That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Kiell Smith-Bynoe and Ed MacArthur

Episode Date: August 8, 2023

What do you get if you put Gaby Roslin in a room with two comedians? Chaos it turns out! In this episode, we welcome Kiell Smith-Bynoe and Ed MacArthur to the podcast to talk about working together, comedy, duos, learning lines and how to keep smiling and joyful in a tough industry. Kiell and Ed are appearing at the Edinburgh Festival (2023) - and you can find out more about there show here! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Last time I saw you, you were with your wonderful mummy, who you've left in Barbados. Left there, yeah. Not on her own. She's with friends, of course. You've literally just flown in just for this. Please just say yes, even if it's not true. Yes. Oh. I heard this was the only date you could do.

Yes, the only date. I'm going back to Barbados straight after. No, you're not, because you're going to be live on stage. And you're going to Edinburgh Fringe. Yeah, yeah. So we start our show for the third time. we commence our show, I should say, for the third time on the 1st of August. You don't mean the third time.

You mean... The third run. Yes. The third run of our, yeah, of our two-man show. Yeah. Tell me everything about it then. Come on, Ed. It is a musical comedy, built as a late-night kids show for adults.

We're two rival children's entertainers. I'm the posh one. Kael is the rapper. And fun ensues. for about, on a good night, 53 minutes. That's very precise. We've decided that's the best length. If it goes over, people get a bit tired.

If it's under, people feel shortchanged. So you're going in to do this for the third time. Incredible reviews. Congratulations. Even from The Guardian. I mean, amazing reviews. How did it all start? How did it all come about? Well, we met at the Edinburgh Fringe in what I thought was 2015, and I was corrected this morning in an interview when Ed told me it was 2016.

Because I also value accuracy. And we were told that we have to meet each other because we have a similar talent, I guess, for music and acting. But we didn't know each other or know of each other. I just went to watch Ed's show, which was fantastic. It was a musical comedy called Stack. But I still didn't really know how we'd worked together. And we met and we spoke about just our journey in acting and what we wanted to do

and then realized that we both at some stage in our journey had been, children's entertainers and then thought like is there something in that and um yeah and then we sort of just put ideas together and we started off i guess with like just a bunch of songs we realized it were both musical and i i haven't been a grime emcey prior to acting had that musical um ability and ed can play anything that makes a noise so we came together and wrote some songs and so at one stage we just had a bunch of songs And then we were like, right, well, we need to find what the narrative is and where the rivalry comes from.

And so then we worked out the narrative and the plot and how it's a story. And that's, yeah. Well, congratulations. I love that. I have to obviously go back and find out about you being children's entertainers because we've all done it. Yes, that was a we. Were you a children's entertainer? But everyone who ever wanted to be some sort of performer

has been a children's entertainer at some time. Your story, please, Ed. I should say, I think Kyle's more actually was pretty legit and was doing some quite high-end stuff, whereas mine was, it was entertaining children, but was it children's entertainment? It was more like, have you heard of mini Mozart? Have you heard of this? Yes, yeah. Well, yeah, you rock up and you play an instrument for children. And it was a form of children that you tell stories and you play for them. But sometimes they were just babies. And sometimes they weren't with their parents. They were with their like, opairs or something, or nannies. And sometimes the nannies didn't speak very good English. So I'd find myself in a room with just like 12 babies and 12 minders.

none of whom spoke English, and I always loved to do little jokes for the parents, and that was just falling flat. So it'd feel some of the loneliest times of my life have been standing there with an accordion, telling the story of Jack and the Beanstalk, and trying to reference kind of, you know, Joe Biden or something, and it'd go for nothing.

Oh, I'm so sorry. It's obviously still affecting you. Yeah, I just felt so stupid. But I suppose the actual, kind of making balloons and stuff and goofing around and all that, that was more your, I've undersoled what you were doing there, but being in the moment, your improv and you're thinking on your feet

and every moment can be a creative moment, whereas I was much more, a bit like our characters are on the show, I was very like, this is how it has to go, and you need to behave, whereas that's not really how children's attention should be. So had you trained,

because I know, Kyle, you had actually trained as an actor when you were younger and then you went off to college, but he's 15, was it East 15? Yeah. But Ed, Ed, with you, had you done the same route? Yeah, I've been to drama school, went to Bristol, Bristol. Bristol. Oh, very posh.

