That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Clarke Peters

Episode Date: January 9, 2024

Star of The Wire, Clarke Peters, joins Gaby in the studio for a joyful natter.They talk about his love of music - and musicals - his new TV series ('True Love') - and we get treated to some impromptu singing too! Clarke also talks about his time filming The Wire - and reveals an incredible fact that was discovered about the show, from actual Wire Tappers! We hope you enjoy the ep...and we apologise for the naughty words. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Clark Peters. Hi, Gabby. Can we start with musicals? Yeah. Please. Yeah. Music is in your soul, isn't it? I mean, that's...

Pretty much so. John Armour Trading? Isn't that where you first started out? Oh, my God. Love and affection, one of my favorite all-time songs of all-time. I knew Joan before... When Joan and Pam had a little duo folk group together, we were all signed to Cube Records on Poland Street.

Essex Music was the house, it was Essex House. And we were all there. I had a little group I was asked to come on in to demo a song. I was living in Paris. I went back to Paris and when I arrived, they said, the demo was so good they want you to form a group. And I came back over and, Joan and I were in and out the building around the same time, quite a few of us there.

And it was just great when she said, would you come and sing on this? And there was Leroy in who, Leroy Wiggins, who was also in now group, and Tyrone Scott, who was the lead singer. And the next hand knew was, oh, give me love to, you. Oh, seriously, whenever anybody says, you know, what's in your top five, that song is in my top five all-time favorite songs. That's beautiful.

I love it. It's so beautiful. And I think, weirdly, I think it should be re-released today because I played it to my daughters about a month ago and they just sat in them and oh, that is incredible. Yeah. Her melodies, her lyrics,

her sensibility with music, the way she communicates, I just, I haven't seen her so long, I feel guilty. And if you're listening to this, I'm coming to you, all right?

I'm coming to see you, Joan. That would be lovely. But you also then, from being in the band, you then went on and wrote musical, I wrote two musicals. I wrote one with some, well, both of them I've written with friends. It's a collaborative endeavor, that's for sure.

But when the group broke up, I went right back into theater. And it was Guys and Dolls at Watford Rep, 1976. So who were you in Guys and Doll? I was Skymasters. And it was Ducky Squires. Remember Dunky Squires? Yeah, he was. a choreographer. That's right. On TV.

Yeah, Dougie was wild. I was hired to play a character named Liver Lips Louis. And so I was just happy to be in a theater. And Dougie and I, we tell the story differently. He says he always wanted me

to play Sky. Well, if he told me that, I would have been ready for it. But around the third week of rehearsal, there was no Sky. And I stood in a couple of times and would read for it and obviously when luck came, when luck came around, anyone who's my age knows this song, you know, from the States. And so I sang that and I was sky right up until opening

night. Wow. With Elizabeth Manchester. I love it. Oh. So like I said, musicals, music is in you. And then five guys name, I mean, I remember going to see it and just, oh, I loved it. I was, I was very little and I loved it and I mean I love musical theatre but but and then of course you were Billy Flynn and we were talking about that before before we started recording

that's such a character and I love that you did a little bit of Billy Flynn from from Chicago just that little bit you did because you said you could just play with it yeah you could it's it's supposed to be Billy manipulating Roxy and she set up like

a mannequin on his on his lap You know, he's got his hand in the back of the puppet, and he's doing this. And from having children, I've discovered these voices in me, you know. And so, I would go, you're supposed to go, where you come from? Massachusetts. And you, you know, so I said, no, to hell with that. Where you come from? Mississippi.

Very wealthy. Where is that voice from? I know. I know. This is what I'm saying. This is what I'm saying. When you have kids you've got to entertain them

then you find all of these characters inside of you and so I used it in Chicago It was interesting when you said the smile on your face when you do that

and you talk about your kids and the smile on your face when you talked about being back in theatre does that still put that smile on your face when you talk about theatre? Because I suppose we all know you

for films and TV Yeah I think I think it does. I'm about to do Lear. I'm about to do The Fool in Lear to Danny Sopani playing Lear. And there's so much scope to play around with, to play The Fool. You know, and at first I thought this is going to be a lot of fun.

And we were at this event where Ian McClellan was there, and we started talking about this. and he pointed out how important this role is to the piece and that he's not like a jester. And that put the smile back on my face because it's the breadth of emotions that this man has got to go through and the truths that he speaks to power. And then this truth that he lays before the audience

before he walks away is exactly what I want to say. How wonderful. It'll always bring a smile to my face. There's no doubt about it. It scares the hell out of me. Oh, really, still? Yeah, and particularly Shakespeare. Thither, thither, thither's thethers.

