That Gaby Roslin Podcast: Reasons To Be Joyful - Steffan Rhodri

Episode Date: February 27, 2024

Gavin and Stacey star, Steffan Rhodri, joins Gaby for a chat about what brings him joy. Known for his roles in Harry Potter, Submarine, Wonder Woman and, of course, for playing Dave Coaches - Steffan finds joy in all the work her does. We hope you enjoy the chat as much as we did! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Stefan Roderie, I just think you're wonderful. I wanted to be able to say in Welsh, welcome. But I don't want to get the pronunciation wrong because there is nothing worse than getting the pronunciation wrong of a Welsh word. I'll say it for you, Croiso. That's what you would say to me. Croiso. Croiso, yeah.

It's one of the few words that many people know because you see it in lots of buildings and signposts in Wales. Croiso. Croiso. Croiso. But also then... And I then say, do you chammer. Have really vaudeyre.

Thank you very much. lovely to be here. Yes. How do I just say? No. Okay. Let's, let's, let's, okay. So I've said that, Grosur,

and then you've said, lovely, and bleep, and then I say, it's so lovely to see you. Habrijawni, doeldi. Absolutely. Haldi. Is that right?

Yeah, it'll do. Sort of hide behind the mic. Nobody was saying. Okay, so many, so many things I want to talk to you about, but I just want to read something to you that was on Instagram after the way dropped.

And I don't know if you've read it, but this is the totally wonderful Russell Davis, who I think you know. He says, well, that's magnificent. Magnificent, he shouts it because it's in capitals. I've never seen anything like it, raw and furious and mythic and beautiful, and it even has time to be funny.

With the most brilliant Welsh cast, it's amazing how they've done it. My head's spinning because it throws in allegory and legend and hallucination and archive and fairy tale and ends up feeling so real. How the hell? So classic and so new at the same time. Breathed taking, groundbreaking, wonderful.

And that's what Russell T. Davis says about the way. He's enthusiastic, isn't he, Russell? He is, but also I think it's incredible. I think I wrote underneath, isn't it superb? Because I didn't have enough. He used every word, but it is. Well, he's, I mean, the thing is, Russell knows television and his television animal. You know, he, you know, just to name drop a bit, he sent me around the same time that he posted that.

He sent me a personal message as well in the similar kind of vein, you know. And he was absolutely raving about it. And as he said, in that, he said in message me, he said, I've spent my life in TV, but you lot have just completely changed the boundaries, you know. So it was such a weird day, you know, when it, dropped on Iplay early in the morning and then no one is going to be broadcast

that night. I didn't know what to expect of the day. But before we knew it, there were some negative reviews coming in as well. How? Well, I mean, the thing is,

I suppose there was always a sense that we knew it would, there was a possibility that it would polarise opinion, that it was brave and ambitious and groundbreaking. And, you know, a lot of people say that

and then it's a sort of formulaic drama, you know, with all due respect. But you kind of knew from the script of this, that there was no formula. And I think that reviewers, to be honest, with all due respect, I don't really care about, I'm not saying for a minute, I don't care about reviews. If everyone absolutely hated it, then I would be a little sad.

But it seems to have wound up the right people. Let's put it that way. That's a clever way of putting it. So the kind of publications that have reviewed it negatively on the whole, I kind of think, yeah, okay, so it's kind of not tick their box. Yeah, it's not going to, really. That's as a subtle way as I can put it. And, you know, there have been some good reviews.

And certainly, to be honest, even if there were no good reviews, that's someone who knows their stuff, like Russell T. Davis would say that about it. Then you think, well, it's got something. It's got more than something, though. Yeah, absolutely. So I chatted to you first about this a couple of weeks ago before I'd seen it. Right. And you were explaining it to me.

Badly probably. No, but it's sort of, it's very difficult to explain. Because it is all that Russell said. It is funny. To be honest, I think that's part of the negative reviews. People don't know how to explain it, you know. Does that matter? I don't know.

No, exactly. I think we, look, we've been around long enough to know that in the 70s and 80s, there was groundbreaking TV like Dennis Potter and Stephen Policoff and people, you know, who created things that. didn't fall neatly into a genre and into a type of TV. And even if it's brilliant, it's more often than not these days in a genre, in a type. Yes, yes. And it is of one kind of style, you know, within it.

