That Triathlon Life Podcast - Is shaving weight off a triathlon bike really worth it, and more!

Episode Date: April 9, 2026

This week Eric and Paula toughed it out and battled through sickness to make sure we got an episode out in time. We kicked things off with a Swim Sets with Paula, briefly covered the Tour of Flanders, and then moved on to listener-submitted questions. This week we discussed:Shaving weight off the bike, only to add four 1-liter bottles in a raceOur imaginary dream triathlon productWhen the juice is, or isn’t, worth the squeeze in triathlon racingHow Eric attaches SRAM blips to his barsHow to act and react when other runners look great on courseCan breathwork really increase VO₂ max by 10%?Do triathlon-specific bike shoes actually make a difference?Is it okay to swim only freestyle in a masters class?How do you “shake off” a bad race?A big thank you to our podcast supporters who keep the podcast alive! To submit a question for the podcast and to become a podcast supporter, head over to ThatTriathlonLife.com/podcast

Hey everyone, welcome to that triathlon life podcast. I'm Eric Loggerstrom. I'm Paula Finley. I'm Nick Goldston. Paul and I are both professional athletes, Nick, and we're sick. Nick is, I don't know if you're deleting all of our coughs out of this or not Nick, but what I did last time is I took them out of the main mic that they're coughed into, but you can still hear it on the other person's mic.

Just so people know like, oh, we're really sick. Yes, but it's not coughing into someone's brain. Yeah, if you can't hear it through Paula's stuff. up knows. Yeah, we're both professional athletes. Nick is a professional musician, amateur triathlet, just lover of the sport. He's one of those guys who were like, why are you, what are you doing this? There was a question about it this week that we can all three of us dive into, about is the juice worth the squeeze. The juice is pretty good right now. The weather is fantastic. We've just been loving being outside. I recently had hip surgery, if you haven't been following

along. And I got to go out on a couple outdoor bike rides this week. Felt incredible. What? Yeah. I don't know. I'm in a great mood. And Paula, you are hard at work at creating a swim set for us. Is that right? Yeah, I'm doing a swim set with Paula. On the whiteboard. On the whiteboard was like seven colors. To doodle with a swim set.

Is this for everyone? Everyone's going to get to enjoy this. Yeah. Awesome. Well, we'll post the picture of the set on the app. I got to say, I am doing a very exciting thing right now. I'm building up a new TT bike. It's occupying a lot of my brain power right now to like condense this down a little bit. Basically three years ago we got a shiv disk in the mail and it said on the box. So this is like the classic Shiv triathlon

bike with the wing reservoir and the whole thing. It's disc brakes. And it said black on the box and we already had a black one. So we left it in the attic and we didn't build it up and I've kind of been fantasizing. Like black is lame. Yeah. I don't know. Leave it in the box. We just, like, Paul has ridden the same Shiv T.T. bike as her practice, whatever, her training bike for like the last four years now. And she just keeps getting new race bikes.

So if you have the same color, it feels a little bit weird to build it up. But I go to pull it out of the box because I kind of want to do some TT bike things this year. I have a fantasy of doing another traflon, TBD, which one? But go to pull it out of the box. And it is not black. Drama. It's not at all black. It is like this most incredible, beautiful red that fades to black.

And I'm obsessed with it. So I'm going full send on making this bike pretty trick, getting some special little bits and parts for it and stuff. And yeah, it's hanging in the garage right now. But I'll be debuting it at some point. I can't remember seeing that colorway anywhere. Do you know what the deal is with that? The only thing I can compare it to is kind of like the speed of light,

Olympic edition mountain bike that I had. It's kind of similar to that. But no, it's so fresh. It's so cool. And what kind of keeps popping into my head is like Vindiesel and Fast and Furious when he gets out that sick charger that's like all supercharged and puts out 900 horsepower. Oh, the one that they race at the end. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's like this retro power. So like that's the visual in my mind for this bike. I'm psyched. No, that's the thing. I think I'm going to like build it up just with what I have. And then like there's several things that I kind of. kind of want to get that take a few weeks to show up or whatever. And like I'll add on. So it'll be like this ongoing tuning process or whatever. What did happen this week was the tour of Flanders,

but I don't know how much we want to get into that. I mean, it was more predictability kind of things that happened there. We were just talking about this because I think Paula saw the Demi Vowlering won the Ronde of Vlander in and so did Tadej. Right. So it's back-to-back. Yeah. Tadee Pagacha. We're kind of like, is it, is it, is it, is it a little boring? Like this dude just wins everything all the time. And I don't know. On one hand, I agree.

It is boring. On the other hand, it's like, are we just watching the best people in the world? Like, you know, the best people who ever have done the sport and we are a witness to their greatness. And that is its own reward. I mean, it's like watching Taylor Nibb. I mean, I'm watching generally for second, third, and fourth because it feels a little predetermined. I don't know. After the Kona fiasco, though, with the heat stuff.

it almost feels like, okay, but if you watch sometimes, sometimes something happens. And maybe if you watch this time, you'll be witness to these great exceptions. The most exciting races has been when he has a problem, Taday. And you're like, oh, again, now that he lost a shoe. Right. He broke off. We got to race on our hands.

Yeah, but anyway, if there's a lot of recaps out there in those races. And like Eric said, there's a slight predictability there. Yeah. It's just amazing. Matthew Vanderpil apparently put out his, I don't know if you saw this number. I want you guys could guess. What do you think his, he put out a lifetime best 90 minute power. Do you want to guess what it was?

375 watts. Oh boy, dude. You are. You are way off. For 90 minutes. Lionel could do that. 90 minutes. Yeah, I guess it's like, what is it like 410?

475. It was 446. What? This is average. power. Not normalized. No, average. It was training peaks told him. He like sent him in the email. You know, I sent the training peaks things. I guess he's a tall dude too. He is, but that's, I was watching this like Phil Gaiman recap of it. And even Phil was like, I want to see that power meter. Because I know the guy's strong. I would believe 410, but 440 is like, that's bonkers.

