The Ariel Helwani Show - Dan O'Toole

Episode Date: February 24, 2022

One of Canada's sports broadcasting legends joins the show to talk about his legendary career, telling Ariel stories about his iconic SportsCentre show on TSN and his relationship with his then-co-host, Jay Onrait. Plus, the guys discuss O'Toole's decision to leave TSN for the new FS1 in 2013, why he wasn't happy at FOX, his eventual return to TSN, moving from Toronto to Los Angeles, an online battle with Katie Nolan, and some of the demons he's battled since leaving TSN again last year.Dan O'Toole is a Canadian broadcaster known mostly for his role alongside Jay Onrait on TSN's SportsCentre in the early 2000s, a show whose popularity rivaled that of Dan Patrick and Keith Olbermann in the United States. After enjoying many years of success at TSN and FS1, O'Toole left TSN (again) in 2021 and is now the host of the podcast, Boomsies! with Dan O'Toole.You can follow Dan on Twitter and Instagram @dangotoole.Today's episode is also brought to you by ExpressVPN. Visit ExpressVPN.com/HELWANI right now to arm yourself with an extra 3 months of ExpressVPN for free.For more episodes of The Ariel Helwani Show, please follow the show on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or on Ariel's YouTube channel.Theme music: "Frantic" by The Lovely Feathers

Hello friends! Hope you're doing well. Welcome back to a brand new edition of The Helwani Show. It is Thursday, February 24th, 2022. I, of course, am Ariel Helwani. Thanks for checking us out. And thank you once again to the lovely feathers for this great intro music. It is called Frantic. Excited about today's guest, my friends, and I know I say that all the time, but I got to tell you, this guest today is a Canadian sports broadcasting icon. Yes, and I don't use that term lightly, but he is. His name is Dan O'Toole. For almost 20 years, he was in our living rooms, on our TVs, on our phones, doing highlights for a large portion of the time.

It was for TSN, the sports network, the ESPN of Canada for four years. It was for Fox Sports 1. If I could equate him and his partner for the vast majority of that time, Jay Onright, to any duo here in America, it would probably be Keith Olbermann and Dan Patrick. That's how influential they were. Maybe Stuart Scott and Rich Eisen for the younger crowd. They were that big doing SportsCenter, doing highlights for TSN in Canada. In 2013, they left to go work for the upstart FS1. That's where I met them, two Canadians or three Canadians working for FS1. And that was a tremendous honor and privilege as well. And they lasted four years there. And then they returned to Canada, to Much Hoopla. In fact, when they left Canada to go to

FS1, the prime minister at the time, Stephen Harper, even tweeted about how big of a deal this was. So you know, they meant a lot to Canadians. They came back, they were together for another four years. Unfortunately, though, in 2021, almost exactly a year ago, he was let go by TSN. And the road has been rocky since then, but he is back on his feet. He's hosting his own podcast entitled Boomsies, which I highly suggest you check out. And he's just a great guy, an open book. He is a flawed individual like all of us, but he isn't afraid or shy about talking about his flaws. He's had a fascinating career, a very successful career, and I'm so happy that he's back on his feet. And so we talk about all of that. His rise, his time at TSN before the move to Fox, his time in LA with Fox, the departure

from Fox, the return to Canada and TSN, the departure from there, checking himself into rehab, mental health, the ups and downs, all that and more is discussed in this conversation with the great Dan O'Toole. In a moment, we will get to that. First, though, a quick word from our good friends over at ExpressVPN. As you know, I'm on the road, I'm in public places, airports, restaurants, etc. It's very easy for hackers to steal my data. If you're not careful, the same thing can happen to you. That's why I use ExpressVPN to safeguard my personal data online and why I recommend it to anyone who spends as much time online as I do. According to recent reports, hackers can make up

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is that? Again, that's expressvpn.com slash Helwani. Please support them because they support us. All right. Here's my conversation with Toolsy, Dan O'Toole. Enjoy. By the way, I love the fact your cat just walked out of the Raisin Dan box right over your left shoulder over there. So you just have cats just kind of crawling around your set. And that's a real cat, yes? It it's not a fake cat we've got three wandering around and um i i did have two we we blossomed to three and i told my kids i'm like am i a crazy cat person so they looked it up and they said if you have five or more you are crazy cat people so we are two below crazy cat level status all right it just adds a lot of character to the set when you have a cat popping out uh right over your shoulder and by the

way this is a game you cj nikowski detroit tigers wow i mean the character oh look at that 95 road what does that mean that's his road hat oh wow, wow. That's amazing. Look at you. So much to talk to you about, Dan. Like I said, you got the new podcast, which launched at the beginning of the year, Boomsies. I hear, I don't live in Canada, but I hear that there's a commercial for your podcast that plays every like 15 seconds on television, which is very exciting. Could I ask you, what is it like? And of course, we'll get into everything, but you were kind of out of the limelight per se broadcasting. You were doing stuff on social media, but you're out of the limelight for around a year to be back out there, to putting yourself out there, to having content, having people react to content, all that stuff.

Just being in front of the microphone again after a year away, a long time for someone who's doing it every night for two decades. What is that like for you? It's been great because when I was doing social media stuff, I did a little campaign where I tried to promote Canadian businesses. It got the juices flowing again. It made me fall in love with the process of being creative. And at the same time, being away from sports made me become a sports fan again because the montreal canadians i grew up watching they had a great stanley cup run um i loved when they had patrick waugh so watching them get to the stanley cup final last year guess what i became a fan again i was jumping i was cheering i'd never done that because when you do sports highlights over and over every night for 20 plus

years you kind of become numb to it you're're like, I don't want this game to go to overtime because I want to get the hell out of here. So I became a fan again. And that's what I've been able to do now is just become a broadcaster who's just doing it for the love of it, really not, not for a paycheck, just because I want to talk. I want to be creative. I want to talk to people I wouldn't usually talk to. So it's actually been a breath of fresh air. The Super Bowl wrapped up last week, and that kind of coincides with a chapter of your life ending, right? Because you were let go from TSN right before the Super Bowl. And I'm wondering with just the Super Bowl being back, did it take

you back? I'm a big anniversary guy. Oh, I was doing this this time last year, and this is how I felt. Did it take you back into that mode of, you know, having your run at TSN come to an end with the Super Bowl and all the memories that come along with it? It was actually, I'm now going to celebrate it because I talked about this on last week's podcast,

Boomsies, where I was fired on a Wednesday by the, what the hell is that place I work for? I always forget the name of it, but they fired me on a Wednesday. Super Bowl was on a Sunday. So from Friday to Sunday, I went on what professionals would call a bender. And then I woke up Sunday morning after the Superbowl and I said, okay, I got to stop this. I actually entered a treatment facility on the Tuesday after the Superbowl. So, and now I've been a one year sober and most clear headed I've ever been in my life. And I see now the

Superbowl as this is my party, baby. I love it now viewing it with a, with a unclouded lens and remembering the entire game is awesome too, because I don't remember much about the weekend's performance last year, but this year's performance unreal. I'm sure we'll discuss that, but yeah, I see it as a celebration and a great anniversary every year. I will see that as that every year down here last year's super bowl you woke up with a gash on your head yes i fell down at some point and hit my head on my buddy's fridge he's like we saw you fall and couldn't catch you in time wow and so you were i mean completely inebriated yes yes so i i overindulged i had had my pity party. And then, yeah, you just wake up and you're like, well, I haven't worked or sorry, I've worked over 20 years at night. So now I'm going to have every night free.

