending it on shout outs it's a good idea let me pull it up let me pull it up give me a sec here do you have anything you want to riff on before we pull up the shout outs i uh i played with the bitbox uh my first impressions are uh it's all right uh i still

love the cold card uh you were right the bitbox does have an sd card slot um it's for the backup i was right they don't um they don't have like the feature where you can you know ferry transactions using the sd card and also what and they actually don't even give you a seed backup they just back up to the sd card what i didn't like about that was the sd card is not encrypted so kind of questionable not sure about that as a backup method um what was nice about the cold card is not only could you make backups with the sd card if you wanted um they also gave you a seed and when you made a backup with the sd card uh it was encrypted by default and the password they gave you is a 12 word seed so like if someone finds that 12 word seed they'll probably think it's a

wallet they probably won't even think it's a password to your cold card backup like i mean unless you have like a podcast and like you talk about it on air then then they might know then they might find you somehow and and figure out what you're doing you know if you're just going to talk about this willy-nilly all right we got one shout out here it goes oh wrong one give me a second oh yeah here it is calling all bulls for the first annual uabm or user-activated bull market on Saturday, July 20th. That's two days from now. Saturday, July 20th, 2019, the 50th anniversary of the US moon landing, simply market by Bitcoin at 000UTC time. The Bitcoin lawyer on Twitter, at Bitcoin underscore lobby, at Bitcoin underscore L-O-B-B-Y,

calling all bitcoin bulls for the first annual uabm or user activated bull market this saturday at zero utc cheers to that motherfucker that's that's 8 p.m eastern time i just looked it up 8 p.m eastern this saturday user user activated bull market i'm down i'll stack some stats if you haven't us if you haven't downloaded the cash app yet use the promo code stacking stats and then come stack sats with us at 8 p.m eastern this saturday okay that was my favorite theory for why the price crashed was because uh people stopped using lolly for prime day for prime day i i hand up i was one of those people sorry i would i would love to see how much like i wish we could see the books to see how much how much bitcoin lolly lolly users accumulate every week it's got to be high

numbers alex if you're listening just tell us just just tweet at us let us know matt we've been away from each other for too long next week we're going to be in the studio together we've got a great bottle we got to give a shout out to uh our buddy matthew case from seattle who gave us a fucking crazy bottle of whiskey that we're going to enjoy together next week oh did he really give us a bottle oh yes he gave us a very good bottle oh is that the heritage is heritage distillery or It showed up this morning right before I hopped on my flight. Oh, my God. Fuck yes.

Thank you, Matt. That's awesome. Matt. Not the Matt I'm looking at, but the Matt we're talking about. Thank you for that bottle. We'll be enjoying it in person. I can't wait to see you in person. I haven't seen you in like fucking a month.

It's going to be lit. All right. That's all we got for this week, freaks. Stay humble and stack sets. Peace and love. Peek-a-boo!