That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Anton Du Beke

Episode Date: November 28, 2022

Gaby's guest this week is the award winning judge from BBC One's Strictly Come Dancing, Anton Du Beke. He joins Gaby to discuss Strictly, being judged, dancing with Bruce Forsyth, his family life and meeting Ricky Gervais outside the toilets at an award show recently! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

And welcome to That Gabby Roslin podcast, part of the A-Cast Creator Network. My guest this week is The Wonderful, All Dancing, Award-winning, Super Judge from Strictly, and of course, dancer, game show host, author, singer. I guess he had an album in the top 20, The Wonderful Mr. Anton Dubek. Don't forget, you can keep up to date by following and subscribing, please, to the podcast, where a new episode is released every Monday. Leave us a rating on the Apple Podcast app. And whilst you're there, why not leave us a review?

We love to hear your thoughts. Now, on with the show. Okay, after all these years, Anton DuBec, I can say, well, actually, you've won so many awards, but NTA winning. Anton DuBek, I mean, please. Do you know what, the most wonderful thing about it? I think the NTAs is the greatest of all awards.

Of course it is, because you just want one. Yeah. But it's because it's voted for by the, audience by the people who watch, go to shows, watch the theatre, watch the television, etc. Who are the most important people, as far as I'm concerned? Because otherwise we'd be in a room on our own rehearsing. Yes, and it's those are the people that we make television for, that we make radio for, that we make it for ourselves. We just do this otherwise, just do it for ourselves.

Go out for dinner, otherwise. Essentially, because you're in a room on your own. So the whole point is that we do it for an audience. And I'm, you know, I'd love to. Let me tell you this. Can I just, can I just tell you this? Yeah, you can tell me anything? I was in the car the other day,

and I was listening to an old Desert Island disc, because I do that. Scroll through, get a historical one, marvelous. And is Roberto Lanya, the opera singer. He's a tenor. Although, do you a deal, $8.50 at the weekends. And he's absolutely very much. He's remarkable.

He's a remarkable talent, classical, classically trait. It's just remarkable term. And I was listening to him, and he's Spanish, and I was listening to his story and fascinating. And I love that where somebody's chosen a particular path, and they come what may they stick to their path, and eventually they reach their dream of being a lead tenor at the Opera House or something.

The Royal Opera House. And I suddenly got this sort of of, a heavy heart, really. I had this sort of feeling of I wish maybe I'd taken a path to being a slightly more dramatic artist and being more of a, I don't like to use the word serious artist, maybe,

a classical artist maybe. Because I know, they're held in a slightly different realm, really. They're held in a slightly different way. They're regarded slightly differently to somebody who's in sort of entertainment sort of world. Do you know what I mean? Yes, I do. Absolutely.

And it's equally the same. It's the same. Whenever you're a performer of any sort, whether you're a writer, whether you're a broadcaster, whether you're a performer, whatever it is, it's all the same because you're always, you've all tried, well, not try to, you've all take a plough along your own path,

and you've got to your pinnacle, wherever it is, and you're a determined and a great performer. But some hold in slightly higher esteem because they come under the world of the classics, if you like. Sometimes I have this sort of feeling that I wish I'd maybe have gone down that road and been held in a slightly different regard. But I have a real problem with the fourth wall

is I'm not a fan of it. I don't like the feeling of that sort of them and us sit there whilst I do this and be I want you you have to be amazed because this is serious stuff and you're going to like it I'm not a fan of that them and us sort of the audience and the artist

I'm much more collaborative than that and I always have been and I suppose I'm influenced by my by my heroes which were Fred Astaire and Brucey really and they always had this amazing connection with the audience. Maybe because there were dancers. I don't know. Dancers have a different sort of thing. But they're entertainers. You use the word earlier. Yeah. Entertain. So if I stand on stage and I want to do something serious and I can do something serious and I will do something serious,

but then some stage I'll probably do some ridiculous gag or something because I can't help myself. Whenever I'm performing, I have to make it feel like we're all in it together. When I was doing shows, people say, well, you should DVD that show and put it on and I couldn't DVD because I didn't feel like if you weren't in the room, it wouldn't work for you. It probably would. But it feels much more scripted when it's a DVD. You have to stick to a thing and fine.

But whenever I'm on stage and performing, certainly if I'm talking to an audience, in any way, shape or form that I am, it's much more sort of fluid. Everything's driven by the room. That's the way I've always been. So do you not feel respected then? I don't know.