I thought, this is it. Yeah. And then was in children's entertainment within a couple of months and never look back and never look. But I do think it is glorious. I mean, because they don't, if they're bored, they just tell you they're bored. Whereas adults can sit through King Lear for three hours and pretend it's fun. Kids are like, no.

And so you have to then do something. I think it's so good for your instincts and for your performing. It's a great way to learn. And because of that, we chose that format to do the show. So we treat the audiences if they're the children at the party. And we keep in mind that we've got to keep them entertained. constantly and there has to be new things as well there's songs there's magic there's jokes do balloon modelling yeah he does you do yeah yeah what can you make what you want have you got any

balloons on you now that's a shame actually that is a shame but it's it awful noise though yeah it's very noisy but what is your what is your go-to a swan swam I wish dog a dog yeah or a dog with a long neck yeah a giraffe yeah I could do giraffes that was all I could do dog with A big body and a pearly dill tail. So is it ad-libbed then? So it's scripted with, you're ready to go with whatever the audience throw in you? Yes, it's quite heavily reliant on audience participation, which is why we need an audience. So we ask for suggestions all the way throughout the show and have moments where,

even in songs where we ask for suggestions and we get people to actually make noises that make the song. So do you go into a blind panic if someone? but he says something that you really not expect. Has that happened? Not really. We're sort of... You're ready for anything? I don't know something at you.

I do feel like we are ready for any... There's a part in the show where I use a loop pedal. A loop pedal? A loop pedal. Oh, a loop? Yeah, where you loop the sound. And then turn it into a beat. You might ask for animal names, mind you.

And the audience give you animal names. So you say, you can say, what's your favorite animal? And then you get all that. Elephant? And then what do I do? All right, then you've got a... Jetlank. I could be your looper.

Why don't I be your looper? Right, we could try that. Okay. So you put your sound in the looper. Let's see what it sounds like. And I'll just put that through drama school. Okay, and what's your favorite animal? Elephant.

Elephant. What noise is the elephant, mate? Are you able to keep up the beat and do that? Right, like that. Okay. Mm-tahat. Oh, that's good. And where might you find an elephant?

Africa. Africa. And what other sounds would you hear in Africa? Like rain. Lion. Lion. Where's the lion? Well, no, you've got to do the lion.

Oh, I've got to be the lion. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm pressing the... Raw. Mata, raw. Mm-to-a-ha-to-Raw. Wow. I'm coming to see this show.

I don't think even you know that you could do it. No, I'm baffled. I'm astonished. I'm actually pretty amazed with what you can do. I don't need the loop. What's so lovely is that you can tell that you get on so well. And I love it that we know how it all started as well. But you're both... You want to know how it's going to end?

No, it's not going to end. You've got to carry on doing what you do. But you're both actors and you're just open to what's going to happen. And I think as actors you have to be, don't you? Because you never know when the next job is happening, if we're all honest. Yeah, yeah. We also have to be sort of ready for anything, and we had that. We've had a few shows where, you know, because we're a late night show.

It's not that late, but it's late for sort of regular theatre goes, if we're on at 9.15. So some people might have come after quite a few drinks. Right. And we, of course, encourage the audience to speak out and talk at certain points in the show. But sometimes audience members can get either confused between what times they're meant to talk and not, or just get carried away and actually chat to us as if they're watching Gogglebox. That's quite sweet though. They feel that comfortable.

Yes. That is. That means that the audience are happy where they are. Yeah. Or just very drunk. If you're bringing 20 people on a work Christmas party and they've all come directly from the pub to your show. What happens if the big TV gig comes in or the movie comes in

and do you plan to do this? How do you choose? What is in? Well, because obviously, Dreamland. You were in Dreamland as well, weren't you? I crop up. I don't know about episode two, episode six. You were both in Dreamland.

We will talk about Lewis. And I will not ask you that question that everybody asks you. And when I met, Kyle, the first time, he said, please don't ask me if I've ever seen a ghost. I went, I wasn't actually planning to you. Don't ask him, get it. Oh, you're the first person.

Yeah, it's true. Five years I've had. I actually can't believe that people... It's their go-to question. And what's your answer? You've got to be kidding me. Don't you dare go there? We're not even...

But seriously, people in the street? I understand people in the street. No, no, I mean like... No, just like interviews and... Especially like researchers. You know, like if you do a research... Oh, you're talking the professionals say that? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I thought you meant everybody in the street. No, no, no, no. So no one in the street? They just holds me like what Charlotte Richie's like. Do they? Yeah. Is that really? Yeah.

That's so sweet. Yeah. So can we just go there quick? We have to go there, Ed. Have you ever watched it? Yes, I've watched it. Yeah, yeah. It's very good show.

Carl goes, we're obsessed as a family. We know it all off by heart. And my younger daughter does impressions of all the characters. She absolutely loves it. She's going to kill me for saying that because she's behind the glass right now watching this. But it's such a great show. Is it true that it's by but? Is that really definitely?

Not a movie. Not that I know of. Please say there's going to be a Christmas special. There's going to be some more ghosts. Please just say it. Just say it. What I do know is that there is one more series only. And I don't, we haven't been given a, like, a start date.

I feel like it's sometime in September just based on the last two years. But also for it all to be over, and the rest of the cast I've met and done things with as well, I beg, I get down on knees and beg, because it's just so innocent. And I think we need that sort of view. Sorry, Ed, I'm not ignoring you, I promise. I have to say that when people come up to us and ask one of the, of us for an autograph and it's normally KAL. The people who ask who are from ghosts are the most grateful often of all the things you've done. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, because often it's just like

something that brings the family together. It does. It's a very, very rare thing. And when I was growing up, there was television that we all sat around and watched together. Now, there's not a lot, you know, let's be honest, but Ghost is one of those and it's multi-generational. When did you start it? How many years ago? We started filming the first series in 2018 and it came out in 2019. So it's five years. years? Yeah, yeah. Okay. So my youngest was 10 or 11, and my dad was in his 80s, and they would sit together and watch that show. Oh, man, that's really sweet. And that is what's special. You know, they're all ages. And it's wonderfully innocent, and it's naughty. Yeah. And it's joyful. But I think, isn't there going to be a film? Because that's the other thing that's talking about. I'd love to do a film.

I'd love to. I think it's just quite hard to do a film. I think like... Sorry, Ed and I are giving us, we're looking at each other going, you work? Why is that hard? I think because, like, the state of the film industry and the situation and all that sort. Not the actual, like,

beginning, middle end. Yeah, that'd be the easy bit. But I think, like, just to make a film. Well, we'll watch out for it. We hope it does happen, because I know all of that team, they do horrible histories

and they made Bill. Bill, yeah, yeah. Bill. So hopefully it will happen. That's it. We'll lay the ghost to rest. That's really. Have you ever seen a ghost, Gabby?

That's a whole other podcast. Is it? Yes. Launching soon. Many times. Many times. Have you? This is about me.

This is about you too. So, right. I don't know. A couple of ghosts. No. No. So let's go if we can to comedy double acts. Because when they work, my word they work, and I can tell that you two obviously just get on so well, which is lovely.

In the past, the ones that you loved, because I have, I, I can. I can imagine you'd like different sort of comedy acts from the past. Ed Gereferst. Yeah. Well, I loved your kind of like your Blackadder, your Baldrick and whatnot. Bordrick and Blackadder or what else. I was brought up quite kind of classic comedies. I knew you would be.

I was about to say, I bet you like all of them. And then stuff like Peep Show. I loved at The Office, of course. Big Game Changer. So is that the way you'd like to see yourself? That is where I would like to see myself, where I actually see myself. It's slamby spanner. But I definitely think,

I definitely think like the, we're the best comedy country in the world, aren't we? Well, I think so. Yeah, yeah. Best comedies. And musical comedy, obviously, is what we also love. And it's quite, I mean, Flight of the Concordes is a big inspiration for us, wasn't it?

Yeah. And obviously, Tim Minchin. And actually, Monty Python, I used to, as a child, would listen to the soundtrack and could sing all the songs before I knew that they were quite explicit. I knew the words, sit on my face and tell me that you love me.

I'll sit in your face and tell you, I love you too. I love to see you oral eyes. When in between your thighs, you blow me away. And I was nine years old. You could sing the whole thing, didn't know. So, yeah. And you, of course. Me, of course.

Where was your comedy roots? I'd ever had Sky at home, but all my friends had Skies. So I would get them to record it for me on VHS. So, like, Keenan and Kel and those kind of shows. and like my wife and kids and all these shows I felt like a bit exclusive watching because I was watching it a different way to everyone else.

Everyone had it sort of like at their disposal and they might have like missed a few episodes because they'll catch up on it at some point. But I was really watching like Fresh Prince and all of those things because I didn't have it on the channels that everyone else had. But also I did love like Morecambe and Wise and

what else was the two two Ronnie's? The two fellas. With the glasses. Yeah, I loved all of that stuff. But like, even to like phone shop with the duo with Javon Prince and... Oh, I wish I could remember his name. But they played Joanne and... Oh, gosh.

It's the jet lag. It's catchy. You do it so well. Comedy acting, though, is that where you want to stay? Because you've done massively successful sitcom. More sitcoms, please. Can you write it? community. Maybe that's what you should do.

Are we allowed to... Yeah, yeah. This is quite funny actually, so we were backstage at a Eurovision gig and then an article got published saying that we're working on a pilot and then you went, what? How do they find out? Who leaked this? And then we discover it and then it says in the article, Kyle recently explained on a podcast interview that they've got

a pilot. I was like, oh right. Yeah. I think I spoke about it on Radio 4. Okay, so tell you about this. So has it been picked up? It's for the in development of BBC. For this show? For these three characters? For this show. Yeah, this show.

Oh, how wonderful. Can you tell me any more about it? Well, it's pretty much like the... Like the stand-up? Like the live show. It's like the live show. It's the origin of our rivalry. So do we get the backstory of the two characters? The backstory. Oh, yes, please.

Yeah. So, I mean... That's your big thing as writing as well, isn't it? Yeah. That's what you want to do as well. Although, I just want to... And I mean, every writer will say this, but you want to write it and then get it made and do it. You don't want to write it and then give it to someone and they give you notes and then you rewrite it. And you give it to the channel and they give you notes and then you rewrite it. You just want to do it.

And obviously all these people are... You mean impatiently? Yeah, yeah, definitely. And unfortunately, the development process in this country is a lot slower than others, like US, for example. So would you take it to America? I'd like to take it to America. I'm going to... Where else can be...

Anywhere? Do a Korean version. Yeah. I'd love to, like, make this show and then be able to, like, sell the format to it and see other countries and cultures do their version of it. I think that's what everybody wants to... Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. And it's, like, the story is... It's so clear that these characters are just from different sides of the track, different sides of the same city, perhaps. Which is, like... You know, it's like Prince and the Porpo. It's as old as that.

and you can just make that in whichever language, whichever country, and see the way that they do it. It's diversity properly on screen, though, isn't it then? Because it's showing both sides. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And we both learn things about each other. We have preconceptions, we have stereotypes. We sort of like assume a lot about each other.

Okay, so what do you assume about, in real life, what did you assume about each other before you started working? I think, well, this is slightly past the question. I was thinking about, I keep trying to find, because obviously there's so many ways in which we're different, it's quite funny the things that we have, like, I think, like, to put it really clumsily, posh culture and grime culture,

there's some funny similarities in some way, in that I think, like, wit is such a big part of crime culture and just, like, the boarding school, the alpha male culture, using wit as a thing, double-barreled names. Yeah, yeah. Also, like, you've got to be quite boisterous, and also, it's quite braggadocious grime in general.

and it's just, it's like, look, I'm the best, I'm the best. And it's a similar thing, I guess. Well, you know, it's interesting you say that because I think that it's more, modesty is more the, maybe this is changing now, but like modesty is the more high status thing. It's kind of naft to be showing off and flash. So there's that fun in the show that like,

the kind of sneering at the braggadociousness kind of thing. Yeah. Okay. That's just the sound of rum. Yeah, I know. I've got on the, on the, on the, The run levels. But when you say assumptions about each other, I basically felt like I was slightly missold you

in that I didn't really realize that you had this grime background and musician background and grew up in East London. I thought you were just a drama school guy. Right, yeah, yeah. So my assumption was, must just be some middle-class guy. Right. Coming up doing his play and then the more I got to know you, I thought, oh, it's Kyle.

Kyle and his grime and his... It's it Joan Littlewood company. Yeah, so I went to Theodore of Stratford East. and that was all journal at all its teachings and we yeah we learned that and then that's where I was I was about to say influenced maybe that is the right word I was influenced to join East 15

or to audition for East 15 at least that's not the group we're talking the school yeah I was also part of East 17 and run that up at Christmas time you're dressed like that now you're dressed exactly like East 17 and my hair as well I don't know, I see that?

Yeah. Isn't that wild? It's shocked me. He's not gone blonde. He shocks myself every time. Do that again. You've gone blonde. So, Kyle, when did it? No, take that off.

It's good. You can keep looking at it. When did you do this? I did it for a show. I did it for Horn Section Series 2. Oh. And then I just kept it for a bit. I like it.

I quite like it. No, it's really good. I'll keep it for a bit. Keep it for the summer. Okay, keep it for the summer. Yeah. Do you wear a hat for most of our live show? All of it, apart from that bit where you take my hat off.

That's going to be a fun reveal, isn't it? Yeah. Ed. So, okay, you're doing the show in just a few days, and you have just asked, do you not look at him in the show? So here's the thing. Do you know whether he takes the hat off? Okay, I've got to tell you this. So we got it filmed, and I watched it the other day.

Yeah. And I messaged Kyle going, Kaya, you're fantastic in the show. Because I'm so preoccupied with what my next line is and where I'm going to be. Apparently, really good actors listen to each other. I hear a noise that sounds like he's finished. Are you kidding me? You don't actually look at him? Because the audience is so live

and you're thinking about a million things at once and I'm sort of taking him what he's doing. I'm often not looking at him. I'm sorting the next prop or dealing with the audience or thinking about what's going to happen in the next scene because I've got to do a call back to that or think of a song that sometimes you fall on the train tracks, don't you? And then I just watch this clip back

and he's pulling all these clever faces and he's got all his bits going about funny stuff, Gail. But I didn't know that until the run had finished. And you can't really know what someone else is fully up to on stage, can you? Maybe you can if you're really, if you're good and not just trying to remember the lines.

But also, remember, he doesn't always give the same cue. So I'm sort of like half listening. He'll do his own thing. And so sometimes I'm just, yeah. Well, maybe I should watch you more. It's too late now, mate. Yeah, we've got that. We've got a third run now, so I'll see what you're up to.

I'm looking forward to seeing the show. I'm looking forward to see what you do. He wears the hat, apparently. And he's gone blonde. He's gone blonde. He's gone blonde. Tell me about the grime stuff. Yeah, so that was just part of my.

At school, it was a thing that a lot of people did. We had a lot of Grammases come out of my school, and I thought I could be good at that. And then I was. So I just kept doing it. But then it got to a stage around 2014-15, where I wasn't really, I wanted to be an actor, but I wasn't acting much.

I was putting a lot of my time and efforts into, like, paying for studio time, for example, rather than paying for new headshots or things like that, or being able to pay for a show reel to get cut together, I'd rather like get a new jacket for a video shoot or something like that. And I had to like really consider what I was going to put my all into. And I thought, right, let me really focus on the acting. Because at the time I was working in the call centre.

So, and I was doing the odd audition here and there. But I didn't have enough money. I wasn't surviving off either thing, either the music or the acting. So I had to go, right, I really need to put my all into one of them. So it's pretty quick that it all happened then, when you decided to put your rule in? Well, yeah, I've been full time since 2016 and goes to start a film in 2018. So, yeah, I guess it was... That is relatively quick.

I mean, it's a strange old business. But will you go back to Grime? Will you go back? Because obviously, your music is if you play every instrument. Are you trained in music? No, but I... But you can play everything. I try and appear like someone who is.

And actually causes problems. So I'm playing, I play piano occasional music in other people's shows, and I can't really read music. And often I appear like someone who's kind of, you know, can do that very well. And that takes a lot of time. You play by ear? Play by ear. Yeah. But that's brilliant. I think it's good, but it's not.

It is. It's a massive talent. But it's, but I keep, basically, when I've presented in the past as a music teacher, I can teach them until they're, you know. Sorry, can we just go back on that? You are a music teacher. So I teach music. But you can't teach actual music. So I can until, you know, until they're about seven or eight.

And then I suddenly have to sort of make my excuses because then they get quite good at the reading of the music. And I can't do it. For me, it's just like Chinese symbols. I can't believe people can read music. That's mad. I get you. So imagine this.

I'm exactly the same. Imagine this. There's a line in a book, okay? And you learn over many years to read English and you read the book. And then there's a squiggle at the beginning of that line that would make every single letter go back one letter in the alphabet. That's what happens in music. So you've got all the notes you've learned them.

And then because there's a flat or a sharp, every single note has to go back one or forward one. And then there's a tempo, and it has to be like that. Yeah, but the tempo you'd be good at. But I just think I think it's mad. Yeah, but if you cite read the tempo, you'll be okay, huh? If you cite read the tempo, no, because because, it's not in your terms, it's got to go whatever it's going at,

and it's like, this is happening. Whereas if you read a book, you can read it at your own time. I just think it's a mad... Have I explained that well? No, you have, because I'm somebody who plays and sings by ear. Do you really? I can't read music either. I think it's crazy. Exactly the same thing.

Don't look for me like that. Kael was giving me that look. What Kyle does do, though, is because you've been doing your... obviously just writing bars for so many years. If I suddenly go, okay, a verse about farts go. And to this thing, you're as quick as AI... What is it called? Chat GPT. It's mad.

And you're funny than chat GPT. Oh, thanks, ma'am. They're welcome. They're never taking my job. No. They win. They're too slow. Too slow.

So you write songs about farts? We've recently wrote a song about a fart that goes in the end of our pilot, which I think is one of our best songs. And it's a shame we can't put it in the live show. Yeah. Why can't you put it in the live show? Because we can't. It doesn't really work. It's like, you know, like when we do our live show, no one's giving us notes about like.

Oh, I see. Okay. About like, oh, this should not. mean this and this should connect to the beginning and we want to see the character development. It's literally like, do what you want and make it good and don't say anything. Can we have a little bit of your farts now? I mean,

neither of us know it. Rump-pity-pump-ty-pump. We're making a noise with our bums. When I was a nipper, I loved a good ripper, a special lindick-smelly ones. See, that's, I can remember my bit. I can probably remember your bit. I love that. No, stream, you've got a let one rip. Oh, I'm wrapping

your stuff and let me tell you, it's harder than it looks. I've got no idea. It's probably on a document. It's all in the cloud. Your fart song is in the cloud. Did you ever think 20 years ago you'd say that? So I'm in a double act with the world's busiest man, obviously, as you can tell.

And that means that if ever we've got stuff to do, I'm so excited to do it. I'm not, I'll do it. But what I'll do is I won't hear from you with creative stuff. And then suddenly you'll get on a plane somewhere. And then when you get the other side of the plane, there's just hours of work done in one go where clearly no one can interrupt you. So I'm thinking about buying you. a few tickets to just travel. Maybe just ask the pilot to just go around

the M-25 and then come back down. Do a couple laps. Yeah, a couple of laps. Come back down. You're so lovely together. Listen, break legs. I hope Edinburgh goes wonderfully well. I hope the pilot happens because I want to see it on the screen as well. But you two are so lovely together and you're what we need because we all need it right now.

There's so much crap going on. It really is and I think everybody needs that escapism and that's why we're talking about ghosts before and I think what you two have got and what you want to give to all of us just to make us feel young and laugh again. And I think that's what everybody needs. So thank you so much. And good luck with it all. Thank you very much. Thank you.