And what people did in the 70s and 80s when experimentation within TV started and then kind of stopped, it seemed. You know what I mean? It sort of stopped, really. But what they did, is it sort of stopped really. But what they did is break the boundaries, break the rules, you know, like was happening in theatre as well. And I think it's not happening as much in theatre maybe now.

But, you know, just to experiment to see what you could do with TV. And I think that's what Michael Sheen and Adam Curtis and James Graham have gone back to and have just gone, right, let's sod it. Let's chuck all this at the wall and see what sticks. What it does is it pushes boundaries. It makes you think. it questions, it makes you question things and I love that from television.

I am a massive fan, obviously, anybody that knows me, a massive fan of entertainment, obviously, and I'm a massive fan of really good drama. And I'm going to actually say this is extraordinary hybrid because I want more. It's not the who done it, I want, it's, I wanted to immerse myself in what you've all created. I mean, it's extraordinary television.

Yeah, and I think that, you know, I'm sure that Michael had a lot of these bold ideas himself, but I think that Adam Curtis coming on board probably gave him the confidence to go for it more. And when you say Michael, you mean Michael Sheen. So this is his first direct. He created the idea. He came up with the idea.

But he didn't script it. He's not a script writer, he admits. And so they got James Graham at a later date. But first of all, to get the story and the idea together, The first person he brought on board was Adam Curtis, the wonderful documentarian, you know, whose documentary style you can really see, I think, within it, you know. It is, it's curious and inventive and, you know, groundbreaking, I think.

And he looks at what, you know, what society really is in an unsanitized way, looks beneath the surface of what society is, and pushes the boundaries in terms of style and everything. really breaks all the rules. So I think Michael kind of probably took confidence from that and whether, I don't know how much is Adam, Curtis, deliberately influencing and suggesting or whether it's the Michael Sheen just absorbing his presence kind of thing.

And the cast, phenomenal cast. Oh, they're great, aren't they? Callum's extraordinary. Yeah, they all. I mean, Mali Harris, Callum Scott Howell, Sophie Melville and Maya Laskovska. And yeah, plus everyone else who joined. us along the way, you know. And I think because it was so bold and ambitious, everyone who joined us, without exception, whether they were there for a day or a week or whatever,

they really were on top of their game. You know, nobody kind of just treated it as like, oh, another little guest lead that I'm rocking up to do. Everybody was like, okay, I am part of this remarkable project and I'm fully committed, you know. So Mark Lewis Jones and Paul Rees and Jonathan Navy, then all these wonderful people who joined us on the way were just like 100% in there from the first minute. I love that we've just gone into talking about it and we're not explaining it and I think we shouldn't because I think everybody has to experience it

in the way that I read about it, I'd interviewed you about it, and Sophie I interviewed Sophie as well. And so I sort of went in still not quite sure what to expect. And I think that's the way to go in. Yeah, absolutely. I think if you can't explain it really. You can explain that it's about a family

and it's set in Portolbe, and there is, you know, appeal because of a strike. And then... Don't say any more. And then their lives are changed forever. Yeah. And you said and Sophie said as well

that Michael has... There's murals of his face. There's a mural. There's a huge... We had to avoid the mural of his face. Seriously? You're not a joke. No, no, no.

It's like a big side of a house and it's, you know, whatever, 30, whatever, 30, 40 feet high mural of Michael Shee. Yeah. He's a hero there You know I mean he obviously they're very proud

And they're very proud of first of all Richard Burton then Anthony Hopkins Then comes you know Michael Sheen Oh wow All from the same town And and Michael Probably more than the other two Has really kind of not forgotten his roots