This could go sideways quick. The way I compared it to was it's perfect analogy because the Olympics are going on. I was standing at the top of a ski jump. I've skied before, but the chances of me landing that are 0.005%. So I got off the ski jump and decided to not attempt the jump and play it safe. So it was the best decision I ever made. So it's one thing to have the pity party to feel bad for yourself. I mean, like I said, that's a very traumatic thing to happen in one's life. But to check yourself into a facility means you have a problem. How big of a problem was this for you? Well, it was on the verge of becoming a major issue. Like I said, if I was having two glasses

of wine or a bottle of wine after work, along with a little smoke here and there, that would have probably doubled in consumption had I not checked it because I have friends and family. I actually have a very close cousin that died of alcoholism when it went unchecked. We thought this person was a successful person, had everything together. Then one day we found out, no, that wasn't the case. A year later, the guy was dead. So I'm like, it sneaks up on you that quick if you don't get a handle on it. So yeah, that's what I decided to do. I didn't want to roll the dice. How long was this an issue for you? Like, how long were you going that hard? On weekends, I would go pretty hard when I didn't have my kids.

So I could see, yeah, I need to dial this back. But I'm like, why do I need to? I'm not in a relationship. I got this under control. When in reality, everyone who thinks they have it under control or questions if they are drinking too much, if you question it, you probably are. So when you're a week now removed from working at TSN, now you're in a facility, do you have a moment? You still are one of the most famous Canadian broadcasters right now. It doesn't matter where you're broadcasting from. Everyone knows Dan O'Toole. Do you have a moment when you're in there and

you're around other people who are going through a similar thing and you're like, wow, how did I end up here? How did I go from, you know, Fox to TSN? And now I would imagine it's very humbling, right? It is. It was very embarrassing. I didn't think I would ever, uh, reveal this to anyone. Cause I thought, oh man, this is so embarrassing. Um, I'm, I'm in rehab. Uh, how exactly, how did I end up here? But then after a year removed from it, now I see it as a badge of honor that I admitted. Okay. I need to fix this.

And now I can help others. I can show people that it's okay to ask for help. It's okay to say, you know what? I've got a problem here. And that's what I'm using it as now. I'm not using it as a point of shame in my life. I'm seeing as a chance to help others. How long were you there for?

I was there for 23 days. I was supposed to be there for two months, but after three weeks I said, I think I get the gist of it. I think I know the program here. It's kind of like going to spring training. You're like, well, I know how to play baseball. I don't need to perfect it.

And I always tell people, this is what I said last week. You don't need to check into a treatment facility. If you have an issue, you just need to find a support group and people that will help you. Because the support community is like nothing else you'll ever find in your life. From team sports to family, these are people that root for you. They are cheering for you. Like you reach one year, you've got, you got the people calling you every day, say, man, that's a big deal. I'm like, that's okay. No, they're like, no, you should celebrate. This is a big deal. So to get the affirmation that, okay, you've accomplished something, that you've had the courage to actually go

ahead and do it. It's not easy. I'm not going to say it's ever easy, but the rewards far away the negatives. So you grew up on a farm in Keene, Ontario? Otonabee. Okay. Otonabee. Is that close to Keene?

Very close. That's where I played my minor hockey in keen ontario wow okay so growing up on a farm did you work on the farm as well i mean i imagine that's part of the deal right well my siblings my siblings will say i didn't do much work because i was the youngest child uh i was the youngest of four kids but yes of course i i had to do all everything like everything from plowing fields to helping with the pigs to cleaning barns. There's never a time where you get to relax on a farm. Well, my friends are going away to the beach or something or going away camping. I'm like, well, I'll be here doing something. I'll be here fixing a fence.

How far is that from Toronto? Ah, you're looking at an hour and a half. Okay. So, I mean, this is real like rural Ontario. Very much. Your, your school, from what I understand, just four kids in the class for a good period of time. You were the lone boy.

From grades one to eight, we had 60 kids in our school. My grade had four people and I was the only boy. That's crazy. That's right. Did you enjoy that? I mean, I guess you, you didn't know any better, right? But that's not exactly your typical grades one through eight, like experience. Looking back, it was awesome because our teacher at one point was a fastball pitcher who was, he was now in the, the hall of fame for my hometown of Peterborough, Ontario, Claire Leahy. So every opportunity he had during the summer class outside, yeah, we're going to play some baseball. We're just going to go run around. Like, I don't know if we did much learning, but it's probably better than just sitting there,

staring at a chalkboard, just running around and being a kid. It was fun. At what point do you start to think that you want to go into broadcasting? How does that happen? Well, I did the the old classic, put the Hockey Night in Canada games on mute and did the play by play. And I also have I got to find the tapes. I have cassette tapes of me trying to be mean Gene Okerlund. Oh yes. And interviewing these guys and all that stuff. So I think I like just

hearing my own voice. So that, uh, that ignited something inside me. And then when I got to high school, we have these programs here called co-op programs where you go and test out a job to see if you like it and you earn credits for it. I tried out teaching and I'm like, I don't want to be in charge of these kids. They're annoying. So that didn't work. And then I went to this little radio station called Trent Radio because our university in my hometown is Trent University. And I did radio and I'm like, this feels like it's not even a job and I would get paid for this. And then went from college out of high school

to study radio broadcasting. And then here we are now in my basement. The dream gig was what? Was it to be Hockey Night in Canada, play-by-play guy? Like, was that the ultimate for you? That would have been the ultimate, yes. Okay.