Yeah. For that long. That's like 30 minute time trial. Okay. It would still be insane. People try to hold 440 for as long as you can see what happens. Well, it's the same thing that if you jump on a treadmill that's going a record marathon pace, you'd last one minute. Yeah, if you can make it a minute at 440, great. You can't really compare it to the average person. I'll quick update on my garage sale. It's going really well.

Most things were taken on the first day, including three bikes and a lot of wheels, a lot of goggles, a lot of sunglasses. Nick's bike is still available. That's right. One thing, I had to increase the price of the grab bags because I realized it was too good of a deal. It was. If you got in, good for you. We ran out of like items to put it at $25. It wasn't even really worth the time it takes to pack and ship it for what I was charging. But they're like, most of the things I'm sending are brand new. So I've increased the price of that. Most things have gone out. And that's the update. Yeah, we showed up to the post office with like 40 grab bags.

It's taken me three trips to the post office because I get too embarrassed because the line of is so long and then I'm like trying to send 30 grab bags out. So I need to like figure out click and ship where we could do it from the house because the post just takes me way too long. Do you have a sticker for the return address? Are you writing it on every time? Everything is by hand. Yeah. That's crazy. We need like a like a triple A sent me my return address stickers for free to try to like coerce me into buying some one of their products. And I just now just use those stickers. because I use our colorful sharpies.

And it's like a color of a sharpie on the plasticy envelopes is so... We're all about customer satisfaction here, bro. No, but it's very like zen for me. Yeah. It's very zen. If I, in my next life, I'm doing something organizational like this because I just love doing it. What's her name? Marie Kondo.

Is that her name? Yeah, I'd be good at that kind of thing. Anyway. Wow. Okay. So let's take more. advantage of your organizational skills here and we'll do a little swim sets with Paula. Okay, so Paula, show us what you got.

I wrote this on a whiteboard. So we'll take a picture of it and post it on the app if you want to have it visually. But this is what it is. What? Look how. Okay. This is too good. Take note, swim coaches, because these are not.

what I see on whiteboards at the pool. This is color-coded, beautiful. It looks like graffiti. Thank you, Leslie, for the color, for the Leslie. Podlinsonor Leslie, who sent us a lot of sharpies. Okay, so warm up, 200 swim, 200 pull, 4-25s kick fast, and then 100 choice. That should get you warmed up. Okay.

Three to four times this set. Four times 125 as 25 fast as a hundred five. if you're starting a race, 100 steady. So settle in to race pace. Yeah. I like this, yeah. Let me do it. With 15 to 20 seconds rest between each one.

And then after those 425s, do a 200 pole paddles, just super smooth, relaxed. I love it. Take a minute rest and then repeat it three or four times. You know, I love the 125s too because you get to stop at the other side of the pool. It kind of makes it feel fun. Oh, yeah. Yeah, and I like 125s too because you're not really, you don't really know what a good time is or a bad time. So when I do hundreds, I'm very critical about, oh, usually I go 110s and today I'm going

112's and you feel bad about yourself or good about yourself if you're going well. But 125s is such a weird distance that you don't know if you're swimming well or not. It's kind of like swimming open water. So you're just going based on feel. So after you do that set three or four times, finish the practice with paddles on, no pole boy, 8 by 25, going 15 meters max, 10 meters float. Oh, max. And hard kicking too.

Like you were sprinting. Yeah, but with paddles. You're already fatigued from that set. And then you're finishing off with 825s, like loading your arms, kicking hard. But it's only 15 meters. And then float your way into the wall. Take full recovery. That could be like 30 seconds rest if you need it.

So you're ready to go max again. Yeah. Could be even a minute rest. Just feel like your heart rate is fully returned to resting. And your state of mind. Yeah, you're not trying to rush through these last 25s. And then finish with a three-under choice,

including some backstroke and flippers for cool down. Man, I lost my paddles a couple of weeks ago when I went to the Beverly Hills pool. It's crazy. I'm sure you guys relate to this, but you go to a different pool, your routine is off. And I remember when I came to bend

And I've left your I had a bathing suit there that I left there I've never left my bathing suit at a pool I've also never left my paddles at my pool But you go to a new pool And all of a sudden You don't have your routine Yeah totally

Try living out of a van for two weeks man Right You're leaving shit everywhere Right Apollo that's awesome though Yep You got a photo On a photo

I'm gonna send Oh Oh boy I'm way too sick to be doing this podcast Where is the photo going to be On the app. On the TTL app. Oh, nice.

Nice. Okay, we'll try to keep your talking to the minimum there, to a minimum there. And you can just answer on the whiteboard, Paula, if you want. Yeah, don't make me talk. Okay, so we are going to move on to questions now. But before we do, as a reminder to everyone, you can submit questions to the podcast yourself at that triathlonlife.com slash podcast.

as a reminder, that is the only way that you can submit questions to the podcast. Messaging us individually on Instagram is not going to work. So stop trying people. I don't know if you guys get these, but I get these every week. Oh yeah.

PSA, anything that you want done quickly, email is the best way because if it ends up on Instagram, we frequently take little breaks from Instagram. And if the message is like, my package is lost, please help. That's the last place I'm going to see it. Yeah, you email Jordan at thatchathonlife.com.

Yes. He's the wizard of last packages. Not being critical, but this is your fastest route to help. Right. Also, if you start your pod question with, hi, hi, TTL gang. I have a Trek Amanda 73.4 with Shimano 10. I'm like, nope.

This is not helpful to anyone else. This is very specific question. to you. Next. Is that the end of the PSAs? We're good. Now, one more PSA. If you're going to submit a question,

submit a single question. I don't want a list of five questions. No, unless they're related. Yes, if they're related, that's fine. But this week, there was actually, I did split them up into two different questions. So just write a question in another week. It's going to increase your chances of getting it on the pot.

This is so not pod-friendly content. No. People are getting them behind the sea rails. These are things that annoy us. And finally, actually, this week we're doing a video segment for podcast supporters, which are the way this podcast makes money is our very generous supporters. Donate $5 a month. Some even do $10 a month.

