That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Emeli Sandé

Episode Date: October 3, 2022

On this week's episode of the podcast Gaby sits down with Singer-Songwriter, and all round joy Emeli Sandé. They talk about her wide ranging career from performing at the London 2012 Olympics, to her most recent collaboration with Nile Rodgers. She talks very openly about how she got into music, the struggles she faced in the industry and how she overcame them. An honest and open chat. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

And welcome to That Gabby Roslyn podcast, part of the A-Cast Creator Network. This week, my guest, is the wonderful singer, Emily Sunday. She discusses everything. There's nothing that we don't talk about. Of course, we talk about her childhood, how she started out in the music business, her beautiful partner, and yes, we do talk about the 2012 Olympics. I hope you enjoy it. Don't forget, you can keep up to date by following and subscribing

being pleased to the podcast where a new episode is released every Monday. Leave us a rating on the Apple podcast app. And whilst you're there, why not leave us a review? We love to hear your thoughts. Now, on with the show. I can't believe that I'm looking at you, Emily, and I keep hearing the words of your song, read all about it. And it's so many years ago it came out, but it's so apt today. Yeah, it's amazing how songs can grow with you. And I mean, I wrote that song probably about 10 years ago. I was in my kitchen with my sister and I said, what do you think about this? Because I'd done

it originally with Professor Green. And she's like, she was like my little cheerleader. She's like, keep going. Don't stop now. Second verse. Get onto it. Go. Middle A. And yeah, for it still mean a lot to people now, it's just, yeah, it's very touching. Do you know how many people have streamed it? Quarter of a billion.

I've actually got the amount. Yeah. Because I screenshot it because when I was listening to it and I just thought, oh, this is. crazy. Okay, right, let's just get this. There, okay, 289,9,9,9,000 to 99. Wow. It's amazing, isn't it? I mean, to even think about that many people. That they've all listened to your song and know your song.

But your songs, when you, which you obviously know intimately, and me as a fan have listened to for years, but knowing I was going to spend a lot of time with you today I listened to them and the words just extraordinary thank you they really are lyrics so thoughtful oh thank you your lyrics for me are just so important I mean the melody first but then

I try my best not to waste any lines because essentially you've only got three minutes and you really want to put in exactly what you mean but doing it poetic way so that's often what takes me the longest with songs just trying to make sure that the lyric is perfect in my my eyes, yeah. And you were 11 was it when you first thought, I want to be a songwriter? Yeah, I mean, from about seven, I want to be a singer. Then around eight, I got my little

notepad. But then my dad introduced me to more people like Joni Mitchell, Bob Dylan, Nina Simone. That's when I thought, oh, I want to do more than just sing. I want to really write and mean what I'm singing. But such a young age to know that. Yeah. That's right. I mean, I knew what I wanted to do when I was tiny. And we're very lucky because a lot of people don't know. Yeah, you're right, actually. And that you're doing it. Yeah, yeah.

That's the part I just think, gosh, it's good to have a dream. But I was up in this tiny village in Scotland thinking, how am I going to break into the music industry? And the thing is I didn't know how. It was just the passion of knowing you really want to do something. And somehow you find your path. So what was the first thing? Because you did for MTV, you did all sorts of things, wouldn't you? Anything I could do. I mean, obviously, school concerts came first. So I was always there, summer, winter concerts. And then there was in a nearby time, there's like a talent show, in brewery town hall talent shows. So I did that. And what did you do for that? Did you do your own stuff?

I did come to the cabaret or chum. Yes. Musical theater breaks through. I love musicals. I had a very interesting green suit that my dad recommended for that. And then my first. in London was Choice FM. They had a competition called Rapology, and it was for under 21-year-olds. So I came and performed in Croydon. That was the first time I performed in London. Then after that, it was sending to different radio shows. I mean, it was just relentless.

Any opportunity, I just went through it. So who was helping you with all of that? Because that's very, I mean, it's very brave, because I know you've spoken before about being very shy. Yeah. So that's a brave thing to go out there and do. Yeah, it was kind of this other personality, you know, and basically it was my family. You know, I had, I have family friends down in London, so I'd stay with them.

I'd sleep on the airbed at their place in Kings Cross. And then my mom would send CDs down to different radio stations. My sister would help me record my little videos to send into competition. So it was a real, like, family event. Everything was. They'd drive from Aberdeen to London, nine hours in the car. just to watch me do one little show. So I feel so, so grateful to have had a family that got behind my dream.

