That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Jamie Cullum

Episode Date: December 13, 2021

In this episode Gaby chats with the musician and broadcaster Jamie Cullum. They talk about his new album “The Piano Man at Christmas: The Complete Edition” and the idea that he could turn it into a stage musical. He discusses those 'pinch me moments' in his life including playing for the Obamas at the White House, how he felt watching Aretha Franklin rehearsing and he tells the funniest story about visiting Puff Daddy's house with Pharrell Williams and what happened when he arrived in his brand-new gold Nike trainers. They share opinions on jazz-inspired movies like 'The Fabulous Baker Boys' and 'La La Land' and also discuss their shared love of musicals such as 'Come From Away' and 'Matilda'. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello and welcome to That Gabby Rosen podcast, part of the Acast Creator Network. This week, my guest is one of the nicest people you'd ever want to spend time with, the musician and broadcaster, Jamie Cullum. His music is like a soundtrack to our lives. We chat about his new album, The Piano Man at Christmas, the Complete Edition, which is so magical from beginning to end. We talk about him writing the musical version of this new album, and we even end up casting it, Jason Schwartzman and Sarah.

Sir Rohnan, I do hope you're listening. He discusses those pinch me moments in his life, including playing at the White House for the Abamas, how he felt watching Aretha Franklin rehearsing, and what an incredible time he had there. He tells me the best story ever about going to Puff Daddy, Sean Coombs' house with Farrell,

and what happened when he arrived for dinner in his new gold Nike trainers. We talk about movies, including the fabulous Baker Boys, with Michelle Pfeiffer and La La La Land. We both rave about the brilliant musicals come from away and Matilda and how he is in awe of Tim Minchin's talent when it comes to that musical.

After listening to this episode, do yourself a huge favour and spend time listening to his wondrous music and lose yourself in his songs. Please can I ask you a favour? Would you mind following and subscribing, please, by clicking the follow or subscribe button. This is completely and utterly

free, by the way. And you can also rate and review on Apple Podcasts, which is the purple app on your iPhone or iPad. Simply scroll down to the bottom of all of the episodes. I know there have been quite a few now. And you'll see the stars where you can tap and rate and also please write a review. Thank you so much. Hello, my lovely. Hi, Gabby. How are you? I'm very well. All the better for speaking to you. And I have never said this to your face. But thank you because you and I, you and I, you and I, I toured the country together for seven months and you have no idea what I'm talking about, which is quite funny.

I really don't. No. I was like, which period of my life was that in? I'll tell you, it was almost 17 years ago. I was in when Harry met Sally, the play. Oh, no way. Yeah. That makes total sense now.

Fantastic. Yeah, because you did the music for it. I did, yes. And that's so funny because I'd forgotten that it had toured as well. It was such a busy time for me around that era. So I never quite knew what was going on. But that's so great to know that you did that. Was it a good experience for you?

Oh, it was fantastic. I was a single mum with my baby girl. And we had the most wonderful time. But you were the backdrop to a huge transition in my life. I mean, it really was extraordinary. So you've been with me in an example. extraordinary capacity every day of my life and sometimes twice a day. Well, that's the nature of being the theatre isn't, that's for sure. Well, there's a lot of people that would say the same about your

presence in their lives as well, Gabby, that's for sure. Oh, well, you're very kind. You're very kind. So your Christmas album has, and I'm one of those people that doesn't like to go early, this year I have. And I think we all needed to go early with Christmas because of last year. Yeah, it's an interesting conundrum that, isn't it? I think when you, by the nature of making Christmas album and I think I'm a slightly different to some people that make Christmas albums. I made one from the pure fascination of the idea of trying to create some songs, new songs that felt like old ones. So kind of from a songwriting perspective, I did it rather than I'd really like a Christmas number one or that kind of thing. Although obviously we all want a Christmas number one

but I've never operated necessarily in that sphere anyway. But when you make the album, of course, you make it very early in the year. So I wrote the songs in February, March, and I recorded them in June. And then the label go, yeah, we want to bring it out on November the 19th. I'm like, that's just too early. Don't do it. And they're like, no, no, you need time to get it in people's consciousness. We need to get it on the, all the digital platforms and stuff.

