That Was Us - An Ode to William Hill | "Memphis" (S1E16) with special guest Jermel Nakia

Episode Date: September 24, 2024

In Memphis, we said goodbye to William Hill, but as we know, his story continues on through the fabric of the Pearson’s lives. We also remember Ron Cephas Jones, whose stunning portrayal of William left us with infinite lessons, wisdom, and broken hearts. Join us as we recap the episode, share its impact on our lives, and catch up with Jermel Nakia, aka Younger William. Follow That Was Us on YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, Threads, and X! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode of That Was Us, we'll be discussing season one, episode 16 Memphis. William recalls his life's pivotal moments and dashed dreams as he and Randall take a road trip to his hometown of Memphis, Tennessee. How'd everybody fair watching this one? Because I was a mess. I was a mess. Yeah. Not good. I remember the first time I watched it.

I was in Vancouver shooting a film, The Predator, like just silly sort of what have you. And the episode aired and messed up my whole world, man. So we were done shooting. We were done shooting by the time this aired. Correct. Got it. Let's see. What can I say about this thing?

First of all, John and Glenn came back to directed, who directed our pilot, and they directed three and four, I believe? Yeah, three and four. Was this their last one? This was their last one. Until the Super Bowl. Episode. Until the Super Bowl.

Season two. Okay. So they had ideas about they wanted to make it like a film and everything. And I was like, oh, it sounds really fun, fun film wise, okay? like in terms of the things that they wanted to do but this was um i can remember leading up to this every once in a while dan would come and he'd say like a lot of people who love william like they they don't want him to go and he's like i could i could change it but then it wouldn't be the show that i had conceived of and he's like i kind of got to follow through on this thing yeah

right and i was like i i get it and he talked to ron about it too and ron understood as well It opens up with this sort of Williams' mom and dad while he's like in her belly singing, You are my sunshine, my only sunshine. And it sort of becomes a recurring thing that we hear throughout Williams singing it later on in life as well. Dad was in the military. He goes off, says he'll be back. You get that familiar sort of thing that we see in TV and film because it happens in life with the two soldiers that come to the door to let you know that your loved one is not going to be making it.

So William is raised by his mom alone, played by a sister by the name of Amanda Warren, who has her, she had her own show on ABC for a minute. I can't remember her name of it, but she's a brilliant actor. We had two Yaleys because they overlapped with each other. And there's Amanda Warren, Brian Tyree Henry, who we'll get to a little bit later, playing cousin Ricky, who destroyed. Destroyed. We've changed the world with this thing, right?

So we see, like, William's beginnings montage through his mom. He gets older. Mom has to go to Pittsburgh to take care of her mother, leaves William behind, and he starts his sort of music career. He's writing. He's hanging out with the band. He plays the keyboard a little bit. And one day his cousin, Ricky, who she's like, make sure your cousin don't be leading

you and the stuff you're supposed to be going to, you lead him. da-da-da-da. This is Brian. And he writes this song. He says, yeah, been working on something. First of all, Young William, played by Jemelle Nakia, is such a beautiful, sweet spirit. We are three of the people, along with John Wirtes, and Jamel, who wound up going to Ron's Memorial when he passed away. Now, we all, like you said, you haven't had many scenes with him, but you, You see each other, we're at the different press events together, like as a, we'll celebrate successes, et cetera, et cetera. I don't know how much time Jamel actually got a chance to spin with Ron. You know, he had scenes with you, none of us, but like he was there.

Yeah, to honor him. Yeah. And I was like, my man. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So that's just the kind of guy. Jamel is.

And we're going to get to talk to him later in this episode. And we get to talk to him later in this episode. No. But he comes up with this song. We can always come back to this. We can always come back to this. So he came up with the lyrics, right? Yes.

And that's when Brian, cousin Ricky was like, okay. He's like, it's about damn time you didn't come up with something. And so then Brian Henry starts singing this song. And I'm like, God, Brian Henry did four years in the Book of Mormon, by the way. Yeah. Brian Henry can sing. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

But he has an old friend of yours. Yes, he is. Yes. We have the same manager. We go back, we did a play with Terrell McCraney at the Sundance Theater Lab, the summer of 2009. Wow. 2007. And then we wound up doing the brother-sister trilogy at the public theater in 2009.

So we've known each other for a long, long time. And he was so funny, too, because he came on the show and said, Brown, they got me to do a song. They got me doing this thing and everything. and he said, I've worked on it with your musical producer, whatever. And then when he sang it, he's like, Brown, I killed the song. He's like, I ain't trying to brag another with a Brown. I killed the song. And I watched it.

And he got an Emmy nominated thing. Yes, he did. I think it was his first. It was. Before Atlanta or anything like that? I mean, yeah. For a show to be doing what is doing. And then to take a little pit stop and produce like a, like,

true hit song. Yeah. Yeah. It's just crazy to me. Like, that song is so good. It's so good. Sid wrote it. You know what I'm saying? Brian did it. And then we have like covers of it later on in that episode and the next episode. But anyway, things are going well for William.

Gets a phone call from his mom because she went to go take care of her mother who passed away. Now it turns out that his mother is a little ill. So he winds up leaving his cousin to say that. He'll be back, but he just got to go take care of his mom. And he goes and turns out that his mother is sicker than she let on. She's got cancer. The first time I watched the show, it didn't quite land for me. But this time watching the show, it just lands like what type of person William is.

And how hard it would have been for a person like this to leave a child at a fire station. It was like the dichotomy of that, to walk away from his life to take care of someone. Sure. Knowing what his own mother meant to him. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. So he goes and she says, man, you know what?

Get familiar with the city. You don't have to be up underneath me. Go get some chicken. I'll make it up. We'll do good. And there's a few incredible montages in this episode that's sort of like, like... Compressed stories. So you understand, like...

Yes. How William got from... being that person to a person who leaves a child at a fire station. On the bus, and it's sort of 103 is the first time that we sort of explore this thing, McGregor. So it sort of dovetails into that. We meet Laurel, who is Randall's mom. We see this sort of courtship of things.

Joyful. Them playing together with his mom and they're a family or whatnot. Across the hall, there's a dude who's doing heroin, what have you. You see Laurel going there the first time. You're like, oh, man. And William, you know, keeps going. And then when it's all done, then he's in there as well because his mom passed away sort of dealing with grief.

So we see that, right? Can I talk about those montages for a second? Those montages hit me in a way that it's so hard. People are so, including myself, terrified to see someone at their bottom, right? To see a heroin addict on the street or on the bus or on the, anywhere. Yeah. You know, living in the big cities, it's not, I've seen it many, many times.

Sure. And it's scary and we don't want to look at it and we don't want to face it and we don't want to deal with it. We don't want to talk about it. But to see in these montages, the time compressed like that to realize that this is a person who had joy, who had love, who had purpose. Yeah. And we can't comprehend how someone gets there.

