That Triathlon Life Podcast - Nick's Escape From Alcatraz Triathlon Race Recap, chasing validation vs. personal excellence, and more!

Episode Date: June 11, 2026

This week Nick races the Escape from Alcatraz Triathlon for the first time. We do a full race recap, answer Instagram questions from listeners who followed along, and discuss whether the steep price tag is actually worth it. Eventually we also got to our classic listener submitted questions.This week we discussed:Nick's Escape from Alcatraz race recap: the jump off the ferry, 57° Bay swim, iconic bike course, and sand ladderInstagram Q&A: thermal cap vs. booties, TT bike vs. road bike, and what crime would have landed you in AlcatrazIs the Escape from Alcatraz Triathlon worth the price tag?Chasing validation vs. personal excellence. How do you know the difference?Body image, weight gain, and the toxic myth that more training = leaner bodyFlying with an indoor trainer, what the pros actually doBalancing passion across multiple disciplines without losing focusCarbon seatpost slipping despite proper torque, what's going on?Getting blown off your bike by wind, has it actually happened?Off day during intervals: ease off the intensity, shorten the session, or go home?Running surfaces ranked: tarmac, concrete, pavers, treadmill, does it actually matter?A big thank you to our podcast supporters who keep the podcast alive! To submit a question for the podcast and to become a podcast supporter, head over to ThatTriathlonLife.com/podcast

Hey everyone, welcome to that triathlon life podcast. I'm Eric Loggerstrom. I'm Paula Finley. I'm Nick Goldstone. And welcome to our triathlon podcast and triathlon adjacent activities. We like swimming, biking, running. All manner of things in that sphere. This is going to be a really fun episode because Nick did the greatest race on Earth. But some may say, escape from Alcatraz, my favorite race that I've ever done. And he's got a little bit of a race recap for us. Plus specific questions about that that we fielded from Instagram. So thank you everyone who sent those in.

I'm Eric. This is Paula. My wife, we're both professional athletes. This is our buddy, Nick. He's an amateur triathlet. He just freaking loves it. Still got his race numbers on, actually. Let's see him.

Oh, man. Dude, are these not impossible to get off? You're giving me shit for the road rash I have on my arm and you got that on there? As soon as she was putting this on my arm, I'm like, is this really necessary? Because these things, like, they do not come off. I was scrubbing it in Jordan Blanco's shower last night for 10 minutes.

You got to use your fingernails. You have to make it like you basically have to wound yourself. Yeah. But it is possible. I do it every time. You need like a board planer. Oh my gosh. So you're number 1,200 and 6.

There are not 1,200 people who do that. I think there are 1,500. No. I think there are more than 1,500. I didn't think that many people fit on the boat. All right. Well, you can, you can, you know, check the numbers on that and everything, but I'm just going to do a little intro for what we got.

going on here. Escape from Alcatraz. I've won it twice. Paul has raced it several times. Nick has now raced it for the very first time. There's a lottery to get into it. It's fairly... You guys. I just googled how many people race escape from Alcatraz. Exactly three men are officially documented as attempting to break out of Alcatraz. So their ultimate survivor remains unknown. Right. Right. For the famous athletic event, 1,500 to 2,000 athletes compete. Okay, so... Okay. That is possible. All right. So that's probably possible. All right. Yeah.

Well, there you go. That's the story. That's the back story of the race. Mimicking these three guys who may or may not have swam from Alcatraz when it was a prison. You jump off a boat right next to the Alcatraz shoreline. You swim across over through the San Francisco Bay. You ride your bike up, like, not across the Golden Gate Bridge, but you go up over a bridge and you ride through Golden Gate Park and come back. And then you do this insane run that involves running on the sand. something called the sand ladder and it's epic. It's a fully an adventure multi-sport event.

Yeah, and it's funny that it gets kind of looped into other triathlons because it does feel like, I mean, the run portion at least is a straight up trail run. I mean, you're barely ever running on a hard surface. Yeah, I think when we had our quick conversation after you finished the race, like why do all races, all other triathlons have to be these set distances when this one they just, you know, they went for a poetic course. So anyway, that's the back story. Nick, hit it. Speaking of hitting it, the way I started my morning was I was very lucky to stay with the Blancos of Jordan Blanco.

And I was putting water in my oatmeal, like those one-off oatmeal things. Cardboard oats? Yep, uh-huh. Shout out to Kodiak. And this pan was drying on the counter and I bumped it and it rolled off. the counter and I'm like, I stick my foot out because I'm thinking, I need to stop this from hitting the ground. Otherwise, it's going to wake up everyone in the house and it like cut a gash into my leg and my foot. And now I am, now I am bleeding. Okay, everyone's talking about like the sharks in the

San Francisco Bay and I've never thought about it. But now I'm kind of like shark bait, ooh, ah, ah. Now you're thinking about it. Yeah, for sure, for sure. So that didn't feel great. But other than that, it was a, it was like a smooth morning and staying. if you do this race, staying so close to the race that you can ride your bike there, which is something that Eric has talked about many times about the advantages of being able to ride your bike to the start. Oh, it's so nice. It's so nice to be able to do that.

Get in your reservation for Jordan Blanco's house right now for next year. I asked her if it was okay to say that I stayed with her and she said it was okay to say it on the podcast. Doesn't mean that every listener is going to be able to go there, but. She's been a friend of ours since I can't even remember one. So I'm, I'm psyched. She's a huge, huge friend, huge supporter of the podcast and everything to you. Nick, what kind of human brain is like, oh my God, I'm going to catch this with my foot?

Well, it was just, I was like, I have to diminish the sound of, yeah, I'm like, I can't. Luckily, they have one of those, like, rubber mats where you stand near the sink or stand near the stove, so it made zero sound. Oh, so nobody even heard it. No, no, not at all. Okay, so do you think it would have been worse if they woke up? Or to get a gash in your leg. No, no. Well, I ended up, I mean, I'm still here.

A shark did not take my life. So I was totally worth it. It must have hurt like a mu-h-h-hre. It definitely hurt. It's still bad. I mean, if you want to see it, it's still bad. Well, let's see it. Yeah, that's.

And a gash on my foot, which hurt every step of the run as well. Wow. Sometimes when stuff like that happens, so it takes your mind off the race itself. I had that for a moment. I'm like, oh, yeah. I'm not so nervous right now. I'm thinking about my wound. Because I'm in searing pain.

That's the trick. Just kick a falling pan out of the air before your next triathlon. Yep. That's our advice for the day. And then the last thing I just wanted to like PSA before even the race started, I used one of the pumps that the bike mechanics supplied to put air in my tires because I had my little electronic pump, but they were very low. So I used their pump and I pumped them both up to 80, which is what I was aiming for.

and when I brought it back to my little transition station and put the, I just wanted to check with my electronic pump because it has a gauge in there, of course. Both tires were 13 PSI low. So do not trust a pump that you don't normally use. It can be way, way, way off. Bring a little gauge or a little pump

or whatever you'd have to do or your own pump is fine, but 13 PSI is a huge difference. Having an tire pressure gauge is not a bad, idea ever. Did you pack ours, babe? I never leave home without it. Okay. There's one in the van and in the house and in our travel kit. See,

Eric knows. I take it seriously. Anyway, so the only thing that was different this year, I think, compared to when you guys have done it, is that last year, sadly, because of, I guess the nature of how the swim starts, which is everyone gets onto a ferry, the ferry

takes you out to Alcatraz Island, gives you a little close-up look at the island. And then everyone kind of jumps off the ferry in a mass exodus. But last year, someone got jumped on and was paralyzed because of it. So because of that, they changed the way that the swim starts now. Now there's a kind of similar to, if you've done Iron Man races, where they have officials there that like raise their arms every five seconds to let a certain amount of people through.

