The Agenda with Steve Paikin (Audio) - Introducing... Big [If True]

Episode Date: November 23, 2024

From online hoaxes to deep fakes, the media landscape is filled with misinformation and disinformation. "Big [If True]" is a new weekly series premiering on TVO that aims to help viewers navigate through the false narratives and fake news bombarding our feeds.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Exciting, isn't it? Visit tvo.org slash Giving Tuesday to make your donation today and discover your 2-Point TVO. From online hoaxes to deep fakes, the media landscape is filled with misinformation and disinformation. Big, If True is a new weekly series premiering on TVO and it aims to help viewers navigate through the false narratives and fake news bombarding our feeds. It's hosted by journalist Molly Thomas, and she joins us now to tell us all about Big If True.

You're nailing that. I love to take the pause. Like the pause is important, don't you think? The pause is important so we can think about it and think, wait a second, what is that about? That would be Big If True. Exactly right, exactly right. You got it, you got it.

We've got a fancy little promo we're gonna show here first, okay, and then we're gonna chat. Sheldon, if true. Exactly right, exactly right. You got it, you got it. We've got a fancy little promo we're gonna show here first, okay? And then we're gonna chat. Sheldon, if you would. In a fractured information environment, isn't it hard to tell what's real and what's not? I'm Molly Thomas, host of a new show called Big If True. We'll look at everything from misinformation

to disinformation, hoaxes to conspiracies, even outright lies. And don't worry, we'll help you cut through the noise. Debuting on November 24th at 8 p.m. Cool. I can tell from that that I'm exaggerating the pause a little bit. Maybe I don't have to pause so much.

I might have to learn a little from you because I was like, that pause is pretty good. You like the pause. You like the pause. I like the pause. It's an Edward R. Murrow thing. He used to do this during World War II when he was covering it for CBS. He'd be on the rooftops in London,

and he would say, this is London. So I ripped him off that. And everybody listened. And everyone listened. Very true. Why are we doing this show, Molly? Steve, think about your Twitter feed. Think about what you see on YouTube.

You have to. Think about what you see on YouTube. Do I have to? You have to. Think about what's coming at you. You know, when I'm looking at him as a journalist, I started 15 years ago. Right now, I'm like, what is this? Who is this? Is something behind this?

Is there funding behind this? It's changed the way that I interact. Social media has changed it. And I think people out there are really confused. There's a lot of chaos. And they're wondering. We have questions. And I think people out there are really confused. There's a lot of chaos. And they're wondering, we have questions. And I think we should question things. We should ask in a critical way what's going on here.

And so this is a show to open those doors and say it's OK to ask questions. Let's ask them. Let's find out what we can. Let's figure out the facts that we know. Let's figure out what we don't know and be comfortable doing that. The timing of it seems very appropriate, right?

Given everything going on in the world nowadays, the timing for a show like this feels right. It is the right time. We just had a little election go down south of us. I heard something about that. Yeah, it's happening. So yes, it is perfect timing. But not just the US election, which is our first episode

is all about elections. We're talking about elections around the world. This was the biggest year for elections in history, both on a national, regional level. Nearly half the world voted, right? So people want to know what's real out there. They want to know what's not. They want to know what political deviance is going on behind the scenes that is not giving them the full information.

And hopefully we have the experts in to come in and give us that background and set the stage for the other things at play with all the information we're seeing. Speaking of background, can you tell us a bit about you? Because you are going to be new for, I mean, you and I have known each other for a while, but you are going to be new for some TVO viewers who aren't aware of your previous work. So tell us a bit about you. Yeah, so I've been a journalist for 15 years. Ever curious, I love connecting with people,

whether that's in the field or in the studio. And I deeply believe in public service journalism. So I just spent my last year working on The Mitchener, all about the loss of school for Afghan women and girls. And I felt very passionate about that because education has done so much for me. I'm sitting with you. I'm able to have a platform and speak about things

because I had a chance to go to school and learn how to speak, how to think, how to question. And so many people, especially Afghan girls, don't have that opportunity today because of what the Taliban has done. And so I spent my year really doing that. And so when this opportunity for TVO came up, I thought, what a cool opportunity

to continue that education pathway. Because this is also misinformation, disinformation. We're re-educating ourselves, all of us. Journalists are re-educating ourselves how to look at content, how to interact with this new world. And so hopefully that education thread has kind of floated throughout my career, but I'm very passionate about it, and so I love what TVO does in that respect. Give a shout out to your high school.