Yeah. But when you see it in a thing. three-minute montage. It's so clear. It humanizes people and that's that position. And how easy is not the right word, but how unconsciously it can just unfold. Yeah. One or two, one or two wrong choices, one or two bad breaks, and everything falls apart. Yeah. And that's, that's unfortunately what happened in this particular case with William. Yeah. That's a great point. So, Because it's hard to look at, it also becomes easy to dismiss. Like, you know, like, I don't want to think about it, and so I'm not.

And so now your story is unimportant because it's not something that I want to tell. And I think Dan, time and time again, throughout the course of the show, says, these people who you are dismissing are value and worth, and I want you to pay attention. Yeah, not look away. Yeah, which is pretty damn awesome. So that's how, you know... That's the backstory of Memphis. So...

What he left behind in Memphis. What he left behind. We open up with... Randall and Beth are at the doctor. And he's checking it with the doctor to see if it's okay if Randall goes on this road trip. See if it's okay. And Beth is leaning hard on the doctor. Like, you understand everything that just happened to this man.

Correct. Yeah, he just had a mental breakdown. And now he wants to drive halfway across the country. And the doc says, I think he's okay. He says, you two are really cute. And we go, we know. It's like one of my favorite little moments of just R&B love. Followed right after you two walking out of the office and that look on Susan's face, on Beth's face, and you just give a fist bump to William.

I saw that. And you know that the road trip is on. It's on. It's on. So we're going to go on a road trip. And before we hit the road, you see William go... Kiss the girls goodbye. Kisses...

Kisses Faith. Annie. I'm always saying everybody's real name. Kisses her on the forehead because she's still sleeping. And then she talks to Tess and Faith... Eris. And says, you know, you keep up with your chest. And she's like, okay.

And he's like, I go back to bed. And then he has... And he says a little goodbye to Beth, right? And they get in the car and they're on their way. Randall's got his maps. He's like, you know, I got it all planned out, this is how we're gonna do it. This is old school.

No GPS is the maps. He's like, let me see those maps. Tosses him out the window. So just drive, son, we'll get there. Yeah. This is just such a beautiful lesson for Randall in particular, for everybody, I think to a certain extent, like, There are plans, and it is good to plan.

It's also nice to allow yourself to move with the flow that is life. Yeah. A couple of days ago, I had a breakfast with a very close friend of mine who pitches TV shows for a living. Okay. What he does. Yeah. Tells these little 10-minute stories to try and sell TV shows. And he essentially pitched me, This Is Us, because I was trying to learn.

Taylor and I have been working on this thing for a long time, and I'm trying to figure out how to, to manage it myself without having to have too much outside help. Right. And he pitched this as us back to me in a way that I was like, wow, wow. And he said, you need to identify in your pitch everyone's want. And then you have to identify and let the person know all the things that are going to get in the way of that person getting what they want. Yeah. And he goes, and that's it.

Like everything else is storytelling. Like, that's where your story's built around. And he talks about, Rebecca, and he talks about Jack. And he talked about Jack in a way that was like, and Jack wants everything the way he wants it. And he wants it to be perfect. Because he wants to, that's the way he loves people. Yeah.

And I saw that bit of Jack in you, in Randall, for this episode. Yeah. Jack Pearson's son, is going to make this perfect, is going to make this right, is going to heal this man. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah.

So they're on their trip and it's very quiet scene. I remember. But what gets in the way of you wanting that? Maps out the window. Maps out the window. The person you're trying to save is like, yeah, we're not going to do it that way. Now we're going to do this in a completely different way, right? He's asking me about, he's like, it was tough, didn't imagine, couldn't imagine seeing you like that going.

He's like, is that called an anxiety attack? He's like, you know, panic attack, anxiety. There's a lot of different names for it, you know, something I've lived with for a while. My dad used to help me manage it. He was sort of the calming force. You know, he sort of take his hands and put him on my face, and he would just breathe. Because we'd breathe together. Until I had calmed down.

And I'm curious before we're getting, do you guys have anything like that that you do with your children? Not so physical like that, but we say to take a deep breath. Absolutely. Like when Gus, our oldest is, you know, having a moment or freak out. or really upset about something. It's like, let's take some breaths together. And not that this is silly, but the other day I was really overwhelmed and I was crying about something in front of them, which I don't,

I try not to make a habit up, but I'm very pregnant and our dog is sick. And so I was crying and he turned it around on me and he was like, Mama, everything's okay. Take a deep breath with me. And I was like, oh, I can't cry more. So I had to like take the deep breath. He's like, and another breath. And like he turned the practice back on.

It's just like, you're like, okay, I'm doing something. I mean, then five minutes later, he smacked his brother across the face. The balance of, exactly. You breathe. Yeah. Since this TV show, I've asked when I am in my place of anxiety or have, Rachel does that for me. Yeah. Hands on the face.

Everything's going to be okay. I love that. That's what I ask for. And I had to, in our therapy, I need you to do that, that exact thing. Wow, I love that. And that will work. And it does. What about you?

So similar, I helped to assistant coach my youngest son's flag football team. They made it to the Super Bowl. They lost the Super Bowl. I saw. I was like, seven, eight-year-old boys just collapsed on to the ground and start crying and so you get down on their level so you're not standing above them or whatnot and I say hey man it's going to be okay and I put my hand on his chest and I say just breathe for me I said let me feel the breath and take a deep one in and out I said now it's okay

to cry you you deserve that you know but you're going to be okay and especially if it if they make a bad play in the middle of the game sure sure I have to tell them I said listen Your tears are fine, but I also need you to keep playing this game. Now, if you can play through the tears, that's fine. Otherwise, there's still a chance to win. So let's wait until the game is over until we feel everything, right? Wow. Great advice.

Try. It's life, life advice in general. Because, like, the way that I was coached? Not like that. No. No, yeah. No tears. No tears at all.

So very much, like, like, 2024 trying to, like, go through the filter of like, okay, what worked for me? Because you can't give up before. They essentially, sometimes you give up before the game is over. Sure. Can't give up before the game is over. I don't mind the reaction that you're having to it, but I still need you to keep playing.

Yeah. So that's part of the thing that I think I've taken from the show and sort of adapted and made it into my own. And it's a beautiful moment that, like, thinking back to little Randall, getting his face held by Jack. Yeah. It's wonderful. Yeah.

So in talking about his dad, William says, like, you know what, you know, I wish I'd meet him. And I said, like, where is he? And I said, well, Kate hasn't been an urn. There's an urn right there. But we did scatter part of his ashes at this one place. And he's like, can we go with me? And he's like, it's kind of half day out the way.

And he's like, hey, man, take me to go meet your dad. So we go and meet the dad. And I can remember at this time in shooting, Ron was very weak. Like, he felt like he was probably like a buck or 05. soaking wet. It was probably like a buck 20, but like you put your hand on his back and you were wondering if he was going to be able to stay up, you know. And he had his oxygen tank, which we just incorporated into the show. You saw me putting it in the backseat of the car as we're on the way to go. And like we had to walk up this hill and we'd have to take a deep breath. And it was hard to get air or whatnot. And like so everybody just took their time. And when he was ready, he was able to do the lines and sit down. And then he would muster the strength to walk up. And it's like, you know what? Go ahead and say you goodbyes and we'll go.

