That Triathlon Life Podcast - T100 Dubai triathlon reflections, Swim Sets With Paula, swim skin sleeves, and more!

Episode Date: November 21, 2024

This week, we get Paula's take on what it was like racing the T100 series this year and how it compares to her experience racing middle-distance triathlons in the past. We introduce a new segment: Swim Sets with Paula and then dive into listener-submitted questions. Topics this week include:Dealing with disappointment after an unsatisfying raceWhat Eric would have done differently (and similarly) to prepare for an UltraConcerns about losing speed toward the end of the seasonLiving and training without Strava PremiumCoping with a 17-meter poolSleeved vs. sleeveless swim skinsA big thank you to our podcast supporters who keep the podcast alive! To submit a question for the podcast and to become a podcast supporter, head over to ThatTriathlonLife.com/podcastSSWP2,800 total:Warm up:200 Choice8x25 (alternating fast/easy) 15s restsMain Set:200 pull+paddle 30s rest4x125 freestyle (descending 1 to 4) 10s rest200 pull+paddle 30s rest4x125 freestyle (descending 1 to 4) 10s rest200 pull+paddle 30s rest4x125 freestyle (descending 1 to 4) 10s rest200 pull+paddle 30s restCool Down: 100 kick

Hey everyone, Nick here. Wanted to give you a little warning that the audio is going to be a little funky on this episode because we had some technical difficulties that ended up needing us to use a web recording for the audio. The first four minutes are especially not great, but then after that it settles in a little bit better. But next week we'll be back to our normal high-quality audio. Anyway, hope you enjoy this one nonetheless. Hey, everyone. Welcome to that triathlon life podcast.

I'm Eric Loggerstrom. I'm Paula Finley. I'm Nick Goldston. And we are coming to you, Paula, are back in Bend. Nick is in Santa Monica. Paula just got back from Dubai, where she raised the T-100 Grand Final. She's a pro-traithlet. I'm a pro-traithlet.

Nick is a professional musician, best friend, amateur triathlete. Pretty good one. And this is our trathlone podcast, where we're going to talk a little bit about the races that we've done, what's going on on our trathleton journey, maybe a little bit about what's going on in the triathlon world in general. But most importantly, we will answer some questions submitted by you. Whoever is listening to this. Paula, what time is it for you right now?

Doesn't matter. It's 6.30 p.m. Oh, wow. She's game time. I'm super grumpy and I'm super tired. I'm only doing this. You know what? I would actually not say you are super grumpy.

Because I have seen you when you're super grumpy. I would not put this even remotely in the cast. category. Okay, maybe I'm not grumpy. I think you're actually in a pretty good mood. You are tired, though. Yeah, I'm tired. I'm in the mode where, like, I was just sitting downstairs reading my book that I'm obsessed with, and I just like start sleeping, like that. You know, you don't even think about it. You just start sleeping. Instant sleeping. So I, the time change is one thing, but honestly, the reason I feel like terrible is the travel. I think I'm the one, although not that it's a competition. but of anyone that raised, I had the longest traveled by a factor of a lot.

That makes sense. Yeah. Yeah, the west coast of the U.S. to Dubai is pretty rough. So it took me about 36 hours door to door to get home. And to make it even worse, you know, for the athletes that are in Boulder or whatever, you fly into a major airport, Denver, you being having to fly into Redmond, it's like always an extra step to this regional airport. Yeah, so I did fly through Denver coming back with a couple.

couple other athletes that raced, but then I had a three-hour layover another three-hour flight. So, yeah, it just extends it that much more, which is fine. And I've, anyway, there's nothing I can do about it. But that's, that's truly why I feel worse, I think, than the actual time change. Yeah, I was talking to you earlier and you were actually, you seemed like you were fine. And it was 1.30 in the morning for you technically. Well, I was in bed. But just to make matters worse, to make matters worse, I have had this all planned out.

I've had this planned out for months. to apply for my green card as soon as I get back from New Zealand. And in order to do that, there's a bunch of, like, medical requirements. And within that medical exam, you have to have a bunch of vaccines. And I'm not like an anti-vaxxer, but I don't like getting vaccinations like during race season. Five at once too. You don't know how they're going to make you feel. Yeah, but we're at the time now where I don't really have a choice. Like, we're applying for this thing. I need to get the medical check and had to get these vaccines. So I had a lot of shock. into my arm today and my arms are sore now and they're all making me feel kind of weird. So

I figured like just while I'm down with a jet leg, let's just like shoot me down a little bit more with the vaccines. I thought that timing would work. I have to pull you out of bed by the feet tomorrow morning. Yeah. So it might take me a couple days to come back to life. But yeah, I'm home. So that's the most relieving thing is being home after being on the other side of the world. It was a very weird feeling to me to be so far away. Does it also feel relieving that the T-100 races are done for the year? Yeah, they went by, I mean, it was such a long season, but at the same time, it went by very fast to me.

Like, it's all come and gone. And I think that every race, I learned a little bit more. And no matter where it was or how I felt about the course or how I did in the race, I did always appreciate the experience of the week. Like the T-100 always took really nice care of us. There was a bike mechanic there, massage guy. Logistics were sorted. Really like a fun, relatively fun week leading into these, being around all the other

athletes. And the more that I did them, the more it became very familiar with the same people. And you get to know everyone involved, not just the other athletes, but everyone on the logistics team as well, who's involved in putting them on. So, yeah, it became like a very comfortable environment, I guess. Even though I was in Dubai, there were a lot of people there that I knew. And it did suck that Eric wasn't there. And it was harder than I thought that would be.

But it was balanced, I guess, a bit by just knowing the team. Did it feel similar to your ITU days when you were going around with all the same athletes to all these different places and staying in the same hotels? Slightly, but I'm just in a different phase. of my life now where, you know, the global runaround and living out of a suitcase and being in a hotel room is like a little bit harder for me now than it used to be. Not glamorous. Yeah. I mean, the hotel was super nice. And I think post race, like, I was sad and like very open about how I was upset about my race and everything. And a lot of retired athletes reached out to me and said, like, you don't know it now. But these are the days you'll miss when you aren't doing this. And it's pretty crazy to be flying to Dubai. and staying in this crazy hotel and having all these experiences. And yeah, there's a lot of pressure and my race didn't go as I wanted it to, but those aren't really the things you remember.

