That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Russell Tovey and Pippa Bennett-Warner

Episode Date: November 2, 2020

In this episode Gaby has two fantastic guests. First up she chats with actor Russell Tovey about everything from trusting your inner voice, getting hot and sweaty under the sheets on the set of ‘Him & Her’, his love of condiments and his hero Robin Williams. They discuss his successful podcast ‘Talk Art’, working on ‘Being Human’, the astounding ‘Years and Years’, and the phenomenon that was ‘The History Boys’. Plus, he unpacks his new mystery drama series ‘The Sister’ available to watch now on ITV Hub.  Stay tuned for actress Pippa Bennett-Warner who talks about the popular series ‘Gangs of London’, BBC drama ‘Sitting in Limbo’ about the Windrush immigration scandal, the female driven ‘Harlots’, working with Richard Gere in ‘MotherFatherSon’ and the amazing career advice she received from Bryan Cranston whilst working on the film ‘Wakefield’. Plus, they discuss the gripping drama ‘Roadkill’ with Hugh Laurie out now on BBC iPlayer.                Produced by Cameo Productions, music by Beth Macari.  Join the conversation on Instagram and Twitter @gabyroslin #thatgabyroslinpodcast Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

and welcome to that Gabby Roslyn podcast with me, Gabby Roslyn. In this episode, I chat to the gorgeous Russell Tovey. You'll hear what a fan girl I am, who I complete your door. We talk everything from trusting your inner voice, getting hot and sweaty under the sheets on the set of him and her, his love of condiments and his hero Robin Williams. We talk about his successful podcast talk art, working on being human,

and the multi-award winning years and years, and of course, the phenomenon that was the history boys, plus his new mystery drama series, The Sister, available to watch now on the ITV hub. I was also delighted to have a quick chat with the very sweet and talented Pippa Bennett Warner. We talked about Skies, Gangs of London, sitting in limbo, the BBC drama about the Windrush immigration scandal,

also the female-driven harlots, working with the swoony and gorgeous Richard Gere in Mother-Farther's son. And also, she got career advice from none other than Brian Cranston whilst working on the film Wakefield. Plus Pippa talks about Roadkill, one of the biggest dramas of 2020, which is out now on the BBC IPlayer. First up, the delicious Russell Tovey. I think it's really embarrassing how I fan girl I like for you.

I don't. I love it. Don't be embarrassed I was getting embarrassed when I said to my youngest this morning take her to school Who are you interviewing today Russell Tovey Should mum, why is it

Every time you say his name You go all giggly It's nice to my confidence Thank you very much Do you know what I was watching last night You in the catch-up commercial That one awards that advert I was like 12 or 13 then

Yeah Here's to the child And all he has to teach us How true is that right now Absolutely. No, I can remember filming that advert. It's a really weird thing that some jobs I can't remember at all, but that advert, even though we did it all in a day, is something I really have a lot of visual recollections of shooting. Really? Yeah, which is weird, isn't it? I remember the audition. I remember I had to pretend I was at a bus stop and just stand there, and there was loads and loads of boys my age, a bit younger, a bit older, at the audition. And I remember just having to pretend, I was at the bus stop, went. for a bus and there was no lines or anything.

You just had to, I think they just wanted you to be. And I remember time going, like, just don't do anything. And then I could remember filming it. And I can remember the guy I played my dad being really tired. And at the end of the day, the makeup team kept coming in, like, I could hear of him going, like, just put some more under his eyes. Can we just get some more makeup under his eyes, please? Because I think he was just like flagging.

And yeah, it's just really weird, isn't it? But then other jobs I've done, I can't remember at all. Does that really throw you when you're interviewed on, on TV shows? and they play something in and you think, did I do that? Yeah, or they bring up a job and you're like, what? What was the character's name? You have to like go through like the Philofax in the head of everything you've done. You said Filifax.

Yeah. You're not old enough to remember Fileifax. Yeah. Well, we just actually, we just interviewed Sir Paul Smith for Toolcar, which will be coming out later. And he is the reason that Filefax was such a success. Did you know that? No, tell me. So File of Fax was run by this little company under the arches somewhere in London.

And they were selling like 80 a year. And Paul Smith came in and went, I really love this product, souped it up a bit, made the cover a bit sexier, and then sold like thousands of thousands of units of Filifax. And it was all because Paul Smith swooped in and saw it as something that gentlemen would desire or people would desire. And then made it a massive phenomenon. And this little company like owe their life. Paul Smith. Oh, you see, I love stories like that. Yeah. How come some people just know that's what's going to work? You know that there are some people. It's like probably you with jobs, not probably, but absolutely you with jobs. You just know what's going to work? But those people

that, you know, there's entrepreneurs that say, ah, now you know what? If you do that with it, it's going to fly. They've just got this thing, haven't they? No. Well, I guess it's by the Dragon's. Den's a huge success. But all you can go on is your instincts, isn't it? And I mean, I think Paul Smith's probably got incredible instincts at this stage or at that stage. And I guess when it comes to work, you just got to, I've been doing it long enough that I sort of trust my instincts. And even if I, even with instincts are a bit, not 100% if I really believe in the character and I'm really excited to play that role, then I will go with it and trust them instincts. Have you ever had that gut feeling when you know you shouldn't, but you still did in life, not just characters? Oh, in life?

Well, yeah, I mean, yeah. But doesn't everyone go against the advice of everyone else? No, I think in life, absolutely. There's things where people have advised you not to do stuff and you do it and you either get burnt or it comes out great. But I think I've always been someone that's definitely listened to my inner voice and definitely trusted that as I've got older and not doubted it. And I think that's something that comes with age and experience.

And I wouldn't have been as confident with that when I was younger. But then there's, you know, then everybody always says, says, oh, well, if you made those mistakes, then do you regret them? And this is something I believe that you should never have regrets because it's made you what you are. Yeah. I think in time, I think in the moment when things happen, you wish you'd never done that. But as you get older, you recognise how they have made you who you are, absolutely. But at a time, when you do things that are really scary, you think, like, I used to smoke a lot of weed when I was younger.

and I got really like screwed up on it. And for years I regretted doing it because it made me anxious. It really affected me. And I wish I hadn't, I wish I hadn't. But as I got older, I realized the effects of that really matured me and made me more self-aware of my own emotions and what I was capable of and what my limits were and made me recognising myself how far I could push myself.