But you can do that in the same place. That triathlonlife.com slash podcast. It's greatly, greatly, greatly appreciated. As you can tell, we have still never done an ad on this podcast. So we're keeping it for you flowing. And look, you're getting all this behind the scenes, us complaining about things. Don't you love hearing people complaining?

God, isn't that the most fun instead of ads? So first question here is from Arola. Kiaora T-T-L. Do you remember Kiaora? Isn't that the, oh, it's a Kiwi thing. I don't know what TRIA, the last part is, though. Trio.

Trio, we are the trio. Oh, okay. Yeah. You were talking on the last episode about Paula being in the wind tunnel and the general optimization of weight on the bike when reducing grams of material. Something I find contradictory is seeing some pros during races carry four bottles of water, two front, two back. Is there an explanation I'm not thinking of?

Seems a bit counterintuitive when so much effort is put into the weight optimization. Thank you for your work in making triathlon a more multifaceted space. P.S. I'm dealing with a hip injury. It might be similar to Eric's. So right now you're very much what keeps me motivated to do triathlon again. Arola, thanks. Yeah. And Eric's healing journey is very promising, I think, for all active triathletes.

It's exciting. Okay, so first of all, how much, you know, there's some assumptions made here about all these interest around reducing the weight of the bike. how much is that true to you guys and how much you think it's true to pros as a whole, trying to reduce the weight of the system? In triathlon, it's not as important because there's not a ton of hilly courses. And I think aerodynamics trumps the weight of the bike a lot of the time. On a course like Marbea or Nice or something that climbs like more than a thousand meters,

the weight for sure is a factor. But to a certain extent, I think sometimes heavier is better for more rolling courses where you kind of need the momentum on the descents. But having a light bike is just fun and it feels snappy. It's satisfying. But yeah, it's a bit counterintuitive when you're then adding four liters of bottles. In the worst possible place. And it looks absolutely atrocious. But yeah, I mean, also nutrition is important in racing.

people want to carry their nutrition on board and not rely on on course nutrition necessarily. So there is a balance between, you know, having stuff strapped to your bike and having it be light. And I think strategy does come into it on a course like Marbea, where it started with a big climb. You can grab a bottle at the top. So I only climbed with one bottle for the first, you know, 45 minutes of that race and then swapped it out for a new one. So if you have the opportunity on course to grab stuff and it strategically works where you can climb with less weight, you can work it out that way. But I don't know how much time we're really saving here. The biggest thing about the speed co bars for me is the comfort.

And it just is a huge, you know, perk that they're so light. But for me, it's more about how they feel. How much do you think that pros are loading four bottles onto their bike because they are, very specific about what is in those bottles versus like not like to slow down or whatever. So far I don't think that they're tossing out like 150 grams of carbohydrate bottles on course. Yeah, people fill them with like flow gels or the high carb mix where you have 90 grams of carbs in a bottle or even more. On course you're not really getting that.

You're getting the precision bottles with just electrolytes. and then the fuel is morton in the form of gels, right? That's right, yeah, for us. Oh, and for you guys too. Do you guys see pros, Paula, do you see pros grabbing stuff from those? I mean, you said you did in Marbea, but do other pros as well? Yeah, I think people use the on-course nutrition quite a lot, especially at the later stages of racing.

I've never done a full, but I could imagine in a full it's even more so the case where you're grabbing water, even to cool yourself, you know, grab a bottle and then pour it on yourself and then discard the bottle right away. I don't know. I think that drives me insane about the way people are setting up their bikes currently is even if you have a light bike like Paula and then you strap two bottles onto the back and you have a bottle between your bars. You have like this completely upside down top heavy bike that like she said,

anytime you get out of a corner, anytime you do anything besides ride arrow straight, even then. Like a bike that has a lower center of gravity just feels better and more planted. So like this is the worst possible scenario. But if you're trying to do a whole bunch of carbs per hour and you have this very specific nutrition plan, that's what you've got to do. But this is also why I love the idea of this old school shiv tri-bike because it's got the water reservoir. And then if you can just have like one super concentrated bottle of water, I mean bottle of nutrition,

and then grab on course water, like I think that's the cleanest setup. And like whatever the canyon is that has that internal thing, yeah, it's a pain in the ass to clean. but very so much cleaner than having like freaking three liters of water hanging off your seat. Would you consider just making your front bottle your actual bottle extremely concentrated

to the point where you need to mix actual like drinking water into it to like digest it? Yeah, exactly. Do both. I would just have like the rear bladder completely full of water maybe and then have the front like mix up some of the high carb fuel to like six or six

100 grams, you know, into a gel almost in the front bottle, and then just take a hit off of that every 20 minutes, and then grab bottles of water on course. You have to be pretty confident in your ability to grab a bottle of water while rolling quickly and not losing space in the pack. That's the only stress as a pro. Because I think the people, the thing that maybe some people might not know that is really relevant about this bike and some other bikes is that even though that reservoir is behind you, you can refill it with a little like a hole in the front of the top two. No, you can. Not on the specialize. On the canyon, you can. It's got a little like... Oh, fuck. Yeah.

It does. I don't know how to describe it. It's got a couple... Take that out. It's got a port. Yeah. It's got a port. It's got a port.

Yeah, there's a port for it. Yeah. Good point. Okay. Right. Yeah. It is a good question for age groupers, though, who are like seeing the pros

trying to shape weight and then bring four liters of water with them on the bike. Yeah. At the end of the day, there's very few courses like Paul said outside of like marbeia like niece cona like have a heavy ass bike

great it just rolls forever yeah cool okay next question here is from evan hi t t tl so excited for the new grab bag fingers crossed i get a used pair of erics bibbs oh boy my actual question as an aerospace engineer i can't help but tinker and be curious what is a triathlon related product you wish existed outrageous answers acceptable

at my first 70.3 this may love all the content keep being yourself thanks Evan all right does this bring anything to mind for you triathlon product I mean what we just talked about a super genius easy to clean

way that you can carry a bunch of water low down on your bike and still access it yes that's great that is so apropos and drink while you're in arrow yeah you're like an upside down camel system yeah what I don't understand

like I think we should be wearing we should be doing what they do in gravel now. You know, how we've talked about, Kastelli has that camel back, you know, hydration pouch inside of the jersey. Yeah. That, like, that makes the most sense to me for triathlon. Yeah, but now you're not allowed to have stuff on your back.