I actually did play-by-play out of school, was that the ultimate for you? That would have been the ultimate. Yes. Okay. I actually did play-by-play out of school, um, for the Fort McMurray oil Barons, who's a junior hockey team up here in Canada. And yeah, I love doing that. But then I got into doing highlights and I'm like, well, this is a lot more fun, less travel, less work. So yeah, I'll just do this. Isn't it interesting that, I mean, that's not that long ago. That's a little over probably 20 years ago, right? I mean, I know you got to TSN at what was like 2003? 2002, okay.

So I mean, that job that you're thinking about, that you're talking about, the highlight job, essentially that job doesn't exist anymore, right? I mean, like there's no one growing up right now saying I want to be the highlight guy anymore. Does that kind of blow your mind? Like it's still there, but it's so, I mean, even the way ESPN treats it, TSN to a degree as well, Sportsnet,

it's kind of like something off to the side, but it's not a main thing anymore because the world has changed. The internet has changed. Phones have changed things. Does it blow your mind that job like kind of no longer exists anymore? It kind of does because I get so many broadcasters reach out to me and say, give me some advice. And I tell them, learn how to do something that's not traditional broadcasting,

because I don't know if the traditional broadcasters are seeing the viewing habits of our kids. But if I gave my kids $100 each to find a show on cable TV, they would not be able to do it. My oldest is 14 years old. She has never used cable TV. She will never buy cable in her life, but there's so much content. We've had more content in this world than we've ever had in our lives. So there are jobs out there, but yeah. Will you be doing highlights? I don't know. Will you be shooting videos of you watching a game and giving your commentary that way?

It's finding out a different avenue to get to people in sports. And I don't know what that is right now because, well, maybe it's what we're doing right now. This is, this is one of the avenues that we've figured out. Where were you when you got the call in 2002 from TSN offering you to come over? This, this is good.

So I was working at city TV in Vancouver. We had just launched a TV station there nine months prior. I'm sitting there at my little sports desk and I see the phone's blinking. So I pick it up. I get a message and it says, Dan, this is Mark Millier from TSN. If this is on speakerphone, please take it off. I'd like to discuss employment at TSN with you. When you get a chance, call me back.

So I'm looking around the newsroom like, ah, funny guys. I've been here nine months as if I'm getting a call from TSN. So I call him back. i'm looking around the newsroom like yeah funny guys i've been here nine months as if i'm i'm getting a call from tsn so i call them back it was legit but i shot them down i shot them down four or five times because i was working in tv in vancouver one of the most beautiful cities in the world i was done work at seven o'clock monday to. I was dating Miss Molson Indy. Wow. I was spending every night with my friends going to a great day. I finally had money for the first time in my life. I would think I was making like 60 grand. I'm like, I'm rich. I'm rich. And then they kept calling me back, calling me back. And then eventually talking with friends and family, they like they're like, you do know if you shoot them down again, they might never call you back.

So I said, okay. And luckily, I did accept their offer finally. They thought I was a brilliant negotiator. And then about six months later, everyone at that station I was working at got laid off. Oh, wow. So I made the right decision. And how long into your time there did you meet Jay Onright? I met him in the first few weeks.

We were working on different shows, and then during the lockout in 2004, we got paired together. Jay was working with another anchor, Jennifer Hedger, very talented, very beautiful. She got moved up to another show because one of our other anchors had to move to Vancouver. So if a man by the name of Blake Price had not had to move back to Vancouver, I would

never be paired with Jay. And Jay always says, I was working with Jennifer and then they paired me with you. So that really worked out, didn't it? So, yeah, in 2004, we got paired together. Did you like him right away? Oh, yeah. Okay. Loved him. We discovered early on that we had the same sense of humor. There's two comedians by the name of Tim and Eric who did the Tim and Eric awesome show. Great job.

Where we would watch that. We would get together and watch that. We would laugh at the same things. We'd watch the same YouTube clips. And then by the end of it, we were finishing each other's sentences, you know, from working from 2004 together to 2001, traveling across the, uh, the country, doing shows, going to four Olympics together, um, sitting on every plane together, doing live podcast events. We never had one fight. As I tell people, it was like the perfect marriage

without having to slip together. I mean, it comes across that way on television. And when I would, I remember when, and we're going to get to the fox years because that's where we met um two canadians working for fox back in the day um i remember when the news broke and i was trying to explain to my american friends why this was such a big deal i compared you guys to keith olbermann and dan patrick you were the canadian version of like it was must see tv to watch you guys do SportsCenter, SportsDesk, just like it was must-see TV to watch those guys, and then Eisen and Stuart Scott, etc. Did you ever look to those ESPN guys and say, we want to do that? Because for the longest time growing up watching TSN, there were legends there, the Jim Van Horns of the world, but it was always very serious, right? It wasn't as fun as you guys were having.

Did you look to what ESPN was doing ever and try to emulate some of the stuff that they were doing on SportsCenter? No, because we didn't get ESPN in Canada. Yeah. So I didn't know those guys existed. Wow. You weren't even aware of them?

Not really until later in life because I didn't even get TSN because I lived on a farm and we had an antenna. Wow. So if we ever went to a hockey tournament, I would run into the room and put it on TSN. I'm like, okay, what's everyone talking about? And at that point, their programming was limited. So I'm like a lumberjack challenge again. So every time I tuned in, it was programming that I'm like, is this what I'm missing? So finally I got to see some sports desks and stuff, but I grew up with, uh, with two gentlemen by the name of Mark Hapshire and Jim Taddy. They worked on sports line, which was a

nightly highlight show on global TV. And those guys laughed their asses off. It looked like they didn't give a crap and I fell in love with them. So those were my Oberman Patrick's to me growing up. Do you recall when you kind of realized, holy crap, we're a really big deal. Like we mean a lot to people. People are tuning in, not necessarily to watch the highlights,

but to watch us on display, having fun, cracking jokes. Do you remember when you had that moment where you were like, wow, we have something here. We made it. Probably when we did the Cross Canada tour, it was called the Craft Celebration Tour in which we would do our show

for 10 straight days across the country. Darren Detition and Jennifer Hedger would take one side of the country. Jay and I would take the other. So we'd do a show on a Monday, travel the next day. Our next show would be a Wednesday. We'd flip flop. But going to these small Canadian towns who had to put in a bid and then win SportsCenter

being broadcast live from their towns, showing up and meeting the people. And it was great to hear them because we do autograph tents and all this. You have the feeling like no one's going to show up. Who's showing up for this? and it was great to hear them because we do autograph tents and all this. And then you have the feeling like, no one's going to show up. Who's shown up for this? But the entire town would come and I'm like, okay, they're just here because TSN's here. But then they would get to the front of the line and every single family that came up said, we wake up with you guys every morning. My mom never used to like sports. She even laughs. And that's where it hit us where I'm like, okay, this is pretty cool. And they're getting the feel for the show we want to do.