I have my, obviously people can't see, but my jaw dropped. You saw that. Because not a lot of people have that, especially people who want to break into the music industry. Because they have this weird, you know, everyone says, oh, the music industry, oh, that's just sex drugs and rock a roll. Oh, don't go near that. And yet your parents, so they saw what we all now know at a very young age.

Yeah, I think they just saw I was completely absurd. and in love and devoted to music. I would just sing all the time. Like, thank God they didn't tell me to shut up because I do have friends and they said my parents, I had to secretly make music because my parents didn't want me to do it. So, yeah, I mean, I took that for granted. I could just sing my heart out, play piano, my sister played the drums. We made up songs and they really let my passion flourish.

So to all those people now that say to you, you used to say friends of yours, had to keep it hidden. How did they then do it? I mean, there must be a part of you that it has to keep quiet about what you went through because it was, I don't mean easy, but I'm talking about with your family behind you. It must be so tough for them.

Oh yeah, absolutely. And I don't really know that they've ever fulfilled that passion and that dream of theirs because how do you make music quietly? It's the one thing that you just have to let yourself be completely free. And so, yeah, I'm very lucky. one that my parents introduced me to great music.

I've often thought about if my parents had bad taste in music, where would I be? But my dad was showing me the world's greatest from when I was, yeah, seven years old. But they weren't involved in the industry at all, were they? No. I mean, my dad loved music. His whole family is very, very musical in Zambia. And my mum, she says, don't forget about my side. Your uncle was a good pianist, you know?

So I can't forget about them either. But yeah, they just saw, they just were really proud. They come, I used to play clarinet, so they'd drop me off at band practice on Saturdays and watch. And, you know, they didn't have much money, but they would put it towards helping me piano lessons and seeing things exposure to arts. So, yeah, very, very lucky. Did you go over to Zambia? Yeah, I went over. Well, we were supposed to live there, so I went when I was two, but that didn't work out.

So the next time I went, I was about 24. And it was amazing. It was seeing everybody singing. It made so much more sense of who I was. It made me think, oh, this is why I love music so much. This is why I can't stop singing because it's in my blood. Oh, amazing. My family is from Zimbabwe, so next door neighbors.

But there's nothing quite like the sky there. Yeah, the moon. Everything's big and rich and full. And wildlife as they're supposed to be. Yeah, yeah. It's stunning. Oh, I love that blow. I love that play.

It's interesting you say about the music, because I think that of Zimbabwe, everybody's very musical. I don't necessarily mean they're singing older, but there's something so welcoming and so loving. Yeah. So everything feels musical. Yeah. And I think it was lovely to see that the difference here is music is just a way of life there. Like when we arrived, everybody was singing as we got there. When we sat down together as a family, everyone naturally started singing and had nothing to do with an industry or a

recording it or selling it. It was just this is how we express ourselves. And that was beautiful to see. Because often over here, when it becomes your job, you kind of section it off. But to see that it is a natural way of living. And we should all be singing down the street. Why not? I do. Yeah. I've been singing your song all the way here. I walk everywhere and I was singing out loud. In fact, I met a very nice man just around the corner from here and I was singing so loudly. And he went, oh, I know that song. And I would sing it with me. Fantastic. It's true.

I honestly, no word of a lie. I do it on Instagram all the time. I sing and skip in the street and I think we should. And your songs do that to me. So what's the music industry like for you? Because you say for you, there it was. As a family back in Zambia, it was part of your life. But actually working in it is very different, isn't it?

It's tough. It is tough. And like from the beginning, I feel like I was taught many lessons of how tough it was going to be, you know, the first kind of song I did. They didn't want me in the video. And then the first... What do you mean? The first song that came out.

And I'm over it now. I definitely don't feel it was, you know, the artist's fault. But it was, you know, I was already, I was in Glasgow. This is when I was studying there. And I was all ready to do the video. I was telling all my friends, I sent me the treatment. And the night of, you know, I was about to fly the morning after. My manager said, listen, they've picked someone else to be in the video.

and my heart just completely shattered. It was just humiliating because I told everybody. Of course. And they picked a girl on the video who was lighter-skinned, who was skinnier. No. Yeah, but they used my voice. So that was my first kind of introduction. Disgusting.

