TFTC: A Bitcoin Podcast - Rabbit Hole Recap: Week of 2020.10.19

Episode Date: October 23, 2020

This week Mart and Matt discuss: - two LND vulnerabilities disclosed - v0.9 and below - v0.10 and below - Paypal adds "bitcoin" - Our boy Paul shills the corn again - coinbase transparency report - FinCEN fines custodial bitcoin mixing CEO $60M - Travel rule white paper & participants - BTCPay Server v1.0.5.8 - Bisq v1.4.2 - Phoenix v1.4.0 - Breez RC1 - Tails v4.12 - Tor browser v10.0.2 - Raspiblitz v1.6.1 - Sparrow v0.9.6 - Voltage cloud lightning node service launched - Hodl Hodl adds P2P bitcoin lending support - BitMEX speeding up KYC process - Bitcoin hit piece by CNAS - Thai authorities attempting to block access to telegram Shoutout to this week's sponsors: Unchained Capital. Check out their white glove vault concierge service that will take you from zero to secure multisig setup in no time. Use the code TFTC and receive $50 off that package that includes 2 Trezor Model Ts and $1,000 in your vault. Cash App. Start #stackingsats today. Use the promo code: "stackingsats" to receive $10 and contribute $10 to OWLS Lacrosse when you download the app.

get in bitch we're headed to the moon what a week matthew pretty exciting what did you just pop there uh i popped the last of my oh fuck octantotion that was a good effort yeah every time i try and pronounce it though i have freaks in my dms telling me how to pronounce it and then i'm gonna switch to some obon uh taking a cheat day in sober october here i'm going to join you with the whiskey considering the uh the vibe of the week had a freak semi uh some premium four grain blended bourbon whiskey ghostwood from montana embrace the unknown shout out to that freak you haven't had a very sober October Marty huh it could be more sober it could be a bit drier I feel like you lied to me in the

freaks but I guess you lied to yourself as well well at least I'm I'm not saying I'm not drinking you know at least I'm not lying right now I'm being forthright that's fair that's fair gotta count the wins where they are anyway Marty cheers cheers to the corn and to the freaks cheers to you cheers to the corn cheers to this day it's beautiful it's beautiful up in long island as well yeah it's gorgeous yeah um got a surf session and today felt good vibes are high we're above 13 000 right now let's just jump into clark's dashboard we are at 13 124 dollars uh you're the amount of satchel able to buy with one dollar is going down significantly right now you can only purchase 7620 sats with one dollar the market cap is up to 243.2 billion dollars uh right now

bitcoin will buy you 6.9 ounces of gold one bitcoin uh at 1.97 percent of an ounce of gold or excuse me the gold market cap is the bitcoin market cap and right now you can buy 131 barrels of oil with one bitcoin we're at block 653,880 nice even number i like that a lot uh reachable nodes approaching 11,000 we're at 10,960 uh we had a retarget last saturday it was on the wrong row here on the wrong column excuse me it was a 3.6 percent upwards difficulty adjustment right now though we are scheduled to have another difficulty adjustment on halloween so next saturday and as of right now it seems that hash rate has left the network and we are going to have a downward difficulty adjustment in 1320 blocks that is estimated to be negative

negative 7.3 mining depth spiral blocks are currently coming into 10 minutes and 48 seconds It's on average, and the scuttlebutt in the mining industry is that the rainy season in China is coming to an end. What does scuttlebutt mean? Scuttlebutt, I think that's like the whisper is the grapevine, what you're hearing through the grapevine. I could be wrong. I'm pretty sure that's what it means.

So that's what people are talking about in the mining industry. Apparently, rainy season in China is coming to an end and the cheap power that the rainy season provides is coming to an end as well, so these miners have to unplug and try to find new homes for those miners. I mean, that's a known thing. That happens every year.

Yes. Shout out to the Three Gorges band for not breaking. It's something we fear-mongered about earlier. Only you fear-mongered about it, Marty. I tried to bet you, and you wouldn't take that bet, so... Well, yeah, it's like a bad bet to take. Let the record show. Record.

Stamp it. it's currently 52 503 transactions in clark moody's mempool uh pending fees oh in the mempool not next block uh 7.51 bitcoin and pending fees uh predicted next block uh has over a bitcoin worth of fees though the reward is predicted to be 7.42 bitcoin so one point fee eFOMO has begun. 1.17 Bitcoin in fees, 15.76% of the total reward. I'd like to see that stack go up. Still, though, if you want to send a transaction with a one-sat-per-byte fee

and you're willing to wait a week, it seems that you can do that. Presumably. We don't know for sure. We'll only find out in a week if there are people who try to send one-sat-per-byte transactions and did so successfully. Right now, according to Clark's dashboard, you can send, if you're willing to wait a day, a transaction for two sats a byte uh we have the weekend coming up uh so if you're if you're lower time preference maybe wait for that immediate next block sat per byte recommendation

per the dashboard is 135 sats i mean it's cleared every weekend uh this year so yeah it'll be interesting to see if it doesn't clear this weekend then maybe what'll be interesting to see is how the uh the transaction congestion around bitmax daily withdrawal changes well obviously it's less because there's less way less volume yeah how does that affect the the fee market though is that a noticeable i don't think i mean that's more on the daily cycle right than the yeah yeah than the weekly cycle i could really the daily cycle matters less to me uh it was kind of annoying if you needed to send a transaction like 15 minutes after bitmex sent out their transactions though

uh unspent capacity on samurai whirlpool up above 1600 bitcoin 1625.53 kind of stagnant up there for a bit waiting for that pop-up over 17 again yeah um worth noting that the usd value of that unspent capacity has gone up tremendously though that is true that is true it is currently sitting at oh it doesn't have the usd value uh yeah he does unspent value uh 21.4 million there you go look clark i know your dashboard enough that i'm not even looking at it he does have it uh yeah that's all we got for the dashboard we got a long list today uh very bullish week from a price perspective obviously we we broke through 11 000 then 12 000

and now uh sitting at 13 000 we passed my market buy number so now if you've been holding that against me and you have no personal responsibility whatsoever and you've been blaming me for that market buy being underwater this whole time then you should sell and get the fuck out of here and the rest of us will continue stacking stats i like i like that recommendation uh two pretty interesting price stats that i saw this week i saw somebody tweet out i don't have the exact tweet right in front of me uh but 98 of all bitcoin buys in bitcoin's lifetime are uh in the black uh people are in profit off their buys and then it's just those like people in like the the 30 days of december 17 that are that are underwater yes yes sorry dave portnoy uh our

alpha zeta actually lost his fucking coin anyway so i think he'll find it i have faith dave reach out uh our boy alpha zeta he posted a really good tweet i really like uh especially if any of you freaks are out there like i can i can fucking time to market don't worry about it he has a list of the top 10 best weeks for bitcoin since 2011 uh if you missed only three weeks which represents less than three percent of total time period that bitcoin has been operational your returns will be a couple orders of magnitude worse uh basically what he's trying to get at there is that you should just hold dollar cost average in don't try to time the market and trade bitcoin tends to increase significantly in short amount of times for example the the biggest

weekly return bitcoin has seen was in february of 2014 it increased by 432 percent in one week 433 percent after crazy taking a fucking dive i mean i i think i think most people that thought that it could outtrade the market and weren't humble got fucking wrecked on march 12th unfortunately um so so at least in the short term i feel like most uh participants in this market have learned their lesson um you know back in my day back in our day we used to have to walk uphill both ways but now in cash app you have this auto daily stack which is like fucking cool as fuck i don't know like i don't i can't put my finger on it but if i think the word i feels is productive when you just see that i've had the auto stack daily setup for a couple fucking months

now and it's just so cool and i set it so that it it um front runs everyone waking up in america so at like 5 a.m it it auto stacks every day and it's just it's just such a great thing to wake up to your productive sat farming yeah exactly speaking of productive productive sat farming and if you're going to produce a perfect segue for our ad reads, you guys should go check out the Cash App. As Matt mentioned, you can stack sats daily. Maybe you should try to front run our boy Matt O'Dell. He's stacking daily at 5 a.m. East Coast time.

We need you freaks to get out there and set your daily buys for 4.30 a.m. Front run Matt O'Dell and his daily sack. If you want to stack only weekly, if you don't want to stack daily, you want to extend your DCA a little bit and do less buys overall, you can stack weekly or you can stack bi-weekly every two weeks you can't bi-monthly you can't choose when you stack it's it's when you set it up is set up on that purpose so like if you want to front run me you're gonna have to wake up at 4 30 in the morning and set it up at 4 30 in the morning just an fyi okay who's going to be more productive sat farmer that's the question out

there cash app is letting you farm sats automatically uh and we're saying sats sats sats you can make sats the standard uh any new freaks out there we've had a lot of downloads recently if you think that you have to buy a whole bitcoin that's not true you can buy a fraction of bitcoin a bitcoin is divisible by 100 million units known as satoshis and you could stack those sats via the cash app on top of that you can stack stonks if you want to i'm not going to the stonks spiel today i don't need to another cool thing that cash app has is their their booth program and i just saw a tweet for them it's gonna be it's gonna be too late for you freaks by the time this episode airs but they just did a 99 boost up to 50 for for a 20 minute period i saw

so if you follow them on twitter cash app sometimes sends out these really insane deals you could have uh you could have spent what 99 of 50 if you spent 50 cents cash app has revolutionized buying engagement on twitter this is true uh and what else they have they're becoming a new bank if you want to direct deposit your paychecks into the Cash App, you can do that because they're offering account numbers and routing numbers, so you can just cut out the traditional banks.