You remember these trips and going to Dubai and the people you were with. So, yeah, just trying to find some like silver lining since the race didn't really go how I wanted it to. Okay. Well, speaking of which, you don't have to do a race recap, but I know I would like to hear from you since we actually haven't talked that much since the race, any takeaways that you felt, even just like your emotions around it, doesn't have to be performance related. Just kind of your takeaway from that experience.

My takeaway from the T-100 in general, and then this race just kind of solidified it, is the thing that's hardest for me about the series and committing to a series like this is that you're a little bit forced to race even if you don't feel ready and even if you don't feel excited about it. And I think that me in particular, I do best in races that I get. get really excited for. I get like the course. I like the conditions. I've had a good training block and all of that as a result of looking forward to going to something. And some of the court races on the series I was excited for and they did suit me really well and the travel was a bit

less. But this race in particular for like months I've been dreading it, worried about it, thinking about how far it is, thinking about the heat, thinking about the technical course and thinking about all that was on the line for this final race that had like double the points and like could shuffle around the rankings so much based on how you do. And unfortunately, the outcome was kind of what I had imagined. Like I didn't think I could do well at this race and then I didn't. So there's so much about an outcome that like you, you prepare, you get ready in your head and this, unfortunately, was one where that was not a positive buildup and then ended up not being a positive race. So I don't know. Like we can't always do things we want in life

and we can't always, sometimes this is really a job and it feels like a job and you've got to do something you don't want to do. But that's what I'm kind of juggling now, whether I do this series next year or not, is going and racing when I don't feel ready and when I don't feel excited for it never ends well for me. And unfortunately, there's several races in the circuit and just the nature of like traveling overseas four or five times a year that is really, really hard for me. So yeah, that's my takeaway is I came back from this and it's not like I feel so overly exhausted and burnt out and ready for a break necessarily. I'm actually still have energy. And I think when I think about New Zealand in 70.3 worlds in Taupo, I'm excited.

about that idea and I want to get ready for it well and I want to perform well there and I want to go and do that course like that looks like a fun course and the one that suits me really well and conditions that suit me so I'm actually going to do that race and although a lot of people have said like enjoy your off season I'm not really on off season I have this huge sense of relief that the Dubai race is done I've put this really big challenge behind me at the outcome is not what I wanted, but I still feel motivated to train and have a good race at World Championships and finish the year on like a bit of a higher note than what I did last weekend. My brain works pretty much the same way. We do the same thing. We're not exactly the same person,

but very similar. So when I see her not overly excited about this course and seeing things that are you know, not in her wheelhouse or whatever and trying to come to grips with that. Like, all I can do is, like, try to say the things that I try to tell myself when I have tried to get ready for an event or something that doesn't feel like, you know, it's harder to imagine an outcome that you're excited about. And I think we've gotten a little bit what we came into the half Iron Man. the 70.3, the, you know, whatever, distance world leaving ITU was a little bit of going towards that of I can dictate my own schedule. I can pick races that are good for me. I don't just have to go where triathlon Canada or USA triathlon tells me to go. And this has been, you know, we got used to that and that was nice. And then this has been a little bit of an adjustment to go back to that.

So I don't know. It's as I was sitting here and a man, imagining Paula, like literally on the other side of the earth, I mean, I just was so impressed and proud that she just went out there and did it because I had to really look inside of myself and go, man, it's so hard for me to imagine myself doing that. And, you know, whatever came out of it, I was just really proud that she went over there and did what she'd committed to doing with that contract and finished it off. I really think the T100 is doing amazing things for the sport and I am in full support completely of it. I really don't want to come across with all of my post race reflections as like bitter towards it or thinking it's a bad thing or whatever.

But for me as an athlete personally, just like, is it for me? I don't know. I was 10th in the series overall, so I do have an automatic contract and we haven't received our contracts yet. So I don't know what it'll look like financially or commitment-wise. compared to this year. So I think once I do see it, I'll have a clear idea, whether it's something that's worth it or doable for me or something that makes me excited to train, because ultimately that's really what has to happen is like set out a schedule where I really want to do every single race on there. And I can imagine myself performing well and setting myself up for success. So, yeah, this is not like a knock on the T-100 in any way.

It's just a, like a discussion whether I can mentally do it next year or not. Yeah, it's very interesting. I mean, even looking back in, you know, just in the past couple of years, I remember when 70.3 Worlds was in Nice. Both Lionel and Jan just immediately when that was announced, that is not a course for me, not doing it. Jan as well, really. Yeah, just like straight out of the gate.

I would have thought, Jan would be good at that. But yeah, I see what you're saying. I see your point. Yeah, and that's the thing that you can do if you're not contracted to do, you know, the entire series of something. So, yeah, you can pick a choose a little more. And Lionel did that this year. Yeah. That's just like pros and cons.

And it is just, yeah, I think Paula nailed it. We're just kind of reflecting just on where we are at in our careers, you know, and how this series fits into how we saw our lives and careers and trathons and everything going. Yeah, like going to 70.3, the highlights of my year, we're going to 70.3 Chambla, going to 70.3, St. George. Those are what stand out of my mind. And not just because I won the races, but it's not a huge coincidence that I was excited for them. The course suit me, and then I win. And from a financial perspective, I make more winning a 70.3 than I do coming fifth or sixth at a T-100 event. So there's obviously a lot of benefits in the T-100 for our appearance fees and the payout at the end. But I'm trying not too much to make my decision about next year solely around the financials and how much money I would make.

Obviously, money is really important and this is our job, but we're really lucky to have several sources of income from our sponsors. And going to race, Iron Man races is still a really good source. of income for us. So it's not all about the paycheck. And, you know, if I was going to go and do what Taylor Nib's doing and win every T-100, you can't turn down those kind of dollars. But if you're kind of finishing where I'm finishing this year, I think that then I can make the decision whether it's worth it. So. Iron Man World Championships are a really hot race. And then now T-100 championships are also a hot race. Does that feel unfair? It seems like that favors a certain kind of athlete and yes,

you can do heat prep, but it does seem like certain bodies are physiologically more ready for racing in the heat. Does it feel kind of unfair that then you're there and there's double the points and it has a bigger impact on your overall standings? Or do you think, no, that's just it. That's just the way it can go. No, it's not about fairness. It's like Kona's in the heat every year and people take the time and investment and whatever to go prepare specifically for that race because they know that if they win it, it's life-changing. And that race has so many eyes on it. I would still argue that like Kona is bigger than any T-100 race that happened this year by a large margin.