Yeah. Which is, it's funny because that's probably faster, right? To have a bump there. It's better in every way. Yeah. Maybe you're allowed stuff on your back, but not just on, not on your front. You're not allowed to put it down the front of your kit,

the way the people were doing. I want to, like, ask somebody. I want to ask the pro-Chinese boys because they're very up on all the rules. They're frothing about the rules. Without giving away my new strategy. Yeah, right. Yeah, so you got to get it in before the pod comes out

because, you know, Kyle listens to this podcast. Yeah. I'll just text me, Kyle. Don't tell Talbot. I was thinking, I mean, this is kind of obvious, but some kind of dropper post, I think for TT bikes would be fun to have not only for descending, but sometimes,

well, I guess always for descending, but not just for handling, but sometimes when you just want to get really low and you're not peddling, I think that could be another fun time to have like a, I mean, it's kind of like a... This is an issue for zero percent of triathletes. Yeah. Yeah. There are two courses. One really, maybe two.

I think I just want dropper posts on road bikes in general. I think that's what I would like as a, what's a word, unrealistic wish. How are you doing this, though? Because now your body is suspended. Because you're not going to corner with like a bent leg on your outside downward leg. You're right. Like a mountain biking, you corner differently.

Yeah, you like in mountain biking, you lean the bike over. Yeah. And road cycling, we don't. Less so. Yeah. I mean, it seems like a thing that would be awesome, but then when I think about it actually doing it. You know, as we need to move on.

Okay. Okay. Wait, Paula, did you not have a wish? A wish is something that existed. Yeah. As someone who tinkers with aerospace stuff. I wish that bodies didn't need any carbs. So you could just race without worrying about nutrition.

Here's the thing. We need a helmet that just has a screen on the inside and a camera right on the top of your head so you can keep your head super tucked. That is awesome. That is awesome. make some motorcycle helmets with that so that you can see behind you without looking in the mirrors. Yeah, there we go. Yeah, that's a good idea. That's a good idea.

Love that. Okay, next question here is from Jen. Hi, I TTR crew. I was wondering if Nick could elaborate, and I think all of us could elaborate on this, on his conclusion that the juice might not be worth the squeeze, is that you would rather focus on progressing in the sports independently of racing, or is it that you would rather do shorter races versus the 70.3 distance? Thanks for your honesty on the last.

Padcast. The insights, even the hard, less glamorous ones, are very helpful and inspiring. All the best for the rest of your seasons. What did you say, Paula? I said, podcast. Is it like you from Boston? That's how you said it. There's a lot of weird things I said in that question. I'm not sure what's going on with my brain. I haven't had breakfast yet. I think that's why. Paula was asking me today which hip was injured. And I was like, I actually don't know. Is this my right leg? Eric, if you're looking at me, it's my left leg, but to me it's my right leg, what leg is this? And Eric's like, you're, you must be kidding.

Yeah. You're losing your mind. We need to write a will because you're losing your marbles. Yeah, that is, that's interesting. Anyway, it's my right leg. Yes, it's your right leg. Eric's like, if someone's looking at you, they need to figure it out. Yeah, it's our, your left leg, but it's your, your right leg.

Yes. Okay, so back to this question here, if I can pronounce things properly. When we say juice is worth the squeeze, we're talking about doing things that are specific to racing triathlon, which might be at odds with what someone actually loves about being a triathlete. Yeah, basically I think we were saying that generally, Like the closer you get to the pointy end of the spear, like the more into the minutia you're getting and the more things you're having to sacrifice. Like, I'm not drinking beer. I'm not going out past 7 p.m. I'm not, you know, I'm spending all day on Saturday riding my bike when sometimes I might want to spend time with my family.

Like those little decisions that can get you that last one or two percent of performance, is that worth it? And will that last one or two percent like enhance your enjoyment of the sport really? You know, it's funny because all these examples that you just put out, the not drinking, the not going out late, the spending all day doing something instead of something else, those are all, there's another version of this where you might spend just as much time and effort in the three sports,

but just not in a way that is specifically helping you race. Right, like maybe. I kind of feel like I fall into this category where I do spend a lot of time training, but I'm doing a lot of it on my road bike or my gravel bike, or I'm not doing three times 20 minutes at threshold. I'm breaking it up in a way that's more fun for me,

but not as beneficial for the racing. And then it's the question of like, all right, well, then why are you doing this? If you're spending the time, why don't you do it so that you race better? Because you enjoy the act. It's like I've been tinkering on all of our cars in our moped right now because I really enjoy it.

and I like that manual labor and fixing things, is it a better use of like resources than me taking it to a shop, someone who's a specialist and can do it faster while I could spend my time doing something that yields more, you know, if we're just talking about dollars or income, whatever. Obviously not. It's not worth my time,

but I enjoy it. So I think that's where you're at. And if, yeah, it's, this is like Paula doing the return addresses on the things. It is not as efficient as getting just like a sticker or stamp. Yeah. But the juice is worth the squeeze for me. Yeah, exactly. And that's how I feel about the training in triathlon. I really like the training I do.

Like yesterday I did a very, for me, challenging gravel ride where I was just like grinding low cadence and like trying to stay upright on this loose dirt for an hour. But it sounded more satisfying to me than going out and, riding TT. Yeah. Yeah, but then when you go to a race and you feel shitty on the TT bike, that's what you were referring to. Totally.