But it's like, I don't want to be talking about Christmas. I don't want to be one of those people. but by the nature of having Christmas album out, you do have to start talking about Christmas quite early. Yeah, but actually I do think this year we need it. And I know part one came out last year and part two. I have to say, the piano man at Christmas, the song is just, it's interesting you said

because you wanted it to sound like old songs. But it sort of takes me back and it makes me go like I'm made of marshmallow. It's quite extraordinary. But I think this year we need to have Christmas early. I mean, last year was sort of, it sort of didn't exist in a weird way. I know you've got kids and I've got kids and it did, but it didn't.

Do you know, I feel more about that from this year, actually. I mean, obviously, I think last year, I think there was the, I used the word novelty, not to kind of put some kind of positive spin on it, but it was a fresh feeling and I count myself in the very lucky camp of the people who were with people that they loved in a house that they felt lucky to live in. So I was, although all my work did disappear, I felt, I felt lucky in that sense. And some dreadful things did happen.

And we lost someone close to us. And there were, it was not an easy time in that sense. But we were together. And I have two young kids. And so in that sense, it felt very lucky. And also, I did kind of busy myself. with this Christmas record. You know, I was like, I thought, well, my tour's cancelled.

What am I going to do? I've always wanted to write an original Christmas album. So that's what I did last year. And in some ways, that was good and bad, because it just took my mind off of what was happening. And it kind of gave me a purpose. I was doing homeschool stuff with my wife in the mornings. And then we kind of finish around just after lunch.

And then I'd be working on these songs in the afternoon. So when the nature of having a Christmas album, it's that comes. the 29th of December, no one cares anymore. It's gone. It's finished. Oh, I've thought of that. Yeah. So it's great. Like, it's all so exciting. Everyone's listening to it so much. And then literally you go from, from Hero to Zero so quickly. So first of January, and I was like, right, 2021, life gets back to normal. Like, I think a lot of us did. And then, of course, we realized that none of this was going to, and the first part of this year felt like the,

the hardest bit certainly for me so in some ways this year felt like a stranger year than before so back to what you were saying before Christmas coming early you're right it really does feel like something we need that feeling of

togetherness the feeling of tradition the feeling of the rituals let's gather them in bring back some normality some of that connection some of that overindulgence and that that feeling of the warmth and the coziness of Christmas is definitely what we need. Do you feel a responsibility? Because you do, it's weird, I've never said it out loud, but I suppose your songs do, they do.

I feel very, you feel very familiar to me. And I, you're such a big part of all of our lives and the soundtrack of our lives. Do you feel a bit of a responsibility when you release new stuff? Oh, that's really kind of you'd say. I love the idea of being the soundtrack to some people's lives. I think there's a few people on planet Earth that I am, but not at the level of some of the people. I mean, think about like Robbie, for example.

I mean, that is someone. You remind me of one another. I've said that to Robbie. I've known Robbie a very long time. He's been on this podcast, and I've known since he was 16. But you remind me of one another so much. I take that as a great compliment. But I have to say that I don't feel any responsibility at all.

And that's not to kind of, I think I'm quite, I love making music. I love that people listen to it. But I kind of work on something and, you know, I promote it and I want people to hear it. But in terms of responsibility, I'm very much someone who makes stuff, puts it out there and kind of moves on to the next thing because that's the way my kind of my brain works. I also feel like it's a good, it's a good. recipe for creativity to just this guy called Austin Cleon he's written some great books

and he kind of encapsulated in a book of his called Keep Going and it's like you just got to keep kind of trundling along particularly if you're a songwriter if you just if you just leave it it's a muscle that goes a bit kind of flabby and you need to just keep kind of banging away writing in a journal

making little melodies making stuff that sounds bad because eventually something will sound good and if you just keep going, it'll happen. So I think attaching too much to the outcome of what the songs are is not something that serves me particularly well, something I think I've got better at over the years as well. It's funny, isn't it, though, a lot of, when I was doing all my research, a lot of the past interviews, people say, oh, you've taken a year off, or you've taken three years since your last album, or you've done this. It's sort of as if your life doesn't exist

for them in real time. It's very weird. And I suppose that people have been saying that to lovely Adele. And people say that to lovely Ed. In fact, you're all very lovely, all of you guys. But it's as if you don't have a life that we don't hear. It's very weird that. It's a funny thought that, isn't it?

But it's, I do, I think I heard Adele say something. I mean, she says it's mostly only brilliant things that come out of her mouth, actually. beyond just her incredible voice. But she, you know, she said, it takes a lot of time to do this well. And she's absolutely right.