You're sick of the blood money coming out of HSBC, Wells Fargo, and all those corrupt banks. Cash App doesn't seem to be corrupt yet, so you can use them as your bank. On top of that, make sure you use the code STACKINGSATS when you download the Cash App, because you're going to get

$10, and $10 is going to go to our good friends at Al's Lacrosse. that's owls lacrosse with an owls user code stacking sats download the cash app today and if you do that go check out our good friends at unchained capital unchained capital just released actually a great blog post about a liquor store in minneapolis that has actually been stacking bitcoin for quite a while and i I believe they talked about Unchained Capital's services, which are Bitcoin first services with security and multi-sig in mind. So they have a concierge white glove service.

If you're one of those new freaks out there who's listening to this podcast for the first time, like, hey, I want to buy Bitcoin. I want to buy a considerable amount of Bitcoin, but I'm not. And I want to self-custody, but I need a little handholding. Our boys, our friends, our boys and our girls at Unchained Capital are here to help hold your hand. Our men and ladies. Our men and ladies. They are going to give you a concierge white glove service. They're going to hold your hand for $1,500 minus $50.

If you tell them TFTC sent you, you're going to get $50 off. And they're going to set you up. And they're going to have many video calls with you to answer any questions you may have about Multisig. multisig teach you about multisig get you comfortable uh they're gonna they're gonna buy you hardware wallets if you need them send them to you help you set up those wallets set up the multisig quorum and then they're going to dump a thousand dollars bitcoin into your vault so go check them out at www.unchained-capital.com we're going to link specifically to their white glove concierge uh product they dump a thousand you get a thousand dollars if you use our code

no you get $50 off and it becomes a $1,450 package $1,000 of which gets dumped into your vault so we're going to link to that go check them out shout out to all of our friends at Unchained Capital doing incredible work not only on the

product side but on the education side go check out their blog posts which dog was that? did you see me shake my finger at the dog before she barked at me yeah she did not like that that that finger wag freaks i just want i want to let you know that that was not a coordinated marty dropped the ad on me there that wasn't coordinated the auto stacking does feel very good

yes i mean that was a genuine comment this is this is part of the business you provide a segue yeah you got to take advantage of it you know it's true and we got it out before 15 minutes into the podcast yeah that's good i don't like when we when we drop it on the later end and true Big list today. What should we talk about first? I'll let you pick. We've got to talk about the vulnerabilities. Every week, Marty, vulnerabilities go first.

You've got to front load the vulnerabilities. Okay, we're front loading vulnerabilities, one of which I didn't even realize existed. Everyone was too fucking bullish this week to talk about these two pretty big lightning vulnerabilities. They just all flew under the radar. Everyone was just going crazy. Yeah, can you blame them?

i mean no especially since it's kind of it's kind of hard to wrap your head around the vulnerabilities um yeah so let's go over the first one the first one was uh but the important thing is neither was exploited no neither was exploited but they can still be exploited if you haven't updated so make sure you're up this is lnd only and make sure you're updated to version 0.11.0 at least Yes, 0.11. As long as you're updated to that, you'll be good. So make sure that's the case. Okay, Marty, continue.

Yes, but every version before that is susceptible to these two CVE bugs. So are they zero days? We had this conversation. I forget the definition of zero days. Yes. They've been lingering in the protocol since it launched. Luckily, I believe, shout out to our boy Antoine Riard. You're not going to find him on Twitter.

You're not going to find him on social media. He just lingers in IRC and on the Bitcoin dev and lightning mailing list and solves problems, big problems, to help strengthen the network. I believe he found the second bug that we're going to talk about. Correct. The first one was disclosed by... I forgot. Oh, wait.

No, the first one was him. The first one was Antoine. The second one was... No, they were both. yeah they were both they're both they were both him what a fucking boss yeah dude could just fucking single-handedly take down the lightning network but he doesn't he doesn't what a good then he doesn't he doesn't go on uh he doesn't go on social media and uh and brag about finding these bugs either just head down hard hat on

helping fix the network uh so the first one a malicious peer could force an lnd node to accept a high S ECDSA signature when updating new off-chain states. Though the signatures are valid according to consensus rules, the mempool policy would reject transactions containing high S values, potentially leading to loss of funds if time-sensitive transactions cannot be relayed and confirmed. We have no evidence of the bug being exploited in the wild. So it affects all classes of Elendino's, routing, merchant, mobile, etc.

The vulnerability was purported privately by Antoine. So this is 0.9 and below. Oh, so this one was incidentally patched by 0.10. That's good. That's good that it was incidentally patched. So the second bug, prior to version 0.11.0 beta, an LMD node could be coerced into revealing an invoice premiage for a forwarded HTLC with colliding payment hash.

This can be exploited to, number one, weaken the victim's receiver privacy by confirming the destination of an HTLC and or, number two, under certain circumstances result in the loss of funds to the victim by believing the invoice was paid when it only received routing fees. We have no evidence of either case being exploited in the wild. Affects all routing nodes, any L&D node that permits HTLC forwarding and operates as any form of merchant node, accepts payment for goods and services.

Nodes that use reject HTLC equals one are not affected. The average man's explanation here is that Lightning is supposed to be a network where you don't have to trust your routing peers, but in this case with both of these bugs, if you had a malicious peer, they could siphon funds from your node. Unfortunately, neither was exploited, but this is scary shit for people that run Lightning nodes. yes this is why if you haven't listened to our episode with josie agar yet i think he makes a very compelling case to only create private channels with people that you trust for the time being to help mitigate the chances of these potential exploits being exploited or you can just run reckless i mean we haven't we haven't had any funds lost yet for what it's worth us personally or just i mean us us personally we're currently between

the two of us we're running four nodes i believe right yes correct um and we haven't had funds lost yet uh i haven't heard of any i mean opening and closing channels haphazardly has lost me lots of funds but i i mean from like a malicious peer or something like that and we haven't heard of anyone who's had that happen to them i think as someone who is you know some people consider me very technical but less technical than our peers uh the easiest way for me to understand things like this is to just fucking you know put funds at risk and see what happens so i i am i am impressed that funds haven't been lost yet there is there is a silver lining in that regard and And it's nice how quickly this was handled and patched

and responsibly disclosed. Yes. Shout out to Antoine, our boy. And there's another silver lining. They're finding these bugs and patching them. So hopefully it makes the network stronger overall. There's a weird thing here where, like, I feel like no one wants to talk about it, but...

Let's talk about it. With both Layer 2, Bitcoin Layer 2's networks, Liquid and Lightning, I feel like the short-term killer app use case is basically interoperable custody payments, custodial payments, to different degrees, like on different levels. basically you can have like all these different little trust models of of custody and they can interoperable there they can operate between each other easily you can send between each other's wallets and the main thing that's holding that back is regulatory which is easy to get frustrated about that but then you have to remember that the whole reason bitcoin exists is because that regulatory friction exists in the first place because if we could just have frictionless payments between people we wouldn't need censorship resistance this is true so what are they worried

about just being labeled money transmitters well like having like yeah i mean anyone who holds custody is easy to regulate right so lightning tries to get around that um through their model right liquid kind of just adopts it they just own it but they like pretend they don't and i think they don't talk about it because of regulatory reasons but it's like quasi custody it's just custody among a plurality of 16 signers right federation members who are geographically dispersed between differing uh regulatory jurisdictions but as we found with bitmex the u.s does not care right but when you hear people with lightning talking about like oh you should just be opening channels with people you trust or like large routing nodes like a single

private channel with like a large routing node with a good reputation you know you start getting into this kind of semi-custodial relationship as well um why would that be custodial because you're sipping a channel because they're insinuating they're insinuating that you're reducing your risk because instead of trusting a bunch of people you're having one big channel with like a bit refill and you're just trusting them but we can trust them because they're bit refill but if we're trusting them then it's like kind of a semi-custodial relationship i'm not saying fully custodial right but i'm there's like it's there's something there right it's like a different it's obviously a different trust model than on-chain bitcoin um and especially

like i we're going to talk about the updates to breeze and phoenix in here love them you know breeze update seems pretty good but both of those models great that they're not custodial they do have certain trust elements where you're trusting those centralized third parties and then if you look at two of the most popular lightning wallets they're just straight up custodial right that's blue wallet and wallet of satoshi they're just straight up custodial so and like tipping dot me uh so so there there's and no one really talks about it because regulators are quick to hit the custodians right and we're gonna we have a story in here about um the bitcoin mixer guy helix mixer and he got hit by finsen because he's a he's a custodian they go after the custodians

it's like they're and bitmex they go after the wasn't he like wasn't he marketing to criminals though that's always you know like a questionable thing because they'll almost always authorities will almost always say that but in his case uh in his case they he literally integrated into alpha bay so yeah i think that goes past marketing that's just it's it's just it was straight up integrated with the dark market just buy your drugs in person people but the point is they go after custodians right that's always that's always the like the weak point uh a lot of our a lot of our problems would be easier if you didn't have to worry about that but that's exactly why bitcoin exists in the first place yes no i agree i mean we just found out what bitmex they just got

murked pretty hard so we we shall see how how this progresses and we adam saltis the developer behind coinos he he basically told us like yeah i'm gonna have to depend on people creating personal servers to keep this going because i don't want the the regulatory risk of being labeled a custodian so we shall see speaking of custodians would you consider paypal custodian now paypal has always been a custodian that's what people don't realize and and why i think you know not your keys not your coins and self-custody is so important with bitcoin before bitcoin there was no concept of self-custody even even something like cash other than cash no no we've talked about this before the only thing is physical gold um or as godfrey say in in specie

which i never knew was a thing i like that term in specie if if except for physical gold there's no such thing as or other physical metal there's no such thing as self-custody because even cash you know i i bills can be labeled like old and defunct yeah it's like a centralized ledger right so you can have like india where they say like all the bills over a hundred dollars isn't isn't valid anymore and then you know it doesn't matter that you that you hold the bills so bitcoin transforms that um and makes that possible all of a sudden but before that especially all these digital payments and stuff like they're all custodial by default yes the point i was trying to make though is like apologies are people getting access to bitcoin on paypal at all like

but no yeah they're bitcoin ious we've called this on the spot if you're a freak you've known about this like a lot of people are saying that paypal is the reason for this pump i don't think that's really the reason but if you want to believe it's the reason for the pump you should thank us because we told you about it like in june hey they gotta compete yeah it was the We heard rumors, too. At least on a narrative perspective. Yeah. Sorry.