And then they call cut and he'd have to sit down. Catch his breath, yeah. Like it was such a interesting sort of like parallel of like us collectively being like, we need you to be okay while knowing that like he wasn't okay and that what was about to happen to the character, etc. But there's this beautiful moment of him saying like, thank you for doing what I couldn't do. you know, for raising him into the son that he is or what have you. That got me. It gets me now just thinking about it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And so he says, you know, say your goodbyes and we'll hit the road. So we hit the road and we're on our way to Memphis. And then again, like John and Glenn do wonderful collages of just like introducing Memphis. You know what I'm saying? Seeing the record stores and just like different things around town, et cetera. And they had this one moment because a lot of this episode was improv. He's like, you know, we're just going to take collages of different things, and you guys say, we're in the barbershop.

I'm talking about, like, the real haircut that I had when I was a kid where I had this ramp, and I dyed it. They took this part out, but I died at Dark Alburn because, yeah, black people's hair changes in the sun. I tried to play it off. I was like, oh, yeah, it's just the sun. You know how it is. Like, bris, your hair red? Not a side lot. It's that thing that happens when I'm just like out and about that kind of thing.

Oh, man. And then there was, we went to this sort of Woolworth thrift store place. And John again were like, look, these are segregated drinking fountains. I was like, this is like the white one set up a little bit higher than the colored one. And like, we should do something with this. I was like, yeah, just roll the cameras. Let's go. And then Ron starts talking about, yeah, when my day, you know, couldn't drink from this fountain,

I had to go to this one here, da-da-da. And I say, like, well, you know, I was raised by white people. So I go straight to the white fountain. And he was like, oh, and I was like, come on, man, come taste this water. It's pretty good. But it was just this delightful. You can feel it. You can feel it.

That was happening. You know what I'm saying? We were having a wonderful time. Earlier in the... You went to the barbecue joint and said, what Sterling says, you know, I try not to eat a lot of pork. Which is every time I've... You heard me saying? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm trying not to eat a lot of pork. I was like, that's not... That's not scripted. And that's not Randall. But the place was so, oh, again, I took a bite. That reaction to the bite. I've been to that place. The reaction to the bite, I was like, so good.

More that was us after these words from our sponsors. I could talk about my experience with Airbnb because I've been using it since the very beginning. Same. I've used it across three or four different countries. Because when I go somewhere, I want to be comfortable. Yes. I want to have my own space, and I want my space to be in the middle of the action. I don't want it to be where all of the hotels are located.

Sure. You don't want to be removed from the action. No, I want to be in the city. I want to be amongst the people. Yes. Feel local. Yeah. And the best way to do that is to stay in someone's home.

I love that. I love that. While you're away from home and traveling, your home could be an Airbnb. What better way to earn a little extra money or offset some of your other travel expenses? travel expenses. This year, I'm going away for work. I might be gone for six to eight months at a time. And so not only do I need to find the perfect place to stay where I am going, but while I'm gone, I could list my home or our brand new guest house on Airbnb for whoever may be looking for that perfect place to stay. Well said, sir. Listen, when you're on the

go a lot or are road-tripping with your estranged family members exploring the complicated secrets of your past, that's what Randall and William do in this episode. is a smart choice to make to ensure those trips, no matter how simple or complicated they may be, are as smooth as possible. And your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at Airbnb.com

slash host. Gang, everybody has a type for hair, that is. And for our hair, we love partnering with way. Their shampoos and conditioners are made to deliver what's just right for your hair type. What kind of type of hair you guys saw? Chest hair. And chest hair

should not be ignored. It needs to be conditioned too. Yes. Absolutely. I have fine hair. Yes, you do. I do. You're so fine with you.

No, no. I have fine hair. I wish it were thick. But nope. But I do love my way products. Yeah. I love the way they smell. I love, I've talked about it on this podcast before.

The body care, specifically the scrub. Oh, in the St. Bart scent. Yes. That's my jam. My wife got real excited when she saw the way products come to the crib. Like, she sniffs me a little bit longer. She sniffs me anyway. She's a little bit like of a puppy

In a very sweet way She likes to sniff when I have it on the way She sniffs a little longer Get-Way products They'll sniff you a little bit longer Listen the point is Is that Way has products for any kind of hair Whether it's fine, medium or thick

Way has got you covered Do you want soft, shiny hair That doesn't weigh you down? What I wouldn't give Way's conditioning hair mask For fine to medium and thick hair types Instantly restores hydration It fights frizz and strengthens

strands. So if you're craving volume or you're in need of moisture, Way has you covered too. No matter what your hair care needs are, you will not be disappointed by Way's quality and incredible sense. And don't forget to check out Way's detox shampoo. Let it cleanse away your buildup and give you that refreshed and clean feeling. Whether your strands are fine, medium, or thick, Wei has shampoos and conditioners that fits your type. And if you're not sure what your hair type is, Way's website is there to help you figure it out and find the best ways to treat your hair. Wash your way to healthy hair. See what I did. Wash your way. Wash your way to healthy hair and get a hair routine that's made just for you by way. Go to T-H-E-O-U-A-I-com and use

promo code T-W-U for 15% off any product. That's T-H-E-O-U-A-I-com. Code T.W.U. The earlier, or I can't remember sequentially, you guys helped me out, but we were spent the night in a motel or before we go to Memphis, and I make the bed. Yes, I have that written down as well. And he's like, why are you making the bed? And I was like, I like making the bed. He's like, we're in a hotel. Somebody's going to do it. I said, first of us a motel. I don't know if people come to make the bad at the motel too, you know what I'm saying? It's not quite the same, but it's something that gives Randall order. Control. Control.

Like the things that I can control in terms of my environment or whatever are things that mean something to me because I know I can't control it all. So what I can't control, I will. But it's another step, it's another step towards this man teaching you how to let go. Yes. Fully live. Yeah. that control and to live your, absolutely, live your goddamn life. Yeah.

So he's like, so then we go to Memphis or whatnot. And I remember him, he says something about the Peabody and the ducks. He's like, oh, I hope the ducks are there, man. And somebody used to take him to see the ducks all the time. And I was like, okay, so you follow that away. And so then we in Memphis and then we go to see. Cousin Ricky? Yeah.

Does he go, his childhood home first? Yes, to see, yes. And this hit me, because Ron is different in this scene. Yeah. He approached this whole scene differently than he has done anything else in this show. Yeah. And he is. A little boy again.