I don't want to become a therapy session, but I never like to presume how people think about me. All I do is I just do the best I can. And I try to be brilliant at what I do. And that's, so I, that's all my work I do before I walk out on the stage. So when I'm standing in the wings, I've done my bit of prep. If I haven't organised it by now, then, sorry, I'll sound it's too late. So I've spent a lifetime working on my craft, for one of the better words,

which is, you know, whether I'm a dancer, trying to, you know, I'm singing or whatever it is. and I've spent a lifetime of doing that, working on it, and then I go out on stage, or I walk onto a television studio, whatever it is we do. And then I'm there, it's a very modern expression, I'm in the moment, and I'm with the audience. So it's them and us together, and we're going to have a lovely time. Wherever I come out with a song and a dance,

and it doesn't matter what it is, I'm not lecturing, I'm not doing a thing where I stay in front of you and you're going to watch me and when you walk away you're going to feel like you've learned something. I'm not interested in that. Unless we're going to a lecture. But that's not what I'm there for.

I'm going to be there because I'm going to perform and we're going to go through this together. And that for me is the whole, that's the whole thing, really, for me. Yeah, I get that completely. You're speaking my language. I mean, I know exactly what you mean. You are a performer, you're an entertainer, you do have, of course you have respect.

You're also very skilled at things that you do. People know you as a skilled dancer, so they know that you can do that. People have heard you sing. They've come to hear you sing. You know, top 20 album, for goodness sake. You've top 10 books. But you are absolutely loved by the public. And that is something that a lot of people,

crave and want and you just naturally have it because I'm going straight back to where I started with and the words you used at the beginning it's about entertaining and that's what you've got inside you well I hope so because I come back to my great influences really which were which were

Frasdair and Brousie really and the thing about you know having I never met Fredstair of course but I spent a lot of time with Brucey and I hate to keep talking about me I seem to talk about Brucey Why don't hate it? I don't want it to feel like I'm sort of doing that thing.

No, no, you're not. It was a great influence on my life as a performer. And I just thought he was the best. And you try and learn from the best. You watch them and if you have the great opportunity of working with them, as I did with Brucey, then you can pick up so much. And he was great and we had a wonderful relationship. We played a lot of golf together and we did bits together and stuff.

You did a song and dance together. Sonoddars and Strickley, which was unbelievable. And I'll tell you another story. You wouldn't know this, because only 200 people know this. And they were in the room at the time. I did a little show at the hippodrome in London. They've got the, they had up there the cabaret room. It used to be the talk of the town back in the day.

And Bruce would have played that house many, many times, many times over the years. And then it became the hippodrome and they've got a cabaret room upstairs. I think they've got Magic Mike in there at a moment. Bruce and I did Magic Mike. we didn't. And so, and it's got stage here, and you have a little, it's like an old cabaret room. You have little dinner there, little supper there, and the show goes on. I love that place.

My thing is, I love doing stuff. So I'm happy to have a room of 200 people and, you know, everyone comes in for a fiver. And I just, because I like to use it as, I don't want to say the word practice, but I want to, I like to. Hone your craft. I like to do, because there's nothing like doing. My old dance teacher you say to me, it's okay practicing. That's important. It's okay having a lesson.

That's important. But you've got to do. Absolutely. You've got to go and do a competition, otherwise you'll never know. You won't know what it's like. It feels great in practice. You look great in the lesson. Let's go and see what it's like in the...

Take the fear away. Let's see what you're like where you're doing it for money, you know, as my old teacher used to say. Where it's competition. And you're in the room with other people. And then they go, okay, go now. And this is it. You know, one go. So do it now.

And it's a different animal. It's a different ballgame. And I, you know, I have my singing lessons, and I have my dance lesson, I'm rehearsing and stuff, and it all fills a million dollars. Looking in a mirror, and go, oh, that's a nice line. Look at that. Marvelous. Let's get on stage now and put this out there.

It's a different ball game. It's a different ballgame. So I just keep it, you know, keep it all going. And so I'm in the room, and I'm playing golf for Brucey one day. And he says, what are you doing? What are you doing anything coming up? I said, actually, the weekend I've got a little thing at the, the hippodrome. I'm doing, it's just, I'm just there with some of the guys.

from the band because I have a big orchestra I tour with when I'm on tour with Aaron. So there's about half a dozen of us. I've got Lance Ellington, the wonderful. Lovely Lance. Who I love, who I learnt so much from about singing. He's just the most wonderful man. And he's a special guest for me and I'll do some

summers. I could do it and it would be just an evening sort of weird and I like that sort of thing and I'm just doing some songs and I'm just doing some songs and bit of chat and stuff like. And for some reason I suddenly got this feeling that I should have asked Brucey if he'd like to come along. and do a number. So I said,

but listen, if you're not doing anything at the weekend, you fancy coming down and doing a number or anything, you went, oh really?

And suddenly I went, internally, I went, oh no, I've overstepped the mark. What am I thinking of? Ask him to come and do a song.

Fancy doing a song, Bruce. Oh, I'm having an turmoil. I'm having an internal. I can feel it. I can hear it. And he goes, I leave it with me.

And never mentioned it again for about, 14 holes. They've only played golf. 14 holes of golf is a long time. So I never gave it any thought. Anyway. So two days later,

it's like the Wednesday and we're doing the show on Friday night. He calls me. He goes, this thing you're doing it a weekend, he said. He goes, I've gotten some thought. He said, tell me to go away, he said,

if you've already organised it. He said, but I thought I'd come down and you me and Lance could do a song. We'd call ourselves the 3-5. Remember the 3-10ers? We'd do a song. What do you reckon?