We don't want to bat you over the head with stats. We want to make it fun. We want to make it for the whole family. And that's where it really hit home. Now I asked you about the call from TSN, the call from Fox. Do you remember where you were when that came through? I was at the London. Was it at the London? Yeah. London Olympics was 2012. So Jay and I were at the London Olympics when I got the call from Fox that they were interested in us. And it went from guys were starting this network. Uh, we're very interested to we've gone a different route. So I'm like, oh, OK. Anyway, that was fun to chat with them, too. We want you guys.

So it was a very chaotic week or sorry, chaotic month. Eventually made the move to L.A. Didn't know what we were getting into, but it was one of the greatest work experiences I've ever had. Cause you, you think, Oh, we're just going to get lost in the cards, working for a big company like Fox, but they treated us like we've never been treated before. And it was phenomenal. So when you got that call in London, did you even apply or they, they, they seeked you out? The Wall Street Journal has a reporter in Toronto and he did an article, why can't American SportsCenter be like Canadian SportsCenter? And it was about

Jay and I. So someone from Fox, a gentleman by the name of Jacob Ullman, he saw that article and that's what put the wheels in motion. All because of one article in the wall street journal And that process took a month like to go from them reaching out to you to you Agreeing to a deal took a month from what I from what I remember probably a month or two But uh, yeah, I think it's about a month that we negotiated and and then it again There was one point where it wasn't going to happen then it got Reignited so about a month was there any point of view that was like,

we have such a great thing. We are superstars here. Let's not ruin this. Let's not mess this up. Let's just stay here. This is perfect. This is comfortable. We're icons. Was there any part of you that was trepidatious about going over there because you were so set in Canada? Of course there was. And then I sat down with one of our bosses at the time by the name of Phil King. And he said, Dan, if you were my son, I would tell you to take this opportunity. Wow. So when one of your bosses tells you, this is too good to pass up, you kind of have to do it. And if we hadn't have made the jump, we had a four-year deal.

We did the length of our contract, then moved back to Canada. But if we hadn't accepted the challenge, then we would have always regretted it. We would have looked back and said, well, what if? Now we have no what ifs. We don't ever have to ask that question. What if? I saw a video. I was kind of reminiscing a little bit.

When you guys walked through, and I know those doors very well. They had maybe, I don't know, 100 people there greeting you, I think, on your first day. That's right. They were singing O Canada. They were singing O Canada for you guys. What was that like? I mean, this is Fox. This is the big time. You're a huge part of this new network that they are launching to go after ESPN. Somewhat surreal for a guy from Peterborough, Ontario, no? It was. I look back with nothing but fondness. They accepted us with open arms. They liked our quirkiness.

And the initial greeting was phenomenal. And we got our own offices. Sure, they were cubicles, but I'm like, at TSN, I always made this joke. When you'd show up to do your shift, you would try find a computer. Sometimes you'd have to ask like an intern say, I got to write the show. Can you think I can borrow this computer? So not that we were treated poorly at TSN. It was just a completely different work environment. One thing I'll say about Fox, Fox, my experience way different than yours.

I was like, you know, on the, you were at the top of the ladder. I was kind of below the first step of the ladder, but they know how to treat talent. Like they got that avocado room that people talk about and the food and, and, and the like the makeup and the wardrobe and all like the one thing they do. And I've also been at ESPNn everyone says they know to treat talent say what you will about fox and so i'm not surprised to hear you say that they treated you guys like kings i also remember uh it was august of 2013 i remember i was in boston because our friend chael sunnan is headlining the first ufc card on fs1 which is the big launching date he's fighting shogun Hua. He submits him. And then it goes from that fight to Fox Sports Live, the big debut of the new sports center, if you will.

This is for FS1. And watching it, I was like, wow, I can't believe America is going to get to see Jay and Dan in their prime, doing what they do best. And then they switch over to Carissa Thompson and Andy Roddick. And I think Donovan McNabb, there they are. There's the old friends. Who is it? McNabb, Roddick, Carissa. And who was the fourth? Ephraim Salam. Ephraim Salam, who was recently on your podcast, Boomzies. How soon into it did you think, well, this isn't exactly what we had in mind? First off, I want to go back to how they treated us. It's encapsulated by this moment that we experienced every single day. We had our own dressing rooms.

We would show up for our shift. Again, we're living in LA in sandals, shorts, t-shirts. We walk into our dressing room. The suit that you're going to wear that night you have to put no thought into it it is hung up with the tie the socks the shoes ready to go even so much as the belt was already in the pants wow so i'm like this is the greatest ever and their philosophy was we want you to concentrate on nothing but your show and not have to worry about what you're wearing. This eases your mind. And I'm like, this is the greatest place ever. Anyway. So as with regards to the show, oh yeah, that first one

where they go to Carissa and Donna and they're talking for like 10 minutes and then they throw to us and, and we're on for like 30 seconds. And this goes on for three hours every night. And I'm like, is it, is this working? I think there might be too many cooks in the kitchen because there was a different producer for every segment. We were trying to do too much. It was almost like if you watch a lot of the Simpsons, when Homer Simpson designed a car, he tried to put too much into that car.

He overthought it. And that's kind of what our show was. It was like the Homer Simpson car. So how long does the honeymoon last? Like, when do you start to think, like, I'm not sure if this is working out? It's a four-year deal. And as you said, you went to the very end. But when do you start to feel like maybe our way of doing things isn't exactly their way of

doing things? Well, we constantly tinkered with that three hour show, trying to figure it out as we went probably a month in, there was dramatic changes, but the biggest drawback was finding our channel. You live in the States. If you've got satellite tv or direct tv or whatever you have trying to find a show randomly is impossible so at one point they gave us business cards with the channel listings on every cable company and our goal was to like if you go to a place hey can you put it on Fox sports one? They're like, what channel is that? You're like, here you go. It's a channel 1601 on direct TV or whatever. So that was the constant struggle was getting people to actually find the channel.

And then if they did to watch our show for three hours, I would love to know anyone that watched it for all three hours every single night because yeah it was a it was a wild one and it wasn't one hour replayed three times it was three fresh hours three fresh hours so they're they were donna mcdabb and andy roddick and chris and gary they would be talking about the the dallas cow. And then people check on social media and people were like, what do I care what Andy Roddick thinks about the Dallas Cowboys? So I'm like, he actually put in the most work out of anyone. We would go over to the cafeteria and Andy's going over stats and stuff. He took it very seriously, as they all did. But Andy Roddick put in the most time and effort on that show.