Now they do that. So there's someone spotting the water to make sure there's room to jump. And so it's a time trial style start. now. I thought it was always like that because you can't all jump off at the same time. I think they just increased the length of time between waves of people. They hurried people off the boat. They used to. This is what I've been

told as someone who's never done the race before. And you guys wouldn't really know because you started as pros. Oh, they used to be like, go, go, go, go, go, go. Yeah, yeah. Now they're like, don't jump on someone. And we were not allowed to jump head first. Actually, that was one of the questions.

We were not allowed to jump head first. You had to jump feet first. Yeah, but I would assume most people would prefer that. I mean, yeah, if you're like kind of a frother, I could see you doing your little dive and like, I'm going to win this race. Would you have dived, Dove? Probably not, even though I do love diving.

Yeah, you'd be a prime candidate for diving. Yeah. I would say all the times I've done it off of, because for the T-100, they use a different boat. It's not as high up. It's a different platform. It's like a yacht, right? It's like a yacht.

Yeah, it's like not a cool, not as cool of a boat as the Alcatraz boat. But every time I did the real escape from Alcatrazas, I did feet first. Oh, yeah. Eric did head first. Yeah, of course. And I ripped my goggles off like one of the five times. That was my worry. That was my worry.

I'm going to pull my goggles from around my ankles, you know? I might as well just like jump in with my hand on my face. Yeah, exactly. Or you just lose them all together. And then you're swimming without goggles. Oh, imagine doing that swim without goggles. Oh, boy. No, I wouldn't. I'd be like, let me back in the ferry. I'm done. My day is over.

My day is over. Anyway, people talk a lot about the cold water, but, and I, it was my main concern as well. I just have this stupid phobia around cold water. But maybe like 10 minutes before the race, I just accepted it and was just excited to do it. I had a pretty rough night of being dreadful and nervous about the race, which I'm still trying to work on. But 10 minutes before the race had switched, and I was just really excited to be doing this race that is kind of,

I feels like outside of Kona, maybe it's the most well-known, recognized race in triathlon. I don't know. Do you think so? Certainly in North America. We're in the U.S. I'll just... Yeah, I guess Roth or, you know, there's a few, like the Alteuze.

There's a few that are pretty iconic. I would say it's like Roth, Kona, Escape from Alcatraz. I would say more likely that a random person has heard of Escape from Alcatraz than Roth. I agreed. I agree. Yeah, when I say, I'm a triathlet, people usually say, have you done the escape from Alcatraz? If you can't sense the sarcasm? Yeah.

No, it is. It is really well known. It is really well known. But most of the time it's, have you done the one on Hawaii? Yeah. You've done the big one on the Hawaii? Yeah. Were we right, though, Nick?

It's like jumping into freezing cold water is completely. different than having to wade in and do an in-water start. It was totally fine. You're right. Yep. It didn't hurt at all. Ripped that bandit off. I jumped in and I tried to keep real, like, I wanted a mental count of how I was feeling during the swim so that I could tell myself in the future, you're going to be fine in a swim.

And I jumped in and yeah, the water was cold. It was 57 degrees this year, which is slightly warmer than it usually is. But it's fine. It's cold and it's fine. We do hard things all the time. Triathlon's hard. We train every day and it's hard. This was no different than that.

And then the swim itself was by far the most fun and best time I have ever had in a triathlon swim. Wow. For sure. Well, first of all, it's really fun for the swim to have a purpose and not just like swim out, make a U-turn, and swim back. Leave safety, go out into the middle of this body of water and return maybe, hopefully. It's a point-to-point swim. You're like jumping off the ferry. And I made a specific point to a few times just like kind of quickly glance back at where I started.

And the sun is at your back. So the Alcatraz Island and the ferry are both silhouetted against the horizon. And it just looked fucking awesome. It's so cool. We started there. I'm in the middle of the San Francisco Bay. We're swimming all the way over there. It is a really, really, really cool.

feeling. Luckily, also, there's a current that pulls you this year. Apparently wasn't as strong, but I didn't know the difference. That pulls you towards in that general direction. So I just, the swim was my favorite part of the whole race. I can't believe I'm saying that. Did you ever feel like I don't know where I am? This is scary? Because that's how I felt when I did it. It was like, I can't see where I'm going. I think Nick had perfect conditions, right? Perfect. So you could see the shore, you could see the different rooftops you were looking for. sometimes you can't see any shoreline. That's scary.

No, we had apparently some of the best ever escape from Alcatraz conditions anyone could ask for. Yeah. Global warming is not all bad. Yeah. And exactly.

And the only thing is at the end there, I was too close to the shore for the last maybe 700 yards. And it just got this like cross-choppiness really, it slowed me down a ton. I mean, all of us slowed all of us down a ton. And it was a little disorienting,

but really such a fun swim. And I cannot believe that my favorite part of the race was a swim, especially considering how amazing and awesome the bike and the run are, which they are. So then you cut out of the water and you have to run like a K. Would you say it's like a K? I think it's 800 meters. 800 to 900.

Yeah, with the age group transition, it probably could be a K. It was so far and you can have the option of putting, Eric, you've warned me about this, but putting a pair of shoes at the swim exit so that you can run in your shoes to transition. Did you do that? I did not, of course not. No, I did not do that. I was like, I'll be fine. I thought you were for sure doing that when we talked. I thought so too.

Some pros do it because you put super shoes on and imagine a kilometer you're gaining like 20 seconds versus bare feet, but then you're also taking 20 seconds. seconds to put them on and off, so it kind of cancels out. But I think the biggest thing is protecting your feet. Like, Eric and I have both gotten stress fractures that were on the verge of stress fractures and became stress fractures by doing that. Yep. Right. That was going to happen sooner later, but it happened sooner.

The thing is that portion of the run is probably the only portion where super shoes actually make a difference because the rest of it, I'm not so sure. You should have worn the on Ultra Proo actually. Yes, that's those were over the race shoe. Yes. I do think trail race shoes are the way to go for this race. If you're trying to go as fast as possible, trail race shoes, not regular pillow super shoes in my experience now.

But yeah, then we started the bike, and the bike is, I mean, you could not ask for a more scenic, cooler, punchier, dynamic bike course. You have sections where you can be in TT, but honestly, you can get away with this on a road bike. And when I say getaway, I mean, like, you, it's kind of a toss-up compared to what kind of rider you are in your fitness. Which one would be better for you? Aren't the roads in really bad shape? Yeah.