But creatively, it also opened up a range of characters and emotions, which I wasn't aware of before, which now I have control over. But at the time, yes, I wish I could, in that moment, it was the biggest mistake of my life doing it because it scared me so much. But in retrospect, absolutely it has made me who I am today. But you wanted, you knew what you wanted to be from tiny, because you started acting when you were 10. Was it the 10 you were in the bill? Yeah, I was playing a train. I threw a football at police officers. I didn't kick it because I can't play football.

So it's my life, but I threw it and said, get off our sight. And I was, yeah, I was going drama clubs. From age 10 all over Essex, my mum were just sort of driving all over the place, which was amazing to my mum to be one in their mum to say, what do you want to do? I'll take you. And I was... That's so lovely. Yeah, amazing.

And I sort of came alive there. That's where I worked at who I was. But when your dad was saying, come on, you've got to join the, coach firm. Was there everything in you that just thought, no, I'm going to break free? Or was there a part of you that thought I need to do this for my dad? No. I think my instincts at the time were telling me firing all cylinders, no.

And I think at one point they sort of approached me saying like, do you want to do your coach licence just in case? And I was like, no, because I know you'll do it. I have this ability to drive a coach and I'll be getting called at like 4 a.m. because something's broken down in the M-25. and you need to do it for the family, so you need to get out. We're like, no, I've got a play reading tomorrow.

So it's, no, I knew. And my brothers went into it and was amazing. And no, I sort of went off and did my own thing. And thankfully, I was allowed to do that with no bad feelings. I'm so pleased you did as well. But you've got to write that because when I read about all of that, because obviously now you're a podcaster with talk art and you've got your book out and you've done your writing films.

You want to direct all of those things. That is a story. That is just the perfect ITV wonderful drama that we'd all watch that's uplifting. Really? What, like what, how there? How does it? What's the narrative of it? Okay.

So, well, it's your life. Is there's a family in Horn. Were you from Hornchurch? Well, from Romford, but I went to drama up in Hornchurch. All right. Okay. So you're from Romford. You're the coach firm.

So it's all the people that go on the coach. it's your dad it's your mom your mom suddenly now not working at the coach business because she's too busy with her 10 year old son taking him to be in the bill which was one of the biggest shows on the telly it's there and then he ends up in san francisco yeah i don't know why i'm putting you but you have been in san francisco yeah yeah i was there doing a tv show yeah for hbo oh i like it you see i think it's nice yeah it's not it's been very nice but i don't know if it's an i tv i don't know where the hook is just like it's a lovely journey watch something Well, maybe, I know. I've got it. I've got it because, of course, you were voted the best were wolf in the world because of George and being human, that in fact, you were always a werewolf. That's a good twist, you know, that's kind of like six cents. Who liked ketchup? Who put ketchup on everything? Yes. And every week would watch Dead Poet Society. Every week would, yeah, exactly. That's a good hook as well.

See, I know you well. Yeah, you do know me very well. Do you know what? When you go through all of the things that you've, done. You are something very unique. I don't think there are many actors like you in the world and that's why you continue working and I think it's because you have not only you were great actor but you have this wonderful positivity and philosophy about the job but you've got there's a deeper thing with you and I can't put my finger on it. Can you? All I know is that when I'm acting and connecting I'm very instinctive. I'm not I don't I wouldn't say I'm technical at all I can do technical things like props and everything,

but when it comes to the acting, I'm very instinctive. And I think I hold on to a lot of emotion in my real life and then use that for the characters I play. And I think I've always been determined that the characters I play have emotional depth. And I know what I'm trying to do is the feeling that I had, you just mentioned Dead Poit Society, the feeling that I had watching Robin Williams,

I remember watching that and thinking, I want to make other people feel the way that I feel watching him by watching me. And I remember that as a kid feeling like that was my drive. I was like, I want the ability to do that. I want to be able to dance around emotionally with these characters. I just remember being so inspired by how he made me feel that I wanted to be able to do that. Did you ever meet him? No.

I was at, when we were doing Being Human, when it went out in BBC America, we were over in Los Angeles at some convention thing where you have to promote the show. And he was on the same lineup. But we had to leave and do this next thing. And he hadn't arrived yet. And I was literally waiting at reception. The car was in there and Russell would get in the car. And I just need to see if he turns up.

And we missed him. And then when I was filming in San Francisco and looking, he lived obviously over the water in San Francisco. And then I went past like the Mrs. Dalfire house. And I was like in the world thinking, of course I'm going to bump into him. And then I went up for a pilot that he did for NBC. which is the last TV show he did to play his kind of right-hand man. And it was, the show was fine.

And again, if he wasn't any, it would have been a show that I wouldn't have been that instinctively excited about it because it was him. I was like, this feels like destiny. I didn't get that. So I felt like there was these barriers or tiny opportunities and it never happened. And then obviously he passed away. And that was like I sobbed. I absolutely sobbed.