And he's like a, I don't know, he was like bubbling, right? And he finds his treasures that he hid when he was a child in the fireplace. And this couple is like stupid as this man is dismantling their house. And it's just a couple of toys. And on the way out, he says, he says, can you believe it? After all these years, these are still there. Isn't it, and see if I get this right, isn't it funny the way the universe sticks and moves that way? Yeah.

Yeah, that's right. That the things that change are so unbelievable and the things that don't change are so unbelievable. Right. Are also so unbelievable. So unbelievable. Yeah. And that line, I was especially knowing that you won't see the man again. Sure.

Yeah. It was just like, I was in the kitchen. I was watching from, essentially from the kitchen table. Yes. Rachel came in again. She catches me every time one of these moments happens, she walks in. Yeah. This episode was.

Like, you need the hands on the face. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So that moment happens, which is. So beautiful. The two people who own the house, the actors were so cool. And I was just like, look, man, I'm trying to do best I can. I know it's weird, us rolling up on your house like that. But he was so impish and delightful.

And your line, I didn't know that was going to happen. God bless and how you guys went. Yeah. Then we go to see cousin Ricky. Yeah. And this is where Doe's tell with the past because he told Ricky in the past that I'm going to be back and I'm going to come back. with 60 hit songs and we're gonna do all this and he's like cool man that's all great so he comes to see him now and we see old age brian tyree henry and he told him to get the hell out of his club because he didn't communicate right we we left william didn't communicate obviously we saw that he was using he was an addict he cleaned himself up but still like he felt like he couldn't come back yeah didn't know how to and uh there's sheer

Dear delight from Randall at the possible, like, he's like, he's called him cousins. Like, wait, cousin, like that means you're my cousin? Like, what cousin? The way they shot this with you popping in and be like, sorry. Yeah, yeah. Like, I have other family I've never met before. You guys, go ahead. You go ahead.

It's so good. It's a real car. Do you guys know the difference between second cousins and cousins removed? No. No. Cousins removed? Okay, so check it out. Through marriage or something?

Yeah, yeah. Your brother's. children yeah and your children are first cousins yeah when your child has a child to your brother's child that's a first cousin once removed when your brother's child has a child with your children second cousins wow right that's how it works i got it yeah does that make sense yep no you got it i got it okay cool cool because that was one of the things i was like for randah i was like i need to understand this part because it's important to ralda but then i realize i'm breaking the vibes so i got to I love it.

But then there's this, they are able to heal, and he understands, and so that we go into, like, you still play? I think what do you say? He's like, I can always. You too sick to play? You too sick to play? He's like, I'm never too sick to play. And you see him on the keyboard or whatnot,

and Randall's hanging out with, he's got other cousins, and he does the Oprah, you have a cousin, you get a cousin. Everybody is like, oh. And then there's just great, phone call with his wife. Which, man, I'm telling, like, you're talking about, like, a pretty, like, hey, let me make sure my wife knows that she's a part of this thing. Yeah.

Like, joy is transpiring right now. Yeah. And everything is better with a little bit of Beth on it, but, man, I'm having the time of my life. And I'm so happy that I get a chance to share that with my partner. Yeah. You know? And what a balm to her after everything that she just witnessed you go through as well.

Like, the trip is going this way. and you are on cloud nine. It's amazing. Next thing, I get a chance to scat a little bit and then do the robot, which are always fun things for Brown to do. How much was improv, how much was scripted is all improv. Like, this was the most improvved episode. Because that's what John and Glenn said, look, what we want to do is just catch snippets of life. And then we'll figure out a way how to sort of weave them together.

Sure. But, like, you want to have the highs because the next thing you see is we're about to go somewhere else and we go into William's bedroom and he... The next morning, the next morning after this wonderful evening of celebration. Yeah. Yeah, they went into the evening, for sure. Yeah. So he is struggling. He's struggling.

William is now struggling. And so I'm going to flash back to something real quick because February 5th, 1987 St. Louis, Missouri is the day. day that my father passed away. And early in that day, I remember walking into the kitchen to start breakfast or whatever. My mom is on the phone calling 911. And she says, go put some clothes on your dad. And I'm like, huh? She's like, go put some clothes on your dad. And I was like, okay. So I walked into my parents' bedroom and my dad was turned over on his side, almost like stiff, like couldn't move his body. And a very similar way to how Ron was.

Yeah. And like, he was naked. And I remember, like, he couldn't move his arms. So I was trying to pull his underwear on. He could see 10-year-old Brown was uncomfortable with, like, putting underwear on his dad. And he just said, go get your mom. Go get your mom. Right?

And so it's interesting about this is like when the paramedics finally came, they have a split-level house. So they have to carry him downstairs to the front door. And as they're carrying them down the stairs to the front door, my dad hit me with a wink. That's the last thing I ever saw for my dad. Oh, Sterling. Last thing I ever saw from my dad. Because they didn't want me to go to the hospital because they felt I was too young to deal with that.

So this is what I'm talking about, the parallels of life and art, art, life, dovetail, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So he's turned over on his side and I'm watching it, right? Then the next thing, we're in the hospital. And the doctor's explaining to me that he's not going to make it out of the hospital. I was like, what are you talking about? Like, he's got months, and he's like, no, he's like, no, you're in the hospital. months and he's like no he's got days i was like listen all due respect he has a doctor in new york

you know what i'm saying i don't know where you're doctors do it but like i have the resources to do this he's like look man i understand what you're trying to tell i'm trying to tell you right now you have hours he's not leaving this hospital make the most of the time that you have and so we go into the room and william is sort of He's talking about just life and where he is right now, and mistakes that he's made. And I don't want to overly summarize this. So if there's moments that you guys want to highlight,

but he says the two things that I remember most are most happy about is the person that I was in the beginning and the person that I am at the end. And then he says, I'm a little scared. Yeah. And the reason why I think I'm having sort of the reaction I am is that I got to be there. Yeah. I know it's Randall.

I know it's William, but Sterling kind of got a chance to be there to say goodbye to his dad. Yeah, man. And I say, it's going to be okay, man. And put my hands around his face, and I said, just breathe. And you see him just breathe. And he passes, right? But it makes me think, too, like, this is weird stuff. I'm somewhat tangential, but you guys bear with me

and then bring me back as I need to. Please. Because, like, my dad went really quick, and so did Jack Pearson, right? And my mom, or Randall's mom, was, was ill. for a long time but it was a progressive illness and like my mom has ALS which is a sort of progressive illness so it's a weird sort of thing still that's happening in my life where I'm seeing like a slow thing happen with my mom's body not with her mind but with her her body and my dad went pretty pretty quickly but it was

such a joy like I to be there it was a joy to be there you know Yeah. Like I, you know, and then we'll come back to this in season six or whatnot, but for those three kids to be there for their mom, that means something. Yeah. That means because not everybody gets to do it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Not everybody gets to do it. And so, like, don't let me miss anything, you guys, because I know I'm jumping through, but, like, it's so interesting. Tidbit, the first time we shot the last scene of this episode was in Memphis, because we did go on the road to Memphis. Like one of the places that we went, we went to Pittsburgh, we went to Vietnam, we went to Las Vegas, we went to Memphis. And we were shooting this last scene and we were running out of time with the ducks going across. And the ducks weren't actually there and like it was being very harried and whatnot.