Some sections there are like, I'm like, wow, I'm surprised they let us descend on this. Yes. Yeah. That's my memory. That's my recollection of this race. There's some fresh tarmac in the last, like, two years. Yeah, there was the last descent back to, like, towards transition. that is so, so rough.

Yeah. I was like gripping the base bar from behind, just so my hands wouldn't slip off. It was not great. And people were taking it very, very cautiously. But yeah, the bike course is unreal, so, so cool. The climbing, the descending, actual cornering. And at first it was pretty congested.

And then I soon got in front of the kind of the masses of people and had room to basically ride the bike course how I wanted to. And it was super, super fun. Heck yeah. Eric, I looked at your Strava segments versus my Strava segments. I don't know how you ride a bike that fast.

When I thought I was like doing 350 watts up these climbs, so I'm like, Eric was 30 seconds faster? Up a three-minute climb. How is this possible? What about me? Yeah, you were also faster. Yeah. I have to look later, but it was a while ago.

So our times were pretty similar, Paula. Certain things they were not. In certain aspects, you were way ahead, but in certain things we were closer. Probably all the dissents. Probably all the dissents. You were better. I didn't even look at the dissents.

But it would be funny to see like the graph. And, you know, compare on Strava. You can see. Yeah, right. I was doing it on a rim break. Oh, you were too, though. Yeah. And that's...

You both raised it in 2015. Yeah, that's how I feel. I would say if you had to choose between a rim-brake T-T-T bike and a disc-break road bike, unless you are a really confident bike handler, I would take the road bike. But there's so much flat. There's so much flat.

Like going through Golden Gate Park? Like, you're in your T-T-T-a-a-lot. You are. And I think it also depends on your fitness level. If you're very fit and you can go fast, the T-T bike is going to be better for sure. If you're not at the front of the race, maybe not. If there were ever a course for it, I think this is it.

But then, anyway, onto the run, last thing. The run was just as a may be, maybe even better. Because it's trail. It's trail the whole time. And I love the dynamicness. It's paths. You're on so many different surfaces with pea gravel, asphalt, climbing stairs, sand. Yeah.

Yeah, a lot of stairs. Don't get in your head that it's like an X-Dera or something that has like, you're like single-tracked the whole time, but you're never on a, you were never on a road. There is some single track. You're crossing some roads, but oh,

you run on the road descending before you go down to the beach. Yeah, on the bike path for at like negative 18% for like 200 yards. That is steep. That is steep. But yeah, the run course also amazing.

You run on the beach, like straight up the beach for, I think of probably a total. of like maybe a mile before you hit the sand ladder. So it gets your legs tired. And then the sand ladder, if you've heard of this race, you've heard of the sand ladder. It is no joke. That thing is for real.

When I was going up it, I was like, Eric ran this. I am running this. Absolutely not. No chance. Zero possibility I was running that. That thing is so steep. It's not even steps. It's just like sand with some wooden dowels on it.

and you were just pulling yourself up that thing for dear life. And then I got a pro tip from Jenna that said, when you get to the top, it's only halfway. Like the sand ladder is over, but you still have to climb to the top of the hill. And I think that was really helpful to know because it never ended. Really brutal.

And Eric, you said that you ran it one year and then walked it one year, right? And you were maybe faster the year you walked it? I was faster relative to the rest of it. of the field the year that I hike walked crap, pulled on the rope situation. Yeah. Yeah.

And then I had this, the last thing, sorry. This is going on longer the road. No, I'm enjoying it. From the top of that, you still have 5K to go. You still have to go lose all of that descent. Run past Chrissy Field. Run past, do you redo your 800 meters from the water part. Yeah.

You've just got a long ass way to go. I was saying to Eric actually the night before your race, I bet you Nick is going to slay the downhill stairs. People were rightfully being very cautious, and I was not. I was just like, all right, skipping steps, jumping over this thing, you know, just going for it. But I try I run a ton here, not in super shoes. So I maybe have a little more just reps with it. But I loved that aspect of it.

So fun. There was actually a technical aspect to all three of the sports in the race. Nick, you need to do an Xtera. We should check you and my downhill segment on that part. Paula, that's beautiful. Thanks. That looks like kind of art. Beautiful piece of art on the whiteboard.

Yep, it is gorge. It's like jelly beans meets tarasso. That's like what I was seeing at the last mile of my run. I saw it was looking just like that. Colorful dots. Oh, I should say something that was so helpful. I forget her name now. But when I started the run like half a mile in, a podcast listener yelled out at me.

You're almost there. No, she didn't yell at me. She said, you're third in your age group, which was nice to hear because when I was climbing up, that climb, after you come out of Golden Gate Park, you make a right, and then you go up that kind of really steep hill there. It's like where the baths are. Some guy goes, you're doing great. You're in the top 100. You're 99th. I'm like, what?

That's not very good. I don't know if I needed to hear that. Out of 2000, though. That's like the top 5%. Yeah, that's not bad. But anyway, when she told me I was top three in my age group, she was actually looking at the tracker. He had just counted the amount of athletes coming through,

and I just started, you know, I started way back in the swim because you have to get in line and he doesn't know the chip time, of course. So when I was coming back and you hit the flat, and then it's like, okay, time to open it up. And to give you an idea of like the delta in, I've never had a bigger difference in average power, normalized power on the bike in a race. And I've never had a difference

between my average pace in a race and my, like the last mile I ran at a 610 pace. And my average pace for the race was 7.15. Like the up and down, it takes so much. It's so fun. No shade would not change a thing.

But don't expect to have a... Not a 10KPR. No. You're not going to have a cute pace. No 10KPRs. And so when I ran down and I kind of was like accelerating more and more and feeling great. I saw that woman again, and then she told me she's like, you moved up to second in your age group. So then I got to run the last half mile with this feeling of, damn, like not only was this race

so, so, so great, so fun, so, what's the word, invigorating. But then I also got to get on my age group podium, which was just the cherry on top. And unnecessary, but a really nice cherry on top. So then you go down that long finish shoot, and of course I'm thinking of, Eric, when I saw him finish, and when you, Eric, when you won before I saw you, had that epic battle. And so I'm like playing these things back in my head. I'm like, God damn.

I love triathlon. This is so great. This is such a great race. Luckily, the podium, the first place guy, whose name is Joe Lancer, he's a podcast listener. And then the third place guy, Kyle, he's a Team T.T.L guy. What? Yeah, I've raced with him. Sweet, baby.

Podium sweep. Podium sweep. So, yeah, it was just a great vibe. Also, the post-race food was maybe the best ever in a triathlon. They had so many options in, like, real food, not just like a banana and a bag of chips, which, you know, you would hope so. The race is not cheap. But, yeah, a super, super, super fun race.

I want to say probably the coolest race I've ever done, not even mentioning how amazing the city of San Francisco is, which I just kind of fell in love with this weekend. So highly, highly, highly enjoyed the whole experience. How do you move to San Francisco? Then it would be a little closer to us. I did think about it. It's kind of prohibitively expensive. Not that that ever really stops me from doing anything.