I mean Anthony Hopkins talks about them And Anthony Hopkins talks about it But he's I don't know how often he's gone back there As Michael's gone back then And he has a mural And he has a mirror And 10 whatever it was 10 15 years ago He did a huge

community project there with the National Theatre of Wales called The Passion. And unfortunately I was working and didn't get to see it. But my understanding it was a kind of Christ story where he emerges from the sea and then the, you know, and it was based on the fact, you know, a kind of Easter passion play that they do community projects of. And it was based on his experience of one of those when he was a child in Potholba and he wanted to recreate it. So this massive project with half of the town as supporting artists. you know, in the cast kind of thing and the other half, plus whoever else

arrived in Pottal, but following them around doing scenes all over the town. So he's a legend there, they love him, you know. Well, as I... Come on. So are you. I mean, you were hugely loved it. It's so funny when I said you were coming on the Red Show and said you were coming on this. I just... It's sort of people

who go, oh... I can't explain, they go sort of gooey and they just love you. You're an exceptional actor. And I I suppose part of it as well is the characters that you've played over the years and that you are passionate about home as well, about Wales. Yeah, I am. I still spend more of the time there's an incredible community,

the Welsh community. And I don't feel blocked. I think everyone, this is a very strange thing to say. I think everybody wants to be a little bit Welsh. We all look to hope that there's a bit of a bit of. it in our DNA? I hope there's some truth in that but yeah we are a very small community we're a very close community

we all know each other that is a weird thing and you will I mean there are YouTube videos of comedians in Australia or whatever doing a set and they say is anybody Welsh in and there's be one person and guaranteed that they will know someone in common and it's the same for me wherever I am in the world I say oh you Welsh okay I don't know them at all

but I say where are you from and if they say Abarist with someone we kind of go oh do you No, Sonso, no, but I was in school with his brother. No. Yeah, I mean, there's always someone, you know, within one degree of separation, you know. And it's, you know, within the media, acting, you know, television, theatre world, obviously it's even smaller world. And especially as actors, we all work with each other quite a lot, you know.

There's a lot going on. I saw a tweet last night, actually, when I was trying to avoid looking too much. at Twitter and reviews and things. But I did see one tweet in the way and it said, if there's anything well, Chantelli, it's always the same. It's always the same actors in it. That ginger fella from Stella,

who's Mark Lewis Johns, my friend, the bus driver off Gavin and Stacey, and if they're really desperate, they get Scott Quinnell in, who's the rugby player? He's not in it, by the way. But I thought, oh, we missed a trick there. We didn't have Scott Quinellilli.

But also, here's a thing, don't read Twitter X, whatever. Don't read it. Just don't read it while something's going out. But, yeah, I mean, And that is the joke. And I've worked twice with Mark last year, and we're very good friends. But we haven't actually worked each other for about 20 years before that.

But we do all know each other. We do come across each other often. And I think it's a very supportive world. That's so wonderful. That's how it should be. You mentioned it. So, of course, we have to go there. If we don't mention Gavin and Stacey, people would go mad.

Of course. I think, and that's what, I mean, I hope. hope it's because of some other things I've done. But when you say that people smile when they owe my name, I think it's largely because of Gavin and Stacey, isn't it? Do you think Dave Coaches has just... Of course, and I'm very grateful for that job, you know. It's funny, isn't it, how you do something that's that huge

and everybody's talking about it? And there are moments where you think, oh, will everybody stop asking me? But then you go past that and you think, I'm really... And I think you're sort of past that. Absolutely, yeah, because it's quite a long time ago now. And there were times when I never actually... I actively thought, you know, oh, I'm going to avoid talking about anything.

No, I've always been, you know, very open and happy to talk about it. I don't mean you. I mean other people sometimes. But personally as well, you know, but sort of secretly and, you know, in discussions with my agent, you know, kind of thought, yeah, we need to move. We need to get things that are very different from Dave coaches now because you can't be associated with it forever, you know. And I hope that by now I have got a body of work that is very different to Dave coaches. But I'll never regret doing it. You know, I mean, it was fantastic. And it did open a lot of doors for me in terms of very.

recognition and the way of talking about who I am, you know. And I nearly didn't do it. What? Well, I mean, I've told this story many times, but not for a while. And not from my point of view, but what people forget, you see, in 2006 when it first came about is that nobody had heard of anybody or anything to do with it. 2006? Yeah.

That's when we first, I know, it's a long time ago. The first series was in 2006. Well, we filmed it. I think it came out in early 2006. came out in spring 2007. We filmed it towards the end of 2006. And I'd known Ruth for a long time since the youth theatre, Ruth Jones. But of course, nobody knew she was.