And I didn't feel good about how I had left like the last scene. And John and Glenn were like, dude, it was great. Don't even worry about it. I give these guys credit because they said, they looked at the last scene. said, they looked at the editor, whatnot, and they're like, I think Sterling could do something else. And so we reshot it. Really? We reshot the last scene once we came back to L.A. With the ducks. With the ducks going across the car or what have you, because like it's, sometimes when you feel rushed in a sort of emotional scene, it's just like, oh, I don't want

to do funny things with my face, sort of feels like I'm forcing something or anything like that. So when I saw it and I saw the ducks, and it was just like I could hear. Ron Williams' voice was like, oh, man, I can't wait to see the ducks hit the Peabody. And you see the ducks walk through. And it was like, it's this moment of recollection and realization that I have all the time with my own dad is that he's still here. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Is that he's still here.

Yes. And watching it like last night and record. Realizing that Ron is gone. But still here. But he's still here. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. You know what I mean?

So it is, as I think about the show, and Chris, you would say in this early on in another podcast that, like, you know, why is the show so sad? Because you're sad. You know, like the show's not sad. Like, you're like, there's sadness. It's part of the fabric of life. What a joy to be able to feel all of it. Right? it feels so good

to feel human and the full range of everything. All of it. That's right. You know what I mean? Like it's nothing's good or bad. Like it's all, it is what it is. You know, you have to allow yourself

to experience all these things because that's what life is. Yeah. You know? And the harder that we try to control it. Yeah. The more painful it is. Come on, bro.

I wrote down this thing that William said to Randall, roll the windows down, turn up the music, and take me to meet your father. I loved that. It was like, what a mantra for, like, backtracking a little bit, but it was just sort of like, when he threw those maps out, it was just sort of like, you don't always need that. You don't always need that. And I feel like Randall, of anybody, needs to, like, take that in in his life and really digest that. And what a beautiful lesson to sort of like be told at the end. Amen.

Amen. Yeah. There's, you know, there's so little to say about this episode outside of your experience of it. Yeah. You know what I mean? And our audience's experience of it. And it's, and it's, man.

There is a reason that it is one of the most talked about episodes of the entirety of the series. Like, there is, people had such an affinity for William. It was such an artistic, thoughtful way to close out this chapter. None of it was heavy-handed. And I think that's why it was like so emotional for all of us to watch, you know? I'm just looking at different quotes that I copied. Again, when I was talking to my cousins, when I did the Oprah thing, I said, sorry, I was raised by white people.

Yeah, I have that written down too. Everything's better with a little Beth on it. I want them to remember looking up at me, not down, when Randall talks about getting the girls here so that he can be covered in hugs. Man, that was a hell of a thing you did, knocking on my door that day. Yeah. Yeah.

I have up, not down. Yeah. I believe that was, like, him referencing, like, wanting to look up at some, right? and not down is there. He said, I had a happy life. Right there in the song. I do love the montage at the end when he gets reunited with his mom.

Yeah. She's really sort of beautiful. You know, just in contemplations of what is next, what is the life after this life? Like, I don't know exactly what it will be. You know, I've done my ayahuasca, so I have some ideas. But there's the idea of being rejoined, of being reconnected

is something that fills me with a great deal of joy with all the beautiful people that have left a mark on the tapestry of life. The painting of your life. You know what I'm saying? Just being able to be rejoined with them in that way. Again, I say these things because Fogerman never talks about anything of like the spiritual, but like it's all over the show.

It's every, it's so many fingerprints of that over every, everything that the show is. It's all over. He also, it's earlier on when we're first getting to the car, he said, you seem to have it all together and Randall says two together. And it just reminded me real quick of like the check on your strong friends sort of thing. Because like it's a real, and I find myself in these moments. I don't know if you guys do too. I was like, I feel this pressure to have. have it all together.

I feel like people look at me sometimes like, oh, Brown's got it all together. Nobody. Nobody has it all together all the time. No one. And God, it's so nice when somebody says, you're all right, man. You're like, brought up and wait for us.

Somebody just ask, yeah. Yeah. And William did that in a really beautiful way. Sterling, I mean, hats off to you and to Ron. This episode is just like, it's beyond. It defies description. It's so, again, it is, there is a reason this is such a called upon, remarked upon episode of the show. It's just like what the two of you did single-handedly.

And again, this is another episode that doesn't really have anyone out. We introduced some new characters with Brian's, you know, cousin Ricky and whatnot and Jermel obviously but it it just like it really relied on the two of you and your chemistry and what what a remarkable way to wrap everything up it was like it was so I think such a feast and such a treat for the audiences that that was along for the ride and loved your connection and the father-son relationship and what you guys were able to create on screen thank you the only the only other performer in this episode who has you know, the intimate knowledge of the story is, is Jermel.

Yeah. You know, and he gave us all such, like, a lovely gift of, like, getting to know William. Yeah. Yeah. We should talk to him. Let's talk to him. Let's pick his brain. We're going to get him on.

That was us right after this interlude. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Jermel Nekiah to the show. What's going on? Hello. Hello. What is happening? You look good. Oh, thank you.

Thank you. You have to go do something or something? Like, or is this just for us? This is what I'm trying to figure out. This is for everybody. That's right. Yes, yes. That's right.

This is not for the three. It's for everybody. That's right. That's for everybody watching. This is kind of my everyday though. So, you know, I'm not really doing that much. You've had the swag since we met. Did I peep a ma'am bun?

Did you turn to profile for me a little quick? Oh, yeah. Look at this. So, yeah. So this is the crazy part. Usually I have a big afro now. And so I was like, let's just tame it down a little bit. Jamel is the reason people need to watch us on YouTube.

I'm not mad at it. Absolutely. You look great. Thank you for joining us. Are you in L.A.? Where are you joining us from today? I am in L.A. Yes, I am.

We were just talking about the Memphis episode, the beautiful work that you did in terms of introducing us to young William. Obviously, your first episode was 103. Is that the first episode? Correct. That is right. Yes.

Yeah. But, like, I'm curious because we actually never got a chance to have any scenes. You got a chance to act opposite Mandy, clearly. But, like, what kind of interaction, if any, did you actually get to have with Ron? You know, it was very brief. If I remember correctly, I was on set for them to decide how the hair and makeup was going on a Tuesday, and they're like, hey, would you like to meet Ron? I'm like, well, yeah, of course.

So you were filming, you and Ron were filming, and so they drove me over, and I got to meet him for all of about maybe five minutes, but it was kind of this, I felt this old soul connection. And then on Thursday, I was filming. So it was just sort of like, okay, I will just take that and just drop it in and let's go. Because you hadn't had a chance to even watch, the show had not been on the air yet by the time that you started shooting. So you hadn't seen, did they show you anything?