I try to figure it out. But not the price prohibits you from attempting to get the things that you want. Prohibitively expensive things do deter you. They do deter me, unfortunately. very much so as do I as am I I like a little bit of the amenities that Los Angeles

provides a little bit more but as far as the city goes I do think the city is San Francisco is more beautiful I think he would thrive there man I just did more than I think about it right now I love it and then we could meet in Shasta right in the middle

oh nice yeah the riding there is also pretty elite I rode the day before in Mill Valley and it was unbelievable I mean unbelievable A plus dude. Just loved it. Just loved it.

Thank you guys for kind of helping me out too and giving me tips before. I felt like I went into the race knowing kind of what to do. It was our pleasure, young Padawan. We've got some questions here that we farmed from Instagram. Thanks to everybody who sent these in.

From SD Candy Bar, congrats, Nick. Did you wear thermal cap and booties during the swim? I had a thermal cap and booties. I brought them with me and I made the decision to not wear them. And I would have worn the thermal cap, but the one I have is one of my dad bought

me in 2017 and it's like an extra small or something so it basically does nothing and the race provided one of the really nice latex caps so i yeah heavy duty so i wore that and the booties i've won them before i don't know if you guys have this experience for me they fill up with water and they just feel like so bad the water's going to be so so cold to make it worth it i think so and and i was fine uh my hands weren't numb at no point during the race was i ever thinking i'm too cold So no, didn't wear it either. Right on. Okay.

Our good friend, Ouse. Us, who I hung out with this weekend, by the way. This is one of these people who we've all messaged with probably 50 times, and Nick finally met him in person. He's from Germany. He was like, he was really, really, really stoked to meet any one of us. All right. So basically he asks you, as you've written on your TG bike,

would you say it's worth a TZ bike or a road bike sufficient? You pretty much answered that. I did. I think if you own the TT bike, I just think it's fun to do a triathlon with the TT bike. It makes me feel like it's this purpose-driven tool and I want to use the thing. And I think if you're fast, it's for sure the right tool. I think the slower you get the further back in the field you are, the more likely it is that a road bike might actually be the right tool, especially if you're a little cautious and scared of descending and you have more confidence on your road bike, it might be the right answer. All right. So if you feel like you're fast and you want to go fast, bring a TT weapon. if not bringing the rib I can have the best time. Yep. Okay, most importantly from us, how was the post-race ice cream at this fake Italian thing?

I had a golden gate and a caramel quake shake wishing you had a good recovery champ. I have no idea what this means. I saw him after the race. He told me he was going to Girideli to get a shake after and I was like, oh my God, that's what I'm doing because you and I, Eric,

I made a promise to you and Jackie that if either of you guys won, I would buy you a shake. And then, of course, that year, both of you won. So I bought you guys both a shake. So then I went to Gere Della with a friend and she actually bought me

a shake, which was nice. Yeah. Love the closing of the circle. Yeah. Okay. Lindsay Rochelle, nice work, great write-up and yay bonus podium finished, Nick. If you were actually escaping from Alcatrazwoodhood, would have been the crime you committed. That's a good question.

I'm kind of a rule follower. Too many chocolate croissants. I don't know. What would I have done? Oh, yeah, I don't know. DeFraud the government. Anarchy. I don't know. What about you guys?

I would get a speeding ticket for sure. I would have my dogs off leash where they're not supposed to be. Every week. One a week. Put us on the freaking get us punch card for that. I would probably let all my ceiling dry up before replacing it.

That's my illegal thing. You have to think of a real crime before the end of the podcast. Leave your car on the wrong side of the street during street cleaning day. Relentless Diana. Nice job, Nick was fun, meddling, you at the finish.

Oh yeah, I remember her. I remember her. Yeah. Put the mud on you. Yeah. What was your favorite part of the race? It's not always a swim. You basically said it was the swim.

It was the swim for me. But there is also just like this, and you guys know this, of course, but this feeling I got when I'm on the bike, which is kind of my strength. And when I was going up these hills and I just, it's a short bike. So I was like, I'm going to treat all these hills

like they're the end of the race. And just going as hard as I could up the climbs. and I just felt so strong. That's such a feeling. When you feel fit, you know, it's all relative, but when you feel fit and you're just like, I am freaking crushing this right now. I will snap this chain.

Yeah, I felt good. That's maybe other than the swim, which probably was my favorite. I cannot believe this one was your favorite part of the race. I'm also in handball. I know. I know. What the hell?

If you had told me this last week, I'd be like you're lying to me. This is the power of expectations versus reality right here. expected to be terrible and it was great Big Delta there You're right Nick I'm looking at flights While you're doing your recap

I'm looking at flights for you To come to Lake Placid with us Would you be available for an entire week Maybe yeah I have to I have to see when I'm going to Europe Because I don't My mom knows the dates

But I don't know the dates Maybe you can fly straight to Europe Oh that's not a bad idea That's not a bad idea Yeah it's not a bad idea Yeah, it's not a bad idea. If that works out, that would be, that would be great. That would be perfect. Yeah.

Sorry, that was a distraction, but I just booked our flights. So we're going. So that's why I'm like kind of in that mode. Yeah. Okay. Last question. From Louise Shirley, 22. Congrats. I finally got in years after being part of the lottery, only to sign up because, not sign up because it felt too expensive to justify.

but it does seem kind of like a once-in-lifetime thing. It's so unique. My question is, worth the price tag, assuming you had to travel from Ben to do it. It's funny, she thinks that you live in Ben. I know. But totally understandable. So factoring in those expenses,

thank you for all the inspiration over the years. What's the entry fee? It's almost $1,000 when you count all the stuff. Think about how much do you spend on flights? That's the thing. Even staying in San Francisco is very expensive. and then like food, everything in San Francisco is so expensive. Okay, but imagine you're going on a vacation.

To see Taylor Swift. How much of those tickets cost? So say you're doing like a thousand dollar entropy, a thousand dollars hotel, a thousand dollar flights, $500 for eating, $3,500 for this crazy once-in-a-lifetime experience, it's not out of this question. And I think that is the way to think about this is I don't love the words bucket list being used in triathes. because it kind of breaks my heart when people, you know, they're just like, I'm just going to do an Iron Man to check it off my list. You know, like, I love this sport and I want to do it forever.

And so when people kind of treat it as this like transactional thing, I don't love that. But this race, I do think is worth doing if you do triathlon. It is other than the public craziness around it, and, you know, like we were kind of alluding to before, everyone's heard of this race, it really is special. That swim is special. The bike, you're riding are over the, I mean, the Golden Gate Bridge is beautiful. The Presidio is beautiful. You go down and you run on the beat. It's really, really cool.