Yeah. So, for you freaks who are unaware, have been living under a rock this week, PayPal announced that they're going to let their users, over 350 million of which around the world, I believe, purchase and sell cryptocurrencies via PayPal. I believe they have plans to integrate it into Venmo as well. And next year, they're going to allow merchants

to accept cryptocurrency. It's not only Bitcoin. it's bitcoin cash litecoin ethereum a bunch of others that's it uh yeah that's four it's those four because it's paxos they just partnered with paxos and paxos supports those that makes sense but you're not going to be able to take control of your you can't withdraw your and i don't even you might be able to deposit but i don't think you can deposit i would be surprised if you can um and then yeah so you can't even send between users yet it's the robin hood model but like it's a little different in that like if you have a paypal account

in which you own bitcoin next year you'll be able to spend that bitcoin at paypal merchants potentially yeah but yeah so it's the robin hood plus paypal credits or something where you can pay yeah yeah you pay point of sale systems i didn't even realize there was paypal point of sale systems and then yeah i mean they've been getting their ass kicked by by both uh stripe and square shout out square um i i disclaimer sponsor yeah disclaimer heavy disclaimer i think i think look the the the p2p payments market um is tight as fuck yeah i do that in air quotes p2p because it's not really p2p but like the venmo's and the cash apps where you send money between each other they they all have to do no fee or low fee because that's how they compete

so then their only way to monetize is either selling user data um or or like trying to to make money on the holdings like if someone has like 400 in the app then they like re-hypothecate that and make money off of that um because a lot of people just have like phantom holdings so they saw cash app just like fucking go hard on investments this is like so so my guess is that this isn't really a bitcoin crypto play this is an investments play so we see them like add stocks and and maybe like gold and stuff like that as investments on the side uh that you can make in your paypal wallet in addition to it so it's i think it's more of an investments play and in that case it's super easy to just take like one percent two percent off the top like people

are cool with that um even though we use robin hood as an example and robin hood takes no fee and just sells all their user data it's like super super user hostile monetization over there so is this bullish may not have everything the reason for the this is true all right just one just need to make sure you need to it's bullish but like people that are you know you have to get like the prop like no one should buy bitcoin on paypal and it's and it's going to be it's going to be negative for users who get like tricked into it and we see this you know people in robinhood i have people in my dms like hi i bought a bunch of bitcoin or robinhood out i get to my my wallet i'm like and people in our bubble people in our bubble would say like oh like a user would

never think they could withdraw on robin hood they would know better but they don't they have no idea it's fucked up because dms to prove it it's fucked up because they never like they conceptually can't imagine taking custody of a digital asset because that like we just said earlier like bitcoin changed that right the bitcoin created that for the first time so conceptually they don't even think that's a possibility so they go and and they get suckered into it and they don't even really have bitcoin and the worst case scenario is a situation where you know you we actually have like a rip your face off run and there's no bitcoin there like the person doesn't actually buy bitcoin someone else if you actually like imagine that like it

rips and you have to sell that pay the taxes on that and then try to buy or not even that what happens if they don't have the bitcoin what happens if like a bunch of businesses go out of business like they're not fdic insured like it could happen and there there's another layer of trust in that model of paxos like what a pax if something happens to paxos i mean i think that's almost if they're actually using paxos and they actually are custodying bitcoin on the back end that's better than robin hood's model robin hood's model i'm pretty sure revolute's model is like they're just using derivatives to like hedge their risk which is way more dangerous yeah i would not i would not trade on robin hood i don't know about revolt too

much well that it's revolute first of all we went over this last week i i and i think they're europe only maybe they came to america i think they are um but yeah i mean it's bullish everyone's talking about it like that helps it it's definitely a credibility thing it definitely boosts credibility um there's a i've had a bunch of uh aunts uncles cousins like oh my god paypal's letting you buy bitcoin i think see venmo's almost bigger for our peer group yes for the older peer group though i know people are like oh bitcoin's legit now paypal's letting you buy it right but i mean for our age group they all have venmo installed at least in the northeast i should have cash app freaks but but you have to like show them cash app and they replace they like add it next to

venmo they already have venmo yes i still have it though yeah i have to interact with it every once in a while but yeah if you're talking like better product cash app lets you send sats off the app into your own personal custody also there's a center there's a narrative you can set up their whirlpool too yeah straight into whirlpool on my i would i my on my kyc accumulation strategy right now is i auto stack daily then weekly i i smelt it in whirlpool and then i secure it like every month so like i let it go in whirlpool for a little bit um what was i gonna say oh there's a narrative going on that cash app didn't have withdrawals enabled to begin with Cash App always had withdrawals enabled.

They didn't have deposits enabled initially. Which I'm cool with. To this day, Swan doesn't let you sell. I love the idea of a service that's just purely an on-ramp. You just automatically buy and just automatically withdraw, and you just can never sell. You have to sell with someone else. We don't sell Bitcoin.

We create the floor, find somewhere else to sell that shit. Completely cool with that. But if you don't allow withdrawals, that's user hostile and fucked up. Yes, I agree. Fun week. Speaking of bullish news, our boy Paul fucking on Squawk Box today. Is that the most bullish two-minute clip you've seen? You think he was jealous of Saylor?

I don't even think Saylor's on his radar. Like another billionaire was coming in and just taking all his Bitcoin thunders. Like, I got to go on CNBC and show the corn again. No, I mean, I think CNBC was like, hey, we need to get Tudor on. we had him on in june talking about bitcoin bitcoins had this price run very flattering words from paul tudor jones towards the the bitcoin community he loves the podcast he was yeah he said it on the side he texted me he said hey marty you're one of the bitcoiners that besieged me after my initial announcement and uh you're one of the really

really sophisticated uh people in the space direct direct text marty it actually happened uh no i think all jokes aside uh again another confirmation similar to sailor uh it seems that i'm not not our content particularly i don't think no he didn't mention tales from the crypt at all no no but i think the grassroots user-generated educational content from everybody in the space is working uh he his explanation hasu our boy hasu tweeted out today he really distilled the value prop of bitcoin in relation to the other inflation hedge assets like gold bonds whatever it may be beautifully in which a lot of those or all of Bitcoin's competition

in an inflation hedge perspective are basically short human ingenuity and they're basically saying they're betting on failure whereas Bitcoin has a sound money as well as a distributed protocol that can be billed out, provides an optimistic hedge against this inflation. It's bullish on humanity. Bullish on humanity.

very bears on our current systems but bullish on humanity yes it is uh i agree with what hasu said i think that was like the most concise and one of the most bullish comments it was all right on bitcoin really it was no i mean i loved it paul killed it it was great i i he's our boy our boy yeah i uh i mean i think it's twofold i think bitstein channels it well that the engagement's addicting like on twitter like we just bitstein's bitstein's video today chopping that up with the bulls oh i didn't see that pre-game music oh my gosh if you gotta watch it probably i got all jacked up freaks go check it out we are we are lucky to have michael goldstein in our in our ranks he is a genius bitstein has channeled has channeled in the past which is just

like bitcoin is like we just shower twitter engagement on people that talk about it and we've seen that uh with sailor we've seen that with paul tudor jones that's what he was actually talking about in the cnbc interview where he was he was like it was just amazing like how many people care about bitcoin and and what he really meant to say was like he his mentions got blown the fuck up as soon as he started talking about bitcoin and then the third thing is it even affects cnbc right we have like a small five percent bump and cnbc is like the next morning at prime time we need to have a bitcoin segment and then we need to immediately cut it up we need to put it in an article format on the website and we need to put it on twitter in video full video

on twitter right they had a four minute video on twitter of the whole segment right away why because they knew our engagement was going to fucking shower on them so i saw a tweet like 10 minutes before the segment like Tudor's gonna be on on Squawk Box so I turn on