It doesn't just, it doesn't just happen really quickly to write songs with that kind of power, you know, that she does and to put that amount of emotion into any song. And, you know, I know that as well.

It takes a lot of time. But also, you know, she's a mum. I'm a dad. I have a family life and I take that family life really seriously. I want to do that well

above and beyond everything else. And I think to, you know, finding that balance is hard, isn't it? But it does. Yeah, it takes a long time. And also touring as well as the other thing. It's some people, I guess, tour just in one country. I've tended to, since the beginning, tour in a lot of different countries. So depending on how you do it, if you cram it all into six months and you're away for six months,

I spread it out because I don't like being away from home too long. So I go away three or four days at a time, come home for a bit and then go away again. And, you know, I don't go away for long periods of time. It doesn't suit me at all that. Well, I understand. You've got to find, like you say, there is life outside of the albums. But, I mean, your touring has taken you to some extraordinary places. Obviously, Glastonbury and the Hollywood Bowl.

I don't know why that sort of, I think that's the showbiss side of me that just goes, wow, the Hollywood Bowl. Was it a bit like that for you? Oh, totally. And I'll tell you why. I mean, apart from the fact that, you know, the Beatles and L.F. It's Gerald and, you know, all the greats. there's something about being in Los Angeles

and playing music or doing something creative that makes you feel like you really made it it's just it's just kind of built into the pavement there sorry the sidewalk but also there's one of my favorite episodes of Colombo happens at the Hollywood Bowl so that's that's another reason for me but yeah

and also it is you know it's outside it's kind of carved into the side of one of the you know one of the kind of canyons that I'm sure it's not a canyon, but that's what I think about it. It's carved into the side of the landscape. And it just feels, yeah, it feels like you might just be, you can pretend your big time for five minutes when you play at the Hollywood Bowl. Oh, and that, as I said, Glastonbury, but then, of course, the White House as well.

And then just some things that, you know, there's wonderful pinch me moments. Was the White House one of those? It absolutely was. So I was asked to play for an event called International Jazz. which my hero, Herbie Hancock, started, a way of kind of celebrating jazz the world over in a way that kind of brings the community of jazz musicians around the world together. And it takes place all over the world at different times, in different places once a year. And lo and behold, the year I was asked to take part was, they said, oh well, because President Obama is a jazz fan,

He wants to host it at the White House. I'm like, yep, I'm there. No worries. But I tell you what, it was, it was, you'd say, pinch me moment. It was absolutely a pinch me moment because I was surrounded by, you know, I was surrounded by people that I feel almost don't belong on planet Earth. They're so extraordinary. And that starts at the top.

You know, Aretha Franklin was one of the performers. Oh, my word. You know, Herbie Hancock obviously was there. Al Jiro, Diane Reeves. and just many, many kind of deeply, deeply gifted jazz musicians, Robert Glasper, Teres Martin. And I grabbed the bull by the horns, absolutely, you know, we rehearsed on the lawn of the White House. It was kind of covered over kind of tent thing, but we got to go in the White House and we got to meet the President and the First Lady and, again, be at the rehearsal,

be in a small situation watching Aretha Franklin rehearsed. in her track suit, you know. And then we were all sung on stage together at the end. And I did suffer from a bit of imposter syndrome during that time. It did feel like I'd been beamed in there by aliens at the wrong event. So I had to kind of overcome that to some degree. But I feel like it was one of the most pinch me moments, things that I've done. And not just to be in the presence of a, of a, of a, of a,

great, you know, I know there are many nuanced opinions of what someone's presidency has been like and I know there's lots of arguments for and against, but I find Obama to be a really impressive, interesting. And Michelle, she asked what a woman. Absolutely. And, you know, he was, you could tell his love of music as well. You could tell his real knowledge of the music. And I think, you know, obviously, it's important to African American culture and black history

and bringing that sense of history to the White House, this music. And just to be, just to play a tiny part of that, felt like a deep, deep privilege. And beyond anything else, they were both just so freaking cool. Oh my God. He walked into the room with the First Lady and I was just like, this is what it's like to be cool. Really? Yeah.

That's fantastic. Yeah. Cool and powerful. Because also it was just so innate, you know, it was so innate. It was hard to describe, but the presence of it hung in the air like a kind of beautiful fog. There's that wonderful thing when somebody like that, or when the two of them, as I said, I'm a huge Michelle fan as well. Like I know her, Michelle. Yeah, I like it.