So, yes, it's very expensive, but I don't know. I do think it's worth it. I was there in the thick of this. I won it in 2015, and then in 2016, they doubled the entry fee from $450, which had been for like 15 years to, yeah, whatever, like $900. And people were messaging me, people were super mad. pro should boycott the race. And that was exactly my response to everybody was,

I think it sucks. I wish everybody could do this race so badly. But also, there's a limited number of spots on the boat. This race is crazy expensive to put on. And it is, it's a one-time thing. Like,

if you have the money and can get in, great, but I do think it's just up there in the coolest things I've done. And it has a premium price tag attached to it. And, you know, I want a Ferrari, but I know that not everybody can buy

Ferraris, it's like a, it's like a premium product. And I think it's, I think it's justified. And let's not forget that there is a lottery just to get in. So you're complaining about the price, but there's also tons of people

who would love to pay that price who cannot. So it's, they have so much demand for that race, even at that price point. If it was my race, I would have like 100 slots set aside for like kids or need in some sort of, I don't know how you would divide that up,

but I think that would be really helpful. That's a nice idea. That's a nice idea, Eric, and have someone on staff whose job it is to kind of like parse that out. Yeah. Yeah. That's a nice idea.

Yeah. That's the race. As hyped as it is, I think it was maybe even better than I expected it to be. Um. Should we do some, uh,

quote, normal questions? We got some phenomenally good questions this week as well. Not to, like, overload this episode. But this is, yeah, we got a lot of good stuff. I kind of read some of them to you guys before because I was just kind of impressed. Just in case Google and algorithms whatnot brought you here just to listen to Nick's race recap. And what we normally do on this podcast is we take questions from the listeners.

You can send in your questions on that triathlonlife.com slash podcast. And we might read them off here on the show. That's how we keep it going. We don't just talk about ourselves, I promise. Okay, first question here is from Mikey. Hey, Penth, long time listener and watcher, new TTL team member, first time questioner. Hell yeah, Mikey. What do you and other pros do for flying with indoor bike trainers?

I have a kicker, Wahu kicker, but it's way too heavy and bulky to fly with. Can you think of anyone flying with a kicker? That would be truly insane. It gives me nightmares. Is there another kind of trainer that is better for flying with? I travel a fair amount for work, and it's hard to train outside. And hotel gym bikes often suck for anything more than an easy hour spin. Even an hour spin, I feel like on one of those bikes is rough.

Love the pod. Mikey. Yeah, we have a little feedback trainer it's called. And these are the trainers that the T-100 offers us for pre-race rides. They have probably like eight of them that they travel with to all these races. They fit in a little suitcase that's like maybe two feet wide by like 10 inches tall. A little bit bigger than a bowling ball bag. It's like a hot dog.

And it's a little bit heavy, but it's got, it's like a pretty skinny roller type system. You attach your fork to the front and then the wheel on the back spins. So that's what we use. But I bring it to races like 20% of the time because normally I just want to make sure I can get out on the course. T100 has them, so you don't have to bring them to those. And then I don't know. It is like an extra thing to check, but never travel with a kicker as much as we love kickers. That's crazy.

Although back in the day, before kickers, there was this trainer called the Lamond trainer. It was the first direct drive trainer ever made. So loud, so heavy. But it was a direct drive trainer and it was like cutting edge technology because these didn't really exist yet. And we would, Simon Whitfield would use them. We had some at the National Training Center. and when we went to training camps in Europe, Simon would check this Le Mans trainer in a huge box on the airplane.

So it's been done. It's possible. But it's super heavy. It's its own piece of luggage. And unless you're going for like an extended camp somewhere, it's not worth bringing it. I mean, we even sometimes don't want to bring our kicker in the van because it's... Yeah.

We never want to bring it in the van if we don't have to. We love it, but... Well, I always insist on it because even if we're somewhere I can't, ride, I can set up the kicker outside the van and ride it outside. Like, I've done that so, so many times. Our first order of business, when we go to a race, if we think that's what we need, we ask everybody that we know in that area to ask everybody that they know in that area, if someone has a kicker that we can borrow. Like, I have a kicker here that's, that Paula gave to me, but it's like the only people that ever use it are you guys. We specifically not taking it back

for this reason. And if that doesn't work, then we bring that feedback sports roller system. Great. Okay. Next question here. Hey, Tripod. Recently got into the podcast, been running through the catalog extremely quickly. Thought I'd send in a question. How do you balance passion for so many different subsets of the sport? Road, Xtera, ultra running, mountain bike, and your goals in them without feeling like you're missing out on what you could achieve if you focused solely on one. I love so many different multi-sport events and don't know how to plan my racing without this struggle. Love the laid back feel of the pod and all the knowledge you share. Thanks, Lily from New Zealand. For me, I guess, especially later in life slash career, I have arrived at the place of I would rather experience more things than be 3% better at one of those things. I spent years of my life as a professional triathlet focusing and not doing these other things that came into my brain. And now lately, this is, I think, what do you have to ask yourself all the time, right?

Like, experience more things versus being the best or better version of yourself at one little thing. I'm going with experience more things. And, you know, like I'm not doing anything like base jumping. Like, this is all aerobic activity. So I do really, really believe that as long as you check the skills box a little bit in some of these like the mountain bike arena or whatever, fitness applies across all the things that you've mentioned.

You don't have to choose that much. You know the saying of like, why be good at one sport when you can be mediocre at three triathletes love to say this. I think the truth is most of us, if we focused on one sport, we'd be mediocre at the one sport. So you might as well be mediocre at three. I'm not talking about the two of you. And funny enough, both of you are actually super elite at individual sports outside of a triathlon. But for most of us, variety is the spice of life.

Eric, somehow you're making it work where you're having your cake and eating it too. but I think even if you wouldn't, it's just more fun to do different things. This is what got us into triathlon in the first place, I think. Yeah, you know, I guess I would finish it off by just saying, follow your heart. And sometimes it feels really, really, really good to focus in and be better every day at one little thing.

And sometimes, you know, you're wondering, why do that? And I guess don't fight that. Yeah. Unless it's your job to make money in one of these specific areas. Yeah, love that. Yeah. next one here's from Parker hey TTL my carbon bike seat post

keeps slipping despite being torqued to spec with a carbon paste applied could my weight 240 pounds be the cause and if so what's the fix thanks Parker what bike that shouldn't be happening though it doesn't say what bike

it should not be happening yeah there are bike brands historically especially ones with aeroseet tubes you know very aeroseet posts that have had this problem I'll just say it. If you got like a 10 years ago, Cervello, you might, this is your fate.

A bike will be weighted, will be spec for a certain weight. So check that you're within the spec for the weight. But 240 pounds should be within every single bike other than some like super one-off, super light bikes. So it probably is just not great engineering. Or you got a little bit of a dud. Like there were, when I worked in the bike,

shop. There were multiple people each year that had multiple seat post slipping issues. And we tried carbon paste. We tried doing a little electrical tape job. All sorts of things. They would just end up pulling, like just breaking things, trying to tighten this down enough. And I think there is just the tolerances were very tight and it wasn't able to grip. And arrow post is just, they're wonky. Do you think the solution is like, how do you go above spec on torque or do you not Do you not even toy with that idea? I think you just buy yourself a new bike. You deserve it.

That seems to be always the right solution, doesn't it? I agree. I don't feel like I can recommend you over torque or... Fair. Speak to your doctor. Yeah. Speak to a medical professional. Okay.

Next one here. Love this one. Why are they called bibs? Liz. I have no idea. Wrong answers only. Why are they called bibbs? They're actually great for cooking in.

