That Was Us - Nothing Bad Ever Happens on Christmas Eve | "Last Christmas" (S1E10)

Episode Date: July 30, 2024

Rebecca promised us, “Nothing bad ever happens on Christmas Eve,” and if you rewatched “Last Christmas” like we did, you know it’s a close call. Kate gets her appendix out; Dr. K is in the same hospital, dying, about to go into surgery; Randall’s co-worker, Andy, is preparing to take his life; and Toby has a heart attack… and who is coding?!?! Navigating the holiday season is already a tricky thing to do. How do we celebrate the joys of life when we’re at death's door? Where do we find peace amidst the holiday season when it’s not always a joyful time? Who do we turn to when we need a hand to hold to get us through it all? Ring the bells and let’s talk it through because it’s Christmas time. Follow That Was Us on YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, Threads, and X! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode of That Was Us, we are talking Season 1, Episode 10, Last Christmas. Kate comes down with appendicitis. Jack and Rebecca are unexpectedly reunited with an old friend, and Kevin celebrates Hanukkah with Sloan's family. All right, guys, pop quiz for you. How healthy are your scalps? Yours looks good, Chris.

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V-E-G-A-M-O-U-R dot com slash T-W-U code T-W-U. Oh, boy. Oh, boy. Merry Christmas. Happy holiday. Back. How's everybody doing today? Doing good.

Good. Glad to hear it. Nice to see you, everybody. Wonderful to see you, Amanda Moore. Always a pleasure, Christopher Solomon. Sterling K. Brown. Thank you very much. We're talking about 110.

I know you guys have some thoughts. The first thought that I have is like the format of the show is we played around with the format a little bit. Yeah. And every once in a while, Dan likes to sort of just like, people think they know what the show is or whatnot. And he sort of like takes it a little way, which is really cool. Because this was a series of sort of one act plays. Yeah. Where normally we cut in between the storylines of all the characters.

We let each one sort of play out on its own. its own. All about death and dying. All about death and dying. Which is the Christmas. Isn't that the reason for the season? Yeah. The Christmas spirit.

Well, yeah. It's the first episode that is a darker episode. Yeah. Not just topic-wise. I would say second. For me, the first one was the discord in the marriage of Jack and Rebecca where things were sort of like... Oh, wow.

Like episode two way back then? I mean, it didn't feel dark. Three? Three. This had a heaviness hanging over at this. episode to me that like... But also stylistically... Correct.

The way it was shot, the way it was directed. Like, yeah. There's darker. Less music, like underneath things. Like, things sort of played out very bare bones. Yeah. And for those who missed it in the credits, this episode was directed by Helen Hunt. That's correct.

The one in the only. The... Who, again, playing on the theme of my naivete during season one, didn't know was directing the episode until I walked on set. You see? Yeah. And unless I was worried about a lot of things that. season a lot of suits and and and anyways i i was like oh how not mad about you you don't

stay yeah i was very excited to see her on set but the first thing she did she she came she came out to me because you know directors they're down to business it's time to shoot we got a day to make and and uh that's the first thing she did the first thing she said she walked with an ipad just like this and goes have you ever seen uh anyone have a heart attack and i was like She pulled up some YouTube videos to show me how people fall when they have heart attacks. And I was like, okay, I think I got it. Which can we just stop? It's the very end of the episode.

I understand it's the end of the episode. But did this guy not give the best fall of all time? I mean, we were on set, and I remember in that moment, I was like, oh, he's going to hurt himself. Like, I was genuinely concerned, but watching the episode back, I was like, slow clap. That is, like, an impressive. No. But in an episode of death and dying, then at the end, someone maybe dies. We're not sure. Yes. This is true. So wait, let's hang right there. We'll go back to the beginning. We'll go back to the beginning. Let's go back to the beginning. Let's go back to Jack and Rebecca celebrating Christmas. Yes. Trying. Trying to celebrate a doggone Christmas. You got Jack. I remember Rebecca saying, like, do you think we overdid it? Do we get too much? Like, no, you know, like I work hard and the kids deserve this sort of thing.

And then Kate's like, I don't know, something's not right. I don't feel good. And you say something about the cookies. The cookies. The cookies. She got into the Christmas cookies for Santa Claus. Like, you know, you get what you get? Yeah.

The fellas are sort of, what are they doing? They're fighting. Just typical presents. They've missed the meaning of Christmas. Yes. And you guys, do you guys know what the meaning of Christmas is? And young calves is like, it's like some Jesus stuff or whatever. You're like, we've got to go to church.

Some Jesus stuff. We're going to church. Yeah. But it turns out, Jack comes over to his daughter, fills her head or whatever. She's warm or whatnot. Like, babe, I think something's really going on. It's got appendicitis, right? Take it to the hospital.

Anybody ever had it? No. I have not. Yeah, I've had it. When did you get yours when I was 19? 19. Yeah. Yeah, I was, I had a temp job at the Double Tree Hotel in Sacramento, California.

Copy that. Best chocolate chip cookies. Best chocolate chip cookies. Don't sleep on the Double Tree Chocolate Chip cookies. What do you think? They give you cookies at. check-in. Okay.

Did they still do that? Oh yeah, but if you work there, you got access to that. Unlimited. I'm not kidding. There's a cookie kitchen. I believe it. If you guys want the behind the scenes, welcome to the Double Tree Hotel rewatch podcast. Let me give you the behind the scenes.

I don't want to brag, but Ani DiFranco did stay at our hotel that summer. You, 19. And so I'm 19 and I'm doing clerical work because if I wasn't an actor, filing would probably be my dream job. Copy that. Taking a stack of files that are out of order and putting the back in order. and putting the back in order, and putting them in bins. Yeah. Very good at it.

Nice. I do enjoy it. And I'm 19. And I am slowly, pain is rising in my side and I'm slowly being bent over until I cannot, until I can't stand up straight. Are you serious? Yeah. Why is it always like you have to wait for near rupture to get the... Can we ever be proactive with it?