I like that. Yeah, yeah. Mish. But when people like that walk into a room, even when your back is turned and you're not sure who's walked in, you feel this sort of this electricity. through the air, don't you? It's extraordinary. Yeah, it's a lot. Obviously, we attach a lot to them, don't we as well?

I'm sure it's, you know, we project a lot on to people like that. But I think, I think for me, it's being able to do what he did. And again, I'm not really commenting on the politics because I don't feel like I, I don't feel like I can wade in enough on politics to really understand. I feel like that that's someone who was able to keep such a strong family life going at the same time as being the president of a deeply divided difficult country or, you know, the leader of the free world, I guess, and seemingly so together with his partner and his family and stuff,

it's really, really amazing. And they seem to have a good time as well. They were dancing, they didn't seem fake their enjoyment of it. It seemed like, yeah, you're loving this. It's very interesting talking about jazz because there is this, I don't know what you thought of it and you might not say but I loved La La Land and I thought it was

keeping quiet, that's very funny but I loved it because it was the whole conversation about jazz and bringing jazz to people when I think a lot of people don't realize they're listening to jazz and your show even though on Radio 2 it is, it's jazz but a lot of people if they just say

oh that's music, that's real music and I think that's what you what you've done is you've brought, I don't know what I'm trying to say. I think jazz has this weird headline. People have this whole idea of jazz and you've turned it about and made everybody realize

that jazz isn't just that headline of one sound and one feeling. No, I really understand what you're trying to say. I think it can come with quite a stuffy attitude or, you know, there's a lot of kind of jokes connected to it. And I think the trick is the way, I've approached it is that I don't think of it as more real music than other types of music. It's just a source of music that I've loved and relates to loads of other genres.

I mean, I got into jazz through hip-hop. I didn't get into jazz through jazz. So kind of relating it back to that, first of all, people are like, oh, okay. And then you see how much jazz influenced rock and roll and motown and funk and through to hip-hop. And even, you know, into modern pop and the stuff you hear in Dewe Leapers music these days with jazz progressions and stuff. It's all, it's all there. So I kind of have a love for all genres, and I think by not treating it as this kind of rarefied thing, but also like with any kind of art form that I think has a lot of depth to it, have a bit of knowledge helps you enjoy it a lot more. And I think

sometimes to have to have a bit of knowledge to appreciate something can be, can seem like a bit of a barrier to classical music or to opera, which I know, I know nothing about opera. So I find it, I can appreciate it, but I feel like I would need more knowledge to really enjoy it. But it's so funny, you mentioned La La La Land, you said I went quiet because it's quite funny. Whenever there's a film out that has a relationship to jazz, I have people that I know say, oh, Jamie, you've got to check out Whiplash. Oh, really?

Oh, my God, you're going to love. Oh, you're going to love La La La Land. Oh, my God. And I think the problem is it's like, it's like a friend of mine who saw a film about the theatre once, who works in the theatre. And he said, oh my God, you're going to love it. It's all about the theatre. And I think when things are observed, just slightly off key.

And I say the theatre, because you know what it's like to be in the theatre. When things are observed in a way, it's about, oh, that doesn't happen. And, oh, people don't talk like that. And, oh, that is such a cliche. And you're going to hide behind your hands. And actually, of course, it was a good film. And of course, the content, I thought it was brilliant. And same with whiplash, but part of me, part of the nerd in me is like, oh, that's not like that.

And oh, my God, people don't talk like that. And when that character said, I said, hey, I'll see your cats out on the road. It was like, oh, my God, kill me. That's so embarrassing. But I did enjoy the film. I enjoyed the music. And I thought, you know, I like the analogy a lot. It did make people start talking about it again.

And also, it was, because I'm a massive musical theatre fan. I'm a huge musical theatre fan. I grew up eating musical theatre. I just, and I still devour it now. Which modern productions have you loved in the last 10 years that you've seen? Oh, come from away. Oh, I loved Come From Away. That was so good, wasn't it?

Everybody always talks about Hamilton and Dear Evan Hanson, which I think were so clever, really clever. But come from away is something that blew my mind and also girl from the North Country. Did you see that? No, I didn't see that, no. I'll have to, though. Is it still, can I still see it?