Nobody knew who Jim's Gordon was. Isn't that a weird kind of thing to remember? Yeah, nobody really knew. They were actors, very good actors. Both of them, they were in a series called Fat Friends Together, and they came up with this idea. And they got a commission. But it was for BBC 3, and it was very kind of low-key, low-budget,

very low budget and yeah and Ruth phoned me out of the blue and just said we've written this thing explained a bit about it and she said I wish it could be more than this but I would love you to play a party he's only in two scenes in the first episode

and he's the bus driver he takes them to London I said that sounds funny and I spoke to my agent at the time and she said oh darling you can't just keep doing small parts like this on a little pilot on BBC 3 people will think that that's all you do

are these you know little parts and I said, well, look, I just think it sounds fun, and I know Ruth. Who is it? I said, Ruth Jones. Oh, I've never heard of her, you know. But anyway, cut a long story short, I sort of insisted on doing it. And what happened as well is that Rob Bryden couldn't make the read-through. And Ruth said, I wouldn't ask you to come to the read-through because it's only small part,

but Rob can't be there to read the character of Uncle Bryne. Will you come and read that? And so I said to Major, oh, they've asked me to do that, so that'll probably be fun because all the producers will be there. And I'm really glad I did that because I got to, you know, show a bit more of what I could do kind of thing. And I read all of Uncle Bryne

for the read-through of the first series. And yeah, and that was it. And they seemed to like the character. And, you know, and they wrote me more and more into it so that by the end, Dave was very, you know, very much a part of the world.

And it was great. It was a great world to be part of. But, of course, you know, we know when we work in television and things, these things happen very quickly. It's a very small part of my life. It was a few days here, a week or two there. And then it's on television all the time forever.

So people think you've been doing it forever, but you haven't. It's just sort of something that came and went like any other job. It's so funny, though, that when you said when it first came out, I'm sort of in some weird time warp, I think, because I'm not quite sure how that happened. Yeah, it's a long time ago now, isn't it? Oh, my word.

Do you mind, though, the people, as you say, it was a small part of your very illustrious career, but do you mind that people will still stop you in the street and say it? No. No. I mean, I sort of, I'm one of those actors who thinks it'll probably be a sad day when, you know, a long time has gone by and nobody's recognised me for anything. You just walk around.

That's not going to happen. No, but of course it will, you know. I think that with autographs and selfies and everything, I'm always, you know, more than, I mean, within reason, but I'm more than happy to stop and sign and take a photo and whatever. there will come a day when nobody knows who the hell you are. Because you're always working. You're hobbling around Stainsbury's and going,

I used to be on this sitcom, you know. So, you know, you're amazed for... There aren't enough sitcoms anymore. We need some more of those. They make us all feel better. Sidcoms? Yeah. Oh, I mean, you know, I haven't talked about this very much,

but I grew up on sitcoms and it sort of gave me more in terms of my desire to act than almost anything, I think. Really? Yeah, I mean, I really loved sitcoms in the 70s. Like what? Like what?

Well, Dad's Army, Porridge, Steptoe and Son, Only When I Laugh, Bless This House, Man About How, you know, all those, the good life, you know, the sort of 70, you know, mid-70s to early 80s, really, that period when. And especially, I don't know, I mean, as a kid, I was a kid who lived somewhere where we could play out at a certain age. And then that sort of stopped. I don't know why when I went to secondary school. And I became a bit more house, you know, just stay in at night kind of thing. My sister, my parents would be out somewhere or them. My sister would be upstairs reading. And I would just be lying on the sofa watching TV.

And it would be what sitcoms are on, you know. And in terms of comedy, I learned so much from watching those classic kind of sitcoms. And other stuff like, you know, slapstick stuff like Lauren Hardy and... Good choices. And even like Tom and Jerry and cartoons and I loved comedy stuff. So when you were lying on the sofa, did you know then that, I mean you said you were at youth theatre? Did you know that's what you wanted to do? No, no.