I went, Bruce, I loved that. Oh my God. He goes, right, come to the house. Okay. Bring your MD. Come to the house and we'll routine it. Oh, okay. See you tomorrow.

Okay, fine. So Lance, myself and my MD Clive, we turned up at the house, the Bruce's, knock on the door. In you come, by the pool, piano there. We routine this number. The lady's a tramp.

She gets too hungry, Fodding, her out of it. Amazing. And then I talked him into doing a couple of other things. He does this great thing he did this wonderful tap dance number on a stall. And I said, do that number for me, Bruce,

because it's such fun and I love it. And the audience will love it. He said, oh, all right. He said, I'll do that. Anyway, we said, we'd end up doing three or four numbers. Went there in the afternoon to rehearse with the band. And he said, when are you going to rehearse? I said, we're going to do it on a day, but don't come.

Just turn up at night time when you want it. And then come on when you want. He said, no, no, what time are you going to be there? I said, well, probably about three o'clock. He said, I said, don't come and sit around all afternoon. Just come in the evening. Fine. So we get there.

He's sitting there already. He's sitting there in the room, having a coffee, three o'clock. Bruce, do your number then if you want to do your number and then go. You don't have to hang around. He said, no, no, no, I'm going to have a coffee, you carry on. People won't know this unless you've been to strictly come dancing. And I do the number in my shows all the time. And if you've ever been to come dancing, you'll know, I love you because you're like an audience member.

It's so great. You just sit there and allow me to chat. Yes, do. I love you. Absolutely. So if you ever been to really come down dancing, you'll know this, that Brucey would do his own warm-up. And he would do it. It was so brilliant because, and I used to always go into the studio when he was doing his warm-out.

He would come down, and we had a wonderful warm-up man anyway. But Bruce would come down about half and a half an hour before the show starts and he'd come down. And he'd chat to the audience, do a few gags, blah-b-b-ba, do a few things, tell him what you'd like people to do, etc, etc. And then he do that thing where he just breaks into a song. And he go, okay, Dave, take it away, Dave, from the top. and the band would strike up and he would do almost like being of what a day this

has been what a rare mood I'm in why it's almost like being in love and he would do this number and in the middle there'd be an instrumental break and he would it would be like an eight bar part of it but he would extend it to about 24 bars something like that and at that point in time we go right

let's see we've got in the audience tonight and he'd come down a band of a play and he'd walk down onto the onto the floor and anybody dance anybody dance and all the girls and throw their arms up. He said, you, madam,

he said, come up here, here we go, let's have a go. And he started dancing with somebody from the audience. And it was just,

go. And it'd be so funny because you know what he was like he was a terrible tease, Bruce. He'd go, oh, look,

300 people in the room and I had to pick you. And if he dancing around and all this sort, oh, look, she's a, oh, look, she's good,

this one's a good. And then, anyway, put her down, you go back up, finish a song. Well, if you were that woman,

that's your dinner party story for the rest of your life. Life made. There you are. You've danced with Bruce on the street floor. Are you mad? So, anyway, we're doing this thing

and I've got this number in there, in the thing. And he said, you should open me that number. I said, Bruce, I can't open me the number. It's your song. He said, no, no, no. I want you to open that number because it's a good number.

He said, you should open that number. I went, okay, so I opened with his song. And we did the thing. And I said, listen, Bruce, you come on whenever you like. And if it's going terribly, I said, Don't come on. If it's a nightmare,

he said, I'll sit up there on the balcony, he said, I'll sit up there quietly. He said, and just, I said, okay, well. This is Bruce Forsyne. This is just incredible. This is ridiculous. So he sits in the corner up there's in the balcony, and we do the first half,

blah, blah, blah. The thing goes well, lovely jubbly. And we're coming for the second half, and we're going through a second half. And I turn to my right to look over my shoulder to Clive just to say, let's do such and such number. And then suddenly the place goes mad. We're getting to the end of the show now.

and I turn around and it's Brucey walking onto the stage unannounced with a microphone he goes now he said I've been watching your show he said it's absolutely marvellous he said no I'll tell you what you need now you need a special guest star so here I am well the place were up on their feet cheering for Bruce anyway if we said we did a bunch of numbers

and then we did a bunch of numbers and then we finished a show all together on stage and it was one of the greatest nights of my life and the only people who knew about it were the people in the room. And it's one of those wonderfully special nights that you can. And they won't. And they won't. It's the most special night of my life. But that's

the man that Brucey was. Yeah. Yeah. Wonderfully generous and incredible. And that's why that's influenced me. Yeah, but you're like that. Going back to the first thing about that's why you won the award because people are aware of that. You are an entertainer.