And just for him. for the pain that he was going through and I guess also for myself as a kid just feeling like because that's like your absolute hero and understanding that feeling when people's heroes pass

the way like my brother loves David Bowie I love David Bowie I'm not like a Bowie Bowie Bowie head but people that are I get that feeling because that's how I felt about him the fact that I didn't ever know him but what he did touched so many people is amazing and only art

culture can do that. What a gift. How did your brother feel then when David Bowie gave you a standing ovation in the history boys? Did you tell your brother? Yeah, of course. I'm probably a bit pissed on in Thomas. No, it was just, yeah, that was mad because he was wearing a white suit and he's with a man and he led the standing ovation. I remember us looking at and I was like, there's David Bowie in a white suit standing up for us in our little play at the National Theatre with a man next to him. It was just like, it was, we, that show, I don't think even now is like, I don't think we understand what a zeitgeist that captured, how that show kind of defined culture of that time because it's still relevant today. And I watched it at the start of lockdown. I hadn't seen

it since the premiere because my boyfriend was like, I want to see the Hitch boys. And I was like, oh, okay, I cried all the way through for nostalgia reasons, but because I really understood it now in these 14 years that have passed, I understand the emotional journey that them characters are really going on, especially the adult teachers, which at the time when I was in the show, were not really, I hadn't lived enough life to fully appreciate their story. And it's only now that I'm like, wow. And I know that in 10 years I watch it again and be like, oh my God, now that makes sense. And that's the magic of that film. And it is actually a really good film and I just was so it was such a wave that we were riding and went to

the premiere and Charles was there and Camilla and it was such a moment and then it just stopped for months when I got back and I think I've just sort of not gone near it against it so it's really amazing to do that again yeah I've read that you said it was like being in a boy band because I remember seeing it on stage at the national I saw it twice I thought it was phenomenal I've always bore you with that because every time I chat to you I go on about the history boys but it was a phenomenon and there's not many things you can say

that create that buzz around the world but not theatrically no I mean you say you were like a boy band because you got in a you arrived in America on Broadway and it must have just been extraordinary yeah it was insane but we were also

kind of spoiled because the show everywhere we went at this fan base had these people queering around a block for returns had everyone at stage door it was because I think because it was like us boys and whatever your taste whatever you was into it follow you were the spice girls or your one direction whoever you kind of had an affinity for in life we we could have tics them boxes and the show just like I guess gained momentum it's like this hysteria around it and that that was amazing but yeah we were spoiled we just assumed that that would

be everything we did for the rest of our lives. And I remember the older actors, France Del Tor and the late Richard Griffiths and Clyde Merrisson saying, it's not going to be like this. Every job isn't like this. And us all going like, yeah, yeah, maybe not for you, but this is us now. And it isn't, you know, I've been incredibly fortunate in my career, but moments like that that really become kind of part of cultural history and become part of like the syllabus. And then you see all these posters constantly of everyone playing.

these characters, but that's sitting up the cover, the poster, that we did the photo shoot as their like front cover of their play bit, of their like poster advertising it. It's always so crazy. And people like, direct mess with the time, like, I'm playing Raj in my school play or I'm playing Raj in my dinner piece from my degree show and you're like, wow, that's how much it permeated culture. And that's an amazing thing. What I always find interesting is that any of the guys that were in it, you're always all

asked about it, but you very much seem to embrace that you're very happy to talk about it and was an extraordinary time it was. Like you said, it all suddenly ended. That must have been a very abrupt end. Yeah, because the journey had been like two and a half years. Then the film came out and the film didn't have the effect that the play had. And it sort of came out and then sort of petered out. And then I thought, then there was no work.

I remember there was like, I had about five or six months of nothing. And I think we'd all been spoiled and told, you know, we're going to come back and this is going to be, you're all going to be Billy Elliott. This is going to be like everyone's going to get their opportunity. And it just didn't happen for me at that stage straight away. And it was really hard. And you are swept up in it.

So yeah. And what you're saying about the boy band, girl band thing is that everyone will always ask anybody's been in the boy band. Do you see the others? Do you see this person? You see that person? And it's just this. And that's what the history boys is. Everyone, we were like a little band.

It's right. I get that. Everybody asks me about Chris Evans. Always. I mean, no matter. Of course. Everywhere I go. Do you speak to him still?

I do. Absolutely. And I love the man. And it's very funny because that's the first thing that people. I sort of see this look in their eyes. You probably get that as well. You see some, they're looking in their eyes. You think, are they going to history boys?

And I go, are they going to Chris Evans? Here we go. Is it not a generational thing for you? Is it not like a big breakfast? Like I grew up watching Big Breakfast. Yeah, but most people, the journalists want to know if we ever slept together. We never did. Do they still ask that now?

Yeah, they do. In fact, people stop me in the street every so often to say. And I've said, I laugh about it. You shacked it. Oh, my God. They go, did you and Chris? Go, no, we didn't. Still to the stone.

Still. Still. It's mad. That is mad. It's madness. And like someone on the street, you're going to be like, well, don't tell you one, but yes. But nobody knows. It's like, yeah.

and they've called you at the right time. You be the person. Yeah, I just thought, I need to tell you, exactly. Outside Greg's, I need to tell you, because I've been wanting to tell everyone. Can we just talk about Paul Newman? Because did you really meet Paul Newman? Yeah, we met so many people. Again, that was the thing about New York, is that you have superstars come backstage.

And they all come backstage because the thing in New York and Broadway is that if a celebrity's in, they will come back stage. It's just a given to say hello. And everyone's, everyone's welcoming. Whereas in London, if a celebrity is watched a show and they come backstage, everyone's like, ooh, who do you think you are? You think we want to, you think we, you think we want to, if you're not, if you're not Meryl Street, why are you coming back? I don't care.

I don't care. And if they are there, you're like, oh, what are you arrogant? That's obnoxious. Why do you think we want to meet you? That's so British. But in New York, it's so British, but in New York, we're like, wow, you absolutely. Oh my God, I can't believe it. We had Julia Roberts, Tom Hanks, Paul Newman, then Harrison Ford and Colester Flock were there one night.

And we all run down, and it was like, oh my God. God and they were like, hey, hey, hey. And the thing is they hadn't intended to come back. Their security guards had put them in stage door because they waited for their car. But then we all came downstairs at the same time. And we were like, thanks are coming back. And they were like, sure, absolutely. Well done.