There comes that voice again. That's the same voice. I know. I don't know where he come from. And I was just over in Ireland with my friend, you know, with Chris O'Dowd. Do you know Chris O'Dow? Yes, oh, he's wonderful, Chris.

I tell you, I was. sitting there with them and we were just having the most wonderful time. You know, I'm looking at you and all these ways, it's the same boat. People who are just listening to this, I promise this is still Clark Peters. But let's go to TV and film. I don't know, I don't, I think I want to start with Bellboards. Just that film, I've suddenly gone, Ebbing, Missouri. It's a long story.

It's a long title. Five, Bill, no, yes, yes. I have a friend. Oh, my goodness. It's called, it's called three billboards outside Ebbing, Missouri. Three billboards outside Ebbing, Missouri. What an extraordinary film. Yeah, yeah.

And Francis McDermott is just fantastic in it. You know, again, that's what theater should be doing, you know, addressing certain issues in an oblique kind of way so that you get the message, you know. And it was wonderful to play. play. It was wonderful to play with her and all of those actors who were leaving me a little bit starstruck because

I spent more time over here than there but those are the faces that I see on television and films when they come out you know. They feel like that about you. Well, that's nice, that's nice but it was fun. It was an extraordinarily

powerful film though and it won so many awards and I'm so pleased it did because it made people carry on talking about it because the whole story behind it, everything about it was incredibly powerful and it made you think. It was one of those films that you leave the cinema and you just, you carry on thinking about it. You carry on talking about it. And it's also a good who-done it.

You just don't know what's going to happen when those two people who you never put together in the same sentence, let alone in the same car going in the same direction, you know, And you just, you have no idea what's happening. And the way that it was edited left the audience wanting to find out what happened. Did they go after him? Did they find him? You know, if you're not seen Ebbing three billboards, you should, because it's a really good, a really good mystery.

It is very good. And those issues of, the issues of the, the feminist movement, and this is before me too and all of that kind of stuff when those issues are in a person's hands like Francis very capable you cannot help but to sit back and reflect on what you've just seen you know it hits you subliminally

but you've done a lot you've done a lot of things that leave people I suppose the wire which it'd be crazy if we don't talk about the wire of course but the wire it was that program that everybody talked about it were you aware at the time

or afterwards that on every corner I mean it was a sort of it was extraordinary everywhere I went everyone was talking about the wire I didn't I really didn't know I don't think any of us knew I don't think anybody that cast knew how powerful these statements were going to be not just in Baltimore

But first of all, across America. But even before it got across America, Europe got it first. People in Europe were saying, well, this is, in France it was called the tap. And so there were people there who were called, who I knew, who were saying this is a wonderful piece of television. And I didn't know what they were talking about. Really? It was the wire.

And Spain, people from Spain were saying this is exactly like Madrid. Glasgow ran into two guys, well they ran into me, saying it to... In a nice way, I hope. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, it's so nice, they stopped a car. They were in a taxi. And it was during the Edinburgh Festival.

They stopped the taxi as I was coming out of my hotel and jumped out and I thought they were coming. They were so excited, it felt like aggression. Right. And they were going, it's freemen, it's fucking framing. And Freeman. You know, I'm saying, Frayman? Oh, Freeman. And they were telling me they had just seen it and that they had just been discussing it and

how much Baltimore and Glasgow were like with the drug problems, with the education problems, the local government, all of that, you know. So, yeah, it was, it was, it was wonderful. We didn't, we had no idea what it was going to be when we were doing that. And I think that that's what the most. grateful for that that awareness of being placed in something like that. So isn't that interesting? So you, when you read it or when you were called to come in and do it,

do you ever get that feeling somewhere inside when you think, yeah, this is good? I mean, do you just go for it? I mean, yeah, no, I knew that. You felt that about the while. I felt it about the stories in that first season. You know, David had to fight for every season after that. What? Yes.

Every season after that, it was always touch and go. Sorry, but this is the show that the world is talking about. Yes. And it was still like that. It was still like that. He had to fight for it. Because I think, personally I think is because both he and Ed Burns, coming from that background and really understanding the law

and understanding the underworld that surrounds what's supposed to be justice. When people are that smart, you know, they need to be contained. You know what I mean? Sometimes they're just too smart for the establishment, so, so to speak. And I think that David really wanted to get a truth out there that the broadcasters had to think about and think, well, we're not too sure we want to let all of that out right now. You know, we can't educate too much of the public in a way because we need to have our public dumb. We need to have our people simple.