Like, they say it's just... Some sort of like warning sign before that? To be fair, I was at the doctor that afternoon. You were? He was a large doctor, Santa Claus-looking character, with very large fingers. And I don't know if you know how they check to see if you have appendicitis. I do not. I did not know this.

I thought this was just prostate. But it's, no, it's also, yeah. He went in a few times. And Sterling and I were talking before the podcast that I deal, ideal when I'm in the hospital. Yeah. We'll talk about it next episode. But I'm very funny. because I'm so nervous

and so I was in my bed yelling out to the nurses like hey I'm an Eagle Scout so if you give me a scalpel I'll take this thing out like I don't we don't need to do surgery I can figure this out because just don't let that doctor come back in here

with the giant hands with the giant fingers anyways huge sidebar so he has appendicitis Okay, Kay, Kate has been the side of this. And I feel like why do these things always happen on a holiday, right? Yeah.

Children, pets, like anything that is going to go catastrophically wrong for some reason has to happen. Yeah, like over a holiday break where things are crowded, crazy, it's just like the worst possible timing. It's pretty terrible. Yeah. So Christmas Eve, they're in the hospital. Christmas Eve, they're in the hospital. She's getting her appendix out. She's getting her appendix out.

And you see sort of like, there's a couple of moments. that pop out in my head is sort of Kev's care and love for his sister. Yeah, their connection. Their connection. He's like literally walking her hand while she's on the gurney. Not letting her go, right? You see Randall talking to mom being like, oh yeah, this is bad. And what I like about Rana and Lani is Randall is just his listening.

Like nothing sort of gets by. Yeah, yeah. He takes it all in. He's an observer, yeah. He's an observer. But the thing that we don't expect, in this episode is that we have a Dr. K reunion. Yeah.

Dr. K is in the hospital. He's just got, he was in a car accident. Yes. Right? He's got internal bleeding. Things are not looking good for him. And his family's unable to make it to join him because of weather conditions.

I can't remember what the reason was. I believe so. I believe it's weather conditions. Something like that. And the Pearson's are like, well, we're going to be your family today. Yeah. And it's such a beautiful, like.

And Jack gives him pretty much the same he gave him when the babies were being born. It was just like, you're gonna be fine. No, I don't wanna hear it. You're gonna be fine. It's Jack's coach. Yeah. He believes in emphasizing the sunny side of the house,

which I'm not mad at at all whatsoever. And I love the full circledness of Dr. Kay being there for their scariest, most vulnerable moment and for them to be able to provide comfort for him in this potential, like potentially what could be the end for him. felt really beautiful and synchronistic, yeah. It's beautiful. Randall goes to get a snow globe for him.

He's like, I hear you, man, it's responsible for me, you know, being in his family. So I just wanted you to have a gift on Christmas or whatnot. And he goes like, you know, I was only pointing a family in the direction that they already wanted to go. You know, it was just super, duper sweet and beautiful. Spent his own money. Because Randall's a saver. And reinstated and reinstated the meaning of Christmas. There you go.

There you go. So that was the first. one that we saw, and then we come back to it towards the end. So this is, I think my smile comes from, number one, Ron the director. Oh, genius. This guy slays this shit. Yeah, yeah. He really does. He absolutely slays. Anytime he's on the show, I was like, dude, you're a fucking beast. Yeah, yeah. He has directed theater before, or at least has been directed in theater before. By someone like that character. Because he says something to the effect of like, I thought this was going to be just like the worst, you know, the vanity project, the sitcom.

And it turns out that you guys actually have a lot of heart. I think we're going to be okay. And Karen's like, there's more? Oh, there's more. And they hug each other. And it's so sweet. And something positive is coming. She told her family that she was dating the manning.

Yes. Right? And he's like, well, actually, I got to go to my brother's house. This is what I do. She's like, dude, you owe me at least this much, right? So he goes and celebrates Hanukkah with Sloan. And you see Kevin sort of be charmed by Sloan in her telling of the Hanukkah story. Yeah.

Right? By the way, Malani, she kind of slays it. She does. She does. She does. She is absolutely wonderful and adorable. So winning, so charming. Why she sells so many phones.

I can see why Kevin was charmed by her as well. It was like, wow. And her family was hilarious. I actually felt like it was an opportunity for Dan, who is Jewish, in the midst of of our Christmas story to be like, you know what? We put a little bit of something to my stuff in this. That's right. That's right.

So it all goes together, right, in the sauce. And he's like, you know what? We should do this. Like, people think that I'm not a serious actor. They don't think you're a serious playwright. She's like, who doesn't think that? Her mom's like, you know, I don't. My sister's like, I don't.

Whatever. So like, you know, forget what other people think. Let's go ahead and do this ourselves. Yeah. Completely charming, completely beautiful. Love it, right? Then we go to Kate. Is there anything else to you, anything else from the Kevin?

No, it's just, it's interesting, it's interesting to watch, because if we are, if this show deals in addiction. Yeah. Right? If it deals in anxiety, if it deals in alcoholism, there's something about Kevin's character that is a bit of, he's a bit of a love addict. Oh, for sure. Like he cannot, like an official, like cannot be alone, doesn't like to be alone. Yeah. Even in his description of why he's doing it, like, there's a compulsion to.

that's good to relate or to couple or to save or to whatever the thing is yeah it's it's kind of the first time you see him like he's he's it's it's weird to me because when when i see this unfold it's like he phrases it incorrectly and he doesn't understand what's going on yeah but it is actually what he should be doing yeah he should be trying to partner with somebody who he's not fully attracted to. Sure. Because when he goes after somebody's fully attracted, it doesn't, it's dysfunctional. Yeah. And it's, and it's, that's in 111. We get to that more specifically. Right, right, right. Sorry. See, I tell you, I watch them back to back and I'm like, yeah, same, same, same. It's hard. It's hard. I'm with you. Anyways, I'm totally with you. It plays out. It plays out. Let's talk about

Kate, who with her mom, goes to consult for the gastric bypass. And this is, you know, As I'm listening to all of the possible side effects that could come, I find myself being like, oh, man, I didn't realize. You know, it's like every time you're going for surgery or whatnot, you have to sign away this thing that, like, you know, if you die. There are potential complications. There's potential complications. And it was so interesting to see, sidebar.