But the, it kind of just is what it is. I don't know. I would agree with you, Nick. Kona being in the same place and being hot, there's a whole bunch of athletes out there that could have been world champions if it had been on the rotating calendar like it is right now with Nise. And they just never were because they couldn't handle the heat. And it wasn't like, but they're an inferior athlete and they didn't prepare properly. It's just some people are genetically equipped for that and some people are not. Yeah, but when the race was in Nice, you saw the same kind of people in the top five on the women's and men's side.

Pretty sure Chris Leeta would have won an Iron Man World Championship if it had been in bike course in Nice, for example. Well, you can say that, but, you know, anyway, that's a completely different discussion. It does just like, it makes me wonder. Like, oh, yeah, no, I think it would be cool if this was somewhere else. Yeah, the T100 does not have this longstanding legacy of Kona and everything. So why not just switch where the grand final is every year? And they still could. They still might.

They still might. This is only year one. I think that my guess is that might come down to timing, might come down a little bit to finances, what city wants to have that title, et cetera, et cetera. But we don't know yet. Yeah, the other thing about Dubai is like November usually it kind of starts to cool off a little bit. I don't know if it was like uncharacteristically hot this year. at this time of year.

But I will say that the heat on the run was not oppressive. Like it was cooling down by the time we started running. There was so many aid stations with ice and cold sponges and cold bottles that I was just constantly soaking myself with coldness. And I didn't feel too bad on the run. I think the bike was the hardest part for heat in terms of just like managing body temperature, knowing what was coming with the run and just having that hard effort back to back. But it was okay.

It was not as bad as I was imagining. But you didn't wear a TT helmet, right? You were a regular road helmet? Yeah, but I think even if I did wear a TT helmet, I would have been just as fine. Okay. Well, thanks for talking about that. I know it was kind of a tough experience in several ways, but I feel I like that you already are seeing the silver lining from it. It hasn't even been a week.

What's my silver lining? I don't think I have one. The silver lining is that I made at home. I finished. Well, you finished. And also you were talking about the beauty of the course and seeing the city in the background and realizing how lucky you were even during the hardship of the race itself. Yeah, yeah.

Blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay, well, let's move on. Last week, we talked about something that was, that apparently was very exciting for people, which was a new TTL podcast segment. and we're going to call this one swim sets with Paula. Okay, so we don't have a jingle yet, so I thought it would be kind of funny and fun for Paula to help produce this jingle.

Okay, so Paula, we're going to break this down as a music recording, if you want it to segment it into drums, bass, guitar, and vocals. So we're going to go little by little, okay? what do you want the drum part to sound like just very briefly wow nick this is required sorry putting you on the spot yeah putting you on the spot okay I want it to be like we love that we love that okay now what about a bass line

what kind of bass line are you hearing in your head so what are the things bass guitar what what we have drums I'm going up in frequency so drums bass guitar regular guitar and then vocals and then any effects that you want at the end

we can talk about like splashy sounds or something like that we can add that too so if we did drums what about the bass part boom boom boom

I don't know I'm fully making this up yeah well that's what music creation is fully making it up so you're doing great we got drums we got bass

what about a guitar part that's by far the best yet okay that's going in there for sure love that love that now finally what do we want the vocals to sound like and keep in mind we're writing a jingle here so you need to have swim sets with Paula in there and only needs to beat two to five seconds

so it's like swim sets with Paula something like that oh it's like a surfer dude voice. Yeah. I was getting Dory out of that, like whale talk. Oh, and Dory's speaking whale? Where is the

Dory? Dory actually might be kind of cute too because Dory is a swimmer. But like that doesn't really go with my like electric guitar vibe. No, it doesn't. It doesn't. It doesn't. It doesn't. I know. I love that. I love what you did there. Okay, now on top of that last week you had said you wanted some effects sounds in there.

So you were talking about like a splash sound. Is there anything else that you think we need to add? I think that we just need to bit to splashing. Otherwise, this is going to sound like a mess. It already is. I think we should add it some fish tank stuff and they're like, Bubbles. Oh, okay. Okay, featuring Eric Lagostrom bubbles. Got it.

You can use my bubbles if you need. You can sample it. I have permission. Okay, just so everyone knows it's 7 p.m. on Wednesday and this is coming out like in, what, five hours? Yeah, so I got to do this tonight. Of course. So this is like intense pressure. We do everything we can for the pot.

Paula. Okay, so thank you, Paula, for co-producing that jingle. The listeners will have heard it by now, and hopefully they are in awe at our symbiotic, synergetic producer relationship here. Okay, so my swimset here that I'm giving you guys today, it's something I get Eric to do occasionally with me, but we beef it up a little bit and make it more volume. But this is a 2,800 yard or meter set.

It only works in short course. So if you're in a long course pool, it's going to be trickier. But what I really like to do, especially if I'm not really feeling great or I'm having a hard time imagining doing like a pace set where I'm looking at my times is do 125 meter repeats. Because you touch the wall, the time doesn't really mean much to you because you're not used to. It's not like 100 or 200 where you know exactly what's good for you or what's a fast time. So the warm up is 200 choice. Mix in some backstroke with freestyle. 8 by 25 going one fast, one easy, super simple on 30 seconds or about 10 seconds, 15 seconds rest.

And the main set, just one main set and then 100 cool down. The main set goes. The other thing I like doing in swimming, just as a preamp to it, is doing short blocks of work, freestyle swimming, no toys, interspersed with some pole paddles. because I feel like the pull paddles helps you to like reset, bring your heart rate back down, get ready for the next set of effort. But you're still getting some benefit in it. You're still doing some strength work.

You're still doing active recovery to get ready for the next thing. So the full block starts with the 200 pull paddles. Pretty smooth. Don't get your heart rate up. Focus on long strokes and do that on like about you'll get like 30 seconds rest after it. So not a stressful interval. And then you're going to do four times 125. freestyle, swim, no toys, descending one to four.

So four 125s equals a 500. What is descending one to four mean? Each one gets faster. So start really easy. The last 125 is fast. Now the interval gets kind of tricky for 125s because like I said, you don't know what good times are. So I would say as a baseline rule, go on what you would do for 100. So say you would normally go on 130 per 100 and add 20 seconds to it.