I've never watched CNBC I turned it off my dad watches it every morning and my brother is staying

my wife and I and we watch it together even he he gets Bitcoin he's into it but not as focused as I am on it

and he was like whoa dude that was fucking bullish and like you said they had that clipped in on the website quicker than any segment

super quick like ever yeah yeah bitcoin drives engagement that's actually going back to michael goldstein he had an incredible tweet today i believe it was yesterday actually like bitcoin haters love the twitter engagement more than they love the gains from bitcoin over time i think alluding to that keith mccullough has been shitting on bitcoin since quad four quad four guy what the fuck is quad four i don't know but he loves the engagement he fucking loves it he had he had raul paul on

uh and he had sailor sailor on he had both of them on to talk about bitcoin uh while he was shitting on it just because the engagement was so fucking nice and then afterwards he even put out a tweet that was like i bought a little bitcoin here like nibbling on some bitcoin here because he just loves it it's just these guys don't get this kind of engagement otherwise it is addicting on a really odd like tangential super bullish note i just wanted to say mad respect to michael saylor he has the sailor academy that i found out about this week where he just provides free education to people that's fucking baller he's got he's got a c++ class so if you're looking to get into

he's got like 150 classes on there for free yeah uh he's adding austrian economics i believe i saw him tweet out and bitcoin science yes this is uh very bullish bringing it back to our boy paul another thing i thought was interesting that he said particularly was he's a macro investor he's never tried to stock pick particular stocks to to ride but he likened investing in bitcoin being like hey this makes me feel like this is the first time i've ever picked like a tech stock and it feels like i'm getting in on apple in the early days with steve job and just because of the excitement and again the the optimistic vision of the future that bitcoiners and bitcoin the protocol specifically uh can can bring to light and illuminate uh so shout out to paul our boy

paul paul cheers to you you can stop texting me you can stop texting me you can we can do this this face video and we can we can do a podcast so if you're out there uh your southern twang would really kill it in audio form only uh he's just been texting you nonchalantly but he won't come on the podcast yeah he's a little shy you know fucking yeah he got he got besieged by bitcoiners uh when he first made the announcement he's a little little nest a little nervous i wonder who our next billionaire is gonna be we got two down now jack dorsey do you see pierre's just going for them oh yeah we had dorsey dorsey already too pierre's like going for uh uh i believe elon said he had 0.25 btc he was going for google oh elon's got a bag

i mean motherfuckers posting doge memes like you don't post doge memes without a big bag of bitcoin But Elon's probably, you know, he's self-custodying and he doesn't want to talk about it. Agreed. Well, actually, tangential, sort of tangential, Skynet will actually be huge for Bitcoin mining in remote places. So, Elon, if you're listening, let's get Skynet, like, fully, fully developed so mining in oil fields becomes simply easier. Wait, wait, wait. Are you talking about, like, his internet thing? Yes. Is it Skynet? Is it StarNet?

Star-Net. Starlink, excuse me. Skynet is like from the Terminator. The Terminator. Oh, God. Was that a Freudian slip? I don't know. I was like, did he really have the balls to come up with a product named Skynet?

No. Yeah, my bad. Starlink's getting a lot of shit from people who like looking at the sky. Yeah. But I don't notice it when I'm looking up at the stars, though. I think it's people just have time-lapse cameras. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I like the idea of global high-speed internet.

I do as well. I hope he doesn't fuck up the skies too much, though. What are you going to do? Yeah. I don't want regulation to stop him. No. And if it gets too annoying, and Bitcoin continues to appreciate in price,

we can just take them down one at a time. Just start shooting down the satellite? Just start, yeah. let's go like let's go like low low orbit probably have lasers by then just start taking them out well you're gonna have to try and protect your own so that you still have internet for your note this is true it's dicey pretty quickly it's a big problem to think about freaks start thinking about them now no the paul tudor jones thing was extremely bullish i'm trying to everyone this week has just been talking about how i was going to come out too bullish and then we were going to

dump because of it so i'm like trigger shy and have ptsd and i don't know what to do freaks because i am bullish but like i'm scared to be bullish like i'm like i i didn't tweet between october 17th and october 21st while we were pumping because i just wanted to make sure we got past the fucking i wanted to make sure we got past the the bitcoin 2019 call and i i believe in jinxes because they're science i believe in jinxes too uh i have not jinxed the price yet i don't think so i think we're past jinxes i think i think we're post jinx now on me i think i made it past if we dump it's it's not my fault anymore i can try to express bullishness for you if you if you would like i think it's i think my bullishness is priced inappropriately now

okay okay this is good freaks if you're not bullish i mean i know your freaks are or bullish but my nips are hard it's uh it feels feels like things I felt before uh

the market is doing things that I like to see uh it feels like it's time primed the geopolitical situation the macro situation are you macro aware

are you macro aware what about your quad four yeah that's another did you take your quad Keith McCullough fucking comment but even that just the energy around bitcoin actually went to a dinner last night somebody in the financial world talked about great american mining and

they were even up to snuff like yo this is going to happen just makes sense so and they were macro aware yes they were very macro aware if you're not bullish you're not paying attention we should hit the freaks with the shout outs we have some good ones this week i only know one but it's good what do you think do you think i'm going to get through it yeah you got let's hit them with the good one for the one i know about first let me clear my throat take a sip of of water here here we go heterocyclic compounds can be usefully classified based on their electronic structure the saturated heterocycles behave like in acyclic derivatives thus piperidine piperidine and tetrahydrofuran are conventional amines and ethers with modified steric profiles

therefore the study of heterocyclic chemistry focused especially on unsaturated derivatives and the preponderance of work in application involves unsaturated five and six membered rings included are pyridine, thiophene, pyrrole, and furon. Another large class of heterocycles refers to those fused to benzene rings. For example, the fused benzene analogs of pyridine, thiophene, pyrrole, and furon are quinoline, benzothiophene, indole, and benzofuron, respectively. The fusion of two benzene rings gives rise to a third large family of compounds. Analogs of the previously mentioned heterocycles for this third family of compounds are

acridine, dibenzothiophene, carbazole, and dibenzofuran, respectively. From our good friend, Vake. I appreciate that science lesson, Vake. I have no idea what it means. It was definitely not a lesson at all. I don't think anyone took anything from that. but thank you vague appreciate the troll yeah i feel like uh i feel like will ferrell in old school they were just blacked out what happened here's a an uplifting shout i'm very happy for

this one uh this shout out is for my beautiful wife john v i know you donate oh excuse me i know you don't particularly love listening to all my bitcoin talk but thank you for your patience and generosity of spirit i love you forever you're my best friend p.s i'm totally going to be building a node in the living room frankie frankie and john v frankie and john v it sounds like you two have a beautiful relationship i'm very excited to to see your node in your living room uh it's good when when a married couple is best friends it's uh it's always nice to see just be just be happy that it's not a minor in the living room because that gets really fucking noisy and hot and expensive uh this one's for you matt from our friends at the auburn citadel matt please

tell all the freaks to market buy at new all-time high peace from the auburn citadel everyone should just market sell market sell everything don't buy bitcoin we're going down well you got to wait to the all-time high so you're actually being they bought the shout out which i think is able to buy a future action from yourself they don't mean they don't mean the local all-time high they mean like the actual all-time high yes yes are we going by the forbes chart where it said it was like 14.1 or something are we going to go by the actual all-time high of 19 000 i think we go actual the reason i asked is because at 14 and a half i'll probably be like completely reasonable but at, like, 20, I'm just going to be shouting from the rooftops,

market buy, market buy, market buy, so it doesn't really matter. How many bottles of champagne? So many bottles. The bottles won't start popping until, like, 30K, though. Matt has an all-time high champagne tradition. It wasn't really a tradition. I mean, it was just a very long December. And the Auburn Citadel bought two shout-outs this week.

Shout-out to the Auburn Citadel for purchasing two. Cheers, guys. We appreciate you. Two shout-outs. You could have done this in one shout-out, but you decided to do it in two, and here goes the second one. Also from the Auburn Citadel,

and that was a wild bird sound. Wow, we appreciate you. Love you guys. All the freaks. Thank you, guys. Love all y'all. If any of you want to buy a shout-out, go to tftc.io slash contribute.

We love these. we love you and that's a fun aspect to the podcast and uh you can make me say stupid shit i'll say penis 50 times if you want me to i wonder if we'll get hit with like a cease and desist by that horrible textbook company for you reading the science textbook passage on air was it did you like did you search it's gotta i didn't search it what was i supposed to type in i don't know what you said i have no idea what i said it was definitely a science textbook motherfucker sent to a science textbook excerpt. Well, Vake is a doctor.

He may memorize that off the top of his head. No, that's true. He's definitely just sitting there with a patient and just starts saying that shit. Yes. Well, you should, though. All right, back to the list. Coinbase dropped a transparency report on the 16th,

which is six days ago at this point. It was right after our HR. It was the day of our HR. No, it wasn't. Yes, it was, because we recorded on Friday. no oh yes we did record on friday because i felt bad because i shat on brian armstrong who deserved to be shat on this i commended him on this this is a this is a good sign to see this i uh i appreciated him releasing this um up until this point kraken is the only company in the space

that has been releasing them uh and i i think it's really important because it sheds a light on how much information is being requested from these companies. Yes. Got to give props where props are due. Props to Coinbase for putting this out. And for you freaks who are wondering exactly what it is, the transparency report of all the information requests from the different law enforcement agencies and regulatory agencies.

Looking at it, it looks like just the U.S. particularly. No. Or not HSI. They break out the U.S. because the U.S. dominates requests. By far. It's crazy. World police. If you haven't seen Team America, go watch it.