I was talking to my wife about Mandy Moore and her portrayal of Rebecca Pearson. I said, Ryan, I'm just sitting here watching this show. I said, Mandy Moore is a killer. Like, she's a killer. And she goes, yeah, she's a killer. And I would say this, I was like, why do you think, do you think because she started off in music that people don't see her as a killer in this particular woman in the same way? She's like, no, no, no.

She makes it look too easy. Oh, guys, that's very kind. I was like, Ryan, she's playing 60-something. Yeah, but she does it so effortlessly that people think that like anyone can just do it. People forget that there's a 30-year-old in there. Do you know what I'm saying? You guys. So I'm just saying to...

Do you want to leave? I'm going to take a break. Because we have things to talk about. To my on-screen mom who's eight years younger than me, you can kill her. Yeah. Thank you guys. You're welcome. That's very kind.

So as I'm sitting here watching it and like, it's so like, it perfectly encapsulates. I catch myself as a parent with my children. Like there's sometimes I just can't help but say something. Yeah. And like I'm not doing anything what I think is right or wrong. is right or wrong. I just want to, like, there's more information to be had. Let me help get the information because my kid tends to sit back a little bit, but I can be like, oh, I need to ask this question. And that's exactly, you're just getting all the information that you can get,

not clocking that she's like, um, can I do this? You know what I'm saying? Sort of like, annoyed, but like, I think it's just kids are annoyed by parents. Once, you guys probably have been not old enough yet to be that. I'm not quite there. Are you asking? if they're old enough to be annoying that no if if annoyed by you annoyed by you oh no he's old enough yet to be to be annoyed by me really yeah yeah yeah especially especially if i like you know the the position shift but if i'm if i've swung into like the boundary position yeah sure sure for too long where last night at bedtime he was just like it took he took on a character like he like all of a sudden like took on a posture that he hasn't taken on before and i don't know where it came

But he was like, Dad, just go. What? Just go. He's three and a half. Like done. He was done for the night. Just go. Just go.

Because I was like trying to like stick to the bedtime routine. Wow. And so I was like, you know what? Okay. He knows what he wants. Yeah, yeah. I'll see you later. He's there.

Anyways. Yeah, it happens more. Yeah. When they get even older, right? And so just sort of watching that dynamic between the two of you. And please feel free to comment on anything that you think of because what really hit me is when we got to that moment in the car, did I do this? Like, and you ask in such sincerity, like, I didn't know when not to talk about the food or how much to bring the food up or to not bring it up. Like, I was constantly trying to figure out what was right and what was wrong.

Because we also got the Prozac information. We got the Prozac information because we didn't know that she was dealing with depression or whatnot. And Mom didn't either. They had no idea. And then, like, her response was about the most honest. I don't know. Did I do this? I don't know.

And I just got to sit with that, for a sec, man, because we're all now these parents, and we're probably going to send them to therapy for something and just wondering what it is that they're going to be going there for. You know, because there's no getting it right. There's getting it the best that you can. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah. The best that you can. Like, and I think about it, I look at them, I'm like, all right. Like, I know, like, Ryan and I will argue from time to time. And like you said before, hopefully I also get a chance to witness the repair. Yeah. Argument's going to happen. The repair's going to happen, right?

I talk to my kids about food all the time. What Ryan and I did on our podcast, this whole thing about diet culture. And especially in Hollywood, I think that, The emphasis is so much on thinness being equated with health that I would like to debunk here now. Like different body types show up in different ways and can be healthy. Healthy, exactly. You know what I'm saying? And however that manifests and just wanting them to be healthy, right?

And I think about like, Ryan and I will go, we've, our kids have never had General Mills cereal. Sure. Right. I had nothing but General Mills cereal. I guess they're not going to be a sponsor. Reese's peanut butter puffs. You know what I'm saying? For breakfast?

Used to kill him. Yeah, the crunch. Captain Crunch. I went to the roof of my mouth. Was bleeding. Was real. Yeah. Right?

And so you do these things to try to introduce and to, you know, healthier options or whatnot, and there's still going to be something that comes up later on. You know what I'm saying? So like I was, it was a moment of real empathy from parent to parent being like, man, you did. Like I see you trying to do it the right way. And even in that, like. you feel responsible for an outcome that you, I don't know. And before becoming a parent, I remember thinking about the scene and rolling my eyes like,

I love my mom, but I'm like, oh, this reminds me of my own mom who just like inserts herself into things and like, and now being a parent, obviously, I have a completely different perspective and I'm just like, of course she wants to be there, of course she wants to hold her hand, of course she's concerned, like that never goes away. So, yeah, I've had a real perspective shift since we film this episode. I can imagine. Yeah, and maybe there's, it may be certainly you can tell us if there's a shift that's, that has to happen. Because there has to be a shift at some point, right, that goes from keeping them alive

to letting them live. You know what I mean? Like, like, like, how do you do that and how do you transition? Like, when is that? I was trying to explain to a friend of my life. There's a reason why I need my son to listen to me all the time. Yeah. Not sometimes.