By the way, side note for the American or non-Canadian listeners, viewers out there. When you guys leave to go to Fox, the freaking prime minister of Canada tweets about you, right? Justin Trudeau tweeted. Was it not just Trudeau?

It was Harper at the time. Was it Harper? My mistake. Yes. In any event, he was the prime minister he tweets about you wishing you well correct yes did you did he call you as well did you have any personal relationship with mr harper because that was surreal we saw him at the gray cup

it was probably uh just before we left and we got a picture with him uh so that was our only ever interaction with the prime minister so yeah it was pretty cool to see i still have the picture it's not here in my studio right now but us with uh the pm right right but when like when that tweet comes through you have no idea it's coming through you're like holy crap that's insane yeah i completely forgot about that actually i should frame that or something that's a big deal yes shows how much you were a part of the fabric of the country i remember you know as time is going on um you're in the nice fancy studio and that evolves into basically like you guys look like you were in your basement like you were in such a tight space there towards the end yeah but i would argue that was probably

the best stuff that you were doing because they probably forgot about you and they let you do your own thing am i right yeah they put us in a studio. They're like, well, we still have these because everyone from that show was gone. Everyone but Carissa Thompson, she was doing a NFL on Fox stuff. So they're like, we still have these guys under contract. Let's figure something out. So we did a half hour show every night where we had guests in there. We would do shots with them and stuff. And it was a very loose environment, but still most of our stuff was being written. Like when Jay and I are at our best, we are ad-libbing, we're riffing off each other. It was still never that feel.

At no point during our four years, did I ever leave a show and say, oh man, that was great. So much so that when we came back to Canada in 2017, we did two days of rehearsals. After our first rehearsal show, Jay turned to me and said, that feels better than anything we've done in the last four years. Wow. Because we were just, it was just the two of us. It wasn't a lot of producers. And this is not taken away from the work and effort everyone put on those shows. They tried their asses off to make it work.

It was just when you tinker too much, it takes away from everything the show was about. How long into it did you know that it would be one and done for you guys there? We were holding out hope until the end. Did you want to stay? We have stayed i believe but tsn flew down and they put a presentation together uh it was a very hollywood moment we went to like this uh uh this restaurant in uh beverly hills uh don johnson was like uh five tables over and I'm like,

this is cool. They're putting out this package and they're like, Canada misses Jay and Dan. And it's nice to feel wanted. And we felt wanted again. Not that we felt unwanted at Fox, but we're like, you know what? Maybe it's time to go home.

We talked to them and then I went to Vegas one weekend. I'm like, ah, I don't know if this is the right deal. And then TSN called me at one point. They said, well, how can we make this work? And I, there were just a few changes needed to be made and then went down, gambled on craps for a few hours, get back to my room. And there's a bottle of champagne from TSN. And it said, welcome back to Canada, Dan. And it was just like, okay, this is a cool moment. And getting back to the country that you call home, there's nothing like it.

Did you enjoy living in LA? I loved it. I lived in Redondo Beach and then in Marina Del Rey. There's nothing like just going to the beach whenever you want to. And people said all the times, all the time, all the times, all the time. Do you miss the seasons? And when you're living there, you're like, no, I like I like this weather. But when you move back to Canada.

You realize I did miss the seasons because you take 75 and sunny for granted. Right now in February, if we have a sunny day and it's like zero degrees Celsius, you're like, this is the greatest day on earth because you cherish those days because they're few and far between. So it makes you appreciate the weather, where you live a lot more. Did your family like it? They did. My kids were so young. They don't really have many memories. They want to go back. My one daughter, Ruby, she remembers Cheeros on the Redondo Beach Pier, how they were the best Cheeros on earth. And I have to agree with her. So it'll be good to go back but we had the like the disney season pass because we we lived uh 45 minutes away from disney but it got to the point where like kids you want

to go to disney and they're like nah we're good i remind them i'm back now and they're like we said what you know uh you mentioned the canadians i've always heard that there was like a montreal restaurant bar in redondo beach that's right is the redondo beach cafe i think it was called and it was owned by a former winnipeg blue bomber wow and i would go there all the time was it good like poutine i heard they had is it legit it was legit poutine it was good and they they had Montreal smoked meat that they brought in. And they had those really strong beers at a Quebec that were like 8% alcohol that they would serve there as well. And like all Montreal memorabilia. Oh, wow.

Montreal everywhere. The Stanley Cup was there when the Kings won. They brought it into the place. So, yeah, it was a nice slice of home. Was there any part? So you feel the love from TSN. Again, not a similar story, but mine is somewhat similar in that I went to ESPN and that was a dream for me. And I lasted three years. My contract was up and I chose not to resign and it was time to go. And there was a

part of me as that was coming to an end where I felt like a failure. I felt like, wow, you made the leap. You made it to the big time. This was your dream. And you're only lasting one contract. And it took some time for me. Actually, therapy helped me not look at it that way. And I know that you do that as well. Initially, did you feel like a failure? Did you feel like, wow, we made the big leap. It was a whole big to do and this isn't you know this isn't going as long as we thought it was going to go uh probably entered my mind but then it was quickly erased when we got back and we had our name on our show it was sports center with jay and dan and we always tell people we didn't feel appreciated until we left the country and came back and then we got our name on the show so that was our uh that was not our vindication but that was um that took away any regrets or any feelings of failure i believe when you get your name on a show it does feel at least to me

because it's come up a couple times in in the conversation, like you have no hostility. You have no resentment towards Fox. Like you, not at all. Nothing. There's no bad feelings at all. No, no.

They treat it. I commend you. Yeah. They, they, uh, they paid us out our entire contract. Uh,

let us go to the very end. Uh, like there was a couple months, uh, at the end where they're like, you guys just don't say anything bad about us we're just gonna pay you the rest of your contract we're like sold wow um they gave us an opportunity uh they they took a chance on us and i have zero ill will i have some of the best

friends of my life still working at fox and even in management i talk to management all the time when there's a big event i'm like oh my god you guys blew that out of the park like the Field of Dreams game. Texting bosses, I'm like, guys, I've got chills. I'm like crying. They're like, oh yeah, it turned out amazing. So yes, no hard feelings at all towards them. Can I ask what happened with Katie Nolan? I don't know what happened. You know, the tweets was you tweeted something and it seemed like you were talking about her oh right right right um because there was a bunch of layoffs

and her show it tweeted out like oh it's great to be I don't know what they're covering some event and I'm flying on a plane back from Canada I I'm like, we just had our entire show wiped out because I believe that was at the point where Fox Sports Live went from an airplane hanger of a studio into a closet. So guys we work with every single night for the past two or three years are out of a job. They go from steady work to I might get a couple of shifts a month. So, and, and Jay and I are, are always on great relations with everyone on the show. So that hit us. And then I read that. I'm like, why would you ever send that out about how great your show is doing when all these people got laid off? And I think things smoothed over, Um, Katie and I have messaged since I, I don't think there's any bad blood,

uh, at least not on my part. I wish her the best. And I, I don't wish her to any failure. It was just at that moment. I was of the mindset where, why would you do that?