You want to keep everybody happy. I mean, that's your big thing. And I met Hannah and you've got your twins and I imagine that you when you go home you must feel in a

way and I probably the wrong word deflated because you're always, you're there you are a natural performer there's either a part of me that thinks, does he go home and go or do or are you

entertaining your kids, entertaining Hannah all the time. Do you ever have downtime, as it were? Do you know what I mean? Well, I don't know, really. You have to ask Hannah that one, I suppose. I mean, I'm, you know, I'm quieter in that regard at home. I imagine me 24 hours a day, even I'd get annoyed with myself. My family get very annoyed to me because I'm way, hey, all the time.

But when you've got five-year-olds, five and a half-year-olds, it's very important. Yeah. It's just full energy. Anyway, and my children are quite, or our children, they're, they're as you would, as you want them to be at five. They're energetic. They're running around and loud and enthusiastic and great. And so it's wonderful, really.

So I feel I have a responsibility to keep, you know, energized. But you're on it all the time. I mean, I remember the many things that we've done together. One of those things that will always stay with me was. when we did Wimbledon, we did the men's final. And we had lovely, my friend Deborah, James. And you danced with Deborah. And Deborah always wanted to be on Strictly.

That was her thing. And I remember what you were saying off my guy, it's ridiculous, you should be. And you danced with her. And afterwards, I said, you made you absolutely, I mean, she talks about it for the rest of her life. And her mom, I know you've now danced with her mom, Heather as well.

but you were aware that you knew how to make somebody's day and that is a gift to spot it when it's you don't make it about you so as you say you learn from Bruce but you've got that naturally I can imagine you going home and making sure that your kids have their day have their moments no but you did you do that for people you know Deborah for for people in the street you know I've been with you where I've seen people Anton, you know, and you're on it? Well, I'm always aware that I never want to make somebody feel awkward.

You know what it's like, because people, you know, people come and say hello and I know what it's like. People, sometimes they do it spontaneously. Like if somebody said to me, actually earlier today, she went, oh, hello? And she went, oh, I totally actually, we don't actually know each other, do we? I said, yes, we do. Of course we do. We know everyone. But, you know, it's that recognition, that sort of familiarity sort of thing.

And I like that because I think we're all friends. I like that sort of feeling. Because, as I said, people were all in it together. And if somebody feels that they know me well enough to go high, then I'm delighted that they should want to come and say hello. And that's why you won the award. Let's be on. And that's why you won the award. I'm going to use the word judge now

because you and I have talked in the past about being judged. Now obviously we're in a different role but that's one of the things and I will never do strictly and very kindly have asked but I never would. I wish you would have done it with me back in the day. I would only do it with you.

Because I know how good you're not. See, a lot of people don't know this but I know how marvellously talented you are. Oh, shush, no, no, no, no, but you are super good. No, no, no, no. Thank you. Shush. But it's the idea of being judged. So you, even at a very, very young age, you were being judged.

Now, that's... Oh, yeah, that's... That's... A whole life of that. Yeah, yeah, I don't mind being judged. I mean, people talk about, you know, how do you feel about criticism? I don't mind about criticism. It doesn't bother me.

But even as a child, did you not... Yeah, I mean, I started dancing when I was a bit later, about 13 and 14. And it's... Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's... They're difficult times because, you know, you don't want to get... criticised at that age, but I was okay with it. It's funny old thing, isn't it, criticism? As long as it's constructive, you don't mind.

As long as you know what they're talking about. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Is that sort of, you know, a difference between home and house, you know, home is so abstract. House is sort of obvious and concrete, isn't it? And, you know, if somebody who say to me, you've got to give it a bit more. I used to get, sometimes people say that to me, well, you've got to give it a bit more. a bit more you know I don't know what that means

a bit more a bit more you want to smile more you want me to move further I don't know what's that way someone says to me you've got to sharpen up your frame I know exactly what that means okay fine

so and that was always the big thing for me I just needed the information to be clear that's very interesting because it's changed these days because I mean when we were younger and when we were starting out there was no social media there was no

trolling there was none of that awful stuff And so I suppose that the word judged is different now because anyone can judge you. If you're on TV people and radio people, you know, performers, whatever we're called, we are going to be judged all the time. Well, you are going to be judged because, but we, you know, we all do it. I mean, life is about being judged. We say, oh, you know, we shouldn't be so judgmental. And we're sort of not trying to be, but, you know, one does, doesn't it?

You go, what do you think of that? Well, I don't really like that one. Well, immediately you're judging. Yeah, but you're also, you're not the sort of person who's going to see somebody wearing something. They go, oh, why's she wearing that? Oh, I'd like to know why, though. But then I, this is, what? You wouldn't do it in a nasty way.

I certainly wouldn't go to go, what were you? What were you? What was the thought process behind this? Because someone's going, oh, well, I'm doing a bit of that with a bit of that. I go, oh, I like that. That's tremendous. That's tremendous. That's so funny.