It looks like an apron. What you call an apron? A bib? Yeah. Like a baby bib? Yeah, I think that, like, maybe when you have no shirt on and the straps are over your shoulders, it looked like a bibb. Maybe, especially in the early days. And also, this is an American term.

In cycling culture and passion, came from Italy. So, bibs. The shammy, the chamois. It is because they're shaped like, like bibs. That is where it comes from. Like shaped like a baby bib? Well, a bib like suspenders. Oh, okay.

Spenders are considered bits. That's where it comes from. Yeah, I think so. I mean, I could do a quick little Google here. Because that's, my brain which is suspenders. I just haven't ever heard of them called bibs. Cycling bibs are called bibs because they feature integrated suspender-like shoulder straps reminiscent of traditional bib overalls. They're all bib overalls.

Boom. There we go. That's true. That's it. That's the answer. That's the answer. Okay. next one here. It's from Alana. Hi, Paul, Nick, Eric Flynn, and Harper. Wow. This is becoming too long.

Sometimes when I need them both to come at the same time, I say flurper. So feel free to adopt that. It's not my best work. Flaper. I feel like that's what happens when you... It didn't happen on purpose the first time. It's like a shart, but you flarp. Yeah, exactly. They got to be real in trouble. I know this is a sensitive topic, but how do you deal with the fact that your physique doesn't reflect the training that you do? Backstore, I used to have a very lean physique due to an eating disorder I recovered from. But ever since I first started running in December, when I started training for the L.A. Marathon and now biking, swimming, and running, training for my first triathlon in July, I've gained a lot of weight and inflammation.

Any tips on getting rid of this? Or do I just need to give my body time to adjust to the training? Sorry, this is long and personal, but I'll see Nick at Long Beach. Hope to see Eric and Paula at my first 70.3 whenever it may be. Lana from Redondo Beach. Paula, do you feel like you can speak to this at all? Yeah, I think that sometimes a fairly toxic way of thinking is more exercise equals skinnier, equals more muscular, equals fitter looking. But a lot of the time when people start triathlon or endurance sport, that doesn't necessarily happen. And I don't think it's a bad thing.

It doesn't mean that your heart is not getting fitter or your body's not getting any healthier. But from an external perspective of how you see yourself in the mirror, maybe it's not changing how you would expect. I think that diet maybe has a lot to do with your figure. And I'm not saying restricting your diet, but actually eating more than you think you need. And I think my personal experience is when I started eating a lot more and fueling myself properly is when I actually leaned out more. Because your body's no longer in a state of feeling like I need to store all of this because I'm exercising so much. And I feel like I'm in a state of starvation. So I'm like storing body fat.

I don't know if this is scientifically accurate. But I do think that if you are giving yourself enough fuel, your body will naturally regulate itself when it feels like, oh, I'm always going to be fueled properly. I don't have to worry. Do you feel like this is especially true around exercise, fueling around, like timing-wise, around exercise? Or was it more of a general thing? Yeah, but just generally getting enough calories in the day. Not, yeah, of course, while you're training, but also like having a really big dinner, eating enough breakfast, making sure you eat lunch, snacking throughout the day. So that you're not at a calorie deficit.

Not being hungry and not eating. Not thinking I shouldn't eat because I'm trying to get skinny or I'm not. I'm trying to get fast. Like, just I'm hungry. Give the body what it wants. I think something that I've heard a lot with this kind of thing is when you get hungry and then you don't eat, it kind of creates this like big swing in the other direction. And then you kind of binge eat and like eat and make these like choices maybe you

wouldn't normally make with food. And it's better off to just feel consistently. Eat when you're hungry. Eat good food all the time. For sure. Yeah. It is a sensitive topic though. And everyone's body is so different.

but they're i mean i've fallen to this trap too where i'm like i'm training 25 hours a week how am my chubby you know it's so toxic because like we also see ourselves as maybe in a more negative light than how we actually look but it has so much stress also can contribute to your body weight and holding on to oh for sure fat and holding on to water and um there's so many factors beyond just like how many hours am I exercising? And the other thing about it is like being leaner doesn't make you faster. This is this is the point, which is focus on your performance. Focus on getting as being as good of an athlete as possible. And I think the more you do that, this has happened to me. I think Eric has told me explicitly that this has happened to him.

The more you do that, the more you kind of like, oh yeah, my body's just going to be whatever it needs to be so that I am as fast as possible. I'm as efficient as possible. And it's going to take whatever shape it needs to take. And I think you can decouple that from the social expectation of what an athlete is supposed to look like, whatever that means. It's just a win-win. Yeah, I do actually think triathlons in a pretty healthy space in general, especially in women's sport right now, where the very, very fastest women in triathlon are not the leanest looking necessarily, you know. And I think it just speaks a lot to fueling well to being strong versus being. as light as you possibly can.

Back in the day, when I was racing short course and I was trying to be as light as I could, and it was like definitely in everyone's mind all the time, people were getting insured way more. It's like not sustainable to have this quote-unquote, like, lean, fit-looking physique necessarily. It actually is a lot healthier to be heavier and to be more robust and you'll be faster. So, yeah, it's hard to not stress about it. It's like such a prevalent thing in endurance sport, but also it's... Is the training going well? Do you feel good?

Exactly. Are you healthy? Are you getting faster? Do you feel good? Who cares what you think you look like? As we're answering this question, I'm just realizing there's certain topics that would be so easy for us to just skip over and not address on the podcast. Because it's hard to talk about this stuff.

And I don't say it's hard because I have any personal relationship with this stuff. But it's hard for all of us because we're like, we're scared. We're going to say the wrong thing here and get people upset. Yeah, I was a little like hesitant. But it's the reality. It's in all of our heads. Yeah. Eric's been through it too, of course.

Yeah. I've had an eating disorder. I've been treating for an eating disorder in college. So I feel very qualified to talk about this. For sure. And to speak directly to the person's question, it does take a long time. It took my body three years to normalize. I went from, I literally put on 50 pounds while going through the process of treatment and everything,

and it took another three or four years for me to lose some of that and my body to figure out and self-regulate, its appetite and its metabolism and everything back to what I would call, quote, normal. So give your body time. It's had a rough go. Be good to it. Would you also say it took your brain three years? Dude, honestly, no. I went through such shit and such hell in the year that I dealt with that.

that I was so ready to have that out of my brain and out of my life, that it was like flicking a switch for me, and I was very fortunate in that regard. That's great. Not many people have that experience. That's great. Okay, next question here. There was going to be another heavy one,

but we'll intersperse a lighter one here. Hi team, this is from Jeff. Hi, team, Eric, the deep section wheels on your shiv build are hot, exclamation mark. They're so good, aren't they? I was running 808's front and rear on my P5-6. It felt like I was riding a prize bull as soon as, So I was at speed. The thing was brutal to handle and felt like I was going to get thrown off at any second.

And it isn't my first rodeo on bikes. Okay, no more puns. Very nice. I slipped to 404 back up front and handling became manageable again, which leads me to my question for the group. Have you ever experienced heard of or seen? Oh, I love this question. Someone getting blown over on their bike because it was too much of a sail in the wind.