When all our people just got laid off, I probably shouldn't have, but now well what are you gonna do i mean you were loyal to your guys and i appreciate that um i've heard you say 2017 to 2021 the shows that you did with with jay that's the best work that you guys have done together a thousand percent why is that we were just in a well it, it's almost like if you played a sport long enough and you've had the same line mate for that long, you aren't amateurs anymore. Like if I look back on the top 10 that they played of our show, when we went to the States, the top 10 Jane Dan moments, I cringe It is bad in my mind. It is bad because it's forced.

It's too scripted. We, we went to fall when we went to Fox, we went to Russia and we did a all unscripted stuff about investigative reporting. That's our best work we ever did with Fox. And then from that, we carried what we did there back to Canada and did a lot more unscripted and a lot more kind of just not giving a crap and going to work again, trying to make each other laugh. That's what we tried to do every night. It was never spoken. We never went out there and said, oh, I'm going to make you laugh tonight. But when you work with each other that long, you know how to teach each other up. You know

when to shut the hell up. You know when to let a joke just sit. And that's what we did for from 2017 to 2021. And at least once a week, if not twice, one of us would laugh so hard during the show that we were in tears. And I had never experienced that in the whatever, 15 years prior of doing any of those shows. I had never loved our work so much and been so proud of what we were putting on the air. So did you have any premonition that this was going to come to an end? Did you have any feeling, any sort of nothing completely blindsided? There was a bunch of layoffs, people that I knew got laid off. And then one morning that that happened about three weeks to a month prior.

And then one morning I woke up to an email and it said, you're needed on a business decision conference call or something. And I'm like, oh, this doesn't look good. So I called up a buddy who just got laid off and I said, I just got this email. And he's like, yeah, that's that's the same one I got. And I'm like, oh, shit. I guess it's happening. And then the worst part is they send the email at like eight or 9. AM.

And the conference call isn't like till two or three in the afternoon. I'm like, come on. Yeah. Like the waiting was just, and just pacing and figuring out, well, this sucks.

And then talking to Jay's like, I didn't get that email. And I'm like, what the hell's going on here? And then you get the call and then, yeah, I didn't get that email. And I'm like, what the hell's going on here? And then you get the call and then, yeah, you don't have a job. You're told it's a business decision. And then also a nerve wracking part was when HR gets on the phone and they say, anything on your phone, you better get off it

because that phone gets wiped in five minutes. And I'm like, I barely know how to take a photo with this phone house. So you're calling people that know anything about technology. Oh, backing up on the cloud. You got to do this. Yeah. So it's very nerve wracking. That day is just a blur in which I was informed. Yeah. So, you know, I have heard you also say no ill will towards Jay. You want everyone to watch his show. He didn't let you go. Like you're still his Jay. You want everyone to watch his show. He didn't let you go. You're still his friend.

You're still very close, right? I was sending him. I found out a new song last night in my discovery search on Spotify. Sent it to him. Yeah, we text probably every single day. But just naturally, is there a part of you that's like, well, why did you let go of me and not him? We're a team, Jay and Dan.

There's no Jay. You know what I mean? So how do you come to the conclusion that one of us has to go? Oh, of course. I have that question every single day. And it was a money decision. And the one thing that people always say to me is, well, are you mad at Jay? First off, yes, he didn't fire me. but he should have left his job to in support.

I'm like, are you crazy? Right. You actually think you would leave a job in which it pays you every two weeks to go out in limbo just to support someone. I think you're out of your mind to think that. It's not awkward, though jay yeah because you such a not at all not at all no that's amazing i commend you i think most people would feel awkward most people will feel like some sort of way about it do you ever watch it jay probably feels the most awkward because that might have survivor's guilt right probably has that and also he has to do

twice the amount of work for the same amount of pay he's got to do all the highlights now right right that is true uh do you would you watch it are you able to watch it do you care to watch it um i've watched it a few times but uh i i really got back at them by canceling that channel oh wow okay that's gonna get them at the bottom line that's gonna get them yes they're going down so do you have resentment towards tsn well i don't know what that station i don't know what that is that we just said i don't i don't know i don't remember the name of that place he used to work at so i don't know about that okay um there aren't a lot of places in Canada that, you know,

there's only two, there's two employees for, for someone who did my job. Right. Sportsnet would be the other one. Roger Sportsnet. Um, and there's somewhat on equal footing these days.

Sportsnet has really come a long way in the last 15, 20 years. Did you talk to them after leaving? No, I never got a call. I've never got a call from a single broadcaster that was looking to hire me in one year. I never got a single call. Did you, I mean, that's why we have agents, right? Did you reach out to people? um no why not because well my lawyer at the time he's like well you you gotta you gotta pay bills and stuff so why don't you call the the little radio station in

your hometown and i'm like so here's how i put it to him i'm like dave say i get a weekend shift on the radio at this station. And then if everything goes right, I work my way up to the top of that station. And then I get moved to a bigger market. And then what? I get fired and then have to do it all over again? So that was my mindset. I'm like, if you get to the top and then they say, we've got to fire you because you're making too much money. Where do you start again?

Is it just a loop for the rest of your life? So that's why I wasn't upset. I was kind of like, it was a shot to the ego when no one calls. Because I don't toot my own horn, but I was pretty damn good doing highlights. And as you said, though, is there, is there any, even a job for that anymore? Because those are few and far between. So it gave me the opportunity to start something new and reimagine and, and kind of just start all over again and find out something I really want to do. And luckily I found it because now I have

put more effort and time into this little podcast from my basement and preparation than I did in the last 22 years. It's not that I didn't take my job seriously. It's just, that's not how we did our show. We just, whatever, we just did it off the cuff. Now, as you know, there's a lot involved. You've got to figure out how to record things. You got to get the audio, you got the lighting, You got to get guests booked. And yeah, it's been a great experience. And, and do I miss doing highlights every night? I do not miss getting home at 2 a.m. The earliest I ever got home in the last 22 years was 2 a.m. So that wears on you right now.