I don't like to go, because I know that it's only one person's sort of preference. So I go, well, I don't like that. Okay, fine. Well, don't like it then. Don't go to me. Yeah. But I do want to know, though, if something's good or bad. And I like that sense of black and white, because I can do stuff with that. You're all right for people saying no, because I have to say, I completely agree with you. I think we have to learn all the time. Learning is so exciting. I've got enough experience in what I do and in life that I know what to do with stuff. I've got enough backstory. So, for example,

My old dance thing you say to me once, Bournemouth, it's very simple, he said, you've got to look good and you've got to move well. Now, that's a really simplistic way. And he's not talking about you'll have a pretty face or your hair done. He's just all right, look good as in, it'll look smart, your shape's got to be right,

dynamic of movement's got to be good. So you're talking about technical things, really, but in a very simplistic way. But that's enough for me. I need that big sort of, what they call it, top line stuff. Just the thing, good, bad. No good, your bum stuck out.

Okay, well, I know what to do. with that because I know the technicalities of why your bum's going to be sticking out. It's not personal. No, it's not about my... The simplicity of saying my bum sticking out is not the problem of my, of why my bum sticking out. That's the result of something else. My knees

are too straight, for example. I'm pitched too far forward with my weight. I need to get more in the centre of my foot or something. You know, I've got to drive my centre away from my standing foot. There's a technical thing going on underneath there. My standing leg isn't compressing enough as I take away from it. So there's lots of highlyfalutin technical stuff

which results me if I'm sticking out. So I've got to, so I've got enough information backlogged in my head, enough experience to know with a simple, that's good, that's bad. How was that today? Rubbish. Why is that then?

Too long? I'm happy with that. So I say to my wife, I say to my wife, how does I sound when I'm on the show? I have the sound. She's not great, she's too long. But I need to get all that stuff out, though.

You're better when you're short, she'd say to me, couldn't you imagine? I love Hannah. She's so great. She's so bawlsy, Hannah. You want me to talk less? Yes, please. How did you to meet?

Oh, just a do. Went with Golf Club, actually. There was a big golf day, charity golf day. And in the evening, there's a black tie dinner in Auckland, one thing, and another. She went along to the dinner as a plus one, actually, of another chap. and I was there and I saw her across the table, a bit like you and I now sitting across a table,

big round table, and of course you can't speak to the people opposite. You're not speaking to people next to, you know these things like. And I chat with this guy she turned up with, a friend of hers, who happened to be sitting next to me and I asked him about his wife

and he said, oh, no, no, not married. I said, oh, sorry, your girlfriend, what did she do? After I'd establish what he did, I went straight in with the girlfriend. And he said, oh, no, no, she's just a friend. It just came in. I went, oh, just a friend.

Oh, the game's afoot. And then, you know, and the rest of they say is history. Oh, how that's, I love that. It's, uh, I should, it was, it was funny. I mean, it depends on you tell. But it was, so I'm looking across the table at her, and she's doing that thing with her hair where she's tootling behind the ear and all that sort of stuff, which she'll deny, of course.

And all that sort of stuff there and sort of looking at me, but not really sort of, you know, acknowledging more. making contact like that and I'm sort of giving her the nod and the eye and all that sort of stuff. She must have thought I'd something wrong with. And anyway, towards the end of the dinner, she gets up to leave the table. And I thought to herself, right, here's my chance. I've got to go talk to her. I never gave it enough thought, though, because when you're at a dinner like this,

there are very few reasons to get up and leave the table. Unless you need the wee. Exactly. Yeah. So I basically followed her out to the ladies' toilet. Love that. Brilliant. So in she goes.

I'm three paces behind her and she's off in and I go Ah, right. So, well, well, you're right, I suppose better go. So I dipped into the men's, which was next door. And then I came out of the men's and went, oh, she might have gone back to the table.

Oh, I might miss my chance. What am I? Do I wait here? She might still be in there. She'll ask somebody to check? I can't do that. That's ridiculous. And as I'm mulling this stuff over.

She comes out of the loo and I'm stood there outside of the ladies' toilet. And she's, stops and looks at me and she goes, if you've been waiting outside the toilet for me? And I went, might have been. She went, weirdo, and walked off. I love that. Walked off.

I went, oh, she's borsy. This is not really badly. She's borsy. But fortunately, I managed to find a way of chatting to her and the rest of those days history. But she deals with all of the rubbish that comes alongside being that see, word, which I hate a celebrity.

She deals with all that so well. I mean, I've been at events with you too, and I'll talk to her. She goes, oh, look, they're all ignoring me. They're, there, and so, and there's this weird thing where they sort of, my husband always just laughs about it. He doesn't like coming to them. But he just laughs about it because people sort of elbow, you know, they, oh, hi, actually. They thrust the phone in her hand.

Take a photo of us. And she's, oh, right, okay, this is my role for the night, I see. But she's all. She's very good. And she's also been very honest and open, because you did interviews. about endometriosis and the IVF journey and everything. So she's, I mean, like I say, she's ballsy. I like Hannah.