Like not hitting a pothole or anything in the road, truly getting blown over or falling. in the arrow tuck because it got to unstable right on Jeff. And I think this is just like a good question of an antibike. Have you ever heard of anyone actually crashing because of wind? I think the most famous example of this is Sister Madonna Booter in Kona. I think she was 78 years old at the time. Got blown off the Queen K on her bike, broke her collarbone, ended her race.

Like an infamous thing that they talked about for several years. about like, the winds here are so insane last year. You know? Wow. She was the non, the triathlon nun. She would do train for cona. She's a legend of the sport. Wow, so it can happen.

Yeah, and then I think you saw a guy get speedwobble in St. George. Was that not wind-related? Oh, my God, that was so scary. No, I don't think it was unrelated. I think he was just like on a, he was an older guy and it was on a road bike. And it was just like, it was downhill. It was after Snow Canyon. It was a downhill after Snow Canyon.

That was scary. Oh, my God. So I guess we should say. We have heard of it, but it is so, so incredibly rare, even though it feels like it's definitely, like it's definitely going to happen. I know how it feels. Yeah, it's scary. But I do think it's worth riding a narrower front wheel if you're scared of that because it's a real feeling. Totally.

And if you're going to pop out an arrow every 10 seconds because you're scared of it and then it's defeating the purpose of the deep section front wheel. Yes, yes, of course. My shiv is definitely more squirrely that way. But what I've noticed is if I'm doing a pre-wrought, well, this is like, of course, I'm going to say this. So typical of me. But if I'm riding an 8-58 in training before the race and I'm freaking the fuck out because it's windy and I hate it and I'm like, I should have brought my 4-5-4,

I get to the race riding the 8-58 even if it's just as windy and I'm completely fine. Right, right. So you get this race brain where you're like pushing more power and therefore the bike is more stable for one. And you're just careless because you're like, there's something on the line here. Yeah.

But I think speed wobbles also have to do a little bit with the bike itself and the equipment you strap onto the bike. I never equate the two with speed wobbles. You're not getting speed wobbles because of your deep dish wheels. Yeah. You're getting speed wobbles because you're... Something else is up. Crazy-ass attachment or you're riding a...

bleep that. You never know. It deserves to not be bleeped. I'm just going to say it. It's a danger. We're not going to throw them under the bus like that. We have insight information. No, I have first-hand information riding with someone with this bike,

getting the most insane speedwobbles every time we go down a hill. I can't wait to see the comments as people are trying to guess or contributing their personal information on what brand they think it is. Oh, for sure. By the way, I've been really loving the Spotify comments. Anyone, we've been getting a lot of comments per episode, and it is fun. I read them all, by the way, and I'll reply to them sometimes as well. Okay, next question here is from Paul.

love this question. How do you know when you're pursuing personal excellence versus just chasing validation? Paul. Oh boy. Wow, Paul. Are you Paul from shrinking? Are you Harrison Ford? I don't even understand this question. You guys can answer it. That's a sign I think all of it itself. It's how much are you trying to get society at large to appreciate that you're doing this hard thing and that you are more worried. as a member of society because you can do this thing versus doing this thing for yourself. Are we doing it for the Strava Kudos? The metaphorical Stravacudos.

Or is there something within us that is telling us I can do hard things and that is why I do this. Well, I think you can't answer it as a professional because we're doing it as our job. So it's neither. Yes and no, because on the deepest level of motivation, I don't think it's because I, you know, the thing that gets you through the hardest moments

is not because I have sponsors. It's whatever is one of these two things, I think. Like, are you ultimately trying to impress to other people or not be a loser or be worthwhile? Or are you like, I just want to find out what the limit is for me and if no one else even knows about it, it's okay. But do you think, Eric, there's actually a third option, which is you're racing and you do want to beat the other competitors,

but it's not for validation against anyone else. It is to prove something to yourself. I feel like that's kind of the other option. I don't know if that's a third option versus another way to say the other option. External versus internal, I think is just the root of this, yeah? When I read this question,

I thought about Paula challenging me to not post an activity to Strava and what that would feel like. It's just funny, today I went for a walk in Big Sur because I camped out in Big Sur last night. and I was just by myself and I went for a walk and I turned Strava on and I kept it private but I gave it a title. I gave it a description and I put photos and videos in it just for myself so I can see it later. And I was like, okay, there's step one of this process.

Like I don't really care about a walk. I like doing that too actually, Nick. You're journaling ultimately. I'm journaling, yeah. And that's what Strava kind of feels like sometimes. Yeah, most of my, all of my activities that I don't share, I still title and put pictures because I like looking back. That's funny. I didn't know that.

Yeah, same. Yeah, they're just like for myself. I do think what's interesting about this is that it's not like one or the other. Like you can be totally personally motivated and everything, but then it's okay if somebody else tells you good job and that feels good. Oh, I love that. Yeah, why be so binary about it? So black and white.

Yeah. When I started the sport, I wanted to prove something to myself, but I also, of course, if I'm being honest, I did want people who knew me to think, oh look, he can do this thing that isn't music. He's doing this hard thing. And as time has gone on,

I care less and less about that. It doesn't go away, at least not for me. But I do feel more attached to myself. This has got to just also track with like maturation as a person. Like this is probably also a metaphor for life. Can you think of a truly Zen person who's out there chasing validation?

No, but we all did to some degree, at least when we were kids. and eventually at some point, I think you become satisfied with who you are and know who you are, and that's enough. You hope so? Yeah. Yeah.

Great question, Paul. I'm not sure we answered it, but I think it's an interesting topic to discuss. A plus. We talked about it. That's worth something. Yeah. Okay, we got a couple more.

This one's great. Question, I live in a big city in Vietnam with no natural surfaces to run on. What order would you put these surfaces for daily running from best to worst? Tarmac Road, interlocking concrete pavers, cement concrete sidewalk, packed bricks, granite pavers, or a treadmill. But one is not like the others, first of all.

This is taking me back to racing in Asia so hard. I know all of these surfaces. Okay. So you guys believe that there's a difference between running on concrete and running on... For sure there is. Yeah. I just don't understand. Cement is so much harder than asphalt.

They're both very hard. They're both as hard as hard gets to me. I don't see how... Dude, no, no, no. Go jump up and down on some asphalt, some black tarmac, and then jump up and down on like a granite tile. Really?

There's a difference. Granite is the worst. Wow, I just can't believe that that's true. Of like, through foamed mid-soul shoes that there's a difference in your body running on one of the other. But I guess, I guess there is. Okay, maybe...

The treadmill is the best for your body if you're talking about softness. It goes treadmill, asphalt, brick maybe. All the other crap you were talking about. Last would be like cement and tile. Yeah. But I think shoes compensate for this a lot these days because you get shoes that have super cush and, you know, I don't think necessarily those shoes are good for your feet and for getting strong feet because you're just like relying so much on the cushioning.

but they do help protect against potential stress fractures of running exclusively on hard surface. And I also do think that your body gets used to running on hard surface. Like for me, if I'm running mostly on trails, if I go do a single run on like the concrete path that you run on Nick at the beach, I'll be sore. But you do it every day and you don't get sore. So there's like an adaptation period where your legs get used to it. And I do think that's also why it's important to do some runs intentionally on hard surface because you're always going to be racing on hard surface. So getting a little bit of like resilience in your legs, free race is good if you live somewhere where you're always running on soft.