It's a documentary. And it's insane. Are we the land of the free, dude? So are we the land of the free? The U.S. leads the request for customer information from Coinbase by 3x, or almost 3x. two and two thirds x the swedes aren't going after bitmex right so by country of origin the u.s leads by far with 1113 requests for information uk's number

two and 441 germ germany's in third at 176 then france and fourth at 45 and then the rest of the request uh are all less than 20 and just shake my head at luxembourg with their one request come on luxembourg get it together you too latvia no i mean it's a shame it's really sucks to see and that that most of the regulations are stemming from us as well right right so what does this say do we actually live in a free country do we look to tout it look you know we've had better days in my opinion most certainly like what like it is like this report is ridiculous and most of it's coming from the fbi and these agencies don't even fucking catch the criminals that they should be catching i'm not going to get into politics here we easily could go into that

We're not going to diverge into that, but it's becoming very obvious that some of these agencies cover for criminals and don't go after crimes they probably should be going after and then hurt the little man for doing stuff that is far less egregious than some of the largest crimes being perpetrated by powerful people around the world. So the bearish stat is that it's almost 2,000 requests, and it's not even a full year. It's a half a year. It's just 2020 up until the end of June. The bullish interpretation is that they're mostly overwhelmingly criminal requests, which is kind of what you want to see. You want to see them going after criminal prosecutions, not just dragnet kind of requests. um even though i'm not sure if they're including the drag net requests in this report and who the who i can't trust coinbase with this fucking shit so i don't know like we just saw like in the uk

um they just did that massive like anyone over 5 000 pounds uh they want all their information for their version of the irs like the hmrc or whatever i that can't be included here because it says the uk's only got 440 requests um so so who knows like what the non-law enforcement requests are but besides both of those things i just want to point something out here is is we see these chain surveillance company ceos they tell us we don't identify individuals we just put numbers on them which by the way you know i'm not going to say it but putting numbers on people i'll say it i'll say it putting numbers on people has been pretty abhorrent throughout history thank you marty um so they say like user 571 or whatever did these transfers and they went

through all these different transfers and then and then the request goes to coinbase and coinbase gives them all the information that they need to know about who that user is so it's just a little bit disjointed but it's the same in practice it's the same fucking thing that's pretty disgusting and disturbing how do you not have any self-awareness you're gonna label people with numbers just because it's digitally doesn't mean it's any different than what happened in history when these mechanisms didn't exist fuck now i'm all pissed off all right we're already on this was supposed to be a positive story though so i mean thank you for releasing this yes yes thank you uh fuck you uh to us uh for not being as free as we should be like the dea makes

up ten percent of this the drug war end it it doesn't make any sense you can't have wars on abstract objects or abstract thoughts that's a bad explanation but the drug war is an abject failure give it up I'm all pissed off now we're getting into I mean we mentioned it earlier finson find um uh the helix is a helix yeah yeah helix coin larry harman find them six 60 million dollars was this was this the same guy yeah because he got he got arrested like earlier this year and i guess they're not going to put him in jail they're just going to find him yeah so so he also uh what was uh he had a he had a wallet what was his wallet yeah it was like based out of ohio coin ninja

no it was a separate wallet was it called coin ninja though uh that had the custodial lightning wallet yes i think coin ninja was the parent company of these products um i want to it was like it was like kind of getting big uh at the time and it was it was yeah because remember not trying to throw peter under the bus yeah i don't want to throw him under the bus but yeah he was the sponsor of peter's it's just reminding me of of that yes that there was a wallet um i forget what it was called though um i think coin ninja is oh drop it yes drop it so coin ninja was the parent company of of drop it and drop it got pretty big because oh and it was also sponsored the bitcoin magazine conference

uh bitcoin 2019 um good night son we just had a good night to my son i just had a little bit corner coming to the screen um i uh so so drop it was getting pretty big and it was it was a perfect explanation of of the dangers of custodial wallets right because the lightning portion was custodial the on-chain portion was not custodial so when he got arrested and all of his funds got seized for something completely separate than drop it if you had funds in the lightning wallet you lost your money because it got seized but if you had funds in the in the on-chain portion it was not custodial so you could just transfer out um but anyway i would actually say like i mean

like this guy was he legit integrated it into alpha bay uh like he says in the coin desk in the coin desk thing or excuse me uh harman's family denied larry had any ties to alpha bay okay so i mean who knows for sure like what happened there but um i feel like oh so he also faces criminal proceedings in u.s federal court but i feel like if it's just a fine like that's actually not as bad as you'd expect it to be um but it's it the last line seems pretty bad also faces criminal proceedings in u.s federal court so maybe they're about to jail him as well get your money and your life we'll see I mean, I don't want to jump to any conclusions here. Yeah. I don't want to speculate either. So, but custodial privacy is not real privacy because of this reason. So that's like the number one thing you can take away from something like this. And this is, this is very different. And, and the government has said themselves, um, and lobby groups and lawyers, uh, which I am not one, um, have said themselves that.

And I think even the DOJ made this clear in their recent ridiculous 84-page crypto framework thing that they're treating custody, custodial mixers and custodians in general different than a non-custodial CoinJoin tool, which is oftentimes called Bitcoin mixing, but it's completely different than something like this. which is with something like this you literally were sending larry your money your bitcoin and he was sending you other bitcoin which actually has is better for privacy if you trust him is better for privacy than any kind of coin joint tools or anything but it does have that custodial element so it adds that additional regulatory um risk agreed and you mentioned the doj uh report on digital currencies we don't have it on the list but i believe the eff EFF has come out and said that the framework that DOJ put forth is actually probably not going to fly if it ever goes to the Supreme Court

because it inhibits and encroaches on individual privacy, which is good to see the EFF recognizing this and stepping up to say something about it. Everyone should go support the EFF. I do every year. But, yeah, I didn't put that on the list because, like, obviously it encroaches on privacy. Like, everything they do encroaches on privacy.

But has the EFF, like, really commented on cryptocurrency, particularly a lot? They actually don't really love Bitcoin. They're, like, kind of lukewarm on it. It's kind of weird. I met one of their head guys when I was visiting HRF in San Francisco. Yeah, they're kind of lukewarm on it. Why? But they'll come around.

are you able to disclose why i just you know i i don't want to be offensive i love them i think the eff is a very good organization so i want to say that first and foremost um very positive force for good and very important for all of us so people should go support them but i think you know i think they just uh there's a lot of people stuck in like the old way of you know the older way of thinking and they they they still think you know like bitcoin is like criminal oriented we'll change your mind soon enough eff thank you for doing what you've done throughout the history of your organization and particularly coming out and speaking up on behalf of bitcoiners after this doj report was released yeah so i mean this is pretty positive right so this shows a positive

inclination towards towards bitcoin yeah that's really good but yeah yeah like i think this might be like the first major i could be wrong and also coindesk hasn't has a tendency to switch anything that says bitcoin to crypto even though it's bitcoin uh coindesk we see you we know you do this uh so like the eff might have said like the bitcoin framework you know like there's like they might come out you know in support of bitcoin but coindesk just changes every headline to crypto if you like search the amount of coindesk headlines that say bitcoin it's like intentionally reduced well you freak should know that coindesk is owned by digital currency group which has an incentive to push coins outside of bitcoin on individuals and naked

potentially propagandized via coindesk maybe they're separate editorially but just know where the incentives lie follow the money travel rule of white paper travel rule white paper this flew under the radar a little bit too this week but you got pretty angry about it I did and I got angry

I don't want to clear anything I do want to clear things up I got angry passionate I think you're right Marty i am right it's so if you freaks didn't see the tweet i sent out and don't know what's going on so there's basically a working group i believe of 25 quote-unquote virtual asset service providers exchanges other types of server providers ledgers on the list i found the list um none of our sponsors on the list you want to list it read the list marty all right give me a second i know bittrex on it i know gemini's on it i know kraken's on it i know coinbase is on it aig's on

it yeah it's like why is the fuck they just have x-men you sponsors are on the list yeah i don't know let me um give me let me find this well of course like you know i'm not even disappointed in aig like they caused a global financial collapse like what can you you know what can you expect right all right so i have the list 100 divided by x all right we're going to filter to the working group ninth i've never heard of a bunch read the ones we know read the ones we know don't read us bullshit companies bitmart don't know them cardano foundation i know them i guess that's funny the whole shit coin is just going to be travel rule friendly right uh cool bit x i'm just trying

to find the one cool bit x is is that wallet that looks like a credit card i have no idea crypto asset rating crypto garage that was surprising to me crypto garage come on uh dt's oh that's i got him confused with digital garage never mind i don't know who crypto garage Yeah, Digital Garage is out of Japan. That's not Crypto Garage. Yes. DTCC, Electric Coin Company. Who's DTCC?

They're serving today. Excuse me, securing today, shaping tomorrow. Wait, I don't know who they are. Zcash, though, is Electric Coin Company. Yes, Zcash. That's interesting. Okay, who else? Spooko is all over that.

Elliptic, shocker. All the change surveillance companies are probably on board. ledger shame a ledger well you know they might just be covering their bases they're non-custodial so non-custodial does not uh like i'm not going to hold it against the non-custodials yet because they're not affected by the travel rule luno but why would they even be participating maybe they want to know what the fuck's going on i mean that's all i know that's it it doesn't show Bitrix, Gemini, Kraken, Coinbase on there? Where'd you get this list, Martin?

Some freak sent it via DM. It's obviously not going to disclose my source, but they changed the website. Does it not show Bitrix, Gemini, Kraken? Okay. If you go to Patreon, it's got Coinbase, Ernst & Young,

Huobi, classic r3 remember r3 and r3 yeah they changed the website dude but see part of this is this is part of the sketchy part to me misari misari is on the advisory council shapeshifts on the advisory council ellipsis oh yeah i heard shapeshift was on it consensus shocker all of ethereum is i i I called on this podcast and on other podcasts, including Ethereum podcasts, that they were going to become the de facto KYC chain. So if that happens, I get a big told you so and maybe a glass of whiskey from someone. I'll provide you a glass of whiskey if this happens.