But theatre was always a part of our lives as a family because my parents met in an amateur theatre company. And they were both actors at one time my father kind of became the director. And they were quite a prolific company in that they would do three plays over one week in the autumn. half term. Three plays in a week? Yeah, they do. So it was a Welsh language company in Swansea's, Swansea Welsh Amateurist Drama Society,

and they would rehearse all through the autumn and evenings and Sundays, and then the autumn half term in early November, whenever it was, whenever it fell. Because a lot of them were teachers, you know, so that was a convenient time to take the week. And they would hire the Grand Theatre in Swansea, which is a big, beautiful old theatre,

a thousand-seater. And they'd put on three. plays and it was invariably two comedies and a drama. So the series play was always called the drama. And yeah, and they'd sell it out, you know. I can't say it was, you know, heaving every night. But some nights it was heaving and most nights it was pretty full. And they'd have busloads of people down from the valleys.

Oh, how fantastic. Yeah, yeah. And it all started to change around the early 80s. And they had to move from there. They couldn't afford to rent that anymore. They went to a smaller theatre in the university and they'd only do one play then. But throughout my young childhood in the 70s

it was a huge part. And because they were so involved, my sister and I would spend all week there because they would be involved in either two or three of the three plays in one way or another. And that would be our week. And I loved it. I would, you know, because I had total

freedom of the theatre. I would be in with the guy doing the makeup and the lady do the costumes and the stage managers and, you know, just in a... You were immersed in the whole day. Totally immersed. And as long as we kind of kept out the way and didn't wander on the stage,

we were just allowed to go anywhere really. And you'd kind of go up the back stairs and go up to the gods and literally, I mean, you know, it was like that. You'd just look, even do it in the performance, kind of be looking down from the gods with all the lamps around you kind of thing. It was quite romantic, you know.

And then if they ever needed anyone, like there was a wedding and they needed a page boy and a flower girl or whatever, we would be roped in for that. And even actually when I was about eight or nine in a play called, it was translated into Welsh but the English version was called

Wind of Heaven and it was about the Methodist revival and there was a little boy who was kind of quite central to it and I was cast in that part surprise surprise my father was directing it so it was always going to happen so it must have been so delighted did your father see

you as a successful actor yeah yeah yeah I mean yeah they came to everything I did really My dad died in 2005, and my mum died three years ago. So, yeah, they came. But, yeah, up until he died, he came to everything. They must be so fast. He saw me in stuff up in London as well.

I mean, I always get, I did a lot in Theatre, Claude, and I did a lot in Wales, and he saw all of that. But, yeah, when he could come, he came to the Globe. I always remember, I worked at the Globe in 2000, and they came to see the show then. They came backstage, and they wondered. And I knew that, you know, it would be lovely to take them on the stage after, you know. And it was, yeah, it was.

a wonderful moment and he just said they both just stood their gasping, speechless, you know, just looking out and it was, yeah, that was quite special. And they saw me in something in the West End and things and yeah. And your mum saw so much. Yeah, my mum kept coming and even even then as she was older, she lived in Swansea and I think the last time she came was about a year or two before she had in 2019. She came up on the train with her friend to see me at the young bit. Oh, how wonderful. And seeing all your TV success as well. So the fame side. That's such a stupid word, isn't it? But she saw all of that.

How lovely. How wonderful. And you're still, all the stuff that you do is interesting that when you're talking about it, you have a wonderful glint and joy in your eyes. And I know this is called reasons to be joyful.

And I get the feeling that theatre and those memories and sitting on the sofa watching the sitcoms, they bring you, you just, there's this wonderful, smile when you talk about that. Yeah, it's true. I mean, it's, I guess, you know, when you ask, like, was it something I always wanted to do? It was never part of my personality to think, that's what I'm going to do and I'm going to get there.

You know, I think I've sort of stumbled into pretty much everything without much ambition. And I, and. Without ambition. Yeah. I mean, it's weird because, really, and I don't want this to sound arrogant because, and I don't, what I mean by that is, I don't want to sound. falsely humble, but I really mean it when pretty much everything I've done since about the age of 30

has been way beyond anything I ever imagined I would do as an actor. That sounds wonderful. That's a lovely thing. Yeah, I don't want it to sound... I really mean it, is what I mean. I was working as an actor. So, yeah, I didn't even know I was going to be an actor. I didn't... I was at the West LaMorgan

Youth Theatre with Michael Sheen and with Russell T. Davis. And that was... You know, my sister had gone to that and she loved it. She'd become good friends with Russell and so on. She really took to it. And it was a vibrant, wonderful camp community, you know. And I was a rugby player and not really, you know.