Into the whole thing. So that was like, okay, this is the industry. This is London. This is, you've got to really toughen up. And it just told me you have to be resilient. There are going to be things like this that happen. And of course you get that. for a few days. I was like, I don't want anything to do with it anymore. But then slowly

picked myself back up and, you know, it gave me more incentive and more fire to be like, okay, at some point I'm going to get to stand in my own videos. They're going to hear my voice and see my face and I'm going to define my own lane, you know. So all those people who did that, or maybe it was just one person, whoever it is, and I don't care who they are. And let's forget about them. But there you were at the opening of the Olympics. There must have been a part of you that go, hey, hey, look, you didn't want me in the video, but look at me now. The world is watching. Oh, yes. Yeah, you do get lovely moments and I think that's the reward of the perseverance. And at the end of the day, regardless of color, it really is controlled by men. You know, there's

definitely women having better, more powerful positions now. But at the end of the day, especially when I first came into it, it was all about, how do you look? Is this man attracted to you? Well, then if he is he might give you a bit more of an opportunity and I'd just never been like that you know I was always a bit of a tomboy and I just liked hanging with the guys and I wanted to be respected more than anything else so that was a big lesson at the beginning

like find your spot and really like stand your ground because it's going to be quite a manly world out there but do you think it's changed now it's still a bit like that isn't it people are so concerned about how people look yeah and it's getting very sexy which is great and it's great for people to embrace their bodies

but sometimes I feel for women like let's I don't know I've never felt the pressure to have to kind of do that but then at the same time it is liberating for people

but I just hope that no one feels the pressure to do that and that we can be respected just as much as a guy would be I'm sure people do feel that pressure though yeah I mean if you look at social media and the way and I don't just mean music industry I'm talking everyday life

and there is a lot of body positivity which is great but there seems to be every filter every I think we're going to go the way of Russell T. Davis's drama I've suddenly forgotten

what the name of it was years and years where there was a young girl it was set in the future and there was a young girl who just couldn't go out without a filter on her face but we're so close to that

and even for me you know I'm definitely I remember a time without internet so I haven't been brought up in it so deeply, but you do get used to it. And you, I have to sometimes just ban myself from going on my phone for a while because it becomes this alternate reality, which is great to communicate. And I've been able to connect with so many people I wouldn't have without social media. At the same time, it's like, don't lose that connection with yourself. Like, remember who you

are in the real life when you go to a forest or when you, you know, see a bird or sing a song in the garden. Those type of things I should be doing more of than sitting on my phone. Yeah, but I think, you know, we're saying about judgment and I think there's a lot of judgment. And you've been very open recently and if you want to talk about it, you can. It's not, you know, if you don't want to, that's fine. But you've been very open recently

about your private life. And I hope you feel that you were supported with your decision and that nobody made you make that decision. I love, I mean, I look at both of your social media last night and I was thinking, oh, you look so happy. Yeah. That's what it's about.

Yeah, exactly. And for me, it was just about, I didn't really necessarily feel a pressure to share anything, but it was just that I wanted to. I'm pleased. I'm really pleased about that. Yeah. I wanted to. And, you know, when you're in love and you're happy, that's something I naturally wanted to share.

You know, whether it was with a man or a woman, it wasn't really my concern. It was just, this is the best thing ever that's happened to me. I'm super happy in love. And I want to share that joy with the world. So for me, it just felt, I'm not. natural to hide it or to kind of be cagey about it. I was like, well, what is there to like be ashamed of here? This is just love. So look at your face when you talk about her. You actually, you're glowing. Yeah, no, she's an amazing person. I feel very lucky to have found her. So

how did you mean? And we met through music. Like I really wanted to learn more about classical music and she's a pianist. So at first it was just sharing music, but sharing that passion and meeting somebody with equal passion and that kind of perseverance to keep. going. That's kind of what first connected us. And then slowly just as people, we just were like, oh, you're really cool. You're really cool. And then we fell in love. Yeah. How lovely. I saw on your, on your Instagram, the work that you do together as well. Yeah. That's incredible. Thank you. Oh, wow. We have spoken about maybe putting out like an album or a collection of songs that have kind of come naturally from the love or because it's great for us to be coming from two separate worlds.

You know, she brings so much knowledge and music theory and I've kind of, you know, through singing and through my melodies, we've found this really lovely, you know, middle point. To be really, okay, here's the naivety now. I'm completely stupid. Isn't music just music? Yes. You're right. You're right. And sometimes we do put too many lines and boxes around it. But I think it's, I guess it's just the approach is different. But at the end, of the day. That's what we're finding out now. We're from two completely different worlds, completely different cultures. But yeah, when we come together, we do make something that's really beautiful. So for everybody that's watched you do what you've done, what would you say to them when they say they want to, I'm talking with music now. That to have, I mean, what you've said to me, sounds like you've had the most blessed time. Yeah.