You know, nobody wants, no government, I promise you, no government in the world wants to have a populace that is well-educated. because if they're well educated, they probably find critical thinkers and might decide, well, we're not going to go to work today because of X, Y, and Z. They might, they'll be more difficult to control. And so I think that with the wire, when you're seeing the corruption of police, right,

that diminishes their power to the public. in a way because now they can be challenged because you've seen the wrong that they've done with local government in America, you know, just recently, you know, two years ago, how many years ago, they stole the election. Come on, come on, did they steal the election? And yet there are people who believe that that process was like that

and that it was easily taken care of. Now, if you were, if you were a full, thinking person, you might be more critically analytical about how things unfolded during that. I can't take any particular side on that because you're looking at me in a way like... No, I'm not. I'm listening. I'm listening to what you have to say. Yeah. Because this is fascinating that you're saying that we're talking about the TV shows, that's why he had to push for it because it was going to question. Yes, yes.

It was going to question people going to question the establishment. Of course they would. Of course they would. You know, there was a moment where we found out, I think it was by season five, the wire taps that were up in Baltimore who became less active when the wire was on. So you can imagine that if, you know,

you're working on a couple of cases and you've got wire taps on, I don't know, Al Capone and whomever, you know. And you're really listening. And then all of a sudden it goes quiet. And you're thinking, why is this, right? And so you're listening and you're listening and nothing. And then after a while, the conversation starts again.

Well, they noticed that those conversations with the people that they had been tapping had gone down when the wire was being broadcast. So the criminals as well were really listening. to the wire. This is what I'm saying. That's incredible. Yes. And well, that's the fact as well. I'm not going to go back and watch it again and look at it differently.

It's made me really think about it completely differently. I didn't look at it until 10 years afterwards when I was recovering from some surgery. And two things hit me. One was gratitude to have been part of this statement. but also that it's a story that works on so many levels. There's a documentary that's going on. There's a who-done it that's going on. There's a love interest that's going on.

You don't know where McNulty's going to wind up. You know, all of that. So it's so full. It's so rich. When I saw it, I thought, yeah, man, this is, I wonder if anyone else is going to come up with anything else like that. And we really need something like that. It's so interesting because the things that you've done, you know,

when I was doing my research and reading about you and everything, I thought you've done some monumental things. I mean, because I'm just picking a few. I'm cherry picking a few. But, I mean, recently as well, it's only a couple of years ago, to Five Bloods, you know, that everyone was talking about as well and people are still talking about. and it's

I feel like you've picked and chosen that's not very good English picked and chosen. You've picked and chosen really well but it's like you you absolutely know what you're doing I think some actors may just say yeah I'll do it yeah I'll do it yeah why not the work is coming in

but I feel like you've carefully you've carefully walked this path because you want to say something I think that I think that all creative people, if they're conscious, want to use the gift that they've been given to serve. If you want to be a star, go to Hollywood. I came to England because England had a culture of theater, and that appealed to me in my teens.

So when the opportunity came to be here, of course I took. took it because it was theater. It wasn't, I wasn't chasing anything else besides, you weren't chasing fame. Oh, to hell with that. Yeah. That stuff is fleeting. No, I, I picked this job because it's the only job that I can be in from the time I'm 18 to the time I'm 108. Yeah. Yeah. You, if you keep your instrument together, you can be working throughout your life if that's what you want to do, you know. I don't think there's another occupation in the world that can do that. You were very young when you started, though, weren't you? Yeah.

I mean, and you started doing costume behind the scenes, in hair. But what makes me laugh is there was times there wasn't much costume in hair. And you did costume in hair. If nobody's seen hair, it's pretty naked on stage. But you did costume in hair. Was that just a way into theatre? It kind of was. Dressing naked people.

Or undressing. Undressing them. No, I went to Paris to visit my brother who was in the show And I got a job backstage in wardrobe You know And it sounds more glamorous than it really was You know, you're picking up somebody's old and sweaty Dance belt and dance bras and all of this kind of stuff

You know And you might be sewing on a button that fell off of something That somebody was wearing But that was, you know, that was it It wasn't like it was a costume But it was the smell of backstage theatre, wasn't it? It was theatre. I was just happy to be in a theatre with a company of actors who were like-minded.