You know, I think it's in America. Obviously now things are all a bit different, but how about you? Do you like musical theatre? Well, it's interesting, I got into musical theatre probably through the back door in the sense that I loved quite a few of the songs first from the older kind of musicals.

of the great American songbook stuff through getting into jazz. And I think, you know, I was in kind of school productions of Bugsy Malone and Oliver and stuff like that. Oh, lovely. And, you know, my mum and dad took me to see a few things when I was younger, but it's definitely something I've come to appreciate more and more. And, you know, in some ways I envision this Christmas album, the first part of it, at least, kind of like a musical, the Piano Man at Christmas, you know.

That's what I was leading to. Oh, there you go. We're in sync. I've ruined your question now. I'm sorry. No, it's perfect. But, you know, I did, I, I watched Hamilton and felt like I should give up trying to write music or trying to do anything. No.

I just, I just, I was so kind of overwhelmed by how brilliant it, how brilliant it was. And, you know, similarly to come from a way, I love that. I took my dad to see that. And I love the through performance of it. I loved, I loved that it was kind of short, really. But just kind of started and kind of didn't give up. It just kind of kept, kept telling its story. kind of beating you with humanity and beautiful melodies and, you know, this brilliant story.

And I just thought it was so clever. And I do think in order to be really good at writing musical theatre, you have to write a lot of musical theatre. It's not just because you're a songwriter you can write musical theatre. I think, you know, a lot of the great writers in musical theatre have just been doing it a long, long time. But then Matilda, have you taken the kids to see Matilda? Oh, yeah. just, I mean, it would be, obviously it's sort of in the family, but that was, Tim mentioned coming in and doing that and that was a surprise for everybody and it's just.

I know Tim quite well and he is like yourself, like a total musical theatre nerd as well, that always has been as well. So actually, in a lot of ways, I think he was fulfilling his, his proper destiny. I think the stars aligned and he's deeply, deeply gifted. The source material, obviously, as we know, is one of the great children's stories of all time. And I think it fell into place and it's kind of a hard thing to replicate really. And I can't, you know, I can't think of, I can't think of it being better in, you know, it's a once in a lifetime musical, that one. It just is so, it's so perfect.

It is so perfect. I mean, they worked so hard in it. And, you know, none of these things arrived just perfect, fully formed. But, you know, it's, Tim is, Tim is. Tim is so gifted and I love his writing and there's so many memorable songs in Matilda. So many memorable songs. I'm starting to sing it in my head now.

Do you know when you write a song and I know that the songwriter questions are always a little bit sort of in but when you write a song do you hope for a hook or do you look for a hook or when you have a hook do you then write the rest of the song? It's quite hard to think exactly how it goes but I always have to start with something strong.

So sometimes that can be a hook. Sometimes it can just be a title. If you've got a strong title, I mean, one of my favorite songs I wrote, I knew I wanted to write a song called The Age of Anxiety. And so that was a title in my notebook for about six months. I thought, God, I better write it quickly before someone else writes it.

So, yeah, it can be a hook. or it can be something that makes me just feel, that feels like it's valuable. And generally, if I've improvised it into the voice notes in my phone, then you should assume that it has some value. And then I'll sit down and I'll work in it. And quite often what will happen is you'll be working on, you know, you'll be working on a song and you'll think,

oh my God, this song needs a hook. This song does not have a hook and it really needs one. So sometimes then you go and search of it. And I think it's hard to go and search of it. But it does help when you've got a certain architecture of a song, kind of mapped out and you go, well, this has got loads of good stuff to it. It's got a good beginning of a lyric. It's got a nice shape. It's got a lovely verse. And the chorus has got something, but it doesn't have a hook. I think if you're in the business of writing kind of

memorable, well, trying to write memorable songs, you do need one. You need a minimum of one. Great hooks. Ideally, you'd have a couple, and possibly even three. But yeah, you need at least one. Right. You've just said what people say when they write a. musical. So that's where I was going, you've got to write it. You've got to. I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, there's, there's, there's, it's, there's, there's, so, it's, there's, so, it's, there's, so just, anyway, there we go. Next Christmas when I, uh, chat to you and on the first night of your musical, which will be very exciting. I would love to and, uh, you know, the, the, the, the piano man at Christmas, I had

envisioned, envisioned like a, did you, did you, did you remember that film the fabulous Baker Boys? It's, it's up there in my top five all-time favorite films. Well, that is why I feel like a number of things in my life came together with jazz and Michelle Pfeiffer. The most beautiful woman, apart from obviously your wife. Well, I couldn't agree more. But I think that it's really a case of envisaging that kind of the atmosphere of the story. And I tried to set that up at the beginning of that very song, The Piano Man at the Christmas, with someone kind of trudging through the snow from kind of bar to bar.