Yeah, she's, she's, well, yeah, obviously I would say it, but she is amazing. And she, as you said, suffers from endometriosis in a major way. But she's talked about it. She didn't need to, but she's going to help other people. I think she should do more in that regard. It's very difficult for time, really, you know, you've got two small children and she's got, you know,

a career as well and very busy in that regard. But she would like to, I know she would like to do more about it and talk more about it because as you know, if somebody is suffering from it, like all these things, when you're suffering from something, you think you're the only person, you don't know what to do and it's very difficult. I had a friend of mine who never talked about it, Amber, because you and your wife talked about it, she talks about it. Well, I think that's terrific and I think it's really, really important because, you know,

all these things, a problem shared, is a problem? But you're also, you're very open about a lot of things because you do, you know, you, yes, you're a performer, but you're, there's, you, you don't shy away from your life and what, you know, your childhood and all of those things. We don't need to go into all of that now, but you're not, you're very open about things. And that's again, I'm going to go back to you,

you're always making sure that everybody else is okay. Yeah, again, when I, when I started doing straightly come dancing, I realised immediately, and I'm glad about this actually, that it wasn't about me. I'm already here, it says on my dressing room door, professional dancer. And I'm only being chosen as a professional dancer because I was good, one of the top ones. And I say that with an element of sort of humbleness,

but it is sort of true. Yes, of course. Because I've chosen anyone. It chose me because I was a good principally, a top one of the top dance. And he wanted eight. people and that's why I got chosen. So now we

established that, we park that, so I've got nothing to prove. And now I've got a lady I'm dancing with who is a famous person. This is first year, I've never, nobody had ever heard of me. So now I've got a lady who's Leslie Garrett fortunately for me

who's here, Gabby Roslin, who is a massively famous person because she's on Strictly Come Dancing and that's one of the reasons why you're on it because you're very well known, and there's only eight, there you are. You're on the biggest show on it as it turned out to me.

And so now my job is not to prove to everybody how marvellous a dancer I am, of it's established we already know that. My job is to make you as good as you can be and to put all my energy into you and focus on you, because by doing that, it makes me look better anyway. But you do this naturally with everything. Well, but then I feel that way about everything

because I don't need to prove myself in that regard because if people know me, it's because they know me. I don't need to go to somebody, tap them on the shoulder and go, do you know who I am? I'm talking about it. Oh, I didn't have no idea.

Oh, it's interesting. Tell me about you. Well, let me tell you about me. It's a fascinating story. And somebody's coming up to me, can I have a photograph? Of course, you can have a photograph. So all that other stuff's already been done.

I don't need to do that anymore. But I think in that regard to prove to this person. And also it takes something sometimes for people to come and say, listen, I'm a great fan of the show and blah blah and one thing or another. And could we have a picture? Yes, of course. You could have a photograph. Come on.

Marvelous. And I don't mind it at all. And I don't want anybody to ever feel a bit orcs. You know that feeling where you do something? You go, I wish I hadn't done that. Someone's made me feel really uncomfortable. Oh, we listen. We've all felt like that.

Yeah. And people, I hate it. You don't want to be the person that makes that person feel comfortable. I agree. I just feel terrible, just thought of it. I completely agree with you. So when you became judge, and you and I have spoken about this away from any microphone,

but when you became judge and the audience loved you, and it meant that you were now full-time judge, which is great news, as you know, personally, you know how thrilled down about that. Is there a part of you, I can't bear that I'm going to ask you this? I'm going to do you miss dancing? Do you miss the performing? Well yeah I mean

a little a little bit only only the good ones only the good numbers but I know you still do with your tour which is now you're going back out on tour yeah I'm still still dancing performing so that's one thing but not doing it on the television

I do a bit I miss dancing and having that sort of fun I have with my partners you know whether they're good bad or indifferent and sort of didn't really matter because we were just We'd have a laugh.

We were building something and we were creating something that was unique to us. I enjoyed that whole shared experience thing and stuff but I hate getting voted off. I couldn't stand the getting the voted off thing and it became cliched who they put you with.

You could always go oh that's the one that's going to be with that. Oh, that one is. And so the flip side of that of that, of course, is that when people get put on the show, if they end up dance with me, they immediately go, oh I didn't realize I was going to be that one.

I said, no, it doesn't mean you have to be that one, my love. Look, with Katie and with Emma. So it was marvellous, but it was a, it is, you know, it is a double-edged sword. It's a double-edged sword sometimes, yeah. You know, that's just the result of having been on the show for a long time and dancing on the show for a long time, which is a great pleasure. Well, potentially. My attitude was, let's just do the best. best number we can, regardless of how good or bad you are or what the judges might think,

because if you're not doing very well and you can't dance very well, then there's no point that's going forward side, together, the backside together, because you're not going to get marked very highly. And so if I pick you up and chuck you across the floor and the crowd stand on their feet and give your rapturous round of applause, you're still not going to get marked very highly, but the audience are going to love it. And that was my attitude. So do you have that attitude when you're marking and watching the dancers now? Yeah, I'm much more about I know what they're trying to do and I know what's happening here.