I mean, hair came about at a time when those issues were really pressing on an adolescent mind in America. You know, and I knew that I had been auditioning for it in America, and my brother was auditioning in Paris. I had no idea that he was doing that. No, the same thing. The same thing. God bless him, the same thing. Wow. And he wound up, well, he wound up getting here.

I auditioned for hair so often that the production company go, here comes Clark. Yes. Come on, son. Yeah, yes, give us another song, you know. What was your audition song? Did you have to do a song from the show? I am ashamed.

say that I come from a jazzy kind of background. You're blushing. My song, and if Chapman Roberts is around and he hears this, the song I sang was a song, it was the look of love. Just give us a little bird, go on, a little burst of it. The look of love is in your eyes. a look that time can't disguise You've got the job

As far as I'm concerned Why didn't they give you the job on straightway? That's not the kind of music that they needed They needed a voice that was going to That was going to really Do you still sing now? Yeah, I had a wonderful time last About two weeks ago at the London Jazz Festival

Right, we were at Festival Hall Yeah And the wonderful Guy Barker and I had met 15 years before, which was the first year that this jazz festival was on, and I was a part of it then. And we were doing a celebration of a man's music name Billy Strayhorn. And he had written an arrangement, and I heard this. I thought, man, this is, I really loved to sing that,

something like that one time. Here we are, 15 years later. he says, Clark, would you be a part of this? I said, of course they will. He says,

here's the chart. I said, I can sing that song. And it was just, yeah, Madeline Bell was on that one, I think, as well.

Maddie Bell. Oh, my. You've got such a beautiful voice. Just keep singing. Keep singing. Keep singing. So let's talk about your new show as well. What a beautiful premise and an amazing cast.

Lovely Lindsay. Duncan as well, but true love. Yeah. Tell me more. Tell me more. Like this he have a court. Where'd that voice come from? That one was not Clark, all right?

You see, it's not just me. All of us crazy actors in this building, in this business. Tell you about true love. Yes, please. There's a question, isn't it? Yeah. If people don't know you're doing a show

and they just tune in at that moment and I'm saying, tell me about true love. Oh. Well, hopefully we'll keep you all the way through it. I guess the best way to introduce this is for a listener to remember their earliest memory and their earliest friends. Your friends, the people that you were around

from early teens to the time you left home and your closest friends and you reach an age where they're popping their clogs, you know. And you may not have seen them all those years, but there's a part of them that is in you, you know. And so there's this attachment. And you have history, and although 50 years has gone by, you still have this history because you cannot deny this.

This is kind of what true love is about. And it's about these old friends that come together and make a certain promise to look after each other. And I shouldn't give up too much information about that. Yes, no spoilers. But what a beautiful thing for a drama to do. I feel like a lot of drama steps away from those sort of issues. Yes, yeah. And also that we're all like in our 70s, you know, so, you know, it's not, it's, it's.

loudly and proudly in the 70s. Yeah, that's right. That's right. You know, we are here. You know, we have something to offer. You know, we know that this technology might confound us, you know. But before this technology was here, there was a world that we negotiated very well, you know, and that we can still, we still have something to offer.

And not only is it just that those issues that we, hit on, it's, there's a suspense story that's going on in this. There's a thriller that's going on in true love as well that is slowly unfolding. That, um, hopefully the audience will lock into and go, ooh, I didn't think they were going to do that. Oh my God. There's another voice. There's another voice from him.

So this is on channel four. But I love that, that, um, there's, this drama that's celebrating age, but also talking about these issues. And again, isn't it funny that I said it's like you very carefully have chosen issue-led pieces. Because you've been in your youth as well, you were very outspoken about how you felt about things and throughout your life. It's the only life we have. Yeah, you know, it's the only life we have. And if you can either be swept along with it or you can participate in it, you know,

I prefer to participate. I'm not a, I'm not a lone player. I'm a team player. I like, which is why I like theater. You know, it takes everybody from the person backstage sewing on that one little button, right? To the person's outside who's making sure that that light is on the right place, from the person backstage who's calling that cue to make the whole thing happen just for you to be out there to tell the story to that audience. Well said.

It takes everybody to. do that, you know. And if life, as according to Shakespeare, is a stage and we are but players on it, don't you think you should be participating? It's playing. Yeah. It's interesting because you said at the beginning as well, when you were writing music, it was a team. It was collaborative. Yes. So that's how you've always been. Yes. Yes. I grew up in a family of boys. So I don't, you know, I was never solo. You know, I always have people, you know, I'm, you know, I'm, It's not like I don't like my own company. Believe me, I can be by myself quite happily, you know.