Appreciate it. Yes. So what is going on here? Yeah. These companies, agencies, whatever they are, involved in a working group to create an API that complies with the travel rule. And the travel rule basically dictates if you have money, in this case virtual assets, quote unquote, moving between different entities that are regulated by the Financial Action Task Force, an agency that should be destroyed, they have to share certain personal data of the customers moving funds from one entity to the other with each other that data has to travel with them these quote-unquote virtual asset

service providers creating an open api to easily comply with the travel rule in the white paper that we're going to link to in the show notes they do specifically say sending from a virtual asset provider to service provider to personal custody is not beholden to the travel rule but i got pissed off because the white paper number one doesn't doesn't name any of the people involved like i had to find had to have a freak send me this we still don't know that's the sketchiest part yeah and again it's initiation of a slippery slope i would say this is phase one phase two it's like oh all right you got the api you know what if they try to send it to somebody who's not using the api don't let them right i mean i think

first of all it's got a big collaborators vibe uh you know they're collaborating with the occupation they're working against their own users and they're not admitting to it so like at least be up front about it coinbase released a blog about it they were like we are the evil enemy we were talking about it um so they were at least i'll give them credit on that one they were at least out front on that um the the simple man's explanation here is if you send from one regulated exchange to another regulated exchange that regulated exchange that you sent it from is going to tell the receiver exchange that you are this person with your kyc info and you sent it so that private information that is already a risk to you as a user that's being stored probably in

securely is now going to be stored in another place also probably insecurely one second marty okay the second implication here is most likely what's going to happen is if you don't send it to an address they recognize which they will probably recognize any other regulated exchange address i'm guessing they're going to start sharing xpubs and stuff like that so they can see an address and they know like this is a gemini address this is a bit stamp address they're going to make you basically like check a box that says this is my own address i take responsibility for it i'm sending it to myself and then ultimately what i think is going to be the the final thing there is the easiest way to comply with all this bullshit is to just go to

paypal and and and robin hood approach and just not even allow you to self-custody in the first place because not only does that check off the regulatory box it makes security really fucking easy if your users can't withdraw you're not going to lose any bitcoin agreed the one caveat i would say here is that if you're moving it from one of these regulated entities to another the other probably has your kyc info already correct that's what john carvalho he has some critiques on the tweet that i sent out and that was one of them it's interesting what he gets angry about uh i uh i mean i guess but like i think the idea is to like double check you right and like make everyone know that they have they're being watched right so so did you say the

same kyc info to that exchange did that exchange check it well enough uh compared to the other exchange and if they're sharing all this information back and forth then basically they have um like collaborators like ratting each other out right and if you have this environment where everyone's going to rat each other out then obviously there's going to be more compliance so like you're literally creating the kind of compliance atmosphere that you see in like prisons and you see in like fucking work camps and shit right i agree i completely agree i think it's complete bullshit and so i got pissed off number one because it doesn't seem like there's been any pushback against this from these virtual asset service providers they're just bending the

knee sucking the dick and doing this behind everybody's back like it hasn't been public at all the api is in beta so they made this without even telling people like hey we're gonna be asked to do this and we're gonna be sharing your information so that pissed me off uh not everybody's involved so then like is this working group gonna strong arm the people who aren't in it like what happens to the people if you're not in the working group it's a suspicious activity yeah fuck that's exactly what's gonna happen cold card unchained our sponsors cold card it's not a sponsor it's cash app fuck dude you just created a huge conspiracy um we've already been accused of having a secret cold card sponsorship which we do not have i've

spent so much sats at cold card like that it does not fucking reverse sponsorship and i'm just gonna say it rodolfo for everybody playing bingo out there you got it you should give us more free shit we're supposed to still we have to raffle off a block clock mini which he released a picture of that looked very good i can't wait but yeah cold cards not involved it appears fucking unchanged not involved squares not involved as far as we know i mean on the list that i've seen we will give them shit no one talks i like we i got some shit thrown at me on fucking twitter about our candid jack dorsey square conversation last week like name me another fucking podcast that candidly talks about their sponsors on air like there's there's no definitely

not in the bitcoin space there's no one else in the fucking bitcoin space that does it and i just want to say as far as i i'm not ready to throw shade at the non-custodial people involved in that working group because as far as i'm concerned they don't have to comply so i kind of i was them and i thought i could keep it secret i'd kind of want to be at the table just to see what was going on yes so another caveat here too there is a don't hate the player don't hate the game that's dangerous slippery slope well i mean the game being the bank secrecy act and the financial action task force like we should really be going after abolishing that act and that regulatory body but the players in this case

who have kept this under the radar built this API and are probably just going to ninja launch it on their users at some point they didn't fight back at all there could have been a legal fight what the hell are we doing here what does bitcoin exist for

are you going to actively bifurcate the network just to comply with regulations that have been proven time and time again to be completely ineffective against the the largest perpetrators of the crimes that they claim to be preventing like it doesn't make any sense these laws are ineffective they should not be in place anymore i mean it doesn't make any fucking sense i guess you could say it's

a it's a cuck mentality yes a cuck mentality from a user perspective not only can should the freaks be outspoken about being against this um and i think like like like fuck fuck you like anyone like we're allowed to be angry about it let's just let's be vocal about it these companies know that we're going to be angry about it they have thick skin they can fucking handle it okay but let them know have them have some pressure i don't have any sympathy there where we got to be like fucking ginger toes about it and be nice you know that's fucking ridiculous um but on top of that like what a user can do is when you withdraw from these kyc services withdraw through coin joint and even if you're not effective at it even if you if you insist on using a broken coin joint

implementation like wasabi and it's just not effective and you you fuck everything up and you just don't gain any privacy from it whatsoever at least it's a protest at least you're telling these organizations that bent the fucking knee that that that you're not cool with that and it's immediately visible on chain like that's how i i view it as a protest every time you withdraw the coin joint i mean obviously i think you should use whirlpool or joy market but if you want to use wasabi use wasabi i'm fine with that um and but but you should use one of them and it should be a form of protest in between your cold storage and your and your and and definitely withdraw don't leave it on custody well i think we should really stress this point like this is

probably a canary in the coal mine the fight is coming if you have a significant amount of sats on one of these exchanges even if it's one of our sponsors especially if it's one of our sponsors because I don't want to hear about it after the fact

like just be again I don't think they're going to jump to the front lines with the people complying with this API I think they're actually going to fight against it but just have have that number of sets in your mind that you're comfortable with on these exchanges and these service providers i honestly i think i said this

on episode 24 or whatever our first episode together that i've operated under the mentality that they were going to close the on-ramps to us at some point and i didn't realize that there was had to be nuanced here where i don't care if they still let us buy if we can't withdraw they've closed the on-ramps the on-ramps have been fucking closed like and i think there's going to be a situation here at least for a little bit of time where that could be the case and it's going to be more important than ever that people withdraw and take out their own to their own self-custody because at least then you know if you kyc they know you have it but it's it's a it's a lot more difficult taking things from people than it is blocking you from taking them yes i agree i agree

beware freaks beware bullish very very bullish week this is something that went a little under the radar uh beware and speak up that's like that's one thing i wanted to say earlier what can you do speak up speak up against this tag these people coin join tweets coin join tag people speak up use your voice voice your displeasure and fight for bitcoin really like again if this stuff plays out to its logical conclusion and the network is bifurcated what are we here for what are we here for again are you are you willing to fight for it ask yourself that question um i will say i have gotten feedback in dms from people who are like hey this may stink but maybe it's temporary maybe yes they do bifurcate the the network just to

get all the viewpoints out there maybe they bifurcate the network successfully for a decade but bitcoin and its network effect grows so large that the p2p side of bitcoin is so successful that it just becomes blatantly obvious that they need to reopen the floodgates potentially that could happen but i would rather not even get to the point where we need that to happen yeah i mean i don't think they can stop bitcoin i don't i don't i'm not in this way i i don't see it um but it could be very painful for bitcoiners it could be very painful for freaks it could be very painful for me and marty um and i i prefer that not the case um and i prefer if our own country wasn't actively working against us you know but well well here we are so it's important

for people to stand the fuck up listen to what you just said like why should we be afraid we're literally just buying bitcoin and sending it to cold storage like yeah we tell people to coin join to get privacy because we think that's important like where have we gotten to as a society particularly in the u.s where we have to be afraid of this i don't know marty there's you know it doesn't make any sense we have businesses around the country closed you're not allowed to go over 75 miles an hour in this country so i there's precedent here i break that law every time i get a car on the highway criminal i hey i love driving fast nobody will ever stop me i drive safe i don't drive like an asshole and swerve through traffic but when i have the opportunity i'd like to drive

fast i like to think that if there was a poll that if there was a poll um big corners would probably trend to speeding yes responsibly what's your yes responsibly yeah i'm not gonna swerve through traffic i'm not one of those assholes baby on board cutting people off yeah i don't i do have a baby on board but i don't have that sticker because i'm not i'm not a cuck no you gotta get the sticker the sticker is like the best part of having baby marty no no the baby is the best part do you think how many people like what percentage of people with baby on board stickers you think um yeah before i triggered the freaks i was joking about that statement what percentage of uh baby on board stickers you think are not actually have