And I can also see what's happened here. So I'll watch a couple and I go, oh, this isn't, you're not doing this very well, but I'll know that this isn't what happened on Thursday in rehearsal because I can see how good they are and what their technical abilities like. But I can see this is a Saturday night, got a bit nervous, job. So, for example, I saw that with Kim Marsh and Gratiana doing their quick step to Borum Blitz

on the 100th celebration of the 100 week. And I could see that this wasn't her normal sort of state of affairs. She seemed a bit sort of unnerved or something. She looked terrified. Yeah, and I don't know why. Somebody sitting and watching it at home, I thought, my God, what she's so scared of? So I know that this wasn't, maybe she just had a. funny five minutes or something, I don't know.

So, you know, you can sort of take into consideration a little bit and understand that, and actually fact, technically she's good enough to pull this off, but she's just gone a bit funny. So you can see all of that that the other judges might not. You still got to judge what you see. I mean, I can't say to her, well, normally this would be great, so I'm going to give you a 12. Yes, yeah, of course. So you still got a judge it, but you can understand what's going on.

But I'd like to give people, you know, but then I can put that in my comments, say, listen, I can see that you're a bit nervous tonight and whatever. But I'd like to give people sort of criticism or comments that might be able to help them. Oh, no. I mean, as, you know, we're all armchair critics. And I've never missed an episode. And it's so lovely because I watch With the Family. And my dad's at his house.

And he always talks about it when I see him on a Sunday. And it's always, who do you think is going to be voted off? And I don't want spoilers. I don't want anybody to tell me all of that. And we get upset because you have your favour. It's all the rest of it. And I apologize to this year. I'm absolutely loving it.

But there were the most extraordinary Saturday night television I think I've ever seen, and I am a TV addict, Rose and Giovanni and John and Johannes. I mean, that's on a Saturday night on BBC One, this beautiful deaf girl dancing and that silence. And I know what you were, I think it was one of the most remarkable. remarkable things I have ever seen.

That and diversity, I know, you know, when diversity did the Black Lives Matter dance, you know, you just see some things on television, you go, wow, look where we are now. Yeah. And Rose, what, that was... Yeah, it was staggering, really. It was.

It was, actually that's good word. It's one of those moments that's sort of transends the... I love moments. The matter what it is, certainly in art or sport, wherever it is, but it sort of transcend the moment. So I remember watching a final, actually probably the year that we were together. where Nadell and Federer were in the final of the men's at Wimbledon.

And the game was of such a quality and such a standard. It sort of went beyond it being a tennis match. It went to sort of two people, two gladiators sort of up against each other, fighting sort of to the death, but not only in a sort of physical tennis match, but also in a cerebral way where they're trying to out sort of fox each other

in this incredible level of high intensity but still with this clearness of mind that you can only get to at certain moments in a lifetime. I remember one teacher, my old teacher, he was like eight times a world champion. He won his first world championship one year and didn't get beaten again in a single competition for nine years. Wow.

So I had a nine-year span of his career where he never came anything other than first. Him and his wife. remarkable a ballroom dancing couple professional ballroom dancing couple and we used to have lessons

from them and he said to me yeah I remember he said I danced really well about four times in my career sorry you haven't lost a competition for nine years

said yeah there was about four times where I danced really really well where I thought this is sort of perfect he said he said most of the other time you're sort of you know

making the best of what you got at that moment in time Now that's your hard work. That's you bringing up your bottom level to match your top. So the great exponents of whatever are people that their top level is of the highest and their lowest level is very close to that top level. So their gap is very small. Other people, which, and I was probably one of these, had a very, very high top level,

but their bottom level was quite low in regards to the gap between top and bottom was too vast. So you'd have a great night where you look at it and go, this is the greatest thing I've ever seen. And other nights where you look at each other and you go, well, we've never met. And so you, and that breeds inconsistency. And that's the same with all great performers that the real highest echelon of performer

have a very narrow gap between where it's not great and where it's great. And I was intrigued to hear him say, yeah, I dance about four times really, really well. and Rose and Giovanni come back to that that moment there was a moment that sort of you take it out of Strictly Come Dancing

and just put it as a moment It sort of sits there as a moment in time It could have been on Straitly Come Dancing could have been on anything really because it was such an amazing sort of immaculate moment captured there

Forever Forever really And it doesn't matter what we ever do on Strictly Come Dancing I don't think anything's going to top that really everybody's going to remember that. Even when Straitly comes off in 100 years. Yeah, I mean, we'll still remember that.

Unforgettable. But also the fact that there were two men dancing on a Saturday night, time show. Yeah, I mean, that's great. I mean, do you know what was so fascinating about that? Was it became really normal, really quickly? Yes. And I thought that was great.