They didn't show you anything. I had seen, before I even audition, I had seen, you guys, I think had done the first episode, right? So there was a little bit of a teaser on YouTube. Okay. That's it? Right. That's all I saw.

So I remember at the time my manager was like, you know what, I think I found the role for you. So I watched that, and I called him back, and I'm like, oh, yeah, oh, yeah. That was like on a Friday. And the audition was on Monday, and I got that job Thursday, and then on set the following Tuesday. That's right. Whoa. That's how you do that.

That is a crazy turnaround. Yeah. Yeah. It was quick. So it was just kind of like, you know, with Ron, we had this eye connect, and it just kind of like, I'm grateful that you're you so I can play you. You know, the younger version, you know what I mean? So it was just, and it just kind of worked out. I mean, we had some conversations along the journey of it all.

I think when Jesse was introduced and he was kind of like, so how do you feel about this? Did anything change? And I just thought, why would anything that's organic and just who are living in the space change? I think just be. And this just happens to be another element of who William is. So for me, it was just like, okay, there's just one more thing, which, of course, there were so many things that William had to contend with.

So that was just another like, all right, we got it. No problem. Gosh, Jamel, I'm curious to. considering that you were cast and brought on and shot so quickly in that sort of succession, did you know who this character was in this story and where it was going? Were you given any of that information? Or were you just sort of like, I'm signing up for this and wherever this goes, I'll just follow the lead and go where I'm supposed to go?

No, I really didn't. I wasn't really given much information. I just, you know, I always felt like my work stems from. like some sort of ancestral place, so I was willing to just follow it. I was hoping that this wouldn't be, that this could be any man who just happened to have fallen and got the opportunity to get up. And that's exactly what I believe William ultimately was. It was nothing stereotypical about it. But the only thing that I worried about, of course, was, you know, the heroin addict. And you think at the top of that, you're like, oh, man, what's this going to look like? But again, that just happened to

be something that this old soul had this innocent old soul had to deal with a lot of the journey but had nothing to do with a stereotypical journey of living in mahogany skin shall we say absolutely it was we were talking about that as we as we rewatched this episode and we and they have these montages that compress time so much and the gift that you gave us by by getting us to letting us get to know young william so well in such a compact amount of time allowed not only you to do your work but Ron to do his in a way that that is so hard

to tangibly explain, especially to a not, maybe to a non-actor. The gift you gave the show and the audience in investing in Ron. It's two separate people. And I think it may be happening. and sometimes in this show, but I think this is the best case. Yeah, the best example.

Yeah, yeah. Especially how quickly, how quickly we needed to love and connect to both of these people, the young man and the older man. And you mentioned the heroin addiction, and that's just, it's grist for the mill, right? It's a period in this man's life. Totally. And he is many things, and at one point, he was a heroin addict. Yeah.

And it was just, did you rewatch this episode by chance? Or when it was the last time you saw it? You know, and I have to tell you, when I saw it this time, it was so different from when I saw it the first time. You know, it just felt everything about it felt different. Like I was like, wow, did I ever even see it? That's almost how I think about it. Yeah. Didn't make any difference also just knowing that Ron is not here anymore.

Oh, completely. Completely. Like, as I was watching him, I'm looking at him, and I'm just thinking, you know, you don't have me. opportunities where you play someone else, like, you know what I mean, and you, and you share the same soul, and this doesn't really happen. You know, we all have our own stamp in life, our own soul that we bring to our characters or whoever it is, but I shared this with someone. And so when he passed, it was like, the older William, of course, went with him, and then it's kind of like, but we still carry it on. If that makes sense, you know what? I'm like, you don't share these things. Like, when your soul leaves this, earth it's it goes but now i i shared this with someone and that was a huge when i even thought about it

the memorial i was like wow you don't have that you don't have that experience you don't share that it was such a joy to see you there we were talking about earlier how happy we were to see you yeah that you that you showed up i was i was saying like i don't even know how many interactions he got a chance to have with ron and and clearly it wasn't a ton of them but like you you you should showed up, which, and I remember asking you, was like, I couldn't not show up. Yeah. No.

I mean, I think that, again, here we go. I shared a space with someone that out of just sheer respect, whether or not I had the actual time with him on the ground, like you guys did, I did not. But there's no way that I would have missed that. I just feel like it would have been borderline inappropriate, if not just full on inappropriate. for sure for sure i think you know also one of the most amazing things about playing

william and i feel like this as an artist the general rule is i was in ohio actually and you know i'm not thinking about william or this is us you know you're just i'm out to dinner and not none of this is going through my head and the the uh the waitress says oh do you mind if the owner of the restaurant comes over and talks to you and i'm still not i'm not connecting the dots and i was like okay sure no problem so he walks over and he says you know um i want to let you know first of thank you for being here and I used to be a heroin addict and I lost my family but they started watching this as us and saw you and called me and said is this just some sort of human affliction if so can we kind of work on this again so me and this guy just cried because i just thought

now when your art of course depicts life and you actually change someone's life like then we've done our job that's right so that's what i felt like that's the biggest honor i felt like for playing William that someone actually actually said to me eye to eye face to face. That's amazing. That is amazing. Yeah, it was like, oh, okay. And I take no responsibility for that. I just take that I was doing what I was supposed to be doing to aid and yield somebody else.

Had nothing to do with me. It was just. You got to be a conduit for it, though. Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of, like, you know, William is such an artistic person. Obviously, you are an artist in general. But did you relate to that side of him?

Are you musical? Because we saw in this Memphis episode, like, you just like behind the keys. And I was rewatching this episode with my husband. And I was like, look at your mouth. Like, he's just going for it. You were so joyful up there. It was so palpable. And again, to like show that color, that side of William.

It's something that like for young William, especially, like, we never got to see until this episode. And I'm just curious if that's something that you should. shared with the character. Yeah, well, I do have a musical background. So I am like semi-classically trained, so I did a lot of musical theater before doing the TV film. But really what re-rooted with what felt more organic to me was that stepping into Memphis and stepping into old black life

and what a juke joint feel would feel like. And that's what I think riveted that work more than actually having the connection to my own personal musicality. Got it. Well, it definitely came through on screen. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We were all feeling it. Yeah.

We'll be right back with more. That was us. You want to know what's just around the corner? The season of fall. And I have to say, there's nothing quite like the feeling of a classic jacket. Oh, a light jacket, some stylish pants, and maybe a pair of boots or sturdy shoes that really bring the whole outfit together. After a long high hat. summer, it's so refreshing to swap out those sweaty summer clothes for something cozy

and comfortable. But let's be honest, finding the perfect comfy sweater can be a bit of a challenge. That is where Quince comes in. I love fall dressing. You guys, I am ready for the weather to cool down. And, like, I want some turtlenecks. I want some cashmere sweaters. I want cozy pants and cozy socks. And I just, I look forward to this time of year, like most people. It truly is the best. It truly is the best. Layers. That's what fall represents. You know what I'm saying? If you need to get a little bit warmer, you get a little warmer, then you can just take it off. That's what I like.