But they had no intention. And did Paul Newman really turn up everywhere with one of his sources? Because wasn't that the urban myth? Yeah, he bought a bottle of salad cream out of his inside. No, he didn't. No, he did. He gave every one of them. He always carries like, you knew there's eight boys,

so he had like eight different condiments in every pocket, and they would just pull him out and gifted this. Oh, I love a condiment. Then we're going back to your bloody ketchup. We always do, Gabby. Okay, your favourite condiment, you can't say ketchup. Tata sauce. As long as it's like a fish finger sandwich, loads of butter,

tartar sauce. Thank you. Do you ever put your peas in your tartar sauce? No, but that's a really good idea. What an idiot. What an idiot I've been all these years. Do it. Also, there's a lot of,

The lovely thing that I read about when you were doing him and her, which I can't believe I didn't know this and when I've spoken to you about him and her before, it just got very sweaty and everybody saw everybody's bits because you just got, because you were in bed all the time. Yeah, all day long sweating on them sheets, eating like chicken and meat and bread and sweets and they all just get caught up in the duvet and sheeting and it's a hot set so we're all sweaty. Yeah, it was gross. It was gross. I'm surprised we didn't all get scabies. But you enjoyed that show, didn't you? Loved. My God, I loved it.

Every day was funny, funny, funny, funny. And everybody was funny. And between, I wish they had like behind the scenes, filming because between every take, everybody in that show was a storyteller. Everybody loved to get up and tell stories. And we would hear the same stories again and again and again. And we'd be like,

do that story again. do that story again. And you'd know the punchline. You'd know what the story was, but you just loved the journey of these stories that would happen again and again and everyone would how. It was a really amazing job and so well written and so well directed that it just felt really, really easy and fun and beautiful.

Oh, isn't that lovely? You see, you were talking about laughter. And we always ask everybody what makes them laugh. But I think laughed and you love a giggle. Oh, gotcha. What makes you properly how laughing? God, my mates, I guess taking a piss out my mates. I love it.

I love being inappropriate. I love being like... You love being inappropriate. That's just the best answer. Yeah, but also in America. Because there's a lot of, you know, our British wit is very sarcasm, sarcasm based or irony-based, or satirical. And over in America, then things go over people's heads. So you can say things that takes them, you can see them computing it going like, what did he just say that?

Do you mean that? Oh, that's sarcasm, isn't it? And you're like, yeah. And then that just tickles me. It's just testing, you know, it's such a unique quality we have. I think we don't even really appreciate it as kind of like a country that we have an understanding and a capability of sarcasm and wit. And it's quite an intellectual quality to have to, you know, to language to subvert it like that. But we do that effortlessly.

And you only really recognize how good we are at it when you go to other countries. And they just don't get it. I love that. Do you know what else you've got? I think I've said this before, but you have the twinkle. You have that twinkle in your eyes. You just, I remember seeing you on a roof at a party. And you had your lovely dog.

Rocky. Yeah, Rocky. I remember saying to you, you're naughty. And there is, there's that naughty bit. in the corner of your eye. And I love people that have that naughty twinkle. I love that. I think cheekiness as a quality is really beautiful in other people.

I've really appreciated that. I think people, some people get frustrated working with me because I can twinker without doing anything and they're like, you made me laugh. I'm like, I've done anything. And I haven't done anything. But yeah, there's nothing better than making someone else corpse, making someone else laugh. and there's nothing better than someone having a shit day and you've been able to make them laugh.

If someone can give you that gift, that is magic. That is better than anything you can give them. And right now that's what everybody needs. I know. So let's talk about your podcast then because it's a huge success. Talk Art and now there's a book. Yeah, the book comes out May next year, which is basically a guide, Talk Art's Guide to the Art World.

We started it 2018, August 2018. just to be geeks because I'm a massive art geek and by the best mates as well and we just wanted to geek out with our light heroes and it grew and then got more attention than it's just grown and grown and grown and we've had over a million and a half downloads now which for a niche show about art is really unheard of we're told so that feels exciting to bring art to the masses because it's normally seen as very high-brow and academic and elitist and inaccessible and all we've challenged and champion is making it accessible artists for everyone, be a geek, be enthusiastic, enjoy it and have fun because I love it so much and it makes me so happy and if I have a shit

day I can go and see some art and it invigorates me and it literally does and that's all we've ever tried to do so the fact that it's getting heard by so many people is really brilliant. Isn't art everywhere and people just don't realize that they appreciate vision and what they're looking at? Yeah, well, you look at public art. That's for the public. It is what it says in the tin. And the fact that there is so much public art is because as humanity, we need to be surrounded by culture and we surround by these things because it makes it aspirational. It makes it more enjoyable. It makes you want to be around these things. There are so many statues that you wouldn't even recognize that are peripheral, but they're placed there, purpose.

to enhance our lives, to make the day better, to experience other people's stories and other people's gestures to humanity. And you may not even be aware of it, but you are experiencing art everywhere you go. And especially what you were saying about the top of the building, about design and architecture, it's all been created by humanity. It's all been created by ideas and striving to better and, and to show off the best of what it is to be human. And I think people who say, I don't get it,

I don't understand it, I don't feel like I see enough. It's like, you are seeing it every day. Design in itself is art. And what upsets me is when schools say, well, art isn't important. I know, I find it. Oh, it really is. And what a child, when the child gets a pen and just does a doodle or a scribble or a piece of art,

whatever they want to call it, can say, I've just been scribbling, I've just been doodling, I've just been making this, and somebody says, oh, that's good, but why did you give him an extra big head? Why not? You know, I love that kids have got that magic at their fingertips. The way that children draw this, there's art movement, which people aren't aware of that much, which is outsider artists. They call it art brute, which is self-taught artists or disabled artists or nonverbal artists or people that are making art outside of the commercial art world, outside of any incentive for anybody to see their work, they're just making it for themselves.

And there's been so many sides of the art world that we've been connecting with and understanding and exploring through talk art. And this whole place where people are making art for art's sake, some of the work you see is just magnetic and they have this childish quality because they're not making it for critique. They're not making it to be consumed. They're not making it for the mass media or the mass. that's market, they make it for themselves.

And when someone's making art for themselves, their message is so much clearer and so much more inspiring than if they were being judged. So when it comes to artists, it has to be, when the government are like pulling away, funding for the arts and everything,

it's just offensive. Because all art is is storytelling and all we are as humans, are storytellers and the way we connect in humanity and make the world better is through culture. And if you take that away, then you're completely stripping the world of an ability to communicate in a way that is subliminal, in a way that is like subconscious, because that's how humans do it. And that's why I have a big, big, big issue with the arts just being seen as superfluous. because what remains when we are all dead and gone is the art.