But I, you know, I enjoyed being in the plays in school. And when you go to a Welsh school, when you're immersed in Welsh culture, that's just part of you, you know. But I never thought, yeah, and I'll be an actor. I just thought, yeah, I enjoyed doing that. And I saw how much he enjoyed the youth here. And I thought, I'll give it a go. And I went.

And I loved it as well. I really did. And that's, I suppose, that started something in me. But again, I never thought, oh, I'm going to be an actor, you know, because there were other actors the same age as me and my contemporaries who were then going off to audition for drama schools. And I just didn't have, I didn't think I was one of them.

I didn't think, oh, you know, that's me. And I think more than anything, that is just fear of failure. I didn't want to. Oh, that's interesting. I think what was in me was, well, there were two things. There was one was a desire to please my dad and get a degree because he, that he drummed into me from a young. age, you know, that I should get a degree and it's sort of just, I don't know, it had just become

a part of the, you know, of my makeup that I was going to get a degree. And secondly, I didn't want to say, yeah, I'm going to be an actor and then fail. And that makes sense. And so I stumbled into it. I did a degree, but I did a degree in drama and English and it was a very practical degree where we did a lot of, you know, improvisation and and devising work and, and exploring different theatres, styles and techniques from all over the world and I loved it and I really got the bug there at Exeter University, you know. And I came out and again, I didn't know then.

I hadn't, you know, there was no kind of drama, there was no acting training as such, but in a way there was. There was, all of that was, really. It was just a way of losing all your inhibitions and learning how to act. So what was the first professional job?

So then I came out and I didn't know I was going to definitely act, but my sister by then was doing some acting professionally. she was working in North Wales in a theatre and she said a theatre and education company in North Wales had open auditions and she just told me about it and I went well maybe I'll go along

you know and so my dad bless me, bless him, drove me up remember we had to leave at the cracker doll and we drove up to North Wales and of course it was like just you know absolutely I was like a duck to water with what I've been doing in in Exeter

you know the kind of physical theatre improvisation, devising, all of that. And, you know, it was just, it felt so natural and easy to me. And I got a job. And so I worked there for nine months. And I thought, well, I'm an actor then. And I say it. You know, because they had an equity card as well, which you had to get in those days.

To give someone they took on. They took me on. And I, you know, and I lived in a caravan near the beach in Harlech. It sounds amazing. It was incredible. TIE, living on the beach. Yeah, it was great. Living the Dream.

I watched one day recently. We watched it. And the second episode, when they're traveling around, I mean, we weren't quite like that, but it was, you know,

there are similarities. And I, but I absolutely loved it, you know? And when I look back, I was being paid to drive around Snowdonia with this amazing scenery

and rock up in a little school and put the set up and do a play about whatever we were doing, you know, and it was great. And so I, yeah,

I was on my way. And then I worked with another really good, that was, that work was not the best. It was, you know, a bit raw. But then I worked for a great

company called Theatre Powers in Mid Wales and we did some wonderful stuff there. We really did. It was chaos at times because it was a cooperative and we'd spent half half times in your early twenties. Yeah exactly. How exciting. And you had a real, what I loved

is you had a real input and investment into the work. You weren't just employed each project to kind of go okay yeah you're playing this, you know. You had a part in, it was a cooperative so you decide let's read some plays and let's decide what we're going to do in next September or whatever

and you know you're invested in those decisions then I loved it and I had to chair meetings you know it was 23 and there'd be 20 people in a meetings we were cooperative and they all like one faction were the workers revolutionary party and the others were whatever you know they were all you've got to do you've got to write this as a drama you do realize that's just fantastic

you on the beach and the TIE and the revolutionary party you just that all of this everything that you've said I can see it in a film. Go and speak to my... I know somebody. Russell Davis, I think you know him. Michael Sheen say, hey, let's do this.