And you're smiling, and, you know, you've got this extraordinarily beautiful smile and glow. For those people who aren't finding it easy, whether it's the music, whether it's singing, whether it's songwriting, whether it's learning an instrument, whether it's falling in love as you have done, whatever it is, what advice would you give them? Because it seems to me that you're glowing and you've glowed throughout. Oh, thank you. I guess, you know, there will be difficult times, but it's what you choose. dwell on. You know, you can, I could have given up at that first hurdle and just be like, I'm not good enough or I'll never make it. Did you ever think that? Oh yeah, so many times. You know, you get so many rejections, so many knockbacks. She doesn't got the right personality. She doesn't

have the right look. The song's like, you get all this negativity thrown at you. But I think it's, yeah, what you dwell on. Take it in and take that minute to have a little cry, to have a little regathering. But, you know, remind yourself while you're doing it, whether it be learning an instrument or trying to get into the industry, why we're here is because we love music. And I think it's re-analyzing your priorities. If it is to be famous and to have lots of numbers and all that type of things, you probably will find it quite difficult because that's hard. And if that's how you're validating yourself, then the powers in other people's hands. But if you're there because you genuinely love music, you have a story to tell, and you have something to say and you have a

unique way of saying it, as long as you persevere, you're going to find people that will want to listen to that honesty. So I think it's always going back to that and renewing yourself with that passion. So let's talk about the Olympics. What was that like? That was, yeah, that was... So the phone call, did you get a phone call? How did it all happen? Yeah, my manager was like, okay, Danny Boyle wants to meet you at the secret Olympic bunker and then we went through the security was so high. It really felt like a movie, like Men in Black or something. I was like, what's going on? Did you have to have an umbrella so never you could see that you were going in or something? It was, yeah, it was very covert, tinted car.

Really? And, like, airport security. I was joking, but you're being serious. It was really undercover. And, you know, sworn to secrecy, all the rest of it. But he was lovely. We got into the room and he showed us kind of the design of the opening ceremony, what they were planning. He gave this beautiful explanation of why he wanted to do it in the pride of Britain and all of these things.

And he played the sequence. and they played heaven in it. So I thought, oh, they're just asking me if they can use heaven. Totally fine. But then they played Abide with me and they said, we'd love you to sing this Abide with me moment. And it was just so exciting. It felt like I'd really been, you know, let into this top top secret.

And for the next few months we rehearsed. It was wonderful. Just getting to know Danny, the whole team, seeing how involved he was in the whole ceremony. And then how it all went down was amazing. And I mean, I was very, very nervous because I hadn't really thought about I thought about how many people were going to watch

but then I hadn't really, until you're there, you don't know how it's going to feel. So I really did go completely blank right before I went out there. After practicing it for literally six months, every day singing at least 10 times, when I stood right before the doors opened. Oh, I'm feeling nervous. My brain just couldn't remember anything.

It never happened to me before. Usually I handle pressure well. But this day, it was like my brain, was like, we have to get out of this. I'm going to... Proper stage fright. I'm going to forget all the lyric, all the melody, so you don't do this. I think my brain was like, you shouldn't be here. And I had to...

I was like, I said to my manager, I was like, AJ, pass me the phone. I had to Google the song because it just literally gone. Wow. It literally gone from my mind. And luckily, and then I got, I managed, I had a few minutes just to listen to, da-da-da-da. I was like, okay, that's what it is. And I had to just walk out there and just see what happened.

And thank God it came back to me. Oh, my word. And I gathered myself a bit because I don't know what happened. That's never happened to me again since then. But I think it was just because everybody's telling you, there's many people are going to be watching. Do you feel nervous? Do you feel nervous?

And I didn't until the actual day. Yeah, there's no weird how people put these things in your head because I grew up, everyone you say, oh, she's so shy. I am very shy. That's someone to talk about shyness to you. But, and you talk about shyness. And people just say, oh, she's very shy and speak for me. And then so I began to say, I'm very shy.

Yeah. Because the more you get told it. So people all say to you, are you nervous? Yeah. Oh, I must be nervous. Oh, yes. Okay. My brain then shuts down.

Isn't it funny how many people who were shy as children end up being some sort of performer? Yeah. I think, yeah. You know, going on stage, I felt like, I don't know if I felt like, felt like, okay, this is me being the real me, or this is just another side of me I get to express. And I always felt that through music, people would listen to me. And I think maybe that's why I started to put most of my feelings and thoughts into music. And also, music allowed me to have a kind of, like, I could organize my thoughts. You know, sometimes when you speak,

you just speak and all of that. But music, you've really thought about what you want to say, how you want to say it. You have music behind it to give it the emphasis. So when I got on stage, I felt this is the real me and this is who I can, who I can, you know, how I can express myself. But I don't know where the shyness came from. I just remember it being so hard speaking to adults. I mean, I remember feeling different because of the color of my skin. So maybe that came into it. Well, there are not many people of your color where you live.