And sometimes it's for dumb things that he doesn't really have to do. But if I ask him to do them, I need him to listen because I don't have the time when it matters, when his safety is at stake to explain which is which. I just need you to listen to me. So the great profundity of because I said so. right becomes clearer than it ever has before now there essentially becomes a time where where i'm going to have to transition out of that yeah and people are going to have to learn from their own mistakes yeah mistakes and consequences of their mistakes right so i don't know you have to touch the phone i don't know and maybe that's the sign of successful parenting is to

make that transition fully or to make it in a healthy way more that was us after these words from our sponsors. Get to Toronto's main venues like Budweiser Stage and the new Roger Stadium with Go Transit. Thanks to Go Transit's special online e-ticket fairs, a $10 one-day weekend pass offers unlimited travel on any weekend day or holiday anywhere along the Go network, and the weekday group passes offer the same weekday travel flexibility across the network, starting at $30 for two people and up to $60 for a group of five. Buy your online go pass ahead of the show

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I think my mom was pretty good at this, to be honest, because I think the trap can be is always seeing them as that thing that first manifested in your life. Right. And not allowing them to mature into who they are now. Sure. So I was just trying to relate to them where they are in that particular moment. I see with my oldest son, he sort of demands. it.

Yeah. Which I give him all the credit in the world for. Like you can't be like, oh, you're my little boy and everything. He's like, no, dude, I'm about to be 13 at the end of the month. Like, you got to, like, can I have my phone? Yes, you may. Like, there's rules to the phone. If you violate those rules, you know, they go away.

Sure. So he'll violate the rule. The phone goes away. And he's like, ah, I had that coming because I messed up, right? At a certain point in time, I want to be able to earn my way back into your good graces. I was like, if and when you do that, then you will get this back. then you will get this back, right? So he's actually pretty mature in that way

and insisting on that you deal with me where I am right now. Right. I think that's what it is. You know how it is sometimes when you go home, and we all, to a certain extent, maybe you guys don't fall into like a role that you played when you lived in that house?

Sure. Because it feels familiar and comfortable and that sort of thing. So like we kind of play a part in it too to a certain extent. Yeah. Because it's kind of nice to be at home and it's kind of nice to be.

Kelvi and like, oh, Kel, what's you doing it? And so, like, we play a part in it, too. But it's also because it feels familiar and comfortable. And so I guess you kind of got to take the kids lead to a certain extent of like when they want to be sort of like when 16-year-old Sterling wants to get into the shopping cart and be pushed around by his mom, which is fun. Right. And you're in the store like at 9 o'clock at night and nobody else is there.

She's pushing you around and he's happy as the lamb. And the times when you're like, Mom, I need you to deal with me like where I am right now. And so I guess the difference that like the real question then becomes like you two have already had an interaction like this where you come to the door and you talk about you knowing about. Yes. Your biological father. And there's like this. It's really like a moment of growth for Rebecca. Even at an even at however old she is at that point.

And this question is also an interest. did I do this? Okay, well, why are you asking? Are you asking for forgiveness? Are you for absolution? Are you, and I don't, I don't know. Are you asking so that you can take responsibility for those things? Like, it's such an interesting, pivotal, it's a pivotal moment for an adult and an adult and a parent. My takeaway from it, when we were filming it at least, was sort of like, this is such a taboo conversation and not something that she fundamentally feels comfortable talking about with her mom. I'm sure with Kevin, maybe with Randall, like she's been a little bit more open

about this part of her life and this, and who she is and what she wants to change. But I feel like it's kept from mom a lot. So just the simple fact that she wanted me at that appointment allowed me the space to ask that question that I probably had never asked before because it is such a profound, earth-shattering question. If it felt to me, Mandy, like, if this is my fault, allow me to apologize. Yeah. Right.

Right. Like, if, like, I don't think Rebecca has any problems. Like, if indeed I did something wrong, let me know. And I can tell you, I'm sorry. Yeah, I can take accountability. Because here we are now at this juncture where you are considering major surgery with all of those complications. Like, it's terrifying as a parent to think about that of your child's life. life in peril and that you played a part maybe at them arriving to this place, you know?

Absolutely. Especially to watch your kids struggle in all the different ways that they do or will, addiction or blah. Breakups, divorce, whatever the thing is. Like you pointed out, I guess the most profound part of this conversation is her response, which is, I don't know. Yeah. Which doesn't really leave you anywhere.

No. It doesn't. I'm still trying to figure it out of. Yeah. Okay. Do we go to William and? And Jess, every time I see him, I well up. Yeah.

I'm just like, yeah. I'm just like, oh, yeah. It's like being visited. He's beautiful. It is like being visited. Yeah. He has this aura around him. But it was, it's always there.

It's not just there because we see it in hindsight. It's like he just is so special. He has this like, it's why people I think loved that character so much, everything he brought to him. And I think, he brought to him. I think I'm remembering the feeling of seeing, I think seeing him in real life felt like being visited by a, by a wiser being. Yeah. A wise old owl? Just by a, just by a spiritual entity.

Yeah. Like, and to be reminded, every time I see him, I'm just reminded of that feeling. So before this episode happens, I'm reminded of a conversation that Fogelman had with me when I was on set. And he's like, so I got this crazy idea. And he goes, I think your dad is gonna wind up being bisexual. Do you think he'll have a problem with that? And I was like, I don't know. I was like, probably ask him, he's an actor,

so he's probably pretty cool with it. He's like, because Dan, his cheeks get all red and he gets all giddy because he's got an idea. He's like, I think we're gonna make William bisexual. Like, what do you think he's gonna be okay? I was like, should be. We go, go talk to him. Yeah.

Yeah. And he was like, yeah, man, what are you talking about? I'm doing it. So, there they are in N-A. And he's telling the story about a monkey, that he encounters on the street like at 3.30 in the morning. And the crux of it, because in a very sort of circular way, it's like, why am I up at 3.30 in the morning?

Yeah. Like what positive is supposed to be happening right now? And he's like, oh, and he's like, is this a monkey? Like, it's almost like, I'm high. Is this a freaking monkey? Oh, I should not be high anymore. Like, it was like a moment of clarity. And then he decided to turn his life around, get clarity.