and I think there's something to be made there kind of interconnecting the songs that were already on the album and a few more and building something like that. I really love that idea, but it's hard to get these things made and do you know what? You'd be hard to find a successful pop star right now

who's not got a musical in development. That's the problem. Really? Because it gives, you know, as a songwriter, it's so disposable music these days and it moves so quickly that I think musicals really give your music quite a lot of longevity or can give your music a lot of longevity. So I think everyone's kind of wise to it now.

I definitely don't have anything in development. There's no producers at my door. No one's asked me. Right. Get in touch with Sky now. Got it. Do the piano man at Christmas for next Christmas. Okay.

Let's casting. Who's going to play the piano man? Would you play it yourself? Hell no. Would you have someone? Okay. Okay. So who we casting? That's a really good question. Should we just go with Brad Pitt? Should we just go straight to the top?

No, no. Too predictable. Okay. Jason Schwartzman then. I like him a lot. Do you know him? Oh, yes. Yeah, I love him. Have you got his number? Tell him he's in it. Just give him the part. I have nobody's number. I have nobody's number. That's not my life at all. We'll get it. We've got the wrong guest.

No, but we'll find his number. All right. We'll contact him and say, hey. Do you want to be the piano man at Christmas? He'll say, yeah. You think so? You think so? You're not calling the album The Piano Man at Christmas,

I did get quite a bit of abuse for that, or so I'm told because obviously, why? Because I got a lot of, on Twitter, Billy Joel's a piano man, you prick, like that. No. Which is fair enough. Billy Joel is indeed the piano man,

but as I've tried to point out on many occasions, this is a fictional piano. I'm not saying I'm not. the piano man at Christmas. This is a fictional musician who goes from bar to bar, you know. This is Jason Swartzman, exactly. Jason Swartzman goes from bar to bar, you know, pining for the one he loves, never at the party he wants to be at but getting to play at everyone's party and bringing the Christmas cheer.

That's, yeah. Who's the one that, we've got to cast? Who's the woman in it? Oh, I don't know. I might need your help here. Oh, oh, um, Sershal Ronan. There we are. Oh, yes. That's a really good idea. Yeah. That's a really good idea. Okay, we got it. I see, so actually, I think you're envisaging it as a movie musical first, right, rather than a stage musical.

It's both. It's both. It's on Sky TV and then it's going on stage. Okay. Do you have any connections with Sky? I'm sure between us. This has been a very, very valuable experience, me being on this podcast, Gary. Very valuable.

Hold on a minute. You're the guy. Talking about connections, just please, my favourite. story about the P. Diddy, gold Nike shoes. Oh, God, yeah. Okay. Well, I, back in the early 2000s when I had my album 20-something out where I was somewhat inexplicably all over the media, like all the time. Me and Amy Winehouse and Katie Mello are kind of the people doing this kind of jazz stuff. and I was at the Brits, the Brit Awards,

I was nominated for a Brit award and I was at the Brit Awards and it was the year like The Darkness won everything which will put you in the kind of era that it was. And I'd just done a cover of Farrell's Frontin song for Radio One which no one had expected. I think they put me on Radio One thinking it would be a big kind of joke

and I ended up doing a cover of Farrell's Frontin And Joe Wiley, who I still speak to very often as she's become a friend, and she played the hell out of it on the radio. And when Farrell was on Radio 1, she played it to him. He absolutely loved it and came to find me at the Brits. He was on the red carpet at the Brits that year. And they said, hey, Farrell, who are you looking forward to meeting tonight? And I think no one expected the name Jamie Cullum to come out of his mouth.

So I met Farrell that night. And Chad Hugo from the Neptunes, who I was incidentally obsessed with. I love Farrell and the Neptunes. And they were so particularly big at that point. And he ended up inviting me to his hotel the next day. We hung out. We got to know each other a bit and we've taught music. And he said, hey, you should come out to Miami and we should do some music together.