You know, we started, we came out, we got John and Johannes. And everyone went, all right, okay, let's have a look at this. Let's see, that's going on here. Okay, got the two fellas dancing together. all right and then literally 30 seconds in we went well this isn't perfectly normal I don't know what the fuss was about

and then we just settled in but it's everybody else's fuss This is exactly what it is You know it was But everybody needs to have that moment Where they go oh okay Because you have to Because in life

As soon as everything becomes normalized Everything is fine Yeah Until we get that sense of Well the same as Rose A deaf girl dancing to music Yeah A deaf girl can never dance to music

You mad Oh no she can actually Oh that becomes normal And it's and I And I love that. And I love that the fact that it's a sort of an immediate thing. And it, you know, the world hasn't ended. Two fellas dance together.

Yes, exactly. Natural fact, it's absolutely normal because two fellas do dance together. You only got to think about Ferresterio and Gene Kelly. Oh my gosh, I've never even thought of that. Two men have been dancing together for a long time. And I kept saying this at the beginning of the series, that last series, I kept saying, oh, two fellas danced together. I said, yeah, I know, but we've had two fellows dance together before.

It's perfectly okay. don't want to people and their opinions funny ideas but it's I'm sure they made the final and they were brilliant but what I loved about it the most

was that everyone went yeah it's absolutely fine normal pretty normal and quite rightly the Rose and Giovanni won because it was

like you say it was something so extraordinary I will never forget it somebody who's never I'm addicted to television I live it breathe it eat it devour it

that is one of those stand-up moments. I'm so pleased that I watched it live as well, that I had that experience. And then rewinding, calling my husband from upstairs, and just going, watch this, watch this. And then tears streaming down my face. And I said to the girls, never forget that you've just watched that.

And I often don't want to watch those things again too many times because it's that classic thing of, you know, the more you watch it, the sort of... Oh, it never... Trust me, I keep watching it. The impact never has the same. same and then it becomes a bit sort of, you know,

it doesn't mean anything. But when you have that moment, Leah, you'll remember it, as the years go and you'll remember it differently. And it's fascinating to see how your memory changes. So let's just end on things that make you laugh. Let's never end. No, I could talk to you for 100 years.

Let's never end. You told me just before we came on air, you're about to tell me a story of, because I know you think Ricky Chavez is very funny. Ricky Javees and you the NTAs What is the story of you and Ricky Javees at the NTAs in the Lou?

Oh no, I was dashing into the Lou and it was there and Ricky I've never had anything to do with Ricky I've never sort of really met Ricky But I think he's brilliant Oh, afterlife is genius Genius

And his stand-up stuff is I know it is You either love it or I did But I have to say it does make me laugh He is on the on the edge there and you do go Ricky, I mean you can get away with that. And it's, excuse me, it's funny.

And I was just dashing in and I was busting him to go and sat in the car. Is this post-a-a-a-a-word? Post-a-ward. Right, okay. I dashed him. And the granddaddy arm, I looked at him and I went, Ricky,

love you. After-life, best thing of us in. Watch super nature the other night. Hilarious. Run into the loo. And as I came out, As I was walking past him, he goes, did you wash your hands? I went, yes, I did, thank you very much.

And then later in the evening, after I told everybody I loved them, I couldn't help myself. I love that on stage. Michael McDonough, I love you. I loved you. Ricky, I love you. Anyway, I saw him upstairs. He goes, thank you very much, he said, for just calling me by my first name. He said, I feel a bit like Madonna now.

I said, we don't need the second name with you. And actually, I'm just going to call you R from now on. Everybody knows exactly what I'm talking about. Well, people have that with you. He's so nice. He is a lovely man actually. He does make you. People do that with you. Anton, you've talked about your real name.

It's ridiculous how people go on about that. But you're Anton. That's who you are. You've reached that place. No, you have. Without a doubt. So last night, very showbiz night. I went to a Gala night of a theatre show.

I've been around a bloody long time. And they were saying, oh, what are you doing tomorrow? I said, oh, I'm starting today with Anton. everyone. And I'm talking A-listers. They're all going Anton! Anton DeBec! Everyone. So that's how I wanted to end. It's completely true. I'm not going to

name drop who those people are. I will tell you afterwards. But completely true. And you are now... Forget Ricky being Madonna. It's Anton. Anton Anton is Madonna. Thank you, darling. I love you. I literally love you.

Thank you so much for listening to this episode. Now, coming up on the next episode. Next week, we have actress Charlie Clive, who will be here just before her run of shows kicks off at the Soho Theatre on the 12th of December. She is fabulous. You've seen her in so many TV shows. You've seen her possibly in her stand-up. You've heard her being interviewed before, but you've never heard her interviewed like this. That Gabby Roslyn podcast is proudly presented to you by Cameo Productions with music by Beth McCari. If you wouldn't mind, could you give us a like, a fallen, a subscribe, and please leave a review?

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