He reconnected with his son and sort of says that he gets to go home and spend Christmas with them and celebrate in that way. And he doesn't have many Christmases left. He's also aware that he's dying. He lets everybody know, but he's happy that he's at this place in his life, right? So then after he speaks, we hear from this dude, Jesse, from the first time. played by Dennis O'Hare and Jesse talks about how he had love in his life and then all of a sudden it went away or the object of his love the love did not go away this was really well well pinned yeah by the way like he kind of killed this shit right and all of a sudden he just disappeared and he was left wondering what had happened to him and you see William in the foreground just like oh man and Jesse telling his story and you realize we had as an audience, we're like, oh my goodness.

William's the object of his. William's the object of his love. And so at the end of that section, the two of them come together. And he said, I didn't know how to tell you. I knew that I was dying. I didn't want to burden you with that. And he goes, well, are you dying like this instant?

And he's like, no. And he's like, are you dying tomorrow? Not that I can tell. He said, well, I love you. And I would like to spend whatever little time that you have together. Is that okay with you? So beautiful. There was there was something else about the sequence of events that I found I maybe didn't notice the first time through but you know throughout this whole episode you know a bunch of Jesus stuff we're going to church also in that

story he talks about a higher power yeah and it's I correct me if I'm wrong but it's like the first time in our show that God is discussed probably in my mind the first time that God is discussed is 105 with the painting. In my mind, sure. But yes. But I mean, but I mean almost in a, not in a spiritual, but a religious way. Right. And to have this character, William, be the one who talks about a higher power in his life, who it's literally put into the character of a, of an ex-junkie. Yeah. And then minutes later, at least a bisexual ex-junkie. It's kind of an incredible network television discussion. Yeah.

Like, I was kind of like, this was on NBC. Bung, bong, bong. I think Dan, in his infinite wells of humanity knows how easily certain people can be dismissed. And he puts in the mouths of people who are oftentimes dismissed by society, profound truths and revelations and, like, wisdom. Whether it's Kevin and sort of like being the handsome sort of like actor who's supposed to be vapid or whatever, have you,

or someone who's supposed to sort of occupy the fringes of society, like William or whatnot, and giving them a depth and sort of richness that makes you say, like, I should not dismiss anybody. And if I see myself in this show and I relate to this man in this way, now I see myself in this man. Bam. Okay. So now there's, there's Randall and Beth. And I tell you. I'll tell you, like, real quick sidebar. I always, most of my career, I always have to play someone who's like the heavy, who's very much in charge and, like, you know, rock solid. I'm always Oberon or Sino, or I'm like, in Shakespeare Times,

I'm like, that dude. I never get to be like one of the lovers or anything because you have presents or whatever it is, right? So I say all that to say, like, we sort of open our section with like a bit about a boat. Like, it's Beth and Randall. And it made me laugh so much. Yeah.

And because I think Sue being the gorgeous human being that she is, who is so funny, doesn't always get a chance to flex that funny bone. She's so funny. She's so damn funny. And the two of us get a chance to do this thing. And it was, ah, I just smile from ear to ear. Because it's also sort of a bit of a respite from the heaviness of what just happened in the NA. So she's like, you need to get the money back for this boat.

Yeah. And I'm like, okay. It's funny. I'm like, Randall's a boat man. Like, that was a revelation to me as well. I was like, there's some curveballs. The South Carolina curveball later. Like, like, there's another one that we didn't, that's in this episode.

It's a small one. Our kids are staying with her sister. Yeah. We never meet Beth's sister. Ever? Ever, ever? You never meet Rebecca's sister either. They're just like mentioned and then forgotten about it. Yeah.

Yeah. I think Toby has a sister too. I'm serious. Toby definitely has a younger brother. I remember you making mention of him. That's what, maybe that's what it was. Yes, yes, yes, to be continued. A sibling.

So here's an interesting, like, little tidbit. I don't have you ever talked about this, but it was deeply profound. So Jimmy Simpson plays in this episode. He plays the guy, Andy, who I bought the boat from. Incredible actor. Yeah. Incredible actor. I met Jimmy Simpson in the summer of 1999 at the Williamstown Theater Festival.

Oh, wow. Him, Charlie Day, a bunch of other people, right? Good buddies. So a friend of mine, one of my best friends from undergrad, died the summer of 99, one year after I graduated from undergrad. His name is Andrew. His name is the namesake for my firstborn child. He, in the obituary, either fell, jumped, or pushed from like several stories high on his

office building where he worked, right? And so I'm reading this episode and I'm talking to this dude named Andy who was about to commit suicide. And I was like, it was one of those moments of like spirit. I was like, God, is this? What's happening? You like, and I, like, so friends of mine called me after the episode. I had no idea, Sterling. I had no idea. Called me after the episode and they're like, did you put this? I was like, no. Wow. They were like, did you ask for the name?

I was like, nope, but I didn't change it. Wow. So as this scene is happening or whatnot, like there's this sort of weird thing about like, if I had been, versus like now I am here to do this thing. Like it's, it's, man. So, and so the summer that I met Jimmy Simpson is also the summer that my friend, Andrew, passed away.

Wow. Wow. Did you ever share that with Jimmy? No. Wow. No, I think this is the first time I've ever talked about it. I had no idea. I just remember, I mean, not to speak out of turn here,

but I remember that there was a lot of moving parts with this particular episode. And there was something about this script, like being altered and changed last minute in your section, in particular, this whole scene with Jimmy. And people having to relearn lines and all of that. So I just assumed that like, oh my gosh, so on top of the burden of like that shift happening, you had to bring all of your collective like real life experience like, whoa, Sterling. It was heavy. Heavy. The latter part of what you're talking about is the scene got rewritten like a day and a half before.

And, you know, we try to be good students and get it all under things or whatnot. But like they hadn't gotten Jimmy attached to it yet. So Jimmy had some ideas about how it could change or whatnot, and they're like, cool. So then they change the script. So Fogelman, he sees me, say, hey, let me talk to you for a second. Because I was like, dude, I just have to like memorize everything over again. It's a sidebar for SKB real quick. I memorized fairly quickly, but I also put in a lot of time to it or whatnot.