So it's going to be a bit of a stressful interval. So 150 for 125 or 155 or 2 minutes. So pick something where you're getting about 5 to 10 seconds rest, not a lot of rest. And then you're going to repeat that. So 200 pull after that, pull paddles. Another 4-125 to send 1 to 4. 2-under pull. Another 4-125 to send 1 to 4.

and then a two-under pull. So in total, that's 12-125s. It's a 1,500-meter block of freestyle swimming, just under a 70.3 distance and interspersed with these 200-pulled recoveries, and then 100-kick cool-down. 100-kick. Cool.

Yeah, social kick, cool-down. Talk to your friends. And like I said, it's just a set I like to do, because the 125 is actually like a 500-meter block, it's a decent amount of volume. But I think it goes by quick because you're thinking of it in terms of 125s. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like 100 plus a little more.

Yeah, it's like barely more than 100, but it is more. Right, right, right. The mind games. Yeah, it's like all about mind games and swimming sometimes and just like sometimes having total lack of awareness of what your splits are, who cares, I'm going by effort. And at the end of this whole thing, you actually get a decent and that. amount of meters in. And if you want to beef it up, I would just add to the warm up or the cool down. But I kind of tried to keep those short because the main set's fairly big volume.

Yeah, I feel like you guys specifically have pretty big warmups and cool downs. How much you usually do? Like 600? We normally don't usually do like a warmup set. It's just like 800 choice. Okay. We'll do 800 choice and then we'll do 850s with some speed in it to get like your heart weighed up. Then we'll start the main set. And the main set's usually about 3K. Then a pull set, cool down. Okay, this is kind of off topic,

but it's something I'm curious about. Do you guys feel like your first 100? How does that compare to 100 later on in the set? Are you going faster, slower, effort is higher, lower? Or you don't even think about it? Way slower, but I don't think about it. Yeah, I usually warm up throughout the workout, get a little faster?

The reason I ask is because ever since I started swimming and it still happens now, my first hundred, even if I try to swim at very easy effort, I'm swimming like 10 seconds faster per hundred than later on in the workout I'll do it that same effort. And I can't figure out. I think that's a sign of a adult onset swimmer. Yes, okay, yeah, yeah, okay, got it. Truly. Do 100,000 meters and check back in.

Right. Yeah, okay. I will when I'm a thousand years old. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but I love the feeling of just getting in and like floating. Not going hard for the first 800. You know, it's just like. Well, I don't feel like I'm going. This happened the other day.

I was literally 10 seconds faster than I thought I would be. I looked at my watch and I thought my, I had set the length wrong or something. Literally your first hundred in the pool. Yeah, and it feels easy. You're taking a split. Oh, of course. This is a problem. Eric, I'm splitting every single thing in the pool.

I have never swam $25 without counting it. Yeah, I couldn't even tell you in my entire life what I've gone for the first hundred. No. I don't look at the clock. I don't know. It doesn't matter. I don't look at the clock until like the warm up is so long gone.

But it's everyone has their thing. Yeah. That's just, man. I mean, you're just like. We just like to rip on Nick in this way. The Garmin like G-WIS data was just made for you. you. Oh, your first 100

was the fastest of your first 100 has been since July of 2017. I'm like, oh, that is neat. Yeah, exactly. I must be good today. Okay, so that was a great first from Sets with Paula.

I will be doing that set as well. I don't know, was it? I don't know. Now I'm like all self-conscious that's not like. I'm into that set. The 125s is such a cool thing I think people are not used to doing.

I completely agree. I completely agree. I spend so much time they're trying to figure out and do the math of what like a meaningful 125 is that I run out of time and then we have to push off and boom. Like the set goes back.

Yeah, so who cares? Paula, we're going to put that swim set in the show notes so people can use it themselves, okay? Yeah, that's the point, right? Yeah, I'm saying that you don't have to rely on dictating what Paula just said on the podcast. If you want to scroll down, you'll find them in the show notes. Yeah, that would be easier. Yes, you're right. Okay.

Yeah, we'll have it written out. Okay. Let's move on to our questions. Our questions submitted by our beloved podcast listeners and podcast supporters. if you want to submit a question and become a podcast supporter, you can do so at that triathlonlife.com slash podcast.

Last week, we teased that we would be doing some special surprise prizes for our podcast supporters, and we're holding true to our word. I have in front of me right now a beautiful orca changing poncho. It's like such high quality, lovely little piece of kit

that you must have. Just in case, you are not aware of what this is. Orca makes wetsuits. It is Paul and my swim sponsor and they have generously supplied us with some giveaways. It's not a swim poncho that has a picture of a free willy on it. Continue, sir. Yes, that's right. Yes.

I kind of assume everyone knew what Orca was, but that is for sure not the case. So this is the first week we're doing something like this. It won't be a poncho next week, but we'll have another Orca prized giveaway next week as well, only for podcast supporters. So if you're not a podcast supporter, this is the time to become one.

This week, the winner is Juan Peña. Juan, thank you so much for being a podcast supporter. Just email us with the address you want us to ship this to and we'll have it sent out to you. It'll be coming from Los Angeles. First question here is from Justine. This is kind of a long one, but it's a great one.

Hi, Paula, Eric, and Nick. I appreciate all of the transparent and emotional reaction. you all share when you compete. Most recently I felt Paula's disappointment to my core with her 200 Dubai's post. And Eric's post also felt really important. Sometimes things don't go the way that we plan

and we cannot predict it. Or we get completely shocked by it. So I want to know what you all do to cope with disappointment in racing. Do you have a post-race meal that warms your spirits, drink, art, music artists you listen to on repeat, is there a movie you watch, shop?

I've spent what will now be three years trying to do a 70.3 Augusta. The first year, 2023, there was a death in the family. 2024, Hurricane Helene canceled it, giving it another go for 2025. Your podcast has kept me inspired and to not give up, but also feel all the feels too. One thing I noticed to is that you all recognize what you are grateful for, whether the opportunity, the TTR community, and each other no matter the outcome. This member of the TTR community is grateful for you all and being honest, step of the way. Justine. Wow. Thanks, Justin. You really read that in a sad voice. It sounded a bit

somberish. I wanted to sprinkle salt on the somberous, right word. You really leaned into the sombranness of that. Yeah, I was definitely very sad after Dubai. I don't remember ever like crying that much after a race to the point where I was like, holy shit, why are you still crying? Like, it's just a triathlon. But there was a lot on the line. I mean, if I had finished one spot higher, I could have made like tens of thousands more dollars. Like, it was really crazy how how much that race mattered and how bad I did and how shitty I felt. So anyway, I was like extremely sad after it made it worse that Eric wasn't there. And it made it worse that I couldn't leave till Tuesday morning because we had a PTO meeting on Monday and I raised on Saturday.