a baby on board do you think there's like a bunch of like faux baby on board stickers five percent eight percent something like that just using the heuristic of there are people with fake uh handicapped things i think that's a similar thing and knowing that have known people that have used that too i believe there would be people baby on board just because uh i believe you just get automatic sympathy for the police i think so yeah like if you get like a parking ticket or something and like if you're about to get if you're like five minutes over and you have a baby on board sticker you may be less likely to get it yes same with handicapped too imagine like giving a handicapped person a parking ticket like they could have been trying their best to get

there yeah i mean same with all those like supporting the police stickers oh well here in jersey that's like a huge have you ever heard apparently like when i was in high school at least so going to high school in philly philly is very close to the border of new jersey and my high school is basically half jersey kids half pennsylvania kids apparently in jersey specifically like if you have the special card it says like i'm a family member yeah pba card yes i had a pba card and a pba badge and i had all the stickers i had a bunch of pba stickers i still have them and what am i saying i'm talking in past tense what it gets it gets you out it gets you out of everything yeah it's crazy fantastic i mean i have a literally a get out of get out of a ticket

free card the problem is it was always a positive but now like in the streets of brooklyn like you don't want to be parked in the streets of brooklyn like with the stickers on like the wrong night because then they like come through they're like oh police sympathizer they just like fuck fuck up your car like actually worried about it a bit but but up until that point it was it was definitely overwhelmingly positive yes now the kid the jersey kids in high school when they got their license they like brag with their ppa cards like uh look at me yeah i mean there's definitely an insider's club i mean to be to be clear like i've always overwhelmingly supported our local law enforcement so it wasn't like a lie i mean i did too but but it was definitely a double standard

yes i will i will 100 admit that actually i have it depends on what local law enforcement uh there's one law enforcement agency in the south jersey shore that i absolutely loathe because they took advantage of. So tradition here in the Philadelphia, South Jersey area, when you graduate high school, you get what's called a senior house. Typically down the shore, you and your 10 of your friends from high school pull your money together and rent a house for the summer. For underage drinking.

Yes. And the cops know that this is going to happen. And no matter how, I mean, obviously underage drinking, if any of you young freaks out there i think the drinking age should be 18 so i don't care yeah the drinking age should be 18 every time when once you pass 21 everyone forgets about it but we believed wholeheartedly when i when i was young it was my most important issue right yeah but there's one particular uh law enforcement agency in one city in a jersey short town just did not abide by any like literally just walk into it no knock just walk in no warrant but they knew yeah i mean yeah

they knew but they they did not follow you need a warrant you need to knock we literally would get in like stat like sometimes we get in standoff fights where we lock the door and just like be like get a fucking warrant um yeah but you'd get out of it it was like minimal penalty i mean yeah It was like a $400 ticket I had to pay a few times. It's just a revenue scam. Well, dude, that's the thing that pissed me off the most. That winter, after that senior summer, literally in the local paper, talking about how they bought new cruisers and new equipment,

not like a military industrial complex. They just got it from the military. They literally bought it with the revenue from the citations. The $400 citations. Yeah, I mean, that's a scam. I mean, that's just a hidden tax on our children. But this is a Bitcoin podcast, not a breaking the law podcast. No, everyone should follow the law.

That's our official stance. Official stance. Official stance, but take that with an eh. Let's get to software updates. We got a lot of them. i'll let you run through them you're gonna let me run through them yeah okay i'll get through btc pay server version 1.0.5.8 is out if you're running that update that uh btc pay server has made their release notes marty friendly so it fixed the pay join client implementation uh

shout out to kooks for that it fixed the the same wallet by default just not include previous transaction shout out to founder bt space server nicholas doria for fixing that and then kooks uh it's a bunch of bug fixes that's about it i should not be reading these release nets um they are already version one they are this version 1.4.2 is out if you freaks are using this make sure you update that it's packed with new features and improvements what are the big The big one is you can withdraw the BEC32 native SegWit addresses. Bang, bang. Yes.

Tor Browser is updated there. I can help you out here, Marty. Or I thought I could, but now I lost the list. We have Phoenix v1.4.0, which is a major release. The big thing here is the app can keep track offline. So if you receive a payment when you don't have a channel and not offline and the app isn't open, it will respond and will create the open channel, which is important because they'll then open a channel to you and you pay them a small fee in sats for that privilege. Breeze, one of our favorite lightning wallet apps, has come into proper release candidate status and they've added a blog post. That comes with a 4 million SAT capacity limit increase from 1 million SATs, which is 3 million SATs of good news.

So it's a 4 million limit, not a 5 million. Right. It's 4 million. It was 1 million. Yeah. That's 3 million SATs of good news. Okay. Yes.

Throw that line on the spot. tails v 4.12 has been released which is a dope ass private linux distro where you're able to just like pull the usb stick and it's supposed to wipe everything and that includes the new tor browser which also has been released tor browser v 10.0.2 which includes the new firefox and the new no script um raspite blitz v 1.6.1 was released right before the two disclosures released make sure you update that um so that you're not vulnerable to those disclosures um that also includes circuit breaker i think the first mainstream node package that includes circuit breaker um if you want to know more about that uh listen to our podcast episode with

used did i pronounce his name right yoast yoast yoast um you're close enough massive respect there even if i butcher your name um and that also includes a local version of mempool.space as well as a bunch of big updates there join join inbox got updated um to v0.1.12 which is the easiest way to use join market from our from our boy open arms um that's literally that's like the only way i use join market now so if you're going to use join market highly recommend just setting up a Raspi Blitz. Massively easier to use if you go that route. What else do we have here, Marty? We have Sparrow v0.9.6 has been released. Sparrow has added CoboVault QR import, added BidBot O2 support, improved wallet load times, and now it supports batch transactions, which

is a big deal considering we are probably never going to see one SAB per byte again for the rest of 2020. You heard it here first, freaks. Big news out of Voltage Cloud. They're now ordering Lightning Cloud services. So I guess we're now out of the updates. So we have Voltage Cloud Lightning service. What do you think of this, Marty?

Did you see this? Not going to lie, a little confused. So it's marketed as non-custodial cloud hosting for Lightning nodes, which means they're going to handle the networking, backups, upgrades for you, so you can just focus on using Lightning. What is this trust model? I'm going to ask that question to you. So it's a little bit regulatory arbitrage, right?

And this is kind of what we talked about earlier. um if they were custodial then they would be super easy to hit with regulations right so they can't be custodial um so so they're non-custodial because everything is encrypted so they can't see what's going on on the server theoretically but it's still their server they have physical control of the server it's not your hardware so the trust model is worse than if you had a node in your home but it's strictly superior than if you're using like wallet of satoshi and you're just using a custodial wallet right like you have your own you you strictly have your own lnd node that is encrypted by your own keys and if they're not doing any funny business they can't

access that they could theoretically shut it off they could do some fuckery with it if they had a channel open with it and stuff but they shouldn't be able to access the data inside of it and and we see noddle is about to release their own competitor to this noddle cloud um it is strictly inferior in terms of trust it is strictly inferior in terms of cost right like a noddle a raspi blitz if you build a raspi blitz you can build one for 300 you buy a noddle you can buy one i I don't even know what they cost right now. Like $400, $450. You can look that up at Noddle.it if I got it wrong.

This is, what is it, $26 a month? Something like that? $28 a month? Yes, $28. If you buy for the year. But one thing, $27 a month. Excuse me, $32.99 per month. No, but it's...

$31.99 per month. It's 20... Purchasing a month-to-month subscription. Right, but $27 for the year. if you buy for the year it's 27 per month which I'm like honestly like if you're gonna do this buy for the year there's something

to be said about the convenience factor I have been on a road trip and my my node was down for a week and a half and I needed to update it

because L&D had two vulnerabilities and i couldn't do it remotely so so for someone who's moving around a lot and i couldn't talk about it on the podcast because i didn't want people to know that my node was compromised like there was like a guy because when it's offline you can broadcast in an old state so i couldn't talk about on the podcast so there's an argument to be made about for certain people they just can't run a you know like a small single board computer like a noddle or a fucking raspi blitz like somewhere stable and they they might they might choose to use one of these cloud nodes and for app developers obviously there's there's major improvements if

they can use you know one of these always on uh cloud node instances for their users rather than requiring the users to have a single board computer yeah i think services like voltage are number one necessary number two inevitable um again as long as you have a range of different trust models and people are executing on people are running nodes like ourselves at home uh as well as services like voltage excuse me i think i think lightning network's gonna be fine and the i think it's okay i think it's going to happen naturally like again people love ux you have to think of the end user and if there's a company say i would prefer this to running this in like an amazon web server i think because i think this voltage is dedicated to bitcoin and lightning

specifically in catering to a very specific client which they'll dedicate their resources to make sure that a very specific client base is happy what's interesting because aws amazon would be more expensive if you were going to run it through amazon it's actually cheaper because uh they've like made it so they can run multiple instances on on servers so that they can reduce the cost as much as possible i i think as long as the trust model is clear it's it's good to have these things these cloud nodes um i think it's important for people to realize that strictly speaking from a trust model like you want uh you want to control your own hardware and it's really important that people control their own hardware for their nodes uh with

lightning it's a little bit different because it needs to be always on which is the main negative of lightning is that it always has to be hot and i i think really though like if we're just going to be we're at the bar just talking between boys the business model here for both voltage and other cloud node providers is one of regulatory arbitrage and it's because really in this situation it'd be way easier to just run a custodial wallet but they can't run a custodial wallet because then they have to add kyc and if they add kyc then you add all this friction and your wallet's not going to be used because no one wants to fucking enter all of their fucking passport information just to use your bitcoin app you know so so what's going to happen is

these are basically regular regulatory arbitrage tools in practice is is what the result is i like that thought i have another thought here could you use voltage as a backup No, like you're just running a carbon copy of your physical node at home in case your internet goes out, your power goes out. It could be a fail-safe. I don't think so. No. I mean, it'd be dangerous because the problem with Lightning

is if you broadcast an old state, it's considered cheating, and then you can lose everything. So you have to be very careful with your backups. You have to be very careful with concurrent backups. Maybe some wizard can figure that out, but right now, no. that would be a good service right um if you're able to encrypt all that data yeah i mean i think both could be good services i mean you have to be careful right like how does that backup work does that add another trust like is is that a backdoor to fucking with your home node

or your office node maybe yeah important problems to solve and yes i don't want to i think voltage is a good service that i would in some cases actually panned up like our just for the website having to always be on well we already we already rely on the same trust model for the website because it's on a virtual private server aws yeah yeah um so i would probably actually i'll probably voltage yeah i'll probably transition the voltage for that we're not allowed yeah um yeah we're not a club doesn't not already have the cloud though that's for like individual They've been working on rolling it out. It's not out yet, but I'm super excited for it.