I can't wait to go to bed at like 10 or 11 at night. Yeah. I get into bed and I smile. I like I actually laugh to myself when I curl up and I'm like, oh, this is great. I get like an eight hour sleep. I don't have to race to catch up on sleep because you you're a walking zombie at all times when you're when you're chasing sleep. So I do not miss those hours.

Initially, though, just because you were so present on television, and you've talked about this a little bit on your social media, which I appreciate. I think a lot of people can relate to it. I'm sure there's a little bit of depression, right? There's that feeling where you're trying to assess what happened to your life, where you go from here. How did you get over that? Because you seem like you're in a great place now mentally.

You've talked about mental health as well. That's something that's very important to me. How did you get over the initial shock of having this run come to an end? Well, inadvertently I kind of shifted my focus when I entered the treatment facility three days after being fired, because I'm like, I'm focused on this now. Uh, I had a, a deal in which I was getting paid a certain amount of time. So I'm like, okay, I don't have to worry about work for a certain set of months. I can focus on myself. And that took out all that from my brain. I didn't worry about what am I going to do next? When people would ask me, so what are you going to do? And I'd say, I don't have a clue. I've given it no thought. And I wasn't lying to them when I said, I don't have a clue what I'm going to do for my next job.

Cause I talked to former bosses and they're like, well, you're pretty much done in this industry. So I'm like, Oh, that doesn't sound good. But why would you be done? Like what? Why? I don't know. Because I, I reached a point in my career and now I'm probably tied to Jay. So they probably thought, well, no one's going to hire you by yourself. So maybe look at other options. And that was what they thought. Thank God they were wrong. But as far as mental health goes, yeah, I shifted the focus to myself and I realized that earlier in my career was probably ego where I'm like, I've got to be on TV.

I've got to be seen. But I didn't need that. I don't need to be on TV. I don't need to walk down the street and someone says, hey, it's Dan. It still happens. And I haven't been on TV in over a year. So if I ever needed that, I just get validation whenever I go to Toronto or something, but I never needed that. I don't need to have like the best seat at the restaurant. First off, I rarely eat out. Um,

I don't need to jump the line at a bar. I didn't need any of that. I just needed to find what made me happy. And I discovered that in the last year. And that's just living life and experiencing and enjoying the small things in life. And about number 35 on the list was being on TV. I'm like, there's so much more. There's so much more to life. And luckily I figured that out. I listened to your first episode, and it was very touching, especially as a father, when you're talking about riding on the bike with your kids on a summer night. I mean, to be honest, I don't know how to ride a bike, and it made me a little bit sad about it. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Yes, yes.

Why? How has that happened? I've tried so many times, and I can't get it. It's so easy. I know. I know people say, get up, ride a bike. I can't do it. And it actually made me feel envious that you get to experience this because I would imagine

riding around with your kids in the neighborhood on a warm summer night is like the greatest thing. You were getting very emotional and I think you were getting emotional because of the actual literal riding on the bike experience and the figurative one, right? Yes. And I think that when you talk about your children, when you talk about your, your daughters, uh, I mean, it makes us all happy, right. When we talk about our kids, but could I ask like, why does that make you so emotional? Why does that thought make you, I mean, you're, you were openly crying on the podcast and it was

very touching. It was, it was amazing to listen to. Why did it put you in that spot? A few things made me tear up. Well, first off, I cry at commercials. I cried sitting Crosby commercials. I like my kids. We go to the Nutcracker every year. They watch me at the Nutcracker to see when I'm going to tear up because it's just so beautiful. At one point, my oldest daughter, Sydney, uh, she went to her first nutcracker, uh, performance when she was five or six. And at one point she turned to me and she said, dad, is this real life? So at that point of the nutcracker, I know when it happens, when all the ballerinas come out and they all look like snowflakes, I am just a puddle. So when I was talking about the bike ride, I was, there was two

thought processes going on. One was envisioning actually riding the bike because it is my favorite. We'll have dinner in the summer, a warm summer night. Uh, we live in a small little town, uh, where you can ride around at the middle of the street because there's no traffic. And we wave to people while we're riding around. We honk our horns. We have little chats with everyone riding around. And that just moment is, I wish I could bottle that because you're just, you're so full of love. You're just full of life and you just don't want it to end. And then when the bike analogy, I came up with that. So when I'm describing those summer night bike rides and then thinking, well, if I hadn't made the change, if I hadn't entered treatment, if I had harbored all that resentment towards

my previous employer, like you screwed me and then just drank and smoked to, to try and get those feelings to go away. I wouldn't be there riding that bike. Literally. I would not be enjoying those moments because I would just be an angry person. No one would want to be near me. So when I finally vocalized it for the first time,

that's where it all hit me. And I'm like, Holy shit. I almost let that all get away. If I hadn't made the decision to make a drastic change in my life and do it right now before it got out of control, I would not be enjoying those moments. So yeah, it all kind of just hit me when I voiced it out for the first time. It was tremendous. And I would urge anyone to listen I voiced it out for the first time. It was tremendous. And I would urge anyone to listen to it. That's the first official, you had the trailer episode, but like the first official episode.

That's another thing about doing these. I didn't know you had to put out a trailer. It's a whole thing. Well, they, they have to make sure that you aren't telling people how to skin a cat. Yeah. Like every episode I'm like, ah, I guess that makes sense. But yeah, that, that's another part of the process where I knew nothing about. I'd be remiss if I don't ask you this, and I completely understand if you don't want to answer it.

Yep. But there was a story that came out regarding a newborn child of yours, and there was a lot of fear about what was going on. Are you able to address what happened there, or would you like to keep it to yourself? I know it's a very touching and touchy subject, but a lot of people were concerned for you in that moment. I certainly was. A few things I can address. One is when people still attack me, like I still get the odd people. They'll send screen grabs from whatever publication it was in, like the New York Post and my current employers. They send it to them saying, oh, real, real upstanding individual to employ this guy.

My problem with it was when I sent out those messages wondering about my daughter's safety and people say, oh, great PR trick. They thought I would send out messages about my daughter to get attention when my job is already on TV. I'm in the public eye. There was thought put behind those because I was in a situation where I had reached out to lawyers, to authorities, and they said, we can't help you. I gave them my concerns. I said, here's where I'm at. Help me because I am terrified for the moment I am experiencing right now and my fears. My fears were real. Nothing I put out there was a lie. But I sent it out. In hindsight, I should not have sent it out.