I'm like, yes. You know I grew up near Swindon, right? So it was so amazing. I did that and it was, it was a brilliant experience. I feel like I would have, I feel like I would have taken the experience in a different way. Now I was very, very nervous and I was,

I felt like I didn't kind of grab the situation in the best way I should have done. I felt so like I was in the wrong place, even though I was so happy to be there. But we had a brilliant time. I ended up playing piano and singing. on his solo album in my mind, which was such a thrill. And we just hung out in the studio a lot.

And I just kind of went around Farrell's life for two weeks, going to different gigs, going to different events, just being in his orbit at that time when, like, half of the top ten was Neptune's Farrell produced songs. And everyone was calling him all the time, Jay-Z, you know, like everyone, Justin Timberlake.

And, you know, I was speaking to him on the phone. It was so weird. I cannot tell you how weird it was. But really just a wonderful experience. And I did feel like I wasn't kind of stylish enough to be hanging out with them. So they were all wearing, everyone just had amazing trains. I thought, well, I love trainers. I'm going to go and get myself an amazing pair of trainers.

And he said, oh, tonight we're going to go to a party. We're going to Diddy's house for a party. I was like, okay, great. I'll go and this is one I'm going to get this amazing pair of trainers. So we're in Miami, easy to get trainers. I spent all day looking for the perfect, perfect pair of, they were like Air Force One Nike's with some gold on them. And they're really good. They really, it was a really great pair of trainers.

And so we go in Farrell's driven, massive escalade car to Diddy's house, Miami. And it's that really exciting. I'm like, my God, this is, we get there. And as I arrive at the door, to my horror, I realize it. It's a shoes off house. It is a shoes off house. So we have to leave our shoes at the door. And I had not thought about my socks at all.

Because my socks were Bart Simpson's socks with a hole in the right big toe. Yes. So I'm walking around Puff Daddy's house. I know it's not his name anymore. Did E Puff Daddy, whatever, with Bart Simpson socks with a hole in. So it was a lesson in humility there, that's for sure. But it was still a really fun night. The whole thing feels like a,

a bizarre, brilliant dream that happened to someone else. And yeah, I loved it. But I love that story. And I love that when you tell it, there's that, that you still find it all wide, you're very wide-eyed about everything. And when you talk about Clint Eastwood and working with Clint Eastwood on Grant Arena,

you also have this wonderful wide-eyed feeling about it all. Even though you did this and it was, and you played at his festival. But I love that of you, that you don't, you just don't seem to take it for granted. And that's wonderful. Well, I definitely don't take, I definitely don't take it for granted.

And I also think I have a, I just know how hard it is to do anything. Obviously everyone does, but I think creatively I'm so aware, in order to get as good at something as Farrell is or as Clint Eastwood is, it doesn't happen by luck. It happens through, through,

oh God, in order to do what you do, Gabby, it's like it's hours and hours and hours. Please, thank you very much. But really, we're talking Clint Eastwood. I know, I know, but I think, I think, I don't, I don't say it for effect. I promise you to, to be able to casually interview someone like you're just having a conversation. Believe me, and I'm sure you know this as well, it is not a skill you just develop. You're not born with that skill.

It's something, it's something, I mean, you can be naturally, pre-naturally determined towards something like that. But I think it takes a lot, a lot of hours to be to be good at something. So I'm always really grateful to be in the company of people that are really good at what they do. and you know I just I guess I just try to have fun and I think to have fun is to bring with it some enthusiasm some wide-eyed curiosity and some like hey you're lucky to be here there's a lot of other people that could be doing this and it's you so you may as well enjoy it and not and not you know just be a decent person in the process

were you always like that when you you did your own album you're 19 or something weren't you 18 or 19 when you did your first album that you produced you released you released. Were you always living for the day? Were you always wide-eyed? Were you always such a, where are you like you are now? And that's a strange thing to ask because I think lots of us will say, no, I was very different. Well, no, I mean, I think the things that haven't changed are that I've always been, I've always had a sense of enthusiasm. And I haven't overthought stuff too much. I haven't kind of thought about all the things that could go wrong with it first, which I think is quite helpful with creative work

because otherwise you kind of shoot yourself in the foot because basically things do go wrong and if you thought it would if you thought about them too much then you'd never start it in the first place so really with that first album I did it because I wanted something to sell at my

basically wedding gigs I was doing I was doing wedding gigs and pub gigs and I was making 30, 40 quid a time and so many people would ask me afterwards they'd say do you have a CD for sale because I buy one. I'm like, huh, I can make an extra 10 quid here. I can make an extra 20 quid.