Where did you go to high school? Oh, I'm from Luther College High School back in Saskatchewan. I'm a Regina girl originally, but as a journalist have lived in different parts of the country and spent time in different countries in the world bringing back stories. So yeah, I am definitely from the 306, but Ontario has been home for 10 years, and I've loved it, I love Toronto. I've just got the title for your memoir now, from the 306 to the 416.

There you go. There we go. There we go. That works, Saskatchewan to Ontario. We keep hearing these terms, and they're occasionally used interchangeably, and they're not the same thing. So maybe we should get you to explain

the difference between misinformation and Disinformation. What's the diff? Yeah, and people I think are confused out there over those so misinformation is you know, you see something online Seems credible you spread it you don't really think about it You share it you tell your friends about it, but it actually isn't true, but you're not doing it intentionally Disinformation is I am maliciously trying to mislead you. And that is happening. And both of them are happening at the same time, with the amount that we are on social media,

the way that we're sharing content, things are flying. The question is, is it true? That's what we're gonna try to get to the bottom of. I tell you, the best example of this I remember was back in the 2016 presidential election. So this is Trump versus Clinton. And I saw something come across my Facebook feed. It was an article from the Denver Bugle saying, the pope endorses Donald Trump for president.

And I looked at it, and it looked like a very professional website. And I thought to myself, hmm, like the pope doesn't normally endorse a presidential candidate, but who knows? Maybe he's making the exception in this case and of course you do two seconds worth of checking into it and you realize the whole thing's a hoax there's no such thing as the Denver Bugle somebody's created a malicious website the Pope doesn't endorse anybody of course he doesn't endorse anybody but here we are now that experience is being replicated millions of times a day across our country, around the world. How is Molly Thomas going to get to the bottom of all of what's going on out there?

I'm so glad that I'm not doing it alone. Let me tell you, we have some amazing experts, Canadian experts that are diving into this, misinformation and disinformation. We also have global experts that are going to be joining our show. And so these people are bringing their research, they're bringing their years of experience where they're just looking for patterns, trying to see how campaigns that copy each other to purport disinformation. People are looking into that. That's what the great thing about this is.

We're going to bring them on. And then we also have a segment that's a little bit more interactive where we use some of our producers, researchers on our shows to show us how you at home might get tripped up over something. Is there a video? Is there a photo that seems a little suspect? And we will dig into it ourselves. So just all of us need to relook at how we interact with information. Journalists, too? I need to do it every single day. So it's a conversation I think we have to have both ways,

and I think it's a time to be doing it How do we know we can trust you Molly? Oh, isn't that the question? Listen, I've been trying to build trust for 15 years and I've had the privilege of bringing stories to this country And and I love what I do. So listen listen with a skeptical eye Write us if you think something is off. Tell us, we want to know that. Because yes, we want to also see our own biases. Our own, you know, maybe we miss something. It's important.

But that's what I mean, it's a two-way conversation. We have to do this throughout the season. This is, I mean, nevermind timely, it's very important work. And people really need, I mean, we need an uptick in our media literacy right now, right? I mean, can I assume that part of your advice to people is before you want to share that story quickly

with all of your friends, because you think it's just so delicious, maybe do five seconds of checking just to make sure that you're not part of the problem and that you are part of the solution? For sure, but even in that checking, Steve, things have changed, because you can find a lot of different articles

that might support what you're saying, but what is behind those websites? It's a certain type of checking. And so hopefully with our interactive segment, we can start to help people maybe expand the types of fact checking websites they're looking at. If I'm not quite sure and I have competing narratives, where else can I go?

My hope is that we can all expand our media diet around websites that we can be thinking of. I'm learning new ones. I'm like, oh cool, this is interesting. Or this is looking at media bias, or looking at bias in the way that our headlines are written. And we're examining it and saying, okay, is this credible? Why is this credible?

Would we give this space? It's just a constant conversation and it's not gonna stop because there's just gonna be more and more coming at us. So, you know, we might be around for a while. Let's hope so, I hope so. If people wanna watch this show, it airs on television when,

and presumably is available online whenever, right? That's right, this Sunday night coming up, 8 p.m. is our season debut, our first episode ever. Fabulous. And of course you can find us on YouTube right at the same debut, our first episode ever. Fabulous. And of course, you can find us on YouTube right at the same time. Everything is launching at the same time. So Big If True TBO, that is our social media handle for YouTube, Twitter. Where else are we?

All that good stuff. You'll find us. Instagram, we're out there too. So Big If True TBO, find us, follow us, and be a part of the conversation. And remember, the show is called Big If True. We love the pause. We love the pause. Molly, welcome to the family.

It's great to have you here. Thank you for having me, Steve.