This was the first time that I was anxious about memorizing lines and having enough time to do it. Because it's a whole act. It's a whole act. You know, it was like seven, eight pages, whatever. So, like, I don't smoke a lot, but I have, like, a joint in my closet of my old house that I've had for, like, two years that I'll take, like, and then I'll put the joint back. I was like, I think I'm going to need this joint. So I took, like, a couple of puffs of joint, and I go into my garage, and I just hammer it out.

I hammer it out, and I got to where I needed to be. And then I go and I see the writers the next day. I was like, I had to, you know, memorize the lines and I think. Dan's like, come, let me talk to you. He's like, do you want me to try it? change it back. It's because I'll change it back in a heartbeat. I'm sorry if this happened to you and da-da-da. I'm like, no, it was the first time I saw Dan sort of be like upset. I was like, it's okay. I got it. We're going to make this thing work. And he's like, okay. It's like, all right.

But shooting it was, it was sort of, I got to release something, you know, in a way. Like, similar to as we get further on down the road, the William and Randall storyline and the parallels between my own life or what have you, like, it's like, God put this TV show in my life for a reason. I'm not saying like it's all therapy and whatnot, but like there's things that were very close to the surface and they were easily accessed, right? Because when I'm watching it, like you said, I cry, like, when I saw myself be like, no, no, no, no, no, no. I was like, I had like anxiety.

Oh, for sure. So I looked away last, like, like I was. got distracted by something. And then when I heard your reaction, I looked back at the TV and I saw you looking over the edge and I turned to Rachel, I'm like, did he jump? I forgot how the scene ended? I was like, your reaction to it.

I was like, wait, no, he didn't. On our show, he didn't actually jump, did he? And then they show him walking away. And I was like, holy shit. Dude. It was such a perfect moment because there was also my black wife walking in and me being like, hey, don't come no funny.

She's like, you don't tell me what to do. I'm like, no, don't do it. Yeah. You don't understand. But you're walking. Don't tell me I don't understand. Yeah. We'll be right back with more.

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He tells him that, like, you don't have a monopoly on pain. Everybody has to go through something. But the story doesn't have to end here. Right. Wherever you are right now, you get. a chance to write a new ending but you have to keep going right yeah right which is the thesis of our show it's the thesis of our show right so that's the end of that section we go home we uh pick up our daughters from my wife's sister and uh who will call claudie clauddin's house and and we're prepared

for a quiet christmas because everybody can't make it and then slowly but surely everybody trickles in. Yeah. And it's such a warm feeling. Beautiful montage, Christmas montage with a Sufi and Steven song to boot. Song's great. Yeah. Song is great. And so the, so the first time I sing each other since the end of 109. Yep. Seeing what 109? And like after that moment, like it sort of made sense. Like I didn't say anything directly to you or whatnot, but I was like, oh, life's too short. Like I gotta let it, I gotta let it go. Yeah. Let me take you cover. come on then. You know what I'm saying? And there's a lovely moment where we're naming

the reindeer. I was like, I bet your grandma knows and whatnot. And we improv that. Like, that wasn't in the script. It wasn't. But they just left it in there. And I was like, oh, they left it in. It's so cute. I love a montage. I love a montage. Justin throwing popcorn into my mouth. And you come in, wait, before the montage, before the montage, you come in. I'm part of the montage. Part of the montage. But yeah, Toby, the big grand gesture of a surprise. You guys have done, you guys have been working on us up for like eight days. I'm gonna say two things.

I said, because I wrote in my notes, I said, and Toby comes, and then later I wrote twice. And so, you make a grand... You make the grand gesture. It's like, they're like, my kids are like, I think Santa Claus is here. Yeah. Sure does look like it.

You got the hat on and everything. Yeah. And you tell how much you love, and you sit in the middle seat. Yeah. And you have a lot of time to sort of crows. after what you think and know. And so a beautiful sort of reunion transpires. And listen, I, as speaking on Randall's behalf,

I don't know how I feel about y'all knocking boots in the crib. Yeah. But I understand. Again. You know. Again, it's distasteful at best. Romantic. You did it, but you do a great job of threading the needle of like post-coital exhaustion

and like, I don't know if that brother right. right like he's a mess something's a mess something may not be a hundred i get that from my that was me that wasn't acting that's just that's just how i this is how it looks how does it look for you wait a minute you don't look like you're about to have heart attack i could go to it on another podcast maybe you're doing it wrong i don't want to judgment that's not quite the one if you don't if you don't look like you're going to have a heart attack certainly maybe try a little harder i don't No. Oh my God.

Oh, wow. So, wait, now this is the important tidbit. No. Because as everything, all the merriment is transpiring, people are getting along. Oh, well, let's do one real quick, because I think this is how it happens sequentially. He's checking out, Randall's checking out William and Jesse kicking it with each other. And his daughter comes up to him. I was like, I think grandpa may be like, my friend from school who's got the two dies.

Like, what? What are you talking about it? He was like, Grandpa's gay, Dad, or at least he's by, and she strolls off. I'm like, did I miss something? So it was really, and that goes into the next episode, so we'll talk about that later. But then everybody's chilling, kicking it, da-da-da-da-da, and all of a sudden, Tobias gets up on his feet and there we go into, what are the frames for second when we go into the slow-mo thing?

48. 48, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. There's a 48 frame. go right over the top. But it's like the knee buckle, then the fall. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was excellent.

This is why, I'm now remembering why it was so shocking to be the whole city. Because you guys have been working on this episode for a long time. And then this is my one day of shooting. That's true. And I come in. You realize this was our first time all being together like that with everybody. Except for Jack. Except for Jack.