So I felt trapped. I was like, I need to book a flight out of here. I need to go home. But it was, I had to stay for the meeting. I wasn't allowed to leave. Anyway, that was every, we all did. So it was fine. But that, like, added to my emotion of sadness and anxiety.

And I didn't really do much to get over it. I talked to friends, but didn't have a ton of friends over there. Chelsea Sedaro was super helpful. I chatted with her a lot. Yeah, what did I? I think I was just, like, trying to reset and think about if I wanted to do Taupo or not and how I felt about that, which didn't really help me get over the same. sadness of it, but it did help to think like, okay, there's still another race this year.

You still have another opportunity. It's not like you're not fit. You just, this was not your race. If I'm with Eric, we'll usually get over it by, yeah, going to having dinner, going to get a drink. I was definitely not in a celebratory mood and I didn't want to, I really should have taken the opportunity to venture out more and go sightsee and go see like some of the cool things in Dubai. But being alone there, I felt for some reason, very kind of scared and uncomfortable leaving the hotel. So I was such a hotel rat. Like I seriously did not leave the hotel at all. And I'll probably look back at that and regret it. I mean, I already do that I didn't go see some stuff. But I was just not in the mood.

Paula, my answer is the same as yours. I also don't have something that I feel like helps me. And I don't know. Asking the sadness. From what I have experienced lately, I think that is what professionals like mental health professionals tell you to do is to kind of like feel it's doing it stew in it's doing it's a little bit you know yeah it's not like like i'm not still sad i'm not still sad i'm not still sad but i'm not still crying like i've got right but it was so crazy how much i was crying i would wake up in the middle of the night the night after the race and just start crying like oh my it was crazy wow i was so sad about it what were you sad?

about the night after the race, the missed opportunity? What was your brain going to? Yeah, that the, I was like kind of embarrassed. I was kind of like, what, I don't know, what should I've done better? I mean, I think the sadness is just a reflection of the fact that it matters a lot and I care about it and I put a lot into it. Everyone has bad races, but I haven't had that many lately. And then back in the day and like, you know, the 2014-15 era after the Olympics when I was having super struggles. I did this all the time. I'd have a bad race and I'd cry forever.

And that's why it's still, it's like actually crazy that I'm still in the sport. Because these experiences, like what I had last weekend, were like the normal. Devastation. Come home, try again. Devastation, come home, try again. So I'm not, it's not totally new to me. I've experienced it before. It's just not recently new to me because I've always, you know,

I've had pretty good races the last couple years. So anyway, Eric, do you have an answer? Yeah, yeah, I just start fixing things. I go to work on every other thing that I have in my life. Usually if I'm going to erase, I have a video that I have to edit, or I can go work on the TTO website, or, you know, I like, well, write down and think about, okay, what went wrong here? What went wrong, you know, wrong, air quotes.

And the buildup to this, is there anything I can do better? As soon as I get home, I'm going to get on that gym routine, and I'm going to start on that, you know, big toe exercise that I never do and, you know, do this and that and that. But while I'm stuck here on this airplane until then, then I'm going to start, like, trying to do every digital thing that I have. I just, like, bury myself and trying to be productive and making a plan for how I'm going to improve next time. Yeah, that makes sense.

It's the same thing. Like, when Paula wasn't here and I was kind of just bummed that I wasn't over there and feeling relatively useless, I just would like work. I would just like go and reorganize the garage and then I like wiped down all the counters. I went to bought new counter stuff. I'm like trying to switch over the snow tires.

I replaced the starter in the car. I just like work on things. And that makes me feel productive and useful when training isn't going exactly the way or racing isn't going exactly the way that I want and I can't just go train more. Yeah, that's a good answer. By the way, I think there could be some like

questioning criticism of like why Eric didn't come with me and it's not Eric's choice. When I booked this flight three months ago, I was like, I can do these races by myself. There's so much support there. I wanted to fly business. So the ticket was expensive. And honestly, for a trip that long, it's like you need to fly that way to feel human on the way when you get to the other side. So that, like we do get a base appearance fee to go to these races. But if you're buying like two extremely expensive tickets,

each race, you're blowing through that so quickly. And it becomes like cost prohibitive for both of us to go overseas to every single one of these things. So that's the reason he didn't come. It was my decision, not his. No one was being critical at all. But when I was there and I told people I was there alone, they were shocked. Like not in a way of like, what, Eric doesn't care about you, but just like, I cannot believe

you came to this race alone. That's absolutely crazy. And there was no other athlete there. who had no other person there with them. You guys are such a unit in people's minds. You're such a public couple that probably adds to that. But honestly, the response when they heard that was like, what can I do to help you?

Like, people were so nice. That's nice. And, like, can I give you splits? Can I take stuff for you at the start? Like, there was a crazy amount of, like, kindness and niceness when they realized that I was there by myself. And it ended up being okay. I think it was more just challenging.

emotionally to be in a hotel room like that by yourself, like, day after day after day. But I don't want anyone to think, like, oh, Eric didn't care. He didn't want to go. It was just a decision we both made a long time ago for this, like, monster of a trip. Anyway, that's just an aside. It kind of just sucks when you, when you have that disappointment, it just sucks and it's just, it might just suck. Especially if you're not at home. If you, like, can get home and start doing stuff and get him back into normal life, that's

easier. Right. Right. Next question. Next question here is from Radu. Hey, TTL team. I'm also making the shift from triathlon to ultra trail running and I'm preparing for my first 100 kilometer race next year in Germany. So this question is for Eric. Looking back, is there anything you wish you would have done different? More of or less of during your prep for the 50K. Thanks for reading the question, but also for creating one of the most inspiring sports communities that I've ever been a part of, Radu. Wow. Dude, congrats.

That's going to be an exciting adventure. I got to think that I guess you don't know for sure, but in my mind, 100K in Germany could be potentially

quite mountainous. And the thing that I'm glad that I did do is I just kind of switched gears mentally and just started going for the hillyest runs that I could do.