Be on the lookout, freaks. Shout out to the Nautil team. And the Voltage team. And the Voltage team. Miss you both. Actually, I don't know if I've ever met the Voltage team, but I hope to meet you one day in the future. I think they're freaks.

We should get them on the podcast. We should. If you guys hear this, reach out. Let's chat. Go over these trade-offs. You know them better than we do, i would assume hodl hodl earlier today inspired by our boy matt odell here launched a p2p bitcoin lending support uh basically a lending platform where you can put bitcoin up as collateral get a

usd loan in the form of a stable coin whether it be tether um liquid tether uh usdc is usdc on it Yeah, he has DCs on it. I didn't even know I inspired them until release. Well, I told you. I told you. Right before release. We're going to hop on the mic with Max and Roman tomorrow morning. Maybe just Max.

I'm not sure exactly. Yeah, so we'll talk about this tomorrow. Yeah. And we'll actually probably release that right after that conversation. So the service is available. It's not available to U.S. clients or U.S. users. for like two weeks or three weeks or something yeah some some point which will be the it'll be the first service they offer that is actually available to us clients um they already have

their buy and sell service and they have a prediction service which both are technically not allowed for us users um all three of the services don't require kyc what's kind of cool here is it's a multi-sig escrow of the collateral between them you and and both parties so both parties and them are the are the three key signers is my understanding which is kind of cool yes you just assume that your counterparty will act a good faith and sign the but you don't have transaction you don't have to huddle huddles there to arbitrate and and be there if somebody tries to fuck somebody else over in these setups. So, shout out to HODLHODL.

In general, full disclosure, I would never lend against my Bitcoin. Fuck that shit. I'm just not going to do it. Like, I'll sell piecemeal at SatSent Parity. Full disclosure, I would actually think about taking out a Bitcoin collateralized loan.

Nah, fuck it. Can't do it. It's in my risk appetite. I would do it, if need be. Stay humble, freaks. i mean if you time the market right if you time the market wrong it's march 12th yes that's true um i'm not gonna put my whole stack yeah definitely don't put your whole well we can both agree on that one yeah i would use the service i would use a bitcoin as collateral

loan service i actually think those rates are going to be arbed down too so it's gonna become more common it's mostly a tax arbitrage service is what it is traditional banks are beginning to let you use bitcoin as collateral take out usd like not stable coin loans which is pretty crazy because if you sell the bitcoin then you have to pay taxes on it but if you loan against the bitcoin you don't have to pay taxes on it as long as that collateral stays above what your loan amount is but the problem is like in a march 12th scenario we went from like 8k to three and a half k so your collateral thirded so if you didn't have enough bitcoin in there you had to get bitcoin in there quickly otherwise they sold your bitcoin to pay the collateral and then at that

point you had to pay tax on that and you sold the bottom yes all right and so if something like this happens and you are going to add to your your collateral make sure you you send a fee that will probably get included in the next block make sure look at look at clark moody's dashboard before you make that transaction uh this bitcoin hippies by cnas what is cnas again i don't know i think i saw something if you click it it says what they are center for new american security were they were they were they the they're both agency or whatever that tied it back to like russian bots on facebook they're both dems and they they're they're they're they support both parties in america and they they were saying that bitcoin is being used to influence our elections

and it's dangerous and i think i just think there's a narrative we'll see more often so i put it in the list and guess what cns it's only going to increase from here bitcoiners are going to start buying politicians about a handful don't give them they're going to like quote you in their next like quarterly statement i'd be honored humbled yeah it's whatever i don't think bitcoin's really having an effect on any election i think most elections are getting or do i think nor do i think russian bots are so most most election interference is being done through the traditional financial system yes you can quote me on that in your quarterly i didn't see this until the last bbc reporting that thai authorities are attempting

to block access to telegram is it thai authorities are these thai authorities proxy for chinese communist party no no no thailand has massive protests going on right now i actually had a thai freak reach out yeah because china's trying to hong kong them right now aren't they no no no no no it's it's just thailand is trying to thailand them has nothing to do with ccp or i mean i mean i'm sure the ccp is doing shit in the background but but it's mostly just the i i think thailand has a monarchy um that is like military it's like a military junta i love the word junta they have like a military government over in thailand

that is just fucking shitty to their people so that the thai are protesting and they're mostly coming through telegram is the way that they're communicating with each other um so so thai authorities are trying to to shut it down and i had a thai freak reach out uh to let me know about it so i wanted to i wanted to spread the word and and in the good news is our boy durov you know if you're listening you should come on the podcast uh ceo and founder of telegram is like really good at trying to subvert these blockades he's he's it's like his i think it's a hobby of his he enjoys doing it all of our thai freaks out there stay strong stay safe we're pulling for you and i think uh while we have this topic on the top of our minds we should bring up the fact that uh

nigeria any nigerian freaks out there with the sars protest uh the no sars protest excuse me uh it seems like the military opened fire on protesters this week pretty abhorrent and despicable behavior on behalf of the nigerian government we're pulling for you nigerian freaks as well i'm not going to speak like i understand exactly what's going on in the ground in nigeria i used to cover nigeria back in my days when i worked at the fun just because of the sweet nigerian crude um but i have not stayed uh up to date with the exact happenings in the country uh but it does seem like uh peaceful protests are being met with violence from the state the government would say

it was never gonna see did you see the video like i'm just opening the bridge literally you're standing outside a gate i did not see that video having a sit down and the military started yeah i mean i i guess what i was trying to say is i think on this podcast we've unequivocally supported hong kong protests we've unequivocally supported thai protests we've unequivocally supported french protests we've unequivocally supported nigerian protests um but when it came to u.s protests there was nuance and consideration that maybe the protests weren't peaceful enough and i wonder how you level that in your perspective going forward

on these international protests considering that perspective previously in america i love that comment and we cannot provide that perspective for the freaks so any of you nigerian thai french freaks out there i want to help us get a better perspective please feel free to reach out make sure we're getting good information out there oh that's a good answer i would love to have any of you on the podcasts on the podcast um i mean i my default my default is i just think authorities will always say that the protests weren't peaceful and i will always stand on the side of protesters um because i think if you're inherently protesting you're obviously on the weaker side otherwise you wouldn't have to protest like the definition of protest yes

i guess here in america particularly this year the the question at hand is where they protest or or riots but that's what they always say like if you ask the nigerians they were riots over in nigeria in thailand there's riots in thailand i didn't see any burning buildings again i don't know the full perspective i can only speak for what i saw here in america yeah like i'm and i have to cover myself i'm not supporting riots but the easiest thing you can do is just put a provocateur in there and you can just make it you can make it uh you can you can make it as an excuse that they were not peaceful they were not you know whatever and and then you just you just drop drop the drop the boot on them yes what a world what a world

keep bitcoining freaks at least like i wrote today and like i wrote today in the bent bitcoin provides an opportunity for an optimistic future we can get away from these kleptocrats we can get away from these oppressive regimes it's not going to be easy it's not going to be immediate it's not going to happen i don't think in the next decade it's going to take time but it's a fight worth fighting and you make progress by contributing what you can whether it be code investing in businesses dedicated to creating products that are true to the ethos of bitcoin this is my shining light at least this is why i do what i do with the podcast the newsletter deciding to work at gam okay i believe bitcoin is a conduit for an optimistic future and that's

why i decided to spend my time on it yeah i mean to be perfectly clear uh i come from the perspective that i think short to medium term we're fucked if we don't have bitcoin so bitcoin is our only hope and that's why i've focused my time on it um bitcoin is a truth machine and you can't there's no nuance there there's no peaceful protest versus harmful riots with bitcoin it's just bitcoin it is what it is and and you can send you can send value all throughout the world without asking permission and that's fucking massive so i would love a world where people can speak freely they can speak with anyone they want to around the world and they can transact with those people anywhere around the world freely and i think we cannot accomplish that with laws we can only

accomplish that with code and that's why i do what i do and that's why i'm bullish and just naturally when that is enabled i believe that free trade leads to a more peaceful world just naturally and i think sound money actually helps bring that peaceful world too because it potentially inhibits inequality to a certain extent because you don't have the cantillan effect being applied to the monetary system. Matthew, we're almost two hours in. It's almost 7.15

here on the East Coast and we've got to get this out to the freaks. Let's wrap it up. What do you got to say? Bitcoin, Bitcoin, Bitcoin. Peace and love, freaks. Okay. Thank you.