I mean, before my sister came to high school, it was just me. Me and my dad because he was a teacher there. So I definitely felt different. And yeah, so I guess that's probably what played into some of the, the shyness. I just get nervous speaking to people. But when it came to singing, I guess because I was so quiet. When it came to sing, I was like, ta-da, this is what I haven't said for the past three months. So, yeah, this is awful because people shouldn't choose a favorite child, but I'm going to put you on the spot with your songs. Because obviously, as I've said, you know,

I read all about it. I love it. I absolutely love it. And I have done ever since it came out. And, but you have to choose one of yours that you're most proud of it. Love your favorite. Go on, go on. Go on. I won't tell the others. The others will not let the others know. I really love Clown because I'm proud of the lyric and I still feel even now 12 years later or whatever, it's growing with me.

You know, every time I sing it, I still mean everything I'm saying and the more experiences you go through. And I think it really sums up my journey and how I've approached it. You know, sometimes you do have to be humiliating. like these stories I'm telling you. You do have to be the clown, but you have to know why you're doing it, you know. And however it may look on the outside, may not be the reality on the inside.

So, yeah, I still get strength from that song. That's my number two one. Okay, good. Is that all right? Yeah, yeah. What makes you really lose it laughing? Richard Pryor. I love stand-up comedians when they're just really, really good.

And saying, me and my sister have a really funny, we just know each other so well so when I'm with her we like it gets to cry after quite easily I like that she's really funny that's how it should always be

thank you so much for this it's been so lovely to spend time with you because I am a real fan and I have your song so I'm one of those billion streamers oh thank you yeah in fact I've got the CDs

oh nice yeah real I've got the real music the real thing do you think that with all the change and the streaming and everything now do you feel different

about it all. Has that changed the way you think about your listeners? In a way, because I think, you know, it was a big shift and I feel like when I came into the industry, that was maybe the last generation of, you know, musicians and artists out there before internet really hit and took over. So, I try, you know, I try and look at everything positively and it has allowed me to reach more people. And it kind of, it allows me to know who's listening to my music and how they they're listening to it. And I think it's made me relax a lot more because it's before it's like chart positions and this.

And if you don't sell this and everyone's on a major label. Whereas nowadays it's like you can have a lot more of an independent approach and you can really hone and curate your music and how you present it knowing your fan's personality. So I'm kind of enjoying it. It's made me relax a lot more and have a lot more control over how we market it, how we put it out there. and also a proper connection with people listening to it.

So working with Nile Rogers, I was not saying Nile, as if I knew. My dear friend, Nolang. Just beautiful song. Congratulations. Thank you. Did very well. Thank you very much. Yeah, working with him was an absolute dream.

He's a legend in every sense. And, you know, it started off as this little jam. He picked up because guitar after telling us these amazing stories. You're kidding me. Is it really, that's what people say. Is that really how it was? That's really what happened. we were at

gosh, where is it called Abbey Road. We're at Abbey Road Studio and I was working on a project for him and then he's like, hey man and he just told us

about working with Madonna and Diana Ross and how this song came up and just legendary songs and then he just got his guitar doing his little riff I started singing over it and that was pretty much

how the song was written. Yeah. So it's just a little kind of jam demo and when I met my manager a couple years ago he's like, what's this little idea here? I just thought, you know, nothing of it. And then I finished it.

And now, yeah, now it's out there for the people to hear. Do you know what? He is one of those legends, isn't he? Yeah, he's so cool. And everybody I know who's written with him or done something with him, they all say the same thing. And I always have the same reaction. No. I can't really believe it because that's how you imagine him to be.

I've interviewed him and I've introduced him on stage. And he's just this, he personifies cool Yeah, he really does I mean, I think he's 70 now But he still just had all the latest gear His jeans were cool His dreads, like, he's just, he's awesome And he rose skates

Yeah, exactly I mean, he can do no role Yeah Now you can do, have you read his book? His autobiography? No, but I've heard it's amazing It's really good I'm going to take on holiday

Have you done a book? No Will you do a book? I'd like to, yeah That'll be next time I'm talking to you. Yeah, exactly. Oh, good luck with the book. Thanks. Good luck with the album, with everything that you do.

Thanks very much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening to my lovely chat with Emily Sunday. Isn't she fabulous? Well, we'll be back next week with more chats with some of your famous favourite. So I'll see you then. That Gabby Roslyn podcast is proudly presented to you by Cameo Productions with music by Beth Macari. If you wouldn't mind, could you give us a like, a follow, a subscribe, and please leave a review.

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