I think that would probably be the biggest thing that was going to be a struggle for someone who's trained for triathlons historically is you're kind of encouraged and it feels more appropriate to run flat as often as possible and just get the pace higher and not load up your legs with climbing and especially descending but just making sure that like every chance that I had I was running

steep stuff and I was going for some long runs on the weekend I would double up days so I never really did like a super long run the longest run I did and training was 31k but I did some days where the two days like Monday, Tuesday together added up to be 50K. I'd do like a 30K long run on Monday and then on Tuesday I'd run like 21K with Paula doing her tempo run which was pretty equal to the speed that I was anticipating running in the 50K. So I was glad that I did that. And the one thing that I would say that I would probably do differently for next time is when I was doing some of those tempo runs with Paula and she was doing a total of like,

an hour of effort, I would maybe continue to run the same pace and then just do another 50% more or double the amount of time. Because I feel like that was a good pace. That's something you would have done differently? Yeah. I mean, if I was going to prepare again, I think I would just make those like kind of tempo efforts where we were doing like four by 10 or two by 20 or something like that. I would just do a little bit more of that uncomfortably fast running pace because I did feel like that sort of started to load up in my legs more so than the vertical. But like take advantage of the fact that you already did all that time with Paula and then mentally just be like, okay, now I'm going to add some more instead of this big block

by yourself. Yeah, I don't know if you can, if you have somebody that you train with maybe, but even just starting a workout with somebody and then continuing to do more effort or whatever, I don't know, that's just what I was thinking. Just a slightly longer workouts. I did, I feel like I did some good long runs that would just go run. And I might have just done a couple more longer workouts for like muscular fatigue at the pace, at the race pace. Yep, got it. Paul, are you waving at me or are you exercising your arm so you're not as sore tomorrow from all the shots? Ooh, that one hurts.

The COVID. Yeah, honestly, they put like the COVID and the flu and this arm and the rest in the other arm. That's the COVID. That hurts so much. It's so sore. It hurts. So achy. Oh my gosh.

And for the record, I've never had COVID. But I haven't to get this vaccine. For me, it's like sore in the shoulder and like the armpit too. Yeah. I hope you don't get that. It's okay right now for me.

Clear through the armpit. But as soon as they put them all in, I started doing like jumping jacks arm motions. I've been drinking a ton of water, just like everything I can to alleviate it. But, oh. I hope you're not knocked on your butt tomorrow. Okay.

Next question here. is from Jackie. Hi, Paul, Eric, and Nick. A few weeks ago, I finished my first full Iron Man and thought I was happy to finish in a relatively decent time, just under 12 hours, 52 minutes. It was still much slower than I was hoping. Since racing, I've been struggling to maintain my target speeds and training. My zone one run pace feels like the high end of a zone two right now, and everything just feels harder than normal. I'm not sure if I've hit a plateau or regressed in training, or simply hit an overreaching slash borderline over-training point. Normally my zone two pace is about 9 to 9.5 minute mile pace, and right now, 945 to 10 minute mile is where my body wants to run.

Earlier in the season, I felt a lot of progression in my speed, but later in the season I stacked up my first Ultra, which was a 50-mile trail race, almost finished top 10, with Iron Man 70.3 Michigan two months later and Iron Man, California, just about six weeks after that. Could these intense events so close together cause me to be overtrained and reduce my speed progress? For context, I'm a 40-year-old age grouper with a full-time job and the mom of a six-year-old, so maybe I should just be happy getting a good race in a year. Truly appreciate your feedback. Thank you, Jackie. So do you guys think that all of that racing and volume could contribute to a drop in speed late in the season? That's a lot.

A lot of long activities. Yeah, it is. But I will say that, like, I mean, I'm not doing as long as I'm not doing as long as I'm not. activities of that, but overall, the weeks of races and the weeks after races are really easy and low volume compared to like a training week. I mean, if you do that. So I would say that racing consecutively, if anything, sometimes I feel better on the other side of it. Like I've had this built-in easy week before and after. And yeah, the race intensity was hard, but I can get back to training, feeling okay. Yeah, my first thought was like how much

downtime are you actually taking, you know, how much are you allowing your body to actually recover from these long efforts? Or are you kind of, I got to get, do something between now and the next one. And I do think this sounds like this could be some just cumulative fatigue. Personally. Like when I did my 100 mile mountain bike race,

which is the longest activity that I've done and it was pretty warm and stuff. Like Wednesday after, you know, the Sunday race, I felt like, you know, I think I could go out there and like join Paula with her workout driver. and I got two like minutes into an interval and body was just no, no, you're not doing that. Even though I kind of felt okay. So I think, I don't know, just it depends on how much you were trying to do between these things and the cumulative fatigue. That's what kind of what sounds like to me.

But like towards the end of a season, I think it's not a bad idea to put some like purposeful efforts into doing some faster. speed work, but lowering the volume of everything. Like, just keep fresh and keep sharp and don't worry about doing as much volume. Like swap in five-minute intervals instead of 20-minute intervals. Yeah, or just, like, do some hill strides or, like, do something that keeps their body awake and feeling like you still have some ability to go hard versus just being bogged down and tired all the time. And do you think maybe for Jackie, this is a good opportunity at the end of this season to take,

at least two weeks fully off or something like that to let your body kind of like catch up a little bit or do you think that's not necessary? Yeah, if the season's over, definitely you have to do that. Yeah. Take two weeks off. Like everyone should do that. The other thing is like not obsessing too much over the speed.

Like you're running 15 seconds per mile slower. That doesn't really matter. I know it's easy to say that versus when you're in it at socks. But sometimes you just have to run without looking at the speed and kind of accept where you're at in the moment. 15 seconds per mile, that's like not that much different. It's more than that. It's about 30, 30 to 45 seconds per mile, which is, it does feel like quite a bit.

I wonder how much of this isn't also like there's a physical toll of all those big long races and there's also a mental toll of what you're willing to, what kind of discomfort you're willing to go through after doing all that. and I wonder if subconsciously Jackie's not feeling this like, am I really going to go out and run again after all that? It's just like, ugh. Yeah, this is hard. Next question is from Sarah. Hi, Paula and TTL Bros.