The juice is doing well at a triathlon. Feeling good, feeling strong on your TT bike for a 70.3. The squeeze is doing 4x20 at 70.3 watts on the weekend instead of going with all your friends and doing a gravel ride. I think where we're at. The juice of the good triathlon race

is not worth the squeeze of doing hard sessions. Correct. That's what Nick meant. The existential question that Nick is asking himself is that the juice you want? Correct. And I do, especially being a one week removed, but I think even if you asked me 20 minutes after the race was over, is yes, it's still worth it to train the way I do

and not then perform as well at a race for me. Yeah. Currently. And I just currently, right. I also want to acknowledge all three of us have been in, positions and we come in and out of it, kind of depending on the time of the year or what's going on or what the activity is, where that feels really good to go those extra miles and not have the beer and like do those little tiny things and sit in the normatics and et cetera and

and so on it. Heat Protocol. Like that can feel so good to feel all in on something. And so we're not like saying that's a bad way, a bad thing. It's just I think it's a kind conversation you'd have with yourself often and check in. I love that caveat, Eric. It's so Right. So true. Next question here is from Joe from Chicago. I have a new bike. It's awesome. I was riding it in Texas and I hit a cattle guard and my expensive-ish, Sram blip went flying off my bike. I don't think they are expensive. I don't think they are expensive.

It's like $50, $60? I think it's like $90 for a pair or something maybe. Flying off my bike. After about 10 minutes of searching, my mom found it. I'm a little curious how your mom just happened to me. where you lost. Your mom ride with you? Yeah. That's awesome. So I must know how do you attach

SRAM blips to your TT bikes? Is it different for the aero bars versus the bullhorns? Currently, it's a lot of electrical tape, but I'm thinking I need a better permanent solution, Joe. Eric, you know this. Yeah, I mean, there's like five different ways you could do this.

The blips actually come with these crazy little clip things that they can clip into and wrap around your bar a little bit. But what we do, is we actually mount them underneath. Well, we've done a couple ways. If you mount them underneath the bar tape, basically. So like electrical tape down. You wrap around it. Yeah, on the base bar.

Wrap some electrical tape around. And then I wrap the bar tape around and make a tiny little notch for the actual button. So the only thing that's protruding from the bar tape is the button. Do you like Xacto knife? How do you get that to come out? Exactly, with an Xacto knife. Just so the button sticks out. otherwise you just kind of feel a little bit of a bump for the whole module.

The other thing we do is use like very intense double-sided sticky tape and stick them to the inside of the SRAM, like the hydraulic reservoir for the front brakes. Oh, that's, so, and it just happens to like fit nicely in there. Yeah, so then like you're, you don't accidentally hit it with your pointer finger when you're out of the saddle and then you just hit it with, you know, with your thumbs. Yeah. Actually, we have some like very cool. integrated things that I'm getting for this new bike.

I just don't necessarily want to recommend them yet because I haven't tried them. I see. Stay tuned. And is this what you do on the bikes? Do you think that's pretty common or is this an Eric Loggerstrom original? That's very common. And yeah, I mean, I've just, I've chatted with the, like, head mechanic. It's specialized in Morgan Hill about it.

And these are his two methods that he uses. Yeah. Okay. Sweet. Okay. Next question here is our video portion. this is our little segment that we're doing for podcast supporters.

We'll read the question on the podcast, but then we're only going to answer it. You'll get an email if you're a podcast supporter. That's how they'll say that I should stop doodling for a sec. You can doodle while I'm still, while I'm reading the question. But no, actually, you probably should stop doodling. Okay.

It's amazing, actually. I think we're getting to something pretty monumental with Paula doodling on this podcast. It's one of my worst doodles yet. other than the fact that the doodles turn out great, I just think it's fun to watch you do it. And she's locked in. Yeah, she is locked in. Yeah, she is locked in.

Okay, this is my doodle of the day, guys. Okay, great. D-O-D-D-Doodle of the day. Oh, doodle of the day. Oh, my God, I know exactly where that is. And the soccer fields are on the left. That's a little fireplace there. Which location that is.

You didn't even need to tell me that was a thump. I could have told you that was thump. Yeah. Maybe. maybe next time Paula needs to draw a place without the title. We have to guess it. We have to guess what it is. I love that.

I love that idea. All right. This is incredible. Okay. So this is going, let's start right here from the podcast reporters. So, but we're going to read the question live. Anyway, this is about layers and there's a funny portion about this. But living in South Florida, it gets brutally cold some mornings.

on those 60 to 65 degree mornings, which for context is like 15 to 17 degrees Celsius, what is your go-to lightweight base layer under a jersey? So we're going to answer the question off the air now, off the air, off the podcast, but we'll be right back if you're listening. Back to the podcast here. Thank you for everyone for waiting so patiently. We just had five minutes of silence. and we're going to move on to Amy's question here.

She says, hello, I love this podcast, and look forward to it every week. I will get right to my question. I'm a long-time triathlete. I tend to be among the first out of the water, hold my own on the bike, and then hold on for dear life during the run to usually end up on the podium. Well, that's great. My question is how not to get in your head

when you see bikers and runners behind you looking great when you feel tired. There's quotations around. looking and feel. On looped courses, I will see people behind me who look so much stronger than I feel, and I end up doubting my performance. Do you have any tips or mental strength ideas to prevent this feeling, Amy? So I'm curious, you guys as pros, how much do you pay attention to what other pros look like when you're racing? And do you let that inform what you're going to do during the race? I was thinking about this. I often think about this when I'm not

racing and I'm watching a pro race. And I think, wow, they all look so good. They all look like they have so much pep in their step, especially the men at the front of the race. They look like they're just running an open half marathon. And I never feel like that. I feel like I'm suffering and low cadence and very few times in a 70.3 have I felt good for the run. And I think a lot of that is a fueling issue. I think I've always gone into the run. underfueled. Because there's people that say after the race, like, oh, I felt great on the run and I could kind of push it and I could

write. I'm like, I've literally never felt like that. So that could be one thing you could try is just coming off the bike after eating enough. Maybe you'll feel a little better. But looks are deceiving. I mean, you know, even when you see someone that might look good, they're also suffering. Right? You have to keep that in mind that when you're hurt.