And it doesn't, you know, if I could get some money together to record it, so I kind of squirreled away about 400 quid of my student loan and recorded this album. We've recorded it in like two and a half hours or something. And, you know, it's pretty low key, the whole thing. But I got my friend to design a front cover. And when my next bit of my student loan came in, I used money for that to print the CDs. And my dad gave me a bit of extra money as well.

Thank you, Dad, very much. And so I had 300 CDs, and I sold them all in about six months. And so that was the point where I still wasn't thinking about being a musician for a living at that point. I was, you know, I was at uni doing English literature and film and just kind of figuring stuff out and loving music. But I didn't, I didn't, I was never around people that it seemed like such another world. the world of entertainment and TV and the music industry. I was, it just didn't seem like something that would be attainable in terms of being in the right place.

You know, I grew up in a village near Swindon. I was born in Essex. My mum was born in Burma. My dad was born in Jerusalem. You know, I got this, you know, it's just didn't feel like that.

So I just kind of went with the ride and just worked really hard at it. And, yeah, But I mean, I guess the things that have changed, I think I feel that idea of not being too attached to the outcome is something that I felt really valuable to develop over the last kind of 10 or 12 years because it's instilled in you early on in the music industry when you're young, particularly that if your album doesn't do this or if your tour doesn't do this, then this won't happen.

And I think that's a really dangerous kind of feedback loop to get into because, first of all, it hampers your creativity. And, you know, mainly hampers your creativity. enjoyment of what should be the fun part, which is, you know, the privilege of getting to make stuff for your job. You know, it's not, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's definitely, you work hard at it, but it's like, God, what a privilege to do that. And if you forget that, then go and do another job. Yeah, living in the moment. I just get a lot of, from that, from you is that you live for the moment and you live for each day, which is such a wonderful, perfect place to live, really,

let's be honest, and not think about what happened yesterday, not think about the outcome tomorrow and just living in the moment. Yeah, I think so. I mean, again, it's probably not something I've overthought. Although, having said that about not thinking about what's happened in the past, I think I've taken a great lot of value from exploring my family history more than I have in the last few years, just where they've come from and what challenges they face

from not being from this country. And it's something that really wasn't talked about when I was younger. because I think it was quite difficult for them and their experience of being in this country and making all that work and stuff. But so I have found that aspect of kind of looking into the past really helpful because it kind of makes you think, well, maybe that's why I feel about this particular way

and maybe that's where that's come from and stuff like that. But in terms of, if you're right about appreciating the moment, I think I've gotten better at that too. And I think there's a lot more conversation about that in the public sphere. about mindfulness and about taking, enjoying the moment

because the moment is what we have because you can't predict or control the future and the past is the past. So, yeah, try and live in the moment and appreciate what's right in front of you at that precise time. One of the things we always ask everybody in the podcast is what makes you belly laugh,

what makes you completely lose it and giggle your guts out. What is it with you that makes you laugh? Definitely lots of things. when my children used really words that I didn't know they knew in the perfect context to describe someone or like a teacher or something it's that makes me really really laugh I'm trying to think of an example for you I can't think I'm one off the top of my head that won't offend anyone just laughing to think about it now for some reason kind of mishaps captured on 80s camcorders Those kind of things that used to be on, I don't know what they were called,

Beatles videos or I don't know what those kind of things are called. For some reason, watching like someone on a rope swing over a river in 1987, captured on a camcorder kind of swinging backwards in the wrong way and landing on Granny's picnic table or something. For some reason, watching those kind of slapstick captured in situ mishaps. You've been framed. You've been framed. There we go.

Brilliant. Yeah, I'm. High brow till the end. Oh, no, you're wonderful. You're absolutely wonderful. And congratulations on the album and all the new tracks now that are on this one as well.

And I'm lucky enough to have sat here and listened to it all. So, Jamie, thank you so much. Oh, thank you so much for having me. It's a real pleasure. Thank you so much for listening. Coming up next week, the one and only Miranda Hart.

That Gabby Roslyn podcast is proudly produced by Cameo Productions. Music by Beth McCari. Could you please tap the follow or subscribe button. And thanks so much for your amazing reviews. We honestly read every single one and they mean the world to us. Thank you so much.