Yeah, that's smart. Okay, well, I'm not a fun one. This is from Blink. Hey, Flynn and Harper. Blink, 182. Yeah, this is Blink the Whippet. Oh, I love this question. Yeah.

So would you please pass a question on from my servant to your servants for me? Ask them, if you're having an off day when doing. doing high effort intervals and repeats, is it better to ease off the intensity and do the full time or full intensity and shorten the interval? Woof and ask for a treat for being so tolerant of your humans, blank. So tolerant of us. Is he speaking specifically of the dog?

No, I think he's speaking on behalf of his servant. Yeah. I don't think Flynn's ever thought, I'm tired today. I'm going to reduce the intensity. No, I think he goes all out until he passes out. Yes, literally. Passes out over the trail. Run today with a hue

It's not great. Big blow. I don't know. I go with the ladder. I used to go with the former and just do everything I could to try to like complete 20 minutes and get the highest watts I could

until death. And now I think I'm a little more reasonable with like, I'm trying to learn how to go this pace. Right. And you want like the physiological stress of that pace, right? That seems to be maybe the more important thing.

Kind of depends. If we're talking about things that are like five minutes and down, yes. If we're talking about like a 25 minute trail running interval, then I think doing the distance and trying to nail the perceived exertion I go for. That actually seems like the hybrid right answer. I just made it up. I didn't even say this question beforehand. I had no idea. That's good.

Blink the whip it. Yeah. Tell your peeps. It depends on the day for me. Another option is just abort mission. Let's do this tomorrow. Throw biking bushes, call Uber, start over. I'm not good at this option, but...

It is there. Actually, last week during an interval session, I did both things. I reduced the duration and the intensity. Hell yeah. When I should have just gone home. And I got told after that you should have just gone home instead of like crying your way through this

and not the right intensity or duration or perceived exertion or perceived exertion. Emotional load is hard. Sometimes you just need to like call it quits. If it's really you're having that mental battle in your head of oh, do I do less watts or less time? Just do nothing.

That's okay. That is okay sometimes. It means you're so tired that you'd probably be better off going home and resting and eating and trying it again another day. Also, just to confirm this, I spent the last two weeks before my race now, basically doing no run intensity, not really being able to bike much at all, and not swimming, and I still felt really, really good during the race. So your body can handle time off from training just fine. I promise you'll be okay. That actually is a pretty good litmus test for that, because you barely rode your bike. And I think if you were doing a Iron Man, you'd be a little more

screwed. Yes. But for like a half or what you just did at Alcatraz, if anything, you kind of got a little fresher. Don't be fresh. Very fresh. Very fresh. Yeah. Don't be tired. And I wasn't. I felt like ready to rip from the, from the start. Yeah. And you were excited to. That's why. Yeah. A lot of the time I go into race is like, oh my gosh, I can't believe I have to do this all hard. That is means you're tired. DBT. We should make sure it's say that. Don't be tired. Don't be tired. Okay. I'm not shirts, but let's just like... Keychain?

I don't know. I saw a guy with a shirt that said never again, and I really liked that. Never again. Hashtag escape from Alcatraz. Yeah, exactly. Awesome. Is that our last one? That's our last one. Dang.

A plus questions this week. I had a lot of love in San Francisco from podcast listeners, by the way. Really appreciate that. TTL runs deep there. Yeah, I didn't realize how deep. it runs there, but it did. I kind of thought it would be a track more like once a year or once a lifetime

triathletes, but there were definitely many serious lifers there who also do the race. If it's a lottery, you gotta have thought of it the year before. Check, realized it's a lottery. They're trying to get into the lottery versus nobody's like impulse.

Should I do? Well said. This month. Did you see Molly there? Molly? I did. I talked to her. I talked to her. Yeah. Molly Lester. Is that her last name? Yes. Yeah, yeah. She was great.

She was like, she's so fast. She's crazy fast. Yeah, she's really fast. I think I just expect her to kind of like win everything she does. And I think she got second. Anyway, yes, we chatted and she was up on the podium as well. So you and her are the same speed. Do you both got second?

I mean, relatively speaking, she is light years faster than I am. But I think in the overall time, I think I beat her by like a minute or two. Oh, wow. She's fast. She's very quick. Quick. What was I going to say? Oh yeah.

I just did a, I recorded a podcast with Matt Leado for Ironman. He asked me this morning. We recorded a couple hours later. Did a little like preview about the rest of my season. I wasn't as honest as I am on this podcast. But it might be worth a listen if you want to go check that out. I don't know when it's coming out. Because you can always text me and be like, hey, take that shit out.

I don't know if honest is the right word versus. raw. Raw. Oh, that's true. I'm always honest. I'm always honest. I'm just very like, I'm just talking to you guys on this podcast.

So I say a lot of stuff that maybe later I regret. But, no, it was fun. But I've been podcasting for like three hours today. Plus we're leaving tomorrow for Happy Valley. Yeah. Happy Valley coming up this weekend. Tomorrow we're leaving for Portland and then Happy Valley.

Oh boy. Dog, you know, yeah. We're doing it though. We're all packed. As I was packing up the bikes today and waxing chains and doing all the things, and I was just thinking about St. George's North American Championships. How dare they?

How dare you stand where he stood? I'm just wondering, it just because I have that emotional attachment to it. Like, does everybody else have like, are they as hyped about, you know, this as I was about St. George just because I got the history and, you know, I don't know. I do think State College is probably a cool city or a town. or whatever it is, because it's like a college town. They've got this real loyal student following in a huge arena. But there's absolutely no way on earth that it's as cool as St. George.

No, nothing's going to beat St. George in terms of iconicness. I still care about it. But I definitely don't have the same level of like, oh, yeah, I love this race. Granted, I've never been there. What does it mean in terms of, like, as a user professional, what is this accolade that it is given of North American Championships What does that mean to you, difference? More prize money, more points?

Yes. Prize money points, prestige. I guess a little bit of prestige, but I don't know what it even means. But yes, the prize money is higher. My bonuses are better. I don't know. I don't really care that much about that stuff leading into it. But it does also attract usually a bigger field.

Right. You know, people will prioritize it. And it is a pro series race this year. So it has a broadcast, has a little bit of hype around it. and has a decent field. So hopefully I'll feel better than I did in Chattanooga. I went from retirement to heading to my next race. Here we go.

Oh, story. Tale is oldest time. Well, thanks for listening, everybody. We'll see you next week. We'll talk to you next week with a fresh recap of my race. It's going to be even better than next Alcatraz recap. I'm going to be like, I loved the swim. I loved the bike.

It was so awesome. I would love that. I love that. Optimism, a hateer. Actually, the swim is my favorite part. Well, I would bet any, any amount of money that that is not going to be true. It is. I'm going to prove it to you guys next week.

All right. I'll talk to later. Bye.