But no, so I was it. I was an actor then. And I was doing it, yeah. But when you talk about it, maybe you don't realize because it's your life. But the difference between seeing the look in your eyes and some actors,

and I'm very lucky to have interviewed so many, there is something you just... There's that smile, that glint. It's that you love this. Well, I do, yeah, I did. And I always, I mean, by the time I was 30, as I say, I was, I wanted to do more kind of proper stuff in inverted commas, you know, and I did go to theatre, Claude, with Terry Hans,

and I did great, proper stuff, you know. But I always felt I was sort of 10 years behind, you know, so friends, other contemporaries, you know, anybody else at 30 had already done long seasons. I can't bear people to do that. I know. Why did you do that? Because you should never compare, you should just,

this is your story. I know. But, you know, inevitably I thought, oh, but they've already, like, done three years at the RSC or done a play at the national by now, or they've played a lead in a TV thing or whatever. And I hadn't done... I'd done some TV, but it was in Welsh, in Wales, and some of it was great, you know, but a lot of it was, yeah, low-key, you know, as I say, theatre and education, community theatre, Welsh language TV. But you learnt so much in that time. I learnt loads, I learnt loads. And in a way, I had time to kind of craft what I could do, but not in not so much under the... under the spotlight. And you learn about you. Do you think you've, you know, if you look back, it's very interesting. A few weeks ago, I put something on Instagram,

which was if you could say three words to your 18-year-old self. And it's, I can't stop thinking about it because people now come up to me in the street and say, oh, and they give me their three words. And I feel like you learned a vast amount in those 10 years or whatever to say up to 230. But that's made you what you are now. I guess so, but I mean, yeah, and I was young. I mean, going alongside that was chaotic personal life as well.

So, you know, it was, I learnt a lot from that as well, you know. But the chaotic personal life was that part of, was it, of your own making or just sort of went along with what you were doing, if you see what I mean? A bit of both. Yeah. A bit of both. But it's a pretty crazy life where you were living. Yeah, I guess so. I mean, but then on top of that, you see, there was also the sort of attempt of the conventional life.

So not only was I was married at 23 and I had my first child at 27 and my second at 29. So did all of that in the 20s and was, you know, and was living in my second house by my late 20s and stuff. And, you know, so it was a huge amount crammed in there.

But then, like I was saying, going back to my career, I sort of thought that's what my career would be. And I was kind of okay with that, you know, doing TIE jobs, theatre and education jobs, you know, community theatre, you know, plays,

in Wales, some Welsh language TV, maybe the odd English language, but TV, but in Wales kind of thing. And, you know, and it was only by my late 20s, really, but I thought, oh, maybe there's, you know. I remember they did Under Milkwood at the National, and some actors I knew and had worked with had agents, which I didn't have,

and got seen for that and got, and we're in it, you know? And I thought, well, I never get a chance to do things like that. And of course I could have been in it. I'm as good as them or whatever, you know what, I mean, but why, you know, and I remember that moment thinking, why are my ambitions so limited, you know, why don't I get an agent and get to do stuff like that and broaden out a bit, you know?

Please, will you write this? I'm actually not joking, you've got to write this. Well, it's flattering, you think it's interesting, but I think any actor is this kind of story, don't they, you know, really? Because we really do, I know it's easy to kind of mock actors that they don't really work for a living but it's work it's the greatest job in the world when you're working

yeah and it's work being an actor dealing with the rejection and the touring and the hope and the despair and all of that it's you know I don't want to sound too lovely about it but it is a bloody hard job sometimes just hanging in there being an actor and most don't

you know most don't really stick at it, you know, because it's exhausting, you know. Honestly, I could talk to you for days and days and days and days and I can't wait to see this drama come to life. The story of your life. It's wonderful. Walking the beach on a Sunday. I was talking about something the other day when I was in Harlech, you know, and it was, there were different times, weren't they, you know? I think one day had set me off thinking about those times.

I think it has for a lot of people. Yeah, and then, because I'm exactly the same age as. them. So it starts in 1988 when they finished university, which is exactly when I did, you know. And I'd read the book, which was great and I'm enjoying the series. But yeah, on Sundays, there was nothing to do in Harlech, obviously, and, you know, in fact

I don't think even the pubs were opened in the afternoon. They were opening in the evening. So you'd have to find something to do and I'd walk on the beach and I'd have a walkman, do you remember the old Walkman with a cassette? And I'd put something dramatic like Marla or Mozart or something on and just walk this wind-swept beach. See, this is the best of backdrop to the whole

thing! Oh, my way. word. Stefan, thank you. Thank you.