You think you're the only one in the race that feels this way. 99.9% of the people also feel that way, including the people that are chasing you down. So I think that if there's an out and back course and there's one specific person you're trying to not get caught by, a little trick I use is to look really good for like 60 seconds. Just be like when I pass them on the U-turn going in the other direction, I'm going to be up super right. I'm going to have really high cadence. I'm going to look like I'm not hurting. going to be nose breathing.

And that can get to their head because you look really good. Everyone's doing that to each other. Exactly. Bear in mind, they can be doing the same thing. So when you're thinking everybody looks so good, maybe they're just putting on a show in the second year. You go by there like,

blah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Start walking. Eric, what about on the men's side? Do you feel like similar things happen? Do you think about this when you see someone else? Yeah, for sure. I mean, this comes into play in the later stages of a race

where you're going, all right, first place or whatever, the next place in front of me is three minutes up. How close is the person behind me? Because there's no way I'm bringing back three minutes. So rather than going flat out all the way to the finish line, how much can I take a log off the fire and chill without getting caught? If there's somebody behind you that's just rolling, then you've got to keep your foot on the gas.

You know, this reminds me of Amy's question. Amy, if you usually end up on the post, podium. I think something that might help you is take note of this. When you're at the beginning of a race, look around. And if you're like me, I look around. I'm like, wow, half of these guys who I'm racing against look way fitter than I am. So you look around, look at the women you're racing against, and you might think the same thing even before they are racing. You look around and then realize, but no, I am going to beat 99% of these people at the end of this race. And so my perception of what looks fast and who is fit is not accurate.

I cannot trust that instinct. You trust your training instead. And then maybe when you're on course and you see the same thing, you might realize like, oh, this is the same thing. I'm just as strong as everyone else here. I'm going to do great. Yeah.

And the more times you think that and it happens and it comes true, the more you'll believe in. Exactly. Okay, next question here is from Mark. Hey, Team TTR. I've been seeing a certain professional triathlete promoting a breathwork app. this is crazy, by the way.

I can't wait to read this question to you guys. That claims consistent practice can improve V-O-2 max by 10%. 10%. I had to read that twice. No, I actually don't know who they're referring to. But 10% is like, okay, so your VOTOMX is going to go from 62 to 68, you know, like doing breathwork. Sign me up. What's that?

Yeah, that would be great. I had to read that twice. Yeah. For context, I'm out here doing threshold intervals in the rain trying to squeeze out marginal gains. And apparently the secret was just breathing differently. So my question is, is breathwork something you actually believe in as a legitimate performance tool? Not just for recovery and stress management. Is it part of your training protocol?

And if so, what's a simple, realistic routine, time crunched age trooper can actually stick to? Appreciate your insight, Mark. All right. First thing, do you guys do any kind of breathwork at all? No. Not currently. I feel like it's, I don't know, the things that I've liked about breath anything is just if you're like trying to meditate or you're trying to calm down and fall asleep at night

and that steady in, steady out, like counting your breaths. I do feel like that lowers your stress levels, like calms you down a little bit. I don't know if it goes beyond that into like enhancing V-O-2 or anything, but I do think. no way it could enhance it by 10%. I'd say that with no scientific knowledge but literally

every single pro would be doing that if it were the case. I do, I do like theoretically. I feel like there are probably some people who have like a breathing disorder

like you're just like you're breathing too much in your upper chest versus like activating your diaphragm and if you were to work on that and get a little bit better at that you might be able to like maintain a lower perceived exertion

like get your heart rate just a couple of people. it's lower at the same activity level. Well, if I'm doing a training session or a race and I feel like I'm starting to panic a little bit or working too hard, I'll take a deep breath from the bottom of my lungs and that really relaxes me and whether it's psychological or actually doing something physiologically to like calm me down, it works every time. And especially swimming. Like if I feel very out of breath with swimming and I can't get a deep breath and I feel a little bit short of breath.

I'll do a few strokes where I do like huge breaths in all the way out. And it kind of resets me to feel better. Let's assume that this is a real thing. I feel like you could find a person and create a test that could show a 10% swing in VO2. If you found somebody who just was perpetually stressed and like taking these like little light up upper chest breaths and you taught them to like get more diaphragm and you redid the test, I may be since V2 is oxygen uptake. I don't do breathwork like sitting in a chair and working on breathwork, but within training sessions,

I'm very conscious of my breath and do breath work within some of the workouts. Yeah, that's interesting. Or at the wall, like if I'm doing fast 50s and you get 10 seconds rest, I think at this point it kind of comes naturally to me, but I am focused for that whole 10 seconds on getting my breathing rate down. and taking big breaths to get in as much oxygen as I can, not touching the wall and being like, you know, that's not a way to get you to recover for the next interval.

It's like being calm. Yeah. I don't know about it for sport, but I definitely did use breathwork for psychological, for calming, for anxiety stuff. And it is so well researched and it is very effective. And it is a, it's not just like a placebo. there's like a physiological reason for it.

Yeah, like who gives a shit about VOTU Max? It's helpful for your brain. I think that's where we're at. It is extremely helpful for your brain. And you all can look it up. There's a million great resources on it. But the main thing is you breathe in for like, let's say, four seconds, but then you breathe out for longer.

That is the most key part of this. It's not just big breaths, is that the exhale has to be significantly longer time than the inhale. When I was going to the Olympics in 2012, I was seeing a sports psychologist before that. And the most useful thing that ever stuck with me from any sports psychologist, because I didn't necessarily like going to them. But it was this breathwork that we did. And she had a melody that she would play on her phone or whatever it was. And now when I think about like, I can't fall asleep, I'm going to do breathwork.

I play that melody in my head. Do you want me to try to sing it for you? Yeah. Yeah. Obviously, yes, I do. Breathwork with fall, I'm well sick. Let me clear my nostrils. Okay, it goes, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da.

I need a keyboard. Interesting, though. So, yeah, so intentionally it is slower on the way down. Yeah, exactly. That's the point of it. So you're, like, going up the scale and then you reach the top, and then the exhale is much slower. Yeah. Do do do do do do do do do do do do do do I cannot sing right you're doing great.