Day Warner and supporter here. Thank you, Sarah. Question. How can I train efficiently without Strava Premium in my life? I'm looking to cancel due to cost and recent changes to the platform that limit other apps. Thanks for any tips you may have or other platform suggestions, Sarah. This is funny because I don't think I've ever really thought of Strava as something that would benefit my

directly benefit my training through their analytics tools. Do you guys use it in that way? Yeah, and Strava, I love it, and it does help me stay motivated through the social aspect of it. But I don't use it to load in workouts or anything like that. Do you guys use Strava like that? No, I use it pretty socially. I do like the, you know, the total stats.

Like, I will look at my weekly run volume. I was looking at as I was getting ready for the, for the 100 mile, for the 50K and stuff. But no, I've never really dove into whatever their version of like a training stress score or recovery or I haven't done that. What does Strava premium give you that Strava regular doesn't? Isn't it just the ability, isn't it just the ability to go on like leaderboards, etc?

So there's quite a few things. The thing that I use by far the most that is on premium is the route creation, which I think is by far the best way to create routes. That's only premium. That's only premium, yeah. That is indispensable for my life. They use their heat maps, and so you can see what people have done, and now they have new features where you can see just like only nightly.

heat maps or like the last week of heat maps so if a trail has just closed or just opened it's easy to see that that kind of stuff is indispensable for me but other things i'm just reading off of their website here beacon on devices which is a safety feature a tracking feature route planning is for premium only segment competition so you can kind of like compete against your friends on segments uh training dashboard heart rate and power analysis which i feel like if you have training peaks, it's not better than that. I'm guessing this person who doesn't have that. Right. Advanced metrics, I don't know what that means.

But goal setting, training, log, compare efforts, personal heat maps and partner perks. Those all feel like they're nice, but they're not indispensable. You can still use Strava Basic to track what you're doing and your volume and put your workouts online and just have like a weekly template of what you're doing. And I often also look at Strava to look back at like what I, what I do. Like what I did a year ago at this time, for example, it's easy to scroll back and see that. But I also have training peaks and use that more for the analytical part where I'm looking at my power and my speed and my heart rate and all that. So I think I would survive without Strava Premium.

But as long as you have some way to track your workouts, you can use a freaking pen and pencil and a diary. That's how people used to do it. Right. Old school. You don't need a computer app to. train. You can go super old school for free. I don't know if I could live without it. I could live without it, but it would come at a cost to my happiness. Nick, I think that if you didn't have Strava, you just wouldn't train. First, that's what I think there's, there's some truth in that. Where are my photo's going to go? I'll just send them all to Eric. Yeah, and I think people seeing what you do is like

half of your motivation or more, potentially. Not in a bad way. Not in a bad way. I mean, that is a bad thing, but it's also the truth. I am motivated by it. It gets me excited. I won't lie. I fall back on that sometimes. If I'm having a really kind of down, not feeling so good about a workout,

it's coming up or whatever, I will go and try to find a segment that is that length of time and try to see how fast I can go on it for the workout just to give a little bit of extra motivation. I think that's like one of the most valuable parts of Strava. Like Paula's thing, if you make up stuff and swim workouts

to make it mean something or play a mental trick with yourself, and Strava is fantastic for that. Yeah, and segments and stuff like that too. But you'll be totally fun without it to cancel it. I think it must be like subscription canceling month. Is that a thing where people go through their subscriptions at the end of every year?

And they're like, what do I want? What do I don't want? I mean, like some, you know, like freaking, what if Joe Rogan could have just told everybody, hey, you know, I feel like he did because like we've had so many people in the last couple weeks email me and say, can you unsubscribe me from the podcast?

It's like dagger to the heart. By the way, you can do it yourself. I don't have to do it for you. No, they want to let you know. Oh, it was like so many the last couple weeks. So if you're not a supporter yet, we need to rebalance our numbers. Oh, my gosh.

You can go and support the podcast. Save us. And for the people that unsupported us, it's okay. We fully appreciate the support you've given us till now. and we completely understand. It just seems too much of a coincidence that so many are happening

in the last week or two. Yeah, and I mean, just buckle up for some AG1 ad reads, guys. I got to pay the bills. Nice. You know what's funny? Oh, my gosh. So, like, a lot of companies hire out

marketing companies to, like, go to influencers and try to find people to promote their brand. So I've had now two emails from Athletic Greens asking if I want to partner with them and if they can send me some free... They can send me some free trials of AG1 and what our pricing is to incorporate it into a YouTube ad bar. Right, right.

She's just start throwing out some like bonkers numbers. It'd be like $50,000. Yeah. No, with these people, and these people have no clue. They don't know who we are. They don't care who we are. They're not, they work for AG1. But I email them back and explain what AG1 did to us in a nice way.

Like I just tell them the full story, full paragraph. This is what happened. And the guy was really nice about it. He's like, well, do you want me to send you some AG1 anyway? That is nice. That is nice. Send me some freaking chock of milk. And I was really not expecting that.

So I was like, wow, that is so nice of you. Thank you so much. We actually still have so much of it because we never use it anymore. But if I ever change my mind, I'll hit you up. Nice. I'm sure that has an expiration date. I'm sure it does, yeah. Yeah.

Okay. Next question here is from Dave. We'll do two more questions. Bonjour Tietal Neish. I am in a predicament. A fire this year has closed my Olympic pool indefinitely until repairs are completed sometime in 2025. Oh, Paula, this is definitely a question for you. Can you recommend this swim set?

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Can you recommend a swim set built for a 17 meter pool, which is all I have access to for the interim? I have difficulty adapting my training from long course to a very short, oh, from long courses, that is rough, to a very short course. I train three times a week and focus mostly on Olympic slash 70.3 racing. Merci in advance. Dave. He said until 2025? Yeah. So a 17 meter pool. So it's not that much longer. It's like home stretch.

Yeah, yeah, that's true. But three times a week still means, you know, that's still quite a bit. Yeah. So when I first read this, I was like, oh, man, that's not even worth it. That's so short. But it is worth it because I think so much of swimming is just feel for the water and making sure that you keep your technique improving. It doesn't need to be like how you get your fitness necessarily.

You can get that through biking, you can get that through running. running. But to me, I think frequency in the pool. And that's why when COVID happened and none of us had access to pools, we were all like doing bungee cords and backyard pools and like tethering ourselves to an anchor and trying to swim. Because the part of it was just water feel and being in that position doing that activity. So 17 meters, you can still get like, I don't know, 12, 13 strokes before you flip. It's not that short. I mean, the slower you are, the better in this scenario. Do you think this person should maybe not dolphin kick or not push off as hard to like not get as far into the across the pool before they start? No, like I don't. He's doing a huge amount of underwater dolphin kick. Triathletes don't do that.