Every civilization that has passed, cavemen, what's left behind? The drawings, the Egyptians, what's left behind, the artifacts, the ephemera they made, the pharaohs. What's left behind is these things that have been created to tell stories. So it isn't superfluous. It is a lifeline. It is what we are fundamentally about. It's amazing to hear you talking about it because I believe that so strongly and I just think, you know, the kids say so much without saying it through art and it's so important. I'm just weirdly, that just made me think of years and years because if you think of a lot of art these days, it's all on computer or it's, I mean, years and years as you know, I was blown away by it.

It was one of the most extraordinary bits of television. Me too. I was totally blown by. Russell T. Davis. Actually, I interviewed him for this a little while back a couple of weeks. go and I was going on about it then. I mean, it's just, it's what it is. It's what we're living in now. Yeah, I know. He's a witch because that came out and everyone was like,

as if, as if, I mean, it's scary if that would happen. Can you imagine? It's like, oh no, we're in it. Yeah. And it's kind of getting worse than that, and it's all coming true and worse than. So, yeah, it's terrifying. That show was incredible to be a part of

and to play Daniel Lyons. to be able to inhabit him and tell his story. And for that story to affect so many people in such a visceral way. And it deserved every award that it got. See, for me, television, I'm passionate. As you are about art, I'm as passionate about television. I think television is extraordinary. And people keep saying, oh, it's not the glory days.

Yes, every day is a glory day of television. It might just not be the thing that you're finding at that moment that captures you. But can we now talk about the sister, which is available now on the ITV hub? Everyone is talking about it. So for anyone who hasn't watched it yet, can you explain what it's about?

It's a thriller, but fundamentally, it's a love story about this guy who made mistakes in his youth and how 10 years later, he's been trying to keep Pandora in the box and Pandora is desperately clawing her way out of that box and he's scrambling to push her back in. and it's written by Neil Cross who wrote Luther.

Brilliant. So it has that energy. Yeah, amazing writer. Amazing writer. And just it's, I don't think people would have seen me act like that. Oh, really? I really, yeah, I push myself. I've tried to push myself somewhere else with playing Nathan in The Sister.

I don't think there's a lot of twinkle, as you're saying, in that role at all. I think he's a man that's filled with trauma and trying to stay buoyant when all. he wants to do is die and he can't, he can't, he's, he's made this life for himself where he's fallen in love with this woman and he has to make it, she is fundamental to his lifeline, her happiness and the love they have for each other is what drives him and what comes back from the past threatens all of that. That twinkle, obviously that's you as a real person. You as an actor, you know, to be able to, I also heard you saying when I went down a Russell Tovey rabbit hole, which was completely joyous yesterday. You said the best thing about acting is pretending to be other people.

Yeah. I mean, and I always assume that everybody wants to do that. They obviously don't. Pretending to be other people is just, I think you cherry pick from your own emotional journey and then you take those elements and you put them into these characters you play and you want these characters to speak to people. and you want people to connect with them and you want people to hang out with them or learn from them or be entertained by them. And there's something fundamental to acting

is that you just want to tell as many stories as possible. I've got my stories as Russell Tobey, but then I'm like, if I can tell all these other stories through being me, what a gift to be able to do that. It is, it's a gift and you've certainly got that. Okay, let's go back to your child for do-d-do-do-do-do-d-d-d-d-d. I've read that you were an avidavis.

collector of stuff. Yeah. What stuff did you collect? Oh, God. I mean, from a young young age, I got given a metal detector, so I used to dig bits more metal up. I remember I had a bit of old fence, and I took it into school, and I said it was a Saxon sword.

And I think the teacher said, I think it might just be a bit of Victorian fencing. Still old, but it's not. I wouldn't say it's a Saxon sword. And I think I would build these imaginative narratives to all these bits of old shit that I dug up. And I then collected rocks and minerals and fossils for my eighth birthday. My parents said, what do you want to do?

And I said, I want to go to the annual Rock and Mineral Society Convention, which was in a school hall in Collieroe in Rhoneford. And I sat there with my parents, at eight years old, looking at A-gates and geodes and fossils. And with all these old white men who are probably 60-plus who had been digging them up for years, fascinated. And they must have looked at me and thought, what they had. hell of we created. I collected phone cards, I collected coins, I collected key rings. I then went on and I collected Star Wars figures and old toys from like 60s 70s, things like Buck Rogers. And then when I discovered art, everything else went out of the window and that became the thing that has been a

lifelong pursuit. But what's happened to all of those things you collected have you still got them? I still got all my Star Wars toys. I've got all the original figures, and they're in a box, and I don't know what to do with them. At one point, I was going to put them all in, like, a big plexy frame in a bathroom so you could see them all, but I don't know. I'm going to do that now. I don't know what's doing.

I've probably given to my nephews, and then they might just stick it on eBay. But there's other things I've given away. There's other things I've, like, sold. It's like, you know, and over the years, they just sort of get passed on, like, one minute you love, like books and books of phone cards from all over the world. Do you remember the phone cards used to have, like, images on. So you'd have like the Mercury ones with Harry Enfield on and then you got one small. So all around the world did that. So I had all these phone cards from all around the world.

Every time I went holiday, I'd buy the phone cards or the pictures. And then one day I was just like, I don't want phone cards. I just had all these phone cards. I was just on, what do you do? I don't know where they are now. My parents are lot. Oh, you've got to make that into a piece of art, though. I can give it to someone's makeup. That's the thing about my collecting of art is that I have no ambition to make art. So lastly, we have to talk about the Muppet movie. Because I love the Muppets.

Me too. You actually met the Muppets in real life. Yeah, Foszie Bear and Kermit I met. And I was there and it was a bit of a shambolic day. Why? Muppets most wanted. It was just like running behind. And I hung out with Ricky Javees.