But everybody was there at the same time. Yeah. And Helen Hunt. And Helen Hunt. Have you ever seen anyone how someone has a heart attack? Here's three examples on YouTube. And it was all like CCTV footage from YouTube of people like at a counter like, obviously it's not funny.

It is when you meet somebody for the first time and that's what they greet you with. It's as serious as a heart attack. Listen, it's funny because Helen Hunt, who's one of the best actors of the world, she's so serious. She's like she is very serious. So serious. So it makes sense that you're going to come up to you. I mean, all respect every, I mean, the job of a guest director on a television show is got to be the most terrifying.

Even if you've been doing it forever. You're coming into somebody else's family. You're coming in to somebody else's house and they're like, hey, good luck making a show that already is a hit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And fitting yourself in and just that's why, hey, have you ever seen anyone have a heart attack? Yeah, it's like you have to be as over prepared as possible. Here's the other part. You are not a series regular.

Right. So this is what we've talked about before. It's like, I've gotten this script. And at the end of this episode, Toby has a heart attack. It says right there, falls over the car, through the coffee table. Yeah. And the questions begin. Because we do actually go to a Christmas break.

Yes, we do. We have like six weeks off. Six weeks off. Six weeks off. We leave people hanging right there. Of just people on Twitter being like, what's going to happen. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Did you have questions?

Did you? Yeah, did you? No, I think... Or because you knew going into 111. When I got the script, I was like, ugh. And then... But then I saw that I was in 111. And I was like, okay, okay, all right.

He survived. Did you ever have the conversation with Dan is like, am I still just episode to episode? Is there... Did you know that it would be more concrete before the season was done? Again, my naivete in season one, I didn't know what conversations to have, who not to talk to,

talk to what you're allowed to arrest. So I just like, show up, talk to Alan Hunt, and fall over this. Do you know, you've been seeing a bad heart attack. And if you haven't ever seen anyone have a heart attack, it's exactly what it looks like. There you go. I nailed it!

And this episode also rounds out in that montage with Kate being okay. She comes out of her appendectomy. She's fine as well as Dr. Kay. Yeah. He wakes up and sees that the Pearson's in his hospital room there to help him usher in his next chapter but also the holiday and it's yes it's very sweet it's like okay he lives to fight another day Kate is okay and this sort of mantra

that I think gets carried through Christmas is down the line for the Pearson's this idea of like nothing bad ever happens on Christmas it that theme sort of comes up again in later seasons and stuff so. And Toby is left, is the last shot him on the operating table? What's the very last shot? Yes. With the heart monitor beeping. Yeah, that's right. We're all left to, do you guys remember? I mean, this is a real sidebar as well. We went to our first award show shortly after, like, days after this episode aired. We went to the Critics Choice Awards. Yeah. And it was the first time that I had ever been a part of something that, like, you're in a sea of people that are in, that are movie stars and TV stars. And regular folks who were just there to, like, attend the award show.

Yeah. And we all, like, there were so many people coming up to us talking about the show. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was the first time that I was sort of like, oh, we are a part of something that people are watching and talking about and curious about because we were also just in our little bubble of like you're going to work and just like chugging along every day. And sure, you'd go out in the world and stuff. But, like, you know, we live in Los Angeles. People are pretty, like, blasé about, like, this sort of stuff, about the business.

Sure. Right? And I just, I just remember this exact moment because this episode had aired and people were, I was with you. I was with Chrissy and Sue. And people were coming up to you specifically, like, what's going to happen? Like, every, but it was being a part of, like, a water cooler moment, which I, it was very, very new. It's pretty cool. It was cool.

It was cool. I don't know how many more shows will get that. I mean, a network television show. For those first few seasons, yeah. Where you're not streaming, right? So you're not just like people binging and watching something like all at once. Like there was an event idea around it and watching it on Tuesdays and being able to like, I mean, it just, yeah, it was a different, different time.

You're right. I'm not sure there will be anything quite like that again. And the idea that like, as I remember, I can remember, and we'll wrap this up. I can remember doing OJ and being like, oh, dude, like, So I get to do some prestige time. Yeah. How exciting. Yeah.

And I remember reading This Is Us and I was like, oh, this show is so good. I was like, it's going to be on network. So it's not going to get the same sort of prestige, whatnot consideration. But like, it's good. Yeah. And that's all that matters, right? And then it turned out to be good. And it wound up catching the zeitgeist.

And the fact that we got invited to those places as well. Was the most unanticipated part of it all. Golden Globes. Absolutely. Yeah. Critics choice. That's pretty cool. Yeah. Yeah.

To be in that conversation. Yeah. When you're telling a 42-minute story alongside dragons. Yeah. The confines of network television versus what the freedom that everybody else had is, yeah. It's pretty remarkable to be in that same conversation. So this episode, this is our Christmas episode. It left people feeling all warm and fuzzy on the inside.

Ish. Yeah. You said you did not cry. This is the first episode I did not cry rewatching. That's interesting. Yeah. Well, I don't know if I did. I cried.

I got, you know, I cried. I cried. I absolutely cried. But that's because, again, of this personal thing that I was talking about. Yeah. And I, in terms of the reason for the season, right, what I appreciate it about Dan, putting in Hanukkah, putting in Christmas, talking about sort of faith. Like, but also, like, the way people showed up, right? Like, Christmas is a time in which people show up for each other.

Right? So like you can say it's for a particular religious reason or not, but like people showed up. Yeah. And what that ending part of us, the family's showing up for Dr. K is like, hey, it doesn't matter now. Like we're family, we're here. Yeah. We got your back. Like that's, you know, maybe it sounds too pat for people, but I kind of dig it. I like seeing people show up for me too. Me too. Sorry, sorry. Ring, ring, we are back with another segment of the emotional support hotline presented by TalkSpace. Be sure to check your insurance coverage and visit Talkspace.com slash T-WU to start speaking with a therapist today.

All right. We love, love, love hearing your messages, Sterling. You have someone for us today. This is Jaisal. Let me press this play. Let's see what we got. Come on. Hi, guys.