But when you are in a headspace in which everyone says, sorry, we can't do anything, but you're like, no one's listening to me. Will someone listen to me and help me with this situation I'm dealing with right now? And they say, sorry, you can't send. So I hit send. And that's where it went. And then I didn't expect it. When you're in a headspace in which it's so clouded, it's like five wars going on inside your head and no one wants to help you put it out and then i i i sent a tweet and i'm like okay this this has made things worse but i'm not backtracking on my mindset right now because that was a very real emotion that I was experiencing. It was a very real situation. And that was my only way of trying to help the situation when it just made it worse. But for those that said like,

ah, screw this guy. I'm like, how did it affect your life? This was my life. Do you think I want this broadcast out there? Do you think I wanted this for attention? I did it because I was desperate. Do I wish I hadn't done it? Of course, but it's now part of my life experience. I can't erase it and I don't run from it. So I just wish people would see it from, this was a father who was desperate for information and for help. And that was his only resource that he saw at that time because he was getting no help from anywhere else. Everything OK now on that front? Everything is fine.

My daughters are here all the time. And at some point, yes, I'll have to explain that to my daughter and say, here's where we're at. And that's something I'll address later in life when she obviously has the understanding, but I know I'll have to address it with her. And I know that it's something whenever you Google my name, that'll come up and it'll be attached to me, but just know I, I didn't do it for publicity. I did it to try help a situation that I was involved in at that time. I appreciate you addressing that. Um, in conclusion, you have, you have the new podcast and it's called boomsies because your producer at Fox used to say that in your ear that's right sean keegan um so whenever there's a big dunk or something you

go that's a boomsies or someone like fell on their face ah boomsies so um can i read you a description i got a great description of my podcast but i think um okay here's where this guy sent it to me yesterday and this perfectly describes what I'm trying to do here. He said, I listened to a lot of radio. This is a breath of fresh air. You know why? Because you teared up, told us about two cars, not working, gave away underwear and plugged the Orono store in one fell swoop.

No agendas or political bullshit. Just a dude in his basement talking to us and the cat. So I'm like, that's exactly what I want to accomplish. I just want to be here for a conversation. I'm a very flawed human. Uh, I shed light on that. I don't hide from it. And I'm hoping to help others where we can just have a conversation and realize that there's more things in life than worrying about your Toronto Maple Leafs winning the Stanley Cup and getting angry when they lose or your car breaking down or anything. There's more to life. And that's what I'm here to provide is just a one hour respite every week where you can just tune off and just have fun and just hang out. I just want it to be

like a little clubhouse, really. It's very natural. It's very you. Would you be okay if this is your thing for the next 15, 20 years? Hell yeah. Because you said you don't want to go up that ladder. And then someone says to you, you make too much. And then you're so you want to be the master of your domain, independent Dan doing his own thing. I know you're working. You said, I don't want to go up the ladder. I just want to go down the stairs. There's the stairs. I take that I take down to work. And I'm like, you can't beat the commute. So I don't want to go up the ladder. I want to go down the stairs area. Will you have Jay on a thousand percent? I get that asked that I read viewer emails and everyone asks that, but I'm never going to extend the invite. If he says, Hey, I'd love to come on. I'll say yes. Come on. Because I don't want to put them in the situation where he has

to say no to me because he and I were of the same belief. If we get asked on a podcast or something, you're like, ah, I don't want to do that, but I don't want to say no. So you do it unless like it's a podcast like this where I know the guy, right? Because you probably get asked to go on a lot of them. And you're like, you hate saying no to people. We're Canadian. I know. I'm going through that right now. I've said yes to too many people and I just had to decide. And here I am. The worst part of my job, and you're going to know now, luckily for you, you have people who reach out to guests. The worst part of my job, the part that I could, if I could erase one thing is the asking of people to come on my show. I hate it. I've never in all my years of doing this, Dan, I've never had someone book a guest on my behalf. For some reason, I am crazy

enough that I feel like I need to make the ask. I wish I could hand that off. It's the worst. Wait, in my defense, I book all our guests, except I have a list of dream guests. And my producers are going to book those, not telling me when. I think I have one today. So they book the dream guests. There's only six of those, but all the other guests I book. Good on you. And the great thing is, since it's at my house, I can do them any time of day. Like I interviewed a Canadian Olympian that'll air this week, Alicia Riesling, last night. And we just talked about the Olympics and did it on our own free time.

So yeah, but asking people it's a pain in the ass. You're doing great, Dan. I'm a huge fan for life. I wish you nothing but the best. Again, the new podcast is entitled boomsies. You can get it wherever you get your podcasts. Also it's on on YouTube as well. Yeah, if you use voice to text, people have told us it comes up boobies. Yes. So watch out for that. Make sure you type it in. Boomzies, not boobies.

Congratulations on a legendary career. And I'm so happy that it is continuing and flourishing in this new way in 2022. It's all about podcasts, as you know. It's all about the internet. As you said, kids are watching things different. You're pivoting as well. Well done.

So thank you for the time. Respect you. Thanks for being honest and open with how you're feeling. I think that helps a lot of people. You know that as well. And thank you for doing this. This was great. I will always say yes to your request,

just because you have to now say yes to mine. Amen. I'll be there anytime. I can't wait. I can't wait. Thank you, Dan. Thanks, Errol. Wonderful stuff there from Dan.

Like I said at the top, an open book, a great guy, a great broadcaster. He has been through a lot. He has come out of it smelling like roses, very happy about his new podcast. He seems to be in a great place mentally, physically. He seems rejuvenated. It's a beautiful thing. It's tough when you're in the public eye, when you're in people's lives every day,

and then you get let go and you have to kind of build yourself back up. And he's been through a lot as he talked about. And I sincerely hope that it's just better days ahead and that his new show is a huge success and he's able to enjoy his life. We all deserve that. So thanks to Dan for being so open.

Go check out his podcast, Boomsies, wherever you get your podcasts, also on YouTube. And thank you all for the support. Please continue to rate, download, subscribe, review, follow, all those things. It means a lot. It helps a lot. And go check out our YouTube channel as well youtube.com slash aria hawani that's where all the interviews are up highlights full interviews i appreciate it it helps more than you know this is just me doing this my little engine that could i love it thank

you to the production team i appreciate them thanks to all of you thank you to the lovely feathers this great song is called frantic i I love them too. And I hope you enjoyed this conversation. More to come. For now, though, time to say goodbye. Have a great weekend. Much love to Dan O'Toole. Much love to all of you. I'll talk to you next week. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh

Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh