That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Paul Foot

Episode Date: June 4, 2024

Comedian Paul Foot joins Gaby for a good ole natter. He talks about his new show, which came out of suddenly feeling joy, his antics at Go Ape and the little things in life which make him smile. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Paul Foote, when the team here who made the podcast knew you were coming on, there was great excitement. What's there? Great excitement. Will, especially, who is there behind the glass, came to see you do your stand-up and just says it's absolutely brilliant. And you have been touring for 26 years. Do you ever take a break? No, not really. I've been going ever since I started.

The only time I took, I always said I'd never take a break if I took a break for more than one month. then I'd stop. But then, of course, COVID happened. So then I did take a break. So if COVID hadn't have happened, so you had, hold on a minute, you really never took a break in all the years up to COVID? Not for longer than a month.

A month was the most. I had this sort of superstition that, because it's so weird going on stage doing a stand-up comedy, when you think about it, it's absolutely frightening. It has to be near perfect conditions. It's not like. like a band where there could be a few people talking or maybe whatever doesn't,

it's not optimum, it will still work. It has to be perfect conditions or virtually perfect. And you have to go on and you have to say stuff and they have to sit there and laugh. And if they don't, it's a complete disaster for everyone. For them, it's a horrendous experience. For me, it's a humiliation. and even if, let's say, they laugh for 55 minutes and in the last five minutes they don't laugh, that's also a disaster.

So when you think about it, it's quite a frightening. Yes, why do this? Why put yourself through this? One mustn't analyse it too much. If you think about it too much, you wouldn't do it. You'd think, if you actually think, I'm going to go on tonight and I've got to do all those things, and it's got to be perfect, otherwise it's going to be a disaster.

You wouldn't do it. So I always had this superstition that I'd always have to just not think about it, just keep doing it. And sometimes I'd have a month off, sometimes after Christmas and January, but that would be the limit, be no more than a month. And I think, right, I've got to get back into it. I'm doing a show, I must never stop. Then when COVID happened, I did stop.

And then I discovered that didn't really make any difference. I just did one after six months, having not performed, for six months. And you were okay? And I was okay. Although I did do Zoom, which is sort of simile-ish. But you can't hear the people in the room. It's a bit different than that.

I mean, I think it's a very brave thing to do stand-up. I mean, I do crazy things and loads of people and listen and telly and all the rest and stage. But stand-up, you're putting yourself out there, like you said. If you analyze it too much, oh. Well, it's the most exposed, one of the most exposed, with the possible exception of trapeze artist. I actually think I'd prefer to try the trapeze. Yeah, I think I would actually prefer stand up.

Okay, that's where we differ. Anything with heights, it really scares me. I did a thing a little while ago called Go Ape. Oh, it's fantastic. I love it! Zipwire. Do you not like Zip Wire? I like the Zip Wire.

Yeah. So the Zip Wire, to me, was like a roller coaster. Yeah. It's just a leap of faith. Yes. Your brain says no, but you then think to yourself. look, it's all fine, it's all attached and everything. And so you just make that leap of face.

It's the roller coaster and you just whizz down. You don't have to do anything. And then suddenly you're just in a load of sore dust and people saying, well done. So that's all right. But it's the ones where... What was the bit you didn't like? Well, it was the bit where...

Like, there were various ones where you had to, like, balance on a bit of wire or something, like a tight-rope rope. And it's very thin bit of wood. It's very thin wood. Or you had to leap from one little bit of woodblock to another. Oh, I love it. It's sort of swinging. Yeah.

And it's a sort of thing that if you set it up in this studio and I was one foot up in the air, I could do it easily. Yeah. But because it was 15. One foot. It was 15 metres high. Even though I had a thing harnessing me on, in the end I couldn't. Did you leap? Did you do it?

Yeah. I did all the leaping things. I did the Tarzan swing. Yes. Where you have to leap. Yeah. And then you have a little drop. Yeah.

You're briefly weightless and then you climb onto the net. But it's the bits where I had to go across things and I knew that if I fell off this bit of wood, I would, I'd only drop two or three feet or even less than that and then the carnis would hold me. Anyway, my brain couldn't compute it after a while. And there were five different things and I did the first four. Yes. I was with the children, not my children, I stole them. Okay.

You didn't really. Borrowed them. Borrowed some nice children that you knew. From Ukraine. You borrowed some... Ukrainian children. You borrowed them? Yes, I borrowed them.

Where did you borrow them from? From my parents, I suppose, because they've got a Ukrainian family. Oh, I see. Okay. All makes sense now. But ultimately from Ukraine is where I borrowed them. Okay. But your parents are looking after them.

They're looking after them. That's so lovely of your parents. Yes. Did your parents know you were taking it? them on the high wire. Oh, well, yes, and they did, and also the mother, she knew. Oh, that's okay. The mother.

Okay. Was she with you? No, she wasn't. She, the mother of the children, she said. It was just you? Yeah, I said to her, would she like to come? Oh, no, she said. And then when I picked up the children, she just said,

thank you so much for taking my children away just for a few hours. Thank you so much. Please. And then I said, oh, we should be back by about three o'clock. No, no, no, no, no, she said, no, no rush. Just come back whenever you want. But did you tell her what you were doing, with your children.

Yes. And she was fine about them going out on tight ropes. Oh yeah, she was fine with that. She just wanted them out. She wanted them away. She wanted them away. Children away. Yes.

So did they manage to do all of these things and you didn't? Yeah, they did them. And you didn't do number five? Well, they did them. I was officially the, I was like the responsible person. So I had to be, they couldn't go without me, you see. Right. But in reality, they were helping me.

And they were saying, okay, sit on this piece of wood. And I was saying, I get saying, it's 10 meters in the air. It's all right, Paul. Remember, remove that metal thing from one clip to another, and you still got the other one holding you on to the other thing. Yes, yes, you know, all that. So they helped me. So you did do it in the end?

I did do the first four. Yeah. But then the fifth one, it was, you could either go extreme or moderate. And what did you do? Well, we decided to go extreme. Of course you did. And by now, my brain is, like, there's so much been going into my brain. It can barely think.

I'm not scared. much, so much it's just my brain is run out of capacity to think. Anyway, so the boy, he went up first and he got to the top. And it's really high. You have to go up like a rope ladder that's higher than a house. It's fantastic. So he went to the top. Then the girl, who's younger, she went up.

And then halfway up, she starts crying. Oh, no. And I think, no, not oh, no. This is wonderful. This is fantastic. means this gives me an out. Oh, I see. She's finding...

I went into mother mode. Oh, I don't care about that. I only care about saving face and all that stuff. So she starts crying and I'm thinking this is what we need and she's saying, let's do the moderate one, let's not do that one. But unfortunately, her brother then said various words to her in Ukrainian that rallied her. And so she went to the top. So then I'm thinking, oh gosh, you know.

So I've got no choice now. So I start going up, but then I go up and down a bit, and then I start speaking to, and there's all a lot of people behind me all queuing. I don't care about that. I'm in an existential crisis. I don't care whether they have to queue for five hours. I'm just... You're melting. I'm melting. I'm halfway up this rope ladders, and I start talking to one of the staff, the men who works there, and I said, look, I'm having a real existential crisis here.

And then it's decided I should come back down. and then it's decided I could go back up and it goes on for ages and eventually I get to the top I get to the top I'm baited breath it's one of the most greatest achievements of my life you know

I've got to the top of this thing and this great long rope ladder I've defied everything I've defied my fears all that stuff then the first thing is you have to go from one swinging rope like wooden bit to another and it's 15 metres in the air

and then I managed the first few and then my brain couldn't compute anymore. So then I just sort of stopped. And then I heard people at the bottom saying, what's going on up there? And I wasn't capable of saying words fully. So I just sort of said, the end now, I die here. Because that's all I could think to say.

That's dramatic. Well, I thought I was going to die there because I thought I didn't realize that they can come and rescue. you. I assumed because I thought, well, maybe. You were just going to be there forever. I thought maybe they can get me off on a helicopter, but that's going to be very expensive and difficult. And how would they unharness me? And then I thought, the most likely is that I'll just starve slowly. I couldn't. This is going for kids. They just thought, yes, we'll leave them up there to starve to death. Well, I didn't really, at that moment, I couldn't think logically,

you see. Right. So I was just hanging. there and I just let the thing and let me hang and I was just hanging there and I was thinking there's just one bit of wire holding me in the air, 15 minutes in the end I just... Where were the kids? Oh, they'd got to the next bit. Right. So they could see you just hanging there thinking

I'm going to die. Yeah, and they were the ones who said I think Paul it's time we went back now and they really wanted to do the final the final bit and they couldn't do it without me because I'm the legal... Yes, but you're still hanging. You've left us hanging with

hanging. What's going, what happened? Oh, well, one of the men came up who'd been, who I'd met before, working there and he came, I don't know how it did, it came up, and he had a separate thing, and he came along on his pulley thing, and then

he had big, this sounds really sexual, but it's not. It had like big, strong thighs, and he put me in between his thighs, and he squeezed me between his thighs really hard, and then he pulls me back. And I remember thinking, I'm going to live. I'm going to live. I'm going to,

this was just before Christmas last year. So I remember thinking, my birthday on Christmas Eve, I remember thinking, I'm going to make my birthday, I'm going to make Christmas, I'm going to go to Australia in January. I should laugh at you with your fear, but it's very funny. Yeah, it was so scary. And then he got me back to this thing, and then I just had to go down the rope ladder. Still in his thighs? No, no. Okay. Well, that's an interesting question because now I wasn't in his thighs. I just went down it myself. I just didn't look down and just went down.

Okay. And then when I got to the bottom, I wasn't all like flustered and shaken or anything. I was just like, I'm fine now. I literally just ran out of brain capacity to comprehend what was going on. I couldn't absorb what was happening when I was up the top of this thing. Can we say that's a bit of similar to life? Can sometimes be like that, can't it? It can be, yes.

So I was really scared. of that. How did we get onto talking about you going on? Oh, yes, it's fear. Fear of doing stand-up. That's my biggest fear is that heights. You know that thing on I'm a celebrity, you get me out of here?

Yeah. When you have to go, they have to go up on the, really high up the building. On the opening episode. On the opening episode. You wouldn't do that. I wouldn't do that. A, because I wouldn't ask me,

because I'm not famous enough. Would you bungee jump? Oh, for. Like, that's one of those great. which is, that's an interesting question. One of those things that really scares me, would I do it if someone paid me lots of money? That's interesting, like, you know those things on the,

which is similar in the Fun Fair, when you go up a high thing and it just drops you? I do those, and I don't like those. Yes, well, I don't like it. But on some level, I know that it's quite safe. I can't, nothing happen. So it would be a question of how much money would someone have to pay me to go up?

Just zip wires for me. I'll zip wire anywhere. So I suppose if I did go on I'm a celebrity out of here, you might do because they pay you a lot of money. Yeah, and in fact, I might be able to negotiate quite a high fee. Is this you trying to get on to it? Is this what this is all about? I'd be so existentially scared of the idea going on.

It's like, oh, that's why I'm doing this because I want to be on I'm a celebrity. Okay, so let's take it back from all of this. So the fear and the fear that you carry, you're very open about mental health and mental illness and talking about the two side by side and suddenly you found happiness and you're happy. That's what my new show's about. So how did all...

Was that a help? Was it being stuck up the top of GoApe that helped you find all those things? It wasn't really. It would be nice you think it would be because when you have those... existential moments of fear. In fact, I was reading an analysis of why people go to theme parks and stuff.

It's because it completely takes them out of their life. Yes. Because you have, part of your brain has an existential crisis of what's going on. It can't comprehend what's happening. And so that's why people do it. It's an escape. But I'd like to say that's caused some huge change. So what was the moment that changed?

It was, I think really. the fact that I got in the end to, it's much less interesting, really, or it's much less sort of exciting. But I like that it's just a simple thing. I got between a rock and a hard place. I'd been on medication, and I'd promised a friend that if I ever got really low again, I would go straight back on the medication.

No questions asked, straight back on it, get back onto those pills, worry about the side effects and all the problems later, straight back on it, no questions, no discussion. And then I did go into that massive low, having come off this medication that was on for a few years, I did go into this low, and then I thought I need to go back on these pills. But I couldn't go on them because I was 300 miles away from my house, and I didn't have them with me. And then I sort of, I didn't want to, so I was sort of between a rock and a hard place. I didn't want to go back on them because they give side effects, but I didn't want to.

want to not be on them. I knew I had to be on them. And so I just got to a point of my life where there seemed to be no good options. I thought I'm going to have to be on these pills for the rest of my life. And I really didn't want to be on those for the rest of my life. But I really didn't not want to be on them either. I didn't want to have to go back to that pool, the old Paul, who wasn't on the pills, who was very unstable. And I thought, oh my God, I don't want that. I don't want to have another few decades of that. So there was no good option. And then I thought, I got in my car because I thought I've got to go home now. And when I get home, I'll have to put that pill in my mouth. And I got to my car and within a few

seconds of being in a car, then everything changed, everything dissolved away and all the, all my problems disappeared. Literally like that? Literally like that, yes. Do you know why or how? Did you just come to a place of calm? I don't know how, really. In my show, I talk about this, how I don't really know how. But I don't, and I know why in the sense that there's various things in my past that had caused various things. So there was a story behind it, which I'd tell in my show, of all the things that brought me to that point. But I don't know, really, I don't understand how that works.

And are you still feeling that? Yes. How wonderful. Yeah, so all I know. is that I don't need to be on those pills anymore, but I did need to be on them before. You know, I chemically needed to be on them. So something in my brain chemically changed in that moment.

So the stand-up that you did before that moment in the car and the stand-up that you do now since that moment in the car, has it changed dramatically? Or is it still you, Paul Foote, who everybody expects to see on stage? In some ways, it's... It's quite similar. And the audience say, oh yes, you still do your crazy flights of fantasy, Paul and all that stuff.

And I've got stuff in my show about King Tutankar Moon and all just surreal, ridiculous nonsense, which is what people love to watch. But on some levels it's different because I do talk about different things now. And there's a new dimension that's opened up. And also the audience say that I look happier on stage. I look different. There's a new dimension opened up. That's a line.

Wow. Yes, if only I thought of that several months ago, you know, when I was preparing the publicity, you know. But that's what an incredible thing to be able to say about life. Yes. There are so many people who search for that and want that. Yeah. And crave that.

So obviously this is what this podcast is about. It's about joy, isn't it? Yeah. Which is obviously here. But in my case, I literally did find it two years ago and one month ago. I literally discovered joy, which I'd never really felt in my life before. Well, I had in moments of it. But not really, not for many years, not properly.

I hadn't really experienced my life. I'd been sort of going through the motions of life, but not really feeling it. I was having a career and all sorts of things were happening. But I wasn't present. Present. And so, yes, I have discovered that now, that joy. Can we just pick up on something to do with, which I think is so fascinating about the difference between mental health and mental illness. And I think that we, luckily, we'll talk about it far more openly now and the huge variety of mental health problems, mental illness problems.

For you, this is part of your routine. I was going to say act. It's not part of your act. It's part of your routine. A skit. A skit. It's a skit. That is really fascinating because I suppose a lot of people don't ever consider the two to be separate things.

Yeah, and I talk about that in my show, how they're different. And I talk about someone, a friend of mine who mentioned all this once. And didn't really, people who haven't experienced real depression don't really understand it. And that's why I say, I'll just get some exercise or, oh, well, if you have a good breakfast, she'll be all right. They don't quite understand it. And one friend, she was telling me about a friend of her, so she said, oh, my friend was very depressed. And she just felt a bit trapped in her marriage.

And I was saying, well, was it like a loveless marriage? Oh, no, no, they loved each other, this wonderful. Just felt sometimes there was just a lot going on with those yoga classes, and there was Pilates classes, and there was too much going on. And the children were things happening, and she just needed space. And I thought, I thought, yeah, this is all very. very interesting, but this is not real depression. People use that word very easily.

Yes. But we all do. We all use it very easily. Oh, I'm so depressed today. And so certainly in my case, I wasn't even in a relationship. I couldn't be in a relationship. I was so depressed. I don't think anyone would have wanted to have gone out with me. So it was such a different, so a lot of people don't quite understand, you know, and they sometimes. Of course, one can never understand another person's pain. But sometimes you think, some people, they don't really have that much pain. They don't really get it. And the things they're talking about are relatively minor.

And I suppose that's the difference between mental health and mental illness, which is... So you have made people laugh for many, many, many years. So it was about giving other people the joy that you weren't necessarily feeling. And I'm not going to get too deep on all of that. But now you're feeling the joy as well. Do you hear people's laughter differently? I don't know whether I do in some ways performing on stage

is one of the things that hasn't changed that much because it's such a weird thing to do Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, let's be honest, it is such a weird thing to do that doesn't really matter whether you are fundamentally depressed in your life and you're going on and you're doing a show or whether you're fundamentally joyful in your life

and then you're going on, such a weird thing to do that at that particular moment I'm just a sort of technician really. That's interesting because, you know, The clown, the fear that people always have about a clown is that behind the makeup, there's that tremendous sadness. And that's interesting that you just say, it's a technician. That's very interesting. Yes, and I certainly, I don't think I was never that sort of, that clown going on with all the sadness in that sense.

Because even when I started, when I started after I left university, I remember thinking to myself, I'm very, very depressed. something's not right in my life. I'm very depressed. And I thought I'm going to do this job as a comedian because I love doing it. And I seem to be talented at it and I want to do it. But I remember even then thinking, this is not going to be a therapy.

If I need to deal with the depression, all those things, that's separate. This is my job. This is a separate thing. And I always felt it was like that. So it was never sort of going on and feeling like, oh, I've given joy to so many, but no, I'm crying.

Right, okay, it was never that. It was never quite like that. It was never, it was more just, I was just sort of depressed all the time really and went on and I'd enjoyed my job because that was one of... How wonderful, though. So you did have joy because you were enjoying doing what you did. Yes. Yeah. And in many ways, and some people would say, oh, well, comedians are often depressed, but then I'd think, well, if I wasn't a comedian, I'd be an accountant or something.

And I'm sure lots of accountants are depressed and they feel depressed all day and then they go in and have to do a lot of figures. But the difference is I was being. on stage. I don't know whether there really is a connection between comedy and depression. Certainly when the depression ended two years ago, I did think to myself. It was one of the first questions I thought to myself, am I going to be creative anymore? It is somehow, is there some link between being depressed and the creativity? And I soon discovered there wasn't. In fact, I was much more creative because I was happier. Oh, how wonderful. And certainly for me, the creativity always came at the

happy times, not the depressed times. I wasn't able to be productive in those times. So, so yes, when I go on stage now, the difference is I could just enjoy it. In the past, and I talk about this in the show, in the past, I would really beat myself up about things. Like I, the night before, all of this happened and my whole life changed, I did a show in Carlisle. And I did the show, if I did it on my own, I didn't have anyone with me that night. I just turned up and did the show. full two-hour show. I did the support as well. I did the whole thing. And it was a great night. And I think I made a very small mistake in the show that not even the audience would have noticed, very, quite small. But I was absolutely beating myself up about it. Why did I make that mistake?

And that bit would have been a bit better if I hadn't done that. And then I was just so depressed for that whole night, even though it was a wonderful night and everyone had a lovely time. I just focused on that small, tiny mistake. And then now, if I do a show, I'll still think, yes, maybe I could improve that or that or whatever, in the way you normally would. But I can just go and think that was a great night and had a nice time. And it's just normally. How wonderful, Paul. So you say two years and one month?

Yes, well, it was the 20th of March, 2022. So that's two years and just over one month, isn't it? Well, long may that make it carry on and carry on and carry on. If people want to see you on tour, where do they go to to get tickets? Well, I can go to my website, which is, you know, they can, I mean, nowadays, it's so simple, isn't it? They just look up Paul Foot. Remember the old days when I would have to say, you have to go to HTTP, go on, forward slash, four, slash. And all those strange noises when you did to try and get them up.

Yeah, all that stuff. Yeah. Yeah, so it's Paulfoot.tv is my website, and it's all on the internet. It's all pretty obvious, really. Well, long may you carry on doing it, Paul. What a pleasure. Thank you so much. And I'm so pleased that you're feeling happy about life.

Thanks, Kathy. Thank you.