California living. Quinn has this knack for offering timeless high-quality pieces that keep my wardrobe frisesh all without breaking the bank. You know what the best part is, gang? Everything is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. And Quinn's partners directly with top factories, cutting out the middleman and passing those savings onto us. Plus, they're committed to working only with factories that prioritize safe. ethical, and responsible practices using premium fabrics and finishes. And the best part, Quinn's offers amazing deals year-round,

even during those tricky in-between seasons, so you can keep your wardrobe fresh without ever breaking the bank. I like it. I like it a lot. Make switching seasons a breeze with Quinn's high-quality closet essentials. Go to quins.com slash T-W-U for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com slash. TWU to get free shipping and 365-day returns.

Quins.com slash TW.U. Tell me a little bit about Amanda Warren, I think, is a wonderful actor, Brian Tyree Henry, like just the scene partners that you had to sort of like live things out with. How was the process of just working with those beautiful people? Well, you know, you also, again, there's no, there's no time here, right? We're just rolling. Yeah. So, you know, with Amanda, I saw her from her trailer to mine, and I was like, hey, how's it going?

Hi, Mom, see you in a minute. Yeah. I mean, it was literally, that's what it was. But she, again, also has this extreme depth that I think is one of my greatest gifts as well. So it was, it was easy just to like, all right, we're ready, that camera's going. let's do it. And one of the things that I do, I never, usually do not say any line before filming, period, nothing, because I feel like I'm making the decision on what the other actor is going to say to me. So in order for me to listen, then I don't say it at all. Because that's

whatever you're saying to me, I now need to respond to it in an organic in the moment. And that's the way it was with Amanda, 100%. Wow. Because that's just the basis she comes from. I didn't expect tears at what happened. They just happened. I never, never claimed, you know what, I'm going to cry here. Let's cry on this line. It's a look good. Let's make sure that tear falls. They just, they just happen. It's like, we'll be from a different angle. I'm like, yeah, I'm going to still probably be crying because that's just what's going to happen. The same, the same thing happened when I first saw Ron on screen and when I saw you on screen, you look into this person's

eyes. And I instantly had the same reaction to both of you, which is, I love this person. Like this person, this soul, no matter what they do, no matter what they say, like they feel, I felt like I, they felt, you both felt known to me. Yeah. Like there's a familiarity. There's such a softness and such a kindness too. And both like. Look at that face. Yeah. Right. But I mean, I felt that working with you and you feel it when you watch it on screen, it just emanates from you. And it emanates from Ron as well. It's just, it's so wild that they're able to find that. Well, I just think that was like the gift that we were given each other to sort of somehow live on the same plane of just as as old soul human beings. You know what I mean?

It's just a little bit deeper than your average pedestrian. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So when you meet on that, in some ways, it just makes it easy because you're already there. So now just step into who this man is. Right. Right, right. Yeah. You know, and I don't know.

I actually, in a weird way, I found it, I don't want to say easy because that's not the right word because all of the elements were given. Familiar. Yeah. Familiar. Let me ask you, you're talking about the juke joint and sort of like the negritude of everything that you were sort of enjoying. in that environment in Memphis or what have you. Talk to me about listening to Brian Henry ripped this song, like, take after take,

because y'all probably had to do it six or seven versions, and then they wound up cutting it together or whatnot. Like, what was it like seeing the song grow and become what it was? You know, it's interesting, you know, because you sit there in the moment. I'm like, I am Williams. Ramel is somewhere else.

I'm like, man, I wrote that. This is good stuff. Pat yourself on the back. I'm like, this is awesome. And I am playing this song over and over again. You go. will you? So from that stance, honestly, because that's what I feel like it's actually, it's really

happening when it's happening. Yeah. You know, this isn't like a script. This is where we're filming real life for me, you know, that's the best way I can describe it is it's just, okay, we might do it two or three times, so we're just, you know, going back. But at the same time, it's actually happening. You're living in the space.

I have a question for you. As a character, how? How did you feel about Rebecca's decision not to let William in Randall's life? That's a loaded, loaded question. As a character, you're saying? Yeah, I mean, we can say character and then as a human, sure. Okay, okay. It's a complicated dynamic for me as an actor, as a human, as a character.

Like, there was so much sort of mixed up. So I'm curious what your thoughts were on the whole thing. Yeah, I actually remember that day really vividly, Mandy, because you and I had just filmed something right behind. And we just went, I went straight into that because I was in that. When I opened up the letter, I'm there by myself. And I remember changing into the outfit.

I was already extremely emotional because I felt so, did she really just say no? Like, how do I digest that? That's kind of, and of course, the digestion for that in the moment of actually opening the letter and seeing the words on the page, I, you know, the emotions just erupted because it's just kind of like you were in control of that entire fate. Yeah.

So, of course, I absolutely can say that I understand, I think, as a human being, but I also feel like give in the, in the, I felt sorry for self and felt sorry for a man who that may actually happen to in real life. Yeah. You know, like, it's just like not being given that opportunity. So I can't say that I have fault there, but I definitely feel like, but what if? Yeah. You know, like, what if you would allow it? Like, what would that have looked like? How would his life have changed? Yeah. There's a, there's a lot of mixed emotions.

I mean, it's the same thing, like when I dropped the, dropped you off at the bus or at the firehouse. Fire station, yeah. And that was a serious emotional scene for William and for self, because I just thought, But I did absolutely think it was the best thing for him. And obviously, as the show played out, what your life looked like, ultimately because of this selfless act. And also, but it was also like, man, this is so hard to drop your child on a doorstep. And you don't know what's going to happen.

You dream and you hope he has the best life ever, which you did. But who's to say? All I knew is I can't. do it. I've got to be man enough. I've got to be strong enough. I've got to be, I have to live in this space and the spirit that this is the right thing. Yeah. Wow. Well said. I think just you asked that question because I think like from the beginning you're like, I don't think Rebecca should have done this. But you do in 117, you as you say, look, I made a mistake. I should have done that differently. And it's this beautiful moment that we'll get to and when we talk about this episode.

But I say, like, it's okay. It was enough time because I knew that I loved him and I know that he loved me. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Which is, you know, I guess that's all you want out of the interactions, the relationships that you have in life is a knowing. Not like I wonder if or a confused, but like a solid knowing. Correct. I was loved.

I loved in return, you know? Yep. So, yeah. Question for you, but what else have you been up to? too late, is there anything that anyone can catch you in right now? I know these streets are hard, so there's no problem saying if there is something. Yeah. What can we refer people to to see your enormous talent on display?