Please tell me that when you're by yourself, you sing. Sometimes I do, yeah. Yes. Yeah, absolutely. Recently, I've been looking at noises in the body that vibrate in your body. Noises that vibrate in your body. You know, as a singer, you have a head voice. Yeah.

The throat voice, chest voice, right? You have three places where the voices vibrate in your body, yes? So in trying to move those vibrations around the body, being spurred on by a book called Resonance, which is resonant healing, you know, and how sound waves can actually help heal certain ailments and illnesses in the body, even destroy tumor.

you know, without being invasive. You know, so I've been playing around with that, you know, sitting in the tub going, going up and down, trying to find where a sound vibrates in the body, and can you move that someplace else? Can you move that to your toe? Can you move that to your stomach? Can you move that to your head?

Can you move that to the back of your head, you know? And what happens when this sound goes? So when I'm by myself, you know, sometimes I'm, We have a place that's in the country. I can be out there by myself and just make noise. How lovely, though. Yeah. You do have an exceptionally beautiful voice

and that you know how to use it. And was it ever... Did you get taught? And I don't mean... I don't mean taught to sing. Talk to... And don't mean that. But did you...

Who taught you? Did you just grow up? how to use your voice? My mother was a stickler for enunciation. So there was that. There was a wonderful man named Ian Adams, who was a vocal teacher here in London, who I went to back in the 70s,

who tuned my ear and my awareness to where to place the voice. So it's a, and I think what they recognize, that there's a gift, and if you have a gift, you might as, you better nurture it. You know, it's just, it's just not going to carry on and grow by itself. You need to look after that. You know, you need to take care of that. And I used to smoke cigarettes, you know, and then I thought, you know, this, this isn't good for this voice. This isn't good for the wind and all that. And then you think about wonderful voices,

wonderful smoky voices like Nat King Cole. Right. And then you think, well, he had that wonderful voice, but those cigarettes that made that wonderful voice is also what killed him. So where do you want to be in this, Clark? You know, so that's why now I'm trying to find those organic ways to get to get to those sounds. You don't smoke anymore.

Oh, no, no, no, no, no. Oh, no, no, no. Oh, hell no. Ten years even now, I think. I had stopped for about five years, and then I was doing this tribute to Night King Cold, and I started smoking again. I think, like, you stupid twat, you know. Said it is, Clay. Can I thought it's a rather strange question, but do people, does anybody still call you Peter? Because you're Peter, Clark. Am I right? one of your sons is Peter Clark?

Yeah, yeah, he's PJ, he's Peter Jr. Right. But are you Clark? When you wake up in the morning, you're Clark. You think of yourself as Clark? I think so, yeah. Yeah.

And people think it's a hard thing to do, but you know, as a child or as a teenager, we would call each other by our last names. You know, what's up, Johnson? Yeah, I'm cool. Do you see, you see Smitty today? Smitty being Smith, you know?

And so it wasn't, when I joined the union here, there were... The actor, for the act of equity. Yes, there was already Peter Clark. So I say, well, how about Peter Jeffrey Clark? No. How about PG Clark, no? And she's like looking at watch, well, you know, I've got to go to whack. Well, do you mind?

Well, do you know what? Okay. All right, there it is. Clark, Peter. She said, Peter. They have to put an S on it, Peters, because your name is backwards on the form. I figured someone's going to remember. They'll know it's me once they see that, you know.

And also it was a nod to one of my favorite actors, Brock Peters. You know, so that's why it stayed and that's why it stuck, and that's who I am. And please, carry on always being exactly like that. And you've got so much to still do. And when you do your one-man show, which is talking and singing, will you do that, please? On stage, I'm in the front. You know. With all those voices.

Did you see what she just did? Did you see what she just did? She said, when you do, I'm not planning on doing a one-month-show. You've got to do your one-man show. You've got to. You have no idea everyone would be there in the audience. And listen, the whole team behind, Ed and Joe have just put their hands up there coming along. You see? You'll be singing.

You'll be doing all those voices. That's very kind. You are lovely. Thank you. And good luck with true love. Good luck with everything. and please keep singing. I'll try to keep singing

as long as you're listening. I don't know where they're... Well, no, that was good. I like it.