He was lovely. And it was, I had to come in with this, I'm a delivery guy. And I had this champagne. chest freezer that I bring in with another, uh, with a guy who was like a, a supporting artist and we have to, we have to bring this chest freezer in.

Then I say something, a, a champagne for a Mr. The Frog. And then leave. Pull a face. Leave. And we did this probably 50 times.

No. And this was a, a chest freezer without the innards taken out with champagne in, that we were going back and forth. And I remember thinking like, surely they could have, they could have like appropriated this for this filming sequence, but no, they'd literally low-loaded a champagne chest freezer that we were walking back and forth. And then I was meant to do this whole dance sequence and now.

I had to learn this dance and this song that goes on the end of the movie where everyone kind of was on this wall. We didn't have time for that. So that got scrapped. So in the end, I just, and I think my line got scrapped. I think in the end I just walk in. I put the champagne freezer down and I sort of do a look and then walk out. And looking back, It was a missed opportunity for the Muppets, I think, but also just like, what the hell was that?

I don't know what this is. I love that we end with you carrying a chess freezer on the Muppet movie with all the amazing things. Oh, my goodness. Russell Tovey, you are a complete and utter twinkling joy. Bless you for doing this. Thank you, Gav. You too. I love your positivity. You're also very good news.

I think you're wonderful. Thank you very much for having me on. Oh, bless you. you. Pippa, it is such a joy to talk to you because, you know, when you came into my radio show last time, I kept going on about what a thrill it was. And then I have not stopped seeing you everywhere since you were on. And honestly, you said, well, it's going to get really busy. You're not wrong. Yeah, I know. It's been a bit mental, actually, since lockdown. I have to

say. Last time we spoke, it was about I kept getting the name wrong and I was so embarrassed. Mother, father, son. So we're going to talk about that as well. And then Gangs of London, let's start with that because that was an extraordinary show. And everyone was talking about it. It was one of those shows. And you've done it again and again because Harlitz was one of those.

But gangs of, that was an extraordinary program. I know. It's super cool, isn't it? It's kind of just got everything. Everything's there and everybody's there. And when I say everybody, I mean, it's so representative and it's so inclusive. And I was saying to somebody the other day, I was like, you know, it so represents London, the London that we all know and that we all live in.

And at least everybody gets to be a gangster in Gangs of London. Do you know what I mean? Everybody gets to be bad. It's not just, you know, it's not stereotypical. It's fair. I think, honestly, that's one of the main things I love about the show is that it's so inclusive. I remember sitting at the read through and just being like, this is awesome.

This is what London looks like. All these amazing actors and, you know, from different nationalities and different ethnicities and everything. It was just great. But that actually, that was what was so powerful about it. It did feel like London, but there was, the violence was extreme. I know. And that, and I'm not a whim, but I was watching it.

And I felt myself like, oof, oof. Yeah, yeah. But it's kind of addictive watching because even though you're kind of, maybe, you know, you have your hand slightly covering your eye. Your eye definitely still open. You're still wanting to engage, but it's so violent, but in the best way, I think, if that makes any kind of sense. I love the way that you say you were sitting there in the read-through and you just thought, yes. So what happens if you go to a read-through and you think, no? Oh my God, I've been to plenty of those. Well, read-throughs are really scary,

actually. Really? Why? Oh my God, they are so scary. So they get loads of tables, trestle tables, and they put them in a big circle with a big, you know, that's a very scary. You know, like a donut with a hole in the middle and you can see across the table and to the side and everything and you have your name place in front of you and the scripts and everything and then you know the producers are there the execs are there the channel are there costumes there everybody all the actors and you have to read the scripts and when it gets to your part every time it gets to my part my heart starts racing really because you because you know i never know quite how much to give do you give the full performance do you give a taste of what it might be like so i always end up doing a halfway house of

kind of giving what I might end up giving, but not giving too much because I don't want to be the only one in the room doing like a full, full on performance. And it's just really nerve-wracking every time. Is there anybody in the room that's ever done the, oh, majesty,

woo! And throwing themselves on the floor and done that whole thing. I'm not sure people have got up, but there have definitely been some big performances. And I'm always, I'm always applauding those people because I'm like, yes, maybe I should have done that and then it comes to me and I get too scared. Oh, I love that.

I love that you get too scared, because you're such a fantastic. actress. But it is that fear, isn't it, as well, of performing? Oh, my God, isn't it so exposing? And also at the read-through, I never quite know exactly what I want to do. I mean, I have an idea of what I want to do, but I haven't rounded out the full character by that point. So it does feel like you're exposing your initial thoughts on the character, which can feel embarrassing, you know? No, I think that's lovely. I love that that's how you feel. I know that's, I'm not saying I love that you're embarrassed, shows how real it all is and you know those people who don't really know the process of

acting yeah and unfortunately as we've all heard in the past couple of weeks it's not a real job go and get yourself a better job whatever i know i know oh i know but but that you are you know you know you still have those fears and no matter how many things you do that fear is still there completely and every single you could be doing a you know a tiny job or a big job it doesn't matter it's still the fear is still there and i but i think that's i think it's healthy i think it's i've had to and kind of just accept that that's what I'm always going to be like and not panic that every time I go into a read through that, you know, just knowing that actually when it comes down to it,

I can get the words out. And brilliantly as well. And thank goodness for television, funnily enough. I mean, it's just been a godsend. Hasn't it? For all of us. People in the industry, out of the industry, we've been able to escape.

And Harlots, of course, they've played that again. Was that lovely that all being on again? Yes. No, it was really lovely. to know that more people were going to get the chance to see it because it was such a brilliant show but for so many years it was so hidden away. The first year it was on ITV encore and Hulu

and then the two latest seasons they were both just on in America and Hulu so nobody could see it here. So the fact that when we found out the BBC had got the series was just like, ooh, this is really exciting. People are going to get to see what we've been doing for three years. Oh, it's brilliant. It was wonderful.