You could just do that for shits and giggles, though, if you want to flip and just not push off the wall. Yeah. And like re-accelerate from zero. That'll like help you with deep water starts too. Actually, that's not a bad idea, Eric. Like, because your times don't matter in this pool. They mean nothing. So a good way to, like Eric said, get some power is to like flip right before the wall and not push off. You're starting from a dead stop. It sucks so much. It's so hard. But it's actually a great idea for if you're swimming in a little pool like this. And I did, I used to have to do this when I was like injured in my knee or something and I couldn't push off the wall. Just flip a little bit early. And then you're getting yourself re-accelerated from zero. Does it feel so awkward? It feels really hard.

but yes exhausting yeah um and one last thing thought that i had on this is that remember when we were in that super little backyard pool eric in Tucson mm-hmm and COVID hit and we thought we were still going to be racing in 2020 ha ha so we were like trying to do swim workouts in it and i think paulo gave us this set where you put the the bungee on and you're going max sprint to the other side and then just letting the bungee pull you back and then go again and do that like eight times in a row. So it's almost like Tabata training like 20 seconds extremely hard. And if you have the bungee, it does take that long to get to the other side even in a short pool. And then the bungee naturally pulls you back as you recover and then you go again. So if you have a bungee,

I mean, that's kind of a fun idea too. Super fun to get pulled back. Yeah, I wonder as you're saying this, like what percentage of this was Paulo thinking this was a good idea and what percentage of Apollo just like these guys are going to freaking lose their minds if I don't give them something to freaking do in the pool. No, I think there was something about, well, at least it is, it's so much like a placebo, like who the heck even cares. But the power of swimming against a bungee max effort sprinting is, it couldn't be bad. Oh, yeah.

No, I think maybe I'll bring that back. No, maybe my 2025 spring training plan. Yeah. The moral of what you guys are saying here, though, is to don't treat it like a a normal swim day. Do something that differentiates it in your mind so that you're not comparing it to what it's like to swim to long course, like the bungee thing or the not

kicking thing. Sometimes, but this could turn silly though. Like it's at a certain point you do have to just treat it like a normal pool and swim. I agree with both of you. I think putting this into its own little bucket of novelty and not getting too frustrated with it and rather

just accepting the novelty, yes, but you don't have to, you know, like balance a waterball on your forehead or anything to pass the time. Okay, last question here is from Alex. Hey, Eric, Paula, Nick. I just completed my first Iron Man in Arizona this weekend and got my qualifying spot to head to Nice to race Iron Man World Championships. Congratulations, Alex.

Nice. That is amazing lifelong achievement. I hear the swim is warmer and may not need a wetsuit. My question is with swimskins, do I get a sleeved swimskin or sleeveless? I need all the arrow I can get. or I guess like hydro. Thanks guys. I appreciate the help, Alex.

What do you guys think? This is a bit of personal preference. I've done both. I think Paul has done both. Yeah. A bit depends on how tight and hydrodynamic your race suit is. And if your race suit goes down to your elbows or not. I would take your race suit to the pool probably

and do at least like a 50 in it and see if it fills up with water, if the sleeves roll up to your, you know, armpits, if that feels like that is actually going to be a good surface to swim in. And then you could go with the sleeveless option. I do think the sleeved option, you do, that's a lot of fabric. You've got like this tight swim skin on over the top of a tight race suit and it can be somewhat, it can feel not the best. So I would say I would probably go with the sleeve.

this one if your rac suit is not going to blow up with water through the, you know, through the bicep zone. Yeah, I'd say that most pro athletes, everybody at T100 Dubai had the sleeveless type. And most swim skin or most race kits are tight enough in the sleeves that it's not really going to be a problem. I don't even know if most companies sell a sleeved swim skin. And obviously, this person is probably not going to have the opportunity to trial them both. Right. So I'd say the safe option is to go with the sleeve list, much more shoulder mobility. And I think you'll just overall feel more comfortable in it. Yeah.

And another thing that some athletes do, just depending on how, you know, concerns you are about your transition time is you can actually have your trisuit kind of down around your waist. And then pull it up. And then pull it up as you walk or run into transition. And as you sit in transition, like I said, it kind of depends how fast you want your T1 to be. But that's an option. Swimskins are fast, though. Swimskins are faster than no swimskins. Yeah, definitely do do it. Do not just go swim in your tri-kit. For a lot of reasons, it's tight, so it covers up all the pockets on your tri-kit.

And also the material itself is more... Hydro-dynamic. Hydro-diamat water repellent. Oh, yeah. Hygrophobic. Hydropobic, yes, yes. And they're super easy to get off. Usually the zippers are like the tear zippers. So you flip the zipper up and then just tear it.

and it all, it comes off so fast. Yeah. If you remember to take it off because that happens sometimes where brain is like, it's not a wetsuit, so it's good to go, but that is not the case.

It's got to come off. That would be warm. Yeah. They're a little bit, they're a little bit unflexible on the bending over. Yeah. Guys, Paula, you did it.

You made it through this episode, even though it's the other side of the world time zone for you. Thank you for being here with us. I felt like you weren't grumpy at all. I felt like you were energetic and charismatic. Oh, good. I mean, I texted you guys right after the day after the race, and I said, I'm not doing the pod this week, so you better find a guest.

You actually did. Nicer than that, but we did find a guest. And we're going to have this guest on. We're very excited. This is, do we want to say who this is? No, let's save it. Let's save it. I mean, nobody's going to know who this is, but it is an expert in a field that we get a lot of questions.

about. We'll say that. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. But lucky for you guys, I changed my mind. Grace us with your presence. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Princess Paula. We really appreciate it. I think it said, hello Paula and supporting cast. Yeah, exactly. That's us. It hurts. I mean, it's just not the same without a female voice in it, you know? Oh, for sure. If it was just two bros talking. It would just be every other podcast on the internet. Yeah, that's true. Oh, my gosh, you're right. I do think you guys could pull it off, though. But I thought it was maybe a little bit of a missed opportunity to go to this race and then not even say anything about it.

Yes, but everyone would have understood if you needed some time a lot after that. So either way, it would have been okay. Thanks, Nick. I know, everyone's very supportive. All right, well, we'll talk to you guys next week and stay warm if you're in wintertime. All right. Bye. Later. Bye.