You're doing great, yeah. You get the jest, right? That is it. And everything that I read and looked into, even like what's his name? Oh my God, I can't remember. Huberman. Huberman, yes. Even he says he has one that he does that you breathe in.

And then when you're at the top, you take another little breath. Hold it for a second. and then do the slow exhale. That's like the key part of this whole thing. And it's pretty amazing how much it can calm your nervous system down if you're feeling that kind of nervous system anxiety there. It's really effective. Yeah, and I think when you think you're done your exhale,

wait a second before you inhale. Like kind of sit there with empty lungs for a minute and then fill them up. Yeah. Awesome. Oh, that's such a good question. That was cool. Okay. We got a few more here.

This is from Derek and Paula, there's a little twist ending at the end there for you. I'll keep this quick and to the point. Does it really make a difference between triathlon shoes and road shoes for regular road riding? I've retired from triathlons, but I still ride and swim a lot. I actually prefer my tri-shoes because they're way more comfortable. Curious if I'm giving anything up performance-wise. Derek, and then he says, sorry, Paula, go Panthers. Yeah, Panthers suck.

Isn't that the way, is that the Florida team? Yes. Right, right. I don't think this guy's really sorry. When the Panthers win, we're like, does anyone even care that they won? Like, the Oilers need to win. I guess this guy does. Do you guys know any pros that wear triathlon-specific bike shoes?

Any what? That wear that race 70.3 and full distance? That wear triathlon shoes. Yeah. Tons. Yeah, I would say mostly. Really? I think we're kind of weird. The Shimano shoes with like the Velcro. So many people wear those. I thought all pros wore road shoes at this point for long distance. Wow. Wow. Yeah. I mean, it makes sense in draft legal, right? You need to be like extremely fast with that transition and then be able to get your feet in really easily. And it's much easier. Yeah. Honestly, I wear my torch, my specialized torch. that have two boas, but often I'm so locked in on going hard that I don't even tighten the boas all the way, and I'm riding the entire race with loose shoes. So if I just had a Velcro strap

to get it tighter, I think it would be a performance gain for me. And the only reason I don't have them is because I like to race in what I train in, but if I always trained in the Velcro option, Specialized just doesn't make tri-shoes anymore. Yeah, Specialized doesn't make tri-shoes. But these Shimano, we should not be promoting Shimano, but the Shimano TR-903 cycling shoe with the, they've got one boa and then one Velcro. You could dial

in the boa but have the Velcro undone for the transition. And you could train in those all the time, it'd be fine. Yeah, so there's nothing, there's, so absolutely there's nothing wrong with it is what you're saying and even more so if you're comfortable in them and you like them even better. Yeah. Yeah. And they're

not even ugly, except for the, why are they blue? I don't know. That's, I don't know They've always been blue. They make a black one. Like, freaking sparkly blue. But I'm tempted to get them. I'll speak as a not front of the pack person

the way that these two here on the podcast are. I also wear my specialized torches, but that's because that's what I like to ride in on the road. And I'm willing to take the whatever second disadvantage it is to put them on and make sure they're comfortable in a race so that I can have that kind of consistency. and I personally really prefer that. The juice is worth the squeeze.

Correct. Or whatever. Or the juice is not worth the squeeze for me wearing triathlon specific shoes. Another thing about tri-specific shoes is they have loops for the elastics. If you're a pro who like attach your shoes to your bike, the night before Oceanside,

Eric was like super gluing loops to my torches so that I could put elastics on them, which ended up looking really good. But the tri-specific ones have a huge. heel loop that can help you pull the shoe on and attach it to your bike. Yeah. Yeah, that is nice. Yeah, I wonder why especially I stopped making the, uh, that try.

It was called like the tri-vent or something or that was one of them. Yeah, I think I still have a pair actually. Maybe I'll pull those back out. Yeah. I just, they just like kind of, I don't, they must not sell that well. People must have had that realization like you, Nick, where they're like, I don't know, I kind of just rather wear my road shoes. And at the same time, Boas got good enough that they could open.

up wide enough to allow you to put your foot in there without a shoehorn. Yeah, that's right. But I wonder in these Shimano shoes if you could not even mess with the bow at all and you're just using the Velcro to tighten it in a race. Yeah, because the bow is further up so you could get it kind of tight enough. Yeah. Curious about these. Yeah. Okay.

Next question here. This is from Kevin on the night shift. Adult onset swimmer here. I recently took a few weeks long swim class with my wife, who was a brand new triathlete at our local YMCA to get a bit better with my technique. At some point, the instructor suggested that we should join the master's group after the class, but told us we'd have to swim all four strokes. Would it be appropriate in a master's session to only swim freestyle if the workout

includes a bunch of sets with other strokes? Am I being a giant baby about being nervous going to a master's group? Like many time crunch athletes, I have super limited. time in the pool, two swims a week max. So it seems silly to me to spend the time doing something that I won't need in a race like breast and butterfly. Kevin on the night shift.

I always skip the strokes if I go to a master's session and they're like, doing 300 IMs. Like, no, I'm not. Yeah, I would do the same. I'm not, I mean, for what? You might get a little shit. They might make fun of you, but, you know, whatever. No, I think I think if you're on a time crunch, you don't swim that often and you didn't grow up swimming,

then it's not as worth it because your technique in those strokes is going to be so bad that it is kind of more worth your time to put your time into swimming freestyle well. Totally. But if you're like us there, can we grew up swimming at my best event used to be 400. I am, so technically I know how to do the other strokes. And I think it is a good stimulus to do a little bit of butterfly, a little bit of backstroke in a workout. I'm not saying we do it that often but it enforces a good catch

it gets your heart right up in a different way it's like doing drills when you run it's not all symmetrical front and back you're like using different muscles and if you grew up doing all four strokes yeah if you know if you're competent in them the one exception is I used to be a breaststroker

and now if I do one breaststroke kick it feels like my knees are going to snap oh yeah because of that motion is so like I'll do it with like I'll do it with like a butterfly kick. So I still do it, but not with the breaststroke kick. And do you think that Kevin has to be worried about, okay, everyone else in the lane is doing fly and I'm following, you know, it's like six people swimming in a row and I'm stealing freestyle. Is that, is that kind of weird?