And it was all my TV reviewers on my radio, show, we're talking about it again and just saying it's just one of those things you've got to watch because it's, it was wonderful. Yeah, it's super cool. And, you know, women, directed by women, written by women, predominantly female cast, produced by women, just all the good stuff. Oh, it was wonderful. But also, let's talk about extraordinary. I mean, I've read a lot of you talking about sitting in limbo. The whole, I suppose for you, for you, You as a black performer, you know, people were obviously asking you about what's been happening over the past few months. And it will be very wrong not to.

And I think it's a conversation that everybody has to have. And I personally need to learn more. You know, of course I do. I think we all do. I think everybody does. Yeah. But how have you felt the past few months? Have you felt a shift?

I mean, I have to say when all of that, when all of the BLM stuff started, it was a really rough ride. I mean, it just, it was very triggering. I know that word is used and sometimes maybe overused, but it was really triggering and brought up so many emotions. I had so many deep, reach conversations with my parents and my sister. And we just, yeah, and we just kind of went all the way back into our history and, because, you know, my parents are west. Indian, so that's complicated in terms of looking, you know, trying to look all the way back. And then, you know, in terms of, I mean, sitting in limbo was actually supposed to come out in, I want to say, March, and then it got delayed for some reason.

And I'm quite, you know, I'm not kind of airy, fairy spiritual, but I do believe that things happen for a reason. And it got delayed, you know, right to the middle, the kind of hot, the sweet spot of all the BLM stuff. And I just don't think there could have been about. better time for it because it just it became part of the conversation and so many people didn't know that that was happening that had happened. I didn't, you know, I wasn't really aware of what had happened until I started doing, you know, serious research once I'd read the script and just

really started to kind of, you know, find the lay of the land. It's been a really interesting, tricky, upsetting, but positive, hopefully very positive time and, you know, I think again, I'm just really proud. I'm really proud of sitting in a living in a really proud that it started so many conversations, actually. It's very interesting that you say out of the upset and the pain, positivity comes. And I hope that's the case.

I really do. Me too. Me too, Gabby. Because I also feel like at this point, it has to be a lifelong commitment to change. It can't be something that, you know, is hot one week on Instagram or, you know, about a month ago I did one of those little short films

for ITV and they did a whole, they did five across the week about Black Lives Matter. And as a channel, ITV are not known for being massively inclusive. It's, you know, they're just not. But they've made such, and they're continuing to make an effort to be inclusive and show that, you know, black lives matter. And so for me, that's a step in the right direction. It's so important, though. I mean, the people that I've, I've chatted to about all of this,

this, they say it's so important to see somebody like you on the screen. Yeah, it's so important. Representation is so important. And that, you know, it's kind of circling then back to Gangs of London. That's why that show is so good because everybody's there. Everybody's having a chance to, you know, everyone's having a go, which I like. It's just, I think it's important. And also it's 20-20.

It's like, ah, come on. I just think we've all got to be far more accent. accepting and kind. Kindness is the key. It's what I say all the time. Kind. Absolutely. And accepting that we're all different. And there's nothing wrong with that.

Oh, it's a joy. Absolutely. We're lucky. But let's go back to father, mother, brother, sister, daughter, some. Uncle, yeah. That show was extraordinary. I mean, Richard Gere. Brian Cranston, of course, you've worked with.

Yeah. I mean, but Richard Gere, it's Richard Gere. I know. Richard Gitt. I know. I had to be so cool the first time I met him. Oh, you see, I couldn't be. I would have just, I think I would have dribbled and cried. I would have asked him to wear that outfit from an officer and a gentleman. You'll see you're too young to have probably seen that film. No, I've seen it. I've seen it.

That moment where he wears the white, oh no, and he lifts her up. I know, such a honey. I know, I know. Well, I grew up in a household with my mum, who, remember you spoke to on the first time I was going to. Yes, yes, we spoke to your mummy. Yeah. And she is obsessed with him. Like, you know, I've grown up with her being obsessed with Richard Gere. So when I got the job, she lost it. And then she came down because I turned 30 on that job.

And I was filming on my birthday. My parents came to set. And I introduced my mum to Richard Gere. And I have to say, she played an absolute blinder. She was so cool. Really? Really? Yeah.

And I was expecting her to go, kind of be like, and she was absolutely fine. And she was like, hello? Just completely fronted it. And then he was like, you know, because he's so smooth and so charming and lovely. And he like gave the dogs some water and all this kind of. You know, so my mum was just kind of, and my dad called him, sir. It was like a whole thing. It was, they were very sweet.

He was very sweet with them. Please tell me you have a WhatsApp group chat with him. I don't. Oh. I don't. I know. It's such a shame. Did you just call him Richard or did you just go, morning.

I would have done that. I would have sung the song. I would have on. Love. lifts us up and then he would have lifted me up and he would have oh no don't tell him any of this this is really if you're listening mr gear you're more than welcome on the podcast and I won't get your name wrong and I won't go that's probably not I don't think he'll do it now he'll be terrified but Brian

Cranston as well and he's what a guy he is divine he's so I grew up watching Malcolm in the middle and always thought he was the funniest ever and then you meet him and he's charming, so good at his job, generous, kind, funny as hell. He's just, he's, you know, Brian, Brian Cranston is a legend. He's, he's, I adore him. Oh, that's lovely to hear. He's one of those people, because I just think he's a really interesting person and he's really funny. And every time I've heard him interviewed, I've always thought, oh, there's somebody I'd like to spend an evening with. Yes, that, well, that's it. And everything that you see in an interview is, is him in real life. And he's so down to earth and

normal and just, you know, and just, you know, working. And I remember I was talking to him about something, about jobs or something when I was doing that film with the film. And he was like, you know, Pippa, every time you get the chance to act, just say yes. And I was like. Oh, really? Yeah. And that's kind of how I do.

I mean, I'm very kind of, I mean, I'm quite picky about what I do. But, you know, once I, once the job is there, I just, you know, my head is down and I do the job. And I go, do the job. And then I go home and live my life. And that, I think, I mean, I don't want to speak for Brian, but that's how I feel he is too. He's like, he's kind of boots on ground, which is lovely. Oh, that's great.