I just saw the video through Instagram about your podcast. and this phone number, and I'm like, she tried it out because it's crazy, amazing, and I'm so excited. Anyways, I've been a huge fan of your show. I watched it all through COVID and through my miscarriage and before the baby, and now I have a two-year-old and I'm re-watching the whole thing because it just hits different and everyone's just so relatable. and I've already watched it the whole thing and now I'm re-watching it and I'm excited to just re-watch it again later. So I talk about it a lot through my friends

and now they're all watching it. It's just, it's a beautiful life story lesson and, you know, it's just us. It's just life. So thank you for doing what you do and I'm excited to watch the pod or hear the podcast, watch a video of it. and um yeah thank you and i miss you guys and i'm going to watch it again now okay bye oh

i've got to say my name jazel j-a-z-el from san diego uh california jesel sweet let's call her we should do let's call jazel back let's do it i'm not going to tell your phone number hello hi is this jazel it is hi jazel it is hi jaysel it is and K. Brown. Chris Sullivan. Oh, my goodness. Hi. Hi, Jaisal. How you doing? Hi. I'm good. I am watching, of course. This is us. And Rebecca just said the word caboose. Oh, wow. And it's perfect timing. Really? How, wait, you were saying in your voice mail that you've watched the show a few times. How many times have you

watched the show? Well, it finished the whole thing, the whole six seasons, binge watch it during COVID. And then now I'm just like back to it And now I'm back to season six And I'm just going to rewatch it again after it is Good gracious We love that we've been able to keep you company Like what what is it about the show for you That feels comfortable

Like that you keep coming back to it What is what is it about the show that you keep coming back to? Curious I made a whole list I did my homework Okay No I think it's bottom line And it's really just the connection. And I'm a Pearson now.

I'm just part of your family. What are you like it or not? I love it. I'm not adopted Pearson. I'm so sorry, Randall. You're not the only adopted. It's quite all right. There's no fun of the Holies can't have now.

Come get some of this Pearson love. Yes, but it's just seeing yourself and your loved ones and all the characters and the stories and how we're all like just intertwined, just like, you know, kept in his drawings and paintings. things. It's life. It's just us. You said you had a baby. How old is your baby now? Oh, actually, yes. So she is now, too. She just turned two last week. Congratulations.

Yes. Thank you. Motherhood is a trip. There's more there. There's more than what's the trip for you? You know, I watched the whole, this is us before. Parenthood. I watched it after I had my miscarriage and I was newly wet and it was COVID and I was working through jobs. So this is something which is my me time. And it hits different back then. It's great. But now that I'm a parent, it's totally a different vibe. It's the parenting and senior kids and they grow up and done having kids and how to manage little things like when they get a little heartbreak and all that stuff. So it's yeah. and I are in that same boat where, you know, obviously when the show started, we weren't parents, Sterling was, and rewatching the show now and like kind of living the storylines through a completely different lens makes things feel. It's, it is wild how different it feels. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and I love it. Thank you guys for doing this beautiful work because I just can't get enough of it.

Jaisal, first of all, I love your name because I ain't never heard it before. It's real cool. Is it a family name? Is it your name? Like, how'd you get your name? I haven't know. So my dad claims that he named me after the music jazz

because she loves jazz. And then my mom says that she made me after this girl that she saw on TV named Jaisal. So now they're still at it, and they're divorced now, but that's not because of my name. But, you know. They just couldn't agree On who picked the name

Just to claim that, yeah Both of them work for me It's a cool name Like did you get compliments for it all the time Because it's not one that you hear a lot Yeah I get called different names Different versions of it

Which I'm totally fine And high school People mess it up How do they mess it up? What do they call you? Of course they call me Giselle At first, Hazel That's not right

high school they go jizzle because they're immature you know but it's all good i got you sorry you called me off guard i'm too immature to take it i just went back to high school sorry it's okay thank you thank you you are our lovely human being um i wanted to like because you said it in your voicemail and you said it like um our condolences on your miscarriage our congratulations on your baby and your family. So to be able to have gone through not having anybody, to having lost somebody to now having somebody is a beautiful thing. And I'm glad we've been able to be with you through that whole journey. So just wanted to say that out loud. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for seeing that. Yeah, it's been lovely. And that's just life, you know. We go with the punches. You take

the sourst lemon and make it to something with lemonade and add tequila. to it maybe yes a little tequila never hurt anybody unless you're under 21 yeah be care postnatal we will let you go now jaisal thank you so much for your lovely message thank you for being a fan i hope the show is good the third time around yeah i hope it still hits the third time around you know thank you thank you guys so much wishing you such a huge fan of everybody thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you for the beautiful message have a good one Bye. Thank you.

Bye. Bye. Jayzal. It's about as sweet as they come, you guys. I mean, and we are also grateful to Mint Mobile for giving us those unlimited minutes to make those phone calls back so we can chat with Jaisel. Absolutely. I love this emotional support hotline guys. The EHS, it's...

Oh, we've already abbreviated it. I like it. The EHS is something special because like I said before, it's full circle. They feed... We feed them in ways that we feed them. and in ways that we don't even know about and they come and say really kind and wonderful things about our show

and the way that it impacted them. You know, just real quick, there's these moments in time, I don't know if you guys have ever had them where you question whether or not what you do as an artist is important. And there are moments like these that you go like, oh yeah, it's important.

You know what I'm saying? Sometimes we're like, should I be building airplanes or, I don't know. Somebody should be. Somebody should be. But not me. No. I'm not that dude.

But I'm so happy that we get a chance to do what we do. And it does have a real impact in the world. So that's it for this episode of, that was us. That's it. We'll see you next time. Bye. Bye. That was us is filmed at The Crow and produced by Rabbit Grinn Productions and Sarah Warehound.

Music by Taylor Goldsmith and Griffin Goldsmith. Thank you.