No, I think you cares what people think. Generally, master's practice, half the people are throwing on pole buoys all the time and just, you're like, everybody's there getting what they need out of it. Yeah. But if you're doing a master set and the set is like 25s, I am order, sure, try it. It's fun. You don't have to do it, but why not? Also, another thing I like to cheat with is single-arm butterfly. So if everyone's doing butterfly and it's too hard for you, you can do single-arm butterfly where you're breathing to the side, but doing butterfly kick.

That's pretty well accepted, yeah. Google it. Wait, what? Explain this to me? Single-arm butterfly. It's the same tempo and motion generally, but you allow yourself to roll onto your side a little bit, but you're still doing like the two-beat dolphin kick.

It's the ultimate cheater thing. Like if you're a kid in swim club and you don't want to do fly, you single arm fly. It sounds harder to me. No, it's way easier. No. Oh, interesting. You're only getting one arm out of the water. Yeah, you're just rolling to breathe instead of having to lift your entire body out of the water.

I see. I see, yeah, I guess you are lifting your body. Okay, there you go, Kevin. Last question here is from Nicole. Love the pod question for you. I also raced Oceanside and didn't have the day I was hoping for. For those of us that don't race that often, or maybe it's, the same if you do. How do you shake off or move on from a bad race? Trusting your training again

or just build your confidence back up? Thanks so much. You guys are fun to listen to. Nicole. This is hard. I experienced this last year because I decided I'm going to just like focus on doing some 50Ks and like going with ball at her races. And you know, if you just race 10 times like and you have a bunch of shit races, it's not as good as racing four times really well. But then you go race four times and one of them sucks, all of a sudden it's devastating instead of you immediately have another one to look forward to. Like I completely understand and identify with this. I haven't really figured it out yet. I like the answer. But I think getting back into your training and giving yourself something to focus on is, I mean, certainly the solution for me with a lot of

things. Get back home and go to work and drive your kids to things. Forget about it. Burry it down deep. No, honestly, Oceanside, I was so sad. Up until the moment we left, and then you realize

that there's a much bigger world out there, no one really cares. And of course, you care, which is the most important thing. But it doesn't take away that you did all the training that you hopefully enjoyed a little bit and you experienced this failure.

So next time, if you have a good race, it makes it even more satisfying. I know that's so cliche, but not any triathlete on planet Earth has a 100% success rate in racing. So if you have a disappointing race, just know that Lucy Charles has had a disappointing race. Lionel Sanders has had a disappointing race. We've all had disappointing races, and it's like part of doing the sport. If you went into a race every time and it was perfect, it would kind of take the fun out of it. Yeah, I guess I would fall back on, unlike you said, like you said, did you or did you not

enjoy the process of getting ready for this race. And if the race didn't even exist at all, did you still enjoy that time that you spent prepping for it? And you get to do that more and potentially have a good race next time. But that doesn't define the work that you put in necessarily. This is the transformation that happened for me. When I first started triathlon, the answer to that question was no. I was doing it.

I was doing the training to race because I wanted to race well. and first of all, it made me so nervous for those races, but also it was devastating when I didn't do as well as I hoped. And I have just like what Eric is saying, slowly turned that to, now I love the training, and I love getting back to the training. And now the race is almost like this thing

that kind of needs to be there, but doesn't feel like the point as much, for me, for me anymore. Maybe I've gone too far extreme, but I love that. You go back to the thing that you love to do anyway. Yeah. The other thing that occurs to me whenever I hear that somebody say this is like, did you have realistic expectations going in?

Did you look at it and go, oh, wow, I had a really good bike workout. I had a really good run workout or two or three. And I think I'm going to hit a 30 minute PR versus, you know, like a lot of the times that those good sessions don't necessarily immediately translate into this huge improvement in racing. And like being realistic with yourself that, you know, racing is a little more incremental. And when you have a huge PR, that can be more of an outlier rather than like the expectation. Yeah, you guys have both kind of talked to me about that as saying people have this one special day and now they think that's the new standard for them. Also, if you don't race that much, you don't get the race-specific stimulus. So racing feels so hard.

Like, think about the first race you do in a year. To me, anyway, it feels five times harder than any other race I'll do all year because your body's shocked into this like four-hour effort. When on earth are you ever doing a four to five hour effort? All out. In training, never. So it's always going to feel so much harder than training does. And I think that's a lot of people's disappointment when they cross the finish line and they're like, oh my gosh, that was so hard. And I didn't go as fast as I thought I was going to go.

That was a fail. But it's hard for, it's so much harder than you think it's going to be every time. And I think if you got to the finish line, that's fun. Like you're still part of the event. You did the Expo. You got the medal at the end. Yeah. Like, of course we still have goals, but you have to think of like all the fun stuff surrounding it,

result aside that add to the whole experience. Yeah. And even Oceanside, like, we did have that this time. It was really fun. The whole experience was really fun. If you let yourself enjoy it. If you get too sad in the, like, post-Olympics in 2012, I was so sad after my race that I didn't let myself enjoy the rest.

rest of it. But if I could go back in time, I would have because that's such a cool thing to be there. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. It's hard. It's easier said than done. I got to go to PT. Yeah. We got to wrap this. Yeah. But that was a pretty long one. That was a long one, yeah. I loved it. Love the midday pod. Yeah, midday pod's great. It's goaded. I think that's the first time I've ever said goaded out loud or type. Just trying it on for size, seeing how it feels. See them we're like, no. Greatest of all time. Get that out of your mouth. You ever know how to say like, you'll say something out loud, you're like, oh, wow, I don't think I've ever used those words before.

That's weird. Oh, that's so funny. Okay. That's all we got, folks. Thanks for listening. We'll talk to you next week, and you'll get the swimsuits with Paula on the TTL app. Yep. Thank you. Maybe I'll post it on my story, too. Yeah, good idea. Bye. Bye. Later. Okay, bye, everyone.