Oh, I'm so pleased to hear that. Right, now let's talk. Oh, no, before we talk about Roadkill, we have to, because we did it before, we have to go back to, Ah, Zavena! Bar-Bi, Baba-hee, blah. Oh, Lion King, you were 11.

11. Yeah, 11, I know. West End show at 11. I know. Sometimes I think about it and I go, bloody hell. That's actually quite a big deal. And of course, when you're younger,

you're so protected by your innocence, that you kind of, you know that it's a big deal, but you're so young and, you know, actually weirdly, back then a stage is a stage. And I was so devoted to singing and dancing and acting, that getting to, you know,

getting to do it on, you know, a town hall stage or doing it in the Lyceum theatre, a stage was a stage. So I was getting to do what I wanted to do. You're just protected by the fact that it's a fun thing. to do. But to go into and the Lion King, which is such, it's a joy, now that's, that is joyful. I know. It's, yeah, I saw it last year and I still cried. Did you? Yes, because it's still,

because the story as well, the actual like, you know, the bricks and mortar of the story are just so good. And then of course you've got all this brilliant puppetry and the music and the, you know, the added African music and the design, just everything. It's just, it's, I think it's sublime. I agree with you. And, but my, my joy of when my kids were younger and going to see that. It's just, it's lovely and the music is lovely, as you say. Right, let's go to Roadkill. Congratulations. Another show that everyone was obsessed with, including me,

and it's still available on the BBC Eye Player. Give everyone a sort of idea of this show. So Hugh Lorry plays a conservative minister. He's brilliant. Oh, God, he's so brilliant. And he's basically attempting to outrun his past and without giving too much away, secrets are exposed and revealed.

My character, I play his barrister, and I win a lie-bell case for him at the beginning of episode one. And some people bring to my attention that there is some evidence that could go against him that could bring him down. And so me and I guess others as well, we try and bring him down while he's also dealing with personal issues being exposed to the public. I just think the performances are absolutely brilliant. And the women as well are fantastic. I think David's written brilliant parts of women I do, I love his writing

I love his writing I love his writing though I really It's just smart sophisticated smart witty Am I right in thinking David Hare wanted you

and that was it Well I don't know Go on I don't Well I was supposed to I was supposed to work with him A couple of years ago

And it didn't work Actually because of father mother uncle brother son And And so when this came along Yeah I think Maybe. I don't know. I don't know. Yes. Well, I've read an interview with him.

And he says, he wanted you and he thinks you're the most sublime actress. Oh, he's so sweet. Honestly, this has been one of my favourite jobs of all time doing this. Why? Why was it one of your favourites? Well, I think because David's writing is so pleasurable to say. And every scene that you have in a David hair TV feels almost like a mini play. which is so nice for an actor because TV scripts aren't normally that dense, the dialogue isn't that dense or really that's sophisticated a lot of the time.

So to get David Hare script where every scene I'm in pretty much, the first two episodes, I'm not in it that much, but the latter two, I'm more, but the scenes towards the episode three and four, they're like five pages long. And that for an actor is just so enjoyable because you get to, It's like the juiciest, chunkiest bit of steak that you're having an opportunity to take a real bite out of. So that for sure. And also because on some level, you know, I would like to think that I could be a good barrister in another life. We shot by, you know, what location came up first.

And a lot of all of my big scenes were in one location. So it was a week of just back to back five page scenes. So it was quite, that was quite difficult. But are you back filming now, anything? I'm not, I'm not and I'm reading stuff and waiting and I don't I don't feel in a huge rush

to go back out to work and also I just I know that gangs will be going in the new year and I'm I don't know I'm ready to go back to work but only for the right thing I'm a bit picky Gabby yeah no that's good

it's good now especially with so much going out oh my goodness you know what so how is your mum I've got to ask you about that oh my god she's she actually sends her love. Oh, will you send her my love? She's just a lovely, lovely lady. But have they been, have they been through all the madness this year? They've been fine. I mean, my, my dad was super vulnerable, so I couldn't go anywhere near him for a while, which was really difficult. And I think

they've kind of, they live in the countryside. So they've been, they've been okay, but I think not being able to see my sister and I have been, has been really difficult. They have a dog who runs the, you know, runs the house, literally. But, you know, she's been keeping them busy. But I think, I think the beginning part of lockdown was just so hard because you couldn't see anybody and you couldn't touch anybody. And I live on my own and actually not having any human contact. I think the first human contact I had was eight weeks in.

And not having human contact for eight weeks was really tough. It was really tough. Couldn't you just call Richard Gere and Brian Bramston? I know I should have done. I should have done. And then Zoom to them and done a Zoom with both. Now there's a Zoom I'd like to be. Oh, there's a Zoom.

There's the Zoom. Oh, that Zoom, it drives me out. Okay, so I ask this to everybody. What makes you laugh? Because you love a giggle. I just know, because I only met you twice, but you love a giggle, don't you? So what makes you laugh? Okay, I'm going to be corny.

But my father, he will always be my father. he can make me laugh like that. You click your finger and he's just made me laugh. So I think I'm going to say my dad. That's so lovely. Yeah. And he doesn't even have to, he used to be, he used to have my sister and I were growing up.

He would do this thing where he would just look at us and like pretend that he was starting to laugh and he would just make my sister and I laugh and he can still do it. And so it's a little thing that we have as a three. But yeah, my dad. Oh, that's so cute. Laughing is important. Goodness. Oh my God.

I laugh all the time. I'm such a laugh. You're right. I really am. But I love that of you. Oh, do you know, I'm so thrilled that you're on this podcast because I just want people that are good, kind, lovely, fun people. So I'm thrilled that we got you for this.

Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. It's been such a pleasure. I love talking to you. Thank you so much for listening. Please join me next week when I'll be chatting to strictly judge Shirley Ballas and the incredibly talented Arienne Bakari,

who you would have recently seen in his dark material. That Gabby Rosin podcast is proudly produced by Cameo Productions, music by Beth Macari. Please press the subscribe button and it will come straight to your phone on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you choose to listen. Also please rate and review us on Apple Podcasts.