You know, I have, and Mandy, I think we talked about this a little bit at the memorial. I have, I bought this huge compound in Detroit, which consists of this old 1920s school and this cathedral and parish house in this parking lot. And I was like, so you bought this. because what what what what is happening here and uh the thought behind it it just came to me one day is that i wanted to see this whole facility turned over from you know commercial to residential and give people a chance you know in detroit 41 percent of the population lives below the poverty line that's what's actually noted but i actually think it's higher probably 50 percent

or more so if so in that case you are in the united states this is someone that I would say is almost feels like a developing nation for lack of better way of saying it. And that just feels unfair for any human. So if there was any way that I could, you know, find this way to give people to health care they needed, the mental health that they needed. And this year of living instability where someone said, hey, I care what happens to you. And at the end of that year, be able to be whatever their best is. That best is, you know, getting off drugs, no longer allowing someone to take advantage of them,

whatever, like just being able to live a full, fruitful life. So that has been taken a lot of my time and energy. And because the streets are a little bit barren out there in terms of the TV film world, it has, it's allowed me to continue to filter that out and to work on that. Do you have a social media presence around that project, or is there a website or a place where people could donate? No, not yet, which is definitely, I know, right? Like, what? But as you guys know, probably, you see, I'm the worst when it comes to social media. You know, it's just something I need to get to get better at. And that's the next step to

work on that. Well, when you're ready to spread the word, let us know. And we'll get it out there. We'll help you. Please do. Okay. You have the vision, which is a reflection of like just who you are as a human being. You are here to be of service, whether it is through your art or otherwise in life. God bless you for listening to that calling. Yes. Yes, thank you. Thanks for chatting with us today. Brother, thank you for taking the time to be with us today. Good to see your face.

Appreciate you. I've seen you all. You take care, and if you need to let the bun out, it's all good. You're big, small, it don't matter. Let it throw. Oh, trust me. And I'm sweating and everything, so this is all coming off. Hey, so are we, buddy.

It's hot in here. Take it easy, buddy. See you later. All right, we are back with our third. favorite segment of each episode, the fan segment. And we receive a lot of mail for these fan segments, but for the Memphis episode in particular, we really, really received a lot of feedback and a lot of mail.

This episode was an especially tough one for all of us, because saying goodbye to someone you love and being with them in their final moments is not something you can really prepare for. No. A lot of you related to this and shared your own experiences with final goodbyes. And thank you for sharing and entrusting your stories with us. So today, with permission, we're going to read a letter from a fan who shared what This Is Us and the Memphis episode in particular meant to her.

You want to start? What up, that was us, gang. My name is Alyssa from Risertown, Maryland. I have been a fan since my sister sat me down and made me watch the pilot about two weeks after the show was released. I was hooked as soon as I saw the fireman try to hand Jack a cigarette in the hospital. The plot twist, don't we know it? Little did I know, I'd be struck with endless plot twisting storylines throughout the series. This Was Us was Appointment Television for my mother and me.

We didn't watch it without each other year after year. I made the tea and got the snacks. She got the blankets and tissue boxes. We had conspiracy theories about how Jack died. And of course, we were very wrong. I'm a ride or die R&B fan. Those are my TV parents. It was great to see a black family be a normal,

family and Beth always reminded me of my aunt and cousins. And it was nice to see Randall deal with his mental health while struggling to be quote unquote strong for his family. I'd never seen that on prime time network TV before. The Memphis episode made me weep thick, salty, hot, wet tears all over my blanket and into my bag of popcorn the first time I watched it. I think I've only watched that episode maybe twice, Max, since the loss of Roncifus Jones. I haven't been able to watch the episode again. I refuse to watch it. I have watched the Super Bowl episode like 10 times

while reprimanding the television academy for not giving an Emmy to Mandy Moore for that hospital scene. I've watched R&B fight a dozen times. I've watched us learn Laurel's story a few times. Oh, my God. I've even watched Rebecca walk down the train a handful of times.

For some reason, I can't muster up enough courage to re-watch that episode. Memphis. Maybe because it reminds me of when my family and I were in the hospital when my own grandfather passed away on November 11th, 2018, Veterans Day. And I couldn't even bring myself to be in the room while he took his last breath, hearing the machine go off. And the correlations between Ron's condition, my grandfather and the image of Randall holding William's face as he takes his last breaths is just too much for me. Masterful work, Sterling, by the way. I truly wanted to say that this show has meant a lot to me as a black woman watching this show and growing an appreciation for the writing, the details, and the acting. You guys weren't caricatures, but fully fleshed whole three-dimensional people I could relate to. Not just side characters, not ignoring their blackness, but leaning into it. Every character was so fully human, this show taught me that everyone has a story and that most stories, intersect more than we know.

Thanks, you guys, for all your work. Peace. Wow. It's all, what an emotional, what an emotional sendoff. My goodness. What was her name? Alyssa.

Thank you, Alyssa. In Reisterstown. You know, I haven't watched it. That was only, I think that was my first time watching it since it aired. Yeah. Like, I hadn't, hadn't watched it. same same either and it was uh that was my first time too yeah i understand yeah you know and she sounds like she's a she's a through she's watched episodes many times yeah that one was uh yeah

that's a challenging one to say you know what i'm gonna do tonight i'm gonna sit down and watch the memphis episode of that of this is us like that it's wild i would agree wild prospect there's only a few things that i've done in my life where i was like that was enough that one time was enough like I haven't watched it but I did a movie called Waves and I was like one was enough

for a way one wave one wave like it's almost like that I did it twice because I had to do this rewatched but if you had your druthers

it would have just been the one time beowing of this episode totally thank you thank you for writing Alyssa if anybody else wants to talk with us

You can send us an email at That Was Us Pod at gmail.com. Yep. That's right. And I think we have a phone number. We do. You can give us a ring. Yeah. It's 41250-5028.

Leave a voicemail. Leave a voicemail. I call you back. Hey, we do that. Yeah. We do that. But at least our day will be made hearing your lovely message regardless. So please, please call us.

This is one thing that I wanted to do to end this particular. episode. It's a little extra. This was a note that Dan put in the actual script at the very end of the episode. And he did this time to time. He did this from time to time. He would leave us personal messages. He's good like that. So it says a note to the reader, and particularly to Mr. Ron Seifis Jones. It's never easy writing the death scene of one of your favorite characters and actors. I hope we've done you proud. You certainly always deliver for us. And if anyone is extra sad about this ending, I'd urge you to remember the words of a wise young actor named Justin Hartley, who once said, people will die in our lives, people that we love. But it's kind of beautiful, if you think about it, the fact that just because someone died,

it doesn't mean they're not still in the painting to be continued. And he was with us for all six seasons. That's right. You know what I'm saying? And continues. continues to be a part of our painting. Mr. Ron Seifis Jones, we love you. We love you.

We thank you for your contribution to our lives. And we'll see you in the life after next. That's it. And that was us. That was us. That was us. That was us is filmed at The Crow and produced by Rabbit Grinn Productions and Sarah Warehunt.

Music by Taylor Goose. Goldsmith and Griffin Goldsmith. That was us.